Dinner’s on Me with Jesse Tyler Ferguson - George Takei

Episode Date: May 14, 2024

"Star Trek” actor and activist George Takei joins the show. Over beautiful sashimi, George tells me what it was like to be forced to leave his LA home and live in Japanese American internment camps, only to return and become a successful actor. We also get into the meaningful “Star Trek” scene that never made it in and why he decided to come out at age 68. This episode was recorded at UKA in Japan House in Hollywood, CA. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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and Star Trek legend, it's George Takei. So I was introduced to acting and the magic of theater and the magic of performance and the magic of performance in an American prison camp. This is Dinners on Me, and I'm your host, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. Okay, so one of the best perks of being an actor is that sometimes, sometimes you are lucky enough

to meet your heroes. I cannot tell you how grateful I am that I live on this planet at the same time as George Takei. I'm even more grateful that George and his husband Brad have become friends of mine. I met George almost 15 years ago when he attended a launch event for Tie the Knot, a charity my husband and I set up to support the fight toward marriage equality. George and Brad were not only enthusiastic supporters of our foundation, but they also became mentors of ours, guiding us toward how to be effective, passionate, and most importantly, optimistic activists.

Now, you might notice I get a bit tongue-tied and teary at the end of this conversation with George, clumsily trying to express how much his lifelong commitment to advocacy has meant to me. He and Brad truly have paved the way and held the door open for the next generation of queer activists and their friendship and open hearts just fill me with so much gratitude. Hi.

Hello. I brought George to, well, no, actually, wait. No, that's not accurate. George brought me to, well no actually wait, no that's not accurate. George brought me to today's restaurant, Japan House LA's restaurant Uka. The restaurant actually has an interesting backstory. Japan House was conceived by the Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Japan as a way to introduce Japanese culture throughout the world. It sits high up in a building smack dab in the middle of Hollywood. It's just a stone's throw away from El Capitan and the Grauman's Chinese Theater,

where George's autograph and handprint are preserved in the pavement. Now George is a regular here, so he wasn't overwhelmed by the presentation. Not as overwhelmed as I was. I mean every single vegetable and piece of fish was cut so beautifully. It was truly art. It was such a special meal and I was so touched that George introduced me to one of his secret spots in LA. Okay, let's get to the conversation. Thanks for meeting me here.

So this was, normally when I'm doing this, I choose the restaurant, but I let you choose this time. I'm so excited you brought me here. I could not find it though. That's why I call it a hidden treasure of Hollywood. Yes, now we're on the fifth floor above Hollywood Boulevard, next to the Chinese, the Grumman Chinese Theater. Good, you still call it the Grumman's Chinese.

Grumman's Chinese. Yes, Grumman's. To me, it still call it the Grumman's Chinese. Grumman's Chinese. Yes, Grumman's. To me, it will always be, no matter who owns it. What do they call it now? Just a Chinese theater? It's a Chinese theater. Right, right. I'm gonna go afterwards, after we have our dinner,

I'm gonna go next door and look for your cast's handprints and signatures. Yes, I love, so I listened to your memoir and I love the way you open the memoir with talking about that moment of all of you being told that you're going to have this incredible privilege of signing the pavement outside of the theater. Thank you so much.

And them telling you, now listen, it's a big cast, only signatures of names, you know, no room for handprints. That's it. And what happened when you signed your name? Well, all the rest of my colleagues, teammates, are from someplace else. So they, you know, they very innocently

and obediently took that in. It occurred to me. I, this is my, I was born in Los Angeles. My childhood was an imprisonment, but when we came out, my parents wanted to reintroduce me to my hometown. Ah, look at that. This is a way to have lunch.

I know, it's just calm. We didn't have to order or anything. Can we tell us what we're eating? Yes, so this would be our seasonal appetizer. On your left, inside the bowl, yes, as you can remove the lid, you'll find the green tofu, that's the asparagus tofu. Behind it, there's gonna be the crab meat tofu with some dried seaweed inside. Topped with a caviar, some asparagus, and also the Ichiban Dashi, very traditional Japanese broth sauce on there. Gorgeous.

Yes, beautiful. And there's some fish on there of course. Please enjoy. This is, we call it an appetizer. Yes, it's the hustle. Oh my goodness. I'm so excited. They're all works of art, as you can see. Look at this, I mean, that's gorgeous. And that squid over there. Yeah, do you need a fork?

You said in your book you're not good with chopsticks. We never had chopsticks as a child. You did read my book. I did, I did. And you remember. And you said you struggle with chopsticks. Brad's better with chopsticks than you are. Absolutely, I am an embarrassment,

but I believe in keep on trying. Listen, never too old to stop trying. See what I mean. No, you're not great. I'm not gonna lie, you're not great. So, okay, you were not great. I'm like, so, okay. You were talking about your cast signing. They all took the instructions.

Bill is from Canada, Montreal. Jimmy Dewan is from Canada, but on the opposite coast, Vancouver. Leonard is a New Yorker. Right. But none are Angelenos. Just you. And I remember when we came back from camp, my parents wanted to reintroduce me to Los Angeles.

And the big treat was coming to Hollywood and to the Grumman's Chinese Theater Four Court. I was already a movie fan. And so this magical place was my heritage, my parents told me, Hollywood. And I would put my hand in Clark Gable's handprint, great big hands. And I was a tiny little boy, well, about nine years old. And so this is my heritage, and I take it very seriously. And here are these people, the foreigners, non-Angelinos.

We all met in the theater, an empty theater, in the Chinese theater. And then we went out the back way, and there was a whole line of convertibles waiting for us. And the parade started down Hollywood Boulevard. And then the ceremony began. Bill was the first to go down and sign. And Leonard and then DeForest. And DeForest was so, he gets nervous about everything.

And he got nervous and he misspelled his name. No, oh no. Oh, no. Oh, the instrument. No, his name. Oh, that's so funny. He squeezed in, it was spelled DeForet. Oh, that's really funny.

So he forgot the S, so you'll see the S. The pressure of signing your name in pavement, yeah. And Bill, of course, said, D, you misspelled your name. And so he went back and he squeezed that S. My turn came and all these people are non-Angelino's. They very obediently did as they were told. But I saw that we had a huge square, and I said, I have a responsibility as an Angelino. And so I wrote my name down, crossed the T, and dotted the I, and then I put the stick down,

took a deep breath and put my hands down and pressed. And Bill behind me says, George put his hand in. I wanna put my hand in too. And he came running down and then everybody else came down in the, but Leonard was always in character. He put his hand down with a vogue and greeting. So you'll see that unique hand print

where right by Leonard's signature. Just incredible, just incredible. And so on this street, cause I know you also have a Hollywood star as well. Yes. So on this street, you are seared into the sidewalk. Not seared, it's, as you know. I'm just saying, you know, metaphorically.

Metaphorically seared into the sidewalk. Yes. I think it was placed there. The star was already made someplace else. Yes, and they just cemented it in, sure. But you were seared into the history of this avenue, is what I'm trying to say. And you are an Angelino,

and you have also such an interesting relationship with this city. Do you remember your first memory of being a kid? And did that happen? Are your memories of you here in Los Angeles? Are your memories, your early memories of you taking in an internment camp? Well, before that, I have memories.

We lived right near Bullocks Wilshire. My father had his dry cleaning store on 7th Street. And my mother would take me in her little pram and walk down Wilshire Boulevard to the Ambassador Hotel, where the Coconut Grove was a place where all the jitterbugging Charleston-ing movie stars like Joan Crawford and Douglas Fairbanks gathered. and I have that memory from my childhood when my mother took me up to them.

And that is still with me. Really? That's incredible. And then the horrific memory also. I shared a bedroom with my brother, a year younger, Henry, and my father came rushing into our bedroom and he was in the bathroom. And he was like, I shared a bedroom with my brother, a year younger, Henry, and my father came rushing into our bedroom and dressed us seriously and told us to play

in the living room because daddy and mama was going to have to be in the bedroom doing some packing. So we went to the living room, nothing to do, so we went to the front window and we were just gazing out at the neighborhood when suddenly we saw two soldiers marching up our driveway. They carried rifles with shiny bayonets on them. They stomped up the porch and began banging, pounding on our front door.

That Henry and I were just petrified. My father came out and one of the soldiers said, get your family out of this house. And my father got 10 minutes and he went back and came out with two heavy suitcases. And so we followed him out and stood on the driveway, waiting for our mother. And she came out escorted by the other soldier. She had our baby sister in one arm, a huge duffel bag in the other, and tears were streaming down her cheeks.

So that's the other. and tears were streaming down her cheeks. So that's the other. And that was seared into my memory. That morning in May is one that I'll never forget. How old were you at that point? Was that- I just turned five. Pearl Harbor happened when I was four.

And this was in May. And my birthday is in April. Just eight days from today, I'll be turning another year, 87. So I had just turned five when the soldiers came. And that was the last time you saw that your home? Yes. Yeah.

We were brought to downtown LA where there was a row of buses on the street. We were driven out to Santa Anita and herded over to the stable area. And every family was assigned a horse stall to sleep in. My father told me this is where the horsies sleep and that excited Henry and me. We get to sleep with the horsies. Just breathe deep. I can smell them. The stench of horse manure was overwhelming. There were insects skittering around on the ground, flies burst in there, but we were excited.

Our first home was in a horse stable and our baby sister promptly got sick. And about three days later, I got sick too. So that was our introduction to what housing was going to be like. The camps weren't built yet, so this was to be our temporary housing at the Santa Anita racetracks. So interesting, I was just there from the opening day.

Santa Anita? Yeah. Oh. And then I was reading your book a few days later, and I was like, wow, I kind of forgot that part of your history, that you were taken prisoner in your own city. In your own country.

In your own country. And- Our own prison. Now for a quick break, but don't go away. When we come back, George tells me about his years growing up in Japanese internment camps, first in Arkansas, then in California. And we get into what it was like settling down in Skid Row

after his family was released. Okay, be right back. Don't you just love it when someone looks at you and says, hmm, something's different about you. What were you up to last night? Well, no matter how late you were up the night before, Lumify Redness Reliever Eye Drops can help your eyes look more refreshed and awake than ever.

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Join Hoda Kotb for a brand new season of her podcast, Making Space. For season five, I am making space to talk to people who are providing a sense of hope and inspiration when life changes course uplifting conversations with inspiring individuals like NFL legend Drew Brees singer songwriter Ziggy Marley and today show co-anchor Savannah Guthrie as you have never heard her before. I found faith more viscerally not because the bad thing didn't happen, but because it did.

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And we're back with more dinners on me. What do we have coming here? So this is going to be the owa soup course. Chef brings out the umami using the sake and also some soy sauce. The aroma is also beautiful due to the Sancho pepper leaves. That's on top, right on top. In the middle, you'll find the fish cake, the dumpling, using some Japanese sea green shrimp

wrapped by the golden-eye snapper. Hope you enjoy. I mean, that's a work of art. It really is. It's gorgeous. And I love the clear soup. Yes, beautiful. George, are you eating enough? You're telling such great stories.

I want to make sure you're eating too. You know, these lovely creations are to be enjoyed with conversation over a long. Good, I'm glad. That's what I'm hoping for. Enlightening evening. And so this is my turf, I'm enlightening you. I love it, I'm so happy you brought me here.

Yes, I was at the racetracks, I don't know, like a month and a half ago, and we went with our son Beckett. How old is Beckett? Beckett's, he'll be four in July. And Sullivan is younger? Sullivan is younger? Sullivan is about 17 months now.

Oh, a baby. Yeah, he's a baby still. But you know, we actually, they toured us around and we saw the stables. I mean, I went to the stables. So I have such a, I'm sure it is, but I have such a visual of like what that could have been like.

And obviously you did say it's much different now, but your father was an immigrant. Yes. And your mother was born in San Francisco. To San Francisco as a boy. So he was raised in San Francisco, educated there, spoke both English and Japanese fluently. Right.

My mother was born in Sacramento, California, but my grandparents were in farming there. And in the rural area, there was a Japanese community of immigrants. So my father spoke better English than my American-born mother. He was elected because of that linguistic command that he had, he was elected block manager, not in Santa Anita, but in Roar. The next place you moved. Yes, the swamps. How long, do you remember how long you were

at the racetracks before they moved you again? We were there about four months. And then they didn't tell us where we were going. They just said we were going by train. And that train journey turned out to be three days and two nights through the dusty, hot southwestern desert. And then on the third morning, we started seeing the swamps and huge trees rising up out of the black waters

of what they call the bayou. Right. Do you remember how your parents explained this to you at the time, being taken from your home into the stables, now you're on a train going to another home? Well, I asked my father where we were going and that stopped him because he didn't know. He thought for a few seconds and he told us, Henry and me,

he said, we're going on a long vacation in the country and we were excited. A train trip, train ride and a vacation in the country and we were excited. A train trip, train ride and a vacation in the country. We had no idea what country meant. Right, right. But on that third morning we thought, oh, it's going to be this exotic place. And then in the early afternoon,

we started seeing barbed wire fences right alongside the train as we were moving. They built a prison camp parallel to the railroad track. And soon we started seeing masses of Japanese people there just standing, looking up at us. And behind them were rows and rows and rows of black tar paper barrack. One of them was to be, or a unit in one of them was to be our home. And I started school there in another black tar paper barrack. And on the first day, the teacher came in

and she pointed to the flag at the head of a classroom and said, we will start every morning with the Pledge of Allegiance. Every morning. The irony of that. And I stood every morning with my hand over my heart reciting with liberty and justice for all, but right outside my schoolhouse window,

I could see the barbed wire fence and the sentry tower with the armed soldier standing up at the top of it. The soup is lovely. If we don't finish this one, can we just set it aside to get something at it? No problem. Are there rules? Let me just set it aside for you.

I'm really enjoying you watching Struggle with those chopsticks. I'm really pulling for you. I'm glad. That was excellent. That was an A+. When did you first sort of feel that spark of what it means to be a storyteller and what it means to be an actor? And also, did you first sort of feel that spark of like, what it means to be a storyteller and what it means to be an actor? And also, did you even dream that for yourself when you were in a place where you were literally

imprisoned in your own country? Do you even, did you even have the ability to dream that that could be a career that you could have? It happened behind barbed wire fences. Very interestingly, the administration would bring Hollywood films to be screened after dinner. And so after dinner in the mess hall, the tables would be dragged away, the benches would be lined up, and a white tarp would be hung up on the wall. And I remember seeing Charles Lawton

in the Hunchback of Notre Dame, or George Raff gangster movies, but they also had Japanese films. You know, we had the immigrant generation that wanted to see Japanese movies. They didn't have a soundtrack, or some of them were silent movies. So when they showed those films, this man came with it as well. He set up a small table and he had coconut shells and triangles and a pipe and various

sound effects. Like a radio play? and triangles and a pipe and various sound detects. Like a radio play? Like a radio play. And he had the Japanese dialogue memorized. Wow. The shogun would be there and the samurai would be reporting to him. And he has his daughter, the princess there.

And the shogun would say, 拙者の領土台の港に異国の船が。 And the samurai would say, 母、そうでございます。 And the princess would say, 母、恐ろしいこと。 One man doing all those voices. Absolutely fascinating. I found myself staring at him more than at the screen because it was such a new performance side.

And I told my father that man was amazing doing all those different voices for so many different people. And, uh, what magic, uh, taught them how to do that? My father said, it's a tradition in Japanese theater. They're called benshi and in Kabuki, they have narrators, you know, off to the side. If you saw Sondheim's- Pacific Overshirts. Pacific Overshirts,

the narrator, they're called the Benchy. And I thought those Benchys were amazing people. So I was introduced to acting and the magic of theater and the magic of performance in an American prison camp. It's fascinating that you even recognize it as that. I think that there is a piece of me, because I always feel like I've always wanted to be an actor. And I grew up in Albuquerque, New Mexico,

where that wasn't really something that I was super exposed to. I saw community theater, and I saw pieces of clips from the Tony Awards. But I feel like there was something in my soul that wanted that before I even knew I wanted it. And I feel like that must have been instilled in you because how do you even recognize

when you're in such a crazy place like an internment camp and you are with a whole bunch of people watching a film, to recognize that that thing that was happening on the side of the film was performance. And it was, it's just fascinating. Well, it's one man being the princess, his voice. But you recognize it as something that was entertainment. Yeah.

That's really interesting. What is this? It's miso soup. This is sea urchin, right? Yes. Sea urchin. Yes, oh I know. People have a love-hate relationship with sea urchin. Yes, oh I know. People have a love-hate relationship with sea urchin.

Yes. What is your feeling about it? Do you like sea urchin? I love it. Do you? Okay, I'm one of those people that has a very tricky relationship with it, but I'm gonna have it.

And you who has babies. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, it kind of has that consistency of baby food. And the color. And the color, yes. Okay, I'm going to be really honest. This is the best uni I've ever had. Truly.

Everyone always says, try ours. Ours is the best. And I never like it. But this actually is delicious. I love it so much. Thank you. I love the texture of uni. See, that's where I have a problem.

Oh, with the texture. Yeah, the texture. So putting it on this salted piece of cucumber is what I think is really selling it for me. Okay, I figured out how I like my uni. Thank you. It's delicious. Perfect.

When you were finally released from the internment camps, your family was given $25 and a ticket to go wherever they wanted in the country. $25 for the entire family or $25 for a head? Per person. Okay, per person. And kids included, you were given $25. I got $25 and my ticket.

But we had nothing else. Right. We were stripped naked. No home. Our first home back in Los Angeles was on Skid Row. What was the racism like when you were released and you were able to then come back to Los Angeles? What was it like being reintegrated into freedom, really? It wasn't freedom. No. Just think, we had no money. It's immediately after the war.

The hate was still intense. Jobs, housing, practically impossible. As I said, our first home was on Skid Row in downtown Los Angeles. My father's first job was as a dishwasher in a Chinatown restaurant. So he washed dishes in the morning and right after lunch. And then in the afternoon, he opened up an employment agency in Little Tokyo and downtown LA and helped other people get jobs like dishwasher or janitor or gardener, you know, which paid a...

And this is all, George, this is all done on $25 where, I mean, how, do you, did he ever talk about how he took that $25 per head and was able to pull you back into a place where you can be a family and have- He and my mother both worked long, hard, killing hours. But my father also was a good businessman. We were living there on Skid Row, but he found an abandoned dry cleaning shop,

which was what he had been doing on the West side before the war. He bought it and built it up and sold it for a profit. And then he found a grocery store in South Central and he bought it for a song, built it up and sold it. Piece by piece. And my mother, in the dry cleaning shop,

I was at the sewing machine doing the mending and repair and with the grocery store, my father was a butcher, my mother was the cash register. And they were long, hard, killing hours. And in 1950, just five years after... Thank you. Thank you. Oh my.

This looks like a seasonal dessert. So for dessert, you'll find the apple taton using cosmic crisp and also the honey crisp apples topped with the hojicha ice cream and an almond crisp using butter and sugar are sous chef Kato-san's creations. I hope you enjoy it. It's beautiful.

Explain hojicha. Hojicha, so it's the roasted green tea that we use. It's the same green tea, the roasted green tea that you are drinking. We use the same tea leaves, organic coming from Kyoto, Japan. I love the tea that flavors this ice cream. Gorgeous. I'm a tea drinker.

So beautiful. So they bought, five years after Guba released, they got enough money together for down payment on a three bedroom, two bath home with a music room. And in those conversations that I had with my father, he said, because this is a government of the people, by the people, for the people. We are part of the people. And so volunteer for any projects at school, join every thing that's happening at school.

And I was elected president of the Junior Red Cross at the middle school. And then a year after that, I ran for student body president. And this was all my father's encouragement. school and then a year after that I ran for student body president. And this was all my father's encouragement, participate in student government, try to contribute what you can. In high school I was senior board president and then in my late teens he took me to the

Adlai Stevenson for president campaign headquarters. And I discovered that political activism is also a lot of fun. Obviously, Stevenson didn't win. General Eisenhower did. I was in George Brown for US Senate from California. He didn't win. I was a volunteer for Jerry Waldy for governor of California, didn't win. So I was a curse for whoever I supported.

But then I found, thank you very much. I finally supported Tom Bradley for mayor of Los Angeles and he won. We won. Yeah, right, right. And he appointed me to the board of directors of the Southern California Rapid Transit District. That was the bus operator.

But his mandate to us was to get started on getting the funding together for the newest subway system in Los Angeles. So it was a real political arena that Tom Bradley threw me into, but I reveled in it. Quite a resume you've built yourself, just like your father. And I tell people, you know, come to LA and ride on our, on the newest subway system. Yes, yes. Well, there's a station right here underneath. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

I was thinking about your, when you were talking about your dad, what was his reaction to your stardom? I mean, you were part of one of the most iconic moments in television and film history with your role in Star Trek. As you know, luck plays a big part in art business. Yeah. And I was very lucky. Actually, my father wanted me to be an architect.

He was in real estate. and I think he fancied putting up a sign that says, Takei and Son Real Estate Development. I would design and he would develop. And as a good son, I did go to Berkeley as an architecture student. But after two years, I came back to have that heart-to-heart talk with my father.

I said, I really passionately love acting and I want to test my wings. And the finest acting school in America is in New York called Actor Studio. And my father said, I know that. Marlon Brando, Montgomery Cliff, James Dean. And he said, I know, I know. And he let me finish.

And I said, that's where I'd like to study. And I promise you, I'm determined. And he says, I know you're determined. But he said, right here in town at UCLA, they have a fine theater arts school. I said, yes, Daddy, I know, but it's not like going to the best. New York is the best.

They said, let me tell you something else about New York. It's a competitive place and a very expensive place. And if you're really determined, you have to be determined to do it all on your own. However, if you go to UCLA, we'll take care of the expenses. So you would decide New York on your own or UCLA with subsidy. Right, right. I know which one you choose. You would decide New York on your own or UCLA with subsidy.

Right, right. And now which one you choose. Yeah. I was a practical kid. That's right. Yeah. And also it turns out to be a lucky thing to do because two years in a row, I got the award for best supporting actor.

The first year was a Bertil Brecht's Good Woman of Szechuan. And I was seen in that by a casting director from Warner Brothers, Hoyt Bowers. You might know him. I know the name, yeah. Hoyt Bowers, who saw me, and he was casting for an Asian role in a movie. And he called me in and tested me and he said, well, this role,

it's a three generational story and you age to your 70s and we want to make sure your face will take old age makeup. So I went through that and I passed. It was Edna Ferber was writing these epic three generational stories about a state. My scenes were all with this character who was an immigrant from England working in a fish cannery. And that actor was Richard Berkman.

One of his early movies. I was a theater student from UCLA, just full of questions. Richard loved talking about himself, so we were a perfect fit. And he was so gregarious and chatty and loved to talk. And I was absorbing all that. Did you know that he was one of 17 children? I didn't know that, no.

15th child. Wow. And he was raised by his oldest sister because their mother was very sickly. And I don't blame her. Well, I mean, after how many kids? Yes. Seventeen. Now for a quick break, but don't go away. When we come back, George tells me about his audition for Star Trek and why it was important to come out as gay at the age of 68. Okay,

be right back. and why it was important to come out as gay at the age of 68. Okay, be right back. I'm Chris Morocco, food director of Bon Appetit and Epicurious, and this is Dinner S.O.S., a new podcast from Bon Appetit. On each episode, we'll take a call from a home cook facing a real dinner emergency. Then, I'll work with one of our editors or someone from our amazing test kitchen to try and solve it. Because cooking for the people you love should inspire joy, without a side of stress. Make sure you're following Dinner S.O.S. wherever you're listening now. Sad, lonely, dating life in the dumps?

Want to spice things up? Well, me too. I'm Nicole Byer and I host the podcast, Why Won't You Date Me? See, listen, I have been single my whole dang life and I can't figure out why. So on my podcast, I talk to comedians, actors, dating professionals, and even ex lovers to discuss their dating life and figure out my own. We cover things like app dating, first date horror stories,

sexcapades gone wrong, truly nothing is off the table. Whether you're single, dating, or in a relationship, there's something fun for everyone. Subscribe and listen to Why Won't You Date Me with me, Nicole Byer on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, or wherever you get your podcasts. ["Why Won't You Date Me?" by The Bachelorette plays.] And we're back with more Dinners on Me.

What was your audition process like for Star Trek? For Star Trek? Yeah. By that time, I had a lot of credits, television, and Gene had obviously seen a number of them, and he had a very interesting way of interviewing. It was a conversation, just him, not a battery of people. When you go for a series, you know, it's a battery of people. When you go off by a series, you know, it's a battery of people.

And we sat in the corner of his office on sofas like this, and we talked about current events and movies we'd seen, books that we'd read and read. And that was it. My agent called and said, I got the part. Wow. So you never even read anything from the character's mouth. Oh, well, we talked about the show

and I desperately wanted it. You know, he told me that 60s was a turbulent time in America, full of wonderful stories to tell, but it's an advertising medium, and you can't deal firsthand with situations and that was going on in the 60s. So he said, I'm gonna put it in the future and speak metaphorically.

And here's this starship around like Starship Earth, And here's this starship around like Starship Earth. And that starship is gonna be made up of the diversity of this planet coming together, finding its strength in its diversity. And to be considered for a project that was so visionary and so exciting and a role that had an Asian American as part of the leadership team.

And so I desperately wanted that and it happened. Do you feel like they succeeded in that mission statement? I know you fought a lot for your character to have more to do, to speak more. I mean, I, you know, in the early episodes of Star Trek, from what I remember, it really was sort of a, almost a two-hander with Leonard and Bill. And I called him Bill, William Shatner.

Bill, my old buddy Bill. But do you, I mean, I know you fought a lot for your character and, you know, do you think that the progress was moved as quickly as you would have liked to? Well, when you have seven people. Right. Oh, Bobby.

You're all fighting for it, yeah. So, you know, Gene had to be a diplomat. Mm-hmm. And, but the second movie, we got a script that had Sulu getting his own ship. That script was directed by Nick Meyer. And he was there in the meeting where I made the pitch. And he's the one that wrote that script where I got my captaincy. But it never happened.

I mean, it got to the film. So your character was being given a promotion. And I know you were really excited to shoot that scene, and then it ended up not making it into the film. Nick, bless his heart, kept my pitch in mind. And when Star Trek VI, The Undiscovered Country was being planned, and he was gonna both direct and write that, it opens with Captain Sulu

in the captain's seat. The critical, dramatic moment is when Captain Kirk is about to be blown away by the Klingons, but who should come to the rescue but Captain Sulu and the classic ending of every Star Trek on the bridge with the captain looking at that giant view screen, but this time he captain looking at that giant view screen. But this time he's looking at that giant image

of Captain Sulu. He gets up from his chair and essentially says, thank you for saving my ass. And Sulu grins and says, good to see you in action. One more time, captain. And he roars off. Are you and Bill friendly? I know you had a tricky working relationship,

as you speak very honestly about in your memoir, which you know, time heals many things. And how do you look back on your time working with William Shatner? He manages to get a dig in, wherever, because of that background. Right. And so, we see each other at a Star Trek convention,

and we say, hi Bill, and he says, hi George. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I know that they all want us to have that emotional gushy. Right, right. I don't think it's gonna happen. Yeah, that emotional gushy. Right. Right. I don't think it's going to happen. That's OK, too, though. I know him too well.

Yeah. And I was blessed, with a cast that large, to have your workmates become lifelong friends. Jimmy Dune was a great drinking buddy. Right. We don't drink anymore in large part because of that. I mean, I just love, first of all, Brad, if you're listening. Hello.

I love the history of your entire relationship. I love how long you two have been together. I love all the work that you have both done for marriage equality. Do you ever talk about kind of like those early years when you and Brad were together, when it was something that was sort of, it was still something,

being gay in America was still a very dangerous, very tricky thing. Obviously there was, we were nowhere near where we are now as far as gay rights. I mean, we still obviously have a lot of work to do and we have to work so hard to still protect what we've fought so hard for. But what were those early years like?

I mean, obviously you were out to many of your friends and they probably all knew Brad and were friends with Brad, but like, what was it like sort of navigating that relationship, especially, you know, while you were so active in Hollywood in that time? I was closeted actually for most of my life. I didn't come out until I was 68.

Wow. That's very late. Yeah. That was because, I mean, I thought I'd be closeted throughout, but hypocrisy in politics is despicable. And when something historic happened, our California legislature, both the Senate and the Assembly, passed the Marriage Equality Bill. That was a landmark event.

And when that bill landed on the governor's desk, I was skeptical whether Schwarzenegger would sign it or not. governor's desk, I was skeptical whether Schwarzenegger was signing it or not. And sure enough, he vetoed it. And that got us so angry that I said, I can't stay closeted anymore. Brad is a very careful guy. And he kind of tried to calm me down, but I was raging.

I mean, how can he deny people who love each other deeply and want the security of their relationship protected? I was so angry that I teamed up with HRC and they planned a speaking tour for me. And that's when I officially came out, thoroughly, publicly came out. I kind of feel like you rushed into it, George. Do you, I mean, you and Brad were, from what I understand, were one of the first couples to register for marriage in Los Angeles? We had friends in the West Hollywood City Council. And so they set aside a place at the head of the line for us.

That's incredible. What an incredible, like like 80, how many years is it now? 86? 87. 87 years you have lived. I mean, so many wild things have happened. And what I love about having these conversations with someone who has seen so many things and experienced so many things, just seeing your life and your career and where you came from and where you ended up

and what you have fought for is just incredibly motivational, I guess, in a lot of ways. But also, it just reminds me that we can't back down and we have to keep going. And we're never too far along to continue to fight. And I just love you so much for all the work you've done and for the message you continue to spread. Well, you are raising our future and they're gonna be a new generation.

Yeah. Having parents like you and Justin, I'm optimistic. I think we're gonna have a better America, a much better America coming soon. I think so too. I am on the- That's why you're a father.

The tales of that optimism, yeah. We share that optimism. Yes, and I do believe that. Thank you so much for doing this with me today. Thank you for bringing me here. This place is incredible. I'm so glad I know where- Come in the evening.

I know how to find it now. It's a little hard to find. Yeah, and you have to find it. I encourage everyone to come here. Just give yourself an extra half hour to find it. And you might get lost. Well, it's like these hidden jewels. You have to make an effort. But once you enjoy that jewel. Oh, it's incredible these hidden jewels, you know, you have to make an effort.

Yeah. Once you enjoy that jewel. It is a jewel. Thank you for doing this, George. I adore you. Well, it was a very, very enriching, enlightening and tasty meeting that we had here. And don't worry, dinner's on me. Next week on Dinner's on Me, you know him from Barbarian, Dodgeball, He's Just Not That Into You, Jeepers Creepers, so many things. He also has an incredibly successful podcast, Life is Short with Justin Long.

It's Justin Long. We'll get into his love for Pickleball, his love story with his now-wife, Blue Crush star Kate Bosworth, and Sam Rockwell's advice for him in Jeepers Creepers. And if you don't want to wait until next week to listen, you can download that episode right now by subscribing to Dinners on Me Plus. As a subscriber, not only do you get access to new episodes one week early, you'll also be able to listen completely ad-free. Just click Try Free at the top of the Dinners On Me show page on Apple Podcasts to search your free trial today. Dinners On Me is a production of Sony Music Entertainment and a kid named Beckett Productions.

It's hosted by me, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. It's executive produced by me and Jonathan Hirsch. Our showrunner is Joanna Clay. Our associate producer is Angela Vang. Sam Baer engineered this episode. Hans-Dyl She composed our theme music. Our head of production is Sammy Allison. Special thanks to Tamika Balanz-Kolassny and Justin Makita.

I'm Jesse Tyler Ferguson. Join me next week.