Do Go On - 267 - Ching Shih, The Pirate Queen

Episode Date: December 2, 2020

Born into relative obscurity, Ching Shih burst onto the world stage in 1801 and would quickly become the most successful pirate in history, commanding tens of thousands of pirates and ruling the South China Sea.Buy tickets to our live streamed shows, (buy a season pass to get 4 for the price of 3! You can also watch old streams, all with exclusive sections):https://sospresents.com/authors/dogoonSupport the show and get rewards like bonus episodes: patreon.com/DoGoOnPodCheck out our AACTA nominated web series: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL2TuMQ31VXvqqEus9Bo6FZW-dDY5ukEuh Submit a topic idea directly to the hat: dogoonpod.com/Submit-a-TopicTwitter: @DoGoOnPodInstagram: @DoGoOnPodFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/DoGoOnPod/Email us: [e-mail] out our other podcasts:Book Cheat: https://play.acast.com/s/book-cheatPrime Mates: https://play.acast.com/s/prime-mates/Listen Now: https://play.acast.com/s/listen-now/Our awesome theme song by Evan Munro-Smith and logo by Peader ThomasREFERENCES AND FURTHER READING:https://www.atlasobscura.com/articles/the-chinese-female-pirate-who-commanded-80000-outlawshttps://medium.com/history-of-yesterday/ching-shih-a-prostitute-who-became-historys-deadliest-pirate-f596f7fcff23https://www.ancient-origins.net/history-famous-people/ching-shih-prostitute-pirate-lord-002582http://www.todayifoundout.com/index.php/2012/06/the-female-prostitute-that-rose-to-become-one-of-the-most-powerful-pirates-in-history-and-whose-armada-took-on-the-chinese-british-and-portuguese-navies-and-won/http://www.cindyvallar.com/chengsao.html

Melbourne and Canada, we got exciting news for you. And we should also say this is 2026. Jess, what year is it? 2026. Thank God you're here. Right now, I'm in Melbourne doing my show with Serenji Amarna, 630 each night at the Cooper's Inn Hotel, having so much fun. We'd love to see you there.

Canada, we are visiting you in September this year. If you've somehow missed the news, we are heading up Vancouver, Calgary, Montreal and Toronto for shows. That's going to be so much fun. Tickets for all this stuff, I believe, are online. And I'm here too. This podcast is part of the Planet Broadcasting Network. Visit planetbroadcasting.com for more podcasts from our great mates.

Hey everyone is saying before you listen to this week's episode, why not watch it? That's right. This was recorded as the second in our season of live streams on our world tour. This one, we were live from Asia. Can you believe that? I can. I was there. Oh, you were talking to them?

No, I was talking to you. Okay, great. And if you'd like to watch this as well as last week's episode, and the next two episodes, you can even get a season pass, where you get four shows for the price of three, and you can watch at any time at sOS presents.com. It includes the episode, and then and also an extra bonus show that we did just for the live stream.

All right, here's the audio. Hello and welcome to another episode of Do Go On. My name is Dave Warnocky, and as always, I'm here with Jess Perkins, and you guessed it. It's Matt Stewart. I did guess it, and my name is Jess Perkins. Oh, hey, Jess Perkins. I'm Matt Stewart and he's Dave Warnocky for you. Thank you.

If you hadn't met him as yet. How wonderful. It's great to be here. Yes. It is. It's so good to be here. We're doing a world tour on live streaming. And it is so good to be here in Asia this week.

That's where we are. So we're doing these live at an appropriate time for different regions of the world. And it is prime time 7 p.m.-ish in Asia. It's 7pm in China right now, I do believe. So, you know, they've probably turned neighbours off. They've probably switched off the Simpsons repeat. Wow. And you know what?

We've got a live stream straight in from the Stupid Old Studios in Shanghai. They're choosing us over Simpsons reruns. Wow. I find that hard to believe. Well, I've just checked the viewership here, and the entire country is tuning around. Now, there is over a billion people watching the stream. And I still don't have 10,000. followers on Instagram.

You're joking. Sorry about that. You are joking. I believe some of their websites are geo-blocked. So let's blame that. That's fair. Yeah. If they could, they would.

Exactly. If they could, if they could, you'd have over a billion followers. Whoa, that's too much responsibility. Yeah. I don't want that. I hope somebody's listening to this in the future and they're like, what are you talking about? She has like 20,000.

You know what I mean? 20 billion. Yeah. Every person on Earth just created three accounts each. just to follow you. That'd be sick. Are you some sort of global dictator? Yes!

But like a fun one. Yeah. It's about time someone brought the fun back to fundamentalism, I think. I could not agree more. The fun police, but the actual fun police. Yeah. Hey Matt, what is this show? Well, I would love to explain it, but unfortunately my job's been taken by someone else this week.

Dave put the call out a while ago to ask for 60s-style jingles to explain the show. we're no good at explaining it five years in. It's so hard. It's really hard. And then, yeah, I put the call out. We had our first one last week from Puerto Rico. And it was an absolute banger. I loved it.

It was great. But, yeah, they've continued to come in. And I believe Matt has organized to play one now. Yeah, so we've got one. This one, I believe, is coming from Australia, only because they referenced Triple M. Okay. This is from Jason Harrison.

He says, it's not really a 60s TV theme, more of an American late-night show across with triple M. Okay. But this is my submission for a silly intro theme. So, yeah, this one will explain everything. Great. Hit it.

Coming at you from stupid old studios in Melbourne, Australia. This is the show where one of them does a report on the topic and the other two sit quietly and listen. This is Jess, Matt and Dave, and this show is called Dude Go on. Can I just say that song made me think, Triple M rocks football. Triple M. That was so succinct.

Jason, that was fantastic. Why have we struggled so much? Do you reckon he scripted it or that was his off the cuff? I don't know. It made me feel good. Made me feel happy. Was that a samba? Yeah.

I mean, that was nearly Jimmy Barnes. He's got piano in his email address. So I reckon he probably played it. That's sick. And yeah, that felt real good. That was awesome. Thank you so much for that. Thank you so much.

Do you think he's any relation to George? I can only assume yes. Yeah. I mean, how common a name is Harrison? I've never heard of it before. So, yeah. It's probably his nephew or some shit. Yeah, how are I'm awesome?

How is that? Probably his son. Whoa. It's probably George Harrison. Could it be? Yeah. Yeah. So.

That's quite an honour. It's huge. I mean, it is anyway. Even if you're not. But even more so if you're a real. Honestly, even more so. I mean, come on. Even more.

So if you are, the Beatle who died before we started this podcast, that would be a real honour. That would be pretty crazy. So now that we know how this show works. So we always start with the question. It is my turn to do the report that Jason spoke about there. And the question to get us onto topic is, who is the most successful pirate in history? Blue beard, black beard. We already did.

Red beard. I've got a clue here. Clue, it ain't black beard. and it ain't Long John Silva or even Captain Feather Sword. Is it a lady pirate? It is a lady pirate. There's been... I've seen this in the hat.

I reckon I put her up for a vote. I think I might have as well. And the name completely escapes me now. Okay, so the subtitle might be the Chinese pirate queen. And we are talking about Ching Shi. Ah, yes. This has been suggested by a few people. Yeah, quite a few people have suggested.

I put it up for a Patreon vote. I put up three topics all set in Eastern Asia. And this was the clear winner. So thanks to everyone that voted. And thanks to all the people that have suggested it over the years, going honestly years back. So first of all, listen to that we used to speak to a lot. Cecil suggested it way back.

Jacob Buckler, get ready for this name. Bernard, Antonio Vera McCaffery. Fuck yes, Bernard. All one name. Johnny Dawson, Brielle Strobel, Abby Garland, Josh, Warn, Darcy Williamson, Bryce Richards and Kelly Tray. God damn, some good names in there. Thank you so much.

Great batch of names. Awesome. So you guys, I've put it, maybe put it up for the vote before. She's come second, I think. Yeah. You guys have done a similar thing? I think so, yeah. I think I must have put it up to the vote at some point.

And I haven't, you know, sometimes when you're going through the hat and you're looking for things to maybe put to the vote, you do like a quick preliminary check to go, is there any information on this story or? So maybe sometimes you do like a very quick one paragraph read. I don't even, I can't remember anything. I don't know if I've read much, if anything about this topic. So I'm very excited about this. Awesome.

Well, there's actually, there's not too much info on there out there. But what I have found is quite interesting. Okay. Let us begin. Very little is known about the early life of the woman that would become known as Ching She. She basically pops up in the history books as an adult in 1801. This was during the Qing Dynasty, which was the last imperial dynasty of China, lasting from 1644 to 1912. And Qingshi was probably born somewhere around the Guangdong province of China in about 1775, meaning that when she pops up, she's probably 25 or 26.

Yeah, okay. She was then working as a sex worker in a floating brothel in the city of Canton. Flooding brothel. Yeah, never even thought of that. Of course. International waters? Is that what they were just trying to get off the land laws? It makes everything better.

International waters. Forget a water bed. Obviously, that's helpful in the trade. Have a water bloody whole boat. Have a water boat. A water boat. Get yourself a water boat. First of all, I used to have a regular boat.

It didn't do much. So I got a water boat. Yeah. And now everything's great. Honestly, I sleep so well now on my water boat. So according to Medium.com, which has an article about Ching Shi, quote, these boats would sail a lot of, the nearby coasts were the customer on board.

Back then, the Chinese perceived that the rocking of the boat added an entirely new dimension to sexual pleasures and enhanced the overall experience. At that time in history, did they not know you could move during sex? Very, very stationary. Honestly, when the boat moves, it actually kind of makes it better. Otherwise, it used to take days. Just like very chill.

We're both having a good time now. Before, neither of us was. Oh, we're done in three minutes. Yeah. I've got four days back up the sleeve now. That's pretty choppy out. So during the late 1700s in China and Vietnam, land was annexed and chopped up and redistributed by many parties,

and many displaced farmers and fishermen turned to a life of piracy to survive. Okay. They lost their jobs. Yep. We've got to do something. Piracy. Piracy. That makes sense.

The bush ranges of the sea, I like to call them. The bush ranges of the sea? Yeah. So a rebellion broke out on the Vietnam-China border, and one of the rebels provided money to pirates to take revenge on China. Okay. So basically, he won the war and then China in him eventually made up, but he never forgave them.

So to secretly fuck up their shit, he started giving money to pirates, being like, you'll work this out for me. And this meant that in the 1790s, And his piracy in the South China and the South China coast rapidly increased. Right. Because there's more money in piracy now. It was in 1801 that today's main character, Qingxi, married notorious pirate Cheng Yi, also known as Zhang Yi, who was the leader of the Red Flag fleet of pirates.

Okay. Which is a pretty badass name. Oh, Red Flag. It's not the scariest gang name. Okay. I'd like to hear a scary. one? Fire skulls.

That's pretty good. Do you know what I mean? Yeah. You try. I mean, no pressure, only if you want to. Boggy boys. Boggy boys. That's scarier than red flag pirates.

What's the gang symbol for the boogie boys? It's a four-wheel drive and the back two tires are like half covered in mud. But they are bogged. They're all leaning out with their thumbs up. because they're not fast. Yeah. And a few of them are doing this. Yeah.

Do it some shuckers. Because they're the boggy boys. Yeah, we're bogged, but we're not bummed. We're happy to be here. We love to be bogged. It's when we're our happiest. Our wet boat is bogged. So yeah, anyway, okay.

Oh, scary pirates. Oh, Red Flag Gang. So she's married Cheng. His family had been pirates for generations. Very famous pirate family. He had managed to unite many rival Chinese pirate organizations. And because of this, He exerted a lot of power in China and in Vietnam.

Okay. So he was a bad boy. All right. In 1798, he kidnapped a 15-year-old boy named Chung Po Sai, who was the son of a fisherman. Cheng took Chung, which translates to Cheng Po the kid under his wing and treated him like a son. Chung Po was a talented part, being smart, brave and a good fighter. And Chung eventually adopted the teenager. as his own.

Oh, okay. So he kidnapped him. Yeah, he stole him from his family. Then he trialed him out for a bit. Yeah. He went, oh, this kid's got what it takes. He passed a few pirate tests. Then they had to go into like the council offices, fill out some forms, make it official.

Is that what you're telling me? That's exactly what they did. Yeah, right. These pirates do everything by the book. That's one thing that's very important. I respect that. I love rules. So he's, yeah, okay, so he's kidnapped a kid.

He's gone, oh, maybe you could be useful to me. I'll adopt you. Maybe you could be the heir to my throne. Yeah, probably he wanted, yeah, someone to take over. My water throne. Ah, my water closet. No, that's different. Son, one day this water closet will be yours.

Really? Thank you. That's what they call closets on boats. Water closets. Yeah, that's what it came from. Yeah, it's water everything. A king once accidentally shattered in his boat's closet. And he said, no, I'm meant to.

Water closets are for shitting in. And that's how it got its name. Yeah, that is true. It always comes back to Kings. It does. Kings can do anything. If they stuff something up, they've got the power to be like, no. Yeah.

Meant to be. You're doing it wrong. It's always some sort of king-related administrative error. Yeah. Good on Kings. Good on Kings. They've had it too hard for too long. Yeah, poor Kings.

Give them a bloody go. So it's unclear how Cheng Yi first met the 25-year-old sex worker that would become his wife. Some sources say that he was infatuated with Ching Shi and ordered his men to bring her to him when they ransacked the brothel. Others say that he just asked her to marry him. Either way, a beautiful romantic story. Gorgeous, gorgeous. Every girl's dream. I don't know if it's an either way scenario there, Dave. I think one of those more romantic than the other. Which one?

I'm not going to say. I'm not here. I'm not here to be telling people what is and what isn't romantic. I'm just saying definitively, one of those is and one of those isn't. Do you reckon that romance is quite subjective? No. Good grief, no. Okay.

Yeah, sorry I asked a stupid question there. What's the most romantic thing? There's one way to romance. What's the most romantic thing? What's the only romantic thing? Yeah, universally accepted. It's the most romantic thing. thing, like object.

Yeah. Oh, it's obviously a big piece of metal and rubber out of coating. Right, like some sort of aluminium baseball bat. Mate, you are making my heart sing right now. Baby, I love you this much. I'm learning so much from you. Yeah, yeah. I'm learning so much about you.

You just hit my love out of the park. Wow. This ain't no foul ball. My love. Hey, my heart's bases are loaded. And we're on the second strike. Four balls. You're losing this analogy.

Come on. World Series. Just tell Dave to do you go on. Crowds full. You're my babe Ruth. They're all watching us. You've just pointed to the stand. Then to my dick.

You knocked it out of the park Knock the dick out of the park Oh my God Are you right? They're on the romantic thing Do you need a hospital? Your dick just got knocked out of the park With love

Oh Okay If it's with love that's all right That's all right then So we're not sure how they got together But either way the woman So the moment this woman pops up in history We realize that she must

Have commanded some sort of real presence Because she married Chang This famous pirate guy and she was immediately granted a 50% control and share of his pirate crew. As it should be. I should have got her to sign a pre-up. What's yours is mine? I don't know.

I did not sign a pre-up. So yeah. Wow. So she's like quite suddenly very powerful. Exactly. Really moved up in the world. Yeah. Diane H. Murray in Pirates of the South China Coast, which is book on this era. She says,

Ching participated fully in her husband's piracy. So she wasn't just a bystander. She was straight in there. Walking planks. Oh, absolutely. Testing planks. Testing planks. Swobbing the poop decks.

Swobbing them. Sharpening swords. Oh, yeah. She, yeah, top to bottom. She was involved in every inch of the business. Loading cannons. Invoicing. Yeah.

Inventory. But also killing cunnies. She'd do that too. Oh, yeah. That was their favorite thing. Two-sie accounts, then go kill 100 people. Yeah. And then, like, put in an order for more toilet paper.

Yeah, yeah. To mop up the blood of her enemies. Exactly, yeah, yeah. That's what reminded her. She used the last bit to mop up blood. It went, bloody hell. Oh, God. I got to get some new bog rolls.

I could get a mop, but that's not how we do things around here. No. For some reason. I used toilet paper to mop up blood, and we use mops to wipe our asses. History. Hey? We've learnt things, you know. Some of their customs might seem a little strange to us in the future.

But it worked for them. So she's granted 50% of the business. She was also granted 50% of his son because she formally adopted the now 18-year-old Chung Po as her own son. Okay, but he's 18. He's 18. Does he need to be adopted now?

Well, according to... Which half, she took? Bottom. She took the bottom half. Her legs. Yeah. Yeah, I think in the pirate game, they're the ones you want.

Spare legs. Yeah. Because they're often taking wood. Yeah. Pags. But if you've got two spare legs, There you go. Ready to go.

Yeah. Yeah, that's smart. I thought top half was my first instinct. Top half. Very yappy. Yeah, yappy, very yappy. Legs can't chat back. Not very leggy.

No. I was also a bit like, why would you adopt an 18-year-old? According to Atlas Obscura, which has another article on this, unlike in the West, adult adoption was often practiced in China in order to establish a kinship basis for further interaction, particularly of a business. type. So he was in line basically to the throne of this pirate kingdom. Yeah, right. So she's like, yeah, we'll adopt you formally, but really he was more of a protege than a son. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But is she not mid-20s? So she's only slightly older than him? Yeah. Okay. But she did make him call her mum. Yeah, fair enough. I make most people call me mum to be fair. Yeah. As you know.

Yes, mum. It feels weird every time, but you wouldn't. I'm two days older than you. You call me mum. That's the rule. But they were now a fully functioning pirate family unit. They began to run the pirate fleet together. Aw.

Beautiful. This can't go wrong in my eyes. It can't. And this family unit turned out to be great at piracy. With Chang and his wife and now adopted son of the helm, the Red Flag Fleet quickly grew. Still think you could use the name change. Red flag fleet.

Red flag fleet. Flag feet. Yeah, it's tricky. I think it's going to slip people up. The RFF? Yeah. FF. That's fun.

RFF. RFF. That is fun. Okay, good. I'll call on that from now and if I can remember. Through a combination of violence and Qing's reputation, they were able to form an alliance with rival Cantonese fleets. In a few years, they went from 200 ships to more than 600 ships, eventually peaking at an estimated 17 to 1800 ships.

Get out of 10. What would you name them all? They've all got names. One, two. Yeah, that's the only easy way. Bill. Oh no, Dave. The system has really lost.

One. One number two. Two, two. Bill two. Bill the second. One the bill. It sounds complicated, but once you memorize it, it's very easy. One bill two.

One bill, two, one. One bill, two, Bill. All the way between... That's so many boats. What yearish was this again? Early 1800s now. Right. All late 1790s.

These ships were junk ships, which is a type of sailing ship. The word junk comes from a translation of a Javanese word for ship, Jong, which the Portuguese translated as Junco, and then in English it developed into junk. Junk ships. Okay. It's like in every house there's a junk drawer. Exactly.

You know, it's where like scissors and ribbon. Second or third draw. There's a ship in there and that's what they... Gotcha. You think of scissors as junk? To be fair, that's always where the left-handed scissors were in my house growing up. Left-handed scissors are gone. I can't think of one use.

The normal scissors would be out like, you know, with pens and some. They're like on display. It's like a cabinet. They're hanging out with their friends. They're living their lives. They're cool. They're popular. And there's like two or three pairs. They're scissering down the street.

Because they use so often they get worn out. Yeah, so used by everyone. Yeah, everyone loves them. Yeah, yeah. Everyone. It is good, isn't it? I love scissors. The fleet ended up being so large that they had to color code them.

Ah, that makes no sense. One bill, two bill. Yeah, I mean, it's not a perfect system, but the Leeser system. Yeah, that's right. The blue album. Black Album. Weid, they were calling them album. Yeah.

How do you get 1,700 different colors, though? Oh, you just have to be. You go to Juleux.com. How do it do it? How do they do it? Cyan. Yeah. Magenta.

Yes. Crimson. Ooh. Claret. Oh, Bill. What's Claret? Red. It's one of the reds.

Yeah, cool. Don't know that one. Now I've learned something. Again, I've learned so much from you. Thank you. I'm a font of wisdom. Fount of wisdom? The lead fleet, where we found,

And Ching and Ching, that was red, so they're the red flag. Okay. The other colours were black, white, blue, yellow and green. Okay. And it says here font. Ah. Perfect. That's so funny.

That's just what Matt was saying. There you go. Wow. But sadly, all good things must come to an end. It is so early for an all good things must come to an end. Wait, we, no. Well, the name we all know her now in history, Ching Shi, that actually translates as Cheng's widow.

Oh. And she got that name because Cheng died. It wasn't like a funny nickname and then he died and suddenly they're like, geez, this is a bit awkward. Oh, boy. We've been calling you, like, yeah, we've been calling him dead man walking as a joke and now he's dead. That is amazing that her name, what you've been calling her is her ex-husband, widow.

Yeah, that's what it translates. Because that's what she's known as in history. They're not even that sure. what her name was at 25 when she appears in history. She became... I've got a quick theory. Yeah. She just hit the scene.

All of a sudden, he dies, and she takes over. He's been very generous, giving her everything. I reckon it's just, it's like an Adam Sandler scenario, where the same guy's playing both characters, Mrs. Doubtfire. She's gone, she's like, oh, where's Chan? And it was getting too much. She was having to come back to the poop deck.

It's like, oh, you want. want my husband, Cheng. Well, sorry, I'm Cheng Shee. Is that right? And she looks in the mirror. And then she runs off and she has to get a man hair on. She comes back. Yeah.

And it got so tiring. She's like, I'm killing off the man character. It was fun for a bit. But I've established myself now. And then you also get a bit of the sympathy as well. Right. Yeah, totally. It sort of helps you.

Yeah. I love sympathy. Do you crave it? I love it. Give it to me. So, sadly... Hey, you'll be all right, your little trooper. Just go, oh.

Aw. Yeah, that's the good shit. That's what you wanted? Aww. Oh, look at her have a go. That's the good shit. So sadly, Chang has died. His death in Vietnam at the age of 39, six years into their marriage, was quite unexpected.

So I was six years of her two and and throwing. That's a lot of effort. That's so much time. to doubt fire. Yeah. Oh, good commitment to the bit. I'm going to say. There's only so many cream pies in China.

Yeah. Hello. I have on good authority. She did speak like that. So do you know how he died? No, there's many, many theories. Some say he died and it's like a typhoon. Other people say that he may have been poison.

There's many. What do you reckon? I think he died of a broken heart. Yeah. Oh. But they were still married. Yeah, yeah. Okay.

Matt, do you really? I mean, six years is a long time. Well, Dave said typhoon. He said poison. I think one or both. Yeah. Typhoid. Typhoid.

Did I say Thai food poison? Yeah. I did not mean to. That almost makes sense. I thought it was kind of funny. Yeah, I was like, God, he's really on tonight. I thought that was very good. That turns out you just, you just misspoke.

I was thinking that that was the wittiest thing you've ever said. No, I have, look, my brain took over there, but it wasn't. That won't be happening again. Even when you misspeak, it's hilarious. I can't miss. What is it like being you? A genius. It's the only way I've ever known.

Yeah, I guess you wouldn't know any different. It's true. God. Jeez. So with her husband, Ching Shi needed to act quickly if she was going to consolidate power. Okay. She didn't want to return to her old life.

Their adopted son, Chung Power, was next in line to the leadership. So she had to maneuver quickly if she was going to hang onto the power. So Ching Shi took her. her own stepson, Cheng Pao, as her lover, and the two eventually married. So she stayed on as leader. So she married her adopted son. I don't love that. In fact, I don't like that. Yeah, it's, um, what I mean? It's, uh, yeah, well, Dave was saying it was basically business earlier. He was already an adult. Yeah, and you even went out there's, the age gap's not that big. And by this time, he's 25 and she's 30 or something. Yeah, I mean, the optics aren't.

Right. Yeah. I still don't like it. And that's my opinion. But, okay, but yeah, I see that it's, yeah, it's a power move quite literally. Yeah, she marries the next leader. Yeah. They can rule together, basically.

And it also probably helped that she rounded up some traders and had them publicly executed. So nothing like lopping off a few heads to assert your dominance. Absolutely, yeah. That's what I do. Female pirate leaders were not common at this time. I'll just point out. And pirate historian Dan H. Murray writes of only one other, Mrs. Honcho Lowe, who was active in Hong Kong in the first half of the 20th century.

Wow. So, yeah. She's very rare. Yeah, she is obviously a bit of a presence if she can hang on to the power. And as leader, Ching Shi was an absolute badass who took no shit from no one. She had a strict set of rules. serious pirate code that she expected everyone to live by. Wipe your feet at the door.

Yeah, that's right. The door of the ship. The door of the ship. Ships have doors, Dave. How do you get into them otherwise? Helicopter. Ah. Which helicopters do have doors.

Well, some of them. One of those open ones without doors. Yeah. And then you have to jump from that. Yeah, roll off. On to the top of a ship. Yeah. So to you, ships are only the top part of a ship.

There's no underneath or... They're like a floating platform. Okay. A barge. A barge. A barge. A barge. Bage.

Yeah. Yeah. Was that one of her rules? Yeah, no. One of the rules was. Any loot and or plunder that was seized had to be first presented to the fleet and registered. After this, it was distributed, but the ship captured it captured it keeping 20% of the value, while the remaining 80% was placed into the fleet's collective fund. Oh, okay.

Did you, where did you get the turn? Was the phrase loot and plunder in there, sorry, are you quoting Captain Planet? I did quote Captain Planet in that. I knew you did, saying loot and plunder. You will pay for this Captain Planet. Yeah, I put that in there. So you keep 20%, 80% goes to the business.

I imagine they needed some pirate accountants on staff. Yeah, God damn. To get track of it all? Which she was already doing, but she's starting to deputize a little bit. Yeah, I mean, a big part of leadership is delegating. So I hope she is You know Sort of handing that out

And taking some time for herself It's hard when you're a perfectionist You want to get everything done just right You're telling me And I think she probably was Yeah But in time she started You know Dolly Parton looks over her own accounts

Yeah perfectionist She does her own accounting She has accountants But then she'll have a look over herself She double checks Yeah So she's really good on Excel Yeah

Amazing She knows how to do all the sums and shit. That would really take the pressure off if you're her account. You're like, oh, she's just going to fix it anyway. No worries. I'd be freaking out that she'd be... What's that? Warren?

And he's like, oh. Oh, no. Oh, God, I don't know. I don't know anymore. God, what's that tax? What does that mean? Do we pay that here? It should be noted that anyone caught disobeying the pirate code

and stealing a hoarding treasure was immediately executed by having their head removed from their body. Okay. And how would they do that? A very big sword. Oh, they wouldn't just twist until... Yeah, yeah. They lopped it off. Yeah, right.

Classic lop. This wasn't the only rule implemented by Ching Shi. Pirates who gave unauthorised orders or those who refused to follow orders from a commander were also executed on the spot. Okay. This sounds like the kind of system where people start to die maybe when they don't deserve to. Hmm You might be right

You might be right Look if you said that You'd have your head chopped off Yeah Just saying It's like we've had stories like this in the past Like the witch The witch hunt and stuff

Where it'd be like all of a sudden People like settling schools with friends They're hoarding treasure Yeah She kissed the guy I liked And she's hoarding treasure Yeah Off with her head

No one was to steal From the public fund Or any villagers That supplied the pirate Many villages were captured and supplying pirates became the whole town's job. Supplying them with just like anything they needed. Yeah, food, drinks, souvenirs. Oh yeah, magnets.

Everyone gets a magnet. That was another rule. I want to be a pirate. For a small second, I thought you said Magnum and I was more excited. The ice cream? Yeah. Everyone gets a magnum, but check your Magnum ego at the door. A female prisoners were to be true.

But unfortunately, ships don't have doors, so that doesn't quite well. Some of the dumbest things anyone's ever said. Check your magnum ego at the door. Look, if I could, I'd have your head chopped up right now for that insubordinate. Dave, can we get a magnum on the way home? Oh, my God, we're going to get magnums on the way home, aren't we? Yeah. Wow.

But, Matt, check you magnum. Yeah. So back to the rules. Female prisoners were to be treated much more respectfully than other parts of the world at the time. Rape was treated as an extremely serious offence and any offenders were immediately executed. Lopped? Lopped. So that sounds good.

But in the case of consensual premarital sex, both the offenders were executed. So no banging on company time. Even if the boat is rockin? Yeah. So sorry, that was premarital. Were people married? I guess that would make sense. Pirate weddings.

Yeah, what are they like? That's funny. They're pirates, but we do not do pre-marital sex. Yeah. Yeah, and if we do, we get killed, apparently. It's really not worth it then, is it? No. Well, not from my experience.

Not how you do it. Our female prisoners were also segregated based on their looks. The weak and unattractive ones were freed as soon as possible. Yes. Which it would be hard to know how to take that, wouldn't you? You'd be like, I want to be freed, but also what a way to find out. I would tell myself I'm weak, not unattractive, just weak, you know? I'm a double threat.

I'm weak and on the trip. Oh, mate. Join the club. All right. The hot ones were held back for ransom. What about the average ones? All right. Line ball call.

You'd be like, you've got to get a second opinion. What do you reckon about this one? Yeah Nah, free him Free him They're like Oh piss off Come on

I'm having a bad day I've got I've got a pimple I've got a shiny forehead Exactly Usually I wipe down my face And I look great Because I'm certainly not weak

I'm an absolute tank Yeah But I don't think I'm gonna be gathering Much Ransom money You know what I mean So I think they should let me go Yeah right

But not because I'm weak No Because you're ugly Is that's name Am I following that looking Yeah I would like that clip just taken out of context and then I can just use that against Matt.

Yeah. Remember that time that you were putting Jess down? Remember that time you called me ugly? You might be ugly but that is not your value. I love the idea that the pirate every time they announce whether you be freed or captured, they'd say, look, you're going to have to go home, but not your value. Yeah.

In this case, it is your value in terms of how much we're going to... But honestly, it's a good thing, isn't it? Because it means you get to go home. You get to go home. Yeah. And you probably won't die. So basically you meant that the villages left behind, there were entire villages full of ugly people. Yeah, right, because they kept all the hoddies.

And that would have, like, that's probably still having an effect today. Yeah. There'd be villages in the area of ugly people. Argos. Ungos. Pirate villages. And weak Argos. Yeah.

But there'd be pirate villages full of only hot people. Imagine the amount of jars in those weak, Argo villages that go unopened. Most of them starved. Everything was in jar form, but it was all just smashed jars. people died from eating glass. Pirates could marry these hot captives, but only if they agreed to it. Only if the pirates agreed. Or only if the women were like, yeah, I'll marry you.

There's no force. And you're setting yourself up again for some brutal reality checks when you go, hey, if you marry me, you can be free. No. I'll stay a prisoner, they close the gate. They close the Europe. Themselves? That's all right. Throw away the key. That's fine.

Thank you. Happy to rot. Thanks. I'm... I'm waiting for a better pirate offer. Finally, anyone who tried to desert was captured and had their ears cut off. Other punishments included flogging, quartering and clapping the offenders in irons. Oh, okay. When clapping sounded good.

It was only in irons. Yeah, that's bad. Just a huge applause. What is quartering? you would be chopped into four bits okay it's as it sounds and you probably don't

hung drawn and quartered I'd heard that a lot and I never knew what it meant you probably don't really survive that do you being corded no no but it's a horrible way to get because they hang you until you nearly die

and then the drawing part is when they like they cut you open and rip your intestines and stuff out and then they chop you and four that feels unnecessary I think that's starting to reflect poorly on the pirates if they're behaving in that way

they're going a bit far hey yeah Let's just make it quick. Yeah. Just behead me. Just better. Hop it off. Whop it.

Come on. Imagine being like, I'd really prefer to just lop my head off if you don't mind. I mean, it'll save you time. I'd rather have my head flopped. Thanks very much. So it was a pretty brutal world, but because of this, Ching She's gang was extremely loyal and fierce an attack, even when outnumbered.

If you're going to die for giving up anyway, you might as well. fight on because you've got a chance. Yeah, okay. So they were like... Backs against the wall stuff. Yeah, stuff is like, well, if I run away, they'll kill me. But if I keep fighting them, we might win, even if we're outnumbered, so they were very loyal. Wow. They made money by looting and capturing entire towns, taxing and collecting this cash and supplies from its inhabitants.

It's been said that her dominance was so absolute that not a single ship moved in the whole South China Sea without the knowledge of Ching Shi's army. Wow. If any ship wanted to cross the South China Sea, which is massive, they had to pay a fee or they'd be plundered and possibly sunk along the way. Wow. Again, sinking, not great. No, you don't want to do that. You don't want to do that.

They're quartering the boats. The same rules for people actually do apply to boats as well. We'll chop your ears off the first time. No pre-marrel boat sex. We catch you. Bump and ugly's. Dung, dunk. Dunk, dunk.

That's hard. Yeah, that's beautiful. That's our little tugboats get made. Oh. I love tugboats. Yeah. They're so little and so strong. Do you see yourself in them, don't you?

Yes, because I'm very small and dainty, but so strong. Wow. What do you got in those legs, iron? Yes. A very strong motor. So not surprisingly, the Chinese monarchy did not like it, and neither did the other global superpowers. of the time.

But her crew evaded capture, and anyone that went after her regretted it. Chinese, Portuguese and British naval ships were all lost to Ching Shi's fleet. So like entire armies, they'd be like, we're not going to pay the fee. Where the army? Where the Brits, we've conquered half the known world, we'll be right, and then they'd get halfway across and then they'd get attacked. Wow. In January 1808, the Chinese Qing dynasty really went after her and had a series of battles,

but Ching Shi was able to gain the upper hand and captured many of the government ships. She did this by offering anyone who defected their life and a place in her army. Embarrassingly for the emperor, lots of his subjects and a large portion of his navy defected. This only increased her power. Whoa.

It said that the choice for the defeated enemy was either you have your feet nailed to the deck of your boat and then you get beaten to death, or you can jump ship and join us and you even get to celebrate the victory. I think I know what I'll be picking Yeah, do I have to marry that guy though Nail the feet

He's like Oh come on Why does this keep happening I just want to find love To the very end Like she's going Oh you can come and live your lives with us Live on fight with us

Or you have your feet nailed down You go down with your ship And you have to marry me Or no deal Oh God. Bring out the nails. Yeah, that's all right. In fact, I'll just do it myself, if you're like. Making eye contact with him. This is because I don't want to marry you.

Oh. No. So she thwarted attempts by the Chinese Emperor and did the same thing to the Portuguese Navy and the powerful East India Company. Again, quoting from Atlas Obscura, an East India Company employee named Richard glass pool was captured by Chingxi's pirates in September 1809 and held until December of that year. In his account of the ordeal, he estimated that there were some 80,000 pirates under Qingxi's command and some 1,000 large junks and 800 smaller junks and rowboats.

So just for comparison, our main man, Black Beer that we've done the web series episode on that Jess reported on, he commanded four ships and had 300 pirates. And he's the most famous pirates. She's crazy. She would have knocked him over in about 30 seconds. Yeah. Sounds like that would be one of the strongest armies in the world. Crazy.

Yeah, absolutely. Wow. It should be noted that the most count about 17,000 male pirates directly under her control and the rest of the 80,000 were other pirate groups who agreed to work for her fleet. But still, it was huge. Yeah. 300 for Blackbeard. She's got at least 17,000.

She's delegating. That's exactly. Yeah, that's what Blackbeard wasn't good at. He was all about his reputation, you know. I'm just like a sizzling beard. Yeah. He's all theater. He's all about, yes, he was. He was just an actor.

She's a fucking commander. Yeah, he trod the board. She walked the plank. Yeah. And she was in the ocean. Well, no, I've done this wrong. I meant to make him walk the plank. Swimming around, trying to be cool.

No, I meant it. No, I meant it. That's how her whole empire comes crashing down. I make them walk them on. Fuck. I do that every time. I keep walking the plunk. So over in the west of this time,

it was seen as bad luck for a woman to even be on a ship. Okay. But in the China Sea during this time, the largest pirate armour in history was being led by a woman. Bad luck for who? The woman, the ship, just in general? Yeah. Bad luck for who?

Yeah, for the ship. Okay, for a woman to be on it. Okay. that's baffling. I think she's maybe proven a few people wrong here. Yeah. Well, apparently it really pissed off the male emperor at the time. Yeah.

That it was a lady. Because he's like, but it's bad luck. Yeah, bad luck for you, emperor. Yeah, it's funny. I think, yeah, superstitions have never made a lot of sense. Yeah. I do love a man upset that a woman is capable of something. That is fun.

Steam coming out of years. Yeah, that's always fun. Learning from she herself and how she was able to lure defectors to her side, the Emperor offered an amnesty to all pirates of the Red Flag fleet that would give themselves up, hoping to usurp Ching Shi's monopoly of the sea. So he was like, oh, you can walk away, Scott Free, if you give up now. Trying to break her power.

Yeah. That's fun. I love that kind of power play from the weaker party. Hey, we'll let you quit now while you're way ahead. You heard the phrase quit while you're ahead. Can you do that? It really helped me out. Because I've got no moves left. And I reckon in a few weeks I'll probably have to give up.

I mean, what? We'll go easy on you, I mean, if you do. It'll help you out a lot. It was at this time that the Portuguese were getting fed up too. So they launched an attack on the Red Flag Fleet for constantly attacking their ships. The fleet had previously defeated the Portuguese, but this time they sent in their biggest and best warships and the Red Flag Fleet, the RFF, were severely outgunned.

Over a series of battles called the Battles of the Tiger's mouth, which is so cool. That is badass. Bad ass, the battles of the Tiger's mouth. There's big teeth in there. Even like the Tiger Mouth Fleet is better than Red Flagg Fleet. That's cool. The Tiger Mouth Fleet, like that.

You know? And then everyone, like, has an animal. Yeah. As a lion. A tiger. The beaver. They're like, what the fuck? There's a walrus there.

There's a platypus and everyone's like, what the fuck is that? They're like, trust me. You'll find out. It's one of only two monotrems, so pretty cool. It's a pretty big deal. The plural is platypie. Everyone's like, fuck off, Gavin. Stop talking, Gavin.

We're in the middle of a battle and you're making up animals. Gavin's like, well, if someone would marry me, I would. I'd have something to do. Poor Gavin. I'm very lonely. He sucks. The males have venomous spurs. Gavin.

Honestly, you don't get to participate in this battle today. I've got a tattoo. All right, man. All right, mate. We've all seen your tattoos. No one goes. So, this is the Battle of the Tiger's mouth. The Portuguese continually defeated the pirates near Macau.

Leading the fleet was Chingxi's son slash husband, Chung Po Sai. Despite the huge Chinese numbers, the pirate fleet had in fact greater difficulties maneuvering around the small Portuguese fleet without blocking each other or getting in the line of fire. There was actually too many of them. Yeah, right. To actually go anywhere. Oh, no, you're in the... Oh, no. Oh, no.

So the Portuguese gunners, on the other hand, could accurately fire explosive rounds on the concentrated mass of enemy junk. So they just massacred them, basically. Wow. Eventually, the junk ships retreated up a river with a large Portuguese. The Portuguese ships couldn't follow, but the Portuguese counted by blockading the mouth of the river, trapping the pirates inside. The pirates, including their leader, Qing Shi, decided at this point to take advantage of the Chinese Emperor's offer of clemency. The entire crew of the Red Flag Fleet, thousands of them, were forced to surrender in 1810.

Amazingly, they were even allowed to keep their loot. Oh, what, so they... I was wondering if they were going to actually come... That's how desperate the government was to stop them. They were like, yeah, cool, cool, stop. But it's funny, and they're like, yeah, we're not absolutely about to get obliterated by the Portuguese. So, yeah, I don't know why I haven't said it because it's not happening. This is our call.

We've all had to chat about it. We just want to do the right thing. Yeah, we just wanted to like have a quiet life, do you know what I mean? That's nuts. Wow. So according to Cindy Vela's history of maritime piracy, less than 400 pirates suffered any form of punishment. 60 were banished for two years, 151 exiled and 126 were executed,

but the remaining 17,318 pirates just surrendered their weapons. They got to keep their loot. Some of them even offered jobs in the Chinese Navy, including Ching Shi's husband-slash-son, Chong Po, who received the rank of lieutenant and took command of a private fleet of 20 junks. Oh, that's amazing. That is crazy. weeks earlier, he was like

Public Enemy number one or two. And then they were like... Have a fleet. Yeah, you'll be pretty good, actually. And what about Changshi? Well, Ching Shi and Chung Po eventually had children of their own, making Chung both their father and big brother. That is so...

Hasn't he... Surely he's relinquished one of those roles, right? Surely the son thing is not still... Is he still going to... Hey, and... I'm your son too. Babe. Babe slash mum.

I reckon they probably dropped that bit. Yeah, it's probably just... But you're really stuck with it, making us all feel weird. Yeah, because it's fun. It's fun to point out that he was their brother and their dad. That is weird and fun. That is fun.

Probably also a cousin somehow. Somehow. Chung Po would later die at sea, leaving Ching Shi widowed for a second time. After this, she moved the family to Macau where she opened a gambling house and was also involved in the salt trade, and she was a very, very wealthy woman.

She is nuts. All up, she'd only been in charge for three years, but had amassed the largest pirate fleet in history and taking command of the entire Chinese sea all by the age of 35. Pretty awesome. Fuck! Pretty amazing.

And she only appeared in the history books at 25. Before that, we don't even know. Yeah, who knows what she was doing then? She died in her bed surrounded by her family at the age of 69. Nice. It's a rare, peaceful end for someone involved in piracy. Nearly every other pirate dies a horrible, horrible death.

I was expecting that. I thought that's what the poor is. She retired at 35, kept all the money, invested well in gambling and salt. And that was, and lived another, that was half, like, half the way. Yes, a whole second half of her life and just died surrounded by loved ones. Amazing life. Wow. Characters based on Ching Shi have appeared in TV, film and graphic novels,

and even a children's book came out a couple of years ago. Some of our listeners might know that a character that is loosely based on her appears in the 2007 classic film, Pirates of the Caribbean, at World's End, the third one, the franchise. The character is called Mistress Ching, and is portrayed by American actor to Kayo Fisher. She is one of the nine pirate lords of the Brethren Court, the powerful leader of the Pirate Confederation of China.

I was so into the first parts of the caravan movie The first one is a lot of fun, isn't it? I was like obsessed with it. Watched it a lot. Got an eye patch. Got an eye patch. Got a bird. I did have a bird around that time.

What kind of bird? I had a budgie. It wasn't quite like a macaw. But, you know, it's out in my shoulder. It's pretty cool. But how many of those movies are there? Because I don't remember that one at all. That's only number three.

Yeah, maybe five. Yeah, there's too many of them. Yeah, and reading just the Wikipedia for the film. At the time was the most expensive movie ever made. They really invested in it. I don't remember it. But there you go. Because I was going to say it's crazy that that's not as well-known a story,

but it's probably also just maybe not super well-known in our part of the world. And it seems like it has been told in stories and feelings. Yeah, for sure. And there is a lot of things that I was reading that I hadn't heard of on and clicked on. There were sort of things in. in China and countries around that area of the world that have adapted her in graphic novels and TV shows and movies. But that was the most famous sort of Western example that I could find.

That is epic. What a lot. Yeah, Ching Shi, absolutely amazing. Thanks for everyone that suggested that topic. It's been and had a long time because you see people, you can suggest a topic at any time. If you go to our website, there's a little link that you click. And you can tell us why we should do it. And a lot of them say, hey, she's the most badass successful.

were pirate in history. Yeah. So you're like, okay, I want to look into this person. Yeah, we've done a few stories about pirates or, you know, adventures on the high seas. They always go down well. They're fun. It's a wild time. Yeah.

It just seems like a real lawless wild time. And it just doesn't happen anymore. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, they're still pirates? Yeah, I think so. But not like this. Yeah. Not with big caches of treasure buried under an X like they definitely did back then.

Yeah. The good old days of pirating. Now's more DVDs and other obsolete technology. You wouldn't steal a car. So imagine playing that to them. Yeah, I would. Of course I would. Doing a run here.

Beep-bip. Drive off in your car run from it. I'm watching this pirated DVD on the DVD player and the stolen Mercedes understall. Dave, that was a fantastic report. Thank you so much. Well, with that pesky report out of the way, now it's time for everybody's favorite section of the show, the fact, quote, or question.

And I'm afraid Matt has had to go, because he's a big showbiz guy, had to go film something. Oh, laity da, I've got to go. I'm a big movie actor. Oh, okay, superstar. I got Tom Cruise on speed dial. Okay, can I talk to him, please?

You put me on. He never puts us on. He never does. But because Matt's here, not here, I'm going to be doing the fact quote of question, which I believe, has a little jingle. Fact quote or question.

He always remembers the ding. Incredible. Do you feel a lot of pressure reading the fact quote a question? I had to do a hat to. Had the pleasure of doing it a few months ago. And definitely failed to men's pressure. I do feel a bit of pressure because like Matt, I haven't read these until I read them now.

So I could definitely stuff it up. But if you're not familiar, this section of the show, this is part of our Patreon section. If people support the show on the Sydney Shined Berg Deluxe package at Resonepiece of course Patreon.com slash do go on pod as well as all the other tiers

which gets three bonus episodes access to the Facebook group, pre-sale staff, a newsletter once a week that you put together Jess and we all sort of give us an update of what we're doing bit of behind the scene stuff. Lots of rewards but this one you get to be part of the fact quote or question

which means you give us a fact quote or a question and you also give yourselves a title Yeah, lots of creative titles too. And we got four this week. And first up, we have Nathan Damon. Damon. Daman.

We know Nathan Damon. Who has given himself the title of Apprentice Chisel Sharpener for the Do Go On Mount Rushmore Construction Project. Ah, yes, that's an important job. I love that. I'm assuming that the Mount Rushmore is the three of us, plus either. May so? Sidney, Scheinberg himself, Ornick Mason, what do you reckon? It's probably Mesa.

Probably Mesa, yeah. The fourth beetle. The fourth beetle, Mesao. And just got a better looking head. Yeah. Than Schindberg, I reckon. Much better. Yeah, good beard.

Yeah, probably easier for them to construct, too, because Mesa's got a real look. Yeah, I reckon beards must be easier than chins, hey. Yeah. Chins are hard. Jaws. Ugh. Difficult. Especially if they're chiseled like ours.

Yeah, exactly. But thanks to Nathan for keeping the chisels sharp. And he's given us a quote this week. And that is, you tried your best and you failed miserably. The lesson is never try. And that is from Homer J. Simpson and Nathan's written just in case you didn't manage to get a Simpsons reference in this episode. And I don't think we did, Nathan. I'm not sure that we did, Nathan.

I think you might have saved us there. Wow. What a perfectly timed quote. Yeah, thank you so much. And just in case, can I just say, Skinner says the teachers will crack any minute. Purple monkey dishwasher. There we go. Thank you so much, Nathan.

Really picking up the slack there. Yeah. I feel like I really let everyone down by not giving one. No, hey, no, it's not just on you. It's mostly on you, but it's not just your responsibility. That's right. Well, actually, when we look at this, so Jacob Lane, one of our Patreon supporters,

famously does a Simpsons audit every week where he writes down the references that we make and then what episode they come from. And when he does, it's not always just me. There's plenty from it. and plenty from you too. So we do... Not plenty from me, but it's always a delight when I get on the board. It's probably also a delight for Jacob to get to the end and go,

I don't have to worry about it this week. Yeah, exactly. But sucked in, Jacob. Sucked in. You're going to have to credit one to Nathan Damon. Next up we have Jessica English, who says, their title is Council of Maritime Law, exclusively working on getting the pod into international waters.

Your dream. Definitely. They're quite fitting for today's topic too. Yes, and a lot of contract work would have to be done. Yeah. So I appreciate the great work from Jessica English. He's given us a question. The question is, how do you not get paralyzed with indecision?

I'm not speaking well, with indecision. Indecision. Matt really doesn't read this before he reads this. He does a great job. How do you not get paralyzed with indecision when trying to pick a topic from the hat or even a couple to put up for the vote? Thank you all for being in joy

Of all the joy you bring It has been a real big assist this year Looking forward to the world tour Yeah Which we're halfway through So I hope you're enjoying it That is a fantastic question And the answer is we do get paralysed with indecision

It's not paralysion It's not indecision Especially when you're sort of trying to find a few That you can put up to the hat Put up to the vote I mean But sometimes I would spend hours trying to find a topic that either I'm into,

that grabs my attention or, yeah. I'm totally with you often, because we usually put up three for the vote. I don't know if you find this. You find two. You've got to find a third one that's worthy. Yeah. You spend another hour going through,

because there are over 5,000 suggestions. Oh, even more than that now. I think it's like close to 7,000. Wow. So it is obviously quite a lot of suggestions. It's so much. And I generally would often put up four topics as well. Good for you.

Yeah, just to get heaps of options. Well, I have found that I had to put up because we're doing geographic specific ones for the world tour for this topic, finding three Asian topics. Having something to look for, that made it easier. Yeah, that's true, yeah. And especially when you're like, I've got to do a Patreon bonus episode, I'll look for, because that's one of the options. Yeah, people mark them as.

This would be a good mini one, yeah. Or a Christmas one or that can be really helpful. But, yeah, especially when you don't really have a specific theme, you're looking for. So you're just like, it could be anything. Could be a serial killer or a biography or just a fun World War II story or something. Yeah. There's so many that it can be, it can be a very long process of just pulling ones out to

then put up to the vote. And then you start researching once the votes come in. Because you got to do that, like I think you were saying on this episode, you do a little bit of like a search to make sure that the topic is enough. Yeah. So you've got to do that three or four times. Yeah. And they're just the ones that get picked.

Yeah, no, it can be hard. But often, I've got to say, the ones that stick out of the ones where people have pitched it really well. Yeah, that's true. Or given good resources, then you can sort of just click on that link and go, oh, okay, I can read a bit about this. Yeah, there's a story here. But there's definitely some as well that I go, oh, what's this? And I Google it and go, oh, that's fucked. I won't do that.

Or, oh, there's barely any information on it. If it doesn't even have a decent Wikipedia page, you're like, oh, there's probably not going to be a lot of info on this. Yeah, that means because there's no other sorts. sources to make that. Absolutely. Thanks for your question, Jessica English. Great question. Next up now is Katie Murphy.

Thanks so much for your support. Katie, who's given herself the title, sticking with podcast head of ethnomusicology. That's a great title. Why wouldn't you stick with it? Exactly. And you're doing great work. And Katie's giving us a quote this week.

And that is, even the prim and proper Judy Garland was not one to use profanity very often, but Liza Manali shared an anecdote from a time they were confronted by a particularly frustrating fan, a drunk old woman in a public restroom. She knocked on the bathroom store Judy was in, slurring her praise as an urge her to, quote, never forget the rainbow, Judy, over and over again, to which Garland scathingly replied, quote, how can I forget the rainbow?

I've got rainbows up my ass. Nice. I've got rainbows up my ass. Oh my God. That sort of reminds, it's like a panicked kind of. come back where it doesn't fully make sense. It's like when we're in Mexico, when I was eight years old, and that we were walking through like markets and people were trying to sell us stuff.

And this guy had all, he had his entire arm. He had necklaces all up his arm trying to sell necklaces. And he was like, you know, any of these, they're real gold. And my mum meant to say, yeah, real gold, my ass. But what she said was as real as my ass. And we're like, what? Does mum have a fake butt? It's like you could just say no thanks, Mom.

It's all right. But she's just like, she'd just been hassled too many times. I know the feeling. Sometimes you just go, you just get overwhelmed. I don't want it and you're in my face and as real as my ass. Very funny. Rainbow's up my ass. That's great.

Judy Garland swearing at you. You would not forget that. Yeah. Thanks so much, Katie. And finally, the main man, Gary J. from the UK has given us a fact, but his title is Mr. UK 1984. What a claim.

Great stuff. I cannot dispute it. That's great. The fact from Gary Jay is John Lithgow turned down the role of Dr. Frazier Crane in Cheers. His reasoning being, he said TV acting was below him

and he saw himself as a movie star. he regretted that choice and starred in such shows as I just left that there dot dot dot third rock from the sun I'm thinking the crown oh yeah he's in the crown of course he was great as Winston Churchill yeah he was really good

John Lithgow's great he is very very good it's so funny that he's like TV is so below me but a whole generation of his fans know him from Third Rock yeah absolutely and he was fantastic in Third Rock and so good so manic and crazy

Dick Solomon And I recently watched, speaking of his movie career, Cliffhanger, the Sylvester Stallone film for the first time last week from the 90s. John Lithgow is the bad guy. And he does make a good psych about. But, yeah, he's big work, of course, third rock. Yeah, that's a great fact, Gary. Well, done.

Thanks, Gary Jay. Well, that brings us to everyone's other favourite part of the show. Equal favour. Equal favourites. Where we shout out, give some thanks. to the people who do support us over on patreon.com forward slash do go on pod. And if you are on the associate producer

or above level of Patreon, then you get one of these shoutouts. And some of these people have been waiting for a long time. And now's their time to shine. Well, it's definitely worth the wait because Jess, you always come up with a game with a way that we can shout out to them in the theme of the episode.

Yeah. And I can't stop thinking. about the red flag fleet. First of all, so hard to say. It's a bit clunky. Second of all, it's not at all intimidating. Yeah. It doesn't, I wouldn't be proud to be in the red flag fleet.

It's so hard to say. It is hard. I'm hoping that maybe the original Cantonese or something was. Oh, yeah. Maybe that rolled off the tongue a bit better. It sounded a bit cooler. But still, you think about it, the red flag fleet. Just the overall imagery is not really there.

You say it's so much easier than me. me. Red flag, fleet. Oh, I hate it. Anyway, so I was thinking maybe we could give them a much cooler gang to. Oh, yeah. Fleet, gang, posse, whatever you want it to be. But, you know, we could just give them like a bit of street cred.

All right. What do you reckon? I love it. Okay. Good. I'm proud of us. Shall I start? Please.

I would love to thank from Missoula, M.T. I just looked it up because I had to be shocked There's so many Mums Montana that one Montana, yes, Missoula and Montana I would love to thank Anna Milheim Anna Milheim

That's a fantastic name Yeah that is good Milheim is good Anna is good Anna Milheim Oof fantastic Okay What do we know about Montana

Anything? I say that to you I don't know anything There's that book in school That I studied Montana 1948 Hannah Montana Oh, okay, great.

Okay, great, here we go. Okay. Okay, maybe something like Miley Cyrus, like a Cyrus. Oh, Cyrus the virus. Oh! The nickname of John Malkovich's character in Conair, one of my all-time favorite action movies. Cyrus the Virus.

I like that, yeah. And they're obviously a gang that hijacks planes. Yeah, awesome. Very cool. Yeah, yeah, the coolest. Thank you, Anna. Thanks for your support. I would also love to thank, from Hampshire in Great Britain, I would love to thank Phil Ellis.

Phil Ellis. Philalus. Philalus. How about the dirty harpoons? Holy shit, that's good. Not sure where it came from, but. I love it. The dirty harpoons.

Because if they're going to, you'd be worried if they hit you with a harpoon, you're going to get an infection. Totally, yeah. Oh, they haven't cleaned their harpoons. Yeah, I clean harpoons. Oh, my God. Clean harpoons, please. They're like, nah. Nats.

The dirty harpoon. He like, they spit on their harpoon before they throw it at you. Yeah, when they get a brand new one, they dirty it up first. Yeah. It's honestly, it's, it wastes a lot of time, but they're very committed to it. So thank you, Phil. Thanks, Phil. Fuck, we're doing so well.

I'm so proud of us. And I'd also love to thank from Pimpama, Pimpama in Queensland. Amazing. I've never heard of that. Pimpamar, just in case. I'd love to thank Joel Broom. Joel Broom. Sweep.

Something sweep. The clean sweeps. Yes, the clean sweeps. That's great. Get it, Broome. Yeah, that sounds like, that's a good bowling team. Yeah, the clean sweeps. And they are just like 300.

Every fucking game, baby. Strike, strike, strike. Very cool. Spare. Still pretty good. Still pretty good. I'd be happy with that. Yeah, I'd be too.

Do you want to thank some people? Thanks, Joel, Broom. I would like to thank, yes, from Austell in Georgia in America. Caroline Stoltz Caroline Stoltz Hmm I mean I always go sweet Caroline Of course yeah

And I'm sure Caroline gets that so often Okay what about Even politely laughing now So how about I set you up Okay The sour Pusses I like it

You had to know that was going to happen The sweet Yeah It's better than the sweet pusses The sour pusses Yeah And they're just just kind of like, they're just sort of like the bad girls. Yeah. You know, they're the popular

girls, but they're kind of bitchy. But everyone still wants to be them. Of course. Yeah. Every guy wants to be with them. Every girl wants to be them. You know what I mean? Yeah, I know. I know what it's like. I'm so sorry, Caroline. Thanks, Caroline's Dalton, Sour Pusses. Going back to Montana again, uh, from Bozeman in Montana, I would like to thank Anita Matthews. Anita Matthews. Anita Matthews. Okay. All right.

I'll set you up. Okay. The, I didn't have anything to set you up. The whistling. Fire breathers. Oh. Yeah. Yeah, okay.

Very cool. They're a circus troupe. Yeah. But again, the bad boys are the circus troupe. Oh. They will fuck you up. The fire brothers are the bad boys of the circus group. Big time, yeah.

Yeah. All the strong men. They're always a bit like, whoa. Yeah, yeah. That's it. You're a lot I mean? Yeah. God, I want to do trapeze.

I want to do trapeze so badly. Really? Yeah. Do you think you'd be scared? No. I'm not sure I have the core strength, though. I need to work on that, and then I want to do trapeze. I love the idea of you going to do a PT.

So what do you want to get out of this? What are you goals? I want to do trapeze. I want to have enough core strength to be able to lift my feet up and put them over a bar and then let a nice strong man catch me. What do you think? They're like, great. Fantastic.

Here's your 11-week plan. Yeah, exactly. And finally for me, I would like to thank from Bidale or B-Dale North Yorkshire, Ian Hayes. Ian Hayes. Thank you, Ian Hayes. Ian Hayes. Okay, from North Yorkshire. Um, the light moths.

The light moths. Yes. Yeah, light moths. They're only out at night time. Mm-hmm. And people flock to them. Yeah. Because they're like, yes.

We are so good at this. We are so good at naming badass pirate crews. Incredible. Ian Hayes, the light moths. Thank you so much to Ian, Anita, Caroline, Joel, Phil and Anna. You're all absolute legends. You complete us. There's just one more thing that we need to do, Dave.

Do you want to explain what the Trip Ditch Club is while I find the Triptych Club people? So we've given a few people a shoutout there, but the shoutouts don't descend there. Because people that have been on that level for the shoutout for three consecutive years without dropping off, which is a huge feat to commemorate that. Massive. We've come up with a thing called the Triptitch Club, which is, you know. Special little lounge. Yeah, a little lounge slash bar slash club, whatever you want it to be, basically. We lift up the Velvet Rope each week and welcome a few people in as life members to the Triptitch Club.

Yeah. There's usually a musical act that I book. You organize some hors d'oeuvres. Yep. Usually a drink. Yep. Have you got any ideas? Well, it's so handy that I went out for a very nice lunch today for a friend's birthday

because then I have like ideas in my head of foods other than just the same three takeaways I've been ordering quite frequently in lockdown. Yes. So hors d'oeuvres wise, we've got some pumpkin uranini. Oh, I love pumpkin. I love Arancini in general. Yeah. So yum.

And we also had, I mean, in the Triptych Club, we have an assortment of woodfire pizzas. I'm sorry, have you just got your leftovers that you've just driven in to the club? I wish there was leftovers. Yeah. And drinks-wise,

Mahitos. Oh, I love Mahito. So refreshing. A few different flavors. And we also have espresso martinis if you need a little pick-out. We're going all out this week. And they're really nice ones too.

They're really good. So, yeah, there's that. And who's playing this week? Well, to celebrate our time in Asia, I've actually been able to ink a contract with Asia's hottest act right now, the Korean band, BTS. No way. Can you believe it?

I can't. They're huge. All six, seven or eight members, I can't remember. I can't remember either. But that is, I know that's a big deal. Yeah, light me up like dynamite if I am to quite one of their songs, I believe. Wow. this is

this is probably one of our biggest gets Yeah for sure they are so hot right now They are so hot So hot hot hot And Dave you'll be very happy to know That we only have two people To welcome into the Triptitch Club this week Because it is your job to sort of hype them up

And it's like it's something that you're very good at But that you also find quite stressful now Yes I freeze in the moment It became a thing where I would hype people up Sort of as I definitely did it as a joke and then now it's expected. Yeah, and so the pressure is on. But then that's where I came in to then hype you up.

Yeah. Which is going to be kind of hard today because I also have to take the role of Matt and read them. Yeah, you're basically like emceeing the guest list. I'm hyping them up, then you're my hype man as well. Yeah, I feel like I can do it. So welcoming in to the Trip Ditch Club from Manchester in Great Britain, it's Jack Marsland.

Woo! Taking you straight to Marsland. Yeah. Woo! And also from Mount Glorious in Queensland, Timothy Barry. Well, things just got Mount Glorious in here tonight. Yes.

See? Imagine did I miss that one. Yeah, that was... To be honest. Honestly, when I read Mount Glorious, I was like, oh my God, don't. It's all over. I didn't even listen to the surname. What was it?

Timothy Barry. Barry? Well, you've won the Barry Award. There we go. Which doesn't exist anymore, but it used to be the Comedy Festival Best Show Award, so well done to you. Barry Humphreys has said some pretty problematic things. So we went, oh, let's not name an award after him anymore. Yes.

But he's very old. Anyway, so thank you to Jack Marsland, Timothy Barry, and all the other patrons that we thanked and for everybody for listening to this episode. And if you enjoyed listening, you can also watch this episode. That is absolutely correct, Jess. If you'd like to watch this episode, just go to SOSPresents.com because we did a live stream of it. And you get to watch the episode with extra bits that we have edited out of the audio because it didn't make sense because we were doing some visual stuff. Yeah, we were being a bit silly.

We were mucking around. My head got a little bit shiny. And then it distracted me during the report. But you didn't know because seamlessly, I imagine, edited that out. And then also we did an extra like maybe 45 minute extra show that Matt's come up with called Who Knew It with Matt Stewart? it where he was taking us through some crazy facts about Asia. Yeah, it was a lot of fun. And those streams, well, at the time of recording, we've got a couple more to do.

And they'll be available on swespresents.com for forever, essentially. So if you're listening to this three months down the track, a year down the track, and you think, oh, damn it, I missed it. No, you didn't. Yeah, just go there. And you get a season past, you get all four of the season for the price of three. And you can do that with also the two previous seasons. This was actually the 10th one we've done this year.

Which is crazy. We've been very lucky to be able to do that during COVID. We're very, very pleased with that. So yeah, you can go check that out. That would be very nice of you. How do we get, how do we boot this home? We just say thanks for everyone and go to do go on pod.com for all the links to our Facebook, Instagram, Twitter, our YouTube channel and our Gmail if you'd like to email us. And follow me on Instagram, please, Jess Perkins.

She's very close to 10,000. I need this. You do. I need this. Your self-esteem is on the line. Yeah, it's at an all-time low. But if I just get to 10,000, maybe then I'll feel good about myself. Yeah, I reckon that's a guarantee.

So thanks again for listening. We'll be back next week with another episode. But until then, I'll say thank you and goodbye. Waiters. Bye! Had to do both, but I think I did very well. Very well. This podcast is part of the Planet Broadcasting Network.

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