Drama Queens - Here We Go Again, Again • EP321

Episode Date: October 24, 2022

It’s the night before Naley’s wedding and just like we did the first time around, we come into this episode convinced of Peyton and Jake… until we once again see Peyton and Lucas. Hilarie, Sophia and Joy relive all the drama and fun of Naley’s rehearsal dinner, discuss what they would have done differently and reveal a secret real-life connection between Sophia and Brooke.  Plus, find out which character the ladies think would’ve done great on Love Island! Here we go again… But this time it’s different! See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. It may look different, but native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

First of all, you don't know me. We're all about that high school drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride in our comic girl. Drama girl. Cheering for the right team. Drama queens, drama queens, smart girl, rough girl, fashion but you'll tough girl. You could sit with us, girl. Drama queen, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens.

Hey, welcome back to the show, guys. Listen, Listen. Sophia's on my Instagram right now showing me the Dyson hair wrap that Hillary did. Yeah, the air wrap. Why does your, oh, the air wrap. Yeah, it's a hair wrap, air wrap. This is not an ad, honestly. Just Hillary has. No, it's not an ad. It's not. Joy asked me how I dried my hair. Because it looks amazing. Yeah. Well, no, it looks like a country music singer. That's my vibe, aka volume. Amazing, baby. Yeah, listen, when we're on the road, you don't want.

want to bring 8,000 tools you don't want to bring a hair dryer and curling irons and like all the things yeah you just need the dyson air wrap i'm stoked i got to go get this so our friends at dyson if you want to uh partner on our show this is your invitation again honestly not a commercial it's really not we had a strong hair episode yeah we really did for sure we really did heyley was feeling like i know you guys think it was mermaid hair was gorgeous i love that hair joy over at the top Joyless looking at herself in this episode and goes, that girl needs a haircut. And Hillary and I both just went, what?

Shish. Sackrelage. Shush. Oh, guys, it's season three, episode 21, Over the Hills and Far Away. This episode aired originally on April 26th, 2006. Hillary, tell the viewers what they've won. I don't even know what the hell we watched.

It was such a weird episode. They're all weird. We're getting used to it now. Listen, it was the night before Naley's wedding. Everyone celebrates a trick with a reenactment of their fairy tale. But one line from Peyton reveals her true feelings for Lucas. Meanwhile, Brooke sort of makes amends with Rachel and designs Haley's wedding dress. Also, sort of.

Sort of. Okay, I like that they've started to use the term Naley in the episode, which was coined online by, you know, a fan base back then. I think that's kind of fun. It was very cute. That's really cute. You guys had such an amazing impact on our show. He was making it into the script. This is weird.

I have to say, all these little skits really fell flat. They could have been. It felt like they had a conversation because Thomas Wright, Tom Wright, he's a good director. He's a good director. He loves one of our favorites. And it really feels like there had to have been a conversation from the powers that be with the director saying, These are high school kids putting on some skits. None of them does theater.

It shouldn't feel professional. It should feel a little clunky. It should feel like kids trying to, you know, make their best effort, not professional. And it went so far in that direction that the skits were hard to watch. Hard to. Well, they didn't even fake the audience enjoying the skits. No, no, there was no laughter. There was no applause.

It was just like curtain clothes. Like a sitcom with no laughter. Does it feel like the episode must have been running short, too? Because they didn't cut any of the air out of any of it. Yep, that's right. It was just... And there was only, like, three scenes with Lucas and Moira. Did we shoot this episode in, like, four days or some shit?

Like, did we know we have the finale coming up? And they're like, we got to save all our money. Oh, yeah, you know what? Actually, that's probably a really good point. Yeah. I think that's probably true. And because of the last episode was such a big basketball episode, Sometimes if they had scripts like this that were very location small,

like we didn't go to a lot of locations, so we didn't have a lot of moves. They would cut a day from an episode like this to add a day to a basketball episode or a stunt episode. Or they do like the havesy days, splits. It feels like that. It feels like Tom Wright maybe got a little cheated. Yeah.

And we're sorry that all of you at home did as well. I mean, in terms of rehearsal dinner, ideas, great idea. And I loved our scene at the beginning. Yeah, that was fun. Having the cute little chat and the little screen is up and our chemistry is so good. And then you see the recorder and you realize what Brooks doing. And I was like, oh, I forgot about this. This is cute. Yes. And then the product. The wedding dress was a little lackless. I don't know. I mean, look, I don't

love the collar, but the dress was kind of great. I loved the collar. The first dress. Yeah. Yeah. I, y'all, we all were just like, okay, Brooke Davis. Like when that dress came out, I didn't see the problem. No, I didn't either. Well, and especially with the snow white reference, I was like, that's the snow white collar. Yeah, exactly. I get it. I get it too.

Also, it worked on you. Thanks. The crown was a little much. Yeah, but the halo joke was funny. Do you get it? It's a halo. It was a headband. Yeah, but it's just so strange.

I don't know why the dress was so much of a problem. I mean, it was great. I also don't know why the fight. had to escalate between us so intensely. Oh, man. Though I guess that did become the point later. Yeah. Because you delivered that line in such a funny way.

Like, I've never seen someone go from excited to heartbroken to enraged so quickly. And I'm just talking about me. I was like, oh, I didn't see that coming. That was funny, Haley, James. You know, I wish I had played that scene differently, though. I wish I had let, let Haley get more upset. Like, it's her wedding. And, you know, just let her have the flaw of, like, freaking out.

That it's not what she wanted. And it would have motivated you a little bit more, too, to freak out. Yeah. I'm watching it going back and going, I could have done that better.

I could have given you a little more. My question was why was Haley boxing? With like gatorade's in the fridge like she's an athlete. It was like,

we have to show that she's revved up. She's aggressive right now. It was random. We're going to pull him. I remember it was in the script. Yeah. It wasn't like a, like me being like

I need something to do. Can I have like a boxing bag? or something. No, it was in the script that I was, and I remember reading the script and going, oh, okay, here's what I like about it. I like, it gives Haley a personality element. Like, she's not just all about Nathan and school

and wandering around, like, with her book bag and being forlorn about relationships. It gave her actually something of a personal interest that she was doing. She's not really doing music a lot right now. So I like seeing her active. But it was definitely a random introduction to that. I mean, is the next person that has to box

an inanimate object in her bedroom. I'm just like, who on our writing stuff? Because in season four, I've got to take up boxing after I'm attacked. And so I'm just like, who on our staff was like, guys, do you know what's hot? When girls boxing. Like somebody had a kink that we had to fulfill

you with your little sweaty tendrils of hair and your Gatorade. I love boxing. Me too. I don't know why I never got to hit up. Why didn't Brooke get to box after she got attacked all those years later? He'd had to do it already.

Well, damn it. You could have it. I hurt my knuckle really bad doing the boxing. Yeah, because I had sliced open my knuckle at the same time that I was having to do all the boxing stuff. It was stupid. Anyway, I just, somebody had a kink about it. Because the boys aren't boxing.

It would have been cuter to see the boys box. Was it popular at the time? Did it like, did it come back in? Was it in all the magazines? What was that, like, food camp or something? Or Tybo. Tybo. But what I wish we'd had was a little.

more of it. Yeah. Like if you're gonna have a heavy bag in your apartment. Yeah, yeah. You've been boxing for a while. Like, couldn't we have had this cute thing where- Kind of introduction. Maybe, you know, whether it was you or you, like somebody was into it

and then the girls had this sort of activity and the boys were like, oh, shit. You know, like, oh, they're all really learning to hit. Yeah. Like, it could have been so funny if it had continued. I agree. Really random. I don't know if we ever see it again either. Those things are expensive.

I know. It could have been easy. Nathan comes home like, oh, I got my old boxing bag. On Craigslist. Yeah, or look what I found or something. I went and took this from my mom's garage. Yeah, and I would be like, I am not having that in my living room. We do not live in a gym.

And then he cuts to you just whaling on it. That would have been great. See, it's not that hard. It's not that hard. And it would have filled up a good five minutes of our episode. It's wasted. So long. Like the breaks in between the same.

skits. That was just the long panning shot of, oh, here's another curtain and some lights. Uh, that's a set. And here's the next old-timey silent movie sign for what the scene is. Also, the animation of those storybook pages turning, that looks like reading Rainbow from the 80s. I was like, who? It's nostalgic, but also who did this? Yeah.

Who did do this? You know what's starting to irritate me about my show at this point? is that it keeps referencing itself over and over and over again. It's like we're reliving the Nathan and Haley thing, which is like, okay, cute, it's a good device. But then also, Peyton is always saying all the time, you know, someone once said to me, it's like, you know how we're just always referencing ourselves?

Yeah, it kind of felt like a whole episode of just reminding everyone where we were. Maybe it was like a recap episode before the finale. Yeah, because we're close to the end of the season. Yeah. People always leave. It's like, of the music thing. Like, there's just, I don't know.

I don't know. It just felt, it feels like people are getting proud of themselves and, like, cute in the writer's room. And it's like, well, want, want, wah, right. Aw. But by the way, I think we could have done dynamite stuff to relive Nathan and Haley's. Yeah. It could have been stage better. Like, if it were taking up different parts of the stage instead of.

Yeah. Curtin open, cup and close. You're right that the episode was short. That has to be it because it should have been, yes, different vignettes on stage. The lights go out in one. They go up on the other. They go out on that one. They come up on another.

Yeah. And boom, boom, boom. We get all the shots. Everybody's laughing. Ha, ha, ha. It's cute. Yeah, you turn from the stage to the bar and it's Karen's cafe. And the character of Haley is busing tables and, you know, Nathan walks in and orders a coffee.

Like, there could have been all these things to make it really snobes. nappy, even keeping it in tricks. And clearly we didn't have the budget to run around town and scavenger hunt of memories for you guys or something. But I liked that Marcus made a reappearance. Oh, yeah. He was wonderful. The idea of giving somebody a second chance.

That was really nice. Yeah. It was nice. Why didn't we get to keep him? I'm so perplexed. He was really good. He's a good actor. Did he also book a movie with him with a sermon?

Yeah, right. Is that where he went? I guess so. He's very sincere. He must have booked something. Or we just worked for a bunch. Which one of us lost out on that opportunity is my question. Like who was going to fall in love with that guy?

DeNeil was robbed. DeNeil was robbed. Oh my God. They bonded in the tutor center, you know? They could have had a, they could have had a relationship. He could have picked her up after the Cooper of it all. And that would have been really nice. Why did we recreate the pilot?

Maybe I was like, did I have too much champagne before? I watch this episode? Because we just keep referencing ourselves over and over again. Her car breaking down and then Marcus pulling up in the tow truck and then Peyton calling Nathan for a ride. It felt, I mean, it feels like masturbation is what it feels like. Oh my

God. Honestly, it's just like I'm so pleased with myself. And it also feels like a little bit of a lazy device to get to when Peyton says or sorry, when Nathan says, don't you usually call Lucas for this? And she goes, she's out of town. He's out of town.

And what about Brooke? And then it flashes to like, it's like, well, I have to, I have to tell the audience I can't call either of my two best friends because I'm in love with one and I'm going to upset the other. And it's like, so you're doing a repeat thing because it's kind, Nathan's kind of joking with her. Yeah, this was like those episodes, you know, friends in Seinfeld and who's the boss episodes that they would always do that were like, I like that you said who's the boss. I like that you went there. I don't know why that just came to mind. It's like an episode of Charles is in charge. You know what I mean?

Where they're just like, let's just rerun everything clips from the, it's a clip episode. I mean. I was always so annoyed when I would turn on my favorite sitcom and then it was a clips episode. I just turned it off. Yeah, of course. There were a lot of clips. There were so many Peyton and Lucas clips. As Peyton's having her like, epiphany that she's in love with him, I was like, oh my God.

Heavy. The makeout montage dream Peyton and Lucas. But by the way, I will say that it did exactly what it was supposed to do because even in the last episode, I'm like, oh my God, Peyton and Jake, Peyton and Jake in the beginning of this, Peyton and Jake. And then I see like all the Peyton and Lucas stuff and I'm like, I mean, that works too. Yeah. I'm open to my mind. Well, and it is exactly to your point, it's a device that really works because we were losing Brian to go do prime. Yeah. And we knew that once he worked with Merrill Streep and Uma, we blame Uma forever, we would never get him back. And, and And the writers had to pivot. Like so fast. Yeah. And you have to pivot fast and you have to pivot intensely. If you've been setting up Peyton and Jake to be end game.

And now you have to go, no, no, no. Actually, Peyton and Lucas have always been endgame. They're like, and we have 46 scenes we're going to cut to in this heavy montage to prove it. I think it was 47s. Hey, you know, I lost count. They had the data. They had the data. They were like, it's always been here.

And then you know what? The audience goes, you're right. It's always been there. It's always been there. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for a hundred of years.

You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Teller Ornellis, who with her, Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, on the IHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. I like that she blurts it out at the end of the episode. Guys, Peyton is mentally ill. She is. Like, when we think about what's happened over the course of her story, I'm serious.

This child should be in therapy. You're laughing. You're like crying. I'm laughing because I'm so uncomfortable. I genuinely, I just feel like, I just feel like my mom just, me something about one of my friends. I'm like, oh, my God. I'm so sorry that hit me so intensely. I had like a, I had like a church giggle and a tear all at the same time. Mommy died, right?

Her dad's gone. She's dating Nathan, who's a nightmare. She goes to Lucas who ends up with her best friend. And then her mom shows up and she dies. And then she gets shot. And then five seconds later, she's dating a guy in a rock band who's like much too old for her. And then she's with Jake after this whole custody nightmare. Proposing. proposing and then just to sit in bed with Lucas and be like okay I love you oh my gosh

it is so much and I see a lot of patent criticism where people are like oh my God and I just need to validate that opinion and be like I get it yeah it is so much

and this child should not be loving anyone yeah she should just be going to therapy yeah yes yes that's it but that wasn't that wasn't something we were talking about on the show and because of the real life practical need to work

around actors availability stories had to be bent to the cast we had yeah and oof what a flip but I will say as someone who is recently hold hold I'm gonna I'm gonna I'm gonna go on a tangent we're gonna come back it's all gonna connect us where can't we take us on a ride I am not a reality TV watcher. Are you going to talk about Love Island? I sure am. I don't watch the Housewives. I don't watch The Bachelor.

I had to host Kelly and Ryan once when she was out of town with Ryan with a Bachelorette. I didn't know who she was. I was very embarrassed. It was like it was not cool. Like the internet made fun of me and I made fun of myself. I was like, no, no, I agree. I have no fucking idea what's going on here.

And I just am like, it's not for me. If I'm going to watch reality TV, it's going to be like a home design show. A cooking show. Maybe a cooking show, yeah. I am so hard, like deep in the paint on Love Island, UK. Yeah. Because it's the only one that's good. Guys, she talked about it for hours last night.

No, I really did. I was like, I need you to know. And all I could think, when Brooke came in and sat next to Peyton and Peyton said, Brooke, I think I have feelings for Lucas. I was like, you know what she's doing is she's telling the girl first. It is an ultimate sign of respect. In the villa, Peyton would be supported for this choice because she didn't go to the boy first. She told the girl first. She prioritized her friendship. All I have to say is you

would have done great on Love Island, babe. Time. In the villa. In the villa. It's a big deal. The show is Love Island. It's just a big deal. Yeah. Tree Hill was our villa. We were trapped together. But you're right, because like people were really, really mad at Peyton for like telling Brooke this. Oh, really? I have always struggled with that. I'm like, what are you guys talking about? Like, she didn't. That's her best friend. She has to tell her. She wasn't. passive about it, she wasn't sneaky about it, like the second she was called on it, the very first person she goes to to talk to about it is broke. Yeah.

It's where the love story, babe. That's it. God. I mean, yeah, I don't know that Peyton loves any of these people, to be perfectly honest. I think she is just damaged. Well, she's looking for love to fill a really intense void, and it's a void that's caused by trauma and loss and grief and look I think it makes sense I can't believe you managed to be a well adjusted human being having to play this person yeah but you know yeah of course everyone was like

enraged and flipped out and it was like what a betrayal but I actually really watching this episode back respect it because it was honest there was no duplicity there was no um going behind brooks back there there were not the mistakes that these kids had made when they were younger. It was more, I've really been trying to act like this isn't my reality, but this is my reality. I can't keep it from you because I love you. And it's going to hurt you, but I'm going to be honest with you because I love you. Like, that's very emotionally mature.

Yeah, there's a lot of emotionally mature stuff that these kids do in spite of all the craziness. Yeah. Haley's showing up at Dan's door. Oh, my God. Like a 35-year-old. Did you, like, how did you get there? There's something I need to do. I need to do this right.

now. Yeah. I guess she drove. Don't they, do they drive? Haley drives. I've never seen Haley drive a car. I don't think I have either. Yeah. I don't know what she did. Maybe she caught a taxi, one of Brooks taxis. T.W. N. I like that you kind of like, it was like you're saying it and there was like a giggle in your voice. You're like, I know, this is probably going to go bad. Yeah. But I love my husband. Yeah. So here we are. I like that. She's being really honoring herself and the fact that she wants to be an optimist and she wants to get people the benefit of the doubt. And that's an active, you have to be active to do that. You can't, you know, that there's a passivity to cynicism. And I like that she was vulnerable and capable of just being like, okay, I'm going to do this for me and for Nathan because this is the right thing to do. Yeah. I think. I might regret this, but I will definitely regret not doing that. Yeah.

But such a mature thing. I never would have done that. Really? No. In high school, to go up to an adult, to go up to an adult and be like, you're an ass, but I'm going to give you the benefit of the doubt. See, I feel like you totally would. Really?

Yeah, you've always been that way. In my time knowing you, and we weren't much older than high school, you've always been like, you're a monster, but I'm going to say a little. prayer for you and I'm also going to bring you like a beautiful collage gift like you always been that way joy I will win you over yeah I guess I don't know I'm trying to think about high school I was so always so intimidated by my teachers in high school yeah but in real personal relationships not I don't know about authority figures like that but I I would agree with Hillary I think you've always said I don't know that I understand your motivations right now but I want to

I want to offer you care. I want to be willing to disagree, but figure it out. Yeah. And that's, that's so loving. Good, good parenting. They taught me how to do it, I guess. Speaking of parents, I super love Deb and Junk. Their scene was the only skit that I was like, okay.

Oh, yes, I wanted so much. I was like, kiss her, kiss her. I'm going in with the open mouth. I'm not even a senior. She did great. She did do great. She was so funny. For Deb to be there and have Uncle Cooper not there at the party was weird.

But he's avoiding Rachel. But he doesn't know she's going to be there. Brooke didn't invite her until that morning. Yeah, but anything that, if I were him, anything that had to do with that high school group, I would totally avoid on purpose. When we were in our 20s, we were, you know, with high schoolers. But yeah, I wasn't screwing 17-year-olds when I was in my late 20s. So, gross.

Pass. Pass, she said. Pass. Heart pass. Yeah, what else? What does that's all power in this episode? What are we talking about in this episode? Well, what's also a little tricky is because we're all together.

Like, y'all, we normally do this on Zoom so we can take notes on our computers or post-it notes or random receipts, whatever we got in front of us at our desks. But, like, we're together. The whole time we watched this episode, we were having snacks and drinking champagne. We have no notes. No notes. No, no, no. No, no. No notes. They're hard. No, that's the name. We have no notes, but a lot of criticism. I don't know. What do we love? I loved that Lucas got a fund from Keith. That was a nice reveal. That was a beautiful. I really liked that. I choked up listening to more than a car, though. Because I would have loved to have gotten in tighter on Lucas as he really, like, processed that. That's a huge thing to lay on a child. And I don't know why Karen wouldn't. tell him that before they went and looked at colleges, like, why is it an Easter egg at the end

of this trip where this kid is like, I guess I'll never get into these colleges that I actually want to go to. I'll never be able to afford it. My dreams are slipping away. And she's like, actually. Yeah. It's like life's always a game show in Tree Hill. Yeah. Where it's like, surprise, there's one more prize behind the curtain. Yeah. I don't know. Well, it really felt again like scenes of convenience. We had to explain why, Moira and Chad were not in the episode before. So the exposition was, well, we took this trip to look at colleges, but also to find ourselves again and our hope.

And I actually thought that was a lovely... Yeah, why was it that the theme of the episode? Sorry, I just mean like, instead of having the whole thing wrapped around these weird skits, I like the skit thing. It just could have been like a five-minute chunk of the episode and then done. It could have taken half the time it took. It would have been a cute little thing, but to fact that that was the set and we kept jumping back and forth to get back to there,

why wasn't Chad and Moira in the car? I don't know if that was that at the opening scene. I don't know. But to keep going back to them and set that setting for what the future is going to hold could have been really nice. So much more dialogue could have been available for them. Yeah, we could have had a lot more of it.

And then you would have felt much more of a group of people, you know, Lucas, Karen, Marcus, Nathan and Haley, you would have really felt that all these people are really trying to move on but struggling. They're still having a hard time. Like what's next? How do we do it? And are we allowed to feel joy? Are we allowed to laugh when our friends do funny things for us?

And, you know, when we do and we miss the people who aren't here anymore, how do we hold both? Like, we could have asked some deeper questions and not really had to change the episode much. It feels like a miss opportunity. It was about all roads leading back to home. yeah and like that being the journey it's like how do we get back um then the whole like time travel thing going back through nathan and haley's journey would have been a metaphor for that but you know because Peyton's driving in Lucas and Karen are driving in Marcus could have been so much more time in the car you know Marcus has got the tow truck now and he had that red handkerchief tucked in the

back of his jeans like Uncle Keith I wasn't sure yeah I wasn't sure if that was on purpose or if he just did that because he had a red rag in the truck and just like as a character thought oh I'll stick in the back of my jeans I don't know either I'm sorry guys like I don't want to be down on this episode because I don't want it to be a downer for you as listeners to listen to us like I don't want us to just trash the episode let's talk about real life because like we've had to go to 3,000 weddings at this point oh yeah yeah we've had to like sit through speeches

and toasts and slideshows and the things. What are your memorable wedding experiences? Oh. I know you crashed a wedding. You mentioned that the other day. I sure did. It was so fun. And I was so scared. And I'm still a little scared. But like, is someone ever going to yell at me for that? Yeah, they're going to come back and find you. It's been 10 years. It's been 10 years. And you're still terrified. I'm anxious forever. I mean, probably I'm thinking about it because these are the things we've done together. But I, you know, you ask about what's memorable. I think about your wedding. I think about you guys at my wedding. Like, I don't know. I think there's something really amazing

about what the milestone of a wedding is and what it means to be people's community. I like having a job at a wedding. Do you know what's like you could have pointed out of with like a thing and like Brooke does it in this episode. I don't know how Brooke makes a dress and then gets the dress rejected in the same day and then go shopping and sees Rachel punch a mirror and then go straight to throw the rehearsal dinner party that night. And then when Nathan forms the whole night too by the way. Yeah. Nathan and Haley come home and she's made a bedspread dress.

How did that happen? How? And the bedspread, don't forget, is the material for Karen's wedding dress to Keith. Yeah. That's right. That's right. That's right. That's right. And then took back to make Haley's wedding dress. It's like, Brooke had all the jobs. I mean, I love Brooke for it. It's so sweet. I'm so impressed with her. It's a good friend. It's so generous. But yeah, when did she have the time? It was, well, I mean, look, she made an entire fashion collection in like six hours.

About 10 episodes ago. So I think Brooke has super fast, superhuman sewing machine skills. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going along. that this is something we've been doing for hundreds of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence.

That's Sierra Teller Ornelis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive, while navigating the modern world,

influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I liked at Tyler Hilton and Megan Park's wedding, at the end of the night, it was at this vineyard, and at the end of the night, like, we had to take all the, I don't know, decorations down. and I don't know that anyone had really thought it through

and so at the end of the night some people had taken off in buses and ubers and things and I'm just there with like Lee Norris and it's like you want to tackle this shit and they were like these huge garlands my gosh yeah it was just like huge garlands that we were like gathering up and no one's wearing shoes

and it was so sweaty and we were real drunk and it was such a fun memory of like I don't know like you go and you go to the party and you do the thing but then the real real work begins of like now you are a family now you are committed and this is your community and so it was a nice memory of us all just kind of like carrying the shit like let's just we're all going to carry the shit out with you and Tyler had this uncle that I really liked flirting with and he was such a good dancer and we I was like hey I think it was Uncle John was his name uh yeah we had a great

time I was like do you want to carry this stuff together yeah want to help me carry this garland Yeah. I like the sweaty parts of weddings. Yes. Everybody just piled into the dance floor. Yeah, or just like lifting up the dress so the bride can pee. Oh, my gosh. One of my best friends was getting married and she had to pee and I went in the bathroom with her and somebody had put a candle on the back of the toilet and her dress caught on fire. Oh, no. What happened? The back of it, like all the crinoline. I mean, crinlin goes fast too. oh my god she just was in there and then she's you know i kind of helped her gather her dress up and it went all up around her uh in her hands and up around her waist and then she i put her in the stall and shut the door and i just like oh wait and something smells weird yeah yeah and all of a sudden she was like oh no oh my gosh oh my gosh joy joy oh no you're to beat down the door offing out of the thing on fire yes oh my god we just put the fire up but she definitely got married in a dress that was like half burnt underneath.

That's terrifying. Yeah, it was pretty scary. That reminds me, I remember thinking, like, I've just never known a cooler person. One of my best friends from college got married. God, I don't know, 10, 12 years ago now. And another one of our girlfriends from college, we'd all live together at USC, made her dress. She's a great designer.

And it was this incredible, like, gold-beated bodice with, like, blue-layered huge like ball gown skirt. Yes. And we got to the reception and she pulled out like fabric shears. No. And we cut her wedding gown into a mini dress. Shut up. And like she worked in fashion, worked at magazines is definitely like truly the

chicest person I know. And to see someone with like one of the most enviable fashion collections that I've ever seen be so un precious and was just like it's time let's go and like we just hacked it off oh my gosh and she ran out on the dance floor and I was like this is the coolest I need to see that in a movie like that's what I was what I'd say it felt like a movie and I remember being like I'm gonna write that into a scene someday that is so we need to do it yeah that's sexy man okay and also it's like the groom to watch that just right okay all her bridesmaids it's like cutting off her clothes I was like, this is amazing.

It was so cool. I'm cutting off all the dead weight. We're starting a new, our brand new life together. I did none of that. I was like, obviously so amped on making a dress that I loved. Don't ever cut your dress ever, ever. Your dress is fucking magical. No, it's amazing.

Literally, I would never. But there was definitely a part of me that was like, this is my exact, like, this moment dream for us, for our family. Like, this thing tells a story. And then it was like, it's time to pull. party, I want to be a disco ball. And you were, what you were. He's like, this is what I look like on the inside.

Glamour. Just sequence. How many wedding dresses did we have on our show? Has anyone ever done that tally? Because I know I wore a couple. I know Joy wore a couple. Yeah. How made you wear?

I just did the one, which was actually so fun when, was it season eight that we did my wedding, I think so? And it was really fun because I'd studied, like when Brooke really, became a fashion designer, I started going and like shadowing designers. I'd go to fashion week and I'd go meet and I just, I was like, I want to learn. Wow. I really want to know a lot about how this industry works. Yeah. And I worked with a designer that I really loved and I designed Brooks wedding dress. What? You did? Yeah. Are you kidding? Oh my gosh. I love that. I know that. Yeah. And it was the cool, like, I mean, we did it together. Obviously, like, I can barely draw a stick figure. So the idea in my head really worked.

but I wouldn't have been able to make my yourself. But yeah, we did this thing together and it like, it just felt really special to do that for Brooke Davis. I was like, yeah, girl, I'm gonna be right here with you. I love that. I love all those personal touches. Like, I loved that you had a tattoo artist at your wedding, Hillary. I loved it.

There was no other way. But now, now, like, our circle of friends all has the same tattoo. So if we ever, like, work together again? Like, how do we explain that? Like Jensen, Jared, and Jeffrey all have the same tattoo now. It's very cute. And DeNeil, Kevin Rahm and I all have the same tattoo now. And it's just like, okay, well, we did it.

It's a family thing. I love it. There's this. Who got like the one cell. There was a flash sheet at the wedding, right? And randomly on the flash sheet was like a praying mantis. And I was like, who's going to get the praying mantis? Who did it?

Jeremy Sisto. Stop. And decided to get it like on his torso. Oh, wow. He pulled his whole shirt off at the wedding and it's like getting this. It was his like first tattoo and he. What? I think he let his kid pick it out.

It was like, it was a whole thing. But I was just like, of course, this does the one. And now we all have forever souvenirs. I love that. At the back of the museum grounds in Tulsa, there's this amazing, it's an art piece, but it's a cabin. Like a full cabin. And it's Grant and I's favorite spot at the museum. And we had talked about maybe we'll set up like a whiskey bar in the cabin that people can go find.

Maybe, oh my God. I was like, Hillary and Jeff had this person doing that's their wedding. Maybe we should have whiskey and tattoos in the cabin. And then we walked to the grounds at night and realized, like, you had to cross a river. Like someone, it's like actually so far from where the reception was. I was like, people will get lost. We will never see them again. And they'll be drinking.

Yeah, we will leave people at the museum. It's going to turn into a Ben Stiller movie. And so we decided against it. But Grant was like, well, if we do that, I'll get my first tattoo at our wedding. And I'm, oh, man. I kind of, that's the one. regret I have about it. It's an indie movie waiting to happen.

Like, at the end of a wedding, everybody's gone, and there's like four people who are left in the woods. Who are just like, wait, we're lost. We're so lost. And they just spend all night in a museum wandering the ground. So what you're saying is we're going to write a rom-com about a wedding. That's it. Guys, I think we have to. I'm ready.

I'm ready. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we, we ain't. to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly like very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for the hundreds of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Teller Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner

in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. We just got home from tour. You guys, I feel like we were taken very, very good care of. It was so fun. Yeah. You took a really good care of us, driving us around in that RV.

That's right. Uber took care of us. They picked us up from Uber. Every hotel. But in fact, when Hillary had to park the RV on the other side of the George Washington Bridge in New York in New York,

because, in Jersey, because she didn't want to drive the RV in New York City, understandably. There was no place to put the RV in New York City. God bless Uber. Yeah, so we parked the RV in Jersey and then in Fort Lee and then Uber

like shuffled us over. sweet guys who pulled up in those SUVs to pick us up were like, what's going on? We were like, hi, we're on a road trip, but we need to go to the city. We're all in ropes. They're like, what have I got myself into? But then we got to the Omni

in four of our cities and it was just so nice and luxurious. Thank you so much Omni. We have listener questions. Oh, yeah. You sure do. Oh, this is great, because we are talking about our weird hobbies.

Mary wants to know. y'all said you have so many weird hobbies what's the weirdest what's your favorite which ones do do you still do today i mean what's your definition of weird i used to knit remember when i would oh my god joy you knitting it was so good it's not super weird i guess but maybe for like a 20 year old it is i will say i do wish that i could you could you just have to learn how to cast on right but i i just don't know how but like nits are expensive i saw a sweater recently that wanted and I picked it up and I was like I'm sorry this is a 950 dollar sweater. I bet I could knit this and then I was like actually I couldn't but I'm not going to buy it. I could maybe you could

here's the pattern I don't know what other hobbies what hobbies do we have I kind of like well Hillary you and I both like taxidermy though we don't do it yet well you had some geese that are waiting for stuffing and I went out to the pool with my kids the other day and found a snake skin out by our pool. And I just brought it inside and I just kind of, I don't know, decorated with it and I put it on a plant. And I didn't realize how upsetting it would be to like other people in my house. But yeah, if you don't have dead things everywhere, how do you know you're alive? I love that. Have you been to Madame Daryl in Paris? The very first convention we ever did, I was like, sorry, everyone, I have somewhere to be. Yes. I love that. Do you know what this place is?

That's the cool, like, museum-y-looking place with all the text around you, right? Yes, yes, yes. It's unbelievable. And you can buy it all. It's all for sale. It's so beautiful. All the entomology, all the bugs, all of the... I love all the bugs.

Yeah, so many birds and beautiful animals. It's just incredible. I have this cool lusite paperweight. It's a rectangle. I don't know. What's that? Three by four inches maybe with this huge beetle in it from the 50s. Gorgeous.

I love it. So beautiful. And I want more. And I'm like, but how many, when does it get weird? If there's just little squares with bugs all over my house. Like, put them all up on the bathroom wall or something. Maybe I need one of those big framed things. I don't know.

Yeah. Do you guys remember the hobgoblin that was in my house in North Carolina? On the bar. Yeah. So there's this artist that works with Guillermo del Toro all the time named Thomas Kubler. And I collected his work when we lived in Wilmington because like all the like Anne Rice and Trent Rezner did. and I wanted to be cool.

So he makes these very realistic looking like goblins and demons and circus freaks and like, you know, that kind of stuff. And I decided that I was going to, too. Like, I was going to do it. And so like went to Michaels, got all the sculpty. No, I love you. Got like this stuff to make dolls.

And when Matt Brookman, remember, worked on our crew, he's electrician. They were having a baby and they'd made so much fun of my hobgoblins. So I made a hobgoblin for their baby as a baby and their dog ate it he was like

we don't need this in the house but I was always really into that and so then during the pandemic when Jeffrey and I were doing Friday night in

we had Ray Seahorn from Better Call Saul on our show and she was like oh hey sorry we're in my workroom I make these dolls and I was like

shut up you're my person oh my gosh I make these dolls Yeah, sometimes you just have to make a little demon doll, you know? That's not weird. It's interesting, but I've definitely never made a demon, but I've gotten really into taking old vessels, like random old bowls or old vases and covering them in airclay and then spraying them in like textured terracotta spray paint or like textured concrete spray paint or I'm...

You put plants in it? Like I am fully in my coastal grandmother era. in such an intense way. I'm going to put succulents in these. I'm like, I'm like, I'll just put eucalyptus leaves in there in my bathroom. It'll smell like a spa. It's so, it's like such a weird hobby, but I saw this video on TikTok and then my friend Sammy and I immediately started doing it.

You made those mushrooms. Oh, yeah. You show me a video of a craft and I'm like, I feel seen. I'll see you in a year. Goodbye. The other weird thing that I do, and I do this all the time. And I think it became like a set hobby because, you know, we live. live away from home so often, I don't have, yeah, like, I don't have all my stuff with me.

I have so many secret Pinterest boards for homes that I do not own, probably never will, that I've decorated completely. Like, if I ever had a barn in upstate New York, it would look like this. If I ever had a house in Taos, New Mexico, it would look like this. If I were to live on the lake in Austin, Texas, this is what my house would look like. Is this what you do late at night when you're laying in bed? This is how I unwinded. When I get home from set and it's like 2 a.m.

And I'm amped because I've had seven coffees. I'm like, let me just design a house real quick. You have got to meet my friend M-ray. You know, M-Rae Inos? Yes. Okay. So this is what she does late at night. She just sits and goes on Pinterest.

And I ask her, I talked to her about TV shows all time. And I'm trying to like, have you seen this? Have you seen this? She's like, Joy, all I want to do when I go to bed. I have two kids. I have a very busy life. All I do when I go to bed is just Pinterest. That's all I want to do is decorate.

It's just decorate houses and just make. and just make boards. I can't wait to talk to her about this. I have boards of tiles, wall, wall treatments. It's truly the thing. I don't doubt this at all. I feel a little high just talking to you. Oh my gosh.

I love it. I feel like my pupils are dialing. I'm just like, whoa. We have a follow-up question that, have you ever played an interior designer? Oh, you should. Yeah, but I'd like to. The question is from Lucille.

She says, what's your top favorite TV film character you've ever played? would it be your OTH character or whatever but but yeah you should play an interior interior and like you should build a brand while you're playing your interior designer I don't disagree with you. I'm like can I just go do one of those design TV shows where I do makeovers for people who deserve them of their homes yeah I would literally love nothing more I would be so happy yeah do it do it you should that's an easy sell we're putting it out there folks okay uh Dyson HGT both of you call us. Yes, 100%.

It's a really interesting question, though, Lucille asks, I can't pick a character because to me it feels like choosing between friends. Yeah, I agree. They're not, um, they're not like on paper to us. They're people. I mean, I could say when I had the most fun and what I enjoy the most. Yeah. Yeah, yeah. If you could hang out with any character that you've ever played. Who would it be? Like if you had to call someone and be like, yo girl, we're going out tonight.

I pick you out. You know what? I did a movie called Unexpected Christmas. This is a cute little Christmas movie. And I really liked that character. And she was fun and weird. And like,

I would hang out with her. I can't remember what her name was. Jamie was the guy. And my character's name was, dang. It's gone. I don't know. You never talk to yourself.

It's so much harder to remember your own character's names. I know. It's so true. It's so true. Yeah, I mean, I'm, God, I can't even remember all the shit we've done at this point. Should we spin a wheel? I think we should. Yeah.

All right, most likely to lock their keys in their car. Are you looking directly at me? No, I'm not. Knowing that I had to call the fire department once when Maria was in the backseat. No. Joy, that's so scary. I know. I was, look, I was in West Hollywood.

I had, I just got out of the car. and she, you know, it was fine. There was no, I was perfectly willing to break the window and it was very quick. The fire department was very close. I wasn't in the middle of nowhere. It was fine. But that's it. You don't want to break the window because then there's glass hole over your baby.

Like, yeah, I would have broken the driver's side window and gotten her. She was all the way, you know, like, it's fine. But it was definitely a moment of like, oh, I can never, ever do this again. That's scary. You also start to realize your muscle memory, like, you've spent your whole. life, getting out of your car, slamming the door and clicking the button. Yeah. You had a brand new baby.

Yeah. And your body clicked the button or clicked the button on the door. You know what I'm saying. You like open it, you click it, shut. And suddenly... Too many things in my brain. Oh, my God. Everything is different now. What a moment.

Yeah. For all your moms out there who've done that, you're not alone. Yeah. I mean, we did a storyline about that on our show. Oh, wait, we did. Way in later seasons, we sure did. Oh my gosh, that's right. It was a big scandal.

You have not seen the episode, Hillary. We'll get there in five years. I'm sitting here like, what? You're like, what? I'm going to have to look this up on Wikipedia? You know when I give people the daggers of death? Yeah. I had to do that to sweet, sweet Austin because it was like in our storyline.

And like, even I felt bad. That is an episode I remember watching. And I watched my face make the face in the shot. coming down the hospital hall and I was like oh man I would not want to be on the receiving end of that face on that person and it happens to be my face and I'm uncomfortable done we've got a big wedding coming up I think in the next episode yeah yeah we're getting ready for it I hope you guys are all psyched and ready next episode's the finale of season three oh my god we did we did it we've been going and going and going and we're just going to keep going thank

you for hanging out with us, everybody. Thanks, everyone. We'll see you next week. Hey, thanks for listening. Don't forget to leave us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram at Drama Queens, O-T-Hare. Or email us at Dramaquins at iHeartRadio.com. See you next time.

We're all about that high school, drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride in our comic girl. Dramma girl. Cheering for the right team. Drama queens, drama queens. rough girl fashion but you're tough girl you could sit with us girl drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens it may look different but native culture is alive my name is nicole garcia and on burn sage burn bridges we aim to explore that culture somewhere along the way it turned

into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop that's dr lee francis the fourth who opened the first native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.