DISGRACELAND - Bonus Episode: Creative Swings, Just a Gigolo, and the Funniest Moment of L.L.'s Life

Episode Date: April 11, 2024

This week in the After Party, Jake talks great films, this week's new DISGRACELAND episode on Kobe Bryant, and of course your emails, texts, DMS, and voicemails. What are your top five Tarantino films? Who are your top five NBA players? Who's your favorite athlete who's a musician on the side? Get in touch at 617-906-6638, [e-mail], or on socials @disgracelandpod, and come join the After Party.To hear an extended version of the After Party with insight into Bryant's rapping days, other musical athletes, and more from the DISGRACELAND community, become a Disgraceland All Access member at disgracelandpod.com/membership. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoicesSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is exactly right. Double Elvis. Hey, Discos, you can listen to an extended version of this after-party episode by becoming a member of Disgraceland All Access. Just go to disgracelandpod.com slash membership for more details and to sign up. Hey, guys, welcome to Disgraceland, which is brought to you by Double Elvis. This week, we have a brand new episode on Kobe Bryant in the Disgraceland feed. And for our all-access members and our Patreon and Apple subscription feeds,

We've got episodes on Lane Staley of Allison Chains and Hunter S. Thompson, the great Gonzo journalist. We've got more exclusive episodes coming real soon, so be sure to get all signed up for our all-access content either on Apple Podcasts or on Patreon so that you can hear those. All right, let's get into this bonus episode. Hey, Discos, need a little more disgrace land in your life? Just a touch to get you through? Yeah, me too. This is the podcast that comes after the podcast. Welcome to Disgraceland, the After Party.

Welcome to the Disgraceland bonus episode, a little thing we like to call the after party. This is the show after the show, the party after the party, the bridge to get you from one full episode of disgrace land to the other, the backyard to dig into the dirt. On this episode, we are talking about Quentin Tarantino, our brand new episode on Kobe Bryant, the sources that we used for this episode, which helped us tell Kobe's story in a unique and really exciting way. And of course, your voicemails, text, DMs, and more. And as always, a whole lot of rosy. All right, discos, let's get into it. Pulp Fiction is the best Quentin Tarantino film. It might be the greatest film of all time.

And I know I'm contradicting myself, but this week with the release of our Kobe Bryant episode where we used Tarantino's Kill Bill as the template to tell Kobe's story, obviously because Kobe took his alter ego name Black Mamba from Kill Bill, understandably, I have Tarantino on the brain. Now, I have made ludicrous authoritative statements like these before, particularly about films,

stating unequivocally that The Godfather was the greatest film of all time. But I think I am ready to amend that and to piss off a lot of film purists in the process. I've also said, by the way, that the Godfather might just be the first great film ever. That really upset people. I think it's true. And if it's not, what I definitely know to be true is that it is at least certainly the first great modern film. but this is a digression, okay? Back to Tarantino and Paul Fiction.

When Paul Fiction came out, you know this if you were around. It was a revelation. It broke the mold. It completely captured pop culture at the moment. It inspired an entire movement of indie filmmakers. It also inspired a bunch of bad copycats. It changed not only how we view movies, but how we talk about movies

and what we expect for movies to say nothing of how unique every aspect of that movie was while it was clearly paying homage to films that Quentin Love from the past. all this, and it is wildly entertaining. This is why it's Quentin Tarantino's greatest film, and also why it may be the greatest film of all time. And I'm being serious.

I'm being dead serious. I'm not just saying this to have a hot take on Kobe Bryant Week. Of course, the Kobe Bryant Kill Bill thing that we did got me thinking about this. But if I'm assessing all the movies I've seen in my life, and I don't pretend to be a cinephile or understand film like some of my friends do, or just, you know, other people out there in the world.

But, you know, I have pretty okay taste, and I watch a lot of fucking movies. So just as a consumer, you know, I'm sitting here going, what's the greatest film of all time? And I'm not trying to be pretentious about it. And when I think about what Pulp Fiction meant at the moment, what it means now, it's hard to think of another movie. Like I said, maybe The Godfather. Now, that said, it might be the greatest movie of all time. It might be the greatest Quentin Tarantino movie of all time. But is it my favorite?

favorite Quentin Tarantino movie of all time? That's a different question. I don't really know. It had this amazing impact when it was released, and it still has to this day. So it's hard to argue with. It really, truly is. But let's argue, shall we? Let's rank these Tarantino films.

Or at least let's rank the top five Tarantino films. And in honor of Kobe, we will later rank the top five NBA players of all time as well. So number one, Pulp Fiction. Number two, I go once upon a time in Hollywood. Tarantino's most recent masterpiece, where he's got all of his powers. They're at their height. They're on full display. Plus, no filmmaker has ever been, I don't think, better suited for the world the time and place to set a story in than Quentin Tarantino in late 1960s Hollywood.

The movie is perfect. I mean, maybe Scorsese with taxi driver in the 70s or perhaps Goodfellas in the 70s and 80s. Actually, yeah, I can definitely make the Goodfellas argument. but still, Tarantino, this is a love letter to where he came from, which is Hollywood. And it is gorgeous and just like Pulp Fiction, wildly entertaining. Number three, okay, so number one, Pulpiction, number two, once upon a time in Hollywood. Number three, super unpopular choice here from me, but I go Jackie Brown. I love it.

I'm, I'm in the minority. I understand. I understand. It's not a big swing from Tarantino. He wasn't swinging for the fences with this one. It's a little genre film, but it's a solid double, and it's a double that cleared the bases. And Michael Keaton, Michael Keaton, Michael Keaton, Michael Keaton, Michael Keaton's charisma and attitude with Tarantino's words in his mouth is something that I can never get sick of. Also, for God's sakes, Pam Greer, come on, what are we talking about?

Number three, obviously Jackie Brown, obviously. Number four, inglorious bastards. I'm still trying to figure out why I love this movie so much. I didn't love it when it came out. I mean, I liked it, sure, I liked it a lot. But I didn't leave the theater feeling like I did after I left the theater watching Pulp Fiction or after I left the theater watching Once Upon a Time in Hollywood or even watching Jackie Brown. I didn't walk out going, oh my God, that was incredible.

I left a little confused, not confused, walloped, I think is the better way to put it. And it took me a while to catch up to this movie. And it's only been in the last couple of years that I've really been sucked into this film and I've really started to truly love it and it's still growing on me and you know you might ask me or I might just no one's asking me but I might just do this list again in another year and this might be higher for me on the top five list. It's some of Quentin Tarantino's best storytelling and Inglorious bastards it's almost like his best micro storytelling he does all these vignettes he's famous for it right and he's he busts the three-act mold with his movies

But this one in particular, these small scenes spread out over this huge canvas that is World War II. He just fucking nails it and makes me keep coming back to this movie. Teddy ball games, strudel, scalps, Michael Fastbender's finest moment on film, I think, and just an all-timer of an ending. I love this movie, and I have a feeling I'm going to grow to love it even more as I get older and as the film gets older. Okay, so let's recap. Again, number one, Pulp Fiction.

number two once upon a time at Hollywood number three Jackie Brown number four inglorious bastards number five you're sitting there saying when's he gonna mention kill bill

he's only going to one spot left man and he hasn't yet mentioned kill bill and what about Django quitting second Oscar win for his best screenplay what about Django there's only one slot left how can he leave off

Django or Kill Bill well I just can and I'm not only going to leave one off I'm going to leave both off because Reservoir Dogs come on the height of 90s

indie filmmaking and the announcement of the visionary excellence that Quentin Tarantino has. It propelled him. It propelled his world. It blew us all away. Amazing movie. Incredible movie. Even if you weren't there, this is a genre busting. I'm struggling to find words to describe how great this film is.

And five, five feels low. Five feels very, very, very low for reservoir dogs. but yeah I'm looking at this list now and I'm going jackie brown at three and reservoir dogs at five i don't know what the fuck I'm talking about i'm altering this in real time okay reservoir dogs is three jacky brown is five so number one to recap pulp fiction number two once upon a time in hollywood number three reservoir dogs number four inglorious bastards and number five jacky brown hard not to put death proof on this list from my standpoint and i know you're sitting there shaking You're going, fucking deathproof, but I rank, I think I rank deathproof even higher than Django,

definitely higher than Kill Bill. Kill Bill might be, despite our efforts, again, despite our efforts over the last few weeks with this Kobe Bryant episode and this homage, which I'm going to talk about later, to Kill Bill and to Tarantino. Kill Bill, I think, might be my least favorite Tarantino film, which isn't to say that I don't like it. I just don't love it. And I love, I love his movies. I even like, I think I like true romance. I know I like true romance better than Kill Bill.

I do, for sure. So, okay, so there's the list. There's the top five. There's the top five. I hope you're putting together your top five right now. And I hope I pissed you off with these. I didn't mean to piss you off. But these kind of arguments are my fucking life's blood, man.

This is what I miss about being young. It just seemed like I was in one of these arguments every night with my friends. And it just doesn't happen anymore. I don't want to argue with people online, but I didn't want to talk about this with you. So let me know who your top five Tarantino films are and what is the number one spot. And if it's not Pulp Fiction, you better damn will have a good reason for whatever is, number one. Because Pulp Fiction is tough to fuck with. Okay, let's move on.

In honor of Kobe, right? That's what we're talking about, are supposed to be anyhow. Top five NBA players, okay? Here's my list. In reverse order this time. Number five, Larry Bird. Number four, Bill Russell. Number three, Magic Johnson.

Number two, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar. And number one, there is no fucking argument. It is Michael Jordan. Just stop with anything else in the number one spot. You cannot make an argument for anyone else besides Michael Jordan. So there it is. Kobe Bryant, just like Kill Bill, does not make the top five. Okay?

Honestly, would you just honestly ask yourself, would you take Kobe Bryant in one game over any of these players? Jordan, Kareem, Magic, Bill Russell, Larry Bird. Okay, maybe. Maybe. I can understand an argument you would make. But I tell you what I can understand is LeBron over any of those top five. Just, I know you're freaking out. I know some of you, your hair's on fire right now.

But I cannot do it. And listen, I want you to know if you got the very subtle, actually it wasn't that subtle. If you got the LeBron dig that we made in the Kobe episode, I want you to write to me, however you want to do it on text 6179066638 on Instagram at disgrace land pot you want to leave me a voicemail let me know that you got it let me know if you agree with it or not okay because i think it is a really uh significant critique of lebron james and it's what separates him and knocks him lower on the list than these other players from a previous generation 61790666 638 hit me on voicemail hit me on text your top five tarantino films that's directed films okay so true romance

doesn't count natural born killers wouldn't count anyways but i'm just saying uh is kill bill on your top five and what are your top five NBA players and does kobe make the cut and did you find the lebron dig in the last cobi episode we did hit me up six one seven nine oh six six six three eight to let me know i'll be back in a flash all right so there are two separate research tracks that we followed for this episode in order to combine the real life of coby bryant with the fictional universe of quentin tarentino's kill bill okay so for us there's basically two ways we could have done this. There's the obvious way to tell Kobe's story. And I understand, some people are upset that we didn't do it that way, that we didn't, particularly that we

didn't lean into the sexual assault allegations with more intensity and with a bigger spotlight. But, you know, and I totally get that. I understand it. I completely understand it, actually. But, you know, we just saw an opportunity here to do something different and to take a wild creative swing. So that's what we did. And, you know, you get a, you you get enough of that sort of like straight, you know, this famous person, this celebrity, this artist, this musician did this horrific thing. And we're going to tell you why that happened. This was something totally different. And honestly, as creative people, we have to do this every once in a while. We got to step out of our lane and try new things and take risks just to keep

it fresh for us. So there was the obvious way to tell Kobe's story, which of course we didn't do. And then there was another way, the so-called Black Mamba way, the alter ego. Black Mamba that Kobe created in order to continue to dominate in the game while facing the challenges of his professional and personal career, this thing that he developed called the Black Mamba mentality. This is something that Kobe lifted directly from Quentin Tarantino's Kill Bill movies, volumes one and volumes two, of course. And we have these editorial meetings here when we're getting into a subject where we're starting the research where I discuss with the writers what are editorial point of view is going to be, things that I want to address, things that I want to avoid.

This stems from my view into the subject, my personal feelings on the subject. And with Kobe, it's a complicated issue because I fucking hated Kobe Bryant when he was playing. And, you know, I just did not like the guy professionally, of course, as a Celtics fan. And I certainly didn't like him personally. And then I saw that Showtime documentary. shortly after he passed away and I was sucked in and I started to hear his point of view on being competitive and this whole Black Mamba mentality and it completely changed how I thought about the guy.

Completely. And then of course when we get into this editorial meeting that I was just telling you about, you know, the Kill Bill connection, we were just like, all right, we got it. This is how we're going to tell this story. And then we tried tapping directly into that Kill Bill mindset and in a fun

It was a challenge for us. We structured, we tried to structure the episode in the same way that the Kill Bill movies are structured. Kobe as an assassin, he has to beat his rivals and former teammates, just as Uma Thurman had to do and kill Bill in order to realize her goal. So for the Kobe side and the research, we used the book called The Rise, Kobe Bryant, The Pursuit of Immortality, by Mike Sieski. Also a great book, if you're interested, written by Kobe himself called the Mamba Mentality, How I Play, which was published two years before Kobe's death. really gives an inside look into Kobe's strategy and how he, how he did what he did. In addition to books, there's some great documentaries that I alluded to before. Spike Lee, of course, made one called

Kobe doing work, great title. Produced by ESPN, you can easily find that. Fascinating documentary focuses on one game that Kobe played, the before, the during, and the after. There's another doc, this is the one I mentioned before from Showtime called Kobe Bryant's Muse. That one gives a bigger picture in terms of Kobe's life and career rather than focusing on just one moment like Spike's movie did. So you get two different things with these docs. And then if you want something awesome, hunt down this clip of Kobe being interviewed on ESPN in 2016, an interview in which he talks about his 60-point performance

in his final Lakers game and how he compared that directly to kill Bill. I wonder if Tarantino's ever talked about this because Kobe was wired into Tarantino in a way that, you know, was kind of news to all of us, okay? It makes so much sense, though. It really does. Which, of course, leads me to our other research track, which was watching the Quentin Tarantino movies, the Kill Bill movies again.

And, you know, I've talked about this before. I talked about it earlier in the previous block. Kill Bill, not one of my favorite Tarantino movies, but still, I mean, I have a lot of love for it. And it was amazing. Patrick Coleman, who wrote this particular episode, did a fucking awesome job, man. He killed it. Took the template from the movies and applied our Kobe story to that template, the fight with Phil Jackson, aka the Zen Master.

We based that on the Bride's Fight and Kill Bill with Renita Green. There's Shaq, aka the Big Beriznikov, burying Kobe alive in a box. And of course, that comes from the scene in Volume 2, where Bud Berries the bride alive in the scene where Kobe trains with his cousin Sharif. So a direct homage to the scene where the bride is training with Pimei. Just Patrick did an incredible job here. There's also all these other Kill Bill references and Easter eggs in this episode. Let us know if you can find them.

617-906-66-6638. That's how you call me. Leave me a voicemail. That's how you send me a text. Just like these folks here who cannot put down this argument of the greatest guitarist ever. And I'm going to play it out a little bit. Here we go. So, we see, our opinions about great guitarists.

I think it was an episode where you were talking about Eddie Van Halen or Eddie Van fucking Halen. Daryl fucking Abbott. this one from the 814, thank you. Yes, Darrell Abbott, Dimebag Daryl, great guitar player, better than Eddie Van Halen. I'm not sure you're saying that. And yeah, you're referencing the Eddie Van Halen episode that we just did. And obviously check that out if you haven't already.

But just so you know, there is a dime bag Darrell Pantera episode, and there's a lot of Van Halen in that as well. 724 with this voicemail. Hey, man, regarding the Bev cover that made it better than the original, probably not. the best, but one that you probably should listen to, if you haven't, is Dr. Doug's part at races, I think, House of Linky, architecture and House of Linky, something like that, wrote the original, kind of weird, but cool, but their version is awesome, so, and Hendricks all the way for Best Guitar. I mean, Eddie Van Halen, it's awesome, but I think Pioneer

and the electric guitar and the, you know, Hendricks scores and all that he did first, I think is in the edge up, but thanks, man, peace. Dr. Dog, I will check that out. That's one of those bands. You know, I've seen them live long, long time ago. Loved them. And this is one of those things. I never really got into it.

I should have. I remember very fond memories about that show. It was at the Middle East in Cambridge, I believe. Anyways, I will check that out. Thank you for the voicemail. Appreciate it. 617-90666-36-38 guys voicemail text. And I specifically want to hear about your favorite, your top five.

your top five, top five, okay, Tarantino Films. 828 writes in, happy Sunday, Jake, just finished the Lane Staley episode. I know the story in and out, but hearing your take really makes a person feel like they have a stake in the story. Bravo once again. My part, here is 16-year-old me in the clash of the Titans show when they took a crowd pick after Allison Shains finished their set. So fucking cool, seeing myself there. This show in Lakeland, Florida was recorded for Slayers. decade of aggression double album.

I can say I'm lucky enough to have seen Allison Chains in 91 and again in 2010. Peace, Lee. Lee, right on. And there's a picture from the, it looks like the inside of the CD cover from that Slayer record. Right on. Very cool. From 386.

On the subject of great cover songs, Jimmy Hendricks version of Bob Dylan all along the Watchtower makes you forget who wrote it so much so that Dylan plays Jimmy's version live. And then there's a text right after that that says, just heard you say exactly that. I did say that. And yeah, wonderful, wonderful cover, one of the best ever, all right? We are going to take a quick break and we'll be right back.

All right, we are back and I want to talk to you about a bunch of really cool things that we discovered while researching this new episode on Kobe Bryant, which did not wind up in the actual episode for different reasons. Primarily, this wild story about the hip-hop album that Kobe recorded back in 2000 but never released. Yes, Shaq was not the only Laker. pursuing a side hustle in music. But there's one caveat, of course, we're only talking about this over in the Disgraceland All Access Feed. Are you a member yet in Disgraceland All Access? You need to be. It's just five bucks a month, okay? Patreon, Apple Podcasts, wherever. You get ad-free listening,

you get extra bonus content in this here after party, and you get an extra full episode per month like the ones we've already produced on Hunter S. Thompson and Lane Staley. We got another one coming up soon on Chris Cornell and another one on Basqueat. All right, disgracelandpod.com slash membership to sign up. Again, just five bucks a month. You can sign up, like I said, via Apple podcast or Patreon. And the only difference being that if you sign up in Patreon, I'm in there with you, man. I'm in there in the chat.

It's like we're on a text thread. And I'm just, you know, it would not like it is. That is literally what it is. And we're talking all day long pretty much. We're talking movies. We're talking music. We're talking memories. We're talking whatever we're going to do this weekend.

It's awesome. And you're not there. And that sucks. So get in there. Okay, disgrace landpod.com slash membership, five bucks. Get all this extra content, including the bonus part of this here after party that you are about to miss out on right now if you do not sign up. All right, back in a flash. All right, let's recap, shall we?

Number one, there's more afterparty to listen to right now. All you got to do is go to disgracelandpod.com slash membership and sign up to become an all-access member. But if that ain't your bag, then number two, right now in your feed, a brand new episode on Kobe Bryant. Number three, coming tomorrow, a rewind episode on Marvin Gay, who we lost 40 years ago this month. Number four, over in the Badlands Feed, we've got an episode from the archive on Tim Allen. And number five, next week in the disgrace land feed, an episode on Heath Ledger. And number six, my number is 617-906666338. Call me on the telephone or text me number seven.

Remember, no one cares about the music you love more than you do. And well, that's a disgrace. And now, my moment of bliss, an honor of this week's episode on Kobe Bryant, me, reading you the lineup of the Los Angeles Lakers for the 2005-2006 season. Position. Center. Number 54. Brown. Quame. Position. Guard. Number eight. Brian. Kobe. Position. Center. Number 17. Bynum. Andrew. Position. Forward. Number 43. Cook. Brian. Position. Position. Forward.

Number three, George Debian. Position, guard. Number 11. Green, Devin. Position, forward. Number 24. Jackson. George, Devian.

Position, guard. Number two. Number 11. Aaron. Andrew, Devin. Position. Center. Forward.

Number 44. Position. Talking and start mixing.