Digital Social Hour - Inside the Mind of Undefeated Attorney Ugo Lord, The Modern Age Attorney | Digital Social Hour #58

Episode Date: July 27, 2023

Hey there, podcast listeners! Sean Kelly here, and I am beyond excited to introduce our latest episode of the Digital Social Hour. In this captivating episode, I sit down with the undefeated attorney, Ugo Lord, to uncover the secrets behind his remarkable track record and explore his fascinating journey as a modern age lawyer. From the moment we start the conversation, you'll be hooked. Ugo shares his unique perspective on settling cases, revealing how this technique has been key to his unbeaten streak. But it doesn't stop there - Ugo opens up about the challenges he faces in making the law accessible and how he uses his platform to educate and debate legal concepts with his audience. You won't want to miss his inspiring insights on how we all can play a role in shaping the law. As the conversation unfolds, we dive deep into Ugo's background - his passion for entertainment law, his unexpected shift to business law, and how his content creation now merges the best of both worlds. We explore the fascinating intersection of law and content creation in the booming creator economy and how Ugo guides his clients to transform their content into profitable ventures while staying true to their message. But that's not all - be prepared for some jaw-dropping moments as Ugo shares anecdotes from his career, including remarkable settlements that left everyone feeling like they lost. We even touch on the dangers of leaving negative reviews and the surprising legal implications that can arise. The stories Ugo shares will make you rethink how you navigate through legal matters in your everyday life. Throughout the episode, Ugo's infectious energy and passion for what he does will leave you feeling motivated and inspired. He opens up about conquering fear, the importance of pursuing your passions, and how to navigate the ever-changing landscape of the digital age. His experiences and insights will empower you to overcome obstacles and live your dreams. So, what are you waiting for? Join us for this captivating and eye-opening conversation with Ugo Lord. Whether you're a law enthusiast, a content creator, or simply seeking inspiration, this episode is a must-listen. You'll walk away feeling informed, empowered, and ready to take on the world. Tune in now to The Digital Social Hour and get ready to unlock the secrets of success from the undefeated attorney himself. Trust me, you won't want to miss it! --- Support this podcast: https://podcasters.spotify.com/pod/show/digitalsocialhour/support Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Man, you're a beast. I saw on your website, you've never lost a single case. That's true. How did you stay undefeated for so long? Oh my God, 10 years in the game, haven't lost a single case. And the secret is to settle. That's really- And the law enforcement official was trying to tell the black guy to step forward. So he's telling both of them, step forward, step forward. And then he tells the Caucasian male, he said, will the Caucasian male please step back? And then the black guy steps back too and he the black guy's like i identify as a caucasian male

i love that i love that i gotta ask this because i saw one of your videos charlie and i love restaurants okay we do food reviews yes i've seen that yeah one of your videos said you could be criminally charged for leaving a negative review. Yeah, isn't that something? What? Welcome to the Digital Social Hour. I'm your host, Sean Kelly. I'm here with my co-host, Charlie Cavalier, and today ugo lord hey how's it going doing well man how are you doing i'm doing good i love being here in vegas i grew up here in vegas yeah i love being that dude i love your energy i appreciate you first of all i don't know if you guys can see it at home this setup

that you guys have here is pretty incredible not bad right behind the? Behind the scenes, it looks good. Yeah. You guys do well. Can't complain, but I'd love to dive into your story if you could let people know the Sparknotes version. I appreciate you. So, you know, my name is Ugo Lord. I am the modern age attorney, and I believe that we should have a modern attorney for the modern world. And that's what I feel like I am. The idea is to bring legal concepts directly to my audience. So that way, not only can we learn about the law, but we can debate the law. And then the idea is that if we can debate the law, then possibly even we can change the law, depending on where you fall

in the spectrum. I mean, you got 2 billion views in nine months. So there could be some changes to laws with your viewership. You know, I it's been an amazing journey. It's it's incredible how now the whole idea of content all derives from being accessible directly on someone's phone. And I've never been I'm a really private person. I live a private life. I've never had this concept that I wanted to be so accessible. But now everything is accessible. So therefore, the law needs to be so accessible, but now everything is accessible, so therefore the law needs to be accessible as well.

Right. What is the most danger you found yourself in talking about the law in such an open, accessible way? The law is never black and white. It is always gray. Every scenario is going to change, and how you interpret the law is going to be based on that changing scenario.

So the biggest issue that I find myself in is trying to put the law in these little pegs, you know, you try to put a square peg in a round, whatever it's called, you know, it's hard to do that with the law. And so the biggest challenge is how do I make sure that this takeaway from this video is something that is educational, entertaining, but at the same time, doesn't kind of sweep everything under one blanket. Do you see what I'm saying? What did you go to school for? Which type of attorney are you? You know, it's interesting because I actually went to school to do entertainment law because I love entertainment, you know, and I interned for Disney studios and I loved working with Disney ABC studios. That is an amazing company. I have

to say that amazing company, um, with amazing people that work there. And I really loved it and I really enjoyed it, but it just so happened that in 2015, I did this case. It was a big case. And I then was recruited at a business law firm as a partner. So I was 25 at the time. And I said, well, listen, I can be a partner at the age of 25. Then I'll do it. So I left entertainment law, which I loved, to do business law. And then I grew a passion for business law as well. And now what I do with making content, it kind of marries the whole idea of

entertainment and the law. So overall, I'm very happy. And with the creator economy, we have now entertainment law and business law are basically merging in the middle. You know, it's interesting because now that I'm a quote unquote creator, you know, I go to all these creator events. It's like all of my clients are all in the room because these are just, I'm just surrounded by creators that are learning how to, learning that they are their own business. They are their own brand. It's not just about making, I mean, you guys know this. It's not just about making content anymore. It's now about how do we make this content profitable in a way that is true to your message and true to your audience. And that's the definition of business law. So,

yeah, that's what I do. Man, you're a beast. I saw on your website, you've never lost a single case. How did you stay undefeated for so long? Oh my God. 10 years in the game, haven't lost a single case. And the secret is to settle. That's really, it's true. I've never lost a case and I'm proud of that. I've won over $550 million for my clients and I'm proud of that. But of course, it wasn't just me alone. I'm part of an incredible team and I've worked with several law firms across the country. The idea is to be able to properly educate your client because it's not that I only take cases. I'm accused of that online a lot that I only take cases. I mean, I'm, I'm accused of that online a lot that I only take cases that I know I'm going to win,

but that is not true. I will take cases that I believe are, are the right thing to do. You see what I'm saying? And then it's about educating my clients. Hey, listen, you have a losing case. If you want to spend $200,000 on me to take this all the way and lose, then so be it. But the smart thing to do is how,000 on me to take this all the way and lose, then so be it. But the smart thing to do is how do we figure out to find a resolution for everybody? And so I consider myself the ultimate problem solver. And that's really my goal. Let's just solve some problems.

You know what I mean? Yeah. I've heard that whenever lawyers settle, that the lawyers know deep down who really won. Yes. Now, even though you have a record better than Floyd Mayweather, do you feel like you've ever settled but you felt like you lost? I believe that any good settlement, everyone feels like they lost. See what I'm saying? Like if you're walking away from a settlement too happy, which I've done.

I've done many times. I've walked away from a settlement too happy, which I've done. I've done many times. I've walked away from a settlement very, very happy. It means that I've won. But there are times where I feel like, oh, I could have – maybe I could have got $100,000 more. Or maybe I could have saved my client $100,000. Or maybe I feel like – I had one client who's – I'm talking had a slam dunk case. Their case was worth a million dollars easy. easy they they went to a mechanic they you know had their brakes changed and then they were taking a road trip and on the road trip their brakes gave out whoa road trip come to find out the

mechanic never put never they put the calipers on the brakes but they never bolted it in whoa so it was there for about a good 50 miles or so, but then it just fell off. Brakes gave out. My client was so just, oh, I don't really want anything. I just want, you know, pay for my car, pay for my therapy, pay for my, you know, psychological therapy. And I was like, we can get you so much more. And he was like, no, no, no no so that was the case that we settled but i felt like i lost how fast was he going when he crashed it was interesting because he was only going about like 60 miles per hour this is on a freeway so i think this the speed limit was maybe

70 or 65 only going 60 miles per hour but what happened was he was approaching traffic so everything started to stop and i realized i could not stop. Luckily, I mean, thank God here in America, we have, you know, we have, we've built in a system to have an emergency shoulder lane for this exact same reason. He pulled into the emergency lane, was able to activate the brakes, but just think about it. Just think about it psychologically, how that feels to be able to hit the brakes and not stop.'d myself dude i would freak out and the idea of the law the thing about the laws yes it's about compensation it's about all of that but it's also about trying to teach someone what you should you should not do be more careful right you see what

i'm saying because he could have died he could have died or killed somebody else so that shop should learn before i allow any car to leave my shop i'm going to check i'm going to double check and i'm going to triple check to make sure that car is safe and when in doubt drive a tesla that is true which i do by the way that's not an endorsement we're just saying i got a tesla too But I don't drive. And you don't drive. Not for 10 months I have not driven. You're kidding. How do you get around?

Uber and airplanes. Good for you. The world is a safer place if I'm not on the road. I love that. That's amazing. I need to travel with you. Let's do it. I've just decided.

Uber, airplanes, that's all I need in my life. So before law, you were a public speaker and you did debates. You won a lot of competitions. You won states. What was that like? Oh, it was crazy. So yes, I was in, um, you know, I was in forensics debate and I really enjoyed it. Yes. I won state here in Nevada. I was also in this, um, organization called future business leaders of America where I won first place nationally. And I love it because I'm a big believer that life is about preparation. And I'm not saying that people have to go out there and be debaters and they have to learn how to speak publicly, but learn to do what you're afraid of. And they say that public speaking is the biggest fear, even more fearful than death. I've heard that.

Wow. Isn't that insane? That's insane. So the idea is that if you know that this is something that you don't feel comfortable with, try it, learn about it. And so when I was in high school, I was not a shy person, but I wasn't good in groups. I wasn't good with groups of people because I was always the weird kid. I was that strange person that was, you know, bullied and made fun of in high school. And the last thing that I wanted to do was put myself in front of another group of people that could bully me or pick on me. I didn't want that. But I knew that if I could do something that would make me uncomfortable and if I could learn to

do it well, then there's no situation that I will ever find myself in where I will ever be uncomfortable again. I've been in front of some of the most influential people in the world, including the president of Taiwan herself. And I wasn't nervous and I didn't feel that paralyzing fear that I used to feel back when I was, you know, a young kid in front of like a jock or in front of, you know, someone that I didn't necessarily relate with. And I felt like, oh, I could be picked on for that. So put yourself in uncomfortable situations, learn to be uncomfortable. And that's the only way to overcome any type of fear that you have. Wow. I love that. I feel like we both love awkward situations,

right? Like, I mean, you prep for everything. You become very knowledgeable about things you're fear that you have wow i love that i feel like we both love awkward situations right like i mean you prep for everything you become very knowledgeable about things you're getting into that makes you able to talk about anything whenever you go into have a conversation i mean i was very scared of public speaking growing up i i was at the point where i had to take a xanax to even do it you're kidding how did you get the xanax i was prescribed it oh yeah But it was that bad. And I could feel like I could feel what you mean 100%. And so how do you feel now? Now I could do it with ease. Yeah, I love that. I mean, that that's a perfect testament on what it takes to push through the pain, push through the pain in order to allow yourself to become comfortable with the uncomfortable. And look at you guys now. I mean, this is amazing. This podcast is podcast is incredible millions of listeners that you guys have you guys it's a huge accomplishment you have to pat yourself on the back yeah and you've i mean you've done a lot more public speaking in the last couple years and a lot more talking on social media what have what troubles have you found yourself in to go from talking about like what's the most hate you've received

from something you posted on social media it It's interesting because I talk a lot, obviously, about the law. But, you know, law and politics, they are hand and glove. It's hard to find one without the other. And when I talk about certain legal topics, for example, when I talked about former President Trump being indicted, what does that mean? What does it mean to be indicted? What does it mean to be arraigned? Are you really arrested? Are you charged? Obviously, it became a huge political topic. And I think when I feel like I'm doing the right thing is when every Democrat and every Republican hates me, then I'm like, okay, that means I'm doing something right. Because the idea is, let's just talk about what the facts of the case is. Let's talk about what the law is. And so I found myself, to be

honest with you, I initially, when I, you know, became this, quote, unquote, you know, legal influencer, I said, Okay, I'm going to steer away from politics as far as I can, but it becomes impossible to talk about the law without acknowledging that politics influences the law. So instead of getting mad at me regarding what the law is, then, you know, go out there, talk to your Congress men or women, run for office, do whatever you want to try and go towards the policy aspects, which you have a huge policy background yourself. You know, talk about the policy aspects, which you have a huge policy background yourself. Talk about the policy aspect if you want to influence the policy. You see what I'm saying?

And then I will just talk about what the results of that policy was, which is the law. Yeah. What's your advice to attorneys just coming out of college looking to make a name for themselves? Oh, gosh.

Just pursue what you love. The law is so big. There's such a huge area of law. And if you try to pursue the money first, you are going to be exhausted. I mean, it's great. I get it. I mean, I had a full ride scholarship, but I get that my colleagues, when we graduated from law school, graduated with hundreds of thousands of dollars in debt. I get it. And one of my friends, her name is Erica. She's an amazing, incredible attorney. She's now a huge influencer as well. She talks about what it's like graduating

with a quarter million dollars in debt and then going to a big firm, paying it off. And then she left the big firm because at the end of the day, it is not worth it. So my advice to all the young graduates that are graduating right now, I'm so happy for them and I'm so proud of them. My advice is focus on the area of law that you love because that's the only way that you're not going to get burnt out. If you say to yourself, oh, I want to do mergers and acquisitions. Oh, they make $300,000 a year. Let's do that. Fantastic. Then you'll do it and you'll realize that's the most boring area of the law that you will ever enter ever. But there are people who love that.

There are people who love to read. There are people who love to resolve problems. There are people who love to look at paper trails. Do mergers and acquisitions. You'll make tons of money and you'll be happy. But if it is money that you're after and the rest is not something that you're interested in you're gonna burn out quickly i promise you that and i think that's the same in anything you do in life if you're not passionate about it you're gonna burn out agreed the money is secondary

you just have to hope that what you love doing is profitable in some way yeah and there's always a way to turn you know to to turn what you. It doesn't matter what you like. If you love the environment, if you love, if you're religious and you have a spiritual message, whatever you love there, there are financial ways through sponsorships and through other programs to make sure that you can sustain yourself and still do what you love. Just find a partner that knows that area. For example, if you know that you love the environment and you want to focus your life and your energy on the environment, find a business partner that has a passion for trying to find renewable ways to start new businesses and let them handle the business side and then you handle the side that you like. Partner together and that's a great way to become financially sustainable doing what you love.

I mean everything that exists in the world exists because it made somebody money, right? From the couch to the clothes to the microphone to the cameras to the TVs. The only reason anything tangible exists in the world is because somebody made a dollar off of it. Precisely. Is there a dream case or maybe like a precedent you want to overturn, something that you just wake up every day and you say, forget that law. I want to overturn this precedent. I think the world should exist like this. That's a really good question. Yeah, I love that.

That's a really good question. I love it. You guys ask really good questions. I love it. Yes. Yes, there is. I'm a true believer in equality. And there are several areas in our laws that haven't allowed everyone to have all the rights and all the freedoms that others enjoy. So I am a big

believer in ensuring that everyone has equal access, everyone has equal opportunity, and everyone has the ability to live the American dream. Now, the downside is that that now becomes more of a political issue. And I'm not even remotely interested in any way, shape, or form in politics. So what I do instead is let me support those who support others. You see what I'm saying? I will happily, I do a lot of pro bono work. I shouldn't say a lot. I do pro bono work. I could always do more.

Right. And I'm a big believer in if you are new and you're upcoming and you truly believe in, you know, equality for everyone, I am happy to support you on the legal side. I'm happy to, you know, there's a lot of very annoying law that goes into both local and federal elections. And I'm happy to be that, that support and, and to support you that way. I'm not going to be running for anything because that sounds terrible. Sounds risky. Yeah. I just, to be honest, it's just, there's so much political correctness in this world

and my life is not politically correct whatsoever. So let me not go down that path. I will not, I mean, obviously I do a lot of background checks, but I will not have to willingly put my family through this this concept of oh we're gonna be this cookie cutter you know people now i yeah i i drink chat i drink it's probably the smart way to go i mean with social media these days you could get canceled for supporting the wrong person the risk reward is just not there anymore it's like you know your life can be over and we're talking about like the deep fake risk your life can be over in five minutes yeah so how do you guys do that because you guys are constantly covering various topics with various guests at all times where literally you can say the wrong

thing and that's it so is it something that's in your mind it's something that's in your head or how do you balance that yeah there's certain topics we won't talk about for sure um and then we try to play both sides so we won't lean towards one way we'll have guests on from each side yeah i just hope the guest says the wrong thing and not one of us yeah we'll ask what we ask and it's on them yeah exactly media insurance goes a long way i love that i love that i gotta ask this because i saw one of your videos charlie and i love restaurants okay we do food reviews yes i've seen that yeah one of your videos said you could be criminally charged for leaving a negative review yeah isn't that something

what what yeah isn't something okay here's the thing this is what i always tell people be responsible for yourself right do what you have to do for you what you should never ever do is tell someone else what to do because the moment that is tell someone else what to do. Because the moment that you tell someone else what to do, you're putting yourself at risk. You can go to a restaurant and you can say, listen, the steak, three and a half out of five. That was okay. A little tender, you know, could have been, could have been better. A little chewy, if you will that's fine but the moment that you say oh guys you got this steak listen it tasted like poison this is if only the chef knew what poison really tasted like and then they would learn how to make some better steak and then someone

listening to you goes and poisons the chef the idea is were you directing someone to do something that they legally cannot do? See what I'm saying? And let's not go down this rabbit hole, but that's like with the whole January Trump stuff. Were people being pushed to go do something they shouldn't be doing? Exactly. Exactly. And the law is very clear on this matter. The law is absolutely clear.

You do not have to say, go poison the steak to be held liable if someone poisons steak. Do you understand what I'm saying? So I just tell people, hey, listen, talk about yourself. Talk about your own experiences. Talk about what you like. Talk about what you don't. But don't try and direct what other people should or should not do. Let them draw the conclusions themselves and stay out of it.

So you can't say this is a bad restaurant. Don't come here. You can say, in my experience, I had a bad experience at this restaurant. Okay. And I will not return. Right. We're going to have to get some pre-written. Do you want to be a judge, Wanda?

You know, it's so interesting because I get that question a lot. And I just hit 10 years in the law, which in the state of California where I'm licensed, now qualifies me to enter into a judgeship program that they offer in LA. And I am strongly, strongly considering it because I do love the law. And it's something that I think I would be good at. You know what I mean? And it's something that I think I would be good at. You know what I mean? And it's something that I do in terms of the videos. I'm kind of making a decision on the videos.

I mean, my videos, I really cover like 1L law, meaning I cover like first year law student stuff. I don't cover complex situations. But it is something that I've thought about. It is something that I've considered now that I'm in my 10 years. But interestingly enough, and I can't really talk about it too much publicly, but there are some entertainment opportunities

that are presenting itself that leans on more of a trier of fact type of show. I signed an NDA, so I can't get into it too much, but you know, stay tuned. You guys might see me. Maybe you'll see me in robes. Who knows? Man, I'm excited. So when you're a judge, are you allowed to take on other clients outside of that? That is such a great, that is such a great question because there are essentially two types of quote unquote judges. There's an arbitrator, which is acting like a de facto judge, a judge in fact that essentially is deciding a case outside of a traditional courtroom. And then there is a traditional judge, right? A traditional

judge, it would be a conflict of interest to be a part of a firm, be on the bench, taking clients while you're on the bench. That's a complete conflict of interest. Why? Because every attorney that goes up against you will know, hey, listen, I could go, I'm before this judge, but I could be against the judge, right? So it creates a significant problem for the attorneys that are in the court. be would be a judge but in an arbitrary role as an arbitrator role excuse me then you can engage in private practice and wear the robes and resolve disputes no so that's the one you would lean towards exactly 100 absolutely and it's also less you know politics because if you're again again i steer clear from politics but if you're working as a judge you're working for the states or the or the federal government depending on what level of judgeship you are with your justice, et cetera. And there's a lot of, when you're working with the government, there's a lot of,

uh, things you cannot do publicly. You see what I'm saying? Um, there are limits on donations that you can make to political campaigns. Again, not that I'm saying I'm into political campaigns, but I just don't like to be restricted in things that I can and cannot do, especially because I'm a big believer in entrepreneurship. I'm a big believer in business. I mean, I'm grateful to be a partner in my firm and I'm grateful to do what I do. But ladies and gentlemen, at the end of the day, like real financial independence, like true financial wealth, oftentimes is derived from private enterprise. And if you are working for the government, you're limited in that aspect. Clarence Thomas is going through that right now.

Supreme Court justice is getting a lot of flack for accepting expensive vacations from a billionaire friend. Whether or not he had to disclose that he was going on those vacations is up for public debate right now. And that's the interesting thing about the Clarence Thomas debate is that there are laws that restrict what a justice can and cannot receive, what they have to disclose, what they don't have to disclose. And again, it all derives because you are a servant of the people. And I love giving back and I love being able to serve my community, but I think I can conserve my community better, not by being a public employee, but perhaps by giving back to the community in other ways. Yeah, that makes sense. Because you're capped on a salary.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And my God, can you imagine, like, just imagine you start a business and let's say your business is quote unquote controversial, you know, and then the government comes in and decides, hey, listen, you can't do this because of X, Y, Z. The X, Y, Z is the policy issue of it, but the can't do this is the law aspect of it. And I don't necessarily, I'm not terribly fond of the idea of, you know, having my future restricted in such a way, unless I absolutely have to, unless it's really about,

unless there's no other way to serve my community, then I'll do it. Um, but if there's other ways to serve my community, I'll serve my community. So you have so many viral videos. Some of them have tens of millions of views. Walk me through the process of creating a viral video. You know, it's interesting when I started, when I joined this whole creator thing, it was, you know, we're in the pandemic, we're doing our thing. And there's this, and I become a legal correspondent. So legal correspondent, meaning that I do interviews on different, you know, news channels or television programs about the law. And so I said, oh, I'm just going to start creating this short form content. And then I decided to, there was a video that was going viral at that time about this.

There was these two young people. One was a young white guy. The other one was a young black guy. And they were in front of a law enforcement official. And the law enforcement official was trying to tell the black guy to step forward. So he's telling both of them step forward, step forward. And then he tells the Caucasian male, he said, will the Caucasian male please step back? and then the black guy steps back too and he the black guy's like i identify

as a caucasian male and i said to myself how interesting because we talk about especially in today's day and age how you identify and there's a huge difference between how you identify and what you are legally considered under the law. So I decided to do a video on that and then it just went, it just took off. It just went viral. And so my, my, I guess my advice for anyone who's looking to create content is find something that is true to you. And you know, if you try and copy someone else, it will never, I mean, it could work, but it's not going to, you're never going to be someone else's original. Be your own original.

Be who you are. Carve your own path. And when I carved my own path, it worked. So my advice is find your niche and do you. And do you in a way that's different from everyone else. And if, and just keep consistency, you know what I mean? Just keep going, keep posting. How many days at times a day do you post? It's interesting because remember I have a full-time job. So for that reason, I know when I was starting out there, like you should post three times a day.

And for everyone out there that gets that advice, I'm sure that might work for you. Go ahead. That's fine. But I only posted once a day. Wow. But I posted once a day. Whether I was tired, whether I wasn't tired, whether I was busy, whether I wasn't busy, I was consistent. Every day, 1 p.m. Pacific Standard Time, I would post something. And it could flop or it could do well, but I would always post something. And remember, when I first started for that first, you know, three weeks, everything flopped.

Like, I posted every day. And if I got 300 views, I was so excited. I was like, yes, you guys, I'm going viral. We hit 800 guys. Four digits. Exactly. Exactly. Um, but then again, the one thing that I will say is, you know, carve your own lane, do your own thing, have your own journey. But when you find something that works, keep doing that over and over and over again, you know, and then just adapt it and tweak it and change it. You know, life is a split test. Find what works and keep doing it. And just because you find something that works and you're doing it doesn't mean that

you can't try new things. Keep trying new things, but also keep what works. I love that. Life is a split test. Yeah. I'm hanging out on my wall. That's a quote right there. You guys are funny. Hugo, it's been a pleasure, man.

Any closing comments for the people? You know, I look at you guys. I look at what you do, and I look at what you offer to your audience. And I think that everything in life is a learning experience, whether you're learning from your own experience or where you're learning from experience of others. When you guys look at your tenacity and everything that you've accomplished and everything that you've done, it is a testament to allow people behind you to try and learn from that. So my hope is for everyone listening and everyone watching out there

learn pick something up write something down and read it internalize it and then live it it is not enough to just keep learning and learning and learning if you're not going to take action take action live your life live your dreams and be happy doing it man i love that his energy is so contagious i feel like we could run through a brick wall right now for sure oh it's been a blast man i had a little social hour thanks for tuning in guys that was a great episode see you next time