Door Bumper Clear - Jeff Burton & Bristol II: S***show for All The Right Reasons

Episode Date: September 15, 2025

The Mayor, Jeff Burton, joins Freddie Kraft, Tommy Baldwin, and Karsyn Elledge on today’s episode of Door Bumper Clear. Jeff and the DBC crew break down the chaotic Bristol Night Race and how excessive tire wear is exactly what the fan base asked for, and Goodyear delivered. Then, they debate whether or not Justin Allgaier and Connor Zilisch’s pit strategy cost them the win in the Xfinity race. And Jeff gives his take on the Playoff format debate and why TV is not the sole decision-maker in NASCAR. Plus, Reaction Theatre, S***show Hall of Fame, #ASKDBC & more!Real fans wear Dirty Mo. Hit the link and join the crew.👇https://shop.dirtymomedia.com/ Want more DBC? Check out and subscribe to the new DBC YouTube channel! Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

The following is a production of Dirty Mode Media. Called me Frat Freddy the other day in a group tech. Or he just misspelled fat. Either way, he can kiss my ass. Let's fight. Let's get it over with. Let's knock each other out and let's move on. I think he's a whiny.

That's what I think. Next thing you know, I got no firesuit on. Routy Nation fans are getting lucky tonight. You want to have gimmicks. Let's go all out. I would never, and here they come never and like they never have before. Not enough, you love them. Hey, what's up everybody?

Welcome to Door Bumper Clear. I'm Freddie Crafts, spotter for all three this week. Bubba Wallace, Dean Thompson, G.O. Zero. Pretty solid week until the, whatever we want to have that. Call that race that happened on Saturday night. It was a lot of fun. But it was a lot of spotting involved in that race on Saturday night. There was coming and going and pitting every 20 laps I felt like.

But it was exciting. Tommy, how are you today? Good morning. You had a solid week? I mean, I text you yesterday. Nothing. Well, I was not capable operating my phone. Well, here's what happened.

Bubba wrecked in the final stages. Notre Dame wrecked in the final stages. The Giants wrecked in the final stages. So after I text you, I got silence. I'm like, oh, I hope he's okay. I saw that text this morning. It was like, Freddy's not having a good day. And I was like, I was having fun at that point.

I was like, I don't even know what he was talking about yesterday. Because I was having a great day. Even with all that bad shit happening. Carson, how are you this morning? I'm good. Another fun weekend with the cars tour. I saw a hell of a wreck in the car store. Yeah, that seems to be the...

Parker, huh? Parker. Oh, yeah. Took flight. Yeah. Yeah, that is okay. Joining us today, our special guest of the week, we just refer to you as the mayor now.

Has everybody do that? How are you, Mr. Jeff? I get called all kinds of things. It might be one of the better ones. How are you today, sir? I'm great. Thanks for joining us. One thing I did want to talk to you about,

we kick it off with Harrison, because obviously we talked about this, I think last week's show, how much making the playoffs means to that team, especially. But then he goes out in the first race and really had a really solid performance. And you could see it in practice. They had a lot of speed on this weekend.

Yeah, they were fast there in the spring, and they had a, unfortunately, they had the old, the dreaded sway bar dragging the tire problem in the spring. They're in Dover, right? Aaron Dover, we used to have that problem. Right, so actually when the first tire went down with them, I'm like, that has every sign of a sway bar, right?

And there's no way in today's time. Well, that's what it was. But so they were fast there then. So, yeah, it was good to see them. And it was, I liked them on offense. you know what I mean they've been playing a little bit of defense lately I liked them on offense I love I love the call in the first stage to stay out and get points I thought that was badass and yeah so anytime you can go on offense that's a good thing yeah I was a little concerned when they took the points obviously stayed out and then obviously they had a restart towards the back maybe forfeited a couple points in the second stage but like the fact that he was able to drive back up into the top 10 and contend it from that point I was worried like sometimes you do that you chase the points and then you kind of forfeit positions at the end of the race because of it they didn't you know they had a they had a they had a they had a good run. The other thing I want to talk to you about nowadays, like your role with the drivers. Like you're with, you know, I think you're like kind of the liaison between the drivers and the

industry, whatever. Like, what's that role like for you? Well, it's fun. It's a lot of work, to be honest with you. You know, it's, you know, drivers are no different than crew chiefs or team managers or spotters, you know, that none of them all agree on everything, right? And trying to understand their perspective of why they have an opinion and then best represent the overall you know, what they generally believe. A lot of them believe the same thing, but how they get to the fix can be different, right? So I think it's long overdue that the drivers have a consolidated voice. They don't, you know, the drivers don't make decisions about rules. They don't make decisions about processes and procedures, but their perspective is important to be heard. And it was long overdue that that happened in a formal way.

what would happen in the past was kind of conquer and divide, you know, because one driver goes in and has this opinion, another driver goes in and has this opinion. You have these varying opinions, so nothing would happen, right? So that's not good either. And, you know, the sport needed it, the sport needed to have that. So being the guy that a bunch of them came to and said, hey, man, can you try to make this happen?

And that was cool. And we've moved the ball a lot. We do a lot behind the scenes. We don't believe that we have to be out in public talking about it. But a lot has changed in the sport. because of the program. And I'm proud. We haven't done everything right for sure.

Most of what's happened because of this has been good. And, you know, it needed it. It was long overdue and I was glad to be part of it. Yeah, we have something similar now with the spotters where I believe it or not, I would tend to say what's on my mind more often. I kind of came from the school of Tommy Baldwin, so I would spout off. And it wasn't going well with it. We all would do that.

You know, everybody would kind of say that we, the same thing. We consolidated. We have one representative from each manufacturer. We go to them. And they present our problems to NASCAR. And it seems like it's working a lot better than me mouthing off at times, because I'm sure I rub some people the wrong way in those points. But, yeah, Tommy, how was your weekend, buddy?

It was good. Went to Bristol on Friday with the Cupcar and had a decent day there. And then we went to Dominion. Jack finished fourth. Luke finished six. Strug a little bit, set fast time. But, yeah, they locked up the final three championship races as five drivers. is five drivers left, and they'll go to where we go to...

She doesn't know. I don't even know where we go to this week. Franklin County, because they changed the race. Did they have speedy dry this time? Yeah, I hope so. And then I think the dirt was better, to be honest with you. Then Tri-County and then the championship races in Wilkesboro during the Cars Tour weekend with the Smart Tour.

Luke's pretty much almost, I would say, locked up to run for the championship for Wilkesboro. So just get through these next couple races. and more so prepared for Wilkesboro from this point on. You know, we're kind of like the 19 car and the 11 car, right? Just getting, maybe having them look a little bit further ahead, getting ready for Wilkesboro. So, yeah, it's going to be fun trip. We got New Hampshire this weekend.

Doug Colby's going to drive the 7-N-Y with the Modified and Jack and Luke will race. I thought I was spawned for Luke. No. No, Luke. You were going to show up? I'm spotting, but I didn't know. I thought it was Luke's got a race.

Luke's got to race Franklin County in a smart tour, unfortunately. By the way, whoever has not watched that modified race in New Hampshire, you need to watch it. That's an entertaining race. Well, at 9 o'clock in the morning, I hope everybody's up. Yeah, well, there's a crowd a little bit. We're going to wait. I'm very confused why the best race of the weekend is at 9 a.m. I mean, it's dumb.

Do we have any idea what the thought process is there? schedule, TV, override, and everything. It's just like, man, I'd rather them line up on Sunday after the cup race instead of the whole world would see. I mean, you can't get home on the plane, sorry. Well, I mean, you can catch a commercial flight. You'll be right. It's just such a, like, I looked at the schedule. I was like, this doesn't make.

And there was, even, they were supposed to qualify it like before. Like, they changed that since. Yeah, we do that on Friday. It was like, 730, 8 o'clock in the morning. And I was like, what is going on? What happened to the schedule? It's a negative. I mean, there's so much going on up there that weekend.

You know, it's stuff going on the track all the damn time. But the negative is they got to put them on the track at some point. Bristol, pretty. I mean, we'll get into the tireware stuff in the spot on, spot off. But, I mean, just a wild race. Bell capitalizes on the last restart. You know, those guys on the front row were kind of sitting ducks. I think they were old tires.

And it's just, you know, I felt like nobody could hit the bottom of turn one on a restart pretty much every all night long. And you've seen Zane get in there a little hot. I seen him last. I talked to him yesterday, and I was like, you were like, you weren't going to get beat off a turn, too, at that point. He's like, no, hell no. He's like, I'm going to go in there and hope to at least cover the bottom a little bit and beat him, or at least drag race him into three.

And just, obviously, they watch up the hill and Bell, there's door opens for Bell. That was probably the best restart all weekend on the bottom. No question. You know, all from the truck to Xfinity to the cup. I was like, oh, man, he's got a shot now. I mean, he, kudos to him. And that team run good all day. Yeah, they were in the top five.

I felt like pretty much the whole race. Jeff, how hard is it to call that race? Like, how about, like, I know you guys, I haven't gone back to watch it, obviously, yet, but so much shit is happening. Like, how do you guys keep track of everything? Well, Steve, Steve Lattart, he had a good point. Like, at some point, we were during commercial, and he said, okay, we've got to be careful not to try to cover everything,

because we're not going to cover anything if we do, because there were so many different things happened at the same time. And I think that was the right approach. I mean, we clearly, you know, showed, you know, when people were pitting, tried to cover that the best we could. But there was no way to get. into every driver and teams day. It was just impossible. And so what do we focus on, you know, what are the big picture moment things? That's a hard thing to figure out because every driver

has a fan that wants to see what's going on with their car, right? And you don't want to leave somebody out, but there's no way to cover everybody on a night like that. And you just had to focus and maybe not cover it as long as we would like to cover it, right? Show it. Yeah. Don't even always have to explain it. Just make sure you're showing it, somebody pity, and even if you don't say anything about it. But that is a challenge for sure. It was fun, though. It was fun as hell. You guys thought it was a good race because of all that? Like what was your perspective up there of the total totality of the whole race of all the issues and everything? So you know what it did? So what it did to me, more than anything else, is it made the bottom the place to be. And I felt like I was in the 90s,

early 2000s watching a Bristol race where you had to be on the bottom. That was the unintended consequence of having the tire do what it did. It drove everybody to the bottom and it had varying speeds. So now you had cars that could pass. You had cars that

wanted to be on the bottom. It's been years since I've seen that many people in the rear bumper of the guy in front of it. It was non-stop contact. I remember Dale was talking about this when we had this race two years ago. It was the spring race last year actually. not only did it bring us back to the bottom,

but it made it the speeds are so slow that now you could get to a guy. You know, before, like when we were hauling ass through there, like you can maybe get to a guy's bumper, but you're not moving them. You know, you're not like we're all going to same damn speed. Now you could get to a guy, knock him up off the bottom. And then when you knocked him off the bottom, he paid the price. You know, he wasn't like he just got back in line behind you.

If there was guys lined up behind you, he was done. Like once you got off the bottom, especially in the middle of those runs time, you get up in those marbles, it was kind of game over. Yeah. And you could see it would, like a light switch once they knew there was a tire issue. I mean, it was like, bang up. He'd done. You know, on TV, you're what? Oh, he's done. He's done. He's done. I thought the 12 car during the end of the run, all of a sudden he backed up. He disappeared. He didn't even pit. Then all of a sudden,

everybody was having problems, and here he comes again. But then all of a sudden, it's like, all right, he had a problem. It's like, it was almost like, if you thought about it at the end of the race, just to go hard, ruin your shit, come in pit, come back out, go. Go back out. hard. I wonder if everyone's doing the math today and seeing if that would have been better by just slowing down, you know, seeing if you're going to make it, because once you slow down and then said, I'm going, you had an issue, right? So I don't know what the final decision was. I think the 77, right? They made that decision, right? Yeah. The last two runs of the third stage is what that's what we committed to. Just, Bubby, you run as hard as you can. The second you feel fall off, come.

And it was, like you said, a light switch. Like Bubba would be like, there was like a pit cycle started. Like he could start seeing guys having issues. And I'm like, all right, guys are starting to pit, be ready for it. We're 30 laps on tires, whatever it was. And Bubba's like, no, I'm good. I'm good. I'm good.

I'm coming. Like, it was not like, all right, we're fading. Now we've got to come. It was. As soon as the belt breaks, you're over. It was game over. Tell us what you feel, you know, we've had that issue. You've had that issue.

Oh, yeah. I mean, that was, that was what I was watching, too. It's like, I remember specifically Eric Jones was sitting there in the crowd. along and all of a sudden you saw him jump up in the second lane and then next thing you know he's like a half a lap back in just a few laps that quick and and um you know look that's extreme like we don't you know we're all looking for tire wear we're all looking for fall off that's clearly on the other side of it i'm good with it though because when you're trying to get to the edge of the cliff and operate on it you're going to fall over it every now and then i'm i am proud as hell

of Goodyear for having the courage to say, you know what, if we have this problem, it's okay. Because if we commit to never having a problem, then we're going to have no tire fall off, right? They got committed to saying, okay, we had this problem a year ago. Remember, they went back with that same tire. They had the courage to do that, right? And they had the courage to come back with a different tire yet. That's what we need. We need the entire industry on that mindset. Like we have this short track problem. Like, my and a half racing to me. me as fun as hell to watch. It's the best it's ever been. And people can complain and bitch about the car. Show me a time mile and a half racing is better than it is now. There's never been a

time, right? The problem is road courses and short tracks. The tire isn't the only problem. There's other things. There's other issues that need to be addressed. And there's a lot of work going into that behind the scenes. But Goodyear, I just can't tell you how proud I am of them for doing what they did, being willing to risk it. And I'm proud of the drivers for saying it's okay, Right? Because in the past, you know, we'd had a few drivers that would get out and have a tire problem and they would rip good year up. You can say, Tony. And that set us back. That set us back. It's a different type of problem.

We would have a problem that's blowing out, not just what was happening there. It's a totally different issue. But when you are good year and you're in this sport and you've invested the amount of money, time and effort and energy into it, you're doing it because you want your product out. You don't want the drivers out there bashing it, right? So the drivers have stood with Good Year, supported them, and that's what it's going to take, is the industry working together on these types of top of issues. And I didn't – the other thing is the way you had the tire failures, no one wrecked because of – Right, right.

That's what I'm saying. That's why it's a different type of situation. And look, the industry knew with this tire, it was half the wear – half the amount of laps from the spring tire. before it failing. We all knew that. It was going to be that. What kind of threw everything off a little bit was Friday. Yes.

You know, and I think it had to do with the truck and Xfinity rubber on the PJ1, the way it reacted, you know, way it woke the PJ1 up. I know they put new stuff down and they cleaned the track on Sunday. On Saturday, I'm sorry. And I'm not sure if the PJ1 reacted the same because if you looked real hard, on Friday, it spread a little bit, right? It spread up a little bit, like half a groove more of the PJ1. It wasn't collecting rubber. It wasn't getting black, but you can see a little glare there. And the other thing you got to understand, and you know this from the tire testing.

A lot of times when you work on the left side tire, you help the right side tire heat and wear. So I think what happened a lot was when the PJ1 probably didn't react the same as Friday, the left side tires didn't wear as much as they did on Friday. So it put more pressure on the right side tires. So I think that's why there was a little bit more of an issue. But I don't know, man, it was just so much stuff going on there and so many decisions being made. It's just like, you know, I was watching, our race got done pretty early,

so I was pretty in tune of what was going on. We went back to the hotel in the lobby. There was 60 to 70 people in the lobby to hotel, and they were going crazy on all the stuff that was going on. So that tells me as a race fan, the people enjoyed it. Yeah. There's also a lot of shit catching on fire. Yeah.

Yeah. And that's a bad side. That's a product of the marbles, right? I mean, essentially, I didn't get a lot. I didn't deep dive into what happened with the 221, but that's usually, a lot of people had issues. And it's a, man, that's such a tough issue with these cars because in that, that valleyway, that alleyway where the pipes go in there, it's a trap of that stuff. And I don't, you know, I think, again, we did a good job at Richmond of putting screens on the left side and the right side to not collect the rubber on the headers. I still think now we need to do a little bit more work in the area of that, and hopefully that don't get fixed.

But, again, we're always making changes after mistakes, right? That's usually our MO, because we don't know, right? We don't know. And that's the way the tire is war. That's where it ended up and catching fire. It's not the first time it's happened. No. Right.

But it happened multiple teams. One of the thing that was different was this race, they sprayed the PJ1 prior to the truck race. That was the first time they'd done that. So that was a little different. And then we learned with that tire, temperature is drastically effective. And we've seen it at some tire test where you would test with the temperature and then come back and the test had nothing to do. like it looked like two different tires and it was just temperature. So that temperature difference between day and night, I mean, that's a small margin, right?

So it's hard to believe that that's 100% what it is, but we saw it in the spring of last year, right? The temperature was the only different between the spring and the fall with the same tire. And that's crazy that that's where they were. But it's one of the challenges of, you know, the tires wider, right? The tire is significantly wider. and Goodyear has had to they've had to make a major investment to know how to create this kind of rubber

and then the technology to put the rubber on the tire. They couldn't get it to stay on the tire for a long time and so they've spent a lot of money to get here. I don't know, man, it was fun. I get it. It's probably a little bit too far. But if we can take nothing else from it than this, a bottom groove racetrack at Bristol,

one groove racetrack on the bottom, And varying speeds in the cars produce better racing at Bristol. And we haven't seen Bristol. I'm sorry, this is just the truth. We haven't seen the Bristol that we all grew up with and loved since the reconfiguration years ago. Yeah, absolutely. And we saw Saturday night what the fans want to see. Yeah.

Bottom one groove racing, variant speeds in cars, being out of move somebody out of the way, that's what we expect when we go to Bristol. And that's what we got Saturday. I would assume, like, I'd have to go back and search the numbers, but I would assume it's going to be the highest short track race on Gluck's pole in the last couple of years. I know it was 80%. I don't, you know, our short track races have not been great since we went to this car. Tommy, one thing I do, want to ask you about, like, you're, put yourself in a position where I know you help call the race at times.

All of a sudden you get an extra set of tires, which maybe it was expected once you see in the beginning of the race. But like, how difficult is that to, you know, we're going to issue another set of tires of you guys. Now, how does that adjust your game plan for the race? Well, I think they did it early enough that it really, during the issues that everyone's happened, everyone was like, okay, thank goodness. And look, I don't think you had a choice Saturday, but to come in when they had an issue. So there was no game plan on, hey, we need another set of tires. I was surprised that they only gave us one, right? So, but I think they gave it early enough that it's okay, all right, got another set of tires,

in case we have another issue. Because, look, if you didn't have an, if you had an issue, had no more tires, what were you going to do? Yeah. You're going to have to pull. How are you going to run? You couldn't do anything. Yeah. It was, it was, yeah, it was wild.

And the one thing I did, I think we talked about this yesterday, a little bit, Tommy, with somebody else. But the difference in when they sprayed the PJ1 versus, you know, I felt like we sprayed it on Thursday and Friday and got right on it. You know, we had arch of practice. Saturday, we didn't have anything all day long except for the race. Somebody said they sprayed it like 2 o'clock and it just sat there not getting activated all day long. and then, you know, the first activation, obviously, is the race. Like that, we think maybe had that effect on. Like I said earlier, yeah, I think that had something to do with it.

I just don't think it reacted the same as Thursday and Friday. And, you know, we also noticed, I don't know if you noticed Jeff up top on Friday during practice, we never laid rubber down, right? Even when they went up top. But I thought it was going to be a multi-groved race because there were no marbles in practice. Right. Everyone started going up there. And once they went up there, it was okay. Now, they didn't go all the way up.

But they were high enough that was like, hmm, I think we're going to see some multi-grove racing here. By the end of the practice, the lap times were leveling off. And I was like, all right, we're going to have a top in it. But of course, all hell broke losing the race. And it just, you could never, you could never. The amount of marbles that were up against the wall at the end of the race, or at the end of these run really was really, I don't know how much TV caught it, but it was crazy. Oh, yeah, we showed it.

We showed it multiple times. The other thing that confused it was the Xfinity race was normal. Yeah. Right? Like, you know, the bottom and the top were kind of equal, right? And the top was a little better for sure. But in one and two, actually in one and two, the bottom was better, and three and four the top was better, which is historically what we see there

as the PJ1 starts to wear. So everything looked pretty normal going into nothing. trust me, I'm involved in behind the scenes on this conversation. Nothing that we saw Friday and Saturday. Thursday and Friday gave reason for a Saturday morning phone call. And I can tell you most Saturday mornings with PJ 1, there's a phone conversation. There was none this weekend. So nothing going into the race said we need to do something different.

Yeah, Tommy, one of the things that came out of this race, Danny loses a wheel, tire falls off. Some of his crew guys are going to get to spend. What does that mean for them moving forward? Man, it just, I think it puts a little bit more pressure on them, right? Because the normalcy of what they have going on is it changes now. You know, I looked at the resetting points. Nobody's safe again, right?

I mean, there's a pile of guys within one, two points. So Denny's only 26 up. So I don't know, man. I think that was a huge turn of events for them. With a roll coming up. Yes. And Denny has been vocal about he feels like he's better off, not dedicating time to road courses, dedicating it to other things.

A third of this is rochorse. So will that strategy work out? And, you know, you got to, if you know you're going to go to the Roval, giving up points, then you damn well better bank them in these first two races. And pit crews matter. A lot. Track position, New Hampshire is going to matter. Absolutely.

Yeah, you look at his, look at his Darlington race. I thought he was one of the best cars. He had one bad pit stop, but you never saw him again. You know, it was just, that was just. It's going to change, change the philosophy a little bit, to be honest with you. It's tough, man. That's, the backups are good, but the backups. And does Ty Gibbs get hurt because of it?

Yeah. Because I'm sorry, if I'm Joe Gibbs, I'm saying, okay, if I've lost people on this team, I got a pretty damn good pit crew on Ty Gibbs car. sorry, Ty, you might, you know what I mean? Like, they're going to have some decisions that they have to make. And I hate that for Ty, but that's just how it is. That's how the sport works. And that's how it should work.

And speaking of Ty, I mean, of course, he makes the mistake coming to Pit Road. Mrs. Pet Road probably cost himself a chance of the win. But he had probably his, maybe his best cup race ever. You know, he was super fast, managed the race pretty well. I was one time, when we first started having problems, you know, we tank. I said, that was funny because I said, I think the 16 was the first one to shit to bed and I was like

oh 16's got a problem then somebody else and I said hey let me know is this tires like as I said that I go hang on boys we got a problem like we're now we're tanking and then we had to come to pit road but then so we all cycle through we all pit and then Ty

team was like Bubba run 1720s or something like that like just just get us 50 laps at 1720s and we'll see where this goes and Ty is fucking hauling ass around the top and I was like, well, just let him go. Like, he's not, he's going to be burned up, but he didn't. Like, he made that whole run last.

And I was impressed, but I thought he just did a really, really good job the other night. Yeah, it was good. It was, uh, I think he learned a lot. Um, but again, it's kind of like nobody's complaining about you guys having a backup times, right? Like Speedway or fuel mileage. Yeah.

What's the difference between fuel mileage and tire management? Nothing. Yeah. Right? But it was all part of the strategy and what, you know, everybody needed to do. Some guys chose. chose to go hard. Some guys just chose to maintain the same speed the whole run. Some guys chose to start off slow and go hard. And that's as well your comers and goes. And Jeff

talking a lot on TV about everything. How much, like I feel like that for in a, in a purest form of racing, how much do you enjoy races like that where you know you got to manage your stuff and you can't just run balls to the wall and you got to have something left at the other room? Well, if you look at, from a personal standpoint, if you look at my career, if you look at the races I won, they were typically races that were challenging races. So I liked it. I like the fact that we're going to, we go into it with a plan and then you pull the pin and through everything's different.

I like that because I think that's when drivers, crew chiefs, engineers, spotters, crew members, when you put them in a moment where they have to change what they're doing, that's when it's fun for us. For me as a competitor and for me as a spectator, Like, I enjoy chaos in sports. I like it when somebody that shouldn't win the game has a chance. Because now you see the other team, the team that's supposed to win, you see them get tight, oh, hell, why are we in this situation?

That's what sports are about. So I like chaos. I enjoy it because I think it brings the best out in people and the worst. Yeah. It brings the best and the worst. And I like challenging situations for athletes. I just think that that is, that's what sports are about. And so I'm good with it.

It's hard to explain all of it in my current role. You know, it's hard to explain to the fans everything that's going on because there's no way on a Saturday night. It's impossible to explain everybody's situation. That's good. That was good thing. It's just a lot of shit going on. So much going on.

Hey, it's Dale Jr. And for the latest DBC gear, we need you to go to shop. Dot dirtymomedia.com. We've got plenty of options, and we're adding new stuff all the time. Shop. Dot dirtymo.media.com. Spot on.

Spot on. Did you want to go first? I think he's a whiny bit. That's what I think. Send it. Why me? Chase Elliott says, if you give these teams

the opportunity to set these cars up knowing they'll be tire wear, I think you could probably see an entirely different race. So let's not blame the tires just yet. Spot on, spot off, Tommy. I think it's spot on. Yeah.

Yeah. I don't know what else we could do. I don't think it was over-cambor issue. I don't think it was an air pressure issue, which is normally the reasons why we have, wait, this wasn't a tire failure, right? This is a tire-aware, then goes to the cords, and the cord breaks, and it starts unraveling. Tire failure is when we are over-cambored, we're heating the inside of the tire too much, starts the blister, and it pops, and you hit the wall, right?

Air pressure. You start too low, you go out, you run hard, it hurts the sun, Sidewall, same type of situation. Tire blows. That's a tire. That's a team thing. This wasn't an issue that we were having because of, for those reasons. So I don't really know what else, I don't know, maybe less down for us, right? Maybe we go to the other, the short track package because we. Why don't we run the short track package again?

It's coming. But, you know, it's coming. But, you know, maybe that contributed a lot to it. who's going to say that once we do that, we won't have the issue again. We're going to have a boring race. We don't know. So, yeah, I don't know.

What was funny with Chase, and I'm going to go off a little topic, you know, he's getting interviewed. He didn't even know if he was in and out of playoffs. He's getting ready to go home. He's like, yeah, well, I'm done. And I forget, I think Park was Parker. Somebody was, no, you're not.

I'm not. He's getting ready to leave. He's like, well, I guess I'll stay around and wait. That was fascinating. I said this. I said, I said, I looked at Steve and we, we, you know, we can push a button and talk just amongst ourselves, which that's what should be televised. Always. We would probably lose our jobs. But, but, yeah, I looked at Steve and I pushed a button. I said, how in the hell can he not know? Right. That shocked me that he didn't know. But it shows you the different approaches of drivers. Like, he just comes in, he's going to do his job and leave. And, and, like, I don't need, I don't need to know all that stuff. I'm just going to go do the best I can and whatever happens happens. That's his mentality. Don't you get knowing what's going on and what around you and the cars you're racing and what you got to? Or you just think he just like, I'm going to go out and finish the best I possibly can.

That's his mentality. Yeah. Yeah. And it's worked pretty well, right? So, I mean, it shows you how different. I think he trusts his team, right? Y'all got all that. I'm going to go pay attention to this.

Go and drive the race car. But yeah, he was like, I'm out. I'm going. Yeah, I'm out, right? I'm done, right? No, you're not. Oh, I'm not? I think it's safe to say, Jeff, you know, leading up to.

the race. I know from my side of our team, and I'm sure you talked to multiple crew chiefs, nobody saw this coming. Right? I mean, I saw Mike Kelly, old magic Mike had a good quote. He's like, if somebody told you they saw this coming, they're foolish shit. It was, it was just something that you never, like, we're running, I mean, we're running max speed, hard as we can, the first

25, 30 laps, whatever was. And it was like, oh shit. It was based off Friday's practice, right? But the tire data did show there was going to be a possible issue. There was going to be a possible issue. It just didn't show up on Friday. which made people go, all right, let's go run.

I do think the difference between this one and the spring race when it happened was that everyone had that experience. Yeah, last spring race. And it was, crew chiefs never forget anything, right? So the minute that they saw the first car, the 16 car had the issue, AJ, immediately all the work that they did in the weeks prior to it about this tire could be an issue immediately popped in their heads. And then immediately, oh, hell, we dealt with this over a year ago. What do we do? Like, you saw it immediately. They had, they were planned, they were ready.

So even in the chaos, because they had happened before and because it was, they had put it in the back of their brain, but it immediately came to the front. What do we do? And it was, it was, that was fun to listen to radio communications. The drivers immediately went, okay, here we are. We did this in the spring. How did I? And that was part of, that was part of Ty Gibbs.

Because if you think about that spring race, the Toyota's the Gibbs cars, they were able to go. and run longer faster than everybody else. So I think Ty gives confidence that they could do that is what you saw early in the race. That they did it over a year ago. We can do it again. It was more communication from me to Charles this week, our crew chief, about, like, what do you want here?

You know, like, we're coming, we come out of the pit. I'm like, are we running hard? Are we, are we now, what's our plan? So our plan is going to be, right, run 17 flat. All right, well, what if the guy behind me wants to run 1650? Like, are my, am I defending this guy? not defending this guy. There was just so many different things going on on both my channels.

I'm talking to the box, try to talk to talk to Bubba, like try to relay to Bubba what our goal is here. You finally earned you pay a little. I was getting ready to say he earned that bonus this week. No bonus. He's an open team. He doesn't get no bonus. Were you in the recliners up there?

I was not in the recliner. So just so you know, I don't know, maybe every third race or half the races, I go up and sit around and bullshit with these guys for a little bit. because it's kind of like going to the hairdress. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. You're going to sit down,

and that's where you're going to hear all the crap, right? And I know Carson's honest about getting to the next thing. No, no. No, no. But, so I'd like to go up there and get all the bullshit. Scuttle butt. Right, right. So, no.

What did you just say? Scuttle butt. So, and they're all fun. It's fun to hang out. So at Bristol, there's these, there's these chained-off areas, right? And one of them has four. recliners. Like old, if you can imagine the recliner that your grandfather would sit in, old brown leather, like this wine, there's four of them. Pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, sitting up there. And I'm like,

what in the hell are these, right? And I realized they need a break like halfway through and they go get in the refiner. Second stage, I go over there and chill out. Yeah, he actually, you were up there yesterday. We kind of had a cool moment on the roof yesterday. Steve Barkdall was there. So we came up. Yeah, he came up and we kind of had a little moment with him. Obviously, he just lost his dad, and he's going through some other tough times, unfortunately, with his brother. So, like, it was good to see him for one, and then we got to, you know, give him a card with everybody signed it. It was, but it was really good to see Stevie come and hang out with us a little bit yesterday.

But, yeah, that happened before the race, too. I think it was fun. Yeah, it's fun to see that. It's, you know, as much as we fight and argue and get pissed off at each other and scream at each other, there's no garage that's more compassionate, you know, no group of people that are more compassionate. That was, that was cool to see. I can't believe people willingly go out there and hang out with you,

Freddie? Believe it or not, we're fun sometimes. Connor Zillich and Justin Algar's pit strategy cost them a shot at the win in the Xfinity race. Spot on, spot off, Fred. I mean, I'm spot on. It costs them a shot to win the race. I didn't really, you know, I don't,

Justin was the one that kind of really puzzled me because we talked about for ourselves getting through the first round of the Cup series playoffs was just take your base hits. If we just don't have any mistakes, we execute well, nothing goes wrong, we're going move on to the next round. Like that's, that's all we have to do.

We ran really well, obviously. But I feel like Justin and Connor can do this. Just take their, like, nice, easy days and get to Phoenix. I don't know why you're coming down pit road and putting yourself at the back of the pack with 80 something, whatever there was. Like, they pit early, right? Justin was just. Justin had, if the car was better, Justin would have want, when Justin, that group pitted. Yeah. Justin's guys made the right call. it was...

The way it turned out, they made the right call. But I don't understand why you're putting yourself in that position. They weren't very good. Yeah, but that's what? They were going to run top five. Stay fifth. Don't put yourself at the back of the pack where you can get ripped by somebody else's mistake. They weren't going to run in top five if they stayed out and those other guys pitted because they would have went by him because the seven car, they were struggling.

And so the 88 was struggling a little bit too. But the seven car wasn't as good as he was in the beginning of it or eight. So I think the 7 car probably in that situation, hoping for another caution, probably made the best choice, but the car just wasn't fast enough. I think they would have been – because the double zero pitted when Connor pitted, and he almost – he caught the leader. But the 88 was just too loose at the end. I'm still – like, if I'm the 88, I know it's hard playing Monday morning quarterback,

but he had a buffer, right? He had those guys that are – And he had probably some guys that were going to be behind him that were in points that weren't going to pit as well and take a gamble. And you knew the 19 was going to do the opposite of that. So he was probably, again, being the leader, and you know that, Jeff, being the leader is the hardest pit called to make at that point of the race. But to know you had a buffer, do you know, to watch the guys that pitted 30 laps, 40 laps before that didn't really make a charge? that was probably the call that irks me, you know, that would irk me the most was the 88. But they were way, you know, they did make change adjustments during that pit stop to help it, and they got worse.

So I think seven maybe was probably a good call because the double zero was right with 30 to go and almost caught him. Now if the seven had that many more laps, I think he would have passed him, but he just, the car wasn't good enough. The moment in that race was the wreck off turn four. Yeah. So if you go back and watch that wreck, who was involved in that wreck, and who lost and gained track position with what happened off turn four, that helped some of those guys that pitted, and it hurt some of those guys that pitted. And then think about how they lined up after that restart. Yeah.

So that was the moment that kind of shuffled up some of those strategies. And, you know, I don't know. I mean, Connor had a terrible night. finished fifth. I know. That sucks. Yeah. Ruined his day.

What a guy's awful. I know who's happy is his parents because on Saturday, Sundays and Mondays, we have to go all go over there. And then if Luke wins and Brent wins, it's a mess. The best thing happened was him not winning because that kid didn't need to be anywhere near a fucking sword. Like, let's be honest. Also true.

Like, we don't need, like, he did not need to win that. race. He's had enough problems. Keep him away from all kinds of stuff. We don't need to be anywhere near. But Jeff, the one thing I do when I ask you, like, you're leading to race. I'm sure this has happened throughout your career. Not enough. But you know, your crew chief makes a call.

Obviously, like Tommy said, it's a no-win situation, really, because you know the guys behind you are probably going to do the opposite. But how, what is that feeling like when you peel off the pit road and you look in your mirror and you see the next three or four guys all stay out behind you, whatever? Yeah, it is, it is a bad situation. I mean, I've done, I've been on both sides of it. Oh, yeah, you have. Some of the bitch is stayed out.

Southern 500. We pitted and the rain happens. Yeah, you stay out, right? You stay out and everybody pits or you pit. And, I mean, I've been on both sides of it. You look, all you can do is make your best guess. And you try to, I feel bad for cruise chiefs in that situation because, especially in the Xfinity series, because you have a group of cars.

And, unfortunately, they don't have the funding that the top cars have. You cannot understand what their strategy is because they're living in a different world. than you're living. In Cup, you know, everybody's there to, I don't want to say everybody's there to win the race on a particular weekend, but their mentality is different. But in Exfinity, if a team that normally runs 25th can claw out a six or seven, that's a win. And so you can't understand what their strategy is. So it's, I think in many ways it's harder over there, even though less tired sometimes makes it easier.

But you just, all the crew chief can do is make the best decision he can make, and you just got to live with it. I'll tell you the one strategy call, just changing topics a little bit, that I could not stand this week. And I got to call our old buddy Bruce Cook about this, leaving that butcher kid out in the lead, older tires. Like Tommy, you know this as well as anybody because you're going through it. That kid is there to get approved for future races. And you're putting him in a position that he does not need to be in where he's on old tires,

leading a race, first restart. Now he's middle of three bouncing off a shit all the way through the field. Like that was a call for me, Jeff, this week that I was, I didn't, for one, didn't understand why they stayed out why they put him in that position just let them have a clean day get through the race and then he takes the bottom on the restart and i was like i don't know what the hell is going on here so cole was i mean he was right he did a good job and he should be approved for anything because it gets a really really talented race car driver but like he was kind of just like to have i think he had just got the lucky dog pitted on that lucky dog then we had a caution i don't know 15 20 laps later whatever it was he's the only one to stay out so he's leading we all put tires on and now he is in the way on the restart it's just it seemed to me like a position that you didn't need to put that guy in in that situation. I get it. Like sometimes you like we saw Brad do it last week at Gateway. We're staying out just trying to make something happen.

But the goal for that kid that day was nobody to even know you're here, get approved for the next race. And I thought that was a poor decision on somebody's part. Yeah, those are tough. Young drivers, you know, the best thing to do, in my opinion, young drivers has put them in the best position to succeed. And what does that mean? And maybe they feel like they gave him some experience that he can, like, you can, You never know, you never know. There's no experience swat and flies.

It's very hard. He did not have fun. They're faster than me. He had about the worst three laps you could have a bristol. Rough. According to Adam Stern, some senior team executives came away from a meeting with NASCAR last week with a feeling the playoff format will likely change for 2026. Jeff?

Yeah, he knows. Can you talk about it? Are you allowed? Come on, Jeff. Obviously, there's a lot of talk, right, about what, what? you know, what should the playoff look like? Should there be a playoff? You know, there's a lot of talk about that,

and there's a lot of opinions about it. And I do think that the biggest pressure with the playoffs is one race. Is that where we should be, right? And, you know, some people want to go back to 36 races. Some people want to go back to the chase. Some people, you know, it's all over the place. But NASCAR's got a decision to make that, you know, what do you want NASCAR to be?

Like, what is, what is NASCAR to be? Like, what is NASCAR? What are we? And the point system needs to, needs to, you know, reflect that. But, you know, clearly I think there's energy around changing the one race. You know, and I don't believe a decision has been made, but there's a lot of decision around that, a lot of energy around that. My mentality, and this is probably wrong, my mentality is just, for example, when the COT came out, the COT, you know, biggest piece of shit ever in the history of mankind, I just thought it was a race car. I didn't give a damn. Like, there was somebody that was going to give you a damn trophy.

Go get it. Like, I didn't care what the car was. And I was talking to all these drivers, and they'll go back and they say, man, those cars in 20, 20, the car in 201, that was the best car ever. I'm like, I don't even remember what the hell it was. Like, what are you talking about? To me, whatever the rules are, whatever the car is, whatever the point situation is, go be the best. Like, I never really gave a damn what it was. I just wanted to go figure a way to try to win it, whatever that was.

So I'm not the guy to talk to about the point thing because I just believe whatever the points are and whoever does it the best is a champion, period, end the story. Nobody, and I don't understand the argument. I know motorsports is different. I get it. There are a lot of things that are different about it. But if you want to crown the best team throughout the whole year, there are a lot of Super Bowl champions that wouldn't be the champions. And nobody says, well, they're not the deserving champions. So that argument I don't understand.

I think the fact that in motorsports, there's a core audience that says, I don't like the playoffs because it's different. It's not necessarily that it's wrong. It's just that it's different. And I think that – and by the way, we should listen to them, right? We shouldn't ignore them. We shouldn't say, well, you're wrong. They feel that way for a reason. So we should listen to them and understand why they think that.

NASCAR's got a decision they have to make, and they're going to make it. And whoever wins a championship, whatever the rules are, that's the deserving champion. He pisses me off when somebody says, Joy Legondo didn't win the championship. Bullshit, they won a championship. There was a set of rules, and they went out and did it better everybody else. You may not like that they won a championship. I get it. I understand that.

But don't take the credit away from them from what they did. And by the way, Matt Kenseth won the championship when he won one race. And Benny Parsons won the championship when he finished in the lead lap one time. He won that championship, too. I don't want to hear that. It's bullshit. And you may not like it, but that's how they crown the champion. And you shouldn't be disrespectful for the people that win it.

The thing that's really bothering me is my buddy Mark Martin. Now he's sitting on a bench, reflecting, looking at water and stuff. You see his tweet, whatever it was. I mean, it's really bothering him. He's getting out of his element. He's sitting. He's got to be Zen. You know, a credit to Mark, the one thing I will say about Mark is he's advocating.

Oh, he's at Bentley's right now. It's a Bentley Saloon right now up there. He's advocating for a point system that he never benefited from. Because I think if we had this system now in place when Mark was racing, like in the heyday of the Routhth days, he'd probably be a multi-time champion, you know, because he would go out and win the last. He was nobody faster sometimes. I don't know.

But, you know, for me, like Jordan kind of leaked this last week when you weren't here on this show. I heard. And people just were up in arms about the 36 race season. And I, because I had told them like, just like, right, it's not happening. It's not going to happen, especially. I don't think TV doesn't want it. Like, TV wants these moments, I think.

Hold on a second. I hear that all the time. And I want to be clear about something. You want to. And I'm in these meetings. TV doesn't make these decisions. Yeah. Okay?

NASCAR makes these decisions. And NASCAR takes all the information from all the people that they can take it from. and they make a decision. TV is not, when this format that we are currently racing under was created, I was in every damn meeting. TV didn't make this decision. They had a seat at the table, as did drivers,

as did car owners, as did NASCAR, as did, I mean, the tracks. Everybody was in this room, and it was a great discussion. It was a great disagreements. everything we should be doing in this country was happening, right? And we had disagreements, but it was all respectful. It was all, and NASCAR made the decision. And TV didn't say, here's your format. This is what we're doing.

That's not how that happened. Right. Yeah. And the fact that people think that's how it happened, I don't know where that's coming from, right? TV deserves a seat at the table. Yeah. The drivers deserve a seat at the table.

Carlers deserve a seat at the table. Sponsors deserve a seat at the table. The fans deserve a seat at the table. But I'm in the meetings. And if anyone thinks that TV wrote a prescription, here's how you're going to do this, that's bullshit. It's such a misrepresentation of how this happened. I'm not saying they don't have a voice because they do have a voice.

They should have a voice. But they didn't make this. They didn't make this. Yeah. This was a collaborative effort from many different places all in this industry that created this. It was not television on their own saying this is what we should do. They do dictate some things, though. They do dictate our schedule, right?

They do dictate sometimes the tracks that they want to run during their, you know, there's a lot of discussion on, you know, there's reasons why dates are getting changed. right? But that is not, there are not many occasions where a network goes and says, we're running this race on this date. No. Is it, is it? Now, is there a collaboration between NASCAR, the tracks, and television in regard to all the things that factor into making the race happen when it should happen? Of course. Of course. But, but I don't, that certainly NASCAR, I mean, and television has a role to play in decisions that are being made. Can you tell them next year to make the modified race?

I think at a lower level than people would imagine. Would it be fair to say TV prefers a playoff system versus the 36 race schedule? I mean 36 race. That's a good question. I don't know. I don't know. I think that there are certainly some people and look, TV is. saying TV is the same thing as saying the drivers, right?

I would imagine if you've got all four TV representatives in a room, they wouldn't agree on what they wanted, right? I would imagine that would be the case, but I don't know that. I think that probably, probably there's a... Mark's tweet, oh, my God. It's really bothering him. Look, man, he's fashionate. And when he gets on something, he's on it.

I don't care if it's cleaning the wheels on the motor on. or like when he's on it, he's on it. And there's no half mark. There's no half mark. But I would say this. I would say that what television wants is they want, they honestly, from day one, when I started working in the industry, they want grandstands full. They want a great at-track experience for the fans.

They want a TV broadcast and races that are fun to watch, fun to Saturday night was a great example and and you know that that's what they want and I would say that that as far as do they want a playoff or not I would imagine look most people I talk to if they are by themselves not with a group of friends or whatever most people by far like the playoffs away from their buddies. When they get in a pack, then they'll be like, whatever he said. But when you get away and you say, hey, man, like most people, and it's not even close, like the playoffs, a version of the playoffs. So like I've talked about, you agree with that? Yes, I agree.

I've talked about it on here before. I think what we have now, the format this season is the most entertaining because you have your game seven moment when we get to Phoenix. It's four guys head to head. As somebody that grew up in the sport, my dad raised for I personally would want a full season format. But I know that there's got to be a balance somewhere. And I think this is a good compromiser where you don't have a one race playoff. You have a four race playoff. Now, by the way, we're going to go to basically every damn racetrack.

We got, you know, I think it's a mile oval, Talladega, Martinsville, and then Homestead. We hit all, we hit all different racetracks in this, if this is what happens, if we go to a four race round, I think it's going to be, the rumors I've heard. six drivers probably. So now you're also guaranteeing the top three in points through that second round are going to make it. You're going to maybe have three winners, but then the top three in the points, you're going to have more guys making it based on overall for that round. But this just seems to me like such a good compromise and so many people who were just going nuts last week. I want 36 races.

Everybody's going to go nuts no matter what the decision you make. Just do it and let's go have some fun. Let's go race. Why do we spend in this industry? why do we send so much time on the negative? I don't understand it. Misery loves company. I don't get it, man.

I don't understand it. I get that somebody may not like something. Man, that's, you know what? Your opinion is your opinion. We should respect their opinion, right? But I don't understand why they're constant negative. It seems like we just try to pull the negative out of something, right? But look.

It's kind of the whole world. I know. It's not just us. It's nuts. It's just our bubble, but it's the whole world. So what don't you like about the playoffs, right? So let's think about it. Like, if a decision is made to stick with the playoffs,

I think generally what people didn't like was that Martin Truex didn't make the playoffs when he finished fourth and points, yeah. Right? Like, if you have that good a regular season, you probably should have a chance to win a championship, right? So how do you fix that? some people don't like the win in your end thing I personally like it and it has nothing to do

has nothing to do with Harrison winning a race has nothing to freaking do with it if Harrison would have if someone would have won and they almost did and knocked him out of the playoffs this year you know what you should have won yeah right but if you have a regular season if you have a really strong regular season

you should you should have a chance to get into playoffs so how do you keep the win and you're in but also protect those people that have really good solid years, and how do you in the playoffs, if fans don't like the fact that Kyle Larson didn't have a chance to win a championship, how do you reward him enough points

to make sure that his regular season protects him a little more? Is that something we should look at? So what don't we like? And address those issues and try to make, if you're going to keep the playoff, try to make that better. I think that's the approach. And clearly, that would be the approach I would take.

And clearly the one race thing is controversial, right? So can you add races? How many do you add? What races? I think that if you're going to have races, if it's a five or six or ten or four or three, they should be representative of the regular season, right? You shouldn't have too many of something.

But if you're going to have a super speedway, a road course, a short track, and intermediate, perfect. Yeah. Good with that. And if you look the way it's set up now, those three, every three races, how jumbled it gets, right? I do feel that the leader of all years should, like, how it resets, right?

So if those four races are going to be the playoffs, they should go in the way we are setting up right now. So the guy that deserves to be ahead enough still has the best chance to win the championship. Now, if he fails twice and that fourth, if six-place guy, whoever they pick, capitalizes on that, well, now we've got a conversation, right? Now you've got a guy that person like Denny's up 26, and, you know, if you look, Prisco would be six, right, going and thing, he's only 16 behind Denny, right? So now all of a sudden, it's a really close championship battle with four races remaining. You know, just let them race from that point on.

Let's keep doing the same things we're doing all year, you know, the stages, the fastest lap, all the things. Throw all that shit in there and make the teams part of it, right? Make the teams the thought process and everything that has to do. I don't like one race because it ruins the consistency for the race team that should have capitalized on winning the championship. You know, the guy that ran the best all year that collected the most points, he should be going into the championship with that points lead or that, you know, like Denny is, you know, at this point. Corey Heim's a good example.

Yes, yes, he should deserve it, right? So, you know, I do think it needs to be changed. However, whatever gets changed, it's still going to be fun to watch. So everybody remain calm, let NASCAR make their decisions, and let's go do it. So stage racing is a really good example, right? So the argument against stage racing fascinates me. You'll have a group of people that say, well, stage racing is just given something for nothing. What the hell?

That makes no sense whatsoever. Like you literally, we literally are saying, like that point system says, the better you do during the race, the more points you're going to earn. if I said to you philosophically we're going to pay you more points for how you run during the race

reward the people that are doing the best do you like that do you like rewarding people I would say 95% of people would do hell yeah right and then stage racing sucks the same people that say stage race and sucks say they want a 36 regular so think about this

so that's why we got Mark on the best look at the poor guy 36 races, right? We want how you do through the whole year to matter. But that same person will say they don't want it to matter during the race. Yeah, yeah. Let's just do it.

Let's go do it. The fact that it's different is what they don't like to do that. So I'm all four-stage race, and it gives two commercial breaks that you don't have to go away from Green Flag Racing. Remember that. And that's something you always want to bitch about, too. Right. The number of commercials. So it gives two commercial breaks that you don't.

miss anything and it rewards the people for doing well during during the freaking rate what is I don't understand how you don't think that's a good thing I don't get it there's there's I see that all the time I respect you if you don't like it I don't not saying you're stupid I'm not saying I just don't understand it's like you made a great point earlier about you know like especially social media which we have we have to engage on social media for the show and stuff but it's it's it's like you you see people and it's like they're rooting for us to fail and I'm like I love this sport like I get on here and I get shit from NASCAR sometimes about being too critical or something. And I said, I've went in the meetings with them guys. And I said, listen, the only reason I'm passionate, I love the sport. Like I'm calling you out because I think what I'm saying is right. And I think this makes it better or I want it to be the best it can be. Like, I'm not going to sit here and go, I think this is awful. Like, like, you're, but on you see social media and they're, you know, the TV ratings were down last week or whatever. And it's just like, ha, I told you so. And I'm like, that's not good. We don't want this. You know, like, I get it. Like, but like we need to all figure out a way to lift it up, not just.

Just tear it down. Because it's easy for people to complain then to be positive. And it's behind, you know, from a keyboard. Or come up with a solution. If you have a complaint and don't like something, you should say it. But you should explain why. Yeah. Like, why do you really feel?

And have a solution. Right? You really feel the way you feel. There's nothing wrong with Pat. There's nothing wrong with Mark Martin saying, I won't. I think, look at him. I think this got something going on right there. Maybe we should call him check on him.

Yeah. Later, because he's at Bentley's. I can shoot him in Texas. All right, it's time for reaction theater where fans can call in and voice their opinions from this weekend's race. Yeah, that fucking num chuck, non-driving num chuck, just freaking ruin the damn night. I swear I was having a great one, damn cars tour put on a show, and damn numtruck just happened to fuck it up for all the chase sexuals. What the piss. Tommy calls Nemichick Numbchuk.

I called his old man that. I guess he wrecked. I didn't see. I know, I know Chase wrecked, obviously. But was somebody had told me, the radio sounded like it was chain reaction. That was, that was a Bristol, get to the bottom wreck. Chase was trying to get to the bottom, fill the hole, came down pretty aggressively.

Nimichick did get slowed up. And then. Yeah, that was. I mean, they got running into from behind. It wasn't. Little numchew. They were both going for the same piece of real. First of all.

There's certain people that you know if you're going to do that, they're not going to lift. That's one of them. He's one of them. You don't do that to hand. You don't do it to host of R. You don't go to Ross. He's not going to go, okay, I'm going to pass you later. No, I'm going to get you out of the way.

You're going to be done for the day. Yeah. That line. That's a fucking TJ up there with his eye makeup and cool that should have told him to hit him a little fucking harder. Man, come on, Brad. That was a weird deal because, like, he hit him square. He hit him square. But it was almost like he hurt himself kind of.

Like he overcharged the corner where he wasn't going to be able to make the corner either. But like I felt like when I saw, you see him come off the wall and I'm like, oh, he's got him lined up. And then they really never, they didn't really move. It was kind of a, I mean, they went up to hill a little bit, but. It's kind of weird. Like with this car where you hit them matters, right? And so like at Martinsville, that was probably the right place to hit him. But at Bristol, you needed to get a little further in the corner.

I don't know. Don't ask me. I didn't know how to hit anybody in moving right away. I think I think Brad hit him and go, okay, what's he going to do? You know, is he going to slide a track? Am I going to go underneath him? Is he going to go? I think.

It's like Brad hit him, but then followed him up. Well, I think he was waiting for the reaction of the 20 car, what to do, and he slowed up and then it was over. I mean, look, if you think about it, Brad don't do that much, right? So maybe he just didn't know what to do because he's not that type of race car driver, right? My wife always tell me, every time you try to wreck somebody, you wreck yourself. Yeah. Just quit trying. Yeah.

Because I don't know how to do it. Yeah. You, Tommy, I understand that this France family reunion is more important than BBC, but you can't even send in your BBC picks. You'll be getting your ass handed to you the whole year by these random people that Freddy's calling at 2 a.m. What's next? You're going to leave a lung nut off, and when an after tries to penalize you, you're going to make them throw a caution and hope they can't count five?

Like, come on. To my defense, that was the beginning of the rule. I did try. And I did try calling in. Yeah, he did. Yeah, timing is not going to work. But yes How was the reunion?

It was good. Yeah, my text, I wasn't saying I missed you. I was just asking how your family reunion was. I didn't say you said. You said, is that your way? I was saying you missed me. And you said no.

Do you brought some awesome tires. Do you brought some soft-ass tires? Do you brought some soft-ass? Oh, at Bristol, baby. We haven't had a song in a while. Big Dors fan, apparently. It was good. I didn't know you could see. Yeah, honestly, that was me last night

on the way home from the bar. Wait, really? No. Oh. Yes. Damn. Damn. That was better. We still could do better, I think. But there was some originality. We didn't have I didn't hear a single thing about a toaster. We didn't have a toaster or rowdy nation this week. I mean, still, Rowdy Nation, their poor

which they had a, well, I don't think anybody's even knows he racing lately, do they? I don't think they didn't spend out this week. That's a start. Yeah. I mean, poor Derek was standing next to me last week, and he's like I don't even know what to think anymore. Like, I just want, like, are we going to spin out again? Like, what lap we're going to spin out?

And they spun out. I go, hey, it's lap 26. You spun out of it. Oh, to leave an audio message 24-7. You can call our number at 704-802-9-7-2-9. And we'll play the best ones each week on the show. AskDBC. You can sit in your questions on X using hashtag AskDBC.

Mr. Excitement 9 wants to know who everybody's next four drivers are to be eliminated in the round of 12. What do you think? I'm good with it staying the same. How do you feel, Freddie? I mean, you guys worked your asses off those three races got so far ahead. Now you're only plus one. Yeah, Bubba did an interview the other day

and he was talking about the playoff format. He said a lot of the same stuff that Jeff said, like, I don't care. Like whatever format they put out in front of me, I'm going out to win every damn race I can win. If that's how it works out, that's how it works out. But he's the same thing, basically, I don't care. But he did say, he's like, man, I wish now that I'm up 50,

I didn't have to reset points next week. But yeah, I mean, it's the same approach for us. We just go out and run the best we can. I think we have all the potential in the world to transfer again out of this round. That's not what they asked. They ask who your next floor out are. Tommy asked me a question. I don't know if you were listening.

I wasn't. I was waiting for you to answer this question. For this one, I think, yeah, I'd like to see Reddick get in, but they are just missing a little something the second half of the year. I don't know what it is. Money. Money. I'm not getting that person.

Open team. You know, somebody in the top eight is going to have a problem. I hope it's not us. One of these guys, somebody's going to run into the issue somewhere. What we got? We have Loudon, Kansas Roval, right? So Loudon's a good track for us.

Kansas is a good track for us. So hopefully, and then he's run better on road courses. So we could just hopefully base hit our way back through another round. But I'd say probably the bottom four will stay the same. Lugano could easily pop off a win somewhere. So it's hard to say that. But I'll take the bottom four right now. And it's tough because, you know, Austin's good at the Roval, right?

And he's a good Rosecourse racer. He's New Hampshire Package. I think he's good. Reddick's really good at Kansas. Yeah. And Joey's, like you said, I mean, the next two is going to be strong. And I mean, if you look at it, who's weak? Yeah.

Who's weak out of those 12 guys at any, you know, the Roval is going to be the key? Because I think the first two races are going to close this. gap up to a point there's going to be eight guys. I'm going to call it right now. There's going to be eight guys going to have a chance to go home. Jeff, how is that, like, to set up? I know you guys do a great job about it on TV, but talk about the roval especially. We get there.

There's going to be a lot of different strategies. Guys are going to be flipping the stage to try to win the race. There's going to be guys chasing stage points. How do you guys set that up on television? It's pretty easy to cover. I mean, honestly, like, you know, but you are focusing on the, you know, you are focusing on the, you know, guys and who's trying to get points and who's not through that guys that aren't in the playoffs use that as an opportunity to try to get a win which they should you know we just cover that but

you know I think the other thing is we've been talking about tires all morning there's a new tire in New Hampshire like a completely different tires so at the tire test there everybody said Ligano was absolutely flying oh great I will I will preface that with and I don't know how many times Tommy's had this situation or this occurrence there's been many tire tests I went to and I was absolutely horrible, went back and had a great run, and vice versa. Yep. Like, we're going to kick their ass and go out and run 15th. So I caution a little bit, tire testing, because when you get there, the weather's different rubber on racetrack,

and this weekend there's every kind of rubber you could imagine on the racetrack. I don't take that into as big of account, but, you know, Lugano was flying at the tire test, whatever that means. Interesting. You have to wreck him early. I'm not supposed to say that. Oh, sir. Yeah.

All right. What kind of shit shows did you guys see this week? Connor hitting the cameraman one last week with 40%. It may be the biggest shit show with a year. First of all, we have a clip that the announcer. But the one thing that I will tell you to watch, I will never ever, ever sign up to spot this race.

But watching it from a suite is maybe the most entertaining thing you can do. The fucking Arc race is like multi-class racing. Like it looks like, it looks like. Literally, the competitive archer guys are out there, and then it looks like you have let 10 guys from the Richard Petty driving experience go out and drive around the bottom. And the Richard Petty driving experience cars.

Not even the race cars. The first guy got lapped, completing lap three. That is unacceptable. Like, I get it. Like, you want to give everybody an opportunity. But, like, the guy, I think from first to last in qualifying was five seconds. What? At Bristol.

If you add it up, lap three, that's 15 seconds. What was the car store this weekend? Like four-tenths? Five-tenths? So, I mean, like, you just watch. But if you, they throw the green. And then the problem is you can't, my biggest issue is you can't really race because you can't pass anybody because there's always somebody in the way.

Like, it's just, and they did it. They finally, for the first time, maybe in the history of the series, park somebody for minimum speed because the guy was literally. One guy. One guy. That was five seconds off. Only one guy? They should have parked half the field.

I was like, why park him at this point? Like, why are we doing that? But I don't know. Did you get to watch that at all? Were you there for it? It was a shit show. It should be nominated as the shit show. It might be the shit show of the year.

But unfortunately, this, this track announcer losing his mind. This is good. Damn it. I think his name was Tommy Cook. I almost meant to call him because somebody gave me his contact info. I was going to have him call in. But go back. We'll obviously post this to our poll on the Dirty Moe Twitter handle.

I guess somebody flips over. Kevin Newton flips over. Throttle hangs. He kind of spins out, hits the wall. And the announcer is calling it in live time. And he's like, we got one flipped over, like expecting a yellow. And then he just berates the race control booth. Why are you not throwing the yellow?

Throw the red. Throw the red. He's screaming it, right? He's like trying to get him to throw the red. He's hot. You can tell he was almost like they must, they're probably in the booth next door. And it's like he's trying to yell. Exactly.

That's exactly what I could. Like he's banging on the glass. Oh, the freaking red. Oh, man. That one there is going to challenge our buddy Chris Wright, I think. That this announcer, no, the announcer. Did you see this video? I don't know if I sent it to you.

Oh, you did, but I can't get. I know. You don't have Twitter. He doesn't have social media. But you're much better off for not having it. But this guy, it's going to challenge Chris Wright for, for, for, shit show of the year probably what else cars to a wreck

I mean you guys had a hell of a wreck thank God Parker Eatman's okay yeah Parker Eatman flying through the air we could nominate that I look like Air Doug might have hung a left on somebody I don't know if he knew that guy was down there started a little bit before that yeah well 44 got out of shape in front of it yeah but you still can't go left when there's a guy next to

yeah but I think he was busy trying to hold on his ass too I mean Luke and I studied that a little bit he was kind of like I don't know whose fault that was maybe my and I don't It's not really a shit show, but it was funny. I laughed my ass off. Blaney's nephew, getting a hold of a radio, might be the top five.

We need to play that. We have the audio. Can we play that? Yeah, let's play. We have audio. Wait, that was... That was... That was...

So, I guess... Hold on, hold on. He's like, hold on. Hold on. It's the best at Ryan. You know how cool that is how he... How Ryan reacted, though. It's in the middle of the race.

Probably had three fucking tires shredded. He's so pissed off. And I bet you that put him in the best mood for the rest of the race. I talked to him yesterday because he was talking shit about me on the radio. And I called and I said, what's your problem? But I said, how hard were you laughing? And I said, I wish we had an in-car camera on you because I can't imagine you're just out there. I think it was under caution.

Yeah, it was. But, like, he just had there rolling around and you hear this little kid on the radio. Uncle Ryan. Can you imagine Harrison getting on the radio like, you know, years ago when you were racing? He wouldn't. He would not have liked it when I got to him. Yeah. You wouldn't have reacted like Ryan did.

No, I wouldn't have. I mean, he's a little kid. I mean, just... I told Fidois. I mean, you're getting replaced. What would happen if you would have done that when you were a little kid? They don't have radios when I was... Okay, but if...

But if... I want him to shut up now when I'm spotting for the kids. I didn't... I don't talk. I said, Dad, get off the radio. Stop. Don't even accuse me. I keep my mouth.

I let you do your job. Don't even start, bitch. You do, you do any better. Now, what you're saying outside. might be worried when you're standing behind somebody. No. No, I let everybody do their jobs. There's inside voices.

Yeah. There's inside voices. That's just... I learned from a buddy of ours to... Shut up. Jimmy, blew it. He's not happy when he's mad. He's mad.

Okay, so we got... So we got... The announcer. The Arca race in general as a whole. Blaney's nephew. That's not a shit show. That was, what? Little Blaney.

Yeah, but it's fun, Tommy. We're allowed to have fun. Yeah. I don't think there's anything else. Did you see any shit shows this week, Jeff? You have to be shit show. When I used to say shit show, it doesn't mean it has to be negative. I thought Saturday was a great shit show.

Like, I enjoyed it. A shit show in the best way. Give me some more. We do have a lot of those good-time shit show. Good point, Jeff. That'd have to always be bad. Some of the best moments of my life for shit shows. Yeah, good point.

Fair. All right. Let's add the cup race. Yeah, add the cup race. Cramp race, Racererer and Blaney's nephew. All right, you can go vote for the shit show Hall of Fame on our Twitter poll on who you want to see inducted into the Hall of Fame this week. DBC picks, Freddie, you finally won.

Hey, I'm back. Thank God. Tommy, we're tied now. I got to get up there. Tie you guys up so we split dinner at least. What page are we on top? Here we go. It's on this.

Is it flipped over over there? Is it over there? Just use that one until we find the other one. I will say publicly, Todd Gillen can kiss my ass. he was at the bar yesterday cheering for the Cowboys who beat my Giants and then just text me

how about them Cowboys So he just now he did Oh boy He's definitely on my list In the moment God he did he win any money off of you I know I don't know I was smart enough not to bet on the Giants

He may or may not have taken some of mine At the golf course last week Oh boy That's always tough Who did you know John Hunter Man I we give him shit on here During the reaction to there but like the last

run, man. I mean, they have been consistently running well. Obviously, this is kind of a shit show. He still ends up 14th, but I mean, they've just been super consistent, I feel like that.

I'm going to tell you somebody and this is going to sound silly because he's a multi-time champion. But if you had told me Joey Lugano was going to finish fifth this weekend, I'd have said, there's no way in hell. They were horrible in practice. They've been horrible there.

They haven't run there at all. I mean, it was shape enough to be a really crappy night. and somehow another Joey Lugano did Joe Ligano things. I had no idea he could finish fifth. Yeah. Like he was, I feel like he was,

when we were running third or fourth at the beginning of the race, I felt like he was going to be like one of the first three or four guys. He was a car away from getting lapped before tire issues. Yeah. He was struggling for sure. Who picks first? I don't know where I finish. You go first.

You go first, Tommy. Maybe you don't pick just because I know you got to call the race. So, I mean, you can pick if you want to, but maybe we'd just have Alex take the guest pick this week if you don't want to do it. Yeah, I would rather. I would rather do that. I can tell you. If I was going to pick, I would pick.

Can you text it to me really quick so that I, because I don't know who to pick? Yeah, I'll go to Lugano. Damn it. That's who I was going to pick. Shit. You want me to pick for a... Yeah, you go for the guest, Alex. The guest will do Bell.

You asshole. That was a good guest pick. You read Jeff's mind. Allegedly. Allegedly. I'm going to go... Fuck it. I guess Austin Cindric.

I don't... I don't know. Man, I can't believe nobody's going to pick the hometown boy. I'm going to pick him, I think. I don't know if I should. I would. I would. I'll take priests.

I thought Lugano was a hometown guy. I thought you'd already pick him. I thought he's a fuck right, priest. We're still not happy. You got to bet with your head and not what you're hard. He can still kiss my ass, but I'm going to pick him this week. Is he a hometown guy like Truex everywhere we go in the Northeast? That's their home track.

I would say that's their. Yeah, that's probably, especially as much as he raised the model. That's probably... Joey's not a hometown. He comes from Connecticut, but he's not... He didn't really grow up racing there. He didn't grow up racing there. I mean, he ran in Atlanta more than he did. Yeah.

I think he ran that Silver City or whatever, him, Ryan, together. That quarter of a quarter of a minute. They got out of there. And when he was four, so... Tommy, I did want to give you the opportunity. Obviously, Bill Davis passed away last week. You weren't here to talk about it. I know he won't...

I know he meant a lot to your career and had a big effect on you. Yeah, he's... He's been, unfortunately, he's been battling some stuff in the past couple years. And, yeah, he, I guess you say he went to a better place, man. And, you know, Gal, Bill and Gail were really tight. You know, they did a lot of things together. And hopefully she's got a good support group in Arkansas. And I still haven't heard anything if she's doing anything.

But, yeah, he gave me a shot. He believed in me and let me just go in there and pretty much tear the place. up and had my back and just said, you know, everyone would complain to him in the beginning, just said, I hired him for a reason because where we were, let him do his thing. We'll see where he ends up. And we put a great bunch of people together and made some magic there with Jeff's brother there and had some fun. Why were we doing it? And he got mad at me, got rid of me. Probably, I think that was the only time I was ever fired in my whole life and hired me back four years later. Double of pay. I loved it. Rebuilt it again. And that's when he

sold it. And actually, if he did not go out of business and sell anything, I wouldn't have had, TBR wouldn't have been in existence because I took advantage of all the stuff that was there, bought it on auction, made some wheel and dealings with, what did he call? What did he call? Totally borrowed racing. One of the coolest moments, I remember. about you award racing, I think it was New Hampshire. You guys were kicking everybody's ass. And you hit pit road before everybody

and blocked anybody from getting a pit road before you. And I went, my man is willing to gamble at all to win this freaking race. And that was badass. Because, you know, the leader normally is like, I'm not going to be the first one on pit road. And then he set themselves up for people jumping them with tires. And that was before we really understood all that.

We really weren't that good at it. But you drug him on pit road first, and I remember, you know, my man is committed to winning this race, and he don't mind losing it trying to win it, and that was badass. Yeah. It was there or Darlington, but I think it. Well, I did it. I did it, Darlington, too. It was us in 88.

I pitted a couple. I set the tone, right, which everybody does now, right? And then I played the strategy right at New Hampshire because it was probably the start of not wearing. Yes, yes. stuff. So I got us in position to take advantage. And I think the 17 was good, but he got a flat

and we got by him and that was it. Yeah. Speaking of Loudoun races, were you managed to stay awake that day? You led every damn lap of this thing? It's funny. They said there was no passing that day. I think there was only 12 cars in the lead lap so somebody could pass. Yeah, no kidding. What was

that day? I mean, what was, like, how you talk about how hard these races are to win and then just have that race there, obviously. So what was, what's bizarre? about that when I think back about it is you know you used to get paid a five points for leading a lap and nobody stayed out to lead a lap yeah and then we never had a bad pit stop we came in and I didn't qualify on the pole qualify at second and so I beat Bobby to the line to lead the first lap um and almost screwed up one restart and uh I still can hear Bobby Hudson my spotter he was their

shop manager in my spotter I can still hear his voice today. We led the whole damn thing, and I bat screwed a restart up, and he says, you know, the tone normally is inside, inside, and this time it was inside, you know. And so anyway, it was, yeah, I mean, it was one of those days. Look, we worked our ass off to do that. That's what people don't recognize is that we heard they were going to do researcher plates. So Frank and I were like, I went to Frank, and I'm like, dude, like, this is an opportunity. We're already good there. Let's go bust our ass.

And I went to Jack. I mean, Jack, we're going to go test New Hampshire. I need you to give me all. I need you to put full effort in. He flew a motor in there. They worked on the plate package. He flew a motor in there. We put the motor in for the wreck.

It was a lot of effort. It wasn't like he just showed up. And, you know, we worked our ass. I went to Milwaukee and tested for two days. We put a lot of effort into winning that race. And that's what I was talking about earlier. It's like, you can look at stuff and bitch about it and say, oh, this is stupid or this is ridiculous, or you can accept what it is and go to

work. And that's what we did. And so it wasn't that we just showed up. It was a, it was a concerted effort. We put more effort in it there than everybody else. Yeah. Going there this week, obviously, I feel like we're starting to run all over the place at this place, you know, getting up there, almost like the modified lines nowadays. I don't think, they're not spraying. I don't think this week. But you talk about a new tire. Like, we're not expecting anything like we had Saturday night. Like, this is just a new tire. We're not expecting, like. We didn't expect that This week you're true. That's true.

No, I don't think we'll get there by any means. But hopefully we see, you know, Richmond was better for sure. That was the best Richmond race we've had in a long time. Richmond's been a struggle for a long time prior to this car. That was the best Richmond race we've had. Hopefully it'll, we'll see some more of that, more tire fall off and different, you know, varying speeds and cars. Whatever we do, let's not complain because New Hampshire's only got, what, one race now. Exactly.

So, yeah. Let's make the best of it, learn from it. great race fans up there. Oh, yeah. I love going up there. It's awesome. Yeah, it's so badass. It's for the first day we went up there and ran that, that, uh, Expendity race.

It was, you know, immediately you're like, damn, these people love it. You know, it's fun going up there. Food's good, too. Thomas, we're going modified racing, right? Doug, I just found out today, so that's fun. And Franklin County. And you got the boys of Franklin County. We got stuff everywhere this week.

Carson, we're going cars to a race this week? Nope. It's my birthday. That's all I got this week. When is it? Yep, Thursday. How old are you? 25.

Oh, boy. It's over. One foot of grave. It's time for my quarter life crisis. Quarter life? Quarter life crisis. You plan on going to 100? Well, maybe.

You never know. Bad bitches don't die. You know what I'm saying? Oh, here we go. Goodness. Speaking of bad bitches, how did it have rare breeze that we've recorded? Tomorrow's the day. All right.

Were you excited? We're going live. Yeah. I am excited. I think it'll. Did you get, what was it, first thousand followers? Yeah, first thousand followers get exclusive access to it on YouTube before it actually goes live. Have we hit that mark yet?

We're really close on Instagram. I'm not sure about Facebook. Alex, do you know? Yeah, I know we're really close on Instagram. So if you're not already following, what is this thing? So this was, we had a fan stop by. He left us a nice note about how much he enjoys the podcast and everything else. And then he went outside and peed on the bushes.

They have it on camera. I'm sure there's camera. is here somewhere that he's, I said, that sounds like a DBC fan, if I got to be honest. Jeff, for you guys, I mean, I know. Speaking of that, what does spotters do when you got to pee? I would tell you, but it's not going to be pretty. No, like, I have never had to do it.

It's kind of like the race car. You know, they ask the race car drivers a lot of times. Like, what do you do? I go before the race and I've never had an issue going. But T.J. literally has to pee every caution. And I, like, there's a bad. Like, Bristol's not bad.

There's a bathroom right there in the hallway that you can go to. That's not too far away. But there's some of them there. You've got to go down a couple flights of stairs. And I'm like, I'm just, I'm just going to be able to hold it, I think. But some of them guys, yeah, they're out of there every caution. I'm like, you got a problem. TJ, like, you might want to check that out.

But, uh, TJ's got a lot of problems. TJ does have a lot of problems. Jeff, as far as Harrison, how far can we, how far can we take this run? Like, what's their, what's their approach? Like, just, just obviously attack as much as you can and see what happens. Well, for that, for that team, the small team, the week off helps, right? It gives them more prep time. It's a big disadvantage, like, compared to, to, to, to,

you know, the bigger team. It's a big disadvantage getting cars maxed out. And, you know, Tommy knows it's the thousands of an inch to make a difference. So having a week off really helps that team get ready for the next two weeks. And so if, I don't know, maybe, you know, they brought a lot of speed this weekend at Bristol. And if a little bit more prep time helps them going to Kansas, then, yeah, they can be in pretty good shape. Yeah, I think maybe one of the best comments you to give somebody Harrison is, maybe one of the best kids in the garage.

You know, I just honestly, just a good kid. I mean, I don't deal with him a lot, but everything we've had conversation. Thank God for his mom. It's funny. I ran into Mike Kelly in the garage yesterday, and he looked at me, he says, there's three grandstands up there, dented. He said, Kim was beating the hell out of the grant. I don't know what happened during the race.

Some high pressure moment or something. Yeah, Kim's always. He's like, I promise you, there's three dented grandstands up there because Kim was on the edge. I was like, well, she's kind of always on the end. It was good to see. He had a good run in the late model. Rick wears late model on Saturday. Yeah, I really don't, I don't know what happened at all.

Finish fourth? Harrison drove it? Yeah. It was good to see him in general. Luke ran it on Friday, got it all ready for him. And then Harrison did. Are they still leading owners points? Yeah.

Oh, good. Good. So that was a good, that was good for owners points. Okay. Yeah, they lost a little bit, right? Because the six car finished second. Who won't? Caden?

Did Caden win? Yeah. Late-Mall stocks, yeah. Really? No, pro-late models. Oh, pros. No, late models. No, Caden won to say, yeah. I get in my names.

Honeycutt. Honeycutt. Keelan. Keelan won the pro race. Caden won. Listen. You know, I'm not just saying this because it's Kevin's kid. That kid is fucking good.

Like, and you see, there was very, I was at the Florence race and I missed a shift or something on the start. And a lot of times that is the pin comes out of the grenade with young kids. And they make, they compound mistakes with other mistakes. He just, all right, I'm okay. I'm fifth. One of the time. drove by everybody to the lead and won the race.

And I was like, that is really impressive for somebody his age. I know you get to see it firsthand. Well, Harrison told me, Saturday morning, I think he called me. And he said, what are you doing? He said, I'm driving to go get my ass kicked by a 14-year-old. And I said, well, I want you to take a step back and remember that there was a day you were 14 years old kicking everybody's ass. So remember that when he kicks your ass. Remember what it felt like for them.

Yeah. he didn't seem to think that was funny. No, no. All right, well, Jeff, thank you very much for dropping in. We obviously love to have you at all times. It's great. It's fun, I enjoy it. Appreciate what y'all do.

It's fun. It's fun to hear you guys debate and discuss, and it's okay to be, it's okay to have a conversation. Right. And I appreciate you guys do because it's, we don't always have to agree on everything. No. But appreciate the conversation. I wish the world could kind of get that where you can, you can have disagreements and argue with each other. We do it all the time.

I know. I'm just saying I do it with you every day. But yeah, anyway, thank you again, Jeff. Well, that one likes to argue. Yeah, we just have the time. It's just to get a reaction. He's good at it. Thank you guys for listening.

We will see you in Loudoun this weekend. We're out. Peace out. Bye.