Dinner’s on Me with Jesse Tyler Ferguson - Harry Shum Jr.

Episode Date: September 5, 2023

“Glee” and “Everything Everywhere All At Once” star Harry Shum Jr. joins the show. Over kampachi aquachile and a gorgeous whole fried snapper, Harry discusses his early dance career, working with Michelle Yeoh on “Everything Everywhere All At Once”, and Asian American representation in Hollywood. This episode was recorded on June 30, 2023 at Mírate in Los Feliz. Want next week’s episode now? Subscribe to Dinner’s on Me PLUS. As a subscriber, not only do you get access to new episodes one week early, but you’ll also be able to listen completely ad-free! Just click “Try Free” at the top of the Dinner’s on Me show page on Apple Podcasts to start your free trial today. A Sony Music Entertainment & A Kid Named Beckett production. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This episode of Dinner's On Me was recorded on June 30th, 2023. Hi, it's Jesse. Today on the show, the star of Glee, Grey's Anatomy, and Crazy Rich Asians, Harry Shum Jr. We'll talk about his multicultural upbringing, being a backup dancer for pop icons like Beyonce, and his first reaction to seeing the script for everything everywhere, all at once. Are they gonna make me look like an ass? Like, just like having this recoon on top of my head?

Yeah, yeah, yeah. This is Dinners On Me and I'm your host, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. I've mentioned quite a few times on this podcast how I've become friends with so many of my guests from simply seeing them at different award shows and Hollywood events. And I believe me, I know when I say this, it sounds ridiculous. Harry and his now wife, Shelby, were always a couple that Justin and I gravitated towards because they were equally amused and flabbergasted by these circles that we were being allowed

to run in. I mean, they were always the two that were the first out on the dance floor, cutting up the moves, not really caring that Brad Pitt and Angelina were watching them as well. They were just really super down to earth people and we always felt so comfortable around them. I remember this one time, we ended up on a ski trip for a charity together.

The catch was Harry and I could not ski, like not at all. So they put us in this private ski class and we were the oldest students by like 25 years and like we were on, I think it was like called the tinkerbell slope, but it was literally made for children who were actually better than us by the way. So I kind of felt like that weekend

solidified our friendship and it's been so exciting seeing Harry's career evolve and lost some over the past few years on film such as crazy rich Asians and everything everywhere all at once. I was really excited to meet up with him in my former neighborhood of Los Feliz. To a restaurant, Mirité, that also just happens to be a few minutes away from where he shoots his newest job as Dr. Quann on Grace Anatomy. Mirité is a relatively new restaurant. It's been an L.I. just under a year. When I lived here, it was rock well table and stage, which some may know as a spot where

Jeff Goldblum would do a little jazz every once in a while. The Mierete owners have transformed it to like, I don't know, in a state you would see in Baja. It still has this great indoor outdoor vibe with the lush vegetation and a tree growing in the center of the atrium. It's absolutely gorgeous. And the food is jaw-dropping, both in taste and presentation. I mean, you guys gotta see this snapper.

I'm gonna post it on Instagram. But now, let's get to the conversation. I'm going through my wedding album because I'm putting something together for Justin. By the time this era, people have seen it. I'm not ruining a surprise. But I was going to FOSA

and I found photos of you and Shelby at the wedding. Oh, really? And so I'm going to have to send these to you. I don't even know if you've ever looked at these. But I have to show you these photos. First of all, I'm just going to show you my favorite one. Because Shelby's known to be a very good dancer. Yes. This is all, I'm just gonna show you my favorite one. Cause, you know, Shelby's a known to be a very good dancer.

Yes. Yes. Yes. Yes. As a photo I have for the wedding. Oh my gosh, this is so, I'm gonna have to post this on my Instagram when this episode is, yeah.

We do, it was so great. That was such a fun, fun wedding. To the next, yeah, it was such a great night. I'm so happy you guys were there 10 years ago. Amazing. That's so great. And how long have you guys were there 10 years ago. Amazing. That's so great. And how long have you guys been married now? We've been married for eight, going on like nine.

Almost there. And your daughter is just four years old. Four years old, okay. So I'm behind you with a three year old and a seven month old. Three and a seven. Yeah, it was the seven month. Good, it's going well.

I mean, so many people ask me this question, I'm like, oh god, it's such a cliche question, but I feel like it is interesting. How has it changed you, Fatherhood? I don't know. I don't know anything that's what I really learned from this whole experience. Like, you think you're about to go into something

and you're like, I know, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, I can do that, I know I do that. And certain technical things you can got to figure out, but emotionally, you just like, you don't know anything. Nothing. You know nothing. nothing like you start to draw I Have not great We are contemporary modern Mexican restaurant with the heavy emphasis on the scalp and

Sourcing all those missiles from Mexico. We do obviously have the good food from our chef, Joshua Gill, who's a board in Baja, and built this menu from his roots in Mexico. What do you think about making a menu for us in just letting us trust you? I think is that okay? Is there something you're eyeing? I'd like for you to show.

Trust the chef, just go. Yeah, I'll tell you a little bit of the old Mocase Mexican. Yes, yes, yes. Hybrid. I, I'll tell you. Little omakase. Mexican. Yes, yes, yes. Hybrid. I'll get that from you. Nice. And do you want me to think of drinker? Stubles cow. Yeah.

Which one's your favorite? I would say there's a new one. It's called the fruit test because it's a petuga. But the eating salad, that's what fruits. Instead of, you know what a petruga is? Petruga is one of the distilled like an animal into a nut scale. But this one is with fruits. But I'm having really nice exercise.

Let me get you a pour of that. And then for you, for something that I'll look up on, we have a list on the bottom here. We do have a OSU-3C that we make, which is special to us. It's not the thing I'll leave that Mexican as you see that. make, which is special to us, because we're all the things that Mexican is doing so that we like. Yeah, let's do that. Great, amazing.

Look at that, sir. Babe, thank you. So excited. Oh my gosh, that is amazing. How long have you been in LA now at this point? End of 2000 when I'm broke. I've been here for 20,000 years. Long time.

23 years. I also just like, I've only known you with Shelby. Because you guys have been together, I think, for like 18, 17 or 18 years. End of 2006, it's just like really long time. Yeah. And you guys dated for a long time before getting married and then you were like married for a long time.

I'm kidding. I love kind of the pace that you were relationship. Snail's pace. That's what I call it. I think it's a snail's pace. I think there's something snail pace. Yeah. I think there's something really. You get to really know someone.

We had our up and downs and you feel like there's a lot of pressure to just for anyone, whether in a relationship or not, just pressure in general. Like, well, I got to achieve these things. I got to find a husband or a wife. I got to have kids and all that, you know, it's so interesting. We never asked like, well, what is the right path that feels right at the moment? And, you know, I always thought I was gonna get married

earlier, I always thought I was gonna have kids earlier, and I wouldn't have changed it any other way. Like, especially meeting with Shelby and during that time, like, even before I got into these, the shows and really kind of seeing what this business is. You know, having someone there was really wonderful to... Yeah, I mean, you really have experienced your entire career alongside her. Absolutely. And she's been a big part of it.

Big reasoning for her. Did you guys meet on a job together? We did. Oh my goodness. All right, so... Starters here. After dips and to stop us. This is the Krabbiski dish which you're raving about right and our Mocha have these also with the no-polis in it and this is our dry abu-julai our

kampachi abu-julai that-am-mato. That that-am-mato sauce is right there on the sides. Okay. Okay. Okay. It's having some spice and some kick to it. Enjoy. Okay. Thank you. Okay but so you can just shall be met on a job. Okay. Wait, I think that's having some spice and some kick to it. Enjoy. Okay. Thank you. Okay, but so you have Shelby Mapp on a job, you said. We met on a dance gig. It was aging myself, Pac Bell and AT&T, I believe, we're like doing this thing.

It was a regional commercial where she was a cheerleader. I was a gardener. We all come out because you save a lot of money by switching over, so we hang out. We say money, money, money, money, money, and the smoothies and money like a million times. And I met her at the audition and I asked her,

I had my eye on her and I just wanted to like, get to know her. And so. How are we here at this time? I was 25, five. That's what we're talking about. I don't usually like, not forward and be like, hey, I wanna go out with you. That's not something I ever got comfortable doing.

And I remember I was like, okay, you know, I wanna ask everyone out and let's go to the bar at BJs, I believe was a spot. And I talked to him, this before like texting was a big thing and I was told everyone, I was like, oh, we're gonna be at BJ's at seven o'clock, blah, blah. It's like you used like T9 word to text her.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You have to be like A, B, C, okay, D. And no one showed up but hurt. No. So she swears, she's like, I did this on purpose. I was like, you only told me, I was like, no, I literally told everyone. And I guess it just shows like no one wanted to hang out with me. Maybe

they were at the wrong BJ. And then, but her and then we got to really know each other and hang out and talk and the rest of history. And she's just, you know, one of those people that is just so inviting. And I just saw like a color that I've never seen before. And it's just really beautiful to, it just feels new still, like, that really? Yeah, it does, it feels new with a new perspective, I guess. And now for a quick break, but don't go away. When we come back, I'll talk to Harry more

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But yeah, I was born in Costa Rica because my dad, it's crazy, this past summer I went to Guangzhou, which is in this region, Yanping, which is South kind of China. And I brought my mom and dad back, my mom, to a birthplace that she hasn't visited since she was born. And my dad, there's my second time with him there. You know, we got his childhood friend that he didn't see

since he was like, I think 10, and then to hang out with them and to talk and see how this, you know, the city has grown. It's incredible. But like, I only say that because that's where he came from. So he moved there after going to Hong Kong and then going to Costa Rica, which I started to find out that the shums from his dad's side, there's a lot of shums there in Costa Rica, which I didn't know.

And it's crazy because like, you know, my dad, he moved here and then when I graduated, he moved back and he started a hardware business again and just loves to come to Costa Rica. Not to Costa Rica, yeah. And it's on the east side and Le Mans, Puerto Le Mans, and just loves the simple life there. And I completely understand, like, especially going back, I've been going about a lot more often and just absorbing different parts of Costa Rica. Because there's the Caribbean side,

and there's the Pacific side, and there's still so much I haven't explored. And I'm still learning about it because I left at such a young age at around five and six. So there's very little that I did remember other than having these different cultures and languages was so normal for me to kind of bounce back and forth. That it wasn't until someone pointed out that that's how odd that was when I'm right here.

So at this point you were like what language is he speaking when you were Spanish and Cantonese? Okay. Actually Cantonese first in Spanish just because we had a lot of friends. Was Cantonese what was spoken in your home? Yeah, yeah. My parents they wanted to just make sure I had some ownership of that. I'm so glad for it, because even going to Hong Kong,

going to Guangzhou and being able to not just use language as a form of communication, but more of a feeling. My vocabulary is very basic. But the mannerisms, I feel a little more mature, just from watching Hong Kong films, seeing my mom and dad, and their friends talking, kind of watching them. Yeah.

You grew up in Costa Rica and you were born there, but most of your life has been as an American, but also your heritage is from China. It's like, I mean, how is that informed, kind of who you are as an adult? They're all just once a belong, right? They're all just once a belong and part of a group. People that can kind of, I can laugh at the jokes, they can laugh mine, and we can be cool.

But I also felt that moving here, I got really comfortable over time being uncomfortable, which I don't know if that was such a good thing without knowing that that's what was happening. So when I did recognize that was really actually in finding a way to adapt in whatever situation you're in, and for me, Costa Rica, I'm still learning a lot of things that I didn't know. Just because I was from there, it doesn't mean I understand the culture fully. I understand only a pocket of like what my parents allowed me to experience. And then in China, I just got back two days ago and I mean seeing the transformation

of what my dad used to live in a concrete, like a brick house that he slept on, hey. And like to now, when you see the city, it's just tall buildings and just beautiful nature and farmland right next to it and to see that it's almost connecting the backwards which is such a beautiful thing and then looking at what the life we built in America and we moved to San Francisco and then I moved slowly down the coast to Grover Beach which is a completely different culture, a completely

different style, a completely different people. Were there other Asians that you were hanging out with, were there people that were other Latin people that you were hanging out with? Like how did you... Well, when I first moved, I didn't really speak much English. First of all, this mess-cow is incredible. Oh, yeah. Have you tried the... This is the octopus, right?

Ooh! What's that? What fell out? What was that? I mean... Yeah, this is a cricket, I believe. A cricket? Yeah. Where did it come from?

I think it's part of it. And I'm going to put in some salt. Oh, I'm going to put in a little one right here. This is very, very, very, very, very tender, girl. Punchy? It's a crunch. You're picking up a crunch? Nice.

Oh, yeah. That was, you know what? It tastes fruity too. It probably ate some fruit before. He was swimming in that mezcal soaked in stone fruit. Mm-hmm, yummy. Okay, so I barely spoke English. You know, I knew how to sing.

Good morning, T. T. Good morning, T. How are you? And that's pretty much it. And at a young age, I got to really see that quietly. And not being the outspoken kid, like to point that my parents thought,

I was like, mute almost, because I was just observing. We were also probably just trying to figure out like what lane to get in. And I went so many different cultures available to you, you know, you speak Spanish, or Chinese descent. English is like probably the main language that you're hearing, like which lane am I sp- you're- you're five, two, five or six years old. What lane am I meant

to like kind of focus on being in here? I can imagine, you know, it's very tricky. And also, I mean, kids from what I understand and like, you know, or like, as I'm learning, but like, you know, there's such sponges. Back at here, he has friends who speak up the languages and he'll like teach me words. And he remembers them, he retains them, and he knows what they mean. And so like at that age, you're just absorbing so much

where you like actually even maybe learning English that a more rapid pace than your parents were. Yeah, absolutely. I think with TV, exposed to TV, I mean, my first show that I remember watching as a kid was Knight Rider in Costa Rica, but that was in Spanish. Sure, over that. Yeah. And I was like, this is my favorite show, but I don't understand it. I got to learn. I got to learn. Oh my god. Okay, stop.

Swim it over here. Hold up. There you go. That is crazy. All right, let's start with the veggies. We've got some wrist wash here, the baby squash, and baby skinny on top of a PPR, which is made up of pumpkin seeds and sesame seeds and other seeds that we basically have on top of that is a Mexican duke, which is again, like a toasted seed that adds a little bit of texture and crunch. Then cutiha cheese shaped on top and a hopeful basil, lemon basil and other

basil. These are the beef ribs. We got those in a Chipotle tamarind sauce, a dark-porky sauce that we make in house. It's again smoked and roasted for 11 hours, so it's very tender and falls off the bone. Now the show's over. The whole fried sapper. This snapper is sourced out of Mexico and baja.

I scored for you again, so it's easy to eat. So the flesher falls off your bone. Yeah, I have never seen anything like that. And just get messy. Yeah, it's all about sharing in the lab. Enjoy your meal, brother. Thank you. Thank you.

Now for a quick break. But don't go away. When we come back, Harry will talk about what it was like to land glee and getting the chance to work on two breakout films with predominantly Asian American castes, everything everywhere all at once and crazy with Asians. Okay, be right back. So it's not a huge surprise to people that I love to cook, but I feel like I'm a student of life and there's always more to learn. So I decided to take a class on master class taught by Roy Choi. In master class sessions, you learn from the very best at, well, everything from cooking with Gordon Ramsay or Roy Choi to comedy with Steve Martin to, I don't know, songwriting with John Legend.

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So what ended up bringing you to your first kind of professional job where you were making money dancing? I think the first one that I learned a lot was this artist named Casey. She did a cover of I think I love you, David Cassidy, I think I love you. And it was huge in Europe and UK. And I was taking a dance class. I was taking about four or five dance classes every day. So I could go around all over LA, the edge and millennium.

And I remember I was at the edge taking a class. And these two choreographers, Rosé and Jamal, came up to me after class and they, hey, we really like your style, all that. It was like, we're interested in you coming on tour. I was like, is this how it works? You know, it can happen anywhere, right? Right.

I got anything. And next thing you know, I was getting paid $700 a week, which was massive for me, because I was like, that's more money than I could think of at that time. And it was the first time I went to Europe and got to go there and experience touring in a completely different country. I look back at, and all those times I got to perform with certain artists and musicians and that feeling of like,

oh, it's the musician, the singer, and the dancer. I was like, that's crazy. That we get to do this. I know you've turned with several different huge artists beyond saving one of them. Tell me some of the other ones. Well, a lot of these shows, I did more like award shows and called spot dates.

Okay, gotcha. Yeah, so I did like, you know, I danced J-Lo for J-Lo on like, I think, dance with stars and then you dance with like, Destiny's Child for Thanksgiving parade. And then you go over and hop to Ashanti and the BET Awards and then, you know then Jessica Simpson for the American Music Awards. So you just keep hoppin' to different artists.

It's such an interesting, unique career. At what point in this timeline did Glee happen for you? This was where my wife Shelby was a big part of that because she did the pilot Glee. How did I know that? She was in vocal adrenaline, which basically just she's like this is the hardest thing I've ever had to do in my life. Just because the choreography was so intense and just like really pushed the limits.

And she just kept telling me I was like oh that's awesome there's a musical show like cool I never heard like you know it's like when you hear something new it's like that sounds cool but yeah I don't know if that's gonna do well because right so she kept telling me about this and you know there wasn't there were many dancers and there's so many dance numbers right we need to hire like two dancers they had Heather Morris who was already a brilliant dancer and there's like we need two guys it's kind of help out a little bit to fill the space and so Zach Woodley kind of help out a little bit to fill the space. And so Zach Woodley kind of asked me, I was like, oh, I heard, you know, you're like dating Harry, he's like, yeah, yeah.

Like, oh, tell him to audition. And so I auditioned, you kept telling me about it and I was like, okay, cool. And I just treated like any other audition. But I came in on the Sunday. I was like, oh, this is pretty serious. They're not going on a Sunday audition. Because they were probably in production at this point.

Oh yeah, they were just like, so we need it like by tomorrow. They're going on a Sunday audition. Because they were probably in production at this point. Oh yeah, they were just like, we need it like by tomorrow. They're shooting up until what I understand what they call fratter days in Hollywood, which is when you shoot until you shoot all day Friday night and you basically end are all night Friday night. You end early on Saturday, had the rest of Saturday off, have Sunday off, and then come back to work on Monday. So of course, Sunday was their one day. The only day we were able to see.

They could review and book. Sure. So I got it. And then the next, in two days, I was on set. It was just like one day player. I thought it was going to be in and out. No name. No, they did have a name.

Did they have? OK. They introduced me as Mike Chang. But I think they were also testing one. It's like, do we like this guy? Are we gonna like this guy? Yeah, just, we're just natural. And, you know, it just kept asking me back.

And, you know, it was just a really interesting way of kind of finding the voice while being voiceless. In a sense, like, you know, I didn't get to talk much on it, but now I look back at it and I'm like, I learned so much because the way I've been operating is just observational so I can absorb as much as I can. And it was absorbing this, like, so much, so much talent around me. Yeah, and the way that when you moved to America as a young kid, you were observing.

It's the same thing that you're out in this new business and then on this TV show, which is, by the way, a huge hit that first few seasons. It was like, I mean, Modern Family premiered at the same time and we was like, Glee and Modern Family were two of the big splashy. At least when you're talking about musical comedies, Modern Family was a musical. But when you're talking about comedies,

like those were the two big shows that everyone was talking about, it was a massive thing. So you're thrust into this huge show comedies, like those were the two big shows that everyone was talking about. It was a massive thing. So you're thrust into this huge show and you are observing and you are silent and not having any lines, really, or very few lines. And watching, you know, like people like Liam Michelle and Matthew Morrison and Jane Lynch, you know, kind of just massive people. So it must have been an incredibly wild crazy thing.

And so you just kept getting asked back to do like another episode. So it was just like basically a recurring job that had no security, I imagine, at least that for a season. For a while, there's like no security, but it felt like they liked me. I was still dancing.

I was still taking dance jobs. So I was like, I need to pay the bills. I need to know. And it wasn't until I had another job. And they were like, okay, let's lock you down for like not to commit to you. Yeah, and it was really nice. And I just think the whole experience through it all of seeing the extremes of what this industry can really offer. And also like talking to you right now, it's so neat because I just remember meeting during the war together.

And just kind of like experiencing this sudden rocket that we're all experiencing in different ways. And also cheering for each other. I just loved your cast because it was always just such a joy to see them and be like, oh, what's going to, who's it going to be? And at the same time, being able to just celebrate what we were achieving at that time and in coming years. And it's so cool that we're sitting here talking still and just looking back and be like, oh hey, what's your name?

Right, right. We liked it, we invited you to our wedding. We did enjoy the UN, she'll be very much. What point in the show did, because I know you and Jenna, Ashowitz who played after the game. She's in the coin chain. Yes, they paired you up as a couple. At what point did that happen?

Because that sort of like solidifies regular status when they give you up as a couple at what point did that happen because that sort of like solidifies you know regular status when they give you a girlfriend season two season two yeah yeah started really happening there and it's all a whirlwind man you know you go on tour right after it goes right so this is very unique to your show with Glee. It's like during the summer after you were done shooting, your show went on like a tour. Yeah, yeah. And did a live performance. Yeah, we toured all over America for that, for that first one. It was like half theater show, half like concert.

It was just, you're kind of in this whirlwind and like this nonstop, there's no break from it. Yeah, it was interesting because I was like a world that I came from, like being a background dancer for a long time and still to a certain degree on Glee, it still was, but then like kind of people knowing who this character was was a very different experience. And being like kind of part of the artist group

was really neat to kind of feel that side of things for the first and second tour. Right. And so you were slowly being given more, more like backstory and then I know in was it season three, you actually had a pretty significant episode. Yeah. The episode was about you. Asian F, which was, you got an A-S on. Yeah, A-S is an Asian F, which is a hilarious show. Do you know a lot of cultures? I mean, it is. It's like, what is this? It's like, it's not perfect. And I think it is, it's like what is this, it's like it's not perfect

and I think it speaks to you know as much as it was like kind of a funny thing for the show I think it spoke to a lot of people because people experience that with their parents of like just constant perfectionism like you know demanding that and that's kind of what that idea of A.J.F. is like it's basically a fail. It's like oh just because I got here is not good enough. I'm thankful for that particular episode and all the times of being silent to be able to kind of really have some understanding of what this character was about. And, you know, I think I thought they did a beautiful job putting that all over again. It's one of the most popular episodes of the series. I don't know if you know that.

I know, no. No, it is. And also, was there a lot of pressure around shooting that episode? Because it was sort of like, all of a sudden, okay, it's spotlights on you. This is, you're kind of front and center. This is, you're not just a background player at this point. You're not just silent. You know, with that, Alfonso Reg Sohrer von Sohrer, he was a director for it, and he communicated

to me in ways that was less words that were needed, and it was interesting, I don't know if it was a technique that he had with me specifically, because I don't know, I watched him, and you know, he would have conversations with actors, but for me, I just remember that one, this one moment when I was having a scene with Tamlin Tumita, who played my mom, and I guess I was, I don't know, acting too big or it was, I was overacting, I don't know what it was exactly. I just remember him coming up to me and just like, he didn't say anything for about five seconds, I was like, oh my god, he's like literally gonna fire me right now. And he kind of looked down and he just looked at me and he gave this signal of his hand just going like Bring it down like tap it down and that's and then he just looked at my eyes

And he just like walked away and I was like, okay, I got that But I've never had that I guess Connection with the director because he's always more like, okay, you dance over here. And, yeah, you do your thing. And then you come over here and then, yeah, yeah, yeah, and go over there. And then it was the first time I got to really collaborate with a director that was more than, you know, that what I was brought to do, dance, and it kind of gave me this, it took the nervousness away. And it allowed me to feel like I could be an artist in this, as opposed to like the pressure of like what I need to do dance. And it kind of gave me this, it took the nervousness away and allowed

me to feel like I could be an artist in this as opposed to like the pressure of like what I need to do with this wonderful script and blah blah. So it just allowed me to perform it and kind of be as natural as I could be during that time. So after Glee ended, there's been this like insane trend of upward hate crimes against the Asian community. And then culturally and pop culturally, there's also been this insane trend of upward hate crimes against the Asian community, and then culturally, and pop culturally, there's also been this surgeons of amazing entertainment and art from the Asian community that is so inspiring at the same time. running side by side. I'm speaking specifically of obviously everything everywhere at once, but also crazy, which Asians, the show beef, I that I'm enjoying so much. There's a minority parasite.

I mean, just incredible, incredible work from the Asian community. And the fact that you've gotten to be a part of two of these, sort of, I consider 10 pulls of like, what's happening right now is such an amazing cool thing. What has that been like for you? It's weird when you use a word resurgence or surge. It's, I don't know.

I think it was always there. It was always in the realm of what was possible, but just wasn't allowed. And I always look at that as really being able to have certain gates open and be like, oh, okay, this is what so many people have been able to play with, like let us see what we can do here. And just loved seeing creatives in the space, specifically,

when you're talking about Asian American voices that tell these stories that have been bottled up inside it. I feel that kinship, but also understanding that, this is more than just for Asian American voice. It's really just kind of breaking the mold and allowing people to realize that, you know, the Asian-American history of cinema has been, you know, very troublesome, but hanging out with someone like James Hong, you know, and then seeing him at the Oscars and seeing

like that, that's something I don't, I'm sure he dreamt of and thought of, but I'm sure when he was dealing in the 19, like, 40s and 50s, that's not something that was on his mind, right? Because he had so many other barriers to face. So I think it's more like the underdog story that's really just such a beautiful thing that brings so much joy and seeing these projects get so much recognition from all facets of kind of like whatever our business is.

And I always try and integrate things that I'm proud of, not myself. And so to see that still kind of carry through with all these different projects, but also knowing that like being a human being is one of the more important things outside of just like trying to challenge the system but also knowing that like what's gonna actually speak to people as you can humanity and how you're making this because I think that's all it is. You're humanizing Asian American voices. It's not even about like Asian American voice.

Like we should watch this. Like I don't agree with that. I think like where's a humanity in this? Like let's put them and for so long There was none of that and a lot of these characters that were be betrayed and I think that's what people in general I don't even think just a major Asian like people in general just like oh that right that's what what short-round could do Yeah, like that's amazing and why it took him so long. Oh, okay, then you start knowing that.

So it's just this beautiful thing. It's like, well, the past is the past. Let's move forward and let's all champion each other to try and bring the best out of each other. Yeah. I have a friend who's a part of a very popular TV show and she was auditioning. She's Korean and she was auditioning for a role and they wanted her to come in with like an Asian accent. And she's like, I just role and they wanted her to come in with an Asian accent.

And she's like, I don't want to do that. I don't want to do it. And she offered, she's like, I'll do British. I can do it if you need an accent. It's sort of to sound like she's not this character as far as dialect. We can do something else, but I don't want to do the Asian accent.

She ended up getting the role. And you could never imagine it being any other way. Like, it's, she's herself and she's bringing herself to the part, but she had to jump through three hoops to do that and risk losing this job. And I just, you know, I hate that it, for me, it's a friend. I hate that she had to put herself on the line like that and that it wasn't something that kind of came from a higher up.

Yeah, I mean, I agree. It's, again, it's like back to humanity, like humanity, what it is to be a human, that their environment and culture has made them a certain way. And in certain places, they weren't allowed to be that certain way because people didn't know about that. And I always look at, you know, even your story of not wanting to do the accent, which I think, like there's been moments where I said, like, no, I don't feel like this character needs,

or it comes from that. But there is, it's so, like, how bad has it gotten that people don't wanna do an accent when every other culture gets to do many accents that from their heritage that wouldn't feel like they're making fun of it. And that's I think the biggest thing is because they were made to be because there's my parents have accents, my friends that have accents doesn't make them dumb. They just they are they know another language that is not their first. That's a great distinction.

And it does question like, why are we feeling that way? I'm like, why have the guys that point? Yeah, and I think it's from years of embarrassment. I remember it was a big film for me growing up. I remember Bruce Lee's story, Dragon, Jason Scott Lee. He played Bruce Lee in this. And I watched that over and over again. And I just remember that scene when he went to the cinema

with his girlfriend at the time and then before he got married to Linda where breakfast at Tiffany's was on. And I've never seen breakfast at Tiffany's. I was like, what is this? And so that was my first experience seeing that. I was like, that's not a real movie. They made that for the movie. And then seeing that, I was like, okay,

that's something that he'd experienced, but maybe there's just making a point. and then seeing that, I was like, okay, that's something that, you know, he's a heat experience, but maybe there's just making a point and then years later, I was like, oh, that's a real movie that happened. And I, you know, I grew up watching a lot of Hong Kong movies. And I was like, that is real that that happened. And then to know that, you know, it's not about, I would love to get a place where we can just make fun of everything. And I think we should, but I got to a point where it's just like, there's just some bears even like being that person. And that's when it's not good for, I think society in general. So I mean, I love that there's more voices and people are enjoying things that they never get to see and watch it on these popular networks and streaming shows and movies.

And even subtitles, I grew up watching movies with subtitles and the fact that people are embracing that more often and really going out on the world. Yeah, mainstream media, right? It's beautiful. And also, I think I would have to say TikTok probably helped that because there's subtitles that were allowed to read. And like, well, just like that's normal. Like you're watching this on TV. You're like, I don't want to turn on the the music I know the

sound so subtitles become like part of at least an American culture that has been normalized I'm guilty of it like I remember sitting down for a movie and like I realized it was a subtitle for another god okay all right okay it's a part of Australia. Because you're like, you're trying to look at the facial everything else that you would usually do. But you acclimate with it so quickly. And every, I mean, some of my favorite films of all time are sub-titled films. Because you start to like, you see it as one,

as opposed to like, because I remember the first couple of times, like, oh my gosh. Yeah, how much do you see it's like. What did that person do? This is an action movie too, oh my gosh. Yeah, yeah. does it do? What did that person do? Yeah. This is an action movie too, oh my gosh. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, but yeah, it's, you acclimate to it, like you said.

I do have a question about everything everywhere, all at once. It is such an insane film in the best way. Did you audition for it or were you just offered this? I was offered it because I did a TV show with the Daniels. Very cool. Yeah. Were you given a script to read? Yes. Did you read the scripts? Yes, I did a TV show with the Daniels very cool. Yeah. Were you given a script to read?

Yes. Did you read the script? Yes, I did. What the hell? So did you think when you read this? Honestly, honestly, if I wasn't a big fan of Daniels before, I would not, I was like, got it. What movie are these guys doing?

Like, who are these people? Yeah. What are they going to make me look at an ass? Like just like having this raccoon on top of my head. Yeah, like I'm gonna make me look at an ass like just like having this raccoon on top of my head. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But like I remember I met him on Aquafina's a TV show and I just lost my mind. Yeah, more from Queens and I just lost my mind. I was like how am I here and they're directing like I've been watching these guys since when they're doing commercials and music videos. So I'll just follow them for a while. They did music videos. Oh, you have to watch their music videos. So I'll just follow them for a while. Are they the music videos? Oh, you have to watch their music videos.

Okay. I did not know that. They're incredible. They're like some of the silliest, most epic pieces. I had to go, I was like, who are these directors? Right. And I started going down this rabbit hole of, I really, there was a site before YouTube, there was like these sites that you go into watch a bunch of music videos that, and anyways, like, the way that this all unfolded, me being just a small part of this film was,

and what it has done and what it means for a lot of people is just like, I always pinch myself, like, how did I get here to work with these people that I admire and also be part of this? So there was great confidence when you had a record to get on your shoulder. Come on, man, like a record. And you're running to the streets with Michelle Yo on your shoulders.

Like you were like, I got this. Like I know what the game plan is here. But the fact that Michelle, like said, yeah, you crazy fools. I don't know anything about you guys, but I know that there's something interesting about this. Says a lot more about her. Because I was like, I get it. And I think that Daniels, they pick people who are willing to go to that extreme with

them, but also have this understanding of reality. Because I think that's why that movie worked so well. There's this sense, they got to go to the spectrum of what it feels to be human, goofy to a point of complete utter sadness of not knowing if the world is was for them. Harry, have you been able to zoom out and sort of like look at yourself in the stage at the end of the Oscars with the best picture and like remember yourself dancing at the Oscars looking at it like Merrill Street. Like oh, it would be, yeah, I'm in this room with these people. And then your're on stage winning as part of the ensemble

of the best picture. But has that, have you been able to like kind of embrace how crazy and cool that is? Yeah, I don't know if it's a detriment to my kind of, to myself in the sense, or if it's like something that keeps me going, is that I honestly view everything the same. Because I look at it, I wouldn't have gotten here if I didn't treat this with the same effort,

the same care that I did with everything everywhere at once, or that tour with Casey, that was my first tour so everything feels like a first time even though I've been on the stage like before in a different capacity but I think I just think that's what's beautiful about what we do is like and treating you know everyone in the crew like I just remember the first time I got school, it was on this job, it was a choreographer on it, and I was talking to the stylist. And I remember I was like, oh no, it needs to be like this, it needs to be like this. And it was just like trying to get the

vision correct and trying to like follow my orders from the director. And I just remember the or stylist, she was just like, I'm an artist too, Goddamn it. And I was like, not that I didn't see her that, but I just had to like, start my own, I was like, I'm not collaborating right now. I'm not like, I'm just saying like, this needs to be this way as opposed to like, what, you know, let's work together

even though we need to meet this result that we're all trying to get to. Right. And when I, that was a huge thing for me that I'm not going to art school, not having, like, I collaborate with people in different ways, but also, like, I just didn't quite understand how we connect these different jobs

that everyone has to put their head down and do, but also look up a couple of times while they're doing it. Right. And I look at that experience of just like this Oscar was like, wow, how neat is this experience? But also I look at James Hwang and I was like, how neat is it for you? And then I go into like, like, key. And it's just like this particular movie was just so special because I got to really enjoy everyone's success fully and wholly, and also that something

that was so deserved of being able to honor all the things that they felt like they was so far out of reach in so many ways and the fact that they got it was was something that's something I'll never forget and that's something that always will not just inspire me but know that whatever we're doing is kind of going on the right track yeah and you're in a big part of that too. Rackikudius. I don't know about me. He was staring at the ship. Thanks for doing this with me.

I really appreciate it. No, this is, I truly, I don't know a lot of these. Well, this is awesome. When you called, I was like, hell yeah, and we got to eat too. Right, all right. Next time on Dinner's On Me, you know her from Orange is a New Black,

Mrs. America, and Clyde's on Broadway, it's Uzoa Duba. We'll get into growing up in a Nigerian household in the suburbs of Boston. What it was like to be in one of Netflix's first hits as a streamer, and being in awe of Kate Blanchett as we all are. And if you don't wanna wait until next week to listen,

you can download that episode right now by subscribing to Dinner's On Me Plus. As a subscriber, you not only get access to new episodes one week early, you'll also be able to listen to them completely ad-free. Just click Try Free at the top of the Dinner's On Me show page on Apple Podcasts to start your free trial today.

Dinner's On Me is a production of neon hum media, Sony Music Entertainment and a kid name Beckett Productions. It's hosted by Yours Truly. It's executive produced by me and Jonathan Hirsch. Our showrunner is Joanna Clay. Chloe Chobal is our associate producer. Sam Bear engineered this episode. Hansdale She composed our theme music. Our head of production is Samu Allison. Special thanks to Alexis Martinez and Justin Makita. I'm Jesse Tyler Ferguson.

Join me next week. you