Doomed to Fail - Ep 188: Hear the one about the libertarian town taken over by bears? - Grafton, NH

Episode Date: April 8, 2025

Today, Taylor talks us through the story of Grafton, NH, and the "Free Town Project." Grafton, like much of New England, has been home to Black Bears for thousands of years (maybe longer? We're not Bear Historians). The Abenaki people hunted them and lived with them. The Europeans almost hunted them to extinction, but with some new regulations, the population revivedJoin us now in Grafton, where a gaggle of Libertarians moved in the early 2000s, looking for a life of freedom from taxation and government meddling; Live Free or Die is the state motto, after all! The folks in Grafton, however, took it a smidge too far; there was no fire department, no public works, and especially no rules on what you could do with your trash or how many bears you could feed.A utopia, it was not.  Sources:https://www.fsp.org/move-to-nhHow a New Hampshire libertarian utopia was foiled by bears - https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/21534416/free-state-project-new-hampshire-libertarians-matthew-hongoltz-hetlingLibertarians Took Control of This Small Town. It Didn’t End Well. - https://washingtonmonthly.com/2020/08/30/libertarians-took-control-of-this-small-town-it-didnt-end-well/A Libertarian walks into a bear by Matthew Hongoltz-Hetling - https://www.thriftbooks.com/w/a-libertarian-walks-into-a-bear-the-utopian-plot-to-liberate-an-american-town-and-some-bears_matthew-hongoltz-hetling/25841331/item/45727529/? Join our Founders Club on Patreon to get ad-free episodes for life! patreon.com/DoomedtoFailPodWe would love to hear from you! Please follow along! Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/doomedtofailpod/  Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/doomedtofailpod  Youtube:  https://www.youtube.com/@doomedtofailpod TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@doomed.to.fail.pod Email: [e-mail] 

In a matter of the people of the state of California versus Hortonthal James Simpson, case number B.A.019. And so, my fellow Americans, ask not what your country can do for you. Ask what you can do for your country. All righty, Taylor. We are recording my energy is a little bit lower than usual. It's been a long travel couple of days. How are you feeling?

How are you doing? Good. Yeah, I'm doing fine. I just got back from spring break. Um, and it was fun. It was, uh, cold and we went to Ventura and like the Channel Islands, like up in California. Um, I took a boat to a very beautiful island and went on a hike and the boat ride was an hour long and I threw up the entire time. I almost died.

That's sad. You told me that and I was like, I don't know why you do this yourself. It was the worst. Like I, I, on the way back was better, but man. Well, I took a drama. I mean, like, I know that like I'm not good on boats, but I don't know it was going to be that bad. Yeah. hear you remember that one time i tried to book uh the ferry uh from l a

to catalina island that was the funniest day of my life guys for us is on the phone with this customer service person and he was like i want two tickets why are they thirty dollars each but a hundred dollars for two and it was like a hour and a half long conversation and it was so funny and i don't know what the answer was but you were not happy was not happy but i did get to catalate island and i also got seasick i don't know what it is maybe it's like the choppiness of like that part of those i mean yeah because i used to do i used to go out on the water in the lancicotia when i lived in miami and i didn't have that problem i think it's a specific maybe i think so too it feels different yeah so um very cool welcome back and also we got to say congratulations to our

really good friends j and beth for welcoming their new bay boy yay and we have an awesome picture of jeff in the hospital uh jay does it say jeff you said jeff that is that j and beth's couple name Jeff. I like it, Jeff. I saw Jay, a picture of Jay in the hospital wearing his doomed to fail t-shirt, which is a hilarious thing for a new dad to wear. It was very cool. So thank you for that. Yep, yep. Cool. So do you want to go ahead and introduce us? Oh, yes, I'm so sorry. Hello. Welcome to doomed to fail. We bring you history's most notorious disasters and failures. I am Taylor joined by Fars.

And yes, I am here. And today we're going to hear a story by you, Taylor. Yes. I am ready. So Fars. Do you remember that joke about the libertarian town that was taken over by bears? I did not. Is that a joke or a real thing? It's a real thing. But you just like hear that and you laugh like you did it. Yeah, that's insane. If that's true. So I was like, there has to be more to the story than that. And there is, but also there isn't.

It's sort of just like there was a libertarian town taken over by bears because no one would take out the trash. I mean, it kind of makes sense. If you're libertarian, you don't believe in any government. So like, why not let the bears rule everything? Exactly. And that's what happened. So today I'm going to tell you about Grafton, New Hampshire, and the Free Town Project. This does, yeah, New Hampshire sounds right for this. Exactly.

I'll tell you more about New Hampshire as well. So I read a book called A Libertarian Walks Into a Bear by Matthew Hongulot's Helt Hetling. And I'll link to it as well. And I have some other, a couple other websites that I went to. But it also had said when I did the story about Munster and the Annabelle, Baptist, like a while ago, that I wanted to do a follow-up. And I feel like this is a follow-up. And then it is kind of because it's like people who want to take over a town where people already live, you know, and then like change it into what they want, whether it's the Anabaptist

being like, you need to be our particular form of Christianity or it's libertarians being like you need to be our particular form of government. In both cases, they kind of invaded a town and tried to take over and it did not end well. Sweet. also in the libertarian walks into a bear one of the characters was reading a book about the Anabaptist and Munster so I feel like I wasn't totally wrong there it's mentioned in there like they were thinking about this like you know taking over a town and like making it into like a utopia which by the way never works so that's good thing about so I'm going to talk about New Hampshire libertarians and then graft in New Hampshire and specifically Bears and the free town project I love that we're going to have an episode that covers bears. Yeah. Bears are the best. So, New Hampshire, the state.

It is in New England, as you know, I probably could put out in the map. That's why it's called New Hampshire, because there's a Hampshire. No, I know. But I think I probably pointed out, but like maybe not. That's the Vermont. It's this way. So the area that is New England, that is New Hampshire, was a, originally the Abanaki people lived there for thousands of years. They lived in longhouses.

They farmed and they hunted and gathered. They spoke a dialect of the Algonquin language. I think we talked about a little bit. We talked about the Niagara Falls, which makes sense because that's like the same area, like up in New England. And currently, Abanaki Nation headquarters is in Quebec. So it's like part of Canada where you just were not that part of Canada, but like it's in Canada and it's like that area of of North America. The state of New Hampshire currently does not recognize the Abenaki people and there was a bill in 2021 to allow communities to rename their towns, the traditional Abinaki names, and it failed.

So New Hampshire does not recognize them, but there is a New Hampshire Commission on Native American Affairs that started in 2010, but they're not like a huge deal in that area. now for the abidaki people bears were obviously considered very powerful because they're scary they were if you were going to kill a bear for its meat and its fur you would go through a ceremony during and before and after the hunt to honor the spirit of the bear which totally makes sense it's like a lot of like things that we imagine native americans doing right wait i think that you didn't you i think you might have even covered this group because it looks like the French and Indian War was when they were displaced. Did you cover that? I think I did when I did Niagara Falls. Yeah, I thought so too. Okay, okay. Yeah. So it's those people that, you know, they were involved in Niagara Falls as well. I

think in the Niagara Falls episode, we learned that there were like those kind of stylized myths that like the French made of like, you know, Native Americans used to like sacrifice people over the Niagara Falls. blah, blah, blah. And that was not true, but they would, like, make stuff up like that. Right.

Kind of thing. So, so those are people that live there before. And then people came from Europe, obviously. So New Hampshire was established as an English colony in 1623. So it was one of the first settlements in the United States. It received a royal charter. It was separate from Massachusetts.

So it's really close to Massachusetts. Sometimes they were, like, merged together, but they were separate. And New Hampshire has always been. a, like, very independent, leaning place. They were actually the first colony to establish an independent government and create its own constitution in January 1776, six months before the Declaration of Independence. So they're ready to do it, like, sooner than everybody else.

And do you remember the state motto of New Hampshire? It's on their license plates. The free people. Is this someone being free? Yeah, it's live free or die. Yeah, there you go. So in New Hampshire, they don't want to pay taxes. They never did.

That was also part of it. The reason that they left, they tried to leave Britain earlier is they were just even more sick of paying taxes than the rest of us. And sometimes they just didn't pay their taxes. Even after the Revolutionary War and they became part of the United States, there were times when the government would have to, like, go into New Hampshire to try to get state taxes, and they would just not pay them. Like, what if we just don't?

And they just wouldn't. In New Hampshire right now, it has no sales tax, a flat 3% income tax, the corporate tax rate is 7.5% and the property tax rate is 1.61%. So extraordinarily low for America. I wonder why everybody incorporates in Delaware. It's got to be lower than that for corporate taxes then, right? Yeah, it must be. Yeah, I don't know. Good question. So New Hampshire is also the home of the free state project, which is basically a call for people who want limited government to move there. So if you feel like you want limited government,

you don't want to pay a lot of taxes, you don't want government involved in your life, New Hampshire is a good place for you. And the free state project still exists. I'll tell you a little bit more about them later. So that's New Hampshire. Have you ever been there? No, no. It's never been a... There's never been a reason to go.

Remember in Wayne's World when they go, hi, I'm in Delaware. Remember that? I don't. In New Wainsworld, they have like a thing, and they're like, it's like a green screen. It's like, it's like the Eiffel Tower and they're like, oh, I'm in France. We have a cigarette. And then it's like, oh, I'm in New York. Get out of here.

I'm walking here. And then it says, it's Delaware. And they go, hi, I'm in Delaware. I saw that I feel about it. I'm sure. I don't think about it often. But there you go. Now, let's talk about libertarians.

So libertarian is a very small third party party in the United States. They're the things that they want are, you know, personal liberty and individual rights, you can make your own decisions as long as you don't hurt other people. They believe in very, very limited government. The government should only exist to, you know, basically like to be able to suit people, to enforce contracts and do like national defense, but nothing, nothing more than that. They don't want, they don't want to intervene in like foreign things. They just want kind of like be left alone to do what they want to do. They also support, like, privacy rights and protection of civil liberties. So the opposed surveillance

programs, they want to be left alone and no one should really, like, know what they're doing. They also want more power given to local governments, but like extreme power in local governments in communities rather than the federal government and then very, very low, low taxes. So, you know, libertarians basically, they're like, I want to be able to do whatever I want as long as I don't hurt anybody. Why is it anybody's business, you know? I kind of get that sentiment. I do too. Sure. But then it also, you know, I think some of the problems that you run into is they want to do things like have a duel if they're mad at someone and they want to sleep with their cousins, not all of them, but some of them are like, why can't I sleep with my cousin? You know, and they also think that

children can consent to sexual acts in some cases, which is not good. So a couple of things that like aren't great for sure. And then there's also things that the government does that I personally enjoy like having roads and libraries and firefighters and having people pick up the garbage and things like that. And if you're not, if the government isn't there to pay for it, people aren't going to want to pay for it. Which is what we're going to learn. No one's going to, no one's going to do it. You know? Yeah. So Grafton, New Hampshire is a tiny town, about 1,500 people, like really tiny. There's things like a firehouse. house and a church and a normal amount of bears for the Northeast.

So like there are definitely bears there. And it has the same amount of bears as any other town in New Hampshire. If you live in the Northeast, you're probably used to this and also other parts of America. California. It's very chair. So I was actually in the car with my kids yesterday and we were passing a store for guns and ammo and Florence was like, why is there a gun store? And I was like, well, people have the right to have guns.

And I was talking about the second amendment. And then I was like, well, in the beginning of America, you really needed a gun because there were bears and you were like moving west and there where you were going to run into native people and like all the things that, you know, not great, but it made sense to have a gun and you don't need them as much anymore. And then Florence like sighed and she was like, yeah, and then we killed all the California grizzly bears. And I was like, damn, you're right. So I know there are bears in California, but the California grizzly bears specifically has been extinct since 1924. Seriously? Yeah. So we just, oh, not we, I don't live there anymore.

But y'all just have black bears now? I guess. I don't know. And other kinds of bears, but the grizzly bear, the California grizzed bear is gone. I mean, Taylor, like, realistically, you probably want them gone. A grizzly bear, I heard if you, if you shoot a grizzly bear that's charging at you in the head, it'll still keep coming at you. No, no, no, no, I don't want a bear anywhere near me. Do you also, did you see that bear movie by Van der Herzog?

Have you seen that one? Oh, my God gets eaten by a bear. tread well something tread well yeah it was horrific yeah those were grizzly bears that's what happened yeah yeah and he was like i'm gonna be friends with them and it's like no you're not their bears yeah that's when you're somebody should have put him on that so the guy was obviously not well yeah no good but but um there are there have been bears in this area forever in the in the northeast all over all over the united states and north america and as soon as europeans came they started hunting the bear more, you know, than the Native Americans had been hunting them in the, in the past, prefer and food and all those things.

And in the 19th century, the black bear, so I'm talking about black bears specifically in this case. So they're kind of smaller than grizzly bears, but like a black bear. So in the 19th century, black bears were near extinction in this area, and they put up some regulations. So the government was like, you can only hunt during certain times and, et cetera, and they were able to recover the population. So in New Hampshire right now, there is estimated to be anywhere from 6 to 8,000 bears, which is a lot of bears for such a small area. Yeah, small, right. Yeah. And there are some interactions with people that bears have that aren't great.

Like they want food, and sometimes they want pets, you know, like if you have a chicken or a little dog in your backyard, you might want to watch them because there could be a bear in the area. And did you also have another thing? Have you heard that quote from a Yosemite? the park ranger about the bear-proof garbage bins. Have you ever heard this? So somebody asked him, like, why is it so hard to figure out a garbage can that bears can't get into? And he said, quote, there is considerable overlap between the intelligence of the

smartest bears and the dumbest tourists. I believe that. Which really makes sense. I've actually also been one of those tourists who've been, like, frantically trying to open a thing and not be able to figure it out for, like, a few minutes. I think I have as well. So I don't blame you or anyone for that. So Grafton, New Hampshire.

Exists in New Hampshire with all that context. There are bears there. They've been theirs for a while and all of that. So now they are in, we're talking about specifically Grafton, and there is a thing called the Free Town Project that turns into the Free State Project. And it started in 2003. And it was libertarians wanting to concentrate their political power, which is a good idea because there aren't a lot of libertarians in the federal government.

Right now, there's only been one libertarian congressman named Justin Amash from Michigan. And he was elected as a Republican and then became a libertarian. So. Yeah, he was a big deal. And he's Republican again now. So he didn't, he wasn't elected as libertarian. He became one and then went back to being Republicans. So mostly they're just Republicans.

But sometimes they say that they are libertarians. It's like you just caucus with whatever gives you the most likelihood. of passing any sort of legislation. Like, Bernie's not a Democrat, but talks is with them. It's the same concept. But their party is just like, unless you start a movement where they grow, do not know things. In all of this of state elected officials, about 1.3% are third party at all.

So very small percent are libertarians. There's like four in like any state government. So some like prominent libertarians wanted to find a place and they started talking to each other. and there's some people who had like worked in the government before and they were like well now we really want to have this place where we can really be free let's go to new hampshire so they drive around new hampshire and they find the town of grafton and there's a guy that lives there named john baborets and he lived there and he loved this idea he had been living in that place in grafton for a long time he has like well water and he made his own solar panels and he's just like as off the grid as he can be and he had actually ran for governor of new hampshire a few times and he liked the idea of a free town so he invited like it libertarians to come to Grafton. He didn't have any like official inviting power. He just was like, yeah, this makes sense. Why don't you guys come here? Yeah. So a bunch of people start moving to Grafton and it might surprise you that they're mostly men. So it was also a problem because there weren't many many women in Grafton. But they wanted like, you know, the same things that the libertarian party wants.

minimal government, personal liberty. They wanted to experiment with our social experiment. Can we really build a town that's like just libertarians? Can we make it great? Because we're going to, you know, decide on not having a lot of rules. So they did things like join the town council so they could like change things and be able to, to do things in Grafton. And by the way, people still live there. Like there's regular people that are not libertarians that live there and they're kind of getting invaded by these libertarians.

And they're like, okay, just, you know, don't mess things up. but they kind of start to do things almost immediately that start to mess things up. They decreased the town budget by a lot. So right away, things like the roads started to fall into disrepair, buildings started to fall down because there were no more regulations on what buildings you could live in. There was also no fire department because they were like, they cut the budget for the fire department and they were like, we'll just have volunteers do it. But you also need things.

to be a volunteer firefighter, you know? Like, if your house was on fire, I could come over, but I have, like, a bucket and a hose. Like, I can't. I don't have a fire truck, you know? So there's several times when people's houses burned down because it took, like, 45 minutes for a fire truck to come from another town that was paying for a fire department.

Right. And after that would happen, they would have a town council meeting, and every time they would vote to still not have a fire department. The risk was worth not having to pay for a fire department. but like you're just borrowing someone else's fire department you still need a fire department you know so one person who like was really into it his name was john connell he ended up buying a church this like beautiful 200 year old historic building and he like made it into his own church and he had like no qualifications as a pastor of any kind but he would like preach and like hold meetings and do things and his church

ended up burning down in 2016, and he died inside of it. And no one could help him and no one could save him because there were no firefighters to go and help him and save him. So they lost a next to work building, which is also not being maintained because there were no zoning laws and no restrictions on the building. So you could live in a 200-year-old dilapidated building that was a fire trap with no fireman to come and save you. Yeah.

Because you're free to do that. Which is great. I guess, you know, like, so a lot of the people who had lived in Grafton for a long time, were obviously upset by this, like this affected their life. The public safety was a huge issue, and there was a lot of tension. And then there were a lot of legal battles because libertarians still believe that you can have legal battles. So they're like suing each other a lot over, like, you know, we need a fire department.

We need to have these services to people being like, we're absolutely not paying these taxes no matter what, even though these services like are essential. So they also, since there was no zoning and no like building laws, they could live wherever they wanted. so they would live in big shanty towns in the middle of the woods and they wouldn't take out the trash they wouldn't take it anywhere because there's nowhere to take it because they weren't paying for like the local like landfills and things to be maintained so the trash would just build up and that would attract the bears I see what it's swollen and some people would feed the bears so grapston has more had more sightings of bears and bear attacks than anywhere else in New Hampshire despite having proportionately the same amount of bears because there was nobody who would like people would feed the bears because they wanted to and no one could tell on them there was no one would

call the like police and be like listen my neighbors leaving out food for bears because they had the right to leave out food for bears so there would just be more bears never feed the bears this one woman in the book they just called her donut lady because she didn't want to say her name because she's embarrassed but she would leave donuts out for the bears every day and she had kind of like trained them in a way so the bears would start coming to her house and she would leave this food out for them and they would know and they would come every day so she would go out and buy donuts every day come home and go put it in the backyard but she'd step out into her yard and the bears would be on like the edge of the forest and they would be like coming toward her and she would go hold on just wait a second back up back up and then she would go

and put the donuts out and then she'd go back up hold on and go back into her house and then they'd go and eat the donuts so they knew that when she was doing that the donuts were coming so when the bears went to other people's houses who didn't know this they would say

naturally whoa back up and they would back up but the bears wouldn't leave because they were like that's the sign that donuts are coming you know so it just got like worse tourists I remember living in LA and I would get like so angry would almost like ruin my day

any of my sauce one feeding pigeons. It's like, stop feeding them. Stop it. Even like in New York, we lived in Queens, people would feed the feral cats. I'll be like, this isn't helping them. Like, I don't know.

Like, don't do that. Like, we could, you know, get them adopted and do, that would be better for them than to, like, live out here. Just have a thousand cat babies, you know? Yeah, just adopt a bunch of feral cats.

That's way better. I mean, some people like doing that. I mean, I don't. But some people do. So for 150 years in New Hampshire, there were no bear attacks on people. And in 2012, was the first wild bear attack on a human in this part of New Hampshire because, and then there were two more, like, after that. So just because the bears felt so comfortable being there, they would, like, show up in people's porches. They'd break into their houses.

And just like I said, there weren't more bears there. They had just let the bears do whatever they want. And the bears were attracted to all the food that was everywhere because the whole town was, like, falling apart because there were no. more essential services. Yeah, they were acting rationally. Yeah. So eventually the local government and the people who had lived there before were like, we can't do this anymore. Like this is enough. Like we have to have these services back. And in 2016, the Freetown Project officially came to an end. Many of the people left because they didn't want to live in a place that had the government, which is like, sure, but you're the ones who ruined this place. They just kind of like left their shanty

towns and and moved on. New Hampshire itself considers the free state project to be a success. So the free state project, people, you can go to their website. It is FSP.org. It says, come to New Hampshire, move here. We have limited government. You can be free. So when in 2016, when the free town itself was kind of deteriorating, the whole state was like, we're successful. So more libertarians were like, well, let's all move to New Hampshire. But why would we move to Grafton? Grafton is a shithole. So they didn't move back to Grafton or to Grafton because Grafton was full of like shanty towns. And then they also, as they fixed it up and fixed it, they went back to having obviously government services.

It's a nice website. Yeah, it's a nice website. I mean, it's better put together than a lot of campaign websites. I will say that. I agree. I think it looks nice. Oh, so I mean, I was like, so the success in the free state project is that you can move anywhere in New Hampshire. But I'm like, you could, you could always have done that.

but okay if you guys want to like live together if you was on their website and they have a calendar oh literally right now is the liberty and cigars meetup is happening right now there is a there's a firearms meeting tomorrow oh there's a japanese club leader tonight there is a cryptocurrency meet up on saturday if you wanted to attend that um a cute things like there's a clothing swap. That totally makes sense. There's a macrame plant hanging workshop. Awesome. These are just like things that are happening in different parts in New Hampshire that you can go to. There's a potluck and grafton you can go to on Saturday. So there's some things in there that are cute and there's like, I don't know, I don't know what else they're doing over there.

But they do have a lot of plant swap next week. So the idea of having this like community where everybody helps each other. It's cute. these beatups are cute but I do think that there's a case for a little bit of taxation for things that are like you need like garbage pickup yeah it goes

it cuts both ways it was like my episode with Ezra Klein's abundance concept about how you have too much of something or too little of it I also tend to think like this isn't um

this probably doesn't need to be a political movement it just it can be a philosophy on life like I generally think like you should try to take care of the stuff that you can take care of yourself and not be relying on others like but I don't I just grow a vegetable garden like don't depend on the grocery store to give you your vegetables like you don't have to then extend that theory into we don't need hospitals well you don't mean like right I'm going to watch your house burn down because I don't want to spend an extra you know which is also why these things tend not to gain any sort of political

traction and political movement why someone like Justin Amash has to go back and forth between parties affiliations because this isn't a united coalition it's a fact it's like very factional actually it's little what the Democratic Party is right now

when you said that I was thinking that I'm like the Republicans are super united and no one else is yes yeah yeah and I think that's also I mean listen if you bring up a bunch of people together who are all like we aren't going to be told what to do and we're going to be free spirited than free thinkers, you're not

going to get them all to be like, vote this way. Right. It's just never going to work. Totally. They're going to be like, oh, I'm doing whatever. I'm not hurting anyone. And then you're like, okay, well, you just had a duel in the town square and getting murky. Like, we got to address it.

Like, you can't keep burning your driver's license, social security card. Exactly. Exactly. You can't have, you know, a thousand guns in your house and then also set your house on fire. Yeah. Please don't do that. You know, someone is paying for everything because like the town next to them is going to let it burn down you know so they're going to come over and and help because that's what you're supposed to do

you know which i think now a place like Alaska tends to attract a lot of those folks who are like just leave me alone because like who is going to care what you do in Alaska you're in the middle of nowhere like yeah so there's there's a place for that it's just i don't know if it needs people at all movement. Yeah, yeah, and I feel like you can be like in my community, I want to have like, yeah, like you said, like a place, like I'll grow potatoes, you grow tomatoes and we'll swap them, we'll swap clothes. We have like a, like the buy nothing groups on Facebook, you know, like all that stuff

feels, you know, you don't have to buy anything, you don't have to depend that you can just, you can live in a community and take care of each other. But I think, you know, you know me. I think that there's a good, good case for the government. I think there's a good case for 70% of government. Yeah. Yeah, especially the essential services part, which I feel like we learned, I mean, we say that a lot more since COVID, but like what's essential and what isn't,

but like, you know, we need to have the fire department. We need to have hospitals. I didn't even say, talk about hospitals. Who knows how they got any like medical care in this area as well. And you need to be able to tell people that they're being stupid. Like, you can't fucking feed the bears like this. that is you're affecting everybody else you know like it's it's not just like oh oh in my yard bears are allowed and you're like they're bears they can go everywhere you know like you haven't being like oh my

my yard is a bear safe zone well okay great but you have neighbors you know and like you're just teaching the bears to to do these things and that's not good i remember my dad'll meet i don't know this is true i'll look it up later but that when he was he used to live next to a zoo in chicago and there was used to be able to feed marshmallows to the bears and then one time there was a flood and the bears got out of their enclosure because they like swam over the moat and they attacked it was in the middle of the night but they like opened up the mushroom the marshmallow stand and ate all of them that's so cute and then they were like well you can't do that anymore because you just trained a bunch of bears eat marshmallows that is so adorable because they're smart so you're just teaching them how to do these things and they're like no yeah guess i want to hug one but like no um you you're talking about the thing um did you hear about this dire wolf situation no okay so apparently dire wolves have been extinct for like i i forgot it was like thousands of thousands of years and there's this company based on a dallas called colossal laboratories and biosciences and their entire goal is um de-instinction de-extinction of animals we talked about that with a with passenger pigeon like a long long time ago

yeah yeah and apparently they successfully were able to they It's interesting. It's not an actual dire wolf derived from like dire wolf DNA. They're gray wolves who had their DNA genetically modified to match that of a dire wolf. And so I don't know if they're legally considered dire wolves, but they just had their cubs recently. And so like now the world has two of these dire cup things. And they're working on like woolly mammoths and they're working on a lot of stuff. I've seen all of the Jurassic Park so many times because we love them over here at my house.

but I love the one where Dr. Wu was like, yeah, of course we had to use like frog DNA because we don't know, we don't have all the DNA and they're supposed, it looked like the way you wanted them to look like, you know? Yeah. He's not like, this is what Dodgers look like, this is what you wanted them to look like. And then also the new Jurassic Park, like the brand new one, we just watched the trailer for it. And it's like, by the way, there's a super secret island with even worse dinosaurs on it. And you're like, they're kind of milking into this point.

I mean, come on. But I kind of believe that people would do that, you know? Like I think if Jurassic Park was a. open, people would go. I would go. These wolves are stupid cute. They are cute. Oh my yeah. Their little puppies. Six-month-old. Oh, my God. His name's

Romulus. The other one's Calisi and then Remus. Nothing good will come of this. I mean, they're not that dangerous, right? I don't know, dude. As soon as there's a brontosaurus in the

backyard, I will eat my tree. I have one tree. delete my tree. I don't know. But I feel like that's also the least in my worries. I welcome William Mammoths. Yeah, yeah. Let's... Come back. Who cares? Dude, they're saying that like,

there's some crazy number. I mean, I haven't fact-checked any of those stuff. They're saying that 30,000 species per year on average are being, are going extinct. That's six per hour and 150 per day. Is that crazy? It seems almost impossible. It does. But I feel like it's like very... very, very specific on what a species is. I know. It's like this one pond scum that, like, is going to be like you've never heard of.

I mean, it's not probably not good, you know, but I feel like also it's probably their time. Okay. All right. Very. Very libertarian of you, but yes. I know. Like if someone in the house next to me was cloning dinosaurs, I'd be like, can I please call someone? Can I call the police?

Who can regulate? What kind of dinosaurs you can make in your backyard? that will actually be a problem that's why it says see also George R.R. Martin I see that one of them is named Calisi they could have found a real name to name the girl

anyway police is a great name I know but oh they're doing dodoes from Rome oh that's nice yeah that's nice

they didn't hurt anyone they didn't hurt anyone they're only extinct because their crime was trusting humans I mean same with a lot of these things it's true like the passenger pigeon

like any of these animals like when people got to like Australia not that long ago had just like gigantic fucking animals now it doesn't anymore

yeah well hopefully these guys will bring them back anywho um that's a fun story we did never never heard of graph

never thought of graft and actually don't even really think about New Hampshire very much um I don't either I was thinking about that when I was doing this

I was like I guess I never think about New Hampshire like I knew the live for your die part and then i'd like like i said in the beginning like kind of heard the story like libertarians took over town and then there were too many bears because i want to take up the trash and like that's pretty much it uh it is also the state where uh family guy takes place so that's the only time i ever thought about it is it yeah that's not they were in like massachusetts but i guess cohawks in new hamps here wait they're rhode island they're in rhode island

are they yeah what state is family guide based I saw the They're in Rhode Island Is it okay All right I'm all in disregard But like I said It's all very close together

Up there Same same Shout out to all of our listeners in New Hampshire Capital of Dover Nope We love you Sweet

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