Doughboys - Little Caesars with John Ross Bowie

Episode Date: February 21, 2019

The 'boys are joined by actor and comedian John Ross Bowie (Speechless, Big Bang Theory) to discuss New England eats before reviewing this week's chain, Little Caesars. Plus, another edition of Pie In This Guy.Want more Doughboys? Check out our Patreon!: https://patreon.com/doughboysSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

I was not tired physically. No, the only tired I was was tired of giving in. Writing in her autobiography, My Story, this is how Rosa Parks characterized her pivotal refusal to surrender her bus seat to a white passenger in 1955. The daughter of two former slaves, the Stan Parks took by refusing to stand tipped over a domino that led to the Montgomery bus boycott and the eventual abolition of Jim Crow laws in the American South. While her one-woman sit-in may have been spontaneous, Parks and her husband Raymond, a military barber and organizer in the city's labor movement, had previously spent close to two decades as activists in the fight for racial justice. And the true sacrifice of Parks's

protest is not seen merely in her arrest, but in the lifetime of hardship that followed. Parks and her husband both lost their jobs and, unemployable in Alabama and besieged by death threats, left their home in Montgomery to resettle in Detroit. Parks would work for Congressman John Conyers and had a string of social justice organizations, making little money in the process. Her husband's life was tragically cut short by throat cancer in 1977. She was brutally attacked in her own home in 1994 and subsequently developed dementia. And in the years before her death in 2005, she was destitute and threatened with eviction for non-payment of rent. But that would remain merely a threat due to the efforts of another

famous Detroiter who paid Parks rent out of his own pocket. Mike Illich, who, along with his wife, Marion, had opened a pizzeria in nearby Garden City in 1959. Ignoring the delivery trend and focusing on carry-out pizza targeted at the value-conscious consumer, within a decade the Illiches had 50 franchise locations. In 1979, they introduced a two-for-one deal promoted with the on-the-nose slogan, Pizza Pizza, uttered by its animated big-nose Toga clad mascot who speared pies in the end of his pylum. The chain would grow to over 5,000 locations over the next three decades, enriching Illich to where he could purchase both the Detroit Red Wings and the Detroit Tigers, and launch charitable initiatives to feed disaster

victims and employ veterans. Illich's financial support of Rosa Parks wasn't revealed until after his own death in 2017, a secretive modesty that sharply contrasts with the egomania and greed of chain pizza rival Papa John Snotter. Of course, a billionaire donating a tiny fraction of his income is not equivalent to the actions of a woman who risked ruin to defy segregation. Decency does not compare to heroism, but Illich used his status to help a civil rights trailblazer live out her life with some degree of dignity, and in that small way, as Parks did in her historic way, made the country a fairer place. This week on Doe Boys, Little Caesars. Welcome to Doe Boys, the podcast about chain restaurants. I'm Nick Weiger, alongside my co-host,

Ted Bundy, the Spoon Man, Mike Mitchell. Like Bunt Cake? Like Bunt Cake, but like Ted Bundy, the notorious serial scholar. This doesn't make sense because you are the Ted Bundy one. What you're saying because of my demeanor and my appearance, that I'm kind of a Ted Bundy like I think you just proved my point. With your response, your response back. I think I think you don't look too much like Ted. Who's it? What's your okay? You said I previously am a dead ringer for Jeffrey Dahmer. Oh, you're Dahmer. Yeah, a lot of people agreed with. I definitely have our guesses being nice to you and saying you said no, but you are Dahmer. That was courtesy of at Jeremy Wehrme, W-H-E-R-E me, and he writes,

because of all the cakes he's killed, obviously. So that's his logic for the Ted Bundy. Oh, thanks for clearing it up. Yeah, we need our hands held through that one. If you have an intel, you like me use them and show the top of the show, roastspoonman at gmail.com is the address. We talked about this, that we don't like the, we don't like how like the Netflix thing people are like. Ted Bundy is like a snack. We don't like. Yeah, we hate that. We hate that. He's looking. Let's get this guy who killed several women is looking like an MF snack. Yeah, we don't, we do not. Right. That's, we don't like that. Yes, we, that's got to stop. Right. I mean, he is Bay though. We agree he's Bay. We do agree that Ted Bundy is Bay, but I can't go as far to say

is he's a snack. Right. Wait, no, other way around. Sure. He's a good look. I just don't like any of that. That whole world around it is weird. Right. It's weird. Yeah. But I mean, like, yes, but all that aside, but you know, you do know that he knew how to lay the pipe. Right. Well, we're not going to release this episode. It sounds like apologies to our guest. He seems a not doesn't really care about that. We got a great guest today. We have a fantastic not normally the case on this podcast. You need to stop saying that. It's an insult to the other people we book. They should be better. Step it up Matt Koalek. Nick, I got a little, first of all, oh God. We were just sharing, you know, common experiences

that we've both had. Right. I guess now I want to look the other way as I do this. I apologize. To Spoon Nation. And here we go. Here's a drop. Oh, his drop is fucked up. Wow. You know what? You know who this is. What is going on? This is this is per singer. Oh, per singer fucked up. You know who fucked up even more, Mitch, is you for not prescreening that. We started to play it and then it got too loud and then we didn't do it. You couldn't give it a full listen before

you put it on here. It was shampooed or shampooed or what the fuck happened there? You assigned it to a per singer, which was wrong. It was shampooed or it wasn't per singer with shampoo. You got to get some new blood in the drop game. These guys are getting they're getting lazy. They're resting on their laurels shampoo. They're fucked up. I mean, we're not. First of all, we're not going to do another drop. This is it. That's it. This is the last one. No, no, no. I mean, like we're not going to do another one because that one was fucked right. We'll keep that one in there. I thought at the beginning of it sounded nice. Yeah. I don't know. It ended the way they all do with you saying you can suck your own dick. Shampoo. They're really comes hard at you in

the Twitter comments and it's it's kind of nice. A little shodden Freud to feel it to hear him fail there. Look at him poorly edited drop shampooedler. Step it up more like a sham poodler because that drop was a sham. Wow, man, he's going to be embarrassed. He's fucking roasted. Mitch, you mentioned our guest or thrilled to have me an actor and comedian from Speechless and the Big Bang Theory. John Ross Bowie is here. Hi, John. Hi, guys. Thank you for being here. Oh, I'm thrilled to be here. This is great. We're sorry about the first five minutes. I've never seen anyone sitting in the guest chair look more confused. No, I've heard the drops before. I just was it was I had a levels issue. I had the same issue you guys had. I was just very baffled and and I agree a total sham.

Wow, shampoo there. He's going to be hurting. That's rough. Yeah, it's after a cover from that Bowie. You grew up in New York City, as is my understanding. That is true. How what was it like in your era? Because, you know, it's the best food city in America, I think that inarguably. What were what was your what were your eating habits in the city growing up? You know, I know like like in our in our era, it was more you were getting a lot more at home. You read a lot more home prepared meals. What was the case in the city when you're grown up? Why are you saying error like that? It's very strange to me. Okay, I've just never heard you say that before. Error. What did you think I was saying? No, I'm just saying the the entire thing of his in our era.

All right, whatever. Just keep we're of a similar generation. Yes, I who you and me all of us. Yeah, no shit. That's what I'm saying. I'm like 10 years older than you guys. It's them and I'm old. I'm, you know, significantly older than not significantly. Not significantly. Yeah. I think Nick, that's what I was confused by. There's a larger gap between us and you song than us and you. That's very the other direction. Fair enough. You song is you song is basically baby's day out. He waddled into the he waddled into the podcast and he and he does great. He strikes me. It's very, very young. He's very young. By the way, Mitch, you haven't you haven't R. C. P. D. You song's bar mitzvah yet. That's coming up. Who is there a theme song?

It's a nervous energy energy is the theme. I love it. I am. You know what? I lived in in midtown Manhattan. So we we there were there were chain restaurants. Right. But not as many. It was sort of it was the 70s and 80s when I was growing up. Right. It was sort of pre gentrification of that neighborhood and Disney hadn't bought out Times Square yet. So it was still like in the 70s. It was all grindhouses and right and porn theaters and I was not allowed on that stretch of land. That's crazy to think about. Fairly free reign. I was on 44th between 9th and 10th and the deuces 42nd between 7th and 8th. So you'll note over that is that three or four blocks and all the way up until the age of 18.

My parents were just like that. You do not go on that block. Man. A lot of wiggle room. A lot of wiggle room. You do not go on that block. And I was like, all right, that's that's fair. Yeah. You know, you've asked for one city block that I can't go on. Also, I'm not in a huge rush to go on that block. Yeah. In hindsight, I regret it just because I could have seen like crazy kung fu triple features with like, you know, people on Angel Dust around me, which would have been kind of fascinating. That feels like a road not traveled. But yeah, we would eat in the neighborhood. There was a lot of the Hell's Kitchen has always been a really good food neighborhood. So there was a lot of good Italian. There was a there was some good pizza. There was great Chinese on like

Chinese is one of those things like Mexican here in LA. It's one of those things where like, there's tiniest, shittiest hole in the wall and you're probably going to be okay. Yeah. You know, you're probably you're probably going to leave there pretty sated. Right. Yeah. It's just a really safe bet in New York City the way it isn't quite in LA, but our Mexican food and our sushi is really good. So, you know, you accept it for what it is and not for what it isn't, Mike. I agree. You know what? There's there's some things about it that like what's the place down here? The Oh God, now I can't remember anything. I'm scared for whatever reason. Why? What's the place down here? Just tacos. Yeah, you gotta get. I'm literally just going by where you pointed House of

Pies, Yuckas, Starbucks, the the the the v it is. I think it's beaten the the Saps Coffee House. Oh yes. Damn God. I can't believe I got it. Have you been to Saps before? No, I haven't. It's so good and it was on Jonathan Gold's list and that is that was one of those places that was just like it's a hole in the wall and it works out. But I agree with you that you can go to another place. It's a hole in the wall out here and then it's complete trash and it is it is a hole in the wall. Sometimes. Yeah, it's it's kind of a kind of a crapshoot. But yeah, it was we didn't eat out a ton. Right. But we when we did there were there were a lot of good options. The town that neighborhood is it's gotten a lot more expensive. But it's still terrific for restaurants. It's a

great little stretch of food. Ninth Avenue has a food festival every May or at least they used to until recently and 20 blocks and like all the restaurants come out with booths and you know sell their wares and you it's really it's this incredible it's New York kind of at its best. You know, it's crowded and filthy, but it's also like all this great food and everybody descends upon the neighborhood. I'm a Bostonian, but I New York rules. I like New York a lot. I think it's a fun place. Oh, that's very generous of you. Yeah, we don't hear that from a lot of Bostonians. That's very generous. New York is it's a cool. It's a cool city. Nick might like New York less than I actually taking your fingernails into your palm while you say that. It's hard for people

from Boston to do that. I am sympathetic to you that you're travails here and you didn't say you like the Yankees. That's fine. I don't like the Yankees nor do I for that matter. That's fine. Are you a Metz? All right. Hell yeah. Yeah, we're like, I mean, where it's New York is like it is. It's a it's we're brothers or we're siblings. We're but we do have love for each other when it comes down for it. I mean, Boston's got a rivalry with pretty much every city, right? It's just an inferiority complex in your already piece of shit. Talk about being from Boston. You know this. I don't have hard data in front of me here, but people from Boston talk about being from Boston. Maybe more than people from New York talk about being from New York. You know,

I will say this also is that a lot of the time they're not from Boston. That's right, which is very frustrating. I mean, I'm not either. But all the time you're from Quincy. I'm from Quincy. It's its own city. It's its own city. Yeah, I at least Nick is Nick is smiling big time right now. No, you own you. You mentioned the Quincy thing. I mean, I say Quincy all the time, but also Quincy is right there. Right. There's like there's so many people from like Western like they're as close to New York as they are to Boston. Here is my question. And my wife is from the North Shore of Massachusetts in Swamsket. Oh, yeah. And she always says Boston, and I always make fun of her for that. She is not from Boston. She is from a town that is so small. It doesn't

have a mayor. It has select men. It blew my fucking mind the first time I heard it. Like I am as provincial. I am the most provincial like New Yorker you've ever met. Like I don't understand how small towns work at all. We'll talk a little bit about the one where we both lived briefly, but the idea of a town being so small, it didn't have a fucking mayor just baffled me. Having grown up with like Ed Koch, the most famous mayor possibly in the world. This guy's like, oh, we didn't have him. We had select men. And by the way, I immediately picture the guys from the Crucible. That's what I got in my head. That's the five white guys from the Crucible. They probably were or the descendants of the metaphor. I guess it's a work of fiction.

No, there's a direct line from those characters in Arthur Miller play. You know what we're saying. Yeah. Don't be pedantic. Yeah. The don't be pedantic your piece of shit. That's my whole game. Here's my question. It's Quincy on the tee. Yes, it's on the red line. This thing. And that's the thing. And that appears to be the thing where people like will cut you a little slack. If you were on the greater Boston rapid transit system, people allow you to say I'm from I'm from Boston. I have to take has to drive to Wonderland. Oh, okay. That's her nearest tee stop. And what is that? What is what is Wonderland? Is that the is that like the purple line or something? The end of the blue line. Oh, good call. It's near. Is it right near

Revere? Am I right about that? It's just past Revere because that's where my sister would drop me off when I was coming back from New Hampshire. She dropped me off at Wonderland and I'd take the tee in. There wasn't very recently a dog track right there. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know too much about anything nor. I'm a self sure boy and then in town. You know, the sad thing for me, Nick, I love Boston so much. I never got to. I never got to live there because I didn't. I went to school somewhere else. I didn't. I didn't get to. I didn't get to live in the in the city ever. Yeah, it's kind of stolen valor on your part ground wearing that Boston merch everywhere. The Boston Strong shirt that I wear constantly. I I'm but Quincy is next

to Dorchester and then Southie and and so it is in that it's the one. It's one over. Yeah. Yeah, but I also say that I'm from Quincy. You know, you're very, you're very open about that. I go for it. I will say when I went to school, it's it's this funny thing because when I came out here to like I've said this to Nick before so often like Chicago guys will be like he's a Chicago guy. I love him. He like he's one and then like with a Boston person. They're like I'm from Boston. I don't know if I like you. You might be an asshole. Like there's a huge chance that you're I don't like you. That's so funny. When I meet people from New York out here, I meet from New York City and that's a whole five very distinct boroughs. Right. Oh, yeah, I know. There are

five very distinct boroughs and they are delineated as such and they name every one of them in the film Gotti with John Travolta. I will have to see. I hear it. I hear it's just you just need to see it. Yeah. That area is called the deuce. Yeah. Um, I mean, not anymore, but it was that was its nickname in the that explains to show the deuce. Yeah, there you go. Oh, yeah, that hasn't been revealed in what I've seen so far. I guess it hasn't just took it for granted. But you can actually see the block I grew up and then the opening credits of that show. Oh, no way. There's a shot of 44th between 9th and 10th in the opening credits of the deuce and my wife sits on the couch next to me and goes, that's where your parents decided to raise you. That's where your

parents in their infinite wisdom said, we shall raise our only child, our single heir. We will raise here. Was it was it was it a tough? That's the fucking 70s in the West 40s. I was three blocks from Times Square. I was crazy. That's that's so just because even just thinking of growing up in Boston in the 80s and like there was the combat zone in a couple places that were bad. Oh, right. Where was the combat zone? Is that Dorchester? I'm gonna help us out here. It was kind of close to your school. It's right. We're in colleges now. It's in. Do you know Boston? Well, a little bit. Yeah, it's right downtown on the corner of the commons of Tremont and Boylston. If you went down into Chinatown, I got up to like downtown crossing that whole area was the

combat. It would have been crazy to go to to be in your school at that point. I said I wanted to go to Emerson. My dad looked it up on a map and was like, oh fuck. No, that's in the combat zone. And I was like, let's just go look at it, but it's all he didn't realize that I had Mayor Menino came in and Emerson bought up all those buildings and made it into their campus and it cleaned it up a little bit. Let me. Chinatown used to be really rough in Boston, right? Chinatown still is a little rough sometimes. I mean, there are certain streets that you don't necessarily want to be on late at night. Interesting there, but it's relatively safe walking. I mean, it's kind of like, I mean, how New York, except yeah, some areas. I mean, it's a city. You have to walk

like, you know, you can't just like walk around like an idiot. You have to know that you're where you're going, like be aware of your surroundings, right? See on the eye contact. Yeah, the commons is still there and the commons at night can get a little hairy. Yeah, obviously, I mean, it's like you don't go to parks. Yeah, exactly Park. Exactly. Let me just say I just want to say that once you said you can't just walk around like an idiot. Nick smiled and then started staring at me because yes, of course I've walked around Boston like an idiot. I'll run past that. Let me just say that like hearing you guys talk about this hyper specific Boston geography. It must be how most of our listeners feel hearing us talk about Star Wars

planets. When we launch into Kashyyyk and Dagobah and Endor, people are just like, Oh, well, what the fuck these nerds are going on about. You definitely don't want to be. What is Mustafar? Oh, boy. What is what is Mustafar? That's what Darth Vader's kind of line aware. Yeah, that's it. That's in the lava world three. Yeah. Okay. You don't want to be on Mustafar. You don't want to be out on Mustafar late at night. It can be. It can be a pretty rough place to walk around with all that lava. Yeah, generally speaking, the lava is and then Darth Vader took up a home there. He had a residence. Well, great schools. M. U. Mustafar U. In 30 seconds, there will be a red bubble shirt that says M. U. Thanks to that

reference. Someone on T-Public is going to go buck wild with that. And now it stands for Marvel Universe. Anyways, it's the same difference, Nick. If you ask me, they're Marvel movies now. Star Wars are marbles. Star Wars are crusade against the modern Star Wars. That's right. We're not going to spend the next 90 minutes discussing. I got to do this whole thread here because I remember being a boy in Boston and being like, oh, this is a city and this is nerve wracking and scary or whatever. And I can't imagine what's like 70s New York is and just seeing pictures of it and just blocks and blocks that are were nothing. And it was pretty scary. I won't lie. It took me years to realize how I have a mild low key PTSD from growing up there and no disrespect to my parents.

They met well and there is something kind of cool about being able to say I grew up in New York then. But yeah, we came home to find our house ransacked twice. That sucks. I got mugged a few times before I was 14. That's no fun. I don't recommend that. There are other grizzlier stories about things that happened to friends of mine that would really drag down this podcast quite a bit. So yeah, it was a strange place, man. It was a really, really strange place. This was Ford to New York, Drop Dead. The city was in dire financial straits. Can I ask a weird question about this? I know the answer already, but I'm saying like that does add character to a city, right? I mean, I know it's not a good thing to have to have people, you know, living in bad

areas and not living below the poverty line and crime and murder and murder and crime. I'm saying I'm saying that like they're people now, though, when they talk about New York, they're like, yeah, whatever, it's Disney five or whatever. I don't know. Well, first of all, I don't know who's middle class and living in New York. Yeah, that's not impossible to be middle class in that city. The pendulum has swung so far because of gentrification that now like, yeah, this gritty, dirty area is now an M&M store only frequented by tourists. I've even seen like a lot of the local establishments in New York, a lot of the beloved local businesses have been driven out. Now it's like a Chase Bank or a Jimmy John's. Is corporate America better than the way thing?

I don't know. I mean, that is, of course, it's better than murder, I guess. Right. It's probably better than murder. You know, there was a little pocket after Giuliani gets credit for cleaning up Times Square, which isn't entirely accurate. Times Square was falling apart just because the free market said, oh, we have home video now, you do not have to go into a room full of strangers and look at pornography. Yeah. And so those theaters all closed very quickly. Nick actually still prefers that method. Yeah, I'm doing my best to keep them afloat. Good for you. Good for you. There's something appealingly retro about that. But it was a very clear thing of like,

just the free market will not sustain this. These places are closing and all these empty old theaters there. And I kind of wish they'd sold it to somebody maybe a little smaller than Disney or sold off chunks of it rather than the whole block. It really changed. And when you change Times Square, you really did change. It just set the shockwave throughout the entire city. Yeah. And now I've got people who are getting priced out of Ridgwood Queens, which is two trains in a bus from midtown. That's crazy. That's crazy to think about. You know, MassBath, places where like, oh, you live out there. When I was growing up, you know, they were at the Hinterlands. They were still in New York City, but they were way the hell out there. And I know people who are

having trouble who were looking at rents in LA because yes, they are cheaper than living in New York. That's crazy. Man, imagine those theaters when you first buy them. They were probably like giant spider webs. They were giant spider webs, but they were also like old vaudeville houses too. So you had these incredible old, you know, aside from whatever gross jokes you want to make about the floor, they were these incredible old like proscenium houses that had wingspace and all this cool stuff. And a couple of them had turned into legitimate theaters. That's great. And a couple of them were like kind of they kept the exteriors and turned and gutted them and turned them into multiplexes. Or I think there's a Chili's. There's a few places. There's three actual

like theater theaters on the block. Right. I don't know. I mean, I feel like I wish it wasn't such an all or nothing proposition. Yeah. The transformation of New York. Yeah. I really wish there had been a slightly gentler transition. No more murder, but then also still middle class families. Yeah. Also a couple of small businesses here and there wouldn't kill you. Yeah. Right. There's got to be a way for us to have like less crime, but also, you know, we can keep the occasional mom and pop coffee shop open. Yeah. Yeah, I get that. That's, uh, yeah, it's sad. Well, also speaking of which, when you went to college, you went up to, you moved away from New York City. Yes. And you went to a place that we both went to. Ithaca College. Ithaca College. That was a great transition

by me. That was good. All right. Thank you. It was fine. It was fine. Yeah. I went to, I went to Ithaca because I wanted, I wanted something that would, and maybe you felt the same way. I wanted something that would be very, like it's funny, you mentioned Emerson. I got into Emerson. That's where I went. And they had a great program and I didn't get into a ton of schools. So I wasn't like, you know, sifting through a ton of offers this particular fall or this particular spring, but Emerson felt like, well, if I go to Boston, that's another big city. Yeah. I should really try and see what it's like to live somewhere small. Yeah. That's, I did, I did feel similar that I was like, oh, this will be fun. This will be very college-y. And then I don't know if I regret it.

I mean, like once it starts snowing in October or something, then it's, you're kind of like, winters are brutal. And they last almost the entire year. It's really crazy. Oh, the year before I graduated, there was snow at the graduation in May. That's, there was my freshman year, there was snow at the graduation in May as well. Right. It's insane. Nick, you would absolutely hate it. Yeah. I can't, I mean, I'm not like a cool, I've a lifelong Southern Californian, so I do not take the cold well. Yeah. Like I feel like we were just in, and I mentioned this on the show, but we were just in Saskatoon, Saskatchewan for a recent live episode that should be out in the feed by now. And yeah, I felt like I was walking in a walk-in

freezer. It was like, it was so, and it wasn't even as cold as it gets there. It gets colder. Oh, it gets much colder. It's like it was negative, it was like negative 40 today, like in the last day or so. Oh, that's like Central Canada, right? That must have been brutal. That's crazy. I can't imagine what that's like. But you would, I mean, you'd get up in the morning, you'd take a shower, you'd go to your 8am class and your hair would freeze. Oh yeah, for sure. Your hair would freeze. Wow. You would show up with frozen hair for your 8am intro to poetry with Kevin Murphy, who I think is still teaching there. Oh yeah. Not the guy from Mystery Science Theater, although that would have been awesome. Right. Like Jack Nicholson frozen at the end of

the shining frozen. You would have an actual icicle banging against your forehead as you're like reading Theodore Retke and Sylvia Plath. It was intense, man. So wind also up there was very bad too. I think a wind kills you. Because it comes off the lake and it hits us right at the top of that hill there. It was, you know, it's funny. It's such a weird town. It's so, it's such a progressive community. They have their own, this is always so hard to explain, I'm going to need somebody to help me out here. All right. They have their own currency. Okay. Yeah. Called Ithaca Hours. Yeah. Which you can use in local businesses. The city, yes. Not the college. The city has its own currency. Yes. They, I think the name of them

maybe has changed. Okay. But yes, they did. Yeah. To keep money local. Yeah. And to keep it in, invested in the smaller businesses that are in that town. There was a McDonald's on the Commons when I was there. But that was it as far as like downtown Ithaca goes. Yeah. I have no other. That's crazy because that, I think that maybe had closed. But then there was, that is something that's changed. I went, I went there recently and there was like a subway on the Commons. Oh really? There used to be. Nothing. Yeah. There used to be just all locally owned restaurants and locally owned. There was a comic book shop down there and there were, there were recon shops. Yeah. And the McDonald's was kind of an outlier, but they were

open really early. So you had like, you know, if you happen to be on the Commons like 6am, you would like someplace that would get you a cup of coffee or something. Right. I don't know if I ever saw the Commons at 6am. Actually, I rode crew. So I did, I actually did. That's true. You were an early riser for a time. I was an early riser for, oh God, that would kill, when I would wake up at like 5am and then go to bed at like 9am. Don't you have to do that for like, because you're an actor. Don't you have to do that for an early call sometimes? Oh yeah. You do. Yeah. Bowie, how often are you up for like, at the crack of dawn? Couple times a week. Wow. Yeah. Couple times a week. What is your routine when you're up that early and you're going to set and

it's like 5 or 6am? I, you know what, it's really weird because I don't consider myself a morning person, but I do love having Olympic Boulevard to myself. It's amazing. Yeah, for sure. When I'm gunning it, because I have to go over to Century City to shoot and that can be a hike. And that, if I have a normal person's call of 9am, that's an hour. Right. Minimum that's an hour. Yeah. And that's an hour with Waze taking me on these dangerous left turns through like, you know, Chevy at Hills or whatever. Yeah. God, that stresses me out. I hate driving. And like, when I have to make a fucking unprotected left turn in one of these apps, give me the extra four minutes and let me take a major street with a protected left turn. What are you doing to me?

You're stressing me out. You're yelling at the Waze ghost right now. The Waze ghost? I am within 100%. Waze doesn't care if I live or die. That's why, that's why, that's why the, that is why it's a ghost. Because Waze was the guy who used his own app and got killed. Well, it's dark. It's a dark history. The, yeah. So a 6am call is awesome. 6am call. I leave it like 544 and I teleport there. It's great. That is, that is the, that is the one thing that rules about the 6am call. There's, yeah, it's, it's, you never see the city like that. It's insane. It's funny. Most of, we have huge chunks of our crew that live deep valley or the beach cities. And I was like, oh God, that sucks. How do you, oh God, no, you're here first. You're first in,

last out. Right. Crew member, it's not an issue. You have a 15 minute commute. Either direction does not matter. Yeah. People coming up from Manhattan Beach. Can do, yeah, I can do it in the same, like under 20, it's insane. It's provided they're their first thing, which they have to be, then they're all set. Yeah. Yeah. It's the damnedest thing. My thing with early morning, I wonder how you feel about this with early, very early mornings in NIC being on set or whatever you get this. I don't love to eat. I don't like to eat early in the morning. I can't do it. I, my, my first meal is usually at lunch because it will upset my stomach. If it's just, if it's like, if I'm up at 5am or something like that, I usually don't like to eat. Power bar and

a cup of coffee. Yeah. That's it. Yeah. And then I, I just eat the casing. My lunch comes in. I eat the box. You know, I've been doing lately as I'll do the AM banana. That's why I move like that. Oh, that's my little bit of fuel. Very Minions. You're saying because I'm, because I like grew in the Despicable E franchise and all the Minions, you think that's what, that's why I'm picking up a banana? It's not for that, just for that reason. Nick is, I'm aware. You're 39, 38, 39. 38. Okay. I know about Nick's thing. There's a while there where I thought it was ironic. Oh, me too. No, no, it's pretty, it's pretty genuine. Yeah. No, there's no irony. I don't, I don't dislike the Minions. They're a lot of fun. I have children

after all. Right. I enjoy the odd Minion. Sure. Yeah. That, if you've been to the, you've obviously been to the 3D ride at Universal. Yeah. It's, you have notes. You have notes. Look at you. Holy shit. No, I actually, look, it's not what you want it to be. I like Despicable Me Minion mayhem. What I would say is that I just find like the 3D dark ride experience a little, it gives a little motion sickness. And so like in terms of like spending time with my Minion friends, I don't know. And like a physical ride where I could go on a track and sort of like, you know, wave it. I'm like, maybe like even just something gentle. Hold on a second. You want like a small world style ride? Like a Monsters Inc experience at California Adventure. Like the Winnie the Pooh ride

at Disneyland, something where, you know, you're seeing some physical 3D models of them. That just might be fun. Have you done, I just did this for the first time the other day. Yeah. Have you done the Transformers ride at Universal? Yes, I've done it. It's exhausting. It is, it's, it's a lot. It is a lot. Yeah. I actually had to close my eyes and tell myself it wasn't happening for a moment or two. It's, it's, it's, it's your on a track moving and then also it is like 3D. Really good 3D. Right. Did you find the, you find the Allspark though? The Allspark is, the Allspark is about, that is what it's about. It's all about the Allspark. Wow. You get eaten. People are fighting over the Allspark and you're, you're a Transformer and you're, you have arms that come out and it's

a whole thing. And but yeah, the Allspark is like the McGuffin that triggers the entire ride. Yeah. And they should just retcon McGuffin into Allspark at this point. They really should. It is, it was, I'm a different man than I was before I took the Transformers ride. It's, it's, it's, it's a, there's, there's people who are changed coming off the ride. My metabolism is different. Like I don't process grief the way I should. I'm, I'm just a very different man having done the Transformers 3D ride. Yeah. And you, you, you parked a Honda fit at the curb and then it turned into you. It's like, oh man, it's wild. You get eaten by like a big robot monster. You get sucked into its mouth. And you get, why does that happen? Cause Maggie sucks you into her mouth too

on the Simpsons ride. Well, Maggie gets mutated. She, she becomes, yeah, very big. She wanders into something at the nuclear plant. Yeah. She's not, cause grandpa Simpson falls asleep. That's right. That's a good script. The, the Simpsons ride. Written by Matt Warburton, I believe. I was that one? Yeah. For Warburton. Yeah. He's, he rules. There's, there's a lot of good jokes in that ride. And it has a lot of the same, it's, but that's more like a California, what is it, soaring California kind of thing. Yes, right. You kind of go up and there's some movement certainly, but it's not 3D.

And you can kind of convince yourself that it's not happening, happening, which I struggled with, with the, with the Transformers ride. I was about, I was getting devoured by a car. There was that one great thing where you go through an office building. Yes. That's, that is kind of amazing. That rules. I think with all those rides though, they kind of like fade. Like the Simpsons ride is like faded. No, like, and that's only just like not, it's like 10 years old. Is that what you mean? I'm saying like, yeah, like, like the screen like looks like faded and, and not as good anymore.

I'm sure the screen has some wear and tear. And I've also heard like that was like, this was a big Roger Ebert crusade is that he talked about the bulb that was used for projection. A lot of times they just like, they'd run it for so long, well, well past the point where it would, you know, it had dimmed. And so a lot of, like you go to a lot of theaters and just the picture would just look dim because they would, this was back when they use film projectors and because they just weren't replacing it because it was expensive to do so. So that could be a similar sort of thing. It could be what it is. Yeah.

Back to Ithaca quickly. Yes, please. I want to hear some of your favorite spots to eat in Ithaca. Were you a shortstop deli person? Occasionally. Occasionally. I love shortstop personally. Shortstop was good. What was the place that just had a car drive into it a few years ago on the corner of the Commons? You song? What, what place did you drive your car into? In the Gale House. Mahogany Grill. Oh, Mahogany Grill. Madeline's. Madeline's. What are you doing?

Wait, oh, wait, wait, wait, wait, what? Oh, sorry. Okay, bye. What just happened? I think he was running through the options of what could have been. It was the place where it was literally at the bottom of the hill and if you were coming down the hill, coming down 96 and you and you looked at that restaurant and be like, well, it's really the only matter of time before someone loses control of their brakes and it eventually happened. And it wasn't like it wasn't a on purpose thing. It was, you know, a car lost control and drove into it. And but that was a really kind of cute little place for good people watching when it was there. There was a place called, oh God, what was the pizza

place? There was a decent like kind of New York style pizza place called sort of with an N. Wait, Naples. Was it Naples? Oh yeah, Naples. They have great wings in Naples. Yeah. Is Naples still there? Naples is still there. Is it the one? It's like off the commons, right? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Naples is still there. Oh, good. That's nice. Naples are really, that was like a nice, slightly, not quite just we're going to grab a slice, just a notch above that kind of pizza place. It is. College Town Bagels was very reliable. Oliver's up in, which was actually a deli that would do my band played there a couple of times in my senior year. What was the other place? My father went to Colgate, which is in Hamilton. Oh, yeah.

He was about an hour and a half away and he used to go to Ithaca and he'd get shitfaced at the chapter house. Yes. Okay. Yeah. I never really went to the chapter house that much, but that's like a famous one. Chapter house is great. And as I said, I didn't drink in college, but they made their own root beer and their own ginger ale. Yes. So this brew house, but they also made soft drinks that were really good. Yeah. I rode against, I rode against Colgate. I rode crew against Colgate and I was just thinking of how that sounds like the douchiest thing on earth. You know why you're off the hook and you're probably going to be able to finish my sentence because yes, the crew guys were not

great. Yeah. Who was worse? The worst than the crew guys? Oh, God. They had their own house at the base of the South Hill when I was there. Right. Oh, not anymore. At his family house. Is it the little cross team? Bingo. Yeah. The fucking lax guys were the worst people in the world. There are, there are a few crew guys I like, but I didn't, I didn't, I didn't get, I didn't fit in with the, I didn't fit in really with anyone is the truth. I never have it, never will. Or fit into most places physically. Why would you? You can't, you can't shame him for that on a show where you're all about chain restaurants. I do do it too much. I watched all of us just house several little Caesars pizzas and you're going to shame Mike for. No, no. Honestly.

Yeah. You know what? This is true. You're right. I should do that less. It's the gimmick. It is the shtick. You are selling out the entire conceit of the podcast, essentially. Fucking monster. So, you know, there's that house that, that they tell Freshman is the Adam's family house at the bottom of the hill. Oh yeah. Yeah. It's not. Yes. But Freshman, before the internet especially, we'd be like, Oh God, so Adam's family house. Cool. They shot it up here. I don't know. They fucking didn't. It's beautiful Victorian. Like it's really gorgeous to look at. It's really, really cool. They say that Ithaca is, they say that Ithaca was like the first if there was Hollywood before there was Hollywood. There was film production up there. Yes. Which

also what a, like if that, if they chose to have Hollywood in Ithaca, it would have been the worst decision. You have like about three weeks where you can be outside comfortably. There would probably be about like three channels still now because no one would have gotten, they'd go up there and be like, I'm not going to be in entertainment. This is too cold. I'm out of here. It sucks. But Rod Serling was, he taught it at, he was a professor at Ithaca. He was a professor at Ithaca and he, they hold his archives. They hold the Rod Serling archives up there. Spooky as hell, Nick. And it's scary. Who was, a year ahead of me, but I didn't know him was David Boreanis. Oh yes. Yeah. David Boreanis was a 92. I didn't know him. Bones himself.

But it was my, he wasn't Bones. The Deschanel girl was Bones. I'd say this, having played a suspect on the show. Wait, David Boreanis is not, no, he's not Bones. Of the characters Bones. Yeah, that's the whole thing. CCH Pounder also Ithaca. That's right. CCH Pounder. I've gotten a chance to speak to her about it. I have, what are other Ithaca alums I've spoken to who have gone on to. Andy Daly, I know, was there. Andy Daly was my year, second it was a 92. Okay. And a guy named Terry Jinn, who was a big New York, UCB guy back in like the late 90s. He was, they were all Ithaca. Those were the guys who were like, oh, you should try this. Oh man. I owe them my career in no uncertain terms.

I just, I just feel bad that it really fell off. I'm the, I'm the new, I'm like the Gremlins two to your guys, Gremlins one. No, there's a lot of Broadway guys who came out of Ithaca. You're not, no one's blaming you for the decline. There's a lot of Broadway guys. Did you ever go to Moose Woods in Ithaca? Yeah, I went to Moose Woods at the Cashew Chili over there. Yeah. Cashew Chili. It's arguably the most famous vegetarian restaurant in the country. They have a cookbook that's pretty famous that's been in like 80 printings or something. World's famous restaurant, Nick. How is this Cashew Chili? Is it good? It's not bad? It's not bad. That's the protein. Yeah. I've dealt with some because I've,

I've encountered a number of vegetarian chilis and, and it is a dish that I felt like the vegetarian version. I've never found one that's quite satisfying. No, listen, you got to go in there knowing it's Cashew Chili and it will not fool you. Yeah. But it's, for what it is, it's like a herty vegetarian stew. And yeah, you, that's one thing about, one of the good things about Ithaca for me was that it kind of opened my eyes about vegetarian cuisine. I tried a lot more stuff. I tried tofu for the first time in Ithaca. It's weird, you know, it's because on the one hand, it's such a progressive hippie town and it's so spiritual and you can buy so many dream catchers in so many locations in that town. And there's the one hand, and I've made

this joke before, but it's true. There's the one hand where you're like, my God, what a gorgeous, progressive utopia. And on the other hand, you're like, put some shoes on, you're in a museum, you know, it's just there's this incredible 100%. And you are, I think we're allowed to have that sort of push pull of like, oh, this is great. And then also, and also then you drop in a drop of broy baseball hat wearing college guys, which I looked like when I went there, but I'm saying there's a lot of that as well. I saw an extra layer of Ithaca because I studied to be an English teacher and I did my student teaching at Ithaca High. So I went, the reason I was on the Commons at six a.m. a bunch my senior year is because I was up the crack of dawn to get

to school by eight and bummed a ride with a, I didn't know how to drive yet. I grew up in New York City, didn't have my license. And a girl named Jessica used to give me a ride to Ithaca High School because we were both teaching in the English department there, we'd get there early before the kids got there. So I saw this huge and Ithaca High is fascinating because it was you had farmers kids and you had Carl Sagan's kids literally in the same class. Carl Sagan's son had just graduated the year before and I taught two sections of 10th grade, two sections of 12th grade lit and it was it was really interesting because there were some really beautiful posh parts of Ithaca and there were some really shitty parts of Ithaca

and there were there was public housing down near down near the not the lake, but the creek. I know what you're talking about. Where the railroad track is. Literally, there was another side of the track to Ithaca. And so I got to see and I remember like like walking home with a bunch of kids one day just because we were all headed in the same direction and I was like, well, I'm not technically a teacher and I'm we're all for all I'll walk with these kids for a while and they were living in like really, really rundown homes in a part in parts of Ithaca that I had never that I'd only driven through. So it was a really interesting eclectic place and it kind of slowed my heart rate in a way that I needed. From coming from

New York City. Yeah, it really did kind of like, you know, I still had all this sort of weird misdirected anger and stuff, but it was it calmed me down in a way that I think of an urban university wouldn't have. Yeah. I can't tell if it calmed down or got me more angry. Yeah, that's what I was going to say. I wonder about the opposite effect on you. I feel like this this it makes me want to move to like, I got to go to like a small cold weather town for a few years. I got to get out of the by by red of being in Southern California. Yeah, your bubble, your cat, your Southern California bubble, Nick. You know what I can recommend actually having visited if you want California's Ithaca Santa Cruz.

Oh, yeah. Santa Cruz. Santa Cruz. Santa Cruz. You've been to Santa Cruz. Did you get an Ithaca vibe from Santa Cruz? Oh, definitely. Right. There's something very. And it is a college town. It's a big college town, like the huge part of the town's economy. Everybody's Jordan, Morris, Jesse Thorn, both Santa Cruz alums. That's right. We talked about it. I did their podcast. Actually, we talked about the comparisons between the two towns. And there is something very laid back yet still, but not like Venice, California laid back. Yeah. And not like, you know, Hermosa Beach laid back. Yeah. Laid back intellectualism is what I think you would you would thrive in, Weiger. Yeah. And I think Santa Cruz and Ithaca have that in common,

but you have none of these snow issues. Right. I think in which if you were in Ithaca the time I was, I probably hate you. I got a question for you. Carl Sagan was his, uh, was his son like a bully? Wouldn't that have been amazing? No, I don't think it was. He was a good kid and a good student. Giving kids wedgies. That would have been fantastic though. Oh my god. You know what? Let's spread the rumor. Yeah. Carl Sagan's kid, vicious virulent misogynist, and, uh, and just really, uh, stuffed me into a locker and I was a student teacher. What the fuck? The rumor starts now. Yeah. If we're gonna, if we're gonna bring up topics from 10 minutes ago to say a joke we've been sitting on, can I do the same? Yeah. Uh, hey, uh,

Bowie, your, your dad went to Colgate University. What do you major in flossing? Nailed it. Good stuff. Strong. Very, very strong. Nowadays, you can, as you know, Nick, my father's no longer with us, but I will. Nick, what the hell? I apologize. You make this funny joke about his dad. I was coaching your team when it happened. Okay. Was that true? I knew that. I know it's totally fine. I can't help but bring a party down sometime. It really is. I've said this before. The dead dad, dad card is a very fun card to play. My dad is dead as well. It's just a very, it's a fun card to play and I do it to you a lot too. It changes the ecosystem around you so abruptly, so abruptly.

So just a seismic shift in the room. Hey, Nick, you know, nowadays you could probably major in flossing anyways, the other flossing. You mean the dance the kids do? The Fortnite dance. But he just rubbed his eyes. I've just rubbed. He's continuing to rub his eyes. This is an visual medium, but he is rubbing his eyes with a man who is like at the end of his rope at the negotiating table as little surface areas. There is for his eyes as massive as his hands are still getting a good rub in there. I was embarrassed. I was very embarrassed by that joke. So then you, you, you, you went down to the city. You went back to New York City after Ithaca. I did, yeah. And you stayed there for a few years before you came out here.

To LA, yeah. I was in New York for another eight years. I moved back and I went back to teach for one year at my old high school, actually, which was exhausting. And it might have been, maybe if I'd taken a break and got into grad school and then gone back, but I was 22 years old and looked about 18. And, you know, a bunch of the teachers knew me. There were a couple of students who were on the six year plan who were like, Oh dude, you were in my gym class. That's crazy. That's nuts. You should tell people that, man. That's bad. That reflects poorly on you. Don't tell people that. But yeah, so I did that for a year. I was like a long-term sub and they, they weren't able to offer me like a full-time position. And I didn't like, it wasn't a, you know,

security's going to show you out. I was like, listen, I'm going to go at peace. This is, I'm technically being laid off, but it's really fine. I'm okay. I'm exhausted. I need to figure out what I'm doing. And then, yeah, just like, you know, there was the band and there was temping and there was kind of all this 20-something stuff before all those Ithaca guys talked to me into taking the improv. Oh, no way. Okay, cool. And I got a, so I keep saying I got a question for you. I can relax. It's all right. New York City, I mean, that you, they, they claim to have the best pizza in the world. Are you big, are you big, are you big pizza person? I am. And are you like a New York slice guy? You can't be beat raise, famous raise or whatever. There's a million

raise. There's a million raise. I've been, I've been to the actual good raise before and it was good. Yeah. Yeah. It was very good. There's plenty of raise that suck. Yeah. There are plenty of raised that suck. And the idea that you, I mean, I am of the opinion that like bad pizza is still going to be pretty good. Even if you, do you remember, uh, Rogans? Oh, yeah. Rogans sucked. Yeah. It was still, in a pinch it would do. It worked. Yeah. Yeah. Rogans was this, uh, chain, uh, not a chain, it was just one off place on right off campus. Yeah. And they did incredible business because you could get a pie and four small pepsis for five bucks. And it was basically like a, was it like a convenience store gas station? Like it's, it's like a, yeah,

it was very much, but it was, and it wasn't bad. It wasn't terrible. It was not good though. But it was not good. It wasn't good. It wasn't good. It wasn't really, it wasn't prickly spicy. It had no like, it was, it was just a pizza like food that it would bring and took no time at all. And you didn't have to go all the way down the hill. And it was cheaper than Domino's. Yeah. And it was, uh, it would, and Napoli's didn't deliver and it was a whole thing. Yeah. Um, so yeah, Rogans, but still Rogans got me through untold late nights at that place. Um, there are crappy rays, uh, in New York, but there was a couple of great places. There was a place, I don't remember what it was called. It's gone now anyway. There's a place right near Central Park that my mom and I

used to go to all the time that it was like a buck 50 for a slice and a coke. And that was really, that was a great deal even in the 80s. Right. Um, John's Pizza on Bleaker, the brick oven place. Okay. That's really good. That's a really good, uh, kind of sit down. They don't do slices, but that's a really good sit down place pizza box further down on Bleaker for just a simple slice thing. Okay. A lot of good places in the West village. And then if you get over to little Italy, of course, you're in really safe hands. All those places are really reliable. I've never, I've never had like besides going to that, like the original rays or whatever. I've never had like the best of New York City pizza. I feel like I have to have more than even when I've gone over

there and done whatever Delclos Marathon or whatever. I just have never and I know that Connecticut has a couple big spots on the list. Right. Nick, we went to a place in Arizona that is ranked one of the best pizza spots. Pizzeria Bianco Bianco pizza. I can't maybe just pizza. It might be pizza Bianco. I don't know, but the guy's name is just, is just Bianco. That's what it's called. You think it's some like fancy Italian word that means like, you know, like beautiful pizza or something like that, but not just Bianco. It's just his name, but, but they probably mean something though. If you go back to, yeah, maybe we'll take a break. We'll be back with more dough boys.

Welcome back to dough boys. Our guest, John Ross Bowie, a native New Yorker, our chain, a pizza chain, Little Caesars based in Detroit originally. John, so we're talking about pizza a little bit before the break. The Detroit style pizza, which is one of the ones that we had here. You know what? Let's take a step back even further from that. You have never had Little Caesars before. This was your first time. This was my first time. Yes. What is your, what was your overall assessment? Because you've had a bunch, I'm sure you imagine your share of chain pizza in your life versus the, the, the great slices you had growing up in New York. Your last one was overall assessment right now? No, I'm like curious, like, like, how,

like how did it compare versus you got the Domino's, the pizza huts, the Papa John's of the world? Did you, did you find it like in that sort of range? Did anything separate it? Well, all, all chain pizza is going to have like what appears to be an extra layer of, of grease, which is used as preservative or something. I don't know why it's there, but so given that it's going to be very greasy, it, the crust is thinner, which I prefer New Yorker than your average Domino's, your average pizza hut. And that puts it in a little higher in my estimation than a lot of those other chains, I have to say. Interesting. I prefer a thin crust. I agree with that. And Domino's, like, especially if you get just the regular plain Domino's pizza,

it can be almost tough sometimes. It's, it can be like tough to get through. I am inclined to agree. Yeah. Yeah. Although as much as I like Domino's and Domino's for what it's worth, it did best little Caesars among the many other combatants in last year's Dave Thomas Cup, Munch Madness, the Tournament of Champiens. It won, it won pizza, it won the pizza competition. It won the slices right. But I think that little Caesars is quite good. And I like it quite a bit. I'm a fan. And I will say that this is a big thing. Let's start with this. Because the thing that kind of transformed little Caesars or at least accelerated their trajectory and sort of reinvigorated the chain was in 2004, they introduced the hot and ready pizza. They're $5 full pizza that's just

like you walk in there and it's just ready to go. You can walk out with it in five seconds. And from that point forward, they added a whole bunch of locations. They got over 5,000 nationwide right now. They really, they really kind of exploded there because they were like the most value conscious of the major pizza chains, the hot and ready cheese we got. Which by the way is, it's huge. It's huge pizza. No, but no, but no, but no, I'm saying, I'm saying just the idea of having $5 pizza. Having a $5 pizza that you can get any of you. You've got like maybe you've got a family and you're trying to feed them on a budget. The idea that you get one or two of those and have enough food is ready to go. $10 to feed your family is pretty good. It's incredible. I think

the hot and ready cheese is, and you know, like they, it only comes in a couple varieties, but I think the hot and ready is a good pizza. I think it's very solid. Yeah. Like, right? Like, what do you think, John? I think, I think definitely taking price factor into the, the, the, the, the amount it costs into it, especially, right? It's good. Yeah, it was solid. It was a solid chain pizza. It had just a little, I mean, it's, it's again, chain. So it's not going to have a super kick to it, but it had a little bit of a little spice to it. And it was nice. It was, you know, that thin layer of kind of grease that made it a little crunchy on the bottom, which I don't necessarily mind. Yeah. Thin-ish crust. I kind of want to talk about the other ones

we ordered though. Yeah. The hot and ready, all due respect to the hot and ready and the wonders that it's doing for the working class. I want to, I, I, there was some very interesting that we got, we got some weird ones. Yeah. We'll get into this selection, but Mitch, it was real quick. Your assessment of the hot and ready. I like the hot and ready. I thought, I thought it was a good, it's basic. Like you guys are saying kind of a basic slice, but it was, it was good. Absolutely gets the job done. Nothing objectionable with it. I would compare it favorably. I think the Costco is better. The Costco pizza is better, but it's the same sort of, right. Yeah. I'd rather have a Costco slice, but really here's my thing is that I, I like the

Costco slice. You want me over on the Costco slice, but there almost feels like there's too much going on the Costco. It's very, very doughy. And that's what you have to like consider about the Costco pizza. But like the, like at that, at a similar price point, and you know, like it, it's just something that you can, there's very filling on a budget and is very like, very kind of like down the middle of pizza. I think it absolutely accomplishes a similar thing. But rank them as you see them. Yeah. Let's talk about these other pies. The thin crust veggie, so this is a green peppers, onions, mushrooms, black olives, and Italian seasoning. What do they call it? They call that the, the tavern cut when they've got like the, they've got it into

rectangles, whatever, whatever that is, the pub cut. It is a, and this one is, you know, like if, if you haven't had their thin crust, it's similar to the Domino's thin crust, just like that sort of wafer thin, you know, like, like with the, the square ones that you get, the middle portions that don't have any crust at all. And you get the edge pieces a little crustier. Bowie, what did you think of this one? A little mild. And the thing about a chain restaurant giving you vegetables on their pizzas, they're not going to be the freshest. For sure. Absolutely. You know, I think they do do a thing though with, with their veggie option is that it's mostly olives. Yeah. A lot of olives.

A lot of olives. And then mushrooms. And what was it? What were the, what were the other veggies? Peppers? Yeah. Maybe some peppers. Yeah. And, and hey, you know, I mean, I love olives. And maybe some of our listeners out there also love olives. Hashtag, I'm a Popeye. I knew you were going to do that. You piece of God. I knew it was coming. But you know, I, I like, but it is like the dominant element of this. And if you don't like that, I'm a wimpy for sure. Hashtag, I'm a wimpy. If you'd prefer a cheeseburger on Tuesday that your friend paid for to some black olives. The, the, I thought, I thought though the, the, you know, I like the green peppers on it. I thought that nice quantity of

green peppers, some good Christmas doing. I just realized that you're kind of like Popeye. Natalie is kind of like olive oil and I'm like blue dough, except you also don't have a power where you eat spinach and turn strong. No, I get spinach and you finish and have diarrhea, which is a power into itself. I guess don't sell yourself short. Yeah. I mean, like this one's not the most, I guess when it comes down to with, with your vegetarian and you're eating at a chain, pizzeria, do I want the veggie or do I want the cheese? Cause those are pretty much the direction. I agree. I agree with you that like you're not going to get the, it's heavy on the olives for a reason. I think so. Yeah.

They're just so bad they're going to go. Right. Yeah. I, it was, it was fine. It was a solid, you know, a solid little vegetarian option. Yeah. I also think too that Italian seasoning, however much they're using it, they're, they're laying it on a little light. I didn't really taste the difference there versus the other ones, seasoning wise. Fair. Um, the deep, deep dish. Three meat treat. Yeah. And here we're getting their branding a little bit. There's a lot of, you know, the pizza pizza thing, which was a, you guys, do you guys remember the, I mean, you guys, you guys remember the little Caesars ads? No, I mean, they're, they're still airing. They're still airing them. Yeah. But they've kind of always had the same sort of tone,

this sort of like offbeat sort of, uh, you know, uh, ironic, surreal tone that I like. I always, I've always enjoyed them. I've always found them very, very entertaining. Can I, can I, I was going to save this for my wrap up, but I might as well do it now. Uh, there's no other, the Noid is gone. There's no other pizza mascot that we can root for. No other pizza mascot. Yeah. Who, who is the other? Papa John, we both don't like. Papa John, just a bad man. A bad man and the pizza sucks too. I'm sorry. That pizza is not good. I'm not, honestly, I'm not letting my, my confirmation bias or my politics cloud that he makes shitty pizza. Yeah. It's bad. We, we one forked it. I mean, it was pretty, our less experience was pretty

unpleasant. Um, see the little Caesar Caesar is, he's the, uh, he's the, the only, he's the only one there is. Unless you're counting the, the frozen pizza mascots and you've got, you want to throw in the red Baron and, and, uh, and Mama Celeste. What is this? Mama Celeste and the Tony's pizza chef Mama Celeste out of here with Mama Celeste. Who the fuck is Mama Celeste? Mama Celeste is an iconic frozen pizza mascot. I know, I know that this, that is crazy. Oh, and then there's you know, Senor Stofer. What are you even talking about, dude? Come on. Mama Celeste is a sweet old Italian lady. You've never heard Mama Celeste talk. You've never. I mean, maybe back in the 80s, there was a commercial with Mama Celeste. I have zero recollection. Yes. I was a massive consumer

of television at the time. I have no recollection of a Mama Celeste mascot. Any personification of Mama Celeste, aside from a picture on the box is, eludes me entirely. I know. She's basically Olivia Soprano, butt of pizza. Borderline personality disorder. Son wants to kill her. CGI. But ready for that last creepy episode. But, uh, yeah, I always liked the marketing and, and pizza pizza was part of it, you know, and, and that's sort of because, so a lot of their branding has things doubled up. And this is one of them, the deep, deep dish, three meat treat, a Detroit style deep dish pizza with pepperoni sausage and bacon. This is what I was going to ask as we're coming back from break, John. Detroit style pizza. How do you, do you have

an opinion on that? I normally don't dig the Midwestern deep dish thing. Oh, interest. So it's toppings to toppings for me. But if you put the right topping on it, I'm going to eat it. Yeah. But it's not something I seek out for some reason. I really like the, um, uh, I just feel like you're going to get more flavor if you've got a thinner crust. I got you. It becomes, it becomes very pretty. There's a lot, there's, you have to have a big base of dough to make the deep dish work. I do, I think I enjoyed that though. I have to say, I enjoy the three meats. I dug it. I remember the first time these commercials were on for these things and Harris Whittles, our old friend, was like, that looks good as hell. I'm going to

get it. Yeah. And he got it and he brought it up to his house and I tried a piece and I was like, this is really good. It's really, really good. It's, it's, it's like, but, and I was like, that's shot. I'm shocked that like I saw this commercial. I was like, that looks good. I wonder if it would taste as good as I think. And I tried and I was like, it tastes just like how I thought it would. It's quickly that like, yes, it's like paid off immediately. That is very satisfying. It was, it was, it was great. It was one of like the first times that I feel like that's ever happened. Uh, and I liked that square style a little bit more than Chicago deep dish. I think that that it's not, there's not as much going. There's, oh boy, Mitch,

you are saying this like a week in front of our Chicago live dates. You're going to be pilloried when you arrive there or in your Boston Celtics hat. There's the Chicago deep. You're going to ride you out on a rail. That's like still, that's like almost like hockey rink pizza or something. We do the deep dish square. It's like, I got you. It's still substantial, but it's not like Chicago, like where you eat one slice. I mean, this is stopping and it's not as casserole. Yes, it's this, this will fill you up, but it's, it's, it still feels like it's a really good way to that. That might be my beef with, with deep dish. And I say this with the safe knowledge that I'm not going to Chicago with you. I, is that it's, it's casserole well put. Yeah. And I don't think

I invented that description, but I've always felt that about you. Oh, thank you for saying that. I feel like casserole is exactly my beef with, uh, with the Midwestern deep dishes. God, he's going to be so proud of this wordsmith thing. I just said, I didn't, I don't think I've coined this calling it casserole like thing, but well, it's the first time I've heard it. I appreciate it. I will take the praise. Um, this is based on there's buddies pizza in Detroit. Yes. Which is, uh, which is great, which is basically the same thing. These, the square deep dish. It's very good. I will say that, you know, this is a place that originated in Detroit. Uh, and, uh, so I think they're trying to honor their, you know, their heritage a little

bit with offering this. And I think it is a good execution of it. I've said this on the podcast before, Whole Foods specifically, their 365 brand has a very good Detroit style pizza. Oh, yeah. And if you ever want like a value slice, uh, you know, I think that's a, that's a really, really good option. Um, but this is like, and this is not quite that level of quality. It's also quite a bit cheaper. Uh, even though the whole, the 365 one is still like, you know, like relatively inexpensive. This is, this is, this is definitely more of a budget option. But this is still good. This is a good chain execution of a Detroit style pizza. And I say that as someone who's never been to Detroit and may never go to Detroit,

probably not. Yeah. You probably will never go. I've been to Detroit, have not had the pizza, enjoyed it. Yeah. It's, it's quite nice, but the buddy, no authentic Detroit to compare it to. I enjoyed what we had today. It's a, it's pretty, it does pretty well. I mean, buddies is amazing, but it does really, it does, it does a really, really great job. Am I the Smith of anything? The Smith of it? Yeah. A word Smith. I can have something like that too, right? Um, we'll come to it. You're rubbing your eyes again. Is there something there? I Smith, I Smith, like you forge eyes, six, something from a nightmare. I just got jealous of your compliment. That's all. I couldn't, there's nice things to say to you. I'm very fond of you.

All right. Thank you. Very fond of you. I go back a little bit with Nick, but I'm very, very fond of you, Mike. I appreciate that. Thank you. Can we get to the headliner of our, of our, of our pizza experience? Of course. We absolutely can. Yes. This is the thing that you guys sent me the menu and I honestly don't know that I've ever looked at a little Caesar menu and this one leaped at me because it combined two things that I love very much and I think did so with a great deal of panache. So this is one, I agree. Yes. Yes. This is one that is, uh, it's offered only, you know, occasionally this is, this is back maybe just for a limited time. Is it their McRib? It's been off the menu,

I think since 2015. It's a very recent return. Very recent return. Yes. And we, and it was such like it was enough of an event when they brought it back and at first it was like kind of a soft launch of it. They, they, they sort of like, uh, brought it back without announcing it. And what, what, what are you granted now? Nothing. Just you saying soft launch, just maybe. What are you, what are you picturing with soft launching? I swear. Why would that make you laugh? You know who's talking right now? The Ithaca crew team. The Ithaca crew team is just talking to me right now. I'm like, you're better than this man. I just feel like Natalie maybe has witnessed a few soft launches. Jesus. I see my friend Nick Weigar's on the dance.

I don't even think that would even work out anatomically. I think that would work. Um, so the pretzel crust pepperoni. Yes. We tested the stuffed version of this, which has a cheese stuffed exterior, uh, with our buddy Ryan Meharry on a recent Doe Boys double episode. This is just the, the, the, the, I mean, I'll call it's not vanilla flavored, but it's the vanilla, the regular pretzel crust pepperoni. Um, I'll read the menu description, a large buttery soft flavored, I'll take it again, a large buttery flavored soft pretzel crust pizza with creamy cheddar cheese. So the fuck it's only we're going to keep all these takes in. It has the creamy, it has a creamy cheddar cheese sauce in the description. Is that on the pizza? Yes. So

they have the sauce on the pizza as well. Yes. Not in the crust. Okay. Mozzarella, monster cheese. If you have the stuff crust, the there is cheese within the pretzel crust. Yes. No, but what I'm saying is like, was this cheese sauce present spread on the, on this slice? It's on the pizza. That's what was going on. I didn't quite notice. There's no tomato sauce on that pizza. Oh, that's right. It's, it's, it's, there's, there's no marinara on there. There's nothing. There's no tomato product on the pizza. Weirdly. I can't stop thinking about it. It's really, it's really good. It's crazy how it's only when I doubled up on. Yeah. I had one of everything, but I had two of the pretzel and I can't stop thinking about it. It's so, it's so,

it's very, very, very good. It's, it's everything I like about pizza and then it's on a pretzel. I love it so much. We were saying that this is, this is, this is a meal not for slugs, because it's, it's very salty. Right. We were saying that. I have not, I'm not going to quench my thirst until the weekend. I'm sure I'm not. I feel, I feel like a piece of beef jerky right now, but I am, I regret nothing. Did you like the salt factor? Cause I think the salt factor, you song, you're really turned off by that salt factor. Too salty for you song. Too salty for you song. Very salty, but I, I, you know, part of the journey, you know, I mean, listen, it's got pretzel right in the name. You're going to expect a certain baseline of salt, I think. And man, I

was, I was there for it. I agree. I agree a hundred percent. I can't, I, I, it's very, very, very good. We were, we said this, Nick, this is the sort of thing that if you bring this to a Super Bowl party, you're a hero. You're a hero. I agree. You're a hero. I swear you are a hero. No matter who wins on the screen, you have won the party. Bring two, if you brought two or three of these two and cause they, it doesn't even have to be the main dish. Just grabbing a slice. It's great. It's great. It's really good. Bring them to a brisk. They're phenomenal. So good. So the thing that you saw is getting brisks. What was it? What was your theme of your bar mitzvah again? Nervous energy energy.

So yeah, we had, we talked about this with my Harry a little bit and he brought it. You know, he was, he was pointing out how the salt is not just on the crust. It's on the pizza itself. It's on the slice. So there's, it's, it's aggressively salty. You have to like salt. I like salt a lot. I, and I think this is, uh, this is just a fucking, you know, I use this, uh, this formulation a lot on the show. I think this is a home run. This is like the, this is such a fucking well done gimmick pizza. I had to have the fact that it was tomato sauce less, tomato sauce less pointed out to me. I didn't miss it. I did not miss it. You don't, you don't miss it. It's, it's, it's, it's, it's hard to tell. It's so, it has such a great flavor to it that you, you just,

it just doesn't, it just goes over your head. There's so much else going on with the three cheeses and the rich pepperoni and that pretzel crust, man. I, the, the sauce was an afterthought. No biggie. Yep. I'll also say on the crust, I think they do a great job of not making it too pretzely, particularly the, the, uh, you know, the actual, uh, underside of the pizza part, underside of the slice part, because, uh, the, the basis of the pie, you have like pretzel buns sometimes. And I feel like pretzel buns oftentimes are just too like crusty and pretzely too hard, too hard. Yeah. But this one had a good softness throughout the soft chewy quality of the pretzel. Yeah. Yep. Yeah. Delightful. And it's the pretzel buns are too thick to go through. No,

no pretzel is as thick as those pretzel buns. Right. For sure. Agreed. Agreed. Yeah. This is, this was the, the clear winner of the bunch. Um, we also had the, some crazy bread, uh, breadsticks with butter and garlic sprinkled with Parmesan cheese, had a little bit of marinara dip and sauce, uh, which you guys may or may not have, have taken advantage of. What are the, hey, you song, can we get a quick inventory of the other dip and sauces we had over there? I know we had like the creamy garlic. Um, we had the jalapeno cheese, right? Oh, I should have done that. We had a ranch dressing and a buffalo ranch and a buffalo ranch. That's it. And the marinara. And, and, and Mitch, you just shot that buffalo ranch, right?

I didn't do shots of the buffalo, like shooter, like I, like I shot it like a, like a liquor shot. Just tipped it back. God. Um, uh, I might, after you guys go. It's Mitch's house, man. The crazy bread, I feel like every breadsticks, I feel similarly to garlic knots. Sure. Why bother? Like why, like just have more, I'd rather have another slice of pizza than, than some crazy bread or, or make like really good garlic bread. Yes. Yeah. It's got to be dynamite. Yeah. But I am inclined to agree that it's all pretty cardboard-y to my taste. This feels, this feels like leftover dough that they just, it's in the price same. Like, you know, they, they, they, they make the pizza, they, they create the pizza crust and then they

have this leftover dough and they turn it into breadsticks. Like that candy nerds. Yes. Yeah. It's, it's, it's extra. It's, we could write this off as a law so we could try to like, it's a thing. It's, oh, they're, they're outcast. They're, oh, they're nerds. Great. Sell it. Yeah. That's, that's what I feel like with, with crazy breadsticks and, and I have a friend, buddy of mine from Ithaca, Mike Falloon. Uh, he's actually from Syracuse, but he went to Ithaca with me and he was drummer in, in my band who was the dough master at Pizza Hut, which is an incredible title. Wow. And he, uh, he said, yeah, it's absolutely what we think it is. It's just, it's just, it's excess crust. That's all it is. That makes sense. You're being scammed. Yeah.

Little insider intel. Hey, he's the dough master. We're the dough boys. He's technically our boss. He would love it. He would love a check or two. It wouldn't, it would be great. Hey, we got to do a kickback to the dough master. He needs his six points. Um, the, uh, yeah, I, I think that, I mean, if you're going to call it crazy bread, do something to it. It's, it's, it's not, it's crazy in the way that like, I don't like how mean you're being right now. I, no, I like, I love the little Caesars. This is crazy in the way that like you're, like, uh, you know, your friend at the office is like, like, yeah, people around here say I'm weird and it's just like, all right. Like, how do you know that little Caesars isn't a part of this

job? Like, what do you want them to do to that? You want to pour chocolate on it? Well, how do you want it to be crazy? I just mean, like, do something a little bit more. It doesn't have to be outlandish. It doesn't have to be like inedible, but do, do a little extra. Give it a little, a little, make it a little spicy or something, make it a little cheesy. You want it to just be called bread. You'd be called regular bread. All right. Fair enough. I guess I get it. This bread's not being 5150. That was what I'm saying. The Caesar wings we also had, oven roasted. You have to remember that the place is called Little Caesars and this isn't like a Caesar flavoring. These are just, they're straight up wings. Traditionally,

seasoned oven roasted wings is how they described them. Forgettable for me. It was a wing. Yeah, I didn't put any sauce on it, which is my bad. I probably should have sauced it up. I probably should have tried that jalapeno, whatever they had there. I will say that jalapeno cheese sauce, I think is like, I don't love it. It's like movie theater caliber. It's not a great cheese sauce. The garlic dip and sauce is pretty good. Their ranch is very solid. But yeah, some of the, some of their sauces are hidden mess. I thought it was like, they kind of has the like soggy, kind of chewy wing, like, but like all the dominoes or every other wing that gets delivered. Yeah. They're very tiny and small. They're small. You're very small. But I will say that,

yeah, which kind of is like, well, man, I must have been a small chicken or a young chicken or something. I don't know. Yeah. The feel of chickens. Possibly. Possibly. These chickens are having bad lives. That's what you, that's what you feel when you're tasting them for sure. But, but I will say that it didn't have the taste of it wasn't bad. Like sometimes you can bite into those and they like will taste almost metallic or something. They'll be very, but I've had some dominoes, buffalo wings that make me feel sick as soon as I bite into it. And these aren't like that. They tasted okay. Just kind of not great. They just weren't great. Yeah. They're not great. They're not great. I would, I would skip them. I would, I would say don't get them. I don't think

there's any reason unless you, unless someone is demanding wings and little Caesars is the chain of choice. Don't bother. Someone is refusing to do carbs. Right. You would have to eat like 30 of those wings. I feel like they're, they're so small. Even a full order is not a meal for one person. It's, they are, they're very, very modest. And that's the full, did I miss anything? That's the full roster of, of items we had. Yeah. We had the, we had the four pizzas we each had some slices of. We had the crazy bread and the, and the, and the wings and that's most of what Little Caesars offers. The only thing we missed, Mitch, is the, the extra most bestest. The extra most bestest we didn't do, which we've, we've eaten. We ate it last year for the pizza tournament. We

did. And it's good. And it basically is like, here's, here's the bad thing. It's really good. We should have gotten, we should have gotten you on. What is it that is extra and most bestest about it? There's more cheese on it. More top, more toppings. I do like more cheese. More cheese, more toppings. When, when, when our buddy Mike Hanford and I were working together on a, in a, in a writer's room last year. So last year, no, like last year, we, we went to a Little Caesars and he asked the woman working there how the extra most bestest was. And she was like, it's too much for me. And I think that is the assessment of some people of just like it's, it's like a little overloaded. It's a bridge too far for her. Interesting. Right. I disagree with

her big time, but oh well. Yeah. Well, for Mike Mitchell, more is more when it comes to. You song laughed at that one. He covered his mouth. I'm not going to hurt you. He knows you're not the one who signs his paychecks. Paychecks. By that, I mean vouchers for classes at the UCB theater. All right, good. Well, let's get to our final thoughts on Little Caesars. So Bowie, here's how this will work. We'll each go around, give sort of a closing argument, if you will, in reference to this chain and then give it a rating from zero to five forks. Yeah. Your guest, we will begin with you.

Okay. You know, I, I think you get a lot of bang for your buck with these guys. Yeah. I, I appreciated the crust work. Oh yeah. There's one five blocks from my house, maybe. Wow. That I've never been set foot in and you know, in a pinch, that might change now. This, this might be a place that I go to. I can't, I gotta come short of five for, because I'm really just talking about how obsessed I am with this limited time offer of the parcel crust. Sure. You know, so that does keep me from going all in on Little Caesars. Yeah. But a solid four. Four, four. That's a great score. Very good score, especially from someone with a lot of experience eating pizza. Mike Mitchell, your turn.

Pizza, pizza, Nick. The chain's so nice, it says it twice. Oh my God. Yeah, get to, get back to work on those eyes for a bit. Wow. Yeah. Why do I feel like this is Mitch's last show? I was gonna try to make some joke earlier about how you should be. You should become the guy at brisks. The memorial saying I should be a moil time out. Did you call them brisks? I did call it brisks. I understand you're from Boston, but my wife is from Bob. There are Jews in Boston. I've heard. I pronounced it like the ice, like the ice tea, Lipton ice tea. It was a ceremonial circumcision themed ice tea brand.

Yeah, moil. The chain's so nice you say it twice. Look, growing up, I didn't have Little Caesars. There was just none in Quincy. So I didn't get to experience it. And I'm sad and I always, I always liked it. I always liked the little Caesar guy. He had a big spear and his pizza would flip over and it would go through and there would be a lot of fun. The pizza pizza deal came around. Not only is he one of the, not only is he one of the only, maybe the only pizza chain mascots, he's one of the last mascots in general. It's true. Ronald's gone. Ronald McDonald, they phased out. He's not gone gone, right? I mean, he'll be seen him in a commercial in forever years. Yeah. I hadn't thought about it, but yeah, he's all but obsolete. Yeah.

Mascots are gone. Right. This place still got Little Caesars. He's still going. It's great. He's a fun little guy. The pizza's great. The whole concept of taking out. I like that. I do. I appreciate that that you go in and you grab the pizza and it's kind of, it's old fashioned. I do wish that there was some delivery service because I would probably get Little Caesars more if there was. Boy, that's a thing we, I'm glad you brought up because that's a thing we did not touch on and that is a key differentiator in a bad way for Little Caesars. It does not deliver. You have to pick it up. That's a good point. Yeah. You have to pick it up. Very good point. See, the problem is that I'm also near a pretty authentic pizza place run by a New Yorker

place called Village Pizza. Oh, God. Oh, wow. Yeah. Village is probably one of the best in LA. Yeah. Village is good. And they do deliver. So that really, I might knock it, I mean, I might knock it down to a three for that. Oh, no. Oh, my God. No. Do we do fractions or we just do three? Oh, yeah. Three. You can do, you can do, you can do. Only three and a half because I'm feeling generous right now, but I hadn't realized that they don't deliver that really. Oh, man. That really kind of screws the pooch for me because now I've got two choices that are almost equidistant from my house. Right. I mean, how do I, I mean, come on. This is shakes. I feel like I'm in Julius Caesar now, Nick. This is dramatic. This is

do I know what Julius Caesar is about? Not really. This is a little. It's a one Shakespeare work that I don't really know that well, but just the one really. It's the one you're up on King John and Winters Tale Winters. I I'm in a bath and that's your that's your shit. I quickly say I try to read Winters Tale every night before I go to bed. I I can't believe that I just did this. You can do 3.75 to if you want. It didn't work. Here's the here's what's going on. Mitch. Mitch likes little Caesars. We have at the four fork threshold. It's the golden plague. There is you're eligible for something called the gold and that's okay. I got the not being able to pick that. That's huge.

It's a big. It's a big, absolutely big factor. Big part of this chain. I kind of appreciate it in a way and then also it is a pain and I would get it if it was delivery. Those pizzas would be it would be great to get a few of those things delivered. I like it a lot though. I think that the price point is great. I think that there is a factor with little Caesars where it's better than you than you think it is, which I think is which it was works in its favor. Sure. Partly because it's so cheap you mean. Yeah. Yeah. But it's a chain I didn't have grown up, but I kind of not that I needed it, but I kind of wish I did. I think it's kind of I think it's pretty great. I'm going to go for four and a quarter forks.

Four and a quarter forks. Wow. That's interesting. I do keep thinking about what you said earlier. We are taping this just a few days before the Super Bowl and I had a comment you made about bringing in a couple of those pretzel pies to a Super Bowl party. Yeah. How you would be canonized for such a thing. Yeah. It's not going to happen. I'll say this. It wouldn't happen with Domino's. It certainly wouldn't happen with Papa John's. There's not an equivalent pizza you could bring in that would have the same reaction. But you know, then again, it is a limited time offering for four forks and one time for Mike Mitchell, a spoon man. I love Little Caesars. I think it's a great chain. I think the Mike Illich, who's the late owner of Little

Caesars, co-founded it with his wife. By all accounts, a good man, a charitable man, a famously paid Rosa Parks's rent for a decade when she was destitute. Really? So she could continue to live in her apartment through her old age. I'm back up to a four. Wow. I'm back up to a four. I really am. That's an incredible. I had no idea. That is an incredible story. It is. You save the day. In a world with where so many of the CEOs of these companies are just capitalist monsters, they're parodies. They're guys like Andy Puzder, the guy who is too corrupt to be even the labor secretary for Donald Trump. There are occasionally some bright lights and I think this guy was one of them. Right now, this is like a Shakespeare play that ends happily. Mid-summer's night's

dream. There you go. Good work. You said that like you were solving a puzzle on Wheel of Fortune. I really like their food. I think it's great. I like that it's a great value. I think it's a great way to feed your family or feed yourself on a budget. I think it's good quality and I think it's right up there with the other chains in its class. In a sense, it's kind of in its own price category because there really isn't another chain that's as cheap and that has it just like ready available. It isn't like the gimmick where you have to take it home and bake it in your own oven or whatever. I will say that their pizza is what to get, their sides and to some degree their dips and certainly their wings I think are forgettable and disposable, but their pizza is great.

Why am I fucking around? This is a five fork chain. Welcome to the Golden Plate Club. I went too low now, I feel like. You didn't go too low. It's in the Golden Plate Club. It's sitting pretty. Bowie, I appreciate you retconning your score and then retconning it again. Truly a roller coaster for me. It really was. I'm sorry I didn't mean to drag you through it like that, but I want to bring a little element of suspense to the end of the podcast here. I'm sweating. This is like how I'll feel during the Super Bowl. That was our review of Little Caesars. It's now time for the return of a beloved segment. I've got a slice of pie and Mitch and Bowie must divine a series of clues to guess what it is.

The winner keeps the pie. The loser goes home empty stomach. This is pie in this guy. I started singing pie pie, which one is in this guy baked up pastry that was tasty, but I'm mystery which kind and Mitch and our guests were given it's their best try. Guessing this will be the type of this pie boy. This will be the type of this. Now you said you you said you coached Nick for a few years. Voice and tap. Yeah. How does it feel when you see your when you see, you know, you see the end result? I swell with pride, man. I swell with pride.

You could also hear the karaoke version of the track under this one. Here's the thing. It's hard to find karaoke songs that don't have backing vocals a lot of the time. So if you're going to do like a parody version, it's still you're still kind of singing over them. But you know, whatever it's fine. It works for harmony reasons. So here's where I was going to quickly ask place. Is there a place in New York City where you get the best place you get a slice of pie in New York City? Oh gosh. I was going to ask you diners because I love I'm a big fan of cats is I know that that's just you know, I know cats. Yeah, because this is old school deli. That's its own thing. You know, they're the West Way diner is open 24 hours. That's on ninth and 44th.

And it's around the corner from what used to be the improv in New York. Oh, OK. And it is allegedly the diner where Larry David and Jerry Seinfeld sussed out what Seinfeld was going to be with the TV show is going to be. But it's a it's a big diner that like all diners is a little overpriced, but they do have a they make their own desserts on the premises. And you can get a decent slice of pie there. West Way diner, 44th and ninth. Oh, great. Wow. That's a that's a great wreck. And so here's how this will work. You'll each get turns. You'll each get a turn with getting an increasingly more obvious clue. So it'll start very obscure. And I always lose this, by the way, it will eventually miss does not have a great record in in pie in this guy.

OK, it will eventually get more and more obvious. You have two lifelines. You have the smell test. You can take a blind smell, a blind with of this pie that I have in this white paper bag right here. And you could also ask Emma, our engineer for her advice. So about your guest, you get to choose if you go first or second. And keep in mind, the first clue is the most obscure. Everyone makes me do the first clue and I always lose is what Nick is trying to say. But you don't you can take it. You can go ahead and gamble and take the the first clue because then you get the first shot at the first clue. Oh, wow. I'll take the first clue. I don't I don't expect this is going to go well. But I feel like mixing it up this evening. Let's go. OK. Wow.

I kind of anticipated Mitch getting the first clue. So this is this might be this might actually be tougher for you. We'll say here we go. Donkey Kong's gun that fires in spurts shares an attribute with this sweet pie. I know it. You know the pie or you know the I think I know the I think I know the pie. Donkey Kong's gun that fires in spurts shares an attribute with this sweet pie. Now, keep in mind, you have two lifelines. You can get take the smell test, take a whiff, and you can ask MR engineer. We take the smell test. OK, I was going to use the smell test lifeline. I'm going to go ahead and open this up. Yeah, close my eyes. Yeah, well, I suppose my eyes. Yeah, you should probably close your eyes. What the hell? If I'm container.

What is the system you got going? All right, I have my eyes closed. Breathe it in. Mitch, I can't tell if your eyes are open or closed. All right. I already know what it is. What do you what do you think it is, John? Is it is it a chocolate cream pie? It is a cream pie. However, chocolate cream pie is incorrect. Your clue. Your first clue is to eat. You knew that I didn't know that I would know this. I didn't know that. I mean, I mean, I know you have a thing with Donkey Kong and it does seem kind of engineered for your field. I'm just like this is a you have to know a very specific lyric, but I guess Mitch just has the entire DK64 rap committed to memory. But we'll see. We'll see

if you know it for real. Here's your second clue also in the world of pop culture. The professor might fashion the main ingredient into a radio instead of a creamy pie. Yes, I knew what the whole time. A coconut cream pie. Mitch, you have won for the first time. I think so. Wow. That was going to be my guess. I know Donkey Kong shoots coconuts out of his gun. I'd forgotten that. You know how I didn't know too much about Shakespeare? I know a lot about Donkey Kong. Interesting. Interesting. Let's compare wedding rings. The that was the meanest thing I've ever said.

Coconut cream pie. Mitch, this is yours to keep. You fucking share. As you will. That's amazing. As I always do. You can have the coconut cream pie. Please take it. I've already eaten a lot of pizza pie. So please I want you to take the pie. Really? Yes. But you can you just won for the first time ever. He made a clue about about a Donkey Kong gun. Who else knows that besides me? It was I should have known for your specific expertise. This was that was too easy. I would love for you to have the coconut cream pie. What a nice gesture. Really? I will accept your generous. Thank you for that. That's really sweet of you. Wow. It's just from House of Bytes. I is from House of Bytes. Yeah, you good work. Oh shit. Yeah, that's beautiful. Look at

that. Yeah, it's a good looking slice. You know, honestly, I don't know that I've had House of Bytes is really reliable, man. Yeah, very solid. It's great. Really reliable. We we we we we we said that quite a bit. That's probably locally. I do like piehole. I know that you're mean to piehole, but I think piehole is good to pie and burger on Pasadena is good. You tried that place. The best con pie is legend. It's the best. And I also think that is maybe the I think that might be my favorite, my favorite LA burger. Wow. Really? I love it. Many, many driver gets their truck occasionally for the casting. Wow, that's generous. Wow. Awesome. Yeah. And like, it's the you know, it's you know, when you get a food truck for a set, you know, you get a thing,

you can you can just get this thing, but it's a burger and a slice of pie. And that's that's it. You know, that's really solid. Let's use let's use some of that Doe Boys Patreon money and get the truck out for Palmerston. I was gonna say that we could hijack the truck. If he just gives us word, it can be an inside job. We can take that truck. That was pie in this guy. Just like a restaurant. We value your feedback. Let's open up the feedback. Today's email comes to us from at Tom whole 20. Tom writes TOM HOL 20. I don't know how you pronounce that. I apologize. Tom, if I mangled your last name. Love the pod. I was wondering what foods you like to have on a camping trip. Nick is a former Boy Scout myself. I have fond

memories of lots of different meals around the campfire, including peach cobbler, chili, or the classic s'mores. I'm sure Mitch has some camping stories from growing up in Quincy. Anyway, keep up the good work. Bertha Brigade, motherfuckers. Does she think Quincy is still forest? I don't understand that. Maybe just think she went on some campouts. Really? Bowie, growing up in the city, did you did you did you do much camping as a youth? I went, I would go, I went to summer camp and I went Connecticut and Massachusetts and we did some over open flame things. I've actually eaten like, like that hardcore stuff you can get at REI and stuff like the dehydrated beef stroganoff

and stuff like that. I've had that. Oh man. It really is something to cooking something yourself, no matter how weird and preservative it is. Yeah. Over an open fire where it will taste better. Right. You know, there's that sense of accomplishment. Yeah, for sure. I've never, I feel like what am I thinking that you put in? I mean, you put, when you make s'mores, you put it into tinfoil, but then also what else in campfire do you put in a tinfoil? Fish? Maybe. Yeah. Maybe it was fish that way. I'm trying to think. I have, I went camping when I was very little and then I went to like camp Burgess, which was a, which was a summer camp, but there was cabins. Yeah. Wasn't really like, and you would you, but mostly s'mores,

hot dogs on a put a hot dog on a stick and in a and roasted over the fire, but nothing, nothing too substantial. Like maybe, maybe beans even or is the closest thing that I've like a can of beans in the, in the bush, a can of bushes, beans in the pit or something like that is kind of oddly satisfying though, like eating food out of a can because it's like though it's one of the only times you'll do that unless you're like a, you know, really playing up the bachelor thing. And I would say that those people who love to play up the bats are like just eating straight from a can. You're saying from like the can of chef Boyardee. That's like a, you'll, that's like the bachelor move in a rom-com. It's not like what people actually do

in reality. Yeah. I will say that it's how we know this character is just really needs to find somebody picked up a t-shirt off the floor, sniffed it and put it on shrug put it on anyway. Yeah. Here's the thing. I actually have had developed some food of versions because I hated Boy Scouts and I hated camping so much that when we'd have like, we had peach cobbler was one of them and another one was chicken cacciatore made in a Dutch oven that I was just like, man, I just like, I don't like these foods because I associated them with going on camping trips, which I didn't want to do. I wanted to be at home playing Nintendo. And so like, yeah, they're, I hate so much about these trips. I didn't like a lot of the other kids. I didn't like

being, I like, I didn't like getting bug bites. I think I like, I didn't like being dirty. I didn't like being away from home. I definitely had like issues with like, like, uh, uh, using the bathroom like, you know what I mean? Man, I'm just picturing this. You must have been everyone's favorite camper. I was pretty high up in the ranks at Boy Scouts. I climbed the ladder. I was senior patrol leader at one point in troops 29. I was the head cheese. Is the, is the troop name for what age you were? That's a paramilitary organization, you know, in the event of the local police force. Check me on this. In the event the local police force is taken out of commission, the Boy Scouts can be called into active duty to defend the United States. Yeah. That's, I mean, that's like a,

an unproduced blacklist script that someone has, I'm sure the Boy Scouts taking over the, the, the local command. I will say that, but however, hot cocoa, that's my favorite context for hot cocoa out on a camp, on a camp out, around a fire. That's, that's just, that's so satisfying. You're not a cold weather guy. Hot cocoa is the best when you're in a cabin and it's snowy outside. It is a delightful context for that. So that would be my answer. But yeah, let us know your camping eats. Mitch, you got a pitch for a camping hashtag, camping eat out? No. Hashtag eating outside. Oh boy. Okay. That's nice and wholesome. Can you, can you put, can you put ellipses in there?

Or the hashtag won't work if we have ellipses. Damn, damn, design flaw. If you have a question or comment about the world of chain restaurants, you can email us at doughboyspodcast at gmail.com or leave us a voicemail at 830 Go Doe. That's 830 4636844. And to get the Dough Boys Double, our weekly bonus episode, join the golden or platinum plate club at patreon.com slash Dough Boys, John Ross Bowie. Thank you for being with here. And being, being with us here today. Being with here. Being with here. I was about to say something sincere, which is why I stumbled over it. Oh, let's hear it. I've known, I, I've known you like you mentioned a long time, uh, very early on when I was involved with the, the

operating citizen of the gate theater, you mentioned you were a, uh, the coach of my Harold team, my improv team. And I just feel like I learned like so much from you. And I really feel like I owe you a lot. And, uh, I do for as, as cynical as I am about my career and the, the finite kind of shitty station in life I'm at. I do, I have been able to make a living writing comedy, which was my dream. And I, I tribute that partly to, to what I learned from you. So I thank you so much. Well, first off, I think you came in with a lot of raw gifts. And I think you've had a great career with a lot of really cool credits. Yeah. I guess so. Dough Boys, Dough Boys Double or Patreon episodes.

I guessed it on Gabriel's podcast. I'll hear you. Dirtiest sketch show in LA. And 2007 came in third. You do the, uh, the monster fuck. That's right. Dude, honestly, this is a little inside, but if it was only Skeletor, that would be enough. Oh, no, how much I love the Skeletor roast. You do know how much I love the Skeletor roast. I've told you how much I love the Skeletor roast. I'm glad I did that bit before everyone was filming everything on iPhones. I don't know if that would have been something I'd like to be up on you for all time. Good Lord. If I, if they had some of my early improv shows from the late 90s, I,

and career. Your early 90s improv shows are like my shows now, basically. Well, I hope no one's recording this episode of Dough Boys. Bowie, do you have anything you would like to plug? Please watch Speechless. It's a really funny show. It's funnier than you think it's going to be. We have amazing writers. We have, listen, here's all I can say about our show and our comedy cred. On our Valentine's Day episode, guest star Eddie Pepitone. Boom. I'm done. Wow. That rolls. He rules. I'm done. On our Valentine's Day episode, it's gorgeous. He's so good.

That's awesome. The bitter Buddha himself. One of the best. And you're one of the best. Thank you so much for making time for us. Really appreciate it. Check out Speechless. And hey, that'll do it for this episode of Dough Boys. Until next time for the Spoonman, Mike Mitchell, I'm Nick Weiger. Do you have anything else you'd like to say that would cause you to bury your head in your hands? Me? No. I thought you were going to say something nice to me for a second. Oh, hell no. Happy eating. I see you. Hey, Spoon Nation. Hey, Burger Brigade. Catch Dough Boys live in your town, provided you live in one of the following areas. Chicago, Illinois on March 1st, Huntsville, Alabama on April 10th,

and Nashville, Tennessee on April 11th. Wow. For tickets and info, go to headgum.com slash live. Go do it, baby. That was a headgum podcast.