DISGRACELAND - Bonus Episode: Are Rockstars Part of the UFO Disclosure Theory? Plus Psychopedia’s Brooke Slater on Slayer and Ed Gein

Episode Date: December 4, 2025

On the heels of the release of the excellent new documentary The Age of Disclosure, and our own recent mini and full episodes on Merle Haggard’s UFO obsession, we discuss the likelihood that rockstars from John Lennon to Tom DeLonge are part of the UAP disclosure theory. We also talk to Psychopedia’s Brooke Slater about Slayer and Jake’s Ed Gein heebie jeebies. For more great Disgraceland episodes, dive into our extensive archive, including such episodes as: Episode 133 - Jimi Hendrix Episode 63 - Chet Baker Episode 212 - Elvis Presley and Johnny Ace Episode 71 - David Bowie To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoicesSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is exactly right. Double Elvis. When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist, they take matters into their own hands. I vowed. I will be his last target. He is not going to get away with this. He's going to get what he deserves. We always say that trust your girlfriends. Listen to the girlfriends.

Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This season on Dear Chelsea with me, Chelsea Handler, we have some fantastic guests like Amelia Clark. When like young people come up to me and they want to be an actor or whatever. My first thing is always, can you think of anything else that you can do? Rather be disappointed in. Do that.

David O'Yellowo. I love this podcast, whether it's therapy or relationships or religion or sex or addiction or you just go straight for the guts. Dennis Leary, Gaten Matarazzo from Stranger Things, Tana Monsu, Camilla Morone, Carrie Kenny Silver, and more. Listen to these episodes of Dear Chelsea on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Movies can make you feel, make you dream. Sometimes they even make you appreciate architecture. Is there anybody who's been hotter in a doorway than Elizabeth Taylor? That's the kind of analysis you'll find every week on Dear Movies I Love You, the new podcast from the Exactly Right Network. Every Tuesday, we break down the films we're crushing on, from blockbusters to deep cuts. Listen to Dear Movies I Love You on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Hey, Discos, need a little more disgrace land in your life? Just a touch to get you through?

Yeah, me too. This is the podcast that comes after the podcast. Welcome to Disgraceland, the After Party. Welcome to the Disgraceland bonus episode, a little thing we like to call the after party. This is the show after the show, the party after the party, the bridge to get you from one full episode of disgrace land to the other, the backyard to dig into the dirt. Our mission to uncover the truth, to confront the myth, to reclaim the story on this bonus episode, we are discussing this week's new full episode, our part two story on Merle Haggard. Merle's UFO obsession has us rewining back to our Blink 182 story and previewing next week's new episode on Phil Specter and the madness behind his incredible Christmas album.

We got a special interview today with Cyclopedias, Brooke Slater about Slayer and Ed Gein, and we get into your emails, comments, DMs, and as always, a whole lot of rosy. This is the podcast for The Musically Obsessed, The Outsiders, the Independent Thinkers, who know that the best history is the history that gets buried. Disgraceland is where I tell the stories they didn't want told, the kind you'll end up telling to somebody else. All right, Discos, let's get into it. Murderers, Aliens.

country singers and haunting heavy metal songs. My head is swimming with thoughts of all of them this week. So first up, murderers and heavy metal songs. There's been an ongoing battle in our house this last month or so about whether or not my wife and I are going to watch Monster the Ed Gein story on Netflix. And I'm just so repelled by the images in the series that I turned to my friend Brooks Slater from the Psychopedia podcast, a bit of an Ed Gein expert to help me work through this true crime story via a heavy metal song that haunted me as a kid. And that conversation is coming up later in this after party and you're not going to want to miss it. It's fascinating. And I can't wait for you to hear it. But now on to country singers and aliens. In our continuation

of the Merle Haggard story in this week's new full episode, we reveal in Merle Part 2 that Merle almost collaborated with spaceman David Bowie, if you can believe that. And we tease out Merle's UFO experience and fully dive into Merle's UFO obsession in this week's mini episode. Now, Merle Haggard's UFO experience claim is not unique to rock stars. Many musicians have made similar claims to seeing unexplainable events in the sky and elsewhere. In addition to Merle Haggard, we mentioned David Bowie, who claimed to see something above the town of Beckenham as a young man, an event that obviously had a sizable impact on Bowie's art. We detail Tom DeLong from Blink 182's Desert Experience in this week's Rewind episode coming

up right after this after party. Next week's new episode is on Phil Spector and John Lennon, who is heavily involved in Phil's story and part of next week's rewind schedule, claimed to see a craft hovering over Manhattan and referenced it in a song, Nobody Told Me, singing, there's UFOs over New York, and I ain't too surprised. Elvis Costello, Sammy Hagar, Kat Stevens, Kurt Cobain, Jimmy Hendrix, Elvis Presley, all claimed to have experiences or sightings. For some of these artists, claiming to see the unexplainable up in the sky, alien spacecraft, UFOs, it's totally on brand. David Bowie, Jimmy Hendrix, hell, even Elvis Presley and John Lennon, but Elvis Costello, cats,

Stevens, Sammy Hagar, Merle Haggard. Now, claiming this kind of thing is wildly discrediting, or at least it used to be. More and more of the UFO, or as it's becoming known, UAP, unidentified aerial phenomenon, more and more discussion is becoming more mainstream and more acceptable. And I don't believe that that's an accident. 40% of Americans say that they've had similar experiences, 40% Think about that. For the Americans in the audience, that's four out of every 10 people that you will encounter. That means four out of every 10 rock stars, doesn't it? I don't know. Is that how statistics works? I don't really know, but I do know that 40% is a huge number. Merle Haggard does not strike me as a type of guy who would be so loosey-goosey with his reputation and credibility. In the upcoming Blink 182 Rewind episode, we discuss whether or not blink guitarist Tom DeLong is part of a larger secret plan by the government

to disclose to the public the truth about extraterrestrial or ultra-terrestrial life. What if Tom DeLong isn't the first rock star? I can see some of you guys rolling your eyes right now. I get it. Aliens, UFOs. Without going out on any sort of fox moulder limb that I can't walk myself back from, I will say that ever since diving into this subject and researching Blink 1282, it's become clear to me that something that looks an awful lot like controlled disclosure is happening in our culture. And this all seems to have landed on our heads with a massive, holy shit, can you believe it, thud, right now in the past week with the release of the documentary The Age of Disclosure by Dan Farah. Now, this documentary is not some obscure YouTube doc by a dude with a tinfoil hat and dog-eared copy of Project Blue Book. This is an Amazon distributed, theatrically released, highly produced film featuring numerous high-level government officials, politicians and career servicemen and women from both sides of the political spectrum, Marco Rubio, Kirsten Gillibrand, James Clapper, and many, many, many others on. record stating unequivocally that we are not alone in the universe.

And say what you will about the proof. The proof is in the pudding. They are risking their reputations in doing this. Everyone interviewed in the film claims direct knowledge of UAP as a result of their work in the U.S. government and what they discuss is truly revelatory. And the reason for their disclosure is truly chilling. They're afraid. afraid that whatever is out there, whatever Merle Haggard, Tom DeLong, John Lennon,

whatever others have claimed to a scene, whatever alien technology that causes unidentified aerial crafts to go 40,000 miles per hour, stop on a dime, turn, and transmitiate between air, water, and space, unexplainable technology captured on video by our military personnel, that whatever that is, that it's going to be harnessed by our foreign adversaries and used against us. If we do not wake up and admit that there's something else out there and find ways to work with it and use it for the good of mankind. Anyway, that's not me saying all that. That's the film. That's the point of the film. And my summary here is only scratching the surface of what the film reveals. But

those are the stakes anyway. And with those stakes, if true, it means that we all need to find ways to wrap our heads around this UAP concept, this thing that Merle Haggard and John Lennon and Tom DeLong and many other rock stars for years have been trying to draw our attention to, the idea that we are not alone. It seems to me that we as a species are going to slowly learn more and more about this topic until it's completely mainstreamed. And that this learning, this disclosure, this is my opinion. It seems to me that it's been going on for decades. And that, yes, willingly or unknowingly, whatever it is, some of our favorite rock stars have been part of this disclosure. And hell, maybe you and I are part of this disclosure as well.

And we just don't even know it. My advice, listen or relisten to our Blink 182 episode after this. And I'm laughing because I'm shamelessly pimping disgrace land right now. But it's not without merit. Much of what I detail in that Blink 182 story is reinforced and expanded upon in this documentary that I'm talking about. So listen to Blank and Disgraceland and then watch The Age of Disclosure and call me after that. 617-90666-6338.

And let me know what you think about this topic. Okay, are we alone as Tom DeLong insists we're not? Is the truth being disclosed? Are there UFOs over New York, as John London warned us? Or are we all just high as fuck? Like Merle Haggard, all right? I want to know. Call me 617-906-66-6-6-38.

Let me know your thoughts. I'll be back after this with your calls, text, and emails. And Ed Gein and Brooke Slater from Psychopedia. There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two? Never mess with her friends either.

We always say that, trust your girlfriends. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of the girlfriends, Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care. So they take matters into their own hands.

I said, oh, hell no. I vowed. I will be his last target. He's going to get. what he deserves. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe. On the Iheart radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This season on Dear Chelsea, with me, Chelsea Handler, we have some fantastic guests like Amelia Clark. When, like, young people come up to me and they want to be an actor or whatever,

my first thing is always, can you think of anything else that you can do? Rather be disappointed in. Do that. Dennis Leary. I wake up and I'm hitting him in the head with a water bomb. And Bruce Jenner is on the aisle in a karate stance like he's about to attack me.

Like, making karate noises. And his entire the Kardashians family over there, everybody's going, and the air marshal is trying to grab my arms and screaming. I immediately know that I've been asleep walking. David O'Yello-O. I love this podcast, whether it's therapy or relationships or religion or sex or addiction or you just go straight for the guts. Guy Branham.

So anyway, Nicole Kimman broke up with Keith Thurban. Being half of a country couple was always a hat she was going to wear, not like a life she was going to lead. Oh, interesting. I like that. Did you practice that on your way over? Gaten Madarazzo from Stranger Things. Tena Monsu.

Camilla Morone at Carrie Kenny Silver. And more. Listen to these episodes of Dear Chelsea on the IHeart Radio app, podcast or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Kate Winkler Dawson, a host of the Wicked Words podcast. Each week I sit down with the true crime writers behind some of the most compelling true crime stories and discuss their years spent investigating and why it still matters. He sees his father coming out of the woods with his hands over his face and he knows

something happened. His father just grabs him and says she's gone. She's gone. These are the cases that leave survivors, families, and the journalists who cover them changed forever. Working in national television, it'll push you to your limits, and you'll end up doing things you never thought you do. You know, you look back at it and you're like, I can't believe that really happened. Join me and step inside the investigation. New episodes drop every Monday on the Exactly Right Network. Listen to Wicked Words on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts.

All right, welcome back. The John Lennon UFO sighting that I mentioned earlier. That might sound like bunk. That might sound like witty John Lennon taking the piss out of us, having a laugh. Taking the piss out of us. I never know how to say that. I'm not even going to try it. That's an English thing.

Taking the piss. You know what I mean. But John Lennon was dead serious about what he saw. And to prove that to you, Zeth and I are going to tell you exactly what we mean in the exclusive section of this after party coming up shortly. Go to disgrace landpod.com to become a disgrace land all access member so that you can hear this exclusive content and get ad free listening on all episodes. All right. That's later. Now, let's hear what you guys have to say. Last week was Thanksgiving. I hope you all had a great holiday with your families. Thanksgiving means, of course,

that we're talking about the greatest Thanksgiving concert film. How the greatest concert film of all time in my eyes, the last waltz. We have, What is the greatest concert film in your opinion? And some of you got back to us, here's Ken in the 818. Hey, Jake, it's Ken in the 818. I'm going to cheat on my answer about the concert film. I am trying to break your heart by a film about Wilco, but Sam Jones.

Not really a concert movie, but there's a lot of concert footage. Probably the best movie about a band ever. But in terms of concert film, the LCD sound system shut up. and play the hits. It'd be even better if they hadn't actually gotten back together. But, yeah, that one would probably be in terms of concert footage. That's my number one. All right, man, take care. Thank you. Ken, my man, man, I saw that Wilco movie when it came out in the theaters

in Davis Square, the Somerville Theater. Incredible. And, you know, I loved it. I really, truly loved it. And I never went back and watched it again. You're reminding me, I need to go back and watch this. You know, recently I had YouTube on and I just was doing something else and it just kept playing and it pulled up the Jay Bennett from Wilcoe documentary that was actually pretty good as well. And I recommend that if you haven't seen it. LCD sound system shut up and play the hits. Great concert film and you're absolutely right. Would have been better had they stayed broken up. But I think, you know, what do breakups even mean anymore? Why breakup? It doesn't make any sense. It really makes zero sense to break up.

We don't live in a world and a culture, I should say, anymore where, you know, old people, supposedly old people can't play rock and roll. You just keep going. And obviously, that's what LCD is going to do. All right. Let's move the conversation over to the greatest country singer of all time in light of our episode, our new part two episode on Merle Haggard. Let's check out the seven. Mr. Jake, name is Aiden from 770. That's Northwest Georgia.

Love the show. I've been binging it back and really enjoying it. Question was, favorite country singer. I might go with kind of current and right now. Number one for, well, I got two. I'm going to say, Coulter Wall. If you know them, if you don't, I'd say go check out nothing. It's a cover of Tom Van Zant song.

It's really good. and motorcycle. I'm going to go Culture Wall, and I'm going to go Chris Stapleton, too. Huge superstar, and I think he's already kind of established himself as a legend in the game, and he still has a lot of time left.

And if you didn't know, he also was the lead singer of a bluegrass band called the Steel Drivers before he established himself solo. So the Steel Driver's Reckless and the South Title album, those are both fantastic. Anyway, love to show. Hope you're doing well and have a happy holiday from the 770. You know, I like Chris Stapleton.

I do. I don't listen to him on purpose, which is to say I don't listen to him enough. But is this one of these guys every time I hear anything, I kind of turn my head and go, what's this? This is pretty good. Colton Wall, I'm going to check out on your recommendation. I'm going to check out that Towns Van Zant cover first and foremost. Appreciate the call, 770. 617-906-6638.

If you guys want to get in touch, you guys want to leave me a message. about anything really but you know more importantly our UFO conversation i'm digging that what do you think watch age of disclosure call me 617 90666 6363638 after your mind has been fully blown and let me know what you think and let me know what you think about this concept of disclosure and if you think our cultural icons are involved our musicians are rock stars if they're part of the plan unwittingly or or otherwise 617 906 6-638 voicemail and text. 724 text. I'm getting ahead of the question this week because I'll be playing catch-up with podcast. The voice that captivates me from country music would be for men, Marty Robbins,

and for females, Reba McIntyre. Both are just incredibly quintessential and have a large catalog of varying material you can find anything in and stretch their range. Good health to you and yours and later days, Jake, 724, Devil Woman by Marty Robbins. Robbins, great, great country song. Highly recommend it. Reba, I don't know much about Reba. She's the one who's on television all the time, right? I probably need a Reba. What's the Reba corn dog thing? What's that all about? I see that on Instagram. There's a meme. I don't know. Hit me up, 724. School me. All right. And talking about great music films, we got this message from the 416 that I want to read here. Great episode on music movies. Okay, so it's not a music film per se,

but a documentary that I consider one of the greatest ever documentaries. Let's Get Lost, The Chet Baker Story by Bruce Weber. It contains what I consider the most affecting male jazz vocal performance ever recorded, which is the time-blasted Chet Baker

singing almost blue by Elvis Costello. The review on the Wikipedia page captures the essence of the film. Terrence Rafferty, in his review for the New York Times, wrote, and this is the quote from Rafferty in the Times, quote, the enduring fascination of let's get lost. The reason it remains powerful, even now, when every value it represents is gone, is that it's among the few movies that deal with the mysterious, complicated, emotional

transactions involved in the creation of pop culture and with the ambiguous process by which performers generate desire. Interesting. I wonder how Rafferty intended us to interpret the word desire. by which performers generate desire. Does he mean performers generating desire from their audience? Or does he mean performers generating desire as in their desire and their will to create? Fascinating either way.

Yes, you're right, 416. Incredible quote. And Let's Get Lost is an incredible movie. Shout out to Flea, by the way, from the Red Hot Chili Peppers. You're right on that performance. It is incredible. It is absolutely incredible. No one ever sang like Chet Baker. And there was a thing when we were researching Chet Baker that I came upon when we were putting together our episode on Chet about how when he sang he was on the edge of, I think it was edge of tonality. I think that's how it was described. Where he just really feels like he, he was on the edge of, I think it was edge of tonality. I think that's how it was described. where he just really feels like he's he's about to he's pushing it so far, but he's singing so subtly, but he feels like he's going to fall out of tune.

And man, that's just, I don't know who else does that or did that. It made it compelling. And just Chet Baker was overall a very compelling guy with a very criminal past, super criminal. Check that episode out. One of my faves. Thanks for the text 416. Appreciate you.

425 writes in, Hey, Jake, Jules, from Seatown. One of my secret wishes every Thanksgiving is to take a time machine back to 1976 to see the last Walt Live. Greatest concert of the 20th century. Thanks for the story. Love the show.

You got it, Jules. Thanks for hitting us up. And thanks to everybody who's chimed in on the voicemail, on the text, on the DMs, on the emails. Appreciate you guys. wishing you and all of yours. Great holiday season. Jasmine Hughes writes in, emails us. Subject, new forensic evidence could rewrite the story of Kirk Cobain's death. Hi, Jake,

and Disgrace, and I'm reaching out because I believe I've uncovered something that fits squarely in Disgracelands Wheelhouse, music history, mystery, and real investigative gravity. A recently published, peer-reviewed, multi-disciplinary forensic report has emerged that calls into question the accepted narratives surrounding the death of Kirk Cobain. The report was prepared by forensic specialist Brian Burnett and Dr. Gabrielle Ritter and includes ballistic forensic reconstruction and investigative findings that were unavailable in 1994. This is an hearsay or unfounded rumor. It's a scientifically grounded, methodically sound, and peer-reviewed evidence that raises serious concerns about inconsistencies and evidentiary oversights in the original investigation,

given disgrace and's legacy of digging into the darker or more complex truths behind the music world. Dot, dot, dot, her music, her email cuts off there. This is interesting. I can't verify the veracity of this 54-page document that the listener sent me here in the email, so-called peer-reviewed forensic ballistic reconstruction. in Kirk Cobain's death. But I will look into it. It is interesting. Man, the people who don't believe Kirk Cobain oft himself are legion, you guys will not give up. And you know, maybe there's something there. I don't know. What do I know? You know, as far as everything I've looked at, I believe the man

was seriously, seriously doomed and that he took his own life. That's just based on all the research I've done, and I know many of you disagree with me. But I'm going to look into this doc, and I appreciate you sending it. So thanks. Mike Black emails us, Jericho by the band. Excellent recommendation. You got great taste, dude. Have a good one.

Regards Mike. Mike, appreciate you. Yeah, that was one of the recommendations from last week. You guys want to email me? Hit me up. Disgracellimpot at gmail.com. Hit me on the cell, 617-9066638 voicemail or text. talk about recommendations. This week, I'm obviously recommending for a documentary, The Age of Disclosure,

New Doc that's out. You can find that on Amazon if you can't find it in your local theaters. I'm also recommending the album, Christmas album, called Christmas Card by The Temptations, which is just fantastic. Check that out. You're going to love it if you don't love it already. And for my book recommendation for the week, I just finished The Violent Bared Away by Flannery O'Connor. and not an easy read, but not a long read. And in a lot of ways, an incredible read, especially for someone who likes to read about faith and reason themes that, you know, humanity struggles with constantly and has since the beginning of time.

Flannery O'Connor has an amazing way of contextualizing it all in 20th century of American culture. And the violent Barrett Away is a great example of that. out if you are at all interested in those things. And you can always hit me up with your recommendations as well. You know how to get in touch. Speaking recommendations, send me some recommendations on Christmas movies, your favorite Christmas movies and New Year's movies, holiday movies, you know, Christmas New Year. Zeth and I are going to be, we're planning something special in the Hollywoodland feed. And we'd like you guys to get involved. So hit us up. All right. Favorite Christmas movies, favorite New Year's movies.

And you'll know why in a couple days. I'll be back in a flash with my conversation with Brooks Slater from Psychopedia on Slayer. And Ed Gein, you're not going to want to miss this crank up dead skin mask. Here we go. There's two golden rules that any man should live by. Rule one, never mess with a country girl. You play stupid games, you get stupid prizes. And rule two, never mess with her friends either.

We always say that trust your girlfriend. I'm Anna Sinfield, and in this new season of The Girlfriends, Oh my God, this is the same man. A group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist. I felt like I got hit by a truck. I thought, how could this happen to me? The cops didn't seem to care, so they take matters into their own hands. I said, oh, hell no.

I vowed I will be his last target. He's going to get what he deserves. Listen to the Girlfriends. Trust me, babe. on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This season on Dear Chelsea, with me, Chelsea Handler, we have some fantastic guests like Amelia Clark. When, like, young people come up to me and they want to be an actor or whatever,

my first thing is always, can you think of anything else that you can do? Rather be disappointed in. Do that. Dennis Leary. I wake up, and I'm hitting him in the head with a water bomb. And Bruce Jenner is on the aisle in a karate stance, like he's about to attack me, like, making karate noises. And his entire the Kardashian family over there, everybody's going,

and the air marshal is trying to grab my arms and screaming. And I immediately know that I've been asleep walking. David O'Yellowo. I love this podcast, whether it's therapy or relationships or religion or sex or addiction or you just go straight for the guts. Guy Branham. So anyway, Nicole Kidman broke up with Keith Thurban. Being half of a country couple was always a hat she was going to wear, not like a life she was going to lead.

Oh, interesting. I like that. Did you practice that on your way over? Gaten Matarazzo from Stranger Things. Tena Monsu. Camilla Morone, Carrie Kenny Silver, and more. Listen to these episodes of Dear Chelsea on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcast, or wherever you get your podcasts. Remember when you'd walk into your local video rental place and there were always those two employees behind the counter arguing about movies?

Well, that's us. I'm Millie de Cherico. And I'm Casey O'Brien. And now we're arguing about movies on our podcast, Dear Movies I Love You, from the Exactly Right Network. Can I say something about the criterion closet? Go ahead, dude. They're letting too many people in there. Okay, that's another film grape I got two.

Sadly, that rental place doesn't exist anymore. It's probably a store that sells running shoes. Or an ice cream shop with an extra pee and an E at the end. So consider us your slacker movie clerks in podcast form. I would like to establish a timeline of the moment you figured out who Channing Tatum was. Every Tuesday, we dig into the movies we can't stop obsessing over, from hidden gems to big screen favorites. New episodes drop every week on the exactly right network. Listen to Dear Movies I Love You on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcast.

All right, guys, welcome back. I was talking earlier about my wife and I, you know, are we going to watch this Ed Gein thing or not? And we watched some of it, a little bit, a little taste, and I was repulsed. I'm not going to lie, this story. Now, I can handle a lot of stuff. I could not handle this story. And it all stems back, all goes back for me, all goes back to a song I heard when I was 16 years old by a band I spent a lot of time with as a kid, not personally, just in my headphones and in my speakers, a band called Slayer. I get into this story, the Ed Gein story, and trace it back to my history with Slayer with, I guess you could call her an Ed Gein expert.

She's absolutely a true crime expert. This is Brooke Slater from Psychopedia in our conversation. All right. I wanted to talk to my next guest here, Brooke Slater, from the podcast Psychopedia for some time. about different true crimes represented throughout music history. Now, Brooke, you are a true crime expert. You are an actual criminal investigator, and you've covered Ed Gein in depth.

Now, Ed Gein is the subject of this newish Netflix series monster that's been quite a topic of debate around the house here. I've wanted to watch it. My wife wants no part of it. I watched some of it. I was disgusted pretty quickly, even though I knew the story. Normal reaction.

Usually it's opposite. Usually it's the wife who really, really wants to get into the true crime, and it's the husband who's like, I'm good. Yeah, yeah. You would know, you've covered this story on the heels of the Netflix series in-depth, in Psychopedia. You've done, I believe, two episodes on the subject. Yeah, it was a two-parter.

Two-parter, because, I mean, honestly, this could have been a 22-parter. The story is so massive, and it is so intense. and it is just, it is a definition of insanity, I think. My interest, though, in Ed Gein doesn't originate from the Netflix series, but rather from a song by a band called Slayer, a band that I loved as a kid. And they had a song back in the day called Dead Skin Mask, and that's how I first heard of this Ed Gein story.

I was probably, I think I was 16 years old when that song came out. And since I started Disgraceland, which, you know, I wasn't a huge true crime podcast fan before I started the show. I certainly was, but I wasn't like one of these, like my wife, huge true crime podcasts. I was interested in. And then I realized, God, I've been interested in true crime my whole life. So I've sort of, but without knowing it, so in the process of the podcast, I've sort of looked back at my formative years and my child and been like, what got me into true crime? And I realized that this Slayer song and this specifically this story about at Gein, which was very pre-podcast, mythical story of horror story, right?

Like, this is something we passed around the hallways at school, the bus stop, et cetera. It was just like you couldn't believe it. It was true. Some people believed it. Some people didn't. So anyways, this is what one of the things that got me first interested in true crime. I want to know what first got in you interested in true crime. Oh, my goodness.

Well, it started way, way, way back. I mean, I can't remember a time when I wasn't into true crime, honestly. My grandmother used to read me true crime stories and fiction horror and detective stories before bed. Like that was my bedtime story. Everybody else is getting. Go grandma. Yeah, their mother goose stuff and I'm getting, you know, Ed Gein, for example. But I, and I have a twin sister.

So she and I would be tucked in together and she would be hiding under the blankets with a pillow over her head, like, Grandma, please stop. and I would be foaming at the mouth, like, please Grandma Moore. So I've always been into true crime. I went to school for criminal justice and criminology. I sort of always knew I wanted to wind up doing something in the field. And there's so much to do, right? Like, you kind of just spoke about it a little bit in terms of, again, there's so many layers. There's the psychology.

There's, you know, the criminology, obviously. There's the gruesomeness of it, which is actually not what I'm all about. I'm all about highlighting the victims to the extent that I can and understanding the mind behind the perpetrator. You know, sort of one of the big premises of psychopedia or what I try to convey in every episode is I try and steer people away from referring to perpetrators as monsters because they feel like when you do that, you're categorizing them into this like other area. And they're not. They're human beings. And you need to understand them so that we can crack the code and prevent it from health. happening again. So we can understand that everybody comes with the history and circumstances. And if we can

dive into that and understand it, then maybe we could prevent future crimes from happening. So this is always where I've lived. This has always been my headspace. I've always been, you know, a creepy kind of girl. There's never been a point when I haven't loved true crime, and now I get to do it for a living. Right, right. I wonder how many Ed Gein's we've prevented from happening. So this story, talk about creepy. I mean, you're joking about yourself being a creepy kind of girl. This is the creepiest. I know you just said you don't want us to call these people monsters. That's literally the name of the series about this guy. It is. And I don't want to go against what you just said. That's okay. Go against. I don't know how to categorize this guy. This is,

this is next level. And it's interesting because the song, the Slayer song, this is, you know, the music is, the music history of it all is my side of the fence. And the song, when you read the lyrics, They're not that creepy. They're a little bit more figurative than they are literal, suggestive. When you hear the song, however, and you hear the lyrics song with the music, it's creepy as all hell. It just goes right up my spine. And I think it just reminds me of that. There's something like you said, you know, when you're talking about your grandmother and you and your sister being under the covers and hearing these stories.

I think there's things are more fearful in adulthood when we can root them. to our formative years in some ways. Yes. And that's what this song does for me. So I thought it might be interesting. Because you're a true crime expert, you're certainly way more knowledgeable at Gien than I am. I thought it might be interesting if we tell the story of Ed Gein through the Slayer lyrics here. I love it.

I just kind of want to do some association here. And I hate to put you on the spot. But I want to read you the lyrics essentially. passages from the lyrics and have you relate them to the Ed Gein's story. And we'll sort of piece together the narrative here as we go. Let's do it. I love it. I listened to the song driving over here, but I was busy, like, jamming to it.

And I wasn't really so heavy into the lyrics. So this will be fun to dive into it. Okay, great. I'm going to start at the top here. So here we go. Now, I just want to give people a tiny bit of context to make this perhaps a little bit creepier for those who don't know anything about Ed Gein. This is 1950s, Wisconsin. Is that right?

That's correct. It's this guy who lives with his mother and his sister. Brother. Brother, excuse me. The dad is gone, right? The dad's out of the house. He was there for a little while. He initially was Ed, his brother, and his two parents.

And they were just one fucked up little family living in isolated rural Wisconsin. Right. Totally, totally off the grid. Not in a sense that, you know, they didn't mingle with society. But they were on the fringes, for sure. And his mother is really the one who wore – not I don't want to say wore the pants. That's, first of all, horrible. I hate that expression.

But she basically had everybody in a psychological chokehold. So when his father ultimately died, it sort of didn't even shift the dynamic in the household because his mother was always the one in charge, always the one calling the shots. So nothing really changed when he died. everything, however, changed when she died. Right, right. Okay, so we're 1950s, we're rural America, Wisconsin, rural society for this family anyways, domineering mother.

And just so those of you, you're movie fans out there, Ed Gein was the loose inspiration for Norman Bates in Alfred Hitchcock's Psycho, also loose inspiration for the Texas Chainsaw Massacre story. not a literal adaptation, but that's what we're dealing with. That's at the core here. So let's get into the Slayer lyrics here. Yeah, there's actually a third movie loosely based on him as well, or a character, I should say, and that's Buffalo Bill in Silence of the Lambs. So he's had, you know, I was going to mention this earlier, even if you think you don't know who Ed Gein is, chances are you do because you've seen one of those movies.

Right, right. And if you're a true crime fan, you absolutely know who Ed Gein is, but you might not know who, you know, who's, you know, who's, you know, who's Slayer is and what the Slayer song is. And here we go. It's absolutely based on Ed Gein. They've said it explicitly. Here are the lyrics, the beginning lyrics. So, Brooke, I want to know what part of the story you think this relates to. Lyrics go, how I've waited for you to come. I've been here all alone. Now that you've arrived, please stay a while. And I promise I won't keep you long. I'll keep you forever, forever, forever. And that he did or that he tried to do. So here's my take on it.

As we mentioned, he was, you know, in this psychological chokehold from his mother. He thought of his mother as the one woman he loved in his entire life. He really did not know how to exist when she died. So the lyric, honestly, it's a very literal translation, but how I've waited for you to come, I think, is how I've waited for you to come back. So she died in 1945. 18 months later is when he unearthed his first corpse. Okay, hold on, hold on. Explain.

We need details here, unearthing the first corpse. How I've waited for you to come, so says Slayer. So yeah, definitely have me pump the brakes. So Augusta, his mother, died, as I said in 1945, and he was lost. He was like a ship without an anchor. He really was. He did not know how to think for himself. He didn't know how to live in the world without her.

She had taught him everything he knew and did. didn't know because she kept him rather so isolated and shielded. When she died, he closed off her bedroom. He closed off the living room. He made like this macabre museum out of their shared home and he wouldn't touch anything that belonged to her. As time went on and I think the wall started to close in on him and he started to just psychologically unravel. He was needing his mother. He was he was needing her in a very literal sense. So he had the idea. to literally recreate her using the flesh of dead women who resembled her. So he would go through the obituaries and he would find freshly deceased women

who mimicked his mother, typically physically, but also a lot of times in personality as well. So he would unearth their corpses, dig them up, take them back to his home, and then go to town on literally picking them apart and making items that he could hold on to. to forever, which is, you know, I've been here all alone as the lyric, since she died for 18 months. He was there all alone. Now that you've arrived, meaning now that I've basically unearthed what symbolically represents you, please stay a while. I'm going to make you into a nipple belt.

I'm going to make you into a chair. I'm going to use women's skulls and eat my soup out of them in the kitchen. He kept nine vulvas in a box. underneath his bed, which, by the way, he painted silver and salted. I think probably to preserve. I don't think he was actually eating anything. Yeah, I know. This is a lot.

I don't even know what to say to that, except nine vulvas might have been the B-side to dead skin mask. Sorry, I'm not trying to joke, but I am. Okay, so he's, I don't even know where to go. I mean, this is in part, I don't know this story like you know it, clearly. and I had a real hard time with getting into the TV show. And, you know, I've seen stuff. I've seen the images of the nipple belt. I've seen these things that are just completely psychotic.

And it's really interesting to me because the Slayer song comes out in 1990. And Slayer was like, they weren't a band that was made. I mean, they were about as mainstream as a thrash metal band could get, but they weren't as mainstream as Metallica or even. anthrax, MTV headbanger's ball would play them, but they got no radio play, no mainstream video play, because their lyrics were considered to be extreme. And as we're going through this story, it's clear to me that the reality here is far more extreme than what they put in the song. And I can actually, I would bet, you know, whatever, whatever you want to bet,

that they made a choice. And they had to pull back on on being explicit. it in the lyrics for fear of just, you know, not getting any airplay and not, you know, who knows what, like how the censorship would have been applied because the reality here, everything, the details you just listed are completely fucked up. And it's, it's a little bit strange to me that here we are in 2025 and it's mainstreamed in not only a podcast like yours or mine, but in or other true crime podcast, but on a Netflix series. And it's huge. And this is the stuff we're talking about. I'm going to go. to the next lyric here. Graze the skin with my fingertips, the brush of dead, cold flesh,

appease the means, provoking images, delicate features so smooth, a pleasant, I can't even get it out, a pleasant fragrance in the light of the moon. What is Mr. Ed Gein up to in this verse? Well, Slayer, I think, took some creative liberties, which is absolutely their right to do. So no judgment on that. Well, yes, so he definitely obviously would finesse the skin. He made masks out of real human faces. He used special oils and he peeled off the faces. He preserved it. And he made actual masks. He also made what was referred to as a mammary vest, which was he essentially skinned the torso of a deceased woman, breasts still intact, and then he would wear the skin suit. So yes, he would graze the skin with his fingertips and he would do a lot fucking more than that.

The brush of dead, cold flesh appease the means, pretty self-explanatory. Here's where he took, I believe Slayer took two creative liberties. Provoking images, delicate features so smooth. His mother was a very severe-looking woman. She was of German descent. And the women that he dug up and actually killed, he did kill two women, were very sort of big-bones, severe-looking women. There was sort of, I wouldn't use the word delicate to describe their features. Okay.

And their features at this way would not have been smooth because they were decomposed. Okay, that's fine, Slayer. The next line, a pleasant fragrance in the light of the moon. So here's a big sticking point. Ed Gein did not enjoy the scent of decomposing flesh. In fact, the reason he provides for countering anybody who claims that he was a cannibal or a necrophiliac is that he could not stand the stench of flesh. So he didn't eat it and he didn't have sex with it.

A lot of sources will say he's a necrophiliac. There's actually different types of necrophiles. There are those who do get off on decomposing flesh, so they will have sex with dead bodies. And then there's necrophiles who just get off on the fact that the body is dead. And they have ultimate control to do with that body, whatever they want. Ay, aye, aye. So a pleasant fragrance, not according to Ed Gein.

I get that completely. It's interesting, though. The smell of death is a real, is obviously a real thing. We covered it in our Norwegian black metal episode where there was the singer in this Norwegian band who just became, I mean, his name was dead. Mayhem.

Yeah, exactly. I did an episode on them. So I actually, yeah. And so you know that he was actually obsessed with the smell of death. And he would carry around dead birds so he could huff on them. And it's so, it's, I can't.

even, I can't, I can't, I literally can't understand it. I can't, if you've ever smelled anything dead like you got an animal, I've had, we lived in an old New England house and we would get animals trapped in the walls and it's just, it's absolutely disgusting. I, I can't understand how somebody's brain makes this switch and that becomes something that they're into. And apparently, I was a bridge too far for Ed Gein. Apparently so. Exactly. Yeah, I mean, I think, I think that's just that you just touched on a really important point. You know what I mean? It's just the psychology. It's the, you know, perpetrators on this level or, you know, in the case of dead, for example, they're so complex, you know, and again, if you label them monsters and you kind of put them in their own category and you say like, well, you know, they're just not like us. And so it is what it is. You're never going to learn about them and you're never going to figure out what makes them the way they are. And if you can't figure that out, you can't protect the future, basically. not to get too heavy with this. He is a human being.

He came from somewhere, Ed Gein. He came from a really difficult background, psychologically speaking, and it took its toll. And it manifested in a very fucked up way. Yeah, absolutely, absolutely. Okay, let's take you here to the next set of lyrics. Dance with the dead, speaking to dead, dance with the dead in my dreams, listen to their hallowed screams, the dead have taken my soul. I know where this is going.

Temptations lost all control. Okay. Dance with the dead in my dreams. Ed Gein did struggle with hallucinations. Really? Yeah, he felt that he could hear his mother's voice after she died. He felt that he could see faces in the leaves, for example. And he felt that he could always smell rot.

What's interesting is he had that sort of olfactory hallucination. before he was unearthing corpses. Initially, when I was researching this, I felt like, well, you're smelling rot because you're digging up dead bodies. But this actually happened before that. But yeah, he was having auditory hallucinations. He was having visual hallucinations. And I think ultimately it was all of that that ended up pushing him over the edge in such a way

that made him end up taking two lives and then unearthing all of these corpses. Listen to their hallowed screams. He didn't kill the women. He did sadly kill two women. Mary Hogan and Bernice Warden, but he killed them very quickly. Neither one of them knew what was happening. He shot them both in the head, unfortunately. So there were no screams. So listen to their hallowed screams, I think is just a creative liberty. The dead have taken my soul. I think is symbolic of his mother taking his soul when she died and taking everything that she created that he did not

know how to run with. When she died, the wheels came off. So I think that is, that, that's, That lyric has to do with that. And then Temptations lost all control is like, fuck it. I'm just going to go all in at this point. And I'm going to wear female breasts and genitals, which he did. Simple smiles, lewd, psychotic eyes, lose all mind control, rationale declines. Empty eyes enslave the creations of placid faces and lifeless pageants. So the psychotic eyes part is what's interesting.

interesting to me. Interestingly, not every expert is on the same page as to whether or not Ed Gein was psychotic. Really? Yeah. So and keep in mind. What's the alternative if he's not psychotic? A personality disorder. So when in a legal sense, they're very different things. You sort of have to understand whether or not a perpetrator has psychosis or they're dealing with mental health issues and what kind of mental health issues because it helps you to determine the sentencing for that perpetrator. So a finding of psychosis means that the individual lacked the capacity to understand right from wrong when they were committing the crime in question. Okay.

So when it comes to sentencing, you're not going to lock that person up in a prison. You're going to send that individual to, you know, a psychiatric institution for treatment. They may not ever see mainstream society again. That's not what I'm saying. They're not given a pass. but they are not given prison. So at the time, Ed Gain was deemed psychotic, and he was sent to live out the rest of his days

in a psychiatric institution. But there are experts today who feel that since our understanding of mental health has shifted so much since the 1950s, that it's not really 100%, you know, the case that he would be looked at as legally insane today. So the question is, did he know what he was doing? doing was wrong and he did it anyway? Right. Or did he not even realize that what he was doing was wrong? And that is the crux of the criminal justice system, really. Right, right. What do you think?

Great question. I kind of, when you're looking at whether or not somebody knew what they were doing was wrong and that they did it anyway, you want to look at things like premeditation. Now, people think that premeditation means that you're sitting and you're plotting and you have every single detail calculated. that's not necessarily what premeditation is. So premeditation is also, were there steps taken to cover up the crime? Was there any thought put into committing the crime where you're covering your tracks, where there's this sort of mental awareness that what you're doing is wrong enough that you could get in trouble? And if you see those elements in a crime, then that can constitute as premeditation.

Right. You saw that with Ed Gein. He only dug up the bodies under the pale moonlight, right? So he waited until it was pitch black and the world was asleep. To me, that suggests premeditation. When he was ultimately put in the back of a squad car, when he was ultimately picked up, the first thing out of his mouth was, I was framed, which was very silly. If you listen to the coverage of it, I'm like, you don't fuck.

You don't even know why you're in the back of that police car. You're already confessing to something. But basically, he had the way. wherewithal to know, oh shit, I'm getting caught for something that I've done here. I'm going to say I was framed. So those two things kind of put up a red flag that there was premeditation. However, all of that said, I think that he was suffering from psychosis. Really? Wow. Fascinating. Absolutely fascinating. All right, let's keep going here. In the depths of a mind, insane, fantasy and reality are the same, right?

Mm-hmm. I mean, that goes to what you were just saying. Exactly, exactly right. Like, if you can't tell that what you're doing is wrong, if you just, you've lost all sense of, you know, exactly what's right and wrong, what's reality, what's fantasy, then, you know, in their lyrics, is your mind insane, which obviously the definition of insanity, you know, in a legal sense is different from the definition of, you know, somebody who's insanity in the mental health sense.

But in the end, Ed Gein was not, you know, was deemed criminally insane. So that was at the time what he was considered. This last lyric, incised members, I'm skipping the chorus again, incised members, ornaments on my being, adulating the skin before me. Yeah, can you guess, can you guess what that means, Jake? And you give us your best shot. I can't. I mean, that's the thing that turns me off with the series is the dancing around,

the wearing of the dead body parts, you know, the ornaments on my being, quote unquote. I just, it's hard to imagine, never mind to watch the visual, the dramatization of it. Yeah. And I know my listeners are probably going to be like, what are you fucking talking about? You've depicted the gory as shit possible. I don't know. There's just, there's something about this story that. that just strikes me. It's like the Dahmer story is very similar. It skews me out in a way that

most stories don't for some reason. I mean, I've done cannibalism. I mean, I've covered cannibalism in the past. Numerous times, big lurch. We talked about mayhem. But I don't know, man. There's just something about, I guess, the wearing of flesh that is just, it gets you. I mean, listen, good for you, man. I don't have that. I wish I did. I have lost all ability to... There's no more line for you? There's no more line. I have not lost my empathy at all for the victim.

So, you know, in that sense, I'm still 100% feeling constantly, which is my cross-to-bear being a true crime podcaster. But, no, I can't get past my fascination with this stuff, I think, enough to, like, feel the gruesomeness of it, if that makes sense. It's all so symbolic to me that I'm almost. looking past the act itself. Yeah, you're looking for the reason behind the act. Always. So you can objectify the act and the horror of it is a separate thing. And you do it masterfully. Your show is incredible. Thank you. I'm glad we got to meet. I'm a fan. I love that

we've been able to talk a little bit about this. And you've been super curious about the music side of it, which is awesome. I know my listeners are going to love your show. Everybody, tell everybody, tell the discos where psychopedia is available, when the episode's hit, and where else they could find you. Yes. And thank you, Jake, by the way. Also, huge fan of yours. I have been for a long time. I've been wanting this to happen for so, so long. So thank you. Thank you for this moment. Of course. Psychopedia drops every single Wednesday. It's available wherever you get your podcasts. Also, on Instagram and TikTok, I actually, you would just follow at Investigator Slater versus Psychopedia. That's kind of where I post everything relating to what I do. And yeah, I have patreon.com slash psychopedia pod as well for extra true crime content, behind-the-scenes stuff, opportunity to guest co-hosts with me over there. But, yeah, otherwise the main feed, I would love to have you on the main feed, everybody. And that's anywhere you listen to podcasts.

Nice. And you just did the two episodes on Ed Gein. What else do you have coming up? What's coming up next? The next one I have coming up is, oh, it's another, it's another doozy. Yeah, it's about a, this is wild. a teenage boy who murdered his parents and then hid their remains in his bedroom

and threw a massive house party. So I'm going to go to town on the psychology there because that's fucking wild. That reminds me of the disgrace line episode we did on Club Kid from New York, Michael Allig, who ended up very similarly, he killed his friend who was his drug dealer, chopped him up into little pieces,

put him in a box, started partying. And then multiple parties with this, his, the friend is like rotting in a box in this, like, luxury high-rise apartment in New York City. There's like flies. Everyone's like, what's in the box, dude? He's like, oh, nothing. And he actually jokes, he's like, oh, that's Angel.

That's where Angel is. Where's this guy going to get his drugs now? You don't bite the hand that feeds you. Come on. Exactly. That dude called me. That dude called me when he got out of prison. That was fucked up.

No shit. Yeah, that was, I had, I actually released it. It was nuts. All right. I'm going off topic here. I love it. This is great. Thank you so much, Brooke.

Appreciate you. I hope all the disgrace land listeners get to listen to Cycopedia. And I don't know, when we get into more true crime and music overlap, be awesome to have you back. Love to. Anytime. Thank you so much, Jake. All right, guys. Hope you dug that interview with myself and Brooke, sort of tracing back my, it would be an overuse of the word trauma.

But sort of, you know, my, my Ed Gein kind of heibi-jeebies back, back to sell. all goes back to Slayer. Doesn't everything go back to heavy metal? I don't know. It kind of does for me. Anyhow, check out Brooke. She's obviously very informed, intelligent, way up on true crime. If you're a true crime head, like I know most of you are, check out her show, Psychopedia. It's fantastic. You're going to dig it. 617-90666-6-6-3-8 voicemail text. Hit me up with your Christmas and New Year's movie recommendations because Zeth and I planning something special and we want to involve you guys all right hit us up we talked earlier about john lennon and his UFO sighting and the veracity of that citing whether or not john lennon was

was pulling the wool over all of our eyes i know it's hard to believe but we're going to get into this and we're going to try and lay and we're going to try and lend some credibility to john's claims in this exclusive section that's coming up to hear this episode you're going to be an all access member disgrace sand really easy to sign up just five bucks a month that is going up. That price is going up next week. Next week, people. So if you don't want to be paying $5.99, if you only want to be paying $5 and you want to get in on some hot discount action that we're going to be offering, get over to disgraceampod.com and sign up to become an all-access member. You're not only going to be able to hear exclusive content like the conversation I'm about to

to have with Zeth. You're also going to get ad-free listening. You're going to get many episodes every week that go deeper into our stories. And you're going to get access if you sign up through Patreon to Zeth and I in the Patreon chat. and the discussion we're having with all the other discos. Your support is very much appreciated. Super grateful for you guys. Your support helps us create all this content. Couldn't do it without you. Discraselampod.com to sign up. All right, guys, thanks for riding with me on another bonus episode of disgrace land. This week we talked about Chip Baker, David Bowie, Jimmy Hendricks, Sammy Hagar from Van Halen. We have episodes on all these guys. And Matt is going to leave a trail of breadcrumbs

for you to find these episodes in the show notes. so that you have no problem sifting through our 255 plus stories. And don't sleep on that chat peaker episode. It's incredible if I do say so myself. Great story. All right. Let's recap, shall we? Number one, this week's new episode on Merle Haggard, our part two story on Merle Haggard is available for you right now. Number two, new mini episode for all access members on Merle and his UFO citing and infatuation. Number three, rewind episode on Blink 182 in Tom DeLong. We get in more fully to the UAP thing there as well. That's kind of. coming up for you right after this.

Next week comes our new story on Phil Specter in his insanity that may have started way back before the incredible Christmas album that he made. Number five, Zets going to give you those Hollywood land and crime vibes in Hollywoodland. So make sure you are subscribed. Get us your favorite holiday movies, Christmas and New Year's as well. 6179-0663638. Your voice keeps us digging into the dark corners of music history. So keep calling texting with your answers to this week's question in the week

or with whatever else you want to talk about. Don't forget, this goes, this isn't. just content. It's a community, a community of the obsessed. No one cares about music, books, records, and the crime and grime. It ties them all together like you do. And well, that's a disgrace. All right. Way back in November in 1973, Merle Haggard took a break from his houseboat and from watching UFOs and released his excellent Christmas album, Merle Haggard's Christmas present. Here's what America was listening to on that day, according to the Billboard charts. Number one. Keep on trucking. Part one. Eddie Kendricks.

Last week, three, weeks on chart, 12, peak position one. Number two, midnight train to Georgia, Gladys Knight and the Pips. Last week, two, weeks on char, nine, peak position two. Number three, Angie, the rolling stones. Last week, one, perils. Weeks on chart, eight, peak position, one. Number four, half-six, spring on, last week, five, five. Four, weeks on charm.

In the cheek position. Two. Number five. Rambling man. The almond brothers man. In the last week on a day. Talking and start mixing. When a group of women discover they've all dated the same prolific con artist,

they take matters into their own hands. I vowed I will be his last target. He is not going to get away with this. He's going to get what he deserves. We always say. Trust your girlfriends. Listen to the girlfriends. Trust me, babe.

On the Iheart radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This season on Dear Chelsea, with me, Chelsea Handler, we have some fantastic guests, like Amelia Clark. When, like, young people come up to me and they want to be an actor or whatever.

My first thing is always, can you think of anything else that you can do? You'd rather be disappointed in. Do that. David O'Yello. I love this podcast, whether it's therapy or relationships or religion or sex or addiction or you just go straight for the guts. Dennis Leary, Gaten Moderato from Stranger Things, Tena Monsu, Camilla Morone, Carrie Kenny Silver, and more.

Listen to these episodes of Dear Chelsea on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Sometimes a suspect is found guilty before a verdict is ever read in court. On the Wicked Words podcast, I talk with the writers who dig deep into the cases that changed history, including Marsha Clark, who went from prosecuting one of the most famous murder cases to writing crime fiction. It doesn't matter that you didn't take part in the murder. If you were at the scene at all, you're guilty of murder. Every week, the real story is revealed. Join us every Monday for new episodes of Wicked Words.

Listen to Wicked Words on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.