Do Go On - 407 - The Real Pocahontas

Episode Date: August 9, 2023

You've probably grown up with the Disney film, but you might not know the story of the real life Pocahontas. This is a comedy/history podcast, the report begins at approximately 07:37 (though as always, we go off on tangents throughout the report).Support the show and get rewards like bonus episodes: patreon.com/DoGoOnPodSupport the show on Apple podcasts and get bonus episodes in the app: http://apple.co/dogoon Live show tickets: https://dogoonpod.com/live-shows/ Submit a topic idea directly to the hat: dogoonpod.com/suggest-a-topic/ Twitter: @DoGoOnPodInstagram: @DoGoOnPodFacebook: https://www.facebook.com/DoGoOnPod/Email us: [e-mail] Check out our other podcasts:Book Cheat: https://play.acast.com/s/book-cheatPrime Mates: https://play.acast.com/s/prime-mates/Listen Now: https://play.acast.com/s/listen-now/Who Knew It with Matt Stewart: https://play.acast.com/s/who-knew-it-with-matt-stewart/ Our awesome theme song by Evan Munro-Smith and logo by Peader ThomasDo Go On acknowledges the traditional owners of the land we record on, the Wurundjeri people, in the Kulin nation. We pay our respects to elders, past and present.  REFERENCES AND FURTHER READING:https://time.com/5548379/pocahontas-real-meaning/https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pocahontashttps://encyclopediavirginia.org/entries/pocahontas-d-1617/https://www.nps.gov/jame/learn/historyculture/pocahontas-her-life-and-legend.htmhttps://libapps.salisbury.edu/nabb-online/exhibits/show/native-americans-then-and-now/introduction/how-is-indigenous-history-port/the-true-story-of-pocahontas Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Melbourne and Canada, we got exciting news for you. And we should also say this is 2026. Jess, what year is it? 2026. Thank God you're here. Right now, I'm in Melbourne doing my show with Serenji Amarna, 630 each night at the Cooper's Inn Hotel, having so much fun. We'd love to see you there.

Canada, we are visiting you in September this year. If you've somehow missed the news, we are heading up Vancouver, Calgary, Montreal, and Toronto for shows. That's going to be so much fun. Tickets for all this stuff, I believe, are online. And I'm here too. Welcome to another episode of Do Go On. My name is Dave Warnke and as always I'm here with Jess Perkins.

Hello, Jess. Hello, I wish I was never born. Well, someone hopefully that does wish they were born. And we're glad that they are born because that means they could join us as a special guest this week. It's Michelle Bracier. Hello. Hello. Hello, how are you?

Oh, I'm the only one who's going to clap for a guest. Thank you. I'll clap as well. Yeah. Thank you. Oh, welcome. So great to have you here. Thank you. It's good to be here.

We've plucked you from the depths of your Edinburgh fringe run. Yes. Brought you back in time to Melbourne. Yes. And let me tell you, now that I'm back in time, I wish that I stretched more now because I am tired then. Yeah. Yeah. I'm one week in and I'm tired.

And how many standing ovations have you had one weekend? What date is this? The ninth? I've had nine. That's bold I like it. Yep. I've had nine. That's the, yep.

I assume it's sold out for the entire season. But just in case it isn't, people should look it up to make sure it's not. Oh, double check, yes. Yeah, double check. Yeah, double check that. Dobley, dobley chich-chooze. And what time are you on? Seven?

Yeah. Yeah, I think so. I think it's seven. Around seven. Seven-ish. I was going to guess 30, but, you know. No, I think it's seven. At the Gilder Balloon.

At the Gilded Balloon. At the Gilded Balloon. Fantastic. And you've got a few weeks, a couple of weeks of shows left at this stage. Yes, until the end of August. And that's 2023, if anybody's listening in August of 2025. And we're long dead. Yeah. Humanity or just the three of us? Three of us. What happened? Oh, mate.

Big submarine accident. Oh, dear. Yeah. Just three of us on wood. Just the three of us, yeah. Wow. I'm building it. The deepest podcast. I wonder what that record would be. That's why I'm building it.

It can't be that deep. Like, I don't, I reckon you could do that quite easily. Okay, like at the bottom. We could do it in the bath. Probably. Should we do a podcast in the bath? Or a pool, at least. But, like, what if we did it in the bath?

Yeah, okay, we could. Do you have a bath that could fit all three of us? Yeah. I mean, not, like, comfortably. Not comfortable. I don't think, like, Matt couldn't get in. He's got, he's too long. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

But the three of us. Squished up. Yeah. Yeah. Can zoom in from his own bath because he loves the bath. Matt could zoom in from a bath. Remember that Zoom we did when we were all losing our minds, Jess Perkins during the pandemic in the lockdown where everyone started, we were dressed in a theme,

which was tennis. Yeah, well, it was like country club. And then we dressed like wealthy people from country clubs. And then we had weird cocktails like PIMS, I assume. Yeah, it was not PIMS. We all went and bought PIMs in our homes and then ended the Zoom. Everyone got in their individual baths. Even like, and I didn't have a bath.

I had a bunting storage tub. And I got into the big budding storage tub and Tim got into the smaller bunting storage tub in our second bathroom. And he joined the. Zoom. And that was the moment I realized I loved him. That was the moment. We were about five years in. And I thought, no, I do like him. I like him.

He's quite funny. Also available to see in my Amber Fringe show. Also, you can see the Bunning Storage Tub that I was bathing in in that as a bit about it in the show. Yeah, I didn't know you'd actually up. I went into a real bath. I was still imagining you in the tub. Yeah, no, I've moved to a place with a real bath.

That's why I thought all three of us were getting to the top. I've seen it in the show and it's like, we're not getting in there. You'd be surprised how easy it is to get into a bunning storage. I mean, I really was quite shocked at how easy and how pleasurable my experience was in that budding storage time, big storage 80 litres. Fantastic. 80 litres is a lot of leaders. That's fantastic.

You can, you're in, you're in that, you know, you're a little squished. But it's good. It gets a bit cold. You pour it out. You fill it up again. You do have to pour out those 80 liters. That's part of it. Oh, yeah, so plug.

It's a real balancing. Yeah. No plug. Yeah, true. That's the best part. I've just realised the best part of a bath is the plug. The plug is so important. An important feature of the bath.

Dave, why don't you explain to people what we're doing here today? What we do here is we take it in terms of a report on a topic often suggested to us by one of the listeners. We go away, we do a bit of research. We bring it back to the group in the form of a report while the other two people chat along. Yeah. We should mention Matt is away on holiday.

this week, so he's not here. He's not just being very awkwardly quiet in the corner of you. But that would be believable. If you thought that was the case, you're not, you know, like, you're not that far off. He's just being shy. He is here. I forgot to turn his microphone on. But it's Jess has turned to report on a topic this week.

And Jess, we always start with a question. Do you have a question for us? I do. My question is, which Disney princess was modelled on and voiced by Irene Bedard? Is it Pocahontas? It is Pocahontas. I was going to say, Little mermaid, is she a princess?

Yeah, they're all Disney princesses. I'm a princess. Are you a princess, Dave? I'm, we're all Disney princesses. We are all Disney princesses. Oh, but Pocahontas. Pocahontas. There you go.

Here's something fun. I am very distantly related to the real Pocahontas. No way. Yes. No. Yes. Wow. Yes.

How did you find that out? My auntie told me. No, I didn't verify it. You just went, I'll take that. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I know we have like some South American, that's not that far away from the other America.

Listen, I should Google it. Yeah, but I think there is a family tree thing that you got. Anyway, I'm sure it's somewhere in there. Yeah. Wow, there you go. Well, how fortuitous that we've had you on this episode. Yeah, me, a real life polka honus. Yes, yeah.

Well, it's been suggested by quite a few people and the Patreon's voted for this topic as well because, yeah, I'm going to talk about the real poker hauntus. Toot, too. And it's been suggested by Jared Schaefer from Ohio, Nick Moll. Holt House from Mount Gambia, Charlotte Stevenson from Liverpool, Hazel Jaggers from Halesham and Sandy Ty from Ballarat. I've been to Ballarat. I've been there too.

Wow, I've been there as well. My grandma lives there. What? Like heaps of my country. How did she get that? She auditioned? It was like, it was ages ago. Oh.

Did she get discovered? Yeah. Head hunted. Yeah. In the street at the mall? To live in Ballarat. At Sports Girl. Yeah, sports girl.

I always, when I go to Sports Girl when I was little, I thought I would get her head. hunted to be a model. That's what Sports Girl meant to you. It was like, I'm about to be discovered. In Warga. Did you just walk around? Yeah, I'd like strut around. Excuse me, Miss, you've been in Sports Girl for six hours.

Yeah. Can we help you? Yeah. Yeah, you can help me. Take me. Be a star. To the stage. Wow.

Okay. What do you mean? But that's how, I mean, that's why you're in Edinburgh right now. I got ahead. Sports Girl brought you over to Edinburgh. The Sports Girl sponsored me. I'm produced by Sports Girl. And for international.

Listen, is sports girl has nothing to do with sport. No. It's a fashion retail chain. It's your Forever 21s. Yeah, yeah, yep. It's your top shop. Yeah, they got makeup pallets and little hair clips and good sunnies. Good fun, isn't it?

Bit of fun. Bit of fun. A bit of fun. A bit of fun. Thank you, sports girl. We will take your money. Thank you so much, sports girl. So, Pocahontas. Yes. Here's a basic plot of the Disney movie. Great.

It's been a long time since I've seen it. I must have yet. I re-watched it and I was like, oh boy. Well, so the most well-known depiction of the story of Pocahontas is the 1995 Disney film. So this is sort of the plot of that film. In the early 1600s, English settlers travel from London to the new world with hopes of adventure, finding gold and creating settlement. In the Powhatan tribe in Virginia, Pocahontas,

the daughter of Chief Powhatan, fears being possibly wed to Cocoaum, a warrior who she sees is too serious for her own free-spirited personality. After having a dream about a spinning arrow, Pocahontas visits Grandmother Willow, a spiritual talking willow tree that alerts her to the arrival of the English.

Meanwhile, Captain John Smith, voiced by Mel Gibson. That's right. Mel Gibson. It's a bad choice for it. It's so weird hearing Mel Gibson. And also, So all of his crew, like the entire crew is English.

He's American, but voiced by Mel Gibson in the mid-90s, when he could still comfortably do an Australian accent because he grew up here and he'd just done Gallipoli. When did Gallipoli come out? I don't know. So why not just make him do an English accent? Why is Captain John Smith American? Was John Smith American?

No. Wow. He just couldn't do an English accent. Maybe. I reckon that's the answer. That's so funny. No, Gibson was like, I'll do Mel Gibson. Thank you.

Yeah. If you want people to believe it's Mel Gibson. Okay, Glipockeme in 1981. It'd been a while. I think if you're an actor and you can't do general British. Yeah. Fuck off. Agreed.

You're not an actor. You have to be able to do at least a general British. Yeah. I mean, and honestly, you're like with a lot of accents, a lot of characters, you kind of need just a line to get into them. Like a Jason Statham you need, what makes you think I'd wish my life for you? Yeah. Yeah.

Right. So like general English, just do anything from Harry Potter. Anything. Or worse, expelled and you're in. Yes, exactly. Exactly. She needs to sort out her priorities, you know? You're in.

Lucky Hermione pays attention in herbology. Wingardium leviosa. You're there. Leviosa, not leviosa. You know, it's right there. I could do this entire thing with the general British and you wouldn't know. You would think I'd just gone on a jaunt. I, you know, I could, I, Phoebe Waller Bridge, you know, and Nigella.

It's obvious. Microwave, you know, have some fucking cold-cha, dumb. It's fine. It's fine. No, good on him. Good on you, Mel Gibson. Sorry to pick on the little guy. What's he ever done?

Exactly, perfectly. Perfect in every other way. So anyway, Captain John Smith, he goes off exploring the wilderness. He's having a bit of a look around, this new world. and he comes across Pocahontas. They quickly bond, fascinated by each other's worlds. I'm sure they were. And end up falling in love.

Do they just chat in the movie? I can't remember. Initially, she sort of hides the fact that she can speak English, baffling that she can, to be honest. She went to school. Yeah. She went to school for it. She got Duolingo.

And they kind of, well, originally he's going to shoot her because he's there to kill. That's what he's there to do. Which is, that's realistic. Most of the others are like, We're going to find some gold. If we come across some savages, and he's like, leave them to me.

I'll kill them. I've killed heaps of them before. Oh, okay, great. What a cool guy, don't you think? So he's hiding behind a waterfall as she sort of like skips across one time and he jumps out to shoot her. And then he's like, wait, she's a babe. And then he doesn't shoot her.

So ladies, it pays to be hot. Pays to be hot. Disgusting. Anyway, but like, you know, we're looking at this through a modern lens, you guys. He jumps out and he says, have you heard of sports girl? You could be a sports girl model.

You would love it. Anyway, they become friends. They fall in love. After a fight between settlers and natives, Powhatan orders the natives to stay away from the Englishmen, but Pocahontas and John continue to meet up. Both sides find out about this budding relationship and a fight breaks out. Kokoam attacks and attempts to kill John,

but a young settler, Thomas, voiced by Christian Bale, intervenes and kills Koguong. Now, which of his many accents is he doing? He is doing English. and he does not sound like Christian Bale. Wow. It's crazy. That's exciting.

He sounds so, I mean, it was a long time ago. He's probably just younger. But I'm like, is that his real voice? I always find it very confusing when he speaks. He's English. Yeah. When in interviews, you go, that's not what you sound like. That's not you.

Stop it. Stop it. Stop making fun of the interview off. I put on this silly voice. Sorry. Billy Connolly's also in it. Oh, fantastic. Which is fun.

Can't argue with him. What was that bit of plot there? Someone nearly dies. Thomas kills Kokoam. Okay. So Kokoam is attacking John. Thomas intervenes because right at the start of the film, Thomas goes overboard. John saves him.

Now Thomas is saving John's life. So he kills Kokoam. John's like, get out of here before the rest of this tribe comes. They'll kill you. You just killed someone. Enraged at Kokoam's death, Powhatan angrily berates Pocahontas for leaving the village and declares war on the English, beginning with John's execution at dawn. Yeah, they're the ones that did the war.

Yeah, it's their fault. This is how I remember it. Meanwhile, Thomas has made it back to the English settlers and tells them of John's capture and they rally together to go fight the native people. Morning comes and Poetan and his tribe drag John to a cliff for his execution. Meanwhile, Ratcliffe, who's the governor. Daniel Ratcliffe. Ratcliffe, Ratcliffe.

Ratcliff, you dog. That's General Ratcliffe. He's a classic Disney bad guy. He leads the. armed colonists to fight Poetan's warriors. Just as Poetan is about to execute John and start the war, Pocahontas intervenes, throwing herself onto John and finally convincing her father to end the fighting between the two groups and spare John's life.

She like throws herself onto, realistically as well, you're watching it, and her dad is like mid-swing, and then she sort of jumps on, and like, logically, you're like, physics, that it wouldn't work. She'd get hit. She'd get hit. He's not in a position. He can't stop. But he does.

And is it with an axe or something? It's like with a big club. Oh, ow. Yeah, it wouldn't be nice. So she, like, puts her head on top of Johns and is like, if you're going to kill him, you've got to kill me. It does like, all right. Put her head on top of Johns.

Oh, we're going to, we're going to two for. Because he's kind of, like, got his head on the side, and she just puts her head on top. Oh, yeah. That's beautiful. And she's like, I love him. And everybody's like, the fuck? And the English are like, whoa. and their Native Americans are like, whoa.

And like the little animated animals are like, what? Because they understand English as well. I love the animals. And they're all- Even's here. They're all speaking English the whole time. It makes a lot of sense. Anyway, the Voyager's leader, General Wrightcliffe, the bad guy,

orders his men to attack anyway, but they refuse. They're like, Billy Connolly says, But they don't want to fight. Yes, Billy Connolly. Love it. And he's just doing Billy Connolly's voice? He's just doing Billy Connolly, yeah. You don't hire Billy and then say,

do general British. You don't say, can you do Harry Potter? Can you do Harry Potter voice? Billy, could you just, could you do something different? Stephen Frye. Can you do Stephen Fry? Did you do Stephen Frye, please? He was unavailable. You go, give us full Billy.

Yeah. Thank you very much. But they don't want to fight. It's like that. Because it's a Disney movie, so it's, you know, all the lines are very exaggerated and it's fun. It is fun. So they're refusing. They're like, we're not fighting them.

They don't want to fight. But Ratcliffe fires his musket at Power Times. and John sees all this happen, leaps in front of the bullet, takes the bullet, saves the chief. Wow. John's, he's nursed back to health by the tribe, but he has to return to England for his, to get medical care. John asked Pocahontas to come with him, but she chooses to stay with her tribe and to help keep the peace. John leaves without Pocahontas, but Powhatan says, you're welcome here anytime. You can return any time.

You're one of us. Right. All you had to do was risk your life for me. Yeah. Okay. You're all right, kid. Was that a stake? I don't know.

At the end, Pocahonda stands atop a cliff, watching the ship carrying John as it departs. That's beautiful. Is that the end of the movie? That's the end of the movie. Wow. It's a beautiful and romantic tale of love, conquering all and bringing people together.

I mean, a lot of violence for a Disney cartoon from the 90s. Yeah, yeah. Apparently, like, some of the songs, in a modern lens, some of the songs lyrics, you kind of like, Ooh, but even back then they were sort of trying to, I don't know, give, what am I trying to say, they were like trying to show what a ridiculous opinion they were having of these Native Americans. I was sort of like, you know, yeah.

So it's, in a modern lens, it's yuck, but it's kind of purposefully yuck, I guess. So yeah, it's a love story, but it's also largely untrue. Oh, sad. Oh. Which is fine because it's a Disney movie made for children, but it's not great at telling the story of a real person's life. I don't think I realize for a very long time that Pocahontas was a real person. She in fact was. But it's actually likely that Pocahontas wasn't even her real name. Okay, they've really done a real rebrand. What bits of the story did they keep?

Well, she is referred to as that, but William Stith, who was a historian in the 1700s, said her real name, it seems, was originally Mataox or Matooka, according to other sources, which the Native Americans carefully concealed from the English and changed it to Pocahontas out of a superstitious fear lest they, by the knowledge of her true name, should be enabled to do some sort of hurt. I don't really, they just didn't want them to know her real name. That's fair. I wouldn't tell them anything. Yeah. I don't think you should. So they, they just, Pocahontas, I think was a nickname, a childhood nickname meaning either little wanton or sometimes some people interpret it as playful one. So it was a nickname, Pocahontas. Oh, cute. Her birth year is unknown. It's

thought to be around 1596, and she was the daughter of Chief Powhatan, who was the paramount chief of an alliance of about 30 groups in the Tidewater region of present-day Virginia. So he was like, top chief. Now, little is known about Pocahontas's mother, and there are a few theories about her identity and status. Some assume that she would have had a fairly lowly status in the tribe. It has been theorised that she died in childbirth. There was an Englishman named Henry Spellman, who was only about 14 when he arrived in Virginia, and he was basically given by John Smith to a village of native people with the agreement being that he would learn the Powhatan language and become an interpreter.

He was given. You can have him. You can have this guy. They'd arrived about two weeks earlier, and they go on this little expedition, and he essentially is like, here, you go live with them, learn the language, and then you can interpret for us. And I believe in some things I read, like the Native Americans essentially gave a young person to the English settlers as well for the same thing. They did a boy swap. Yeah, they did a boy swap.

I'll swap me that boy for this boy. Oh, my boy's worth two of your boys. Look at him. Look at him. All right, all right. Yes, you're right. You give me this little piece of shit boy. This boy has psoriasis.

I don't have the relevant creams for this boy. I can't help this. You're going to give me the creams. I can't be expected to do. sauce creams for this boy. One by one cream. You know the rule. I don't want the boys to be uncomfortable here.

He can't be, you know, he's itching. He's not going to learn. He'll be distracted by the itching. And that's fair. That's fine. So just give me the cream. Give me the cream, mate. Hand over the cream.

Honestly. So he would then serve as a messenger between the two communities and facilitate trades and other communications. I got really, I got really lost in his Wikipedia page for a little bit because I was like, that's wild. But anyway, the reason I bring him up is that because in his writings, he knows. he noted that when one of the Paramount's chiefs, many wives gave birth, after she'd given birth, she was returned to her place of origin,

could be within any of those 30 smaller tribes. And she'd be supported by the Paramount Chief until she found another husband. Oh. So that's possible as well. It's like he's got many, many wives for giving him lots of kids. Okay. And then, like, I support you until you find somebody else. Someone else to support you.

Thank you for letting me rent your uterus for a bit. Right. Listen, as far as that sort of thing goes, at least she had a bit of support, I guess. Yeah. Yeah. I wouldn't volunteer for the program. And that's okay, you don't have to. I'd rather be in the boy swap.

Yeah. The boy swap program sounds really good. We had a boy swap, I think. We had a Japanese boy come and stay with us for a bit. Yeah, there's it. It's just an exchange type thing. It's an exchange. And you, like, you really immerse yourself in the language, which is the best way to learn any language.

Absolutely. I learned Japanese from the man. Did you? Well, the boy. He was a boy. He didn't have psoriasis. He didn't come with a cream. but he did help me with my Japanese.

Hey. That means yes. Sucked in if you didn't understand. And did you help him with his English, do you think? Yeah, which means no. The Mataponi Reservation, the people that are descendants of the Powhatans, their oral tradition claims that Pocahontas's mother was the first wife of Poetan and that Pocahontas was named after her.

So there's kind of a few different theories about who Pocahontas' mother. was, but we don't know for sure. My auntie's theory is seeming further and further away from true. You never know? It feels like it's not true. We don't even know who her mother is. Yeah, we don't know who she is. I'm like, oh, I'm related to it.

I'm related. I am related. No percent. One. No question. Yeah. I really just didn't look it up. And I kind of forgot about it until you just said it just now.

Yeah. It's one of those. But I think especially as when you're a younger person, you just believe the things your family say. Yeah. And then you get a bit older and you're like, has anybody looked into that? Yeah. Grandma said it one time, so we all just accept that.

Yeah. Okay. Yeah, I've got some family stuff. Yeah. There's some stuff that I'm like, oh yeah, that's that side, is it? Are you sure? There's some, yeah, there's definitely some secrets. We're looking into them, into them.

Oh, exciting. Yeah. We'll do a report on Michelle's genealogy one day. It'll be a good fun. So we don't really know much about him. Mother. What we do know is that Pocahontas is most famously linked to colonist John Smith, who arrived in Virginia with 100 other settlers in April 1607.

The colonists settled on the James River, and their little town, was called Jamestown. Oh, like the massacre. No, Jones Town, different. Different town. And way earlier. So this is original Jones Town. This is the original Jones Town. I saw original that it was pronounced James back then.

That's amazing. Language changes differently. It's so interesting. It's so interesting. Language. Over the following months, they have. had several encounters with the native people. Some of those encounters were friendly, others were hostile.

So the friendly bit was the boy swap. The boy swap, that went pretty well. That always goes well. And then other times they were like... I'm doing a boy swap in Edinburgh. Oh, good. Yeah, I'm swapping Tim for another boy. Yeah, good.

Yeah. Let Tim spread his wings a little bit. Learn another language. Yeah. Swap, swimming in a... Tim comes home just full Scottish. His grandmother's Scottish, so he, you know, I need to immerse him here. But is she actually Scottish, or is that just something...

His family says... She was Scottish and he just believed him. She was born there, but you know, who knows? Come on. Could be like, he does have ginger hair. Have you seen a birth certificate though? Do we know she was born there? I think we do have the birth certificate because we're trying to get the visa.

But yes. Oh, okay. But it could be faked. It could be faked. I wouldn't put that past grandma. I hope it's real because I want to get married specifically because I want him to wear a kilt. Like I'm not interested in getting married or being a wife or having a wedding, but I want him to wear a kilt.

So I'm happy to spend like 20 grand or whatever it is. Okay. To see him in a kilt. Can we just get him a kilt? Yes. Could that be easy? Yes, yes. The thing is that kilt's on their own cost $21,000.

That is it. But for our wedding it comes. In the package. It's one of those weird things. Yeah. Yeah, right. Yeah. Okay.

It's really good. That's exciting. It's so good, yeah. There was a hunting party led by Powhatan's brother, captured Smith while he was out exploring near the Chickahominee River. Okay. Also, I meant to look up more of the pronunciation. I'm definitely butchering it and I'm so sorry.

That's okay. But go back a few episodes, listen to Matt speaking French and I think you'll agree that at least I'm saying the letters. Uh-huh. Yeah. Flamenno-no-sand. But he can't hear that he's not saying a word. But he's gesturing and making like a honking sound.

There was some English words that Matt says that he can't hear that he's not saying the word. That's true. And we love him. I say that with love, and we wish him well. With a full awareness that he's not here to defend himself. Yeah, it doesn't feel right, doesn't it? No. He is, I just won't turn that microphone.

He's swearing black and blue. Oh, come on. Get me in there. See, John Smith's captured by... By the brother of... Powhatan. Oh, my goodness. So, I guess, Pocahontas's uncle.

Writing about the encounter a few months later, Smith recalled a great feast, followed by a long talk with Powhatan, presumably through the teenage interpreter Smith had handed over to strangers. Do you know their boy. He offered Smith rule of the town of Capahosic. That's so generous.

Yeah, which was close to his capital. And in Encyclopedia, Virginia, Margaret Williamson Huber, theorised that this decision from Powhatan was hoping to keep Smith and his man nearby and better under control. That's smart. Treat him nice, keep him nice. You know, that theory that more flies with honey. enemies close.

Enemies close. Glenn close. Glenn close. Okay, we're getting there. That's quite, I mean, I was imagining when he's being captured, they're like, he's at risk of being killed or whatever, but they're like, he's having a nice feast. Yeah.

He's being offered. Having a chat. A town. Lovely. Yeah, captured. I'd love to be captured. But many years, many years later in 1616, Smith wrote about this capture again, and in this new account, he included a detail he hadn't previously.

So the writing a couple months after the capture described a nice dinner and a chat, but years later he described a threat to his life. What? Yeah, the chicken was off. This is what he wrote. At the minute of my execution. Sir, hang on. You said they fed you and you had a chat and now they're executing it. You mean executing the contract to take over this town that they're given you?

Feels like you're lying. And this is where he mentions Pocahontas. He says, she hazarded the beating out of her own brains to save my. mine and not only that but so prevailed with her father that I was safely conducted to Jamestown so essentially he said Pocahontas like saved him like protected is that one that the beating of the brain do they interpret that as her putting her head on his as she's about to be clubbed that's right and he expanded again in 1624 again years and years later two great stones were brought before Powhatan then as many as could lay hands on me dragged dragged me to them and

Thereon, okay, hang on. Some of it's in weird tenses, and I'm trying to change it as I go. I'm just going to read it as it's written. They dragged him to them, and thereon laid his head and being ready for their clubs to beat out his brains. Brains with an E.S at the end? Weird. Pocahontas, the king's dearest daughter, with no entreaty could prevail, got his head in her arms and laid her own upon his to save him from death. So, yeah.

She actually did that. Yeah. That fucking rules. She's so nice. What a nice person. But from Time magazine, he was brought before the Great Powhatan, where he encountered men with clubs ready. He thought to beat out his brains.

Suddenly Pocahontas intervened and put her head on his. In his 1624 general history of Virginia, Smith wrote that she risked her own life to save his, but modern scholars think she was probably playing a scripted role in some kind of adoption ceremony. Afterwards, Powhatan called Smith his son. Oh. So when you were adopting a child,

you almost... their head to death of the club. You get your other child to put their head on their head. Yeah. And then they're your son. But see, because... That's how babies are born. That is crazy.

I've wondered along. Whoa. Yeah. I've been fucking. No. That's not it. That's where you're going wrong. Oh, that's yuck.

I know. Sorry. That's really gross. Don't do that. Sorry. Oh. Sorry. Sorry, guys.

I was just joking. I haven't done it. Oh. Yuck. But I haven't. Don't. No, I won't. Yeah, never do that.

Sorry. Sorry, guys. I don't even joke about that. Of course. Yeah, I know. It's disgusting. Yuck. Yeah, so it's possible that it's just sort of a bit of a miscommunication and misunderstanding.

There's obviously a huge language barrier, even with their boy. Even with the boy. Even with the boy. He's had to learn from scratch. But he's barely been there that long. Like, you can't learn the nuances of a language. Just by working it out. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

So Smith's. kind of like, wow, she risked her life for me. And maybe she did. She's like, I'm in a play. Yeah. I'm doing a little, she's treading the boards. She's also, you know, in the Disney film, she's late teens, like she's a young woman. In real life, at this stage, she's about 10 years old.

Okay. She's a little girl. So she's just doing what, you know, probably, we assume, just what is part of that ritual, that ceremony. Oh, no. It's okay. There's nothing very. She's just young.

Okay. Nothing weird. She's young and talented. Great actor. Beautiful actor. Very convincing. Oh, yeah. Like a...

The love bit is made up. It's made up. That's okay. Everything's fine. Yeah. It's okay. So yeah, early historians did establish that Pocahontas befriended John Smith and other colonists.

She was very young, but she would go and visit the settlement and play games with the young boys that were there as well. The colonists struggled a lot with food supplies at various times during their early settlement. And a few of them wrote about Pocahontas's visit. when the colonists were starving. They wrote, every once in four or five days, Pocahontas, with her attendance, brought Smith so much provision

that saved many of their lives that else for all this had starved with hunger. So essentially she would bring them food. Just save their lives. Yeah. Her tribe is very accommodating, can I say. They're so lovely. Yeah.

Have this town. Have this food. Yeah. I don't know very much about what happened there. But, you know, just reflecting on what happened in our country, I feel like they were nicer than the British probably deserved. It's just a general thought. Oh, yeah.

And some of the, yeah, yep, yep, yep, you'll come. Yeah, that's true. That's true, yeah. They were nicer than the English deserved. And English were a bit shit. That's not a hot take. That's just history has proven that a few times. It's just the history of it.

But if you are a Brit, come to my show. Not you, just you, the old one. Just your great, greats, greats. Just them. And they were a product of their time. Yeah, you know, it's different. Different. Just buy a ticket.

Just get a ticket. Get a ticket, you'll absolve. Yeah. I'm sure. It'll be fine. In late 1609, John Smith was injured from a gunpowder explosion and returned to England for medical care. There's dot points that do kind of match up with the movie.

The movie's sort of taking a lot of creative, license. I love that. Instead of taking a bullet for the chief, he had an accident. Yeah. He had a whoopsie, and he had to return to England for medical care. The colonists apparently told the Powertans that Smith was dead. I'm not sure if this was just a straight-up lie or a miscommunication. Again, big old language barrier. The boys hadn't had very much time.

No. It's hard. And maybe the word for like, just hurt going to get medical care is very similar to dead. Yeah. He's going to the NHS. Yeah. I don't know what that is. A and E. He needs some stintches. Do you guys have A and E? Do you have Coronation Street?

Coronation. I want to be on coronation Street. Okay, well, maybe stop saying such horrible things about the English. I like the English now. I like them now. Because they're not colonising things. Yes, they're just staying put. Stay in your lane.

Stay there. It's nice. there, going to France for the summer, things like that. That's nice. That's nice. That is nice. I hope they, I hope Europeans appreciate the fact that they can just pop to another country for a weekend. I don't know if they do, well actually my UK manager sent an email to my manager because my manager in Australia just got out of a holiday and she was like, where do Australians go? Do they go, do they often go to Bali or do you sort of holiday around Australia? I've often wondered That's like, that's not what she sounds like.

I've often wondered. I've often wondered. I've often wondered. I've often wondered. Sure. Julie Andrews is my UK management. Wow. Yeah.

Yeah. What is your Ibiza? Where do you go? But yeah, she was just like, where do you guys? Where are you going? Like, it's so far away from everything. But there's also a lot of variety in Australia. Like you can go from desert and rainforest and beach.

Lots of beach. City. City. So, so. It's easier to get variety and change holidaying in our own country, but also, yeah, Bali, mostly Bali. I've never been to Bali.

Oh, babe, you've got to. You've got to go to Bali. Girlies. Girlies. Let's get a villa. Let's get a villa. Let's get a villa. Let's get a villa.

Let's get a villa. Let's get a driver. Let's get a villa and a driver. We're going to go every day. We're going to have a breakfast. It's going to be cheap. It's going to cost $10. That's expensive.

I want to go. Let me go. Let's go. I'm like, do you want to go? Let's go. Let's go. We'll talk off pod. Let's go. All right. No one is looking at me when they're in this conversation. Yeah, no.

The girlies are getting a bill. I just want a buffet breakfast. That's all I want in this life. You can go to the RISL for that, mate. We are going to Bali. Is that true? Can you get an RASL for a buffet breakfast? Some of them.

Oh my God. Yeah. Yeah. You might have to be a member or like you've always got to sign in. Yeah, I'll join the RISL. Yeah, you got to sign you. Why are you sign in for? I don't know.

I don't know. I haven't spent enough time on our ourselves. What are they doing with that information? You should do a pod-up on her. You should do our whole investigative podcast on what are they doing with that information. Yeah. Okay. Mm.

I reckon it's Kim Trails. Okay. No offence. Eva just sighed at you. Yeah, she's had enough. I talked to her about Kim Trails a lot. She's really quite tired of it. That's Eve of the dog?

I don't know if we mentioned that. Yeah, we mentioned Davis there. Okay, so they think John Smith is dead. Pogo Honda stopped visiting the colonists, which some people also like because John Smith wasn't there. But that could have also been because of what happened to her next. Oh. So as the colonists expanded their settlement, the Powhatans felt that their lands were threatened and conflicts arose again in the summer of 1609.

A few years later in 1613, Captain Samuel Argel saw a weakness in the opposition and made contact with the Patawomac tribe. They lived on the Potomac River and were not always particularly. particularly loyal to the paramount chief Powhatan. And it just so happened that the interpreter, Henry Spellman, was living with that tribe at the time. Through Spellman, Argyll learned that Pocahontas, daughter of Powhatan, was staying in one of the paduomac villages

under the protection of their leader, Iopassus. Argyll pressured Iopassus to assist in Pocahontas's capture by promising an allegiance with the colonists against the Powatans. Oh. He's like, you have a... get the girl. Then we help you against the big guy. Ayapassus, with the help of his wives,

tricked Pocahontas into boarding Argyll's ship. There she was held for ransom. No! Argyll demanded the release of colonial prisoners held by her father, as well as the return of any stolen weapons or tools that the Powhatans had acquired. And Powhatan, he did it. He returned to the prisoners and the weapons and tools,

but not enough weapons and tools. Oh. Okay. There was a standoff. Oh. For a long time. They're like, no, you have more weapons and tools. Oh, no.

Give them. So they have this standoff, a long one, like a year. And she's stuck there? She's just sort of... On the boat? I think, no. She's living with the tribe, the new one. She's living with, like, colonists.

She's with the English. Ah, fuck. And he said the standoff is for a year. Yeah, about that. Probably longer. We can wait. Yeah, 100%. And the...

We've given you the prisoners, we've given you the weapons. Like, what more do you want? They're like, all the weapons. Oh, my God. All the weapons you have given. So all the while, the colonists are keeping Pocahontas captive. Not much is known about her life in this captivity, I guess. Colonists wrote that she was well looked after,

while Native American oral history claimed she was abused. There's an anthropologist and historian Helen Roundtree. She's like, has written a lot about this time in Virginia and also Pocahontas. and said that other historians have disputed that such oral tradition survived and instead argue that any mistreatment of Pocahontas would have gone against the interests of the English in their negotiations with Powhatan. A truce had been called, the Indians still far outnumbered the English,

and the colonists feared retaliation. So she's like, it was in their best interest to look after her. Yeah, but then there's individuals acting in a monks. I just don't, I don't reckon it was. good for her. No, I don't think so either. We do know that during her time with the colonists, a Christian minister helped her improve her English and taught her about Christianity. Girlies in the boy swap.

And then she was baptized into Christianity. Oh, cool. Which I'm sure was 100% her choice. She was like, you know what? I think I want in. And he was like, oh, no, are you sure? Are you sure? She was like, yeah. Like, really? Wet me up. Priest, let's go. And she took her new Christian name, Rebecca. What?

What are you talking about? Why didn't they call the movie Rebecca? I agree. Beautiful name. So she's Rebecca now. I'm just going to call her Pocahontas, but... I'm going to call her Beck. Becky.

Becky! That's nice. Hostilities between the two groups escalated and in March of 1614, a violent battle broke out. When Powhatan arrived, colonists allowed Pocahontas to speak with her father, who she hadn't seen for ages. and she apparently criticised her father for valuing her less than some old swords. Fair. Yeah, okay. She was like, you'll swap a full boy.

But you won't. You won't give over some more weapons to release me. So she said she preferred to stay with the colonists who loved her. Oh. Okay. Becky, weird choice. It feels a little brainwashy. It does feel culty, doesn't it?

We don't know. We don't know. We don't know. But, um, but, um, but, um, So she's like, no, fuck you, Dad. Yeah, maybe, listen, fair. Who knows? Maybe she had psoriasis that they had the cream.

Yeah. If I had psoriasis, I'd stay with the cream. I would always stay with the cream. That's good life advice, actually. Stay with the cream. Listen, first you get the money, then you get the girls, then you get the cream. Yeah. That's the order, and it works every time.

Money girls cream. Moneygirls cream at gmail.com. Don't take it. I'm taking it. Email me. Don't like to. Money girls, creamerjima. Now remember Cocoa from the Disney movie, the boring warrior, who her father wanted her to marry,

but she was like, I'm a free spirit and he's serious. He's boring. He's like a maths guy. Yeah. And she's like, I'm really more of an art girl. Yeah. She loves books. He's like, I love to express myself through numbers.

And she's like, I like stories. I like stories and pictures. Yeah. Okay. Just me and Tim. He likes maths. He likes maths. And I hate maths.

I know, I don't. I just don't understand maths. And that's an important narrative to reinforce. I just need a different way into mathematics. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's not that it's not for me. Yeah. It's just I need a different way in.

And maybe it was taught in a way that just wasn't right for me. It wasn't right for you. And I also hate it. Yeah. And also all my math teachers made me feel like I was a dumb shit for not getting it. Oh, me too. Yeah. And I was like, I'm actively trying.

Yeah. And you're snarling at me. I don't know. School in the 2000s was good for everyone. I loved it. I think they were good and perfect. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And everybody did a good job.

Yeah. There's so many incredible teachers, and then there's just some absolute fucking duds. Yeah. I think also their hands are so tied by the system, it seems, these days, that they can't even, like, step left of the program for a certain student who might need extra help or different help or whatever. It feels like they have no autonomy at all now. Yeah, just for information to be presented in a different way. Yeah.

They're like, oh, I can see what you need. but I'm hands of time. I'm sure I've spoken about this at some point, but I remember having a science teacher, and I just didn't understand something, and I went up to her desk. We're like working away on stuff in our classroom, and I went up to her desk,

and I was like, I'm sorry, I just don't really understand this particular part. Can you explain that again to me? Or like, can you help me? And she just stared at me. Oh, that's so mean. It's sort of like a way of like, you figure it, come on, you figure it out. Oh, my God.

And so eventually I just went, oh, okay, I get it now. Thank you I went and sat down And I was like I still have no idea In science I used to Whenever they tried to teach me something

I didn't want to know Because it would ruin the magic So like you know how like Rainbows You know how rainbows are made How like there's like Light reflects Or refracts

Yeah I don't care How they're made It's very beautiful Eva Eva Eva have some respect Sorry

She's having a scratch She's having a scratch She doesn't want to know She just doesn't want to know She just does rainbows Yeah, she loves it. But I, when they tried to teach us about rainbows, I would pretend to faint.

That's funny. So I was like, I don't want to know. And they were like, well, I feel sick. But I don't have to fall down. And they're like, oh, she's doing it again. I was so annoying. What a nightmare. I was an absolute nightmare.

And then years later, my teacher, my science teacher came to one of my shows. I went back to Walker to do a show and he came to it. And he said, you're my favorite student, but I could never tell you because you were so naughty. but I used to like go home and say you'll never guess what she's done today. We were talking about rainbows. She pretended to pass out. His partner's like, she sounds hilarious this kid. Tested for great things.

And we've gotten onto this topic by saying that Kokoam is a math guy. That's how we got here. So do you remember Kokoam? Yes. Thank you. The math sky. The math guy, he's the... She was meant to marry him.

Yes. That's right. Well, the Mataponi history says that Kokoam was Pocahontas's first husband. Oh! And that he was killed by colonists after her capture in 1613. Oh my God. Today's Padawomics believe that Pocahontas and Kokoam also had a daughter named Kaoki, who was raised by the Padawomics after her father's death and her mother's abduction.

However, Kokoam's identity, location, very existence, have been widely debated among scholars for centuries. Wow. From Wikipedia, it says, oh sorry, Wikipedia's a website. From my understanding, it's basically just like about Disney movies. Right. Like the real events around Disney movies. Well, Disney, Ikepedia. That's right. Yeah, I guess that's what the wikis for. Yeah. So anyway, from wiki, it says the only mention of a coquorum in any English document is a brief statement written around 1616 by William Strachie that Pocahontas had been living married to a private capital. and called Kokoam for two years. So that was written in 1616. That's all. But Pocahontas married an English man named John Rolf in 1614.

So some people think he must have just been referring to him. Again, maybe a bit of a breakdown. But also, that's saying it's the only mention of Kokoam in English. Right. But there's a long oral tradition, oral history from the Native Americans. So maybe he existed, maybe he didn't. Maybe she had a daughter. Maybe she didn't.

That's a mystery episode. I don't know why they don't just ask my auntie. She seems to know everything. She knows. She knows. So, I mentioned John Rolf. Yeah, who the hell is John Rolf? Well.

John Rolfio? From Parks and Rec? Yes. John Ralfio. That's who I thought it was. Mm-hmm. During her stay at Henrikas, which was like where the colonists were keeping her,

um, Pocahontas. During her stay. During her time there. She met John Rolf. This is from Wiki again. Rolf's English-born wife, Sarah Hacker, and child Bermuda. What?

Hang on a second. I'm into that. But wait, but wait, this sentence gets more baffling. They had died on the way to Virginia after the wreck of the ship, Sea Venture, on the summer aisles, now known as Bermuda. What?

And also part of the Bermuda Triangle. Yeah. Oh my gosh. But I was like, somebody's fucking with this Wikipedia page. I go to his Wikipedia page, and under children it's listed, Bermuda. Bermuda roll.

who died in the Bermuda Triangle which is now named Bermuda. Is it named after this child? I don't know. Fuck. Isn't that weird? That's wild. That's a side quest I'd like to go on.

Yeah, let's. Yeah, dig in. Where does the name Bermuda come from? Yeah. British Overseas Territory. I wonder if like the word means something. God, if somebody knows this, they are screaming. Well, don't worry, we're looking it up.

Should I sing? Probably. Oh, I found it. Yeah. Oh, my God. I'm so sorry. Please keep singing. How I can sycamore grow.

Keep, you talk. If you cut it down, then you'll never know. And you'll never hear the wolf cry. Why aren't you speaking? You sing much louder than I'm told. Can you speak, please? Bermuda. Bermuda is named after the Spanish sailor.

Juan de Bermudez, who discovered the islands in 1505 while sailing for Spain from a provisioning voyage to Hispaniola in the ship La Gasa. Ah. He were just grunted. I didn't listen to what you were saying. I was singing. So it's named after a Spanish navigator called Juan de Bermudez, who had been the first, I guess, European person to discover it. So probably a coincidence that he's talking about. child's name was Bermuda and they died on the summer aisles, which are now known as Bermuda.

Bermuda. Bermuda. Bermuda. Anyway, so this man's lost his wife and child. Oh, good fun. A bit of fun. He established the... I'm so sorry.

Sorry for singing. He established the Virginia plantation Verena Farms where he cultivated a new strain of tobacco. A plantation, that's always good for American history. Yeah, love that. Rolf was a pious man and agonized over the potential moral repercussions of marrying a heathen. Okay. Oh, cool.

Though in fact, Pocahontas had accepted Christian faith. She got wet. She got wet up by the priest. She got wet up. She's fine. Fucking judgmental, fucking. Fuck you, man. I'm sorry about your wife and your daughter, but I don't think you were that good.

No, none of them were. Were they? I remember all of them. In a long letter to the governor requesting permission to wed Pocahontas, he expressed his love for her and his belief that he would be saving her soul. Tim wrote one a letter like that. To the governor? Yeah, my mum, the governor.

Ah. He calls your mom the governor. Yeah, she asks for it. All right, governor. I like, govna. Gavna. And he wrote a long letter being like, no, I can fix her. Yes, that's nice.

I'm like, thank God. I'll teach her to wipe. Yeah, yeah, yeah, all that stuff. All that stuff, I wish. I'll make her stop singing. He's not, he's still working on it. She's definitely singing less, less. I used to sing myself to sleep.

God, I was a fucking nightmare of a child. Just sing until I fell asleep. Until you passed out. Top of your lungs. Top of your lungs. Top of my fucking lungs. You're keeping yourself awake. Yeah, but they let me.

So all of this is their fault. Yeah. Everything that's happened, my unbridled confidence is because they never said, shut the fuck up. Were you freestyling or singing songs that exist? No, I was always just making up songs. I was like lying in bed being like, Tuesday, going to get up and have a breakfast. And they were like sitting in the lounge room watching sex in the city being like that fucking child.

And now Tim says that. Yes. Please stop seeing yourself to sleep. Tuesday. I do. I do it too Tim. He's trying to sleep. I sing a little song.

I sing a little song called I'm just a little girl. I sing that one. There were two in the bed, but I changed it. Okay, there were two in the bed and the little one said, Give me your money. That's my lullaby. And he's like, ah ha ha, ha. Good night.

Okay, that's enough. Okay. Sleep time. Anyway, so he's written to the governor, and this is what he wrote. Motivated not by the unbridled desire of carnal affection. Motivated not by the unbridled desire of carnal affection. I'm certainly not attracted to her. I don't.

I'm not just horny. But for the good of this plantation, for the honour of our country, for the glory of God, for my own salvation, namely Pocahontas to whom my hearty and best thoughts are and have been a long time so entangled and enthralled and so intricate a labyrinth that I was even a wearied to unwind myself there out. That is stunning.

I'm not just horny. I'm not just horny. I just, I quite like her. She's beautiful. She's a labyrinth. She's a labyrinth and I'm stuck in it. I'm lost. I can't get out.

I can't get out. Where's the end of this maze? Where's the end? I can't get out. I don't know. I don't want to know. I love it. I'm not horny.

Don't look at me that way. I'm not horny. I probably won't even try to have sex with her. I probably won't even try. I love her to. I love her to. I love her heaps. I'm not going to put my head on her head.

I will not put my head on her head to have babies. I will not. That's our babies are made. So the two were married in April of 1614, and although her father gifted them land on the James River, they opted to live at Varina Farm. the plantation that Rolfoaned. Beautiful.

They had a son named Thomas, who was born in 1615, and the marriage created a climate of peace between the Jamestown colonists and the Poetan's tribes. It endured for eight years, and it was known as the peace of Pocahontas. So their union kind of made everybody chill out a little bit. My auntie did say something about a man called Thomas. I wonder if this... Oh, shit, yeah.

I wonder if I'm related to this awful man that I've just been backing out for a long time. That's a super... It's a very distant, distant relative. But it's such a rare name, Thomas. No one's called Thomas. It's probably him. But Thomas is the son of John Roth, so he's probably not bad. I'm sure he's fine.

He's fine. In 1615, Ralph Hammer wrote, Since the wedding, we have had friendly commerce and trade, not only with Powhatan, but also with his subjects roundabout us. So everybody's kind of getting along. They're being civil. Right. The marriage, however, was controversial in the British Corps.

at the time because a commoner had the audacity to marry a princess, even though Pocahontas is not a princess. What? Well, and I talk about this later. Oh. The English, they kind of saw, in fact, you know what, I've got it written down. I'll just get to it when I get to it. Okay, you get to it. I was going to try and paraphrase something I've written down.

No, don't do that. I'm just going to read it. Were you going to reference yourself, though? As Jess Perkins said earlier on. The piece of Pocahontas had ripple effects as well, though. The London Company, they're the ones who had sent the college. colonists out had a goal of converting Native Americans to Christianity, which we know they'd done with Pocahontas, and her conversion paired with the way that her marriage to Rolf had helped

end conflict between the colonists and the Poetans, gave the company a great idea. They decided to bring Pocahontas to England as a symbol of the tamed New World Savage. Oh, fucking hell. And the success of the Virginia colony. Christ. Oh dear. Isn't that gross? Oh no. They're like, look. Look, look at this one. We tamed her. Yark. Yuck! Incredibly yuck.

And I'd love to remind you again, the Patreon's voted for this topic. Yeah, we didn't know and peaked this. No, but it is so interesting, but it's also... It's good that people know the story. People who've just like seen Pocahontas. Yeah. And like, you know, if you're, especially Australia and you probably have no idea about the true story.

Yeah, but it is gross. But it's 400 years ago, nearly everything from that long ago feels gross now. That's true. So they were accompanied by 11 other power tons and I'm not entirely sure what their purpose was but hopefully it wasn't so they could also just be shown off. But possibly. Only once she arrived in England did Pocahontas find out that John Smith was not in fact dead. Whoa. She just runs into him in Times Square or something. There's a lot of Times Square in England. There's so many John Smiths. Sorry, in front of Buckingham Palace. where everyone hangs out.

Oh, how awkward. I thought you were dead. I was just here to see the lights and the signs and stuff. The guys in the big hats. Yeah. I love those big hats. I love them. I mentioned earlier a letter that John Smith wrote,

and that was to Queen Anne, and he urged her to treat Pocahontas with respect, suggesting if she were treated badly, her present love to us and Christianity might turn to scorn and fury, and England might lose the chance to rightly have a kingdom by her means. So Pocahontas is not a princess in Powhatan culture, but the London company presented her as one to the English public

because she was the daughter of an important chief. And many English at the time recognized Powhatan as the ruler of an empire and presumably referred to his daughter with what they consider an appropriate status. They're like, well, if he's a king, she's a princess. She's a princess. But that's simply not true. So they're sucking up to her a bit, trying to win her over, so they can essentially fully take over her people.

In reality, she has no control on that at all. Yeah, wow. She's sort of, she's not an heir to any kind of powerful position or title or anything like that. She's just a beloved daughter of the chief. But they only know one societal structure. Exactly. Well, okay. Yeah.

This is that works here. She's got to be the next in line. I'm sure it's exactly the same. Yeah, that's right. When in actual fact, it was more like, once something happened to her father, I think it was more like his brothers would or then their kids or whatever. Yeah. It wasn't her.

You're the prince. You're next in line. Where are your crown jewels? Yeah. Come on. So that was just kind of the English. You're right. Seeing it through their own cultural lens, the only kind of power structure they know. Yeah. You can see why you'd think that.

Yeah. I get it. They're not bright. Anyway, so she's entertained at a bunch of swanky London events and social gatherings. Wow. Apparently she like met the king at one point. But she didn't realize he was the king. Only later somebody, she was like, so where's the king I'm supposed to meet?

And they're like, oh, that was him. And she's like, oh. That guy? That guy? That's your king. Okay. He smelled bad. Yeah.

But yeah, not all of the English were so impressed. Helen Roundtree, that historian claims that there is no simultaneous evidence to suggest that Pocahontas was regarded in England as anything like royalty despite the writings of John Smith. Rather, she was considered to be something. of a curiosity, according to Roundtree, who suggested that she was merely the Virginian woman to most English people. They were just like, yeah, whatever. Like, she was kind of like a spectacle or a novelty.

Okay. But not, yeah. So some were kind of like, wow, wow, she's seen as so powerful, a princess. And others are just like, she's just a woman from Virginia. Yeah. And most of the peasants are just slopping around in the mud anyway. I don't fucking know who that is. She's talking about her.

Virginia lady. Yeah. Oh, lovely. Oh, I want. You know, like that. Like that. They sink, they sink. That's how you get into the English accent.

Yeah. Little people, no, I got it. I've got it. I'm in. We're in. It's that easy. Pocahontas and Rolf, they stayed in England for a little while, living in the suburb of Brentford and Middlesex for some time,

as well as at Rolf's family home in Norfolk. At a social gathering in early 1617, Rolf and Pocahontas ran into none other than John Smith. Toot, too. Oh my gosh. So embarrassing seeing your ex at a party. Oh my God.

It's not her ex at all. This feels real like the rom-comy type bit and they didn't put any of this in the Pokemon's movie. Yeah, they should have done this in the movie. This is good fun. Well, there's a second Pocahontas. Is there? Really?

Is that when she goes to? That might be when she goes. I think that's Return of Jafar. Oh, shit. Yeah. Return of Jafar. Like Pokemon's in the big city or something like that. Pocahontas 2, Journey to a New World.

Bocahontas. Came out in 1990. And just like that. I had no idea that was a part two, so there you go So maybe they did cover this Pocahontas too, it's called Journey to a New World That sounds like she's probably going over there John Smith is ambushed by a group of soldiers

With a warrant for his arrest Where's Pocahontas come in? In the New World Wait, okay, Chief Powhatan to England for negotiations Pocahontas, Powhatan's daughter mourns John Smith's death But he's eventually able to move on So he dies Oh my God

Different story Wait You look upset Well because I can't speed read this fast enough It seems like she does in fact go to England. So there you go. They do kind of cover it in the sequel. Right. So yeah, they run into John Smith. But it's a little anticlimactic.

Smith later wrote that when Pocahontas saw him, without any words she turned about, obscured her face as not seeming well contented. So I think she was like trying to hide that she was happy to see him. But that's from his perspective. She sounds like she blanked him. Yeah, she sounds like she's like, oh, okay. And then he didn't really chat to her for a while. And then he chatted to her later on. and his record of what they spoke about it's very fragmented, it's quite vague finally apparently Pocahontas told Smith

that she and her tribe had thought him dead but her father had told Tomokomo one of the Powhatans who was travelling with her to seek him and I quote because your countrymen will lie much he's like you guys are full of shit so we kind of assumed you were probably alive

dad was like look out for him because he's probably he's probably alive a bit of a burn there By March of 1617, it was time to go home to Virginia. They boarded a ship, but they hadn't even made it very far before Pocahontas became quite ill. She was taken ashore for medical care, but died shortly after from unknown causes. Oh no. She was around 20 or 21 years old.

Really? That's it. Yeah. Just a baby. Yeah. Wow. So young. A few causes have been speculated, like pneumonia, smallpox, tuberculosis, dysentery or poisoning. Oh, my God.

But it's probably just one of those diseases. Probably one of those diseases. Especially coming from, like, she's in a completely different, like, country, not exposed to those. Yeah. Yeah. That makes sense. And back then, they just all got sick all the time.

Yeah. But, yeah, the true cause of her death is unknown. Baby Thomas was also sickly, and John left him to be brought up by his brother in Norfolk for fear he wouldn't survive their voyage home. Do your family in Norfolk? I don't think I've actually got any real English. We've got, we're Irish and Spanish. Okay.

But maybe there's some English? I don't know. There's some mysteries. It's exciting. I could have family in Norfolk. And if I do, it's him. Yep, 100%. Thomas.

So he left Thomas there because he's like, he's not going to make it. But he, John was sort of, he had a lot of pressure to return to Virginia. So he went home and he appointed Sir Lewis Stuckley as guardian to his son. And he went back to Virginia. The plan was that Thomas would return to Virginia once he recovered his health. But John Rolfe never saw his son again. Thomas did recover, but he remained in England until he was an adult. Wow.

He just never said for him. He just left his kid there. Apparently he like, John Rolf married a third time and had another kid. And he's like, I swear, I'm not horny. I swear it. She's a labyrinth. My wives keep dying. I can't do anything about it.

It's the weirdest thing. It's crazy. Anyway, Elizabeth, do you want to get hitched? If I was being proposed to by somebody who's past two wives had died, I'd be like, nah, bro. Yeah. Not necessarily that you're involved, but like... It's just unlucky.

Yeah. I don't want jinx myself. No. Anyway, so Pocahontas's funeral took place in March of 1617 in the parish of St. George's Church in Gravesend. And her grave is thought to be underneath the church's chancel, like near the altar, though that church was destroyed in a fire in 1727, so the exact side of her grave is unknown now.

Oh, we've never, never found it. Just for in the sense of her legacy, numerous places, landmarks, products in the United States have been named after Pocahontas, and obviously her story has been romanticised over the years. She's the subject of art and literature and theatre and film, which is incredible for the daughter of a chief of this Native American tribe who, who only lived to 20. Yeah.

But just to have such a... An incredible story. Yeah. Such a... To be so memorable. I don't know. It's so interesting. Are there any like plays or films made by people from where she's from?

Like from her tribal or descendants of her or like... I think so. I'm going to look into this. Yeah. Find some more resources about her. Most recently there was a movie called A New World in like 2005. It has like Colin Farrell in it. I don't know.

It just looks like a gritty. kind of drama. But yeah, I would think so for sure. But yeah, she's a subject of a lot of books and writings and plays and movies and everything. Since 1958, she's been commemorated by a life-sized bronze statue in St. George's Churchyard, which is a replica of one that was made in 1907. She was the first Native American to be honored on a U.S. stamp that was in 1907. Wow.

So again, like this is hundreds of years after she died. at the age of 20, 21. Yeah. And she's still such a memorable and important part of history. It's so interesting. And a little fun fact, Pocahontas is the 12th great-grandmother of American actor, Edward Norton. So you could be related to Edward Norton. Are you related to Edward Norton?

My auntie hasn't said. Well, there is like a long lineage, especially from her son Thomas. Because he had quite a few kids and then they had quite a few kids. So there definitely is a long lineage. Lots of people have connections to him, including one of the people who suggested this topic. Oh, cool. Edward Norton?

Hazel, who texted in, said they were a descendant of Pocahontas. I think, I don't have it written down. I think it was like six times great-grandmother. Maybe Hazel and I are related. 12 times or something. Hazel, where do you live? Oh, you're not live. Hazel?

Hazel. Where do you live? Yeah, so there you go. That is the story of the real Pocahontas. do just have like this quote at the end that I quite liked and they refer to her as Madaoka and they say Madaoka's story was not one of romance between a native woman and a white man. It was a tragic story of a girl who played the role as peacekeeper and became caught in the economic and political webs of settlers and natives in early colonial American history.

It's just so interesting that such a small, such a short life has had such a lasting impact and she's such a notable sort of character in this whole time in American history. It's really interesting. Yeah. I mean, Disney definitely helped for sure. But why do you think that they made her husband or partner John Smith and not the other John? Why would they do that? Well, it seems like John Rolfe comes up in Pocahontas too.

Oh, okay. But I think it's probably just that idea that she saved his life, saved his life, put her head on his. And they went, oh, it's easy just to make them a thing. that they'd had a friendship. And back then, I mean, this is the 90s of Disney. They were all romance stories. Yeah. There was always, you know.

It's such a shame. It's not her real name that she's known by. Yeah. That's really sad. But it's like an, it's an affectionate nickname. Mm. Which I guess is kind of nice. A clippity gibbet.

Yeah. If you were in 400 years, people will just, just refer to you simply as Bop. Yeah. That's it. Yeah. Like, her name wasn't even that. It was actually a reference to the big bopper. In like episode 10 of a podcast,

she did for a very long time. A podcast is... Yeah, there's a lot to unpack there. Okay, big Bob, I died in a plane crash. A plane is... Yeah, now I'm... Maybe I'll watch Pocahontas too, but I'm seeing the name John Rolfe come up.

So, yeah, interesting. But, yeah, I think it must just be that they needed to be some sort of romantic angle, as there always was at that time. I guess, at least this one was different in a way that they didn't ride off into the sunset together. She was like... she was like, I got to stay with my people.

And he's like, okay. And that was that. That's a nice point of difference for 90s Disney. Yeah. Because previously it was we'd ride off together on a white horse. Yeah, he would like save her and take her to England because that's the good place. That's the good one. That's the good.

Then they kind of flipped that with Tarzan where Jane stayed with him. Oh, I love Tarzan. It's so good. George of the Jungle, not Tarzan. But George the Jungle is one of the best films in the entire world. Yep. When he says, George just lucky, I guess. Oh, that's the best moment in cinematic history.

Yeah, agreed. So important. Agreed. So important. I think the scene where he's trying on a suit and he like winks at the camera is probably the second best. That's the second best in cinematic history. George looked good. It's a great movie.

But yeah, there you go. That's the real story of Pocahontas. There you go. I did not know anything about her real life. Nobody does. Nobody does. Now you do. And look, there's so much writing on it.

Lots of documentaries. lots of stuff. I've kind of given you like a basic overview. But it's interesting the parts of the Disney movie that are kind of, you know, similar to real life. Yes, I'm glad he gave us that recap at the start because I wouldn't have noticed the similarities otherwise. But yes, now I'm like, huh.

Yeah, it's really helpful. That wasn't me just padding for word count. There was a point to it. It was beautiful. So yeah, there you go. Thank you. Great report, Jess, on someone we've all heard of, probably a lot of us didn't know that much about really.

I'm very much in that camp. Yeah, absolutely. And I like to, it is great to get those suggestions of topics like that where it's kind of a name, you know, but you don't know really anything about the real stories. When you think about it, you go, oh, actually.

Yeah, so if that's reminded you of other topics that are like that, chuck them in the hat. There's a link in the show notes. There's a link on our website. Anybody can make a suggestion. We love to hear about them. Hell yeah. Hell yeah.

And we also love to hear how we can see your show, Michelle and Edinburgh, that you're doing right now. Wow, wow wee. It's at Gilded Balloon. It's called Reform, and I think it's at 7pm or 7.30 p.m. It's around 7-ish. Great. It's a great time. Gilded Balloon, TV at Bristow Square. Just come along. Tickets are what, like 10 pound, 12-pound max? Just come along. If you can't get a com for the night, it's a nice and early show, get your train up, watch the shows, and then go home. Easy. But do book ahead if you're coming, Because last year we did sell out genuinely.

So maybe do, just book ahead. Just check. Right now. Check right now. Just check, just check. Turn off the podcast and go get your tickets. Please come. It's a cost of living Christ.

It costs me so much money to come. Well, Michelle, thanks so much for joining us. An absolute pleasure as always. Thank you. And Jess and I will move on to everyone's favorite section of the show, which I think has a little jingle that goes a little something, a like of this. Fact quote or question. Lovely harmony there.

So good that Michelle, it hurt her ears as a train singer she had to leave. And fair enough. Yeah, fair enough. But yes, this is a part where people who support us at do go on pod, no, a Patreon slash do go on pod on the Sydney-Schenberg deluxe level, get to submit a fact, a quote, a question, a brag, suggestion, a challenge, a recipe, it can be anything you want it to be, any piece of information you want us to know. Absolutely. And these people support us on Patreon. We can get bonus episodes, join the Facebook group.

Lovely place. Hear about shows before anyone else that we're doing live and get discounts on tickets. And most of all, keep us humming. Yeah, that's right. That's the most important part. Yeah, we appreciate it. We couldn't do without these people. So we dedicate this next little part of the show to them. And like you said, on the fact is quite a question level. Jess, people give themselves a little title. Yep.

And do you want me to read them out this week? Yeah, go on. Give you a little break. So usually this is Matt. I've been talking all day. Yes, exactly. You did the whole bloody episode. This is usually Matt's domain.

Yeah, it's the one thing he does. And he's very, very good at it. Yeah, and we're also pretty good at it. It's like it's not hard. Okay, well, let's find out. And like Matt, in True Matt style, I don't read these until I read them. Meaning that there's no proofreading here. There's no fact checking.

I'm just going straight from the page. So bear with me as I first up say hello to Henry T. Will Hoyt. Henry T. Wilhoit. Fantastic. And Henry's given themselves a title, official hazelnut farmer. Oh, thank goodness.

That was a position we really needed to fill. Yes. So I'm happy to have you on board. Henry. Great to have you in. And Henry is kicking things up this week with a fact. Okay. And it looks like it's a hazelnut fact.

That is so fitting. So I trust this. That is so fitting. It says, The skin of the hazelnut is often considered an undesirable part of the nut because of its bitter taste and unpleasant texture.

Honestly, that feels like... A pretty good reason for it to not be that popular. A bit of a death sentence for it. But they are still useful, exclamation mark. Due to their ability to not impart a static charge, they are often used to polish machine and electrical parts that are bound for space. Because there is no grounding point in space, any electrical static charge brought from Earth stays with the equipment and can damage the

precise instruments on board. What? Wow, there you go. So, using the skin of the hazelnut. It polishes it and gets you ready for space. Do you know what the tagline should be then in an advertising campaign? Hazelnut and astronaut's favorite nut. You know?

Like just, I would lean really hard into that. You've got to get like Buzz Aldrin or something in the commercials. Yeah, and he'd be up for it. When I go to space, I use hazelnuts. And they were like, the fuck! The hell? The fuck? Do you think that would work if you were to spread Nutella all over it as well?

Absolutely. If you look closely at their dashboards, they can't read shit. It's another. nightmare up there. Thanks, Henry. Great fact. Keep farming those hazelnuts. Next up, I would like to say hello to Peter Atkin.

Hello, Peter Atkin. His title is Master of Repeating Bill Bryson Facts Learned from Matt. I hate that Bill Brison. That's great. Matt says like a fact that he half remembers from Bob Bryson on the show and then you half remember it and tell other people at dinner parties. That's so good. That is getting out of hand really quickly, isn't it? Yeah.

And then they're probably telling people. Peter's given us a brag, which we encourage. Yes, love a brag. Lay it on us. Here we go. Hey, guys. Hope you're all having a fantastic time podcasting on your bunk beds. That's right.

We are. Absolutely. It's a three-stacker. I have a brag based off my last submission in which I asked your New Year's resolutions. Oh. Mine was to watch 100 movies and read 25 books. And I'm far too proud and slightly concerned to report that I've managed 141 movies. What?

And 28 books as of the 20th of June. That's not even halfway through the year, mate. 28 books in six months. 28, I'm doing... That's a four books. That's a book a week, essentially. Yeah, I think he's ahead of pace even for a book a week. Yeah, yeah, slightly ahead.

My top recommendation so far would be 310 to Yuma and Children of Men for Films and The Blade itself or Wind in the Willows for books. Nice. That's nice. I hope you guys are all enjoying 2023 so far, And congrats to Dave for continuing the French lessons. That's right. I've just finished term two.

Beginner two. So proud of you. Done. Love from across the prom, from multiple ponds, Peter. That is amazing, Peter. What a great achievement. Although I don't know how many movies or TV.

Like, I've watched a lot of sitcoms, a lot of TV shows. You know, you can, yeah, I have been trying to read the same book for a couple months now, so that's really impressive. Great.

It's persistence. It's also the book that my partner wrote. And I am. You're preferiting. But it's also, I'm reading it in bed. He's next to me. It feels weird reading next to the author. Right.

Does he look over your shoulder? Every time I laugh, he's like, what part? What's funny? That's really good. We've got a PS from Peter. Shout out my partner, Karris. Karris. It's Welsh, lull, because it's spelled C-E-R-Y-S,

but he's written, pronounced K-E-R-S, who has graduated from medical school. starts life as a doctor soon. Congratulations, Keras. That's huge. That is awesome stuff. You guys are both crushing it. Yeah.

Peter's reading up a storm. Karras is out there saving lives. Great. But the thing about Peter is you're halfway now in the year. Yeah. Are you just going to, because you've done your resolution, keep it trucking and smash it. Or will you just take the foot off the gas and be like, I've already done it?

I would slow right down probably. Yeah. But that's me. I'm pretty lazy. So I don't set resolutions like that because I'll never do them, ever. All right, thanks Peter. And next up, big shout out to our friend and yours, Ben Johnson, who's given themselves the title of, and there is a link to an IMDB page.

Okay. And I'll be opening this up. Here we go. I haven't read this yet. This is Ben's title. It is Ben Johnson, a 2005 movie with an IMDB rating of 5.4 out of 10. Was that from the page itself? If you heard that at home, that was some music going off, I think from the IMTP page.

Wow. And let me read you the plot for Ben Johnson. This could be a good one for Who Knewit with Matt Stewart. Son of a notorious criminal becomes a police officer to erase the bad image of his father, but things are not as easy as he seems. Oh. There you go, directed by Anil C. Menon. It's definitely not in English on the poster.

There you go. Good one, Ben Johnson. I wonder if you've actually watched it. Let us know. did you review your own movie? And Ben has written in a quote and it says, okay, okay, this is a quote from the late great

Kenneth Williams. So I need you to get into character. Do you know who Kenneth Williams is? No. I'm googling. Kenneth Williams. All right, Welsh actor. Okay.

Fuck. I'm assuming you've seen the carry-on films. So your key line is, ooh, matron. Oh, Ben has set you up beautifully here. Oh, have you seen the carry? I have not seen the carry-on. I haven't.

Kenneth Williams, it's fantastic. I can just have a go. Now for the quote, I can't stand innuendo. If I see one in the script, I whip it out immediately. Quote, Kenneth Williams. Ooh, matron. I'm sorry, Ben. I loved that.

Good job, Ben. That is so good stuff. And finally, I would like to thank from, or shout out to, Daniel Headley, whose nickname is Aussie Music Head. Oh, my God. Good stuff. and we've got a suggestion. This is good.

We've had a fact, a brag, a quote, and a suggestion. This is. With the suggestion of bands, I thought I'd jump in. Great. Well, you are the Aussie music head. Yeah. My mate always puts me on the door when his band is playing, so I thought it'd be time to pay him back with a shout-out.

Sophisticated Dingo. Oh, yeah. It's a garage rock, punkist duo from Melbourne, from Melbourne, and they're fucking sick. Particular shout-out for the songs Radio on and Morning View. Just might know them because they're a lot. in rotation on Triple J and they tour with other Aussie rock acts like the Terry's, Betty Rays and Press Club.

Yeah. Cheers and Oro. That's awesome. That's great. Sophisticated Dingo is a great title. Great name. Great band. They're really fun.

I like Sophisticated Dingo. And I do know them. Hence I like them. So that's very cool, Daniel. It's nice of you to give a shout out to your friends. And our listeners can go and give them a little listen. Give them a listen. Listen along with the Terry.

Betty Rays and Press Club. Come up up up those streams. Get them up there. Sophisticated thing go, 12,000 monthly listeners. Let's get that to a million. By this time next week. I don't think that's unreasonable.

I don't know. That's unreasonable at all. It's easy to go viral. Absolutely. I did a TikTok recently. And I, like, you know, throughout the day, it had like a thousand views,

which isn't much, but I get fuck all. So I was like, oh, blah, yeah, that's all right. Yeah, thanks very much. Came back like a few hours later, and it had 10,000. Oh, great work.

And I was like, what's, happened. Oh my God. How many's it had now? 10 million? I think I'm viral. I think I'm a TikTok a star. Oh my God. I'm a TikTok a star. I'm a TikTok a star. I'm a star. I'm a star. Thank you. Wow, TikTok's talk. Ticktosser. Ticktosser. You're a tictosser. Yeah. Yeah, you are. Thanks to our fact quota questions this week. And next thing is we are shout out to a few people who've been supporting the show at patreon.com.com. S do go on pod. And just usually come up with a little game to do with the topic, or sometimes we go to our friends at horse name generator.

I, yeah, okay, because I was thinking, you know how Pocahontas is a nickname? Yep. And, like, what it means. Maybe we could, maybe, I don't want to give them all a nickname. Um, I guess we give them a nickname. I was thinking more of like the meaning. No, okay, okay, okay, just, okay, their name, but what does it mean? What does their name mean?

Okay, great, great, good, love that, love that. Well, first up, I would like to thank from Old Crow in Canada. it's Stephen Climmy. That's... Stephen Climmy. That's actually crazy, the coincidence, because Stephen Climmy means Old Crow. No.

Yes. Wow. It means Old Crow. Some translations, it means like decrepit Crow. But many just say that it's Old Crow. Isn't that amazing? That is amazing. Wow.

I'm looking at Old Crow, a community in the Canadian Territory of Yukon, located in a peri-glacial environment. Wow. Very, very cool. I don't know how many people live here. That's very cool. It looks very remote.

Okay. Like, incredibly remote. Like, it's north-western Canada on the border of Alaska. Wow. Thanks so much for listen up there. Klimi? An old crow? You old crow?

You old crow. I would also like to thank from Ball Davis or Baldivus. Baldivus. It is baldivus. In Western Australia, B of B and E. B of B and E. Oh, and the B stands for Bronson. Bronson.

From around the twist. That's what it means. Yeah. And the E stands for Bronson and? And Eggie. Eggie from Round the Twist. Who could forget that episode where Bronson meets up with Eggie? A classic episode of Australian.

Honestly, if you. If I also read out any Round the Twist plot to someone who's never seen it, it would sound just as bad chitters. But Bronson meets an egg. Do you remember the one where one of them microwaves some like underwear or swimmers and then put someone in, suddenly their magical swimmers? Because he microwaved them. It's a bonkers show. I loved it.

I love Roundin the Twist. Fantastic. And good on you to Bronson of Bronson and Eggie from Bordubis in Western Australia. I would like to thank from Fish. in Indiana, it's Matthew Harris. And Matthew Harris means, Dave? Son of Chris. Son of Chris.

Matthew Harris's name. Son of Chris. Imagine if Matthew's dad's name is Chris. Is your name Chris? That'd be. Oh, my God. Matthew, please let us know. You know the weirdest part is?

His mom's also named Chris. Oh my God. That's Chris and Chris. Son of Chris. Matthew Harris, son of Chris from Fish's, Indiana. I bow down to thee. I would like to thank from Leeds. Leeds, Leeds, Lizzie, Zittes, Liz.

I would like to thank Rosanna. Rosanna, Rosanna. And Rosanna means red Anna. Red Anna. Wow, where do you get your ideas? I mean, I can't believe that that's what came up when you looked up Rosanna and what it means. I'm just like, it's not my idea. It's just what it means.

It means red Anna. And Anna is a type of frog. So it's a red frog. That makes sense to me Thank you because it's the truth Redam Redam Do you want to thank one more

Yes I'd like to thank Not that far from Leeds But further south It's from Sheffield In greatest of Britain's Mr Sheffield It's Michael Westwood Michael Westwood Michael Westwood

Michael means guy Who gathers stones Yes He's a stone gatherer Stone gatherer Very important job Yeah I mean Stonehenge

Wouldn't be anywhere with that. It would just be a henge. Yeah. What the fuck's a henge? What the fuck is a henge? Get this henge out of my face. I hate hensers. Thank you, Michael Westwood, Gatherer of Stones.

I would love to thank some people from Chester Springs in Pennsylvania. I would love to thank Jason Wozner. Jason Wozner. What a great name. That's a great name. I hope I've said that right, but beautiful. Jason? It means skateboard.

Whoa. Daredevil Hell yeah Jason Wozner Jason means skateboard Yes Wozner means

Daredevil Put him together You got a skateboarding Daredevil Yeah yeah Yeah yeah Yeah yeah Yeah yeah

Oh yeah This guy doesn't need Pats No frickin way Yeah Whoa whoa No helmet For this bad boy

Now wear a helmet Yeah definitely I would also love to thank From Newtown In New South Wales Craig Ryan Craig

Craig What does that mean Sorry Craig That's what it translates Sorry, Rianne. Craig Riann. And Craig Riann, what does that mean? That means squeaky door.

Squaky door, fantastic. Yes, yes, yes. It's essentially like someone who is not stealthy. You know, they're like a squeaky door. You can always hear him coming. All right, squeaky door. Yep, there is. There's Craig Rian.

Hello, Craig Rian. I've been expecting you. He's like, ugh. So thank you, Craig slash Craig. I know you're in New South Wales, so it's Craig to you, but the Americans cannot hear the difference. We're translating. I would also love to thank from Columbus, Ohio, Dawn Stanley.

Dawn Stanley, which actually means midnight, blues. Midnight blues. You're feeling a bit like, you know, lost at night. You're kind of okay through the day, and then it gets to nighttime and it's dark and you're alone, and you're just like, what am I doing? What am I doing with my life? Is this it? Is this it for me?

Yeah, and to dawn, I say, it's not it. But it feels it, doesn't it? At midnight, but by the morning, you're fine. By you're fine. Have a sleep, you'll be right. Dawn Stanley, midnight blues. And finally, I would love to thank from Stroud. Stroud.

In Ontario and Canada, I would love to thank Marissa Stroud. No. We've thanked Marissa Stroud before because we were like, Stroud from Stroud? I'm sure of it. No. I'm sure of it. That is incredible, Marissa Stroud, from Stroud. Maybe in the Triptitch Club recently or something like that.

It's not coming up when I'm searching any other Strouds. Oh, we've talked about Strouds. rowdy before. I'm sure of it. But thank you so much. Oh, maybe on the fact-qued-credit question? Yeah. I'm not sure where. We'll have to have a glimpse.

Or was there somebody else who had the name and the place the same? Jess and I aren't usually in charge of the section of the show. We've probably fucked it. Matt's a spreadsheet wizard. He usually puts this part together. Wizarded spreading the sheet. That's pretty good. And getting into bed.

Yeah, yeah. And having a good sleep. It loves to snooze. Which is where we can assume he is now, because he's sleeping on the job, because we've had to do this for ourselves, and we're not very good at it. We've probably done a bad job. So, Marissa Stroud, from Stroud. What does Marissa Stroud mean, though?

Marissa Stroud, let's do a word each. Okay. Bear. Hammock. Bear hammock. It's a hammock. Oh, wow. But, like, it's called a bear hammock, but it doesn't mean that, like, only bears use it.

They can, I guess. But it's just that it's very big. It's big enough for a bear, so you and a paramour could get in there. I enjoy a bit of a swing in the hammock. Beautiful. Very nice stuff. Canada's got bears. They need them.

They need a bear hammock. Thank you. Marissa. Dawn, Craig, Jason, Michael, Rosanna, Matthew, B of B&E and Stephen. Great work, everyone. You rock on my world. Our final part of the show is to welcome people into the Tripditch Club, which is our Hall of Fame for people that have already been shouted out to

because they've been on the shoutout level or above on Patreon for three consecutive years and to thank them for their dedication to this podcast. We induct them into the Hall of Fame of the Triptitch Club. We welcome them in. And yeah, it's a place where you can hang out. There's live bands. There's music. There's food.

There's chill out zones. There's foosball. There's hockey tables. There's a football pitch outback if you're feeling fit. Anything you want, because once you're in, you can never leave. And why would you want to? You wouldn't. And I, how dare you?

And Jess, you're our fantastic bartender slash chef. Yep. What food or drink have you organized this week? Thank you for asking, Dave. I have prepared Virginia ham. Oh, okay. A variety of heavily salted ham preserved by curing and smoking. And I've got it ready for you.

So a nice Virginian ham. Wow. And virgin margaritas. Nice. So great combo. and you're welcome. You usually book a band, Dave, as well. Yes, but this week is not a band.

It's actually a composer, P&S, singer, music director, record producer. You never going to believe this. I book these guys months, if not years in advance sometimes. And this week we have the musical stylings of Alan Mencken, best known for his scores and for songs for the Walt Disney Animation Studio, films Little Mermaid, Beauty and the Beast, Aladdin, and of course, Pocahontas. Wow, Alan Mencken was busy.

What are the chances? won two Academy Awards. And you managed to get him for our TripTage Club. He is in. That is incredible. And the other thing that we do is... Oh my God, so sorry. This is so rare.

This is so rare, but you'll forgive the interruption. I don't know if I will. Ellen Mencken, I didn't give his full title, Ellen Mencken, Egot. Get Fucked. He is one of 18 people to have won Emmy, Grammy, and Oscar and a Tony. Only 18. And he's only one of two people to have won a Razzie as well. as an Emmy Grammy Oscar and Tony, making him a regot.

Wow. That's the dream. Wow. That is the absolute dream. Congratulations. And look, the other thing, the, the, the, one of the most beautiful parts of the Triptych Club is Matt, holding the clipboard, lifting the velvet rope. We are all standing.

We're cheering for you to enter into the club. Dave is on the stage. He's hyping you up. I'm hype and Dave up. I'll read the names for you, Dave. You hype them up. Are you ready? I am absolutely ready.

We have four inductees this week. First up, from Brighton in Essex, it's Nick Wilson. They've nicked my heart. It's Nick Wilson. Yes. From Abbotsford in Victoria, it's Daniel Headley. I don't want this compliment to go to your Headley, but you might be the greatest person I've ever met. Yes.

From Address Unknown, we can only assume deep in the malls. Shelley, Fitness. Oh my gosh. I think you are really fitness. And my gosh, don't you need? know it. You know that song from the streets? No.

But you know it's Shelley. Okay. No, no, that's good. When I hold a... You know how many you hold a shell up to your ear? Yeah. You can hear the ocean. Yes.

When I hold the ocean up to my year, I hear Shelley. Whoa. That's amazing. That's what they mean to me. Stop putting your ear in the ocean. I've got swimmer's ear. Finally. From Gilliston Heights in New South Wales, it's James Horn.

Sorry, I just need to blow my James Horn for a second. Legend! Legend! We've got a legend! That's me blowing the James Horn That's very good Thank you and welcome to James Shelley, Daniel and Nick A couple of Aussies in there

Isn't that nice? Yeah, great to have you in Thank you so much Welcome aboard, make yourself at home And the final thing that we need to do Is just to tell you that we love you And if you want to suggest a topic, you can Over at do go onpod.com

There's a link there, it's also a link in the show notes And you can find us at Do Go On Pod across all social media as well Well. We'll be there. Can't get rid of us. Dave, I reckon,

booted home. Hey, you know where we will be next week? Where? Right here. Same place, same channel, same podcast.

We'll be back with another fantastic episode. I can only presume and assume. But until then, also thank you so much for listening. And until then, goodbye. Ladies, bye!

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