Don't Blame Me! - MLM Predators

Episode Date: May 2, 2022

Meghan and Melisa give advice on: Update: Racist/House Stealing/Succubus Cheater Friend constantly canceling plans Warning a client about MLMs Going to a music festival with someone who hates music festivals Shopping Addiction Don't Blame Them: Converting religions for a partner Buy our merch: https://store.dftba.com/collections/don-t-blame-me Subscribe to our new show: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/but-am-i-wrong/id1591757891 Follow Us! @meghanrienks www.instagram.com/meghanrienks https://twitter.com/meghanrienks @sheisnotmelissa www.instagram.com/sheisnotmelissa https://twitter.com/sheisnotmelissa @by.meghan.and.melisa https://www.instagram.com/by.meghan.and.melisa Affordable Therapy By State (Curated by Crissy Milazzo): www.tinyurl.com/y64kwdnf Need Advice? www.dontblameme.show Domestic Listeners Call: [phone] International Listeners Send a Voice Memo To: [e-mail] … with as much detail as possible under 3 minutes! WeI'll do our best to share our wonderful words of wisdom. If you're under 18, please get your parent's permission. Advice is for entertainment purposes only, so you can't blame us if we screw up your life. I kid! Our advice IS AMAZING. Want to WATCH this episode as well? Become a patron! https://www.patreon.com/dontblameme Join the Facebook Group! https://www.facebook.com/groups/dbmsecretgroup Support the show: https://www.patreon.com/join/dontblameme Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

hello hello welcome not you melissa welcome to those of you who are listening to i was gonna make this an mlm pitch welcome to the first day of your rest of your life you are about to be on the path of independence where you work for yourself but we are a team of synergy we're a family and you don't ever ever turn your back on family or else now we're doing a blood pact and you're signing away your life rights and if you uh argue we will send you on a ship similar to scientology dude i i can't believe that they've been getting away with this for so long with the mlms scientology specifically yeah we've got dirt on people so that's why yeah i guess we could start our own cult we have dirt on people i want dirt on like negative people

though yeah me too i wouldn't want to we wouldn't want to like induct any of you into a cult no you are you you are all wonderful most of you that's insane most of you most of you and here's the thing the people who aren't wonderful they don't know they think they're in that group and then everybody else who's very self-aware is going to be like oh my gosh is it me of course it's not you if you're questioning if it's about you so you know what i mean yeah unless you just love jk rowling oh yeah that was so weird the thing is we haven't let anybody into the facebook group i know a long time so they've been sitting there for a minute yeah some people what's that quote from the joker some people just want to watch the world burn if i was a straight white

man i would actually to be fair if i was a man i'd be able to really come through with that that's like every man's like the only impression they can do like every man is just like the joker my joker impression hi welcome to don't play me we are an amazing wonderful fantastic podcast i am megan i am melissa and together we are the two the two uh devils on your shoulders who also have like little angel wings because the angel wings are cute i think angel wings and horns maybe maybe that is our promo but maybe that's a photo shoot for us yes i love it that's really right yeah because like here's the thing like does the devil actually have a tail like is it what is the devil the devil is a fallen angel so like in the bible no but like in the depiction that people

have yes the devil has a tail because i think the cute parts of like an angel like a halo in like drawings like very cute but like in practicality you like attach like a pipe cleaner like it's looking a little wonky so like horns like cute but wings also cute so you get the pick and choose yeah i like that i like that a lot anyways we are an advice podcast where we give wonderful life-changing amazing advice to people who ask for it because unsolicited advice is for bitches and scum well no bitch is a good word for scrubs and scum like with another s word so we give solicited advice we give the advice we'd like to see see in the world so tough love but it comes from a good place and um if you want to call in for an upcoming episode you can leave

us a voicemail at 310-694-0976 and international listeners you can send us an audio message at meganpodcasts at gmail.com. Got to keep it under three minutes or you'll be cut off. Let us know your pronouns if you are comfortable. And if you are 18 or over, you're solid. But if you're under 18, got to have your parents' permission. And then how can people get the much coveted diamond? If you want the diamond, you've got to keep your call under three minutes, as Megan already said. You should write it down, practice it, rehearse it, say it a few times. Those are all the same words as practice they all mean the same thing as practice but some people you know aren't getting that in their minds also do not be don't do it while you're driving in a car don't do it when

you're around a cow don't do it when you're in a noisy area please if you're in a car please be parked no radio on the car isn't on and quiet and then put as much detail in there as possible also if you mess up you can if you're calling in then you can you know hang up and start over and if you're doing a voice memo just delete it we'll never know the difference also with your voice memos please use a mp3 file which someone just sent us a message on instagram that asked what should they do and i appreciate that always ask question we reiterate this in every episode and i will say i think we've gotten a lot of people who listen and it has reflected and we've given out you personally have given out more diamonds than not yeah no i wouldn't go that far

you've been not been what been not giving them out we've never had better calls yes i will say we've never had better calls so i did say last episode that i was raising the bar yes diamonds Yes. Also, for some reason, people, we have another podcast in case you don't listen to it called But Am I Wrong? Please go listen to it. But for some people think that if they write into But Am I Wrong, then they can call Don't Blame Me for an update. That's not how it works. Two separate shows, separate ways. So if you want advice, don't blame me. If you want to know if you're wrong, But Am I Wrong? and hey if you have an update but am i wrong send us an email and maybe we'll want to talk and hear about it but advice is here so what's new with you i've been directing an audiobook i forgot i haven't done one in a month and in that month i forgot how much labor it is mentally um and yesterday i was completely wiped out but i'm good what's new with you moving when this comes out you'll be in your new home yeah it'll be like the first

week that we are there which is wild so i'm excited definitely stressed i had the most vivid dream last night that i don't remember all of it but i do remember like joe jonas and sophie turner were there and then like i don't know it was like a lot of weird stuff but i woke up and i felt like even now it's been hours since i've been awake and i just feel like you ever have like in a dream where like you're like a dynamic duo or you're like with a group of people that now i feel like if i saw joe jonas and sophie turner i would be like you definitely had to have had a dream about me as well because like we were so close that like now i feel like we're friends yeah and it's all because i saw joe jonas tiktok right before i went to bed

yeah so i think it was like a fine dream like that's what i remember like i don't remember being bad so it's not like when i had that reoccurring dream that selena gomez was trying to kill me and that was just like so specific and like she didn't deserve all of the fear i had of her every time i would see her face on like glamour or vogue i think so didn't she have a knife in those dreams it was essentially like one of those horror movies like someone just like keeps trying to kill you and it was like my final destination was selena gomez like she was just like tracking me in like every which way she could to come kill me and that's why i stopped taking melatonin anyways um let's get into the update whoa so the show that i'm calling to

update about is the one where I told a story about how my boyfriend at the time, now ex, cheated on me with a succubus sex switch and sex workers. And we had bought a house together. And at the time, I was in the process of figuring out what to do with the house. We talked about how I was going to make a YouTube video all about it. And at the time, I was actually living with my parents until I could figure out my new living situation. And that was over a year ago, I think, at this point so fast forward I did get an apartment and then recently I got uh it's like I upgraded a little bit so living situation is all good the reason I called about the update what made me think about it was I only just now was able to sell the house so he fought me tooth

and nail for however long it's been since that last update and we end up having to go to a small claims court thing situation i don't know all the details about how that worked legally because that's what i had a lawyer for but ultimately it worked out we ended up selling the house which was a whole other thing because in covid times even if two people are on the title of the house on the deed and everything on the loan you only need one person's permission to put your loan in forbearance what does that mean so a loan in forbearance necessarily means you're telling your bank that you don't have the funds to pay your mortgage and so before covid that affects your credit it's like a step that i i believe you have to do before you like you declare bankruptcy so

it's like it's one of those steps you follow um so usually it affects your credit and usually you need everyone's permission to do it but because of covid and since people are getting laid off you only need one person's permission to do it and it doesn't get recorded reported to a credit bureau until a month or a year has passed so it turns out he put the house loan in forbearance and I found out about it when we went to court and that's why he was fighting on me selling it because he was trying to live there mortgage free while I was in the apartment in hopes that we would get back together and he would oh my gosh so he was using the money instead of paying the mortgage for more prostitutes and why do I know that because

we had to get his bank statements everything and he did the same thing he did a year ago and i was like oh and i know he's still doing it because he cc'd me in the email where he included the bank statements and because i'm nosy i was like i wonder what you've been doing for the past year and a half the places are still on there like the massage parlors it was like but there was also what didn't he the succubus come from fiverr yeah yeah wait so did he have to read these or did his lawyer have to like read these in small claims court no they didn't read through the transactions themselves once like I think he wasn't serious like I threatened him and then I got a lawyer involved in everything I just think he didn't think it was serious until we actually got there

and that's when he was like oh and like as soon as we got there it was like stopped in like two seconds like I like it was a 30 minute portion of my life and then I left I'm convinced that he was still hung up on the fact that somehow we were going to get back together and he didn't think it was going to seriously be a thing until that happened and like he didn't realize that like he was essentially committing like a crime I don't know if it was technically a crime because we just had to like argue over the like logistics of it because technically I was on it and he didn't want to buy me out and that's why we ended up selling which ultimately I guess worked out for me because as y'all know and Megan especially how the housing market is so ultimately that worked

out for me in the end yeah but it was a long long process and all of this I find out because his cousin texted me that he has a new girlfriend who is living with him in this house in your house who is younger than me so if we recall this man was 12 years older than I was and we met when I was 20 on tinder so he was purposely looking for girls who were like teenagers basically and he's dating someone who now lives there she was younger than i am who is also a woman of color so you know it's a predatory yeah he has a type i guess a fetish if you will yeah yeah um so yeah there's that i like struggled like on and off because during all of this he's still sending me emails and text messages and stuff and being like i want you back like blah blah and obviously i blocked

his number but he was still emailing me and i couldn't block his email because the house stuff and so during this whole time and apparently they started dating like a month after i moved out so like right around that time i did the update call so i went back and forth with like should i tell her like should i not and then i just ultimately decided i didn't want to let this man take any more my energy that's fair so like it is what it is wow yeah and so that finally happened like i said we sold he actually sent me an email like two weeks ago in it detailing again how even though we sold the house he hoped that there was still hope of us somehow reconciling in the future because destiny was a thing and somehow our paths would come together because the lessons that i

taught him and then the next this was like a time paragraph email the next one was him talking about how what i taught him was that he needed to be more liberal because he didn't realize his white privilege but he said that word for word which made me think he copied and pasted it were there any examples of his white privilege or not like no no no no that's a step extra you know yeah and so then the one good thing to come out of that email was we'd had adopted a second cat together so I have my cat that I've had for years and we did adopt a second one that stayed with him so he did include an update photo of this cat I did appreciate that the cat is a monster he's like 40 pounds and I didn't know cats could be that big so I'm really just very happy that he ended

up with that cat mine's like 10 pounds so I had like a 40 pound cat growing up and it was a mountain lion and it was a beast and it was his house and I just stayed there like it was a terrifying experience like wow yeah holy shit and like did you have to pay for your small claims court like lawyer did you or was that did he have to i made him do everything so before we had moved in together i'm not sure if i mentioned this in the first update call but as a tip to anyone who buys a house with someone um and not as sure of their romantic future i made him sign a cohabitation agreement that for reference a lawyer should actually draft up but i like got one online and like finagled it and then i signed it and got it notarized for both of us and in there i had

originally said like if we broke up he had to pay me out of the house because I didn't want the house to begin with and because I got him to do that before we moved in that was the reason that we were even able to go to like a court case to begin with because they're like well you signed this and this is everything that's happened since then so you know just a tip even if it's like a prenup even if you think you're going to be together forever go you prior you was looking out so hard for future you like prior you was like I don't know if this is the right call but like I'm gonna do this shit to ensure that like future me so like that's like that's the best it's like the opposite of like when you're like high or drunk or whatever or like you're it's late at night and

you like don't do you do something and you're like oh fuck now I regret now I have to clean this or do whatever like you did the opposite like my Virgo rising really said here you go like that's so smart like that's so so so smart like I'm here for like we're all gonna make mistakes and poor decisions in dating but like make a poor decision with a like safety net and like that's exactly what you did like where you're like I don't necessarily know if I'm super confident in like moving in I don't know if I'm gonna do this but like I'm not going to not make this decision but like I have knit I've crafted a safety net and it's legally binding motherfucker like that's so smart i would have never even have thought of that yeah wow well look at you yeah that one's

on my mom i'm distrustful of everyone so well it worked out fear is actually good in some instances because it protects you yeah yeah so ultimately that all super worked out for me and last time i spoke to melissa um not in the don't blame me i had mentioned to her how i was in the middle of trying to figure out where to move to a new state and kind of figuring out I ended up staying in Charlotte where I am now like a year and a half longer but so my lease now ends in January and I will be moving to Milwaukee so I'm really excited about that really fun and crazy yeah but I'm excited to do that and kind of like move on I guess to the next stage too since I just got that house stuff all finished I was kind of afraid to leave the state just in case oh yeah and now

you can go you're free so that's really nice and then on the other update that I have is I am currently in a new relationship also with a person of color whom is also queer unfortunately they are a man yeah so that's been um really nice because I did take like y'all's advice too I don't know if this was in regards to that specific update or a time I'd called before but one of the advice that y'all gave me was kind of to surround myself with more people of color and more people who kind of were aligned with my values and morals and so I worked really hard to do that when I got back from Arizona last year and I like I went on Bumble BFF and did the whole thing and I found a really great queer community and a lot of people of color that's been able to like reshift kind of the way

that even I was acting and I guess towards myself a little bit we're still in therapy so that's good great and yeah oh that makes me so happy this yeah yeah like this was such a a journey of like the original call and it's so cool to see like obviously visually because we've done updates with you before but like to kind of um we hear about people who call in and like talk about like those pivotal years of your life where you like age and grow but like I literally not to be like older sister but like I literally feel like we've like watched this with you and like the audience gets to hear that kind of thing and like it's just I don't know like it's so cool to like see your success in all of this and like I don't want to be like cheesy like watching you grow up or

whatever but like yeah but I think it's like really cool I think we put so much pressure on ourselves for like growing up ends at like 18 but like I think that like the conscious choices I made to like grow up in like whether that's like surroundings the people that i date like my relationships with people those conscious choices that i made i think shaped me like the most and like it's really cool to like watch that for for you and like happy you're in a new relationship what's the age gap with this one six years but it was an accident we met in real life that's not yeah it's not and you're also older than you were yeah yeah before yeah my brain is almost fully developed we're almost there yeah just so we can have it in case people don't know

we're connecting that these are the same calls but i think one of your first or the first time you called in um you talked about and let me know if i'm completely off base and i'm thinking of the wrong person but he was in the military was that correct yes yeah he used to be in the military and made racist comments yeah okay yeah so that was my second call i think actually pertaining to him so the first one i've i think i've been on like five times now we love it we love it um the very first one pertaining to him was when i went searching through his laptop because i had been sitting there in my apartment forever and that was the one time megan says she was like usually i say you know don't go looking for things let you find some but it's been there forever

so that was the first one that's when i first found out that he was into kind of like the succubus sex porn thing but we had collectively decided that it's not something that he could get out of real life or so we had thought and um so to just leave it i mean he still can't get out of real life but he got scammed into other people which i don't fault that i'm like scam scam and he deserved it and then yeah and the second one was he used to be in the military and he had made like a racist comment so i was trying to figure out the cognitive dissonance with me being a Hispanic queer woman and like dating and blah blah blah and then it was the update yeah got it oh wow well I'm so happy for you I can't wait for I can't wait for you to have something else

that happens in your life or maybe it's just another update on this and we get to see your other apartment when you move and all of that so I'm it's your is your partner right now going have you talked of it like how long have you been dating like are they gonna go to Milwaukee like yeah so we've been together for six seven months now nice so yeah so i think the plan will be that they'll also come to milwaukee so we kind of just are milwaukee together because i know it seems kind of like out there but i'm into the semi-small cities that are growing a little bit so still diverse still has like access to a lot of stuff but they're just not huge huge yet ultimately what i'd like to do there is i have a cousin there who's queer and they're really

involved in like the community there and trying to get some stuff up and running and wisconsin apparently is thinking about passing laws that are similar to like the texas and florida ones but they're like barely there so the idea there is kind of i want to get more involved there and kind of move away from just my nine to five corporate gig yeah so that's hopefully like the goal there we're actually going um so my birthday is on sunday and happy early birthday thank you and so then um three weeks from now we're going to my home country of colombia and we're gonna go my grandma's like you know older and like that sort of thing so we're going for a week to like stay and so that'll be fun because this is the first person i've ever brought back

to colombia and the first person who has ever like taken an interest i guess in like my background and culture and stuff so it's been really interesting to see because they're on pakistani so it's like totally different yeah but i think it'll be i think it'll be good i'm feeling good about it right now but tbd yeah yeah i think playing it by ear is like a is a great way to kind of go about it you you know our constant advice is if you're moving to a new place don't necessarily move in with a partner but you know you you also don't have to listen to our advice like that's also very okay i'm just excited for you then how you went from dating someone who made you do a lot of internal reflection of why am i with this person who is an invalidating

and like insulting to to two of these huge parts of me to then want it becoming like a very wanting to incorporate that in like a justice driven way so that's like this is like ultimate this is like so much this is like like a five years later movie montage like like it's like and that and you're like oh my gosh wow like this is of course he's like just fucking tripping over himself trying to like get back into your life because he knows that like you literally don't need him at all and i'm not one for believing that like shitty people in our life are like the reason why we end up the way that we do like i believe that like that's always who we were going to be and sometimes like situations push us there either before we're too ready

or in like a different way but like this was like always you and like he was he was a blip and like a whatever and like you are on to so many bigger and better things and it's just like so cool to witness and like yeah feel like a very small audience member in it oh I mean yeah it's kind of crazy my very first call I had just moved like out like post-grad I had just turned 21 like I think it was like two weeks after my 21st birthday and look here we are it's almost your birthday again oh my gosh wow wait so how old are you now how many years has it been i turned 24 okay that was my next wow that is crazy oh my gosh well thank you for giving us an update people were obsessed with and like so invested in your original calls so this feels like a this is

such like a commute obviously it's your win but it also feels like a community win because you've got to be an audience to it i concur yeah thank you so much and happy birthday yeah happy birthday hope you have fun whatever you end up doing probably having a really good dinner we are tourists after all but facts and i hope you have a great time in columbia and it's so fun thank you guys so much of course thank you always great to get an update from them yeah i love to see it love to see it because each time there's just a little bit more growth and it's great seeing people grow yeah it's yeah everything we said on that is like very true and it's it's exciting and it was very exciting for us because we obviously have people helping with us

helping us on these podcasts so sometimes for updates right before we melissa internally was like oh my gosh i think this is and then said the name was like oh i hope and the camera comes on we're like yes so it's a it's a good feeling some of those calls just stick with you because succubus i mean succubus it's when you taught me what succubus was yeah in toronto every arrival is a statement and nothing says it better than this cadillac optic was the number one selling luxury ev in canada for 2025 find your rhythm across a seamless 33 inch display and an immersive 19-speaker AKG surround audio system. This city demands agility

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I remember it so fondly. Yep. Anyways, shall we get into the rest of the episode? We shall. Roll the tapes. Hi, Melissa and Megan. My friends and I are all 21 years old and use she, her pronouns. We are juniors in college and met and became close friends during the first week of our freshman year.

My one friend, I'll call her Sarah, has been dating her current boyfriend for two years and they plan on getting engaged right after graduation. She is 24 and has been graduated from school for two years and currently lives at home. Sarah is extremely busy. She is a resident assistant, is studying for the LSAT, has multiple on-campus jobs, and also has her normal schoolwork. For the past two years that she has dated her boyfriend, she has seen him at least two times a week for the entire day and often sleeps over. My other friend, I'll call her Lily, and I plan to hang out with Sarah at least one time a week. However, Sarah never fails to cancel or has to somehow shorten or alter the plans because of how busy she is.

even if our plans just include studying together. I would totally understand this, given her really intense schedule, yet she is constantly hanging out with her boyfriend and his family. I see her on her Instagram stories constantly going out to eat with them. If she and him are really going to get married, they have the rest of their lives to spend with each other. However, we will probably rarely see each other after college, given where we each plan to move to.

In this process, I've made a new close friend, so it's not like I'm putting all my pressure to socialize on Sarah but Sarah always complains that we never hang out yet she is always the one to cancel. Am I being selfish? I wouldn't be as upset if she wasn't spending so much time with her boyfriend and not us. I just feel like I prioritize my friends but no one really prioritizes me. Please be very gentle I'm a very fragile Aquarius. Thanks bye. So I have like a lot of feelings about this but like the first thing that kind of pivoted my initial or like had a new lane of thinking in this was when she Sarah complains about never seeing you because it seems like up until like as soon as you were saying that

and you're like well and I don't put all of my pressure on this friendship like I've made other new friends it seems like you were in a situation that like you kind of made the best of this situation and you didn't wait around for her and you kind of were proactive in making other friends and doing all of that but then she turns around it's like i never see you that is just like a what like i you were flaking and then i made my friendships and like started doing other things and now you're annoyed with me so like to me this kind of reads like i wonder if that is kind of why she's saying that and sometimes i know we shit on people in relationships a lot on this podcast but like there are some people who think that single people or people who aren't in relationships

fit into their lives as like a married person or a person in a long-term relationship and that you're not ranked as like the same priority as a relationship like a romantic relationship which is fine but it's kind of as if that like she expected you to just wait around and like not make any new friendships i don't know i also like and i know you said that you're sensitive and like I don't mean this to be, like, a knock to you personally at all, but do you feel like she actually means that when she says that, or do you feel like she's just kind of going through the motions of, like, saying it because she, some people just, like, are all relationship people, and they drop all of their friends, but then in the back of their head, they know they're

supposed to maintain friendships, and so then does she, is she saying that to kind of take out, take away her own personal responsibility in this and, like, kind of be victim-y? Do you know what mean? Yeah. I mean, at the end of the day, you make time for what you want and she's making time for her boyfriend and his family, but not making time for you and has canceled on you several times. So to me, this just feels like lip service. And I don't think any of this is on you because you try to make the effort. You've invited her to things and you have tried to be there, but she's not putting in the same effort. And at some point you have to say like, I'm not a priority to you. You don't value our friendship because she's putting it below her other relationships with,

which I know like relationships are on different levels, but like if you're constantly canceling on someone, that's not being respectful of you or your time or your energy. And I just think that we should be giving people what we want back and if she's giving you nothing then she deserves nothing yeah and i think like you and you said that like they're really going to get married and all that stuff they have like the rest of their lives and i agree with you but some people interpret that differently so for her it's like i completely understand your perspective where it's like well i'm going to be like we're probably not going to have be able to be as close because like we are like just friends we're not going to live together blah blah blah but she might see it as

yeah why am i going to invest time in a friendship when it's not going to last for that much longer in like this proximity but my relationship will so like i'm going to just spend all my time with my relationship and i don't think that's a foundation for a good relationship and how you're going to spend your time with other people because like even when i'm at your house and moz is always like hey what do you want to eat too or like do you want to hang out he always asks if I want to be included in other things or even staying over longer than I myself expect to stay over longer. You're like, let me go home. So I just don't think that's a good setup in her being isolated from her actual friends. No, it feels like she knows as a concept she

shouldn't be ditching her friends for a relationship. So she thinks knowing that is enough. And therefore, because she knows that, that she's not participating in that. but she is it's like my therapist told me something really great was she was like just because you can identify the problem doesn't mean you are avoiding the problem like that doesn't mean that you're working through the problem you just know it exists and that's kind of what it feels like on her and it feels like she's waiting for you to kind of play victim not you play victim her to play victim where like you all she treats you like shit for long enough that you just stop being friends with her but i think that you just have like a serious conversation with her where

it's like hey let's talk about expectations in friendships it's and i would not do it with both you and your other friend you said name with lily i would not do it two against one i would just reach out to her independently because you can lily can feel the same as you but like it's not you have to talk about your specific relationship with her and just be like i feel like i understand that you're in this relationship and you're really happy but i can't lie like it has hurt my feelings that it feels like constantly if you're going to cancel on anything it's always it feels like it's me and it feels like i know that you're really busy but like i personally and like not looking for friendships

where I feel like I have to track someone down and chase them down to spend quality time with me. And I just like want to know where you're at. And if that's like this season of this friendship is coming to a close, like I'd rather us have a conversation about that because it also really confuses me when you then complain about how we never see each other.

Like as if I'm not the one who's constantly trying to like make plans and I'm just like really exhausted of putting myself out on a limb to just be canceled on all the time. So if this is the end of the friendship, okay, but I just like want us to have this conversation. I also think on top of that, that at this point in your life, this is a transitional phase in your life. And I think

definitions of friendships also evolve at this point in your life, because I have friends that I consider close friends and I might not see them, but once or twice a year, but like, they're still my close friends. And I think maybe if she doesn't, if she doesn't want to make time for you, but still considers you a friend, then she might be one of those friends that you only see now and then. But again, it's the part that she's canceling on that really irks me because don't make plans.

That means that you made plans in time, but then something else more important came up and I can understand doing that once or twice. But if this is a consistent thing, that means that she doesn't want to be a part of it. And also if this is the person she's going to spend the rest of her life with, like if I'm going to cancel on anybody

that like is going to be cool with it, it would be Mott. do what i mean like if i was like oh shit i double booked myself like also mods should like want you to have other friendships too yeah so that's the part that it feels a little i don't know i think that she's making these decisions and then is kind of just putting the onus on other people so she feels like if it fails or if something goes wrong she can't avert the blame yeah so yeah i you deserve better than this this just doesn't seem like either of you are going to be the right friends for each other for right now and that's like you said it's also very okay yeah

all right next call whoo hi megan hi melissa i am a 23 year old person who works in apa even though i hate apa and i want to quit my job but that's another story for another day i am calling oh am i pronounced barge here i am calling because the craziest thing happened to me at work and I just need to know what I should do in situations like this if it arises again. So, essentially, I work with a child who has autism, and her mom is, you know, very sweet and stuff. And so, during the session yesterday, from what I'm calling, one of their family friends came over. And I thought the family friend was coming over to, you know, hang out, chill, have coffee, whatever. But it turns out that she was an MLM-er.

I watched someone get MLS in real time, and I, like, freaked out internally because I was like, if Megan or Melissa were here, they would literally be going off right now. Because of the way that she did it, it was so predatory, and the fact that she was specifically marketing towards my client, so literally a 9-year-old autistic girl who has other health, like, has other health issues. And I'm just like, you are pandering to a person who is differently abled, has health issues, and their parent, you know, wants the best for them. And I was just like, this is, I understand why I hate MLS. Like, you have predatory aims to, like, do things and frame people who, like, outwardly seem more if you know them personally, you know, has issues. but the thing that got me was at the end of it she offered me a brochure to buy stuff from her and I literally threw it in the recycling because I could not but I need to know if I should tell my client's mom like that the company specifically she works for is like not good not reputable at

all and it would be a disservice to her to like use these things for her child when her child has like health issues that are that have better means so yeah I hope that that was as clear as concise I tried to limit my ADHD in that call but I really love you guys have been a best for years you guys are the best glitter fit combo out there bye before we get into this I want to give a little bit of like a precursor and this is inspired by the call that we had or the callback the don't blame them we had about pronouns just as a whole so we know this caller and this caller we've had conversations about aba and they are like very very aware of aba being a very problematic practice but for a lot of the time

it's it's very widely used but just because something is considered aba doesn't mean that the exact people are participating in the way that aba wants them to so there's a lot of reform happening within that community. It's essentially like imagine like, like how stadiums or concert venues have like contracts with Coca Cola. Like it's something that like, right now for a lot of places, the only accessibility they have for like autistic kids, people with autism is ABA. And so there's a lot of reform happening within that. But I just wanted to call that out because it's a very problematic dialogue in the teachings of ABA. If you're going by like the textbook definitions of that and then the other thing was the term differently abled so potentially and

this is something that like again we don't want to like police anyone's call when they're talking about people that they have personal relationships with and how they prefer to be identified and so we operate on in the mentality that like that is what it is but i just want to make sure to call out as a whole using the term differently abled within the disability community is not preferred and it can and always should be in these instances to A, default to listen to the disabled community as a whole, but specifically listen to the people who are disabled in your life

and the terminology and things that they prefer. So to anybody who is disabled listening to this call, I just wanted to make sure, I don't want to lump everyone in as a group with this terminology and especially if you haven't been, if you're not familiar with ABA or how using terms like differently able can be harmful,

I want this to use as a jumping off point to learn about that, but also making sure we're not policing how people speak on their personal relationships on the podcast. This is someone that works in a professional environment, as she said in the call, has direct contact with their clients. And this is a preferred term for this specific person. Yeah. So just wanted to give that precursor. so do you think that this is essential oils because i feel like it is i 100 that's where my brain went to was essential oils it could also be you know what i i'm not really on the up and up with the mlm community because when i'm not on facebook anymore too it's just something unless it's like the scam is making national headlines i'm not really aware of it but yeah if because of

the circumstances around it it feels like essential oils to be fair they can make absolutely anything about like oh this will cure your disability this will change your life it could have been teas yeah it could have been i mean again i feel like it could have maybe it maybe it's tupperware yeah and maybe they just have like a very creative sales pitch my uncle sells like fragrant, fragrant oils, like not for this kind of stuff, but not for like healing. They're just like, instead of wearing cologne and stuff. And I told him he needed to change his marketing plan. So he makes it very clear that he's not selling essential oils. That's funny. You could do a really a whole campaign that's like, you know, making fun of that. That's funny. So I mean,

I think that like you're very spot on with that the specific targeting use of like her kid who is autistic is like a very problematic thing to do I think that in the moment depending on my relationship with the mom and then knowing their relationship with like in this case like if I was you like my client that would kind of determine how I would talk about it I do think that when it comes to watching someone kind of like be swindled into something or attempt to get swindled into anything, it's a very delicate thing with that because you don't ever want to make that person feel like you think they're dumb or you think that like, I know something more than you do. I know better than you because embarrassed people usually don't admit their like mistakes

and their faults they tend to hunker down in those things because like sunk cost fallacy and they don't want to be wrong so i think that like maybe like after you've like wrapped your session with your client like talking to her mom separately and being like hey i saw this was going on like i know this was like definitely not within my part as like being as working with you but i just wanted you to like know that like i would want to wondered if it would be okay with you if i sent you a bunch of articles about like the predatory things with MLMs and how they target people with disabilities and people with family members who have disabilities and just like that this stuff like isn't proven and I would love to be able to like direct you to those resources

and something like that where it's essentially giving her and empowering her with said information other versus calling it out as like a she was falling for something that was like nefarious because mlms prey on people in specific instances and they also really prey on like emotional like they it's really emotional in their ways of getting that stuff but yeah i mean it's just it's hard because i also don't know how this mom is with their kid you know and if this is something that like if this you saying something would harm that relationship in the sense of like Would you be replaced by someone? Would you be replaced by someone who is really adhering to ABA guidelines? What is more problematic as an option? And is this someone who's receptive to information and would be open to learning and changing their mind? I think I agree with everything Megan said. I think on top of that, if you feel comfortable with talking to them about this, which it seems like you are just how the how to go about it, maybe not talking specifically about that MLM, but talking about the product, like researching the facts on this specific product.

Because I mean, I did while we were sitting here, I did a quick search where I just put in MLM and autism. And so many things came up from like parents of autistic children that were saying how they're being targeted for so many different products and how it's taking advantage of them, everything that you said. So this isn't something she she also your client also may know that this is something that they don't want to use. kind of i think just kind of fill it out ask yeah like questions about how they feel about the

product blah blah blah and then do specific research on the specific product and not the company as a whole and then present like hey there's been studies that found that this doesn't work because of x y and z also if you work for a company you could also tell your company and be like hey i would love to draft up a email from said company being like here is some information descending with all of the the the clients on our roster about things in the media whether it's like and it can be like an encompassing thing about like the disproven over and over and over again that like vaccines cause autism and you could incorporate it in something like that it's like and also there's like targeting on this this and this and like here's some like informational

resources like as people who are parents and or guardians or are people who are actively participating in this program here are some things that are some information about these things that are like common misconceptions and also in a way that maybe it's not even written in like educating those people on it but it's like how to like responding to people in your life who are approaching you about these kinds of things because it's everywhere in this like predatory kind of thing. But again, it's about not shaming people. I don't know. Anytime with this stuff, I always try and do it being like, hey, this is something I just learned. Like I had no idea. Like the way that you phrase it where it's not coming across like a know-it-all

or like, oh my gosh, you didn't know this. But when you phrase it as like, I just figured out this thing like or i read this thing or someone just told me this last week and like fudge it but to have it put yourself on the same playing field with other people because it can that makes uh information a lot easier to digest when you don't feel like you are you made a mistake you know this is rough and i i hate that i do too all right let's take a beat r e a k break we're back let's play the next call let's do it Hi, I'm a stay-at-home mom. I'm in my late 20s and I have three kids and a wonderful marriage.

Except for one thing, I have a problem and addiction. I want to stop because it's starting to hurt my marriage and my household. I'm a shopaholic. I don't know exactly when it started, but I know I improve by a lot. Unnecessary things for the most part. Amazon, Target, things I see on TikTok, you name it. Every day there's boxes and packages outside my door and I'm so embarrassed by it. I want to stop before it gets worse. My husband has given me several lectures about my spending, but I just can't stop. I want to and I'm acknowledging that I have a problem. I haven't gotten into any credit card debt or anything like that, but I don't want to get to that point. I know that I should probably seek therapy, but

are there any other ideas in the meantime i have deleted apps but i always find myself back i don't know what to do and ever since i became a stay-at-home mom i've been an introvert i do mostly online shopping and it usually happens when i'm bored at night after the kids go to sleep i don't know if that has anything to do with it but i know i need help because i don't want to do like this anymore and i need to stop thank you i don't know if like you are if you're in the process of trying to look for therapy and it's just something that it's just taking longer and you're looking for something in the interim or if you're looking for an alternative to therapy because i will say if therapy is something that you have access to financially it is something

you can do and what's stopping you from therapy is like the stigma and like feeling like you're not at that point and you would like, like to kind of do it on your own or there is some like magical like cure or something. But my therapist gave me like wonderful advice because I am like a very stubborn person that she was like, if you could get, if you could figure, and it's not applicable to this, not, not, I didn't have this exact situation, but she was like, if you could have figured it out on your own, you already would have by now. And that was like very helpful for me because it was like there's not something there's not like a magical quote there's not something that's like an aha moment where it's all going to like change that you have done it yourself like

you care about this you want it to change and you just haven't been able to do it yourself and that's what it is so i mean i think that yes admitting that you have a problem is the first step and you've taken the other steps where it's like deleting apps but it just keeps happening again And that, to me, is where you find a therapist and find or find an anonymous, like, support group. That's, like, a great way to kind of get into those things and also get references to therapists in the area. If you're having a hard time finding someone, like, finding, like, a – there's, like, a specific one, right? Yeah, I mean, this is called compulsive shopping is the specific one. But I'm pretty sure they have, like, a version of AA.

Yeah. Yeah. From healthfund.com says it affects almost 18 million people a year. Yeah. And I'm sure it's gotten worse because people now can shop at the click of a button. But at the end of the day, like this is a substance abuse, a mental health issue, which we are not experts. This is not something that we can help you with. Like Megan said, this and as it's always said, recognizing that you have a problem is the first step.

And maybe, you know, calling into this podcast is like the next step of you saying it out loud. and so we can't give you tips because we can't actually diagnose you because this is a medical issue. So the next step would be to talk to an expert, to maybe join a group, to maybe, I mean, I typed in shopping addiction into my phone and there were so many resources that came up

and so you should seek help from a professional. Yeah, there's lots of toll-free hotlines for this stuff that are specific to like location based so finding that like i think that you go through the order of operations of calling a calling a hotline getting some resources that are specific to your area joining these support groups and then getting into therapy i'm from google one of the bigger treatments is or one of the more more common treatments is uh cbt and then there's 12 step groups. But that is something that like it might take a bit to get into a therapist. But I think that the best thing that you can do when you are dealing with any addiction and is something

that you want to get help with is not waiting until all of the pieces are perfect. And so it's okay, I have a month long wait at like this, this therapist. And so I'm not going to use this as my last month. What I'm going to do is I'm going to practice and I'm going to be going to support groups. I'm going to find ones that like maybe I have to drive a little bit longer to go. Maybe there's like a virtual one that I can do at night and I'm going to do this and I'm going to get these books from the library and starting it kind of like homework before you start this other stuff. I think there's in any form of addiction, there's like a lot of shame that goes on. And I think that the best way we can set ourselves up for success in getting help is just this constant kind of

like exposure to rhetoric that is really educational and helpful that doesn't put shame on you but when you have your own internal dialogue a lot of the time it just ends up being a shame loop versus reading a book about this and coming from like a medical or scientific perspective like hearing groups and hearing other people but when you keep it in all in it just becomes like you feel like it's a personal failure and not something that you can learn more about and feel like there's like help with that and also like if you're on a waiting list when you call the therapist ask them like i recognize i have a problem i want to i know that i'm on this list but there's something that i want to, I want to do something in the interim. Do you have any recommendations? Yeah. And also

just know that if you feel like you aren't, you haven't gotten into credit card debt and trying to find things besides therapy, like just know that a therapist is not going to take you on unless they have the capacity and the bandwidth and that you are not taking the spot of someone who you may quote unquote feel is more, is in a worse spot than you and should be getting that more help than you getting more help than you are but the best thing that like again my therapist like told me was starting therapy and you're the most susceptible to therapy um when you don't immediately think that you need it and you think that she's like that's that's a level that is when you do need it because we all let ourselves get really really far gone before we like in our minds

can justify it even though it's not something we should ever justify and it's maintenance and it's like preventative and all of these other things so knowing that like it's a great step that you can take and that's why those resources exist but yeah i think that those books and those resources will be able to give you more tips than either of us can give because like yeah i would say like delete the tiktok app from your phone but that is not something that like you can just re-download like it's like that's not and i also don't want to be insulting and you you've been trying like and like i don't i want to give you credit for that and like there's really nothing that we can say that you haven't thought of and that's not that's because you care about this and you really want to

change this and like you it's okay to need some help but i think you're right i think this probably has like jumped up a ton in the pandemic yeah all right next call yes hey megan and melissa i'm calling about a thing with my friend i 24 she her i'm going to a big music festival with my boyfriend the 26 he him the festival is friday to sunday in august um i was talking to my best friend macy 23 she her about it and she said she always wanted to go to this festival i told her that i would love if she was coming with us so she should think about it she also knows another friend cindy 24 she her who is going to this festival with a friend of hers called lauren 25 Eventually, Maisie bought a ticket for the Sunday.

Problem is that Maisie doesn't like the music. It's hardstyle, it's techno, and that isn't her thing. I'm afraid she won't have a good time at a festival, and it might ruin the last day. For example, I went to a party with her, a friend, and my boyfriend. At this party, there were three stages, a side and disco, house, and techno. I wanted to go to the techno stage, so we went there, all three of us, four of us. she clearly hated it and wanted to leave after no less than five minutes she really isn't great at hiding her emotions or taking one for the team just keeping the peace i'm afraid something like

that might happen that the group wants to go to the heart style and she wants to leave but she doesn't want to leave alone so i might have to go with her but i don't want to go with her because i actually do like that music and that's why i'm going to the festival but i don't know if i'm okay with letting her be miserable on her own or potentially having her wander around the festival all alone when yeah they're just no I'm not sure about that then there's another issue my boyfriend and I like to use drugs ecstasy molly whatever you want to call it at festivals like this she doesn't like drugs she does drink alcohol and I'm afraid she'll judge me for using drugs even though she'll be drinking alcohol I don't want to babysit her I just want to have a good

time. And I'm pretty sure that Cindy also uses, but I haven't asked her. I know Cindy through Maisie, but I don't know if I will personally. Wondering what you guys think about this and how I should handle this the best way. Thank you. Bye. Why do people voluntarily do things that they don't enjoy? You're asking the wrong person. If you don't do drugs and you don't like the music then why would you go to a music festival like that's the whole like when I think of music music festival I of course think of music but the second thing I think of are drugs same like for example I don't like drugs I don't like being around drugs so I haven't really gone to I also don't like being around a lot of unshowered people and so like I don't like

going to music festivals because of that even though I enjoy music I will go to a concert of someone that I enjoy that I'm going to pay my money and spend my time on yeah did anyone ask her why she wanted to go because like that to me is like it's FOMO to me it's FOMO because then I would have asked because like to me that's so obvious because yes I am the same way I'm like I like if you told me like ultra like no offense to techno music or anything like that it just gives anxiety but like ultra is like my bad place like if i if that the bad place exists it's me and it's a rave and like everybody's on drugs and i'm like i have to live this for the rest of eternity like that is my bad place and so i feel like someone needs to ask her and like i think you should have

been the first question but prior to being like yeah come along but i don't think it's too late to ask her like i think it would be like hey here's the plan like i just want you to know that I know you don't do drugs, but we're doing drugs. We're popping Molly. And we're going to be staying really late. It's all techno music. And I just want to make sure that has something changed? Because the last time that we went to go do this, you really didn't enjoy that. And I just want to make sure we're on the same page because I don't want you to commit to something and not realize what you're committing to. Because if you want to leave early, I don't want to. I'm not going to want to do that and i think that you just say that ahead of time because i think some people

like to romanticize these ideas and like it's going to be so fun but if you give her all of the information prior and then she chooses to go then that you are exempt from everything i also think to be fair it is her responsibility as an adult to like do research and like know what she's signing up for i think that either she doesn't know what she's signing up for or she's completely changed her tune and she like she's like oh i started listening to techno music and i really want to go and like i've always wanted to try now i want to try i don't think it's either either of these no but i think that she has to own up to it like that it's like i want to hang out like well you guys are all doing this i want to do that and then it's like okay then no no by joining that

like if you want to leave early nobody's going with you like but that's extenuating circumstances or whatever but like you just i need you to know that like you're this is how this is what's going happen and like is this what you're okay to sign up for because then if she decides that i want to leave like i'm in a bad mood or whatever you can be like i'm sorry i paid my money i'm here you have to you know music festivals you have to find your place and stick to your place like i'm not again i'm not going i have spent my money this is something that i enjoy doing i'm here you chose to be here you don't enjoy being here like i'm not gonna fucking sign up to i don't know i'm trying to think of something that i enjoy i mean that i don't enjoy i mean this isn't this i'm not going

to go to a fucking music festival i don't care the only way i'm going to go to a music festival is if i have direct transportation to and from i have a special designated area for me that's close enough to the music and then people aren't gonna be bothering me but like then what's the point go to a fucking concert yeah i think that like you essentially just need to give her an ultimatum where it's like here's how it's gonna go and you're either signing up for this or you're not coming and i think like don't stay with her like i just say like whatever you do like make sure that like if you see her at the festival like that's the only time you see her don't stay in a house with her like don't do any of that extra stuff but like give her give her the out

and be like very brutally honest with her because it's like i don't want us to walk away from this situation not being friends anymore because like i'm telling you how this is going to go and you're either like you're either on the ride or you're fucking off and like we're still friends if you don't come we don't have to like all of the same things but like if you ruin this for me like i will hate you and like i would rather you just not come and like us do something fun that we both enjoy like later on but like this isn't going to bend for how you want and that's just like the end of it and like no i'm not and i'm not gonna bend to you yeah yeah but don't stay with her no don't go in the same transportation anything separate yourselves and if you see

her at the festival you see her at the festival but otherwise she needs to have a buddy that like has the same feelings that she has so if they need to leave then they need to leave you know who my buddy was lily lily was my buddy where i would be like the sun would go down when i've coachella the sun would go down and i would be like i'm anxious i need to leave and lily it was like she could stay if someone was like lily let's stay she's like i'm down and someone's like i need to leave she's like i'm down let's go you just have to be whoever gets to you first and then she'd be like let's leave like we'll go come on and like you just have to have that like otherwise you will be like miserable and need to have that planned out ahead of time and like

that's not your responsibility that's hers yeah okay now it is time for don't blame them which is where a listener will call in with their own advice from a call that we played on a previous episode so maybe they have personal experience or they just have some insight that they would like to share with the original caller hey megan and melissa i'm calling in for don't blame them uh specifically season 8 episode 18 and the more specifically the religion conversion call um I just wanted to drop some advice from the perspective of someone who grew up in a pretty conservative Muslim household so if we're talking about religion technically Muslim men are allowed to marry women who are Christian or Jewish I myself have several male family members who are

married to Christian women. Now, if we're talking cultural or personal standards, that's obviously different. We all know that culture can sometimes be the bigger factor at play, even when something is religiously sound. For example, I've known some parents where, like, being Muslim isn't even enough. Like, their kids have to marry someone from the same sect of Islam or even the same country, same cultural background. I'm not saying the mom is completely wrong about the possibility of being shunned, but that's not due to any religious reason. My overall advice to the caller is for her and her boyfriend to share all the ins and outs of your respective religions, or I guess in his case, his parents' religion, so that in discussions, you have the leg to stand on. I also

encourage you to do your own research about his religion, and I also encourage you to get him to do his own research about yours. I've just learned from experience that it helps in understanding and also helps people from misleading you about what might be acceptable in religion and what might be more of a personal thing. And yeah, that's all. Thank you so much. That makes total sense. I never thought about it. Yeah, the social aspects. Interesting. Great insight. Thank you. I hope we get a callback from that original caller and some what happens after those conversations yeah anyways um that is it for our episode we hope you all enjoyed if you want to go leave a review on the podcast app we would so appreciate

it if you are still listening go comment on the latest instagram what you think the mlm was yeah be curious and if you want to call in for an upcoming episode leave us a voicemail at 310-694-0976 international listeners you can send us an audio message at meganpodcast at gmail.com follow our socials everywhere our ones for the podcast as well as our individual ones anything else that's it that's it and we will talk to you you'll hear we'll talk at you and you'll hear us soon sooner if you listen to but am i wrong goodbye don't blame me is a production by me executive produced by melissa de monts and diamond imprint productions edited by coco lawrence post-production sound by chris henry

production assistance by melanie d watson music by ryan hunter and giacomo picasso