Do Go On - 117 - Why Do Girls Wear Pink and Boys Wear Blue?

Episode Date: January 17, 2018

This week's episode is in the form of a question - 'Why Do Girls Wear Pink and Boys Wear Blue?' Well, Matt has a bloody crack at answering this... he goes back to the 1800s to a time before the pink and blue dichotomy, all the way up to modern day, today! US President FDR gets a mention and historian and author Jo Paoletti's research is referenced a lot. It's an interesting time!Support the show and get rewards like bonus episodes:www.patreon.com/DoGoOnPodSubmit a topic idea directly to the hat: http://bit.ly/DoGoOnHat Twitter: @DoGoOnPodInstagram: @DoGoOnPodFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/DoGoOnPod/Email us: [e-mail] and further reading:http://www.thelist.com/32342/real-reasons-behind-blue-boys-pink-girls/https://www.theatlantic.com/sexes/archive/2013/08/pink-wasnt-always-girly/278535/http://www.bbc.com/future/story/20141117-the-pink-vs-blue-gender-mythhttp://content.time.com/time/health/article/0,8599,1654371,00.htmlhttps://www.smithsonianmag.com/arts-culture/when-did-girls-start-wearing-pink-1370097/http://blogs.discovermagazine.com/neuroskeptic/2017/07/02/boys-wear-pink-revisited/#.WlTNtVRdJE4https://www.researchgate.net/publication/229437155_The_Twentieth_Century_Reversal_of_Pink-Blue_Gender_Coding_A_Scientific_Urban_Legendhttps://www.theguardian.com/science/2007/aug/25/genderissueshttp://www.badscience.net/2007/08/pink-pink-pink-pink-pink-moan/https://www.livescience.com/22037-pink-girls-blue-boys.htmlhttp://www.todayifoundout.com/index.php/2014/10/pink-used-common-color-boys-blue-girls/https://people.howstuffworks.com/gender-color.htm Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Melbourne and Canada, we got exciting news for you. And we should also say this is 2026. Jess, what year is it? 2026. Thank God you're here. Right now, I'm in Melbourne doing my show with Serenji Amarna, 630 each night at the Cooper's Inn Hotel, having so much fun. We'd love to see you there.

Canada, we are visiting you in September this year. If you've somehow missed the news, we are heading up Vancouver, Calgary, Montreal, and Toronto for shows. That's going to be so much fun. Tickets for all this stuff, I believe, are online. And I'm here too. This podcast is part of the Planet Broadcasting Network. Visit planetbcasting.com for more podcasts from our great mates.

And welcome to another episode of Do Go On. My name is Dave Warnaghy, and I'm here with two of the best buds, Jess Perkins and Matt Stewart. Hello. I'm a little Rosebud. Oh, I'm a little. Gary Bud Tingwell. That's not his real name. What's Bud Tingwell's first name?

Charles. Fuck. Charles Fuck. Bud Tingwell. Was it Charles? I'm pretty sure. No, that's right. Yes, it is.

Legendary Australian actor. I loved Bud Tingwell. See, what I did there was I panicked and I said whatever the thing I said first was. And then I thought of something. What did you say? I've already forgotten. Gary. This is go-to word.

Go-to word. It's my go-to word. And why wouldn't it be? It's a good go-to word. There's no good reason. No good reason why I wouldn't be my go-to word. Gary, the greatest city in the world. And also name.

It's the big two And it's hard to To make that big two You know It's hard to be both It is really hard Yeah It's like how the town of orange

Is the greatest town And the greatest fruit Yes I thought you were going to say colour And I'm like A no no No No

Oh god no That actually brings me Oh Are you going to do some plugs first Dave Or No no Oh you're going to get Straight to the air

Yeah I was going Because that was a real segue into the app. Okay. All right. Well, hold that thought

because I do want to tell them. That's you listeners. Hello. Hello. That's you. Hello. That's you. A lot.

The Melbourne... The person at home is like... Me? Yes, you. Yes, you. I just wanted to tell you that Melbourne Comedy Festival tickets for our live podcast

at the end of March, start of April, are flying out the door. They are genuinely selling. That's right. Wow. And that is not a word of a lie. At least one has sold.

Multiple of one. We've sold a lot of season passes too. So thanks so much to everyone that's jumped on that. We're doing every Saturday at the Melbourne Comedy Festival at the European Beer Cafe. And a lot of other great podcasts are doing stuff there. The Weekly Planet have just announced that they're doing a live podcast, our comedy buds, just before us on one of the Saturdays. So that's cool.

Josh Earl's doing, Don't You Know Who I Am. The Little Dumb Club will be there. So a lot of great pods. Sands Pants. That's right. So you've got a lot of planet broadcasting, but also others. Which I only recently found out there are podcasts outside the Planet Broadcasting Network. Not many.

Not many. And not many good ones. God, no. But good on them. Good on them for having a bloody goat. We were talking off here about how it would be great if we got a dollar every time we made Jess laugh. Okay. To be fair, that time I made me laugh.

Yeah, I was going to say, no, don't put a stipulation of us having to make your laugh. Anytime just laughed at herself. We'd still be rich. Oh, you'd be rich. If we got the money. I think it's because I'm the only one operating at my level. Do you know what I mean? High frequency.

And so I'm throwing a lot of things out there and you guys aren't getting it. We're too low. But I get all of it. And I'm not above saying I inspire myself. Wow. But you are above us. Oh, yeah. Definitely.

On the comedy pyramid. Oh, big time. Big time. No, well, a pyramid's got to have a base and I'm happy to be it. Okay. Good. Matt, are you also happy to be? Maybe the middle.

You can have that. I'm in the middle. So you're kind of good here. In a pyramid sandwich. On this pyramid scheme of comedy. You don't get it, do you? Anyway, let's get on with the show. Okay, now I don't remember what I said that was a segue into.

It was something about the color orange. Yes. and not being a favourite colour. That's orange is not my favourite colour. Well, the question this week is... What's your favourite colour? What's your favourite colour? Blue.

Interesting. And Dave? Also blue. That is... Yours is green. Mine is green. See, I remember. Which is half blue.

Oh. Oh, that's so deep. So that is interesting. It hits me at the bottom of the comedy pyramid. That is all the way down. Wow. That joke sentence. transcended every level of the comedy pyramid.

I was going to say that it belonged at the bottom of the comedy pyramid. No, because I got it. Oh, yeah, but I think that's broad. Broad appeal. That's what happens at the bottom of the comedy pyramid. Yeah, that's right. I'm an every man. Come jokes.

He loves him. You're an every boy. Yes, I am. I'm every boy. I'm every boy. And sink. So, That's interesting.

So blue and blue. That makes sense to me. But what would you say of the stereotypical colors for young boys and girls? Pink. Four. Girls. And blue. Four boys.

Yeah. So that's the topic this week is the question. Why do girls wear pink and boys wear blue? Oh. That's the topic. That's the topic. Wow. You're taking a bit of a curveball here.

I won't say what I was going to say because I reckon you'll talk about it later. Might do. I mean, I'll just, so the topic came up, because I do, I've got a bit about boys wearing blue and girls wearing pink, right? Like a stand-up bit. A stand-up bit. And someone came to me after the show and said, oh, listen to the podcast. I'd love you to figure that, like, where that originates as a topic. Cool.

And so this week I put three topics up for the vote and all of them were going to help me with whatever one it was. I was going to, like, elaborate on for my festival show. This is part research for the show. Great. So I'm going to, any jokes you make that are funny in this episode, you also are signing across to me. I'm okay with that. No worries, but they will come from the bottom of the comedy pyramid.

I was talking to Jess there, Dave. And I'm not doing a festival show, so you can have all my best jokes. Perfect. Do you like any of my jokes? You can have them. Yeah, great. All right. Any that you want.

What about one about looking like a nappy sand mum? Yeah, nappy sand mum. You can pull that off. I'll take the heroin spoons. Oh, that's a good one. What about my joke about looking like Steve Bishimi? You do them all. all in one.

I'm the Nappy Sand Mum. I'm Steve Bishimi. Goodbye. Dave's forgotten how to do stand-up. Standing ovation. Standing ovation. Accept award. Oh, thank you.

Are you still saying these things into the mark? Is that how a stand-up work? Standing ovation. Standing ovation. You're standing on stoves. Sometimes I say hold for applause out loud. That's fun. That's fun.

That is good fun. Anyway. Okay. So, well, I'm curious. What were you going to say? That it used to be the other way around. Yes, well, that is sort of true a little bit. But yeah, that is something I'll be talking about a bit of a bit.

Have you got any thoughts or any theories? We might talk to it more at the end because I mean, it's all a little bit vague as well because it's, you know, colours go back a long time and other people do not agree on how far back it goes. Right. I'd actually have no theories. I don't have ever really thought about it. Yeah, typically. It's fucking in your own little bubble, aren't you?

Yeah, a blue bubble. Blue and blue and gray. Okay, so anyway, as a starting off point, I found a few articles that referenced this. In the 1880s, there's a photo of future president of the United States, FDR. You're familiar with him, Dave? Yes, Franklin. Delano.

Delano. Delano. I would never, yeah. Excuse me. It's interesting that you didn't ask me if I was familiar with FDR. You were familiar with FDR? Yes. Did you know Delano?

No, I didn't. I didn't know it either. I thought, I'd never heard that, but this is him. Oh. Look at that face. He's a future Mount Rushmore material. How did you describe that photo? Well, what's he wearing?

He's wearing little ballerina-style shoes. They're tea bars, little T-bar, strappy shoes. They were cool at my high school. Yeah, me too. But with women, I will say, he's wearing a dress? He says it's a dress, yeah. Yeah, white dress, yeah. So this is how it was described on the Smithsonian website.

So he was two and a half years old at this time. It describes him thusly. Sitting primly on a stool, his white skirt spread smoothly across his lap, his hands clasping a hat trimmed with a marabou feather, shoulder-length hair and a patent leather party shoes complete the ensemble. If you look at that photo now, you would likely assume it's little girl. I think kids don't tend to look super masculine or feminine unless it's what people put on to them, right? True.

But why? So back then, it was normal for boys to wear dresses up until the age of six or so, which was also the age where they would usually have their hair cut for the first time. Probably easier to like change nappies, isn't it? Exactly. That was one of the main reasons. A lot easier to change nappies for boys and girls, obviously. Because you could lift them up by the hair.

Yes. Very easy. Come here, mate. Like your shear and shape. I'm never letting Dave babysit. Yeah, please don't ever let him near your children. Anyone listening? Just pick it up by the hair, he says.

If anyone listening was thinking about letting Dave look after your children. Damn it. We had a little bub at one of our live shows, Willow. Yeah, I remember picking her up. By the hair. She didn't have much, so I nearly dropped her. But I'm pretty good at grabbing those tiny little ones. and they're strong in a baby.

That's amazing. Really? Fine hairs on a baby are stronger. Yeah. They're like little steel cables. I don't think that's true at all, Dave. You should just pick children up by their torso. I actually am very scared of holding pets and children.

I don't know how to hold them. Okay. All right. I don't know. You've got to know how to hold them, Dave. I know when to hold them. I do. I know when to run.

I always run. Yeah. Sorry, you were talking about nappies. Well, yeah, we're talking about the dresses. Yeah. And we got the nappy sand mum, Jess, here. So that was, that outfit was used for little boys and girls back in the day, back in America. It was a gender neutral outfit.

A lot of this most... A lot of the Smithsonian article's website is based around the research of University of Maryland's historian Joe B. Paletti, who wrote a book called Pink and Blue Tell them the girls from the boys in America Tell the girls in the boy in America Did the song The book come with a theme song?

Yes I love it As well According to Pelletti For centuries Children wore white dresses up to the age six Calling it a matter of practicality Nappies are easier to change with a dress

Also easier to know when they've shit themselves That's it But that's true But also The white dresses are a lot easier to bleach clean. Oh, to get rid of the poo. Get rid of the poo or whatever.

Just get rid of... Sorry, just pointing it out. Getting rid of, you know, kids, dirt and whatever. They're playing out. They're much and about it. It's not necessarily shit. It's not exclusively shit. Well, 98% of it is.

That's not true. No wonder you're grabbing by the hair. Yuck, come here. It's 98% shit. You've got to comb the hair as well because there's a lot of shit in there as well. Stop it. Jess, it's the 1850s. It's a different time.

No. It's the 1880s, Dave. Poo was dealt with by then. 1850s, you're right. You're right. Everyone was made up of nearly all poo. We were poo people. We evolved, mate.

From poo people. It's true. It's all true. Dress has also allowed more room to grow. You know, pants, you're going to have to change every few months as a kid, but a dress. Unless you shak yourself, then you've got changed sooner. Which happened often, but only in the 1850s. The kids grow out of that.

It's a weird phase. Another reason for the white and the bleaching, right, was because back then dyes weren't as good, or good quality dies weren't as cheap. So continuously washing clothes, colored clothes that would fade out anyway. So if you stay with white, you could keep getting them back to brilliant white with a bleach or a Napi Sam mom or whatever.

Jess, you could probably talk more to that. Oxyaction Plus. Great, perfect. I think they should have just had brown clothes. It makes the most sense. They're getting shit all over them. I mean, these people are stupid. What is the one color I would say probably not?

I read a lot of surveys and stuff about people's favorite colors, and brown was nearly always people's least favorite color. Because it looks like shit. Bage? Bages. If you're having a beige-shit color, doctor. I'm saying that right now. It's not all.

How is this already? Because Dave's here. And we did, I mean, nappies weren't mentioned. Look, I'm at the bottom of the period. It's all right? Right at the bottom where the shit comes out. Into the 1900s, colorful infant clothing started to become more popular. One theory is that with white dresses, parents could pass the clothes down from sibling to sibling regardless of gender.

Yeah. Basically, stores realize that the more options they marketed, the more products they could sell. I don't really stop my parents, to be honest. Yeah, which I like that. I like parents going on. It doesn't fucking matter. It doesn't. It really doesn't.

So what kind of thing you're wearing? Well, some people would argue that it does. My brothers use nappies, yeah. All right. I'm handing down the napes. Disposal? No. No.

Oh, my God. It's about to call child services. You guys got to get over the Perkins house. Yeah. And go back in time, about 27 years. Oh, God. It's a mess in there. Haven't cleaned it out.

According to Palletti, initially it wasn't clear cut that blue was to be worn by boys and pinks by girls. In fact, there were examples of the opposite being recommended, like Jess, you mentioned before, including this article from 1918

in the Earnshaw's Infants Department publication saying, is the quote. The generally accepted rule is pink for the boys, and blue for the girls. The reason is that pink being a more decided and stronger color is more suitable for the boy, while blue is more delicate and dainty is prettier for the girl. So similar.

That's from the children's department. Yeah. God, they are very well spoken for a department of children. They really are. They send out the head baby. In a little suit. Boss baby. That's what boss baby was.

Space does boss baby. Oh, that what you just said. That's what it was. What was Boss Baby? To me. Good question. I'll field this one. In an article on live science.com, they say that up till the 1950s, chaos rained when it came to the colors of baby paraphernalia.

Also quoting Pale Eddie, she was like, she really seems like one of the main experts on this topic. They quoted her saying that there was no gender color symbolism that held true everywhere. Her research found birth announcements, cards, baby books and newspaper articles from the early 20th century that indicated pink was as likely to be associated with baby boys as with baby girls. So it wasn't like it was one or the other. But early days, I hadn't figured out exactly which way. Yeah. I think you'd kind of struggle now to find anything that wasn't pink for a girl. Yeah.

And I don't mean that in terms of clothing. Like, I think there'd definitely be a lot of pink, but there is some variety. But I mean like, let's say your friend had a baby and you wanted to get them a card and all of the It's a Girl cards are going to be pink. I would purposefully find something that isn't, but you would struggle. I think, yeah, for the most part, that's probably true. I imagine probably is a, in response to that, people are probably starting to offer alternatives.

Probably. Because there's a market for it, people who don't want to do that necessarily. but probably yeah this is all science man he said probably about eight times in that sentence probably did yeah well I don't want anyone to think that I'm being definite in anything I'm saying

uh... pal lady references a piece published in Time magazine in 1927 that charted what colors different department stores used for boys and girls it was all over the shop she said with many including Fellini's in Boston Best & Coe in New York City Hallies in Cleveland and Marshall Field

in Chicago recommending pink for the and blue for the girls. According to Paletti, she found that she found sources that recommended blue for blonde kids and pink for brunettes or blue for blue-eyed babies and pink for brown-eyed babies. So there were also even non-gen, it wasn't necessarily spit on gender lines. To do with their looks. Yeah, which makes more sense in a lot of ways that if one colour favours, even if that's possible. Does blue, isn't blue men to suit people with blue eyes?

Yeah. Well, it makes the eyes look even more blue. You know, when Dave wears blue, it's like, hello. It's true. It's all true. I'm gorgeous. What can I say? I was all a bit fluid at that stage, right?

But from the 40s and 50s, it started to coagulate into the common color gender pairings we see today. Oh, that's good. Did you write that? Coagulate? That is good. It went from fluid to coagulation. Oh. Fuck.

Get this man a Pulitzer Prize. I did collagulate and then I went back to the. line before I went. I need to make this more consistent. That is great. Is this part of your stand up? Because it should be. Coagulate. Nothing gets them laughing like the word coaculate. It's a hilarious word. Yeah. In any context.

Coagulate. I mean, you guys have been laughing ever since. I'm in tears. So it's sounded to coagulate into the common color gender pairings we see today. Blue boys, pink for girls. But why did this happen? Well, according to old mate Paletti,

it could be because of the French and their trend-setting ways. Oh, those damn Frenchies. According to the live science article, traditional French culture paired pink with the girls and blue with boys, while Belgian and Catholic German culture used the opposite. And because France set the fashion in the 20th century, their tradition held sway.

Now I get it. You laugh more at fashion than you did at Coagulate. Yeah. Because are a confusing crowd. No, it's because we know Coagulate is clever. Right. Fashion. It's just silly.

It's just funny. It's more. It's just funny. Funny. Fraction is frathing. The idea of this French influence is often backed up by quoting this line from the American novel Little Women, published in the 1860s. Familiar with this book? Yes.

I've never read Little Women. But I'm familiar. I saw a movie as a kid. With Winona Ryder? Yeah, I think so. Was it terrible? I don't recall it, but I remember it being. Winona Ryder was in it.

From Stranger Things. So it was pretty terrible. Oh, I wasn't sure which way you were going to go. Yeah, no, I was like, are you a big fan or? Not a fan. So this is the quote. You know, it's a line for the book. Amy put a blue ribbon on the boy and a pink on the girl.

French fashion. So you can always tell. That's actually a line. That's a line. French fashion. French fashion. So you can always tell. Ah.

That's interesting. and that's 1860s. Yes. But I mean this is, you know when you see like that quote from before saying dainty, blue is dainty for the girls? Yeah. That was just a quote that is across everything. That's the big one they use.

Dainty. Well, that quote from that baby, whatever. The Department of Babies. Yeah, the Department of Babies quote. So, you know, when sometimes you see you're looking at, I'm talking about hundreds of articles that I read, right? And that one came up in, I'd say the majority of them. So that's what we call it, primary source.

It's a primary source. But also, don't anything that makes you go, it feels like. Right, everyone's latched onto that. Yeah. Is that actually it? Yeah. I did find, I found others, but that just seemed, I probably it's because it's, it spells it out so clearly.

And it is quite the opposite of what we think of those colors. Yeah. What we've been trained to think now. by the man Another theory I saw put forward a few times Was that red used to be seen more as a masculine color And red coats were a common part of the military uniforms In particular in the British Army from the 7th to the 20th century

Pink was like a watered down version of the masculine color The masculine red color And boys were like a watered down version of men I guess Red was used a lot less in the military in the 20th century, while blue was becoming more common with the rise of the importance of the U.S. Navy in the Second World War, around this time it was popular to dress young American boys in sailor suits like Navy Sailor suits, apparently.

So instead of wearing a skirt, now you wear a Navy suit. Navy suit? Times are changing. That is cute, though. That's really cute. Oh, that's so cute. I'm not sure if these things played a major or minor role or none at all, but sort of interesting theories. I found it interesting that red, yeah, red used to be, um, seen as like a real army color.

Now it would be, I think it did happen when, um, the turn of the century. Oh, because you couldn't wear red. It's not camouflage. Yeah, it's just like, it's the opposite. Hello, I'm over here. I used to be about pomp and ceremony going like, oh, we're, we're, we're, you know, we're loud and proud. Yeah, like, I think in the, in the, in the first world, well, there was a time at the start where they hadn't really adapted. to modern warfare yet in the French rock up on horseback with big red red jackets no helmets and they just just mish just mowed down yes and they quickly went this isn't working did you

ever listen to hardcore history I may have got that from that I think I was I remember that from that as well and he just found it he spent a bit of time it was found that bloody fascinating yeah that was great there's a little bit of lag in um strategy and that only find out when they're like Oh, we're getting shot real easy from a distance. Whoops. Let's figure this out. Yeah, I strongly recommend that podcast, hardcore history. I'm sure a lot of people do listen to it.

Dan Carlin, great stuff. It's bloody great. Real long. If you like them long. Yeah, gosh. That was like a six-part, six-hour each episode series. Jess doesn't have time for that. I'm a busy mum.

I didn't expect. I was expecting a woman. I don't think Jess changed mid-word. I did. Thank you for hearing that. You hear me. I hear, mate. I can hear.

Anyhow, according to the women's lifestyle magazine, the gender divide between blue and pink was firmly entrenched in the public consciousness around the end of World War II. While women working on the American War effort were likely to be wearing blue, as depicted in the iconic We Can Do It Post. You know that one? Yeah. the strong arm.

Oh, right. Yes, sorry, I didn't know what you're talking about. Yes. Oh, he's got a picture of it. So we can do it. We can do it. Yeah, she is wearing blue. So that was...

It's a redhead band if you're still not imagining it. Yeah, she looks great. All right, man. Only to objectify her. So during World War II, a lot of women were wearing blue. They were, but it was sort of a at that stage, a bit of a working class color as well.

or if you were on the factory floor or whatever, you were wearing blue color, I guess, is wrapped up in that. Anyway, I went on a slight tangent when I saw that post exam. I'm like, I don't really know anything about it. I've seen it so many times that I don't know the history of it. So I just looked in it very briefly, and I got my attention because it was designed by a Pittsburgh artist named Jay Howard Miller, and he was commissioned by the Westinghouse Company's War Production Coordinating Committee.

And obviously we did an episode about George Westinghouse a year ago or something. So he was commissioned to come up with a poster. It was only intended to motivate workers in not even across all of their factories, just in a certain area in the Midwest, I think. And the phrase, we can do it was the idea was sort of grouping management and the workers together. That's the way, you know. Interestingly, it was only... Oh, that's the way.

interesting it was only displayed to Westinghouse employees for a couple of weeks in 1943 it was only even put up in-house for a couple of it wasn't shown publicly or anything like that after that it disappeared till the early 80s when it was rediscovered and became the famous poster it is now really was so it wasn't popular at the time yeah it wasn't it just wasn't even made to be a public thing which I found interesting that's really I didn't know that and so the the we at the time was for the meant to be for the workers and the management or whatever, but now it's more likely it would be seen as we, women, we can do it. And it's become like an iconic feminist poster.

Yeah. Can it be an iconic icon? Yes. Great. I think you'd probably just call it an icon, yeah. Yeah. Inherently. Yeah.

So that's, I do. I really love that design, that poster made by a great man from Pittsburgh. Well, actually, I don't know what the Jay stands for. It could be a woman. Jay Howard. Jane. When they put the initial first, Jay Howard, Millard.

Jane. Jessica. Yeah, that's a good one. How did you struggle with that? Women's starting with Jay. I've got Jane and I'm out. I don't really see myself as a Jessica. Do you know what I mean?

Could have said Jess. We would have accepted. Yeah, well played. That is my name. Instead, I went for your sister. Yes, thank you. Thank you. I think it's a much.

Oh, that was really nice gesture. Gesture. Could it be gesture? Howard? Maybe. Yeah, Jess was still just guessing names. And the pun happened to be a pun. What pun?

Queen of the pun. What do you mean? No, we'll ask Matt because he will be able to tell us. Matt, what pun was in there? I don't even fully know what a pun is. When Jess said gesture there, Is that a pun? Nah.

Yeah. What is it? It's a plan words. Is that a word? Yeah. And Jess is my name. Yeah. And is what a pun is.

Right. So yeah, American women often wore blue during the war. But quoting an article from the list, the list is a like a women's life sole website. They had a pretty good article about this. So they're quoting them, once her man came back from the front line, she could trade. in her oil-stained blues for the flowery pink aprons that became her kitchen uniform. By 1947, fashion designers like Christian Dior were advertising the clothing of the post-war ideal.

What did this mean for women? A ton of soft, flowing, feminine pink. So it sounds like it was a real weird time, the 50s where they went, oh, things were fucked there. World War II, everything was fucked. And then they went into this weird, like, sort of like coma where they're in this weird fake world. Yeah, they're trying to, let's make it all idea.

We won the war. Everything's good. Yeah. Women in flowers and cooking and smiling and men, briefcases, going to work. It sounds like one of those Stepford wives or something. Yeah, and they're all secretly killing everyone.

Something that I don't, I've never seen, but I assume that's sort of what that's like. Yeah, spoilers, Dave. Actually, I think I'm thinking of an X-Files episode. That sounds about right. I'm not built for the 50s. I wouldn't have done well. Or maybe I would have because that's all you know.

Yeah, I don't think I would have liked it. Smoking inside. I'm too funny. Lots of racism. What would have been? Yeah, you're right. Those things probably more important than. Like 50 years, 70 years backwards in medical science.

Yeah. But smoking, the horse. That's fucked. I remember that. Not a good time. By the mid, I used to work in this advertising. agency where we used to smoke cigars and yeah sounds like a lot of fun yeah it sounds great yeah I saw an ad for madmed once um by an ad which is apt uh by the mid 60s though the women's liberation

movement put forward the anti-feminine slash anti-fashioned message and according to the smithsonian the unisex look became the rage but in the reverse way of the time of the young franklin d roosevelt Now these young girls were dressing in masculine or at least unfeminine styles devoid of gender hints. Pelletti found that in the 1970s the Sears Roboac catalog pictured no pink toddler clothing for two years. Wow. So it sort of went, you know, it's funny how the fashions and stuff. The what? It's funny how like the fashions and stuff are on this roller coaster rod.

The ebbs and the flows. Yeah. Yeah, the flows, yeah, and the ebbs. Yeah. I mean, you already got it. I get it. You got it. It's flowing.

It's ebbin. It's flipping. It's flopping. According to Pelletti, one of the ways feminists thought that girls were kind of lured into a subservient roles as women is through clothing. If we dress our girls more like boys and less like frilly little girls, they are going to have more options and feel freer to be active.

So this is like 60s. feminist thoughts. This from the list article again, dressed like the boys, the theory went, and you were going to be taken seriously like the boys. That was also the start of the argument that there was no biological reason for girls to favour pink over blue, which we talk about a little bit later.

And then it was the way we were raising our children that made the color and gender divide an accepted thing. Clothing colors became, once again, gender neutral. So that's in the 70s? That's sort of 60s in the 70s. Right, so at the time, it's only been, of course, it's not really having any effect because it's only been around for, what, 10 to 20 years. Which is like a generation.

It's not many, it's not, yeah. That's right. And Paioletti sort of always said that it never really hit fully until the mid-80s. Right, gotcha. So she reckons it was around 1985 that the pink blue gender divide really kicked in a full swing. She remembers it well because she had her first child. a girl in 1982 and her second a boy in 1986. And with the birth of her son, she recalls all of a sudden it wasn't just a blue overall.

It was a blue overall with a teddy bear holding a football, you know? Everything went upper level, like boys are sports and balls and trucks. He's a man. Girls of fairies and Barbies and... She's not a man. Not men. That's 80's dad. No, I got it.

That was very good. What's 90s, Dad, sound like? Oh, she's a man. Oh. She's a man. Is that movie with me in the 90s? Well, he's still saying she's not a man, but, you know, he's calm down a bit. Yeah.

And now it's, oh, I'm cool. Yeah, old dads are cool now. Be what you want to be, kids. Do what you want to do. Be what you want to be, yeah. What was your dad's? Man! You had 90s

Dads Yeah We had 90s And they were like You're a man Yeah Dad told me I was a man And you Dave

Dad told me that Jess was a man He let you know Yeah Yeah Fair enough I mean you have a right to know No way Is that true at all

20 years You know Before you met me Not 20 It's crazy That was such a long time When I didn't know Who you were Jess

Yeah Do you have I reckon there'll be a time when we, like, we're old, say Matt's age, and we look back on this time and we go, I wonder what they're doing. You know? Because we've been out of touch for so long. Do you think that'll happen? Oh.

I don't think you'll ever get to my age. Yep, that's true. It's very hard to catch up as well. Someone. I'm the group of clubhouse leader. Could you stop? Yeah, yeah, I can stop. It's cool.

I don't know. Many times stop started. It's called death. Well, yeah, no, don't do that. Anyway, I just hope that I never lose you. Matt, please do you go on. Around this time, disposable nappies also started to become more common, and they were marketed with pink or blue packaging,

depending on the sex of the child. And then just like things across the board were probably done. Like that's weird, isn't it? Yeah. That's strange. I find it pretty weird. They're just nappies. Are they different in any way?

No. I don't think so. Are they? Maybe there's a little bit more room for the boys. Do they accommodate for pain? Yeah. But you don't need to leave that much room, do you? No, I wouldn't have thought that you didn't have to worry about it.

They did for me. I wore a man snappy, if you know what I mean. I don't know what you mean. Like a man snappy. A what? It's a thing. I had it. Oh, it looks so funny.

What had it gone up to your shoulders? Oh, no. It's normally in every way except there's just a massive pouch. Oh, I hate this. Were you a bit lopsisar. a child. Yeah. Have you grown into yourself?

Still trying. Still catching up. I don't understand. Oh. Dave's saying he's got. Wait, Dave, what are you saying? Can you spell it out? I'm not spelling it out.

Small tosh, giant. Fill in the blank. Brain? Oh, that makes sense. Thank you. Yeah, I wore a nap in my head. There's a hat. You think you have a hat?

A nappy. I'll get where that is now. Yeah, okay. I didn't get that before. Oh, boy. I was wondering why they were selling disposable pink hats to girls. Yeah, it is weird. Disposable hats.

It was the 90s. In case somebody picked them up by the hair again. Oh, they call them something else in other places. Diapers. Diapers. Oh, yeah, sorry, overseas. It's a diaper in many. If I'd said diaper, would you have understood, Dave?

Yeah. Yeah. Because you went to Disneyland once. That whole period where you were learning about nappies, you're in America. I just missed that whole bit. Diapers. One suggested catalyst for this change was the leap in prenatal testing from the 70s onwards.

All of a sudden, expectant parents could determine the sex of the baby. Retailers took advantage of this. As previously, parents would prepare gender-neutral rooms and clothes for their babies. But now they could market specific boy and girl merchandise. Got away from me of it. Merchandise. to the expectant parents. If they knew their second child was going to be a boy after their first was a girl,

the pressure to conform would mean most parents would buy a whole second set of clothes and toys, etc. It was bloody good news for retailers. Oh, it's bloody good, isn't it? But I mean, it sounds like some think that they were the ones who were helping create. Well, I mean, if they just didn't sell. Well, it's hard to know what can't do us, but I think definitely they weren't. They weren't helping.

No, they weren't helping. Because for parents and for everyone, it's better if it's just everyone uses the same, less waste and all that sort of stuff. Totally. And kids don't know. Could not give a fuck, I'm sure. They don't give a shit. I don't remember any clothes I wore when I was a toddler.

No. I remember maybe saying some stuff in photos. I imagine I would have worn my older sisters, hand me downs, probably. Yeah, sure. Mother made a lot of stuff for us, too. Yeah. But, yeah. Mom knitted me a Saints scar and Saints' pajamas.

Get out. Yeah. She's quite a knit her. Oh yeah, big time. Diane. Oh yeah, Diane can knit. Don't worry about that. Oh, no, I believe that.

Don't you? No, I totally believe it. Yeah, big time. I don't know why I wouldn't believe it. I mean, he just told us. Yeah, it'd be odd. How'd this is just a big lie? Your mom can't knit.

I've just, yeah, caught him out. That's just like I'm an undercover cop. I have to, if you call me out. You have to admit it? Why, are you a cop? Which is not, that can't be true. That is not a thing. That can't be true.

I love it that people think they go, yeah, you ask them, they have to tell you. That's the law. That's putting their own safety. Are you an undercover cop? Yes. Yes, I am. Oh, you got me. It's like, it's a 40-40 out or something, some sort of backyard game.

Murder in the dark, but you've got to say. You have to. Look, if I wing at you, you have to pretend to die. And if you don't, I'll tell mum Tell mum that you said you weren't a cop But you were There were so many different versions

Of murder in the dark I don't even remember really the rules I remember the lights went out And then someone had Maybe just someone died Yeah I can't remember Definitely people died

It was a brutal game Oh yeah I remember writing things down On pieces of paper And scrunching Oh yeah I don't know what you wrote down I don't remember that one

I forgot the winking one Until you just said it Yeah did you remember that one Yeah vaguely So if you were the murder You just had to wink at people So I think someone went outside while a big circle inside, someone was assigned to be the murderer. And then when they winked.

No, from the teacher. Is it my school anyway? Right. Which is kind of crazy now. A game where you pretend to die. Yeah. And then a detective came back in and had to work out who was winking and killing everyone. Right.

For Christmas I gave my brother these tiny little mini laser guns and he had a red and a blue one. And every time he shot me with a red one, I had to do a very elaborate fake death. Like at one point I was trying to carry some drinks and I was outside and he shot me and I had to like fall to the ground. But then if he shot me with the blue one, it brought me back to life. Oh, blue is life. We're 34 and 27. So blue is life. Yeah.

Red is death. Correct. That's fascinating. Isn't it? What is? Because it's basically this blue and red, blue and pink. Yeah. Red is just the watered up version of pink.

Watered up. Water that pink up. We've gone pretty heavy with Pelletti so far, right? Most things have been through her research and stuff. I like her style. She sounds like a jazz musician. Yeah, it's got a great name. Scooby-Dip-Bap.

Scooby-Bap, bap, bap, bap, it's Pailetti. But not everyone agrees with her. For instance, an Italian sociologist named Marco del Guduch. Which I possibly knows. Gnucci. Conducted his own research. using Google books. You know Google Books?

He searched for books published in the US between 1880 and 1890 and he searched for key words and phrases like blue for boys and pink for girls or blue for a boy and pink for a girl and lots of variations on that. And he found that those blue for boys, pink for girls ones,

appeared in books from 1880 onwards. So relatively, early, well, in that search at the very beginning of the search. Well, he's based a paper on a Google search. Yeah, I know. That's why it feels like it's pretty flimsy research. Guys,

I googled it. I got 8.9 billion results. That seems like a lot. That's the interesting thing. I don't think he got, it was searching millions and millions of books and I think it was nowhere near that many.

Mainly because he just kept hitting, am I feeling lucky? And one site kept coming up. That's one again. Suddenly one. All images. It's interesting. What does that do?

It takes you to the first page. Am I feeling lucky? Rather than giving a list, it takes you to like... I thought it took you to a random one, but it takes you the first one. I think it's like, this is what you're looking for. Surely it's Google. We get it right. Oh, right.

So it's not that lucky. It's just the, it's probably the right one. Well, maybe, I don't know. That's my understanding. And my understanding could definitely be wrong. No, I've never known you to be wrong. They still have that as a feature? Not sure.

Great joke either way. If everyone else remembers surfing the internet, the early 2000s. I think we do. Ask Jeeves, yeah. That's a great reference. And this is all as a direct response to Palletti's research, right? He's trying to go, her research is false, right? So he said he did consider that Pailati did have a hand.

handful of legit sources. Just that, quote, the magazine's excerpts cited anomalous or unrepresentative of the broader cultural context. So there's a few blips. Right, she's gone fishing. Yeah, she found a few, but really they're not representative, right? Which I found really fascinating because it's a widely different result from what Pelletti had said.

Delgadoucci has said, pink seems to have been a feminine color, at least since the late 19th century. In summary, when inspected closely, the reversal in pink blue gender coding shows many warning signs of a scientific urban legend, an urban legend that somehow managed to infiltrate the peer-reviewed literature, because it's all throughout like legit science. Interesting, though, and kind of the problem with that is, as far as I can see, is that Paley never said that there was a reversal pink blue gender coding. that it was inconsistent until the second half of the 20th century. So his urban legend idea is kind of like a,

it's a bit of a straw man sort of urban legend in itself, I reckon. Right, yeah. Because she didn't say it was a flip. He's sort of, for some reason, saying there was no flip. Yeah, right. As I read it, she wasn't saying there was a flip. She was just saying it was inconsistent across the board until... It came and went.

Yeah, that's right. And different areas with different things. Right. Either way, Paley criticized Del Gouducci's research saying, I would never think of doing a word search in order to study something visual. Got him. Oh, that's a... Fucking burn!

These are two academics going back and forth, stabbing at each other. That's so good. She's basically said what we said, which was like, you've done a Google search. Dude, you've just Googled it. You've googled it. You're not a fucking scientist. Oh, I googled biochemistry. Oh, I've got a PhD now.

Dr. Jess in the house That's how the Gadootis do it I'll just follow this link It's a Google search for dickhead Yeah Cut that Hey click on images Yeah save search

Turn it off first Go on images Who's there a picture of Oh fuck it's me Have you done that I love the other day that he doesn't even really know how Google works Yeah And it's somebody's pranked him

Yeah, it's like, oh, fuck. Carl? What have you done? I have you done this. So funny. Someone tweeted a few weeks back that it must have been a couple weeks ago we were saying, okay, Google or what? And it was setting off her.

Yes, I saw that. That made me laugh. I loved that. Okay, Google, look up Dave Warnocky's YouTube channel. G-string episode. No. I've taken it down to it. You're welcome.

Okay, Google. Find the dark web version of Dave Warnocky's YouTube channel. Is dark web a thing? Okay, Google. Okay, Google, it's dark web a thing. Okay, Google, pornhub.com. Do that work, everyone? Hope that work you.

I'll see someone diving across the room in their office. No. Or while the elderly grandparents are visiting. I hope Google's listening. Google's always listening. Yeah, surely they are. How good was it the way and the other? Anyway, we're going off track.

But when someone was listening to the BTK episode from the newspaper's office. That was ridiculous. Oh, from Wichita. That was sick. From the Wichita Eagle. That was one of the coolest pieces of correspondence we've ever had. Yeah. Matt, can I interrupt you just really,

quickly. Jess, I'd really love you too. That didn't sound sincere. I wouldn't. No, please do. Well,

I just wanted to mention that this episode of DoGo on is brought to our dear listeners by Shipstation. Ah. Oh, shipstation.com. Dot com. Do you sell online? eBay. Amazon? Magento?

Then you need Ship Station. It's a fast and easy way to manage and dispatch your orders, all from one, place for all that online selling. I like that. This could be good for us when we start doing merch online. Exactly. Merch ideas I've had lately. Yes.

Rules that have Jess's nose on it. Excuse me? Dave's eyes in a balloon bag. Oh, wow. These are not good ideas. A heart-shaped faceball of my hand. What? Just spitballing.

Wow. These sound like number one selling products. Yes. I don't think those are good ideas. If we made these, ShipStation could really help us out. That's what I was thinking. This works out really well. Well, you can use ShipStation to compare rates from top couriers, including Royal Mail, FedEx, D.HL

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Shipstation.com. Make ship happen. Did you just come up with that? I didn't, but that's very good. It's better than anything I could have come up with. Make ship happen. At first I thought when they contacted us, I'm like, ship stations, how many people of our listeners have a ship that need somewhere to dock?

Yeah. They've probably got a dock. Yeah. I was wrong. You were wrong. But hey, now we're educated. But do you get in contact if you do have a ship because that's cool. Yeah.

That's great. I'm impressed. Like I'm impressed with ShipStation.com. We'd love to do a live episode on international waters. If we could. Oh my God. I've been thinking about that. Of course you have.

Anyway. Legit. We should hire a boat like a dual live show. Take everyone out. I don't know. I think you've got to have about 45 kilometers out. What's the best? For us.

Then we can do, we could talk about anything we want. We already do. We could do anything. We took on Scientology. I could be, I'll be unleashed. Thinking about the things I'll talk about. Are you leashed at the moment? Oh, I am so leashed, baby.

Don't call me baby. Well, I will on international waters and there's nothing you can do about it. Okay, well, we're not going on international waters. There we go, saved it. Don't make threats like that, Dave. Matt, do go on. Okay. So recently blogger, Neurosceptic.

Wow. I can't wait for what this person's are amazing. Yeah, I want to have dinner with this person. Credible findings are. Actually, I think you'll find. No, I like, I like, Neurosceptic. Actually, I think you'll find vaccines are hurting people.

He blogs for Discovery Magazine's website. Discovery. He reported that Del Gducci has published an update to his findings. So his initial stuff was from a couple of years ago, and this is from the last six months. He was reporting that while Del Goducci maintains that the text data still shows no evidence for that pink for boys, blue for girls was ever the dominant pattern. I think that has not been said by Paletti. But anyway, he still maintains that that was never the dominant for it to be pink for boys, blue for girls, which is what Pale Lady would agree with.

Anyway, but he has admitted that the period. periodicals do reveal that in the period before 1920, both blue for boys, pink for girls and the reverse scheme were mentioned roughly equally often. Roughly equally. Yeah. So which is what basically what pale ladies said all along. So just, yeah, it was just different trends, the ebbs, the flows. Yeah.

And some of it was just inconsistent because it wasn't like now there's mass media. Everyone can, you know, look at the same ads and department stores are spread across the country. Back then there were pockets of different vibes, different settlements. So German areas would stick with the blue for girls for longer. And there were all these different things. Anyway, so it was just a mish-mash. Let's just change it completely. Like, don't worry about blue and pink.

Let's go like orange for boys and purple for girls. Cyan. Purple's still quite girly. I just like the idea of just picking a cool color. Who gives a fuck? Yellow. I don't really understand why it matters. Yeah.

No, it doesn't. Blue for everyone because it is clearly the best color. Oh, that's a good point. Well, two thirds of us picked it and I sort of half did. Green is also, it's probably my second favourite, so. A big fan. I like red. I like yellow.

I wear a bit of yellow. Yellow is fun. You do look good in yellow. Thank you. Just a mustard yellow. Yeah, you do pull out. I can pull off a mustard. Thanks, Dave.

Goes with the brown hair. Shut up, you bloody flirt. I can't. Oh, my goodness. I can't even. I can't handle it. That's wearing a yellow hat right now. Oh, he looks fucking fabulous.

He looks gorgeous. I love a piece of that. Oh, no. I've gone too far. You can't have a piece of a hat, man. Don't objectify my hat, man. So today it's all about pink for girls and blue for boys, so much so that you'll see bald baby girls with pink headbands to assert their femininity, right?

So you can get something to grab onto when you want to pick them up. For the hairless babies. Yeah, exactly. That's what the headbands are for. You don't know. That's actually, it's a full, I can't think of the word. Noose. It's a full, it's a full harness system.

Harness. A couple of carabinas thrown in for fun. Wow. Yeah. It sounds like you're probably just going to rip babies' heads off. Dave. Is that what you're trying to do? That's not my intention.

I just want to pick them up. Okay. You're not babysitting my future non-children. You're having non-children? Yeah, I'm having non-s. Like noners, like old Italian. Yeah, cute little nonas. They're going to walk around feeding me.

Oh, my, thank you. That's a great idea. It's gratsy. It's not gratsy, you uncultured swine. Jess isn't going to be the non-a, you fool. Her children are not. No, but you've got to thank the nunner. Oh, right.

You're going to thank the nunners. And how do I do that again, sorry, Dave? Grazzi. Oh, yuck. So, Jess, you want to give us a great? No, you butcher the language. Grazzi. Better.

I did four years of Italian. So did I. Mm, Sih. Very bene. Well, bene. You know, I'm actually 1 16th, Swiss-Italian. Okay, all right.

Andiamo. Maybe even 1-8. Yeah, 1-8. Andiamo. Love when people go right down to it. They're like, How much do you call me? My name.

Mattio. My name. Yes. With Ozzy accent. Quantian I. Yes. Yes. Yes.

I said how old. I said how old are he goes, yes. Yes. I am but old. Quatro multi-banny. Wow. Four very good. Not even not very good, multi-good.

Is that out of five? Out of five? Multi-goods? Thank goodness. Four out of five, baby. Pretty good. Happy with that, baby. So if you go to the supermarket, obviously,

products are all in pink packaging for girls, blue for boys. But even for adults, not even just kids, like pink razors and pink deodorant. Yeah, that's true. How weird is that? Well, men stuff is usually black. Black, because you're a man. Yeah, it's so funny. So weird.

There was a, did you see that research that came up recently? It was a smallish study. I think they were saying that men will be less likely to be environmentally friendly if it's in pink packaging or just if just the idea of being environmentally friendly feels feminine to them I think it was saying so so men who would avoid things that are pink would also avoid using products that advertise themselves as environmentally friendly the same kind of people who are like threatened their masculinity is threatened by by colors are also have their masculinity threatened by being environmentally friendly that doesn't

surprise me at all yeah Yeah, this is interesting, but it just seems really odd. But again, it was like one small study, and I know, these always feel like a lot of these studies, I feel like people go, I want to prove something, how do I prove this thing? I asked 13 people at the pub last night, and 11 answered. Granted. Pretty good.

It was a rugby team. And two of them just weren't in the room at the time. Two out of third not answering is not a good result. I know. I liked it. According to that article on the list, they pointed the question, do we assign genders to these colours because that's what girls and boys like? Or do we gravitate towards these colours because that's what they're dressed in

and that's what they've seen their peers doing, right? Is it like a chicken or the egg thing? What do you reckon? I'm just thinking of times that I've been part of the problem. That's what my face was doing. I was like, oh, shit, I've done that. What's that? I bought a two pack of toothbrushes recently, and they were blue and red,

and I took the red and gave my boyfriend the blue. Even though blue is your favorite color. I know. That's interesting. Why? What's wrong with red? No, I like red too. But what I'm saying is red's not like a classically feminine color.

No, I know, but like that's, it's pretty similar to the blue and pink kind of argument, isn't it? Blood is red, and we bleed. Yeah. Only women bleed. Yeah. Only women bleed. Do you bleed, Dave? If you prick me,

doth I not bleed. Doth? Don't prick Dave. He is the prick. Yeah, hard to prick a prick a prick, you know, to win. Hard to break a brick. That's true, it is hard to break a prick. It really is.

But I actually, I think it is the, because I find it hard to not, we all go, when you ask the question, blue for boys, pink for girls, even if you choose not to in my mind, I feel like it has been programmed in there by these marketing people. Definitely. Not by me, though I do like blue. It's my favourite colour.

I think that that's a natural thing. But I think because we're so aware of it now, do you think it's possible that there will be a change? It would be a very conscious one. I think it, I imagine it will. change because it's only been around for such a short amount of time if you believe the studies that we've been talking about and the research we've been talking about it's only been around for a little while some people are like it's in eight women like pink and like blue some people

have tried to do studies to prove that you know and and said that they have been able to prove which i'll talk about in a second we're not too far from the end um but this so this oh sorry your question i really think that we will i think we will change again i don't i think we will We'll move away from that. Yeah, maybe in a hundred years, what will it be? Trends and stuff just, they change around. And usually it's something rebelling against the thing that came before. Yeah.

So it'll be interesting. And sometimes this one seems to last it for a while. But it did seem like there were periods in those earlier years. Periods. Yeah. Only women bleed. Where, but adult, like, you know. Is that really a song?

Yeah, it's an Alice Cooper song. Only women bleed. Yeah. Was you covered by John Farnham as well? The voice. Two of the greats. I often lumped them together too. But please do go on Matt.

Sorry. So, so that whole, you know, what comes first, right? Is it us or is it what we already, do we innately think blue for boys and pink for girls? Or is that something we've been trained to do? To me, if you believe the things like everyone was dressing in white, 140 years. ago, then it seems like how is it innate, right? It just isn't. But was that for practicalities then that overcame these other things and when we started

to get to choose colors that we chose? To me, it feels like bullshit. But anyway, these are questions that people ask, right? And there's been a lot of studies into it with mixed results. This is a quote from the list. One study done in 2011 offered babies the choice between two nearly identical objects. One was pink and the other wasn't. When they were one year old, there was no difference in the number that chose pink or the other color.

By the time they were two years old, many of the girls were choosing pink. By four, the gender divide was evident on both sides, with most boys now refusing the pink item. Another study did the same thing by separating a group of three to five-year-olds into two different shirt colors. One group in blue shirts, one group in red shirts, but not... on gender divide. Each was told that their shirt color was the best color. And three weeks later, there was a clear divide there, too. Kids that wore blue shirts picked blue items and kids who wore red shirts gravitated towards red.

Wow. So you can program. I mean, based on that 2011 study, you would say that makes it seem pretty clear that it's a program thing. Seeing as kids at one year old didn't care about whether it was pink or not, there was some sort of innate thing, but it was different to four years later. And apparently that's around the same time where kids are actually realizing what gender they are or what sex they are. Right.

And notice that other kids are different and sort of that plays in it as well potentially. Interesting. There was a study conducted in 2007 that was widely publicised by the media with headlines such as Time Magazine's study, Why Girls Like Pink, which grabbed my attention. I'm like Liz. Here we go. I'll answer a few questions. This is the opening paragraph, which starts strongly.

When shopping for baby gifts, everyone knows the blues for boys and pink is for girls. But now there's evidence that those colours may be more than just marketing gimmicks. The may be like a, no. But anyway. You started so strong. So confident. But anyway, I'm listening. I'm interested.

Then the third paragraph said, so the second paragraph went on on a similar thing. And then the third paragraph said, on average, the study found, all people generally prefer blue, something researchers have long known. The study also found that while both men and women liked blue, women tended to pick redder shades of blue. This is in the article that is titled,

Why Women Like Pink. You might like a bluer blue than I like. Maybe. For I am a woman. And I am not. I'm not Isn't amazing So the way they did this study

Did I do fact check that Oh is that what you would Yeah That's why he checked his junk Oh no Check my nappy Which I still wear Your man nappy

That's what I was wondering why you're wearing a hat Around your junk Yeah You have been confused for a long time You're gonna flip Flip your lid I'm gonna flop I'm gonna flop

I'm gonna flop my lid Oh That was unfortunate unfortunate wording So the way they did this study, and it really, like, it was picked up by media, if it came out now, you definitely would be talking about it or at work, I reckon, Dave. It's that kind of study. Oh, yeah.

The ones that just get picked up across all newspapers and websites and they just run with it because it's a great headline. And it's good, you know, good conversation fodder, yeah. Yeah, and I found, I found many, many articles about it. Some, you know, favorable and some just got basically just repeating what the press release would have said. So the way they did the study was they first showed block colors. You know, like blue was favored by men and women when they showed multiple different colors. But then they started showing blended colors.

And they found men preferred green blues and women red blues. How this proves women like pink, I don't not fully understand. To me, it kind of proves the opposite, like they like blue. Blue and pink are the options. And men and women prefer blue, and according to them, it's been long known. Because that did come up a lot. Blue just seems to be across the board people's favourite colour, which is why I thought that was interesting that you two both feel that way.

We are very vanilla people. I mean, it's the colour of the sky, the colour of the ocean. Two of the most... Whereas pink is the colour of nothing. I know. That's really hard to think of. pink things whereas Don't Google

Pink Things Okay Google Pink things Pornhub.com Yeah Like your pink bits You know Yeah

Do you know what I'm talking about? When I did that I did that Genitals Yeah All right Anyway okay How do you say

How do you say Genetal How do you say How do you say Yeah Just give me some Brum Bapap

So basically the end here. I just got this quote from an article on the BBC, which I think some things up a little bit. Various studies have looked at colour preferences in different age groups. In the US, most have found that babies and toddlers, whether male or female, are attracted to primary colors such as red and blue.

Pink doesn't feature high on the list, although it is more popular than brown and grey. Yeah, because they fucking suck. Brown is poo and grey is sadness. I could understand brown more than pink in a lot of ways because brown is... It's chocolate and it's coffee and it's the dirt and it's... It's just everywhere, right? And shit.

I know. Kids are saying more shit than coffee. Where does pink occur naturally? Some flowers. Fairy floss. Would you obviously naturally occurring fairy floss? What else is? there. That's pink.

The jackets that the pink ladies wear in Greece. That's a good point. Naturally occurring. Of course, they found those jackets. Elderly ladies, the pink rinse hair do. Oh, no, the purple rinse, blue rinse? Pink rinse, they go through them all. I probably do.

You think of fairy floss again? Ah, yes. You saw that time a woman had fairy floss. No, that was a... Yep, anyway, that was going to be a real good riff. Some studies of this age group have found blue as favoured, others read, but they rarely find any gender difference. That's the BBC quote.

So what do you guys think? What do you guys think about it? Do you think it's chicken or do you think it's egg? And what does that mean? What? Okay. A great question. And that one that's hard to unpack.

I'm afraid that's all we have time for. Yeah. Yeah. To me it does. And it feels like this whole report is. probably been leaning towards the side of it's taught rather than inherent. It sounds like a marketing gimmick, like many things in our society turn out to be. I think it sort of comes down to a perception thing too.

Like this phone cover, I nearly didn't buy because the background is pink and I don't really like pink. But it has a little avocado and a piece of toast holding hands. It's fucking adorable and I love avocado on toast. But I didn't want to get it because I didn't want to have a pink. pink phone cover. That would look so good on a yellow. Imagine.

Oh, yeah. Imagine that. I wouldn't have even hesitated if he's on a yellow. That pink is reminding me of strawberry milk, which I love as a cute. Yum. I love strawberry. I'd pick strawberry over chocolate for a milk show. Yeah, big time.

I'd go banana then strawberry. Unless it's a fake banana. Fake banana is pretty wrong. Okay. Banana smoothie I'd take. Sure. Anyway, what are we talking about now? I love a smoothie.

Yeah, it does seem like it's sort of set up, especially if people haven't been doing it for a long time. Well, and also there's all these different areas that actually did the opposite. Say if that is true that the German Catholics dress the kids differently, there's one theory that for a while Christians did the opposite as well. Red was seen as being more Jesus like, the blood of Jesus and his sacrifice. Only Jesus, please. Blue of Virgin Mary, like she was often depicted wearing blue.

Mary doesn't bleed. So that's one theory why that's true. I don't know. I couldn't seem to find anything that's back that up necessarily. But a lot of this is a bit... Sounds like you did a bit more research than scaramucci that it. Scaramucci. He was too busy doing the Fandanga.

One interesting thing. So you want to have some... These are fun slash dull facts. So Dave, you're the expert on dull facts. Jess on fun facts. So true. I'm hoping that one of you will claim each of these. Okay.

If it's somewhere, if neither does. Yeah, then it's nothing. It's a sentence. All right. Hey, hey there.

Oh, hey there. Sort of cut in here. This is Matt coming in later. I, this next fun fact, the first fun fact. As I was editing,

I'm like, did I even check this out? I saw it on one source, which could be a bit dodgy. And then I try, I've just tried to look it up now. And it's, the only place that says it. So it is almost definitely bullshit. But I've left it in because I thought

Dave was being really funny, uh, talking about it. So sorry about this. Real dumb of me. It was the very last thing I read before we went into the studio to record and I didn't, I didn't bloody check it. I've let you down. I've let myself down. I'll let my family down. But most of all, I've let you down. I've let myself down and I've let my family down. Um, sorry about that. But anyway, uh, China probably invented pink for all I know, but it certainly doesn't seem like it first saw it when introduced to it by the West. Apparently, China never saw pink until they had contact with Western culture. Dull.

No, I think that sounds fascinating. So that means it's dull. Look how excited it is. I'm the captain of fun, and I'm bored by that fact. But imagine someone that you don't know exists, comes over the hill and they have a color you've never seen. I thought that was fascinating. That's great. It could happen.

Unlikely. But it could. Like an alien species comes in and goes, this is pump. Pardon? Pomp. Enjoy. And we're like, all right. Red and orange and pink and poop.

Hang on. Hang on. Hang on. I have a question. Yes. So this alien coming over the hill, first of all they speak English.

Well, they speak every language. They're very clever. Secondly, they only came to Earth to give us Pomp. And then they left. Oh, I didn't say they left. Oh, you did. You said, didn't they say bye? Oh, probably.

Goodbye. Well, I mean, he said guy could have been going back over the hill. To get another color? Yeah, another color. What other color were they going to get? Wait, was he just grabbing a color from over the hill? Yeah. Just let me go grab it.

What other colour was he getting? Pomp. Pomp. Pomp and... Light Pomp. Yeah. And then we say, mate, don't try and pull the wall over our eyes. That is clearly just a different shade of Pomp.

He's over the hill with a mixing bucket of white paint. And he's just diluting it to different levels. Into his Pomp paint? This is also Pomp. We're at the point where we can't... We're beyond discovering new colours now, right? Yeah. Well, because, you know, when you get the light of a prism, you can see all across the spectrum.

Right, and they've done that. But there are, I think, like infrared, we can't see with our eyes. Right. But some animals, but some animals can see him. Some animals can see them. Who can see Pomp? Soon. Can we see Pomp?

Yeah. Imagine we're not, we're not enjoying it if we can't see it. Yeah, he says, this is Pomp. And you're like. empty bucket. You're like, I can't see it. And he's like, just trust me, it's there. This is pretty impressive.

Mate, you got a bucket of water. Interesting that the alien is a male. Who said he was male? He said he. You just said he. I didn't I say bud? What? Bud Tingwell.

I mean... Do you have another dull fact? Is they have to lose your shit over? I said he because the alien is hung like a horse. I didn't mention that. Right. And in alien world... Same jennies.

Same jennies. Yeah. How do you say, how do you say jennies? Maybe that's what the J was, the initial statement of a Jenny. Maybe. Jenny Howard. That was a great fact, man. I actually led with the one I thought was most interesting.

Always a good idea, yes. Jess will be so bored by the end of this. Yeah. All right. Pinko. Have you ever heard the term pinko? You bloody pinkos. Oh, no, pinku is Japanese for pink.

That's pingu. Claymation Penguin Yeah Pinko No pinko Yeah like Pinko you're bloody pinko

It's like a Communist left It's communist left And I never put it together But the idea is that they're like a watered down Communists And red is the colour of communism So that's why they're a pinko

I didn't know that anyway That's the thing Hey Dave What did you think of that fact That is great Because I didn't I'd never put two and two And two together

Another dull fact Another dull fact You're lighting me up over here mate And I am bored, stupid. So just, yeah, but Dave is a guy who, he lives in facts. I live with stupid things like this. What do I live in? I don't know, you just live in a happier place than us.

Yeah, you're a higher power. You're on the top of the pyramid. Interesting. You are God. I am God. Pomp. Carry on. I am poop.

The leader in Giro di Italiana. The leader in Giro di Italia. The cycle race. Cycling race. wears a pink jersey. Oh. It's like the yellow in the... Tour de France.

Tour de France. But in the... So is that the big Italian? Yeah, so the three... They call them the grand... I think it's the Grand Tours. Right. The Spanish one is...

Up in the north. Gosh, I can't remember it's cold. So I think pink is sort of like yellow. Their colors that stand out, right? Yeah. So they make sense as that kind of lead... Well, I mean, it's a fluoro pink. Yeah.

It's not a... It's not a musty. You really stand out from the punk. What was Lekelle? Pomp, boom, boom. All right. Here's another thing. Love Walter.

I don't even need to tell you what that was. No, I know. Well, I know. The look on that face tells me you know what it was. I'm not even addressing any of these to you now. You may as well. That's rude. You could step off.

Just for the record. Can I go home? Yeah, I think so. So no one tweets me. I know, it's Love Welter. It's the Spanish one. Great. I don't know what color they have, though.

Don't tweet him. Tweet him. As spoken about on our Montreal screw job episode, Pink is worn by Brett the Hitman Heart. But he also, for a little while, co-owned a hockey team called the Calgary Hitman, Hitman. That makes more sense. And they originally, they wore a pink outfit. Did they? A uniform.

Yeah. Pink. What kind of pink, though? All right, guys, put on you. Put on your outfits. Your team outfit. And then the final one, I think that one might not have even been. Did they get either of you at all interested?

No, I liked it because I like Bret the Head Manheart. So, dull. And then finally, in 2013. Now he's owning the dull. Then I'm loving one than dull. In 2013, 30 cells in Swiss jails were reportedly painted pink in an attempt to calm aggressive prisoners down as part of a project called Cool Down Pink. Love it.

A police spokesman in the town said, it really seems to work. They quieten down and go to sleep much more quickly in a pink room. Wow. That is very dull. And I love it. I actually kind of enjoyed that one. Oh, okay.

Apparently they put them in there for about two hours and normally they're asleep in 15 minutes. Oh, cute. But apparently also a lot of the prisoners hate it. Again, I need to know what shade. Yes. I don't know that's a soft calming pink. I don't sleep well.

So any trick. I can get. Yeah, apparently pink, I've read that a few times. Pink is a real. Pink groom. So I was imagining like electric pink. Like as pink. Hot pink.

Like, wouldn't that make you feel like? Yeah, it would be overwhelmed. It makes you want to just have fun. I think it would be a bit crazy. Yeah. I'm thinking like a wet pink. So it looks, I don't know. A wet pink.

Like an oil, like it looks oily. It's what you're going to? Yes. A wet pink. Yes. I was thinking like a real soft pink. A dry pink? That makes sense.

No, I don't think you want to dry pink. A wet pink. Not a wet pink, no, a powdered pink. You couldn't think of the word glossy. I'm still thinking wet. It looks wet. Like it hasn't dried? Yes.

So it's glossy. So it's dripping down the wall? But it's wet. I think you're drunk. Anyway, that is the episode. That was great. That is, when you said the topic, I thought, can you get a whole hour out of this? And you did more?

So, great son. Boy, did you? No, that was, that's, I've never thought about it, but now I have. And at the end of that, my children, no matter what, will be wearing blue because it is definitely the best color. Yeah, people, people are attracted to blue. I'm going to put my kids in cute clothes, regardless of the color of them. Yeah. Mine will be dressed in Saints uniforms.

Red, white and black, baby. One's red, one's white, one's black. Three kids. Perfect. Put them together. I love it. A little emo kid. Yeah, that's no good on a hot day.

What are the child? All in white. Yeah. You're going to have a lot of trouble cleaning that. You're going to have your Roosevelt. Yeah, now, don't worry. It's just to put them all in dresses so they can shit all over them. Is that right?

Is that why it was? Yeah. Well, thank you, Matt. And thank you to everyone that's support of this week's episode and supports the show in general by hitting up our Patreon. Patreon. Patreon.com slash do go on pod is where you can pledge back to the show if you really like it. And we really like it when you do that because it makes the show happen. And just by chipping in, one, two, five, ten, a million dollars a month.

Who knows? It helps the show. And also you get rewards in exchange for it, including a bonus episode once a month. We're not far off having two bonus episodes every single month. So that's something to look out for. And also we'd like to thank some people by name and by number. Yeah, that's right. Okay.

Pledge number. Let's give them all a colour. Yeah, great. We did give coloured houses last week with the blue house. I do. How about it? This time we'll give them a color. A shade.

A colour nappy. Great. Great. What nappy will they be wearing? I mean, that's another thing like now, it's not like gender is binary. Like that's pretty clear, right? So even on that level, it's quite bizarre that there's only two colors. Sure, yeah, yeah, great point.

So it feels like it's only a matter of time. time before it's abandoned. But there will be like this, for a while people will say PC police and stuff. But they'll get it. I just want my daughter to wear pink. It's like, why can't girls just wear pink and boys wear blue? Let girls be girls and men hit their wives. You know?

She's that escalated. Sorry for getting too real. It's not a bit real. Is that too real? Who wants to start? I think you should, yes. Okay. I would like to say.

thank. This is our Patreon supporters. Thank you so much. From Sierra Vista. I would like... A whale's vagina. Does that what that means? I would like to thank Joshua Romerfield.

Good name. Great name. Josh Rummerfield. And what colour nappy diaper would Josh have? I want to say Move. Move. Oh, that's a great colour. Sierra means a long, jagged mountain chain

And vista means view, right? So, mountain view. Yeah, that's right. View of the mountain. That's great. That's a nice. I'm guessing it's a mountainish place. Do you approve of the Move Nappy for Josh?

Not mountainous. Do you know? Mountain-ish. Big confession. Yeah. I know a few things, but I'm very bad with color. It's like a purpley color. That's what I was imagining, but I wanted to confirm.

Correct. And that's kind of why, instead of saying purple, I said Move. I was like, let's fuck with Dave because he's a fucking idiot. Bad. Okay, so Josh, you've got a Move diaper. Congratulations and thank you for your support. Use it wisely. I would also like to thank Jacob Pol now.

Pole no, poll now. Paul now. Paul now. Paul often. Jake. Jacob. What color is Jacob wearing? And he's from just said the name. I can't.

Kowashkum. Kewiskem. Kewiskem. That makes sense to me. there was no H in there. Qiscombe, is that Wisconsin? Let me see. Wisconsin.

That's what I said. Okay, so Jacob from Kewskim, Wisconsin. What color? I'd say lime green is what it came instinctively. That is nice. You've got to go with your gut. You've got to go with your gut. Lime green, that's nice, very fresh.

And into that nappy, he will go with his gut. Gut first. Dave. Can I, please. underline what Jess just said in thanking Jacob Pol Now What a name, I love it. That is a great name. I've never heard that as a last name.

Pole now. It's like a call now. Pole now. Call now. Only for people who communicate with polls. I think there is a website called Poll Now. Do you think he came up with it? If he did, all the best.

If he did, all the best. If he didn't. Oh, fuck him. Fuck him. I'd love to think from County Antrim, almost definitely not how to pronounce it, an Irish county in Ireland. Although it says GB,

so does that mean maybe that's Northern Ireland? That would make sense. Ian Irving from Carrick Fergus. Oh, that is good. Carrick Fergus, Ian Irving, Ian with two eyes. Oh, okay, and what colour then? I'm thinking Cerulean. Oh, you're fucking Googling colours.

No, no. I'm just saying colors. You didn't know Move. You know Cerulian. Serulian blue. What the fuck is that? It's actually, I think I know that because that's what Frida Carlos house was painted last wood. Oh, that's a nice blue.

That is a very nice blue. Yeah, that's my kind of blue. Yeah, it's me too. And that, I'll give it to Ian. That's nice. Ian can shit into my blue all day long. Shit into my blue. No.

First, he's swimming in pink. No, you're shit with my blue. Thank you so much, even, you guru. I'd also love to thank Lucas Bengsten from Sankt Oloff in Sweden. Okay. That is. Lucas. Right.

That blue color just said isn't that far off the Swedish flag blue. So maybe he could have the yellow? I was thinking yellow, genuinely. Yeah, I'm thinking it. But like a nice yellow, not a mustard, like a bright. Like a Swedish yellow. Like a Swedish yellow. Yes.

Do you reckon he'd be happy with Swedish yellow, a Swedish man? I hope so. I'd be happy with Australian blue. I reckon we give him true blue as a backup. Australian true blue. True blue. True. True.

Me and you. Is it mom and dad? Or is it a cockatoo? Is it hanging by your mates when they're in a fight? What is happening? Is this, I think it's really the word. I don't know the words. Or will she be right?

True blue. They're close to the words. Wow, that's a shocker. That's something, isn't it? True blue. I hate it. I'm asking you. Is it the same guy that sings up there?

Because A, Lee's that same guy. It's the same guy that sings, Rip, rip, wood chip. Put him up your banner. Put him up your banner. I thought I knew what that. What that mean? I knew and I realized I didn't.

Shove it up your bar. Barna, mate. Shob it up. Same guy saying, Give us a home among the gum trees. Oh, no, this one. We're lots of plum trees. A sheep or two and a kangaroo.

A clothes line out the back. Miranda out the front and an old rocking chair. I sing all the way to Prosser in Washington State where one of the best live. And that best person's name is Patrick Burnett or Patrick Burnett. Burny Patty Patrick What are you feeling

What are you feeling Give me something Well Because I was thinking Burning I couldn't help I think Some sort of charcoal

Fuck off Okay I literally thought charcoal Charcoal I think Well I think that's a Contriced Did you look at the wall

Too Because I looked at the wall And saw charcoal His diaper Is charcoal Why do we I didn't ever I missed that

I was wondering What you're talking about Are we colouring their diapers Yeah Right Last week we color their houses is we're coloring their diapers. Charcoal.

And we're saying diapers. Oh yeah, because they're in America. Because he's in Washington. Gotcha. Makes sense. Jesus, Matt. Pay attention. No, I'm sorry.

But yeah, charcoal for Patrick. Patrick Burnett or Patrick Burnett. Please enjoy your charcoal diaper. Charcoal's a beautiful color. I love charcoal. I'm wearing a charcoal t-shirt right now. A charcoal mall. That's charcoal?

Jesus Christ, Dave. Sorry. And I would like to thank finally from Mount Gambia in our great state of South Australia. South Australia's second largest city. This will be a nappy. What? This would be a nappy. Oh, Mount Gambier is.

I thought you were saying South Australia was the second largest city. I was like, oh dear. A little fun fact about South Australia. I would like to thank the resident of Mount Gambia. Alice Lasslett. Alice. Alice Lestlet. I'm thinking Lassie, I'm thinking golden.

Ooh, gold. Gold nappy. Gold nappy. Oh, how regal. How rare. Good for you, Alice. I'll wash it out and give it at least a couple of goes because. I think it's a soft metal.

It's only that much. Yeah. Malleable. Yeah. Good for you, Alice. Thank you, Alice. Not the most absorbent. But hopefully you're not shitting yourself anymore.

Yeah. Really, it's just underpants. Decrative now. Decrative nappies. Yeah, we're just giving you all underpants, actually, haven't we? You're all adults. I don't think I've said the word underpants in a while. Underpants.

Underpants. It sounds so formal. Undies. What are you usually call them? I don't know. Reg Grundy's? You just don't wear them. I don't wear them or talk about them.

I would, it just doesn't come up in conversation a lot. Well, okay. I'm talking about them daily. Are you? I'm bringing them up. Yeah, I never, never talking about it. Bringing them up at the meetings at work. It's very strange.

First thing I say at work, morning, how's your undies? You must. Would not encourage that kind of behavior in the current climate of the world. Interesting. Traditional greeting in TV. The workplace. And radio. That's where I work.

TV. Sorry, telephone. You work in telephone, don't you? I work in TP. Tollipaper? Yeah. But I'm going to say, it's a big thank you to Alice, Patrick, Lucas, Ian, Jacob, and Joshua for supporting the show. Good memory, Warnocky.

Thank you so much. Thank you so much everyone that does support the show at patreon.com slash do go on pod. And you want to drop us online at any time. The links are in the description of this episode. It's at do go on pod for all our social medias and do go on pod at gmail.com. We do love hearing from you. And there is now a link in the description of this episode.

If you want to click it, you can submit an idea directly to the hat. It goes into the mainframe. We get it. It's hooked up to the cloud, I think. Yeah. And even if you did put one in a long time ago and hasn't come up yet, I'd recommend putting into the new system.

I still go through both hats. Yeah. But the new hat is so much easy to use that it's probably worth putting it back in there. Yeah, have you got a ripping topic? I chuck it in. I've moved a bunch from over, but they don't have, like, they're missing so much information that the new ones ask for, like where you're from and a good resource and categorizing.

Categorizing. And why you think we'll make a good episode? That's always interesting. So thanks again for everyone that does support the show. And you were also supporting this right about listening to it. Thank you. Thank you so much. We love you.

And the listener who suggested this topic, I'm so sorry that I didn't take your name down that night. I mentally made a note. Tweet me and I'll thank you next week. But thank you so much for the topic. Thank you so, so much. Suggest a topic anytime, as we were saying. And until next week, we will be back then,

but we won't be back in between. So we're taking the normal amount of time. The normal amount of time. Yes, just in. We're taking six days off. We will be taking six days off. But we will be like with a new episode next Wednesday, our time. And until then, I will say thank you and goodbye.

Later. Bye. This podcast is part of the Planet Broadcasting Network. Visit planetbcasting.com for more podcasts from our great mates. I mean, if you want. It's up to you. We should have called our podcast, OK, Google. What could have been to Google?

It would have been even. even harder topic thing to search for. Good point. And do go on is... Good point. No, that's the beauty of it. Oh. Yeah, I think.

If I understand technology. I don't. I don't get it. I think in the modern age, you want to be unfindable. Yes. That's one of the buzzwords of being here. Unfindable? Unfoundable.

That is a real buzzword. But also, do hit us up if you want to... If you're part of this comedy cruise that I'm thinking about. Comedy crews. On international waters. No. Look, if you can make it happen, Dave, I'm up for it. I knew you would be, man.

Never, me again. All of a sudden, expected parents. All the sudden, expectant parents. Well, that's not going to seem like a natural laugh. He still fucked it. Oh, did I? All of a sudden, all of a sudden, as a sudden, as previously parents

as previously parents would prepare gender I've put a comma there at an awkward spot as previously gent as previously taking that comma out I'm so sorry I can't hear you Dave and I'm just getting this little whisper in my ears

are you getting that? No I love you love you too Jess yeah um fuck you Dave Don't forget to sign up to our tour mailing list so we know where in the world you are

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