Digital Social Hour - The $46 Trillion Health Crisis No One's Talking About | Dr. Anthony Chaffee DSH #909

Episode Date: November 21, 2024

The $46 trillion health crisis is bigger than you think - and it's affecting every one of us. 🚨 In this eye-opening discussion, we uncover how our modern diet is fueling a massive healthcare catast...rophe that's draining trillions from the global economy. From shocking statistics about disease rates to fascinating insights about traditional diets, this video reveals why our health crisis is spiraling out of control. Discover why chronic diseases are skyrocketing worldwide, how our ancestors maintained incredible health without modern medicine, and what simple dietary changes could revolutionize global health. Learn why some populations are four times more likely to develop chronic diseases and the surprising truth about what we're feeding our children. You'll learn: - Why chronic disease rates are exploding worldwide - How traditional societies maintained perfect health - The real cost of our modern health crisis - What ancient cultures knew about nutrition that we've forgotten - Why some doctors are calling for a complete dietary revolution Whether you're interested in health, nutrition, or the future of healthcare, this conversation will change how you think about food and disease. The solutions might be simpler than you think - but time is running out. #HealthCrisis #Nutrition #ChronicDisease #Healthcare #Diet #Wellness #Health #Medicine #Prevention #GlobalHealth #anthonychaffee #paleodiet #metabolicsyndrome #functionalmedicine #animalbaseddiet CHAPTERS: 00:00 - Intro 00:30 - Ketogenic Diet and Fasting Benefits 01:40 - Ketogenic Diet and Mental Health Recovery 07:45 - Impact of Ketogenic Diet on Disease Rates 10:29 - Animals and Human Disease Resistance 15:44 - Chronic Diseases in Pre-Agricultural Societies 21:53 - Economic Costs of Chronic Diseases 24:30 - Expense of a Meat-Based Diet 26:58 - Role of Fat and Cholesterol in Brain Development 29:54 - Meat vs Vegetables: Cost Analysis 31:00 - Animals' Natural Eating Behavior 37:05 - Human Evolution Inflection Point 39:37 - Agricultural Revolution's Health Impact 42:15 - Brain Energy Requirements Explained 45:34 - Height of the Tallest People 47:26 - Nutrition's Influence on Height 51:56 - Dr. Pottinger and Nutrition Foundation 54:10 - Importance of Vitamin D 1:00:03 - Where to Find Dr. Anthony 1:00:43 - Thanks for Watching APPLY TO BE ON THE PODCAST: https://www.digitalsocialhour.com/application BUSINESS INQUIRIES/SPONSORS: jenna@digitalsocialhour.com GUEST: Dr. Anthony Chaffee https://www.instagram.com/anthonychaffeemd/ https://www.howtocarnivore.com/ www.youtube.com/@anthonychaffeemd LISTEN ON: Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/digital-social-hour/id1676846015 Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/5Jn7LXarRlI8Hc0GtTn759 Sean Kelly Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/seanmikekelly/ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Starting point is 00:01:03 That's right, Newton. With the Bronco and Bronco Sport, gravity has met its match. Huh, maybe that apple hit me a little harder than I thought. Yeah, you should get that checked out. With standard 4x4 capability, Broncos keep going up and up. Now get purchase financing from 0% APR for up to 60 months on eligible 2024 Bronco family models. Visit your Toronto area Ford store or ford.ca. And so people argue, well, then, you know, this is just the key junk diet sort of mimics the metabolism that you'd be in when you're fasting. And we know
Starting point is 00:01:38 that fasting is really good for you. So it's just me making that. What I argue that fasting actually mimics the metabolic state we're supposed to be in all the time anyway, which is a ketogenic diet, which is the same metabolic system Pathway that most animals are in the wild All right guys, dr. Anthony Chafee here today we're gonna talk the carnivore and ketosis baby Any any new studies or findings recently come across your desk? Well there are new studies coming out all the time on ketogenic diets in general.
Starting point is 00:02:10 Carnivore diet is a ketogenic diet and typically what a ketogenic diet is, is you're eliminating out carbohydrates and you'll go into a completely different metabolic state and you start running on your own body fat and you produce the carbohydrates, ketones and glycogen that you need. And so instead of bringing in a lot of carbohydrates and shutting down your metabolism, you actually are allowing your metabolism free a bit. And so there's more and more research coming out on ketogenic diets. A carnivore diet is a ketogenic diet. And when you eliminate out carbohydrates, you have to replace it with fat and protein.
Starting point is 00:02:45 Where does that fat and protein come from? It typically comes from meat, and most of the studies show that. It's a high-fat, meat-based ketogenic diet, and a carnivore diet is a high-fat, meat-based, ketogenic diet, so you're cutting out the rest of the stuff, too, like vegetables. So there are more studies coming out
Starting point is 00:03:02 on pure carnivore version of a ketogenic diet, but a lot of those are in the works as well. But there are literally thousands of randomized controlled trials in humans on a high-fat meat-based ketogenic diet, may include vegetables or not, but the main thing is being ketogenic. And so the ketogenic diet is the most well-studied diet in the world.
Starting point is 00:03:28 There isn't a single other diet form that has the rigor of scientific testing that a ketogenic diet has. And you're looking at specific endpoints and diseases. So things like diabetes has been shown in clinical trials to be reversible with a high fat meat-based ketogenic diet. Alzheimer's, a high fat meat based ketogenic diet has been shown in experimental data in humans to be a better treatment for Alzheimer's
Starting point is 00:03:55 than every medication ever trialed. Whoa. Yeah. That's crazy. We know we have quite a lot of studies showing the benefits of fasting. And so if you just fast for a period of time, people can reverse a lot of studies showing the benefits of fasting. And so if you just fast for a period of time, people can reverse a lot of diseases.
Starting point is 00:04:08 We see this in different traditional cultures and religions going back thousands of years that this can be beneficial. And we have studies showing that as well. And so people argue, well, then, you know, this is just the key, it sort of mimics the metabolism that you'd be in when you're fasting.
Starting point is 00:04:27 And we know that fasting is really good for you. So it's just making that. What I argue that fasting actually mimics the metabolic state we're supposed to be in all the time anyway, which is a ketogenic diet, which is the same metabolic pathway that most animals are in the wild. So carnivores, 70% of animal species are carnivores.
Starting point is 00:04:45 They eat just meat, which is protein and fat. And so they're on a ketogenic diet. Lions have been found to be in ketosis. And that makes sense because they're not eating carbs. But also herbivores, because herbivores that eat fibrous plants, fibrous strings of glucose, you think, oh, okay, well, they're getting carbohydrates. But in fact, they don't eat, they don't digest the fiber.
Starting point is 00:05:08 No vertebrate animal can break down fiber cellulose. And this is fiber. And so it's actually, they're actually feeding their microorganisms in their gut. And as a byproduct, they actually produce saturated fat. And then the proteins die off and they absorb those as protein. So even cows and gorillas and these sorts of fibrous
Starting point is 00:05:27 animals that eat fibrous plants, they're also getting the majority of their calories from protein and fat and are in ketosis. So I think that's our natural metabolic state. That's where all of our heavy machinery comes to bear. That's where a lot of health benefits come from. So some of these studies actually aren't, aren't termed ketogenic diet or low carb because some is sort of a four letter word in some academic circles. They just don't want to hear about it. The car board. Yeah, the car or ketogenic. They just think, Oh, that's just a, that's just a weird fad or something like that. So sometimes they'll hide it.
Starting point is 00:05:59 And they'll say, well, since we know fasting is really good for reversing diabetes or, you know, helping this sort of health issue. Well, what about, but fasting is really hard. So what about a diet that mimics the metabolic state of fasting? It's what's called a fasting mimicking diet or FMD. And so you can find a lot of papers called fasting mimicking diets, which is a key to J.
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Starting point is 00:07:57 in people over at Harvard. That's not published yet, but it's in the works for looking at perversing and putting into remission major depression, OCD, bipolar disorder, even schizophrenia. Wow. With a professor, Chris Palmer over at Harvard. And he's been in his clinical practice applying this to his patient population for years now
Starting point is 00:08:20 and finding that you can reverse these major, major issues because you're fixing the metabolism. He's arguing that these mental health issues are actually metabolic issues as well. You get metabolic derangement, it damages your mitochondria, which are the powerhouses of the cell. And when those don't act properly,
Starting point is 00:08:35 your cells don't work properly and your neurons are cells. And so your brain doesn't work properly and you get these mental health issues. And so you fix your metabolic health, you fix your mitochondria, all of a sudden, things start working better. There was a study that was done in France
Starting point is 00:08:50 and it was an interventional experimental trial, but it wasn't randomized control. They just took 31 people that had treatment resistant, major mental health issues. So major depression, OCD, bipolar, and schizophrenia, Schizoaffective disorder. And these people were severely affected, and they were treatment resistant.
Starting point is 00:09:12 It's really unfortunate, but the standard of care that we have right now in modern medicine only works well for about 10% of people with these serious mental health issues. And then there's another 40% or so that get some benefit, but not complete benefit. And the rest of it really does nothing for, those are the treatment resistant populations.
Starting point is 00:09:32 And so they took just the treatment resistant population that standard of care just did nothing for, for some of these people for well over a decade, all treated by the same psychiatrist, which is important. So they're getting consistent continuity of care. And they said, okay, would you be willing to go on a ketogenic diet? Some of these people really couldn't live on their own. They had to be institutionalized, things like that.
Starting point is 00:09:53 And so they put them on a high-fat, meat-based ketogenic diet, like a carnivore diet. And they found that 28 of them were able to stay on a ketogenic diet for at least three weeks. That was the minimum cutoff. And of those 28 people, every single one improved. And I think it was about two thirds went into complete remission.
Starting point is 00:10:16 Whoa. And they were completely treatment resistant. Standard of care had not worked for them at all. And so that was a major finding. And now that's not a randomized control trial, but now they're doing randomized control trials. And so that's some of the new exciting research over at Harvard.
Starting point is 00:10:31 And so that's sort of been in the... So you believe if every single human was on a ketogenic diet, the rate of disease would go down? Oh my goodness, yes. Absolutely. The large burden of disease are these so-called non-communicable chronic diseases, so things like diabetes, heart disease, cancer, mental health issues, Alzheimer's, dementia, Parkinson's, autoimmune issues.
Starting point is 00:10:59 All of these things, they cannot be passed on. They live in your body and you get them or you don't. And people think, well, it's just part of getting older, you just, they live in your body and you get them or you don't. And people think, well, it's just part of getting older, you just get unlucky, it's genetic. Well, if it was genetic, then why is the prevalence of these things going up decade after decade after decade? So there's more people in society
Starting point is 00:11:17 that are being afflicted with this. Well, that's just screening, we're getting better at screening. Like, I'm sorry, but you have somebody with Crohn's disease and you have 30 bouts of bloody diarrhea every single day. Like, you're not going to miss that. So it's not a screening issue. And cancer rates have skyrocketed.
Starting point is 00:11:36 They've more than tripled in the last 40 years. Now, one in two people throughout the course of their life will get cancer. Holy crap. One in two. That's crazy. Yeah, it is nuts. It's a coin flip.
Starting point is 00:11:47 Exactly, and so then you look at places like India, I mean, they're metabolic. They're some of the most metabolically sick people in the world. They also eat some of the least amount of meat in the world. They eat about three kilos of meat per person per year. They have some of the highest metabolic disease and diabetes rates in the world in America.
Starting point is 00:12:04 And we talk about America, or we get painted as being the and diabetes rates in the world in America. And we talk about America, or we get painted as being the sickest country in the world and having horrible metabolic health and everyone's overweight and just eating junk food and evil meat that makes them all sick. But our diabetes rate is 9%. And we have a lot of pre-diabetes, about 40% of pre-diabetic, but diabetes is 9%.
Starting point is 00:12:25 Well, India, where they eat hardly any meat, it's 25%. That was published in The Lancet in 2018. And that was looking at rural populations as well as urban populations. They were both 25%. So it wasn't just people living in the cities that were getting a higher affliction rate. It was everybody, 25%.
Starting point is 00:12:42 And that's diagnosed. And so people in India have a much much less access to medicine so it could be higher than that. There could be more people that... Help turn off hesitation, turn off doubt, turn off fears. With your support the YMCA of Greater Toronto helps people turn off whatever's holding them back so they can let their potential shine, help turn on confidence and connections and possibilities. From youth shelters to job training,
Starting point is 00:13:11 mental health counseling and beyond, the YMCA offers hundreds of programs that empower people to shine their brightest. See our charity's impact at ymcagta.org slash charity. Are diabetic and they just haven't discovered that. So yes, I do think so. 90% of the things that we treat nowadays as doctors are these non-communicable chronic diseases.
Starting point is 00:13:33 90% of the mortality of the deaths in Western countries come from non-communicable chronic diseases. 74% of deaths around the world are from non-communicable chronic diseases. And so that is the major, major burden of healthcare. Now you look at the animal kingdom. You know, deer don't get lupus, right? They don't typically get any of these diseases that we would see, even animals in the zoo,
Starting point is 00:13:57 if they're being fed their correct diet. And there are signs at the zoo that are very clear, say don't feed the animals, it makes them very sick if they eat anything that they're not designed to eat. And so they're saying, don't feed the animals the thing that you're eating right now. It makes them sick. What is it doing to us?
Starting point is 00:14:14 Wow. Or don't feed bread to ducks at the park, because it can make them sick. Well, give them diabetes. Wow. Right? Ducks get diabetes. And fatty liver.
Starting point is 00:14:22 I mean, how do we make foie gras? That literally means fat liver. I mean, how do we make foie gras? That literally means fat liver. We stuff a tube down a duck or a goose's throat and we pour grains down. How do we even get marbling, intramuscular fat in steaks? We give them a bunch of grains. Well, in humans, that's called myosteatosis. It's a pathological sign that we see on MRI and that denotes very serious metabolic dysfunction. So we're causing metabolic dysfunction in the animals because it increases the fat and
Starting point is 00:14:53 pathological deposition of fat in the liver and in the muscle tissues because it tastes better. Wow. Wag you, right? Wag you, exactly. And it doesn't matter that they're getting sick because we're going to slaughter them anyway, but we get sick. So the exact same practices that we're doing to animals to make them sick and get this pathological fat deposition in their muscles and organs,
Starting point is 00:15:17 we're doing that to ourselves as well. In the 1930s, there was an article about getting the poundage up on pigs and increasing their fat content and making them bigger and bigger product. And the way they did that was giving them grains and also skim milk, which was a byproduct of the cream and butter industry. And so it was just sort of a throwaway product. And they found that giving the combination of grains and skim milk actually increased their hunger, and so they overate. And when you're eating grains, that can raise your insulin,
Starting point is 00:15:52 that can then drop your blood sugar, and so you feel down, so you wanna eat more, but it also blocks a hormone called leptin, which is your satiety hormone, so you're blocking that and you tend to overeat. And then milk has casomorphines, which cause a baby mammal to drink more because you're trying to encourage babies
Starting point is 00:16:10 to get their weight up and grow. And so when you drink that as an adult, it still will trigger that hunger signal. So you have this combination of grains and skim milk, and all of a sudden it says specifically in this 1930s article paper that the reason that this worked is because it caused them to overeat. So what is grains and skim milk?
Starting point is 00:16:31 That's breakfast cereal. Right. So we're doing this to ourselves and we look at these same diseases, these non-communicable chronic diseases. Animals get them too, but only animals in captivity. Wow. And so only animals that are being fed something outside of their typical
Starting point is 00:16:49 evolved species-appropriate biological diet. And so you get dogs and cats, which are known carnivores, and yet we're giving them food and kibble that has some meat in it so they get the nutrients that they need, but it's packed out with grains so that it, because it's cheaper and you put something on it, you know, like put science in the name and go, oh, this is supposed to be, well, science actually tells us that they're supposed to eat meat. That's what science tells us. And then, you know, marketing agencies tell us otherwise. And they get sick and they get obesity and they get diabetes and they get sick and they get obesity and they get diabetes and they get cancer and they get autoimmune issues and arthritis and they get osteoporosis and these sorts of things.
Starting point is 00:17:31 But that's not typical. And those disease rates have gone up and up and up in recent decades. The average life expectancy in the US of a golden retriever in the 1970s was 17 years. Whoa. Now it's nine years. So it got cut in half.
Starting point is 00:17:46 Got cut in half. And I think that's directly because of the food that we're feeding them. There's a big shift that was when it started switching over to kibble was in the 80s. And now the vets are talking about how there's a massive increased prevalence in so-called human diseases in domesticated pets.
Starting point is 00:18:03 So these human diseases, these non-communicable chronic diseases, such as metabolic disorder, diabetes, and all these other sorts of things. And those are human diseases. Well, okay, well, what the hell is a human disease, right? Well, it's non-communicable, so we know we're not passing it to anybody. And yet they catch it when they eat this other diet.
Starting point is 00:18:22 And you talk to zookeepers and they know you feed any animal outside of what they're supposed to eat, they get sick. And when they get this other diet. And you talk to zookeepers and they know you feed any animal outside of what they're supposed to eat, they get sick. And when they get sick with, they get all the same things we get. They get the so-called human diseases. And I've spoken to some people, and I sort of knew the answer ahead of time,
Starting point is 00:18:37 but I asked them, I was like, do you ever give them like grains or dog food or anything like that? And the guy said, he was like, are you out of your mind? Like, you know, if you give animals that garbage, they'll get human diseases, right? So if you feed the animal human food, they get human diseases.
Starting point is 00:18:54 When you don't feed them that food, they don't get human diseases. That means directly that the food is causing the disease. And we see this in pre-agricultural populations. So the Native Americans, especially in the Great Plains, when they had a lot of access to meat, bison, they would do a buffalo drop, knock over a bunch of bison and just eat those throughout the year.
Starting point is 00:19:18 Other places, they didn't have as much animals available to them, so they had to sort of flesh out their meals with plants that they grew locally. But they also had specific ways of preparing them. Maize was, corn was prepared with a process called niche tomalization, which is a complex process to lower the toxic load and increase the bioavailability of the nutrients of corn. They had fermentation, all these other sorts of processes that we use to lower the toxic load of plants.
Starting point is 00:19:50 So plants defend themselves by being toxic. All plants are toxic. They make about a million different defense chemicals in order to protect themselves from animals and insects. Animals are hard to catch, they're hard to kill because they'll fight back, they'll run away. Those are their defenses. But once you get them and you take them down,
Starting point is 00:20:05 it's the most bioavailable and nutritious food that exists on this earth. Plants are easy to catch, they're just sitting there. So they can't just be straight up nutritious. Their major defense is by being physically poisonous. And so their traditional ways of eating plants are, you know, it was never raw food, vegan or anything like that. It was very specific ways of eating plants are, you know, it was never raw food vegan or anything like that. It was very specific ways of preparing these plants to make them more
Starting point is 00:20:29 nutritious but also lower the toxic load. And so when you look at these pre-agricultural societies, and anthropologists talk about this in these sort of hunter-gatherer populations, that the health issues that afflict them are very different than what we have. It's basically infections and injuries, childbirth. You know, mothers can die in childbirth, infant mortality rates, things like that are pretty high. But they don't get these chronic diseases
Starting point is 00:20:58 and people say, well, it's because they don't, they only live 30 years, that's not true. You know, right now, you know, pre-agricultural hunter gatherer populations, when they've been studied, as long as you're not killed by something. So there's a difference between average life expectancy from birth and how long you live if you die of old age. And so since the infant mortality rate is much higher and you're fighting off panthers and maybe polar bears and things like that up in the Arctic North with the Inuit.
Starting point is 00:21:27 That's obviously gonna lower your average life expectancy from birth. When they look at the people, how long they live, it's old age, actually people are living just as long, if not longer than people today. Wow. And they don't get these chronic diseases. And anthropologists talk about this shift
Starting point is 00:21:42 in the health issues. And they look at just infections, chronic disease, infant mortality, things like that, and injuries being attacked by lions, things like that. And then when they go to post-agricultural sort of civilized sort of society, they then have a shift and they get more of the diseases of civilization, which are also called human diseases, which are also called chronic diseases. And 100 years ago, 150 years ago,
Starting point is 00:22:09 they were called Western diseases, because we only saw these diseases in Western populations. We didn't see them in the Native Americans and the Native Australians and the Native Canadians and Alaskans and so on, or the Maasai or the Nanette or these populations that are still alive today, and some of them are still living in a traditional way, they don't get these diseases.
Starting point is 00:22:32 In Australia, when I first went down to practice there, I was told that, basically day one, that if you got an Australian Aboriginal patient, whatever age it said on their sticker, basically add 20 years to that. Because they just age so much more quickly and they develop diseases more quickly. And so you had someone in their 30s and 40s,
Starting point is 00:22:55 you had to consider them in a geriatric population and start thinking about the heart diseases and the cancers and the afflictions that affected 60 year olds, 70 year olds, and things like that. Why is that? Well, because they age more quickly, but I think it's because they haven't been exposed to agricultural food for very long.
Starting point is 00:23:15 Our ancestors would have had thousands of years to acclimatize and try to build up some sort of resistances to the toxins in plants. But the Australian natives and the American natives, especially in certain parts, it's really only the last 100, 150 years that they've been exposed to this. Some areas that did have agriculture, but the large majority of their diet was meat,
Starting point is 00:23:43 especially in the Great Plains with like the bison. Like if they had access to meat, all the historical records I found to be very consistent, that when they had access to meat, they would just eat meat and they'd sort of fill in the gaps with plants if they had to. But then there's places like in the Arctic North, where the Inuit are,
Starting point is 00:24:03 and the First Nation people of Canada now, there's no plants growing up in the Arctic North where the Inuit are, the First Nation people of Canada now, there's no plants growing up in the Arctic Circle. You're not cultivating any crops, you're not growing potatoes or anything like that. And so they just ate meat. And they have, when eating a Western diet, they get more sick. Native Americans, I heard this when I was a kid,
Starting point is 00:24:22 that the Native Americans, when eating Western diet, had a kid, that Native Americans, when eating a Western diet, had four times the burden of disease, chronic disease, obesity, heart disease, cancer, diabetes, all these things, than the rest of Americans. And I remember thinking at the time that, well, doesn't that mean the food is causing the disease? Because if they don't eat the food, they don't get the disease.
Starting point is 00:24:40 We get the food and we get the disease, just at a lower rate. And what's a non-Western diet? Whether they're eating that we're not and vice versa. And no one told me at the time, but they were, they were carnivores. They were predominantly eating meat and, and then, you know, the, the plants that they grew and prepared in, in specific traditional ways on top of that as well, but they weren't having any of the highly processed garbage. They were eating a lot of meat whenever they could. And it was just a very different diet and lifestyle.
Starting point is 00:25:12 And when you switch away from that, you start seeing a massive increase in disease. And I think that is the true healthcare crisis. We argue about what healthcare system we want. Do we want a public system or a private system or something new that we haven't thought of yet? It doesn't matter because any system is going to collapse and crumble under the weight of the growing burden of the chronic disease epidemic. Harvard University School of Public Health
Starting point is 00:25:43 published a massive study looking at the economic burden of chronic disease, just five chronic diseases, heart disease or cardiovascular disease, COPD, diabetes, cancer and mental health disorders, just those five. So obviously a lot of other ones as well, they're very expensive and costly, just those five they found that in 2010, I'm gonna give rough numbers here, so forgive me, but around worldwide, we spent about $8 trillion in treating that, in the direct and indirect costs
Starting point is 00:26:17 of treating those diseases. By 2030, it's estimated to be up around $14 trillion, trillion with a T, right? And so that's worldwide. So it's nearly doubled in that period of 20. Five, six years? 20 years, yeah, so 2010 to 2030. Oh, okay, got it.
Starting point is 00:26:34 And so, but then they looked at more than that. They looked at the cost to, you know, the lost opportunity costs of people not being able to work, not being able to take care of their family, not being involved in the economy,, you know, the loss opportunity costs of people not being able to work, not being able to take care of their family, not being involved in the economy, getting on disability, these other sorts of things. And they found that, that between 2010 and 2030,
Starting point is 00:26:55 we're basically gonna spend around $46 trillion in lost opportunity costs. So that's $46 trillion out of the economy that we don't have access to. And the biggest one was premature deaths. So people dying young, someone having a heart attack in their 30s and not being productive for the next 50 years
Starting point is 00:27:12 or 40 years, however long you're productive. And that they found in 2010 to be around $23 trillion a year lost to the world. And by 2030, they're expecting that around $23 trillion a year lost to the world. And by 2030, they're expecting that to be up around $43 trillion a year that we're losing. So the burden of the healthcare crisis is not just the 14, 15 trillion dollars a year that we're spending, it's the 43, 45, $50 trillion
Starting point is 00:27:45 in lost opportunity and early deaths that we're losing from the economy as well. So we're realistically thinking about 50, 60 trillion dollars a year that we're losing out of the economy that could be going towards very useful things and just being more productive as well. So any healthcare system is gonna collapse and crumble under that. And it's not gonna be able to survive.
Starting point is 00:28:05 And so we need to fix that first. And then we can argue about what system would be best. Yeah, do you think that's fixable with the average salary in America right now? Because this diet might be kind of expensive, right? It's surprisingly less expensive. You think about it, you process food, junk food. I mean, potato chips cost more per pound
Starting point is 00:28:25 than steak does, but also spinach does too. Spinach per pound costs more than meat. And you get a pound of meat or two pounds of meat. That's every nutrient that you need in the proportion that you need it for 24 hours. That's perfect nutrition for 24 hours. Just one pound of meat? Well, depending on the size of the person. So for me, it would probably be 6'3", 230. So I generally eat around two pounds of very fatty meat, so like fatty, ribeye quality sort of fat.
Starting point is 00:28:52 I get that sort of amount of fat. And so two and a half pounds, I would have a day. And if I'm working out and I'm exercising, my body wants to put on muscle, which I've found to be far more easy to put on muscle on a carnivore diet than I would have a day. And if I'm working out and I'm exercising, my body wants to put on muscle, which I've found to be far more easy to put on muscle on a carnivore diet than anything else I've ever done, even as a high level athlete and rugby player
Starting point is 00:29:16 in the US and UK. And then I'll need more. So if I'm working out, I'm pushing myself, then I just need more. So I could eat up to four pounds, but four pounds of ground beef is still only about $20, $24, and usually the higher fat, ground beef is less expensive, so you're actually saving money there,
Starting point is 00:29:36 and you want the fat. The fat's actually an essential nutrient. It's not just a calorie source. There are essential fatty acids that you have to have or you can get sick and die. There are essential fat soluble vitamins that you have to have or you can get sick and die. There are essential fat soluble vitamins that you have to have or you can get sick and die. Your brain is made out of fat.
Starting point is 00:29:49 60, 70% of your brain is made out of fat and a large portion made out of cholesterol as well. Cholesterol is really important. So important that your brain makes cholesterol. And there are countless studies talking about how if you disrupt your brain's metabolism for cholesterol, you get very serious neurocognitive disabilities and problems. And yet we're doing everything we can to disrupt
Starting point is 00:30:13 our normal cholesterol modulation and metabolism. Taking medications that will cross into the brain and suppress your brain's ability to make cholesterol, changing our diet so we have less cholesterol, all these sorts of things. And we're doing this with children too, which is, I think is honestly a crime against humanity because you have to have fat and cholesterol,
Starting point is 00:30:34 high amounts of fat and cholesterol in your diet. You need to be in ketosis to properly develop your brain and nervous system because ketones cross the blood-brain barrier. Ketones are from fat oxidization. They're just basically a fuel based on fat. And they cross freely into the brain. They cross the blood brain barrier and they can re- they are act as fuel and two thirds
Starting point is 00:30:59 of your brain optimally run on ketones. So if you have enough ketones and you have enough glucose, two thirds of your brain will only run on those ketones. So it's actually a preference. It's only when you start getting less ketones or not enough ketones that you start filling in the gaps with glucose. And so some will still run on glucose, but the majority, including the cortex,
Starting point is 00:31:17 is what we do our thinking with, is optimally fueled on ketones. But the ketones also can reconstitute into fatty acids and make up the physical structures of your brain. So when a baby's brain is growing and a child's brain is growing, it's really important for them to get ketones, a lot of ketones, a lot of fat.
Starting point is 00:31:39 So a baby in the womb is in ketosis. Even though they're carbohydrates in breast milk, when a baby is breastfeeding, they're in ketosis because it's a lot easier for them to be in ketosis. Wow. Even though they're carbohydrates in breast milk, when a baby is breastfeeding, they're in ketosis because it's a lot easier for them to be in ketosis because they need to be in ketosis for their brain. And then we get them onto really high sugar baby food and formula and actually suppresses the ketones and the ketosis and you're not giving them proper fat. Dang. So you're not a fan of baby formula. No, no, no. A lot of parents use that, right? They do, and sometimes their circumstances
Starting point is 00:32:08 require that they do, and that's unfortunate because they don't have the same makeup as breast milk. They have sort of different fats. They say, well, you have to have omega-6s, so you need seed oils, like vegetable oils and things like that. Well, vegetable oils do have omega-6s, but they have the wrong omega-6s, so you need seed oils, like vegetable oils and things like that. Well, vegetable oils do have omega-6s, but they have the wrong omega-6s.
Starting point is 00:32:29 We don't need omega-6s. We need arachidonic acid, which is an omega-6. We don't need random omega-3s. We need specific omega-3s, DHA, EPA, for our brain. 20% of your brain is DHA. Massive proportion of your brain and yourHA, massive proportion of your brain and your body is made out of fat. And so breast milk is actually the highest concentration
Starting point is 00:32:50 of saturated fat and cholesterol of any food in nature. And so why are we scared of this? Why are we saying that this is bad for us? And first of all, that's been completely discredited that whole cholesterol heart hypothesis. But, you know, just looking at what kids need to eat. They need fat and cholesterol. Getting back to your point about cost, it actually ends up being cheaper.
Starting point is 00:33:14 So a pound of spinach costs way more than a pound of ground beef, certainly, and it can cost more than many steaks do per pound. And you're not going to get all the nutrition you need from spinach. You will get all the nutrition you need from steak. With that spinach, you're going to need to buy 30 other things. Half of them are going to go bad and spoil before the other ones get used. And so you end up having a lot of waste.
Starting point is 00:33:37 Meat, I've really never had to throw out meat. Worst case scenario, give it to my dogs. And they're on a raw meat diet as well. Nice. They're healthy as hell. Yeah, I just switched my dogs over to that. Oh, perfect. Their skin is way better already.
Starting point is 00:33:50 Yeah. And they look healthier. Yeah. Yeah, and they will be. They absolutely will be. And they'll live longer too, and much more healthfully. And so I don't have any waste. I've actually saved a lot of money.
Starting point is 00:34:01 I'm not buying coffees and snacks, and this and that's, or whatever. I eat two pounds of meat, and I'm good for 24 hours. It's really convenient too for people with a busy schedule because I'm just not hungry. I eat a big meal. I eat fatty meat until it stops tasting good. I can listen to my body's signals.
Starting point is 00:34:21 I don't have to figure out with a calculator how much to eat. You're never gonna see a koala pulled out of a calculator to figure out what to eat, right? And so if you need a calculator to figure out your macros, you're probably eating the wrong thing. I was never a fan of that trend. There's apps that do it now.
Starting point is 00:34:35 You've got to input everything you eat. Yeah, that's it. Where is that in nature? Nature is natural. It has to happen just on its own. And so if we have to figure out something and calculate it, it means we're probably eating the wrong thing, because we should be able to eat intuitively.
Starting point is 00:34:48 We should just be able to just eat our natural, biologically appropriate diet and listen to our natural instincts. We're not here from space. We're animals, just like every other animal on this Earth. We came from this planet, and those same biological laws apply. No animal in the wild. You don't see like a fat badger waddling around,
Starting point is 00:35:08 oh, that one just doesn't have any self-control. They know what to eat, they know how much to eat, and they know when to stop. And we do too, if we're eating the right thing. And that's a testimony to it being the right thing. If you're just eating fatty meat and you eat until it stops tasting good, your body will perfectly
Starting point is 00:35:25 regulate what's coming in and out. And so you don't need to worry about it. And I think that is a big testimony to understand that this actually is our biologically appropriate way of eating. Yeah, that's a good point, because you'll never see fat animals in the wild, but you'll see fat dogs, fat cats, fat humans.
Starting point is 00:35:42 Yeah, but only when eating inappropriate diets. You know, like dogs that are just eating meat. I mean, you put as much meat as you want in your dog's dish. It will eat a certain amount and it will stop. Really? Yeah. You think they'll stop? Oh yeah, they will.
Starting point is 00:35:55 Wow, I want to test that out. Yeah, yeah. Because my dogs be pounding the food I give them. Yeah, well, maybe they need a bit more. Yeah, they might. But there is a point that they'll stop. And because they know, look in the wild again. You have animals out on pasture, right?
Starting point is 00:36:11 Cows just live on their own food, and yet they stop sometimes. They monitor how much they're eating. Actually, they don't have to monitor, but they stop naturally. Koalas, they live in a tree, they have no natural predators, they're just sitting there lazy as a lump, and they're just eating leaves and then they stop. They could just keep going,
Starting point is 00:36:33 but something in them tells them to stop. Lions, you look at a pride of lions, and King Lion, the alpha, gets to, when they make a kill, alpha gets to eat as much as he wants of what he wants. And typically goes for the belly. That's where more fat is. That's like bacon is the belly, belly meat. And there's a lot of fat around the organs. The momentum is nearly completely fat. It's fat around the kidneys. The mesentery, which is the blood supply to the, to the intestines,
Starting point is 00:37:02 completely covered in fat. So there's a lot of fat in the abdomen. And I think that's why they're going for the abdomen as opposed to, oh, they're getting all the organs. Organs are great. There's a lot of nutrients in them, but they're going for the fat, I believe, because they leave like the haunches, the hindquarters. They're very, very lean. Lions will often leave those
Starting point is 00:37:20 and eat the fattier parts of the animal first, unless they're very hungry. And then the hyenas will come in, they'll eat the hindquarters, and their jaws are strong enough to crack open the bones and get at the marrow, which is more fat. And so animals always go for the fat. So King Lion goes for the fat.
Starting point is 00:37:35 It goes for the abdomen, eats as much as he wants. No other animal gets to touch that thing until King Lion's done. And so they're all just waiting. I've seen videos of these where they're just like, impatiently waiting, like, oh my God, I wanna get in there. And Daddy Lion is just doing his thing. And then all of a sudden it's just, he's done.
Starting point is 00:37:53 He could, and then the rest of them come in and devour the thing. But he could just keep going until he just made himself sick and was just rolling on the back. Oh my God. You know? Yeah, exactly. But he doesn't. And they don't rolling on the back. Oh my God. You know, exactly. But it doesn't, you know, and they don't get fat.
Starting point is 00:38:07 You know, it doesn't, it doesn't get overweight. They're ripped. They're like on steroids. And people say, well, they're in the wild. They're really active. I mean, everyone knows that male lions aren't all that active and, you know, and, but also it doesn't explain animals in the zoo, right?
Starting point is 00:38:21 And that's what most people say is that, well, animals in the wild, they're always running around. Koalas don't run around anywhere. They're basically sitting there. A lot of animals are just very sedentary unless they have to be, um, active. And, uh, but again, it doesn't explain animals in the zoo that live in a box the size of this room. It's the definition of a sedentary lifestyle. They just sit in an enclosed area and don't go anywhere.
Starting point is 00:38:44 And yet when fed their natural diet, they also look very strong, very muscular, very lean. And so that's the thing, if they fed them grains and inappropriate food, they would get fat, but they're not. So being fed the appropriate diet, and even though they're getting no activity, no exercise to speak of, they're extremely muscular and lean and healthy.
Starting point is 00:39:05 And so I think that's because of the diet. Yeah, I don't see too many healthy vegans. The only one I've seen actually is Brian Johnson. Yeah, well he takes 160 different supplements and he has a whole team spending about $3 million a year keeping him that way. The interesting thing about Brian Johnson is he said that, well, and he may have changed his opinion on this,
Starting point is 00:39:26 but I did hear him say at one point that he didn't, wasn't doing the vegan diet because he thought it was the healthiest diet. That was just his choice. That's how he wanted to do it. And so he had his team figure it out. And so it's like, okay, I want to do a vegan diet. I want to do it this way.
Starting point is 00:39:42 You figure out how that works. And so that's why he's taking 160 different supplements a day, because you have to. There are essential nutrients that you cannot get from the entire plant kingdom, from the entire fungus kingdom. They just don't exist. B12 is the classic example, but there are more.
Starting point is 00:39:57 I mean, you look at, and that's the argument too, you cannot say that humans are herbivores for a lot of reasons, but it just starts and stops at B12. There's no B12 in the plankton. Right. Right. You have to get that from meat. And so we couldn't be herbivores.
Starting point is 00:40:14 We couldn't have evolved as herbivores. And we didn't evolve as herbivores. I mean, that's absurd. All the best evidence shows that humans have been apex predators, top of the food chain, which by definition means carnivore, for at least two million years, if not longer. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:40:28 Homo habilis with the onset of the ice ages, two, two and a half million years ago, there was this inflection point in early human and then human evolution, where eight million years ago or so, we split off from our ancestors who were largely herbivorous. And because they started eating meat, they started eating more and more meat, more and more meat, started having more genetic adaptations to closer to what we are today.
Starting point is 00:40:54 Started getting taller, started getting bigger brains because we had to figure out how to get meat. We weren't just naturally predisposed to hunting like a lion, taking things down. We had to scavenge. We had to figure out how we could take a rock and smash open the skull of a dead animal and eat the brains and things like that. And then get sharpened tools. About 3.3 million years ago,
Starting point is 00:41:12 we got the first example of a sharpened tool that we can now use to cleave and cut off meat off the bone. And we see butcher marks, very classic, clear signs of butchery on bones around that time and beyond, showing that this was intentional butchering and carving and ripping off meat with these stone tools that were again found in that area. And you can see the deposits in those cut marks
Starting point is 00:41:36 in the bones that came from that Flint ax over there. And so we have very good information about this. So our brains were growing, our jaws were getting smaller, teeth were getting smaller because we're chewing on, we're eating softer and softer foods. We're not chewing on sticks all day like a gorilla, right? And so we had these adaptations. Then about two, two and a half million years ago,
Starting point is 00:41:57 the ice ages started. We didn't actually have polar ice caps two and a half million years ago or so. When the ice ages started, we're in an ice age. We're sort of in an ebb of an ice age. When that ice shelf started coming down, obviously ice kills things and it stops, kills animals and plants and things like that
Starting point is 00:42:15 that were surviving in the area. And animals had to specially adapt or die out. And our ancestors in Homo habilis did, and the adaptation that they had was they were able to turn to full carnivore apex predators. So they weren't just scavenging now and then getting a kill every now and then. Now they were able, they had the technology
Starting point is 00:42:35 and the brain power and the tactics to be able to take down large animals and get the whole animal. You can get the organs, you can get the meat, you can get all the fat, you weren't just getting the scraps. And there's an inflection point in our evolution at that point, so our height and brain size
Starting point is 00:42:51 was coming up steadily over millions of years since our ancestors started eating meat. And about two and a half million years ago, bam, it's just an exponential increase in brain capacity, cranial capacity and height. Up until about 15,000 years ago, it's going up and up and up and cranial capacity and height up until about 15,000 years ago. It's going up and up and up and up and up and bang straight down straight down and Anthropologists and paleontologists show that in the fossil record
Starting point is 00:43:17 there's a clear point right at the point of the agricultural revolution and this this isn't just in, you know, all over the world this happened. This happened when a society went from pre-agriculture to post-agriculture. It's starting about 10,000 years ago, but at other points in time, people have come across agriculture, have been introduced to agriculture, and you see the exact same thing.
Starting point is 00:43:39 And as, oh, I'm gonna butcher his name, but as Professor Ula Jacek from Oxford, I can get it spelled for you if you like. But. I'm good on that. Yeah, but he said that, starting about 10,000 years ago, you saw a clear, distinct line in pre and post agriculture
Starting point is 00:44:00 that the height, the same thing occurred, regardless of the time, regardless of location, and regardless of the type of crop that they moved to, the same things happened. The height and health of the population declined. And they say there's all these signs of malnutrition, infectious disease, and all these other things that came on afterwards.
Starting point is 00:44:20 The jaws got smaller, started getting crooked teeth, fallen dental arches. Weston A. Price was a dentist a hundred years ago. He showed this in these native populations. They have perfect teeth, perfect dental arches, until they started eating Western food and didn't get enough fatty meat. And specifically he found that it was the fat soluble
Starting point is 00:44:39 vitamins that you needed to develop your hard palate and your dental arches and jaw. And in the same families, all of a sudden, Johnny starts eating this other stupid food that come from the towns and has screwed up teeth. And then they can reverse that by giving him fatty meat and whole milk and things like that. And then the next generations,
Starting point is 00:45:06 they could get the teeth back, things like that. But we saw that, you can tell the difference between a pre-agriculture and post-agricultural skeleton and teeth, especially because of that. Dang. And the brains went down. So after agriculture, the adult male brain capacity reduced by 11%, female adult brain capacity
Starting point is 00:45:29 went down by 17%, and the average height went down by about five inches. Holy crap. And so that wasn't over hundreds of years or thousands of years, that wasn't an adaptation process. That was overnight in the fossil record. So that happened immediately. And that's persisted until today.
Starting point is 00:45:47 And we saw this in real time, again, with the Native Americans, the Native Canadians, the Native Australians. And we're seeing it in the Maasai as well, who are traditionally carnivores. They have a large portion of that carnivore diet being milk, but milk, blood, and meat is their staple diet. And they started introducing some plants
Starting point is 00:46:06 throughout the 20th century, and they started getting some of these human diseases throughout the 20th century as well. Now they have Coca-Cola trucks going to the Masai Mara and these little villages, and they sell out very quickly because they don't know how harmful this stuff is. And now their diabetes is actually going up and their tooth decay is going up
Starting point is 00:46:22 and their chronic diseases are going up, even though traditionally they're extremely healthy. So now they're seeing that inflection point that anthropologists talk about, that they go from this just injuries and infectious disease and actually pretty low infectious disease rate. There's a study out of the British that in the 1920s and early 30s,
Starting point is 00:46:41 they actually have, they're actually extremely healthy, they have very low rates of like almost no chronic disease and very low infectious disease rates as well. And they were much taller, stronger, healthier and more lean body mass than their neighbors, the Akikuyu who they interbred for who knows how many hundreds of years or thousands of years. So they're genetically similar population.
Starting point is 00:47:04 And the Akikuyu were largely vegetarian. And they were, so they were just growing their own crops. This is out in the middle of Africa. They're not in cities. They don't have pollution. They don't have commercial agriculture and pesticides and fertilizers. It's just living out on a commune,
Starting point is 00:47:21 growing grains and things like that. They were much less healthy. The Maasai were five inches taller on average, 23 pounds heavier of lean body mass, stick skinny, just really svelte people and 50% stronger and they didn't have any of these chronic disease issues that the Aki Kuyu had, who also had a lot of nutritional deficiencies.
Starting point is 00:47:42 The British started supplementing them with the different nutrients that they were lacking, and it didn't actually make them healthier. It wasn't until they replaced the plants they were eating with meat that they got healthier. And there's no mention of heart disease anywhere in that study with the Maasai in the 1920s. And yet in the 1970s, you start seeing,
Starting point is 00:48:04 oh yeah, well, there's a bit of it there, but I know people that have volunteered in Africa in the 80s and they were like, yeah, that was never anything we treated. We never treated these chronic diseases. It was always different things. Now you're seeing it. Now you're seeing it show up more.
Starting point is 00:48:18 Now you're seeing diabetes, which if you have diabetes, it increases your risk of developing cardiovascular disease by a thousand percent. And metabolic syndrome will increase it by 600%. And so those are major, major risk factors, those metabolic issues are major risk factors for all these chronic diseases. And now we're starting to see those in the Maasai.
Starting point is 00:48:38 And we saw those, and those disparities between the Maasai and the Aki Kuyu, exactly the same disparities that we saw pre and post agriculture in the fossil record. And the Native Americans, especially in the Great Plains, there was a study in 2001, that was just called Tallest in the World, and they looked at records from the late 1800s
Starting point is 00:48:58 with the Plains Indians in the Great Plains that were largely just eating buffalo and bison. And then they found that they were the tallest human beings alive on earth at the time. They were far taller than the Europeans, you know, five, six inches or more taller on average. And there's sort of an average between them somewhere, you know, ranging from like five foot six to five foot ten on average, but the Cheyenne were about five foot 10 on average, adult male height. And now in America, last I checked, it was five foot eight.
Starting point is 00:49:30 So it was still taller than people here today, but they were far taller than people at the time, which was much lower, more like five, three, five, four. And so they were much, much, much taller. And that was at the end of the 1800s, after they'd killed all the bison and put them on the reservations. That's a really interesting thing.
Starting point is 00:49:48 So they were still taller than everybody else, even though they had started transitioning onto a more Western diet and started getting sicker and started having that, their height come down. And in those original, those studies and measurements, they said that the older generations were far taller than the younger generations. And so if they just looked at the older generations
Starting point is 00:50:09 or maybe looked 100 years back, the average height would have been much, much taller. And in fact, we see the fossil record of people going back tens of thousands of years who back before the megafauna died out because we were eating mammoth, that the big mammoth hunters, some of these people were on average 6 foot 2 to 6 foot 4 average.
Starting point is 00:50:29 That's crazy. Right? And so I'm 6'3", I would be average. You'd probably be slightly above that. But everyone would be. That's so wild. It would just be a population of NBA players and things like that. Yeah, eating a mammoth.
Starting point is 00:50:44 Damn. Eating mammoth. Damn. Eating mammoth. So why do you think Asian people are so short? Well, a lot of it's going to be because of diet as well. You look at the Mongols. Well, looking more recently, there's been a lot of famines in the 20th century as well with Mao and the forced famines and poverty
Starting point is 00:51:02 and things like that. And of course, if you're not getting adequate nutrition during development, you're not going to grow as tall as you possibly could. And we see that all over the place, which is why I think it's a crime against humanity to be putting kids on vegetarian diets or processed food diets and formulas and things like that.
Starting point is 00:51:20 And vilifying means they know, no, it's bad. Putting five-year-olds on statins out of your mind. I mean, but people are talking about that, that you should put kids on statins if they're cholesterol aside. It needs to be high. Their brain needs it to be high. Their body needs it to be high.
Starting point is 00:51:36 And it's good for you. All your hormones are made out of cholesterol or your steroid hormones are made out of cholesterol. Vitamin D is made out of cholesterol. So if you're not giving kids adequate nutrition, they're not going to develop properly. And so you've had a lot of forced famines and poverty throughout the last century in China and elsewhere.
Starting point is 00:51:54 And people are going to be shorter as a result of that. Then you see people I've known many friends that were first generation American. And their parents were these wizened little old Chinese people. They're six foot four, just ripped. Yeah, that happened to me. Yeah.
Starting point is 00:52:10 My grandparents were super short. There you go. Yeah, so I think a lot of that's nutritional. And I think that there's a stark contrast specifically because of the malnutrition that was prevalent in the 20th century for various reasons. Look at Genghis Khan, the Mongol horde, they were carnivores.
Starting point is 00:52:27 They ate, you know, horse meat, they drank horse blood and fermented mare's milk, very lactose intolerant, it had to be fermented. And still to this day, persistently lactose intolerant. Some of the more lactose intolerant people in the world as a population, and yet they have a lot of fermented dairy, but they can't do the lactose.
Starting point is 00:52:46 And they obviously carved out the largest contiguous empire that's ever existed on earth. And you read histories about Genghis Khan and the Mongols and a large portion of that success was attributed to their diet. They're extremely well fed. Even the most base fighter in the Mongol horde had a lot of access to meat and high protein and nutritious food while they were fighting against these peasant armies that were just already subjugated.
Starting point is 00:53:17 They were just eating a bunch of gruel. They had a lot of health issues. And they were just weaker and more frail and just malnourished. And they actually attribute a lot of their success to how healthy the Mongol people were because they were eating such good food. It also was an advantage
Starting point is 00:53:32 because they didn't have to cook three times a day. So they didn't have to stop their armies and they didn't have all these cook fires going up. As you can track an army in the horizon by the smoke that's coming up, I go, okay, see how fast those smoke clouds are moving. They're gonna be here in three days. Okay, we have three days to prepare.
Starting point is 00:53:46 You didn't have that with the Mongols. They just showed up out of nowhere. So they were eating raw meat? They would eat raw meat. They could cook it as well. People are always saying about how you have to. There's a thing now in Australia where they're telling parents not to put lunch meat in their kids'
Starting point is 00:54:03 sandwiches because, oh, we don't have refrigeration. So it could be like three hours before going. I was just rotting, go to hell. I'm like, are you out of your mind? No one's ever brought a sandwich to school or work before. It's like, this is the first time this has ever happened. The Mongols would take a raw piece of meat
Starting point is 00:54:19 and put it under their saddle and ride on it for several days to tenderize it. Wow. And then they'd eat it. How savage. And they it for several days to tenderize it. Wow. And then they'd eat it. How savage. And they could go five days without eating, eat 10 pounds of horse meat, and then ravage the countryside for another five days
Starting point is 00:54:34 and do it again. And they could drink blood as well. The Maasai drink blood and they just sort of pop a little hole in a vein and drain some blood and they drink that and it keeps you going. It's amazing nutrition. and it's a renewable resource as well. They're eating grass or turning it into blood,
Starting point is 00:54:49 you're drinking the blood and you just keep going. It's like milking them and you do it in a rotation so you're not overdoing it but it works very well and they were much taller and healthier and more robust as well. And so yeah, so it's, I think you'll find that in populations, any population, you go back to eating that way,
Starting point is 00:55:12 the kids will be taller and smarter and have bigger brains. We saw this in cats. There's a very famous doctor named Dr. Pottinger. And Dr. Price, I mentioned before, there's an organization called the Price-Pottinger Foundation carrying on his work. And Pottinger is this other guy, Dr. Pottinger, who randomly was my mom's doctor as a kid in California at one point and said you need to feed, I mean
Starting point is 00:55:34 I don't remember the health issues she was having at the time, basically said she needs to eat raw meat or raw liver and every day she had to have some raw liver every single day and actually sorted out her issues. Wow. And he did a study with cats for several years, many years, probably 14 or some years, and looking at nutrition because they're studying tuberculosis and he thought that tuberculosis
Starting point is 00:56:00 had something to do with the adrenals. In fact, it has to do with diet. Pre and post agriculture, pre-agriculture, you don't see any signs of tuberculosis had something to do with the adrenals. In fact, it has to do with diet. Pre and post agriculture, pre-agriculture, you don't see any signs of tuberculosis infections. Post agriculture, immediately you saw signs of tuberculosis in the spine of the fossils and things like that. And then Dr. Jay Salisbury, who was a New York doctor
Starting point is 00:56:19 in the 1800s, did a 30-year research project into the optimal diet for human beings. He was living with the native Americans, seeing that they were just really healthy with, you know, just eating meat, they were living to be 110, 115 years old. And they're like, Oh, well, that's, that's far fetched. And I was like, well, actually it's not, because I was taught in genetics class 20 plus years ago that we are designed based on the length of our telomeres and our chromosomes, genetically,
Starting point is 00:56:43 we're designed to live 120 years on average. So people actually just living to be 115, 120 years old, that's actually normal. That should be how long we live. But we're dying in our 60s and 70s and 80s and calling that a good life because we're sickening ourselves for decades and eating these low grade poison
Starting point is 00:56:59 and not getting proper nutrition and our bodies are just failing 40 years early, 50 years early sometimes. So he was looking at, and Salisbury actually found that when you put people on just a pure red meat and water, this is long before processed foods and garbage, you cut out the grains and the vegetables and just eat red meat and water.
Starting point is 00:57:18 He could reverse autoimmunity like rheumatoid arthritis and Crohn's, reverse gout, and even tuberculosis. He was actually finding that he was getting people healing from tuberculosis, which was a major killer back then by putting them on a pure red and water diet. And so Pottinger was looking at the adrenals. And so he was taking, doing an adrenalectomy,
Starting point is 00:57:39 which they took out the adrenal glands from these cats and we're gonna expose them to TB and sort of see what happened. But all the cats were dying and so they couldn't figure out what was going on. People were sort of passing in strays before they all spayed neutered animals back then. So there was a lot of strays. So they're getting like a lot of cats, more cats than they knew what to do with.
Starting point is 00:58:00 And they sort of had more than they needed. Mostly they were cooking the meat and giving it to the cats. They're still just giving it meat, but they were cooking it. And then they sort of, it was just sort of for time management. They're like, all right, well, we have too many cats. We'll cook as much as we can, but then we'll give just raw meat to the rest of them.
Starting point is 00:58:16 The raw meat ones all survived. All the cooked meat ones died, raw meat ones left. And they're like, okay, well, what the hell is going on? And they switch the focus of his research to, okay, what nutrients are you losing something when you cook meat? And they found that, yes, you do. You lose taurine, you lose glutamine,
Starting point is 00:58:33 you lose other sorts of things. And taurine is essential to cats. And so they have to have raw meat. And so they looked at it and they found that the raw meat group, there's a lot to this, but I'll paraphrase and get to the high notes. the raw meat group, there's a lot to this, but I'll paraphrase and get to the high notes. The raw meat group was extremely healthy,
Starting point is 00:58:49 generation after generation after generation, big strong animals, perfectly formed cheekbones, big brains for a cat and proper bone density, all that sort of stuff. And the cooked meat cats, same meat, it's just cooked, were much less healthy. And the next generation, they were smaller. They weighed less, they had like about half the bone density,
Starting point is 00:59:10 their brains were smaller, their cheekbones weren't as developed, and they weren't as interested in play, they weren't as interested in mating. The next generation, they were even sicker, even smaller, less developed facial structures, even smaller brain, and their bones were so soft because they only had about 3% bone mineralization.
Starting point is 00:59:29 Same amount of calcium. The calcium doesn't cook out, but because of how this changed the nutrients and how the body processed these nutrients, their bone mineralization was down around 3%. And so their bones, they said, were so soft and flexible, it was like foam rubber. And so they could have dozens of fractures
Starting point is 00:59:48 and they were sterile at that point. They couldn't have babies. They weren't even interested in mating really, but the ones who sort of did mate, couldn't get pregnant or the few that did get pregnant had stillbirths. So they couldn't make it past the third generation on cooked meat. And then they switched them to raw meat
Starting point is 01:00:04 and they got healthy again. Now they didn't grow after that because their growth plates were already closed. So it would be like your grandparents and you come to an area that had more access to food. They are much more healthy, but they're done growing at that point, but their kids could benefit from that.
Starting point is 01:00:20 And so the cats were able to reproduce and you'd think, well, the next generation, they'll just be back in normal again. No, it took four generations to breed back to where the raw meat cats were. So there's this multi-generational epigenetic knock-on effect that happens when you aren't as healthy as you could be. So it's actually a big impact.
Starting point is 01:00:42 So you're gonna be a lot taller than your parents and your grandparents. And if you eat properly, your kids are gonna be even bigger, taller, smarter and stronger. Their kids are gonna be even better as well. And we're just gonna get taller and taller and taller and better and better. You know, genetically I should be six, seven, six, eight.
Starting point is 01:00:59 My grandfather on my father's side, he and all his brothers were pushing seven feet tall. Wow. And my dad all his brothers were pushing seven feet tall. And my dad and his brothers are all from between 6'4 and 6'7. So something happened there. Yeah. Me and my brothers, 5'10, 6'3 and 6'4. So just three generations, we've just gotten a little bit shorter and a little bit shorter
Starting point is 01:01:21 and a little bit shorter. And so why the hell is that? Well, we had this big plant-based push throughout the 20th century. When my dad was a young man, they started pushing this whole cholesterol heart hypothesis, you shouldn't eat fatty meat, all that sort of stuff. And so he took that very seriously and we ate meat,
Starting point is 01:01:45 but we trimmed off all the fat and we had like whole grains and all that sort of, and milk and skim milk and grains. So we were just eating the fatty pig diet, so like fattened up pigs in the 1930s, that's what we grew up on. He read Dr. Pritikin's book, which was all about just eating basically no meat, but certainly no fat, and how important that was.
Starting point is 01:02:09 And so that's how we grew up. And my little brother really wasn't a fan of meat. He mostly ate white rice with tempura sauce. That was all you could get him to eat as a kid. And he's 5'10". I'm 6'3", my brother is 6'4". And, you know, when I was 18, I wrestled that 215 pound weight class.
Starting point is 01:02:32 My little brother was 148 weight class. Holy crap. Yeah, big difference. Huge. Yeah, and I always loved meat. I always wanted to eat a lot of meat. I also didn't have braces, neither did my brother or my sister.
Starting point is 01:02:42 My oldest, one of my sisters who decides she wanted to go vegetarian as a teenager and my younger brother who basically just didn't eat enough and just ate a bunch of rice, they were the only two people in my family that needed braces. Wow. And now we know in the dentistry journals
Starting point is 01:02:57 that crooked teeth are not genetic. It is developmental and mostly nutritional. And also, if you're chewing on soft food, you're not stimulating your heart pal in your jaw to grow properly. So you need to be chewing on not sticks like a gorilla, but something firm enough to trigger that growth response, which is meat.
Starting point is 01:03:17 I swear to God. Yeah, and get the fat-soluble nutrients that you need, which is really important. Absolutely. Dr. Anthony, it's been a blast. Where can people find you, your work, and what you got coming up next, man? Yeah, so thank you very much for having me.
Starting point is 01:03:29 It's a pleasure. And I have a YouTube channel and an Instagram. It's just my name, Anthony Chafee MD. You can find a lot more on this subject. And I have a podcast called The Plant Free MD, and that's available on any podcast platform. I'll be speaking at multiple, I speak at medical conferences and different things.
Starting point is 01:03:50 The next one will be in Wyoming. I'll be speaking in Spain and in England. And I announce a lot of these things on social media and Instagram, so if people wanna come see me talk, they can do that. Perfect, the link below, thanks for coming on. Awesome, thanks man. That was awesome. You said it.
Starting point is 01:04:03 Thanks for watching guys, see you next time.

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