Digital Social Hour - AI vs Poker: How This Pro Player Sees Tech's Future | Robbie Jade Lew DSH #1098

Episode Date: January 13, 2025

AI vs Poker: How a pro player sees tech's future! 🃏🤖 Dive into the fascinating world where poker meets artificial intelligence with Robbie Jade Lew. 🔥   Discover how this night owl pro player navigates the high-stakes world of poker and embraces cutting-edge technology. From biopharmaceuticals to the poker table, Robbie shares her unique journey and insights on AI's impact on the game.   🎰 Learn about the future of poker livestreams 🧠 Explore the potential of AI in gaming and beyond 💡 Gain valuable perspectives on adapting to technological change   Don't miss out on this eye-opening conversation about poker, AI, and the future of tech! Watch now and join the Digital Social Hour community for more mind-blowing discussions. 🚀   #AIPoker #TechFuture #DigitalSocialHour #SeanKelly #RobbieJadeLew   #technologyinpoker #mixedgamespoker #pokerplayerinsights #futureofpoker #highstakespoker   CHAPTERS: 00:00 - Intro 00:24 - Sleep Schedule 02:16 - Love for Poker 05:00 - Finding Best Poker Candidates 05:56 - Cash Games vs Tournaments 06:51 - Poker Etiquette: Leaving a Game 09:52 - The Future of Poker 12:49 - The Future of Poker Insights 15:10 - Future of Poker Trends 16:49 - Making Poker Interesting for TV 21:12 - Experience in Biopharmaceuticals 23:40 - How to Start Winning at Poker 25:22 - Controversy: Masks at Poker Tables 29:15 - Best Poker Livestreams 31:30 - Hans Neiman Discussion 32:48 - Support and Community 35:01 - Responding to Hate in Poker 37:37 - Keeping Poker Non-Political 40:50 - AI's Impact on Job Creation 43:34 - Finding Passion and Monetizing 45:18 - Neuralink: Are You Getting One? 46:55 - Discussion on AI 50:24 - Outro   APPLY TO BE ON THE PODCAST: https://www.digitalsocialhour.com/application BUSINESS INQUIRIES/SPONSORS: [e-mail]   GUEST: Robbie Jade Lew https://www.instagram.com/robbijadelew   SPONSORS: SPECIALIZED RECRUITING GROUP: https://www.srgpros.com/   LISTEN ON: Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/digital-social-hour/id1676846015 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5Jn7LXarRlI8Hc0GtTn759 Sean Kelly Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/seanmikekelly/

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Bed MGM operates pursuant to an operating agreement with iGaming Ontario. I'm just a night owl. I've always known that since I've been young, I was told that it was really hard to get me to bed. I love living. I don't want the day to be over. I do this thing where I like go into my day bed as like the segue into the final bed. And then I end up crashing there anyways,

because I don't actually like going to bed, but it's just, it's a weird thing. I don't want the day to end. All right guys, Robbie J. Lu here today. The latest podcast I've ever filmed. Really? Yeah. That's actually really interesting because it's pretty early for me.

8 p.m. is early for you? Yeah, it's pretty early for me. I'm like, oh, let's get this night started or the day really. So you're a party or you're a night owl. I'm just a night owl. I've always known that since I've been young. I was told that it was really hard to get me to bed. And it was one of those things like I just love living, I guess, in a way. This is what I've told myself. I love living. I don't want the day to be over. I feel that. So I do this thing where I like go into my day bed as like the segue into the final bed

and then I end up crashing there anyways because I don't actually like going to bed. I do enjoy sleep once I get to sleep because it's also kind of hard to get me up, but it's just, it's a weird thing. I don't want the day to end. Wow. So what's the average time you're sleeping like? I have like this,

I've decided I'm on a different sleep cycle. I've actually gone to sleep therapy for this. Like where you actually have to sleep inside of a sleep clinic and be like connected to all these notes to figure out what the hell's wrong with you. And according to that sleep expert, a physician actually, he actually informed me that some people are just on a different cyclical cycle.

I don't even know if that's proper English that I said right there, but that like, not every human was meant to be in a 24 hour cycle. And for me, he said mine's it's like more closer to like a 34. Whoa. So it's just, it's completely off. Like I'll go through like periods of time where I can sleep from like nine to 11 hours. I'm not kidding. And then just be awake for like 25. Holy crap. Not be tired at all. When I'm awake. They say like when you're awake for 24 hours, you lose some brain function. Um, I don't. In fact, I feel like as the day goes on and it moves forward, I start like thinking

about newer and brighter and bigger ideas to the point where I'm like jotting them down and I feel like my idea, like my scope of understanding the world just kind of like broadens as the day goes on. And the interesting thing is it happens more when the sun goes down. That is interesting. So you really are a night owl then. I'm a night owl. So you probably hit the tables late while everyone else is tired and you're wide awake.

I'm actually the person that's always the last to leave. I really am. I'm like, I hate to say this and you know, you never want to be the last person to leave a party. Like I'm always the last person. I probably am the only reason the gay man's one date. I decide to leave because I'll never leave when I'm winning, but I also won't leave when I'm, I'm losing.

Cause that's like a known thing. You don't usually when you're losing, if you're like stuck or what, what not. It's usually the people that are stuck that are still hanging with me, but I will, it has nothing to do with how much I win. I will win. I will get lucky in three pots and most like, you know, intelligent and disciplined human beings will leave. I won't, I'll just stay.

Cause for me, it's not, it's not about like how much I leave with, it's just for love of the game. And if there's one thing I realized about me, I just love poker so much it's hard to get me out. Wow. So you're just a fan of the actual game. I just am. And it's one of those really weird things where like, you know, I lived a, and I guess most people know this now, I'm not like your typical,

like just, I've been playing poker since I was like in my teens and now I'm in my 20s and I've decided to drop out of college and become like this poker player. I mean those guys have like the years of experience behind them. I'm the type of person that actually had a completely different career in this bio-pharmaceutical biotech industry where I thrived enough to have enough of a bankroll where I could finally see what I do that I love and really if the pandemic never happened I wouldn't even be playing poker full-time like I do right now. It really was that it gave me the opportunity

kind of honing on my hobby, one, being poker. And I realized that like, yeah, I've lived most of my life doing what made me money, which I actually did enjoy. I mean, I did pick a career I did enjoy. It's always fun to be doing really well in a career. So like, it's hard, but ultimately it was a golden handcuffs type of situation. You know, it's really nice once you buy your house

and you have everything you need, like you're kind of like, okay, I felt a little stuck and the pandemic happened at the right time for me where I realized that like, huh, well, you know what? They always say, if you're doing what you love, there's a way to monetize it. And I wasn't really thinking about monetizing it. I just had enough money, I guess, to lose at the time, which I hate to say. I mean, it's kind of

like a probably not the best thing to be saying. But at that time, and I'm definitely more wary about that now at that time, I wasn't thinking about like, this is going to cost me a lot because I'm jumping into a place where I probably don't belong. I was thinking about doing something I loved. And I and I realized that I was able to do it at the time. I didn't know how long it was going to last. It ended up obviously lasting a much longer time than I thought. But what I did realize is that if it's going to cost me a little bit, it's okay. Because I really enjoyed getting up every day and deciding when I wanted to get up

and when I wanted to sleep. And the other thing I realized is that like, I do love the game a lot. Doesn't matter what stakes it is. And it doesn't even matter if it's cash or tournaments. I like tournaments a little bit more, but they require a little bit more discipline as far as like. Looking for the ultimate online casino experience? Step into the BetMGM Casino app,

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Cash, you could just start and end whenever you want. And I love it so much. I could play online, live, whatever it is. I just love the game. I love it enough that I'm even expanding and learning mixed games and all kinds of different types of poker. That's a hot take.

I feel like people like the cash games more than tournaments. That's because they're kind of like the immediate gratification. They don't have like that discipline to do like the longevity of like the patient side. Yeah, Nick Airball. Yeah.

And there's also like a little bit like bankroll, I guess, like, bullyism kind of can come out in like cash games a little bit more. And the feeling of like, you don't have to get up and rebuy and, you know, get back in the line to do so you can just kind of sort of like add chips on and continue to play. And of course it's just the ability to decide

when you're done playing. And unless you're in a live stream, we're kind of committed to a certain time that you wanna be playing. But yeah, I think with cash games, there's a certain type that prefers that over tournament play, but really the best players are the ones that can do both.

Yeah, how do you feel about people that win a big hand and then they dip out of the table? Cause I see people get pissed off about that. I mean, those type of people just won't be invited back as often as they want to be. And I think that there is a certain type of like hidden sort of level of respect that everybody has to kind of they're secretly signing up for when they're invited to a game. And look, if you if you want to like, like won a lot of money and you don't, and you have no expectations of being back, you can be that guy.

But one thing I have learned about the poker community, because it is relatively small versus other industries, is that where it gets around. So you know, whether you owe someone money or you, you made like a, like a disrespectful move against somebody, like people do hear about it. People talk and you know, there's a lot of rumors, of course, they're not always accurately, you know, portrayed. You're not always accurately you know portrayed you're not always accurately portrayed there's a lot of like lies out there but there's just enough smoke where you might have to explain yourself and in another game or you just might

realize that you're not getting the invitation that you were getting before and and that's really shitty if this is your profession yeah well there's a lot of big youtube channels that cover drama poker drama yeah and they have a lot of big YouTube channels that cover drama, poker drama. Yeah. And they have a lot of power and influence, right? Yeah. I had my moments with them and they like, you know, I would see them at a certain like meet and greet or something. And I've had like, like Alex Duvall come up and like kind of apologize and sort of explained to me that that's just his MO and that's like how he navigates through the

poker world. And look, we are all kind of like, I mean, we're, we're, we're, we're all victim to a little bit, but we also are, you know, I am, I am somebody that has kind of like occasionally kind of graced like the, the topic of the hour, you know? Um, and I'm very grateful that somebody is enough of an investigation where you can kind of like make your own, um, determinations as far as what you believe about the issue at hand when it comes to poker drama. But poker drama, unfortunately is something that I realized and I hadn't realized is a big part of that industry. Um, and I feel like people get bored and they're just waiting for the next, next scandal. And there always seems to be a scandal, you know, whether it's like a cheating

scandal. Now there's like the whole like, you know, me too movement coming back around with what's happening in the poker community. And that's a lot to talk about. But the poker, unfortunately, the dark side and the side that I'm not too like proud of when it comes to me saying that I'm like kind of in this industry is, is the side that I feel like they people really kind of want to have this sort of avenue to troll and get the dirty on individuals that they might be a little envious towards. I think there's a lot of envy in the industry and the best way to release that sort of tension and feelings towards individuals is to sort of feed off of the drama of those that maybe annoyed you in the past and made more money than you,

unfortunately. So I feel like there's a lot of that in there. There's a huge discrepancy when it comes to like high stakes versus low stakes and those that have a seat at the table and those who do not. But the one thing that I find fascinating about the industry that's really interesting and like, I think is very, very cool is like, you know, it's just one of those things where like, you don't need a resume to play poker. It's not like a job that I have to interview for. All I need to do is find a seat at that table. And it just takes being a certain type of person

to get a seat at the table. It's not really that hard. As a woman, it's a lot easier. Right. Right. So that argument can absolutely be made, but you just want to have enough respect for the community to get a seat at the table, but you don't have to interview for it. And your resume doesn't need to be long. Yeah. I could see that envy because there's like a new era of these poker stars that are getting tons of views and these guys have been playing for years, not getting recognition. So they could be a little upset, right? Right. Yeah. I mean, look, old school poker is still something I find

fascinating. And I'm going back to the old books of mixed games, because the tried and true methods still do work today. But there are the newer methods and there's Daniel Negron, you can talk about this a little bit more, those guys that are playing to a certain level of competition where they realize that the theoretical approach or game theory is really something that everybody needs to be honing in on if they want to thrive. Because there's a lot of good poker players today. And that has to just do with technological advancements and also just people that are, we have some great coaches.

It's really hard to even recommend the right type of coaching site or coach to anybody because there's such, we have so many tools that we can, that are available to us now that you really could be a very, very, very good and possibly profitable enough poker player to thrive in the industry today. However, the competition is really fierce. And the ones that really, I think, can compete with the rest are those that are staying up to date with the newer methods of the theoretical approaches of the young people, because that's what they're learning. And you'll see that the younger guys are doing very, very well, especially online.

Right. That being said, technology has also created this alternative avenue and unfortunate concern for cheating online and stuff. And RTA is just the beginning, which is real time assistance. That's just the beginning. But now we have all these other issues that we have to be concerning of, like they've

taken away our phones and live streams. And I, I do feel like we're getting really close to a place where they might be like limiting the use of sunglasses and even taking away our phones during tournament play, which is going to be really detrimental to a lot of people, I'd be so bored. Oh my gosh. Absolutely lose my mind for if anything, it slows me down and it makes, keeps me from playing every hand, like I want to play, right.

Cause I have something else to kind of like do, but yeah, the, the last time guys fascinate me. If anything, it slows me down and it keeps me from playing every hand like I want to play. Right. Because I have something else to kind of like do. But yeah, the Livestream guys fascinate me. I played a lot of poker with them and I feel like those who embrace them that are of like the older generation like Phil Hellmuth, they're the people that are really going to see themselves also advancing because Livestream poker is the future because content creating is the future and the technological advancements that we have. And I feel like the AI first and foremost,

I think is a future. I mean, if there's anything that I find more fascinating than anything is AI and I'm curious to see how that's incorporated into the industry. Yeah, yeah. I mean, the Livestreamers are getting more views than almost anyone in the space, right? For sure.

Like even the World Series events, they were getting more views than the world series videos. Yeah. Cause the problem with the poker community is it's really niche. So those that like the top poker players, nobody really knows of outside of like in the mainstream world. And I'm talking more specifically outside of like the ones that we do know, which

are the old school kind of type of players that have been around since a really young age, like Daniel Nagranyu. Yeah. I feel like, and Phil Ivey, those are notable names that maybe people outside of the poker community know of. But outside of that, there's like, there are players that we know to be top of the line that nobody would have never even heard of in mainstream media, but they'll hear about the person that's doing, I don't even want to throw out names or anything like that, but like, I just saw a really young guy and like, I'm like, wow, he has like a lot of views and nobody in the poker community really knows about him, but

there needs to be some kind of like segue or some kind of like assimilation that we do have with the mainstream if we want the sport to grow. And I feel like those younger kids and even not even the young kids, just anybody who's interested in kind of doing the live streaming version of it and sort of like the YouTube version of the YouTube world of poker, I think that they're really going to find finally, we're finally going to see some kind of integration where more people know about poker than it's understood right now,

because you'll even see like the fame in the poker world is only in the poker world. You know, outside of Las Vegas, like most of the really well-known people in the poker community can go grocery shopping without being recognized. You walk into a casino and you're a very good poker player, you know, of course you're going to get hounded and ask for photos and everything like that. But it's kind of like nice to have that level of privacy in the public world. But I do feel like these live streamers that are kind of out there that maybe the poker community doesn't recognize or doesn't want to or refuses to recognize are the ones that are going to be recognized as poker players in the

mainstream world. Yeah. They probably get recognized more to be honest. Yeah, they do. And I feel like that's really fascinating. I think that those that can somehow incorporate the fact that this younger generation is more interested in integrating the outside world with the inside world of poker. I think that they're going to find like a higher level of happiness because happiness comes with acceptance than those that just choose to kind of like live in their own little poker worlds. The term of poker nerds came from that, right? If you want to be like a dorky poker nerd that just wants to live in your poker world and make a lot of money and do your thing.

And I mean, look, let's be honest, poker players, most of them don't really have the most like comforting and like good, like lovely presence about them that everybody wants to be around. Most of them are not the type of personalities that you wanna see talk. They're similar to chess players,

cause I play chess and I see a very similar mindset with both. Yeah, yeah. And you kind of have to have that, right? Like there's like a lot of them have, like in your, we were talking about this earlier, there's a lot of them that are really autistic players that are really, really good poker players.

You know, I have a cousin like that. And like, it's so wild. Like when I found out that he was autistic, I was thinking, oh my gosh, he should play poker. I mean, it's like, that was like the first inclination that I had, like that I thought that I had, which is really odd of me to think, but they have a way with numbers, not all of them,

it depends on what type of autism you have, but they tend to do really well because they tend to be quiet and really like see things. And there are certain skillsets that I think are very successful at the poker table that aren't in the real world. So you'll see those that are like the more sociable poker players that also are good enough at paying poker are the ones that kind of have more of a voice and a presence in

the poker community and outside of the poker community. And I'm just really curious to see where the industry kind of goes in the next 10 years or 15 years. I feel like we're going to see a lot of changes. And I think that where we're going to see growth is in those that can accept the technological advancements and the ways of thinking of the younger generation that's incorporating it more on like a public platform online. Absolutely. You were just on a poker reality TV show, right? Yeah, like I'm on a couple of poker reality type of TV shows. You always wonder what's

going to get picked up or not. But one of their main arguments, actually, it's a huge network, was, and we're still filming, was that poker is really boring to the world. So, you know, like at first I was thinking, I don't want to bring my personal life into it. And we all know that reality TV does obviously include a personal life, but they had never done that before. They never actually took a poker player and had them like, what does their life look like?

Their family lives, their lives with their spouses and loved ones. What does that world look like outside of a poker player schedule, which is really outlandish and seems really absurd to those that kind of live on a basic nine to five life. And they're like, no, we need to incorporate this type of understanding of how you live your life, because nothing else is interesting about you guys.

I was like, you know, and I don't blame them. And there's also the other idea, like, I've had people come, but just wanted to come to a game with me. I don't know how bored they would be. Like when I'm playing in a poker game and I'm sitting at the table, I'm having the time of my life. Like for me, whether I'm losing or winning, I don't even realize that an hour went by. But for somebody watching you, every minute is like the most painful long minute of their life. They're adrenaline junkies, right? Yeah, so you have to think about that. Why would anybody wanna see that on TV?

So I understood when they said that, unfortunately I do have to incorporate like my personal life in order to become more interesting to like a mainstream audience. And I do feel like that like my personal life in order to become more interesting to like a mainstream audience and I do feel like that's probably gonna be making the biggest moves because I Think for those that don't understand the life of a poker player Like the poker playing aspect might be interesting, but it's like how do you incorporate these really odd schedules into? into your like daily life and of course that generates a lot of drama for any of your loved ones because they don't understand our weird hours

and not really being able to tell them when we're gonna be coming home. Right, MTV Cribs. So you let them inside the house? I let them inside the house. I know. I was like, oh, this sucks. My dogs would have hated that.

Oh, you know what? They let my dogs roam freely and be part of it because I did say that. And I do even bring one of my dogs to the poker table all the time. Oh yeah. Yeah. And look, they were friendly and everything, but of

course you've got like a 10 man crew in your house and, uh, even in your car. Right. So like there is that part of it is a little unnatural, but the conversations you have are real and it's, and they are real, um, issues that we deal with, with our loved ones. And, you know, people always wonder and something that even came to light is like, why don't more

women play poker? And you really get to see that side of it because I don't have children, but I know that if I did, it would be really difficult to be a poker player, especially since like some tournaments can last two hours or 14 hours. And if you have somebody, you really have to have a lot of support at home.

If, you know, like if you're a mother and what not. So I can see like, you'll see why there is a little bit more of a disparity when you get into the lives of others that play poker because I think that's where the divide is when it comes to more men playing poker than women, which unfortunately is still something that the industry really grapples with. We have a really, really hard time growing the sport in women.

I think we've made some advancements, but not, it hasn't happened as quickly as the amount of funding that's going into it has. Yeah, I've been perplexed by that. I think with Kristen Foxen's run this year, it might change a little bit, but we'll see. Yeah. I mean, she's one of the best poker players. I think it would have been, it would have made, it would have done volumes if she had made it to the final table. She was very close. But yeah, everybody knows the best poker players that are women. And everybody kind of knows any poker player that's well known for whatever reason, that's a woman. Because one, there's not that many of us. And I don't know what the statistic is. It's somewhere like 4% to 8% max, 8% being on like top of the line

that even played in like the World Series of poker. I think it was closer to four this year, which is unfortunate. So like, it is interesting. Like when I sit at a table and there's another woman, it's almost like we know each other, but we do tend to usually know each other. I've been playing like long enough now

that I almost know every poker player that I sit with that is a woman. And so it's like you get excited. It shouldn't be like that. It should be that there's like, you know, it's 50-50 at every table, but it just isn't the case. But I think when you see the reality side of what it's like to kind of like incorporate poker

into your personal life, which is what you see in this reality show, you'll see like the difficulty of being a woman in the industry versus a man. Yeah, I'll check that show out for sure. So you said you made your money in biotech, biopharmaceutical. What was that about? Well, I was on the business side of it. So you said you made your money in biotech, biopharmaceutical. What was that about?

Well, I was on the business side of it. And so I come from a family that really stress the importance of education. It's all doctors and physicists. My dad is literally a physicist and my mom's a physician. And so they really, I grew up in an environment where education was first and foremost. And so of course, I had to take a certain route. I didn't want to be a physician at the time.

I remember I also disappointed my dad that I didn't want to take a science route. So I picked like a more business approach of that. And I, you know, I did everything my parents wanted to do. You go to a really good college, you get your masters. And I jumped into the world of the biopharmaceutical industry of creating drugs primarily in cancer when I left. And it was interesting because it was very innovative and fascinating, and the lobbying

side of it really intrigued me. But like I said, the doors did close during the pandemic, and I realized that I was living a very systematic kind of private life that I couldn't make very public because you're working for a big corporation that's creating new drugs. So I learned a lot from that. And I think that one of the things that people are really perplexed by when, um, somebody comes out of nowhere, when they even play poker is that like, you know, there's two different poker players.

There's the ones that start from, like I said, at a young age, and then those that might even be interested in coming a little bit later on the ones that come later, bring a different experience. Like it doesn't really matter, um, how many years you played. It's really like the level, like the experience to bring at the table. And I learned a lot in my experience in a completely different industry that helped me have the level of confidence

that I did when I played poker. People wonder like, how did you jump to the high stakes? Didn't matter for me. I wasn't concerned with like the stress or the pressure of other players. I could have cared less if you're a big name. I really didn't even know if anybody was. And if they were, it didn't matter to me because I created a name for myself in a different

industry. So I knew what it already took to be like somebody from the bottom and working your way up to the top in a completely different industry. And for me, bringing that experience to any new industry wasn't going to change my level of confidence and thinking that I could thrive in it because I'd already done it. So, you know, kind of having that level of experience behind me is I think why I kind of accelerated a little bit faster than others would. So that's what I love about poker too. It doesn't matter what age you are and who you are, you can come in at any time and thrive. You just have to have kind of like the confidence to be sitting at the table with anyone who thinks that they're better than you. And it's okay if you're the worst person at the table, if you've got a seat, it's about being able to survive.

Were you winning right away though? I think I had what you call beginner's luck. Ah, classic. And I jumped, like, you know, like, but listen, there's a lot of people that like grew during the pandemic and then they kind of fell off the face of the earth because those skill sets worked then and their environment kind of fostered whatever they were doing at the time. And I think I'm thinking more of like certain content creators that really could offer nothing less and people just started talking a little bit less. There's also other apps that kind of just like fell apart

like Clubhouse and stuff. I remember, yeah. Everyone was like on Clubhouse, right? But it didn't work in the real world because now we had interaction with each other physically. And during the pandemic, I was playing in games that were really, really easy because it was games that were near me and individuals that were now don't have the time to play poker that weren't very good at it. So when I got lucky, I got lucky amongst those that were okay with spending their money playing a game that they weren't really good at. And me having been brand new at the like really really playing at that state, at those stakes and at that level where I was able to find what I felt was like easy success at the time.

You know, I got luckier than most and I wasn't much. My competition wasn't that difficult. And then I came into the real world where everybody else came out of the woodworks. And I realized, like, wow, I should probably study. Yeah. And even now it's, you know, I realized like, wow, I should probably really study. Yeah. Um, and even now it's, um, you know, I, I get like, uh, I really think about the importance of studying and I have a whole, I've always had a high level of respect for those that have put in the hours and the time, but it's really like those that have played a lot more hands, just do better at the game.

Um, so there's that understanding that you need to have of the game. And if I'm gonna sit at a bigger game, I do wanna be a little bit more steady than I used to be in the past. Yeah. So COVID, were you wearing masks too, when you were playing then? We were supposed to be, yeah.

I feel like that's a controversial thing I see on Twitter now. So there are those that continue to wear masks, and they'll use that as like COVID or like the concern of having it like not spreading disease or getting it from anybody as like an advantage. Because of course, you're, you're giving away, like you're limiting any tells that you could potentially give away. Isaac, I think is one of the ones. Yeah, I didn't want to name them.

I know, but like at the end of the day, can I be honest with you? He'd probably be just as good without it. You think so? Yeah, he's, he was a phenomenal poker player before. I don't think that it takes, it might be irritating to those and something to talk about. He gets so much hate for it. It's crazy. He does get hate for it. And I'll be honest with you, I don't even know what he looks like in real life. Because when I started playing poker, he was wearing a mask. That's funny. But yeah, you're right though. He was good before, but. Yeah, he was really good before. So like if you'd have to literally do an experiment where you put like Isaac like without a mask or would like take his last three years and somehow convince him not to wear a mask in the next three years and then do like a comparative experiment as far as like how what a success rate is. But then there's so many other obstacles and like other control issues that come into play that you couldn't really do it adequately. But that being said, I feel like it's one of those things that gives people a reason to talk,

but he was a phenomenal player before. And if he wants to wear a mask, you let him wear a mask. It's the same with something like- I know Ivy's against those and sunglasses, I believe as well. Yeah, sunglasses I can see. I just saw a commercial on Ray Vans that have a camera and I thought like, oh my gosh, you can't wear that.

But then I thought, wow, that's really good for a content creator. Like these Ray Vans that have a camera and you can like, Oh my gosh, you can't wear that. But then I thought, wow, that's really good for content creator. Like these Ray Vance that have like a camera and you can watch, you know, like you're watching it. And instead of having to have your like camera out and whatever, you could just record it. But then you might capture something that somebody might say is like, gives you an advantage over others or like, nobody, not everybody wants to be recorded at the poker to poker table. They don't want their faces shown or whatnot. But I can see where sunglasses can end up being a little bit of an issue. But there's issues with even contact lenses now that people can see certain things. We just have so many different methods of concern

that can come out the poker table. I think it's really just about controlling the controllables and not worrying about the fact that we can't be above technological advancements. We just have to somehow incorporate them into our lives. But we can't take away every resource that a human being needs to survive. And unfortunately, having your phone is one of those things that I think I would absolutely freak out about if they took that away in the tournament setting. If you want me to wear sunglasses, sure, I don't give a shit. I don't need to wear sunglasses. It's not like the sun is shining. Are they taking it away because of that main table drama that happened? Well, even if you think about live streaming,

we can't have phones when we live stream. It's always something that has to happen for a certain thing to be taken away from us. right? Like, unfortunately, that's just the way life is. Like, even if you think about like plane crashes or something bad has to happen for somebody to bring light to the fact that we need to wear seatbelts when we drive. Um, multiple accidents have to happen before we realize that we need airbags, you know, things like that. So unfortunately it's that part hasn't changed.

And it took somebody like literally utilizing their phone to supposedly cheat for phones to be taken away from a live streaming perspective and then now you even know that there's a time delay and everything so I don't know if it's gonna take a specific incident for that to happen for it to be taken away but the argument can be made that there are certain advantages and certain things people can do on their phone of course that might work in their favor while they're playing poker it's just it's a really like a heavy thought to think that that could be something that they take away.

Or maybe they just give us like, maybe they just control our phones in such a way that we're only able to listen to music. Yeah, open certain apps, right? Yeah, and that could be, it's gonna be one of those things we're just gonna have to like, I guess it's gonna get more jobs, you know?

Yeah, so that happened on a live stream, someone got caught using their phone. That's why we can't have phones on a live stream and why there's a- What was he doing, using a solver? It was before my time, and like, look, I was also accused of cheating on a live stream as well, and I think it was a story right before mine,

but like from what I'm told, there was multiple hours and multiple games where it was very evidently clear that he looked down at his phone every time. And he had a really high win rate. He had a really high win rate. Yeah, I think I saw this actually.

And it actually ended that live stream completely. So there was that concern, like we have a scandal going on right now at the Hustler Casino Live about whether the recent scandal, like regarding like sexual harassment and stuff is gonna end that livestream. But I really think it's about like coming ahead and having a conversation with the world about it. Because the one thing that that particular casino up north didn't do was they didn't address it with like the public that was watching their livestream.

And they just try to like ignore it, got rid of the player and move on. And it was that level of like, I guess, like disconnect with the world, that made them lose their live stream altogether. And then Hustler Casino showed up and thrived. They were the first ones to do it right. Yeah, you gotta take accountability, right? Yeah, for sure. If you're providing the setting.

I think Ryan did do that, the other producer. I was- I think they'll come back. He's been pretty on top of it, right? I mean, it's just the best live stream right now. Look, I mean, I think they'll, I think they'll come back. He's been pretty on top of it, right? I mean, it's just the best live stream right now. Look, I mean, I haven't been back on it. I haven't been, I haven't asked to go back on it. I don't think that I would be allowed back on it unless like maybe

Garrett was allowed back on it. He's definitely not going back. Did they kick both of you out? How did that work? I know that he's not allowed to go back. I'm, my assumption is that I am not, I I'm purposely not asking. I, I don't have any desire to, there's still some level of PTSD that I have, like even walking into that casino, but I never really walked into that casino before.

So I'm not like really missing out on anything. The only reason I even walked into Hustler Casino altogether, cool casino was because of the live stream. So I played three live streams and then the hand happened and I was out. So I haven't asked and I think I just don't want to put him in a position where he'd have to say no or yes or have to kind of grapple with the idea of like, what do I do if she comes back and maybe one day it will happen. I think it might happen. It's just a matter of it being like the right time

that it happens. And I know it would cause a lot of chaos. Yeah. It reminds me of a, I don't know if you followed chess, but do you know Hans Nieman? Yes, of course. Yeah. You remind me of that story, you know, where he got accused and then nothing ever, no evidence came about. And now he's like back in the tournament and he's crushing it. Yeah, he's crushing it. Like it's one of those things like it was a one-off. And the same with like my, like my situation, it was a one-off. If there was other incidences of where it looked really clear, I think it would be more of an issue. And like, look, the debate can be made like, you know, of the fact that like, oh, it made me bigger and it bettered my career, whatever it made me more notable in the world. But I didn't ask for

it. I just embraced whatever had happened. And it was hard in the beginning, but I'm at a point now where I'm like, wow, it's so crazy that that can happen to somebody. And you can take what was originally seen as like, it was just so shocking at the time. And I just, I created an opportunity out of it. And it didn't, what's more than interesting is that it didn't take the love of the game out for me. If anything, I was really sad if I'd have to like never play, I knew I would always be playing poker, but like to be as invited and welcome back in every, in any game all the time, uh, is, it was like a really comforting part of it. And then also to see that I had like so many supporters out there that wanted me to continue

playing and sharing my story was very cool. It was wild to see the change in support during that because at first someone's everyone sided with one side and then it like everyone side with you and then it kept going and forth I've never seen that in a in a battle you know you always hear like the the truth is stranger than fiction and I feel like that's what sort of happened in the beginning there was like I know I lost a lot of supporters on like that situation when Brian what's his face came and they found out that the 15k was off my stack because I was just kind of like a weird part of it that didn't really make sense.

And it's just one of those things if you really look at like I'm a documentary junkie and documentaries are far more interesting than fictional stories. Because the truth is always stranger than fiction. There's a part of me that just doesn't understand why those certain elements did happen in that particular case that were only really like discovered during the investigation. But it really just was coincidence. And it's, it changed like this whole flow. But like, I don't, I don't know if it's just the way that I've set up my social media. All I see is supporters. Really? Yeah. No, I mean, to be fair, same, because at first it was all hate. Like when it first happened, all hate.

And I'm sure you dealt with that. And it was tough on you mentally. And then I saw it like completely turn over time. Right, it's so crazy. When there's no physical evidence or whatever. There's nothing. It's been a year now, right? For sure, and like, I think that one thing

that I didn't realize, and I didn't even do it purposely, I feel, and people always wonder like, when you're telling the truth about something, do you stay quiet or do you fight? And I was a fighter. I was like, I am not gonna let the world think this of me. And I came out and I started fighting and I didn't realize it about myself. You know, you always hear about like the fight, flight or like, you know, like freeze type of response. And for me, I just fought it because it was, that was like my character that was being

put into question and nobody knew me in the poker industry. I mean, some, of course there was a huge number of people that did because I'd been playing already for a year. But those that were like accusing me, they didn't know anything about me. And I felt like a very strong need to kind of defend my character and who I am as a person, even though the ones people that matter to me already knew that, you know, the truth, but for me, like the whole world was attacking me. And I was like, hell no, I'm not going to do this, especially since I know my truth and I know that I didn't cheat and this is bullshit. It's not fair that I'm treated this way for something I didn't do.

Hats off to you, cause I've had some haters make videos about me and I don't respond. I don't know if that's the right method, but I feel like- It is the right method. I will say, I just did a reality show on USA, Peacock. It's still going, I was eliminated already, episode five. And it's a very cool reality show called The Anonymous game show, obviously competitive. And we had a lot of therapy going through that

show, especially coming off of that show, which I found really fascinating that they had that because I didn't think that I really needed it. I was already kind of in the limelight as far as it comes to the criticism that I had already received from my experience. And I brought a different type of experience to the contestants. There were some big name contestants on there. Like they had like Xavier who had one big brother and whatnot. But the one thing I did realize is that like people need to get some kind of assistance when it comes to like the social media, like disrespect that can come from being like a

public figure out there. And we had psychiatrists that really walked us through, how do you deal with the comments the negative comments about you? And for me it was like I felt like I was just giving advice you just ignore it I know individuals that have hired a media team and I did do this in the beginning I hired a media team for like three weeks or whatnot and realized like I don't need them anymore To go through all the negative comments delete them block the individual Wow Because at the time was just a lot of heavy weight on me. Now I just laugh at them. I have this need to almost respond to them. And I do know that if I respond, I give them waiting, especially if

you have a certain presence anymore, that comment's going to go to the top. So they're going to get what they want, which is to get you to respond. But I have fun with it now and it's more comical to me than it was in the beginning. And I'm not offended literally at all. And it's such a crazy... I don't know if it's like, I woke up one day and I didn't give a shit anymore, but I feel like that's the way that you can thrive is just to absolutely come to a place with yourself where you just don't give a shit. Because it's like, those people will always be significantly less than those that support and are on your side. And it's the ones that I think that get affected by the ones that are saying the negative things

that see themselves incapable of continuing to have a public presence in the world. Yeah, that's a great headspace to be in. It took some time for me to get there as well. At first, I used to let the comments get to me. Now I literally, I got thousands of hate last week comments because I had on this political episode and I was getting roasted and stuff, but didn't even affect me. I mean, like, but like your job isn't to know the person, everything about the person that you're obviously interviewing because at the end of the day, they're on their further level

of expertise that you can't have. You can't be the jack of all trades. Well, it was just a super liberal guy, and my audience is pretty conservative. Yeah, I can see that. And you know, like, one of the things that I was told was, like, never make it political. And you know, it's so, because all Twitter is. Like, the poker community communicates the most on the world of Twitter.

And you just, like, it's so irritating to see that, like, there are those that just completely thrive on, like, their political perspectives. And of course, they have the following that follows them. And I actually just threw out like a silly tweet or something like my vote doesn't count because I knew that it would just get people frigging like up in arms and at the bottom I was like, if you actually believe me, you're an idiot. Just like see it. And I do feel like it's really fascinating how much that can divide us. So I try really, really hard just to stay away from the

political arena. It's hard to do, everyone has an opinion, but I think that's probably one of the best ways to create 50% of people hating you because- Oh, it's the quickest way. ... it's that divided. That or gender. There's a small percentage that exists in their own independent platform, but we all really can only be voting for one of the two candidates. I can't wait till this election period is over because I'm so tired of talking about it and I, and I feel like I don't want to dismiss anybody that asks me about my perspective, but I also just don't want to have that debate.

And I feel like there's just no winner in the end and it can only make you look worse. Yeah. You probably get asked that daily. I do. They're like, why don't you like what with your platform worse. Yeah, you probably get asked that daily. I do. They're like, why don't you, like, with your platform and your voice, like, what do you want me to do? Do you know what I mean? Like, I even, to be perfectly honest, I'm like curious.

I'm not voting. It's come down to the point where you're almost like voting for the more intelligent candidate. I wish we had that out of other options, you know, or like, you know, when I was in the world of the biopharmaceutical industry, I wanted to go towards the individual that supported innovation and research. And that always kind of like leaned heavily on the Republican side.

Because I was all about creating new drugs to finally find a cure for cancer, you know, and like, I got attacked for evil pharma, do you know, you know, like this and that and stuff, everyone has a perspective, there's only so much we can do. It's like often like when my dad says, like when I was younger and I was like, dad, like, I'm not gonna like if I donate this dollar to charity, it's all gonna go to the, you know, the person that created sure we don't know where it's gonna go. It's like even if one penny goes to the person that actually needs it, that's one penny more than zero. So there's only so much we can do as human beings. All I can do is at least pick the candidate that supports the industry and

my belief systems a little bit more and can make sure certain laws are in place that might support that. I'm all about innovation. I think Elon Musk is a hero. Some people see him as this evil source. I'm going heavy and deep into AI right now. So I'm going to support the candidate that I feel like supports AI and innovation and development. And like we're in a very advanced digital stage. So it's less about like what party I'm part of. It's more about like who supports my ideology moving forward. Yeah. You're a rare breed out here in Cali voting for the, the team, man. I mean, like I haven't even decided yet. And that really is what it comes down to. I, um, it's, but like, again, like where it's the electoral vote is very different than popular votes. So then there's that concern of like, well, you can have certain belief

systems and whatnot, but I'm not going to change the world by my votes. Um, all I can do is like kind of support, my interests are and if my interest is in technological advancement, I'm kind of going like the Elon Musk route because I feel like what he's doing is huge and I want to be a part of that movement. Would you get one of those robots you just released? Absolutely, I'd be the first ones. I'm a little skeptical of those. You know like you always hear people saying like we're being replaced by robots and like I hate to, but like, there's a certain level of ignorance that has to come to those that actually believe that robots are going to replace human beings. I feel like that there's like a, these people have like the same predisposition into thinking like technological advances are going

to take over our minds as they did when computers came out. When computers came out, yeah, it took away some jobs that are also created a phenomenal job known as coding that has been one of the most like, like, like, like, in demand positions of all time, people wish that they got back into coding. If you want to be part of like that dream that coders people wish when like, you know, people started coding back in the day, you can be part of that movement now because we need AI prompters. Like we need support to get AI moving. Like AI is an AI unless you prompt it to be AI, right? Right now.

And there's going to be a new like herd of individuals that have skill sets that we absolutely need in order for AI to thrive. Like chat GPT doesn't work unless you prompt it to work. Really nothing does. Like I'm like heavy on AI animation right now. I had absolutely no interest growing up when I was growing up when it came to film. I suck at content creating.

I've paid content creators more than a teacher's salary to create content for me. And I can't even give them the video that they would need to create the content. I've had people working for me for free. That's how much I dislike content creating. But what I realized that I do like that I never thought that I liked before was like creating AI images and AI animation. And I was never really interested in that before. So I think that the other interesting thing about the AI

movement is that it's creating more skill sets and individuals that may not have been interested in like the basic like film work before right for me that's what it was I love technology and somehow incorporated it into art and I when I wake up I think of two things I think of like AI and I think about poker I really do and those are the two things I think about and and and I like, like moan and huff and puff through like any content that I have to do. But I've also realized that I'm better off doing my content on my own because I work at my own pace and it's got really costly to pay others to do something that I wasn't giving them anything to do. So the fascinating thing I think about like the advancements and the opportunities that we have today is I really do believe that in society right now as we speak, everybody has something to offer because people always worry about their purpose

and their place in life. I do not think that robots are something to be concerned about. I think that we, instead of looking at it as a threat, we have to look at it as an opportunity. And I think that actually, the higher intelligence is heavily weighed on those that see opportunity over a threat in any endeavor that we have to face. We can't get rid of AI, we can't get rid of technological advancements in this very advanced digital stage, but we can learn to incorporate it

and we can monetize it, monetize from it heavily. And you could do it from the confinements of your home. We already learned during the pandemic that we can make so from the confinements of your home. You know, like we already learned during the pandemic that we can make so much money within the walls of our house. Like it should be a blessing that you're able to be, uh, do anything online. And you wouldn't be able to do without

technology within the confinements of your home. Robots aren't something to be scared of. There's something that we should incorporate and find, and we just need to find our place in the society. I do feel like everybody has a certain skill set. And if you don't know your purpose, you just have to figure out what it is that you absolutely love doing. Because there's a 100% of way to monetize from that. If you just incorporate like this tools that we have today to help you get there. Like for me, I loved art, but

I didn't love it enough to pick up a paintbrush. The moment it was available to me through this like AI kind of like avenue, I was, I'm able to do that whenever I want, however I want and monetize from it when people look at my like animation, because right now it's still the very beginning. And everybody has those tools out there discretion. All you have to do is watch a bunch of YouTube, which is literally what I did. YouTube University, baby. You can monetize anything these days. You're going to get a neurolink, aren't you? What's that? That's the chip Elon Musk made. And now like what? Like Mark of the Beast and all this kind of crazy shit. I've always thought from

the very beginning that there would be a lot less kidnapping. So if everybody just got a microchip in them, like we do dogs. Dogs get it. But dogs are different, right? Like the microchips don't actually work until somebody delivers your dog to the vet, and then they're able to see who the owner is. So unfortunately, with all the crime that's in this world, which is kind of, it's not as rampant as it used to be, of course, because of DNA, thank God. I think there's a lot less serial killers, so to speak,

and like that actually is true. But I do feel like we could really limit a lot of crime that we're facing if we're able to track individuals. Like it sounds like I'm talking about like a black mirror episode. And it's so unfortunate because of course there's like, like when I robot came out that Will Smith movie, like, yeah, it can go wrong.

It can absolutely go wrong. If you look at the dark web, for example, it was created for espionage and it was only a way for method, a method for, you know, everybody to communicate, kind of underground with absolutely no way of figuring out anyone's IP address. And like now it's utilized for, you know, like the black market for organs and trade and everything. And it is important, the worst, obviously trafficking, sex trafficking and everything. So it is unfortunate that we could take like a technological advancement and we've just lost

control of it in a way. But like if that's going to happen inevitably, you've got to figure out a way to, to find a way to incorporate that in a more positive light and then incorporate in a way that you can monetize from it so that it doesn't feel like a threat, but it feels like an opportunity. Yeah, I'd love to see you sit down with Liv Bourrée and talk AI with her. She's a little frightened.

Is she against it or for it? She's both. Okay. Yeah, I think she's a little scared of it, but I think she sees the benefit as well. Yeah, I think we have to see the benefit of it because it's one of those things it's like, I mean, I'd rather have, I don't know,

a septic tank today than a hole in the ground like we did like a hundred years ago, right? Like we have to appreciate the technological advancements that we've had and we have to appreciate that this is all done because of us and our level of intelligence. Like AI was created through the human mind. So if you appreciate your own intelligence and you appreciate that it is survival of the fittest and you are a fit individual. How can you not survive in an AI world that you created? I use it daily.

It's helped me a lot. Absolutely. I mean, I don't even Google anymore. I used to Google things. I just asked chat, chat, Google has been, it's, it's compromised. Yeah. Obviously the top results are like either paid for or influenced by someone. Yeah.

Like I just, and look, it's not perfect. It's actually really far from perfect. Even if you look like animation, like every human somehow has six fingers and it's irritating. So it's like, obviously, but like the amount that it is developing is insanity. There's a guy I follow and he always has some kind of like new product or new program that has come. And it's usually given by like Adobe, one of like one of the bigger people, but look, there's a lot going on in Silicon Valley as far as the new apps and the new programs and platforms that are being put into place right now that are going to help us just better and ease our lives. This is supposed to make our life easier. It is. It's crazy. A robot's going to be able to cook for you. It's going to be able to do anything for you.

And I will be the first person to own a robot as soon as that's made available. And I think it's only $20,000. Elon's making like, he already like, they kind of like, I don't know if they like launched it, but they- I think it launched, yeah. Yeah, it's only a $20,000 robot.

Let me know, let me know how it goes. Maybe down the road I'll get one. I got a Tesla eventually, so. Exactly. And it's just a $20,000 robot. Let me know how it goes. Maybe down the road I'll get one. I got a Tesla eventually, so. Exactly. And it's just like the Tesla movement. How can you be upset about driverless cars when we ourselves, if you just look at the data, we're far more dangerous behind the wheel

than driverless. 100%. Well, texting and driving is probably, and drunk driving. I mean, it's insanity. And like, I don't understand why everyone is so fearful. It looks strange and it's something that you have to get comfortable with like seeing and, and used to seeing, but it really should, if you just look at the data, I mean, you, the, the safety measures when it comes to letting like the computer run our lives is,

is like far more like, I think that it's not only safe for the younger generations to come, but I just feel like it supports anything that we've always wanted to do that we feel like we've never had the capabilities or access to doing. So I cannot even seem to understand those that feel like that we're going to be replaced. If anything, the parts of us that are going to be replaced are the parts that needed to. And that's like our inability to stay like attentive at a task that demands our attention like driving, especially in a in like a highly like computerized world where we are spending most of our time on social media, like we have to let somebody else take the wheel. And if it's an AI individual, we're going to be leading much safer

and like even productive lives because we're finally we can finally distract ourselves to doing what we want to do and not be 100% on point when it comes to tension. Absolutely. Robbie, it's been fun. Where can people find you and keep up with you? Well, obviously social media. I'm Robbie J. Lu almost on everything. And I'm playing a lot of poker. But of course, like I do have this like love for technology. So I do want to somehow incorporate that world into my poker playing. We'll link your socials below.

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