Do Go On - 422 - The Satanic Panic

Episode Date: November 22, 2023

In the 1980s and 90s, a moral panic swept across the United States leading many to believe that an underground network of satanists was operating across America. It might seem laughable now, but the people who got swept up in the hysteria had their lives changed forever! Featuring special guest Bec Petraitis.This is a comedy/history podcast, the report begins at approximately 06:07 (though as always, we go off on tangents throughout the report).Support the show and get rewards like bonus episodes: patreon.com/DoGoOnPodLive show tickets: https://dogoonpod.com/live-shows/ Submit a topic idea directly to the hat: dogoonpod.com/suggest-a-topic/  Check out our other podcasts:Book Cheat: https://play.acast.com/s/book-cheatPrime Mates: https://play.acast.com/s/prime-mates/Listen Now: https://play.acast.com/s/listen-now/Who Knew It with Matt Stewart: https://play.acast.com/s/who-knew-it-with-matt-stewart/ Our awesome theme song by Evan Munro-Smith and logo by Peader ThomasDo Go On acknowledges the traditional owners of the land we record on, the Wurundjeri people, in the Kulin nation. We pay our respects to elders, past and present.  REFERENCES AND FURTHER READING:https://www.vox.com/culture/22358153/satanic-panic-ritual-abuse-history-conspiracy-theories-explained https://www.thecut.com/2016/11/remembering-childhood-trauma-and-abuse-that-never-happened.html https://www.latimes.com/archives/la-xpm-1988-10-27-ca-449-story.html https://www.nytimes.com/1994/10/31/us/proof-lacking-for-ritual-abuse-by-satanists.html?sq=satanic+ritual+abuse&scp=1&st=nyt https://www.senate.mo.gov/LegislativeLibrary/Panic.htmlhttps://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-lists/pmrcs-filthy-15-where-are-they-now-60601/vanity-strap-on-robbie-baby-180905/ Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Melbourne and Canada, we got exciting news for you. And we should also say this is 2026. Jess, what year is it? 2026. Thank God you're here. Right now, I'm in Melbourne doing my show with Serenjai Amarna, 630 each night at the Cooper's Inn Hotel, having so much fun. We'd love to see you there.

Canada, we are visiting you in September this year. If you've somehow missed the news, we are heading up Vancouver, Calgary, Montreal and Toronto for shows. That's going to be so much fun. Tickets for all this stuff, I believe, are online. And I'm here too. Welcome to another episode of Do Go On. My name is Dave Wornikey, and as always, I'm here with Jess Perkins.

David, looking, dashing as always. Thank you so so much. Dashing Dave, I call him. That's right. I wear a tuxedo on these podcasts. At all times. I've never seen you in civilian clothing. Civilian.

Only tuxedos. Sometimes I say, Dave, chill the fuck out, bro. And you're like, none, no, no. We go on tour, you're in a tux. We're on a plane, 14-hour flight. Tucks it up, baby. We have sleepovers. You're in a tux.

You sleep in a tux. I'm worried about the smell of that tux. And joining us this week, I'd love to hear their thoughts on the tuxedo. Please welcome back to the podcast. Beck Petratus is here. Hi, Beck. Thank you for having me. Well, when you said civilian clothes, you implied that, like, I feel like, are you a secret agent?

You can't tell us, right? I think if you ask outright, they have to tell you. You have to tell me if you're, are you a secret agent? Yes. Oh, that makes a lot of sense with the tuxedo. You've got to go to all the fancy dinners. I've got to say, I've got to tell the truth, but I do have a license to kill you now. Do you understand that?

Only now that I know the truth. Yeah. Before that, you could not have killed me. No, it wouldn't have had reason to. But now you can kill me and you don't have to have a reason. I'm just going to hover that over you forever. Wait, all the listeners know as well. Oh, this is very well.

Oh, my gosh. Sorry, everybody all made a list. I'm so sorry. Dave has a license to kill everyone now. Hopefully no one's heard this. It would have been edited. now. No one knows that I am definitely 100% a secretation.

And who's going to kill us all? Exactly. If people know, but we'll edit that out. Sure, and we'll edit that out. But I would like our editor to just keep it aside somewhere for if and most likely when I die in mysterious circumstances. Okay, don't worry. I'm very good of making it look like an accident. Okay.

And now, AJ, I really need you to isolate that bit as well. Also, don't worry. I really could have made, yeah, you're good at your job, but everything else you've said is quite worrying. I want you to know that you're dealing with a true professional, Beck. Don't worry about it. You're going to be killed by a true professional. I can tell because of the beautiful bow tie you're wearing. Exactly.

This bow tie says, I never miss. Yeah, this boathe says, I'm a secret person and you'll never guess what I'm doing. Wow. You're so secretive. I never, you blend in anywhere in your full tuxedo. It's a surprising early rant we've gone on. I don't hate it. I'm sorry.

I don't hate it. I encourage tangents. I started with a tangent. Oh no, Beck, we don't like that at this podcast. I've got a big bucket of tangents for you. We don't know. Have another one. I'm full of tangents.

This one's about oranges. I couldn't have another. Okay. Now, Beck, you've entered the podcast at one of the most magical times of the year. I know you're a big Christmas fan. Oh, sorry, I was just going to start chanting to myself. Yes, I am. You're a big Christmas fan, but Block fucking blows Christmas out of the water.

Do you know what? Fuck Christmas. Fuck Christmas. People are saying it. Agreed. It's about time someone comes in and says, it's time for block. Where are the blockmas trees? I agree.

Are there blockmas trees? I think it would be a palm tree. Oh yeah, that's chill. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, that's true. Yeah, that's good. It's a great tree. Yeah, yeah, great.

I think you see a palm tree and you feel like you're on holiday. Unless you live somewhere surrounded by palm trees. What if you work somewhere surrounded by palm trees and then, oh my God. You never work a day in your life if you're surrounded by a palm. That's true. Is that how that phrase goes? I believe so. Yeah.

So it's block. It's a. magical time, we are counting down the nine most voted for topics. Absolutely. You send out a big poll, people vote on it, and these are the top nine, which does infuriate me. I'd prefer it to be a 10 or an 8, but it's nine and I'm fine with it. And we're up to the second most popular.

Yeah, Beck, this is big time. We are top two. I can't believe I'm here for this. The second most voted for topic of the year. I want to make it very clear we would normally never have you here for this. Oh, absolutely not. I would be not surprised at all. If I tried to come in the podcast studio, you spat at me and you shouted angry slurs.

And I'd be like understandable because you've got to get me out of here because I'm not important enough. Usually. Yeah. But for some reason, okay now. Yeah, Matt's away. So we were desperate. The pod does not work with two people. And so we do need a third.

So, yeah, you're filling an important role. And look, we're delighted to have. you here, but it is important you know, normally you'd never be welcome. It's a good energy. Some of the time earlier in the year when you came on and you were definitely wrong. Yeah, because that wasn't Block. Oh, okay. See what you're saying.

No, block is sacred. But this is big time. For people who haven't joined us before, we take it in terms of report on a topic, and it is my turn to do the second most fertile topic of 2023. And here is a question to get us onto that topic. Fantastic. My question for you both is, which character does the great Elizabeth Hurley play in the U-2000 film

starring Brenda Fraser bedazzled A beautiful film A beautiful film Beck, I'll let you take this one Ah Janine Gonc Genene Gonk

Is that her? Is that her? That sounds like her I'm going to need more information Including the correct answer Hey on, wait, is it... Is it the devil? It is the devil. Okay, it is the devil. It is the devil.

Okay, Janine Gongk. A.k. A.k. For a second, forgot she was the devil. And I was like, oh, she must have a beautiful name. Good name. Janine gong. Janine gong.

It's a great name. She looks like a Janine, too, doesn't she? Elizabeth Haley. She especially looks like a gongk. Famously gongish. Oh, my God. Absolutely. The answer is, of course, the devil or Satan.

And by the year 2000, they were able to be able to hell. will have quite a lot of fun with Satan. But in the two decades prior to this, probably not so much, because the USA had been gripped by the satanic panic. Oh, it rhymes and I like that. That's good stuff, is it. It's great branding. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

And that is the topic of this week's episode, the satanic panic, suggested by a couple of people. Thank you to Ruben Dodd from Broken Hill, who wrote in brackets, Lucky Me. Beautiful area. Love it out there. Marty Goodwin, from Brougham. Brooklyn, New York.

New York. Scott Coventry from Grenick or Grenoc. We've had some feedback in the Patreon group that we're saying that wrong, I believe. God, they're fucking tedious over there, aren't they? Those people who support you. There's people who love us and support us. I think that's only if it's in Scotland. It doesn't actually say which Grenoc or Grenick Scott Coventry's in at the time.

So thank you so much anyway. Erica Parody from Ottawa in Canada and Jacob Miller from Bloomington Indiana. Wow, real mixed bag. Real mixed bag. Spread out. Do they all love Satan or panic? Because we're about to find out. Yeah, it's about 50-50 in that list. Yeah. The Satanists were first, the panic is second. I famously love to panic. So I am fully in on at least 50% of this report.

Same. Do you know much about the satanic panic? It's one of those things that I've heard the phrase had no idea any, many more about it. No. No, not at all. I did think you were about say, do you know much about panic? Like, I thought we were going to keep talking about panic. And I'd be like, oh, yeah, you'd like to prove your credentials. Oh, I got diagnosed with a generalized anxiety disorder, but I didn't know I got diagnosed with it because I was too anxious and panicked that I didn't clarify. But I've read a piece of paper a lot later that said it on it.

That's incredible. Maybe two years later, I was like too panicked to actually clarify what the doctor said. So I'm very good at panic. Yeah, so. By not clarifying, you've proved yourself that you do have the anxiety. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But Satan, the doctor hasn't said anything yet, but maybe I should have asked. I'd follow up, I'd ask to see a copy of your records.

Yeah, could be possessed. I'm not sure. Not sure. I'm not sure. Didn't ask. Do you know? You got to ask specifically. You do.

It's a bit like asking somebody if they're a secret agent. You have to be like, am I possessed by the devil? Yes or no, you have to tell me. Yes. Now, just a content warning for everyone listening. There's some full-on accusations of murder, assault. and crazy satanic rituals in this episode. Oh, wow.

Okay. So just a little content warning. That's right. If that's not your bag, don't worry, I'm not going to go into full on detail about a lot of the stuff. Yep. But it's... If that might be a little bit upsetting for you.

Impossible not to mention, I'm afraid. Okay. Now, the satanic panic was one of the longest and most famous media scares in history. A series of moral panics in the 1980s and 90s led to social hysteria and a cultural panic that heavily influenced many high-profile criminal corporations. convictions. Wow. All up there were over 12,000 claims of satanic ritual abuse. But how on earth did the world get there? Because when you said before like about the movie and in the couple of decades before that, I was like, does he mean centuries? Like it feels like, it feels like something

that would happen in like the 1700s, you know? Yes. A lot of people did compare it to the hysteria around the Salem witch trial. Yeah, that's what I'm thinking. But this is in the 80s and 90s. Yes. Of the 19s. Of the 19s. A time that we all lived through. That was a cool and normal way to ask. Yes. Sorry, are these 90s from the 19s?

Or are we talking 18s? What sort of 80s are we talking about? 17, 19? That's so... 20! And in my head, that is so recent. And if you say it isn't, oh, I will get a satanic panic within me. It's very recent.

It's very recent. If it's within our lifetime. Yep. And in my life, I'm so young. We're babies. We're tiny baby, booboo, boogga. So much to look forward to... I need my bot-bot.

That sounds like you wanted a butt. I don't know why you want to... Yeah. Do you call bot? Okay. My bot bot bot. Give me that butt. My bottom.

Give me that box, please. I need a bottom. I might put myself on time out. It's coming with a weird energy today. I had to go back. I had to go out the patrons. I blame Satan. Yes.

You know, that's an option here. You feel in that in the air tonight? It's not that it's a bit warm in here. I'm a bit tired. And I'm losing my mind a little bit. It's definitely the devil. It's definitely the devil. So how do we get here?

Well, cults and the violence they were capable of and Satanism had been heavily profiled in the media all the way back to the Manson family murders in the late 1960s. We've done a podcast on before. At this same time, Anton LeVay founded the Church of Satan, calling himself its high priest. He later published the Satanic Bible in which he set down the teachings and rituals of his church. And according to the good people at Britannica, LeVay presented Satanism, not as the practice of evil or the worship of an actual Antichrist, but as a kind of ethical egoism. According to LeVay, traditional religions were fundamentally hypocritical and dangerously inhibited the physical tendencies and emotional needs that were vital to human life. He instructed his followers to obey the law, and he taught that indulgence in pleasure could be beneficial only if it did not harm others.

Okay. Oh, gosh. Oh, no. I'm agreeing with the sateness. I'm not already. That all sounds pretty fine. That sounds quite reasonable. That sounds really reasonable.

Very moderate. Yeah. And I do, I really do agree that people should enjoy stuff more. Like, I think that's a big problem that people have when you withhold enjoyment of something, especially when it doesn't hurt others. Yeah. Like getting, sometimes like when I get a cold, I'll go get like, Codrell original. Yeah.

This is not a good example. No, yeah. Just to dwell in the cold for a bit. No, no, Cordial Original is good. Like, you're like, oh, that's a good thing. But sometimes, like, I shouldn't have too much Cordial Original. Yeah, yeah. This is not relatable to a global audience.

When does the Satanism get involved here? I think it's because you can dwell in your sadness and unhappiness, whereas you should try and find joy and try and help yourself more. Right, I agree with that. This sounds like an ad for, I'm not chill. Yeah. This is barely related. You couldn't think of anything else you like.

No. just coddle original I worry about you back I know I should listen to Satan more enjoy things so he puts this book out but Vox describes the book as full of plagiarism and other people's ideas and he has been

It's a whole page that starts with I have a dream It's quite it's beautiful It's quite rousing I don't see what it has to do with Satanism but it's beautifully written And then there's my loneliness is killing me And that's also part of Satan's Yeah And that was before

that's interesting to plagiarise something before it comes out. And yet, here we are. He has been accused of writing the book in order to build a lucrative and tax-exempt business as well. Either way, it sold over a million copies was highly publicised. LeVay was a fantastic self-promoter. He has an incredible look. If you're at home, look him up.

Bald with jagged eyebrows and sculptured dark facial hair, appearing in photos with a cloak or a cape, often holding snakes. And numerous articles, magazines and other TV shows featured him, and dubbed him the father of Satanism, the St. Paul of Satanism, and the evilest man in the world. Okay. So far, cool Brandon.

Even though he wasn't really doing anything evil, he just kind of looked cool and was like, yeah, I'm the Satan guy. But, yeah, I don't know if you can then label him evil, or the evilest guy in the world. No. Capes are pretty evil. Oh, shit, sorry, I did.

Caped, you forgot the cape. I forgot the cape. I took that back. That guy's evil. Looking at me does seem a bit like, like, like, if they gave him. a WW wrestler the Satanist persona

Yeah Yeah yeah Yeah It's quite camp Yeah Yeah really really over the top Yeah Britannica continues

LeVay's persona Was always greater than the Church of Satan Whose membership Never exceeded About 2,000 people And which declined When a splinter group

Called the Temple of Set formed in 1975 In response to LeVay's Selling of higher church offices Okay I think he was kind of like Give me some money You can be in the church

You can be up here You can buy buy you a in. It does feel very business-like to me. He also said that he had romantic affairs with the actresses Marilyn Monroe and Jane Mansfield. And these stories have been proven to be absolute bullshit. But he did help to put Satanism on the mainstream map

because he was doing a lot of media. I think he went on like the Tonight Show. Wow. He's in magazine and stuff and people like, what is this? And, you know, conservative people who are from the Christian background were a bit like, oh, this is an evil man. But really, I don't think he was doing that much evil stuff.

Seems a little harmless. But I don't want to say that too soon. Yeah, it feels like it made turn. I know. But in saying that, like, I feel like branding is an important part of religion. Like, you don't think about it a lot. I, you know, I grew up Catholic and a big part of that was, there was like a church shop and all I wanted at this church shop. And this was, I think, like, you know, merch.

Yeah. I feel like I've talked about this on a podcast with you before. Church merch. Church merch. Church merch. There was a glow in the dark Mary statue. I was like, I want that so bad. A glue in the dark, I want it so bad.

We went on an excursion to a convent, and I bought a little mini glow in the dark. It was tiny, but I got a glove in the dark area. You got it. Did you ever get it back? Yeah, I do. I used to light it up and then like sit and look at it. So cool.

And that's kind of all you do with a glow in the dark thing. I've just described an object. I got an object and I enjoyed that object. I'm glad you got it because that's what life is all about, remember? Nice moments. Did you ever have a? a crucifix or a cross necklace? I had a lot of different necklaces.

My dad loved a necklace. I was very excited to get one for like First Communion or something. It was also the only type of jewelry you were allowed to wear to school. And I think that was a lot of the appeal as well. The Catholic school, so you could wear a crucifix. Do they ever say how big it could be? Could you have one? Mine was fucking huge.

In theory, dragging on the ground. What? What's the problem? I'm sorry. Am I not allowed to love Jesus in this school? Sorry about that. Excuse me, I'm on my way to P.E. Thank you.

I'm going to use this as a quick about. So then in the 70s first came the best-selling book, The Exorcist, and it's extremely successful in 1973. Film adaptation. Build is being based on a true story. Vox, which I've already referenced, because they've got a great article about the satanic panic written by Aja Romano that I'll link to if anyone wants to see more.

Beautiful name, too. Great name. and Arthur Romano Ruts, The Exorcist profoundly impacted America's collective psyche regarding the existence of demons and single-handedly transformed the popular Ouija board from a fun, harmless parlour game into a malevolent device

capable of inducing spirit possession, demonic infestation, or other paranormal activity. Have you ever Ouija-boarded? I've never Ouija boarded. You ever wiched? I have a vague memory, but not much. Yeah, I've vague memory of a Ouija boarded a part of,

Yeah. But it always seemed a bit like someone's pushing it. Someone was pushing. You know how it's like it's quite a unique word. Oh, you i. J-A. Ou-I-J-A. Ouija board.

Do you know why it's called that? No. The person who like created it, apparently that's the first word that it spelled out. Oh. So that's why it's called that extremely, you know, strange looking word, a Ouija board. Huh.

Isn't that amazing? That is. It's the first word. No. And it feels like that person just wanted. to call it that and went, oh, spooky. Oh, you. What should I call you?

Ah. I mean, it is a good name because it definitely wasn't like trademarked. They went through it and they went through it and they're like a pocus, pocus board, can't call it spooky board. Scary board. Talk to ghost board. They're all taken. Also in the early 1970s came another best selling book called Satan seller, which was written

by a man intriguingly for me named Mike W. Warnke. Whoa. Very close to my W-A-R-N-K-E. So without my E, but very close to me. That's very close. I've never even met a Warn-Kee. That's spookily close.

Do you feel that? Warn-key. In 1972, Satan Cellar. Wonke writes about how he was orphaned as a child where he was introduced into Satanism, where he participated in sexual orgies, alcoholism and drug dealing, his rise in the ranks of Satanism to the level of high priest,

presiding over satanic rituals, including magical spells, summoning demons, ritual sex, and then... That's how I do it. It's a ritual. It's a ritual. Same time every week. Always wearing cloaks. Always in the same exact order.

You like candles. Somely spooky. It's a spooky sex. And the book also details how he found Jesus and became an evangelist. Oh, wow. What a roller coaster. It was a big seller in religious circles, putting him on the map as a preacher and also as a satanic expert throughout the 1980s.

In the 90s, however, an investigation into Warnkey by Christian magazine Cornerstone revealed all his claims to be completely made up. Wow. So even the Christian people were like, this doesn't sound right to us. So they did a big investigation. They also investigated John Todd, who claimed to be a former occultist who was born into a witchcraft family before also converting to Christianity. John Todd also made a variety of claims about witches, Satanus,

the Illuminati controlling people. And I actually read that John Todd and Mike Wonki didn't get along. And in one meeting between Todd and Wonky, the two had a backstage confrontation and Todd accused Wonky of stealing his testimony regarding the Illuminati. So even the conspiracy theories are like, no, there's a conspiracy that you stole my theory on the conspiracy. Wouldn't that just support your conspiracy theory? No, that's my.

You're silly. You're part of them. You're part of them. Then you go like, yeah, then the thing. That's so funny. That's so funny for two. conspiracy theories and go, you're lying about the thing I'm saying. It's like real.

People should buy my book, not yours. That's great. It turned out they were both full of shit. What? But at the time, this stuff was being taken on face value, and more and more people were being exposed to the idea of satanic cots. The late 70s and early 80s also saw the killer clown John Wayne Gacy, Ted Bundy, the son of Sam killer, the unsolved murders by the Zodiac killer.

We've done reports on a lot of those. Aides misinformation. homophobia and then the panic around the Tylenol murders that we did for block last year. Yep. Great report. If I may say so myself. And through all these things, all mini panics, it was a great. It was very good.

It was one of your best. I agree. I totally agree. I thought for a thing there and you didn't do it. And I was like, that's a fun bit. No, I did. It's one of few I remember. Yeah, great stuff.

Yeah. But through all these things, there's all mini panics about all these things. And together, America was on. edge. Both danger and evil seem to be lurking around every corner. Throw in equally intriguing and terrifying satanic mysticism, some alarmist Christian preachers, and you've got the recipe for a perfect moral panic. Mmm, good soup. Mmm, delicious panicky soup.

Grab a bowl. Those are all the ingredients you need. It needs a little less morals. But the thing... I don't know. I couldn't think of any other word he'd said. That's funny. That's funny.

I'm trying. Morals are gross I get it You don't want to ruin Morals in my soup Well the thing that arguably made The whole thing boil over And explode in the public's consciousness soup

Sorry I'm so sorry Nah this is all checking out I also think Evan put a soup My partner Evan put a soup in the microwave yesterday No cover This is not to do with this What are you doing mate? Isn't that hectic?

He was like oh no this is fine I was like that's a hectic thing Unless she's doing that 10 seconds at a time You're a fool Evan's one of the smartest people I've ever met in my entire life and then sometimes there's gaps in his knowledge like that and I'm like, how the fuck have you got me? That's so funny.

Out of all the electrical items on earth, the one thing I'm better at Evan that is microwave. Got him. And you don't even have a microwave. I don't even have one. Oh my gosh, an expert regardless. Anyway, did they put the panicky soup in the microwave without a cover? They put it into a spooky cauldron.

A broth. Okay, no, I'm getting. too spook now. So we've got to pull it back. I can't handle that. Double, bubble. No! It's in a spooky Tupperware container for later. I can handle that. Okay, good. The thing that made it boil over wasn't a microwave.

It wasn't a cauldron. The thing that made it explode in the public's consciousness was the 1980 publication of a book called Michelle remembers. Oh my god, that is spooky. Remember this? Remember this? No. No.

We went alive. Rebecca forgot. I feel like it's, it's That's a spooky name. That's a great name for him. Michelle remembers. Yeah. Because he instantly goes, remembers what?

Yeah. What are you talking about? Yeah. So it was written by Canadian psychiatrist Lawrence Pazda and his psychiatric patient and later wife. Okay. Oh, no. Ethically murky. Michelle Smith.

There's not enough morals in that soup. Yeah. More moral in your soup. Yeah, you mean more morals. So the book chronicles therapy sessions between Pazder and Smith, Michelle, and alleged recovered memories of satanic. rituals, she claims she was forced to attend as a child. She claims she was locked in cages and that animals and babies were sacrificed during the rituals

conducted by a secret society. So she alleged some really wild stuff. Using hypnosis, Lawrence Pashter claimed he was able to recover repressed memories from her childhood. Over 600 hours of hypnosis. Jesus. Pazza relied on the now discredited practice of recovered memory therapy. Michelle said in a television interview, because there was lots of press about this,

this is a big deal. She said, basically, what I remember was a 14-month period of my life at age five where I was given to a group of people, and at first I wasn't aware of what they were doing, other than to a child, they were adult doing things that I couldn't understand it that frightened me. They sacrificed animals and they used fetuses of babies in their ceremonies. So this is what she's going on claiming, it sells lots of copies. I have to say it was a big payday for the authors. Michelle remembers was the first published survivor account of alleged satanic ritual abuse. and was a publishing success, earning Pasra and Smith a $100,000 hardcover advance and $242,000

just for the paperback rights. Then it sells lots. Wow. Crucially, Michelle also said in a TV interview, I think today it's very, very wise to take a good, hard look at where you place your children into whose care you place your child. Like I said, big news, bestseller, and it really freaked people out. It also says a lot about that sort of morbid. curiosity that humans have as well, that a book that details horrific stuff like that sells so

well. But I mean, like, yeah, there's so many true crime podcasts and there's, but it's just so, I find it so interesting that morbid curiosity that humans have. I have it. Oh, me too. We all do. And sometimes I read and I go, I wish I hadn't read that. Every time, people go, I mean, really read this at your own, at your own risk. And I go, yeah, I'll read it. Oh, what? I read that. What did you warn me? Yeah, every time. It's just, it's such a weird and interesting thing that we have. So people were gripped by it, but also the she's out there saying, this could, basically

saying this could be happening to your kids. Yeah. And people are really going, oh my God, really? Who are you trusting your kids with? Yeah. And did Michelle get any money from the sales of the book? Did I miss that? Oh, yeah.

So her and her eventual husband, Lawrence. Right. They're co-authors. Okay. Listeners co-authors. Both went on the publicity circuit and both. made lots of money. Do they marry later? Yes, but not that much later.

They're kind of... They were probably together. Yeah, yeah, okay. Yeah. Interesting. And I've got to say, Michelle remembers has now being completely discredited. Wow. Michelle forgotty. Oh, no. So now people are like, like, you know, so... The recovered memory technique isn't really a thing. Isn't really a thing.

Right. In most cases, I think a lot of the time, it's like, they see, are now seen as like implanted memories or like, you know, teasing out dreams. and things like that. Yeah, yeah. And 600 hours of hypnosis is a lot of hypnosis. That's so much. I mean, you look at the situation of that, that whole thing sounds very morally murky.

And then it makes, it's very, I don't think I need to say. I feel like me not saying anything, it's clear that I'm just going, oh, no. Yeah, this is all about, just a guy coming in going, this is what you remember. That feels, yeah. And also marry me. Oh, all feels icky. Yeah, what is the implication there that it was made up, that it just wasn't true? Yeah, that it was in planning.

Not that stuff ever happened because there's been lots of investigations into like her childhood and things like that. Her siblings being like, what are you talking about? Wow. No evidence of it. Her parents who are very Christian people were like, what? It's so interesting that people do stuff like that. If it is sort of coming from a bullshit place and not thinking about the fact that you have

parents and siblings and evidence of your life at that time. But it does also, and this is, you know, I'm cast to as Persians, but it does feel a bit like, you know, you have someone who is in a, what sounds like an unhealthy relationship. Yeah. I would say. And sometimes that can make you think, oh, this is the, you can get manipulated to think that their truth is better than the truth of your family. Yeah, that's right.

It kind of sounds like it might be a sort of controlling relationship. Oh, I know my parents have pictures of me at that time, but, They're fake. Stuff like that. Who knows? Interesting. But the book really helped kick off the satanic panic of the 80s and then into the 90s. Great.

Part of that panic is the daycare sexual abuse hysteria that started in the 1980s. And as you can probably tell from that, not super funny topic. No. It all began in Kern County in California where several local social workers had attended a training seminar that emphasized satanic ritual abuse as a major element of. child sexual abuse and had used the now debunked memoir Michelle remembers as training material. So these social workers are being told this happened. This happened to her when she's growing up.

Here's what to look out for. Be on the lookout for it. As soon as you put that in people's heads, they're more likely to see something even if it's not there. Of course, it's that sort of confirmation bias thing. Yeah. In 1982, Alvin and Debbie McEwan's two daughters alleged they had been abused by their parents and accused them of being part of a sex ring that included Scott and Breniwain. and a Niffin. The Niffin's two sons also claimed to have been abused and made claims of being

involved in satanic rituals. Both couples, the McEwans and the Niffins were convicted in 1984 and given a combined sentence of more than 1,000 years in prison. And from here, six similar cases occurred throughout Kern County. More than two dozen men and women were arrested and served decades-long sentences for abusing children. But the truth is, none of it ever happened. That's so terrible. Oh, my God. To kick it off, Alvin and Debbie McEwen's two daughters were coached by their step-grandmother, Mary Ann Barber, who according to the National Registry of Exonerations, Mary began to believe that the McEwans had also abused their daughters and that the girls were not safe in their parents' home. The National Registry goes on.

In most of these exonerations, the children who had testified they'd been abused recanted their testimony. In all of the exonerations, there was evidence that the complaining witnesses, some as young as four years old had been coerced or persuaded by the authorities to make false accusations. What the fuck? That's awful. That's just terrible. Yes, I believe it's been, I think that their step-grandmother, Marianne, Barber, also had some severe mental issues. Wow.

She was undergoing psychosis. Yeah, okay. And was very scared of her kid and the partner around their grandchildren, and she was just feeding them stuff that just didn't happen. It is worrying when you do look at things that are made in pop culture, people will make something really kind of and not think about the implications of what it might do to wider society. I feel like the people who made that the Michelle remembers book were not considering that this could kick off. How could you think that? I mean, in saying that, it's not necessarily the fault of the person making the thing that it's interpreted by someone. But it is interesting how things get interpreted.

by people in ways that you wouldn't expect. Yep, absolutely wild. So scary. And yeah, the ripple effect of it is so full on and scary. This is like only the first little ripple. It's going to absolutely explode this as wild. One boy, Brandon, who grew up without his parents, Scott and Brendan Niffin, who I mentioned, because they were sentenced to prison. For gruesome crimes, he and his younger brother described on the witness stand when they were very young.

He later, after recanting, said he only repeated whatever. heard during weeks of group therapy and had no inkling his false statements would mean he would be separated from his family and assigned to live in foster homes for nearly a decade. Wow. It's just the impact one little moment can have. Yeah, because you're four years old. You're like, I don't know, like people are repeating stories and you're like, yeah, you know. Because you're four. Four. You don't understand anything. You don't understand consequences at that stage. It wasn't until 1996 that the convictions of the two couples were overturned and they were released. Over time, 20 of the defendants who were sentenced to prison were exonerated,

the earliest in 1991, and the latest in 2008. Holy shit. Very late. Part of the problem was the district attorney in Kern County in California from 1983 to 2010 was Ed Yagels. To quote from Wiki, I don't know why Yagels is fun. It's a fun name. But he's not a fun guy because Wiki says, during this time, he prosecuted some notorious cases of wrongful convictions and engaged in what is now acknowledge widely to have been a pattern of prosecutorial misconduct in which he convicted innocent people of abusing children. He created a task force to investigate sex crimes against children and all those people were charged without any physical evidence. Perfect. Oh, okay. He gets results even though they were all wrong. He gets bad results. Finally from his wiki page,

he was unapologetic about the false convictions in the 80s and was re-elected six times as district attorney before announcing his retirement in 2009. Fuck. And, and America. Yeah. I know it's not your fault America, but oh my word, oh my word. And it cost them a fortune too.

The county had to pay millions in conversation to those that were wrongfully convicted and wrongfully jailed for sometimes, for like decades. And you think about the long-term mental impacts of that as well and the impacts on those families and their relationships.

Yes. First and foremost, not first and foremost, but like just one, factor is those kids don't really know those parents very well. The parents went to prison because of the children, not their fault. No. Wild. And that kid who grew up to be Brandon and said.

And was at birth as well. But grew up to be, you know, adult Brandon interviewed saying, I think he said in the interview, like, we've worked past it now, but it was a lot. Of course it was. Yeah. My parents went to jail for over nearly a decade because of what I said. Yeah. I think this is important too when you think about these things because,

Sometimes you'll talk about, you know, a certain event happening or a true crime happening. I do a lot of, on the side, true crime podcast editing. And to hear from victims of things and the impact that it has makes you realize, like, one, yeah, one terrible thing is not just the terrible thing. It's like you're saying, it's just ripple effect that impacts everyone around you, your relationships, the relationships of the next generation as well. And like, oh, man, you're not out of prison and fine. No, absolutely not. horrendous happened to you and you serve time for something you didn't do. Years.

And the whole time you're there thinking, I didn't do this. And the judge to just be completely, I mean, oh, yeah, that's terrible as well. It's bad stuff. And unfortunately at the time the Kern County abuse case started what is known as the daycare sexual abuse hysteria of the 80s. There are many, many, many examples of this. Many that could be their own reports. There's a lot of info out there.

But a very famous case is the McMartin preschool case in late 1983. So not long after this, the McMartin family owners of a Californian preschool, as well as a McMartan teacher called Ray Buckley, were accused by a parent of molesting children under their care. I have read that the parent was later diagnosed with and hospitalized for acute paranoid schizophrenia. But the accusation came and the police sent a full-on letter to the parents of the 200 other children enrolled in the preschool. Like, I'm not going to read all of it because some of it's like, oh my God, you can't write that in a letter and not expect people to absolutely lose their minds.

It says, dear parent, this department is conducted. a criminal investigation involving child molestation. Ray Buckley, an employee of the Virginia McMarton's preschool, was arrested on September 7th by this department. Records indicate that your child has or is currently a student at the preschool. Don't send this in a letter. We are asking your assistance in the continuing investigation. Please question your child if he or she has been witness to any crime

or he or she has been a victim. Then it goes on to describe some of the extreme things that Ray has been accused of and ask them to ask their child if they've ever seen another child get tied up by Ray. Jesus. Now obviously, this really freaks out parents. Of course. And Susan Moran, who's a criminal defencest attorney and professor at Case Western University's

School of Law, told A&E True Crime, she said, when you send a letter out like that, naming the alleged individual, you're already tainting that investigation. Exactly right. These parents are ill-equipped with the proper questioning methods, and now you're going to have corrupt responses. Of course. And also, that's a phone call. That's a visit.

That's something more than a... A letter feels like a very legal thing that they've done. They've done that so that they can go, oh, we sent this letter, here's this proof. They needed to go speak to people. 200 letters and then. 200 letters that are so, there's no way anything that comes of that can be trustworthy. And they're all, you know, two, three and four years old. So what are you going to get out of them?

Yeah. Terrible. Terrible. Several hundred children were then interviewed by the Children's Institute International, a Los Angeles-based abuse therapy clinic run by Kea McFarlane. The interviewing techniques used during investigations of the allegations were highly suggestive and invited children to pretend or speculate about supposed events. Later research demonstrated that the methods of questioning used on the children were extremely suggestive,

leading to false accusations and could have led to false memory syndrome. Wiki writes, Michael P. Maloney, a clinical psychologist and professor of psychiatry, reviewed videotapes of the children's interviews, Maloney, testifying as an expert witness on interviewing children, was highly critical of the techniques used, referring to them as improper, coercive, directive, problematic and adult directed in a way that forces children to follow a rigid script. He concluded that many of the kids' statements in the interviews were generated by the examiner. Yeah. Not their actual words, not their actual memories, not their actual thoughts and feelings. Putting the words in the kids' mouths, basically. Basically, leading the witness essentially.

Yeah, yeah. And despite this, in 1984, seven McMartan family members and staff were charged with 115 counts of child abuse, later expanded to 321 counts involving 48 children. What the fuck? During the trial, accusations were made that the alleged abuses were satanic in nature,

causing more panic about it. Of course, yeah. There were stories of ritual sacrifice, witches flying, traveling in a hot air balloon. What the fuck's wrong with that? What's wrong with a hot air balloon? The spookiest mode of transport. And so sorry, you've got a three-year-old going,

and then we went in a hot air balloon. And then there was a witch there. And it's like, okay, I'm writing all of this down. Tell me more. Tell me more. Oh my God, this kid's got all the goss. Surely a hot air balloon is a very easy thing to investigate. Was there a hot air balloon? Easy thing to spot?

Well, those like, Michelle remembers, like, one of her things that she remembers is that she was, like, taken on a plane, which she'd never been on before. taken on a plane, flown to Mexico, and then flown, like, for the satanic rituals, then flown back to be back at home by the time her parents got home. That makes sense. You can do that.

Easy. And people are like, that can't happen. If you're a Kardashian. They fly a lot. They fly too much. They fly too much. Yeah, they fly private and they go stay in nice places. But you're right.

They vacation in a different way to us. They do. But these kids are sort of just riffing stuff and they're writing it all down. And this shows you how ridiculous it was. When shown a series of photographs by Danny Davis, who was the McMarton's lawyer, one child identified actor Chuck Norris as one of the abusers. And they were still like, see? Got them.

And they arrested Chuck. No, they didn't get him. But they're still like, yeah, they got that bit wrong. But still, these seven got to go to jail. Some children spoke of tunnels under the preschool used for the ceremonies. Several excavations proved these did not exist. They did excavations. Yeah, because the case lasted seven years.

Oh, my God. It resulted in no convictions and all charges were dropped in 1990. But by the case's end, it had become the longest and most expensive series of criminal trials in American history. That has ruined that business as well. Oh, yeah. Well, Ray Buckley had been in jail whilst, like, on trial for five years by this point. And he didn't do anything wrong. Did he do anything?

Never convicted. He worked at a daycare. Yeah. That is what he did wrong. Five years of his life gone. That's fucking crazy. And like so much media drama, so much, so many dollars spent on the most expensive trial America's ever done.

And then even when they're cleared, that business has to close. Oh, it's probably been closed for ages, but they can't. Yeah, I think the building ended up being demolished. It has to be. Oh my gosh. It has to be because how can they then go, okay, well, we're all cleared. Yeah. Bring your children.

Come back on Monday. Nobody's going to do that. Even if you cleared, nobody's going to do that. It's going to take years. That is awful and insane. So charges dropped in 1990, but at the time, in the middle-late 80s, it's front-page news. In the aftermath of the charges and the publicity that surrounded them, including all the stories of satanic rituals and witches and all sorts of things.

Hot air balloons, you left off the hot air balloons. Yeah, the hot air balloons, the spriciest motor transport. After this, more than 100 other preschools face similar accusations. Get, fuck. So it was like a just spread like wildfire across the country. I've never heard of any of this. It's wild. So, so wild.

So many people's lives ruined forever. The organization, Believe the Children, was formed to promote the theory of ritual satanic abuse happening across the nation. What the fuck? Particularly in preschools and similar facilities. Can I ask, was believed the children run by religious people? It feels religious. Yes, I believe so.

Yeah, it does feel a bit religious. Yeah. Heavly conservative people. Yeah, there's a, there's a, it's, it does feel like it's a, a fear-based thing. I mean, believe the children is such a good message. You should do that. Yeah. But to be co-opted in order to spread fear about something is very, that's, I hate that.

It's so much. Believe the children specifically about this one thing. Yeah, about Satanism. Yeah, that we really want to get more children to talk about. Well, they said, didn't happen. Just ask them about it in a different way. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Because, of course, they'll say, no, everything's fine and I really like

my childcare, but you've got to dig. You've got to guide them a little. Yeah, and even when you dig and they find no tunnels under there, they've somehow covered up the tunnels. Yeah. The tunnels were there. And we will find the tunnels. Oh my gosh.

So it happened at so many preschools, and I can't come into all of them, of course, but the cut has an article written by Eric Vance that writes, in March 1988, residents of the small town of Stewart, Florida, were gripped by what can only be described as mass hysteria. Law enforcement officers had discovered a secret satanic cult being run out of the local Montessori preschool. I can't believe we don't have Matt Stewart here to answer for Stuart, Florida.

Yeah. Feels like he would be an expert. He would quickly point out that they're spelled the more evil way, ST-U-A-R-T. Oh, no, that is. Nothing to do with his clan. I'm sorry, I didn't hear the U. I didn't hear the U.

I couldn't have known. Stuart, Florida. Stewart. Stewart. Why? The difference with these ones is the accusations came a decade later, and the former preschool students and kids who are still only 12 or 13 were now able to uncover so-called buried memories of abuse

through hours of interviews with law enforcement officers and hypno sessions with psychologists. Resident Carol McMillan said, it got to be the kind of thing where every other storefront in the town had a new child psychologist. So, big business. I mean, it's so terrible because there would, this isn't to say that there wasn't things happening.

There might have been things happening, but if you're just continuously swelling up this fear. Yeah, it also does, you're right, cover up the actual, any actual abuse, you're right. And in this town, more than 60 allegations were leveled, and the town went bananas, again from the cut. Some residents attended town meetings armed with handguns, hunting for Satanists. Oh my gosh. While others planted listing devices in classrooms and searched for mass graves on school grounds. One parent recalled, it was like Salem all over again.

So parents are losing their minds. Do you know, I just had a flashback to when I was in primary school and everyone talking about a spooky clown who was apparently around. And I just remembered that I was genuinely very scared about the spooky clown who didn't exist. People were like, there's a spooky clown. Keeps coming to the schoolgrounds. And I was a tiny child. I was like, yes, of course there's a spooky clown. I've seen the spooky clown.

Yes, see, that's the whole truth for you. And I just remembered and I was like, oh, there was no spooky clown. But I've only just remembered just then quite afterwards. This is a new book, Rebecca remembers. The clown. The spooky clown that didn't exist. The memories that were being uncovered by these, you know, young teens and kids in Florida were in fact false memories. And at least one of the psychologists was sued for implanting false memories in the patients.

One of the 12-year-old girls, Kristen Grace Erickson, recalled at the time that she wasn't sure what she said was completely true. The memory felt funny like a lie, she said. But she records saying something to the psychologist about her feeling. And he said, no, that's just what it feels like. It really happened. Oh, those poor kids, far out. So they're really being, you know, being told, no, no, no, this is what happened. They want it to have happened.

They want satanic abuse to have occurred, which is so wild and fucked. The cut article from Eric Vance also says, A classic study by the legendary psychologist and memory expert, Ulrich Nyser, goes like this. The morning after the explosion of NASA's space shuttle, the Challenger in 1986, which I've also done a report on. Nysa took a poll of where his students were

when they first heard about it. Almost three years later, he ran the poll again, and almost all the answers had changed in some way. Several people had even placed themselves in totally different circumstances. I was actually on the moon. I was on board. I was on board. I survived.

And then when they were told about it, they refused to believe the accounts they'd written down almost three years earlier. Yeah. They're like, no, no, no, what I'm remembering now is the truth. Memory is very unreliable, is what I've learned from Dr. Carl. I also learned it recently. From Dr. Carl? I asked Dr. Carl about it, and then I forgot. Yeah.

Oh, what? What? I got, for my birthday, I got a poker decks. Oh, yes, yep, that I had as a kid. Yep. and I remembered that it got taken from me at school. Oh. And I, then someone asked, they were like, oh, who took it?

And then I was like, oh, I think it was these people, but maybe I just lost it. Like, and then I had to think about it. And I'm like, there is no way to check this either. Yeah. Back in the old days, there's no way to like, you don't have phone, you don't have, you don't have, nowadays it's a lot easier to try and fact check where you were and get some information because there's like a digital footprint. But back then, there's no digital footprint.

There's no way of checking anything. Anyway, I got my poker decks and look, it's a happy ending. And that rules. And that one's stolen it? Not yet. Oh, now I'm not looking at it now. Where is it? Where is it, Rebecca?

Where is my poker decks? Remember. Remember. Yeah, so isn't it interesting though that should be so stubborn when like I've got, I've literally got a transcript of what you said three years ago and they're like, no, that's wrong. Wait, so they were even wrong with that. Oh, I missed this.

No, no. Also, they said this, you know, on the day of the challenger, they said I was here. Then three years later, he just asked them, where were you on the day that the day we all heard about the challenge disaster? Oh, I missed the, it was this test as well. Yeah. They had the information.

And they said, we were, I was over here. And then, which was completely different in a lot of cases. And when he said, oh, I've got your testimony here that says you're actually, you know, at home. See, I. And they read that and went, I don't believe that. See, I didn't even take in properly what you just said. Oh, my gosh. Memory is so terrible.

It's not even working currently. And things can be suggested to. people too. University of California Irvine psychologist, Elizabeth Loftus, is an expert in this field and one of her most famous sets of experiments in the 70s involved people viewing slides of a red Datsun, a car, passing a stop sign and then smacking into a pedestrian. The experimenters asked the subjects a number of questions,

some of which are a little misleading like, did another car pass the red Datson when it stopped at the yield sign? Which is what they call a giveaway sign. The subject thinks for a moment, and then, says to herself, no, I definitely didn't see any other cars next to that yield sign. The sign had changed in their minds from a stop sign to a yield sign because that was what was suggested to them. Right.

It's like that video that used to go around the internet with that, there were people playing basketball and there was a dancing. I can't remember what it was. It was either an elephant or a lion and you get distracted by the basketball as well. And then if you watch it back again, you go, oh my gosh. There it is. It's a little bit like that as well, but not at all. Actually, it's a different thing.

That's a different memory thing. That was more coercion. My thing is just not paying attention to a lion in a dancing suit or potentially an elephant. One of them, some sort of animal. Another one, so Loftus also proved that you're able to implant memories into people's childhoods looking back. She was able to make many people believe that as a child

they got lost in a shopping centre and that a man in a jean jacket rescued them. Oh my gosh. That did actually happen to me as well. I don't know if he was wearing a jean jacket. So I got you But I did get lost in a target But Jess

Are you sure he wasn't wearing a jean jacket? Whoa Hang on a second He was wearing jeans on the bottom There's no way he was wearing jeans on the top That would be crazy Are you sure? Was it the 90s?

Oh my God, I wasn't a 90s I was a child We were in a target I stopped to look at the toys Mum said come on Jess I didn't come on Jess And then she walked off And then I was lost

None of that ever happened What the fuck? Loftus was also able to make others like think that they went to Disneyland where they got a photo with Bugs Bunny even though he's not even a Disney character Oh see I would never That would never happen to me

I would never mistake something like that I'd be like excuse me that is That is the wrong corporation Ha ha ha ha nice try idiot Good one Good one Maybe I went to Hollywood on the Gold Coast And got a picture with him

Would he be there? I don't know No he would be Yeah he would Yeah no he's one guy No no no he did it Movie World Warren Brothers movie world Hollywood on the Gold Coast

What a place. Superman roller coaster? More like the Scooby-Doo Spooky coaster. Thank you very much. I love the Scooby-Doo ride. I'm so sorry to tell you it's closed currently. No. What's happening to it?

They're redoing it. Oh, thank God. No, no, no, they're doing a good job. Yeah, it'll be open. Is it going to be Scooby-Doo themed? Yes, it will be. Okay. Thank God because that rules.

Oh, it'd be so sad for it. I don't know why I brought up such a sad event. Yeah, don't do that. Why did I do this? Not on this happy, happy podcast. No, no. They're sort of a police academy. On the stunt show.

Love that show. Loved it. So, Loftus did all these experiments under controlled circumstances to prove that memory can be corrupted. Some of the kids from Stuart Florida have since discovered their memories to be false. Others knew they were lying from the beginning, but just wanted to make the adults happy.

Furthermore, repeated questioning of children often causes them to change their answers. This is because the children perceive that repeated questioning as a sign. They didn't give the correct answer previously, so they try again. Yeah. So if you keep asking, they go,

they stop thinking it's about the. truth, it's about telling them what they need to hear. Often in these preschool panics, there was no evidence at all. And how could there be? The claims were wild. One babysitter from a church was accused of killing a giraffe and an elephant and drinking their blood in front of the children. Of course.

But where do they get the animals from? Was anyone questioning this? Hang on. Have we asked the zoo? Has the zoo done a stock take recently? Yes. Did they notice a missing giraffe? I've done so many stock takes working in.

retail where you just have to get there at like 6 a.m. You go through and scan everything with a little gun. It'd be so funny doing that at the zoo. Me a cat. Bip, binaucerous. I got to get all of them though. If you guys could line up, please. Beep, beep, beep, beep.

Then the gun runs out of battery. Fuck, and out. And stories like this happened all over the country. Nationally in the USA, there have been dozens of exonerations in child sex abuse hysteria cases, but lots and lots of people went to jail for many, many years. The Vox article written in March 2021 says, although most satanic ritual abuse cases eventually resulted in overturned convictions, at least three people at the time in 2021 were still serving prison sentences

for crimes that most likely never happened. Oh man, that's awful. So bad. And of course, the media in the 1980s only helped fuel the flames of panic. In 1988, tabloid TV host Heraldo Rivera hosted a two-hour special on NBC called Devil Workshop exposing Satan's Underground. Okay. And it's pretty...

It's on YouTube, you can watch it. I feel like to see that mustache saying such wonderful things, what a good time. Also, Satan's underground is surely... That's just hell, right? Yeah, that's just where he lives. But maybe it's the underground below hell. Like, Satan's basement. Oh, cool.

Satan's basement's what I call my ass. Wow. I got a standing ovation for that. You really get standing ovations on pods. I know, and that's why I had to announce it, because nobody would know. Yeah, you got a known. Well, deserved. Thank you so much.

Wonderful riff. So the show, I watched a bit of it. In the show, he crosses to a young man on death row who claims the devil made him commit the murder, as well as numerous religious experts, so-called followers of Satanism, and Ozzy Osbourne. Of course. I feel like Ozzy also... Was he a big into Satan? I guess he kind of used Satan branding.

Yeah, he's asked about the link between metal music and Satanism. and he's like, I never started making music to freak people out. Shut on! It's so great. But Rivera says quite dramatically, the very young and impressionable should definitely not be watching this program tonight. This is not a Halloween fable. Get them away from the TV during the next report.

I'm begging you, please get them out of the room or change the station. I mean, I feel like that warning could go to everyone, because it seems like old people and young people, are taking these old people probably using it and then using the criminal justice system so that's probably bad. Yes. Okay, good explanation.

Chanel, that one really, that one really. They got away from me. They got away from me. I was like, oh no, the mouth is still going but the head has nothing left. The brain's going, do, do, do, do, do. And he says some wild stuff and he says,

estimates are that there are over one million Satanists in this country. The majority of them are linked in a highly organized, very secretive network. From small towns to large cities, they have attracted police and FBI attention to their satanic ritual child abuse. The odds are, this is happening in your town.

Oh, all of those beautiful journalistic statements that are so vague. So vague. There's definitely no sources for these. And when he's talking to people, he's actually quite good at cutting people off. So, like, because it's the 80s and there's, like, you know, there's a bunch of people on satellite links on different TVs,

and they start saying like one sentence and he goes, oh, stop you're right there. We've got to move on now too. And he's really good at stopping it. But it also means that nothing is ever actually said. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I get frustrated watching shows today with panel discussions where they stop people.

I'll stop you there. Have like one less person and then continue the conversation. And have a conversation. Yeah. It was a huge writing success and was seen in 19.8 million homes, which was one... Oh, that's too many. One third of the number that were watching TV that night.

And that's, and a million of those were Satanists. Yeah. So they were just tuning in going, oh, all right. This is what happened in. Okay. He's talking about me. Oh, what that heck. We got the popcorn out.

Having a great time. It was the highest rating, quote unquote, documentary to air until that point. Hmm. Quote unquote documentary. It's very fitting. But between his special and 1995, hundreds of other documentaries like it aired on every major network. Because it was, you know, they're like, shit,

A lot of people watching this, we better make some. Yeah. In 1989, Oprah featured Michelle Smith from Michelle Remembers and another woman, Laurel Rose Wilson, another author of a satanic ritual abuse survivor memoir on her program, warning millions of her viewers about the danger that satanic cults pose to their children. Even Oprah was in on it. Come on, Oprah.

In saying that, Oprah, like, I feel like we all remember the cars, but a lot of us don't remember that that was a talk show that aired, was it every day? Like the amount of stuff you would have to put on She had to fill some gaps She had to feel, I feel like I'm worried to look back on Oprah And Oprah's impact on people What sort of books was she promoting in that club?

Satan books Satan books The Shale remembers But genuinely that's a very She shouldn't have done that All of these things You just look at it and you go It makes me sad about journalism

and media literacy. Yeah, but the people were absolutely swept up in it. In February of 1989, the St. Louis Post-Dispatch followed the example of other news outlets and launched a two-part expose on the supposedly growing satanic threat. According to self-styled authorities on cults, interviewed by the paper, devil worshipers perform 50,000 human sacrifices a year nationwide, which is more than double the reported murders per year in the USA.

But they explained that by writing. the murders are not recorded because the bodies are never found and the bodies are not found because they are mutilated the blood drained and any remains not used for ritual purposes are burned Oh, that sounds like very factual information You think that 50,000 people going missing and dying every year? Yeah. You think more people would be talking about that bit?

Yeah, people might realise that. That would come up. I think, you know, yeah, I think 50,000 people missing at least one of them's got a friend who's like, where's Sharon? Where's she? Sharon! It's Ozzy Osbourne.

It's always... Okay, so when we had Foxhole growing up and we had MTV... Oh, hello, Rich. Yeah, I'm sorry. Dad got a deal. Good work. I would watch bits of the Osbournes,

but the strongest memory I have is Ozzy Oswald struggling. He had like one of those like tablet remote things that did the blinds, the TV. everything. He's trying to tear the TV on. He's accidentally putting the blinds down. And he's getting so frazzled by it and he just goes, Sharon! And that's what plays in my head. Anytime somebody mentions Ozzy Osbourne, I just see a doddery old man with a tablet.

Also, the way you've just said that has just, I feel like I am Ozzy Osbourne. The other day I went to get a remote out of the drawer. I thought it was for the TV. I was for the Rumba. And I was like, why is it working? Sharon! Sharon! Sharon! Everyone needs a Sharon. Everyone does. Everyone needs a Sharon.

Wow, that's nice. That's lovely. I hope to one day be someone's Sharon. But I'm the Aussie. I can't be somebody else to Sharon. The satanic panic also extended to popular culture like Dungeons and Dragons, which I did a full episode on for Block 2019. Episode 206, if you want to listen to that.

I don't want to go over fully again, but Dr. Gary North, the Christian economist, described it as a recruiting tool for Satan. I can't believe. funny when you see any Dungeons and Dragons game to think that Satan would be involved and not like instead like be

very suspicious about you know the people running Cheetos or something like I don't know it feels like it's more like a ring for soft drink and chip companies Yeah, for Mountain Dew yeah oh look at what they're doing keeping kids inside eating snacks

pretending to be a bard Tipper Gore Tipper. Tipper. Tipper. Who was married to Al Gore. Oh. What?

Tipper. The vice president. Tipper Gore, that's his wife. She founded the Parents Music Resource Center, or the PMRC, an American committee formed in 1985, with a stated goal of increasing parental control over the access of children to music deemed to have violent, drug-related, or sexual themes via labeling albums with parental advisory stickers. You know those stickers they have? Yeah. And they...

She's responsible. They're fucking cool. Whenever I saw one of them, I was like, you know, a naughty CD for a film. There's articles about it totally backfiring. Yeah. And CDs selling more after the sticker went on it because kids are like, ooh, naughty.

I got Tenacious D's tribute as a single. Holy shit. A naughty single for Rebecca. And it's like, how is that a naughty? Because it has Satan? And we said, hey. I think it had some. We are, but men.

Rock. That's very spooky. Yeah. But yeah, be you angels, that bit because they're doing an impression of Satan, it needs one. Probably. Probably. Because in 1985, the, what are the, the PMRC released a list called the Filthy 15. Oh, that's a list you want on.

I want to be number one on the Filthy 15. Of course you do. How fucking stupid are you? I know they thought that this is a way of stopping it. A list of 15 songs they deemed, the most offensive music at the time. Prince, Madonna, gross. Cindy Lawpool. Oh, my God.

Disgusting. We're on there with songs lyrical content being listed as sexual. Like a virgin? I don't think it was quite... That's the opposite of sex. Yeah, true. Promote him a video. How dare you promote never having sex?

Because what it is, it was like name of song, name of artists, and reason for it being on the 15. They were sexual content. But two songs were listed because their lyrics were about the occult. Oh my God. They had English metal band Venom and their song Possessed. Oh, okay. Taken from their album. welcome to hell.

It sounds like it was about love, though, right? It's like I'm possessed with being in love. I know the song very well. Listen to me. I love beer. I got the devil in love. And I need to kiss you with my tongue. And your permission.

That's the bridge. And it was like harmonized kissing. Yeah, it was actually really impressive. I liked it. I've got a couple of lyrics here, ones that you didn't quite get to. Oh, okay. Some of the lyrics include.

Yeah, after the bridge. Yeah, after that. I drink the vomit of the priests, make love with the dying whore, Satan as my master incarnate, hell, praise to the unholy host. Now, that's a romantic song if I've heard of one. And it's two minutes, you're listening and you go, two minutes, that's too long. It's just right. When you listen to the song, it's just right.

That was one of the songs on the 15. The other one of the filthy 15 is a Danish metal band, Merciful Fate. and their song Into the Coven. Lyrics include, Come, Come, into My Coven and become Lucifer's Child. Do you know what? I don't like, there's too much come in that.

Yeah. Come, come into my coven. But... Come, yeah, nah. Too much. But I want to go to one of their shows because the band used human bones as props on stage

and blew up a nun dummy as part of the concert. I don't want to go to that show. No, I'm okay, actually. Off you go. I'm busy that night. I'm busy that night. I'm pretty funny.

I'll be to go to Tatswifting instead, I reckon. Yeah. She blows up multiple dummies. Human remains everywhere. The Taylor Swift concert. And one of the members of Merciful Fate, they later said, thank God for that list because we weren't selling that well before it. And we really, we went platinum after that.

That is wild. Yeah. What were they thinking with that list? What, yeah. This is going to deter people. No, it's not. No, this is cool. You're just telling them what music's really rad at the moment.

And then, like, rappers were like, these stickers are cool. Yeah. I mean, they should have released the list and called it. Our favourite 15. Family-friendly 15. Like Tippy's tracks. Oh. And then the extremely nerdy,

Tippy Gore on the cover just given a thumbs up. Another big fan of the flame was police and law enforcement, which makes it sound like they're fans of flames, which makes it sound like their fans of the devils. But I mean, they were fanning the flames, what that sounds like was meant. Another fan of the flame. Pirate. Police were given training and undertook seminars

That showed them how to spot satanic crimes And how to put Satanists behind bars Do you have to look for like criminals wearing little devil ears That's one sign But some of them are a little bit trickier Oh They weren't where devil is? How are you supposed to know?

Yeah, and then how do you know they're Satan? It's crazy You just got to go on vibe If you think they're Satan There might be a Satan Just arrest them Better to be safe And just arrest them

And there's a video you can watch on YouTube now called Law Enforcement Guide to Satanic Colts. And it's so ridiculous and over the top now. It's really, really funny. There's a supposed former Satanus who takes you through a park where Satanus supposedly gather and do rituals. And he talks to the, he walks the camera around some trees with symbols. And he sort of touches one and it's still wet.

And he goes, oh, this is a fresh symbol. But it's so obvious that whoever's making the film has just spray painted and upside down cross like about two minutes ago. Yeah. But they take it so seriously. It's really funny. Oh, my God. And he's got a great mull at this guy.

Really funny to watch now, but back then it was deadly serious. Police officers, some of whom were extremely Christian, were gullible and believed they were on the front line defending their communities against demons and demonic forces. You want your police force gullible. You really want a bunch of gullible guys as your cops. That's what I've always said. And also, when it comes to. to Christianity, I'm like, where's that extreme Christianity? You know, like a cool snowboarding priest.

Good. Extreme. Extreme. Well, some cops proclaim themselves as experts on Satanism and gave lectures to their fellow officers. And they also played this video like it's 100% fact. Further fanning the flames of the panic. So between the police, the media and children being encouraged to make up false memories,

there was a time when a lot of the American general public genuinely believed there was an underground satanic nationwide network that sacrificed thousands of people every year holding satanic rituals and kidnapping and assaulting their children. Jeez. I mean, I'm acting all high and mighty in this situation, but I know that there are things in the past that I've also been told by the media and gone, oh yeah, that's definitely something as well. Yeah.

You know, where something will spread and you're just like, you take it as fact until someone... Coney 2012. Coney 2012. Oh, wow. were we all swept up in getting wristbands. Yep, sticker packs. Oh, we all needed to do something. I mean, what a strange time.

Do you remember that they took an hour out of the day? The project aired a special on it. The project did a full Coney 2012 special. Absolutely amazing. And now you look back and you laugh at about it. It's the same with this, but at the time, the people, I know, it's so funny, but people like this, you get swept up in this stuff somewhere.

Absolutely. I mean, this isn't the same, but I was so sure because my friends told me, that in, I can't believe I keep bringing up Pokemon. Did in Pokemon read, if you got to, there's a truck, if you got to it and you press A, then you get Mew. And I thought that was, because so many people said it to me individually. And it's spread throughout the school. And guess what?

You get to that truck, Mew's there. No, there's no Mew. Wow. There's no nothing. What do you believe after that? Nothing. How do you get on with your life? I've never believed anything ever since.

I've lost all hope. The big story at my school was, so a lot of people took the, bus to the school and at the time it was all paper tickets, met cards, they were called. Yep. And the big story was, if you collected 1,000 met cards and took them back to the people who made them, in exchange, they would give you a free yearly ticket that you could use for an entire year worth like $1,000 or $1. That genuinely should have been a thing, though, because those tickets were expensive.

Yeah. And I feel like that's a nice recycling scheme. If you collected a thousand of them, so people were trying to collect them, but I don't know anyone who ever got it. I also think, okay, so I walked to school. So I didn't, if I had to catch the train or something. Bekin matter. I crossed 18 miles of field on foot.

No, I lived so close to my school. It was embarrassing. It was about, like, oh, there's my house. I can see it from there. One time in a geography class, we had to, like, use maps to map the route from our homes to. That's great. And everybody else needed multiple pages of the Melways. And I was like, I'm done.

I'm done. They're like, like, solving a maze with no walls. Totally. I was like, there's my house. There's this. As the crow flies, it was like 500 meters. It was so close. So I walked to school.

So if I ever needed to catch the train or a bus or anything, I would just buy a two-hour ticket or whatever. But what always blew my mind was the kids whose parents bought them a yearly ticket. I'm like, who the fuck? And I'm not somebody, I don't lose stuff. But I was like, who the fuck isn't going to lose a yearly ticket? Hello. I caught the train every day.

You got a yearly ticket? I had yearly tickets. What? I had half yearly tickets as well, which is what? were safer. Those were safer options. Still feels crazy. My family should have trusted me with a yearly ticket because I went to the bus there every day, bused back every day and I bought a daily ticket every single day rather

than the yearly, which is a lot cheaper. Yeah. But I think that my parents were like, this kid's going to lose it. Even a monthly. Like go a monthly or something. It was a daily every day. So I got, I think, five or six hundred of the tickets together because I was thinking you get the free yearly and then we worked out, oh, it's not real.

See, I think I was trusted with it because I was a massive nerd But then I was going to go, why weren't you trusted Dave? That makes no sense! But how do the cards not just fall apart? They were like paper. They were built of a better, they had plastic in it. I still have them. I'd love to see your yearly ticket.

I'm a little creep, do you on me? Would that be good in the show notes to have a picture of a yearly ticket? I might have half yearly ones. I don't know if I've still got a yearly one, but I definitely have half yearlies. That's amazing. I can't believe that. If you need any more MET cards to add to your collection to try, Try and get the thousand.

I think I do have a pile of them in a pocket in the front of my billabong backpack. Yeah. Oh, beautiful sentence. So did your parents, did they give you like cash every day? Yeah, coins every day. Wow. Because it was like, I think a dollar, when I first started high school was $1.40 for a daily. I hope, no offense.

But your parents are stupid. Yeah, your parents are dumb. That's a waste of money. And then they had to always be on top of having that cash around. And I know it was a different time and we did sort of have more cash. Yeah. But I have to go to the bank to get coins now. for my laundry.

And honestly, there's only a couple of branches that still carry cash now. I know, but this year seven was 20 years ago, Jess. Fuck off. Don't you dare. Don't you shut. Fuck your stupid little mouth. Fuck you.

No. How fucking dare you. And the thing that annoyed me the most was there was one bus driver because it'd be a different one every day. One bus driver, you get on and you know, I'd say, hi, can I have a daily ticket please? And he'd say, oh, full fare, is it?

And I'd be there standing in my school uniform going, no. You look like you're in high school now. Yeah. Imagine that. And then I'd have to say, oh no, it's a student. And he'd go, oh, okay, well, you have to say that every time. Oh, shut up.

And we do this little dance because I wasn't giving him the satisfaction. I genuinely think that he was messing with you. No, I think it was just annoyed him. You're one of those cranky old men. He would do it to every single kid. And you'd go, dude, this, you know, 40 people on this bus, 39 of them are going to high school. Yeah, shut up.

And there's one lady being driven up to the shop. So, fucking out. Just shut up and get it. And that poor lady, I pray for her, because that would have been horrific. Horrendous. It would have smelt so bad. How did we get onto this? I'm so sorry.

But also, fuck you about the 20-year thing. 20 years. Last night, I was going to sleep and I was like, oh, it was 10 years since I finished high school. But I was like, 15. It's 15, Jess. It's 15. But you can round it down. Am I, are we mid-30s yet?

Are we still early? Is this our last year of early 30s? I'm so, I don't know what you were talking about. I'm 13 years old. I still catch the bus. You still use it yearly. I've never driven. What's wine?

What's wine? What's wine? That's a good question. I'm going to answer my own question. We're in our last year of early 30s. 34 is mid. I'm happy to take that. I agree with that?

Okay, please proceed. The name of the podcast, please proceed. So I've talked about how it all happened. How did it all unwind? Well, the National Centre on Child Abuse and Neglect conducted a study led by the University of California psychologist Gail Goodman, which found that among 12,000 accusations of ritual or religious linked abuse, there was no evidence for a well-organized intergenerational satanic cult

who sexually molested and tortured children. How many accusations? 12,000? None of them true. No. Of the 12,000 reports, investigators have not been able to substantiate a single case. That is so embarrassing and annoying. There's been like every now and then there's like one or two isolated cases where someone is a Satanist and that they are an abuser.

But no big cabal of people all connected or like doing it on a mass scale. It's just an isolated one person who, you know, is a child abuser. And they also happen to have some satanic stuff in there. You do see a lot of, I feel like conspiracy theorists just like to see patterns that make sense of the world. Right. They go like, there's a pattern. It makes me feel. feel like I'm in a bit more controlled than I am.

Yeah. Of the bad things that do randomly happen that are bad. Yeah, that is, I also feel like the journalists who spread all this should feel really terrible. Yeah. So, like, I feel like probably a lot of them are still working. Yeah. Oh, awful.

In 1992, FBI agent Kenneth Lanning released an exhaustive report on the presence of satanic ritual abuse in the United States. He found that there was no evidence of. of any occult sacrifices ever happening in the US, despite the extremely widespread belief in such activities. He concluded, hundreds of communities all over America are run by mayors, police departments,

and community leaders who are practicing Satanists and who regularly murder and eat people? Not likely. However, he explained the appeal of that satanic conspiracy was easy to understand. He said, first, it's a simple explanation for a complex problem. If we do not understand something, as you're saying, Beck, we make it the work of some supernatural force.

Reports like this led to a shift in media coverage and how society viewed the panic. People started being like, oh, it's not real, and then started being like, you know, what were we thinking kind of thing. In 1995, Geraldo Rivera, who did that two hour long special, issued an apology. Oh, good.

He said, I want to announce publicly that as a firm believer of the Believe the Children movement of the 1980s that started with the McMartin trials in California, I'm now convinced that I was terribly wrong and many innocent people were convicted and went to prison as a result. Wow. Okay. That's something. I feel like also you do sometimes forget that journalists are people and they also get swept up in the things.

Exactly. And they also think the thing. That's not to say that they aren't complicit to some things and guilty of them. But it's also like, I mean, you know, therapists have a terrible time with their mental health sometimes. Yeah, absolutely. You're still people. Yeah. And you have your own implicit biases that you can't escape.

Everyone wants everything to be very objective, but especially when it comes to something like this that is so emotive. It's so easy to also want to protect people. I understand people would come from a place of wanting to do that. But oh, man, the amount of harm this caused is just... It's so much. And throughout the 90s and early 2000s, other things from popular culture were linked to Satanism,

but in a less widespread alarmist way, like the video game, Doom. Oh, it's so spooky. Musician Marilyn Manson. Oh, yep. No, while he is spooking in a real way, he's not good. And even Pokemon, which was accused of opening up players to the demonic realm. I mean, that's, I do go there. When I crank up that theme song, that truck you were talking about, that truck,

that's Satan's basement. I'm just, that music, pallet-town music, is that one on it? Yeah, yeah. Be-de-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. So I see Satan. Yeah, Satan. That's Satan. That's the music of Satan.

And now it's easy to look back and think, what the hell were they thinking? But if we think that we're fully past this sort of stuff, well, Arsra Romano, again, for Vox in 2021, wrote, perhaps the most common misunderstanding about the satanic panic, the societal fear of the occult that troubled the US and other parts of the world throughout the 80s and early 90s, is that it ever ended.

Because these sorts of whack conspiracy ideas are alive and well, or be it in slightly other forms like PizzaGate and QAnon. Yeah. Speaking of very quickly to talk about those in March 2016, the personal email account of John Podesta, who was Hillary Clinton's campaign share, was hacked. WikiLeaks published his emails in November 2016, and proponents of the Pizza Gate conspiracy theory

falsely claimed the emails contained coded messages that connected several high-ranking Democratic Party officials and US restaurants with an alleged human trafficking and child sex ring. One of the establishments allegedly involved was the Comet ping pong pizzeria in Washington, D.C. And yeah, people were thinking that that was involved, that they had some sort of basement where they were doing horrific stuff, and then they were like, this place has no basement. Yeah, it was terrible.

Or a pizza shop. I'm pretty sure people were really, like, some people were hurt. I can't remember exactly. I think that maybe someone pulled a gun or something in the pizza shop. Yeah. then came Q&ON, which the Anti-Defamation League describes as thus. And we can do a whole report on Q&ON, because it's ongoing and absolutely wild. But Q&ON is a decentralized far-right political movement, rooted in a baseless conspiracy theory

that former President Donald Trump is waging a secret war against the so-called deep state, a cabal of Satan-worshipping pedophiles who control the world and run a global child-sex trafficking ring, murdering children in ritual satanic sacrifices, in order to harvest a supposedly life-extextinct. sending chemical from their blood known as adrenachrome. They believe only Trump can defeat the cabal.

Only Trump. Only Trump. Only Trump. If I looked at anyone in the world, yeah, a man who just realized the other week, he was like,

hmm, US, that means, you know, that's us. That's so funny. I think he did that. Has anyone else ever thought of that? Has anyone else ever realized this before?

And you think he can defeat what was this I don't I'm okay he can defeat the big boss only Trump can do it and that was in 2017 I don't think there's anything

anything in the world that only Trump can do hang on a second he might be very good at doing backflips I bet somebody else would be better that's true we haven't seen him do it that's true we haven't seen him do backflips do you know what let's wait for evidence

on his backflipers yeah you're right here I am just throwing out baseless skills I'll wait for the evidence. Yeah. Yeah, so that's the modern world. And so people still believe weird, wild shit. Wow.

It's almost as if that banned things happen and then people get scared and they want to find reason in it. And then they themselves put the devil in the world by being kind of terrible. Yeah. Like, it is interesting that the Satanist, I mean, from the beginning, it sounds like we were talking about that guy so long ago who just had snakes and a cape and said everyone should enjoy things. It's really harming anyone from what I found. It doesn't sound like it.

And then you've gone on to this where you have leagues of people just causing witch hunts against people and destroying lives. And I feel like that's the devil right there. If you, you know, not in energy sense, in vibe sense, they're themselves being the Satan they want to see in the world. Holy shit. Beck, that's deep stuff. That's good.

Thank you. Deep state stuff. I'm going to put it on a pillow. Yeah. Be the Satan you want to see in the world. I agree. And they just have some truly insane stuff like they think they believe in a thing called dog code, which is tweets from various celebrities and politicians about the deaths of their dogs are secret messages about members of the deep state being arrested or executed.

I thought it was that dog on TikTok that presses the buttons. Bunny? Bunny. Hungry. Hungry. Feed now. That actually... Where, Dad, that is also a conspiracy thing.

And if you buy buttons for your dog, it's not... Unless it's out, next to the door, that makes sense. Yeah. Because my dog scratches on the door, that means out, right? Yes, that's...

We've got that button in our house too. Understandable. That one is fine. I've got the button. The dog does not like the button. No. He doesn't like the sound it makes. It scares him.

It has like a doorbell kind of sound. It's really loud. He does not like it. I changed it to my voice going outside. he does not like the bun. I put the bun down to the ground. He's like, I'm scared of the door now. Anyway, my dog's an idiot.

Our dog paws at the door to be let out. And there's a dog door that he's never used that we... Installed at great expense. Okay, you're dog's an idiot. You know what? All this evidence? I don't think dogs can talk. But the sounds of it might be that if they haven't worked out dog doors yet,

which are dog, they're doors for dogs. Door for dog. Door for dog. You are dog. You are dog-go-in dog. He scratches at the door and we're like, I think that was some sort of dog door you could use. Well, I guess I'll open up this sliding door for you.

That is my report on the satanic panic. Wow. A wild time not that long ago. I knew nothing of that. That was absolutely wild and horrific and fascinating. It's one of those things, fascinating. Not our funniest of topics. No.

And so thanks, Beck, for coming in a... Yeah, they bring in a bit of lights. Yeah. Appreciate you. I mean, that's all very sad. And it's... And it is sad when you... you look at something like this and just see history repeating in different ways.

Totally, yep. That's the other part. The thing you would hope is that we would learn from it, but it doesn't feel like we often do. No, we never learn. Something a little bit lighter. Is that why they call that hair dye Manic Panic? Probably not.

Probably just because I'm going to say yes. What colors are Manic Panic? A range of different colors. I was going to say at the start when you said Satanic Panic, I was going to go, oh, I love that hair dye. And then I'm happy I didn't because it was a very serious topic. And we didn't get it anyway.

It's a brand. Dave doesn't buy his hair. It doesn't buy his hair. He doesn't buy his hair. You can't buy that color. You can't buy that color. That's Dave's, Dave's own beautiful brand. You can't buy perfection.

Exactly. People have tried. They have tried. Well, thank you for letting me be part of the filthy three on this beautiful day. That makes me want us even more. Ooh, sexy. The second most requested topic, there it is. Yeah.

Back, we appreciate you coming on. If people want to find you online, see you, hear you, follow you. Where should we go? I am spreading the word of Satan. Nice. But the good word. The good stuff. Yeah, the one way it's just like, enjoy yourself.

Exactly. None of the underground tunnel stuff. No, no, no. No, no of that. No, no of that. Wait a second. Wait a second. Let's not rule out hot air balloons.

I'm on Beckness everywhere, especially Twitch, where I stream a lot, mostly doing very silly things the other day I put lipstick on a jack-a-lantern and I did feel like I was having a breakdown but it was... That was the one that made you feel like you're having a breakdown. Yeah, that was the one. I was like...

Not buying an inflatable pool and setting it up in your grandma's backyard. And go around in circles in a boat. No, no, I felt fine. It was just, I couldn't work out whether a jack-a-lantern should have a cupid's bow for lipstick. Oh, yeah.

That was tough. Anyway, come watch me Do weird shit on Twitch Love it, thank you so much Thank you Well, that brings us to everyone's favourite section of the show Where we get to spend a little bit of time Just, oh, laping up

Oh, basking Basking in the sunshine and beautiful warm glow Of our wonderful Patreon supporters So we have a few sections here and the first thing we like to do is a little section called the fact-quotal question has a little jingle that goes something like this

fact-quotal question I always remember the sing he always remembers the ding and this is for people on the Sydney-Shimeberg deluxe memorial package yes we got loads of levels don't we when you can get

us personally as people yeah yeah and I'm very I'm very shallow you're a basic bitch yes absolutely as shallow as they come. But if you want to join in a... You're a puddle. And I'm an ocean.

I'm a bit of pissed than stride. That's a pond. I'm an ocean. Okay. Now you know, hierarchy. But the Patreon levels, you can sign up. We've got about four different levels. And at different levels, you get different things like we give you a shout out.

Yeah. You can vote for topics. You get pre-sale tickets and discount tickets to all the live shows. Three bonus episodes a month when very close to our goal of, um, a fourth bonus episode, which is basically one every week, and that will be a Dungeons and Dragons campaign, and there's 190 episodes plus in the back catalog that you unlock instantly, as soon as you join at that level, plus the fact quota question, Jess.

Yeah, so this, yeah, for the Sydney-Sharmberg Deluxe package, you get to give yourself a title, you get to ask a question, give us a fact, a quote, a suggestion, a brag, it can be anything you want it to be. Exactly. I'm getting really emotional. I'm thinking about all the different levels. All the different facts.

I'm thinking about you being a puddle of piss. That's mostly dry. I'm mostly dry, but still there's a little bit of a state. Should I read the fact code or questions this week? Good luck. Yeah, yeah, please. That would be great. What's that supposed to mean?

Oh, I don't know. Okay. Don't know if you're up to it, mate. I don't know either. Yeah, we're about to find out. So basically, Matt usually does this section. Yeah. And he always says he doesn't read until he reads it.

And we haven't read ahead either. God, no, I would never. So our first factual question comes from William Hofstadter. And Williams giving themselves the title, which is good. Good delivery. Thank you. And Williams is asking a question. The question is, what is your favorite time of year?

For example, season or month? And where would it be the best place to enjoy it? My favorite is spring when it first starts getting warm again and the plants are all fresh, green and blooming. This is particularly start. during the first sunny days after a long winter of Chicago. Love that you've answered your own question. We love when people do that. Great one, William.

Favorite time of year? I think for me it would be in Melbourne, January. When there's less stuff going on because people aren't at working. And I live not that far from the ocean. And I love walking down there and being able to have a small paddle on maybe New Year's day or January the second if the sun is out. have no real responsibilities and everyone's sort of got this carefree attitude.

Yeah. The vibe is good around, yeah. Yeah, so I love it for that reason. And also the first couple of weeks of the Melbourne Comedy Festival, which is often before the weather sort of turns completely towards, you know, cold. Cold, like, because we're on the way to winter by the time it gets to late April. But that first week of Comedy Festival, which is late March, you can have, and before the clock's changed. Yeah.

you can have some warm nights where people are out and about doing stuff. That's nice. And it's also another great vibe in the atmosphere. Yeah, absolutely. I would love to have something different to say, but I'm fully with you. Because like spring and autumn are really nice seasons, particularly in Melbourne. Autumn was lovely this year in that we had like really, it'd be sort of cool crisp for mornings, but then the sun would come out in the afternoon and it was just beautiful.

It wasn't particularly cold. But I'm like busy and I'm working hard and I don't really get to enjoy. the weather. Summer can be too hot at times, but... Yes, definitely. You're right, the vibe is different. I like being a bit more carefree. I'm on summer holidays. We take, you know, we take a little time off work and you can go to the beach. You can go enjoy the sunshine or just chill out at home where it's nice and cool or go, like swim in a pool or something. Yeah. And the energy is different. You're right. Melbourne in January, the first couple weeks of January, when most people have like, not everybody, of course,

but like a lot of people take some time off. Yeah, I think it's... There's enough that it changes the vibe. Yeah. It's the roads are a bit quieter. Yeah. Beaches are busier. Yeah, you get, I don't know, fishing chips on the beach and, you know, 7.30 and it's still

T-shirt weather. Yeah. I love that. And it's still daylight and it rules. And I love late daylight. If I could have it to go to be dark at 9pm every night, I would. Me too. I like it.

It makes me feel like I can do more in the day. Yeah, because I'm not a modern person, so I'm never getting those first couple of hours anyway. Nah. And then by the time we both finish work, it's nice. Actually, when it's light later, we tend to do more like evening walks with the dog and take him to the park and stuff. And it's just nice little family time, which is cute and wholesome.

Thank you, William. I didn't expect such a beautiful question to really set us off on a nice little tangent there. That was wholesome. I loved it. Our next fact, where a question comes from Madeline Murray Baker. Oh, MNB. Everything about that works.

Unless you're Madeline, Marry Baker. Still good. I'm just saying I wanted to make sure because I know like... You weren't like... And then if it is, Madeline, terrible. It sucks. No, I just, you know, if you're a Madeline or a Madeline, you get annoyed when people say your name the other way.

So I just wanted to cover all bases there. Good one. And Madeline, Madeline has given themselves the title of Vice Chairman of Chairs for Men, a charitable organisation. That's good. Vice Chairman of Chairs for Men. Love that. Madeline's also got a question.

and Madeline asks, hang let me scootch on over so I can see it a bit better. With Kishmish fast approaching, I'd love to know, what's the weirdest gift you've ever received? Madeline's answered the own question as well. Do you want to hear? Yes, please.

One year I got a bent picture frame and a votive candle holder from my sister-in-law. The candle holder was pretty, but I had just seen it in their bathroom a week before. And here I was, being good all year for this,

Never again. They re-gifted it. That you've been gifted that one or they've gone, this is so nice. We'll find where it's, you know, where it's from if it was a gift for us or we'll remember where it's from. Bye for you. I reckon it's a re-gift.

Bent picture frame and a re-gift candle. That's pretty... Candle holder. Not even a candle. I've got to tell you. That's not that great. That's not that good. I can't think of the weird gifts.

What about you guys do? Your family and do some fun. Every year there's a bit of a challenge set. Yes. Yeah. particularly my brother and sister-in-law live into state now so they can't always make it back for Christmas but because they're the best at it and they bring the necessary energy you need kids to outnumber parents I think um for it to work because my dad as much as we love him no whimsy

not a whimsical person and this is a game that relies on whimsy yes and so essentially the challenges differed every year. But usually it's some sort of like you have like an overall limit you have to spend. So like you got to buy five presents, but you can only spend a total of 50 bucks. So you got to find something for $10. Some years we've had it that you have to get everything in one go one shop. So you can't, you're not shopping around. You just go to one place by something for everybody. Other times it's been everybody gets the exact same thing. So that's fun. So that year I gave everybody notebooks that I had monogram. It was from like typo and you could monogram it for free

but they would all say variations are like Jess is the best. Somebody got Jess best. Aiden got J.P. Queen. They were all just about how great I am. And that year Aiden gave everybody a mug with his face on it. And this was like maybe his first or second year participating in the game. Good work, Aiden. In the game and he's given everybody.

But if you think about it, it's three couples essentially. So two households have two. With Aiden Mugs. With Aidan's face. It's not a good picture either. Have you ever been to either household and seen them like? I have not seen the mug again. Never been used?

I don't know where the mugs are. I'm going to check with mum if she still has those mugs somewhere. We didn't think he was going to stick around. We threw them out the very next day. That's great. What about you? Any weird gifts? I don't want to disappoint, but I can't think of any fun, weird gifts.

Yeah, it's tough, isn't it? You don't get as many gifts as an adult? Or it tends to be people go, tell me what you want. They get you something practical. Get a lot of vouchers, which I don't mind. Yeah. My dad often gets like sort of those light up Christmas toys.

Oh, yeah. That you like press a button on it like, you know, like wrapping Santa Claus. I remember that. Yeah, classic. Ho, ho, my name is Santa Claus. This is my flow, stuff like that. And then it was like, and then it did the Christmas version of getting jigger with it, the Will Smith track.

Poor boy. It's pretty awesome. Yeah, that rules. Once there was a farting reindeer. Classic. Yeah, so that's the level one. That's sort of fun stuff. Yeah.

Yeah, I mean, I quite like just making Christmas presents something a bit fun or a bit silly. But then it feels a bit wasteful. Yeah, yeah, there's a fine line, isn't it? Like, so a notebook sounds good because that's funny with your stuff on it, but that's pretty useful. Yeah, Aidan uses it. But one year, my brother gave us all inflatable dinosaur costumes. So you had to, like, it was the type of one where it looked like, you were a little jockey riding a dinosaur.

Oh, that's good. Did you all put him on and take a photo? 100% we did, yeah. See, that's fun. That's fun. You can't take that memory away. And he included batteries, so we could all get straight into our dinosaur costume.

So that was really thoughtful. My brother is the best at it. Can I ask what the batteries do? It had a little fan that kept it sort of inflated. Okay. Because it's open, so it had to have a little fan in it. Yeah, my brother wins every year. He's a freak at it.

Has the same been set this year? No, because the last couple of years they haven't been able to get back to Victoria for Christmas. So if they're not involved, what do you and Aiden and your parents do? Is it like a free-for-all? Actually, we still did it last year, but we increased the price a little bit because we weren't buying for five people, you're only buying for three. Yeah, okay, yep.

And so my mum got me a porcelain, like, paint your own kit for kids of the characters from Frozen, which was fun. And without discussing it, Aidan had... given me Frozen 2 on DVD. And I don't know why. Do you love Frozen? No. I've never heard you talk about Frozen in your life.

As it turns out, Aiden had given me that because he, he for ages wouldn't watch the movie Frozen. Okay. And eventually my friend and I bullied him into it and he was like, oh, yeah, it's pretty funny. So I said, now we can watch Frozen 2. He said, I will never watch Frozen 2. So he gave me the DVD as like a piece offering of I will watch Frozen 2. but my mum had heard me talking about

my friend and I wanting to watch the enchanted sequel and then the next day she saw this frozen toy and was like oh that's the movie just likes

and I'm like nah that is a wrong one that's so good because when you're a teenager you'd be so annoyed at that mom it's the wrong one

I was like hell yeah when you're 30's like this is hilarious so good that's so funny I got the Auntie Donna

Christmas book there's always room for Pud. Oh, great, yeah. And Aiden got a remote control dinosaur from my mum. And she was like, are you sure? Because I was shopping with her.

She was like, are you sure that he won't think it's offensive and I'm getting him a toy? I was like, he will fucking love it. And he lost his mind. He was playing with these remote controlled dinosaur all night. We're in our 30s. Anyway, so who knows what will happen this year? Who knows? Thank you for that.

Again, another question that really set us off on a little tangent. Yeah, yeah. Sorry, we loved it. We loved it. Thank you so much. Next up we have Ben Johnson Ben Johnson's giving themselves a title and it's a Google Maps link

Oh my gosh If it's where we are right now I'd be really freaky No it is for Ben Johnson Primary School Where's that Harford Street in London Ben Johnson

You got your own primary school You got your own primary school Congratulations It's good I've just looked it up It's got a 4.5 rating on Google Wow Not bad at all

Bloody bad One of the second reviews loads of people should go to this fabulous school. That's great. How many stars reckon this one is? My sister used to go to this primary school. It's amazing. Four stars.

Wow. For amazing. Yeah. It's always room for improvement. Ben has given us a fact. And, oh, it's a long one. Let's see how we go. Did you know Stephen Hawking wrote five children's books?

Here we go. Yes. In addition to his many books for adults, Hawking wrote several children's books in collaboration with his daughter Lucy that combine science and adventure. These books all focus on a young boy named George, who learns while travelling around the universe. The first book, George's secret key to the universe,

explains scientific concepts like black holes in kids' terms and was so well received, they followed it up with four sequels. I actually think I need that. Sometimes I need things really dumb down for me. Yeah, really spell it out, Stephen. In the most recent one, George in the Blue Moon, he enters a Mars training program, according to Hawking's own description,

George is fighting for survival in what feels like the Hunger Games set on the red planet, red carpet. On the red carpet? Imagine that. I'm so sorry.

You're so glamorous, you can't, you see red carpets everywhere. I see red carpets. It's just, I see red, I think carpet. This one comes with a little note

asking Matt to read this in a snarky but also joky tone, so I'm going to try and nail that. Okay. Hey, Dave, is one of these good enough for your little

book podcast. Well, it sounds like you've given it a great summary already, Ben. Thank you guys. Keep up the good work and happy block. P.S. Dave, sorry for the little book podcast. Bit, just a joke and I have huge respect for you. And book cheat, please feel no real pressure to read anything. Anything ever, Dave. Well, I've given up reading because of you, Ben. So I hope you're happy. No, I appreciate that. Thank you. I had no idea that he'd written children's books. The man did it at all. God, so busy. Really fit a lot in. Have we done a, Stephen Knox? We haven't done a report on it. Haven't we?

Be a great person to a report on. I would have probably said yes. It feels like a life that we would definitely do a report on. There's a few really big people from the 20th century that we haven't done a report on. Yeah, we'll get there. We've never done Nelson Mandela. Wow. Yeah, okay.

Martin Luther King, Jr. Haven't done it. Senior, still haven't done them. Wow. And finally, God, we have really rambled with this on apologies. Roy Phillips. who's given themselves the title, seashell, seasore seller.

Well done. This is going to hurt. Roy's given us a fact. And the fact is, this tongue twister is possibly inspired by a woman named Mary Anning, who spent her time gathering seashells from beaches to sell to tourists.

Oh, yes. Oh, good. I thought this was going to be a really hard tongue twister, but it's just the backstory on she sells seashells. Oh, right. Maybe that's why I've heard of her. Yes. In 1811, her brother found a skull

in a seaside cliff and ran to tell her. Fascinated, Mary Anning dug until she uncovered the fossilized skeleton of an animal she initially believed to be a giant crocodile. This crocodile was later revealed to be the aquatic species of dinosaur. Oh, I don't know what that is. Oh, sorry, do you want me to look at? I think I nailed it.

That sounds good. Mary went on to hunt for more fossils and later discovered skeletons for plesiosaurus, for plesosaurus, Lochness Monster, pterodactyl and others. Today, modern scientists credit Mary Anning with the foundation of modern paleontology. There you go. And we have this silly little tongue twister about her getting seashells.

Wow. Way to really downplay a woman's achievement. Yeah, she does a lot more than sell seashells by the seashore. She discovers paleontology. Yeah. Okay, she rules. By the seashore. By the seashore.

How dare you? That's really cool. Thank you, Roy. I loved that so much. We haven't done Mary Annie. either. No. Put it in the list.

Thank you to Roy Ben, Madeline and William. And now, Dave, the next thing we love to do. Ah, yes. We love to shout out a few more of our favorite Patreon supporters.

Basically, we usually come up with a game to thank them. Yeah. Maybe we could, I mean, usually you come up with the game. No, but I'd love a suggestion because this was a pretty grim topic. Satanic panic.

Maybe we could talk about what they're panicked by. Oh, love. that. And then, you know, make it a bit more fun. Yeah, cool. Than like the satanic cabal. Yeah, great. Love that.

It's fun to panic over small, trivial things. Yeah, that's right. And not huge, big, scary stuff with massive consequences. Exactly, ruin people's lives forever. Do you want me to kick off this one? Yeah, go on. I would love to thank, first of all, from Franklin, Indiana. Beautiful place.

I would like to thank Eric Lovens. Supermarkets. Just gets really flustered, panicked. Oh, my God, there's too many oils. It's not at all based on the Perkins. person I live with. Just getting really flustered in the supermarket. Oh, my God, but this, do I want a truss or a Roma tomato?

Oh, my God, they look similar, but I don't know. Price is comparable. Oh, but this one, I'm paying for STEM. Eric, it's going to be fun. We get it, we get it. We get it. We're going to be fun. Do you want to go one for one?

Okay, one for one. I would love to think. Marlouimano. Medford, Massachusetts. Medford. Kirsten Brown. Kirsten Brown panicked by tennis. Oh, yes, very stressful sport.

The tennis panic. Yep, as in watching it, playing it. Both. Yeah, both. Just a real... Freaked out. It doesn't really understand the rules. You know, there's the doubles lines going down.

It's like, oh, why is that? It's considered out. It's still on the court. There's a line there panicking. The umpire seems to be scoring in French. There's a 15, then a 30, then a 40. What is going on? What are these points worse?

Some of these players are grunting after they've hit the ball? How could that possibly help you hit any harder? Very overwhelming. Like that ball, kids falling over. Yeah. We understand, Kirsten. The crowd laughing at jokes that are pretty bad, to be honest. Yeah.

It's all a lot. It's a lot. It's overwhelming. The tennis panic. I would like to think from Los Angeles, California, the city of angels. And dwelling there is Jacob Papineck. Roller coasters. Oh.

And I know, you know, some people enjoy the rush. Some people find them a bit too scary or, you know, upset your stomach or whatever. But for Jacob, it's just a. full-on panic at the mere side of them, which is terrible living in L.A., home of a few theme parks. Yeah, oh my gosh, you'd be terrified. He's got to really make sure he's gone on a different route to work and stuff. Oh, there it is. Oh, my gosh, there's Splush Mountain.

Blop, blah, blah. So, yeah, that's Jacob. Real panicking about roller coasters. Just between you and us, mate. Obviously, we can't read it out because it will ruin your life, but your email is incredible. Oh, yeah, that's very good. Well done, sir.

We will ruin your life. Exactly. We will not docks you. Everyone will email you and say, great email, but we're not going to read it out. There's another great email up next, actually, as well. I love it too. Which I can't wait to read out in full. No, I won't.

But from Thornton, New South Wales, Justin White. Justin White. Panicked about. Oh, sorry, you're pointing to me. I thought you were like leaning over. Panicked about indoor plants. Oh, yes. And obviously, we're going through a period where there's a lot of them.

People love them. of indoor plants as a kid? I just thought about it, no. No. No, not at all. No. Actually, no, maybe we had one, like, in the corner of, there was like a little, I guess, a plant holder with one sad looking plant in it sometimes.

But nothing like there is now, no. Isn't that wild? But do you think it's because, like, we had backyards and my family homes? Now people live in tiny apartments and... I don't have a backyard. I've got a pretty small balcony, and the only space on that balcony is taken up by a little patch of grass for my dog to piss and shit on. So the plants have to come inside. That's glamorous.

It is glamorous. It's lovely to go out there in your morning, have a cup of coffee while the dog takes a shit. It's really nice. Very holes. It's a really busy road, too, so it's very loud. Perfect. Perfect balcony. It's nice except for Justin White, who finds it very overwhelming, to come inside from the balcony, be surrounded by those plants.

Oh, my God. And Justin, we keep telling you, keep telling you, mate, get rid of the indoor plants. You don't have to have them. Yeah, but you have to pick them up. You don't have to get touched them to do that. Get somebody to help you. Wear gloves. Wear gloves.

Back over to you, Dave. I would like to think from location unknown, but this person doesn't need an address. I imagine they live in a car. It's David Coupe. Imagine they live in a car. In a cool way. In a cool, in a coupe. In like a sick car.

That's one of the best names I've heard in a long time. David Coupey, because it rhymes with David Suchet. I was going to say, it reminds you of David Suu Shea, that's why. Oh, Coupé. But David Coupé is obviously, finds themselves panic-stricken by lip balm. Oh, no, doesn't like the feeling. And unfortunately, has quite dry lips. Can't help themselves.

Drinking a ton of water trying to hydrate from within. But unfortunately, it's gotten to a point where you are going to need some sort of ointment help. Oh no, you're going to have to hydrate from... You're going to need a balm. From outside. You're going to need some outdoor help. You need a humectant.

What's that? I don't know, some of it hydrates or like it absorbs water, absorbs moisture. On your David Coupe. On your David Coupe. I love it. I would also like to thank from Surbiton in probably Surrey in Great Britain. Sorry. Samantha Fletcher.

Samantha Fletcher. Samantha Fletcher is afraid of joysticks. Oh shit. Which in the 90s was an image. Do you feel like you saw more joysticks in the 90s? Yeah. Yeah. No, that's creepy because I was a child.

Based on the joke I was trying to make. Yeah, but it's a funny joke if you don't think about it. I feel like, but you used to go to people's houses maybe and they're like, you know, especially there's a couple of friends whose dads were like computer people and you go around and they had like games with joysticks and stuff. Did we have the same family friends? You know what I'm talking about? Yes.

They have like flight simulators or helicopter simulators or something. And there's always joysticks. I haven't seen a joystick in, what, 20 years. No, but I would go over to Pat Yee's house and there were joysticks everywhere. That was my favorite family friend to visit because they had all the, well, obviously I had all the joysticks. They had a lot of video games. I didn't have any video game consoles, so I got to play PlayStation. And but also because I got along really well with the kids.

And Pat Yee. Pat Yee. Do you mind if I Pat Yee? No worries Yes I just Scruffle my hair No worries Pat Yee, it's so good

He used to make us Every time I stayed over there He'd make pancakes in the morning Off and chock chip And he would make them in like The letters of our first names So I'd always get a J pancake That's great

Loved the Yee household Shout out to the Yeas I love you Big Yee love Is it you or me What are we up to? It's my turn Okay great

To read out the name And you two are sign a panic I think from Jasper Indiana Brian Olive Oh it's actually it's the cruelest irony No no He's just afraid of Brian's

We're gonna do that too You started to figure out what I was going to say Pivoted and then you pivoted back to Olive And it was funny Brian Oh no Brian Oh Brian Oh Queen Brian mate

And every time he's at the doctor's office Someone's like Brian Oh, that's me. You've really got to change your name, mate. I don't see it getting any better anytime soon. I think change your name to something you feel more comfortable with and seek out some therapy, I reckon, on that one. Bit for a long.

I've got to put both Brian Olive and David Coupey on a list of, like, characters' names. So good. It's so good. But if you wrote a play and the character's name was Brian Olive, people would be like, this is crazy. Well, someone said, I'm David Coupey. Incredible. You'd be like, come on. man.

That couldn't possibly be a real name. And these are real names of real people. Do you love us? Remember a couple episodes ago where I wanted to rebrand as David Zest? Yes. Yes. That's good stuff. It has not caught on.

It has not. But I could be David Coupe. You could be David Coupey. I believe that more than Zest, I think. Okay, couple more. I would love to thank from Deep within the Fortress of the Moles. Location Unknown. S.J.

S. Okay, SJ is having a panic about seashells. Oh, no, where have they been found? On the seashore? Yes, that's where I got that? I was thinking, where did that come from? Yeah, that's where it is. Yeah, so SJ avoids the beach or...

Which is fine, because they're in the fortress of them. Or is there a long way from the surface. Long way. You're not going to find many shells down there, man. No. So that's probably good, actually, then isn't it? Yeah, kind of like, oh, I'm really, really scared of Zipzorps. It's like, well, they're not on this planet.

So far. It's a seat saw. It's a zeep so. It's on a different planet. Do you know one of my pleasures in life? And I don't know if this is actually a bad thing to do. I like walking on the beach and crushing up shells. You're a psycho. Is that bad?

Yeah. I don't think anything's living in them. How do you know? Because they're like just washed up on the beach. And now they can't live in them. But that's how sand is made anyway. You're an absolute dog. You don't need to help sand.

Are you wearing shoes or are you barefoot? No shoes. So it goes crunch, crunch, crunch, crunch. So you're wearing. She's wearing shoes on the beach. That's a problem too for me. Oh, really? Even what about when it's like cold?

Like I go for a winter walk. You're not going to go barefoot then. No, but you got to like, and you obviously go down to like the hard sand right on the... Yeah, yeah. Where it's crunch. I just love going crunch, crunch, crunch, crunch. And you also like crushing snails? No, see, but I feel bad because something's living in there.

But is something living in the shells? Sometimes. You don't know. You're not checking every time. Okay, I'll stop doing it, but it's so fun. And never tell me about your pleasures ever again. I love crunching leaves. I will crush them for you.

I love crunching leaves. Oh, please, can you crush some leaves? I love crunching leaves as well during autumn. Yeah, that's nice. Crunch, crunch, crunch. Okay, anyway, I'd like to thank finally from... Crunch, crunch, crunch. From Salinas in California, it's Anthony or Antony.

That's an Anthony. It's got the H in there, babe. That's an Anthony. That doesn't always make... I mean, it's Antony. What about... Mark Anthony. How do you spell that?

I don't think that's with the H. Fuck, don't let a beep with the H, please. It's without the H. There you go. That's Anthony. But I think... Some people with the age pronounce it Anthony. I reckon this is Anthony.

Okay. According to euglish.com. You've got to be right, don't you? Which is... It sounds like it's uglish.com. I've Googled Anthony pronounced. And Euglish says, has listed 6,822 pronunciations of Anthony

or Anthony in American English. 6,000. That's too many. That can't possibly be right. How could that be right? Even if you're putting a different emphasis on each letter, it's still, there's not that many options. No. Incredible.

Anyway, so we think you're Anthony. We think you're great. You're from Salinas. And you're panicked by buttons. That's a nightmare. Yeah. Because they're everywhere. They are everywhere.

On shirts? Yeah, you couldn't really wear shirts. Yeah. Elevator buttons. Computers. Now, these days, you get a new car, the push start. Yeah. Matt Hatchett.

drive by car recently took him 10 minutes to figure out how to turn it on. Was he yelling? On. On. But then he was like maybe it's voice recognition. I better do Jess's voice. I'm on. Anthony, afraid of buttons. Not afraid, but panicked by. So living in a constant state of final flight, basically, still has to work, but he's in, but he's very stressed, typing away, going, ah, this hurts. This hurts. It's not good. So a big thank you to Anthony, S.J. Brian, Samantha, David Coupé, Justin, Jacob, Kirsten and Eric. I don't even remember. Eric we talked for so long. Thank you so much, you absolute legends. Last thing we need to do, and there's only one person to welcome us, to welcome into the Triptitch Club this week.

And the Tritage Club is for people who have supported us on the shoutout level of above for three consecutive years. You get welcomed into the club. I'm behind the bar. And look, I can't make any fun sort of puns based on Based on this week's It's a Satan drink It's red Something dark and It's red

Yeah It's essentially a French martini It's just got shambored in or something Nice Nice And I put little devil ears on everything And I'm wearing a little devil costume But a sexy one

But not too sexy Just the right amount You're not uncomfortable But you are like a wuga Oh my God Jess is a smoking hottie, that kind of thing, but not like, not objectifying me. No what I mean? Yeah, no, thank you.

Perfect. And you also, I book a band. You book a band today. Every week and you're never going to believe it. What? I can't believe that I was able to lock in this huge artist. What have you done? I've locked in the Prince of Darkness themselves.

What? Ozzy Osbourne. No. And family live, it's the Osbournes. Sharon! Sharon! Jack! I hope they play my favourite song.

Shara! Shut! Wow. So the Osborn's life, Kelly, she can do Papa Don't Preach. Yeah, which took me way too long to realise it was a cover. Yeah, it's a bit of madge. It's a bit of Madge. Yeah, great.

Okay, cool. I've always wanted to see Papa Don't Preach live. There you go, and then Ozzy Osbourne. Can eat a bat or something. What about, I said that he was on the Rivera show when he's like, I never wanted to freak people out. It's like, you bit the head off a bat, man. Yeah, that was psycho.

That was a disson. disgusting thing to do. Even if you thought it was fake, but thought people of the audience might think it's real. It's a full-on thing to do. Yeah. Anyway, so we have one person to welcome in. Dave, you hype them up.

I hype you up. Are you ready? This is a done deal. It's one person. She can't be that hard. One and done. Easy peasy. Here we go. From Saskatoon.

Is that in Canada? In Canada. It's Jacqueline Chaiton. More like Jacqueline Riton. Boom, boom, boom! Could be Shaiton. More like right on. Right on.

Yeah, no, the puns still works, but I'm just making sure that Jacqueline feels sorry. Included, loved, appreciated. Because you're an absolute legend. Thank you so much for supporting us. We appreciate you. And if, yep, and yeah. Yeah.

It's the end of a late night. I'm struggling now. Hey, no, thank you so much for everyone who supports us. on Patreon and you can go to patreon.com slash dogoonpod to get those rewards, there's different tiers and support the show, help us keep going. And that's basically it. We've got to tell you that, you know, we've got a website, dogoonpod.com. Yep. You can find us on socials as well at dogo on pod across all social media. I think it's dogo on podcast on TikTok. And you can anybody can. You don't have to be a Patreon supporter. So there's a link in our show notes and also

on that website, dogoonpod.com. Hey, we'll be back next week with the final installment of Blockbuster Tover slash November 2020, the biggest topic of the year. And guess what? Our main man, Matt Stewart, will be back. I've missed him. I've missed his warm embrace. Exactly.

His dulcet tones. Oh my gosh. He's odour. I feel like I can smell him right now. Sorry, odour has negative connotations, doesn't it? Odour is bad. A musk. He's musk.

That's much nicer. So we'll be back next week. But until then, I'll say thank you so much for listening and goodbye. Bye. Don't forget to sign up to our tour mailing list so we know where in the world you are and we can come and tell you when we're coming there. Wherever we go, we always hear six months later, oh, you should come to Manchester.

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