Doomed to Fail - Ep 119 - Presidential Hopes & Dreams: Gary Hart

Episode Date: July 5, 2024

Join us on "The Enigmatic Journey of Gary Hart," a deep dive into the life and career of one of America's most intriguing political figures. From his meteoric rise as a presidential hopeful to the scandal that shook the nation, we explore the highs and lows of Gary Hart's public and private life. Through exclusive interviews, expert analysis, and rare archival footage, we unravel the complexities of a man who was poised to redefine American politics. Tune in to discover the untold stories, the political machinations, and the enduring legacy of Gary Hart. Whether you're a political junkie or a history buff, this podcast will captivate and inform, shedding new light on a pivotal moment in American history. #GaryHart #PoliticalHistory #Podcast #AmericanPolitics #Scandal #PresidentialHopeful #HistoryPodcast #UntoldStories #PoliticalIntrigue #GaryHartLegacy   Join our Founders Club on Patreon to get ad-free episodes for life! patreon.com/DoomedtoFailPodWe would love to hear from you! Please follow along! Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doomedtofailpod/  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/doomedtofailpod  Youtube:  https://www.youtube.com/@doomedtofailpod TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@doomed.to.fail.pod Email: [e-mail] 

In a matter of the people of the state of California versus Hortonthal James Simpson, case number B.A.019. And so, my fellow Americans, ask not what your country can do for you. Ask what you can do for your country. And we are back yet again at my shitty headset. So apologies for the audio, but we're back on a sunny Wednesday day. Hi, Taylor. How are you? I'm good. How are you? Good.

Would you like to introduce us? Sure, I'd be happy to. Happy almost 4th of July. Welcome to doomed to fail. We are the podcast that brings you history's most notorious disasters and epic failures twice a week, every week. On Monday, we covered the 1972 Munich Massacre at the Olympics, which was terrible. And today, Far as going to tell us something not as terrible? It's not that terrible.

It's interesting. It depends on what scale you grade terrible. because if you graded it on a scale of one thing begets other things that ultimately so us to where we are right now and there's ultimate planes of reality that we have gone down or it help us maybe this terrible but someone um to talk to just mention mention last week um someone while we were talking on our last episode someone who is a friend who is someone who is someone who would, who is a, who is like a third party voter, said, sent something mean to me on Instagram. And then I got, immediately got like a notice that they took it back. It said like,

the person is leading the last message. And I'm sure that they think that I didn't see it. But I definitely saw it. And I'm like, you do you, man. But you do you. You do you. So I. So I, I mean, I'm not like really that patched about many things. But like, Parts of the topic I'm discussing here, which are political in nature I'm, like, super passionate about. And it has nothing to do with, like, party affiliation, so much as it has to do with, like, establishment apparatus and how things operate and what things I feel are right and what things I feel are wrong. And in those things, if anybody feels a certain way, you're probably wrong. Like, I'm sorry, but, like, I'm very sure about very few things I say. oh my god also before you get started i have another sad thing to tell you okay our fish died

i saw that his name was chippy he was a beta fish he i think we had him for like two years and i really think that he listened at story time like he would get really excited and like come up to the side of the tank and then like one day i didn't feed him we didn't feed him we forgot and the next day he yelled at me he like camped me in the tank and went whack like he opened up his mouth kind of gave me a big bubble and like I know he was talking to me. He was bad at me. And then when I got home from vacation after Japan, I like took him out of the tank to clean it and he got back in and he was so mad at me from leaving the tank. He was doing the jumps and flips. And I just felt like he had a really good personality, but he was getting sick the last couple weeks. And

we found him passed away the other day. And so we buried him in the backyard. And I painted a big stone and I wrote Chippy. He loved Storytime. And we buried him this morning. And it was very sad. And I like took his tank. And I think this might have been a mistake. But I like cleaned it and I put the plant back in it. So it's like in the same spot. But I keep picking that he's there, and I'm just like, sad. So, rest in peace, chippy. You were a good beta fish. Rip chippy.

That's the one thing about pets. They're great, and they also just rip your heart out so bad. I know. I'm just like, wanting to go say hi to him. And I'm like, oh, my God, he was a fish, but I'm like, I still loved him. I'm sorry, I'm sorry for your loss. I'm sure the kids are sad. Yeah, we're all sad.

Now we've had a pet cemetery, which is cool. So, I just don't bury yourself there. Or do. or do if you want to be a Stephen King character. So it depends. Depends on what you're shooting for. Okay, so I kind of preface this. So I was looking, I was, we're recording this on Sunday, June 30th.

And so the presidential debate between Biden and Trump were on Thursday. And obviously a lot of people are talking about this kind of stuff. And it started making me think a little bit about party apparatus stuff. But one thing that I asked ChatGBT, GBT, and again, people can feel however they want about this. It is an absolute undeniable fact that Ruth Bader Ginsburg and Diane Feinstein should have quit when they had the chance. Things would have been, the world would have been a lot different if they had identified their flaws and quit when they were ahead of time. So I started thinking about other what-if scenarios and what those downstream impacts could have been. and I landed on one that is kind of the beginning of the national political scandal in the U.S. crisis,

and that is the life and time of Gary Hart. Do you know what that is? I don't know. I think so, but I don't know, maybe. Tell me anymore. Okay. I'm sure I do. I literally just mentioned that I have a master's degree in political communication,

so am I going to get shamed for this, probably? I think that was in the last episode, so you probably know, if they don't connect the dots, it's fine. Don't connect the dots. So Gary Hart looks like the guy who was, he looks like a type of guy who was basically born to like either be president or play the president in a movie. He's very Mitt Romney-like in that regard. He was a lawyer. Well, is he still alive. He is a lawyer in Colorado.

And in the 1970s, he started getting involved in local politics. So in 1974, well, local politics is then he was working for the McGovern campaign. Like he was working on campaigns. And then he started being involved directly himself. And in 1974, he ran for a U.S. Senate as a Democrat against a two-term incumbent senator and just destroyed him in the general election, which is a challenge because usually incumbents have like that advantage of being an incumbent. And having a newcomer on the scene and doing that is pretty impressive. He actually was in luck because, again, he was running as a Democrat. At that time, Nixon was, that was a year Nixon resigned office.

And so Republicans were just shooting the bed left and right. And so he was able to kind of ride that wave. So typically when a rising star is found, and that's somebody who can basically mobilize donors, fundraisers, supporters on national level, they tend to become kind of the media darling or the party dog darling in this case the dnc's darling and the way things were going with gary his looks his demeanor his attitude the way he actually just crushed it in colorado in his first race and winning a u.s. senate seat which is crazy like that's actually really impressive that's like why Obama was so impressive is because he like just leapfrogged every step along the way like he was there's levels to this and he definitely went

really far far ahead of everybody else his result is he basically was just rising in the ranks the Democratic Party. He wasn't at the top. He was kind of like where like Gavin Newsom is right now. You know, like just somebody who's there and everybody knows he's reliable, but we don't know what we're going to do with this guy. Sort of thing. Gavin Newsom is busy this weekend.

Yeah, yeah. So I just passed. Oh, I see what you were saying. Yeah. I thought you meant because he just passed the budget deficit the bill in California. But he's also on every news program out there. So in 19, He ran for re-election for U.S. Senate, and he also won, although it was more narrow this time.

Back then, he was also operating under the wing of basically what was going on with Jimmy Carter, and Jimmy Carter had a horrible, horrible approval rating. And so it was tough. It's tough to be a downstream Democrat or Republican in win your office, when the president is losing his office. So it just doesn't work too well. So in 1983, there was no clear and obvious Democratic candidate to, run against a very, very strong and dominant Ronald Reagan. So his poll numbers were through the roof.

And so nobody really knew what they were supposed to do here. What we had on the ticket was these are just no, nobody's. So Claude Kirk Jr., Ernest Hollings, Alan Cransston, Ruben DeSkew, George McGovern. Okay, we heard of them or him and John Glenn. Okay, we've heard of John Glenn too. So those were the basically inconsequential candidates. then there was Carter's VP, Walter Mondale, and Jesse Jackson, and then there was Gary Hart himself. Those were really the three consequential candidates that were running for the Democratic nomination in 1983 for the 84 election.

So in 1983, Gary decided to throw his hat in the ring for the primary campaign, and he went from kind of like an unknown on the national stage to beating everyone but Mondale in the first primary state of Iowa. and then beating Mondale in New Hampshire, which was a huge wake-up call for Mondale, going from VP, name, recognition, you know, all that to starting to losing. As the primary season keyed it up, it was clear that there was only two candidates worth really talking about. Mostly everybody except Jesse Jackson dropped out at that point, but it was mostly just a Mondale and Gary Hart thing. Mondale, obviously, like I said, he had the good look of being a former president,

which means he also had party establishment support and a ton of dollars that were back. him. But despite that advantage, they basically tied on Super Tuesday, which is kind of nuts if you think about it. So a strong Super Tuesday showing is like one of the most important ways for a campaign to submit that its legitimacy for context. Going into Super Tuesday in 1992, Bill Clinton was trailing then former Massachusetts Senator Paul Sangas. And then he won. And then Bill Clinton became who he was. Same story. So in 2008, Obama was, was trailing Hillary in the polls until they hit Super Tuesday and just blew it through the roof and obviously what happened there happened.

Actually, this is the part where I think people are going to have a beef with me and I don't give a shit because I'm right. So this is also the case between Bernie and Hillary in 2016. So Hillary started out as a frontrunner and then Bernie had a super strong showing on Super Tuesday. It's a weird example because obviously Hillary went on to when the party nomination over Bernie. But again, this goes back to like the insane amount of bullshit corruption within the DNC. I mean, I'm going to say at that time, but I'm not so surprised if it isn't the same

right now. Things that we were privy to directly, Taylor, was them revoking his access to the van. It was just they planted, it was crazy how much corruption. I didn't realize this until later was that there was a hack that happened to the DNC after this. And it led to Debbie Wasserman Schultz resigning, the DNC CEO, the communications director, the CFLA, they wiped out the entire DNC because they were so obviously trying to screw over Bernie Sanders because they thought Hillary should get the nomination.

And honest opinion, if Bernie had got the nomination, there wouldn't be a Trump right now. Yeah, they screwed over the whole fucking country. They destroyed the world. These four idiots destroyed the entire world, basically. So anyways, that's where we are. so I mean yeah yeah um anyways my point my point about how angry that makes me is that despite everything being said about like the moral morals of the parties the Republicans

actually were democratic they let the guy that should never have gotten nominated get nominated it's insane like in meanwhile the Democratic party is like no we got to bury the guy, whatever. It doesn't matter. It is what it is. I did say alternate timeline earlier, and I do wish I was on an alternate timeline, but yeah, yeah, I started going down this rabbit hole of like the super delegates because I like was like, what was going on with the delegates again? I was like, oh yeah, it was just all all party elders. It was a 572 party elders that just voted for Hillary because it was just like, oh, it's her turn. It's her turn to run.

It's unbelievable. Anyways, so we're going back to Gary Hart. So the race comes down to Walter Mondale and Gary Hart with the two having, you know, those block victories on Super Tuesday. One of Mondale's most popular attack lines against Gary was that his policy position sounded good, but they lacked substance. So in what would end up being like a disastrous debate performance for Gary Hart, he was was presenting himself as, I'm the younger candidate, I have new ideas, Mondale's old

and stodgy and all that, Mondale would turn to Gary and he would reference a Wendy's fast food slogan, where's the beef? So, heading into the convention, both Gary Hart and Mondale were still campaigning for president, but neither had enough delegates to kind of cinch the nomination. That's when, what I mentioned before, the superdelegates came into effect. Basically, that's where and the candidates go and lobby to these party elders. That's what happened with Lincoln. Yeah. Like,

Lincoln was everyone's, like, third, second choice, you know? Yeah, actually, yeah.

And that's how he won the nomination because he was like, okay, well, this guy, you guys got this guy, but like, I'll be your second. And he was,

that's how he got it. So that's not like new, you know, but that's also just like, it's all too. So they don't do that anymore. They don't do that anymore because it was,

It was one of the things that Bernie railed against the most was that this was undemocratic to have your state won, but the delegates not bound to what the voters is that. It's crazy. That's like, I know. It's crazy. That's so, such bullshit. Now it's a different version of it, which is like, it's like the first round, if it's a contested convention, then the first round, first time, it has to be contested. If it is, then the first round ballot has to go with the way their state voted. Then on a second round, some percentage are allowed to vote on their own.

But back in 2016, that wasn't the case. It's just changed like 2018. So I was, you know, I was president of the Manhattan Young Democrats? Yeah. So the Young Dems are very sweet. It's like they have good intentions, but they always end up fighting with each other, you know. But they have a nominating convention for the president of the Young Dems. it is fun as shit because everyone's mad at each other but you guys do the thing where you're like state of new york uh we have six votes for farmer or circle standard seven votes for whatever like it's it's very fun and i like watching the part of that part of the convention where they're like the great state of nevada supports joe biden or whatever you know it's fun i mean yeah it's very old timey it's very cool and all that but also uh i did i did do again rail against me all you want about belief systems

the Republican Party does not do this. This is, this was, this has always been a unique feature of the Democratic Party. The Republican Party does have a concept of unbound delegates. But the way the Democratic Party works now is the way the Republican Party always operated. Yeah. It's crazy. Like, come on. So there's also like, yeah, like I, someone who I know was like, the young Dems always fight isn't normal.

And I was like, yeah. Democrats, all they do is if I get with each other. That's how he got here. There's no, I don't know. So anyways, Mondale wins the argument with the superdelegates. He becomes a nominee. And, oh, yeah, this is also hilarious to me. So, yeah.

So Mondale wins a nominee. During his nomination speech, again, this goes back to like, dude, like, just please stop shooting yourself on the foot for no, absolutely no reason. He's quoted as saying, let's tell the truth. Mr. Reagan will raise taxes and so will I. He won't tell you, I just did. And they reminded me of when Duke Caucus was in a debate and he was asked if he would want the death penalty of somebody raped and killed his wife. And he's like, no.

And let me tell you why. The death penalty is it's like, dude, if you're a campaign manager, like, these are human moments. These are not, this is not a policy discussion that you're having. Like, have a human moment and stop being so like moralistic and principled. Like, just, God, just want to shake. these people awake. I mean, I mean,

I know about a debate perhaps from watching the West Wing, right? And it seemed like it's very, it's stressful, you know? And like, if they throw you a weird ass question like that, you know, you're going to be like,

oh, this is like Miss America. You know, Jamandio was giving his acceptance speech. It wasn't that challenging. He wrote it probably a month before. Mm-hmm. Okay, fair.

Fair. Oh, okay. no what it honestly made me think of was like the democratic party wants to would rather lose nobly than to win that's what it makes me think of it that i think that is exactly right and that is what a lot of people who are like third party voters this right now are like that's how they're feeling and you're like but all these examples of this you know it's really it's it's frustrating i feel like also for like you and me are very in we know what's going on. We spend our lot of times thinking about this. Most people don't, you know? Like, during the debate the other day, I'm texting with some people who have strong opinions one way,

some that have strong opinions another way. And then one of my friends sent me something about, like, making jewelry. And I was like, you don't even know this is happening. That's wild. That's actually, you know what? You don't know this is happening right now. Me and you were texting too.

And I had that same experience where I texted somebody like, I'm not watching this. It's like, wow. okay they didn't even know what's happening you know it wasn't like I'm I'm I'm I know people who chose not to watch it which I planned to not watch it but then I decided to it because people kept texting me so I was like okay if I don't put it on I appreciate how easy it was to watch because I feel like I said about the Olympics are like nearly impossible to watch but like you have to have like a cable subscription and all these things but I appreciate how accessible it was for yeah no it's interesting it's interesting because I was um I've been listening I'm listening to listening to a lot of like progressive voices on this because that's actually one of the reasons why I wanted to text you because I was like I was like am I like hearing things differently like how is somebody that's like super on the progressive side hearing this and then you were telling me your perspective on it and so I sort of listen to the pod Save America guys I'm like

these guys have to have a really good perspective on this they know they know Biden and like they were I don't know I mean I'm whatever it doesn't know I like if there are stuff she was listening to them after and yeah yeah it's gonna be rough it's be rough four years i mean i don't i don't know yes and i'm excited for four years from now no matter what happens when we have two fucking 37 year olds who are handsome as shit talking about debating that's what Yeah. So anyways, okay. Let's go back to the structure. This is a long one. It's longer than I thought. So the outcome of the Reagan-Mondale matchup is basically what we already know happened. Reagan ends up Trounsing him. He actually won. I didn't know this, but this win is the biggest win in the history of presidential politics. Reagan won 525 electoral votes to 13 for Mondale. It was a swing of 17 million votes. are 20% of the total electorate on the popular boat side. Wow.

Literally the biggest margin ever in U.S. history. And another, like, super cute thing, given our current situation, you should do this. You should go back and watch the Mondale-Ragan debate. It will blow you away, Taylor. It was, it was, so what do you think about the earned income tax for the children? And it's like, because you're talking about the golf swing. One is it even talking.

It was incredible. It's incredible. It's incredible. It's cute to think about now. But I went back and I watched one of them. And so back then during this debate, Reagan's age was a problem. Reagan was 73 years old. And he was being called on a question for being old. And it was during one of these debates when Reagan, who was being told he's too old,

he quips back. I will not make age an issue of this campaign. pain. I'm not going to exploit for political purposes. My opponent's youth and an experience. And I read that Walter Mondale, he was like, amazing. Amazing. Everybody was tackling when he said that, including Mondale.

And I read that Mondale said that, yeah, I was laughing, but if you look really close, you can see a tear coming out of my eye because I knew at that moment this election was over. Fuck, that is a really fucking good answer. Wait, so, do you want to talk about the Nixon Kennedy debate real fast?

Sure. So that's the one that you always hear about, well, like, every, it's like the famous one for being really, um, having to do with, like, what a president looks like and, like, being more presidential in a debate. Because during that debate, Kennedy, like, is young as shit. He's handsome. He wore makeup. He knew how to be on TV. Nixon was sick and he didn't want to wear makeup. So people who watched the debate thought that Kennedy won and people who listened to it because it was still like heavily radio thought that Nixon won. You know? And that was like the first time where it was like, it matters. Like, So then in school, I learned a lot about, you know, you scrutinize every debate.

And like, in like the, there's a Clinton Bush debate where Clinton, Bush just like sits and doesn't move. He's like, they're sitting on these stools for some reason. And Bush is like on his stool the whole time. But Clinton is getting up. He's looking at the audience. He's talking to them. There is an audience. He's like moving them around.

Nixon, the Nixon Kennedy one there was not an audience like this one that happened last week. There was no audience. And that changed the dynamic as well. It's interesting. So like it matters like, you know, what you wear. It matters. But you're, in the Bush, in the Bush Clinton one, Bush was checking his watch. Oh, my God.

Yeah. But it's also, so you actually called this out in the last episode, how Obama kind of did bad against Mitt Romney. Like, he just seemed kind of flat-footed and wasn't as, like, sharp as we know him to be. And so one thing that the Ponce of America guy said was, like, when you're an incumbent president, you're not used to being called, like, a lying scound rule, you know, whatever. or like you're used to people just listening to you and you're the boss and all that. And so it is something. You're busy, right?

And you're busy. And there's something about like you show up to a debate and it's like, it's your first time going back into that world of being talked to like that and you're just trying to get used to it again. So, anyways. So long story short is that

Gary goes away from this lost, but he decides he's not going to rerun for Senate. Instead, he's going to wait for Reagan's term to expire and run to president again in 1988, which was totally a reasonable thing to do, given how well he did in the 83 primary season. So Gary mounts his, his 88 campaign in a proud of field. This time it includes Jesse Jackson, Al Gore, Paul Simon, Dickhart, and Michael Dukakis. The singer of Paul Simon? No, no, I looked that up to. It was, I forgot if it was Utah or something. He was a former senator.

That's funny. So fun facts. This is also the election where David Duke campaigned for president on the Democratic ticket. Whoa. And then it was also Joe Biden's first run at president. Oh, really? Yeah. He actually ended up dropping out before any primaries happened.

The reason was that all these plagiarism things started popping up. Do you remember this? It came up, it came up in 2020 that he, like, plagiarized a bunch of stuff. And this, it was during this run that that all surfaced. So all the stuff that you heard in 2020 about him plagiarizing speeches, it was from his run in 80s. Did he do that? Yeah, he did. Oh, my God, remember when Melania Trump plagiarized his speech from Michelle Obama?

I remember that. So, so to Biden's credit, he credited the. person who he's whose speech he was saying except on like a specific incident incident which was recorded and it was actually the Dukakis campaign who spread that far and wide that he did this so it's who his Dukakis is I guess this was it's so cute they they forced the campaign staff who did this to resign can you believe how cute that is yeah that is ridiculous and then I was also thinking oh I was thinking about oh I can remember I lost it about plagiarizing

continued I remember so in this case in 88 the Dems actually had a better chance they had in 84 the reason being they had already taken

back the Senate in the midterms and the Republicans weren't boiled in Iraq Contra which was not a good book for them at the start of the cycle

the overwhelming winner according to public opinion polls was Gary Hart he was polling in the 30 to high 40% range depending on the

poll and when exactly it was being given which is crazy given how many people were running for this office in the primary. So one thing to know about Gary is he didn't have the best personal reputation. He and his wife had separated twice and were living apart at the time with her raising their kids alone.

He also was kind of considered a bit aloof with policy positions that just didn't have that much on the bone. And it was under this cloud that he had developed a reputation of also being a womanizer. so the media was primed and ready for this which is so funny because like I'm being a president who isn't yeah right yeah I'm gonna say

Biden's not I'm gonna say Abraham Lincoln because he was too busy reading wasn't he gay but no no was gay there was one gay one

there's definitely gay one it's not Lincoln I don't know I came from yeah There's one who was a bachelor, you know, and had a bestie, James Buchanan. Got it, got it. He was unmarried, you know, a roommate. A roommate, that's what it was.

So, yeah, I was under this, it was under this cloud that he developed this reputation as kind of a womanizer. And I was thinking about how this is like 88 and like it was just starting to be a thing that they would like start looking into like your personal life. You did a whole episode of how Eleanor Roosevelt had like a lover. And, like, it was, it just kind of sort of was hush whispers, like, notes that nobody really talked about. Like, if it was that, if that was today, that would be, like, all over everything. It would be, like, years of content being produced on it. So, like, this is, like, the impetus for that. It's like the beginning parts of that.

Yeah. And I think also, like, I don't really talk about it before, but, like, for a very long time, presidents didn't campaign for themselves. Yeah. Yeah, that was considered, yeah, that was considered, like, not cool. So, like, people would just get, like, you wouldn't hear from the candidate. Like, FDR didn't even go to, like, some of the conventions. And then he, like, get a call that he was nominated again, you know? It's pretty cool.

Kind of cool. That's wild to think of now. When you're like, if we could just not hear from them and hear from other people, that'd be nice. Yeah, if only. So in 1987, a woman named Donna Rice was the former Miss South Carolina Beauty Pageant winner. And she was doing as you do when you are that type. of a person. She was in Aspen with her boyfriend at his house for New Year's Eve party. Her boyfriend was co-vocalist and lead guitarist for the Eagles, Don Henley. She's just like pretty, pretty hard, pretty

awesome. So obviously when that kind of guy drops a party, the movers and shakers in town come, here comes the former U.S. Center for Colorado, Gary Hart. So they meet and they end up kind of striking up like a friendship, whatever you want to call. I have no idea what they actually struck up and we still don't know what they struck up, but during all this, the media was playing up on his reputation that he's a womanizer. So Gary challenged them to stock out his life to find out how boring he really is, which is like a horrible move. So according to an anonymous tip, reporters ended up taking out his DC townhouse and they observed Don and Gary are riding at the house together and nobody walking out the front door until the next day. So we don't

know if Gary would later say that she left out the back door. We don't know what happened. We don't know if they actually stayed over. He's married, but separated. Separated. Yeah. The New York Times Magazine published a story about this and basically start up all this alleged affair stuff. And it led to basically the media just all kind of piling on essentially. So

his poll numbers started to take and he started losing popular appeal, specifically to Michael Dukakis, who was like second up, the run up to him. So literally a week after the story came out, the Washington Post also told the campaign that they have another story about a woman who said she's like in an affair

with him. Like horrible. And at that point, he decided it's going to be too much. And so he dropped out of the race on May 8th. So literally a week after all this broke, he dropped out of the race for president while he was ahead. Wow.

He would ditch everyone and basically abscond to a small cottage he rented in Ireland and just presumably right and walk the countryside, which sounds absolutely delightful. No, 100%. That sounds way better than the president. Yeah, no kidding. Yeah, just go do that.

Something happened to him. I don't know what got up as asked about this, but in December of 1987, he decided to return back to the campaign and keep running for president. So he would obviously go forward and get destroyed by Michael Dukakis. And Dukakis would then go on to lose, in the 13th biggest landslideous financial history, to George H.W. Bush, 426 to 111. Stop being principled. Like, this is, come on. I don't even care about the policy anymore. It's like, just trying to win a real campaign. I know. I mean, it would be fun for, like, people to see and, like, be a part of and, like, be around.

I don't know. That'd be super exciting. Yeah. Yeah. I am, given how long I've been in politics, like at this stage, I, um, zero hope of the Democratic Party. I've seen absolutely no signs that there's any interest in trying to win. I know. Yeah. It's crazy. It's scary. so crazy anyways because people don't remember this but in 2015 the Republicans

were shitting themselves they were so terrified like this guy's gaining traction he's literally beating all of our like institutional Republicans there goes Jeb there goes Marco there goes like those are the people

who were supposed to get elevated to the presidency and there was all this talk that we were going to try and block him at the convention and they literally let him go forward I'm not saying it's good I'm not happy about it

but it's at least democratic no totally do you do you know how that jeb's name is initial and they make fun of him in rest of development because like job is like george something gluth and that's what um that's what jeb is that's his initials oh oh oh you're right yeah yeah because they call him gob yeah exactly which is really funny and stupid um i know he was like you were like he was like he was like I feel like he's, I mean, he's fine, but I'm fairly like he's like, that, that was shitty. Yeah, well, yes, yeah. So, so here's the thing. Like, what I've learned about him is, like, since then, he, he was one of the main people who was running around trying to alert.

So basically, in 1988, Bill Clinton put him on a commission to study, like, terrorism, counterterrorism measures and stuff like that. he was responsible for that whole project that whole program and it was like the it was like September 2nd and then 3rd and then 5th and then 6th and then 8th he was having all these backpack meetings like Condoleezza Rice in the the cabinet was no Gary okay Gary yeah he was having all these back-to-back meetings with the cabinet of George A. We're saying a terrorist attack is about to happen. Like, it is literally imminent to happen. It was like

he did this up until like September 8th, I think was like the last meeting. He did this in 2001 right before 9-11. I that also happened in Munich. They were like, there is going to something terrible is going to happen at a big international event in

Europe and people were like, meh. What could it possibly be? You know, you're like. Whose job is it? Who's supposed to care? it's obviously obviously this you know yeah so anyways i i would say this i would say if you are on the on the democratic side of the aisle ask more of the people that you're giving money to ask more the people who are in control of the committees that you're giving money to ask more of the dnc ask ask more of your state party ask more of like your county party ask more it's just like

again like nothing has changed even this conversation we're having today about Joe Biden is all based on party elder logic of like we can't supersede like disperse this turn it's this they've been doing this for so long dude and then and then and then you start playing out the logic of like what else could be done so what if you contested the convention like what's wrong so if you put Gavin Newsom up there the starkest contrast like Donald Trump then the problem is that you're putting another straight white guy up, right? Like, you got to, like,

the party politics won't let you win. Like, it is not designed. God, it's so stupid. And so because of that, we're going to keep having, we're going to keep having this. Like, that's, that's, I don't see a road out of this,

essentially. Yeah, I don't know. I mean, like, I hope there's something, but, like, I also don't know. And that's why I feel so, like everything local and all the committees in the states like that's important like i'm so fucking grateful that i live in the great state of california dude but that's the thing that's

the thing taylor like when like what i literally just mentioned about the 84 and 88 elections is that when the top of the ticket doesn't inspire turnout then the bottom of the ticket loses Yeah. So I'm not talking about Trump just winning in November. It is the Senate. It's the House. It is your school board. While your school board technically should be nonpartisan, we all know it's not. Like it's governor. It is all of it because all that's really important. No. Yeah, that's something too. But then you have to eat it because nobody will just say the hard thing at the highest level and do what it takes to actually win. Mm-hmm. Anyways, I'm rambling on. No, I mean, yeah. No, I know. I feel like the third party people, and I was like, okay,

and then give me a third party fucking governor or a senator, like, whatever. Like, what is happening? Dude, but this thing like, like, see, here's something like, I'm at this, I'm at the point in my, like, understanding of this stuff where I'm like, dude, I get it. I get it. I get why you want to vote third party. I, like, yes, there's like a greater good logic to it, but there's also.

at how many times do you have to get punished before you want to punish back? And part of punishing back is But to what end? Like, isn't this a bad place? Are we not there yet? Dude, this is going to continue. That's what I'm saying.

I feel like we're there. I mean, it's supposed to get worse. I don't think I'm in a good place. No, no, and that's what I'm saying. I'm saying in like the 15 plus years that you and I have been involved in this way in politics, it's never not been like this on the Democratic side.

It's always been like this. Yeah. That's the reason why I'm, last company or CEO started his company was because there was king makers and you had to go

with the key maker said and he was right and that's where we are right now and anyways it's super yeah it's super bad

but and there's no solution there's absolutely no solution no I think that the solution is aliens come we have to decide

do we kill them or do we let them tell us what to do? Either way, I think we'd be better off. I'm going to say, what do they want us to do? Do they want us to like use our natural resources better and not have nuclear war? I say yes to those things. Yeah, maybe they'll make Trump and Biden hug each other. Do they want to just like take all of our resources? I'm also like, yeah, we don't deserve them. But also if they got here, If they got here, they already figured out how to harness their son. So, like, they don't really need our, like, oil.

But maybe they want to, like, hang out. Honestly, they're not coming because we're too stupid. I'm going to switch back to that. Because, like, yeah. We are quintessential don't deserve nice things. We don't deserve nice things. We don't. And that's what we learn through history.

What we learn through politics. We learn through all these things is, like, we're never going to all. We're not going to figure it out. certainly not ever maybe no in no one's lifetime we can't do it we don't want it we don't want

world peace or country peace or anything we want people want to be like oh I'm going to be a billionaire so blah blah blah you're like you're not so why would you not want to give kids food there's something about like the smugness of we know better

that's like man god And meanwhile, everybody has to try to, like, live, you know, and survive. And, like, that's what always happens. It's like during the fucking Roman Empire, people are back and forth, back and forth. And there's like, most of the people are just like, I'd love to have some bread today. That'd be great. Yeah.

But you don't get that. I would love for our, like I said, when I would love for our listeners to, like, write us in after hearing this. Because, I mean, I don't know if any of this, like, inside baseball, like, it probably is. that inside baseball might just be so that people have forgotten about or haven't read in a while or whatever. But I would love to just get just different perspectives on this. Like, whatever your belief system is, I don't care. Like, I don't like, nobody's wrong and nobody's rights.

Like, we all just have to be shades. And we all want similar things, you know, I don't think, I don't think that there's anyone who, like, doesn't want good things. things. I don't know. You don't want people to like self-shed. It's just varying interpretations of how to do certain things. But I'd be really curious for anybody who who cares about this stuff to write into us and let us know what you think. Because like I said, when this debate was happening, I was texting all my friends left, right and center because I was like, I want to know what you think is happening. Like, what's your perspective on this? That's

why I've been listening all these podcasts. I'm just trying to get a sense like, what is the overall arching narrative on this? And where does it fit with my worldview of what I understand about the Democratic Party. And was it? And this is the answer? This, well, literally everybody said that

that was an unmitigated disaster. And then the next thing was, how did they replace him? And then that led me to the DNC, as much as they're saying, we're freaking out privately and we're doing this privately and this stuff, what they should be doing

is going out public. and saying something. Putting it out there the way the New York Times editorial board did, the way that CNN did and saying something publicly so that there's a shot in hell for somebody to be able to stand up and do something. And somebody's got to figure out this FEC stuff because I don't even know what happens there. Like if you donated to the ticket, where's that money go if he isn't the top of the ticket? I don't know.

But somebody high up instead of just being a sick of fan about this stuff, it's guaranteed unequivocally it's a foreign inclusion Trump wins a presidency foregone conclusion like there's absolutely zero zero doubt they just generated 10 years worth of ad content during that one debate so anyways

I would love for folks to write in at doom to philpotta g1.com and let us know what you think and what your perspective on this stuff is and if there's things around this that you think maybe like I or Taylor can provide context on. Happy to do it. Obviously, it's a topic that we both care deeply about. I know.

It's a wild type to be alive, but every time is a wild time to be alive. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's what are you going to do? Researching these old presidential races, it's like, dude, like, yeah, even when that was the biggest thing in the world,

remember we thought what George Lee Bush was being elected, really this is the end of the world? I mean, could you imagine, like, the Nixon stuff, Watergate happening? You know, and, like, the president resigning and, like, all those things. And, like, there's a whole part of the Nixon story where he goes on TV and tells everybody his financials, like, exactly. And he's a part where he talks about how his wife, Pat, has won for a coat. Like, what?

Hey, do you know what happened that made Nixon resign? Tell me. The Republican Party went to him and said, you have to resign. Because the party, the man is an extension of the party. party is not in the connection of the man. Anyways, that's it. I got to go have dinner. I know exactly what you're saying.

No, it's crazy. And I hope that anyone who is listening to this who didn't watch the last debate watches the next one. Because whatever we're doing now, whatever, it's always important for you to watch them. Like, this is what people are going to talk about forever. Watch it anyway. Who knows what's going to happen? You just have to keep, you know, pushing forward and hopefully no one dies.

Go watch. Mondale and Reagan, you will be a guess at the depth of knowledge. It's just like, they're like talking about detailed statistics and percentages, like, in the most minutia way possible. Like, what is this? I mean, do you have to lowest common denominator your debate skills to like, are you talking to? Maybe that. Also, like, I don't know.

Anyway, you have to go at dinner, I know. I do have one more note from a listener. Oh, I just talked to Nadine, our friend Nadine. She was traveling in the UK, and she had her purse stolen. So she wanted to just share a public announcement that, like, if you are traveling, keep your stuff very, very close, especially your passport, put it inside your shirt, cross-body bag. If your bag breaks, don't put your cross-body bag in your backpack.

Just be very careful out there because that, is a constant of the world is be careful if you're traveling just in general so I'm so sorry Nadine but thank you for bringing that up and she also had some really fun stories that she heard on a ghost tour when she was over there and I'm like that sounds

really nice to tell a ghost story so maybe I'll do that after this. Nice. I like that yeah why not? I feel heavy so I'm like yeah silly. Ghosts are fun for fun. So fun who cares. I did watch oh my last thing to tell you under Paris was

not terrible. You made it sound like it was like the worst movie you've ever seen. I thought it was fun. I don't feel like it was the best movie I've ever seen, but there's definitely seen worse horror movies. Like, there's sci-fi movies that are really bad. I don't think it wasn't bad. I recommend it. I wouldn't not watch it.

I'd watch it again. It was fun. It was like Deep Blue Sea. You know, I loved the ending. The ending was super fun. We watched one Christmas who watched a movie called Santa Jaws, which is literally about a shark that has a Santa hat on its fin. I did too. Did you watch it? Yeah, boy, the kid draws a Santa hat and then he like drops in the water. That was like the dumbest movie I've ever fucking seen. And in that one, you were like, just don't go by the water.

Like, it's like really easy not to get eaten by a shark. But under Paris, it was like super fun to see how people will accidentally get eaten by a shark. I liked it. There you go. I mean, technically I recommended it to Taylor. So it was recommended it. You said it drinks three bottles of wine and then watch it. I don't recommend that.

I think you should just watch it. Just watch it sober. Okay, cool. Thank you. doomed to fail pod on all the socials. Dumb tofellopod.com. Send us an email. Doomtofellopat at email.com.

Awesome. Thanks, Taylor. Thanks, Farrs.