Two In The Think Tank - 304 - The New England Vampire Panic

Starting point is 00:00:00 Hey everybody, Jess and Dave, just jumping in really quickly at the top here to make sure that you are across all the details for our upcoming Christmas show. That's right, we are doing a live show in Melbourne Saturday December the 2nd, 2023, our final podcast of the year, our Christmas special. It's downstairs at Morris House, which usually be called the European beer cafe. On Saturday December the 2nd, 2023 at 4.30pm, come along, come one, come all, and get tickets at dogoonpod.com. Most weight loss programs are short-term fixes, but managing your weight needs a long-term solution,

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Starting point is 00:01:56 in months, not years. Take classes online or on campus, and financial aid is available to qualified students, including the GI Bill. Now is the time, mycomputercareer.edu. Hello and welcome to another episode of Do Go Onon. My name is Zévoon. He and his eyes. I'm here with Matt Stewart and Jess Perkins. Howdy, Dave. Howdy, Jess. Howdy. Howdy. Big fan. Hello. Howdy. I'm not normally... I feel like I say that all the time, don't I? Or maybe not. I've never, never what? Her'd you say, howdy. Yeah, right.

Starting point is 00:02:45 And now you're like, what do you mean? I say that all the time. Do I not say that every episode? No! I thought that's just how I talked. I love it! And I encourage it. I don't usually wear that cab I had either, but you know.

Starting point is 00:02:58 It looks good on you. It works. It works. Now, howdy partner, Matt. Can you explain to possible new listens how this show works? Darn good on you. It works. It works. Now, how do you partner, Matt? Can you explain to possible new listeners how this show works? Don Tutten.

Starting point is 00:03:09 Oh, I don't mose you on over here and have a little explain in the saloon, but... Yeah, I'll have a whiskey, thanks. And while you're putting that together, I'll let them know that, well, normally one of the three of us goes away and we research a topic that has been suggested by the listeners and then we bring it back and then we tell the other to all about it and they don't know what the topic is and we get onto the topic with a question.

Starting point is 00:03:37 This week I'm doing the topic so I get to ask the question, yes and Dave don't know what the topic is but they will soon when I ask the question, yes and Dave don't know what the topic is, but they will soon. When I ask the question, yes and Dave. What's supernatural being caused a pack in 18th and 19th century New England in the United States? Supernatural being. New England. Okay, this is before David Attenborough's time. David Attenborough's time. Who else? We got. Is it like a werewolf type thing? Yes, you're very close.

Starting point is 00:04:11 Werewolf aka Likens. AKA Vampires. It is vampires. Well done Dave. Thank you very much. So today we're going to be talking about the New England vampire panic This was suggested by Ben Ward of Southampton in the UK Peter C. Kinslow from Wilmington North Carolina in the USA quick fact about North Carolina that I went recently

Starting point is 00:04:37 Oh here we go Apparently their fire engines over there are blue they're not red real Shelbyville type situation Wild yeah, I'd also love to engines over there are blue, they're not red. Real Shelbyville type situation. Wild. Yeah, I'd also love to shout out Sophie from North Caduce suggested it as did Christian Evry from Victoria and Ellie Nicholas from Summers hat in England. A bunch of great suggestions there. I want to kick it off with the opening of this great article, Abigail Tucker wrote for the Smithsonian. I think this is one of the key articles about this whole scenario and I really brought people's attention to it. It's from about nine years ago this article

Starting point is 00:05:20 and it starts thusly. Children playing near a hillside gravel mine found the first graves. One ran home to tell his mother, who was skeptical at first, until the boy produced a skull. Because? So that's like, your mom's going, yeah, sure, you found a grave

Starting point is 00:05:39 and the boy's holding a skull behind his back, right? Which hand, mom? Left or right? Is if you're not gonna late with that, look, mom, I found a skullborn who's back, right? Which hand, mom? Left or right? Is if you're not going to lead with that, look, mom, I found a skull. Where'd you find that? In a grave. I was hanging out, I was playing on a gravel hill. Different time in 1990. So that's when this was.

Starting point is 00:05:57 1990 in Connecticut in Griswald. And police initially thought the burials might be the work of a local serial killer named Michael Ross as they taped off the area as a crime scene. But the brand-of-cang bones turned out to be more than a century old. The Connecticut State archaeologist Nick Bellentoni soon determined that the hillside contained a colonial era farm cemetery. New England is full of such unmarked family plots, and the 29 burials were typical of the 1700s and early 1800s. The dead, many of them children, were laid to rest in thrifty Yankee style and simple wood coffins without jewelry or even much clothing. Their arms resting by their sides or crossed over their chests. That

Starting point is 00:06:42 is, except for burial number four. Bellentoni was interested in the grave even before the excavation began. It was one of only two stone crypts in the cemetery, and it was partially visible from the mind face. Scraping away soil with flat edge sort of shovels, and then brushes and bare-boost sticks. The archaeologist and his team worked through several feet of earth before reaching the top of the crypt.

Starting point is 00:07:06 When Ballantine lifted the first of the large flat rocks that formed the roof, he uncovered the remains of a red painted coffin and a pair of skeletal feet. So this is the only one I think that was painted red. All the other ones were just simple wooden crypts and they were much easier to access. This one was really buried under a lot of stone. It took a lot more effort to get to and then when he found it, it was painted red. But it is a cemetery.

Starting point is 00:07:30 It is a cemetery. It's just, it's an old school farm cemetery. So it's been covered over over the years. All right, it's all that they... They... They were surprised to find bodies in a cemetery. Yeah. But there's another one.

Starting point is 00:07:43 It must have been a serial killer. This is guys, you'll live a believe it. I've found another one. I think I know this one's name because it says right here who it is. I've started a figure out of this. This serial killer was organized. This serial killer would love a label maker. I think this serial killer was a bear goat.

Starting point is 00:08:07 So we find these feet and they're in perfect anatomical position. But when he raised the next stone, Bellentoni saw that the rest of the individual had been completely rearranged. The skeleton had been beheaded. The skull and thigh bones rested atop the ribs and vertebrae. And it looked like a skull and cross bones motif for a jolly Roger. I'd never seen anything like it,

Starting point is 00:08:32 Bellentoni recalled. So they found this one grave different from all the others, even before they opened it up. And then once they opened it up, the bones of all being, it's all being messed with in a way that looks kind of like it's a warning or something. Yeah, something's going on here. The other skeletons in the grave, the Gravel Hill side were packaged for rebarial but not JB which is what this one grave came to be known as. They think it was a 50-ish male from the 1830s,

Starting point is 00:09:08 and it was known as JB because they were the initials that were spelled out in brass texts on the coffin lead. It was shipped to the National Museum of Health and Medicine in Washington, D.C. for further study. Meanwhile, Balantoni started networking. It invited archaeologists and historians to tour the excavation soliciting theories, simple vandalism seemed unlikely as did robbery

Starting point is 00:09:32 because of the lack of valuables at the site. In the course of his far flung research, Balontoni placed a serendipitous phone call to Michael Bell, a road island folklorist, who would devoted much of the previous decade to studying New England vampire estimations. The Griswold case occurred at roughly the same time as the other incidents Bell had investigated,

Starting point is 00:09:52 and the setting was right. Griswold was rural, agrarian, and bordering southern Rhode Island, where multiple estimations had occurred. Many of the other vampires, like JB, had been disinterred, grotesquely tampered with and re-barried. In light of the tale's belltold of violated corpses, even the posthumous rib fractures began to make sense. JB's accusers had likely rummaged around his chest cavity, hoping to remove and perhaps to burn his heart. Pretty full on.

Starting point is 00:10:21 Well rummaging around is like a funny way. I almost got it. There it is. Yep. Yeah, like you're in the dark trying to find something in the back of a cupboard. My keys, I know they're down the back of this cap somewhere. Another back of this ribcage somewhere. Yeah, this vampire.

Starting point is 00:10:39 Just keep rummaging. So Michael Bell started investigating vampires of the New England area in the early 1980s. In the first 30 years of his career, he documented around 80 axiomations dating from the 18th and 19th centuries, most of which took place in the regional areas of New England. He's like the pre-aminent expert in this sort of folklore vampire field.

Starting point is 00:11:02 One thing to be, Tucker describes him saying, he wears hair in a sleek silver bulb, and he has a strong Roman nose. He favors black sweaters and leather jackets, and on sombre, he can easily accentuate with dark glasses to fit in with the goth crowd if research requires it. It's an adaptable outfit.

Starting point is 00:11:23 Yeah. Check on the sunnies. you're a goth god. Oh, you've got a goth now. To goth swear sunglasses, is that a thing? Dave, come on, everybody knows. Haven't you seen the Matrix? You're gonna be a goth. You check on some sunnies.

Starting point is 00:11:40 Yeah, well, when it's sunny, when it's sunny, when it's sunny, when it's sunny. I mean, go head to Toby, but you put sannies on your Goth. You know, there's so many Goths down at the beach in their bodies and sunnies. Oh my God, Goths everywhere in summer. Goths on the road on a glary day. Goths everywhere. I myself have been known to be a Goth sometimes. Some are the Goths time to time. Black sweater and leather jacket, that's a strong, already.

Starting point is 00:12:15 Yeah, he sounds like a real bad boy. Yeah. He's the bad boy of academia. Oh, wow. He's a bad boy of folklore. Oh, yeah. And his business card says vampire hunting. Yeah. He's a bad boy at folklore. Oh yeah. And his business card says vampire hunter, all right? Yeah, that's true.

Starting point is 00:12:30 He is described in a, because he's in any article about this topic, he is the key featured expert. He's the one, either he's just very available to chat to journalists or he is the guy, one of the two. I think it's, I think it's a bit of a column, maybe a column B.

Starting point is 00:12:45 Yeah. Yeah, this is, can't say it's vampire hunter, you flip it over, it says, I'm very amount of please. Please, please call me. Don't have to say please. Sunglasses are optional. Vell, it doesn't really appreciate how fictionalised vampires have become pop culture darlings in shows

Starting point is 00:13:03 such as Buffy the Vampire Slayer and the Twilight films, saying vampires have become pop culture darlings in shows such as Buffy the Vampire Slayer and the Twilight films, saying, vampires have gone from a source of fear to a source of entertainment. Maybe I shouldn't trivialize entertainment, but to me, it's not anywhere as interesting as what really happened. Okay, well, I mean, if you've seen the Twilight saga, it's pretty interesting. Saga, it's pretty interesting. Sounds like someone who's like offended at their portrayal on screen. Is this man about? Yeah, that's right. Oh, you could be unassuming here.

Starting point is 00:13:34 Yeah, I'm hunting him. I'm tracking him down. I'm an expert in him. Yeah, just call me, call me. And he kept me, because he's all, he's like, no, no, they're not real. That would be so because he's like no, no, they're not they're not real That would be so that's like crazy that you think that they're real but No, I can't meet you for lunch during the day, but I can hang out anywhere from

Starting point is 00:13:57 Sundown to sunrise Wearing sunglasses That's just because I'm a god. Yeah, I'm a God. I'm a God. I'm a God. So you guys might be wondering, what are vampires? Is that what you're wondering? No, I wasn't wondering that at all.

Starting point is 00:14:14 Yeah, I wasn't because I've seen pilots right now. I've seen all the toilets. Yeah. Okay, well, for the listeners at home who don't know, this is from history.com. Vampires are evil, mythological beings who roam the world at night searching for people whose blood they can feed upon. They may be the best known classic monsters of all. Most people associate vampires with Count Dracula, the legendary blood sucking subject of Bran Stoker's epic novel Dracula, which was published in 1897. Same year that VFL football began. But the history

Starting point is 00:14:46 of vampires began long before Stoker was born. Vietnam, Brahm Stoker is Dracula for Bookcheat yet though? No, is commonly requested, I've got a copy on the shelf, I was just going through my bookcheat hat the other day and I think I might be up there in the top three. Most requested books, I reckon, I'm going to get to it this week. Yeah. You should get to it soon because people look after this episode, people are going to go vampire crazy. They're going to be, I want to kind of feed on the blood of your book. I would just say, so to speak, it's lost control of that. A little bit in there.

Starting point is 00:15:21 No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, Dracula are aristocrats who live in castles. Some of those things are like, I think with vampires in popular culture and generally speaking, the rules change from text to text, but they are a lot of the common ones. I think sometimes they can see themselves in mirrors. And I was reading the whole counsemen mirrors and about because the people, you know, trying to take a document and they'd be like,

Starting point is 00:16:01 oh, I tried to take a photo, but they just don't appear in it. Mm. That's sort of like a loophole there. It's pretty fun. document them and they'd be like, I tried to take a photo but they just don't appear in it. That's a little like a loophole there. It's pretty fun. Little goes on, but vampires didn't start out so clearly defined. Scholars suspect that the modern conception of these Halloween monsters evolved from various traditional beliefs that were held throughout Europe. These beliefs centered around the fear that the dead once buried could still harm the living. And vampire-like beings have had a long and varied history, according to Alison Eldridge, writing for Britannica, creatures with vampiric characteristics have appeared at least as far back as ancient

Starting point is 00:16:35 Greece, where stories were told of creatures that attacked people in their sleep and drained their bodily fluids. I think that's a bit vague and not blood necessarily but bodily fluids sucking their piss. Oh god. Suck this piss dry. Suck it their piss. I mean, it's a weirdest thing, Barbara. Usually I go to bed, I've got to get up to take a piss two, three times, but last night, I didn't have to get up at all. What? What can you believe? Something was sucking out my piss. It's the last of it. I'm sucking my piss.

Starting point is 00:17:11 It's the only effect. As it goes on, vampire myths. Vampire myths were especially popular in Eastern Europe, and the word vampire most likely originates from that region. Digging out bodies of suspected vampires was practiced in many cultures throughout Europe and it is thought that the natural characteristics of decomposition such as receding gums and the appearance of growing hair and fingernails reinforce the belief that corpses were in fact continuing some manner of life after death. That idea that your hair and fingernails keep going, but it's really your body is receding rather than those things going. That's what it makes sense. You know, the vampires with sharp fingernails and big protruding teeth, that's just people saying corpse that's half decomposing going, holy shit, I don't understand how this stuff works.

Starting point is 00:18:02 The only explanation. Yeah, how it tastes so big. Yeah. Also, possibly contributing to this balloon and belief was the pronouncement of death for people who were not dead. Because of the constraints of medical diagnosis at the time, people who were very ill or sometimes even very drunk and in a coma or in shock, were thought dead and later miraculously recovered.

Starting point is 00:18:27 Sometimes too late to prevent their burial. Believe in vampires led to such rituals as staking corpses through the heart before they were buried. In some cultures, the dead were buried face down to prevent them from finding their way out of their graves. I love that one. You know what, I'll trick a vampire, but I'm still dead.

Starting point is 00:18:43 So they're trying to dig their way out, but they're digging their way further deep down in the ground. Got them. That's pretty fun. That's interesting. That whole staking, I never thought about it before. I never sort of connected it, but the idea of staking them through the heart wasn't necessarily started as a thing to the moving around vampires come and at ya. It was about a real human was buried, they were worried was a vampire. They'd bang a wooden stake into them so that it sort of tethered them to the gram so they couldn't get up. And then that sort of...

Starting point is 00:19:17 Oh, right. So it's like a... Yeah, exactly. Isn't that interesting? Wow. And gross. I never thought of that either. Yeah, because obviously all these things have some origin and it's a weird one to come about you. Obviously you kill a vampire with a wooden stake through a tarp. That's just what they would have had as a tool at the time and they were worried that these...

Starting point is 00:19:38 You're like if they'd waited a couple of centuries like they'd be handcuffing the body to the coffin. And then you'd be like, all right, just heck out of vampire, you've got to handcuff it. You've got to handcuff it. All right. According to history, extra.com, the idea of staking the undead to pin them to their grave

Starting point is 00:19:54 originates as a medieval southern Slavic practice associated with vampire epidemics. In these cases, exhumed bodies were considered to be unnatural because they were undercade, bloodied, or apparently fatter than in life, and hence not truly dead. Again, this is today usually attributed to a poor grasp of the processes of decay. Sometimes they'd be fatter because sort of gases were growing inside them or whatever, so they look like they're bigger.

Starting point is 00:20:21 But apparently, often these are natural things. Sometimes they'd move, the gases would fill up, so sometimes they'd even sit up, the corpse. They weren't sitting up when we buried them. So, vampire, I think that's what I mean. Even today, if I saw one without reading that, I'd be like, well, that corpse sitting up, there's something in this, that doesn't feel well.

Starting point is 00:20:41 Yeah, something's a bit off there. Something's a bit off there. Something's a bit odd. I just can't quite put it in there. Yeah, it doesn't seem quite right. Did he die sitting up? Was it some sort of L-pine, toboggan accident or something? He died doing what he loved.

Starting point is 00:20:58 Tobogganing into a tree. Tobogganing. Tobogganing's fun. Fun word anyway. Fun word,. Back to semi-div- Fun word, fun activity. Not often you can get the double there. Usually if it's a fun activity, not a fun word.

Starting point is 00:21:13 Yeah, a grade. Yeah. Like cricket. Puzzle. Fun word, not a fun activity. Puzzle. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Fun word, not a fun activity.

Starting point is 00:21:23 All vice versa, I'm not sure. A little writing for national geographic continues on this same writing. As a corpse's skin shrinks, its teeth and fingernails can appear to have grown longer. And as internal organs break down, a dark purge fluid can leak out of the nose and mouth. People unfamiliar with this process would interpret this fluid to be blood

Starting point is 00:21:46 and suspect that the corpse has been drinking it from the living. Bloody corpses weren't the only cause for suspicion. Before people understood our certain diseases spread, they sometimes imagined vampires behind the unseen forces slowly ravaging their communities. The one constant in the evolution of vampire legend has been its close association with disease, writes Mark Collins Jenkins in his book Vampire Forensics.

Starting point is 00:22:12 Trying to kill vampires or prevent them from feeding was a way for people to feel as though they had some control over disease. Because of this, vampire scares tended to coincide with outbreaks of the plague. In 2006, archaeologists unearthed the 16th century skull and Venice, Italy, that had been buried among plague victims with a brick in its mouth. The brick was likely a burial tactic to prevent straga, Italian vampire's or witches, from leaving the grave to eat people. It's interesting, depending on the culture, depending on the time and the place in history, these similar ideas about corpses coming back from the dead to kill or hurt people. That's saying it seems to be an idea that survived through centuries, but depending on where it was, they deal with it in different ways. Either they turn them

Starting point is 00:22:59 upside down, or they put a brick in their mouth, or they'd stake them to the ground with a wooden stick interesting. How big are their mouths in Italy? Well, how small are their bricks? You get a full brick in there? Little continues, not all vampires were thought to physically leave their grave in Northern Germany, the Naxe-Zera. You familiar with these days?

Starting point is 00:23:20 You're German heritage? No, I never heard that. They don't talk about these at family. They get together? Well, it hasn't come up yet. But I'll bring it up with the next re-era in our Deutschland. So they're the NACCH-Zero or after devourers. They stayed in the ground these ones chewing on their burial shrouds. Again, this belief likely has to do with purge fluid, which would cause the shroud to sag or tear, creating the illusion that a corpse had been chewing it.

Starting point is 00:23:48 These stationary masticators were still thought to cause trouble above ground, and were also believed to be most active during outbreaks of the plague. In the 1679 tract on the chewing dead, a Protestant theologian accused the Naxira of harming their surviving family members through occult processes. He wrote that people could stop them by exhuming the body and stuffing its mouth with soil and maybe a stone and a coin for good measure. Without the ability to chew, the tract claimed that the corpse would die of starvation. Tales of vampires continued to flourish in southern and eastern European

Starting point is 00:24:25 nations in the 17th and 18th centuries to the chagrin of some leaders. By the mid-18th century, Pope Benedict XIV declared that vampires were philatious fictions of human fantasy, and perhaps Bergrulla, Maria, Teresa condemned vampires beliefs as superstition and fraud. Yeah, so for a long time they've been around, but for a long time, people like this is silly, but you know, even like the pope and stuff. Oh, I found that interesting that apparently it became big issue in New England because of what are those areas weren't very religious. So they had they use these superstitions to explain things instead.

Starting point is 00:25:02 But as I always sort of connected vampire stuff with Christianity, because you know they use the crucifix to ward them off and stuff like that. It sounds like the Pope even, you know, centuries ago the Pope was like, now this is silly, this is silly everyone, stop believing in vampires. Yeah, it was interesting that the way the German guy would stop the knack zeroes by filling their mouth with soil is pretty clever. Easier than a brick I would have thought. Yeah, and more adaptable, like it really, you know, like if you have a small mouth and they're trying to put a brick in there, it can't fit, but, you know, soil, you just put

Starting point is 00:25:42 as much as you can. Yeah, exactly. If it was done today in Australia, it would have been, fill it with sellies no more gaps. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. That'll just fill to whatever the space is required. Yeah, yeah. That's what's so good about sellies no more gaps.

Starting point is 00:26:00 Yes. Lean for a couple of hours and you're ready to go. Very product. And if you have a Nazi problem, if you have a vampire problem, or an Nazi problem, or not a problem, or not a vampire problem. Maybe a similar. Honestly, there's very few problems. A cell leaves no more gaps. Can't fix. Name some problems. What about the gender? Sally's no more. Sally's on the lawn. We'll have this sorted out within the hour.

Starting point is 00:26:34 Thank you, Sally's. Nax zero. Not Nazi. Nax zero. Sorry. Very different words. There are a lot of German words with Annenzett in them. Yeah. There's two right off the top of my head. There's many, many, many words. There are. What was the letter definition? Many words out there. That's what's so interesting. That's what I think German, as a language, as a language German has lots more. But what's the translation? Translation. Yeah, translation. That's beautiful.'s the translation of translation? The translation of towers. Beautiful.

Starting point is 00:27:05 They're love to slam two words together. They're beautiful language. Beautiful language. So obviously, it wasn't the end of it. Even when Pope Benedict XIV and Maria Theresa were condemning vampire beliefs, it was still kicking on in the United States. I have vampire folklore made its way

Starting point is 00:27:23 to America is still debated. History professor Brian Carroll believes the anti-vampire rituals were introduced as a medical procedure at the time of the American Revolution by German doctors. And as such, he thinks the New England vampires were based on the German knack-zero. The ones we were talking about before, the underground munchers. But our man Michael Bell disagrees. According to Little, he believes anti-vampire practices in New England came from many places

Starting point is 00:27:51 and that the suspected New England vampires were actually more akin to Romani and vampires than the Naxeera. Whatever the source of the beliefs in New England, they were driven by the same social concerns as those before them, a fear of disease and a desire to contain it. And it seems that the disease at the center of the New England vampire panics was tuberculosis. I was familiar with tuberculosis. I knew the term and I knew it was bad, especially in the sort of, you know, century plus a go.

Starting point is 00:28:23 But I didn't know that much about it, but this was, yeah, it was a big one. It was a big one, one of the big ones back then. According to Tucker, though scholars today still struggle to explain the vampire panics, a key detail unites them. The public hysteria was almost invariably in the midst of savage tuberculosis outbreaks.

Starting point is 00:28:42 Indeed, the medical museum's tests ultimately revealed that JB had suffered from tuberculosis or a lung disease very likely. Remember JB, the Scaling Crossbones corpse from earlier? Yeah, so it sounds like it's amazing that they can figure that out from bones from 150 odd years earlier. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:29:02 So you may be wondering what is tuberculosis? Well, it's a disease caused by bacteria that usually attacks the lungs. It was a leading cause of death in the US back in those times. Also known as consumption, it began to poison New England in the 1730s and by the 1800s, according to Rhode Island Monthly, the highly contagious epidemic was to blame for nearly 25% of all deaths in the northeast. The name arose because the disease began to consume the physical being. With their action and withered bodies, victims resembled walking corpses, much the way vampires

Starting point is 00:29:35 are portrayed in folklore. In fact, the afflicted was said to be in the vampires' grasp. They coughed up blood with an incessant hack their breath was starved of oxygen. It felt as if someone was sitting on their chest. The healthier family members had appeared that someone was sucking the blood from their loved ones. Until a drug trade member was available in the 1940s, the diagnosis was a death sentence. The quack doctors would say they could cure it, bell notes, while the honest ones declared cleared, it's in the hands of God. These dubious doctors were primarily Slavic and German immigrants who touted a remedy from

Starting point is 00:30:10 Eastern Europe. Some were astrologers or herbalists, they were showmen who went from town to town, bell explains. In the early days, few people were educated so medical advice was not scientific. It was a role of the DAS. What these docs proposed, he says, was an antidote more terrifying than Dracula's fangs draining the living. Yeah, so consumption, had you heard of consumption? I don't think I knew that those were the

Starting point is 00:30:34 same thing. No, I didn't know that were the same, but I'd heard of consumption, yeah. Yes, I did. And it's also called TB. Do you know what that stands for? No. I've a, we're going to No. No. I reckon I could have guessed. I couldn't guess. Well, never know. I think it's never know.

Starting point is 00:30:50 The bug. No, no one knows. The bug. That would be my best guess. This boy, the point of the day, said, it's this kid's fault. He did it. He did it. Which boy did it?

Starting point is 00:31:02 TB, an appointing at this boy. TB. Oh, which is only one letter away from JB. And is there a possibility that they just misread the letter J? It's possible. Capital J and a capital T. But really it was saying, don't open this coffin. Don't open this coffin because he died of TB and you'll get it.

Starting point is 00:31:18 Hmm. Hmm. According to Nathan Chandler, right, for how stuff works. No one understood how diseases spread back then. All they knew was that consumption victims perished, and their surviving family members would begin to fall ill one by one. Neighbors would be afflicted too. So frightened villages began to believe that the first to die were perhaps vampires of

Starting point is 00:31:38 sorts. At night, those sharp toothed blood suckers would wriggle out of their graves, stalk their families, and slowly but surely suck the life out of their graves, stalk their families, and slowly but surely suck the life out of them, till they too died or understeaths. Terrified, villages reasoned there was only one way to halt the vampire attacks, but first that to dig up the bodies and examine them. If the corpse appeared to be less decay than expected, they'd slice the bodies open and sift through their internal organs.

Starting point is 00:32:03 Have a rummage. Oh. If the organs contained liquid blood, the person was deemed possessed. The theory seems sort of been that the corpse was being inhabited by some sort of evil spirit that was sustaining itself by draining the lifeblood from the living says bell. This spiritual possession had to be destroyed and the evil bond between the living and dead needed to be broken, usually by burning the infected organ and sometimes feeding the ashes to those who were ill. To be extra sure that the vampire wouldn't rise again, sometimes the corpses were beheaded, some of their bones shattered and rearranged

Starting point is 00:32:36 in a skull and crossbone symbol, as with the case of JB. As Tucker continues, the particulars of the vampire exhumations vary widely. In many cases, only family and neighbors participated, but sometimes townfathers voted on the matter, or medical doctors, and clergymen gave their blessings or even pitched in. The bodies would be dug up and inspected for signs of vampiric activity.

Starting point is 00:32:58 If they found supposed evidence, they would go about making sure the undead was proper dead again. Just like in Europe, how the excumations were conducted very depending on the region. For instance, Tucker writes, some beheaded suspected vampire corpses, while others bound their feet with thorns. It's hard to walk as a vampire if you got thorns bound around your feet.

Starting point is 00:33:18 It's hard to walk as a person if you've got thorns bound around your feet. That's a point. Yeah, that would suck. In New England, some communities in Maine and Plymouth, Massachusetts opted to simply flip the exhumed vampire face down in the grave and leave it at that. In Connecticut, Rhode Island and Vermont, they frequently burned the dead person's heart,

Starting point is 00:33:37 sometimes inhaling the smoke as a cure. Often these rituals were clandestine, lantern lit affairs, but particularly in Vermont, they could be quite public, even festive. One vampire heart was reportedly torched in 1830 on the town green and would stop Vermont. Your favorite state, that day.

Starting point is 00:33:53 Yeah, I mean, were any of the hearts turned into cremings? Maybe that's where the cremings started. They ran out of hearts, and they started using dairy products instead. Just so creamy. How the, depending on the state, some places were, you know, the graves were all these little farm graves

Starting point is 00:34:13 so they could do it with a small group at night. You don't have to get the whole town involved. But I think Vermont was more like communal graves so they kind of had to get everyone on board to do it. You couldn't sneak in there. Or up in the center of town so you have had to get everyone on board to do it. You couldn't sneak in there. All right, in the center of town, so you have to just get everyone on board, make a fucking mega party of it. Oh, right. It's a festive event. In Manchester, hundreds of people flocked to a 1793 heart-burning ceremony at a blacksmith's forge, and this is written at the time. Timothy

Starting point is 00:34:41 made a fishhead at the altar in the sacrifice to the demon vampire who was believed was still sucking the blood of the then living wife of Captain Burton. It was a month of February and good slaying, playing as in tobogganing. Oh, not as in the vampire slaying. Or is it different spelling? But I mean the English language has changed, it's a bolt. Maybe the two came from the same place. I used to do it around Christmas time. Santa's annual sly. Oh no, Santa's coming.

Starting point is 00:35:13 Yeah, it used to be very different tradition. Santa, vampire sly. Oh what fun, it is to ride, slaying song tonight. Is that what it is? Santa. Yeah this is a slang song. Santa please. Santa. Stop digging your mom. But you're making Santa feel like. I saw the cults of mommy kissing Santa Claus. Santa what are you digging up my relatives? This episode is brought to you by Progressive. Most of you aren't just listening right now.

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Starting point is 00:36:50 and financial aid is available to qualified students, including the GI Bill. Now is the time, mycomputercareer.edu. Probably the most famous story of the New England Vampire Panic was the case of Mercy Brown. You guys familiar with Mercy Brown? No. No. Sometimes known as America's first vampire.

Starting point is 00:37:12 Mercy Brown, known as Lena Tour family, lived in the farming community of Exeter Rode Island in the late 1800s. According to Tucker, in the late 19th century, Exeter, like much of Agrary in New England, was even more sparsely populated than usual. Civil war casualties had taken their toll on the community, and the new railroads and the promise of richer land to the West's fluid young men away. By 1892, the Yellina died, Exeter's population had dipped to just 961 from a high of more than 2 and a half thousand in 1820. And tuberculosis was harrowing the remaining families. People dreaded the disease without

Starting point is 00:37:51 understanding it. Though Robert Koch had identified the tuberculosis bacterium in 1882, news of the discovery did not penetrate rural areas for some time, and even if it had drug treatments wouldn't become available till the 1940s. So it was actually, it was known they'd figured out exactly what tuberculosis was at this point, but even still some areas were still thick nards, fanpires, either they hadn't heard or they didn't understand the medical discovery I guess. Nineteenth century cures included drinking brown sugar dissolved in water and frequent horseback riding. I mean, that cure is anything, doesn't it?

Starting point is 00:38:31 I mean, if you're down on your luck, I mean, I have a better fun. And it's going to be frequent. You don't think you can have the occasional horseback riding cure this thing. You've got to be doing a nonstop. Freaky a frequent like yours. yours. Take to the back. You are now living on horseback. I'm gonna live forever on this horse. So, on this horse, I live. I'm feeling better.

Starting point is 00:38:55 If they were being honest, Bell says the medical establishment would have said there's nothing we can do and it's in the hands of God. That's something he said, everybody's like they were giving false hope and they sort of quack different people giving these different possible ways to fix it. I guess they're offering hope but really they were offering false hope because they just had no way of treating it. And like I said, there would be no way to treat properly until the 1940s. The Brown family, living on the eastern edge of town, began to succumb to the disease in December 1882. Lena's mother, Mary Eliza, was the first.

Starting point is 00:39:32 Lena's sister, Mary Olive, a 20-year-old dressmaker, died the next year. Attender, a bitry from a local newspaper hints at what she endured, writing, The last few hours she lived was of great suffering. Yet her faith was firm and she was ready for the change. The whole town turned out for a funeral. Within a few years, Lena's brother Edwin, a store clerk, second two, and left for Colorado Springs hoping that the climate would improve his health. Basically just going to a warmer climate. Lena who was just a child, when her

Starting point is 00:40:01 mother and sister died, didn't fall ill until nearly a decade after they were buried. Betabercalosis was the galloping con. It's a whole stuff, isn't it? Can't trust him. And that means that she might have been infected but remained asymptomatic for years, only to fade fast after showing the first signs of the disease.

Starting point is 00:40:19 When it came on fast. She was like a carrier. Yeah. Kind of. Honestly, that sounds like a better way to go. Yeah, I think so, like a carrier. Yeah. Kind of. Honestly, that sounds like a better way to go. Yeah, I think so, that's true. I guess, yeah. Well, the other people linger in.

Starting point is 00:40:30 It's also one of those diseases that some people just had a natural shield against for whatever reason. And their dad never got it. I think I've got that. Yeah, you've got that. Naturally TB proof. I've never been consumed.

Starting point is 00:40:43 Right. Yeah, honestly, and I've scared of horses, hot riding horses, so if I get it, I TB proof. I've never been consumed. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Honestly, and I've scared of horses, hot riding horses. So if I get it, I'm fucked. Best of the galloping car. Why are you scared of riding horses? I got bucked off as a child. At a rodeo.

Starting point is 00:40:55 I didn't. I didn't. No. When I was in prep, so 60 years old here, we all went to the local farm. There's like a small local farm in Elham and everyone got to take an intense ride on a horse being led around the circle. And then when it was my turn, the horse cracked it.

Starting point is 00:41:15 And then you saved your horse, Dave. And then the lady, yeah, I was whispering, you're a piece of shit. You were a horse at the disadvantage. You're a horse. I was saying, donkeys. I'm a horse. You're more like a piece of shit. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're a piece of shit. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're a piece of shit. You're always hot out there, just like that.

Starting point is 00:41:26 You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that.

Starting point is 00:41:34 You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that.

Starting point is 00:41:42 You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. You're always hot out there, just like that. I'm happy to get the farmer. That horse got shot because of you. I'll have to get the farmer. Because of my whispering. Get the farmer and he's gun. No, they told us they just took him to the farm. So.

Starting point is 00:41:52 So the full size horse. But over that means? I imagine it was a small horse. It was a shetland pony and. It was probably a shetland pony and I was bucked. The only other time I rode a horse was in grade six at a camp. So it's been a while. It's been a while, but I respect them too much to ride them.

Starting point is 00:42:09 And I'm so scared that they weren't listening to me. Well, they will listen to you. It is mostly about talking to them, yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, the thing is, when you panic, they tell you like, oh, don't dig your feet in. Like that makes them want to go faster. But of course, like when you're freaking out,

Starting point is 00:42:23 you're like, oh, tensing up. And then it's just, it's like saying saying like if you're out of control in a motorcycle do not hit the accelerator, but then just just freaking out and just revving it. It won't stop the summary. That's why Dave scared of motorbikes as well. Yeah, that's what I'm So, so, so, Mercy slash Lena Brown, she had the galoping kind of consumption or TB. And a doctor attended her in her last illness and newspaper said and informed her and informed her father that further medical aid was useless. So they told it told him straight at this point. And she died.

Starting point is 00:43:03 Who told her, sorry? A doctor. Oh, sorry. You said it. Sorry, you were talking about coiting from Newspaper. I thought you said a newspaper visited and said, look, she's gotten a home. No, no, no. Yeah, that was the Newspaper road at the time. Then listening to the local tabloid. The town doctor did seem to be one of those science doctors it seemed to be one of those science doctors who knew what was going on with tuberculosis. So she died, she was 19. Her January 1892 obituary was much closer than her sisters, writing Miss Lena Brown, who was suffering from consumption died Sunday morning. It was a lot colder.

Starting point is 00:43:43 Oh yeah. Maybe because they think they're riding about a vampire at this point. Maybe. I'm not sure, or not sure. Maybe it was just a different person wrote it. Maybe Lena was the one who wrote the last one and she was the one with the talent for the pros. As Lena was on her deathbed her brother was after a brief remission taking a turn for the worse Edwin had returned from Exeter I've returned to Exeter from the Colorado Resorts in a dying condition According to one account if the good wishes and prayers of his many friends had been realized

Starting point is 00:44:17 Friend Eddie would speedily recover and be restored to perfect health another newspaper wrote but some neighbors likely fearful for their own health, weren't content with prayers. Several approached George Brown, the children's father, and offered an alternative take on the recent tragedies. Perhaps an unseen diabolical force was praying on his family. It could be that one of the three brown women wasn't dead after all, instead secretly feasting

Starting point is 00:44:43 on the living tissue and blood of Edwin as the Providence Journal later summarized. If the offending corpse, the Journal uses the term vampire in some stories, but the locals seem not too. So yeah, that's something that the people who are talking about this aren't calling them vampires. They're just thinking it's like this, this other thing. Vampires, that'd be silly. But they're trading them like vampires, and it's just easy to talk about it in that way now, yes. I gotta say this is not that long ago. Yeah, that's the wild thing, isn't it?

Starting point is 00:45:14 Like George Brown. It's not that long. George Brown lived until 1922. My grandparents were kids then, or you know, it'd just been born. Some of them. Wow. So I've mercy brown live she you know if she lived a full life she would have lived to like 1950 or something or a lot of labor even you know isn't that yeah. So this is what they were saying. The locals are

Starting point is 00:45:39 going we find the offending corpse we destroy it then Edwin the brother, he'll recover. The neighbors asked to exume the bodies in order to check for fresh blood in their hearts. George Brown gave permission, and on the morning of March 17, 1892, a party of men dug up the bodies as a family doctor and a journal correspondent looked on. George was absent, for unstated, but understandable reasons. So obviously he didn't want to be there. He actually didn't want to do it. He didn't believe in the vampire stuff, which is wild.

Starting point is 00:46:10 But according to the Providence Journal, he asked the doctor to perform an autopsy at the graveyard, and he only authorised the exclamation to satisfy the neighbours who were according to another newspaper account worrying the life out of him. He basically just got pressured into it. Yeah. So anyway, the group dug up the bodies of Lena as well as a sister Mary Oliver and her mom, Mary Eliza.

Starting point is 00:46:32 As the Mary's had been dead for nearly a decade, they were understandably a long way decomposed. Lena on the other hand was looking similar to the day she died. Some sources even say that her body had turned over in the grave. Though unlike her sister and mother, she'd only been buried for a couple of winter months. And as the ground was extremely cold, it was as if she had been preserved in a cool room. So it made a lot of sense that she didn't look decomposed because she was buried a lot more recently and it was freezing cold though in the ground.

Starting point is 00:47:08 The doctor conducted an autopsy and he found that her lungs showed clear signs of tuberculosis which he told the villages, but they weren't convinced. They found that when the heart was removed, blood was inside. Liquid blood in the heart of an exhumed corpse was viewed as unnatural since it was interpreted as Liquid blood in the heart of an exhumed corpse was viewed as

Starting point is 00:47:25 unnatural since it was interpreted as fresh blood, says Bell. People understood the blood coagulates following death, but they didn't know it can liquefy again, depending on the circumstances of death. For example, the blood of a person who died suddenly has a tendency to re-liquify. Convince she was a vampire, the villagers took her heart and liver and burnt them on a nearby rock before mixing the ashes into a tonic for a brother Edward to consume, believing this would save his life. So his brother not only is on his deathbed, he's now being made to drink or eat his sister's heart. It didn't work and he died a couple months later. I'm shocked. Yeah, I really thought that was going to do it.

Starting point is 00:48:08 It was so recent. You know, the Saints were already a football club at this point. You know, that's what they were already at half time. Yeah. Yeah, it was a while before they thought about cut up oranges. So 120 years after this grim occurrence, Tucker and Belle went out to visit Mercy Brown's final resting place, and she wrote, he lies beside her brother who ate her heart and the father who let it happen. Other markers are freckled with lichen but not hers. The stone looks to have been recently cleaned. It has been stolen over the years and now an iron strap anchors

Starting point is 00:48:43 it to the earth. People have scratched their names into the granite. They leave offerings, plastic vampire teeth, cough drops. Once there was a note that said, you go girl, today there's a bunch of trampled daisies and a dangling butterfly charm on a chain. People still believe that she was a vampire, you know, there's still this, that's why some people visit and they noticed that hers is the only grave where the grass doesn't grow. And they're like, that's sure, that's proof. And bells like, no, that's just because that's the only grave everyone's visiting. And they're walking on top of it. So it grasses and it's going to grow there. Walk over. Yeah. Tucker finished her story on mercy, Lena Brown writing, Lena hasn't

Starting point is 00:49:21 left entirely. She is said to frequent a certain bridge, manifested as the smell of roses. They're fun. People find you as a see you as a ghost, but they don't see you, they smell you, and they don't smell you, they smell roses. There she is. It has nothing to do with the fact that roses are nearby. Yeah, the bridge is over a rose field. But that's got nothing to do with it. She still appears in children's books and paranormal television specials. She murmurs in the cemetery, say those who leave tape record is there to capture a voice. She's rumoured to visit the Terminal Yil and to tell them that dying isn't so bad, which is nice.

Starting point is 00:50:00 It's a nice way to use, like, you know, it's not you see a lot of hauntings, but if you're haunting people to say hey To comfort the dying that's that's alright. Yeah, you'd freak out though death ate so bad Join us Don't worry darling, it's not so bad over you You're gonna eat eat that, you've been jelly. You've got a love jelly. You said before that they leave cough trops at a grave side. I guess because you cough so much during tuberculosis, but it's like, leave some fucking

Starting point is 00:50:39 antibiotics. Yeah, that's right. Help us out. Yeah, come on. Yeah, come on. Yeah, that's funny, isn't it? It's interesting that people are leaving tape recorders out and hearing, why wouldn't she, if she was there,

Starting point is 00:50:52 she'd probably say words, murmuring. She's sort of murmurs. All my sounds like the wind. I don't know how she does it. Yeah, she sounds a bit like a goat. There is a goat, lives in the flybar. I think that's coincidental. It's all coincidental.

Starting point is 00:51:08 The story lives on in many other ways. She's referenced a lot in pop culture, including in previous topic, HP Lovecraft's The Shandhaus. Lovecraft himself was born in Rhode Island in the late 1800s. So he was living in Rhode Island when this happened as a young child. But these stories, I guess, would have been swirling around somewhat. It's interesting, because at the time this area is right near, like, a lot of intellectuals would go around there to a new port nearby for summer holidays. And this is like, you know, intellectual times. And they're so strange that nearby, you know, just down the road,

Starting point is 00:51:54 people are digging up what they think of vampires while like the great minds of the era drinking shandys by the beach. So, what, that into like a pool of food? Big shandy drinks. Oh yes. So I've heard. You might be wondering Dave and Jess even possibly as well. Was Brown any influence on the most famous vampire story of all? Brown Stoker's Dracula. Is that why you guys were wondering? I was personally wondering that a lot. Yeah, Jess, to a lesser extent? To a lesser extent, yes. I was thinking about it, but also thinking about cheese, so. Yeah. Oh man. I was thinking about cheese too, yeah.

Starting point is 00:52:39 Well, the answer to your question is maybe a clipping of an 1896. Yes, I don't know, I didn't look into that. Why'd you ask? Yes, sub-buggin' me. So a clipping from an 1896 article about Mercy Brown was later found amongst Stoker's things. Stoker was touring America that year's a theater company's stage manager

Starting point is 00:53:01 and his gothic masterpiece Dracula was published the following year in 1897. According to Tucker, some scholars have said that there wasn't enough time for the news accounts to have influenced the Dracula manuscript. Yet others see Lena in the character of Lucy, her name being a very tempting amalgam of Lena and Mercy. A consumptive, seeming teenage girl turned vampire who is exhumed in one of the novel's most memorable scenes. Fascinatingly, a medical doctor presides over Lucy's disentermen, just as one oversaw leaners.

Starting point is 00:53:31 So there's definitely parallels there. And he definitely knew about the case, because he was found that he had a clipping of a news article about it, whether or not there was time for him to write that into the book or not, people disagree. I did see somewhere else, someone said that he was actually touring the year that it happened,

Starting point is 00:53:49 so which was about five years earlier, which would have given him heaps of time to write it into the story and be influenced by it. But I think either way that makes sense. You could write, you could rewrite something, even if it was a year out, surely. How long does it take to rewrite? Yeah, for me, minutes.

Starting point is 00:54:04 And I've written quite a few Gothic masterpieces. With sunglasses on, obviously. Very hard to see the page with sunglasses on. Interestingly, Stoker has thought to have found inspiration into other historical figures that we've done previous reports on, including Vlad the Impaler and the Blood Countess. They were episodes 1755 if you're interested. According to Little, vampire panics died down in the 20th century as these fictional monsters

Starting point is 00:54:32 replaced folk beliefs and also medical knowledge improved. However, there was a strange resurgence in the late 1960s when Sean Manchester, the president of the British Occult Society, said that a vampire was causing people to see strange things in London's high-gate cemetery. This story, I already told back in episode 162, the show was called Unbelievable Urban Legends. So I didn't realize I've all done a lot of vampire-related stuff over the years. Yeah, wow, it's amazing. We have vampire podcasts. I think we want to see a vampire podcast.

Starting point is 00:55:05 What the hell? Is there a category for that on iTunes? There should be. Yeah, we're top of the vampire charts. Imagine that we weren't. Yeah, that's a suck. So anyway, that's basically the end of this report. But I did want to finish with a possible fun fact

Starting point is 00:55:23 for new listeners. Some reason only Jess has allowed to decide if a fact is fun or not. I don't remember why that is. Because I'm the only one who can. It's my cross to bear. You write a thesis on that, Matt, and you get to be the expert. Yeah, yeah, I got that for some reason. But anytime you're like, is that fun, you're not sure.

Starting point is 00:55:42 I know. But every time there's a vampire panic, that bloke turns out, every time there's a fun fact, our Jess Perkins turns out. Yeah. She says, in all the dockos, all the articles they reference her on fun fact.

Starting point is 00:55:53 Yeah, that's on my business card. Fun factologist. Very available. I'm very available. All right, so let me know, Jess, what do you think about this one? This comes from a live science article written by Benjamin Radford. I assume live science could be live science.

Starting point is 00:56:10 It's one of those words. It's about how to find a vampire. So this is what you need, according to Benjamin Radford's research. According to one Romanian legend, you'll need a seven year old boy and a white horse. The boy should be dressed in white, placed upon the horse, and the pair set loose in a graveyard at midday. Watch the horse wander around, and whichever grave is nearest when it finally stops

Starting point is 00:56:35 is a vampire's grave. Do you think that's what happened when I was in prep? Yeah. We all went back to that horse, and then I was bucked off because they found a vampire. Yeah, that's the only explanation. Right here, get him off. Just wherever the horse stops.

Starting point is 00:56:49 Yeah, where the horse stops. That's dumb. You really hope that your loved ones haven't dropped a bouquet of delicious flowers on your grave. Yeah, awesome apples. It would make sense why Brown's grave has no grass on it though. The horse keeps stopping there. Oh, that makes sense. Dave to say and holy shit. Holy shit. You've cracked this case wide open Dave. So that is the end of my report on the New England vampire panic. Love that. And was that a fun fact? Yes, we didn't get a ruling. Yeah. It's pretty, it's a, I don't know if I'm allowed to claim a new category because I've got boring facts,

Starting point is 00:57:27 but to me that's a funny fact. I was going to say it is funny. Which I guess, I guess, you know, half of the word funny is fun. So, all right, I'll allow it. It's a fun fact. Right. We did it. That's a great, great tale there, did it. That's a great tale, Emma. It is amazing that multiple reports of ours have crossed over. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:57:51 And something that a lot of people mentioned was that it wasn't far from the area of the Salem Witch Trials, but it was a couple of hundred years later. That mercy brand story. Amazing that such things were still happening. Although someone did mention, I think our man Michael Bell said, one of the key differences was at least this time they were only accusing dead people, you know, whereas in the witch trials, they were killing people for being witches. So it wasn't as full on, I guess. That's arguably worse, arguably.

Starting point is 00:58:28 Yeah, but yeah, just fascinating stuff. Very much so. All right, well now it's time for everyone's favorite section of the show, where we thank a few of our supporters, and you can become a supporter by your own Patreon.com such do go pod, or do go on pod.com. And there's a bunch of different levels, all sorts of different rewards. You get bonus episodes, you get to vote on topics.

Starting point is 00:58:50 Like this week's episode was voted on. I should say it was so close. It won by one vote against another topic, which I have to put up for another vote. And I'm talking like hundreds of votes, and it came down on margin of one. So yeah, one of the big rewards you can get is on the Sydney Shamburg Deluxe Memorial

Starting point is 00:59:10 edition level resting piece, you get to give us a factor quote or a question. This section has a little bit of a jingle that goes something like this. Factor quote or question. Ding. Anyways, remember the ding. And so yeah, you go to the,

Starting point is 00:59:24 you sign up on that Sydney Shamburg level, you give us a factor quote or a question, you also get to give us, or get to give yourself a title, and I read four of a amount, I read a amount for the first time on the show, that we all get to live, learn and laugh together. This first one comes from Soth Waldron,

Starting point is 00:59:40 and Soth has given herself a title, photographer of live shows long past. So for Zer, I think Soth must have, photographer of live shows, long past. So for that, I think Sophas must have been a more live shows than anyone else. I think the world record is held, absolutely. Because she's been to nearly every Australian one we've ever done, and didn't we see her in England or somewhere?

Starting point is 00:59:59 Yeah, in London I believe. So that's how she got that title. And Sophas given us a a quote here it is. I'm currently reading John Green's The Anthropocene Reviewed. I highly recommend it by the way. And in it, he quoted a poem by Paige Lewis that I can't get out of my head. Here is that quote. I feel as if I'm on the moon listening to the air hiss out of my space suit and I can't find the whole. I'm the Here is that quote, life and I can't help but agree. That's great. So, I love that. Should I try and read it again more fluidly? I feel as if I'm on the moon listening to the air hiss out of my space suit and I can't find the hole. I'm the vast president of panic and the president is missing. That is really

Starting point is 01:00:57 great. I love it. I like that. Reminds me of one of my favorite Troy McClure movies, The President's Neck is Missing. LAUGHTER That's good stuff. Thanks so much, sir. The next one comes from Tom Goodall, who's given himself the title of fact-checker and chief who knew it with Matt Stewart. LAUGHTER

Starting point is 01:01:18 Checker and chief of who knew it with Matt Stewart. Which is my spin-off podcast, which is it's band-a- to come out. I'm going to start making it sometime this year, I reckon. So it's good to have a chief fact checker ready to go and Tom Goodall. Yeah, very important, yeah. All right. Tom's also, oh no, he's offered us a fact and his fact is. It better be right, Tom. Oh, and I wonder if it'll be fun. We'll find that out. We'll find both those things out soon. The two most played songs ever by the BBC are, I don't know if you guys want to have a guess of these. I don't think you'll get them.

Starting point is 01:01:51 Oh, yesterday by the Beatles? No, I think they're both British, but one of them is a previous topic. Or the band was a previous topic. Queen. Yes. Sucked in, Dave. That's not the upper thumb. A Hemi-Rhapsody?

Starting point is 01:02:04 Yes, Dave. Oh, Jess. You delivered it to him on a platter. No, I'm taking that point. All right, just take it. Is the other one like the BBC theme song? No, it's a wider shade of piles. That is a good guess, though. And I reckon you might have a monotecticality there, surely.

Starting point is 01:02:22 LAUGHTER He's asked me to pause while you sing both. Yes. No. Both songs were jointly also voted best pop songs by the Brita Awards, are in the Grammy and Rock and Roll Hall of Fame, and feature in the Rolling Stone top songs of all time. But the weirdest thing they have in common is that both songs reference the Fandango dance.

Starting point is 01:02:48 That's fun. That's fun. What are the odds of that? Yeah. I mean, the BBC know what the people want. Fandango. All Fandango. I didn't see that coming.

Starting point is 01:03:05 Thank you very much, Tom. This next one comes from Rachel Johnson. It would also, she'd be up there with the record for most live shows or a film. Rachel's given herself the title of President of Pops and Pavlova. A couple of very important roles there. And Rachel has offered a sequoit short one here, what if I fall? Oh, but my darling, what if you fly? That's from Aaron Hansen, Australian poet, great quote, love that.

Starting point is 01:03:38 Are you familiar with that work, Dave? Aaron Hansen? No, but it does also sound like famous last words, doesn't it? Yeah, someone's egging you on, jumping off a cliff. What if I fell? No, that one if you fall. What if you fall? Hi.

Starting point is 01:03:55 Oh, no, she's fallen, yeah. Yeah, no, she was right up front. Straight up front. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I think it's a more powerful part for me for next time. It's a bit, yeah. I recognise her quite. Are you know that one? Yeah, I know that one. I didn it's a more popular point for me for next time. Yeah. I recognise the quote. Are you know that one? Yeah, I know that one.

Starting point is 01:04:08 I didn't know who it was. So that's nice. Yeah. Thanks for that Rachel. Finally, last one we've got here is from Daniel Headley, whose title is It Me, The Dickhead. And Daniel has asked us a question. His question is,

Starting point is 01:04:25 Jess recently had a segment on Triple J, during the weekday show, Pover and Hing, where she got people to call up and tell us they're absolutely useless shit skill. What are yours? Oh, oh, this was like, this was last week. This was fresh, yeah. So Daniel, he didn't do the, I normally say, if you're asking a question, you've got to answer your own question, which is Daniel

Starting point is 01:04:53 and his partners. Do you want some context on what I was doing on radio? So what we were doing, what I was doing was, because the Olympics were on, and I was like, yeah, yeah, whatever. I'm sick of saying I was joking. It was tongue in cheek, but it was like, yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever. I'm sick of saying I was joking. It was tongue-in-cheek, but it was like, the Olympics is all about people, you know, but they are the best in their field. They are achieving athletic greatness. They are the least.

Starting point is 01:05:16 They're like a Michael Bell of sport. Exactly, a perfect analogy, thank you. But I was like, whatever, let's celebrate the useless skills that we have. So the producer I was working with, can I identify where someone is from in the UK with 90% accuracy based on their access? That's very good. That's great. That's how hard, are they English? No. Wow, that's an amazing skill. Very impressive. I've said to people before like I'm like, well, we're in Scotland, and they've been from Newcastle or vice versa. And it's always embarrassing. And I don't even guess

Starting point is 01:06:00 anymore. If you're asking a Scottish person, whereabouts in England they're from, that is a faux pas. That do not happen. That's not going to go well. I'm Irish. Yeah, I get Irish and Scottish confused sometimes. I normally have to really stop and think and concentrate.

Starting point is 01:06:19 And these are like the big, famous broad accents, let alone regional ones. So that producer, that is a great skill. Yeah. And 90% is Hawaii. with the big, famous broad accents, let alone regional ones. So that producer, that's a great skill. And 90% is high. Yeah, my mum can always look at left overs and pick the perfect Tupperware container for those leftovers.

Starting point is 01:06:38 She'll lay it every time. It's those kind of useless skills. I'm pretty good at catching things in my mouth. Skittles specifically. Yeah. That's a good party trick. Yeah. And from a distance as well, like, you know, if somebody threw...

Starting point is 01:06:53 If somebody throws Skittles at me, I'll catch him. Impressive. So that's just some context there if that helps. All right, Jess, what about this skill? Whenever someone's talking a little bit, a little fragment of what they've said, we'll start my brain singing a song with a similar lyric. Like you just said from a distance, and then my head started singing. I think bad middle.

Starting point is 01:07:21 That's a pretty good skill. Yeah, it's pretty shit. Like it's useless. It's useless. But yeah, you didn't say you, skill. It's pretty shit, like it's useless. It's useless. But you didn't say unique. It's just, no, no, that's great. It doesn't have to be, how could it be? I mean, like, it doesn't have to be unique.

Starting point is 01:07:35 I mean, none of the Olympians are unique. Are they? There's a bunch of them there doing the same thing. That's right. Oh, I'm actually really good at jumping over a stick. Yeah, so's like 10 of these other people and you're all gonna have a crack at it. Okay, is.

Starting point is 01:07:53 That's a good point. So it doesn't have to be unique. Just something that's probably a bit useless. Yeah, I've got a really loud click. Oh, me too. Why? And very consistent. Pfft.

Starting point is 01:08:04 Pfft. Pfft. That's my left hand. Yeah, I can't click left hand pretty useless. Right hand on my K. We could save Go. So it's my visual. Yeah, it's going to be very confusing to tell who is clicking. Who was clicking? You're all very good or very maybe it's me

Starting point is 01:08:37 Yeah, the other one that I don't I think it's faded a bit But I'll say Tromba Bertrand used to always get me to do this he go. He found it interesting that I could remember where I was the first summer sort of movies. Yeah, he used to get me, be like, uh, the Lion King, I'll be like, oh, my 10th birthday party, if so with Damon, Damon bought me a block of Cabri Hayes on a chocolate for for my president and Yeah, he stayed over that night. That's sort of stuff. I love that. It's a very wholesome skill It's cute wholesome skill. Yeah, I've been I think as time goes on my memory is fading a bit And I can't I'm losing those memories unfortunately

Starting point is 01:09:23 Try me try it. give me an old movie. Armageddon. Haven't seen it. What? You gotta say Armageddon. Oh really? Jurassic Park? Jurassic Park, so with Nicholas in content with his dad,

Starting point is 01:09:41 I was back visiting content for for a dream school holidays. I love it because we can't fact check it. That's my favorite. Yeah, that's true too. You could be making all this up. I wasn't actually in Conte, I don't think Conte had a cinema, but I was staying in Conte. We went to the closest cinema there. I actually saw the Jurassic Park plot. The lies unravely. So that's the fact quoting questions section for this weekend.

Starting point is 01:10:05 Any other ones Jess? What was the best one that a caller in came up with? Um, that's a good question. I can't really remember. Not one of your skills. I can't remember at all. Yeah, remembering, not up there with mine, with my skills. Oh, this is actually quite visual, so don't.

Starting point is 01:10:24 I can do that thing where, and I've never met anyone else who can do that, where you put your arms out like this, and then lock your arms in like this. And then, yeah, you're out of this quite visual, isn't it? But then you can put your head through the hole in the middle. I can put a photo up if we need to.

Starting point is 01:10:39 And all you've said is where you can put your arms like this, and then you can do this, and then you turn them around like this. It's when you lock your arms and then you bring them back to what you're self. And then there's a little hole formed in between your four arms and usually it's really quite small. And I've heard people say no one could put their head through there, but I can. That is.

Starting point is 01:10:58 That's what I think you'll have to escape. Something. That's why I think you should vote for me. I should be the next prime minister. Thank you. Maybe you'll have to be reborn sometime. You'll have to get your head out of small. All right. So the other thing we like to do is thank a few of our other

Starting point is 01:11:18 Patreon supporters and Jess, you normally come up with a little game here that's related to the topic. Any thoughts on this one? Yeah, I'm struggling a bit with this one. Could give them a different mythological creature? Yeah, that's good. Yeah. Or, or a rock.

Starting point is 01:11:38 And they're part of a, like the something else panic. Yes, panic. Right. All right, well, it's there, panic. Right. All right, shall I kick us off? Yeah. All right, I'd love to thank from Rockdale and New South Wales, Beck Lehman. Beck Lehman, what about the slug girl panic?

Starting point is 01:11:56 Slug girl. Slug girl. Yeah, slug girl. So we're not starting with any, that are already known. We're just making ones up, are we? What do you mean? No, we're going with like, this is like top five.

Starting point is 01:12:11 Slug girl. Slug girl, probably the fifth most famous cryptid creaturey type thing. Yep, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. What does a slug girl do? Slugs around. Slugs around. Please, please, like the horrible trail. And you're like, oh my God, the slug girl's been here. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around.

Starting point is 01:12:25 Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around.

Starting point is 01:12:33 Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around.

Starting point is 01:12:41 Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Slugs around. Imagine a full human stars version of that. Yeah, oh, there'd be, oh yeah. Take of the whole hallway. I just fucking washed that last weekend. I just washed that hallway. I'd also love to thank from Inglewood in Western Australia, Bonnie Larson.

Starting point is 01:12:56 What's she panicin' about, Jess? The Demon Horse. Oh yeah. Laura. Panic. Lucifer. Yeah, yeah. Lucifer yeah Lucifer yeah Damon horses with glowing eyes and they will back small children off them It's like I'm trying. Oh, she's a real Damon horse in the sack Yeah, yeah, yeah, but that's not a good thing

Starting point is 01:13:24 It is not good. You will die. Thank you very much, Bonnie. And finally, for me, I'd love to thank from Hamilton Hill, also on Western Australia, Jesse Wormold. Jesse Wormold. It's got Worm in the name there.

Starting point is 01:13:40 Yeah. It being Jesse, sorry, didn't really, it you. Jesse Wormold. Um, I reckon Jesse was a part of the upside down cupboard panic. Oh no, you're quite as a topsy-turvy. And ever like they didn't know why it was happening, but all the cupboards were upside down. Wow.

Starting point is 01:14:11 Until, like, buried a small set of drawers, the curse was then broken. Wow. Yeah, confusing one. But they all are completely correct. They are exactly, yeah. They're all complicated and you know with the with hindsight we go, oh, how kooky. But back then, this was 15 years ago. It was a different time. That's almost the mid-term. It's very strange. Strange time. That's all my, the mint on the outside. It's very strange.

Starting point is 01:14:43 Strange, John. Would you like to thank a few people, Jess? Yes, I would love to thank from Clinton, M-A, Massachusetts. Is that right? Yeah, surely. No, probably not. No, there's also a main. No, Massachusetts.

Starting point is 01:15:01 Possibility. M-A, Massachusetts. It is Massachusetts. It is Massachusetts. It is Massachusetts. Yes, Jess, never doubt yourself. From Clinton, I would love to play in New England. Which is in New England. I think.

Starting point is 01:15:15 I would love to thank Katie McEwan. Katie McEwan, the sinkhole witch. Oh. Causing all those sinkholes. Yeah. And a which. Yeah. Yes. There's a few things on the go. There isn't there. That's a bring it back. There's a lot happening in that one. Yeah. Famous history. With the sinkholes and witches, I believe. Yeah. Wow. How did they fix that one? They filled the sinkholes with bricks and dirt. Right.

Starting point is 01:15:46 That's a nice... Well, what... Top'd it off? Keep making more sinkholes. Well, they topped it off with a bit of cellies. Oh. Problems are off. Yeah, and that'd be fun then, yeah.

Starting point is 01:15:56 No, which can get around cellies. No one can. I would also love to thank from Bell Park in Victoria, Brianna Nash. Brianna Nash. Brianna Nash, obviously, or famously involved in the Swarada bottle panic. Yeah, but I know, have I swallowed a bottle, they would say. Everyone thought they'd swallowed bottles. They weren't sure. That's why it was a panic. There was one missing bottle in the town and they thought,

Starting point is 01:16:29 well, someone swallowed it. Someone passed it. There's no other possible explanation of where this bottle could go. So somebody's bloody swallowed it. Who swallowed the bottle? Who was it? Dennis and mechanic found, oh, hang on. I put it in the wrong bin.

Starting point is 01:16:43 Here it is Dennis Fucking out of this you started a swole a bottle panic. We've cut Again half the town Dennis Okay Fucking Dennis So yeah a big a big panic there in Bell. And I would also love to thank from Westfield, I-N. Indiana. I want to say Indiana, yeah.

Starting point is 01:17:12 We've been watching a lot of parks and recs, so Indiana is on the brain. Westfield, I would love to thank Ronaldo, Scalzi. Ronaldo, Scalzi. Fantastic, name the Ronaldo. What are they panicking about in Indiana, Dave? Yeah. Nauticality. Fantastic. Nany, you're another. What are they panic in about an Indiana dive? It is the fly fishing coyote. Panic.

Starting point is 01:17:32 Panic. Panic. That's right. No one could quite get their fly fishing technique working. And the morning, the last time someone did a good one, they'd seen a coyote. So they figured that the coyote, so they figured that the coyote must have cursed their fly fishing technique, so they had to go around and kill every coyote in the state.

Starting point is 01:17:54 I'm afraid. Oh my God. Geez. Or coyotes. It's a sad story, Dave. Well, it has a happy ending. Oh yeah. The fly fishing technique returned to full ability

Starting point is 01:18:06 and everyone had a great day fishing. So that is good news. That's great news. There you go. Hey, hey, there you go. Ronaldo Scalzi, thank you so much for your support. I'd love to thank now from Columbia in Maryland, Jocelyn Cravitz. Jocelyn Cravitz.

Starting point is 01:18:27 Jocelyn Cravitz. Thank you so much for your support. The... The... Picture frame bandit, panic. Oh! Okay. Picture frame bandit. Is it someone stealing picture frames or like making them off center, or?

Starting point is 01:18:46 Both. They would steal them from one person's place, put them up at somebody else's place, crooked. Very weird, you'd wake up in the morning and on your wall would just be family portraits of strangers, and it would be crooked. It was very unsettling. Oh my goodness, crooked portrait.

Starting point is 01:19:05 You're like, who's this family? Why are they all in the same colored jeans and white t-shirts? It's weird. You are this weirdo. It looks so staged and unnatural. Well, thank you so much, Jocelyn Crabbitts. I'd love to thank now from location unknown and I can only presume that means it is deep

Starting point is 01:19:27 within the fortress of the malls. And that is big thank you to Sarah Horton. Malt people panic. The Malt people panic. Which was a dance craze. We're all doing. Everybody do the Malt people panic. Bamp, bamp, bamp, bamp, bamp, bamp, bamp, bamp.

Starting point is 01:19:43 Ooh. It was actually quite similar to the Fendango. That the original lyric, Can you do the Mold-People panic? Doesn't quite fit. Yeah, so that to rework it. Wow, it's a great name, Sarah Horton. A lot of great names here today, yet again.

Starting point is 01:19:59 One final to think, and that is from Florenceville Bristol, that's a half-natter place in Canada, I would like to thank James Allison. Where Wolf Bannock? James out. The Where Wolf Bannock. Yeah. How are we spelling Where on that one?

Starting point is 01:20:17 W-E-A-R. W-A-R. Is it a fashion panic? Yeah. We're all wearing clothes. We're, fashion panic. Yeah. Wolves, wolves are gone around wearing everyone's clothes. Oh, this is part of the panic though, because people couldn't work out what they were panicking about. Yeah. One day the town woke up and all the humans were wearing wolf skins and all the wolves were wearing human skins and clothes.

Starting point is 01:20:47 It was weird. That's weird. No good. Oh, that's. That would make me panic. Yeah, that's cause for panic. Yeah. It's the only one that we've listed that I'm like, I understand the panic to be honest.

Starting point is 01:21:02 What? Up to the encubbers. You know, panic. No, I What? Up to the encubbers. You know, panicking? No, I'm going, that's a bit odd. But waking up in a wolf skin and seeing a wolf wearing my skin, yeah, I'm panicking because that's fucked. Yeah, that's very good. Yeah, that's no good at all. No good at all. That's crook.

Starting point is 01:21:21 That is crook, but a beautiful tribute to James Allison and the support you've given us over the years. So, thanks again to James, Sarah, Jocelyn, Ronaldo, Brianna, Katie, Jesse, Bonnie and Beck. The only thing we're left to do now is to induct a few people to our tripage club, just a small handful today. The way this works is if you support us on the shout out level or above the three straight years, you get inducted into the club.

Starting point is 01:21:53 It's a beautiful space. You can always, you want to remember, you're always a member. And it's just a fun place. Physically, it's located this week in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, but it is also always located in our hearts. So welcome in and butts, thank you. To these five inductees this week, I'm standing on the door, I've got the velvet robe,

Starting point is 01:22:20 ready to lift it, I've got your name written down on my clipboard. I'm gonna say your name, then Dave's gonna hype you up because you're being welcomed in this club, it's important that you feel right at home straight away. And then,

Starting point is 01:22:33 because that takes a bit of effort from Dave, Jess then gives Dave a little bit of a hype himself. Jess is also behind the bar, normally comes up with a little cocktail, anything this week? Jess? Yeah, lots of vampire themes, obviously. So we've got garlic bread, we've got steak,

Starting point is 01:22:51 we've got cocktail wise, we have blood orange, mimosas. Oh, delicious. And Dave normally books a band who you booked this week, Dave. We've actually got a rotating lineup of every artist on the Twilight soundtrack. Wow. Oh, we're going to get Muse. I'm Muse is there. Muse. We've also got Paramore. I'm looking at a list here. Robert Pattinson, that's obviously a spoken word bonus on the belief that he's going to do it. Collective Soul, mute math, Lincoln Park, and more.

Starting point is 01:23:28 Whoa, that's pretty good. All right, well, the inductees this week are from Cooper Pety in South Australia. It's Chris McDougall. Oh, come on in and grab yourself a Cooper Pety. Yes! Yes! Yes! It is thanks. Woo! From the Greensboro in Victoria, Australia, it's Toby Gawl.

Starting point is 01:23:49 Oh, the Gawl of this guy, because he's so cool. From Jalong in Victoria, Australia, it's Jamie Boros. Oh, one of the Boros. Boys, Boros, it looks better written down. I'm sorry, I realized I just nodded at you at the last one. I was like nodding approvingly, but it wasn't, it wasn't audible. Sorry about that. He gave me nothing.

Starting point is 01:24:09 He gave me nothing. No, I'm, audibly, audibly. Yeah, okay. But yeah, Jamie Boros, one of the boros, I should have said, Boros, I love that, love that. The third Victorian inducted in a row here, representing the big V from Burmara's Victoria Australia.

Starting point is 01:24:27 It's Peter Holberton. Holberton? Well Holbert, hold my beer Holberton and come on in. Yes, that was something alright. Yeah. And finally from Cologne in Deutschland, Germany, it is from Cologne in Deutschland, Germany. It is Berina Limpa. Oh, can you smell that? A beautiful Cologne from Berina Limpa. Come on in. Yes, he's done it. He's done it again.

Starting point is 01:24:56 Thank you so much, everybody. You're all my burrows. So welcome in Berina, Peter, Jamie, Toby and Chris. And that brings us to the end of the episode. Dave, you want to book this baby home? So welcome in, Verena, Peter, Jamie, Toby and Chris. That brings us to the end of the episode. Dave, you want to book this baby home? Yes, I do. Thank you so much for everyone who has listened to this episode.

Starting point is 01:25:12 We will, of course, be back next week with another episode. But to keep yourself occupied in between, you could support the show on Patreon or dogoonpod.com and unlock all those bonus episodes or you could buy some merchandise or you could suggest a topic or follow us on social media and there's links to all those bonus episodes, or you could buy some merchandise, or you could suggest a topic, or follow us on social media, and there's links to all those things on dogoonpod.com.

Starting point is 01:25:31 We also have an email dogoonpodatgmail.com. But I guess, until next time, I'll say thank you for listening, and goodbye. Lighters. Lighters. Lighters. Lighters. Lighters.

Starting point is 01:25:43 I would just say light is! Yuck! This episode is brought to you by Progressive. Most of you aren't just listening right now. You're driving, cleaning, and even exercising. But what if you could be saving money by switching to Progressive? Drivers who save by switching save nearly $750 on average, and auto customers qualify for an average of 7 discounts.

Starting point is 01:26:09 Multitask right now, quote today at progressive.com. Progressive casualty and trans company and affiliates, national average 12 month savings of $744 by new customer surveyed who saved with progressive between June 2022 and May 2023. Potential savings will vary, discounts not available in all safe and situations. Are you working way too hard for way too little? There's never been a better time to consider a career in IT. You could enjoy a recession resistant career in a rewarding field with plenty of growth opportunities and often flexible work environments. Go to mycomputercareer.edu and take the free career evaluation. You could start your new career in months, not years. Take classes online

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Two In The Think Tank - 304 - The New England Vampire Panic

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