DOUBLE COVERAGE PODCAST - Georges St-Pierre Reveals His Advice for Conor McGregor’s UFC Return and Talks the GSP Podcast

Episode Date: July 23, 2026

UFC legend Georges St-Pierre joins Double Coverage for a deep conversation on the GSP Podcast, life after retirement, Conor McGregor’s UFC return, Max Holloway, Justin Gaethje’s incredible comeback, Jake Paul’s boxing journey, Jon Jones, Islam Makhachev, Anderson Silva, Alexander Usyk, and the evolution of combat sports. GSP opens up about staying hungry after retirement, why fighters need to leave their comfort zone, how Conor McGregor can regain his old mindset, why Justin Gaethje should consider retiring on top, and what Max Holloway needs to do in a potential McGregor rematch. He also breaks down mental visualization, Jake Paul’s rise in boxing, the Anderson Silva superfight that never happened, and why modern fighters continue to evolve. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Connor McGregor, finally going to return to the Octagon. He's five years removed. What advice would you give him? What I think he needs to do is... What's up? Ready to back. Ready to flex. We're on a string with a check.

You can Michael Parson get you a sack. Some of my cover. Deionasseller. Beck like a wrecking. Here be a beginner. We double coverage. We're double coverage. And this is the eye.

George St. Pierre, aka GSP. How are you doing, my man? Doing fantastic. Thank you. So you just launched your own podcast, the GSP podcast. What inspired you to start that and get into the media game more? Well, a lot of things. One thing that I found interesting when you have a podcast, it's like going back to school.

But you choose the topics and the guests that you want to learn from. So what I really enjoy is to meet different expert in different field, different topics that I'm passionate about and to talk about it, you know, and to learn from them. What are some of the podcasts out there that inspired you to start your journey? Well, a friend of mine, Joe Rogan, I really admire what he does because he, he touched on topics and subject that, especially in the beginning when he started his podcast, no one wanted to talk about it because the risk of being discredited.

and, you know, it's kind of inspired me in a way that I, you know, I think you, there's no shame on being curious about something. You know what I mean? And the more you're asking question, it doesn't make you, you're not supposed to make you look dumb, you know, there's no, if you ask a question, is because you want to learn about something. And I think it's, it's honorable, you know, to do, to ask question that a lot of people are afraid, to ask. To segue and to more mixed martial arts, but your day-to-day, you're still in great shape. Yeah.

What is your training schedule like nine years out of retirement? Are you still constantly in the gym? Are you still training mixed martial arts? What are you doing day-to-day? I'm not training to be world champion anymore. I'm training more for longevity, but also because for me it's a therapy. And I really enjoy martial art.

I still go in the gym. role, spar, wrestle with the guys, you know. And I plan on doing it as long as my body allow me to do so. But yeah, I consider myself a martial artist. And a martial artist, I believe it's, he trained because it's part of his life. You know, I don't only train because I have a competition coming up. You know, I don't have any competition coming up. But I love it because for me, it helps me be a better person.

So we all have in our heads, and it allows me to canalize my negative energy. That's the exact what a lot of fighters say is that, but a lot of them struggle with their identity post-retirement when they don't have that fight to train for and those start to take over. I did, I did too. Even though I even often publicly say

that I really never really like to fight. But, you know, I prepared my retirement. But the thing is, when you fight, it's such a high, especially when you win. There's nothing really to compare to it. When you don't have that feeling anymore, you feel empty. But in order to not derail, you need to find yourself other goals, other things that you want to do. And that's what I did. I'm more busy now that I used to be when I was competing because I'm more of a, I would say, an

entrepreneur now. I have different businesses that I'm involved with. And that keeps me busy and I still have goals. And my goals are, you know, I want to be somewhere better, you know, in the future than I am now, you know. And I think it's important to stay hungry because if you're, if you're satisfied and you sit, I think that's when you might. lose it. You know what I mean? And I think it's important to always strive and always look for better things. It's important. Absolutely. There's another guy who's, we've seen his ups and downs, but he's finally going to return to the octagon, Connor McGregor, July 11th. He's one of the

greatest we've ever seen, of course, in the cage, true time world champion, but out of the cage, revolutionized the sport. When you talk about the most revolutionary fighters, he's there. I mean, he pushed the sports to bounds that we haven't seen before. What's the most important thing for him heading into this fight? He's five years removed from the octagon. He had a devastating... What advice would you give him? What an advice I would give him is...

Well, not that I've done exactly the same, but when I came back, it was more than four years. So what I think he needs to do is to be... get out of his comfort zone to not be the boss of his training camp. Let your trainer be the boss and tell you what to do. Choose someone that you trust. He has an excellent coach. Kavana in Ireland, excellent coach.

The guy is a genius. So let him dictate what's the training camp to choose your partner to what to do. Because when you're in a fight, you don't decide what's going to happen. You just have to react accordingly to whatever the problem is. And so you're trying while you're preparing to recreate that environment to put yourself outside your comfort zone. And I think it's very important because when you get money and you reach a certain status, you're sort of a boss.

But you don't want to be a boss while you're training for a fight. You want to be, you know, like anybody else, like another number. and you know that's what he needs. And it's very hard to do because, you know, I'm sure he's very wealthy now and everything. It has to be. So he has to go back into that mental phase that he once were. He was very hungry. He wanted to climb and he was ready to do anything that he needed to be done to reach his goal.

But once you have everything you want, it's very hard, you know. So he needs to put himself willingly, himself back there and it takes a lot of sacrifice. Marvin Hagler said it's tough to wake up and run in the morning when you wake up in silk pajamas. That's true. 100% when I was in my prime in training camp I have my regular training partner that I have that I train every day in a gym but I purposely fly other guys with my coach, we planned

it who they want me to you know to bring in and The job of those guys is to give me hell, you know, because they're not my friend. I mean, I'm nice to them, and I really appreciate they help me, but I'm flying some different guys with different styles that are similar to my future opponent. So they bring me the similar kind of problems. It's impossible to find someone who's exactly the same way of your opponent, because, you know, especially at that level, there's, you know, there's, everyone is pretty pretty unique.

But you can find guys that have, that will bring you similar problem that you will, yeah, that's their job. And Ferras used to tell them, say, if you, you know, if you, if you, if you, if you, if you, if you, they'll stop the, the entire academy and praise you for our, like, you know what I mean? It was, and you, you willingly did that on purpose because you didn't want to, Like some of the guys that we brought something, they were sort of Star Trucks. Yeah. But they were young, very hungry guys, you know, they want to, you know, take your place.

Yeah, of course. It was good. You know, you did it purposely. But that's what I'm talking about when you need to go back in that, you know. And it's hard to do once you're healthy, you know. Were you more nervous going to those sparring sessions with the brand new guys where you don't know exactly what they're going to give you more switched on, right? Yeah, absolutely. And that's one of the way that you get outside of your conference zone

because when you spar with a guy that you know and you train with every day, you kind of know what you're going to get, you know what I mean? Even though if he's better than you insertion every... Even if it's great. Yeah, but you know, you know. When you go with a guy that you don't know. When you spar with someone for lots of rounds, say over 100 rounds,

it's almost like a dance and you guys are both going back and forth. I'll tell you, I box and I sparred Corey Spinks, world champion five times. I couldn't touch him clean, don't get me wrong. We sparred so much, I got so comfortable, I had no butterflies. It was just like routine. But if I go to a random gym in a weird place,

and there's a guy who doesn't even look that good, but I don't know him, and he's twitchy. I'm way more switch on and nervous. I'm thinking, what if you know, totally different. Yeah, 100%. And I think that's one of the problem with a lot of guys. it costs money because, you know, especially when you get more successful, when you have the meaning to do it, you need to spend money to make money.

And you have to see it like an investment. You would invest on yourself. And I was never afraid of doing it. A lot of guys sometimes I tell them what I just, like, hey, bring new sparring partner. Yeah, but it costs money, the plane ticket, the hotel. And I'm like, yeah, but it's worth it. It is worth it. And I used to do that all the time.

It's something that I don't see much from the new generation that I'm training him. And I think it's important. What's up, guys? It's Mystic Zach, aka your host of double coverage, aka the biggest sports fan in the world. I personally endorse Fathead. Fathead is the absolute best place to get any sort of sports merchandise. I've been using their products all my life.

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The city of New York is going crazy. Nix fans are going crazy. Go to fadhead.com using the link in our bio. Buy some Nix merch, celebrate that championship win or support any of your favorite teams in any of the major sports across the NFL, MLB, NHL, wherever. One of the greatest things about your career, and I know you don't like to talk about yourself that much,

but your only two losses you suffered, you got it back. You know, you won the rematches. What was the mindset of you going into the Matt Sarah and Matt Hughes rematches versus other fights? And what's important for Max Holloway heading into this rematch because McGregor beat him before? So the two losses that I have in my career are against Matt. Yeah. Matt's Matthews and Matt Serra. If you want to beat JSP, I'll be named Matt. You have to be named Matt. It's like my kryptonite. I don't know why. That's your kryptonite. So the first fight that I have lost against Matt Hughes, at the time, I was very hungry, but very young. And Matt Hughes was a legend.

It was like one of my idol. And I was going into that not to win. I was going to not lose. And even in the stare down, I remember I couldn't even look at him in the eyes. I was looking up the scene. I was like, man, what the hell I'm doing here? So the f*** started. And I didn't realize until I watched the video.

after I was doing pretty well until I got caught with a and when I watched the replay of the video I was like man I got all the skills to beat that guy and I was doing very well but while I wasn't I didn't realize I thought he was like just like yeah it's when I watched a video I said I told myself I said man if I got a rematch I'll beat him because now I know I can beat him and it when I The second time, and I beat him. It's not that much because I was on skill or technically better than I was the first time. I wasn't maybe a little bit, but just because mentally I was in a different place. I had confidence.

Then I became world champion. I was very young. Everybody told me at the time how good I was and everything. And my first title defense was against another Matt, Matt Serra. And Matt Sarah was a veteran, you know. He had a career, a very successful career, but he had certain ups and down. And he was like a rocky story. He made it like very close.

He beat Chris Lytle in a very close decision to make it for a title fight against me. And I remember the odds. I think it's probably still to this day the biggest upset in UFC. history or one of the biggest upset. How incredible was that performance from Justin? Six to one underdog, goes in, he's fought twice previously for the title, came up short both times, he's 37 years old. He's fighting at the, the most pressure that I ever be on him against the guy that no one

thought could be beaten and goes in, takes it to him from the first round. Yeah, he was amazing. Man, Justin is a freaking warrior. It's unbelievable. I'm going to say something that most people will probably not agree with me but I would love to see him retire I'm a fan of Justin I love the guy

but I hope if he continues though he continues and he's you know he retire when he's at his best you know like don't let the sport retire you. But what an amazing ending of a career would it be? I know in the MMIC culture, they want you to pass the torch, but leave with the torch, man. When you feel that you're going to make a lot of money,

you're going to leave a lot of money on the table, but the opportunity that will come to you once you retire on top are huge. And nothing prevent you maybe in a few years or maybe a few months. If you change Roman, you make a comeback. But I hope he stay healthy. Because, you know, when you talk to him, he's a very well-spoken person. You know, but he's been involved in a lot of followers. It's crazy.

I just hope he stay healthy. I'm a huge fan. Yeah. I would love to see him fight again. But as a human being, I would love to see him retire on top like this. Like, what a great ending and a blueprint of a carer that would be for the young, younger generation that look up to him. So inspiring.

Not about how many times you get knocked down, but how many times you get back up. And he's done it over and over and over. He's the embodiment of it. Yeah, he became a friend of mine. I got to train with him back in March. We sparred. He did pretty good.

And I had a great time and saw his hard work and effort and very normal, the most modest guy. I mean, you go to his house, you see the way he lives, and you see kind of his mindset and lifestyle. It's so mundane, you wouldn't expect him to be the most You know, so I'm a huge fan of him. And I agree with you. I think unless Connor McGregor wins, I would get out.

Yeah, I mean. But the McGregor fight, it might be too much. That's generational money, you know, your grandkids. And I haven't thought of that. That's a good point. It's true. Him and Connor would be an incredible fight. But however, I correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think they're in the same way.

I think Connor is fighting 170, right? Yeah. But if it's a fight that. he wants, I think that would be the fight if he wants to finish. He's got that proven. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. It's big money, yeah. But I think that would be probably the second biggest fight in the sports history.

Behind McGregor could be. Yeah, probably, but I'm not sure if, let's say, depend on what's going to happen next. If, let's say Connor wins in a crazy fashion, his aura will automatically come back. Yeah. and then Justin that just, you know, won at the White House, you know, incredible underdog. That would be like, that would be the fight to make. To make, maybe at 155 or in a catchway, whatever. That would be the fight.

Right. Yeah. I agree now with that if Connor wins, especially if he wins in a good fashion, if I'm Justin, that's the fight. I mean, that's what he should do. And he's going to be there. Yeah. Because what more can you get? Like he beat Ilius Toporio and now his next fight.

If it's not Connor that got back to his aura, like that's the only thing that could be bigger. You know what I mean? Yeah, I don't know. I mean, I'm just, we're just speculating. Yeah, speculating. But I hope. I love Max.

And actually, I want to touch on this. What's important for Max? Because they fought previously. It was a long time ago. Max was so young. He went on to do so many things after. But McGregor went on through a lot of things after as well. What's important for Max heading into this rematch? How does he get the last fight out of his mind?

It's probably not that hard for him because he's accomplished so much. But what's key for him? I think from Max's perspective, I mean, I'm a so-called expert, but I got it wrong all the time in my prediction. But the way I analyze this fight from what I've seen from both guys, If I'm from Max Holloway perspective, I think that he needs to put a lot of pressure to focus on volume. Connor is a striker.

You don't want to go first with Connor. So a lot of fake. Make him troll is big left, you know, his main weapon. Make it troll and miss, you know. Fake it and make a troll and go third on him and put a lot of pressure and focus on putting.

that pressure in a way that you you want to you know bring him in the deep waters i think that's max all the way's uh blueprint to be connor connor and on this side is to you know to control the distance you know like to to get enough space you know where he's you know he likes to to have a wide stance you know but is to you know to make max commit commit step into the to put him where he wants him to be in use that. Yeah, and he's such a fast starter. He is. That's a problem.

When the, if the fights, the way I see it, if the fights, if the fight is a fight high pace that finish early on, it favors, according to us, I think, Connor. But if it goes in the deep waters, if it's a five-round war, I think it favors max. Well, Connor's thinking, I'm sure, is I saw Deporia. He's been in so many fights, more than Connor. I mean, no one's had more time in the Octagon than him.

It's one weight classed up. He's going to have his power. That's got to be Connor's gameplay, in my opinion. Yeah, but I don't think he's going to try to grapple him like Olivera did, or I think he's going to... They both very big for their weight classes that they fought previously, and now they're fighting on 170. People don't know that, but Max Alois is a big guy to one. So I don't know which one who's the biggest, naturally. But I know Max Hollowitz is very big.

And Connor, obviously, he's big because he made the movie Roadhouse. We saw... Do you, Conner's at this? Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I don't know who it will favor the fact that they fight at 170, but they're both big guys. They'll both be fully hydrated, right? So, you know, no dehydration, which makes a big difference. Yeah, yeah, it would be a...

I'm going to watch that fight. I'm really looking for it. I'm not sure, yep. Probably... I'm not sure yet. I depend of my upcoming schedule. Yeah. But it's an exciting one.

How would you rank the UFC in the history of the UFC's events? It's one of the best ever. I mean, it's very unique. I don't think we'll ever see that happen again. And also, all the fights were like... All of them? I think so, right? Yeah, every single one, first time in the history.

It was unbelievable. Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. Another fight that happened, your trainer's brother fought Sean O'M. Mali, tough fight. Sean looked great and obviously he had, you know, Zahubi's got to go back to the lab. For Zahabi going back to his training camp and he's obviously got a great team around him, what's important for him to keep going and not let this affect him in the future?

Well, he needs to learn from what went wrong and not repeat the same mistake. again. I don't know what's going to be his next fight. I think he was asked to headline a card in Canada I think for October. I'm not sure what's going to be his decision. You know, you need some time off, you know, for sure. You know, it's a lot of sparing, a lot of preparation, plus you got a you know, you got to probably in that fight. but yeah you need to take some time off people say after a fight like that or it's not too close from you know bell to bell oh a rematch you never need to see it it can never happen you know and we don't have a chance

but then we see peyodor yon versus marab marab dominated every second of that first fight i mean it was like 50 to 43 everyone said oh my god this was such a blow i never want to see it again and they fight a few years later everyone counts yon out and he beats him yeah that's the beauty of the sport. Yeah. Yeah. It's the ability to adapt how good you are to adapt

to a certain problem, you know? There's fighters that are, I'm one of them, by the way that I'm always been very good in rematches. Because I'm lucky. I have a great team. I'm very good at analyzing and transforming myself

into the perfect nemesis of my opponent. And this has, to do with the ability to adapt. When you fight a guy for the first time, sometimes you expect certain things, but you found out quickly always that he's never as good as you thought, and he's never as bad as you wish.

He's always different. Yeah. But the second time you fight him, you know, he might have changed since the previous time, but you have a better idea of what you're going up against. Absolutely. And I think your biggest advantage was the fact that you were a Swiss Army knife, where you had every discipline and you had mastered martial arts to a certain degree. There's only a few guys, in my opinion, who have done that you, Mighty Mouse, Sean Jones.

There's a few guys who can kind of take it anywhere. How do you, as a 19-year-old, get into wrestling and become that high level of a... We don't see that in the wrestling room. It's always guys who start at a very young age. They're bred to wrestle when they're very young, especially usually in an American program. but now we got everyone in Chechnya and Russia and all that too. But how do you as an adult, as a karate practitioner, take up wrestling and have the mentality to get that good

and then use that throughout your career? Yeah, I mean, I was always very good in sports, very good to adapt. I started karate when I was nine years old as a self-defense. It quickly turned into a passion and later on that's how I heard a living. But when I was nine to up to maybe 16, I was doing karate maybe twice a week only, you know, an hour, an hour class twice a week. But I was playing other sports, hockey, you know, track, basketball. I was always doing sports. And there's a lot of studies.

It might seem surprising to a lot of people. But there's a lot of study that came out recently because a lot of people, because a lot of people, wonder, hey, which discipline should I put my kid, my kids in to, if I want to make him a great athlete? And I think the, what the data show is that it's better at a young age to do different things and to specialize later on in your life. So while a lot of people see that as a surprise, oh, you started so late, how come you become so good? I think it's the most common theme among champions. Cyril Gann, who's the ever-weight champion,

started martial art late. Yeah. He was playing basketball, soccer. I think it's something very common. Most people think that most champions start their sport very young. Maybe they got initiated young. in their sport, but they didn't start specialize young. There's, of course, a few exceptions like Tiger Woods.

There's guys that are exception, but most of champions, I think, the data supported. They start specialize very late in their life. And there's a reason why it happened, I think, is because when you start very young, we all have a windows, you know. If you do the same movement pattern over and over again at one point, doing sport it's healthy, but doing sport to the elite level is not. So your body break down faster.

So you have a certain window in which you want to be at, and you want to keep that window while you're in your prime age, which is probably in your 20s or early 30s, you know. So when you specialize, I mean, you could start specialize late in your teenager, but when you get into the elite level in your 20s and 30s, that's when is your best bet to be, to earn a living out of it. Yeah, there's a very famous story, an American football. There's a quarterback named Todd Marinovich and his dad came out.

He was a football player as well. He said, I have the best plan for my son. He was five years old. His entire life has to be dedicated to football. He had a special diet, routine, schedule. He was never allowed to do anything, couldn't party, couldn't have a girlfriend, not that he had to train, train, train, train, train. And by the time he got to college and he got away from his father, he was the best quarterback in the country, got addicted to drugs, partying, was doing everything because of how much it was forced on him.

And then it was an NFL pick. And, I mean, he's recovered now. He's a painter. He's all these right things. But he flamed out because of all the drug problems. Yeah. They came with that. And it was just because he was pushed on him so much from a young age.

What I meant more so with you is just, I see the grapplers that can pick up the striking, like Justin. in Gagee, college wrestler, Rashad Evans, college wrestler. It's not usually the karate guys who get so good at grappling. It seems harder to pick up wrestling specifically at a later age. Usually they're good enough to defend it,

but they don't use it as a weapon. I was very lucky. At the Montreal Wrestling Club, I had a lot of mentors that took me underneath their wings. But one thing I have to explain is that takedown in MMA is different than take down in wrestling.

And wrestling is a lot of hand has to do with hand fighting, which is very specialized in wrestling. In MMA, you can use chain wrestling, like Khabib, like you drag your opponent to defense and then you chain wrestle your way to a takedown. Or you can do, also like what I did, I use a lot of proactive and reactive takedown from the center of the octagon, from a distance. Because I'm very explosive. So that was my God gift, I would say. So I was using those proactive.

So which proactive is when I initiate the takedown. I create a distraction and then I go, I shoot to the legs. Proactive is when I bait my opponent to come strike me and in the timing I go for it. So that was more my thing. And because I was coming from a karate bag, background. Karatee is a striking sport mostly. I was able to identify the cues and to know what is coming so I could time the takedown perfectly. So in a way it's my karate that helped me set up my

takedown. My wrestling helped me finish the takedown. If you know if you know if you. Yeah, it's just so like Wonder Boy Thompson. He's so incredible karate and he got such good defensive that the guys couldn't take him down, he could use his karate. But you don't see him taking guys down. You know, it's just totally different. Usually that's, and then you see wrestlers who never want to wrestle, they only want to strike. Like Dan Henderson, Justin Gaci, these guys are wild.

They don't have any interest in wrestling. They just want to. Yeah. I think they, I think the key, I mean, there's no perfect formula. There's the specialist and the generalists. There's, like, I would call myself more a generalist. You know, I'm not the best striker. I'm very good in striker, but I'm not the best.

I'm very good in grappling, I'm not the best. But I'm very good everywhere. And there's also the specialists that are they're the best at one particular thing, but they lack a little bit in others. But because they're able to keep the fight where they're strong, that's how they become successful. There's prongs and cons and boat style,

but I always found that if you're a generalist, it gives you more option. Yeah. Because you can transform yourself and become the perfect nemesis to your opponent, which is not the case if you're a specialist. You don't have that option. You just have to make sure you keep the fight where you're strong.

And that could limit your way of winning a fight if you face a problem that you can't solve. Well, the sports come so far. UFC won. Everyone is a specialist only. And then Hoise Gracie won as the jiu-jitsu practitioner. But now it seems like there's such little specialists. Everyone's become a generalist.

Look at Islam Makachev. Yeah. I mean, how incredible are his skills? Yeah. He's, I would say he's now a generalist. He's a specialist. We all know what is end games. End game is.

But reverly, Wokanovski. So he's in a way, he's a generalist too. So that's the key. You know, like you want to become very good everywhere. You know, like John Jones used to be mostly a very good wrestler. He used to troll people and now he became one of the best striker. So that's the goal. You know, as you progress, you want to make sure that your weaknesses become strength.

He would strike with his ass. The his... People don't talk about... What are you doing the clinch? John Jones. Oh, yeah. And the hard thing for his open is that John Jones has a reach advantage.

So most of them in their game plan, I'm sure they were like, oh, I'm going to close the distance. But John is like an amazing fighter in close range because he has those... He's as... As close as a perfect fighter as you can find. You know, he's basically...

Basically, like, perfect physique, perfect athlete, incredible fighting IQ is unbelievable. He's so great, and I think that even in recent times to people have grown up watching him, like Cyril Gahn, where I think they find themselves like, I can't believe I'm fighting John Jones. And they're almost watching him instead of being in the fight. Yeah. Like, he sikes guys out before the fight starts. Yeah. I mean, it's part of the mind game.

Yeah. I mean, he's just... John, I found that looking at John Jones' fight, he always been better when there's more at stake. When he fought guys that he's supposed to win easily, I don't know if it's a mental thing or a preparation issue, but I always found that the more he has to lose, like Daniel Cormier was a question of honor for him,

Like, you know, like a serial gun, he was like coming back from, you know, like every way for the first time. The more the bigger the fight is, the more stressful it is, the better he performed. The fight that he, you know, like, he's highly favorite, you know, like, I found that, you know, maybe that's why he's so good. You know, to be a champion in the sport is to be good when it count, to be good when it matter. A lot of guys are good in the gym, but to be champion is you need to be good when it matter the most. Yeah. John Jones is the embodiment of that. Big time performers. And it's in every sport, you know,

even American football, we cover it all. But like they coast in the regular season. And then Eli Manning, I don't know you're familiar with American football, but this guy, he was average in the regular season, very average. He did a lot of interceptions, but twice in the playoffs, he pulls off the most miraculous runs in the history of the sport. He has the most big-time throws completed.

It's inexplainable. Yeah. The flip that switches for. for him when the games are tough yeah he writes to the occasion yeah 100% you know it's like a mental thing that you almost can't comprehend as a normal as a civilian yeah 100% and then i think a lot of it has to do with the preparation there's different kind of preparation there's the physical preparation you know that you you put yourself true you know the the hard work that you do in the gym like that's you know that physically are you in shape are you injury free uh you know you know you

what I mean and technically you know your stuff your knowledge tactically your preparation everything is physical like it you know but there's also the mental preparation that has to do that with visualization you know imagery stuff that you need to do I believe I believe strongly in that a lot of people sometimes they roll their eyes because it's a little bit like esoteric but I think it it helps a lot and it's something that can make a big difference between a guy that's going to crumble under the pressure between a guy that's going to make it because the guy that that's going to crumble is because he didn't work on it the guy that that rise to the occasion maybe he thought of it he felt it before he visualized it

so when it happened it's it feels to him like it's not the first time that it happened so he has confidence in himself. Yeah, a good friend of mine, I was with him for his training camps early on, Jake Paul. He's fighting these huge fights, so much pressure on his shoulders, half the training camp is working on his mental. He's, I'm gonna, this guy, and he's walking around, he's visualized, doing his breath work, and he believed it so much to the point where he got to the fight, and he was just living what he had already seen his head a million times. That's what no one understood that was outside. They're thinking, this kid has to be so scared. He comes from YouTube and now he's fighting the greatest U of Seafirs of all time.

But he just had already won in his head. So it was like nothing for him to go out there. And that was his biggest advantage. A lot of people, they ask me, how come as something that is in your head can become real? Like, it doesn't make sense. The best way I can explain it is think about anything. Like a room, this room.

Someone had to create it first in their head. Maybe it's multiple people. that created and when it merges all together, that idea of this room, the carpet, the color of the walls, this became unified and they were able to, it was able to be materialized.

That's how you create something, you know, from scratch. It first started as an idea, you know, something that does not exist materialistically, but it exists in your mind. I think it's the same thing. in sport performance. You need to have the idea first, your goal, your dream,

to make it, to materialize, in order to materialize in the real world, you need to make it happen up here. And then it materialized in the real world. Barriers get broken all the time. If someone had told you beginning of your career, someone would become a world champion

two different weight classes at the same time. You can't do that. They won't even let you find. And then McGregor does it, and then all of a sudden you get a rush of double champions because they saw that it can be achieved and everyone sees that. They said no one could run a four-minute mile.

One guy beats it 19 more the next day, right? So that's just how it goes. Once barriers you're broken, then people see it, they can visualize it right in front of them, then you can achieve it. Yeah, exactly. That's the best way I can explain it. It all starts from an idea

or combine ideas from different individuals and then you can materialize it. I think that's something, that is very powerful that most champions, they start believing and acting like champions before they became champions. Look at you saying both, look at Jordan, look at all the great champions in sports. And it's something that I've learned from them and I try to replicate it in my career. I try to keep people ask me about things years from now. I go, I can't, I'm not going to have the time, I'm going to be, I can't take that risk.

I'm going to be too big and whatever in my space. And they go, you're not that big. I go, I'm going to be the biggest. So I'm preparing for that. There's no other reality I live in. I'm going to be at the top. There's no other way you can put it to me. Because I'm not going to be there.

What if this doesn't happen? Then I'll break that barrier and I'll keep going. I think it's Michael Angel who says the danger in life. I might screw it up, but it basically says the danger in life is not to set your goal. too high and never be able to reach it, is to set it too low and reaching it. Because once you've done that,

and after that, you have nothing else that you want to improve, you know? So I think there's nothing wrong to set your goals very high. What are your thoughts on the current state of combat sports? Obviously, the UFC, the biggest player. Soa boxing, Zufa boxing,

karate combat, R-A-F, we're almost could be hitting a golden arrow, Netflix, MMA, what are your thoughts and everything? What have been some of your favorites, maybe outside of the UFC? Oh, I love the fact that there's other organization rising, competing with UFC. It's very important, especially for the athletes, because the UFC has the monopoly. The UFC has the monopoly. The UFC has the monopoly.

So it's important for the performer, for the fighters, that they have other options. The industry of mixed martial arts is very unique. You know, like if you play hockey, you have different themes that you can go. You know, American football, same thing, soccer, you know. But in UFC, UFC is the most prestigious organization in mixed martial art. And they have a power, you know. And it's not good for the fighters that if they don't have other options, It's always better for them from their perspective for the fighters that if things doesn't work well in the U.S. City, they can go somewhere else.

And it's important. You know, I will always support the fighters because I was a fighter. So in my perspective, I think it's a good thing. I'm a big fan of all those other organizations like, you know, like Raff. I love to watch it sometimes, you know, all the Jack Paul's promotion on Netflix. And I love the show. It's entertainment. Do you think they could be a legit competitor?

Absolutely. There's different form of entertainment. Like, for example, if you see one celebrity fighting another celebrity, you're going to tune in because you want to know what's going to happen. It's entertainment. But it's not because you want to see who's the best fighter in the world. You know what I mean? Or the best boxer in the world.

If I want to see who's the best boxer in the world, I'm going to watch Alexander. under Music, next fight against whoever it is to see, you know, was the best, because I think he's the best. But it's all a form of entertainment. And I'm not against that model of entertainment. I think it's genius. I think, for example, like what Jake Pauli has created is genius.

Even though, like, you know, we say, you know, you want to see who's the best in the world. Like, maybe one day he's going to knock at the door for a title, title fight. Then he went against Anthony Joshua as in every way. It's like a ballsy move. I think he, I think it would be interesting if he, you know, from in his way class, if he can, you know, climb maybe the rank and go for a title fight. I think it's doable. I think he can do it. I couldn't agree more.

Yeah. I call him a cruise way prospect. Mm-hmm. And he'd be like, you're crazy. He's a prospect. 100% he trains. Behind behind that. that persona that he is, the YouTube,

because I went to, what is it, Puerto Rico. Oh, you did? Yes, yes. I've trained there many times with John Dannar in Jiu-Jit, but I've met him there. He has an incredible team. Like, he trained with the best, the best trainer, the best, you know, aspiring partner,

my friend Jean-Pascar. I was there for that. Yes, so he's willing to put himself, even though he's very wealthy. willing to put himself outside of his comfort zone in order to improve and to be the best. And he has the money and the resources to do it. And he's willingly doing it. That's why he's so good.

A lot of haters, but I respect a lot of what he does. I think it's entertainment at his best, and I wish him the best of luck, knowing this journey. I've said if he continues on this journey, I think he's going to become cruiserweight champion. Yeah, the only danger for someone of his texture because he has a, access to pretty much everything you want is to fall into, you know, like, freaking like the trap of life, you know, the me too,

the this, that like, if he stay away from that, then he focus on, you know, what needs to be done, I think he can do it. Yeah, I first got acquainted with him. I was there for Logan's training camp, and he was just starting getting out of fight, but he was

working so hard, and he didn't have a trainer. And he was sparring tough, and he was just, like, had the willingness to learn and improve without any help. And I said, you know, you have all the characteristics of a potential pro boxer. You should really take it serious. Then he had his first pro fight and I was there in his second, his third, his fourth, his fifth. And then as it was going, he could see it.

You know, at first he told my friend the Hinton Test, he was, I'm going to be the best YouTube boxer. He goes, no, you're not. You're going to be the best professional boxer. Get out of that mode. Start calling out the professionals because you're going to get there. And that's what broke the mold and got him to where he's at today and to see his journey through hard work and dedication,

he's tough. Yeah. He's nails. Yeah, yeah, yeah. He has that toughness that you need. Yeah. God given. You wouldn't think someone from his background would have that, you know,

in his stardom and whatever, and he shouldn't, but he's got this chip on his shoulder from everyone doubting him and talking so much. They first try to laugh at him, then they try to ignore him and now that nobody, nobody laugh now. He's there, you know, when he's a force to... He beat Anderson Silva. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, Tyro Woodley. You know, like, yeah, it's a boxing, but he did it.

And he lost that fight, but he was still a little bit competitive. It was competitive. You could see what Jake was thinking. Like, if I land that, you know, I can do the impossible. You call it David v. Goliath. Yeah, yeah, yeah. It could have happened, you know, but it didn't go his way. But I respect that he did take the risk.

You know, it takes a lot of courage. You know, and I say Anderson Silva, because he beat Chavez in boxing, and Silva looked up to Roy Jones Jr. for a long time. If he had gone into boxing rather than martial arts, I think he would have been a world champion. Yeah, could be. Because he has that acumen and the skills and just the athleticism to do anything in martial arts, combat sports, anything. You spoke by this recently. I don't want to beat it at horse, but you almost had a super fight with Anderson Silva, one-way class up. I saw you breaking down

how it went how do you think that fight would have gone if you had a crystal ball while like if it happened when we were in our prime how were you visualizing it when that fight was being talked about

in your guys' prime well from my perspective if that fight would ever happen it would have been in a because at the time I had a lot of competition in my weight class he had a lot of competition in his weight class

and I knew that if I would have take that fight it would be outside of my line, would have forced me to perhaps go outside and then I would need to go back to my weight class.

At the time, what it was asked, it was talked about once with the UFC, we gave them the request. We wanted to be compensating with a special contract for that fight outside of our existing contract.

That was one thing. We wanted to be in a, how do you say, a weight class that is a... A catch weight? I think it was 180. And we wanted to have implementing... That was the three conditions.

And once we gave our condition, they never get back to us. So that's why it never materialized. But the way I was, if the fight would have a happen, of course, there's no secret. Anderson Silver was like a fighting like the Matrix was a very good striker. So my plan would have been to use a lot of feign and fake with a lot of forward pressure to close the distance to put them down. Yeah. To use granite and pound and, you know, that would have been my...

Like with Chelle Sunnan, the first fight. A little bit. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, from my perspective, and I'm sure, from his perspective, I'm sure he has a different Gaitland, that EC himself winning that fight.

So that's the thing we'll never know. They never go for the catch weights, the UFC. I don't know why. I would love that. You know, you and Kabe was the other one. Yeah. It didn't get made. I know I know Anderson.

Anderson fought in Pride at 170. But we'll later in his career got very big. And I don't know if he could have made 170 when he was later in his career. He had gone out to

205. And James Irvin in like the first round in 205. Forrest Griffin. Yeah. So that for that reason I think

yeah and Stephen Bonner as well. So he was very big. Knowing he was like very like he had maybe something like 30, 30,

40 pounds over over me, you know because I was not a big weight cutter. I was like I have a very large frame but I'm not thick, you know, like I have very long reach, but I'm not someone who is like in terms of

thickness. Yeah. So, so people have a misconception that I lose a lot of weight. I never did. I walk around 185, 186 pounds, and I got like 15 to 16 pounds to make weight, which, especially nowadays, fighters at 170, they're close to 200 pounds. Look at Michael Morales. They're big, they're big guys

This guy's like, it was he, 210? Yeah, they're very big. There's guys in my era too that were very big but at the time I was fighting in my prime The win was the evening Of the day before They need to implement like a similar system The One Championship

Exactly, like you know, one of the Exactly, that was I think the best system To prevent Hopefully will never happen Yeah, and some Some of these guys, how Pereira made 185. McGregor used to make 145. I want to touch back on a name that you brought up earlier, Alexander Usik.

I call him the master of boxing. Yeah. I got to spend some time with him, and he's an incredible champion, undefeat. He just relinquished all his titles. He said, I have one last dance. What do you think about him and his fighting and kind of how he is as a boxer? I see. Probably the best of all.

all time or one of the best of all time. It's just unbelievable. And he was not an heavy weight. I think it was light. It was cruiser weight. It was cruiserweight and unbelievable. Like the way he moves and everything is, if you want to learn about boxing, he's the perfect model to mold yourself after. You know, it's just unbelievable. We need to get him on your podcast. We'd love to, yeah, 100%. Usakar podcast, ESP. Let's make it happen. I'm a huge fan of it. Yeah, I agree, absolutely. To do what he did, a cruiserweight against great fighters, Gassievin, Michael Hunter,

then move up to heavyweight. And when he first moved up, there are so many skeptics. And what's crazy is his manager, Egus, said he was going to be the undisputed world heavyweight champion. And everyone thought he was crazy. And actually, when he was negotiating certain contracts for Alexander, he would say he would put in a clause that dictates he gets a certain amount if it becomes undisputed heavyweight champion. When he first moved up and they thought, oh, he's crazy,

not going to happen anyway, so they would put it in. And then they cashed in when he beat Tyson Fury. Good for him, you know? Very happy. This is a very good and powerful underdog story. It's good. It inspire people. It's amazing.

To do what he did against Joshua twice and Fury twice. I mean, the difference between him and Fury is like night and day. Oh, yeah. You know? He's just an incredible athlete. Like, he's another one that I just hope he's going to, when time comes. I mean, he's in his prime. Now, you know, sky is the limit, but when time comes...

He said one more fight. Oh, yeah, one more. Yeah, well, I wonder who will be... Maybe the RICO rematch. Did you get a chance to watch that fight? Oh, yeah. That one was, yeah, the RICO, yeah. I think he did very well.

He did excellent. I think he did very well. He surprised a lot of people. Like, I've watched the fight as a fan. I've not watched it. I didn't score it, but I think in a rematch, I don't know if it's... I don't want to make any excuses.

I wonder if you sick train, like, like prepare himself 100% for that fight. It could be also the fact that Rico was a weird style, you know, because he's coming from a kickboxing background, you know. I would be very interesting to see a re-match. I think it would be great. Yeah.

And that'd be a great final send-off. 100%. 100%. And if he wins that, you know, he'll go back, go to the get out under the sunset. Straight to the Hall of Fame. Yes. And Terence Crawford just retired,

undefeated as well, straight to the Hall of Fame. Terence Crawford is another one, I think, best pound for punk. It's unbelievable. Those are the two bests of this generation? 100%. 100%.

And the two of them are the two guys who I think can stand toe-to-to-to-with-any generation. You know, Crawford can go against Sugar A. Leonard and Tommy runs all these guys. Ousek can go against, I don't want to... But Ali and Tyson and all these guys, you can see them fighting, you know?

Well, there's a thing in combat sport. But we always compare that guy versus that guy, for example, who would have won between Mohammed Ali, Mike Tyson, and then we put Uzik in the mix. Same thing in M.MA. It's only speculative because we have no way of knowing for sure. But if you look at other sports, for an example, like a hundred meter, we know that Usain boat, the race that he ran and beat the world record was the fastest race ever. We know that other sport where we can measure the performance, the performance tend to be

better as time goes by. But in combat sport, we have this thing that for some reason, sometimes we stay, we always say, oh, this guy will kick everyone else, which I think is wrong. And it's not appealing to me to say that because now I'm retired and yeah, you know, a lot of guys, their pride, they want to be remembered. But I lean towards. the theory that, I mean, it's a theory, but it's measurable in other sport, but not measurable in combat sport. But I think as time goes by, fighters get better. I mean, the performance get better. I don't think the person is better. I think their performance get better because they have access to more knowledge and technology. What I wanted to learn jujitsu, and I was 19 years old, 18 years old, I needed to drive to a new.

York, eight-hour drive from Montreal, get physically in a class and learn it from, you know, the Henzel Graysies. Now I can, you know, grab my phone and learn it in two seconds. So the access of knowledge and technology that I have now is so much better than at the time. That's why I think fighters would be better if you would have put them against an old timer. Most of the time, not always, but most of the time. There's exception. Not because they're better athletes, because like Einstein said,

if I've seen further, it's because I'm standing on shoulders of a giant. The same thing for me when I was in my prime, I've learned from my predecessor, you know, Hoys Gracie, Mark Coleman, Mark Kerr, those guys that were beasts, and I've learned from them. And now the new generation can learn from me.

That's why I think they're better. than what I was. There's a good chance Islam Akachev beats anyone ever right now. Probably. Yeah, probably. I would think so.

You know, logically, it's, I would say so. His skill level is almost like impathomable in each discipline. It like almost shouldn't be human, but it's almost like he's a machine trained to fight.

His boxing, is kicking, his grappling, his submission. And as good as he is, maybe in two decades, there will be a young guy. And not maybe,

They will be another guy. They will be better than any one of them that we have today. And that's how it goes. And I'm going to tell my son that Islam would kick his ass. But it's every sport. It's not even just basketball, Michael Jordan, Will Chay. My grandpa, Bill Russell, the greatest player ever. Yeah.

Grandpa, he couldn't shoot threes. He couldn't do anything yet. He couldn't score that much. He was the greatest ever. Not even good. It's not a nostalgia. His guys couldn't compete with Bill Russell. Yeah.

It's nostalgia. And it's appealing for guys like me that people think that. It's very flatter that I'm very flattered than when somebody they say something like this about me. But the truth is, as time goes by, things get better. Yeah, it's sports, music, everything. Everyone loves when they were a kid when they were watching. I believe so, yeah. So whoever the best wrestler, you know, we talked about pressure wrestling, everyone always,

the old guys so much better, you know, but it's evolved and they've gotten more athletic and they do cooler stuff. There's exception. There's guys that will transcend and history that will maybe be the best for a few generations. but eventually eventually it won't go yeah absolutely George was an honor

to do this podcast I appreciate you so much I'm excited to see what you do on your podcast journey and I can't wait to speak again some other time thank you man I appreciate you appreciate you