Dice Shame - 2-177 | 'Conflict of Interest'

Episode Date: January 15, 2026

The Party discusses what to do with the Vonindod once they find it...______________________________________________________________________________________________________________Imagine your best game of D&D. The shocks, the twists and turns, the moments that can’t be caught because you just had to be there. That’s Dice Shame.Join our DM Jo, her husband Harlan, their brother Alex & their friends Nic & Timm as they experience those unmissable, gut-wrenching, heart-aching, joy-filled moments.This legendary AP releases a brand new episode every Thursday morning at 1:20 am!Content Warning: animal death, swearing, violence, claustrophobia Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Yeah, are you realistic? This is... That was a little bit of a tense conversation. Are you coming with us to take down this Von and dog? I heard it too. It's that simple. I think I kind of understand where you're coming from. Now's the time to just put it all out there.

What the hell was that? Well, that's all good dwarish steel, by Fred. A highly dwarven craft some shit. I think we should take it. What is it that you want to use it for? That would be pretty messy. We won't be around forever to guard this. Look, I have no issue shut down a cannon or a catapult.

We are there. We can't replicate that kind of magical technology today. As long as I'm... holding the key. We're not going to be using it for anything unless we're all in agreement. Welcome back to Dice Shame. This is Season 2, Episode 177, Conflict of Interest. I'm a piece. This week. It's my birthday, Henry. I hear you. Congrats, Henry. You're this week's MVP. Love you, kiddo. All right. Should we do this? Let's do it.

Woo! So, Tim, you went to Pax, unplug. Was it? It was a blast. Yeah, Pax Unplugged might be my favorite con. Wait, break it down. What's Pax? I don't, yeah, what is Pax?

So Pax is the Penny Arcade Expo. It's, you know, one of a series of different conventions that go on that I was going to say the U.S. And that's not even true. There's in Australia and other places. So the, um, but Pax Unplugged is easily my favorite because I think I like it even more than GenCon because it really reminds me of GenCon, except less overwhelming. it's dedicated to just tabletop games and board games so I mean I and I kind of feel spoiled because

I made it like my home con kind of much more so than like New York Comic Con or anything this is the one that like was accessible to me and I got to go like year one and of course it's it's fake and illusory the imposter syndrome but I very much felt like oh if I go to a convention you know the first year it happens then I'm allowed to say like I'm a convention goer of that where's gencon's been going on for so long. You feel like an imposter. I think I agree with you there, though. That's fantastic.

So let me get this straight. Just humor me for a moment. It doesn't actually have anything to do with Penny and arcades, right? Well, so the comic book? The web comic, yeah. Web series. Oh, yes. That's right.

I'm still at a touch. I was going to say, I don't even think Alex knows about the web comic. I'm just thinking of like, He's literally asking if it's about a penny. In the 50s, we're arcades with pennies? And I'm, like, picturing like this, like, casino-style penny arcade hall. So cool. Alex.

I feel like most of Penny Arcades fan base doesn't realize that their webcomic is named after a concept that once existed as a real thing. They don't know who Tico Brahe actually was. They don't actually have the historical content. They're just like, that's the guy that writes the funny shit on the web. Are you barking with me? Famous for famous webcomic writer. Tyco Brahe, yes, absolutely. I thought you're going to say famous arcade owner.

Not even. That's cool, though. What were the highlights? Did you get to meet anyone famous? Did you get to run any games or playing any games that really... I definitely got to hang out with a lot of great... I mean, mainly I have friends in Philadelphia who I go way back with. So more than anything, I got to hang out with friends, and I really like that.

But I also have a lot of friends in the industry who I only get to see at Pax's as well and at the other convention. So it's a really cool one. something I really appreciated this year. There's only really one place to go back to for the after party. So unlike somebody voiced this that I really like at Gen Con, you feel like you're always trying to find

where everyone's hanging out at and you're always one step behind and it's the worst feeling of FOMO and just being left out. And everyone feels it. Everyone at Jencon because they all feel like, oh, at the next bar over, that's where all the cool people are hanging out and they've excluded. It's such a

silly feeling. But Paxon plugged, it's the lobby. The lobby of the Marriott is where everyone goes. Oh, cool. There's nowhere else to go. So everybody just goes there. Not that there's nowhere else to go, but everyone congregates at that one place. So it's just the hub of everybody's there and you don't have to worry about like, oh, am I in the right spot or not? So in that sense, getting to hang out is really cool. That's like cross-convention vibes, though. I do have to say, like, I've been to work conventions and people hang out in the lobby where they can congregate the most. I, I, I, I, I, I swear to it.

That's exactly the thing. Oh, I agree. I just love the idea of, like, Tim coming out of, like, Pax and Alex coming out of an insurance convention and, like,

seeing each other from opposite sides of the bar, like the Montague's and the Capulets type v. Absolutely. Alex longingly looking at the nerddom and Tim secretly being an ex-insurance broker for some reason. Yes. It doesn't have to be a divide like that necessarily. It can be a positive thing.

Could be. Hey, Tim. Oh, no, it would be. for sure. Let's switch parties. How many insurance brokers do you think play D&D? I would, I don't. I'll bet a surprising number. Four.

No clue. I would imagine. I don't know. I feel like it's right in the middle. Well, whatever. We don't have to go down this. I was going to say. Let's stick with the big conversation.

Mean about insurance brokers. Harlan, tell me your thoughts about insurance brokers. All the insurance broker fan base here. about to lose in the next second. Every insurance broker I know is a total asshole. Man, you know what's worse? They hate D&D. It's not even the losing the fans.

Your premiums are about to go way, way. Oh, yeah. Actually, for more reason than one, I backed into a car the other day that was parked on the street. I was backing out of my driveway and I literally hit another car. Yeah, that's always a fun way to spend a Saturday afternoon. Yeah, it was, I, well, and it was extra bad because, So Henry was in the car with me.

We were going to, funnily enough, a local Comic-Con, which is like, but like a super small. Like there were like 15 tables. I love that. In our hometown. Many. So we went to a little Christmas fair as a family on the Saturday. And again, tiny.

And they were like, tomorrow there's a Comic-Con. And we all were there. And Henry, obviously, he's eight. He was like, oh, my God, we got to come back. And Joe and Marie had to have their naps because Joe was working in Marie's a baby. So I was like, yeah, we'll go back. So we were in the drive. We all amped up to go off the other way around.

Comic books and stuff. And I just smashed in this car. And I just like drove forward and just turned off the car. And I was just like, God damn it. And Henry was super chill about it. You know what I mean? And I remembered even our dad backing it. Do you remember when our dad backed into a car, Alex?

I think it was maybe it was in the driveway. Yeah, it was Christmas Eve. Do you remember we were going to Grandma's house and he backed into a car that was on the opposite parked same type of thing and he had to get out and go into the house

because it was like parked at a house for a party. And honestly, that made me feel better about it because I was like, well thank God it's not at least like Christmas Eve and I'm ruining someone's party. Imagine having a drink in your hand and eating a cocktail,

we need someone knocking and during me me like, by the way, I just fucked up your car. I'd be like, give me your number. How bad did you back into the car? Are we talking about like some scrapes and a little dent? He pushed it over that boulevard down a hill. It landed on train tracks and then it fucking got ran over. And then a teradactyl came and it picked up the car and dropped it into the Atlantic Ocean.

And then Arnold Schwarzenegger was there and he was like, get into choppa. That was nothing compared to the family that was inside. Get into chopper. He pulls out a picture. There's like huge dense airbags and there's like blood. and like clothing rips everywhere and you're like what is just people running around on fire but you know what harland oh yeah i was thinking about it later because obviously he calls me i'm in his insurance broker as well he made fun of me immediately that is not true don't say that i'm just not i'm joking you were

great i mean i had no fear telling you i knew you no but but i will say i was like driving later that day and i and i hit a car often crosses my mind i often think about my client's claims but i was like literally I said to myself, I remember I was, I know exactly why I was turning. I was like, I could easily see myself backing into a car. I don't really blame Harlan. Like, it happens. It happens. Like,

Well, and that's exactly what I said. When Harlan called me, he was like, oh, I'm, I'm, we're not going to Comic Kong. Like, I'm so fucking stupid. Like, literally. I backed into a car and I was like, are you serious first of all? And then second of all, like, listen. Yeah.

Yeah. I mean, to be fair, I was beating myself up over the stupidity. Because like, and this is all because we recently just got a new car from my mom. She was sick of it. So it was just I wasn't familiar with it. But for, I don't know, my entire life, I've been driving this Camry. And I get a car like two weeks ago with a reversing camera. For the first time.

This had the camera. Literally. I had no excuse me. I just wasn't looking at. I wasn't, you know, I never fucking looked at here. Damn AI. I believe it dings at you. it's like ding ding ding

like stop what you do it yeah yeah it was so funny too but like our car is like what an idiot I couldn't couldn't find a scratch on our car and it was just funny because like

even backing into it there was no resistance it was like tissue paper it was like and I was just like oh fuck and Henry's like what I just hit the fucking car behind us anyway it was a good comic con con experience afterwards let me just tell you

I know that feeling so well though that like sinking in your stomach, like, ah, being so disappointed that time only goes in one direction. You can't rewind the last five seconds. You got to live in the moment and say, fuck everything and everyone. None of it matters. At least on this plane of existence, it only goes in one. Hey, that's true.

But if you want to play D&D, I will offer you a segue. In this trying time. I think I will. I think I will. After interrogating General Chaos Hammer and investigating the bodies of slain and burned monsters, you gather in the base of the tower to discuss your next moves. What's our next move? What the hell was that? There was a laughing in it.

It's echoing. Well, we still have the Von and Dodd to deal with, and we should send word back about what happened here, right, to Citadel Thelba. Right, Chaos Hammer. Are you coming with us to take down this Vonendod? Yeah, he's like kindling a fire in one of the cold hearths of this room to try to make it a little bit more hospitable. And he turns around to you as he speaks.

Yeah, I can come with you. Von and Dot is mired in a valley not far to the south of here. It can't be mired for very long. We shouldn't dawdle too much, but... And Red sort of locks eyes with Tamil. Like looking overwitted. He's like, and when we get there, we want to make sure we disable this thing, so they can't use it, right? Especially if we don't know exactly what we're going to be fighting, fire giants or corrupted fire giants.

Witted did flinch at that. Didn't say anything in response, but did flinch? I think that Tamil is also responding to Red but watching Witted. If she sees him flinch, I think that she's been kind of thinking. thinking about how they've been talking kind of around this and how, you know, they've, they've had some discussions, but now it is, we are there. It is an imminent thing. And so I think that she will just fully say, Mm. Witted, yes.

Are you comfortable with that plan? Do you have other intentions? Now's the time to just put it all out there. He slowly kind of turns disarming, disabling, uh, On a temporary basis, yes, I think taking it out of the hands of the fire giants. I agree is the top priority, yes. And not letting them use it. It might not be temporary.

If there's a way to shut this thing down permanently, and I'm talking full out, pouring concrete down those gears, I think we should take it. Concrete. Are you realistic? This is... Okay. Truth be told, everyone. and he kind of looks in the direction of where this giant is, like, not visible, but at the same time, it's almost like he's looking at it, and there's a shine in his eyes. I understand the stakes. Don't get me wrong, I understand what's at risk, but this is an ancient, and powerful item, and it is a, what of a kind.

It's like can't be recreated. If we destroy it, we may never see it's like walk fair route again. And a price like that, I'm not sure I'm willing to pay it. Doran sort of stands up from helping Chaos Hammer build the fire and joins the conversation. Whedidid, could I argue that if it never walks Fyroon again, and the benefit of that is that it never falls into the wrong hands again, it can never be used against innocence, against civilizations again. Is that not... It can't be used for good either.

in that case. A tool, a technology. It is not evil in its own right. I understand evil is something that we fight against. Evil is something that we work together to resist. But this is not an evil thing. It is a suit of armor. It is a weapon. I don't doubt that. That's its original purpose. But could a weapon be used to fight evil? What happens when a threat arises that threatens Farrood, any of us, and the Vodidot isn't there to help. I think it wants to help. I think it doesn't want to do evil. You talk like this thing's alive with it.

And you see the suit open up. Is it? Does it everything have some kind of a heart ultimately? Hold on. We're talking about a machine here. This is just, like you said, a suit of armor. It's not sentient, is it? And Redd, like, asks genuinely?

The truth is, I don't know. But whether it has a sentience of its own or whether it has a pilot, what I'm getting at is there is a consciousness behind the voted dot. Not to say that it necessarily has a pilot, not speaking of its pilot or any kind of sentience that it may or may not have, but it had a creator. It had someone who put work into it. It had someone who craft.

it, who forged it lovingly, and wanted something for that. And maybe we don't want the same thing that the giants who built the Voted Dodd wanted, but the Voted Dodd doesn't know what it's for, and maybe we could, in a sense, teach it. And Witted, with your sort of thought that it could be sent to it, you see a flicker of doubt in Red's eye. And Red snaps his eyes back to Tamil with a flicker of doubt. Both of you see it. Sentient?

Well, if there's sentience there, that is something we can discover. But, widget, it seems as though you're conflating two separate concerns. If it does have sentience, then perhaps it can be reasoned with as an independent thing. But if not, you speak of the intention of the creator. And though our intention may not be the same as the other, if it was created as a weapon for destruction, then while its component parts could be used for some sort of good, it is still a weapon. And again, I, my hesitance is mainly around the idea that there is no way to ensure that someone with ill intent will not be able to steal it or otherwise abscond with something

that could then be used to create something even more terrible. We may not have to destroy it entirely, but I am not entirely sure what your intentions are, Whitted. That, I think, is the thing that is most worrying to me. Timil's right, look, a weapon of that size, of that magnitude, can only do evil. Death of that magnitude is wrong. Witted's face seems to harden at that red, and he becomes very serious, and it looks like border line angry at you. And he says that, I

think is where we disagree. A weapon is only as good as those who wield it. And we're good. We have strength. When we hold on to a weapon, we, by wielding it,

make sure it doesn't fall to the hands of evil. So all we have to do is make sure that we have the voted dot and they don't. We can't ensure it forever. No one can, but as long as we have it, we could

use it for good. And as long as they don't, it won't be used for evil. It's that simple. And he's obviously like, doesn't almost want to talk about it anymore and it's like turning away. I think that like Tamil will kind of, she'll put a hand out and

specifically put a hand on Bessie. Witted, what is it that you want to use it for? I just It's powerful and it has secrets within it. The construction that went into it, what the giants did to forge it, we can't replicate that kind of magical technology today. But it was replicated today.

This was constructed recently. This was something resurrected in Ironslag. If I may, Tamil, you are familiar with combat. I can see that. But this is war. The forces that are amassing in silvery moon, they are going to be unlike anything you've ever seen. And I don't know you, but I can assume

that this is going to be an incredible sight to behold. And maybe Widdid's right, that we are going to need something with enough power that's going to be able to turn the tides. Witted is a very obvious, like, gesture in the dirt. direction of a chaos hammer. Like, see, see. Well.

Well, listen. And Red's sort of almost like a little pissed off, like matching Whitted's tone a little bit. Steps forward and says, as long as I'm holding the key and he pats his bag, he says, we're not going to be using it for anything

unless we're all in agreement. Widid's face for just a flash kind of scrunches up in a child like, mm, fine kind of way. And he realizes how, Not just mean but immature. He's kind of like kind of just shakes his head. I think that Tamil will look at Witted and realize that there's something that there's something that she doesn't understand about the construction of this.

She'll look at Chaos Hammer and like, you know, understand that he has more experience commanding troops and on battlefields. And we'll see kind of like the intent with red that kind of lines more with her. but is now in direct conflict with the party, and she'll just kind of look around and she'll give a small shrug and she'll say, well, I'll defer to the better judgment of those with more experience than I have. But, Witted, I will not keep this. Once we are finished with the Vonundad,

if you wish to wield it as a weapon, you are free to, and I will not try to stop you, but I also, I think I will have to part ways. I would not wield this as a weapon. I would use it as... Oh, no. Of course. I would not want to be entrusted with the responsibility of guarding such a thing.

You are a technological whiz, and your prowess with it, I'm sure that you will be able to whip up something that will make it more challenging or impossible for others to take over. But I do not feel comfortable. accepting that responsibility. Hearing this, Witted, almost starts muttering under his breath. Yes, research, studying it. And you realize he's just saying clips of, like, what he's thinking aloud

because what you just said, you're realizing has shook him in a way that you realize he hasn't even considered, no insight check necessarily. He has not considered that once he gets the Vonen Dodd, he'll have to protect the Vonen Dodd from people who want to take it back. and it's occurring to him what that would look like. And the fact that he might have a weapon that can defend the von and dot,

the von and dot itself, and that that would be pretty messy very quickly. Look, let's all cool off a five and regroup, and then we should head out. He's just staring right now. Just let's all take a moment. Timil and read sort of gestures for Timil over, like in a corner.

Can you help me with this upstairs? Of course. And I think Doran, who sort of joined the conversation moving from stoking the fire with Chaos Hammer and then joining and silently listening the whole time, steps away from the discussion silently, but with a little bit more of a purview into Witted and sort of the way that he, the way that he respects the things that are built by others a little differently than how one of us might respect something that's built by somebody. And it's kind of interested like that.

And I think Doran sort of mumbles under his breath. How can a weapon be goose used for any good? Use for good. Chaos Hammer nods at you. Well, you know, Doran, you've got one knot strapped to your back. Ork splitter. She's mighty powerful, but in the wrong hands. you know as well as I, she could

take down friendly just as easily as foes. Yeah, he kind of takes off his back and he's spinning it in his hands looking at it as he listens to Chaos Hammer. But he doesn't really give any response. Fuck yeah!

But I do think that this moment, Doran sort of takes a moment to maybe approach with it when the timing is right. There's this solemn moment. moment, I think, where there's a bit of a disband, and Dora takes the opportunity to maybe approach with it. So, uh, are you doing okay? I know it's, uh, that was a little bit of a tense conversation there.

I just, the idea of recklessly, um, a museum, you wouldn't just go in and start taking things apart because they're weapons. I mean, you, you understand, Adoran, I, I just, sorry. Hey, listen, I do. When it comes to this sort of thing, I lose sight. of what people are trying to tell me, and I understand they meant well. Is this one of those times I should apologize? I didn't want to...

No. I didn't want to... No, no. No, not at all. He like kicks a rock with his big metal boot. No, no, no, no. There's no, no, no apologies necessary. I mean, I think we're just still sort of getting to know each other.

Listen, I don't really know what to say about the whole one. and done thing at, not yet at least, but I am starting to learn a little bit more about you, and I think I kind of understand where you're coming from, and that you have a lot of respect for the way that this thing was built, and the amount of, well, magic and other engineering that goes into it. You're sort of a funny character, aren't you? I didn't know you could speak dwarven.

Where did that come from? well dorrit i apologize but and he switches flawlessly to dwarfish really good dwarfish even for a gnome nomes often like do at least know some dwarfish um but uh i i thought it might be obvious achta bruce off lucklethast catay te uh but nonetheless uh the colloquialisms aside i mean uh i thought it was clear um how much of bessie's craftsmanship uh don't get me wrong the the small parts, the inner workings are primarily of nobish design and involve a good deal of maggio clockwork, but at the same time, the outer shell, well, that's all good dwarfish

steel, my friend, clank, clank, he kind of knocks the forearm a little bit. I would say when it comes to the actual blueprints and design, I'd say it's 50-50. I relied upon dwarven artificers for a good deal of the craftsmanship. dwarves, some humans, no doubt. A lot of other gnomes and their plans went into the designs that I extrapolated. And there was even a half-work, if I'd be honest, a lot of different craftsmanship. And lots of, there are artificers all over the world whose work I crimped from.

You know, no scientist works in their own right alone. And I did not design this from scratch the way perhaps you thought. I did my research. And well, dwarves have worked very hard to arbor themselves very well. And I carry on that tradition proudly. So Doren, as Wooden's talking, sort of looks up and down this piece of machinery. And not realizing that he hasn't really taken a moment to actually look at Betsy, the grooves. It is Betsy, right?

Is Bessie. Bessie. Bessie. Classic Doren. Yes, Doren. I don't comment on it. It's all good. He sees the line in the workmanship.

Oh, wow. You know, I never really put two and two together, and not realizing that, yes, of course, this is a very, some very highly dwarven craftsmanship, obviously mixed with some gnomish inspiration, of course. Don't get me wrong. Nobes are great artificers, but arbor, I give your people credit where it is due.

That is all dwarves all the way down, as far as I'm concerned. As I said, I visited dormant cities on a regular basis, especially once I understood what it was I wanted to build. I knew where to go to speak to the very best, as it were. And as a child, as I told you before, it was my visits to dormant cities that really first inspired me. As much as nobish craftsmanship as in my blood,

it was your people who really set the standard that I hold Bessie to today. And continuing in thick dwarven accent. And, you know, it's actually quite ironic the fact that we're, you know, crossing paths like this and discussing this the very moment when, you know, we talk about approaching the Von and Dodd. Certainly. Which is the perfect mix of armor and invention. He pauses and goes, yes, that thought had occurred to be, Doran, yes, 100% certainly. It is very much the pitiful of what I would. aspire to.

As much as, as much as, and he kind of reaches out and just with one metal knuckle wraps against your armor, as much as the dwarven craftsmanship that goes into your armor, you would look at it as different for Bessie. I really view them as, in many ways, one of the same. And by extension, the Voted Dodd, well, the Voted Dodd is just a big Bessie at the end of the day. And armor is, I don't view armor as primarily a weapon. I understand that it's different when that armor can maybe crush a city beneath its feet,

but I view it as protection. The same way your armor protects you and my armor protects me, I would like the voted Dodd to be something that can work to protect, not destroy. I mean, I agree with you, and I agree with Chaos Hammer as well. In some ways, this shouldn't be destroyed. it. It can't be destroyed and it could be used to maximize any defense against, maximize our defense against really any enemy. At the same time, we won't be around forever to guard this thing. And you and I both know that something of this ferocity in the wrong hands, I guess the question comes down too. Well, what do we do with it?

Wim drags Chaos Hammer's golden long-handled Warhammer into the room from where she had been elsewhere in the tower

searching for this weapon she like brings it over she's like dragging the head of it on the ground behind her because she's just a little slip of a thing and this is a dwarven warhammer

and she lays it down at Chaos Hammer's feet and he nods at her in thanks and then she retreats from the room going to look for some more of his gear in doing so she passes by tamil and red who have made themselves more of like off to the side and she nods at the two of you yeah hey wimmy look timil you and i are in agreement this weapon isn't something to risk in anyone's hands i've traveled this world enough to know that even the most well-intentioned people can do the most damage, and I've never met a good person or an evil person,

but I've met thousands of people capable of both. However, the question here is about what that thing is exactly. Look, I have no issue shutting down a cannon or a catapult. But I've seen things like Ork Splitter, and I've seen things without a heart in a way that I know, it care for things and people. And if this thing is sentient, I don't know how to proceed. I think we can only trust those that we have chosen to travel with. In the same way that we trust Doran to wield Ork Splitter,

who, from what I understand, is quite bloodthirsty. We trust him to wield him, wield her responsibly. I think that we can only move forward trusting Whidididid. But, as I said, there are things I would like to do in the future that trying to protect something like the Vonendod would absolutely stand in the way of. No, no, look, look, you're not walking away from this, because you and I aren't going to walk away from this unless this thing is shut down. I'm with you. What I'm saying is, I agree. Leaving widded with that is just as bad as leaving that to the giants, because it's just another weapon.

And I don't care if there's a thousand with it's protecting this thing. The bad guys can take it back. What I'm saying is, if I stand over that keypad or whatever the hell it is, or if I'm pouring concrete down those gears, I need to know that this thing is a tool. I need to know that this thing doesn't have feelings, doesn't have thoughts. Because to destroy that, that's not just a museum. That's not just a thing that deserves to exist because it's special or unique. That's a thing that deserves to live because it's alive.

And I don't know how I feel about that, especially something that more or less isn't capable of choosing its targets. What I'm talking about here is a serious moral quandary with the responsibility of what could be a life. Hell, I've seen things in this world that I can't even explain. And if this thing is walking around and having feelings, I don't know how if we have a right to take it out of existence. I don't know either

And also The question I've been asking myself is If it truly is Just a tool of destruction If the choice came down to Shutting down Or destroying the Von and Dodd Or killing Witted

Would I be able to do that And I don't think I could I think that I would just leave it to trust. And I have no sense for this thing. I truly wish my sister were here because she would be able to tell if it was sentient or what kind of magic it was that was truly powering this thing. But I have no head for these things. Look, I have you back so far as I can speak to this damn thing,

but I'll tell you right now, before stopping it outright, I need to know what it is. What I mean by stopping it outright is if we do find a way to self-destruct this thing or whatever the hell. I want to talk to it first, if it's capable of that. Yeah. Can you meet me there? I think so. Okay. For now, especially just for the optics, I'm behind you on destroying this thing. I don't want to get into the nuance with Witted. He might latch onto that sentience, and I don't know. He's so passionate he may lie outright about its level of intelligence just to get me on his side of keeping it alive. And I don't want to play in that just yet.

I think I understand where you're coming from, but I have to say I would rather have it out here and now than over the controls weapons pointed at each other. That is not the time to have this conversation. I think now is the time for honesty, in this quiet moment before, whatever storm we are throwing ourselves into. I don't think he knows, to be honest. I don't think he knows the level of sentience until we're in that thing is the truth. I think he could hypothize, hypothetically.

What's the word? Hypothesize. Thanks, Darwin. He could hypothesize. And with his intellect, he could be making some really educated guesses, but I'm telling you here and now, I don't want to open that window

to create doubt in what you and I need to appear as a united front. Yet, I need to figure out for myself if that thing is sentient. Because hell, you might feel differently too. If this thing is alive and it tells you it wants to fucking go live in the middle of the ocean, I don't think you're going to worry as much as, you know, as you are to destroy it.

You know, maybe it's just a big beast that wants to be free. True. And if it's alive and its delight, lies and destruction... Then we kill it. And if anything, it'll be easier then, too. This is a quagmire. This is, there is so much to consider. There are so many factors.

the only thing that I am sure of is that this group has saved me in ways that I was not expecting. And I, if I have to have a way to prioritize my concerns and my actions, I think I will put the people of Red's Rovers over other things for now. But I will also stand by you, Red, if you think this is the best course. I just think I needed to let you know where my head was at so that you could, you know. Of course. Be in my corner if it comes down to it. Oh, Red. I'm always in your corner.

She throws her arm around your shoulder and starts giving you a nougie. Oh, I was shot there. Oh, sorry. This is sound of screeching metal on stone as Wim, like, walks by you dragging a set of plate mail. And she brings it through between the two of you. Do you need a hand, bud? Let me help you, Wimmy. And with that, Temeel and Red, you return to the others as you prepare to leave.

Okay, now I'd just like to thank our dear Patreon supporters. I screw all their names down here. Just bear with me. Okay, thank you too. Leta J. Christopher. Colin Burkhart. Merlin. Adam Frey.

Liz. Ruth Ann Reed. Trin. Lorelei Feldman. Merrick's Moon. J.D. Scotty. Haley.

Joshua Nance. Nicky. Queen. Shannon Waldner. Wren? Cass. Joy Robinson. Melinda Curley.

Sray 96. Moon. Janette. H.D. Gabby. Tow. T kettle. Izzy.

Anna Lena. Gareth Bradshaw, Abriel, Mizra, Nibia, NERGUEA, Nerd Fairy, Oakland, Abby Mae Birkin, Quinn, Manderpants, Stab, Vol Control, Keely Hill, Pan, Axel, Rabbit and Cheese, Absolute Ocelli Behavior, Danny, Seer of Time, Wanderer Fen, Luna de Maria, Feli, Bird, Starlight, A.K. Trash Panda, Amanda Nicole, Clockwork Phoenix, Lickrott, Kite, Alicia Duh, O.B., Marimo, Luke, Fisher, Knox the Nightshark, Sunny, Zill Street, Liz, Kara, Caspian, Beanfeant, Jagger Man Jensen, Roses of Envy, Karen Duley, Minty, Percy, This guy could, Hydrus, Martina, Celeste Jedlick, Lysanne Klechner, Nick D, Slate Blue Flowers, Sparks, Marino, Ren Gillespie, Scoutgar, Delicate Jaws, Shank, Sakura, aka Cam, Veritas, Tell, Laura, Jane, Sasha, Busing Star O3, Snick-Snack, Jinks, Jaroni, Jaron, Conzo-Como, Trinity, Morgan King, Brona, Loris, Bart, O-W-O-N, Art Jacks, Axe, Arrestu, Libet Reed, Mademois, Salaman,

Ramandra, Ray Silver Tongue, T.K. Hayst, Heather Newman, Marshmorrow, Mittens, Fern Ferguson, Harry, Immortal Dragon, Sarah Tonin, Deku Loves Hair, Dylan Ibb, Jesse, Rachel Isaacs, Red Wing Rising, and Milk. It's a good thing I have this all written down because I would never be able to remember some of these names. Have a great one and see you around the battlefield. And he sort of snaps his view back to Nick. And she's right there waiting. She's like, what are we playing? What are you doing here? Guys.

I heard you laughing earlier. This is such a Boramir in the fellowship moment where he's... We wield it. Yeah, wield it for good. Or whatever the fuck he says. I have to say I would rather have it out here and now than over the controls weapons pointed at each other. that is not the time to have this conversation.

Yeah, but isn't it somewhat so much more dramatic? It does sound like it would make good better listening, if you know what I mean? Right. And sometimes I feel like someone's listening to us, you know? I know, I know. Life is a performance, if you really stop and think about it.