Door Bumper Clear - 341 | Off Week: Connor Zilisch, Jesse Love, and Todd Gilliland Talk Rising Through NASCAR's Ranks

Episode Date: July 29, 2024

Just because there's no NASCAR on-track action this week doesn't mean DBC, or Dirty Mo Media at large, is taking a break! Young Trackhouse phenom, Connor Zilisch, makes another appearance on the show, along with his good pal and Xfinity Series driver for Richard Childress Racing, Jesse Love. Plus, Cup Series driver for Front Row Motorsports, Todd Gilliland, joins the show to talk about his racing origins, and his relationship with teammate Michael McDowell. Want more DBC? Check out and subscribe to the new DBC YouTube channel! Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The following is a production of Dirtymoe media. No good. Buy one. Don't ever drive, man. It'll come to you. You're a fucking idiot if you think that's right. Wait, that's just because T.J. planned it that way. Ball three, one to get you down here.

Keep up in top of your team. You come and keep up. Bottom three. Model three, watch. It's hard to get lost. I mean, seriously. Might be the dumbest thing you've ever said. Door.

Bopper. Clear. So there, popper. Popper. Clear, clear, clear. Yo, what's up, everybody? So just because NASCAR decided to take a couple weeks off, the folks here at Dirty Mo Media would not let the rest of us take any time off.

So here we are. Now we're going to record some shows for you guys for these off weekends. We don't have a race to recap. So now what are we going to do? So I reached out on Twitter a couple weeks ago, and we've obviously got some feedback on some of the guests. People like some people don't like sometimes. But I reached out on Twitter and the people spoke.

And they wanted to hear from guys like Jesse Love and Conner's, Zillich. So we have them coming in together, actually, which good new, I don't know what that's going to be like, but the two of them are really good friends off the racetrack and obviously really talented race car driver is on the race track. So I'm looking forward to hearing from them. And then Todd Gillen was one that was actually, actually a little surprising to me. People, Casey, they wanted to hear from Todd Gillen, which is obviously another young up-and-coming driver, having a great season. So that's another guy we were going to get to talk to. We're headed to Richmond next. So what can you look forward to?

Man, you know, Richmond obviously is a track where's a track. strategy's been playing out. It's been hard to pass there. They are going to have the option tire, which is going to be interesting to see how that pans out. Obviously, these crew chiefs and engineers are really smart. So a lot of times we all just end up doing the same thing because that's what's best for all of us. But it's interesting to see if anybody gets off strategy there. And obviously we got some tight point battles going in. I think it's seven points to the cut line right now.

There's a tight battle at the top for the, I think it's within 10 or 15 points for the top three for the regular season championship. And we're getting down to it, Casey. This is the last four races, I think, before the playoffs starts. So this is when everybody gets a little tighter. The pressure is on. Yeah, for sure. But looking forward to it, looking forward to seeing a bunch of DBC fans out there. And hopefully you guys enjoy the show this week.

Yeah. Sit back, relax and enjoy. Hey, what's up everybody? Brett Griffin. Thanks for joining us here on this special edition of Doorbumper Clear and Freddie. We've got probably the two most famous secondary spotters in NASCAR history. Yeah. I feel like these guys are becoming like the adopted sons of,

door bumper clear. They're both now finally of age to at least hang out with us. They still can't drink, I don't think. Had that stopped them before? Yeah, yeah, unfortunately, it has. But what's up? We have Connor Zillich and Jesse Love in the house.

I had to say Connor first because he won this week. You just tore your fenders off in the first lap. The first lap. It's good to be here. What's up, guys? Yeah, I figured you guys spent enough time together. You might as well just come here again. Actually, not lately.

We actually, we haven't really hung up. He's whipped. Oh, no. We're going straight for the gut right here. Nice job, Connor. Bro. Is that true? No, but these are the comments of I don't.

Connor, were you kicked out of his house? Like, do you not live there anymore? Yeah, I was kicked out. You got kicked out too? Because he's wiped up. He's done. No, it's not bad.

Jason person lives in the house. Dyson lives there? He's never there. It doesn't count. No, Jason. Dason so lives with me. He's been hauling the mail. So is it true?

You kicked Connor out? No. Is that not true? I mean, I don't true. You're sure. If you saw Connor's house, you'd want to live in his house. It's unreal. What one is address, drop it?

Want an address drop it? People can look at it on Zola. Actually, it's not on Zillow because we built it. I'm sure we could find it on there somewhere. It's not very nice. Poor living. What the hell of you two idiots been up to besides, besides throwing each other out of houses and one of you've been whipped? How's, how's racing going, Jesse?

Racing's actually not been great. We've got to win since we lost. Yes, we got to win, Talladega. We are a lot faster now than we were at the beginning of the year. But I'm kind of realizing, like, again, what it's like to race this level. I feel like you kind of hit ebbs and flows where at the year we were not super fast. We were like top 10-ish speed, but we run really good. And now we're far faster and qualify better and run up front and lead more laps on non-speed player tracks as well.

And the finishes haven't came just from a bunch of just small, details that I'm learning about that we're fixing as a team, but also part of it, just bad situation, wrong place, wrong time, kind of like Indianapolis getting in that wreck on lap one. So the good part is that I think that as speedwise goes and how our cars are driving, that we're able to go contend for a championship, but the finishes haven't been there. So I think once we get the two in sync with each other, that will be in a really good spot for the playoffs. Yeah, I agree. And you. I mean, you're just still racing a little bit of everything. Yeah, yeah, it's been good.

The ARCA stuff this year's picked up. Obviously, at the end of the day, it's still ARCA, so. He's not racing me. Cherry picking. It's all I can race, dude. Actually, today I can race other stuff, but until today. Yeah, it's been good. It's been a fun year. You know, we've been kicking ass on the ARCA stuff lately, which has been a lot of fun.

Cars have been really fast, finally, able to compete with the 18 and the 20 and those guys. So it's been a lot of fun having fast cars over there. And, you know, just trying to have fun with all this stuff, man. It's a straining lifestyle to come out here and race every weekend. But at the end of the day, we're race car drivers. So you just got to enjoy it. Jesse is actually working on being a spotter. And I asked him to be my spotter at Indy, and he said he would have to train for it.

What would you need to train for? I'm curious. So I spotted for context at Chicago for Austin Hill. and it was honestly pretty hard. Like the, I knew what I wanted to say. However, the feed, so, okay, hard to explain. But when you talk on the radio and you key up, you hear yourself talking in the, in the radio,

but it was delayed like a half a second. So as I'm talking. So the radio was just messed up how it was, some guys like that, I guess. No, nobody likes that. I promise you. Brett explained it, just not as well as you. Yeah.

Yeah. So I'm talking and I'm waiting for my word. that I'm speaking to catch up to what I'm hearing. So we start talking, I'll be like, inside coil bump. And I start talking really, really sub, be like, five back, three, go back. And I can't talk. Here's my favorite part is Jesse's texting me during the race. And obviously, we don't see him.

I saw my guy for eight seconds a lap. And I get this text message from Jesse and it goes, how do I sound? And I'm like, you sound like, you sound like, you're terrible. I couldn't speak. I literally could not speak get the words out. So I ended up taking both headphones off. Did you run? And just talking in the microphone like this. Did you run too? Did you have a radio played to yourself? Why don't you just unplug that then? Yeah, you would have been way better off. You know that. Brett did not explain that. Brett left you hanging. But I that same, listen, to your point. So I use a different style radio. But that radio you were using is what a lot of

people are trying to go to now. And I used one of the tests for Bubba. And the same I was like, yeah, you are now clear. And Brett's like, a brother's like, what the fuck is wrong with you? He's like, he's like, you sound drunker than you normally sound on here for some reason. I was like, I think I'm trying to match my voice to this stupid radio I'm listening to and I can't do it. No, it's hard. So yeah, you just turn it off next time, one of them off, the one that's listening and you'll be fine. And honestly, you hang out Connor every day.

He hasn't given you that advice yet. No. Conno, do you have that issue when you, did you listen to yourself? I do. I did like five radios. It was kind of, I felt important. You feel like you have voices in your head. How was your lunchbox?

That was cute. That was good. That was good. It was the lunchable got left out for like three days prior to that. Connor is who inspired my story that I told on here a couple weeks ago about, hey, when I come back to life, I want to be a driver's wife or girlfriend.

That was my advice to Connor. That was thinking at the time of 17-year-old Connor when you thought about that. That seems weird. I was thinking about Connor's checkbook when he's 25 or 30, actually. Yeah, that was spotter stand talk. You guys are in the fraternity now. Yeah, unfortunately. Don't ever come back up there again.

That usually means the end of your driving career. Yeah. But I know so obviously your 18th birthday, Exfini race is coming up. How you like, I'd be looking for. Watkins Glenn the first one? Yeah, Waukeens Glenn's the first one. I'm super excited.

You like Watkinsville? Yeah, I do. I get to beat you this year. Is there something? I was going to say, we have a friendly wager on this race. I just curious. I'm too too at Waukinsville. I was curious.

Oh, did you beat him last year? Yeah. He was like a second faster. and it worked out. In the Archer race. Do you wreck them? No. No.

It isn't wrecked me. Can you just not blow turn one this time? Yeah, I got you. I got you. But honestly, I can't wait, but that's the first,

I was talking about it this past weekend. That's the first playoff race for Xfinity. And obviously, SVG is going to be in the playoffs. And, you know, he's good on the road course. I mean,

he finished well this past weekend at Indy, but, you know, he's going to need to run well at Watkins Glen. I'm not going to say it. So you're saying, that you're going to go beat him and no no i'm not saying i'm not saying i'm going to go run with but it's going to be fun if i'm as fast as him to go out there and race against him and and he's

going to be you know with a little extra pressure it'll be fun to you're driving the 88 car right yeah and then you have more races i don't know if you yeah i've got three more i've got brist or not bristol i got kansas homestead and phoenix after that so i got four total this year and then five truck races next one's after the break at richmond now how much obviously you know you got a couple mile and a half's in there, which I don't, have you run any mile and a half? You haven't been able to do, right? So that's going to be your, obviously, you've been excelling at road courses, short tracks, cars to races, how RACA races, you've won. You know, what's the, what's the jump like that going to be for you to go an old mile and a half race? Yeah, it's going to be different.

Honestly, I don't know what to expect. I tested at Kansas a few, few months ago in the Rka car. We didn't get too many laughs before. An oil line blue and kind of ended our day, but, you know, it's, it's going to be a jump for sure, something new for me, but, you know, running places like Dover and not quite Iowa, but in a way, you know, those places kind of got me ready for the speed of it at least. And, you know, I'm excited to get out there and see what it feels like. Obviously, we've got simulation stuff. But at the end of the day, until you go out there and feel it for yourself, it's going to be different from anything you've kind of done before. So, yeah, just trying to talk to as many people as I can and take as much in before it. But I'm

excited for it. It's going to be a learning curve. But, you know, I'm going to take it all in and try to have fun while I'm learning. Yeah, Jesse, how much are you planning on torturing him while you're out there? Like, I know, we know, like, I know Bubba and Blaney like flip each other off every time they're around each other. I remember back in a day, Dale and Elliot would throw the chocker at each other every time they're around each other. Like, you got anything planned for like the first time you go blowing by Connor on the outside

or anything? I don't know. I mean, it depends, right? Like, Walkin's going to hope I'm just up there. Away from Connor. You just said you were two for two. No, I am two for two, but speed-wise, I had a pull-wold. one out of my rear both times.

But no, I think that the, to kind of brag on Connor and kind of some of the younger guys growing up, like even Brent as well, like my first time at Dover, which I think if you can get around Dover speed-wise, then you'll be fine at places like Kansas and stuff for the first time, homesets are going to be tough. But, like, my first time at Dover, like I was terrible, like super, super bad.

Again, my speed perception was just so slow compared to that point. But I think Connor and kids like Brent and stuff, like doing, driving these really fast cars, like especially the LMP2 car that he drives, like the speed isn't a factor for him. And I think that he's a lot of people that tell him what to do and what not to do, that the learning curve for them is super slow right now, or super fast right now. It's like not, there's not a lot to learn for him. As far as going out there and making lap time right away, for me, that was like the hardest part, I think, off the truck at going these big places for the first time when I was like 17. But when I was 18, I actually

kind of figured it out at that point. But anyway, no, I'll probably, you know, give him a bird or two or deuses or something like that just to kind of get him, you know, in the role of things. Again, I get flipped off probably three times a weekend. I saw you got flipped off by Austin one week. I forget. Yeah, Charlotte. No, Charlotte. I was like, hell. And then we get to that car and he's perfectly fine. So Sheldon, I thought gave me the bird at, uh, where we at Pocono. He gave me the bird. And I was like, I didn't even know how I did wrong. So I texted after race. You like, no, I was giving you a thank you or something. So you can get them confused from time to time.

But you did that on here, didn't you? Didn't you think, was it Ty Gibbs? Oh, yeah, yeah. I thought Ty Gibbs flip somebody to bird. He called me and told me I was an idiot. And I said, all right, I'm sorry, I'll retract it. I have an idiot. You are an idiot.

So how do you guys stay such close buddies when you all are racing each other? Well, they're not even friends anymore. I mean, I've had this same talk with Brent forever. And, you know, it goes back to when we were eight or nine racing against each other. and we'd race each other like maniacs on the racetrack and then we'd come off and we'd go to the trampoline park the next day. But, you know, I feel like you thought you'd never hear on door before clear. I was hoping you weren't going to say the bar.

No, eight years old going to the bar, no. But I just, I try and separate anything. Like the people we are in the racetrack is not who we are off the racetrack, right? So it's two different people for me. And, you know, say a friend races me like, you know, disrespects me on the racetrack. I'll take note of that.

And next time I'm racing, I'll remember it. But, you know, I separate that from the friendship that we have off the racetrack. And I try to do that. It's tough at times because you want to let the two intertwine. But,

you know, to have a friendship in this sport, you got to be able to put things to the side and just be able to go out there and race and then come off the track and still be friends. But it's cool how when you all aren't in the same race, you're literally rooting for each other. I mean, the camarader is.

I mean, it's awesome. Have you guys wrecked each other yet? I mean, I got one up on him right now, honestly. You wrecked him or he wrecked you? I didn't know. I've got one up on you. It means you wrecked him. Yeah.

Sounds like. Yeah, I owe you like, I owe you on it. You don't owe me shizn't. You were, sounds to me like you were doing some reckless driving. Okay. Here's what happened. I owe you a bumper. Here's a habit of Walker's Glenn.

It was in the rain and I got to run and I thought I made a pretty good move like getting swinging out wide through the second to last turn. We go through 12 and I just gave him a bumper up to the paint. And he got the pain and spun his tires. But I mean, even after that race, we were fine. There was a bumper involved. So you owe a bumper. Yeah, exactly.

I mean, it doesn't sound like you guys were fine. Sounds like there's some, you know. I was frustrated. No, I mean, like at that point. Built up anger that needs to be. Here's like the one up thing. It's like if he was in that spot, I would, I would expect the same thing from anybody, really. But that's the thing.

I don't race like that. You know, like SVG talked about it. I'm not, I'm used to getting a penalty for that stuff. So I don't race like that. That I probably honestly wouldn't have. So we might get figured out. I know.

I know that. But so are you saying that like if you're in a spot where we're in the same position, and that never happened and you're a bumper away? Again, like no quarter panels were crinkled or no front ends were knocked in. But a pretty. I thought tactful bump and run.

Yeah, if you asked me... You wouldn't do that. If you asked me a year ago, I probably wouldn't have done it, but since the last 10 months, you know, racing... Dude, I've been moved for 15th this year. Racing again. Shahoo. Sammy Smith.

I think it's like Las Vegas or something. I mean, like... Some of the guys in a midpack of that Expedity deal are pretty funny. I think there's like a line to it, right? And like how I go about the Xfinney stuff, and I think of a pretty good idea of it right now, is like there are certain guys that I feel like raised me like super respectful like Cole Custer Sheldon Creed like guys like put like they raised me a ton of respect and there's certain

guys where like I won't like drive through to win a race right like try to do everything I can to not do that then there's certain guys that I know would do it to me so I would do it to them right but I think like when you take it person to person even though you're at that point you're kind of making it personal you kind of avoid all the drama because you're kind of self-policing it, right? But there's obviously, like, if I were to go in there and have just spun you out or wrecked you, then that would have been really bad. Right. Yeah. No, I agree. And I, since then, like, racing against the 18 in ARCA and, you know, all the cars through stuff. He doesn't hardly ever hit you. I mean, what the hell race was that? Iowa. Was, yes, it was Iowa. I was like,

and the best part was, the whole in-lap, he was just, he was, he was just run right in front of me, just flipping me a bird. I was like, what did I do to you? I literally, I had to text him after I was like, look, man, like we're going to be racing each other for a long time. And if this is how you're going to race me at every race, I promise you I'm not going to make a fun. I did not understand that one at all. Like, it seemed that was just pretty egregious. I mean, I understand what happened at Dover and I understand he wants to, you know, get one back

at me. But if you're going to get back at me, do it once and make it right. Don't do it five times and fail every time. The same time, that's part of putting on somebody's door that you take the risk. Yeah. If they spin out. Yeah, and that he did it at Iowa. Same thing.

He entered right on my door. and I got loose under them and about wrecked, but thankfully I didn't. And it's just frustrating. Those guys in ARCA, they don't understand that you're the one putting people in that situation when you put it on their door. It's like, yeah, no dumb going to get loose and hit you when you put it on my door. And they just think, oh, you almost wrecked me. You drove it into the corner way too hard.

I was like, I didn't know you're going to put it on my door and make me loose like that. But like you said, that stuff carries over. And like I've always kind of praised even before we had you on the first time. your maturity of like listen buddy we're going to see each other for the next 30 years hopefully you know like and you see some of that stuff carry over from those arcad days you know there's the the tie gibbs corey hyme rivalry that started in arca tie gibbs sam mayer they can't state each other that started in arca like that that stuff like to listen you got to get over it because we're going to be doing this for a long time to come so yeah that stuff there that iowa race i was i was watching i was like wow this is pretty wild i got a bounce always good to see y'all. I'm pulling for you guys. Y'all know that. And Jesse. Who are you playing for Moore, though? I'm pulling for Jesse Moore because he's my teammate

at RCR. Come on. I'm pulling for Connor, like, just that far behind him. And I'll say this before I leave. There is as much talent between these two guys as anybody I've ever seen come through here. We unfortunately are not talented. I've not seen guys come through here with as much talent

at their age, potentially ever. And the pipeline for what's coming is awesome. And you guys, listen, all the future of the sport, period. So no pressure. Thank you. Be careful driving on the highways. And happy 18th birthday.

Thank you, Brett. Now that, now that Brett's gone, we could talk about a spotting. How bad was he at Chicago? I was actually very surprised. I thought he was really good. Really?

Yeah. Oh, he was surprised. Yeah. I'm not surprised. That was like, damn. Hang on.

Hang on. Jay, cut that and let him talk. I could understand. Yesterday. yesterday was the hardest race he's ever spotted. We didn't pass a single car all day. Nobody passed. I know.

It's like, I don't know what race you were at. It's interesting, like with the spars that are really good, how much stuff they can be doing at the same time. Well, that's what I tell everybody. Somebody stopped me on the roof and that pagoda thing. We were on in Chicago. And they're like, you have four radios on? And I'm like, yeah, they're like, what are you doing?

I'm like, listen to myself, listen to NASCAR, talking to the crew chief, talking to driver. And they're like, what? I'm like, yeah, I'm just having a lot of voices in my head. I was like starting stopwatches and like figuring out like, like how far behind we were from the leader so I could like see when they were there. That was all I could do other than that. Like I just had to fully focus on what I was saying because like any other distractions it would

just throw me off. So some of the guys like I am not good about. So a lot of guys now have adapted like where they have SMT open on the rail in front of them doing it. And I'm too afraid of missing something. And like two weeks ago, Feedwood was standing next to me at a couple weeks ago, Pocono, wherever that was. He was standing next to me practice.

So I just fired off to see. I was looking, I opened his SMT and put it on my car just to see kind of how we were getting in a turn one. So I'm down here looking at SMT, looking to see how Bubba's entry was. And Fri-Renick spins out right in front of us. And I never saw it. And I look up and there's just a cloud of smoke. I'm like, oh, watch out.

Like Bubba's like the next day in the hall or before our pre-race meeting. He's like, what the hell are you doing yesterday? I was looking at FD, which I hate to do because I know I feel like I'm always going to miss something. And we almost piled into our teammate, of course, of all people. But yeah, it's pretty amazing. And how much do you guys, I mean, how much, I know you get it, SMT? I mean, I don't know how much you have to rely on now with what you're doing.

Not at all, really. We got dark fish. That's great. The dark fish used to be like back in the day. But, you know, how much do you rely on that now, preparing for races? I would say preparing for it, not a ton. I look at it a little bit throughout the week just to kind of see some patterns of what's good, what's bad. But also, how I says, like at the Josh Wise program, like we get all the info we need before we get to the racetrack for the most part.

There's very few things that I do aside from that because Josh and Scott are really good at knowing what we need and what we don't need. We're not overdoing it. But at the racetrack, like even at Sonoma, we were good in practice, but not phenomenal. I was probably like six or seventh in practice. And then, you know, actually Connor, too, like looking at my SMT for me and kind of tell me some things I needed to fix. And then the road course is for me the biggest thing is I'll pick three things that I can for sure go and fix and then go and do that. I'm a big SMT guy for the road courses because it's not my bread and butter. The Oval stuff, I hardly ever look at it.

There's just a few places this year that I haven't been to before that I would look at it and just kind of figure out like what's the biggest part of the corn I can go and make some time or where we really good at. So I know kind of where my runs are going to come and things like that. Big example is Nashville kind of knowing I wasn't great on entry, but I was so good center exit. So kind of trying to fix that. know in the race where I could pass guys. But other than that, unless it's a road course, I don't, I try to overthink it because, again, everybody's car is different. I'll primarily

look at me in Austin's and just me in Austin's because we're driving pretty similar pieces. Yeah. And we'll start with this. Where do you guys sit on the fact that this stuff's available? Like obviously young guys, like you guys, it's probably more helpful than somebody like obviously Danny or somebody that, you know, those guys are probably not very happy that they're there that is out there for everybody to see. Obviously, it's more helpful for you guys. Do you think that should be available to everybody. I do. I mean, it's tough. It's a fine line. You know, selfishly, I'm glad that it's a thing for me because, you know, when I get up into that stuff, it's going to be a big tool to use and to utilize as I'm getting into the Xfinity and truck stuff. But, you know, at the

same time for those guys that, you know, have been doing this for a long time and they have their ways and they kind of show up and know what they're going to do, it's probably not the best for them because they don't get much advantage out of it. So, you know, I think it is good, though. It helps equalize a sport because, you know, they do want parity in the cars, especially at the highest level and they want the teams at the back to be able to, you know, find ways to make speed and get to the front.

So I do think it helps with that. And I do think it is good for the sport, but I'm sure there are guys out there that probably don't think the same. Yeah, I don't know. I think that, you know, like I've got to have NASCAR props for it. Like, it's the same for everybody, right? We all have the same info. as far as SMT goes.

Selfishly, obviously I like it because I don't think it's huge on the ovals, but I think it's really important on the road courses. So that is a benefit for me. You know, I don't know, like, natural talent-wise, there's some guys that just have a ton of it that they really don't need it, right? They can kind of go fly by the seat of their pants, which I feel like I can do a lot of ovals and stuff. But when it comes to the road course stuff,

like the way that I feel like I've been getting pretty good at it, it is by looking at the data and using my brain to figure out how to go and make speed and things like that. So it's a benefit for me in that sense. But at same time, the Oval stuff, I don't think it makes a big ton of a difference. Again, with the truck and the Xfinity car, we don't have the actual throttle trace, brake trace, steering trace, and things like that. So it's not as accurate. So I'll basically turn everything off, but mile per hour and delta, and that's about it. And I'll look at speed traces. And if I was in a cup car, obviously, you'd be looking at the real data.

But the Xfinian truck is all based off of, you know, GPS. Yeah. So now obviously you guys took two very different paths to get to where you're at today. You know, Jesse's starting on the dirt. You're starting kind of car racing, road course stuff. Obviously, see where he went. He ran a couple handful of truck races. He gets a great opportunity to the RCR car.

I don't know how much you can divulge or what you're doing. But ideally, if you cut the pick, like what would you, what path, would you like to take just a jump straight into Xfinity car or is it kind of still run a little bit of everything? I think this year I wanted to run as much diverse as much as much diverse of a schedule as I could just because I wanted experience in as many different things as I could to learn as much as I can. Obviously, I know that I have a, you know, a longer term contract with trackhouse and, you know, I feel pretty secure about that. So for me, it's not all about going out

and winning races and trying to prove to someone that, you know, I can go out and do it. And I feel like that's kind of where ARCA is for me, where I can go out and I know I can compete. But when it comes to the truck in Xfinity races, I wanted to go to tracks where I would challenge myself. And, you know, there's, you know, we were going to run the roval. And I kind of told him, I was like, I want to run like homestead or somewhere where I can go out and just learn for 300 miles and get better. So for me, this year is about learning and trying to improve on what I'm doing. But, you know, I do think that, you know, next year I want to be able to run in a series full time and go out and be able to race it every track and just get laps under my belt. That's the

biggest thing for me going to all these places for the first time. It's going to be a bit of a challenge. But at the same time, I do think it's going to be good for me to get some reps this year. And then hopefully next year, if I go full time racing, I'll be able to have at least a little bit under my belt before I show up. And I mean, you don't have the answer if you don't want to. But like, if you had to choose, would that be Xfinity Series? Like, if you got to just pick wherever you wanted to go. I do think the Xfinity Series has the most competitive. at the top. And I do think that's good for me to learn. I feel like the truck series is, you know, it's still a bit of a mess. Honestly, you know, from fifth on back, you know,

outside of Corey and Echis and, you know, some other guys that can contend, you know, the Spire guys are there, you know, every other, every week or, you know, whenever, whenever they're good. But, you know, much past that, it's tough to kind of get into that stuff just because it's so reckless at times. And I feel like Xfinity, there's a lot more respect out there, you know, outside of a few guys that Jesse might have beef with. But, you know, I do feel like the X-Favine series has a lot more, I guess, respect and competition. And I feel like that's more attractive than going out and, you know, and another thing is, you know, the X-FINity series races more. And for me, that's big, right? Going out and racing more is big for me. Running laps is going to be

my biggest thing. So, yeah, I do think the X-Finity series would be more appealing than trucks. I feel like in Jesse's run boats, so he can comment on this, you know, I feel like talent-wise, and we've already discussed, you know, we feel like do you twitters or two of the most talented guys coming up through the ranks. You can show your talent more in the Xfinity series. Like the trucks, I feel like are more, you're more relied on how good your truck is, how good your equipment is. They're air, you know, people we've argued on here whether or not truck racing maybe gets you more prepared for cup racing because of how much arrow dependent it is. But I feel like for you guys to get really out of there and show off and maybe you can comment to this. Like, you're going to be able to show off better in the Xfinity car than you can in a truck.

Yes and no. I think that if you're a really calculated driver, like Corey Hime, for example, right? Just, he's so sharp. And I've learned probably half of the stuff that I know from him growing up racing with him. That's why I thought, you know, I ran top 10 at all my truck starts. And I think it was just because of the air itself, right? Because I was constantly thinking, then even though some days our truck wasn't handled the best or some days it was really good, then that I can put myself in spots on restarts and things like that. Like the truck series, I think, has the hardest restarts because of air and all that air is involved. But as far as just raw ability goes and talent goes and where you're out in practice, where you're out in qualifying, kind of bringing a car that wasn't great that day and still finishing good with it, I think is way more doable in the Xfinity series than the truck series. I'll say that for sure. And obviously, you know, Conrad at the nail on the head, the Xfinney stuff is,

Definitely, I think, really respectful and you're running against really good guys. I feel like I've raced against a lot of cup guys this year and learned so much from them. And but yeah, and also the exfini cars just so hung out the whole time and you're kind of, you're doing more of what we did growing up where you're kind of over the limit of the tire in the truck deal. It always felt like I was kind of under the tire to make some speed. So I loved the way that the truck drove. I enjoyed it. I definitely enjoy the Xfinney car.

I'd say more. I think, you know, I was talking a way not about this a few weeks ago. Like the racing and the Xfinney stuff is, I think, like, the best of the three. Just because, like, I think the fans, like, see how hung out we are. Not that the cup stuff isn't and the truck stuff isn't, but I think, like, how far you slip the car in the Xfinney stuff is more. And you're more sideways and hung out. And the package itself, because there's less air involved, I think makes it a little bit tighter

of racing. But, yeah, I mean, I was thinking about it's a lot of racing. about the other day, like how much fun I'm having running the infinity races and the restart are just so much fun. And you're racing against guys that are so good at what they do. Like even racing against Cole, like that's a cup guy, right? Like you're racing against him every week. John Hunter, Eric Amarola, Austin Hill, guys that are really, really good. It's fun to go race against them because you know that the level you're at is, is that high. Yeah. And that's, that was always an argument. You guys could both talk about this. Like,

everybody always, you know, Kyle Bush, this. Kyle Bush is going out. here cherry picking. Like, the only way you guys are ever going to get better is if you race against the best guys out there, right? Oh, yeah. I don't think that people think all the time, like my mom, for example, plus her heart or love her, right? She's always like mad when a cup guy comes and runs an exfinny race. Or, I mean, I've raced against cup guys in Arka before, right? Which might be a little extreme. But still, just a little. But I mean, no, like when I was racing against Kyle at Charlotte, like I learned so much when he passed me for the lead. just by how like air was non-existent for him right like he just knew everything that i was going to do

before i made the move and things like that and racing against guys like kyle at the road courses and um like especially you know chicago like the way that kyle was passing cars and like non-passing zones was pretty impressive too but yeah i think we just learned so much from them and it's not so we can't beat them. Like I thought I could have beat the cup guys at Charlotte if we didn't have that power steering issue. And even at, it takes a day where you go run fifth at, like I ran fifth at Chicago. And it's like, okay, you're on.

It's not super, super impressive. But I think it makes it more impressive when like all the guys that for the most part beat you other than SVG was, you know, primarily cup guys, right? So I think that makes us look good as well. And also when you're racing against the cup guys and you're line up on the front. front row with them and say you go beat him on a restart, right? Like, when I beat William on the restart at Pocono, like, I think that makes it better than how did I just beat an exfini regular on the restart because, like, Cup guys are watching that. Yeah. And his, and, you know, for example,

like in that instance, like, Chad Cana house watching William on that restart. Like, I think that's good for us and raising our stock up. I think stocks are really important in the racing world and that raises our stock. Yeah. I'm assuming you agree with that. Yeah, no, I do agree. I always enjoy when, you know, the cup guys come down and race against, you know, the Xfinity truck and even sometimes ARCA. I do think it helps all the drivers in those series get better. And at the end of the day, that's what everyone, for the most part, is in those series to do, is to get better and hopefully, you know, make a name for themselves and go cup racing.

And when those guys come down and you race against them, like, for instance, you know, Ty Gibbs and Larson at Road America, you know, a few years ago when, you know, Ty outran Kyle in that race. That was big for him, and I'm sure that's some of the reason he went cup racing the next year. And I think that raised his stock, like Jesse said. And that's super important for those guys to get that experience racing against them. And you can always learn from those guys, which I think is cool. And one thing that I always appreciate whenever those guys come down to race,

even though some people will call it cherry picking. The really important question I had to ask you, Jesse, was how often have you been going to dinner with Chad and Casey lately? Have you guys been? Not much. You're more like family dinners. Yeah, I've kind of upgraded the family dinners and the family outings and stuff. You go to Billy's? Yes.

Not having gotten invited to vacations yet, but I think I'm more working towards that. Well, it's between him and Dason these days. So that's the elephant in the room is that Chad has this new kid, Dason, personally, who is, he's my roommate too. Yeah. I mean, Dyson's doing really, really, really, really well. And I told Dyson, I drove Chad's car quite a bit last. year and I don't race enough dirt to I feel like go and contend on any given you know weekend with the USAC guys but me and Chowers still able to win last year at where we

out I don't know I five some outlaw race but you know I think Dason running really well he might be getting invited to more dinners than I have but now I mean the CBI stuff super super fast right now even the micro stuff as well I was able to to want to chat this year Nilbridge was kind of cool because I don't get to run a whole lot of dirt now with how busy I am and things like that. And with the dirt side of things, haven't run a lot because I feel if I can't run it all the time, then I'm not going to be as good. And I'll put myself with more chances to get hurt because I'm not as sharp and things like that. But now, the CBI stuff has been cool to watch how fast-d-d-a-station's been.

Yeah, I mean, they're leading national points, right? Yeah. One midget week, right? Yep. That's cool. I saw they kick the ass midget week. There's a podium every night, right? Yeah. That's pretty impressive.

I mean, have you ever run dirt? Do you have any? I've run out Millbridge a few times. It's fun. I like it. Yeah, Conner's run really, really well for not having dirt up. Going to Milbridge and running good. You know, you guys know Casey likes Milbridge?

You ever heard that around here? Well, I like live there, so. You guys got any, you want to talk about each other before we leave? I mean, I think, I mean. Connor's been to a few family then is too. He's getting close. Freddie, you need to step it up. I know, Billy's, I'm like Billy's forgotten son now.

I've come to the house a couple times, but. I didn't get invited on July 4th, though. I kidnapped. That wasn't me either. That was a small get-together. The best Billy story I ever have was Casey and Chad's wedding. We were leaving and we were all going to Saeeds, which you guys have never even heard of, I'm sure, right? I mean, you can't go, so you can't talk about it.

But we're going to Saeeds, and I said to Billy, I was like, I said, hey, we're going to Saeeds, a bunch of us. He's like, I can't. I got to stay and help Andrea clean up, because they rented a barn basically. whatever. I don't even know what it was. And he's like, no, I can't. I got to stay. So I'm like, all right, well, I'm jumping into Uber, me and Megan, a couple of other people. So the next thing I know, I see the door swing open. We're literally rolling out of the parking lot of door swings open. Here comes Billy shuffling out to the car. He's like, I jumps in, takes off. As Andrew calls, she's like, where are you? He's like, I'm going to Saeed's with Freddie.

I'll see you later. And so we're in Saeed's singing karaoke all night after Chad's wedding. True story. Yeah. I just want to be invited to the, if we win the national championship again, I'm coming to the party this year. Well, you need to tell Dason and Chad The last, how old's Dason? 19. 21. Yeah, it gave me 21 for one day.

21. The last time, the last time. The last time you guys won the National Championship was with Windham. And I remember, if I remember correctly, the victory party got a little out of hand. Yes. Yeah. I don't even want to know. Chad might have to move into Jesse's at that point.

Still don't want to know. Oh. Still don't want to know. That's brutal. Anyways, it would be nice if they got the team. Yes, yes. We're still pulling for them, even though the parties were to be a little more tame this year. It was the pandemic, so we didn't even get to celebrate at the banquet.

So we had to have her own. Yeah. That was the always thing. They did from what I recall. But yeah, I mean, so future-wise, obviously you're like trying to lock some stuff now for next year. Jesse, what do you got? Obviously, locked in. Was it a multi-year deal at RCR?

It's a multi-year deal. I mean, my path is pretty clear right now with RCR, which is, you know, I feel like keep doing what I'm doing right now go win more races and compete for a championship and wait for the three of the eight to open up and try to be the guy that they, you know, tap on the shoulder to go up to that level. And we're hearing rumors of pretty big changes over there. Obviously, Andy left. You know, I don't know how much does that affect you guys more on the? I know Danny's probably kind of in charge a lot of the Xfinity stuff, right? Danny Lawrence. You know, obviously there may be we were talking about last couple weeks ago on the show about Austin made comments about how the

future's bright and Kyle's bought in and obviously kind of hinted that. they're making a bigger higher. How much does that affect you guys on the Xfinity side? Yeah, I think like you hit on, Danny Lawrence has a really good job at RCR. He's our competition director on the Xfinity side of, you know, keeping the two somewhat separated in the sense of we know, I feel like on the expedite side, we're doing our job really well right now, and we should be proud of that and happy about that.

And there's still things that were cleaned up so we can go race for a championship. But obviously, is the Cups side, you know, super pretty right now? Obviously not, but everybody RCR is making decisions and changing things so that we can get back to where we need to be. And, you know, I think that there's certain people, the people there that are going to make the differences are the ones that understand that obviously every team is going to ebb and flow. And, you know, we're in somewhat of a trough right now, but we're going to come back up eventually as a whole.

And I think that we're making changes to go and do that. So it sounds kind of, you know, cheesy. but it's just like we're just, I scoff at the people that don't believe in the company, that don't believe in Richard and the people that he's going to bring into the table, which, you know, big changes are coming. And we're going to get back to winning races as a whole, exfini side and the cup side as well. And we're all going to get there.

And, you know, everybody at RCR from Mike Verlander to Richard and Danny Lawrence and all the crew chiefs, like, we're doing what we need to be doing. and we're going to get to that point and figure out what we need to do. And people are, you know, going to be really impressed when we do get to that point. Rested year for you, still bound. Obviously, you got three or four Xenity races. Are you running anything full-time? Are you running the Arque East?

Yeah, I'm Arki-East, which is eight races. So you say full-time. That's full-time, but you're running for points or whatever. Are you leading to points? Yeah, I've won four of the six so far. It's pretty good. It's pretty good. Yeah.

But what is so you get to run? You can run the seven anymore, truck? Yeah, I've got five truck races. My next one's at Richmond. I've got Bristol. Martinsville, Homestead, and playoff Talladega in the trucks. That's a good idea. Oh, man.

I've heard good things. I know to play off Taladega in Martinsville. Yeah. Golly. Yeah, playoff Martinsville and play off Taladega in the truck. Should be fun. That'll be exciting. It's funny, Martinsville.

You're hitting the guy in front of you and you're getting running behind you. It's like there's not even in control whatsoever. Well, Casey, you got anything for these idiots? before we cut them out of here. What did you call me? Idiots, both of you. Okay. I mean, they were at the last week, so.

What else is new? I would say, you know, you mentioned Brent, obviously. Oh, wait, Brent. He's been Ubering around everywhere and he took his driving test today to get his license and he failed. Are you kidding me? Do we know why he failed? That's probably not something he wanted on. He'll be okay.

He said something about a three-point turn. Get you every time. Yeah. Listen, a lot of people fail their first attempt. Maybe not a race car driver, but most of the people do. I didn't actually, I took mine, I didn't even, I got my license during COVID or 2021. And I didn't even have to do a driving test. Really?

Yeah. They just handed me a license. Oh, during COVID. Yeah. That makes sense. Perfect. Yeah. Yeah.

But maybe, I figured maybe like with that cars to a race, I watched those. That car away where they're just running to each other. I thought maybe he just ran somebody over. Yeah. Poor Bryn. Which, I mean, we can talk about Brent for a second. That kid's, I mean, a friend of yours, obviously, another. super talented guy, probably going to have him on here at some point in the near future.

Oh, God. Just the three of them. Yeah, we should bring all three. He's not made for this. No, we can't let him. No, he's made for this. I was going to say, you know, besides Brent, who else do you see you running for the next 30 years with as like a top contender? I mean, you know, guys, Corey Hime, for one, I think he's one of the best our age out there.

You know, he's been doing really good this year. and hopefully he gets an opportunity to go cup racing. It doesn't sound likely or great for him for next year. But, you know, obviously he's got a lot of great people around him at Toyota and everyone at Legacy and 2311 who supports him. But he's obviously going to be one that we're going to be racing against for a long time. You know, obviously Brent, one of our friends, Swalich, I'm sure that we'll be racing against for a long time to come. And hopefully we can settle our beef this year. but there's a lot of guys out there that are good.

I guess he's been doing really good this year in the truck. You know, I mean, what do you, who else do you see? I think like, it's going to be interesting to see what Corey Day ends up doing. Obviously, he'll have a, he has a really good opportunity coming his way. Seems not, not my place, but a little rushed, obviously being a dirt guy and kind of getting put into a lot of payment stuff really quickly. But, I mean, Corey's, I've raced against, in a few different occasions. On the dirt side, he's phenomenal.

He's probably the most impressive young guy that I've first ever raced against, you know, and just super smart and makes it promising for the pavement side of things because he's not one of the... There's like two different types of dirt drivers, I feel like. The ones are really fast, and some of them are just, like, crazy, like just psycho. And Corey, I feel like, is really calculated

with the decisions he makes and is really smart inside the car. I'm not sure about out of it. Yeah, that's one thing. Inside the car, he's really smart. So it'd be interesting to see what he does with those opportunities. And if he does really well, then he could be some guy that nobody really knows about that. We could be racing against a lot. He's, I mean, like I just said, Uber, Uber talented.

And talk about psychopaths. I thought I thought Brent was. The first time I watched Brent race and he was like, I don't even know, 12 years old at Millbridge just crashed. I was out there hanging out with Dylan Welsh. And he's like, man, I just don't know where to find those other two tents. I'm like, you're not going to, you just have to be a moron. I don't think that kids ever hit anything because he's just crashing every lap.

He's just falling ass. That's one thing you say about dirt kids that I've seen from, you know, coming up, the kids that are really, really good on dirt, a lot of, they're all talented, right? To be good on dirt, you have to be talented. But a lot of them are good because they don't have fear and they're just reckless. And I mean, you can make speed like that on dirt. I mean, obviously I'm not a dirt racer, so I don't know. I mean, you kind of count.

I mean, I finished fourth of Millbridge, so I call myself a dirt racer. But there are guys out there in dirt racing who make speed by just being reckless, and then they get in a late model. All right, we don't need to name names here. And then they get in a late model or, you know, whatever it may be and struggle because they're so used to just going all to the wall. And, you know, you have to use the left foot and things are different now. So I do think Corey will be really good. He's got, you know, already some air experience running the wheel.

wing sprint cars and has an understanding of that stuff. And I've been talking to him. And obviously he's got a lot of good opportunities. So I'm excited to watch him. He's a good kid and puts the work in. So hopefully it all goes well for him. Yeah. His biggest thing will be just probably learning to use the break.

Yeah. You know, the dirt stuff, like we use the brake a ton. Don't get me wrong. Like I feel like I use it a bunch just to keep it laid left and things like that. And the wing sprint car side of things, I don't run as much of, but they use even more than we do in the midget. but how you use it is just so, so different. But I think he thinks, and he's not just flying by the seat of his pants the whole time,

which I think is going to be good for him. But even Brent, like, he looks like he's not thinking at all on the racetrack. And, again, he's just so unbelievably fast. Sometimes you try to have to outsmart him to beat him. But even still, like, he does think inside the car a lot. And his, like, emotional maturity in the car is stupid high for his age. Yeah, for sure. Well, we appreciate you to stopping by. We're always pulling for you, whatever the hell you're in. We're not going to know what to do when you start racing each other.

We're going to be and Brett. We're going to have to switch split side, pick our favorite child, I guess. But appreciate you guys coming by. Good luck this year. Thank you. The driver of the number 38 for Front Room Motorsports, Todd Gillland. Thanks for joining us. Yeah, I'm excited to be here and check out the studio and talk to you guys. I'm so sorry for anything they said. You interrupted a very important game of ping pong when you walked in. I know. I thought I was next,

but you guys were ready for me. So maybe next time. It's weird because they were playing. And they sound like it's like women's tennis, whatever they hit the ball. It's like, yeah. I don't know if that's how I would describe it.

So obviously with the off weeks, you know, we don't have a race to talk about this week. So we're bringing in some of the guys. And I actually put out a tweet and Todd had been on our list there anyway to come on eventually. But I put out a tweet like, who do you guys want to hear from?

And believe it or not. not people actually wanted to hear from you. I'm with you on that, man. It always blows my mind. I see like, right? The Twitter mentions stuff like that. I'm like, what is interesting that they want to hear from me? But here we are and fans are going to get what they want, I guess. Yeah.

We'll see. So, I mean, it's just going back, obviously, third generation, I assume third generation race car driver. Your dad, your grandfather both ran forever. I know your dad, they're both out, mostly out west, dominated out there for a long time. Where did you get started at? Yeah. So I was born in.

Southern California, kind of Riverside area. I think I made my first quarter midget start out on the West Coast in Pomona. How old were you? Five years old. So, yeah, but it was pretty young. And I can't imagine putting a five-year-old in a go-car or a quarter-a-old. Quarter-a-old midgettina. Like, it's crazy. But yeah, so I started my first-comberets. You can't give a five-year-old a box of markers right now. I wouldn't give you a box of markers. How Chad that for Chloe. What is the nanyo clean it? Don't worry. Yeah. But so I started. So I started. of racing out there, but it was around that same time that my dad won that nationwide race, I believe it was at Kentucky. So that was kind of his first, like, huge win and got a lot of,

you know, more opportunities past that. So around that time, we moved our whole family from Southern California to Moresville, North Carolina, where we are now. And yeah, it's been super cool. Like, obviously, right, center of racing and everything. So I took a few years off during that time. I kind of went through all the other sports, right? I played soccer, basketball, not football, because it was too dangerous, but then I eventually got back into racing. So yeah, I'd say pretty much when I was nine years old on, I ran, you know, full, full quarter midgets until I was 13 years old, jumped right into a late model stock car, ran at Hickory for a little bit, a few years or probably one year in the cars tour.

From there, jumped right into ARCA, K&N for a couple of years, the truck series for four or five and now into my third year in the Cup series. Yeah, obviously, Jason Hedleski, was the first person that, like, put you on my radar. You had, he told me like, oh, Todd's going to run. I forget, you won. I forget where the hell it was. But like, it was your first, like, one of your first Arker races. And you went out and like won and I was like, holy, I think probably at the time you're what, like 15 years old, I would assume probably. Yeah. Where was that at? That was that Toledo. So that was the arc of rule at the time.

You had to be 15 years old to race. And I was, I was, it was the day after my birthday that I ran that race and won when I was 15. So that was really cool. It's like totally unexpected. I wasn't running great. A bunch of guys, crashed and yeah it kind of fell into my lap but it was it was awesome and yeah like said jason jason delisky spotted for a lot of my first um you know arca k-nn races so uh yeah that was really fun days back then and i was talking to tj about this before you got here interesting path for you not so i mean there's guys that go from the travis you went to the truck series had a little bit success there uh with kbm and then went straight to cup obviously and

what i didn't realize i was looking up stats last night people be i think people find an interesting you don't have a single Xfinity series start. Yeah. Yeah, like you said, it's definitely an interesting path. And yeah, never even sat in an exfinity car or anything. So definitely a little bit different from normal. Yeah, you mentioned kind of KBM days, right? I wish we had more success there, which I did a little bit better job during those days.

I think, you know, the path maybe would have been a little bit easier or a little bit more standard, right, of a path. Just if I was able to win races there, maybe move up and continue on. But yeah, it wasn't smooth. And honestly, that was the kind of jump to front row motorsports. We had a good relationship with Bob Jenkins, everyone at front row. And for them to start the truck team kind of pick me up when I had nothing else, that was really cool. And that was my only opportunity.

So that was my only chance to kind of stay racing, and stay in the truck series. And then, you know, staying within the team, that was, you know, I guess kind of the easier move, right? Just moving straight into the cup cars over there. Once the next-gen car came out. Yeah, for sure. And you're coming up, I think I looked last night.

I don't know if yesterday was 93 or 94, so you're coming up on 100, 100 cup starts, which is, you know, a milestone for some. I mean, that's basically what three or four full-time years. Obviously last year, you know, I always say this. We talk about it. When you guys have, when you put your back against the wall, some of the people either respond or they don't. And obviously yesterday, last year was probably a tough year for you and as a part, like,

they took you out of the car. You know, they like they gave Zane some of your races, essentially. and I felt like last year you responded in a way that earned you what you're doing now. Like how hard was that to first even absorb the news? Like, hey, what do you mean you're taking me out of my car? And then when, you know, stepping up to the plate to make what you did like to make happen what you did last year. Yeah, it was a really tough situation.

Like you said, it's, you know, me and Zane were friends and, I mean, we still are great friends. But it's just funny, right? Looking back, it's like you're always going to have these type of situations, right? You're become friends with the people in racing. You know, in like you said, though, it's not between, it wasn't between me and him and it still isn't, right? It's a racing deal to business. And I'd say that was the toughest part.

It was just kind of absorbing the news of, you know, not going to race these six races. Is this even what we need to continue doing? Or do I need to go back and run in the Xfinity series or truck series again, win more races? And so it was definitely, you know, kind of a time to reflect, I guess, really, right? So I feel like in my first year, I had kind of achieved most of what I wanted to. You know, we finished, I think, the second most amount of laps in that first year in the next-end car when guys were having a lot of issues. We didn't have many issues and we were able to capitalize and maybe get some better finishes

than we deserved. So but still, right, that's kind of the learning process in my eyes. So it was definitely disappointing. And then, you know, to pick up those six races that was out of the 38 car last year, you know, I think I drove in the 15, the 51 at Rick Warr. racing, the 36 at front row. So it was working with a bunch of different people. And honestly, I think that helped me a ton, just, you know, broadening my, my horizon of communication with a bunch of people. You know, we talked about my career, you know, growing up in racing. From the time I was

13 until, you know, 17, which are very important years, right, of racing. I raced with Chris Lawson, who was my crew chief and, you know, kind of driver coach everything, right? When you're on late models, you don't have a huge team. So to me, I feel like that helped and hurt a little bit, right? I worked with one guy. We ran really well and won a lot of races. But once I got into other situations, I hadn't worked with a lot of different people. So, and I still feel like I'm learning that today, right?

You, in a perfect world, you work with one guy and everything goes well. And you don't have to change. But that's not the real world. And I think that was the biggest thing from last year that it took away. It was just working with a lot of great people. And it definitely made me, I think, better on the racetrack. Luckily for you, you get to work with Ryan Brigadey, who is, just mild mattered, never really gets upset about anything. So he's an easy one to deal with.

Yeah, he never gets angry. Absolutely. Yeah, never gets angry. Never gets angry. And I'm the only reason I think he does get angry. So that's a, yeah, interesting thing. And just, you know, at Pocono, we had the, you know, the embedded whatever NBC thing. And he had a camera on him. And I was worried, dude. I don't know what even picked up or I'm sure he was worried too. But he's done a better job. He's, I think he knows he can't control as much of what I do on the racetrack. And it. Sometimes it's not even worth getting mad about. I see the clip. I forget where the hell you guys were.

But like Ryan was just being Ryan, who I've known Ryan for a long time. And he's just yelling to yell, I think. And so you fired back like, Ryan, will you just sit down please? Like, come down. We're at like Darlington. He's telling me just use the bumper. Get him out of the way. I'm like, Ryan, if I could get to his bumper, I would love to.

I would love to pass it right now. But I can't. Okay, that's racing. I'm trying to, try and set him up. Trying to get closer. I'm not yelling. That's us on the radio. Yeah, it sounds like he had an epic meltdown.

Was that Dover? Where'd you have the flats at? Yeah, that was that was an epic brigade. That was a spaghetti moment. I've ever heard one. But again, dude, that's just me making it mad. I'm the one that's fun out. He's mad at me in the first place.

And we sit there for like five laps and he's just boiling over. He's just getting temperatures rising. You know, watching, I think there's two things that stand out to me watching you come up. The last year in the trucks, you, whatever flipped the switch, I mean, you just became the finisher. you know you just finished i mean you were very competitive every week had a lot of speed and you were just putting everything together and i think it stood out and i think that um carried over whenever you switched um whenever you drove them other cars i felt like you were driving a little bit of

a chip on your shoulder i mean it looked like it whenever because man you got them other cars and and was fast it's like i don't like it and it stood out and i think people recognized it um And, you know, I think it helped get you to where you're at now. And honestly, uh, next year going to be the, I mean, the main guy, right? I said, yeah. I hope so. Yeah. We're expanding.

With the news, obviously, the team continues to grow, continues to bring on new hires. What is the future look like for you and how close are you to those conversations? Yeah. I try and stay pretty involved with all those conversations. I think, um, you know, I definitely. feel way more comfortable having those conversations, being involved with them now than ever. And I think that also those conversations will just get kind of easier and easier, right? As I continue to kind of mature in the sport and know more people, I think that's the biggest

thing. When I first got to the Cup Series, I knew nobody and didn't know who was strong in any position and all that stuff. So learning that a little bit over the first, you know, few years has definitely helped. It's definitely a big turning point for our company. You know, going to three cars can definitely help us in a lot of ways. But at the same time, if you don't get the right people, it's not going to help whatsoever. So I think that's the biggest thing I'm trying to keep pushing for, you know, Jerry Freeze, kind of all our management group at front row. It's just we have to get the right people. There's obviously a lot of good people out there right now with, you know, Stuart Haas, you know, changing their whole thing. And yeah, it's just about getting the right

people in the right positions. And obviously getting the right drivers is really important, too. So yeah, we'll see, but I'm super excited about it. Who's your third teammate? Yeah. Is this where you break news? Yeah. Great news here. But how like, listen, I were, I spent a year over there and Bob and Jerry were amazing to deal with. And like, like, what's it mean to you to have an owner like Bob that's just like so committed to like this guy, he was talking about. I've seen an interview there day where he's talking about how he got back in the day when he named his team front row racing and they ran nowhere near the front row. You know, so now to see the progression that were their winning races last year, you're much more competitive now. Like what's it mean to you to work for a guy like Bob and Jerry and that whole team over there?

Yeah, it's really cool. I think it's a story that kind of gets overlooked a lot of times, right? It's just so different than a lot of the cup owners out there. So Bob is just a businessman that, you know, has become very successful and, you know, owns a lot of franchises, restaurants, owns the whole Long John Silver's brand. And, yeah, just doing a really good job on the business side, right? And to me, it's always makes me laugh, right? Why are we racing if we're doing so good over there, right? But I love it and super thankful for it.

Thank God, yeah. Yeah, and yeah, it's super cool, right? He's just kind of his motto, right? He's just chip away at it. That's how he's done on his business side. And I think you can definitely see that just as much on a racing side. So, yeah, I've had kind of a cool look at it because my dad ran for the team 10 years ago at this point. So even from back then, you know, they used to lay off everybody as soon as the off season started.

And they wouldn't come back in until January, right? It's just all those little things where, you know, nowadays, right, we're, we're functioning as a full-blown race team that is going to compete and expects to compete for wins and if not be super competitive. So it's crazy how it's all changed. And it's just kind of that slow and steady mentality of, we're going to move up, hopefully, a couple positions of, you know, average start and finish every year.

And eventually, right, you end up taking those next steps. It's really fun. Well, they started off. I mean, when you got started off this year. super hot, like really fast at Daytona, Atlanta really good, even after you wrecked the field. Did you wrecked that?

Oh, I'm not like lap two. Yeah, lap one actually. Yeah, I was like, when did I wreck the field? Did you do that?

I don't remember that. I must have missed it. Remember when they were to let each other up? Oh, that's right. Yeah, I don't know if I wrecked everyone else wrecked each other. You were being a nice guy. First of all,

they pulled one over on the initial start. Yes, that guy. And they weren't supposed to be where they were. Anyway, that was more Michael. That was more Michael. Yes. And so. What did we do wrong at the start?

Was he? Michael's supposed to be on the bottom or something? Yeah. Gotcha. Yes. Interesting. Yeah. This is stuff I don't even, I just miss.

Oh, yeah. Just taking a chance at like jabs. I know. Just let it off your heart right now. What else you got? I've been waiting for this. It's like Chicago. It's like Chicago.

I've been waiting for this moment. No, but you guys started off really good, man. A ton of speed of Daytona, a ton of Atlanta. you know, obviously struggle a little bit more when we get to the, you know, the mile and a halfs and stuff. But, you know, what do you think is, you know, you said you, I just mentioned a couple spots better this year. Like, you're just trying to still keep improving a little bit at a time. Yeah. Yeah. I think that's, that's kind of our whole goal, right? I think when we go to short

tracks, I feel like every time we go to Martinsville, you know, I think we have a chance at running inside the top 10 and fishing there throughout the whole day, which is tough. When we go to Super Speedway, I definitely feel like our cars, especially this year, like you mentioned, they have enough speed to go win the race. Where before, you know, our cars, you know, we're good enough in the draft and I feel like we understand it all and could put ourselves in a good position to have a chance at it. Where now I honestly feel like we have some of the fastest cars every time we go to a Super Speedway. So, so yeah, like I said, short tracks, road courses, super speedways. I feel like we go and contend, you know, around 10th. then, you know, we pull some good pitch strategy and whatnot.

And hopefully we have a chance to go, you know, win the race. Mile and a half, at least for me, are definitely still the weakest link. That's kind of where the 34 team is still, you know, a few levels ahead of us. And that's what we're still working on for sure, just right, having more speed, more consistent speed. But at the same time, it's so hard. The fields are so deep. It's not like you're racing bad cars, right? It's hard.

We're running 25th and you're racing really good cars. And everybody's so good. Yeah, exactly. So that's still our goals, you know, kind of evening out the whole thing. Like, so we can compete at the short track, short course, of super speedways, but mile apps, I think we still have long ways. Yeah. How do you, so there, Noah's been announced. You know, how do you feel you and Noel will be as teammates?

Yeah, I'm interested to see. I think. I'm interested in this too. You can laugh. He's obviously a super fun guy. He has great personality. He has tons of fans. So I should think just, you know, those three things alone will definitely help the race team.

he's definitely great with people. I always see him, right, interacting with his own race teams. We've been teammates before back at KBM, I think in 2018, we were teammates. So yeah,

it's fun. I'm sure we've both matured a little bit and just know a lot more about, you know, what we're trying to achieve nowadays. So I'm telling you're going to be a fun deal. Yeah, it should be a lot of fun.

And, you know, from the sounds of it and looks of, I think we'll have a really, you know, young race team, you know, all the way through.

So it should be interesting. And then hopefully, hopefully work out for the better. How difficult would that be for you? We talked about it on here. Like, you know, Stuart Haas last year had Kevin. And that was,

Kevin's the benchmark. And if this is where we need to be, you know, you kind of have that now with Michael. Obviously, Michael's moving on. You just said, you know,

like the 34's a little bit, a couple levels ahead on mile and a halfs. Like, where does that come in next year when it's obviously Noah and rumored to be a younger guy getting in the third car? You know, where do you lean to like, where do you know,

all right, are good enough? You know, where does that? There's no, you're going to be the benchmark, essentially. You would know, I would assume, are the guys that are going to be competing for the, you know, the top, the top dog over there. You know, how does that play into your preparation every week?

It'll definitely be different, right? Like you said, over my first three years, Michael has always been the benchmark and was before I got there, honestly. So it's going to be tough. But at the same time, right, we still have glimmers of like what our cars can achieve and do. And I think the biggest thing for Michael is just how well he always qualifies, right? It doesn't matter what racetrack we go to. I feel like he always qualifies so good.

You know, whereas for us, I feel like we always race really well and we always end up right by each other. We kind of just meet in the middle. So, but yes, as far as I have benchmark, it's going to be hard.

But I think maybe with, you know, with three cars, I think you might see, you know, one or another, right, hit it better on, on any given weekend.

And, but yeah, it has been tough, right, because Michael's has always been the benchmark. But, yeah, from my side of it,

I definitely think we can fill that spot and, and hopefully be, you know, the guy to beat. Brit will hold court in those meetings. Britt. So we are a spotter podcast. You have a guy that I've known for a long time,

Britt Anderson Spotting. What's it been like working with him over the last couple years, right? I mean, you guys been together for a while. Yep, it's been fun. So kind of on the same thing. We mentioned Ryan Burginney had a camera on him. So did Britt this weekend.

And I was joking with him. He rode home with me or rode to the airport with me. I said, man, where are you starting your own podcast, man? You've been on TV now for, you know, the whole day. He was just laughing. But he's, he's been good. He's been learning a lot.

And it's been fun. It's, you know, him and Michael Fisher, been working really well together. That's Michael McDowell's Spotter. So, yeah, they've been doing a lot more, you know, driver prep stuff for me. And he's funny. He's, uh, I love to give him hard time for sure. Yeah, he's very easy to give a hard time. He was to my right.

And I did actually, I put a piece of tape on my shoulder that said, loser with an arrow pointing to him. But I, I didn't want to leave it on there. How old. Yeah, I took it off. But, yeah, there was a couple times. I look down there and they had a camera on them. You can see one right across the must in the front stretch and I'm just like behind his head.

I saw one time somebody gave the body. Oh, yeah, 100%. I looked down and I'm like, he's not getting away with this. So, yeah, Britt, he's a good one. He's fun to argue with. Oh, yeah. It's easy to get going. Oh, I can't imagine what he's like up there, dude, because I can just picture him running,

yelling to everybody and just never telling me about it. Well, he yelled at me in Texas. he yelled at me whenever your tire rolled in our stall he looked over me I love that too he goes he looks at him he goes that's your fault and I'm like

it's your tire why did you do that your tires in my stall we had that yesterday Tyler Green actually says it on me because which I didn't even know this is a rule and I guess

teams can use it to their advantage they were pitted behind us 77 their tire rolled into our stall and our guy just reached out and like stopped it as he was jumping over the wall. Yeah. And I guess because he touched it was a, whatever they call it now,

pit road interference or some equipment interference. And it's only because that guy touched it. I'm like, well, that's a good move. Like, you can just start going out. Let me get me reaching for tires all the time. Have like a like a pool rod thing trying to pull it over to you. Get over here. Let me touch that.

So what's it like obviously, you know, you tend to run, you know, that 10th to 20th range. And when like we talk about on here all the time. Like back there, when you get in the middle of the pack, especially restarts are wild. You get back there in your midpack and it's just like, I feel like it's killer be killed in the middle of the field these days. Yeah, absolutely. And like he's definitely at Pocono. I was just kind of in the way in general. So we kept kind of staying out, putting on two tires, and we're just clinging on anything.

And man, that just everyone knew I was slow to begin with, I think. And then obviously it's tough to pass once everyone gets kind of settled in at Poconos. So everyone's just going for it. into turn one. Yeah, I kept getting pushed out of the groove and like said, I was too slow to be up there anyway. But yeah, the restarts, a lot of these places are like that now, though. So they're really fun if you're kind of the first guy on, say, four tires and everyone has two or none. And you're able to make the aggressive moves, right? Stick it to the bottom, three wide and wrap the line and be able to, you know, make it out the other side without an issue. But a lot of times if you're the

kind of slower guy, right, it's just really easy to be putting in a bad position. And it's kind of a out just making the most of it, right? Like, those guys aren't going to be patient. Most likely, if you're, you know, too wide on a restart, you're going to be put three wide by, you know, a faster car behind you. Yeah. Yeah, anybody really. So also I heard you say is you wish you had four tires more yes. There was one race. Where the hell were we? I can't remember where it was. I felt like you didn't put four tires on the whole race. Yeah. Oh, it was in New Hampshire? I think it was in New Hampshire. Like there was, you were, you just kept two tires. I'm like, Todd's back up front again. Yeah. Yeah. I'm like, I don't think Ryan's put four tires on this thing all day. And it's been

working a little bit when we've had decent speed. So that's the hard part. But Pocono, like I said, we're not fast enough to make that work. But hey, I appreciate Ryan for keep trying it in and keep putting me in questionable positions at times. But, you know, they've been working out, working out most of the time. Who's the guy? So we always deal with this. I'm sure T.J. does. Right now for us, it's Bush. Like, who's the guy out there you can't get away from? Do you feel like there's always a guy you're like, I'm always racing to some of it. He's racing me all or whatever it is. But there's always a guy that I feel like you're always around sometimes. Yeah. To me, it's kind of a group of guys, right?

It's kind of 77, 42, sometimes at 34. Me and McDowell race each other hard. But overall, you're making me nervous right now. So when you said the 77-42, I got kind of puckered up a little bit for you. Yeah. You're in the middle. 42, 77. Yeah, at Iowa, we were kind of door-banging each other a little bit.

We've been good since then. 77 kind of ran me in the wall a little bit. but at Pocono was it 70 was a you with the 77 right off of one I saw it once I was I was like they're wrecked like he just kind of came up and I was like oh well that 42 he did rack is I'm there was like three of them together there yeah but yeah it was uh it was interesting too I had the onboard camera so I figured no one even saw it no one was ever going to see the light of day on that one but yeah apparently it showed on broadcast and everything so um it's fun and I mean it's not really that much fun but uh I was saying you're going to lie to us yeah

But that's the hard part, right? You race these guys every week. There's bound to be some give and take. And I feel like eventually it all evens out. And sometimes you just have to be smarter by your time for a couple weeks. Like we mentioned, I got into Josh Barry. Pretty bad, really bad at Chicago. Obviously, I apologize, but it only does so much, right?

And you kind of just have to, you know, pay attention who you're around, I feel like. And, you know, take it when you can, but also sometimes you have to be smart. And then how hard is it? Like, you know, everybody talks about back in the day, Mark Martin was the king of, I'll let that guy go because I know I'll get him back later. It's not a big deal. You can't do that anymore with these cars. Like it's so hard to pass. Like how hard is it to define that line of I've, I know I'm being an ass-a-k now, but I got to defend this spot. I'm sorry. You know, it is super hard. And yeah, in the car, you absolutely know, right? When you're kind of just, you know,

not giving up a spot, I guess, like, especially at Pocono, right? There's a few times that, you know, guys would just barely get to my left for your off turn one. And I would just, drive in side by side and kind of clear them back off turn two, right? And it doesn't feel good. You know, that's not what you're supposed to do. But at the same time, if it takes another five to 10 laps for them to pass you, that could be a full fuel window. You could get on and off pit road, you know, and still stay ahead of them for the whole run. So it's really hard. It's not fun, but it's kind of the necessary thing, right? It's, I think there's races, though, that that do have those traits, you know, like the 600, when you get those long green flag runs and you do have,

when you have green flag stops and you're kind of settled in, you can have a give and take scenario with some guys, especially if you got comers and goers, like you pit 10 last four of me, I come back out. It doesn't make sense to get messing around and crossing each other over and let the guy behind you get two free spots out of it. But it is so hard to get track position back.

At Pocono, we have to race every single lap pretty much. I was right in front of the battle when you were battling on the 77 and like the 77 was kind of running us down. Todd caught a 77 from behind and they start racing each other and we end up putting like 20 car lengths on them just because they spent two laps racing each other. It's like so that's where you've got to draw the line of like am I doing any am I hurting myself more than I'm helping here by even racing this guy. I saw chase catch uh, Ricky. Ricky was racing with somebody and they started they come off a three side by side and Ricky went

way down to the bottom and Chase had a big run. He went drove right through the middle. I've got two spots and one straight away. Yeah. Like it's just, so like I think like you mentioned though, too, I think it is a really good point that, um, you know, definitely depends on the racetrack. Like, yeah, somewhere like Darlington, if you're like there's some places you just have to race the racetrack. And honestly, like, at least for me, the second I start racing someone like over my head, I get myself in a lot of trouble. So lap time slow down. Yeah. You're, you're, it's, there's a lot of bad things that add up and keep piling on when you do that. Yep. For sure. So so what is what is, I mean, obviously everybody knows Todd Gillen at the racetrack.

What's Todd Gillen like away from race track? I know you got married recently. Like, what do you do during the week? Obviously, preparing for the races. But what else is going on in Todd Gillen's world? Yeah, it was actually just yesterday. I've been married for a year and a half exactly. So just over that.

Congratulations. You made it. Yes, we've made it this far. So that's fun. She's definitely, you know, one of my biggest supporters goes a lot of the races. Definitely one of my biggest critics also. So all that stuff. Yes, exactly.

But away from the racetrack. I'm a big golfer. I love going to the golf course. And, you know, last week I probably played, you know, three or four times. And once when we got to the racetrack at Pocono. So I love just going out, seeing new places. And yeah, that's kind of my main hobby right now. What are we shooting?

Dude, so I'm like an eight handicap. So my scores recently have been like low to mid 80s. So not horrible. I don't think we're getting anywhere near that. I don't play golf luses. Freddie, what's yours? Handicap? I got a lot of handicapped.

I'm about 100. I stop counting at 100. So I don't know. That's usually about that 15th hole. Probably. Yeah. I've been, so I started playing with Ricky Sennhouse and he's really good.

But man, he's the type of guy that will just make you sit there and count every single stroke. Dude, if you go in the woods, you're going to drop a ball, man. That's too bad. One time is me and Riley Herps with him at, I don't even know where,

but we had to hit over water. And this is when we first started. We could not. He made us sit there and hit like 15 balls into the water before he hit it over. So now that he's a dad that I'm sure his son is going to be raised like that and it's going to be tough on him. You know what? What's funny is I remember, do you remember David Hovis? It worked for your dad.

Worked for that. He was your dad's PR guy when he won that exfini race at Kentucky, right? Yeah. Yeah. Well, that night, and this might be new to you, we actually, the cup cars were off that weekend. It was an off weekend for Cup because we were partying at the Western Town and your dad actually came back. Allegedly came back and ended up down there. And we all pretty much celebrated down there.

And Hobes was your dad's PR guy and he may have, I'm not telling the entire story. She's going to get to skip the kid. You need to ask your dad about it. You actually worked out better for your dad because it wasn't. his car that had it wasn't his company car that had a problem so but yeah it's you're giving us bits and pieces I know we're going to do it out of air basically uh he took a car to go get something to eat and came back or he thought it was your dad's but it wasn't ended up being another drivers and may have had a made it may have crashed it yes oh good so i was probably David was probably glad

And we can talk about it really quick. TryCon. Obviously, Dad's heavily involved with that owner. I don't even know where they're at anymore. Like, who owns what over there? But, you know, what's that mean to have that in the family? And springing up, we were talking about earlier this, you know, a couple weeks ago about like, Corey Heim is, Hyme and Eckers are dominating the truck series essentially.

Like, what's it mean to have that, them being in the sport and then so competitive where they're at? Yeah, that's definitely a really cool chapter. I think of his kind of racing career. Um, yeah, like I said, so he ran in the cup series for right, probably six to eight, 10 years somewhere around there. Um, and then that's about the time I started like really seriously racing in the K&N series on the West series. So he kind of got, you know, to work on the cars.

And he is a huge passion for that like being involved in building a really fast car and going to the racetrack and you know, just the expectations. I think all of that stuff, right? That's kind of what he lives for. So, um, it's really cool to see he's been obviously in the truck series for probably close to six, six years now, started out as, you know, DGR Crossley and then David Gilland Racing, now Tricon Garage. So they've made some huge steps. It's been really fun to watch. He's always there. Yes. Every time I've, every time I've had to go over there for meetings

and stuff, I always see him. Like you would always see him. So he's involved. He's there literally every single day. So he still works full-time job there. And yeah, like I said, he's, he's part owner in it all. So it's just been really, really special to kind of see their success. And it's kind of tough right there, Toyota, and we're Ford now. So I wish I'd still run some races for them. I ran some, I guess, a couple of years ago and was able to win one on the dirt at Knoxville. So, yeah, that was pretty fun, but it's cool to see what he's doing. That race was entertaining. Is that the one Krauss wrecked everybody? Oh, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's your guy. Oh, he's my guy. Trust me. I know. I just got, I wasn't there that guy that day.

So we're sitting, let's see, looking right now, sitting 20th and points at the moment. We're doing this. You know, what's, what's, what's, what's your goals the rest of the season? Yeah, it's hard. I think we've made such big progress in, you know, the point standings and in results. And to me, points really do show a lot of, you know, kind of throughout the whole season, right? Like, there's a lot of weeks where, you know, over the course of 38 weeks, some guys are bound to have a good week, right? Every so often, at least. Um, whereas points position, I really feel like shows kind of the whole season. So, yeah, like you said, to be 20th, we're ahead of some really good cars. And on the cusp of the great cars right in front of us, right? There's Austin Cindra, Kyle Bush,

you know, Chase Briscoe. Those are all great organizations, great drivers. They're not missing any part of their race team. So for us, it's, it's all about, you know, going to the next level on, you know, me being prepared, right? Unloading fast, having good pitch strategy, having good pit stops, all that stuff. And really, really, that next step is the playoff bubble on points. So we know that's a tough next step, but, you know, for us, that that's the realistic next goal is, you know, if we could have had a little bit better, stronger start to the season, and really everybody's got those races, right? But, you know, we could be a little bit closer.

And honestly, I think next year, I think that's a really good goal. It's in sight. Yeah, in that playoff bubble cut off. So it's in sight. You talk about Michael being the benchmark. I'm looking at this list. Dude, we've been leading the points for a few weeks now. Is that because you get to poke your chest out a little bit?

like talk a little trash over there. Yeah. Well, he did at the beginning because like, I mean, my whole time there, he's just been so far ahead of me in points. Even the first year, you got a hundred point penalty. He was still way out of me. So it was nice. Like the first week, I passed him by like one point.

So I was like messing with him. Like he's super close. But we've been able to pull away a little bit. So it's, uh, it's been cool. Yeah. Well, man, we appreciate you swinging by. Um, obviously, you know, something little different here, just trying to get some guys out there.

They do the names out there. And for like I said, for some reason, people wanted to hear from you. So we appreciate you swinging by, man. Awesome. Thank you for driving me. Yeah, now. Thanks for coming on. Check out Dirtymoe Media, Twitter, Facebook, TikTok, and Instagram.