Dig It with Jo Whiley and Zoe Ball - 43: DIG IN: Virginity Cake, Mug Wars, and Help for Thinning Hair

Episode Date: December 8, 2025

Jo and Zoe are back in the potting shed tackling everything from thinning hair to teenagers in love and the chaos of Christmas. Hair guru Michael Douglas shares calm, practical advice for midlife hair loss, while the girls swap stories about talking to teens about sex, virginity cakes and keeping communication open.   DIG IT LIVE AT CROSSED WIRES PODCAST FESTIVAL Our first ever Digit Live is happening at Crossed Wires Festival in Sheffield on 5 July. Potting Shed presale opens 11am on 10 December, general sale 11 December. https://crossedwires.live/ FOR MORE MICHAEL DOUGLAS HAIR TIPS Michael’s Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/mdlondon/?hl=en  Michael’s Website - https://mdlondon.com/blogs/md-hair-clinic  SUBSCRIBE TO OUR FREE NEWSLETTER Stay up to date with Dig It — new updates every Friday straight to your inbox. 👉 https://digitpod.substack.com/subscribe GET IN TOUCH 📧 Email us: [e-mail] 📱 Text or Voice Note: 07477 038795 💬 Or tap here to send a voice note or message on WhatsApp:⁠ ⁠https://wa.me/447477038795 SEND US A CHRISTMAS CARD Dig It C/O Persephonica F17/18, Leah's Yard, 22 Cambridge St,  Sheffield  S1 4HP⁠⁠ CREDITS Exec Producer: Jonathan O’Sullivan Assistant Producer: Eve Jones Technical Producer: Will Gibson Smith Video Editors: Danny Pape and Jack Whiteside Dig It is a Persephonica production 

Coming up on Digit. How handy to date a hairdresser? I mean, why did I never think of that? Hairdresser or personal trainer? Can you imagine dating a personal trainer? Be like, get up, drop and give me 20. I'd be like, I'm going to go and eat a bun. In a way, I think they want me to be their mum, not their sex advisor.

They just want, they want a different relationship. I also learnt this thing recently. Some people, when they have lost their virginity, their friends make them a cake. I was like, what? All of that, right after this. So we have some very, very exciting news. We are taking Digit to the stage. Woo-hoo, yes, we're going to be live in Sheffield at Crosswires on Sunday, the 5th of July.

And if you haven't heard of Cross-Wires, it's basically the world's biggest podcast festival. People have called it the Edinburgh Fringe for Prossedwires. podcast, even the Glastonbury of podcasting. It is a whole weekend packed with live shows from some of your favourite podcasts. They take over venues across Sheffield. There are after parties, DJ sets, outdoor bars, food stalls and loads of free events too. And we'll be at the Crucible, which is an iconic, intimate venue, the home of world snooker, will be properly up close with all our diggers. Now, Sheffield is right in the middle of the country and very easy to get to by train. So if you fancy making a whole weekend of it, you can, and the Peak District is right on the doorstep.

Potting Shed members will get an exclusive pre-sale link at 11am on the 10th of December so you can grab early access tickets. And then general sale opens at 11am on the 11th of December. And if you subscribe to the Potting Shed through Apple's subscriptions, you'll need to email hello at digipod.com.com. Because Apple doesn't share your contact details with us. That is the only way we can make sure you get the pre-sale link. We'd absolutely love you to come and soak up the atmosphere at Crosdwires. It's a brilliant weekend. Come and join us for our first ever Digit live show. We cannot wait to meet you in the flesh. All the details are there for you at Crosdwires. Live. We'll see you there. Hi, Diggers. Welcome to our digging. Zoe, how you doing? I'm doing all right, darling.

Lovely to see you. Looking pretty and beautiful. pink love it like that vibey color it's the season when it's dark outside you do everything you can can't you don't you just kind of brighten yourself right mentally wear pink feel pinker feel brighter to kick things off we have a question from beth and beth writes hi zoe and joe as i get older my hair is thinning more and more does anybody have advice on supplements treatments maybe styling tips on how to make my hair look healthy and luscious again this is something i'm becoming more and more aware of, more people that I meet, more friends of mine, getting in touch or just chatting to people and they're talking about how their hair is just decreasing in fullness

and it's a real issue. Yeah, it really is, isn't it? You don't know what to do with it. And it's a really good question to ask because I'm like, should I take this supplement along with all those supplements? Should I be using something to wash my hair? Other things I shouldn't style it with that might be making it heavier. So luckily, we got in touch with the brilliant hairstylist, Michael Douglas of M.D. London to give us his sage advice. Hey, Joe and Zoe and Beth. It's Michael here from MD London. I get a lot of questions about people losing their hair or shedding more hair as they get older. There are many different reasons for him. The first thing I would say is that your hair struggling is an indicator

that there's something going on in your body that's changing perhaps. And aging is one of those things. Lack of hormones, especially estrogen and progesterone, can cause quite a havoc with your hair growth cycle. But diet, lifestyle play an enormous part. So check in on yourself. Like, have you cut something out of your diet recently? Are you eating more of one thing that you used to be eating? Getting a blood test from a tricologist is quite important if you're really worried about it because they will be able to determine if you're insufficient in something like iron, zinc, vitamin B, vitamin D, that kind of thing. With regards to supplements and stuff, The best thing you can do for your hair is eat an egg, an extra egg, a day on top of what

you're already eating. Your hair is protein, so having extra protein in your body is a good idea. There's also loads of other goodies amino acids and vitamins and stuff like that in an egg that is literally a super supplement. And you don't like eggs, you can take other supplements. A collagen supplement is a really good idea as well. Collagen is essentially protein, but upping the amount of protein that's in your diet is a very good thing to do and an egg is a brilliant way to do it. With regards to styling tips and things like

that, blow drying your hair with your head upside down, get plenty of body, use a blow dry spray, a bristle brush, nozzle with a hair dryer. All the volume and body you put in your hair, really you do at the styling stage, not at the shampoo and conditioning stage, okay? Shampoo conditioner really cleans your hair and makes it feel soft. But putting and volume, body and volume in your hair is something you do with a styling tool or a technique. And my other big tip is dry shampoo. Put the dry shampoo in as soon as you've blow dried your hair, just blast it in at the roots. And then the dry shampoo, the starch, which is what is in it, is ready to absorb grease or sweat as soon as it gets produced. So don't put it in once your hair's

gone greasy and a bit flat. Put it in at the beginning as a preventative rather than trying to fix the problem once that's happened. Anyway, there's a few things you should look at there. What I would say, though, if you're really worried, go and see a tricologist, get a blood tester specific to finding out the problems of hair loss. You won't get that at a GP. You'll get that from a tricologist anyway. Good luck. What I would say is hair takes a long time to grow. So you'll only see the benefits of much thicker hair after somewhere in the region of like nine to 12 months. So don't think you're going to try something and it's going to work really quickly. To slow process, patience is probably one of the best things I could prescribe. good look and I hope everything works out well for you, Beth. Take care, everybody. Bye. Oh, Michael. Isn't he wonderful? Yeah. And I understood everything he said there that was kind of really simple advice and very thorough, Michael. Yeah, so really appreciate that. It can be so miserable, can it. When your hair is thin or it's not behaving itself, it just changes your whole perception of yourself and how you feel and it can make you feel very much lacking confidence and self-esteem. And it's, yeah, it's a really, really big issue. So Michael's amazing then.

And also some of the supplements he's talking about there are things that I really have realized I definitely need. And that's vitamin D, B vitamins, you know, and your amegas, did he mention? And I've got all the supplements that, yeah, and collagen. Because, you know, these are supplements that are good for your hair, but they're also really good sort of in preventing dementia. So there are, I've got a whole stack of supplements by, they go. in a cupboard, then they're by the kettle, and then they kind of, they grow, and then they go down and then they go in a cupboard. But the ones that I leave next to the kettle are a drop of B-vits, drops of vitamin D with K, and my amigas and my collagen. I'm like, take those,

even if you don't get to take some of the others, take those. And Michael mentioned all of those there, actually. So, yeah, they're going to work on all sorts of levels. Brilliant. Okay. That's good. So the blood test for them, a tricologist, if you're really worrying about your hair thinning, that's a really good tip. Yeah. I think pumpkin seed and sore palmetto, this is something that a couple of my friends have recommended that they're taking and they've found it works for them. A natural product rather, but maybe that's something that other people have tried and has worked for them. So pumpkin seed apparently really good with saw, S-A-W and then Palmetto, P-A-L-M-E-O. Saw palmetto. Yes, but the pair of those combined in a tablet, I think is supposed to be good.

But anybody else, if people have got their own experience and they want to share, then that would be great. But yeah, the other tips about the dry shampoo and styling your hair was wonderful. Yeah, I love that. Volume drying upside down. Okay, we'll try that. And, of course, Michael. He dates one of our favorites. He's going out with our friend.

Davina McCall. My Nana would say, you're stepping out? He's stepping out with Davina McCall. How handy to date a hair dresser? I mean, why did I never think of that? I know. Hairdresser or personal trainer. Those would be pretty good, I think, those two.

Oh, God, I don't want to date a person. No, can you imagine dating a personal trainer? Be like, get up, drop and give me 20. I'd be like, fuck off. I'm going to go and eat a bun. I'm amazing you're not dating someone who just wears a toolkit all the time. He doesn't wear it all the time, but he is good on tools. Yeah.

So, you know, when you see people who just look so in love, it makes you happy. It makes me happy. I'm really supportive because they've obviously both gone through quite a lot. Davina more than anybody has gone through so much. And Michael is just there supporting her in every which way, whether it's physically doing her hair or just kind of holding her and talking with her. But again, I'm like you. I've never met Michael.

I just really like him from Instagram. Yeah. And that's how that's a weird relationship we have now, isn't it, with people? With people, you feel like you know them. Yeah. Through what they post on Instagram. It's very bizarre. I get like that about people on Strickley.

where I just feel like they're my family I've never met them in my life but I watch them every week doing their incredible dancing thing oh I love them if you enjoy hanging out with us every week do make sure you're subscribed on YouTube or hit follow on Apple or Spotify

then the latest episodes will pop up as soon as they're out is so clever so we've had a message from Claire she says my 14 year old son has just told us he has a girlfriend who is also 14. Oh, can you imagine the excitement? He doesn't need a chat about the birds and bees as such,

but have you got any tips for having conversations about relationships that perhaps you've had with your children? Thanks and keep up the fab pods. Well, congratulations, Claire, to your son. That sounds very exciting. Are you managing to remain cool? Or are you running in the other room going like this? or going eke

or going eke or panicking, yeah it's interesting you say there that he doesn't need to chat about the birds and the bees I think our kids know probably more than we do actually well they definitely know more than I did at that age I found with both of my kids but I'm really glad to be able to have chats with my kids about relationships

sometimes I do it through talking about the good and the bad in my own relationships which they've often pointed out to me but yeah I think it's really good to know that they can come to you and talk about things because it can be quite overwhelming when you start dating someone you know and boys and girls are so different or you know if your boy's dating a boy or your girls dating a girl you love who you love but it can be quite overwhelming because there's a lot to encounter and so to have that relationship with you with your folks where you can go can I just

ask you about this thing or you feel that you can sort of say stuff. So do you have that with your kids, jokes? Yeah, they're pretty honest. I think one of the things I've learned is because you never know how long the relationship is going to last. So when they start going out with someone initially, you're like, oh my God, they've got a girlfriend or they've got a boyfriend. This is quite exciting. Also inside, you're thinking, do I like them? Do I want them to be part of our gang? No, I think they're good. They can join the family or whatever, but you're never quite sure. And so the best and the most important thing is not to pass any judgment or say anything at all.

about the character or the personality or the relationship. I just listen. That's what I have learned after four children and watching them all go through because there'll be, you know, you'll pass some comment about a habit that their girlfriend or boyfriend has. And immediately, normally, they get very defensive, I think, because, you know, they're going out with somebody

who they really, really like. And so you just don't want to put yourself in that position at all. So say nothing. Just be really cool and listen and just ask questions and just see how it pans out, I think is the most important thing. Because if you either fully commit, to one of the partners and then it ends after two months or two days or two years. You're devastated.

It's really, yeah, you are, you are quite often very, very devastated. Or sometimes you're very, very relieved because you don't particularly like the person that they're going out with, but just never let them know that. Just kind of hold it back, just be cool. And then, you know, when it does finish, you can just go, it's okay, somebody much better is going to come along or, you know, you say the appropriate thing, but definitely don't go in there. It's such a relief when you really, when you can see that they're really suited and that that person is bringing a lot of love and joy into your kids' life. There's something so wonderful about that where you're like, oh yeah, because sometimes my kids have appeared with someone and I'm like, this person's going to last two minutes, they're not going to be able to handle Woody or Nell, you know, it's, you can sort of see.

But you're right, you just, you know, welcoming, always welcoming. My parents were always really welcoming with, you know, especially with some of the complete losers that I brought home. I remember my dad years later, he'd be like, oh, God, she'd come in and be like, oh, here's another winner, but not say anything, you know. And my mum was always, yeah, she was always wonderful with them all. And she'd be like, oh, we quite liked him or, da-da-da-da. But yeah, you don't know how long it's going to last. So just being positive and welcoming is so lovely. One thing I have done with both of my kids is even if they've not wanted to have a chance.

I'm just like, are you cool with stuff? If you ever need to talk about anything, if anything comes up, you can talk to me. You know that. It won't go anywhere. It's just between us. And I have, for both of them, bought them supplies from the chemist at different times. Because I just wanted them to know that it was okay to talk about stuff like that. It was okay to ask if they wanted any help, if they need to see a doctor about, you know, going on the pill.

if they know these condoms in the house, it's just like, you know, about safety and stuff like that. And I just want them to know that there is, they are free to discuss that stuff with me. And we kind of are a family who talk about things quite openly. So, you know, and I really love that sometimes my kids will tell me things and I will, you know, listen and then I walk away and think, I'm really privileged that they've decided to share that with me.

And I really love that we have that relationship. It's a real relief, I think. When it's all out in the open and, and there's no embarrassment because there should not be any embarrassment there should not be any shame and absolutely information education is the most important thing

but they do get that at school they get it on their phones they get it all over the place so whenever I've tried to have yeah when I've tried to have those conversations I'm just shut down immediately it's like I do not want to go there because in a way

I think they want me to be their mum not their sex advisor they just want they want a different relationship but I wouldn't there is nothing that they could not talk to me about and they absolutely know that, but they don't want to have the sexy conversation. They really, I've learned over the years that I definitely have the maternal mothery kind of role in their lives.

And they don't want, I think Steve, maybe Disco Steve is the one who just, you know, makes all the jokes and does that kind of banter. But for me, they don't, they don't want me to have those conversations, but they totally know that they can. Yeah, absolutely. And we know how hard relationships are, relationships are difficult. And also, you know, I worry sometimes that, I haven't set the best example in some of the things that I've done in relationship.

So I do try to talk to them about, okay, maybe that wasn't a good thing to put up with or to accept, but, you know, da-da-da-da, you know, and talking about my relationship with their dad and how it's better and where it fell down and da-da-da-da, you know, so that they feel they can have those conversations with you. But it's all so fascinating. I love it. And I'm both, I'm really lucky both my kids. seeing really lovely folk at the moment and I won't go into detail but I'm always there and also

you just worry about them having their hearts broken sometimes or breaking hearts you know and also the physical issues that come with with when they're having sex when they're in a relationship I always want them to be able to come to me because sometimes it's really embarrassing talking to a doctor or contacting knowing who to contact knowing who to speak to about it and I think because the way the same way that we talk about the menopause and all the physical issues that can come along with the menopause. So we need to do that with adolescence and with relationships and with sex as well. And that's really important that they are able to come and talk to us about that. Absolutely. And the boys ain't ever going to come near me to talk about that, but the girls do

and that's great. I also learned this thing recently that apparently, I don't know that it's the TikTok thing, but some people when they have lost their virginity, their friends make them a cake. I was like, what? Yeah, apparently that's the thing. Sometimes when they lose their virginity, friends make them a cake. So I'm obviously watching for baking supplies constantly. I mean, what is it not to celebrate these days? No one made me a cake when that happened. Not that I would have wanted a cake. We're going to take a little break now. If you'd like these episodes, add free. Become a subscriber to the potting shed. You will get longer episodes. You'll get early access to our live show, which is happening in Sheffield. So it's a very, very good time.

to join now. But most importantly, you'll be supporting the show. To subscribe, head to digipod.com. Or tap the link in the show notes. This episode of Digit is sponsored by QVC. I've been improving my bedtime routine lately. Lights low, limited phone time, just trying to introduce a bit of calm before I sleep. Limited phone time. I've impressed already. I know. But honestly, I've found a gorgeous neon magnesium bath milk and body butter on menopause your way at QVC. It helps me unwind. And then I use this retinal night moisturiser from Pericon and I am out cold in minutes. That sounds divine. Menopause your way at QVC is such a brilliant hub for women who are juggling everything work, family, caring for others and just needs somewhere that says here's what

might help you. Exactly. It's not one size fits all. Everyone's experience of menopause is difference whether you need a product for sleep, stress or skin changes. QVC's shot by symptom tool helps you find what's right for you. And they've got loads of expert advice too, everything from relaxation and confidence to relationships and nutrition. It's made such a difference. To explore more, search menopause at QVCUK.com. And don't forget to use the code QDIG 10 for 10 pounds of your first purchase over 30 pounds. That's QDig 10. Q, D-I-G-10 for 10 pounds off your first order over 30 pounds. For full terms, visit the QVC website.

You have been in touch. Christmas is not far away. Ye-ha! And our substack gift guide is out now. Check out the show notes to read it. One of the brands featured in the gift guide is Art House Unlimited. It's a charity that showcases the artistic talents of adults who live. with diverse learning and physical disabilities.

They have a Christmas shop and Alex has sent us this. Hi Joe. Hi Zoe. Welcome to ArtHausen Limited. Merry Catmast. We're celebrating what the artist, adults living with, complex neurodiverse and physical support needs and do when we all work together. The artists all combine their work led by a professional art instructor to create a unique, beautiful,

piece that everyone can celebrate and share. This Christmas we've got amazing deals. Mix and match bundles where you can choose from a variety of chocolate bars, large and small, seed packets, got hand creams, lip balms, incense with all of our own fragrances. Notebooks with beautiful artworks by the artist. Fully recycled shopper bags, best-selling product in the VNA this year, Laura Shogales' Psychedelic Dreams artwork. We have Christmas Jumpers. First time ever. God resty, merry gentlemen said Madonna,

with Madonna's portrait on. Kylie cooks her turkey on the Barbie by Maria Travis, who is very good at creating quotes by famous people. Her own quotes, maybe not the actual famous people. We have a present and puzzles. And all the money comes back to the charity to continue offering a life, long, life-changing service.

Please help us raise some money. 100 million pounds. Very strangeness. You are the coolest, coolest people who do those things. I can't believe how big they have expanded now. I know. It's incredible. Yeah, because I first saw them in a little tiny boutique that I go to in local to me,

market harbour, and they have really cool things. and they had these fantastic cards. And I was like, oh my God, I'm having those for Christmas and the birthdays, because the sayings are so good. The images are so cool, the way of they're designed. And that was a few years ago. And they've now expanded, as we just saw, they did seed packets of the chocolates.

But the Christmas jumpers, I didn't know they did those. They look amazing, don't they? We might have to invest. Yeah. Also, I love that the shopping bag was the best-selling thing in the V&A museum. Yeah. I mean, it just shows how brilliant they are. So thank you for making that film for us all to see the amazing work at Art House.

Because also, you may have been given Art House chocolate. People always buy me Art House chocolate. And it's so lovely to actually see some of the fabulous artists who have created that for us. So, yeah, spread the word. Excellent. And Chris, I've just bought an RN-L-I Christmas jumper. It was modelled brilliantly by Joe Wilkinson. And he did a little video on the beach down.

I think he lives down this way. And I just thought, it's Joe, he's the perfect person to sell the RNLI Christmas jumper. Anyway, I've ordered one, so I shall be donning that on the show at some point. I'm going to buy an art house one. I'll wear my art house one. You can wear your one. Question, do you send Christmas cards? Do you know what?

I always did, and we always made a family Christmas card with a kids on. Yeah. And then Norm sort of adopted the ones with the kids on, and partly because I would never get around to doing it. So then I started doing, you know, charity Christmas cards. And then the last couple of years, I haven't sent as many. But I love sticking them up when they come. And there are less and less and less. And I guess partly is that a good thing because it's saving the planet, less trees,

you know, less paper, but it's actually really sad because I love getting postcards and cards and letters through the post. And that art feels like it's dying a little bit. So let's bring back the Christmas. We have got a dig-it Christmas card, haven't we? We have, yeah. If you subscribe to the potting shed, you will be getting a dig-it Christmas card from us, Bose. There's your incentive to subscribe. We'd love you to receive it.

Christmas cards are so important to me. My mum was a postmistress, so I grew up in a post office for many, many, many years, majority of my life grown up. And it was such a ritual. And I remember, you know, you could buy the bits of strings and the pegs, and she would have, we'd have Christmas cards everywhere. They'd be all over the walls. And it was a huge part of the decoration.

And then also the ritual, I love the ritual of writing Christmas cards to people. It's such a big part of my Christmas. So I absolutely think people should be supporting Christmas cards, writing Christmas cards. I tell you what, why don't we ask you lot listening right now, will you send us cards please, Christmas cards? We would love to receive them. It would be very nice. I know lots of people you make stuff and you are artists who listen to this and watch us and other people just really enjoy Christmas. So if you send us Christmas cards, the details will be in the show notes of how you get them to us.

And then we can put them on display. We can put them in our substack. And then we can just, we can celebrate the Christmas card and the beautiful art of saying hi and spreading Christmas love and cheer. I will stick some along the back here. That would be lovely. We've got this text from Amy. We're scrolling through TikTok and saw this video from Jocelyn, who's fighting with her sister via the medium of Emma Brie. Bridgewater, customised mugs. Oh my goodness. And I just thought you girls would love the pettiness.

Let's remind ourselves where mug wars began. Must have been 2022 when my sister sent me this deliberately misspelled mug, thinly disguised as a memento of the day the Queen died. Still, I thought that was it. Turns out that that was just a probing strike. Cut to October the 25th of 2025. And this is what I get. A little menopausal cow. Well, Lydia, two can play that game. So today I sent Dimitri, the delivery driver up to Lydia's, to deliver her this message. Let the mug wars commence.

Oh, my Lord. Oh, my God, that's amazing. Oh, thank you so much, Amy, for sending that. Do we need to do our version of this for the Digit merch shop? Menopause or cow. Jocelyn. You're a legend. Yes, that was so good.

We can't wait to see the next move. What happens? Yes, tell us, let us know. We want this Christmas update, please, as soon as possible. This is so good. And speaking of gifting, we have a voice note from Elaine. Hi, Zoe and Joe. Just want to chat to you about Christmas presents, really.

When I was a teenager, myself and my two sisters all put together and went to the fancy shopping town, you know, the big department store, and brought my mum a lovely handbag for Christmas. We had a beef wrap and a fancy bow per and. you know, the full works. Conference this morning, we were all excited and started unwrapping our presents. When mum gasped and said, oh gosh, this is a lovely wrapped present.

She opened the presents and saw the bag inside and said, that's lovely, thank you so much. Me and my sisters just looked at each other, very puzzled. You see, that wasn't the bag we had brought her. She then looked at us and said, well, I know it's not what you brought, but I didn't like that one.

So I took it back to Beaties. the said store and got the bag that I really wanted and got that gift wrapped exactly the same. We just all burst out laughing because, you know, that was just our mom. She used to peek at presents before Christmas just to make sure she liked it. And if she didn't, she would take said present back. She's taken 90s back, all kinds of things. So my question to you, both, is, have you ever opened a Christmas gift before the big day, had a sneaky peek and maybe taking it back?

and it was journey if it was something you really wanted. My mum is still and naughty, but absolutely gorgeous, 81-year-old. I love the podcast. It's like listening to mates over coffee every Monday and Wednesday. Thank you. Bye. Oh, Elaine. I think your mum is a one-off, Elaine.

What an icon. I've not ever done anything like that. That is fantastically outrageous. I love it, that she's gone snooping. I had a look and thought, no, I don't like that. I'll just take it back now. So on the day, I actually get something I like. Oh, it's so good.

Maybe we should all try that. Also, Elaine, can I just. say I love the mention of Beatys because that was my department store when I was growing up in the Grovenor Centre in Northampton. I know exactly where it was. We used to go and we used to walk around there every Saturday. They had really lovely record departments and we used to go and buy records from there. And the makeup was also really good too. I was very sad when it disappeared. I know they all disappearing, aren't they? The Beetys, you know, the Debenams of the world. All those department stores were so good for presents as well. And yeah, one by one, they seem to

go. Joe, have you ever sort of discovered that you were getting something for Christmas that you weren't going to like and done something about it? No, but I probably engineer it so much and I'm very specific about what I would like for my Christmas present, but I want it to be a surprise that I know what it is, but it's a surprise on the day because I've just, I've, I tell India or I tell Coco and then they tell the others and there's just this kind of, this network that then manages to get the right present for me. And then when I open it on Christmas Day, I'm overjoyed. And genuinely, absolutely thrilled and overjoyed, but because it's exactly what I want, because I've been quite specific about what I want. Does Disco Steve get you good presents? He's amazing. He is

amazing. Great. And is that because you tell him what you want him to get you? Or is he quite good at going, she'll love this? I tell him that he knows the shops that I like to go to. So he goes in there. I might take photographs of things I like in there and send them to the other kids, like I said. But also he's brought me some incredible things, you know, really beautiful earrings that I would never ever have imagined that he would know that I would like,

but I've really loved them and artwork as well. So, yeah, he's super generous when it comes to gifts and also really instinctive. He's, apart from the fart pants, let's not forget the fart pants. He doesn't really go wrong. But I love a blip like that because it's given us loads to talk about it.

It really has. I'm hoping that he will fight disco. He does listen to the podcast. He does. He's very loyal like that. And if he's listening, go on, go on disco. Go on, get something daft this year because it's all material from. I'm sure he will.

All the family, they're really, I'm sure yours are the same. I'm sure everyone listening will have people in their lives who just go the extra mile when it comes to Christmas. Like we really love thinking about presents for people, choosing the right thing, choosing funny things, things that resonate from the past, you know, like old copies of magazines, like look in or, I don't know, but, just things that. Like old toys, the boys used to love Thunderbirds. And yeah, last year I bought them like Thunderbird 1 and Thunderbird 5 and they were over the moon because they were toys that they used to have when they were kids. And it was just so exciting for them to open them on Christmas Day. So just thinking a little bit harder and deeper and not expensive, just something that, you know, will really touch someone's heart and bring back those lovely feelings of nostalgia. I've got a room upstairs that is full of presents now.

And I went in the other day and I said, oh my God, because my family's, I've got, you know, I've got three brothers. everyone has kids you know it's quite big extended family and I have loads of really lovely girlfriends that we tend to get

stuff for each other as well and then the kids and their partners and stuff so I have to be really organized and this year I've gone yeah I'm sort of

rather than leaving it to last minute I'm trying really hard to think about it but what tends to happen though I find is there are people who are really easy

to buy for that you can just end up with loads of stuff for and then someone else you're thinking oh God I've got nothing for them and I've got loads for them

but I went in to Santa Scotto yesterday. I had a little look and I'm like, okay, we're doing good. We always find it hard with my sister because she tears through presents at like a midi miles an hour. As soon as we wake up at 5 o'clock on Christmas Day, she's just like, present, present, and you can't manage it. Like, it's not like a normal child. She is absolutely desperate. She has this insatiable desire to open a present. And there is nothing you can say to calm her down. She just rips everything open all the time. So Jude last year had this genius idea of buying her hundreds of pairs of glasses, like cheap plastic glasses, like big Elton John glasses.

And he just, every half an hour, she'd be like, present, and then he'd just hand over another pair of glasses. And she loved them. Every single pair, she was like, put them on. Oh, look at me. And she was absolutely over the moon. And yeah, it was, so that was a really good idea. If anybody else has got people with learning difficulties or differences in their family sunglasses and spectacles, they're a good idea. We once made a guess who game of all our friends, which was, it took quite a bit of effort, but we had, you know, everybody on the cards and the board and made a guess who of all our mates. I think it was for someone's wedding anniversary or something.

Oh, I love that. And that was brilliant. And then you slotted the pictures into the, you know, like a proper set. That was quite a fun thing. It takes quite a lot of work. It's a really good present. You make me laugh, though, because you say, I'm running out of time. and I'm beginning to panic.

It's still the beginning of December. I mean, I'm just beginning to think about buying presents. I actually have way too much time. I'm going slowly mad. I'm going to start wrapping them. I love wrapping presents. Anyway, that's for another episode, another time. Yeah, yeah, I do.

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