Digital Social Hour - Being $25M in Debt, Beefing with Dave Ramsay + Getting Death Threats | Sam Primm DSH #269

Episode Date: February 6, 2024

Sam Primm comes on the show to discuss why is in so much debt, how he got into beef with Dave Ramsay and reveals his plans to scale outside of the St. Louis real estate market. APPLY TO BE ON THE PODCAST: https://forms.gle/qXvENTeurx7Xn8Ci9 BUSINESS INQUIRIES/SPONSORS: [e-mail] SPONSORS: Opus Pro: https://www.opus.pro/?via=DSH Deposyt Payment Processing: https://www.deposyt.com/seankelly LISTEN ON: Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/digital-social-hour/id1676846015 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5Jn7LXarRlI8Hc0GtTn759 Sean Kelly Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/seanmikekelly/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

wants people to invest in real estate. That's amazing. When I saw Trump pay zero, I was like, dude, I'm doing something wrong. Well, he maybe does it wrong too. But yeah, no, there's a lot of power in real estate and just getting those assets. They say when the US housing market sneezes,

the world gets a cold just because the entire world economy boils down to the US real estate market. Seriously? Wherever you guys are watching this show, I would truly appreciate it if you follow or subscribe. It helps a lot with the U.S. real estate market. Seriously? Wherever you guys are watching this show, I would truly appreciate it if you follow or subscribe. It helps a lot with the algorithm. It helps us get bigger and better guests, and it helps us grow the team. Truly means a lot. Thank you guys for supporting, and here's the episode.

Welcome back to the show, guys. I'm your host as always, Sean Kelly. Got with me a real estate expert, Sam Prim. How's it going? It's going well, man. Excited to be here. Excited to get this kicked off on probably the most boring guest you've ever had, but that's okay. People can relate to boring. Nah, there's been some, I wouldn't say boring, but definitely some, what's that word? Monotone? Okay. You're not monotone. No, I won't do that. I'll fluctuate my voice as much as you want. Yeah, so we're off to a good start there, but what's new in the real estate world?

Is the market kind of weird still? The market's a little bit weird. So it's still a really strong market in most areas. Real estate is cyclical, but it's also, you know, it's not just the whole United States. Every market's a little bit different. So most markets are still strong. I'd say over half the markets are still above average as far as strength goes. So it's a good market still. Yeah. I noticed Vegas isn't dropping, man. Not very many places are dropping. The only places that are dropping are on the far coast, and it's usually just the higher dollar volume houses,

not the mid-level houses. Those aren't falling. Right. So is it true you're $25 million in real estate debt right now? I'm about $26 million in debt, Sean. Dude. $26 million in debt. I owe banks like $140,000 every single month.

Oh, my gosh. How are you sleeping at night? I sleep like a baby. I sleep like an absolute baby. As soon as my head hits the pillow, I am out, get my good seven hours and I'm up at it again. I need to understand like this whole debt thing. Cause on, it sounds bad when I, when we talk about it, but what exactly does that mean? So if you get into like consumer debt, like buying, you know, borrowing money for a car or a boat or to do something stupid with, of course, that's bad. But I borrow money to buy assets.

And if you don't have the money, like I didn't, when I got started, I didn't have enough money to invest in real estate. So I borrowed money to invest in real estate. So if I'm, simply put, if I'm borrowing money to buy an asset that produces cash, I take the cash that asset produces and pay off who I borrowed the money from. I'm out no money and I own the asset. It's how the world really works. It's how Zuckerberg started Facebook, got involved in Tesla, how he bought X. He didn't pay his own cash for X. Apple sits on $200 billion in cash and they're in $100 billion in debt. So as long as you're borrowing money to buy an asset, then it's a good thing as long as you're managing that asset well, especially if you don't come from money, because I sure as hell didn't come from money. Interesting. So how did you go about that first borrow? People watching this are looking to borrow some money. What's the process?

So I went to a private lender. You can go to a hard money lender as well. So you're going, you're finding like a distressed house is what I did. I found a house that needed work, and I borrowed money to fix up that house. And then I took it to a bank and I took a loan from the bank to pay back who I borrowed the money from. So there's some nuances to it, but it's not super complicated. As long as you're buying something at a discount, there's enough equity in there that you're able to pay back who you borrowed the money from. Got it. And how long did it take you to make that first million with real estate? I'd say probably about a year and a half. Every single house that I bought had 20 to $20,000

to $40,000 worth of equity. So I just had to buy 15 to 20 houses to get to that million. And the cool thing about it is that first house, even after two years, had gone up in value five or 10 grand. And the debt had been paid down by the renter five or 10 grand. So every single house that I buy, the equity grows every single day. So I make about $10,000 a day without doing anything because I own almost $50 million worth of real estate. It goes up in value a little bit every day, and the mortgage gets paid down a little bit every single day, plus tax-free cash flow. But that's the beautiful thing about real estate is if you're buying something that produces cash, like I said, you take the cash to pay it off. So you get the appreciation,

plus you get the debt pay down. And if you do that enough times, you can really make a lot of money. Wow, that's a good life, waking up to 10 Gs every day. Yeah, without having to do a thing. Can't complain there. I mean, that's enough to just retire at that point. Yeah, and I'm kind of an idiot too, so imagine someone smarter than me, what that could do. Why would you say you're an idiot? Like, were you bad in school growing up?

No, I wasn't. I just kind of like to have a little self-deprecating humor. But I'm not, like, super, like, smart. Like, I don't, like, can't, like, compute things, and I'm not, like to have a little self-deprecating humor, but I'm not like super like smart. Like I not, you know, I don't like, can't like compute things and I not like super good technology. I just work hard and figured out that buying assets is the way that 90, whatever percent of people create wealth. Unless you're Dave. Right. Let's talk about Dave. Cause he, Dave Ramsey went at you. What exactly happened? So he basically, I guess he saw one of my videos where I talk about my $25 million in debt.

Shout out to today's sponsor, NordVPN, my personal favorite VPN. You can change your virtual location very easily with Nord with one click and sometimes even zero click if you want to have on auto connect. It's got amazing speed. It's probably one of the fastest VPNs out there in my experience. And you can use one Nord account on six devices to make sure the whole fan is taken care of. You can also use it to avoid price discrimination so you can see if certain products or services are cheaper in other areas or regions, which I have personally used on flights and believe it or not, I've saved some money. You can also use it to secure your connection, protect yourself from hackers,

especially in public locations like airports, hotels, etc. You can make sure you're safe there. It's supported on every major platform. Windows, Android, iOS, etc. So don't worry about where you can use it. They got you taken care of. You can get an exclusive deal at the link in the description. NordVPN.com slash DHS. If you're listening on audio, we will link it in the video. It's risk-free with Nord's 30-day money-back guarantee.

Check it out, guys. It's risk free with North 30 day money back guarantee. Check it out guys. And it's a pretty good hook for videos, right? I'm in $25 million worth of debt. Most people are going to watch the rest of that video. So I've done that, you know, a couple handful of times and I guess he saw one of them and on his show, somehow it got brought up and he's like, Yeah, that guy holding the baby on his hip says in $25 million worth of debt. He's a liar. I don't need to FBI trained trained detective and he he went at me for like five minutes so it allowed me to respond you know

everybody responds to dave about his death but i could respond saying he called me out so he punched down and allowed me to punch up which is a lot better place to be so i have nothing against dave but he he definitely has this hardcore following this hardcore belief that all that is bad and a funny thing about that sean is I read something the other day that said Dave might become the first billionaire that's debt-free, and that person was bragging on Dave. What about the 99.9% of other billionaires? Why would you try to do the thing that one person can do and not everybody else has created their wealth through properly leveraging debt?

Dave's the only one that hasn't. So unless you've got the cult following Dave has, you're not going to create multimillionaires or billionaires through, you know, borrowing or saving or through saving money. You have to borrow it. Yeah. He's so against debt. I don't understand why, because there's so many beneficial ways to use debt. Like Robert Kiyosaki is probably the complete opposite end, right? So I'd love to see them two in a room together. Yeah, I think they're kind of friends. And I've heard Robert talk about him.

He's like, Dave, behind closed doors will say that if you are responsible with money, that it's good to leverage it. And it's OK to get a little bit of debt. But he can't say that in the public. He's got to be, you know, he's the no debt guy. He's built, you know, a billion dollar brand or whatever around it. So he's got to stick to his guns, whether he truly believes it or not. Yeah. Now, when is the best time to refi a house, take money against your house? The biggest thing is when you have that equity. So when there's equity may get created very quickly from 2020 to 2022, houses went up in value like crazy. Out here in Vegas, they did,

and a ton of markets they did. So once you get that equity growth, then you can tap into it however you want. You can do a HELOC, a cash out refinance, that's debt, it's tax free. So there's a ton of different options. So just buy the thing that everybody needs, real estate, a house, an apartment, a duplex, whatever it is, everybody needs it whether they want it or not. So get involved in that industry. And if you got to borrow money to do it, great, because most people don't have enough money to scale, you know, putting 20% down all the time. So just get in the game and over time real estate will go up it doubles in value every 15 years from 1950 to 2023. It doubled in value every 15 years except three. So like from 1965 to 1980, it doubled in value from 1972 to 1987. it doubled in value. So every 15 years,

it doubles. And that's as a whole, that doesn't even include like rental priced houses that are a little bit less in price. They go up even more. So the three years that didn't double in value went up like 88, 94, 98% or something. So get involved in that. It's going to go up. If you borrow money, right, the tenant's going to pay the mortgage down. And that's why 90% of mariners come through real estate. You don't have to start some tech startup or get lucky on crypto or buy NFTs before they buy or whatever to create wealth. It's just a simple, clean way to do it. Wow, 90%? Mm-hmm.

That's super high, but it makes sense because it's not too complicated. And a lot of it's in people's personal residence, right? Their house that they own. Right. So if you think about it, all the other ways to create wealth make up 10% of millionaires. That's nuts. Combined. And that's what people focus on, the other 10%. Yeah. So dude, stop trying to recreate it, right? Just go with what works. You just have to be patient. People aren't willing to be patient long enough to actually see the fruits of the growth and the debt pay down, and they get tired of it and move on or try to invest in something else.

Absolutely. Now, have you been in the real estate game long enough to experience a crash yet? I have not. No. So I got started in 2014. There was a decent sized dip in 2018 that some people felt. And then actually from Q4 of 2022 to Q2 of 2023, Q4 2022 to Q3 of 2023. Yeah. There was the biggest dip ever in real estate house value. So the average house in the United States went from 480 to like 410. So that just happened. You probably didn't feel it because of the higher priced houses. It wasn't. So we just experienced a huge dip. But if you're not over leveraged, and I've talked to a ton of people that went through 808, the people that got screwed were the people that had one exit strategy. They were flipping million dollar houses

and they were borrowing above what the houses were worth. So I have $25 million in debt but own $50 million in real estate. So that's a big delta for a dip to eat into too much of that. Yeah. I feel like with those fix and flips, there's a big skill gap. Yeah. I feel like you really got to know what you're doing with those. And there's a big skill gap, and there's a big risk.

You're taking it down. You have to manage contractors. The housing market can and will shift over a six month period. If you're wholesaling, you're in and out. And if you're holding, as long as you hold long enough, like I said, it's going to go up. As long as you're not over leveraged and don't have to give it back to the bank, it's going to go up in value. It just is. It's not something you can't buy a house now how you could in 1990s or early 2000s. It goes up. Right. Are all your properties in St. Louis? Everything's in St. Louis. It's not the most exciting market, but it's a great market to invest in. It's steady. Yeah. It went down like 10 or 12% in 08, and it doesn't get the crazy swings that a lot of the markets get, but we

also don't get the crazy lows. So it's a great market to invest in. A lot of people around the country invest in the Midwest and St. Louis. Yeah. And there's a lot of different strategies, but your strategy is basically to hold. Yeah. So we flip about 300 houses a year. So I do a little bit of everything. So we flip, we wholesale, and then I hold as well. So I do a little bit of everything. I fell in love with real estate. And there are so many ways to make money in real estate. As long as you've got a good team and you buy a good product and buy at a discount, you can kind of do anything. We sell probably 200 houses a year that we don't even close on. We go direct to seller. We get it at a discount.

We mark it up 10, 15, 20 grand, sell it to a contractor or a rehabber or a landlord, and then they buy it. And then there's still enough meat on the bone for them to make money. But we have low risk and really no exposure if we're selling them before we even close on them. Wow. So you're flipping 300 a year, you said? Jeez, that's almost one a day. Yeah. No, it is. Yeah, it is. We did 312 last year. The market shrunk a little bit because

interest rates are so low. Very few people are selling because they don't want to get out of that interest rate. So we're going to do like 250-ish this year about. Damn. Yeah. I'm buying a house right now. Interest rates are like 775 out here. Yeah. That's tough. That makes it a little bit harder, but it'll go down. I'm buying a house right now. Interest rates are like 7, 7.5 out here. Yeah. That's tough. That makes it a little bit harder. But it'll go down. I always say, marry the house, date the rate. The rate will go down.

Yeah. What's the highest you paid on interest for money? The highest we've paid is probably, so with private lenders, we pay 12%. 12%? That's on a short-term basis. So you give me 100 grand, let's say, and I buy a house for 75 grand, put 25 grand into it. So I have 100 grand in this house, and then I sell it or refinance it. You know,

it's worth 130 grand. I'll give you back, you know, after six months, I'll give you back 106 grand. So you made 12% on your money. So you made six grand on it. But if I don't have a hundred grand, like I'm not getting anything then, or I just get a little bit less profit, a little bit, a little bit less equity, but I still pay you. So we have a ton of private lenders. I've probably done $50 million in loans for private lenders. But if I didn't have the money or even if I do have the money now, I still can't scale. I do well for myself, but I don't make enough money to buy 80 houses a year and put 20% down. And if I did, I don't want to spend it on that.

So if you want to scale, borrowing money and just getting over that 12, it's not that big of a deal. It's annualized. And as long as you're buying deep enough, it doesn't really matter. Yeah. I mean, with that model, it makes sense. I feel like 12% in any other business would be tough to justify. I agree a hundred percent because the margins are just, and there's so much equity there that it, you know, it makes sense in this business. And it's not long-term. I would never do a 25-year mortgage at 12%. I got locked in at 30 years last year at like 395 or a year and a half ago before the rates raised. So I did my entire portfolio and I locked it in over 30 years at like 395. So I don't have any renewing loans, took out a couple million cash tax-free. And that was all from like

at that time, like six and a half years of investing in real estate. It's crazy what you can do if you scale it the right way. Yeah. How were you able to take out that cash tax free? So if you do a cash out refinance, so technically it goes on top of your mortgage. Now your mortgage is up that, you know, million or 2 million, however much you take out, but it's debt. That is not taxed. It's not a taxable event. So you pull it out as a cash out refinance. You have to pay $0 in taxes on it. Now, my mortgages, technically, just for simple math, I took out, I had $18 million in mortgages, but I did a refinance.

So now I have $20 million in mortgages, and I took the difference, that $2 million in cash. So my mortgages are a little bit more, but I'm not paying my mortgages. The renters are paying my mortgages. That's so sick. This is how wealthy, like a lot of really wealthy people preserve their money. They buy real estate with it. It goes up in value. They do a cash out refinance and they pull out the money tax-free and they just do that over and over

again as it grows. And that's how they're able to get at least a portion of tax-free money every single year. And I didn't pay, I paid $0 in taxes for 2022. And I made the most money I've ever made last year. And I paid $0 in taxes because real estate allows you to depreciate and write-offs and all this stuff writing off this whole trip coming out here and all this stuff so there's so many writers that come along with real estate the government wants people to invest in real estate are you interested in coming on the digital social hour podcast as a guest we'll click the application link below in the description of this video we are always looking for cool stories, cool entrepreneurs to talk to about business and life. Click the application link below, and here's the episode, guys.

That's amazing. When I saw Trump pay zero, I was like, dude, I'm doing something wrong. Well, he maybe does it wrong too. Yeah, no, there's a lot of power in real estate and just getting those assets. They say when the US housing market sneezes, the world gets a cold just because the entire world economy boils down to the US real estate market. Seriously? Yeah. And just with the jobs it provides with real estate agents and contractors and building houses and people needing the rentals. And then also when the house values go up, people refinance and then they redo their kitchen.

They go on vacation. So if you live in your house, people live in their house, the house values go up. Over time, they do a HELOC, they pull out some cash and they spend money. It spurs the economy. The economy moves because of people's equity. That's why the economy was so hot because house values went up so much from 2020 to 2022. The economy was so strong. And then people took that equity out and they went and

spent it in the economy and kept the wheels are turning along with the government stimulus. But that's why the economy was so hot for a couple of years. Yeah. Good times, man. Especially for you. You must have been printing money back then. It was not like the government. I didn't push a button and print. It was pretty good. Yeah. So you got to be one of the biggest guys in St. Louis right now. Yeah. We're the biggest as is home buyer. The Weebugly Houses is one of our competitions. So yeah, we're the biggest, the top one or 1A as far as the distressed house buyers in St. Louis. Yeah. So is the plan to expand to other cities? We've talked about it.

We've done a little bit. We're dabbling into Columbia, Missouri right now, which is where Mizzou is, Missouri University. It's like 90 minutes away. So we're dabbling into that. I don't know. It's tough. I know a lot of people that do it remotely and you lock it up over the phone and you don't know the condition of it and you have like a contingency in there and there's a ton of fallout because you send somebody over there and it's not the condition of the person. So it's just a very inefficient way to do it. In St. Louis, our buyers, we have six full-time buyers. Their job is to go buy houses all day, every day. They're in the house. They're able to, we lock up, we lock it up. We close on a guaranteed. So it's just, I like that

business model better. I think we'll probably always be in St. Louis and just do that. But my education and social media and a lot of other things, then buying rentals and all that stuff, I'll probably expand into other markets. Yeah, that makes sense. There's something about being close to it where you could go there and just be there. Touch it, right? Touch the siding and I don't have to get on a plane to go do that. Yeah. Yeah. So I know you've had some weird death threats in the past. Yeah, just a little bit. So I'm like, not like huge on social media or anything, but like, there's a sect out there of, I think they're okay with me calling them communist, but like,

they're like the communist socialist of like, you shouldn't own real estate. The government should own it. You shouldn't own something that somebody has to have like shelter. You shouldn't own shelter because it's a human necessity. Well, people profit on water and people profit on groceries. So anyways, so there's those people that get really mad. If I do a video that goes viral, then I'll get people saying, not usually like I'm going to you, but like, I hope you die. Or I hope you're, I've had like four or five people say, I hope your family gets cancer for Christmas and just things like that. And it's like, bro, I'm just trying to help normal people create wealth. I grew up in the Midwest, lower middle class, and been able to do a lot of really cool stuff. And I'm an idiot,

like we said earlier. So like, I'm trying to help other people do that. I'm not like, you know, trying to be greedy here, but anyways, it's just, you, you see it probably more than I do. There's just a lot of hurt people out there and hurt people, hurt people. Yeah. There's a lot of negative people on social media, unfortunately. Yeah. That's just the, it just, uh, and they're the loudest section. And then if you were to see them in person, they'd like shake your hand and say, oh yeah.

So they're not doing that in person. Um, Midwest though. What was that like? What's the culture like? What are the people like? It's a little bit different. We say opalot. If you run into somebody, you say, oh, sorry. Oh, we say opalot. So a little more

polite than the coast, especially I heard you saying you're from New Jersey. So a little more polite. Where's your Racton, Jersey? Yeah. So I've talked to a lot of people from the coast and they're just like Missouri and the Midwest, just a little more polite and a little more patient, I would say. But in general, I mean, it's all I've ever known and I enjoy it out there. It's not the most exciting city in the world, but I like it. It's a great market to invest in and raise kiddos in. Yeah. But not as business driven, right? Not as business driven, I wouldn't say. No, I mean, it's not too bad. The red states are the pretty business friendly states and Missouri is a red state. So there are some advantages, some tax things that you can take

advantage of, but it's not anything crazy. We don't have the industry that Texas has, or even like, you know, Nevada or California has their actual economy are ginormous. So it's not, you know, super business friendly, but it's not that bad. Yeah. So was it tough to find a mentor group of entrepreneurs out there? It wasn't too bad because like I mentioned earlier, St. Louis has, it's a great market to invest in real estate. So there are people from around the country, these high level people that invest in real estate that I've been able to connect with. And there's a lot of people in St. Louis that are super smart that invest there because it's such a good market. You're like sitting on a gold mine is probably a little aggressive of a way to say, but sitting on

a really good asset type and a lot of people invest in it. And there's smart people in every city. So it wasn't too bad. I know out here on the coast, you can run into a celebrity at every other restaurant you go to and have maybe a little more connections, but not too bad. I know out here on the coast, you can run into a celebrity at every other restaurant you go to and have maybe a little more connections, but not too bad. Yeah. I don't really care about the celebrities. I just want to be around solid people. And Jersey for me wasn't cutting it. Yeah. I've heard that a little bit about it. You like it out here? I love it here because all the conferences are here. We're getting a lot of big sports teams. I know you mentioned St. Louis might be getting NBA team, right? That's my goal, I hope. So I don't think they are.

So I would like that to happen. So my goal is to own an NBA team in St. Louis, to get an expansion team to St. Louis. And that's cool. The vanity behind it's kind of cool. But in general, the whole reason I have that as my goal is because it checks all these boxes. And it's easier to say, like, I want to make a lot of money, obviously. I want to connect with the local business and political community. I want to network with other, you with other multimillionaires and billionaires. I want to provide a lot of

jobs for St. Louis. I want to make St. Louis a more desirable city so people think of it as more of like a hub in the Midwest. So if I'm able to do all that, I would have to do that to own an NBA team. So I don't have to own an NBA team, but I want to do all that. And it's just kind of one of those things you can visualize a little bit easier than the six things I just said that I want to do. Absolutely. I think owning a pro sports team is like every entrepreneur's final checklist item. Yeah, it'd be pretty cool. And most of them, unless you're like a Kroenke or Mark Cuban, most of them, there's like 30 owners.

There's one like the most famous person that owns them is known as the owner. But a lot of people own 5%, 10% of – not a lot, but a decent amount own 5%, 10% of sports franchises. there's like 30 owners. It's not just, there's one like the most famous person that owns them is like known as the owner, but a lot of people own five, 10% of not a lot, but a decent amount on five, 10% of sports franchises. So I don't have to be the majority owner. That'd be cool, but I definitely don't have to be.

No, all you need is a few points to get the main benefits. I think, I think a PBD just invested in the Yankees. Yep. He did. So, I mean,

if you have two points in that, I mean, you're getting a suite at all the games, you're networking, you're having fun. Well, you're around those people. And I know, yeah. And there's a ton of people that are buying into, I think, uh, Jay Cole and Eric Church just invested in the

Charlotte Bobcats a little bit too, I think. So just getting a little piece of a little piece of it and helping your brand help the team and then the team help your brand. I think it's beneficial. I do think a lot more celebrities or influencers or people with money are going to get little portions of teams just to help boost the team brand as well. Yeah, absolutely. Have you had any bad deals, nightmare tenants, anything go wrong? Yeah, we've had our fair share. So I own, I don't know the exact number, but like 290-ish rental doors, something like that. And so we do our best to approve good tenants. We treat them like people. We respect them. We're not slumlords, we're landlords. Our houses are really nice. We give them every opportunity to pay. We communicate with them. So we have very minimal issues,

but we do have some issues. I remember there's one tenant that took us to court or whatever, and she claimed that there was mold in the house and it was causing, you know, her to not be able to breathe and rashes and all this stuff was trying to sue us. And we tested it and it was, there was nothing wrong with that. But I do remember, funny thing is, in the court documents, this was during, so it was over via Zoom, but there was a picture, she's probably in her 60s. The evidence was a picture of her tits. And it was there because there was a rash in between them. And so I remember like, whoa, all right, well, we're going there. But anyways, that just was a funny story aside from it. So I was like, whoa, all right, well, we're going there. But anyways, that just was a funny story aside from it.

So I was like, I don't think that helped your case, ma'am. But anyways, yeah, I didn't go through anything. That's weird. How common is mold actually? It's not super common. We did a test. There was more mold outside the house than inside the house. Oh, really?

Yeah, so it wasn't anything we did. There's just natural mold. There's a ton of different kinds of mold out there right now. We're breathing mold right now. It's just not all bad. Oh, I didn't know that. I always thought it was indoors for some reason. I didn't know it grew outdoors too. Oh, there's molds outdoor everywhere. Really? Wow. Any properties where the tenant just never paid? We've had a few of those, but that's the beautiful thing about Missouri and St. Louis. It's fair. If they don't pay for 30 days, we send them to the eviction courts and they show up.

The judge usually will allow them to go on a payment plan and say, hey, you can go on a payment plan, pay your missing month and the next month over, you know, the next six months, this kind of payment plan. And if they don't do that, then you can get them out in 30 days pretty easily. So they get a second and third chance and then they're gone. So that's the cool thing about Missouri is we can get them out in 30, 60 days if they're not paying. Some places like California and other places, it's months before you can get them out. Sometimes years. Yeah. So that's one of the reasons I invest in St. Louis.

Yeah. So no squatting. No squatting allowed there. None of that. No squatting. Yeah. I think if you're in there for, what, 30 days in Cali, you can live there. Yeah.

I just did a video the other day on that lady out in California who's requesting $100,000 to move out of ADU that she was Airbnb-ing. So it's not even like – she wasn't like her full-time residence. She went out there and wouldn't leave and something didn't pass occupancy. And she's been out there living free for like a year in like this ADU of this doctor's really nice house. And he can't go talk to her. She'll like call the police and he can't get her out. She said, give me $100,000 and I'll get out. So we don't get that here in the Midwest.

Yeah. What do you think about Airbnb? Have you done any of that? We have a little bit of Airbnb. So I bought a resort in Branson, Missouri, which is like redneck Vegas kind of. There's shows and gambling and comedians. And it's a decent-sized little town as far as entertainment goes. I think a third of the country can drive there in a day.

So it's a pretty good hub for the Midwest as far as tourism goes. So I bought a little resort there. It's like a 20-unit little hotel that was in shambles, and we're turning it into like a boutique Airbnb hotel thing. So I'm doing a little bit of that because interest rates are higher right now. So it's harder to cash flow on a 12-month lease, but a nightly lease or a midterm three-month lease to a traveling nurse, you can charge more so you can cash flow. Again, that's another thing about real estate. There's so much flexibility that goes along with it. So many different ways. Now I'm seeing a lot of section eight stuff. Have you done any of those? We do a little bit of section eight, just basically government subsidized. The government

will subsidize some or all of the rent that this person has to pay to you. And it's not bad because it's usually close to market rent, if not market rent. And then the fact that the government's paying their rent, they do require them to take care of the property. If they're not taking care of the property, we can call in the Section 8 authorities. They'll go look at the property and they'll be like, get out, clean up or get out. They'll kick them out for us. So there's some benefits to it. We do a little bit of it, but in general, we're more just market rent. That makes sense. So out of your $40 million portfolio, how exactly are you sourcing all those deals? Mainly through relationships. So the flipping company we talked about earlier, we buy about 250, 300 houses a

year. So any really good deals, we'll pick those off and keep those as rentals. But also just developing relationships with apartment brokers. I own six apartment complexes and local wholesalers, a wholesaler brought us that deal down in Branson, which is about four hours from, from our, from where we live and operate in St. Louis. So relationships is the key to real estate in any business, as you probably know. So building relationships with the right people, life happens. People need to sell their house. They have to sell their house. There's always a, there's always a supply of some type of supply of distressed properties because houses go bad, they get mold, there's foundation issues, there's hoarder houses,

people get relocated, people get foreclosed on. Life just happens to people. And that's where we can come in and we say, hey, you can list it for this and we'll try to do that. It might not pass occupancy, it might be a pain in the butt to sell, but this is an option. Or we can buy a cash for this, like you pick. And usually they pick the cash option and they're crying at the closing table because they're happy that we were able to help them out of that situation. So there's a ton of different sources to find distressed properties, but usually networking and just resourcing to people is the best. That's awesome. Are distressed ones the ones that are in auction? Yeah, distressed ones are usually the ones in auction, yeah. So that's the thing.

You're buying into equity. You sign on the dotted line and there's equity in there because of the distressed nature. Now, you do have to repair it, but you're getting enough discount that you buy distressed, repair it. Then there's still 20%, 30% equity. So every single rental that I close on, I walk into 30% equity because I'm selective in buying the right houses at the discount because they're distressed. Yeah. Do you still have that same drive and hunger you had when you first got into real estate? Yeah, I would say it kind of goes in ways right now. I feel like I'm really driven. It's cyclical.

I am satisfied, but I'm not at the same time. I'm content, but I'm not satisfied. I feel like I'm just scratching the surface. I want to own an NBA team. I want to own a billion dollars in real estate, and I want to have a billion dollar company annual revenue. So that's going to require me to continue to grind and move hard and hire the right people. So I feel like I've done well for myself. Yay, pat myself on the back. But time to step it into high gear. I feel like I'm just getting started. Right. Well, St. Louis, is that enough to get to a billion-dollar mark? You'll probably have to expand, right? I'll probably have to expand a little bit. But real estate market is so big. So like we said earlier, I own like $45 million in real estate. I was on the plane leaving to

come out here and flew out, like wrapped around St. Louis. And I'm like up in the air, like my 45 million real estate is like those three blocks. You know, you see everything else. The real estate market is so big that I could do it in St. Louis, but we'll probably expand around a little bit just because St. Louis will be fine. It's not like dying, but it's not growing like crazy. It's just steady. But having all your eggs in one basket in case something were to happen, I don't think would be ideal. So I'll probably spread around a little bit. Yeah. So to get to that level, you'll probably have to start a fund like Cardone did, right? Yeah. So that's the thing I struggle with. I feel like I could right now. I could do the

syndication route and I could raise money via social media, create some content around it. And I hung out with Brandon Turner the other night, a couple of nights ago in Vegas. And he's like, you could raise $10 million right now by three stories and a funnel. But I like to own 100%. When a syndication, you usually own like 5% or 10%. So I'd rather own 100% of $10 million worth of real estate than 10% of $100 million, if that makes sense. So that's where I think to get to a billion, I'll have to do that syndication route. But I want to own a billion dollars worth of real estate. I know Grant has, what, four or five billion assets under management, but he's not 100% owner. Oh, so he only owns 5% of that? Or maybe 10%, maybe 20. There's a ton of different ways

to do syndication. A lot of people will charge 2% of the deal to set it up. So a $50 million apartment complex, let's say I'll charge 1% to set this deal up. So I get paid 500 grand to do it. And then I bring your money and I source the deal and I get, you know, 5% ownership or 10% ownership. So the people that pay into the syndication fund usually get a return in ownership usually. And sometimes they can be bought back out, but there's a ton of different ways to do it.

But in general, most people that syndicate own, I would say less than 20% of the, of the fund and of the asset they're buying with the fund, but some own more, there's different ways to do it. You can offer higher returns and less ownership, a ton of different ways to slice it, but I'd rather just own my assets. Yeah. So then it comes down to how much work am I putting in for that amount of money, right? Exactly. Yeah. So right now you own all of it. So you could put in five times less work to get that. And I own all of it. And I get all the tax benefits go directly to me. Like we talked about earlier,

I control everything, the people that go in it, the management, my team manages. So I just have more control over it. But if I do want to grow, I'll probably have to give up some control. That's how I've grown my other companies is bringing the right people

and giving up some control and trusting them. Yeah, that makes sense. Dude, it's been fun. Anything you want to close off with or promote? I don't think so. I think just anybody just shoot me a follow on social media, same faster freedom and shoot me a message on Instagram and I'll get back to you. Awesome.

Thanks for coming on, man. That was fun. Yep. Thanks for watching, guys. I'll see you next time.