Dinner’s on Me with Jesse Tyler Ferguson - Side Dish: More with Tan France

Episode Date: June 25, 2026

More of my interview with 'Queer Eye’ star Tan France. Tan tells me about his long partnership with his husband Rob, a stabilizing force when he wasn’t publicly out. Plus, Tan’s run-in with one of my ‘Modern Family’ co-stars and how he’s hoping a big life change will lead to a reinvigorated social life. This episode was recorded at Cento Pasta Bar in West Adams, Los Angeles. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Spring break planning at our house is, it's definitely an adventure. Our kids have very strong opinions, and they're always on different sides of the spectrum. Beckett has very strong opinions about the ocean. It has to be a certain temperature, and the wind has to be blowing a certain way if he's going to get anywhere near it. He doesn't want sand on his feet. Sully, on the other hand, he will roll around in the sand and doesn't care about the water temperature, and he could be just sitting amongst seagulls and he's happy. Justin and I, we just want air conditioning and Wi-Fi, honestly.

Juggling all the details of a trip can be very stressful. And while I'm thinking about our plans, I also start thinking about our house while we're away. And it hits me. Maybe we could list our place on Airbnb while we're gone. It always sounds great, but I don't know if I can manage all the details myself. That's where Airbnb's co-host network comes in. You can hire a vetted local co-host to handle all the behind-the-scenes details. managing reservations,

guest communications, and even providing on-site support. So hosting feels manageable, even with everything else going on. So if you're traveling this spring, it might be the perfect time to list your space on Airbnb and maybe earn a little extra cash while you're gone to put toward that extra future travel,

someplace with air conditioning and Wi-Fi. If you're ready to host but could use a little extra help, find a co-host at Airbnb.com slash host. You know those meals that, just immediately take you somewhere. Like you take one bite and suddenly you're transported to a backyard. Someone's manning the fryer and everyone's waiting for a taste. That's exactly what Boar's Head has managed to do, but at your deli counter,

new from Boar's Head, the friar's turkey breast has the taste of deep-fried turkey. And I mean, it's perfectly seasoned, that golden, savory flavor. It really does that thing where one bite kind of takes over and you're like, oh, okay, this is what we're doing now. And the best part is you don't have to host anything. You don't have to fry anything. You don't have to politely ask someone else to handle the hot oil, which frankly I'm always happy to avoid. It's just there at the deli, ready to go.

So if you're putting together a sandwich or just standing at the counter deciding what kind of day you're going to have, the friar's turkey breast is a pretty great choice. Discover the craftsmanship behind every bite at your local Boreshead deli counter. Borshead, committed to craft since 1905. Hey, it's Jesse Tyler Ferguson. Here's a little side dish from this week's episode of Dinner's on Me.

This week's conversation was with Tan France, who you know from Queer Eye and Next in Fashion. We met at Centro Pasta Bar in Los Angeles, where over some truly delicious pasta on a beautiful patio beneath an olive tree, we talked about our very different coming out journeys, and the impact queer representation on television has had on both of our lives. When did you, I know you're into being me, but when did you come out? It's so interesting that you start off your book by talking about how you didn't really ever have that moment of like, oh, I'm gay. I'm really related to that, man. Like, I, people always ask me, when did you realize you were gay? It's the number one question that people love to ask queer people.

And I don't know if I have an answer for that. Yeah. It's just something that. I always knew that was different about me. And probably I knew that what gay was before I knew the word gay. And so for me, it just was something that was part of who I was. And as I got older, the outside world and, you know, I went to Catholic school and like all these other things that I was, that informed my life were telling me that this thing that

I was learning about myself in real time was something that was wrong. Yeah. Specifically with the Catholic Church. Yeah. And, you know, also just watching my mom and my dad navigate, you know, the little queer culture that trickled to us in Albuquerque, New Mexico, like, you know, on television. And just seeing their responses to that, seeing, you know, my siblings who, my sister's a lesbian, but my brother. But, you know, she was probably going through her own set of things. And that's a whole other conversation.

But, like, you know, my, thank you so much. My brother, you know, had, you know, different perceptions of what gay people were and, like, had, you know, he had language around that. And, you know, he's my biggest advocate now. But, like, you know, at the time when he was sort of figuring out who he was and being pressured by his friends, he had, he would say things that would make me feel unsafe. And, like, I felt very, um, ashamed of that. this thing that I hadn't even really come to learn.

I hadn't even fully realized about myself. Like I was already like making judgments about this thing that I was still figuring out. And so when, you know, when you asked like, when did I come out? I, it was sort of like happened in weird little bursts of like information. Same. Like, you know, this thing would happen and be like, well, that certainly must have like alerted them that like I am gay or like this thing would happen. Like, well, now I don't need to come out because that thing has.

happened and like, yeah, it sort of raised the flag. But then there was a point of time where I was like, I had to like actually officially come out. And I was like, good Lord, this is taking forever. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But, you know, it was in my early 20s after I moved to New York. And I sort of felt like I was under the umbrella of a safety net of like a theater community and like having friends who were gay and like watching their experiences and hearing their stories about, you know, their childhood and their teen years. And like just feeling like I had a sounding board.

Yeah. with them that I felt okay to then have that honest conversation with my parents. But knowing how scary that was for me, even just with those kind of safety guards put up, I can't even fathom for you what it must have been like being a part of a show where like literally the whole thesis of the show is embracing the gay community and gay culture. and then in turn, shining that back upon other people and letting those things that we're so proud of about ourselves influence other people's lives.

And yet having to figure out, you know, personally how to become proud of that thing for your family members. That's very complicated and very complex. Now for a quick break, but don't go away. When we come back, Tan explains why fame was never the reason he joined Queer Eye and why it was so important for him be visible as a queer Muslim man on television.

This episode is brought to you by Activia. You might already be eating yogurt, but not all yogurts are created equal. Activia contains over one billion probiotics per serving to survive and reach the gut alive. When it comes to gut health, Activia is the number one family doctor-recommended probiotic yogurt brand. Choose Activia, feel good from the inside out.

Visitactivia.ca for more details. I may not hold a diamond. But I do hold a few opinions about Bravo. I'm Sarah Galley, certified Bravo-Holic and host of Andes Girls, the only Bravo podcast that takes Housewives as seriously as they take themselves. Recorded straight from my closet office, or as I lovingly refer to it, the Clophis. This show offers a psychological deep dive into the drama on and off screen, not to recap per se, but to understand what's really going on.

Think of it as C-SPAN meets Ayanla Fix My Life, a little stream of consciousness, a little emotional autopsy, and a whole lot of nuance. From housewives themselves to culture writers, comedians, and everyday bravo-holics, I'm joined by rotating guests to explore the psychology behind Bravo's most fascinating personalities. Because when someone storms out of a reunion or rewrites their own history mid-season, we don't just ask what happened. We ask why. So if you're looking for something different than a recap and deeper than a soundbite, you're in the right place.

New episodes of Andy's Girls drop every week, streaming from the clothist to wherever you get your podcasts. Say bon, say bon. And we're back with more dinners on me. Now, I don't really care if somebody is homophobic online about me. I just feel sad for you. I feel so sad that that's your opinion of who we are. if gosh if you would ask me in my teens could i ever be proud of being a queer man the answer would be no like i'll hide it away for the rest of my life and i'll feel shame

i feel no shame i feel such pride in who i am and when i see other queer people from across the world especially from my part of the world i just think i'm so arrogant jessie i know but to say i think i might have had a part in you feeling like life's possible that's not arrogant at all i think representation is everything. And having someone turn on the TV and see someone that they recognize, I think that you should absolutely take that win and you should take that and be so proud of that.

Thanks. Absolutely. That's not arrogant at all. It's the main reason why when I first said yes to the show, it was because I thought the gays in America would watch. And I thought, there's probably brown gays here and hopefully they'll watch. And they'll think, well, if that guy can do it

and he's married and he wants to have kids. and he's got a normal life. Maybe I can have a normal life. That's the only reason why I did it. And I think that people think that that's bullshit. Like, no, you wanted to be famous. Fame was, actually fame's the worst part of it. The money's the lovely part.

Of course, it's so nice to have financial freedom. But I had financial freedom before this. I retired before Queer Eye. And so my main motivator was, how can I make it more acceptable For me, I wasn't quite frankly, I wasn't thinking of just other brown gays. I was thinking, how can I make it easier for people like me, but me included, where I can walk down the street in America and hopefully people will think, well, I do love him on that TV show. So maybe he's not a nightmare.

Maybe I don't need to be scared of him. Right. It's really interesting that, you know, you, it's happened in a very sort of like reverse way for you. because you, when you came out to your family, you would already met someone that you adored so much and then you wanted to spend your life with. And it's just very interesting to me that that family element was like one of the last pieces to come together.

I will say that that was by design. I don't know if you felt this way when you were coming out. I didn't feel like I had that. You mentioned safety net when you moved to New York. Yeah. I didn't have that in England. I dated dudes before. I'd had long-term relationships.

But I never thought, if I have to come out to my family, you're going to be my person. You're going to catch me. I never felt that safe with them. Then when I had Rob, I thought, God forbid, if my family leaves me, if everyone leaves me, that's okay because I've got this person who's the love of my life. And I pray will be the love of my life.

and I pray will be the love of my life forever. And I'm going to just be really gushy. Even after, I think it's been like eight and a half years we lose count. Still my favorite person in the world. I'm obsessed with this man. And I feel for him because he's molested by me every day. And I know that he just thinks, can you not grope me at every turn? Every time I pass him, I'm just think that's my man.

I love him so much. Oh my God. he's my favorite person in the world. And at this point, I just think, if you leave now, bitch, where are you going? Right. And where am I going? Well, now with kids, you've really locked me.

Yeah, yeah. Sometimes he'll say, please don't ever leave, because I will say, please don't leave me. Like, I don't know what I do without you. I don't, I truly don't know what I do without you. And he'll say, please don't leave. I'm like, where am I going? I'm not taking my clothes off in front of anyone.

I'm 43. Like, you think I'm willing to take my clothes up in front of someone. You get out of here. Justin's my outfit to take. Can you want me? imagine dating right now? I would, oh my gosh, if someone... By the way, I'm sorry to anyone who's listening.

That's like, well, that's me and it's awful. No, oh my God, I'm so sorry. Listen. There's no judgment of any of you. There's a no judgment of any of you. We're really glad we're not you. However, I'm telling you, if you are single, whoever's watching this, that's wonderful that you're single and hopefully you're enjoying your life.

But I'm just an insecure person where I think, Well, actually, that's all I. It's not insecurity. I'm a lazy lay. Let's tell you all. I ain't putting in the effort at 43 to get you going. It's just not going to happen. And also,

A lazy lay. Turn the lights off. I'm taking my clothes off. Oh my God, it's so funny. And the funny thing is, I know that I'm in shape. I know, like, I've got mirrors everywhere in my house and I've got the three of them.

I work out every day. I work out every day so I can take my clothes off in front of my husband, but still I'm like, I don't want someone new seeing this and turn the fucking lights off. That's so funny. My God, it's really funny. I love it. I will say that after, if I weren't in this situation with my husband,

I'm sure that becoming an entertainer would have been terrifying. I watched some of my castmates who either were single when the show aired or became single. I don't know how they decide which dudes. wanting to be with him because they want to be with him. Right. Or are they just using them for the opportunity that they're like? I mean, it's probably a little bit of both. Well, that's terrifying.

And I don't know how a person's like, okay, I'm just going to believe that this person who is so hot is like, yeah, I just want 10 fronts. Get out of you. Get out of you. But these things fade. I got advice from someone when I was single and starting to work in television. And I thought, well, you know, how is it going to be dating? Yeah. when I'm on a TV show.

And my friend was like, listen, we all date people for superficial reasons at the beginning. And someone dating you because you're famous is just as superficial as you wanted to date someone because they're hot. Both of these things fade. Like, when you see someone that's hot, it's fun for a few weeks and then it fades.

Dating someone because they're famous, there's no connection there, it's going to fade after a few weeks. So like, you know, our ins are our ends. We get into people, how we get into people. I like that. And so I was like, yeah, That's actually a really good point.

So we always, everyone starts superficially is what I'm saying. So I don't know. The Lux Fading thing is so funny because all the guys who are the tens at the equinox make me feel like absolute shit when I'm there, which is why I don't go there anymore. And I always just want to say, give it 10 years, love. Give it 10 years love. And you're going to be right where I am. And you're like, oh shit, what else do I have?

Oh my God. What else have I got? And I'm so grateful. I was an very unfortunate teen because I'm like, no, I encouraged your personality. I got on TV because of my personality because I developed. They're also very handsome. That's very kind. But first and foremost, I think I got my job because I could do their job.

I could keep your world and my world is so different. But on queer eye, my scene's three hours. My solo scene is three hours. And I've just got to fill it. Wow. Just with conversation, be entertaining, asking interesting conversations, and that better be fucking entertaining. Yeah.

It's got to be exhausting to be on for three hours. I'm exhausted by hearing it. No, I think something's wrong with me. And my mom thinks there's something wrong with me and always has done. I think I have whatever the disorder is called where you just want to be a clown all day, every day. Like even after a very long shoot day, I'll go, I'll walk into the house. Whoa. I can't help it. And with my husband, as soon as I get out of bed, I'll, I'm on. I'm on. And it is, it's not a performance. I swear to God, it's not a performance. I just can't

help but want to play. That's sweet. That's actually very sweet. That's how my kids are. I am like my, I watch my four and a half year old. I'm like, how did I not grow out of that? But I'm glad I did it. It's kind of remarkable that you didn't, yeah. Yeah, I mean, I can obviously also be serious when I have to be, but most of the time I just want to play. And so I don't find my job difficult at all. I think that unscripted work, I can't believe someone gets paid, but unscripted work.

I just have to stand there for three hours and perform. I was a host of the reboot of Extreme Mega Home Edition for HGTV. So I kind of relate a little bit to what you were talking about. I know we had our heroes, quote, unquote. and I would have to fill time with them. You know, interview them and extract story from them. And so, like, I definitely understand what you're talking about. I found it exhausting because sometimes, you know, I,

the cameras would be off and I'd be talking to these people because I want them to feel comfortable around me. And all the good stuff would be coming out. Oh, yeah. Oh, my God, we've got to get these cameras on. Oh, yeah. And, you know, then I'd be like, how do I get that back into, like, the show? Because what they just told me off camera was really great.

And they're not performers, so they can't do it again. Exactly. You know, so I would start hiding from them whenever the cameras were off. I learned that. And then that people think when they're on a TV show that the talent is mean, unfriendly, unkind. But I'm like, no, no, no, I can't talk to you when the cameras are on. Sorry, when the cameras are off.

Because you're not used to repeating something as if you've never said it before. And I need authenticity, so I just can't talk to you while it's the cameras off, which I feel really bad about. Or I'll just keep it really surface. What did you eat today? Right, right, right. Like lame shit. Now for a quick break, but don't go away.

When we come back, Tan shares a story of unexpectedly meeting my modern family co-star and his Salt Lake City neighbor, Ty Burrell. And he also opens up about why crowded Hollywood parties aren't exactly his scene. And we're back with more dinners on me. You live in Salt Lake City. I do. And I know you've been to Salt Lake. I have. I did one episode of this podcast in Salt Lake because Ty Burrell lives there.

We ordered it from Barracks. Okay. Yes. Oh, you ordered in? Yeah, because it was in an Airbnb. Wow. That was the whole thing. It was like weird.

Wow. Okay. And how is it? I doesn't like to interact with humans. That makes sense. So we had to like keep him away from any civilians. That makes sense. Yeah, he's really complicated that way now.

I sat next to him on a flight. I'd never met him before. And I wondered if at some point I would bump into him. I thought like to small town. You must have. Yeah. Only once on a flight we were sat next to each other. Oh, interesting.

He came and sat down. I turned to him and I said, look, I don't want to bother you, but I just need you to know, love your work. Did he know who you were? No, but then I told him I was on a show called Queer Eye. He was just asking, well, what do you do here? Where are you going? I was going to LA.

And he was going for Emmy stuff. I was going for Emmy stuff. So I said, oh, I'm going for Emmy stuff. And he was like, oh, what do you do? Do you work in the industry? I was like, yeah, I'm on a show called Queer Eye. When I told him the name, he was like, oh, I know queer, I've just never seen it. He hasn't seen anything.

Whenever somebody, a lot of people are apologetic where they haven't seen it. I'm like, I don't care. I don't care either. I don't care either. I don't care either. I always, I mean, my go-to line for a while was like, I get paid whether you watch it or not. But then that sounds like that sounded a little aggressive. That's literally what I said.

I was about to say it and I thought that's going to sound mean. But I do. I get paid by the way. Yeah. I mean, I'd love for you to watch it. I think you would enjoy it. Yeah. But I, it doesn't, I don't apologize.

Now I say the numbers are amazing. Don't worry about it. Like, it would have made no difference than numbers. I like that too. Yeah. I did fine with that too. Yeah. Don't feel guilt about it.

I do have a strange aversion to people who like really aggressively tell you that they don't watch TV like they're proud of it. I just don't watch TV like what your job, what you do in life is not worried at my time. It's inconsequential. I don't like that. Don't love that at all. The thing I hate even more is I don't know who you are, but my friend's freaking out. I'm like, then why did you come over?

Yeah. Or when somebody's come over for a photo, you'll come over and ask for a photo, but I don't know what you do. Yes. But that person took a photo, I'm like, then why you waste my time, bro? I know, I know, I know. I get that a lot too as well. Very sweet.

I don't care about you, but my friend does. Yeah. Yeah. There's better ways of doing it. I know. I just want to say, well, can't you just say, my friend loves you? Can I take a picture? Like, I get this a lot, which is my mom loves you.

Like, I know that a 17-year-old isn't a fan of mine, but their mom probably is. Yeah. Like, yeah, I will take that any day of the week. It's just that when they start, I don't know you. Right. Right, right, right, right. Then how do you know that your mom loves me? Exactly.

You do know you have some, you have some. You have some knowledge of me. Yeah, exactly, exactly. You could start it outside, I had limited knowledge of you. I barely know yes. Do you think you're going to end up in a big city in the East Coast? We're going to do two things. We're going to have a place outside the city where the kids can go to a normal school

because it scares me too much to have them raised in the city. Right. So Monday to Friday will be outside of New York and then we'll get a place in the city for the weekends and for my work because I'm in New York. a lot of work. And so in the week, at least I can go into that place and it'll feel like home. I think if you can have a place to escape to upstate, it's really important. I love the outdoors.

Me too, yeah. And there's beautiful homes up there. And I like a remote place. I mean, again, I live in Utah where I'm not into the hustle and bustle. And also, I do think I may have affected, sorry, I know I talk a lot. I love it. I think I have affected my career so greatly. in the fact that I don't do anything.

I don't, I will go for a job places. I don't network. I don't go to events to be seen. My publicists are always like, you should be seen at stuff. I just want to set my sofa and watch Golden Girls. It's so true. I rarely saw you when I was doing modern family

and we were at these many parties. Like, I would see you on the carpet, taking your pictures, going in, see you on stage. Yeah. But I would never, I wouldn't see you, you know, hanging. I go. For the last nine years, so the show's been on for eight and a half nine years,

I would go to Emmy's week because we were nominated so it felt appropriate to go. But I would go to one party and then around Oscars week I would go to one party. And I still just do that nine years on. You don't see me at anything else. Because I'm not a partyer first and foremost. I don't drink. And I get really nervous at parties. I do too.

I've, the amount of times I've gotten ready, I've been in the car, we go to the venue, and I tell the driver to go right back to the hotel because I'm too nervous. Oh. I know that sounds crazy, but I always get worried thinking, nobody is going to talk to me. And my husband's always at home. So I go to most things solo. It is terrifying going to. It's very brave to go to solo. Yeah, it's so hard.

I definitely, I obviously had. to become good at it because it was something that I felt like I needed to do. And Justin's very social, so that certainly helps. But, you know, it's, I completely understand that. I find myself some conversations with people that I admired greatly. And then halfway through the conversation, I'd go into my head and be like, they don't want to be talking to me. They want to be talking to anyone else. And I would like extract myself in the conversation and end up abruptly. I do that. I still do that. Why did you act so weird? I was like, I don't know. I feel like it was time. I still do that. I know that people miss.

I don't know what the English word is. They don't understand what I'm doing when I do this. Microaave? Microwave, yes. Thank you, Angelia, yes. You know, when you're at an event, talking to somebody, and you can see that they're looking over your shoulder. I'm not looking to see who else I need to talk to you next.

I'm looking over thinking, oh, they're going to want to talk to. Right. Okay, it was really good to see you. Biontys. Talk to her. because I said there's no way you're not going to I live in Utah

I'm talking about my kids and golden girls I've got nothing else be here and so I know that it's rude to look over their shoulder but I'm just thinking I'm going to excuse myself

because they're going to want to go and talk about person yeah so I don't stay at the time long probably three fourths of time are wrong and they're having a great time talking to you I know I know

that's why I think the beast coast is going to be good for you I really hope so I'm going to try and do like solo dinners I love the one thing that really pisses Anthony and Jeremiah off. You know Jeremiah, right?

Yeah. Okay. So just so you all know at home, we met through Jeremiah, he was launching was it a kid's range or something? Oh, right, he was doing something with a cream barrel. Yeah. So I went there and I think I'd seen you before and we'd said hi, but we'd never spoken

spoken before until Jeremiah's when he had his line that he was releasing we were at his police party together. Yeah. I thought now that's somewhere I felt very out of place. I was like, they don't want me here. They don't want you guys there. and they're like let's get all the queer guys yeah yeah yeah

I was like eh what do I do yeah when your castmates I mean I'm sure you felt this way with modern family too when your castmates are there it's clear that the press

just want to have pictures of the cast it's a weird thing but so Jeremiah Brent yeah Jeremiah Brent so Jeremiah and Anthony whenever I'm in New York

I will go and see them now Jonathan lives there so I see Jonathan but their main gripe with me is I will go to New York maybe once or twice every couple of months for a day or two. And I was one of their many dinners.

Or they were one of my many dinners. And so as soon as I'd get to wherever we were getting to, they'd be like, how long do we have? Because who do you have next? Yeah. And that is so true. Because I have a lot of friends in New York, I want to see them all.

You stack them up. So I will be at a place for food. I won't eat much food. But I will be at a dining place from the morning until I go to bed. There was a, they found it ludicrous that at one point, I sat at Baldassarre for six hours. No, rolling. And I had three different hangouts with different friends. I'd been from this table and then once the other person would get there, I say,

it was really good to see I've got to go. I'd move to the next table and go and sit with our other friend. Six hours I stayed there. So yeah, that's how I operate when I'm in New York. So it'd be nice to be like, oh, I can just see, thank you. I can just see one person tonight for dinner. Yeah, I'm really looking forward to that. But it is a very strange thing, changing your life completely.

And it feels like I'm going to change my life completely. It is. And it's going to be good for you, I think. I hope so. That was a little more from my conversation with Tan France. If you haven't heard our full conversation yet, make sure to check it out on Dinners on Me. This episode of Dinners On Me was recorded at Sinto Pasta Bar in West Adams, Los Angeles.

Next week on the show, you know him as a chef, restaurateur, and television personality behind top chef and beloved L.A. restaurants Gwyn and Maud. It's Curtis Stone. We'll talk about raising adventurous and not so adventurous eaters, the lessons he learned running restaurants through the pandemic, and the simple secret to being a restaurant guest everyone loves. Dinner's On Me is a production of Sony Music Entertainment and a kid named Beckett Productions. It's hosted by me, Jesse Tyler Ferguson. It's executive produced by me and Jonathan Hirsch. Our showrunner is Joanna Clay. Our associate producer is Alyssa Midcalf. Sam Bear engineered this episode. Hans Dale She composed our theme music.

Our head of production is Sammy Allison. Special thanks to Tamika Balance Kalasney and Justin Makita. I'm Jesse Tyler Ferguson. Join me next week. Hey y'all. It's Kelly Clarkson with Wayfair. Ever order furniture online and wonder what if? Like, what if it doesn't hold up? That sofa was four days old. You should have ordered from Wayfair. With Wayfair, there's no what if. Just style you love and quality you can trust. Visit Wayfair.ca. every home.