Do Go On - 488 - The Tichborne Case

Episode Date: February 26, 2025

In the mid 1800s, a young heir tragically disappeared at sea. But then, miraculously, he turned up in regional Australia! (But he no longer had a French accent... or spoke any French... and he looked a bit different)This is a comedy/history podcast, the report begins at approximately 07.29 (though as always, we go off on tangents throughout the report).For all our important links: https://linktr.ee/dogoonpod Check out our other podcasts:Book Cheat: https://play.acast.com/s/book-cheatPrime Mates: https://play.acast.com/s/prime-mates/Listen Now: https://play.acast.com/s/listen-now/Who Knew It with Matt Stewart: https://play.acast.com/s/who-knew-it-with-matt-stewart/Our awesome theme song by Evan Munro-Smith and logo by Peader ThomasDo Go On acknowledges the traditional owners of the land we record on, the Wurundjeri people, in the Kulin nation. We pay our respects to elders, past and present. REFERENCES AND FURTHER READING:https://www.sl.nsw.gov.au/stories/tichborne-case-victorian-melodramahttps://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tichborne_casehttps://www.cantab.net/users/michael.behrend/repubs/cornhill_tichborne/pages/index.htmlThe Tichborne Claimant: A Victorian Mystery, 1957McWilliam, Rohan (2007). The Tichborne Claimant: A Victorian Sensation. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hello, it's just Matt checking in quickly before we start this episode in the year 2025 to let you know that me and Dave Individually are coming to Adelaide for the Adelaide Fringe. Dave is doing his show Dave Warnocki dates the entire audience I'm doing my show bad boy. We're also both doing our podcast I'm doing a who knew what Matt should Dave is doing a book cheat all these shows are at the Rhino room apart from Dave's Book cheat that is at a separate venue For the writers festival, I believe but you can find out information on all this at duguanpod.com. And of course, don't forget about our live 500th episode. There are very few tickets left. So if you were thinking about coming along to that, get on it.

We have booked in some of the biggest guests we've ever had, many of our favorites. It's gonna be so much fun, cannot wait. Let's get on with the show. Hello and welcome to another episode of Do Go On. My name is Dave Warnocky and as always, I'm here with Matt Stewart and Jess Perkins. That's right. We're here. It's so good to be here. It's so good to be alive. Look, I shouldn't say that.

I'm posing this question. How good is it to be alive? Well, you just said yourself, so good to be alive. Yeah. No, I was doing it like a Jeopardy style. Oh, great. Sorry. I don't understand that show. I haven't seen it. You've never seen Jeopardy.

No, but I hope Alex Trebek is doing well. Yeah, Alex and Queen Lizzie. And who hosted the Australian Jeopardy? Probably Terps. Probably Terps. Terps, Bird Joe. Oh, it could have been Berger. Yeah. Baby John. Now Jess, we're not here to talk about retired game show hosts.

We're here to talk about, well maybe we are because- Retired is a kind term. We don't know what you're going to be talking about, but please explain what the show is. So I have to explain the show and then do the show. Yeah, well, because I didn't want him to do it because he didn't want to do it. No, I've got it. So one of the three of us researches a topic often suggested by our listeners. We bring it to the other two who don't know what we're going to talk about.

And they politely listen and every now and then go, wow, that's very interesting and well researched. And that's about the only interruption you get. Basically, we should just have a button that you press for our voices. Yeah. Wow, incredibly well researched. Wow, that was very interesting. Then we wouldn't have to all get together to record a podcast.

Yeah, we just do a solo once every three weeks. Do it in your own time. Yeah. I imagine some listeners assume that's how we do it. Like, you only interject with, wow, that's really interesting and well researched. Or what about, haha, what a funny name. Yeah, that's a good one. A good year.

Like just get that clean and you can check that in wherever you like. Yeah, okay. And yeah, you could get that from Matt. Oh, what? Oh, sorry, I missed this. What year is this? What's going on? Sorry.

Wait, is this the guy from before? No, different guy. Oh, you can get that. There's a second guy? Yeah. Yeah, shit, we should probably look into that just in terms of efficiency. Anyway, we always get onto the topic with a question. I have a two-parter for you today. How is it? Two points off of Grubz, do you think? Sure.

Great. Number one. What a fantastic game show host, Jasper Cummings. I guess. Alex Trebek never said that. That's why you're the host whenever we do game show type things. Okay? Thank you for letting me live out my little childhood dream.

And I sit there and I bully you and that's my childhood dream. All right, two-parter. This is to put these two together. We get the name of today's subject. Okay? Okay. Number one, something you might find on a dog, not fleas. Leash. No.

Collar. No. In the same world as fleas, but it's not fleas. Or you might find on its skin. Tick. Very good. One point to Matt. Ringworm. No, I've already given Matt the point. Is this about ringworm, John? And part two. Tick, tick. Any guesses early on, Matt? Tick. The Tick, tick. Any guesses early on? Tick.

The Tick. The TV show slash comic. No. The Nike tick slash swoosh. The swoosh. It's not the swoosh. Have we done that? Or have I watched the documentary about it?

Is it TikTok? The history of? It's not the history of TikTok. Oh, it's the history of clocks. Yes. Wow. Okay, sorry. Second question. Part two.

Surname of Matt Damon's character in an action thriller franchise. Bourne. Bourne. Two points for Matt Stewart. Tick-Bourne is the name. The Tick-Bourne case? The Tick-Bourne case. I've seen this in the hat. I wasn't sure if it was Tick-Bourne or Titch-Bourne or Tich-Bourne.

I'm not really sure either, but I'm going to say Tick-Bourne. I thought that you might have gone to the... You know what? I didn't. I'm not sure either, but I'm going to say Titchborn. I thought and a half watching different YouTube videos to find out how to say, and Jess, the verdict is. It's probably titch-borne, but how could I have given you a clue on titch, you know? Yeah, that's good. Titch. There's a little kid with a kite.

That's that book titch, do you remember? Or spinning wheel. Is that Titch or Tish? Let's go to the YouTube video. All right, an hour and a half later, we couldn't find it. We couldn't find it. Dave, misremembered. Sorry, but I'm excited about this. So, it's probably Titch-born, Titch-born.

I might say Tick-born at various points, because that's what I've been saying in my head as I've been writing this, but you'll know who I'm talking about. Plus, the main character today is going to be referred to by a bunch of different names. You're covered there. It's fine. So this has been suggested by a lot of people, hence Dave has seen it in our suggestion hat, which by the way, you don't have to be a Patreon or like pay anything to suggest a topic. If you've come across a YouTube video that you think was interesting or an article or just

a story you know from your area or not from your area, whatever, you can put it in the hat and we might get to it. One of these people, and I forgot to point them out, cheated and I'd already put this up for the vote and they then said, I'm putting this in because I've meant to for a while, but Jess just put it up for the vote. And they said, I'm cheating here, but I say it's fair game. They didn't know it won. That's cheating.

That's cheating. Anyway, so it's been suggested by Kim Hill from Wollongong. Is that the cheat? No. Okay. I'll, I'll give you a wink. We won't say it on public. Okay.

I'll give you a wink. Okay. Not Kim. Grant Cheese Wright from Aberdeenshire. Cheat? Not cheat. Okay. Not the cheat. Tim Randall from Brisbane,

Sam Holmes from London, Josh from New York and the UK, Marissa Stroud from Canada. Oh my God. Oh, not Stroud. You know where she's from? Canada. She's from Stroud. And that was a coincidence. I asked her, she, because she's sent in a few questions for who knew it with most sure and I said, oh is it named after a family member? She's like I didn't even know that was what the area was called until after I moved in Wow amazing Wow amazing stuff amazing I told that story on ABC radio Wow. But I forgot her name was Stroud. I said a different name.

You know, the story is still played. Marissa London. And she moves to deliver those calls. Hang on, it's also been suggested by Pete Holberton from Melbourne and Jamie Alcantara from London. You know, Pete's nickname is the silly old missile man because he works at NASA. Wow. Is that right at NASA. Wow. Is that right?

NASA. Yeah, that is correct. You are saying that correctly. Yep. Incredible. And thank you so much for all those people suggesting it. Yeah. It's a fun story. So have you ever, do you know anything about it at all? I can't remember if I know. Yeah. Because there's a couple of these.

I don't want to say anything because I will give it away. There's two things that I'm thinking of that maybe I don't want to say anything because I will give it away. There's two things that I'm thinking of that maybe I've looked into briefly for a vote or something. Yeah. It's just one of those like quick cursory looks, so you go, is there enough information on this? Yeah.

I probably looked at the pitch and went, geez, that's all right. Yeah. Because people describe the topic to us. The titch pitch. The titch pitch. Yes. So a bit of background firstly on the titchborns of Titchborne Park. Wait, they're named Titchborne and they live in Titchborn Park?

Yeah. Did they know? Crazy. That's an unheard of anecdote. Call up the ABC right now. They were an old English Catholic family who'd been prominent in the area for centuries. They gained the baronet title in 1621 with Benjamin Titchborne, who was given the title for services to King James I. So several generations later,

we have James Titchborne. So James and his father Henry had been detained together in France in the early 1800s as they happened to be traveling through France when the Napoleonic Wars were reignited and they were now enemy citizens. Oh, that's unlucky. That is unlucky. Bad timing. Yeah. If you're just like basically on a holiday.

Yeah. And then like your country is declared war upon. Yeah. Oh, why? Come on. Just let me, I'll just go home. I'll leave. I understand you don't want me here.

Yeah. I'll just go back. I'll go back and I'll tell them to knock it off. I'll say, Oi, Oi. Oi. Oi. Hey, Napoleon's alright. Cut it out. He's pretty good.

That's enough, I'll say. Yeah. And they'll listen. They will listen to me. I've been a baronet for centuries. I'm a titch-born. Yeah. Okay.

Anyway, so they became, while they're in prison, they became chummy with another English nobleman, Henry Seymour of Noyl. That's good stuff. Seymour somehow managed to conduct an affair while imprisoned and that affair resulted in his daughter, Henriette, being born in 1807. I'm bringing in a lot of names, but this family has a lot of like messy drama and it's fun. Okay. I'll let you know when you really need to remember someone.

An affair in prison is pretty impressive. Yeah, I know. How do you do that? Like through the bars or something? Yeah, it must do. That's hard. That's kind of hard. I was like, at first I'm like, how hard could it be?

You know, they share, people share cells, but yeah, to have a child, it's normally, they normally split up the sexes. That's right. I'm not sure why you said it like that. Splitting up the sexes. If's right. I'm not sure why you said it like that. Splitting up the sexes. If you honor me. He can't say the word sex in any context without that voice. Matt, just say the word sex.

It's disturbing. Sex. Okay. Why? We'll work on this off-pod. Actually, I won't. Yeah, let's never bring it up again. That's good.

That's for a therapist, not for me. So 20 years later, Henriette was embarrassingly unmarried. At 20, disgusting. It's over. And so her father, Henry, thought his old prison pal, James, might make for a good husband for his daughter. This is from Wikipedia. Although James was close to his own age and was physically unprepossessing.

He ugly. Wow. An ugly old man. So you're thinking, fuck, my daughter's unmarried yuck embarrassing and even more. I know who do I know? Oh that guy that was a little bit younger than me, but close to my age from prison when Henriette was born Oh ugly Phil. Yeah And also it's your unmarried daughter named after yourself Is that right Henri Henry named after Henry?

Yeah! I mean, come on, that's a blot on the family's reputation. I've staked everything on this girl. She can't even get married. Okay, well, we all know you've named your daughter, Devina. That's a beautiful name. It was a coincidence. I didn't even make the connection until just now, actually.

Hang on, that's quite similar to my name. So yeah, he's 23 years her senior and an Argo. Nevertheless, the couple were married in August 1827 and had their first son, Roger, a couple of years later in 1829. Roger is who you need to remember. Okay, well, it makes sense. It's how he was created as well. So it's weird that more kids aren't named Roger.

We've named you after how we major. Well, because a lot of people, a lot of people will name their kids after where the kid was conceived. Yes. But yeah, not enough about how. That's why I called my daughter Divina. Doggy. I was going to say.

Middle name Penetration. To Divina because she was conceived in my house. So but uh. Yeah, by divine intervention. But uh, penetrating. Just a middle name, just a tribute there. Nobody uses a middle name. But if she wants to go buy a penny or something when she's older, she can.

That's funny stuff. Hope she never listens to this. So she's married, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's

got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got a daughter, she's got stuff. Hope she never listens to this. So she's married.

She's got Roger and Roger's not a Titchborne. Is that right? He is a Titchborne. Oh, he is a Titchborne. Yes, this is James Titchborne. Who has married Henriette. OK. And they've had Roger Titchborne.

All right. And the father was of Noelle. Is that right? Why is Noelle so funny? The grandfather, yeah. I don't know why, of Noelle. Is that right? Why is Noelle so funny? I don't know why, but Noelle's very funny. Noelle. And it's like K-N-O-Y-L-E. Noelle. I'm heir to the Noelle fortune. Sorry, the oil fortune. Oh no. Noelle. Well his name's Seymour. Seymour of Noelle. So Noelle must be a place.

Seymour Noelle. I've seen enough. Anyway, so yes, Roger Titchborne is, is the main subject of today's report, but I just liked a little bit of that family background. After Roger's birth, James and Henriette had three more children, two daughters who died in infancy and a second son, Alfred, born in 1839. The marriage was unhappy and the couple spent much of their time apart. Is he so ugly? He in England and she in Paris. You got to get to a beautiful place.

She has to look at him via a telescope. Yeah, to avoid that I'll go. So she had Roger with her in Paris. As a consequence of his upbringing, Roger spoke mainly French and his English was heavily accented. Now that seems like a weird thing for me to mention, but maybe keep it in mind. Oh. Now that seems like a weird thing for me to mention, but maybe keep it in mind. In 1845, James decided that Roger should complete his education in England and placed him in the Jesuit boarding school Stonyhurst College, where he remained until 1848. In 1849, he sat the British Army entrance exam and then took a commission in the Sixth

Dragoon Guards. I love the Dragoon Guards. Now that's probably what we should have called our Dungeons and Dragons. Go on. Yeah. Yeah. But. Do Dragoon. Yeah. On. Yes, that's it. Now I think I got it. We got it. Yep. He served in that battalion for three years, mainly in Ireland. You would have loved that. You know, being three years in Ireland. What a posting. Yeah. I love that. You know, being three years in Ireland. What a posting.

Yeah. And, and being in the military. Yeah, you love that. Perfect for me. Um, I won't go, there's a, there's a bit of like complicated family history here basically because some men in the family only had daughters. James was next in line for the, the Baronet C and after him, Roger. So from Wikipedia, went on leave, Roger often stayed with his uncle Edward at Titchbourne

Park and became attracted to his cousin, Catherine Doherty, four years his junior. So Edward and his wife, though they were fond of their nephew, did not consider marriage between first cousins desirable. At one point, the young couple were forbidden to meet, though they continued to do so clandestinely. Oh my God, if they meet, we know what will happen. Don't let them meet. They will definitely fall in love. Feeling harassed and frustrated, Roger hoped to escape from the situation through a spell

of overseas military duty. When it became clear that the regiment would remain in the British Isles, he resigned his commission. So, Catherine Dodie will come up again later as well. But I do like that, because back then it feels like marrying your cousin normal, but they were like, no, dude, that's weird. Leave her alone. Yeah, please.

Stop it. So he won't get to travel for work. He decides to just have a gap year and do it privately. So on the 21st of March, 1853, 24 year old Roger Titchborne set sail on board La Pauline bound for South America. Three months later, they reached Chile. He spent a little less than a year in South America, I think around 10 months. He took a hunting trip in Peru. He crossed the Andes.

By the end of January, 1854, he had reached Buenos Aires. He wrote to his aunt, Lady Doherty, who I think he also wished was his mother-in-law, if they weren't such prudes. And he told her he planned to head for Brazil, then Jamaica and finally Mexico. That's an incredible gap here. What a trip, right? Wow. In April, he left Rio on board the Bella and set sail for Jamaica.

But. Yes. Whoa. Only a few days later, a capsized ship bearing the name Bella was discovered off the Brazilian coast. No survivors were found, nor were there any remains. The Titchborne family were told in June that Roger must be presumed dead. Whoa. Sir James Titchborne died in June of 1862, at which point, if he was alive, Roger would have become the 11th baronet.

The title instead passed to his younger brother, Alfred, whose financial recklessness rapidly brought about his near bankruptcy. The family had to move out of Titchborne Park and rented out to tenants. Oh no, Alfred. Is this the origin of Batman's butler? Yes. Oh my God. But we'll have to edit that out because that's a huge spoiler. Okay, that's the twist.

Okay, I'm sorry about that. So he started out being wealthy himself then had to work his way up. Yes. As a butler. As a butler. As like an 85 year old butler. He had to work his way up as an 85 year old butler. It's a classic way.

He started that job at 50. Yeah. He got the job of an 85 year old butler. It's a classic way. He started that job at 50. He got the job of an 85 year old butler. Pull yourself up by your bootstraps. That's classic stuff. Start as a butler, end up a billionaire. That's right. Exactly. Work hard. Billionaires are the hardest workers. We all know that.

We all know that. Okay, I won't hear another word about them. Yes. We don't think we should be killing them. No way. Just because we just mentioned France and lopping off heads. Did you mention that? Well, that's always implied when you mention Paris, you think lopping off heads. Yeah. But I don't think we should be doing that. No. In fact, I would go as far as saying don't do that. If you're about to, don't do it.

Stop it. I was going to say cut it it out. And that's, that's misleading. Yeah. No, I think that's good. Yeah. Cut it out. Yeah. That's plausible deniability there. Cut it out. Every time there's a pause, it's a, it's a wink. Oh, Dave. So I'm just saying what I'm seeing. Okay. Well. Well, we were doing very, very subtle winks that the camera will barely even perceive.

Did you want to have a go? Oh, that's a double wink. They call that a blink and a miss. That's a plausible denial. Dave, can you wink? Yeah, what's this? Yeah, and I'm probably the third best winker in the room right now. Really?

Top three. Top three, I'd say that's about right. That's actually really impressive. You know who does a great subtle wink? Sir Ian McKellen. Really? Yeah, yeah, yeah. I watched one of the Lord of the Rings the other day and I was like, bloody hell, that

was a nice subtle wink. I reckon I could have had 10,000 guesses and I wouldn't have guessed that that's a U.S. accent. My first guess was, your dog Goose? Oh, no, he's not subtle at all. Jess is always bringing up that dog. I love my dog. That dog Ian McKellen.

Oh, that would have been a better name. Sir Ian McKellen. Yeah. This is Sir Ian. One of my favorite ever TikToks is about a small dog whose name is Stuntman Mike. Oh, that's really good. And he's the best.

Wouldn't you, you'd call him Sir Ian McWuffins or something, wouldn't you? No, Sir Ian McKellen. That's the kind of thing you would do. Yeah. Dog people. Dog people. Why are they?

I was trying to build a little bit of tension. Oh yeah. Yeah, so Alfred's gambled it all away. Alfred's gambled it all away. Roger's dead. But if Roger was alive, Alfred would be usurped. Is that correct? Yes.

Oh my God. Cause the family held onto a slither of hope, having heard rumors that another ship had picked up survivors of the Bella, and that ship was heading for Australia. What? That's where we are. That's us. Oh my gosh, did you pick this topic because it mentions Australia and we know you love being mentioned.

I love being mentioned. You'll never guess where the Bella specifically was going. Oh my gosh. But let's just say, uh, laneways. Oh my gosh. Okay let's just say, Laneways. Oh my gosh. Art capital. Whoa, Sydney.

Sydney. That's amazing. Sydney's the art capital. How? Have they got NGV? They've got an opera house. What's artier than opera? It's one type of art.

And they've got like the Sydney gallery, probably. Well why don't you fucking marry Sydney then? Yeah, why do you live here? It's too expensive. I can't afford the gallery. You wouldn't believe how many cows there were. Sydney's dad once. Sydney's dad.

Who would Sydney's dad be? Brisbane? Yeah. Just in terms of further north, but that doesn't make sense. Is that what dads are? Just further north to you? I was assuming England. Ah, yep. So that's the mother country. Who did England marry to make Sydney? And that's how you make babies by marriage. Yeah. It's the only way. Anyway, so after her husband's death and nine years after her son's disappearance

and presumed death, Roger's mother, Henriette, who was now Lady Titchborne, felt encouraged by a clairvoyance assurance that her eldest son was alive and well. Whoa. She'd always, I think they'd heard that a ship had picked up survivors and taken them to Australia. And they'd kind of held on to hope that maybe Roger was amongst them. But then this clairvoyant was like, yeah, he's alive. He's doing really well. Wow. Clairvoyants are powerful as well.

That's right. Is this back in the time there was a period where spiritualism and stuff was so big and like proper people, like not now you'd be like, Oh yeah, they believe in that sort of stuff. But then they were like, you know, kind of mainstream. Maybe it'll just come back around in a circle. Yeah. For a little while we go like, Oh yeah, these, Oh yeah, you went and saw your psychic, did you? Okay. Um, but that'll come back around. We'll be like the Pope, whatever. What does Gertrude say is gonna happen? Yes.

Gertrude's the best name I could think of. Because currently we all go, if the Pope says it, we are on board. Correct. Yeah. So she began placing regular newspaper ads in the Times, offering a reward for information about Roger Titchborne and the fate of the Bella. Unfortunately, these weren't very successful, but in 1865, Lady Titchborne saw an ad placed

by Arthur Cubbot of Sydney, Australia on behalf of his missing friends agency. She wrote to him and he agreed to place a series of notices in Australian newspapers. So I guess she's putting them in English newspapers, but you think he's in Australia. Oh, of course. So I'm not sure how they're going to get that information. And then in Australia, there's someone running something called the Missing Friends Agency. Yeah. Wow.

So it's obviously, because it's harder back then to contact people. Well, that's right. Yeah. You didn't have Facebook. So you just put a photo up and be like, hey, do you know this person? Yeah, I didn't. Yeah, exactly. You know how I am.

Here we go. We've lost him for the last few minutes, but I'm sure he's found something fun. When you said the Bella and I'm like, this is starting to sound vaguely familiar. I did, you know how I used to do, I do sleep shows for Hatch. Yeah, I did this story. I don't remember anything about it apart from the Bella. I'm like the Bella, I just looked it up. I did it. I don't remember how this goes. I didn't recognize the Bella. I'm like the Bella. I just looked it up. I did it. 100. I don't remember

how this goes. I didn't recognise the name. Looking it up, I'm like, I must have called it something different. No, I called the episode the Titchmorn case. That's incredible. I have no rec- because I was doing like four episodes of that show a week. But I just want to put this on the record for the people who email me and say, I think you might actually have something wrong with your memory, you know? It's actually when you're consuming a lot of this stuff,

you have to make room. Yeah, I'm like, I was like, I must've focused on a different character and this was a side story. No, this was the whole story. Yeah, this was the whole thing. But I still don't remember it. But the Bella is what.

Yeah, the Bella is the Bella. The Bella's not, and that's not even the most amazing or like really noteworthy name. I don't know why. That's so interesting. I wonder if you said Tick-Born or Titch-Born. I almost definitely said whatever it is phonetically. Yeah, it's Titch. There's, obviously it's a sleep podcast,

but were you recording it whilst you were asleep as well? Yeah. I go full method, yeah. He's very good. This is how I want you to feel. Bella. Shit, I'm just like, I don't know. The guy goes like this.

That was worth it. That was worth it. That was worth it. Okay, I'm like, feel free to edit that bit out. That's worth it. That was worth it. That was worth it. Okay, I'm like, feel free to edit that bit out. That's really funny. I'm very glad it was for your sleep podcast and not this podcast. Oh my god.

Where else is it going? Because let's not forget that I think it was while I was putting this up for the vote, I had to message you guys and be like, this story's vaguely familiar. Have we done this topic? Not this specific one, a different one I was about to put up for the vote. And Dave's like, yes, I've done that. It was a bonus about nine years ago or something. Like it was a long time ago. An early on bonus, but it was a long story.

A similar thing on Who Knew It. I've reused the question without knowing it and someone's like, oh, you did this on another episode. I'm like, oh no, that might start to happen. I'm going to really search my documents for every question. Yeah. Anyway, so she's placing ads. Well, he's placing ads in Australian newspapers on her behalf. I have one of them here. It's from the Sydney Morning Herald in July of 1865.

So it says, a handsome reward shall be given to any person who can furnish such information as will discover the fate of Roger Charles Titchborne. He sailed from the port of Rio, Rio Gennaro. No D back then. On the 20th of April, 1854 in the ship La Bella and has never been heard of since. But a report reached England to the effect that a portion of the crew and passengers of a vessel of that name were picked up by a vessel bound to Australia. Melbourne, it is believed.

That's where we are! The art capital? Sydney's little brother. Two thirds of us were born here. Whoa. And Matt just outside. Just outside. Just an hour and a half outside. Yeah, very close. But doesn't take into account. No. So sucked the fuck in. Yeah, I'm more unique, I guess. I was more like in the suburbs, it's probably 40 minute drive from the CBD. So it's not that. Same. Absolutely. It is not known whether the said Roger Charles Titchborne

was amongst the drowned or saved. He would at the present time be about 32 years of age. I've been that age. Well, what about this? Is of a delicate constitution. That's Mickey. Rather tall. Well, what about this? Is of a delicate constitution. Rather tall. Oh, I used to be. Back then, for back then.

Oh, yeah. I was short back then. You were probably quite tall. Yeah, I was just towering over those. With very light brown hair and blue eyes. So light it's graying. It was light at one point. When you were 32.

Yeah, that's right. Hmm. When you were 28. But light blue eyes? Yeah, blue eyes. Yes. You got blue eyes. Oh my gosh. Sorry to dox you like that. People have been asking for years what colour are his eyes.

Could you be the missing Roger Titchborne? Oh my gosh. Did you like how I said both Tickborne and Titchborne at the same time? It was actually very impressive. That was good. I don't know how I did it. Yeah. Maybe that's why this sounded familiar to me because I am a very good at this.

I'm a very good at this. I'm a very good at this. I'm a very good at this. I'm a very good at this. I'm a very good at this. I'm a very good at this. I'm a very good at this and Titch-Born at the same time? It was actually very impressive. That was kind of hard to do. Maybe that's why this sounded familiar to me because I am part of the case. Yes.

Well, let's save that for the end, you know, as a reveal that you are Roger. I'm a Roger. Mr. Titch-Born is the son of Sir James Titch-Born, now deceased, and is heir to all his estates. The advertiser is instructed to state that a most liberal award. What happened? I said waward, right? Waward? That was great fun.

A most liberal award. I mean, I dish it out a lot, so it is kind of nice for it to come back. That was just fun. Liberal reward! Liberal reward! I've survived actually. Yeah. And that will be given for any information that may definitely point out his fate.

So they've kind of said there, this is a nobleman and the family has lots of money. Is that smart? Is that you? Let us know if that's you. Yeah. Oh, actually. Here's a vague description as well. If you can pretend to be this person, you could be in some cash.

Oh, I don't know what you're implying there. Or be the person. Thank you. If you look at this person, it might be you and you've just forgotten. Yeah. Well, that can happen when you have a shipwreck. Yeah, you get a bonk on the head. Or like you moved to a new place. He was only what, 30 when he moved. Yeah. Well, that can happen when you have a shipwreck. Yeah, you get a bonk on the head. Or like you move to a new place.

He was only what, 30 when he moved. Yeah. So like, you know, the first 30 years that my first memory comes at about 30. I don't remember anything. Yeah. Yeah. Your brain, I don't think it's fully developed till 30. Oh.

That's probably true actually. Thinking back through my life, pretty 30 it was that I didn't do a lot of. Oh, I'm, I'm, you know, my reaction is just like, am I done? Like, I think, I think maybe there's more time. Yeah. You'll have a growth spurt in the brain. That's what I used to tell myself, because I have been this height since I was about 14. But you know, some people were like, oh, sometimes girls will have a little growth spurt at around 18. That didn't happen, but I held on hope. Yeah, in their 40s. Yeah, in their 40s you might.

40s, 50s. A little bit, a little bit taller. Yeah, more likely a shrink spurt, but still. Shrink spurt. So some family members held hope that Roger had survived and was picked up by another ship, while others felt pity for Henriette and her inability to properly mourn her son. They wish she wouldn't waste her time and effort on posting these ads in newspapers, because what did she really expect to come from them?

No one was going to respond because Roger had died at sea. They don't know that. Yeah. Isn't that a wild way to think about it? It's like, they're probably dead. Forget about them. Yeah. Forget about your son. They're probably dead. Move on. And she obviously misses her son. But is there an element of, I want to get my other shit son out of the way because he's ruining the family by spending all our money?

Oh, right. Do you reckon there's any of that or is it, I just miss my son? I think she probably liked Roger Moore. Yeah. Roger Moore. Oh! Who doesn't? Oh my God.

Okay, again. Dave's favorite Bond. Oh. Again, I was building suspense. Oh, sorry. It wasn't my favorite. The Saint. I've got it capitalized. Sorry. Okay, so Roger had died at sea.

But then. What? A few months later, in October 1865, Arthur Cubbot wrote to Lady Titchborne, informing her that a lawyer from Wagga Wagga, William Gibbs, had found Roger Titchborne. Wow. In Wagga. He must have bumped his head pretty hard.

But a lot of famous people come from Wagga, like sports people especially. Yeah, it's a big, big sports town. And Dane Simpson. Well, he doesn't, he lives there. And Michelle Brazier. She comes from Wagga Wagga. Bloody hell. Oh, he doesn't. He lives there. And Michelle Brazier. She comes from Waga Waga. Bloody hell. Oh my gosh.

Can you believe that? So William Gibbs, he's a lawyer in Waga Waga, which for international listeners is the teen pregnancy capital of Australia. Is that true? That's something Michelle Brazier says all the time. Okay. Her mom was a teen? No.

Um, it's a regional town in New South Wales. It's a few hours west of Canberra. It's about five hours northeast of Melbourne. So he obviously arrived on that ship, didn't like our laneway and coffee culture, decided I'm going to try somewhere else, which is bullshit. Give us a chance. Give us a fucking chance. Come on. Do they have a nice spring day? There's no better city.

Do they have the G? And we have like two of those a year. Nice days. Worth it. It's worth it. It's worth it. So William Gibbs, he's a lawyer there. He is dealing with a bankruptcy for a client named Thomas Castro, who's a local butcher. During their conversation, Thomas mentioned he had entitlement to some property back in England, and Gibbs noticed that he was smoking a pipe that had the initials RCT on the side. Could it be Gibbs thought?

RCT, RCT. Gibbs questioned Castro, who denied having any other identity, past or present, other than Thomas Castro. What an absurd question. And that was the end of that. Okay. Okay. Now Gibbs pushed a little more.

Okay. And eventually Thomas Castro caved and admitted he was in fact the missing Roger Titchborne. Whoa, why was he keeping it a secret? Yeah, great question. So Gibbs wrote to Arthur Cubbot, who offered to accompany Thomas back to England and wrote to Lady Titchborne requesting funds for their travels. Gibbs also suggested that Thomas write a letter to his mother and also write a will before he leaves. I'm not entirely sure why. And did he say, and you know, if you were looking for someone to leave stuff to?

Yeah, if you like, if you, if anybody's like helped you with this kind of stuff recently and you like, Yeah, I could, I could take care of it. Ah, you know, I'm a lawyer. I don't make a lot of money, so any help would be nice. My Lord. Anyway, so the will incorrectly gave Lady Titchborne's name as Hannah Francis. OK. And disposed of numerous nonexistent parcels of supposed Titchborne property. Oh, you can have Buckingham Palace, Big Ben. Enjoy the London. Edinburgh Castle.

That's yours. Yeah, if I die. It's giving me my stuff. I'll tell you how to do it. That's weird. He's just having a stab. He's having a stab at you know. But he misspelled his mum's name or? Oh, got it completely wrong. Her name's Henriette. He wrote Hannah Francis.

Just had a stab at it. I think, I know, I think what's happened. I mean, you have to remember. Oh, he hit his head. He hit his head. He had a bonk on the head. Yeah, he had a bonk. And he hasn't seen-

And he's probably a bit waterlogged too from being in the water. Oh, he's probably- He's got swimmers ear. He's got swimmers ear. And that can do all sorts of things. Yeah, it makes Henrietta sound like... Hannah Francis. Hannah Francis.

And if you hadn't seen your mum in a couple of years, you'd forget her name as well. You'd forget her name. Yeah, I haven't seen... Yeah, I'm trying to think. I saw my mum on Sunday. It was her birthday. But what's her name? What?

Did you say... When we were seeing happy birthday? I think I yelled mum. So I was at a birthday recently. Uh, actually you were both there and I, um, during the song realized I'd forgotten how to sing the song. Yeah. I was standing right next to you. I forgot the deer part. I just went straight for the name. And, uh, yeah, that stood out in a crowd where one person said a different word to everyone else.

You honestly probably would have gotten away with it had you not started laughing and then leant over to me and said, I forgot the words. I think I've got it on video for it. Anyway, so, uh, the letter to his mother, cause he did the will, and he wrote a letter to his mum. Did it say, Dear Hannah? It said, Hey, mummy. That's good.

I only know where it's mummy. I only call her mummy. It gave vague references to his former life. Pretty vague. But that was enough for Lady Titchborne. Do you remember when I was a boy? Oh, now I'm a man? Yeah.

Back when I was in a lot of ways shorter than this. My Roger was a boy, and now he's a man. She was convinced. She was like, my eldest son is alive. Definitely wasn't made worse by the fact that her younger son, Alfred, had died in February. So she's a grieving woman. She's vulnerable, but she is convinced and she's happy. Well, and she would know what her son looks like. It wasn't like you left.

I could understand. They're not FaceTime. I just want to make that clear. It is a letter. Oh, okay. And they're right. But you're thinking about like, if you disappear, there's a two year old in that 32. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That that's, you know, that could be them. But if you, so she's going to see him and either know. Yeah, it's been nine years. You're not going to change that that dramatically in nine years that your immediate family aren't going to recognise you totally. I saw her. I thought he'd already arrived. No, no, no. He's still back in Australia.

He's written a letter and he's forgotten her name because of the bonk on the head. The only thing that might look different is he might have a bump. Yeah. He's forgotten her name because of the bonk on the head. The only thing that might look different is he might have a bump. Yeah. He's got a large egg. But if you just put your hand over it and sort of close one eye, you're like, oh no, that's Roger. Yeah, there it is. Cover the egg and you'll get used to the egg.

In time, you'll learn to love the egg. You could dress the egg up. Put a little hat on the egg. Put a little hat on the egg. See if there's a hat for you, hat for the egg. All these Christmas presents now are hats and then a small version of the same hat. Like when you dress twins the same. You dress the egg the same.

The egg's wearing a little free face. A little bow tie for the egg. The mum gets too into the egg. Yeah, she's like, mum, I'm in my thirties. He's like, Mum, honestly, my hair covers it. It's a slight bump. You're really drawing attention to the egg. You might be in your thirties, but the egg is still young.

The egg's my little baby. The egg's the closest thing I have to a grandchild at this point. That's not true. He has children. Anyway, I'll get to that in just a second. Oh my god. So all of this happened around October of 1865. Things moved a little slower back then. So it took a few months to get all of their ducks lined up.

In June of the following year, Thomas slash Roger, I'm just going to keep calling him Thomas through the whole thing. A lot of, um, a lot of sources call him the claimant. Oh. Oh, okay. I mean, I'm in my mind, I'm going to call him Roger because I know that's who he is. Okay, but I'm just going to say Thomas. You'll say Thomas, but I know you mean Roger.

Well, if he's, if he's chosen to change his name. True, actually, that's right. call him Roger because I know that's who he is. Okay, but I'm just going to say Thomas. You'll say Thomas, but I know you mean Roger. Well, if he's chosen to change his name, I think we should respect that. True, actually, that's right. That's right. His new identity, which he chose. Is Thomas. Yep. So yeah, he was discovered in October. June of the next year, he moved from Wagga to Sydney where he was able to secure loans

from banks for his travels based on a statutory declaration that he was Roger Titchborne. So he's a wealthy heir. He's heading back to England where all his money is. That's a slam dunk for a bank. Yeah. They're like, take this money. But he's done a stat deck. You can't lie. You can't lie on a stat deck. You cannot lie. You can't. So, so like that should be proof enough. Case closed. If there are any doubters, it's like he's done a stat deck. Yeah. I don't know. He did it in front of a chemist or whatever. You can't lie in front of a chemist. If you lie in front of a chemist, you'll disappear. Have either of you ever had to do a stat deck?

Oh yeah. I don't think I have. Oh yeah. Sorry, he's very old. Of course he has. I only had to do it once. When I got a new car and gave my old car to my partner and we weren't married and that you don't pay a transfer fee if you're just giving it the cars staying within the same relationship or household or like so just give to give your car to your spouse is fine you don't pay a fee for that right so we had to go get a stat deck saying we're in a relationship and it felt really weird in front of the chemist. We're like, do you need us to kiss or something?

He's like, look at me in the eye. Do you want to see our Facebook status? Are you in love? Well, yeah, I suppose. Bit of fun. Anyway, so the banks, they're like, oh, he's good for it. They give him some money for his travels. The stat deck was later found to contain many errors, although the birthdate and

parentage details were given correctly. You always remember your own birthday. Okay. And the parents, he's now getting their names right. He's getting them right. But are them like mistakes? Well, it included a brief account of how he arrived in Australia. Oh my God.

I've just realised though, if he's starting to remember his mum's real name, I think the egg might be dying. No! No, not the egg! I think the egg might be- What? So it's the egg or his memory? Yeah, I'm afraid so.

Gosh, now I want to watch this movie. The egg or the memory. It's up to you, make the choice. So sad. Because the egg has funny little outfits. Yeah. And we have even do with those clothes? I know. Oh my god.

But memory is important, you know. Yeah, but the egg. Yeah. And I don't even like eggs. I know, but- I like this egg. You like this egg. I don't like eggs, but I like this egg.

That's sad. Yeah, sorry. So, the stat deck included a brief account of how he'd arrived in Australia. He and others from the sinking Bella, he said, had been picked up by the Osprey bound for Melbourne on arrival. He'd taken the name Thomas Castro from an acquaintance from Chile and had wandered for some years before settling in Wagga Wagga. It's so funny the idea that you have to take, like you can't just make up a name.

I took it from a man. Yeah. And somebody a man. Yeah. And somebody I met. Yeah. And then he wandered for years. Don't worry, this isn't a made up name. I took it from another man. This person exists. It's just not me.

Yeah, he didn't like Melbourne. So he went to Wagga. Fuck this guy. What is it? What is this? Probably doesn't like a laneway culture, coffee culture. Doesn't like some of the best coffee in the world. Yeah.

I'm really scared of trams. Ding ding. Don't worry. Only city that has them. Only city. The only city that has trams. So avoid us at all costs. Maybe you didn't like weather. That's something we have as well.

Yeah. Maybe you didn't like the Royal Botanic Gardens. Oh yeah. Good luck. I challenge anybody to go in there and not be just mesmerized. Yes. Enchanted. Enchanted. Oh my God. Yeah. Horny. Horny.

Yeah. Rock hard. Yeah. I love that grass. I challenge you to go into the Botanic Gardens and not get a stiffy. Yeah. Good luck. Good luck. He had... But I love the idea of him wandering for years despite knowing that he's a baron. Or has he forgotten this for a while? Yeah, I have no idea.

He doesn't sort of explain why he wasn't like, I'll just write to the family and let him know I'm okay. I'm assuming it's like a Harold Bishop on Neighbours type arc. Okay. He fell off into Port Phillip Bay in Melbourne. He washed up ashore in Tasmania. fell off into Port Phillip Bay in Melbourne. I washed up a shore in Tasmania, obviously bobbed his way across the Bass Strait.

Treacherous piece of ocean, hundreds of kilometers long. And you know- It's very close on the map though, you'd think you could swim it. He had a big egg and he, yeah, he forgot who he was, took up the tuber I think. Right. You know, you'd never know what that kind of trauma will do to you.

Yeah. You take up the tuba. No, no, I don't want to do it. You know, the water is probably quite cold. Yes. And that sort of, I mean, I've heard people talk about cold therapy and plunge pools and stuff like that, but at some point- Ah, okay, yes.

It's very dangerous. Even Wynne Hoff wouldn't like that one. Have you been listening to Joe Rogan again? Yeah. Yeah. I just think he has really great opinions. I think he loves the plunge. And great guests. Or does he? I don't know. It feels right. He feels like a plunger. He feels like a plunger. Back to Thomas. Sorry, he's wondering. He had married a pregnant housemaid called Mary Ann Bryant and taken her child, a daughter as his own.

And the couple had a second daughter that same year as in the year that he's discovered. So while in Sydney, Thomas met two former servants of the Titchborne family. Great. old pals. So like, they're going to know him. Yeah. Yes. One- We'll find out now if this is the real deal.

Oh yeah, okay, I'll build some suspense. One was the gardener. Okay. Now there's no closer relationship. Than a lord and his gardener. Than a baronet and his gardener. Oh my goodness. We all know that to be true.

That's where the saying comes from. Yes. The gardener's name was Michael Guilfoyle. Tighter than a baronet and his gardener. Yeah. Is that the saying you're referring to? That's what I say about us. You and I, specifically.

Yeah. Not Dave. No. Let me in. You and me. Let me in. No. They could be two gardeners.

There's not a lot of room between a baronet and a gardener for you to squeeze in between. Yeah. We're very close. I've tried to wedge my way in there, but I can't get in. We're mushed together right now. I will break you up. I will break you up. Mark my words. So Michael the gardener, first, he acknowledged the identity of Roger Titchborne. He's like, yep.

OK, that's you. So it's him. OK. Hi, that's good. He later changed his mind when asked to provide money to facilitate the return to England. Okay. So maybe it's just that he just didn't have the cash and he was like, all right. Why is he asking the gardener for cash?

Yeah, I'm not sure. I don't understand. And how did the gardener say him if he wasn't already in England? What's this guy's deal? The gardener is in Sydney. He moved to Sydney. Probably to work on the lovely Sydney. Seems like you've got an answer for everything.

It's so funny because the sentence before that started with, while in Sydney. Yeah. He met two servants. I thought that was the name of an English woman. So I do apologize. The second person that he met up with was a little bit more removed. His name was Andrew Boggle. It's one G, but I'm going to call him Boggle.

Yeah. Of course he's saying Beauchel. Yeah, that's it. He's going, it's Beauchel. It's Boggle. Who had worked for Roger's uncle, Sir Edward. The elderly Boggle did not immediately recognize Thomas, whose 189 pound or 86 kilo weight contrasted sharply with Roger's remembered slender build.

Slender build. Wow, people can put on weight. Exactly. Especially over nine years. If you haven't seen someone's in their early 20s. Nine years. Early 20s to early 30s is a big change there, okay? Your body does some changes.

Yeah, your libido, not libido, what's the thing? What's the thing? Metabolism. Metabolism. And libido. His libido's gone. Slow down. They both slow down. They both slow down. Okay, that's fine thing? What's the thing? Metabolism. Metabolism. And libido. His libido's gone. Slow down, they both slow down.

They both slow down. Okay, that's fine. And that's not it. Nothing wrong, there's pills for both. If you want them. But no pressure. No pressure, you're welcome to have slow both. If you want.

That's totally normal. Your bowels, they get quicker. It doesn't make sense. So he didn't recognize it because he thought it was normal. However, yeah, he quickly accepted that this was Roger and remained convinced the rest of his life. At first he was like, no, you're heavier. Oh, wait, I just remembered people can gain weight over a nine year period. Oh yeah, you're probably right.

He's like, hang on a second, you don't look like you're in your early 20s. 86 kilos for a man isn't that big either, unless he's quite short, but it says he's reasonably tall. He'd be the biggest man in this room. That's true. In probably in all sorts of ways, but oh no. Oh no. But yeah, now you say he's not like, he might, maybe he was quite very slim.

Are you purposely, are you purposely yo-yoing here? Cause I, one paragraph I'm like, it's not him. The next I'm like, oh, it is him. And then I'm like, wait, no, it's not him. And now again, I'm like, oh, it is him. Two people have ID'd him. Yeah. Two people that worked with the family.

Yeah. Like. One of them sort of reneged on it because he didn't want to. Didn't have cash. But what? I mean. But see, so Andrew Bogle, the one who did confirm, like who said, yes, that's him, even though at first he was like, no, oh wait, yes.

He worked for the uncle and Roger would go and stay with them all the time and was in love with the daughter, his cousin. So, you know, he was around a lot. So, yeah. I'm just saying, like, because there are people that doubt it and I'm saying that's ridiculous because we've got two eyewitnesses. Everything points to it being him. It is pretty funny, though, the situation.

Hey, Gardner, do you know me? Yeah. Yeah, that's you. OK, can I have five thousand dollars, please? No. No. It's not you. Yeah? Yeah, yeah, that's you. Okay, can I have $5,000 please? No. No. It's not you. Yeah, we don't know the details there.

Not just like, no, I was your uncle's gardener or whatever. I can't afford to send you to England. Surely you, a baronet, can sort that out yourself. You'd think so. So in September, Thomas and his young family set sail for England in first class. Thank you very much. That was the problem. Need to save up for first class.

Good Living in Sydney had raised his weight on departure to 210 pounds or 95 kilos. So he'd put on a bit. And during the long voyage, he added another 40 pounds or 18 kilos. Bloody hell. Now I want to be clear that I'm only mentioning his weight because one, Thomas is a lot heavier than Roger was remembered, which doesn't, like we've said, doesn't mean anything because bodies change, but it is sort of like one of the main things people talk about when they're skeptical.

But two, I'm just incredibly impressed with adding 18 kilos in a three month journey. Yeah. That is impressive. But I reckon if I was in first class, I'd be like, just keep it coming. It's difficult to exercise on the boat. Yeah. As a weightlifter. That would be incredible.

Yeah. What do you call that period as a weightlifter? You... Gaining. Gaining. He's just gaining. Maybe he's going to shred later. Yeah.

Or shed. Shred. Shred. But also if it isn't the real him, maybe this is a tactic to be like, you know, I'm giving a reason for not looking exactly the same. Not looking quite the same. Yeah.

So like it, it sounds like to put on that kind of way, it'd probably possibly be on purpose. I don't know. Yeah. Like is this like, it's honestly just very impressive. Sounds like someone like Jared Leto or something like only eating like microwaved ice cream for three months because they're gaining for a role or something. Yeah.

Like it's, it's hard to do. It's hard. It role or something. It's hard to do, you can imagine. It's very impressive. It's hard for you to do. Yeah, it actually would be. That would be the only way you could do it. You could do microwaved ice cream. Oh, God. Yeah, you'd have to, you'd be mushing a lot of stuff.

Now, that's good eating. So they arrived in England on Christmas Day, 1866. They traveled to London and checked into a hotel and then Thomas popped over to Lady Titchbourne's place only to be told she was in Paris. So then he did something that would later be seen as a little peculiar. He then went around the room going, oh, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, And upon reflection years later, people said, that was a bit peculiar. Only upon reflection they went, you know what, that was a little odd.

At the time, I thought nothing of it. I don't remember him doing that when he was younger. But people change. It could be an Australian thing. Yeah. I don't know what they're like down there. It's a new culture. New culture.

Yeah. They're just trying to assimilate. Could be some sort of Wagga Wagga thing. Yes, yes, yes, yes. Teen pregnancy and flippity-bipp-bop. Yeah. They're two big things. So, no-

Kind of a high-pitched scat. See what I mean? Yeah. Skibbity-pitched scat. Do you think? Yeah. Skibblebub. Skibblebub. But it was really the facial expressions and the hand gestures that made it- Oh, okay. That made it peculiar. Yes. Before that, I was like, uh-huh, uh-huh, yes. He's doing a bit of high-pitched scar. I understand. No, what he did was he went to a whapping in East London.

Wet ass. Whapping. Pussy ink. He went a whapping. He went a whapping. He went a whapping. Wow. That's what I think the 12 geese do in that Christmas song.

12 geese a whapping? I think that's right. He inquired after a local family named Orton, finding that they'd left the area. He identified himself to a neighbor as a friend of Arthur Orton, who he said was now one of the wealthiest men in Australia. Just keep this odd little visit in the back of your mind for now. So he said, I'm now a, I'm a, who's- No, he said, oh, I'm a friend of Arthur.

I met him in Australia. He's doing very well now. He's very wealthy there. If you could pass that on, if you see the family. But he's just visiting the family of a friend, Arthur Orton. And he's saying Arthur is wealthy or he's now wealthy? Arthur's wealthy.

Okay. That's confusing. So what was a whapping? A place. Okay. It's like, I can't get through a fucking sentence. He went to a whapping. He went to whapping.

Oh, he went to whapping. I never said a whapping. You might have said a whapping. He went to whapping. I went to whapping. I never said a whapping. You might have said a whapping. He went to whapping. I am sorry. Had a coffee. I'll shut the fuck up for a bit. You won't though. I will. OK. I'm going to look at the clock. Yep. I'm going to go.

I'm going to go five minutes. Five minutes. Five minutes zipped. That's too long. That's too long. Two. OK, two minutes. I mean, it's up to you. Well, it's just a bit boring if like one person on the podcast just goes completely silent. OK. Don't don't do it to you to give me to.

A few days later, he visited the Swan Hotel in Al-Alsford, sorry, where the landlord commented that he had a resemblance to the Titchborne family. Thomas confided that he was in fact Roger. Okay. Presumed dead, but very much alive. Let's keep this between ourselves. But also tell me everything you know about the Titchford family. Did he say Titchford family? Titchbor. These Titchfords, what do you know about the Titchford family. Did he say Titchford family? Titchborns.

These Titchford's, what do you know about them? I'm them. I'm doing well. No, it would be such a great story. Titchborn, yes, Titchborn, yes. But it's in the wrong name. Yeah, yeah, yeah, that one, that one, that one. It's pretty, it is impressive though, that a stranger has said,

you look like the family. Gosh, you look just, you've got such a strong resemblance to a famous family. Yeah. Bizarre. So Thomas hired a solicitor, John Holmes, who agreed to travel with him to Paris. There they met with Lady Titchborne. Here we go. The moment she saw him, she knew that was her son. Oh, wow. Great news. At Holmes behest, she lodged with the British embassy, assigned declaration, formally testifying that this claimant was her son.

She allowed Holmes to inform the Times in London that she had recognized Roger because it's sort of, it's making a bit of news. She traveled back to England with them, with Roger, with Thomas to declare her support and belief to the more sceptical members of the Titchborne family. So back in England, he's mingling with his long lost family, Thomas quickly won a few significant supporters. The Titchborne family solicitor Edward Hopkins and a family doctor J.P. Lipscomb both accepted that Thomas was Roger.

You will love this. Lipscomb after a detailed medical examination reported that Thomas possessed a distinctive genital malformation, which Roger had. Oh my gosh. Really? Yep. Was it, what was it? Don't know. Wow.

Third testicle or something? Matt's looking at the clock. You could speak if you want to talk about the genitals. No, I just made it. Two minutes. Well done. Uh, that is, well, I mean, what are the odds? Exactly. Yeah. And like a doctor never forgets a cock.

No! Never forgets a cock. It's the family doctor. Yeah. He knows every penis in that family. Yes. Yes. And he knows. As is his job.

Yeah. Nothing weird. Like we're saying that, like, it's special about this Doctor, but like all doctors should just remember. Yeah. Have a photographic memory. Yeah, my Doctor I walk in, he says, who are you? I drop my pants. He says, oh, Mr. Warnock, good to see you again. Good to see you. Good to see you. And he's shaking your dick as he says it. And he says, this is a new mole, we should keep an eye on this.

Incredible. Very thorough doctor. Really face blind, but penis rich. The opposite of blind. It's really hard cause I'm, I'm not doing well today and I'm doing a lot of the talking. It's tricky. It's tricky, but you have to try. It's not tough you say penis rich.

Penis rich. I wasn't sure. I was also not sure. What does it penis sightful? Yeah. What is the opposite? Got 20, 20 penis vision. Oh, that there it is. Yeah. That's good. That pretty good. Yeah. 20, 20 penis.

Let's edit that together. Yeah. 20, 20 penis. 20, 20. That's a bit bigger than that. What does that mean? My penis. 2020. That's a bit bigger than that. What does that mean? 20 mil? 20 by 20? Yeah. What are we talking?

50 by 50. Mil? Mil. Mil. Mil. Yes, mil. 50 by 50. OK.

That's why it's very distinct. It's a little cube. It's a little... I'm just talking to you. It looks like a wombat shit. What? What do Americans do for mill? They're going to be confused by that. Put it in terms they don't understand. Like a quarter inch or something. Their equivalent of a millimetre is a quarter inch. Oh, sorry, 50. So 50. 50.

We're awful. We're having a- Did you say we're awful? We're awful. We're awful. We're awful. Well, so he's got a distinctive dick. Yes.

It's Roger. Yes. It's Roger. Someone at the pub recognized him without ever knowing him. He's got a weird dick, just like the real guy. It's definitely him. Yeah. I wonder if it's just like his dick has like a specific mustache or something, you know, twirly sort of thing.

Or do you think that's possible when he was talking to the public and he said, tell me everything you know about the Titchford family. He said, well, they always have these strange mark on their left testicle. He's gone out, got a permanent marker, couple of circles on there, dropped his pants, dropped his trowel. Didn't even commit to a tattoo. No, a tattoo. Just like, you have one exam, the doctor's not going back in there.

And then you go, check it out, doc. There it is. Yep. And the doctor says, this is it. This is a Titchford penis. I never forget I thought. T is it. This is a Titchford penis. I never forget. Titchford. Titchborn.

Titchborn. The doctor is also. You're getting confused with Tickford because the old high performance Ford manufacturer. Yes, that is that's it. That's why. That's what I was thinking too. Yep.

So Thomas impressed people with his ability to recall small details of Roger Titchborne's early life, such as the specific fly fishing tackle he'd used. He's obsessed with tackle this guy. Several soldiers who had served with Roger recognized Thomas as Roger. They're like, yep, that's him. Okay. And you're in pretty close proximity with your fellow soldiers. That's right. I mean, you're with them so often that he'd probably

drop his pants and they'd recognise it. Yeah. I don't see how anyone, there can't be any doubt on this. Everyone agrees. Yeah. From Wikipedia, Rowan McWilliam in his account of the case calls this wide degree of recognition remarkable, particularly given the claimant's increasing physical differences from the slim Roger. By mid-June 1867, the claimant's weight had reached almost 300 pounds or 140 kilos. Oh, right. It's honestly incredible. The rate that this man can gain weight.

He was 86 when you first read out this guy's weight. Yeah, and that was bigger than Roger. But you know where you don't put on weight? And now he's 140. You cock. You did. Yeah. Have you tried that though?

Tried putting, yeah. Putting on weight. I've tried to, what did you call it? Gain. I've tried to gain down there and yeah, pumps, all sorts of stuff. You forgot to shred. Just, yeah.

So far, not so good. Well, keep us updated. Okay. It's good to check in. I don't want to pry, so you just share with us whatever you feel comfortable. But it's important we all know. I've tried everything. He does.

I'm running out of ideas. Let us know if you've got any. I'm running out of ideas. Let us know if you've got any. So we've heard from the family doctor, the family solicitor, Roger's former fellow soldiers, people who knew him socially. But what does the extended Tichborne family think? Like the mum's surely final say. Totally. And she instantly said surely final say. Totally.

And she instantly said, that's my boy. Well the extended family almost unanimously declared him a fraud. Oh, the family who would otherwise get the estate? Yeah. Well, I wonder if they have any motivation to do that. Okay. They recognized Alfred Titchbourne's infant son, Henry Alfred, as the 12th baronet and wanted this imposter to stay away from the title.

They're like, that is not Roger. Right. Yeah, baby's a lot easier to get to sign your checks and stuff to keep you in. Yeah, that's right. In the life that you've grown accustomed. That's something that they might say. And working is deeply shameful to have a job. Yes.

Disgusting. Oh my God. I like that for Bridgerton. So, okay. I'll say again. Between, between. Between. Yeah.

What? Dancing. Bridgerton. Dancing to like. Bit of horizontal dancing if you know what I mean. What? Isn't that what I've been saying, but I've heard Bridgerton's pretty saucy. Jess watches Netflix with the parental lock-on, so it skips all the scenes.

So each episode only goes for four and a half minutes. Is that a thing that you can do? Because I would honestly... Sure, sure. Genuinely, I'm like, some shows I'm like, all right, we get it. Yeah. This loves making scene is going for minutes. All right, guys. I got it. It's going for minutes. All right, guys.

I got it. It's going for minutes. That's unrealistic. It's taken me out of the scene. Stop rubbing it in, okay? I get they're allowed to have sex. Do I have to watch it? It's out in space.

I'm like, well, this is a bit far fetched. I will say again, so I've mentioned his size a couple of times and that feels like a bit of a gross detail to mention so much, but it is one of the main arguments made against him is that like, that he is sort of a different body shape and he's quite a lot heavier than Roger was. That is, that's not a good argument. I know, but this one, this other main argument is slightly more important. Okay.

So Lady Titchborne's brother denounced Thomas as a fraud when he found that he neither spoke nor understood French, which was Roger's first language as a child. Oh, yes. As a child, you forget that stuff. And he lacked any trace of a French accent. So I did mention before that Roger spoke with a French accent. You totally did, but he lived in Wagga. Yeah.

That's a specific accent. They'll beat that out of you. They You totally did, but he lived in Wagga. Yeah. That's a specific accent. They'll beat that out of you. They'll beat that out of you down in Wagga. If you don't change in Wagga, they'll let you, they will, they will run you out of town. They don't like Frenchies there. No, famously. He's done that to survive.

Bulldogs or humans. And I'm glad you guys are saying this because I've written down, the argument could be made, language is one of those things. If you don't use it, you lose it. And that's definitely true of your first language. And you can certainly lose your first language and accent in a 13 year period. Yeah, if you have a bonk on the head, all the language went to the egg. If you lost the egg, the egg said, oh, mon amie.

Yeah. Honestly, have you ever got a few days without speaking to another person and then you try to form a sentence and you're like, yeah, you know? Yeah. Now try that for 13 years. 13 years, no French. Okay. First language gone. I think that's pretty unreasonable of his uncle to be like, that's not him.

He doesn't have a French accent. Okay. No. So yeah, I think the uncle's got a point there. The white thing. Yeah. The white thing. Your body's white thing. Your body, your bodies can change. Accents and language. Your first language.

You regress to your first language. That's what happens. If anything, if you're going to forget anything, it's the second language. And maybe let's say you're not instantly completely fluent, but you're going to have a bit of that left, right? You're going to understand the basics at the very least. And then hopefully, usually people will pick it up as they are exposed to it again. Yes, yes, yes. You'd think, but this guy's dick, let's not forget. Yeah, he's got the dick malformation. He's got a very specific dick. The specific dick, I did forget about that. This is tricky. This is a tricky one.

It's hard. I once got knocked back from Wild Bill's club in Southland. Was that the lowest point of your life? No, there's been others. I can't come in there, really? The bouncer, because the bouncer said that my hair color was different on the ID, saying it was a fake ID.

I'm like, it's not, firstly. Secondly, you can change your hair colour. That can't be the reason for not letting me in. I do it every six to eight weeks. That's absurd. Yeah. It's like the light, it just looks different in that photo, that's all. But if the security guard got you to drop trout, you would have been straight in there. Yeah, international listeners won't know on

the back of our IDs is a very graphic photo. Tasteful. Yeah, tasteful. But detailed. Yes, high def. Yes. Holographic. Yeah, yeah. What's that on the back of women's? What's the same area? Yeah. Yeah, the crotch. Yeah. All graphic. Like snowfl Yeah, the crotch. Yeah. All graphic. Like snowflakes.

All different. No two of the same. Yeah. Wow. The labia majora, labia minora. Do you want me to keep going? Yeah, if you want to keep naming other. So, yeah, that one is it. That's a big one.

He's lost his language and accent. Hmm. That swung me back. This pendulum keeps swinging. Yeah, it's exciting, isn't it? Much like a mouthful. So Thomas also struggled to identify several family members and he complained about attempts to catch him out by presenting him with imposters. They were not imposters.

He's like, oh, you're trying to trick me. Nice try. Trying to trick me, bringing in strangers. I've never seen them before in my life. It's like, that's your cousin. That's the cousin you were in love with. Yeah. That you probably had sex with.

That's your sexy cousin. We've all got a sexy cousin. Don't worry about it. Well, if you don't, maybe you are. You are the sexy cousin. It's not me. It's not me. You're thinking of a specific hot cousin? Well.

I have like 40 cousins. Yeah. Chances are for you actually. There's a lot of hotties. Yeah. Same here. Yeah. They're all pretty much, you know, they've got my genes.

Yeah, that's right. If they're all added to you, they've got to be. Yeah. They're me times 10. Smoke shows. I'm actually, well, probably like dead last hottest in our extended family. Really? Yeah. Yeah.

You're the lowest. Yeah. And you're already this hot. Yeah, I know. Can't even imagine. Holy shit. Can you imagine number one? My gosh. I think that's too much actually.

I couldn't handle that. Probably got no personality, right? Too beautiful. Yeah, I think so. All dull. Cruise through life. Yeah. Yeah. All very dull people, but very attractive.

Yeah, yeah. So, okay, he can't identify family members. He had given Vincent Gosford, a former steward of the family, a sealed package before he'd left back in 1853. Thomas could not remember the contents. Now that, I'm sort of like, I mean, just reading about the stat deck before I'm like, where is the stat deck? Where do I put that?

I can't, I don't know where anything is. That's not true. But you know what I mean? Something I put away 14 years ago, I'm not like, oh, I know exactly what was in there. Before he left. Before he left, the real guy, if this is not the real guy, gave the, and they were like, what's in here? Yeah.

Gotcha. And he's like, I don't know. I don't know. I don't remember. Can you remember the mail you brought in last week and where you put it? Fuck no. No. Probably the bin. Yeah.

So I don't, I don't know if I necessarily trust that one. The extended family believes that Thomas had acquired pieces of information from sources like Boggle and other people in close proximity to the family. And it used these small pieces of information to convince them he was Roger. So he's just sort of like doing his research, remembering as much as he can. Playing boggle, getting a separate certain set of words coming up. Okay. Yes.

Mustache. He boggled his own mind. Bookshelf. Lady Titchborne throughout all of this never changed her mind. She was unmoved when Father Shat- Shatilun, Roger's childhood tutor, declared that he was an imposter. Oh. Even then she's like, no. But childhood, I don't know about childhood ones.

Yeah. That's, you're going to change the most from childhood. Yeah. The only other person in the extended family that believed Thomas was a distant cousin called Anthony John Wright Biddulph. Sorry, what's the last one? Biddulph. Biddulph. Beautiful, what's the last one? Biddleff. Biddleff.

Beautiful name, boy or girl. However, as long as Lady Titchbaum was alive and maintaining her support, Thomas's position remained strong. She set him up with an income of a thousand pounds a year, which was a considerable sum at the time. Wow. And he was just living his best life. He underwent a judicial examination in July of 1867. This is a story he gave after his arrival in Melbourne in July 1954.

Just a couple of years before the Olympics. If he just stuck around. Oh my gosh. He had worked. Surely it was 1854. Just 102 years before the Olympics. So close. I was going to say he lived a life.

But you do that too every time. It's 18, I think 19. It's my millennial bug. Yeah. Millennial bug? What's the actual thing? Millennium, but I thought you were doing a very clever joke. I was doing a very clever joke.

That's what that was. That was a very clever joke. Very clever. Anytime you're confused or I sound confused, I'm being clever. I'm being very clever joke. That's what that was. That was a very clever joke. Very clever. Anytime you're confused or I sound confused, I'm being clever. I'm being very clever. And if you don't quite get it, that's on you. Yeah. So he arrived in July of 1854, 102 years before the Olympics, and he worked for

William Foster at a cattle station in Gippsland under the name Thomas Castro. While there, he'd met Arthur Orton, a fellow Englishman. After leaving Foster's employment, Thomas had subsequently wandered the country, sometimes with Orton, working in various capacities before setting up a butcher in Wagga Wagga in 1865. That's quite a long time there. On the basis of this information, the Titchborne family sent an agent, John McKenzie, to Australia to make further inquiries. McKenzie located Foster's widow, who produced the old station records.

These showed no reference to Thomas Castro, although the employment of an Arthur Orton was recorded. Foster's widow also identified a photograph of the claimant and said, yeah, that's Arthur Orton. OK. And that's the same name he went to the Orton's house and said, tell them their son's very rich now. So he went to the Orton's place and they didn't recognise him? They weren't there.

Oh. He said to a neighbour. He said, hey, when they get back, tell the family they've got a rich son now. Anyway. He's fine. He's in Australia. He's he's rich interesting in Wagga Wagga one local resident recalled the butcher castro saying that he'd learned his trade in whapping in a whapping is that a different place which is where Thomas had visited the Orton family yes okay okay during silent period, just after I'd said 12 swans are whapping,

they went to the Swan Hotel and I'm like... And that's, yeah, and you should do a little bit more of that because... Another two? Oh, like Swan! Like a swan from the Swan for a whapping! You know, like it wouldn't have been that funny. We'll go for another two. No, no, no, I'm just saying... You don't know what I would have done with it.

I would have weaved something quite beautiful there. And Dave would have said that was really clever. And I said, what was? Yeah. What was? What happened? So this is very interesting. It's quite interesting. So they send this information back and then a private detective, ex-police inspector Jack Witcher, he does a bit of looking around as well. And he discovered that Thomas had visited the area shortly upon his arrival in England. Hmm.

Sus. Well, he visited Wapping you mean? Yeah. Oh, okay. Okay. So that's very interesting because this, Thomas Castro said he learnt to be a butcher in Wapping. Hmm. And, oh, he visited Wapping and asked about the autons.

And there is an auton on the records of that farm, but not a Thomas Castro. How very peculiar. Unfortunately for Thomas, Lady Titchborne died in March of 1868. And as she was his only source of income and the main advocate for him being Roger, he was a little bit screwed.

He outraged the family by insisting on taking the position of chief mourner at her funeral. Now I didn't know that was a position. Wow. Would you just get to cry a little louder? You just sort of lead the mourning. Okay. Yeah. He insisted and did he, was he allowed?

He insisted and he did take the position of chief mourner. He's lost income is rapidly replaced by a fund set up by supporters that provided a house and an income of 1400 pound a year, equivalent of about 160,000 pound. Wow. And so that's actually a raise now. Yeah. He's got an arraise from mum's death. And is that family that do believe him putting support, as you say?

It's more like, I think it's more family friends. There's really only the one cousin in the family who believes that he is Roger. Yep. Everybody else doesn't, so it's not family, but I think it's kind of, it's caused a bit of a stir and later on he has quite a lot of public support. So I think it's probably a bit of public support and also just like wealthy people around him. Yeah, wow. And yeah. In September of 1868, together with his legal team, Thomas went to South America

to meet face to face with potential witnesses in Chile who might confirm his identity. He disembarked at Buenos Aires, sensibly to travel overland, and then he would rejoin his advisors who were continuing by sea. So they let him off. He was like, I'm going to go via land. I'll meet you. And they keep sailing. Don't know why.

And he did that ostensibly. Yep. What does that mean? I don't know. I'm quoting. Okay. It's kind of like practically, right? Yeah.

Okay. I'm doing ostensibly. Ostensibly. Oh ostensibly. Yeah. Okay. It's kind of like practically, right? Yeah. Okay. I'm doing ostensibly. Ostensibly. Oh, ostensibly. Yeah. Okay.

I thought you said ostensibly. Ostensibly. Yeah, I'm like ostensibly. I'm like, I don't know what, that's a beautiful word if it exists. After waiting two months in Buenos Aires, he caught a ship home. His explanation for this sudden retreat was poor health and the danger from highway robbers. And that did not convince his backers, many of whom withdrew their support. And Holmes, the solicitor, resigned, resigned.

Furthermore, on their return, his advisors reported that no one in Chile had heard of Titchborne, although they remembered a young English sailor called Arturo. Arturo like Arthur? Oh. Oh. So let's hear a little bit about Arthur and see if any of it fits with the story that we've heard so far. Wild to if he is a fake to go there. Yeah. Like you can be like, oh, hopefully, hopefully somehow I can. And if he is a fake and if he is Arthur Orton, why did you ever bring up the name Arthur Orton, you fucking idiot? Yeah. Shut up. So let's hear about Arthur.

See if any of this lines up, because maybe it doesn't. Maybe it's sounds like complete bullshit. So Arthur Orton was a butcher's son born on March 1834 in Wapping, had gone to sea as a boy and had been in Chile in the early 1850s. Sometime in 1852, he arrived in Hobart, Tasmania, in the transport ship Middleton and later moved to mainland Australia. His employment by foster at Gippsland terminated around 1857 with a dispute over wages. Thereafter he disappeared.

Thomas hinted that some of his activities with Orton were of a criminal nature and that to confound the authorities, they had sometimes exchanged names. Oh, OK. Interestingly, a former sweetheart of Orton's, Mary Ann Loder, did identify a photo of Thomas as Arthur Orton. Huh. So that's two different people that knew Arthur have seen a picture now of Thomas and said, well, yeah, that's Arthur. Wow. Yeah.

But even more have IDed him as Roger. Roger. So, you know, what does that even mean? I'm starting to wonder if people know what people look like back there. I know. How is this happening? And what's very funny is there was a little note that said like some of the photographic evidence they had was dismissed in court cases because people were worried about how photos

could be manipulated in the 1800s. I'm like, they're going to lose their fucking minds. So now Thomas is bankrupt because the people who were funding him are now pretty sure he's full of shit. Oh. So his new legal advisors launched a cute little fundraising scheme, Titch-Born Bonds, the holders of which would be repaid with interest when the claimant obtained his inheritance. That's brilliant. Somehow around £40,000 were raised.

Wow. Allowing Thomas to keep up his living and legal expenses for quite some time. 40,000, his mum was giving him a thousand a year. He's just made 40 years salary. Yes. I hope he doesn't spend it all at once. How could you? Back that up, that's crazy.

The case ends up going to trial and Thomas's team are obviously wanting to establish that he is in fact Sir Roger Titchborne. Because in addition to Titchborne Park, which is like a 2,300 acre estate, the estate also included manors, land and farms in Hampshire, considerable properties in London and elsewhere, which altogether produce an annual income of over £20,000, which is equivalent to about £2.3 million now. So it's quite a big estate. Wow. So they really want to win and they want to prove that he is Roger Titchborne because

all of this, it's sort of high stakes. In his opening speech, William Ballantyine made much of Roger Titchborne's unhappy childhood, his overbearing father, his poor education and his frequently unwise choices of companions. The claimant's experience in an open boat following the wreck of the Bella had, said Ballentine, impaired his memories of his earlier years, which explained his uncertain recall. So they're saying exactly what we were saying.

Egg. Egg. It's the egg. It's the egg. It's the French speaking egg. He's had a bonk on the head. That's right. What's the French word for bonk? Probably bonk. Ed bonk. Yeah, thank you. Are they going to put the egg on the stand? I hope so, but hopefully it's well dressed.

The problem is, if you put the egg on the stand. You put a little, um, um, judge's wig on it and then it can get cross examined and you don't, you just, I don't know if it would stand up, you know, don't you reckon under like that kind of pressure under heat? Yeah. Oh my gosh. They might crack. Don't crack the egg. Yeah. Um, we'll need a translator. It's a French speaking egg.

You do a bit of French. Ah bonjour. 600 day streak. Oh yes. Did you know? I got the notification. It came up on my watch before. Dave, he had a, Dave and I are friends on Duolingo and he's got a 600 day streak today.

Can I just say, it always asks me to send you a high five for doing something. Yeah. Have you ever sent me a high five? No, it's never told me that. I've got a high five. I congratulated you today for that streak. Oh my gosh, I'm going to open it right now. But I don't think I've sent you high fives, no. 600 days, let's see. Maybe it's because I've just started. I'm at like day 16 or 17 or something. Day 600, this is Duolingo we're talking about, I'm not sure if we mentioned that. Yeah. Where does it start? I don't know. 600 days streak.

I've got three freezes for that. That's pretty good. That's pretty good. Friends. Anything? Nothing from you. Brutal. No congratulations whatsoever.

That's bizarre. Cause look, I pressed celebrated. Oh, well thank you so much. Add a comment here. I'll add a comment. Thank you very much. I look forward to receiving your praise tonight when I'm back on there. And I'm doing it at 11 55 PM. You're going shit, shit, shit.

I've got to keep the string going shit, shit, shit. This is definitely the best way to learn shit, shit, shit. It's always right as we're getting into bed. I'm like, sorry. Are you trying to get some sleep? Yeah, no worries. Um, vodai. I'm talking loudly into my phone.

Beautiful noise. That's good stuff. Okay. So attempts to identify his client as Arthur Orton were, Ballantyne argued, the concoctions of irresponsible private investigators acting for the Titchborne family. He's like, that's, they're just, they're lying. Yeah, they're lying. I mean, because they've got best interests for him to not be the guy.

Thomas was called to the stand and answered questions about Arthur Orton. He described him as a large boned man with sharp features and a lengthy face slightly marked with small pox. described him as a large boned man with sharp features and a lengthy face slightly marked with small pox. He'd lost sight of Orton between 1862 and 65, but they'd met again in Wagga Wagga. After questioning him on his visit to Wapping, Hawkins asked him directly, are you Arthur Orton? To which he replied, I am not.

So okay, there you have it. I don't understand why this gets so drawn out. Case closed. He's done the stat deck. Yes. And now he's on the stand in front of the judge. He's like, no, I'm not after all. Probably swearing on a Bible.

What more do you want? Yeah. Honestly, bizarre. The, from Wikipedia again, the claimant, that's Thomas, displayed considerable ignorance when questioned about his time at Stonyhurst, the boarding school. He confused Latin with Greek, did not understand what chemistry was. He caused a sensation when he declared that he had seduced Catherine Doherty and that the sealed package given to Gosford, the contents of which

he earlier claimed to not recall, contained instructions to be followed in the event of her pregnancy. Oh, scandalous. That's very scandalous. So he's remembering this stuff now? Yeah, before he was like, I don't know what's in there. Oh, I wonder how he found out then. Well.

But maybe- It just came back to him. If it was something like that, maybe he's like, well, I won't say in polite- You don't want to say in front of your mum. Yes. You know, you've got- Well, he fucked your cousin. That makes sense.

Yeah. Whoa. That's scandalous. The pendulum's just swung back. Yeah. So Rowan McWilliam, who's written a lot about this, says in his Chronicle of the Affair, comments that from the point, from that point on, the Titchborne family were fighting not only for their estates, but for Catherine Doherty's honor. Oh, OK.

Unbelievable. In early July, the court adjourned for four months when it it resumed, the prosecution had over 200 witnesses ready to be called and their intention was to prove that the claimant was Arthur Orton. Turns out they didn't need to call 200 witnesses. On the 4th of March, the jury notified the judge they'd heard enough. They were just like, please make it stop. We get it. So they were ready to reject this suit. So Thomas was arrested on charges of perjury

and was sent to Newgate prison. Oh no. From his cell in Newgate, he vowed to resume the fight as soon as he was acquitted. He, in March, 1872, he published in the Evening Standard, an appeal to the public requesting financial help to meet his legal and living costs. And he wrote, I appeal to every British soul who is inspired by a love of justice and fair play and is willing to defend the weak against the strong.

I mean, he's a baronet. I think he's in the strong category. But anyway, he gained considerable popular support during the civil trial. His fight was perceived by many as symbolising the problems faced by the working class when seeking justice in the courts. When he was bailed in early April, a large crowd gathered and cheered as he was released. So it's big news now. It's a big story.

The front page after that with all the cheering would have been, Orton, here's a woo. Could have been. Could have been. Wow. Print that right now. Print that. Front page. Gerald's on. That's huge. Please keep going. We can't wallow in this. You've got to keep moving. I'm sorry, but that was really good. Okay. I wanted to wallow a little.

Please let's not wallow. I was looking at you with love and adoration. I appreciate that. And I know you were misinterpreting that as I was about to be mean to you. But that was... You would have rightfully done it. That was pure love. You were like silenced with... Yeah. Astonishment.

And that that takes a bit. Because normally when I'm astonished, I go, ah! Ah! Ah! Ah! I started yelling like that playing a video game last night because a baddie was chasing me. Oh no!

Anyway the criminal case went to trial in 1873 and given its expected length the case was scheduled as a trial at bar, a device that allowed a panel rather than one judge to hear it. You know that's the the St. Kilda football club was formed? 1873. Yeah. Wow. How about that? You can believe it.

A one premiership in that whole time. Yeah, that's right. Wow. They suck. Yeah. I've never actually put that together, but yeah, now that I think about that length of time. Well, they've sucked, you know, for 152 of the 153 seeds or whatever it is.

But how are the boys looking this year? The boys looking this year? Hey, we're building something. We're building something. I don't think you'll cope if they win. The boys and the girls. I think, yeah. I think your heart might stop.

I think they're both going to win. Have the women won a premiership either? No. Have they been close? You would have heard about that. Yeah, yeah. No, they haven't been close. Okay. Because I was. They've, yeah. No, they haven't been close. Okay.

Because I've... They've, they've, they've held up their end of the bargain. They... They knew what they were signing up for. They get it. They get it. They haven't played finals. I don't think the women could come in.

The men... In the first few years win a premiership, like it was, you know, people that'd be... The men did play finals two seasons ago. Yeah. And you've been in the grand final. Yeah. A few times in your lifetime. Only 15 years ago. Just losing it. Yeah.

Yeah, it was, they drew it. Yeah, that's right. Let's not talk about it. I agree. Because yes, that was the year the St Kilda Football Club was formed. Oh Jess, if you do want to hear more, I think we did a five hour episode about it. Still haven't listened to that one. Really?

Likely won't. That's weird. Really? No offense. Love you all very much. Yeah, I was there. Too long. I've heard people say it's a really good episode.

I'm feeling bored of this report I'm doing right now. Me too. That's a lie, I'm only joking. I'm loving it. Let's move it along. What's happening? I know, it's a bit wild, isn't it? Is it him or is it not? That's exciting., I'm only joking, I'm loving it. Let's move it along. What's happening? I know, it's a bit wild, isn't it?

Is it him or is it not? That's exciting. I'm unsure. Yeah. But he's still in prison. He's in prison. He's in front of the bar now. I think I'm leaning more towards it not being him, but yeah, I really, you're going to say

something in a minute and I'm going to, oh no, it is him. Exactly. So panel of judges. So his legal team was significantly weaker this time. His previous team would not re-engage with him. Others declined as well, possibly because they knew they would have to present evidence concerning the seduction of Catherine Doherty and that would be sort of like the Titchborne family are powerful.

And also that's just like pretty gross. His backers eventually engaged Edward Keneally, who Rowan McWilliams described as an Irish lawyer of acknowledged gifts, but known eccentricity. Okay. He's a little bit of a cook. The trial, one of the lengthiest cases heard in English court, began on the 21st of April, 1873 and lasted until the 28th of Feb, 1874, occupying 188 court days. Wow.

The tone was dominated by Keneally's confrontational style. His personal attacks extended not only to witnesses, but also to the bench. Wow. This is- Fuck you! Fuck you! I'm imagining- That's eccentric.

I'm imagining Brendan Fraser's character in Killers of the Flower Moon. Remember he was just- Oh, God. Yeah. He came on about two and a half hours in, went for ten minutes and was just doing a funny voice yelling at people. I was imagining like crazier hair, almost Einstein-ish type hair too. Oh yeah, that's great.

I don't know why. Anyway, so he's just dominating the courtroom, but not in a good way. Altogether 215 witnesses were called, including people from France, Chile, Australia, and whopping who testified either that the claimant was not Roger Titchborne or that he was Arthur Orton. It's kind of the same thing. I guess they're regardless. They're saying definitely not Roger.

A handwriting expert stated that Thomas's writing resembled that of Arthur Orton, but had no resemblance to Roger Titchborne's. riding resembled that of Arthur Orton, but had no resemblance to Roger Titchborne's. The entire story of the rescue by the Osprey was a fraud. A ship of that name had arrived in Melbourne in July of 1854, but it did not correspond to the claimant's description. Furthermore, he'd provided the wrong name for the captain of that ship and the names he gave for two crew members were found to belong To crew of the Middleton the ship that he had taken to Hobart Right. So like he's sort of forgetting that all this shit's written down. Yeah, okay

given evidence on the contents of the sealed packet, so Gosford originally was like, all right, you gave me a packet before you left, what was in it? And he said, I don't remember. And now in a scandalous way, he said, it was what to do if Catherine's pregnant. And everyone went, oh! Wow. But Gosford takes the stand now and revealed that it contained information regarding the

disposition of certain properties and nothing related to Catherine Doherty's seduction or pregnancy or anything to do with her. But does he have the package still? Because he could have been paid off by the family. Yeah, yeah. Oh, okay. He opened it. Oh, wow. That's cool. What a wild guess for him to have gotten. So, all right, I'm swinging hard doubt. If it is mad, it feels like he just keeps trying to buy himself more time to try and, alright, I'm patting myself into a corner, but I'll work it out.

It could be right. Like, it says giving evidence on the contents of the sealed packet. Maybe, maybe Gosford is being like, no, it was about property. Yeah. Maybe. And the family have slipped in, you know. But there's still not enough. I don't know.

There's still not quite enough. Yeah. More sensational testimony came from a sailor called Jean-Louis, who claimed that he'd been on the Osprey during the rescue mission. Louis identified the claimant as Mr. Rogers, which his first name was Roger, one of six survivors picked up and taken to Melbourne. On investigation, Louis was found to be an imposter, a former prisoner who had been in England at the time of the Bellis sinking.

He was convicted of perjury and sentenced to seven years in prison. Oh, that's a big sentence. I it's it's a bit tricky because the team with cash, as in the family, they're shipping people in from all over the world. They're obviously only shipping in people who are going to back them up. Yeah, of course they are. There might be people in Wagga Wagga and wherever who are like, no, we'd agree that he's really him. They're like, oh, we don't want to talk to you then.

Yeah, don't pay for their ticket. Yeah. Because otherwise, I mean, it feels like they're bringing people from all around the world. This would be expensive. Yeah. You know, just saying. But a bit- Leading your witness to a- Thomas has Mackers who have put a lot of. Yeah. You know, just saying. But a bit. Leading your witness.

Thomas has backers who have put a lot of money in. He's got backers. He's got backers. Bloody hell. He's got financial backers. So they could also be bringing people in who who are. OK, yeah. Defending him and saying he is Roger Titchmore.

But yeah, OK. And that's what he did, I guess, with that prisoner. Yeah, with that prisoner that they paid to lie. Yeah. And was he even French? I don't think so. He's like, I guess, with that prisoner. Yeah, with that prisoner that they paid to lie. Yes. And was he even French? I don't think so. He's like, I lost my accent. I've been in England for three days.

Check out me egg. The jury retired at noon on Saturday the 28th of February and returned to court within 30 minutes. Their verdict declared that the claimant was not Roger Titchborne, that he had not seduced Catherine Doherty and that he was indeed Arthur Orton. He was thus convicted of perjury. He was sentenced to 14 years imprisonment. Oh, dear. The lawyer, Keneally.

Yeah, it's not going well. But so Keneally, for his behaviour in court, ended his legal career. Whoa. Because of his behaviour. Yes. They like, they disbarred him basically. Cause he was such a, he was so full on and threatening. Fuck you, fuck you, fuck you. But don't worry.

You can't say that to the judge. Don't worry. In February of 1875, he fought a parliamentary by-election for Stokes upon Trent as the People's candidate and won with a resounding majority. So he went on to be a politician. Perfect. You'd be pretty annoyed getting seven years for lying when the guy who actually did the crime only got double that. Yeah. In the years of the Titchborne movement's popularity,

a considerable market was created for souvenirs in the forms of medallions, china figurines, tea cloths and other merch. But by 1880, interest in the case had declined and in the general election of that year, Keneally was heavily defeated. So he was kind of riding that wave for a little while as well. So Thomas, or more probably Arthur, ended up serving 10 years and was released in October of 1884. Throughout his imprisonment, he maintained that he was Roger Titchborne.

Upon release he signed a contract to tour with musicals and circuses, but the British public's enthusiasm had waned. He went to New York in 1886, but no one there really cared about his story and he ended up just bartending for a while. I mean he's got a wife and kids back in London. It's so funny the people they got touring back then. Remember this guy? He said he was someone, God said he wasn't.

Well, here he is, have a look at him. Here he is with a band. Yeah. Isn't that bizarre? So strange. He returned in 1887 to England where, although not officially divorced from Mary Ann Bryant, he married a music hall singer, Lily Enevar. Scandalously, in 1895, for a fee of a few hundred pounds, he confessed in

the People newspaper that he was, after all, Arthur Orton. Oh my God. For a few hundred pounds. With the proceeds, he opened a small tobacco shop. He quickly retracted the confession and insisted again that he was Roger Titchborne. He just wanted the cash. Just wanted the money to open a shop. The shop failed as did many other business attempts and all good things must come to an end. And he died destitute of heart disease in April, 1898. Didn't even get to see Australia federate.

And he loved Australia. He loved Australia. So commenters have generally accepted that Thomas was Arthur Auden all along. He was not Roger Titchborne. But there are theories and questions still floating around. A lot of today's report has come from the writings of Douglas Woodruff, who published a massive study on this case in 1957. He posits that Thomas very well may have been Roger Titchborne.

Woodruff's principal argument is the sheer improbability that anyone could conceive such an imposture from scratch at such a distance and then implement it. Which really? Yeah, no. Another theory was brief. To me, it just sounded like he heard the singer, you vaguely look like this guy. And then bit by bit he- Yeah, he pieced it together. He built the lie up.

Yeah, it didn't sound like it had a full ingenious plan. No. No. It seemed like it kind of maybe shared a vague resemblance and tried to capitalise on it. I reckon if he, yeah, if it was a genius plan, he would have had a French tutor on that long voyage over. Yeah, he got three months. Yeah.

Just go full immersion. Learn some words. Learn some French. Another theory was go full immersion, learn some French. Another theory was briefly explored while Thomas was in prison. A man named William Cresswell, who was an inmate of a Sydney mental asylum, claimed that he was Arthur Orton. Oh. There was circumstantial evidence that indicated some connection with Orton, but nothing came

of this claim. There were obviously some uncertainties and inconsistencies with the entire story. To explain the degree of facial resemblance between Thomas and the Titchborne family, some people speculated that Orton's mother, a woman named Mary Kent, was an illegitimate daughter of Sir Henry Titchborne, Roger Titchborne's grandfather. So they're saying maybe he was like an illegitimate family member. Which is why there was some resemblance. Yeah.

And why he had the weird- The weird- Weird wang. Oh. Not run of the family. Yeah. So what about the weird wang? An alternative story was that Mary Kent was seduced by James Titchborne making Orton and Roger half brothers. So maybe he was somehow a half brother of-

Gosh, that would be so wild. And then he just finds out about the whole case whilst living in Australia. He goes, all right, I'll pretend to be, pretend to be this even, even though he might actually be a half brother. That would be so wild. Other versions have Orton and Roger as companions in crime in Australia, with Orton killing Roger and assuming his identity. Like, that doesn't sound like he knew enough.

No. To have, like, learnt everything and then hung out with this guy. That sounds like the novelised version of this. Yeah. Well. At what point do you think he learned about the cousin affair? For him to make that guess at the package? Who knows? But the claimant's daughter, Theresa Mary Agnes. So remember he had two daughters with his wife.

I wanted to ask earlier on, were they allowed to live with him the whole time when he was pretending to be- I think so, yeah. So they did live this life of luxury for a while and then rode their wave with him. Yes. And his daughter, Theresa, maintained that her father confessed to her that he had killed Arthur Orton. Oh.

There's no direct evidence of any of these theories. Theresa continued to proclaim her identity as a titch-borne daughter and in 1924 was imprisoned for making threats and demands for money to the family. So it seems like it runs in the blood. With theories and doubts hanging over the case, Woodruff wrote in 1957, probably forever now, it's key, long since lost, a mystery remains. A mystery episode? It's a mystery episode.

Oh, boy. It's a mystery episode. But it's widely believed it was Arthur Orton. But it's a mystery episode. But it's widely believed it was Arthur Orton. But it's a mystery episode. Wow. The daughter is saying that he killed Arthur Orton. Yeah, he was Roger Titchborne. They knew each other in Australia.

Dad killed Arthur Orton. Where Titchborne's? I think in the end. And then she went to prison because she kept harassing the family to give her money. What do you think? In the end, it feels like he was a fraud and he was, it seems, is that relatively clear? I think my favourite detail is that he didn't speak any French. Yeah. But the dick.

But the dick. But the dick. But the dick. If I read a book about this, I'd call it, But the Dick. But the dick. How are you spelling butt? That confused readership. Oh, this sounds good. That's probably what you want, I guess. Yeah. Yeah. Could you just get? Oh good one. Confused readership. Oh this sounds good.

That's probably what you want I guess, yeah. Yeah. Because you just get their money. Yeah. No refunds. No refunds? No refunds. Oh okay.

That's on the front cover. What a story, what a tale. And I, it's amazing how little of that I recall. Yeah. But that brings us to everyone's favorite section of the show, I believe. This is where we thank the people who make this show possible, our beautiful Patreon supporters. If you want to be one of them, sign up at patreon.com slash to go on pod, a bunch of

different levels depending on what you're into. You know, you get bonus episodes, we do four a month, including a bonus report, a D&D campaign. We do like a game or something like that. And we do a movie club. The most recent movie club was about Paddington, the first of the films. It was really wholesome. And I think Michelle Brazier was a guest. That's right. And yeah, you also get access to the Facebook group, which is generally the nicest corner of the internet. You get shout outs and all sorts of stuff. I get to vote on topics like, was today's topic a vote?

Yes, it was. There you go. One, it was one of four put up and it had, I think about 50% of the vote. Wow. And I think, I'm swear I've put it up before too. It's so funny how that happens sometimes. The Titchpon case had the popularity of a runaway train. They're very popular runaway trains.

One of the things people can get involved with on the Patreon is on the Sydney Schomburg level or above, you get to be in the fact, quote or question section, which has a jingle, I think, go something like this. Fact, quote or question section, which has a jingle, I think go something like this. Fact, quote or question. Bing. Always remembers the ding. She always remembers the sing.

The first one this week comes from Piper Gallaher, AKA Prince of the Halflings. I don't read these out till I read them out. I should say that. And Piper offering us a suggestion writing, howdy, howdy, David, David, David, David. I know you've said you intend on reading the Lord of the Rings book at some point in the future.

Just watch the movie. They're pretty good. One of the reasons, yeah, sorry, I'll let this finish. Let this finish. We'll get this over and done this. I'm speaking about Matt, not the. I think I remember you saying that for Book Cheat, you often read a hard copy and listen to an audio book of the same text.

My recommendation is that when slash if you do listen to these books, you listen to the versions narrated by the monkey houses household God, Andy circus. Oh wow. They got the guy. They got the circ. That's good stuff. The golem the whole time? The golem voice? The whole thing is going,

hmm, and my ax precious. What's up with that? Is that kind of something? Yeah. Is that a good reference? He narrated all three books, as well as The Hobbit, the Silmarillion during the heart of the COVID pandemic.

And they're the single most delightful audio books I've ever heard. Robert the Silmarillion during the heart of the COVID pandemic. And they're the single most delightful audio books I've ever heard. And that's a large pool I'm drawing from just to be clear. A story has never sounded more alive or engaging than hearing his voices and inflections throughout the saga. That sounds great actually. It also causes me to laugh at times because some of his voices sound like Matt's when he says, what you toilet? I depart with, oh man, how formal is that?

I depart. I depart with one of my favourite quotes from The Hobbit. Matt, do this in the funny toilet voice. I bet it would be funny. The funny toilet voice. All right, do it in the toilet voice. All right, do it in the toilet voice. All right, here we go. If more of us value food and cheer and song above ordered gold, it will be a merrier world, you toilet.

The you toilet bits outside the quote, but it still counts. Yeah. Much love and remember to pack your pocket handkerchiefs. I'm guessing that's a that's a reference to a Hobbit. Oh, thank you. Now, one of the things is I do feel like I'm like, I have enough. Does everyone know the story already because everyone's seen the movies? But a lot of people do request it, so maybe.

Yeah. Maybe people want the book on Bookcheat anyway. But yeah. Why don't you do that third, that one that I've not heard of before, The Simillion or whatever. I think that's kind of like the Bible kind of thing of- Oh, for wine, right? Even if you- I think it's actually, even if you've seen the movies, the books are obviously

so different. And even if you've read the books before, you can forget. Similian is a book consisting of collection of myths and stories, I think, about the world. So yeah, I could do that. Big fan of Stephen Friar. Awesome. Love his work. Great.

He does a good job. He is delightful. He's kind of the king of the audiobook, isn't he? He was in the recent Star Wars TV show as well. Was he? Yeah, as a voice of a robot, I think. Bit of fun. Bit of fun. Bit of fun.

Next one comes from Kevin Packrad, aka Leopoldo the Blue Blumo Po-wo. I hope I've said that right. I think you nailed that. Yeah, that feels right. Plus music to my ears. And Kevin's offering a fact writing, Hey, mates, fair warning. This will probably be the longest fact, quote or question I will ever do. I hope that it is all right. And I just, just to warn everybody, Kevin has not split this into paragraphs. I hope that it is all right as I'm going to talk

about something I'm very passionate about. What I'm referring to, of course, is James Joyce in the recent episode you did. Not just his horny letters, although I was aware, but I'm a passionate lover of his other writings. So much so that I've read maybe four or five separate books about the man and his works. But never his work. Just books about the man. Certainly not. I think my first fact, quite a question, back in 2018 was actually a fact about Bloom's day,

the holiday dedicated to Joyce and the day his novel Ulysses takes place on 16th of June, 1904. Maybe Matt remembers that this is also the date when James and his lifelong partner, Nora's first rendezvous took place, where she pulled him off. I do remember that. I think for a long time though,

you'll see this was something that called to my literary sense since before the time I was in high school. After many failed attempts, I've since managed to finally read the book all the way through starting in the second half of my last year in college when I bought the Cambridge Centenary Edition, which is a giant copy of the book that I decided to lug around campus like I was Sisyphus or something, and I like attention. It has earned the status of-

Excuse me, coming through, coming through. Sorry, I got a huge book here. Sorry, everybody. It has earned the status as one of my favourite books next to Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy and a Confederacy of Dunces. Both are available on the Bookcheek feed. Jeez, very Bookcheek.

That's true. Heavy, fat quarter question section. Appreciate that everyone. There's a new episode out right now, Sherlock Holmes, sign of the four. A portrait of the artist as a young man is the most blatantly obvious, but throughout Dubliners and Ulysses, most of the characters are either A, based on Joyce and the members of his family,

or B, based on real people that lived in Dublin that he knew. I've missed a bit here. This is referencing how a lot of his work is autobiographical. All right, gotcha, yes. I won't go into all of that background because there is a lot of it,

but I think you saw with The Dead that Joyce used his literature almost like a therapy session, but I don't think he ever really got over anything. Joyce had this problem that was very insecure, very idea that another man could have been in love with or been loved by his wife, Nora. In 1909 when visiting Dublin and away from Nora, he was staying with his former school friend Brian Cosgrove who appears as the character Lynch in his various works. Cosgrove told Joyce that she had cheated on

Joyce with him when they were younger, which was a lie, and Joyce ostensibly had a mental breakdown. Cosgrove made this accusation of a, of jealousy over Joyce's success with Nora, but Joyce took it very seriously and very nearly ending their relationship and writing a series of depressed letters to her over the course of a day. Oh my God, we are, I think we're over halfway here. James Joyce would be proud. But it's still this one paragraph.

I've lost myself again. It's a real stream of consciousness coming at you. That's right. He eventually gets over it, but it is funny because the idea of being a cuckold, weirdly enough, is a big part of his work. Eulessy's follows Leopold Bloom, a middle-aged ad canvasser who avoids going home because he knows his wife has plans to cheat on him and he does nothing about it. There are various reasons why he does this and talking about Ulysses can get very complicated very fast.

So I'll just say that Bloom is supposed to be Joyce, albeit an older version. Stephen Day-Dulles, Joyce's literary alter ego from a portrait, is also a main character in Ulysses. Bloom takes center stage throughout the majority of the book, but in this sort of way, the book acts as an opportunity for those two characters to meet. The book takes place over a single day, so you watch this the whole time as these characters pass each other by and wait till they actually meet. The meeting is also based on something that happened to Joyce but the whole point is that Joyce is writing about who he was and the person he wants to be. At the time Joyce said that if he was tired of Steven and was much more interested in Bloom as a

character and I will agree that Bloom is the best part of the book, partially because he is funny and has weird thoughts but partially because he is funny and has weird thoughts, but also because he is kind and flawed protagonist. The focal point between the two characters is Molly, Bloom's wife, who is very obviously Nora. And it turns out that the book is just one long and complicated love letter to her. I don't think I've ever seen someone so in love or so insecure, but I love the book anyways. It would be a challenge, but I would make for, it would make for a great few episodes on Bookcheat one day. I don't know.

You've done most of it here today. I don't know how Dave would do it, but there are several resources out there that you can use to help you through it. Cheers and thank you for indulging in this madness. Hey, thank you, Kevin Packrad. Two Bookcheat requests there, both long ones. The Lord of the Rings and now you for indulging in this madness. Hey, thank you, Kevin Packrad. Two bookshed requests there, both long ones. The Lord of the Rings and now Ulysses. Yes. I reckon maybe due to the length of that one, maybe we'll just do the two of the fact quotes questions today and move on to the next section of the show. Thanks so much to Kevin

and Piper for their Sydney Scharnberg support and their facts, quotes and questions. Next thing we'd like to do was shout out to a few of our great supporters. Jess normally comes up with a bit of a game based on the topic at hand. Yeah. I thought, what about the people that they are impersonating? Oh, okay. Great.

Yes. So a baron or... Yeah. It could be, I mean, it could be a non-baron. Yeah, it could be a non-baron. The two kinds of people. It's not very specific. Yeah. Non-baron. How about I read out the names. Dave says the real identity, which is just them, I guess, again. I'll say the address, you say the real identity. Okay. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And Jess, you give us who identity. Okay, yeah, yeah, yeah.

And Jess, you give us who they're impersonating. Got it. All right, from Dunfermaline in Fifth in Great Britain. Maybe five, it's Beth. Beth is trying to assume the identity of John Hamm. Really? Whoa. Oh my God, I mean. Do you want some Mad Men money?

If you can pull it off. And there is- Good luck to you. Yeah, there is a resemblance. Yeah, okay. That's nice. So you're saying Beth is hot. Yeah.

Classically handsome. Classically handsome. Probably a bit of a douchebag. Not your value. Oh, really? Not Beth. John Hamm. Oh, is he?

I reckon. What a shame. He seems like fun. We've heard that opinion from Jess before. Oh, okay. Maybe he was in a phrase- we talked about him phrasing the bars in a Brendan Fraser movie. Oh. I think we've also had friends who have been at a party with him and- Oh, okay.

Have given me that impression. Yeah, a party with the ham. Yeah. I got a little slice. Yeah, I don't know. Just based on that story, whoever the friend is, I think they might sound like a wanker. And you know what? Yeah, thinking back. Yeah. All right.

I'm a wanker. Party with the hand. How well I take that person's opinions. Can't wait to find out about this. Next up from Lexington in Kentucky. Oh, a city that we've talked about in a few previous episodes, I think maybe including the cocaine bear. Oh, right. Yes. And that story about the art thieves, the book, they stole that book of animal art. I can't remember what that episode was called. I did it. That was a good one.

Anyway, I think that there was time in Lexington there. And now we're talking about the resident Brett F. Oh, there's something about someone who won't give the full surname that makes me think we are involved in one of those crimes. Yeah. Let us know Brett. And the next crime. We won't snitch.

Yay. Come on Brett. And the next crime is stealing the identity of Robert Downey Jr. Oh, OK. OK. Cocaine Bear himself. Yeah. Not anymore.

Not anymore. Betty Ford, sort of that. Former Cocaine Bear. Yes. Maybe the F is Ford and it's Bretty Ford. Not Bretty Ford. Thanks so much, Brett. From Pau.

Pau! In Tennessee. It's Brad! Brad. Brad's actually trying to go undercover as Glen Pau. Oh, all these people. My goodness. Not their value, but very good looking.

Is he pulling it off? He can pull it off. He's bloody awesome. He's just like, let me take that back and pull it off. What is that? Thank you so much, Brad. From my land in South Australia. It's Rory Marchant. Queen Elizabeth.

First or second? Second. Oh, okay. Yeah, the current queen. Current queen. Yeah, honestly, you'd get more respect if you're the current queen than one from a few hundred years ago. Yeah, a dead one. Yeah. Yeah, come back out. Wait, why is- who's this on my throne?

Who the hell's that? I'm still the queen. A few hundred years later? When was the first Elizabeth? Yeah, a few hundred years ago. My God. She still looks good. Rory Marchant from Toronto in Ontario, Canada. It's Eva with an E, EVA, Eva.

Um, actually an impersonator, an imposter of one of our favourite Canadian Americans, Brendan Fraser. Whoa! Oh my goodness. Yeah. Yeah. Once again, hot. Oh my goodness. Yeah. Once again, hot. Hot man. Not the value, but-

What's going on in my brain at the moment? Um, hot man? I think they're- Oh, yeah. I'm picturing a conga line of all these men. Yeah, I'm at the front of the conga line. And in the middle? Quintilis with the second.

And she's having a great time. She's grabbing onto Glenn Powell's ass. Can you blame her? No. Next up, I'd love to thank from Bern in Bern in... Where's that? Switzerland. Switzerland.

You know, I think it's the capital. That is... Would have put money on China. CH. Oh, the country code CH, yeah. That is, and the person is Anonymous Octopus. Octopus with a K. Anonymous Octopus.

That's a sick name. That sounds like somebody who's trying to keep an identity kind of secret. James Bond. Oh, big time. Wait, which Bond? A hot one? Craig. Oh yeah, a hot one.

Not one of the Uggos. Not one of the other. So many Uggos are playing there. Sean Connery, famously. Not his value. Not his value. And none of my octopus. Well done.

I'd also have to thank, from Hamilton. Also in Ontario, Canada. This is Jeffen. Jeffen? F and Jeffen. It's J-F-A and I love it. Jeffen. Jeffen. Jeffen. It's J-E-F-I-N-I-L-O-V-E-T-H-E-M-O-N. Jeffen. An imposter for Taylor Swift.

Oh, my gosh. I mean, can you blame him? Yeah. You know, because T-Swift, I don't know if you've heard, pretty big. Yes. Really? Quite famous. Gosh. Sold out the G twice.

Yeah, harder to probably impersonate the real famous people, but all of these are having to go all the same. Pretty well-documented people. Yeah, so you've got lots of resources. Yeah, true. Yeah, you've got to impersonate a recluse. You know if they can speak French or not. That's right.

Before you pretend to be them. Yeah, you jumped on the wiki page and not really read it twice. I don't think Glen Powell can speak French, so, Yeah, I think you'd be smart to go that way. I'd love to see that. Me too. Would you mind if I thanked from Leatherhead in maybe Surrey in Great Britain? I'd love to. And I think- you think what I'm thinking? Shout out to Tim S Green.

Yes, I am thinking that. Who's the actor? Green, Tom Green. Oh, Tom Green. Because it's just an easy, like it's changing an eye to it. Yeah, you never forget that. And if you say Tim Green, people say, did you say Tim? No, I said Tom.

Tom Green. Check your ears. And, you know, like he was famous for a time, but less so now. So that's probably a good one to sort of impersonate. It's a little less eyes on you. I remember you. Yeah. Boston, Massachusetts.

That's what I said. That's one of his famous misunderstandings from a movie. Maybe road trip. Wow. It's probably a road trip. And finally from, oh, address unknown. Can only assume from deep within the fortress of the moles. It's Rachel Plowman.

AKA Jeff Bezos. That's a good one. You just got to shave your head and you're good to go. Easy. Nobody really knows what he looks like. No, they just know he's got a dome. I actually picture him like Pitbull. I picture him like Pitbull.

Have you seen Pitbull with hair though? Did he ever have hair? Yeah, it changes your life. I picture him- Oh my god. I'm looking at it right now. I'm picturing him as Howie Mandel. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Pitbull. Or the friend from Californication, David De Covey's friend. Oh, I never saw it. That might be Howie Mandel. Oh my- Is this actually him or is this AI? Is that him? That's him, babe. Oh my God, Pitbull was so hot. Pitbull with hair. Wait, is he not hot now?

Is that what you mean? Mr. Worldwide. Mr. Worldwide. But he looks like a different man. Like, it's a different type of handsome. When was that- When was that shot from? Let's not get lost in Pippel's hair. Yeah. Easy to do. Oh my gosh.

Good for you, Pippel. Good for you. I used to not get it. Now I do. Mr. Worldwide. Thank you so much to Rachel, Tim, Jeffen, Anonymous, Eva, Rory, Brad, Brett and Beth. And the last thing we need to do is welcome a few people into the Triptych Club, which Dave will explain so well. This is our hall of fame, our theatre of the mind,

where we welcome people in to a clubhouse, a sort of hangout zone with food, drinks, games, stories to tell, all sorts of nice things. We also, we shout out new people every single week if we have anyone who's been on the shout out level or above for three consecutive years. They already had a shout out, we already gave them a Mr. Worldwide type nickname or something years ago but now.

Equally very funny at the time. Exactly. Now we get to put you in the Hall of Fame and you can't leave but why would you want to? You don't need to. We've got five inductees this week. The way it works is I'm on the door at the clipboard. If I read out your name, you jog on in. Everyone else who's been inducted,

which I believe is maybe it's hundreds. We're pushing up over 800, I think. Yeah, it's quite, but it's spacious in here. It is, yeah. And we are extending from this. Yeah, always extending. It feels like, you know, when the band is playing, which Matt's about to explain is usually a band,

when they're playing, it's like the perfect amount of people that it feels like a good vibe, but not like really crowded. If you want to stand at the back, there is space and air there. There's absolute space at the back. And if you want to get up and be mushing against each other, mushing in the mosh. We've got a mushing room. And if you and for the times that a band isn't playing, ample space.

You can socialize, you can have some you time. We've got it all. Yes. Sort of make that clear if people like, I don't want to go to the triptych club. Because this is how it works. There is a bar and Jess is behind the bar. Yeah. Grab yourself a drink. Cocktails, Jess and we have one going at the after party.

Dave's the MC of the event. We've got high tea this week. Oh my God, that's fantastic. Dave books a band. So high tea. Yeah. So like little sandwiches and cucumber sandwiches. That's fancy.

And some scones and cakes and tea. I can't wait for that. Just a nice cup of tea. Yeah, lovely. Great. And the temperature of the tea. It's really, really fucking hot. What the fuck?

But you can add milk. Good one. We'll just wait a few minutes. Yeah. And that's the good thing about tea. And Dave, you've booked a band, is that true for the Oscar-pund? Oh my gosh, you're never gonna believe it. What?

You know, I booked these bands obviously years in advance because of their schedules and at the start of the episode, Jess, that's why I was so obsessed with how to pronounce the name of this topic, because I thought ahead and was like, oh my gosh, we've got the, we've got Tick-Born, we've got Titch-Born. Well, tonight, please welcome to the Rock and Roll stylings of Airborne. Oh my gosh. Airborne are here. At least the Bourne part was accurate. Yeah, I wanted to confirm that that was right. Yeah. Just to see if it was, obviously Airborne were Oh my god. Airborne are here. At least the Bourne part was accurate.

Yeah, I wanted to confirm that that was right. Yeah. Just to see if it was, obviously Airborne were gonna play regardless of whatever the topic was. Of course. Wow. But amazing. Huge.

So a bit of a classic Ozzy rock and roll. That's right, a bit of rock and roll. A few Marshall stacks on the stage tonight, let me tell you that. Oh yeah, big time. All right, so but before we get to the after party, let's have the party. Dave, you're on stage, you're ready to hype these guys up as I bring them in? Absolutely, so hyped, big time. All right, so but before we get to the after party, let's have the party. Dave, you're on stage. You're ready to hop these guys up as I bring them in?

Absolutely, so hyped, so ready. Jess, you gonna hype Dave up? Yeah. Because you know, he does sort of pretty weak word play. You are talking to a microphone plugged to my headphones. I can hear you. Oh, I'm so sorry. The fuck, my confidence is already low.

Come on, this is why I have to put my hand on Dave's butt for this. Okay, we'll get it on there. And then I'll put mine on Queen Elizabeth, which will put hers on Glenn Powell, and we'll go to you. Oh, could I skip a couple and just go show it to Glenn Powell? You've got long arms, I reckon you could do it.

Yes. It does mean you're going to have to be pretty close to the Queen. All right, first up, I'd like to welcome into the club, thanks for all your support for the last three years from Endeavour Hills here in Victoria. It's David Glue. You glue here. But you flew here, David Glue. Also, you're the glue that holds us together, David. I thought that was a bit of fun.

Bit of fun, glue here. I looked at Dave. Just his anticipation there. It was fantastic. Yeah, I looked at Dave and I, and we shared a nod because I was like, you got yourself a home run here, my friend. This guy's David's glue. How did he fumble that?

How did he fumble you glue? Because Jess gave me a look, I thought, I have to do something she's not expecting. You were right, and you did. But you are the glue that holds this society together, David. David glue. From Denver, Colorado, please and thank you and welcome Alicia Beaton. I felt beaten until I met Alicia. From Denver, Colorado, please and thank you and welcome Alicia Beaton. I felt beaten until I met Alicia.

From Sutton Coldfield and maybe Birmingham, Great Britain, it's Sophie Rodriguez. More like from Sutton Hotfield. I'm feeling warmed up tonight after the energy that I'm getting from you, Sophie Rodriguez. From Jefferson in Ma, in the United States. It's Elizabeth McNulty. You know, some people they like, um, Nick Nolte, but I prefer my Nolte is a bit Mc Nolte, Elizabeth McNulty. Yes. Massachusetts is where MA is.

And finally from Moabital in Deutschland, I reckon it's Bastion Heckel. I've got a Heckel for you. I don't come to where you work and say, welcome to my house, we're going in, Bastion Heckel. Yeah. Garnies good. That really long pause, I'm like, jeez, these put pressure on. How is he going to make it feel worth it?

But he did. Let me just tell you that a video just went viral of a podcaster welcomes heckler. Geez, he's nailed it again. Back to back. Fantastic. If you have a little time to think, if you have a little time to think, you come up with a goal. Yeah, that's right.

If you have a little time to think, you come up with a goal. Yeah, that's right. I did, in Brisbane the other week, I did this, a quizmeisters sheeple show and Ben Hunter hosted it and Emma Zamet said something. He just welcomed her to the stage and she sort of did something like what you did there and Ben looked at her and went, now, how do you think that sentence went? Oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh, oh? Oh, but moments later, he fumbled one and we got the turn. Absolutely ruined him.

Bit of fun. Anyway, welcome in Bastion, Elizabeth, Sophie, Alicia and David. That brings it to the episode. What is that? What is that? Jess, is there anything you want to say about the episode? That's the end of the episode. Yeah.

Everyone panic. Look, I mentioned at the start of the show that you can suggest a topic and anybody's welcome to do that at any time. There's a link in the show notes. It's also on our website, which is dogoonpod.com. And- I like how you said it like a question. Podcom? Podcom?

I always forget. You can find us at dogoon on Instagram, do go on podcasts, on TikTok, and just remember that we bloody love you. Okay? That's from both of us. I'm sick of having to tell you all the time because you keep bloody forgetting. Okay? Make sure you got your keys, your phone, your shoes on, and I love you.

Okay? Dave, boot this baby home. Hey, we'll be back next week with another episode, but until then, I'll say thank you so much for listening and goodbye Later Don't forget to sign up to our tour mailing list so we know where in the world you are and we can come and tell you When we're coming there wherever we go, we always hear six months later. Oh, you should come to Manchester We were just in Manchester. This way you'll never, you'll never miss out and don't forget to sign up, go to our Instagram,

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