Dinner’s on Me with Jesse Tyler Ferguson - Colton Underwood – on causing a stir on ‘Traitors’ and his husband’s Bachelor binge

Episode Date: February 3, 2026

'Traitors’ star Colton Underwood joins the show. Over juice and breakfast burritos, Colton tells me his strategy coming into ‘Traitors’ -- it’s not being lowkey – and his reaction to some of his colorful castmates. Plus, he tells me his husband’s reaction to his season of ‘The Bachelor’ and how he looks back at a difficult period in his life. This episode was recorded at The Butcher’s Daughter in West Hollywood, CA.  Want next week’s episode now? Subscribe to Dinner’s on Me PLUS. As a subscriber, not only do you get access to new episodes one week early, but you’ll also be able to listen completely ad-free! Just click “Try Free” at the top of the Dinner’s on Me show page on Apple Podcasts to start your free trial today. A Sony Music Entertainment & A Kid Named Beckett production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hey, it's Jesse. Today on the show, you know him from The Bachelor, from coming out Colton. He's a best-selling author. He's a podcast host. And he's on the new season of the Traders. It's Colton Underwood. He basically was like, if Donna's there, do not go for him. Even if she's a traitor.

Because he's like, do not put the Swifties on us. Like, we have a family now. And we're finally, like, doing well. You have a family. This is Dinner's On Me, and I'm your host, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. All right, so we're at the Butcher's Daughter here in West Hollywood in Los Angeles. I am so excited to meet Colton and have a meal with him. It's been a while since I've seen him.

I thought this would be a perfect place to bring him. It's delicious. It's bright. It's airy. It's health conscious. He's an athlete. He likes to hook healthy things in his body. But also we're in the heart of West Hollywood in an area that celebrates the LGBTQ community.

and Colton is in this beautiful new place in his life as a father, as a new husband, and I just thought this would be a great place to bring him. So I think he's coming in soon, and I'm excited to get to the conversation. So I'm at this point in time that we're talking, like everyone else who's around me in the world, has only seen the first three episodes of the Traders, which I'm obsessed with it. It's already such a great season. Yes. So you're saying, and I love this because by the time this comes out, I almost be like, I know what you're talking about.

But what you're saying is some shit's going to go down next week that I don't know about personally that you're not going to spoil for me in this moment. I won't spoil it for you. I don't want to do. No. And I won't. But yes, some shit's going to go down. Like, I realized very early on. Okay, so you can like go into this game and have a clear strategy and be like, this is how I'm going to play.

And then you meet Lisa Renna and you're like, oh, fuck, now I can't play this way because. like she's here. So what I saw you, what I saw happened last week was Donna, Donna Kelsey, soon-to-be-mother-in-law of Taylor Swift, was outed as a traitor, as a secret trader. So the audience didn't even know that she was in a trade. I have theories. I think Donna would have crushed as a regular trader. Yes. I don't think she was about that life of staying up until two or three in the morning to film in the turret. So that's what that's what it takes? Wait, wait, wait, but this is like behind the scene stuff that I'm interested. Do you have to stay awake until two or three in the morning to film the tour?

Some nights. Some nights filming goes really late. Yeah. I mean, most of us are, like, we've worked before. Like, we know, like, that's part of the job. Sure. But, yeah, some nights are really long. And so, like, there is an endurance that goes into this.

You can ask Lisa about this. But, like, there's, like, an endurance into shooting a show like this, because if, especially if you're a traitor, because I can imagine, like, the bandwidth. Well, that was what I was thinking about when I was watching at this past season. And I don't know why I didn't think about this earlier, but I was like, oh, the traders have to work, like, more hours. For sure. Because they have to have a whole other, like. But they also get rewarded with more screen time.

Yes. Yes. And honestly, if I was on the show, I'd want to be a traitor too. For sure. I think everybody will do. Yeah. Okay. Well, I'm so excited about next week then.

This is exciting. But what were you, because you really held, you really, like, led the charge against Donna. Yeah, well, so what I was saying is I realized very early on that I could. could not play a small game. Like, when I walked into a room, people, like, looked at me and, like, naturally, I'm, like, I'm, like, 6'3. I'm a bigger build. I was doing really well on the challenges. So, like, I was like, okay, like, laying low is not going to be in the cards for me here.

So, like, I just have to step up and, like, do this. And then also, there's a part of me, because it doesn't play necessarily how it went down, but, like, everybody was, like, scared. Everybody's like, maybe Donna. I'm like, okay, Donna, like, let's focus on that. Why were they scared because they just didn't want to go after the matriarch? Well, especially the first one. You start throwing out names and then all of a sudden the target gets put back on you.

Yeah. So like I think everybody was sort of like who's going to say it, who's going to do it first. And you were. And I sort of was. And like I was terrified because the last thing my husband told me before, because I don't, I mean, I had heard that she was possibly cast on this. Like we don't know for sure. That's another question I have for you. Okay.

He basically was like, if Donna's there, do not go. for her. Like, whatever happened, even if she's a traitor. Because he's like, do not put the Swifties on us. Like, we have, we have a family now and we, this is hilarious. You're finally like,

in the media, like, you're doing well, you have a family. We're like, let's just not ruffle any feathers there. We have Bishop to worry about. The Swifties will come after our son. The night that I had to go after Donna, I was like, Jordan's going to kill me. You had to do it. You had to do it. I had to do it.

I had to do it. But could you imagine if she wasn't in such a home. Yes. Oh my God. I would never work in this town again. I was kind of right, exactly. That would be done. You're not wrong. I was kind of shocked that.

Because I guess for a viewer, and you can't look at it this way because you were in it. But I guess as a viewer, the minute she was revealed as the secret traitor, I was like, that is a little obvious. I think. It was an obvious play that she was going to be a traitor. I think. Because she's the exact opposite of what. In defense of her. Yes.

very difficult position to be. You're isolated. You know, I would not want to, I wouldn't have wanted to be a secret trainer. And she already is an outsider because she's not part of this reality world. And she was a genuine fan of you. And it's sort of like me too.

Like I didn't really have a wagon to hitch to. Like, I was going to ask you who you like kind of aligned with. Because like they still put like The Bachelor there even though like I'm not really connected with any of those people anymore. But like I don't, I don't really have a group of people, right? I mean, there's the gamers and the housewives. And I think if I had to

like categorize you as one of those people, it would be housewives. I mean, yeah. Well, I gravitated towards Love Island people too. Right, right, right, right. Well, of course. I mean, that's how all these reality shows are, though. I mean, it's, you know, you have prototypes and you go in and you have, especially for an audience member, you have such limited time with all these people. There's so much that ends up on the editing floor. And like, they're really like molding how they wants the audience to react to all of you. And you know this very well from being on The Bachelor as well. But like, you know, it's this very little room for nuance and there's very little room for,

um, I don't know, I think, I kind of think that you, you played it the right way by going in and being just a bold player. I had to. I had to. And I think it fit my style. Yeah. The best. No, it felt, knowing you, it felt, didn't feel like you were not being true to yourself.

Hello. How are you? Hi. How are you going? How about your of you best? I've been here before? I don't know if I have. It's been a minute.

There's a couple in New York. Okay. There's also one in Venice. I've been into one in New York. That's right. Do you want any drinks to start? Yes. Are you doing a drink?

Not a, not a drink trick, but I'm going to do one of these delicious crust juices. You can have a drink, right? No, I'm going to do. My favorite is the waterflower, though. Oh, I'll do the waterflower. That sounds nice. I will join him in the water flower as well. Anything else right now?

Any questions? Okay. And we're going to talk about this. Because might as well. But I'm on a soft food and liquid diet right now because of a procedure I had. It's not a facelift. Something with my internal organs.

I'll get all into it with you in a bit. What can I have that's in that family? I was kind of thinking maybe you might like eggs are okay. Eggs should be fine. Yeah, you might like this. I don't know, we'll see. I don't see. It's pretty soft, very gentle.

I would maybe... Gentle sounds good to me. Yeah, I figured you like that. I'm on gentle foods right now. I love it. I'm just going to let him pick my entree. Oh, really? Yeah.

I'm just, the only thing I don't like is olives. Okay. So, we're rolling the dice? We're rolling the dice. With what I bring me your favorite item on the menu. Yeah. Just make sure there's no olives. Yeah.

Sweet. Oh, I love your confidence. I'm going to do the Greek-style scrambled eggs. Yeah, fantastic. The first eggs I've tried on this diet. I'll hold your in while you eat. My name's even. Just let me know if you need anything.

Thank you, Ethan. Yes, I'll need your support. Hey, wait. So you said you heard that. certain people might be on the show. Like, when do you find out who the other cast members of? Well, there was a few people who I heard that weren't there. So, like, you know, that's only as good as your intel.

Right. You don't find out who's there until you step out of the different. Well, obviously, when you get in the car, you see the first two or three. Right. Who you're in the car with. And then when you get out. And tell me who you were on the car with from the first time. I was in the car with Tara, Lepensky, Ian and Porsche.

Got it. So Ian and Portia went home like one, two. So I was like, oh, our car got decimated right out of the beginning. But, like, I didn't really feel like an alliance forming with them anyway. And so you find out the people who are there, like, when you get out of the car. Was there anyone that, like, when you saw them, you were, like, super, like, starstruck by or jazz by? And then also, like, super scared up. Like, oh, fuck, that one's going to be scary.

Immediately when I saw Lisa, I was like, no, thank you. I cannot, like, really. No, because also, before I left, Jordan was like, just, you're finally at this place in your career, just don't fight with a housewife. I'm like, of course they put Lisa on my season. Like, I like naturally, I like love her, but also I know. Did you know each other personally? No, we had never met. Okay.

I knew of her. She knew of me. Sure. So like that was always interesting. You both are notorious. Yeah. Greets sell scrambled eggs. There you go.

And then I went with our house favorite, the breakfast burrito. I'm a breakfast all day type of guy. This is incredible. Wait, I'm so excited for this because you know I'm Bachelor we're like told not to eat. Wait a minute. Now listen, I assume that at least on the Bachelor, like you're literally out to dinner dates.

You're not eating on those dinner dates? No. Oh, no. It's all for camera. Oh, my God. So anyway, this is a treat for me. Okay. Just an old side bar for you to catch people up on where I'm at.

I had this Haidal hernia, which is basically my stomach lining was coming through my diaphragm. And so I had to go and do an operation. And then they also, while they were in there, did this thing on my esophagus because I have really bad assid reflux. And so I'm trying to go out the medication.

And because of all these procedures, I have to be on soft foods and liquids for six weeks. And I'm entering my fifth week, this week, which I can add now, like scrambled eggs in risotto. And I had polenta last night. How much weight have you lost? I have lost like 10 pounds. Yeah.

That would be the hardest part. for me. The losing the weight part? Probably. And like energy levels, I'm assuming, are down. They're not great, especially in the afternoon. Yeah. Now for a quick break, but don't go away. When we come back, Colton and I talk more about what's to come on this season

of the traders, and we'll get into how he looks back on his time with the Bachelor franchise. Okay, be right back. And we're back with more dinners on me. I just recently hung out and met Prishel, who is a mutual friend now. You guys are

close um we just were in uh in cabo together and i had a great time with her um she's obviously from selling sunset yep but she was on last seasons of the trader so i had some of these questions for her she was the first person i called by the way when i got the offer oh yeah i was like talk to me about this she's like you have to do it yeah and she gave me all my tips she did tell me that the food is terrible we had christing kersh on our season yes i know who's a friend of mine as well oh gosh i don't want to The chef's there, but, like, Kristen basically went to production and was like, we need to, like, step this up. Yeah. We were like, thank God you're here to say something.

I watched Christian trying to butter a piece of toast in one of those episodes, and she's just, like, dealing with this, like, rock cold butter. Right. No, no, no, the knives were sharp for legal reasons probably. Of course, right. So that's hilarious if that actually cracks that food is not great. Great, thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

Because on TV, that breakfast that you all sit down. for looks luxurious and stunning. Is it... I'm a big breakfast together, so you can put anything in front of me and like, I'm going to eat it. Uh-huh. Our favorite activity at the breakfast, though,

from speaking for the gays, we just liked watching Rob eat his eggs because they were hard-boiled, so we always, like, made it over-under on how many bites it would take from the finish his egg. Just like you find little things to keep yourself entertained while you're filming the show.

Wait, also I did want to know, so like these shots of you like, okay, so talk to me up the shots of like you are getting ready for bed. Because those are fascinated to me. Just the, well, I don't know if you've seen any of mine yet. I don't haven't seen any, but I can only imagine what's coming. Because they only play when you're up for elimination and where you can be banished. Right. And I've done a very good job at winning shields almost every challenge. Yeah.

So. Yeah. Because I knew I'm going to play a big game. I have to protect myself. Yeah. Like, I can't be the only one throwing names out here. Because, like, naturally, you're going to miss. And when you miss, then you have a huge target on your back.

Right. But then also, there was a little bit of strategy in me missing because when you miss, it puts a target on your back and the traders want to keep you around just in case. It's like a shield for them. He has some heat on him at the round table. Right. Like, let's not kill him yet. People stay away from us. Yeah.

Right, right, right. I did have a question about, I mean, you know, it is a show that you can't shoot through the entire time. So I assume there were days off that you had in there. I think after the start, there was like every fourth day. Okay. What would you do on your day off? Would you all hang out? You just work out.

I needed, I just need to move my body. The challengers gave me a little bit of that, so that was really nice. But then, like, you're walking around a castle and, like, sitting there and talking, like, I was. It's like, I need to move. Like, can we go for a walk? Like, what have we got? Like, I want to go explore. Right.

And then I met with the show psychologist. Because I was just like, I want to stay on top of that. Yeah. Something I didn't really have with Bachelor. So, like, there was nothing major because, like, the drama is the game. They don't have a psychologist on The Bachelor? Is that something that might have changed since? They do.

But producers, at least when I was Bachelor, did not like when I used him, used her, because they want to get that in their confession. They want to use that kind of stuff. But I was like one of the only people to read my contract. And if you ask for the show therapist, they have to legally or contractually put cameras down. So that was. Yeah. So that was like, you know, that was like the whole me jumping the fence.

And then they chased after me. And then like I asked for the therapist. And like you didn't see anything else after that. Wow. It was because I was like, I'm like not good right now. That was also two months of filming. Like that was brutal. That was a much different beat.

than this show. I just want to like preface this by saying, I don't want to get like too much into The Bachelor stuff because I'm really interested in like this next chapter of your life. I think it's really interesting. But just in terms of like

context for like, you know, people who might not know a lot about you. I mean, I mean, I got to know you after you had already married Jordan. And you know, I have a lot of friends who are actors and like I know them really well and I watched their work and I, you know,

see them playing this other role. And when I was watching scenes from the Bachelor, I was like, let me just look at some of these things. So I watched you jumping the fence, and I watched you, you know, and like somebody's, like, difficult conversations such you were having. And it was like I was watching a friend of mine in a role. Like, it was so far removed from the person who I know you to be. And I just was sort of, I'm just so fascinated.

Because, I mean, I relate so much to you in so many ways. I wasn't a football player. I was a musical theater kid. I didn't have the sports background, like the hyper masculinity thing that you did, that you went through. I wasn't involved in, like, toxic masculinity in the locker room. But I grew up in the church, and I was raised Catholic, and I was afraid of, like, what homosexuality meant to my faith and my family. And so, I really related to these things that you had talked about.

But I also know how hard it was just for me struggling with my sexuality as a teenager. And then in my early years, as, like, an actor in New York. I can't even fathom what it's like to struggle with that on a show that basically celebrates heteronormitiveness. You know? It's really astonishing. It's such a rich and fascinating and complicated groundwork for this whole other chapter of your life where you're now married and have a kid and are like this incredible father. And like, I just, I'm wondering, I guess, my question. question and all that is like, what's your perception of like the last 10 years of your life

now on this other side of it now that you are in such a healthy place? And like does it feel like another person and another lifetime ago? Yeah, I mean, I appreciate you saying all that. But yeah, basically like even doing a show like Traders, like right under my name is The Bachelor. So like that is going to be with me for the rest of my life. Like there's no running away from that. even though I would consider that one of the most painful chapters of my life. Like I grew up in the church, I grew up playing football. I threw my identity into both those. Like, you know, I really just wanted to be this football player

and I didn't want to have to deal with like my sexuality at all until it was too late. And then the Bachelor shows up and I'm like, this could be a fun opportunity. I don't have football anymore, so let me try this. Right. And then like I said, I did Bachelor at, Bachelor in Paradise and Bachelor, all while trying to push down and be like, you are not gay, you cannot be gay, don't do this to yourself,

let's try to find a way to make like being straight work. So like obviously navigating that had a ton of challenges. And at the same time, I like the entertainment industry. So there's like this constant push pull of like, well, I have to keep doing this now because like I'm interested in this and I like it and I'm good at it. But also I'm not sort of like lying to myself. I'm lying to these people. I have to figure this out.

This isn't fair to anybody, including myself. So it was like really, it was hard in the fact that like during COVID, I had a mental breakdown. And I was like, I can't do this anymore. Like, this is really intense. And the outside pressure of trying to stay in that relationship after the show is like hard enough when you're a straight man. So let alone somebody who's struggling with their sexuality. Yeah. Trying to do that all while like navigating blackmail and like,

loosely trying to like slowly come out to himself was was challenging i can't i honestly can't even fathom it and i'm we've talked about it just privately you and i about like what that was like but it's just it really i mean i guess what i want to say to you is i'm so surprised and i know this took a huge toll on you but i'm surprised that you survived it at all i mean it's it's it's really something that as someone who struggled in high school trying to keep myself just alive day to day

I can't even imagine putting the pressure of like cameras and the opinion of the nation on top of my already like weary shoulders it's well yeah and I mean this is also like where the differences of

still TV you're on TV but like you had Mitch to hide behind it right like in your performance whether in one episode got picked apart that was on you as a professional. Right. Versus like when things would hit the tabloids about me, like that's my life. That's who I am as a human being. And like it struggles because it's so deeply personal.

Like I can still like get fired up. Like I remember when people critique me on a game or if I missed a tappler or had a bad play, like on to the next one, right? Like when it becomes your life and it's like you're reading these articles. And like that's like the hardest part even today is still reflecting on those chapters. knowing one day Bishop my son is going to have to like he could read those like that is like the challenge I'm like I was a 20 year old lost really lost really hurt really trying to figure himself out now all of a sudden I have like a year or two years worth of news articles that I never want my son to read

but like I'm going to have to right I'm going to have to so like I think that's like the hardest part in all of this is like realizing like one the internet's forever to my mistakes as a 20 year old are so publicized and scrutinized and opinionated when like people don't really fully understand what I was going through and like yeah I don't owe that to anybody at this point I don't care to fix like there's no narrative that I want to like fix or change because like I went through it's like that's not the point but like what is is like it's very complicated and like you I think most gay people just know like that coming out journey is so complicated yeah so messy in so many different ways.

Now for a quick break, but don't go anywhere. When we returned, Colton tells me about coming out to his college coach, and given he's a former pro athlete, we had to discuss the spicy queer hockey love story HBO's heated rivalry. Okay, be right back. And we're back with more dinners on me.

How long did you date before the proposal happened? We tried to keep it under wraps for a while. We were dating seven or eight months before the proposal, four months. four or five months before it got leaked. We had a sneaky pick in Hawaii get posted. Why did you want to keep it a secret?

I never wanted a public relationship after what I went through. Right. Because like, especially coming from the Bachelor franchise, every one of your relationships is so publicized. Oh, I can imagine. You know Jordan. He's not a very public person.

Like, he can turn it on when he needs to. Yeah. Like, he doesn't really like to be in front of the camera or like have that moment. Yeah. So it was something we agreed on. And I think now he's leaned into it because he felt like an asshole when we were in public. And people would be like, what did you think of his fence jumping?

I was like, I didn't watch that show. Right. It's like, I feel like there's a big chunk of your life that like I'm missing. So like I need to watch this. So he ended up. Did he watch it? Well, because when we first started dating, my only ask was I said, just please don't watch Sebastian. He goes, for sure.

I'm good. I don't need to know. And then like a year and a half into our relationship, he came to me and he goes, we're outside Akbar. And he, a sweet, gay bars and all of us and was a sweet lesbian couple came up to me

and just said your story was so inspiring. I watched The Bachelor with my family and after you came out I came out to my family. And so Jordan was like, I need to watch this

because I need to understand your fans more and especially if I'm going to be put on the spot. Like, he felt like an asshole in that conversation because she's like, like, what'd you think of that?

And he was like, I didn't watch. So then he had a conversation and he's like, do you mind if I watch the show? And I was like, go for it. And he just gives me so much shit to this day. What did he say?

I didn't want to watch it with him. No. I never want to rewatch that again. Why would you know? He would be in like the bath watching upstairs and I would just hear him start. Would you just hear like parts of the show that you were like? Yes. He'd be like, wait, why are you?

He was so opinionated. So then he would come down from like an episode. And he had a list of questions. Tell me some other questions he had for you. Well, like, and then he would become a fan. So he's like, oh, Hannah Brown. Yeah. Like, what?

Why didn't you? And I'm like, I'm married to you. The formula is addictive. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm like, shut up. If you're telling me, why didn't I go? I'm married to you now. And I was like, also I'm gay.

Right, right, right, right. But it was so, I was like, oh, this is why this show works. Yeah. It's like, it just got my gay husband to, like, be opinionated about me choosing another girl. Right. Yeah, super invested. Okay, so I'm fascinated that Jordan watched The Bachelor. I think that's just like, you know, Justin's sort of the same thing with,

Modern Family? No, he watched every episode of Modern Family. But I did a show before that that he had never seen it. He watched it during COVID called The Class. And I actually did watch some of it with him because I hadn't seen it in a while. See, professionally, I know you more from Take Me Out than Modern Family. I know the greatest. That was my favorite.

That play is made for you. It really was. I left and I'm also. I'm still eating. Yeah, thank you. I'm also not a big. I shouldn't say big. a huge Broadway person.

I wish I was. If I lived in New York, I would go more often. But, like, previous to take me out, I went to, like, Frozen with my friend Patty Mirren. She's excellent. I don't know you're friends with Patty and Colin. Yeah. Yeah. I love them.

She so sweetly invited me to see Frozen. I love that. I've seen it twice now. I saw it twice. But, yeah, I love both of them. They're great. But anyway, other than that, I saw, like, Harry Potter, really bad theatrical. Yeah.

Like, a resume. That's fine. I'm thrilled that I'm on the list. You're not on the list. You're at the top. I feel like when you came to see my play, were you in the front row? I feel like I remember having eye contact with you. Oh.

You were close, right? Well, it's, yeah, you preached to me in one of your. That's right. I just feel like I remember seeing your face in the audience. No, I wasn't front row because there's a very famous shower scene that I wish that I was front row while that was going on. Yeah, I know. I know. That had to be such a trip to like navigate that.

I mean, you weren't in the shower scene. Let me tell you. Okay. So I, so this play. How did that come to be? So take me out is a play about a closeted baseball player on like a Derek Jeter level. Yeah.

And it's super, super famous, super big. And then he comes out of the closet and it's about, you know, toxic masculinity. It's about his, you know, acceptance of himself. It's about so many things. You did tell me after you saw the play. because you have been literally you've lived that reality you've been in a locker room

you know as a professional football player like you are you know you were clotted during that time I mean you spoke very eloquently to me about like how spot on that that scene was

and really all the themes of the play yeah I mean it's brilliant do you feel like well I have so many different questions about this But, I mean, first of all, do you feel like things have changed at all in that world? I mean, I feel like there's more sports figures who have come out now as gay. But I do sometimes feel like the majority of them have come out after retirement or after they've left whatever league they were playing for.

But, like, I'm sure you also probably have an influx of people who are still closeted within that community reaching out to you because you're a safe person and certainly understand. Yeah. Yeah, I mean, after my Netflix show came out, there was two active players in NFL that reached out to me to confide in me and like asked for advice and help. And like, one has a family. Yeah. Like much different situation than what I went through. So like, and also I think that was like the complications of me all of a sudden being poster boy for like out athlete when that Netflix show dropped. Yeah. I was not ready to be anybody's mentor. I was like still very much coming out to myself that like all of a sudden now I have people, I feel responsible. for like advice. I really, I resonate with all of that because I felt that same pressure

with modern family. Like just the community's expectations on you. Yeah. It's hard. That is so hard. And then like, then like then you also feel weird

saying like I don't want to be this. Like I have this privilege of this platform. So now I have to get good at this quick. Yeah. Like I can't. There is no like out. So,

but do I think it's gotten better? I think I'm always going to say no until like I truly believe there's been a death. made. I don't think there has. And when I say that I'm talking about the main three leagues, so NBA, NFL, I'm speaking from a male perspective. NBA, NFL, MLB. I mean, let's include the NHL in now because of heated robbery. But like, so I think I can say it has not gotten to a place where I would like to see it at over the years, even since I've come out. Yeah. Because there's many

different things. I mean, one, these are all big, big businesses that have a system put in place to make sure that players do not get bigger than the team and the teams do not get bigger than the league itself. This is a trickle-down effect, and this doesn't only apply to sports. This applies to many different facets of our system of a world, right? So the players can't express themselves freely out of fear for their job, fear for media, fear for the organization, the organization then doesn't really reinforce or support people coming out because they're fearful, that the league will then out them weird. But they'll be the first to use a gay player. Like, look at Michael Sam, who's in my draft class. SEC defensive player

of the year, which I know I'm talking sports, so just stick with me here. It's a very high honor. And like SEC is arguably at that time was the best league in all. of NCAA football. He is the best defensive player in that entire league. He gets drafted in the seventh round after he was openly getting. The last time an SEC defensive player was drafted in the seventh round, I don't know off the top of my head, but I would assume never. He's at least in the first three or first four rounds.

But then on top of it, he gets cut from the Rams and picked up for the Cowboys for two weeks. And within those two weeks, he's a practice squad player. his jerseys are in the team thing. Highest rated cowboy jersey for those two weeks. And then as soon as those numbers started dipping, he got cut. So it's like you see, I think that's also what like why I get fired up about this is because like you're not really allowed to come out. But then also we get used. And then like I even remember too, like even to this day, it's like they sort of just prayed you a boy, prayed you around being like, look, we're inclusive.

We have one here. We have one there. And it's like your whole system. isn't working here, and we have to figure out how to support gay players. Because the only regret I have in my football career is I wish I would have played out. Because I feel like I would have played looser. I wouldn't have to like add that like coil. Can you go back and think about like what the reality of that would have been for you?

Is it something that would have been possible? I think so. I think like, because I remember my phone call with my college coach. It just depends when I would. would have came out. If I came out in high school, would I have still received my Division I offers? And if I came out in college, would I still have been made All-American team? Would I still have been, like, approached by agents? Like, what would that have looked like? But my college coach was super supportive. And, like, it was so funny. I called him and he was, like, he was,

like, having a beer unwinding at the end of the night. So, hey, I just want to let you know, I couldn't, I mean, I was this phase of coming out where I couldn't say I'm gay. I was like, hey I just want to let you know I came out to my parents and he goes I'm so proud of you that was his first thing he goes I'm so sorry for the way that I talked to you over the years he used a lot of homophobic

language in the way he motivated yeah that's all I'll say sure and then the third thing he said he goes so what kind of dicks are we into oh my god it was like right there where I was like oh you're a writer dot like you care like it's so funny and if you know him

he's like insane he spoke at my wedding like also it's such a streak i think to say what kind of dicks are we into all of them is the answer thank you yeah i can appreciate what do you mean any type of dick um i was like okay like maybe but like that was like the first thing in my head where i was like oh maybe i could have came out in college because like i might have had him to have my back like i'm sure he wouldn't have gone as hard on like any homophobic slurs if he would have known that he had a gay person in his room. And he probably thought, honestly, well, I don't know what he's doing with his career now,

but like, he's still a coach. And it's made, I'm sure it's changed everything. It's changed the way that he approaches it. Absolutely. And I have this conversation with my friends, because I'm still in like a group chat with some of my athletes who every once in a while will drop like, well, that's gay.

And I'm like, use your words. What do you mean by this? Yeah. Because I'm like, that is such a, like, a lazy throwaway dig. It is so lazy. I'm like, what do you mean? Yeah. Stop saying it's gay.

Yeah. What do you mean by that? And like once I say that, they're like, oh, I get it. Yeah. You know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. But wait, can we talk about Hated Ravel already? Did you watch that?

Yeah, no. Okay, so, okay, this is a good segue. So I'm only two in. Okay. I am, well, I want to start with you. You tell me things about it. What I love about it is it tells a queer story in a non-traumatic way. And the other part that I appreciated that I don't think a lot of people talk about is,

and you'll get to this point. the female roles play such a big, big role in coming out, men coming out. And I think you get to see two incredibly female-led characters. The Russian girl, I assume she's one of them. Russian girl. And then there's somebody else who you'll be introduced to that, like, in my opinion, having them in change the entire dynamic of the show, at least for me as a viewer, like, there was just so much appreciation and also like a little bit of jealousy where I'm like,

I wish I had that in my coming out experience. 100% I am out. gave me permission to open up slowly and not judge me and also like not come for me if I said anything along the lines of exploring and not like just sure that I want to be with you and women. So I think that those are the parts for me that are brilliant. But wait, talk to me about your feelings. I mean with the first two. Okay.

So I, because I think it's, I love that it's, that it exists first of all. And I don't mean that in like a passive like whatever I'm about it exists. Like, I'm truly so happy it exists. And I think having been a part of a show, like, Take Me Out, I realized the importance of, like, representation in that community. And I think it did actually make me think. I was like, God, I wish Take Me Out was honestly happening now because I feel like this, this, like, buzziness about the locker room stuff

and in homophobia and being closeted in, like, professional sports is so accessible to people that I feel like, you know, that play could have succeeded on an even more successful level than it already did. Yep. I mean, it won best survive, but the Tony's, so it did okay. Can I just say something? Yeah. You walked so those two could run. Okay, there you go.

I'll accept it. Like, Connor and Hudson are having their moment because of Jesse. Well. And the cast of Take Me Reality. Okay. But I do, I mean, I really appreciate that it exists for those same reasons that I love, Take Me Out. I mean, I, you know, it's so funny because like when there's so much hype around something. Yeah.

I mean, I remember looking at Conner's Instagram or Hudson's Instagram, seeing like 75,000 followers, 100,000. Right. These guys are in the millions now. Yeah. Oh, yeah, for sure. On every cover. Yeah. Presenting at the Golden Globes.

I mean, I have so many friends who are in town for the Golden Gloves. And they're like, all of them have gotten friends, all of them have gotten photos with every single cast member of Peter Ryan. These are some of my friends are like super A-list celebrities who are like chasing after the guys. What do you think it is pop culture wise right now that made this such a phenomenon? Because this doesn't happen anymore with like stream, in my opinion, with like streaming and like how many different things drop. It's very rare do things like this happen?

It feels, you know what it feels like to me? I mean, it's it is a young, it is a Y.A. genre. Yeah. I think like just the storytelling of the love story. It feels very Y.A. That means young adult. in the biz. And I just feel like it's a really well done

for that genre. And I think that there hasn't been a really great, I don't know, it just feels like if there's something for everyone. And I don't know. There's something about it being a slow burn. There's something about, obviously, these guys are like people who we've never seen before.

We don't have any preconceived notions attached to any of these actors. They are completely able to do. disappear into these roles because we don't know them from something else. And then sort of like it's that those things don't happen anymore. We don't give fresh young actors the ability to like lead a TV show. Does something like this hurt or help a career? And I'm this, I don't want to put you on the spot or like make you throw shit.

But like from a career standpoint. It's going to make it difficult for, I just know having been on a show that I was so closely tied to a character. It makes whatever you want to do afterwards hard. And that's just the reality of it. Yeah. It's going to be hard for those guys to have people cast them

in things where they're expected to be forget about this white hot success that they've had. That's just the reality of the thing. The show is so successful. They're on every red carpet, every talk show, which they should be. Right. But it's just solidifying

their identity into these roles. And but that's what they should be doing at this moment. People don't normally have success like this and they should be riding it. They should be enjoying every single moment of that. But, you know, it is like you are at the end of that road, you are like kind of with a shovel be like, okay, how do I dig this identity out from around me? I mean, that's somewhat of like for me to like with The Bachelor. Yeah. I don't really want to like also I'm like I get it. You know that like the first line of your obituary is going to be like the former bachelor. Yeah, exactly. I mean, yes.

Yeah. No, and I know what the first one in mind is. I was like, could they put coming out Colton here? Like, they're. Right. No, no. People don't know. Absolutely not.

No. So. I mean, and that's just, that's the way it's going to be for a really long time. I cannot wait to watch the rest of the traders. I'm so invested. I'm so, my interest is so peak from this conversation. I'm very excited to get. I'm excited for you to have Lisa on next.

That's me too. You are going to get ying yang and it's going to be. I feel like I'm really like, I have some great. information to come into that that conversation with. But I really I don't want you to move away because I've really loved getting to know you

over the past like five, six years and I think you're just great. I love watching you blossom as a father. And I don't know, I just really love our friendship, so I really glad you did this. I love our friendship too. This episode of Dinners On Me was recorded

at The Butcher's Daughter in West Hollywood, California. Yeah. Next week on Dinner's On Me, you know him from Cheers, The Good Place, and more recently from Netflix's A Man on the Inside, it's Ted Danson. We'll get into his legendary run as one of TV's most iconic leading men and his latest chapter on screen, which this season includes his wife as a co-star. And if you don't want to wait until next week to listen, you can download that episode right now by subscribing to Dinners on Me Plus. As a subscriber, not only do you get access to new episodes one week early, they'll also be able to listen completely ad-free. Just click try free at the top of the Dinners On Me show page on Apple Podcasts to start your free trial today. Dinner's On Me is a production of Sony music entertainment and a kid named Beckett Productions.

It's hosted by me, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. It's executive produced by me and Jonathan Hirsch. Our showrunner is Joanna Clay. Our associate producer is Alyssa Midcalf. Sam Bear engineered this episode. Hans Dale She composed our theme music. Our head of production is Sammy Allison. Special thanks to Tamika Balance Kalasny and Justin Makita.

I'm Jesse Tyler Ferguson. Join me next week.