Drama Queens - I Want You To Want Me • EP 715

Episode Date: October 28, 2024

This tribute episode to John Hughes goes down as one of Sophia and Rob's favorite episodes!  Sophia shares the inspo behind the flawless Brooke Davis look, Rob recalls filming in the back of a truck with unruly pigs, and what they loved about each scene that was inspired by John Hughes' iconic movies.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. It may look different, but native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

First of all, you don't know me. We're all about that high school drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride in our comic girl. Drama girl. Cheering for the right team. Drama queens, drama queens. Smart girl, rough girl, fashion but you'll tough girl. You could sit with us, girl.

Drama queen, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens. Hello, everyone. Hello, Robert Buckley. Hi, Soh, how are you? Hey, and hello to everyone at home. Gang, we got a fun one for you today. Episode 715, Season 7, episode 15, don't you forget about me. Cue the song.

Air date, February 1st, 2010. Tell them what it's about, Sov. Okay, this is such a fun one. In the chaos surrounding an 80s alumni dance at the Highseau. school. It's a fundraiser dance, by the way. That's not in the synopsis, but does feel relevant. Haley's birthday gets forgotten. Jamie's left home alone, and Nathan and Clay are stranded 200 miles from Tree Hill. Meanwhile, Brooks' appearance at the dance with Alexander forces Julian to relive his dorky adolescence in an episode dedicated to the memory of John Hughes. Les Butler

directed this. It was written by Terry Coley. This was so fun. Yes. Agreed. Are you Are you a big fan of the 80s and of John Hughes? Inmense. Like an immense John Hughes fan. I went through a phase where I probably watched the Breakfast Club once a week for two years. Wow. Like, I just, I don't know. I just love the whole era.

I think, you know, from that to Ferris Bueller's Day Off to Pretty and Pink and 16 Handles. It was such an iconic moment in film history. And I think the nostalgia of it relates to this show because you really had a lot of kids trying to figure out their identity and talk about their feelings and figure out how to be good to each other and forgive each other. And I don't know, there's something about getting to honor John Hughes on a show like One Tree Hill felt like a really big deal.

Yes. I had forgotten entirely that we had done that. this episode, by the way. And I am a huge John Hughes fan. I'm a big 80s fan. When I became an actor, one of my bucket list dreams was to work with John Hughes. So when he passed, I was devastated because his movies, they're so unique in that they entertain you, but they leave you feeling good when you walk out of the movie theater.

There's actual, like, substance. They're nutritious, you know? It's not like Diet Coke, like a lot of movies. There's 90 minutes of content, but they don't make your heart feel better, you know? And his were just different. And so when, you know, the episode opens with, was it simple minds, don't you forget about me? Yeah. And, oh, I just, I loved it.

I thought it was so great. So, do you remember, did he, did he pass, like, right around this time and we just quickly turned around an episode dedicated to him? Yeah, it must have been, I would imagine it was a few months before filming. I don't really remember in the calendar, but obviously they had to figure out how to do it. And then the sort of device of letting all of us adults honor John Hughes and then giving Jamie the home alone storyline. Yeah. Felt so sweet because it sort of merged the world's weak. up in, you know, as viewers and to your point that we kind of grew up idolizing. Like,

similarly to you, I really always hoped I'd get to make a John Hughes movie. And it is really weird when your heroes pass away because it's so confronting about time. And I don't know. I think it's really special that we got to do something that felt like that and felt authentic to us as well. And then, you know, the fact that our team, our studio was able to also get cheap trick to come in and perform was so crazy and cool. Yeah, it was really neat. This show continually crushes it when it comes to music. I'm constantly amazed at what we pulled off. You know, we talk about sometimes how things happen on this show and it feels like, it feels a bit half baked. Or it's like, oh man, if we had just given that a little bit more

thought, we could have pulled this off so much more successfully. I felt like this, was an example of they really executed it very well in terms of kind of seamlessly fitting in the 80s vibe, the amages to all of the different John Hughes movies. It was all done very, very just cleverly. Like it all worked. None of it was sort of clunky or awkward, you know, because we're referencing, I think, what, let's see, home alone, 16 candles, pretty and pink, planes, trains, and automobile. and Uncle Buck.

It's a lot of movie references to get right, you know, but they wove it all together quite well. Yeah, it is a lot. Forgive me, because this is the John Hughes, these movies that I'm not super clear about. The iconic shot of, is it Molly Ringwald and Andrew, whatever his name is, with a cake in the middle? Is that pretty in pink or 16 candles?

I asked the same question. Hold on. I'm going to Google it. Carthy is his name, because I knew we were referencing one of them. Obviously, Ducky is, I don't even know which one Ducky is either. Pretty and pink. Okay. Is what I'm finding online? I had the exact same question. I was like, wait, is it pretty and pink or is it 16 candles, but it. Okay. Is 16 candles Molly Ringwald as well? Yeah. I mean, she's in all of them. Good for her. In every John Hughes movie. She was only 16 when she did Breakfast Club.

What? Yeah. That blows my mind, really? She was 15 when they made 16 candles, 16 when they did the breakfast club. Wow. So I got to say, if an actor wants a dress, I feel like one of the worst answers you could give to shut them down is, you're not that kind of girl. Oof. You know what I mean?

That's a great way to get someone to dig in their heels. Your character's just not that cool. Sorry. Oof. Infinitely smarter. I will say wardrobe killed it this episode. Hair and makeup as well. Oh my gosh.

I did have a question. This is a very obvious boy question. But Quinn uses a flat iron apparently to achieve the kind of crimped look. So a crimper is essentially, it's the same tool as a flat iron, you know, flat sides. And then there's the metal plates in it. But instead of the metal plates being flat on the inside, they're in like a, they're in this. They're in like a zigzag, like a triangle shape. So when you push the flat iron together, it actually crimps the hair.

And so instead of grabbing it and dragging it down like you see girls do with a flat iron, you grab and press and hold for a minute and then it's crimped and then you keep going. You have to do each section on the plates. Gotcha. Okay, see, I thought she was holding a flat iron, and so I was very confused as to how a flat iron would achieve such a crimped look, but... That's it. It's the shape of the plate. Got it.

The more you know. The more you know. Do you remember in the 80s, and you might be too young for this, but there was, you know, because there was things we grew up with that we were, like, taught to be afraid of that just had absolutely no, like, real world, like, presence, like quicksand, for example. I was deathly afraid of quicksand as a kid. I have never seen quicksand in my life. Nope.

Do you remember hearing about how aerosol hairsprays were destroying the ozone? Yes. What happened? I don't actually know. Because we still have plenty of aerosol hairsprays, but I feel, do we just have bigger fish to fry? I don't know. Because do you remember hearing, like, I were being at, like, a younger age and hearing, like,

Yes. These hairsprays are destroying our ozone. Well, and there was a big deal, especially when we were little kids. The hole in the ozone layer was growing. But then all of these great regulations and environmental protections were put into place. And, you know, hundreds of thousands of acres of land were planted with trees that would pull carbon and, like, all these great things. And then you cut to a couple years ago and, like, these terrible people set like, how? the Amazon on fire.

And I'm like, so I know the ozone started to get better, but then we essentially set the lungs of the planet on fire. Is anybody going to give us an update about that? Like, I know it's really bad. And people talked about how it could, you know, push climate

into like terrifying, a terrifying sort of zone where we're going to go past 2C and then like what happens to the global food supply. That, wow, this is really taking a turn. Yeah. Now you know what I spend on my free time reading about. And I'm like, okay, I read all the really, really scary things. Is anybody going to like let us know what we need to do about that? Because you talk to us way more about hairspray

than you did about like fires that ate up hundreds of thousands of acres of the trees that keep us alive. So thank you for reminding me of that. Terrifying thing, Rob, that I now am going to have to go and check in on an update for on the internet after this episode. They're like, Don't worry about what we're doing to the rainforests. You need to be focused on acid rain and quicksand and killer bees. And rats of unusual size. Yup. You know, there's a lot to be worried about, which is all the more reason why we need an episode like this.

We need a John Hughes moment. Let me ask you a question. When you think 80s hair makeup, what's the first thing that comes to your mind? I think a lot about, is it Helmut Newton? he did all these really edgy portraits of women and like I think they did didn't he do music videos?

Okay why Sof does this I'll give my answer Okay For me it's Moose Oh yeah Like when Moose is so specifically 80s In fact I was doing I was doing some sort of job

Not too long ago And the The hairstylist put moose in my hair And I remember feeling like Did you just find that in a time capsule? Like, I haven't seen that in the two decades. Still works, though. It absolutely does. And by the way, I had to do a shoot recently, and they put moose in my hair. And I was like, wow, this feels like a real throwback. I didn't say anything because it was

my first day on set with these people. And at the end of the day, I was like, my hair still looks really good. Is moose the secret? Yeah. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for the kinds of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence.

That's Sierra Taylor Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television, On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage, Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Okay, Robert Palmer was the 80s music video guy, addicted to love, and it was all the, like, hot chicks in the black dresses and the really beautiful, like, red lips, severe eye. This is what I think about immediately when I think about 80s style. Yeah. Like all these chicks in their black dresses with the guitars and the red lips.

just looking epic. Yeah, I know this look. Right? Yeah. And I loved that I got to do a version of that. That was actually me and Carol's inspiration for Brooke was like the shape of the dress looks a lot like those 80s electric guitars,

and it's the black velvet and the red lip and the big hair. Like, we really wanted to lean into that. Kelly Kapowski meets a Robert Palmer video girl. And it was the highlight for me. Yeah, great reference. Kelly Kapowski, yeah. Right. That hair is so perfectly 80s.

My gal. I thought, yeah, the wardrobe was so good. I was bummed that Clay didn't get to get in on it, but I loved the planes, trains, and automobile storyline with Nathan and Clay. That's actually a memory, a clear memory I have from shooting the series, was doing. Really? Yes.

First of all, I remember being at the gas station, that scene, where Clay and Nathan, because I thought deluge was pronounced deluge, and the produce ready to come out and go like, it's, it's deluge. I was like, I don't think so. It was one of those ones where I was wrong and confident, and I had to be corrected by several different people. And then the pigs, I remember being in the back of the truck with James and the pigs. How was that? It was great. Stinky? Probably, yeah. But what I just remember is going like, this is cool. this is my job like this is awesome you know it's this is we're sitting in the back of the truck with pigs also there was so much fun stuff you know what it did they did a really good thing with

that storyline where even that little snapshot of a john hughes movie was like a john hughes movie in the sense that we had laughs yeah but then we had emotional sincerity like when clay actually talks about losing Sarah and then and then there's like the hero's redemption it they actually for it's so hard to do an episode of television when you have so many characters to serve this is a thing like people don't realize when you have an entire ensemble it oftentimes worked out to where it's like every character gets five minutes of screen time you know when you have such a big cast and it's really hard to tell a whole story in five minutes but that storyline they did an exceptional job with because it really kind of had

its own arc, its own beginning, middle, and end. So, yeah, while I was bummed, I didn't get to take part in the 80s fashion. I loved, because I also love planes, trains, and automobiles. Yeah. It's just iconic, you know? The only thing missing from that homage was the incredible scene at the airport where Steve Martin goes to get a rental car and it's not there. And he has the vulgarity-laden tirade where he's like, you know.

And I guess apparently that, that little riff in the movie, I think that was what got, did that movie, I think that movie was an R. I think I were hearing. Because of that scene. Yeah. And the studio is saying like, no, because especially back then, I don't know if it's still the case, R movies, you're not able to gross as much as a PG-13 movie. But I believe John Hughes saying, or the thing was like, no, that's, that needs to stay in the picture. I loved and I want to reference this because it comes up at the beginning of the episode and I actually think it's so cool that it happened in this one because we talked about it

last week with Austin that it would have been so much better if he had been in one of the rooms in Lucas's house and overheard the director berating Alex like just on the other side of the doorway and we got it in this one because Brooklyn. and Julian are in Lucas's old bedroom. And, you know, she has the bit about, like, this teamster is, you know, painting over my childhood. And I, by the way, love the teamster shout out because they just ratified their new union deal. And I was like, go teamsters. It made me really proud. But it's like one of those jokes that's burned into my brain. But it's so great because Brooke's talking about the dance and Julian's not getting it. And they're back in

this bedroom that she tried to have good communication with a boy in in high school and it failed. And then right on the other side of the wall, Alex, when Julian comes out, is like, she's asking you to the dance. And he's like, no, she's not. And she's like, yes, she is. You're going. And it's this great moment because it does feel so high school. And it also gives us the thing we really wanted last week that we didn't get. And I loved that it happened. Yeah, I was a very big fan. of Alex, the wingman. Yeah. I will say, so I was, I love that because it was so believable.

Like, I'm the same way. I'm such, I can be so thick-headed and just like not pick up on cues and subtleties. I'd be like, she doesn't like me, you know? So I was, I totally understood that. But so I loved all of that. I loved, and it was kind of cool that the two Alexes were both actually just sort of there to like wingman and cheer lead. Yeah.

I loved that dynamic. The weird thing that. I didn't, I bumped on hard was at the end of it when Alex, I think she's talking, I think she's talking to Alexander. Yeah, outside the school. And she's like, just so you know, like those two are going to end up, like she loves him or something like that. And he goes, well, how do you know?

And she says, because I love him too. I was like, what? Why are we still telling people you love him? Yeah, it's weird. It would have been better if she'd said some version of it that was like in the past tense. Yes. Like I used to love him and there's no getting between those two or something. Yeah.

You know, like I've seen it. They're meant to be something. It was weird because she's rooting for them and then she's also like, but I love him. It's bizarre. And that's fine if you still have feelings for him, but I don't know why you'd advertise that. Right. Especially to someone, especially to the person who is Brooke's right-hand man. Yes. And it's interesting too because Brooke has had the conversation with other people about what it

was like to be the third in the Brooke, Peyton and Lucas Love Triangle. Like there's no getting between Peyton and Lucas. You could give the audience that familiar feeling and that you of like, I know what it's like to be in this love triangle. There's no getting between those two. And it would really get into that canon of the One Tree Hill relationships, right? Like the end games are such a big deal, yada, yada. And instead, it's like, wait, is she being the sweetest person in the world or kind of a stalker? Like, what? That's it, exactly, because I'm still trying to figure out, like, who Alex is. Like, what is Alex going forward? And so throughout the entirety of this episode, I was thinking, sweet. She has sort of come to terms with the fact that

it's Brooke and Julian and now she's just going to be a team player. And then so to do this, to make this proclamation, it's not really a proclamation, but to make this admission, it just, it's like, yeah, it kind of muddies the water of like, so is this sincere? It kind of takes the charm out of the whole night. Yes. Yeah, well put. That's what it is, I think. And I just, because she's been so manic, I was sort of hoping that we would just settle into this. We're finally just friends with no ulterior motives. And then she says this at the very end. I'm like, oh, friends don't do that.

Because you know what it is? It could have been very similar to last week with Mouth and Miss Lauren, where you get to see these friends who really see each other and they have great chemistry, but that chemistry is not romantic. Mm-hmm. And the Alex and Julian chemistry as friends and sidekicks is so great. And then in a way, like, it pulls the rug out from under itself by having her say she still has feelings for him. And I wonder just to what end it was in there for? Because I don't know. Are they still trying to have Alex be a potential threat to Brulian?

I don't remember where the story goes so that I'm genuinely asking. I was just going to say, I'm embarrassed. I don't remember. I don't remember how long Alex is around for, but that was my only question was, are we still trying to, like, have the presence of a potential threat? Is that why that's happening? I don't know. It was, it would have been a lot cooler if, like, she hit on Alexander, you know? Sure. Or if she even admitted that it's hard, but she's trying to be a good friend. Because, by the way, that's what he's do. You know, he, he is so charming through this episode, coming in to check on her, offering to be a date, saying, look, Miami Vice is my, that's my jam. And the way, like, that shot of him, of Mitch outside, you know, on the Trans Am, in the suit, it's so charming.

Like, holy shit, is it charming? And I don't know. I like that he really shows up for her as a friend. And even if he likes Brooke, he's not talking about it. Yeah. And it would be cool to see him in Alex, Alexander and Alex, wind up in the same kind of space. But then the writers like took it away from her a little bit. And I don't love that.

Yeah. And also that Miami Vice suit was incredible. He looks so good. And his hair is so good. So good. The whole thing is perfect. I also like that he comes in and he ribs her about the dress. a little bit. He's like, what is, like, what is this? What, like, flamenco dancing contest or whatever

he says, are you going to? And she realizes she has to redo it. My flag on the play there is whose hands are cutting and sewing my dress, because they are not mine. Oh, how funny. Like, they realized they didn't shoot inserts. And I'm like, you guys, I had, like, I had a manicure. And whoever whoever's hands they used for the inserts had like rings on that aren't mine and it's so silly to me. So that was a big flag for me in there. Is there a world in which it was Alexander's hands or were they female hands? No, they were they were a lady's hands. That's funny. I didn't catch that. Oh, it's good though. Like it's a shot of like scissors cutting the red crinkle fabric that becomes the sash on my dress and then sewing like through the sewing machine feeding the

fabric through and I'm like I don't know whose hands those are but they are in the mind it was kind of a trap but yeah to your point I think anything Alex would have said all you have to do is just make it past tense yes the issue is that she's stating it as as if it's just how she's currently still feeling that makes it yeah and she's been such a great friend recently to Julian that it makes her kindness seem suspect. And then it's like, well, is she kind or conniving? Yeah. And I don't think that that's necessary.

Yeah. And we've put her through enough extreme stuff. Can we just have her be a human for a while? Yeah. Like, just let her be a buddy. They really ran Alex and Millie through the ringer this season. Yeah. And you know who else they ran through the ringer this episode?

Kylie. Poor Sasha. God, Sasha is such a good sport. Yeah. They're like, just show up in a bikini. We're going to pour a smoothie on you. I didn't. What?

No. They did her dirty this episode. They really, literally. I wondered if it was sort of a, you know, the famous red bikini scene? That's a John Hughes movie, right? When the girl gets out, Fast Times at Ridgemont High is not? That's not John Hughes.

It's not John Hughes? I don't believe so. So it's in that era then, I guess, and it felt like they wanted to kind of reference that, but they did it in this way that was a bit degrading. And it was also weird. It felt so left of center for Quinn. I was like, wait, Quinn is like pretty chill. And then she, like, dumped a smoothie on this girl and is accusing, is like calling her a whore?

It feels like a lot. Well, and it doesn't help that literally last episode, she was telling Haley to kill Taylor with kindness. And she was like, I'm a high road type gal. I kill with kindness. And then the next episode, she's pouring a smoothie on this gal. And neither way made sense to me. Kylie's, I don't understand.

She's not like a real person because she just shows up at Clay's to swim without even talking to him, which again is just odd. She has a key and she goes to let herself in and then she's mad when the door's not open. It's like, what kind of a real person would do that? No, it's all very weird. And she has such a great storyline in this episode because she is the babe from weird science.

Yeah. But it opens so oddly. And again, it reminds me of what we talked about with Austin last week. that they had an idea for how to bring the Kylie character back so that they could do the lock thing and Clay could be cute to Quinn and then Kylie could be the fantasy girl from Weird Science in this episode, but it feels like they never got past

the outline on her scenes. Yeah. It was like they just left the bullet points from the outline in and they didn't flesh out last week or these first scenes this week. Because then once Kylie gets to the dance with mouth it's so great but when she shows up for the date and we're we're doing this really gross like they wrote all these really sort of transphobic things in the episode about how there's no

girl so perfect she's going to be a he and then to prove that she's a woman she flashes her tits at him i'm like what like it felt so yucky and i mean poor sasha it's like look you show up as an actor and you have to do your job and she committed she did such a great job she made it charming and funny and sassy and she winds up just being the sweetest sad girl who feels like she doesn't get picked and you know the scene where they wind up together at the locker between her and quinn is actually so sweet yeah and i was like did it have to be so mean to get here couldn't we have just gotten here anyway? Yeah. And, you know, the whole weird science thing, like, that is male wish fulfillment, right? That's the whole point. It's like this. It's like creepy male gaze stuff.

Yeah, but they definitely continued with that theme because the thing that I, that just killed me, man, was at the end of the episode, her and mouth walk out to the parking lot. And she says, well, but you have been a trooper so we can go and have a shag. And it just felt like as if she was offering him a cookie. Like, well, you weren't a complete asshole, so how about I give you some sex? It's like, what? What?

Yes. Just, come on. And it feels like this recycling of the not, it's not the charming John Hughes of it all. No one's learning a lesson. It's no different than last week where they had Taylor say, and the rest, as they say, was sex. It's like, no one's saying that at the dinner table.

that's not how women talk and this girl is not going to do this with mouth like i don't know maybe they they would say you know let why don't we start over let's go to a bar let's go have a great time and she realizes he's an amazing dancer and they wind up going to like have a night together but it's so i don't know i feel like eight-year-old boys wrote these scenes and i'm like what is happening here even the fact that she's so hung up on clay when all we've ever seen is her laying in Clay's bed and then she makes one comment to him about maybe feelings and he goes

I don't believe in love he shuts her down hard and ever since then it's like she has keys to the house weird and she's in love with him but again it's odd like so she shows up to his house to swim but doesn't go to talk to him

and then now now it's uh they're like yeah just it's it's so it's so odd so i just had such a massive brain fart what was i talking about well it's just this thing of us really going like it feels reductive and and illogical like kiley can't possibly be in love with clay there it is also why does she have keys because the only time we've seen her show up at his house he has to let her in So again, it just feels to me like they had these bullet points in the outline and then they never fleshed out those scenes because they were doing really great work in so many other scenes. And I know we talk about this. I do want to be careful.

I feel like I don't want to be totally negative because I actually loved this episode. But it is hard, I think from these points we're all in when we're when we are, you know, older and wiser when, you know, many of us. us are directors and producers and our literal job is to break down scripts to make sure they're as good as they can be. And then you look back and you go like, wait, all of these actors are so good. Everyone is so charming. The setup for the episode is actually so adorable. Who doesn't love John Hughes? And then you're like, you could have done better by this character who's actually great. Yeah. And to be fair, I mean, I mean, I don't, we're not really complaining about this episode. This is just this one storyline where we feel.

for Kylie. And also, they really nailed it with, again, sort of going back to how when you have an ensemble and you really break down the math of how many minutes of airtime you have and how many characters you have, like genuinely, you get to a spot where you're like, we have six minutes with this character to tell a whole episode. Yes. And if they didn't flush out the Kylie storyline, which let's be honest, that's not the ABC or probably even D storyline. Like, that's okay because they nailed it with all of the main characters. Yeah. But that's not to say that like they couldn't have done a little bit more just to humanizer.

Just a little adjustment. Like two clicks to the left would have been great. Yeah. And the point when I lost the thread, what I was going to get to was it just I didn't earn the moment when they're in the parking lot. And Kylie looks over and sees Clay and Quinn reuniting. And she kind of has that look of longing. I know what that moment is.

But I just found myself going, but it's just odd how into him she is and how completely oblivious and he is and how he's just like not there for her at all. Yeah. One-sided is a better way of putting it. He's having an appropriate reaction. And she's been assigned adoration based on pages. Yeah. And just if that last little exchange with mouth instead of just going, well, you sort of

would have behaved yourself tonight. So here's some sex as a reward. It would have been so so much better if instead it was like, well, like, let's go get waffles. You know, anything. I was going to say pancakes. Yeah. See, a breakfast food of any type, you know. Yes. Just like that, I would have just been nice to see. Like, let her just be a, let's let her be a person. Yeah, it would have been nice. is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing

for a hundred of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage, Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I was wondering if you remember watching everyone in the parking lot, it didn't seem like that was a freezing night. Sometimes I feel like you can see the cold on camera.

I could see how cold it was when you and James were at the gas station and in the pig truck. Like, I know you guys were freezing. And this episode airing, uh, What does it say? February 1st. I'm like, this was probably the first episode we shot coming back from the New Year's break. Like, were you just frozen in the back of a truck with some little pigs? Yeah. Yeah. I remember when they gave wardrobe options for being in the back of that truck, it was one of those moments where I was like, give me every suggestion you have is a yes. You got a silly hat, put a silly hat on me. You got gloves? Give me gloves. Because the

seen at the gas station, I don't remember that being very cold. I mean, to be fair, most of it plays inside the car anyways. But yeah, that truck was cold because it's cold outside. And then you're also just, you're just exposed to the wind chill and the breeze. So that, that was cold. But at least it was, it was funny and distracting because you just have unruly pigs. And so we'd be like halfway into a take, you know, and a pig would want to like cuddle up with you. And it's just, you know, You'd be like, okay, this is happening. We're just going to, we're going to go with it. The little baby pigs in the back.

They weren't the most professional of scene partners, but they were adorable. It worked. Oh, my God. And then the hiking, I also watching, in all caps, I wrote, why are they hiking? Did love, that'll do, pig. Your little quoting babe was so sweet. Yeah, and how did it go? did, Clay didn't confess right away about Sarah, right? Didn't Nathan kind of admonish him a couple

times? Yeah, you guys have been hiking for a while and he flips out, which I thought was great. You know, I liked that we got a little bit of realism. Because again, these characters all have these crazy jobs. Like, it's all fantasy land, right? And I liked that he said, I spend over half the year on the road. The least I can do is be home for my wife's birthday. It was such a nice thing because it does. It reminded me of, you know, there'd be weekends where, like, we would have worked 100 hours and we'd go straight from set at 5 a.m. on Saturday morning to the airport to get on a 6 a.m. flight to get home for somebody's wedding or something because you're just never home.

Yeah. And it felt so true to me what he was saying. And I think in a way when he said, you know, you'd understand that if you'd ever been married. I was not expecting it. And when he said that to you, the look on your face coincided with me going, like I gasped out loud alone in my house. And I was, it felt like such a sucker punch.

And then I literally wrote down. I was like, wow, they really played the scene well. Like I got very lost in it. And it was amazing that I, as a viewer, I got to watch you be hurt. by that and then realize that the only way to undo that hurt was to tell the truth because he just doesn't know. He says something shitty to you, but it's shitty because he doesn't know. Yeah. And the way that you share together in that moment was so good. And he thinks you're joking. And then you explain that she died. And I wrote down. I have all these notes about

both of the ways you both reacted. The look on James's face, he looks away. He looks away. He looks down. He, like, shakes his head. He doesn't know what to do. Yeah. And he says, I'm so sorry. I thought you were joking. Yeah.

Like, and you realize these two people are so close, and they do love each other so much, and their friendship is so meaningful. But this thing, not existing between them until this moment, like creates a big hole. It was really beautiful. You guys were so good.

Yeah, thanks. And I'm glad you brought up because I loved this scene. You know, I love, I love emotional vulnerability on the guy. I love emotional accessibility. And it's, it was such a great invitation, you know, for like intimacy between these two of like, okay, we're pals. Like, I'm going to really let you see me here. You know, I'm going to drop the guard. And I love, like you said, I think the way he played it was perfect. I like the way that Clay delivers it because it's not punitive. It's not like, well, you don't think this, but guess what, you know, he was just saying. Hey, matter of fact, by the way, I've never shared this with you. Here's some of my, here's some of my story, you know. And I love the way he did it because it's so honest. That would be, that's how I'd react. It was like, that's not funny.

That's, don't make that joke. And then, oh, my God, you're not joking. Oh, you know, but it landed. It was so great, man. Yeah. And just sets the stage for them getting even closer, which is, which is awesome. Yeah, and the bit with the woman who drew. drives by and the whole thing. And, you know, when he shows back up to rescue you, and he's like,

I bought her car. It's so, it's a great buddy comedy that you guys have going in this whole episode. Yeah. Was that Christy Swanson? I think so. Because I remember shooting that scene and just, I remember having a moment of going, no freaking way. The OG Buffy. I get to do a scene with the OG Buffy. But yeah, again, like the fact we have her and cheap trick. Like, it just, It fired on all cylinders, man. Yeah, they did really, really well. And I really love that all of those 80s references, you know, from the obvious to maybe the niche, depending on what people know about the era and those shows and those movies, they really layered all of that stuff in so well.

even the fact that Brooke and Julian have their scene with, you know, the nerd and the popular girl in shop class. Like, it was such a good choice. It wasn't over by the punch bowl, you know? Yeah. It was so fun. And the one thing I do wish, and I remember because obviously I had that really intense red lipstick on, I barely kiss him. and that would have been my note watching it back. I was like, oh, I should have just kissed him

and we should have reset and gotten the lipstick off his face. But it was so colorful that I was trying to be careful and, you know, respectful of Austin's face and time. And that was the one thing I wish we had changed. But I do think that the scene itself was so sweet because he talks about, you know, losing his confidence. And it's nice to see that on a movie director. And she talks about, you know, knowing what it's like to get a kiss from the popular girl, which was always something she was

self-conscious about. And now it's like, oh, well, if you can own that, I can on this too. And I don't know. It was this very sweet. I felt like I saw them as adults and as teenagers, like healing their teen years in their present together. I got to say, I'm actually glad you didn't put a big kiss on him. Really? Yeah. I don't mean like a makeout. I just meant I wish I'd like kissed him and I felt like I pecked him so that I didn't

red up his face. The reason that worked for me was because it left me a little confused that you kissed him. But then the episode goes on to say that like you're still broken up. Yeah. Because to me that kiss is sort of an invitation back in. That's how I interpreted it. Like if my ex, who I still have feelings for, who I know has feelings for me, kisses me, that is sort of the door being opened to, let's revisit this now.

So I was confused because after that scene, there's some sort of mention of like, it's going to be hard, we're going to figure it out. And I was confused going, but you just, you just sort of showed. So I'm glad it wasn't more of a kiss because that would have been even more confusing. You just had this wildly passionate kiss and now, you know, because then it would have been like, you're back on you know what I mean like that's really true and so because you made it small it was sad yeah it was sad it was sad and it also made sense because in those movies that is the kind of kiss that the popular girl gives the nerdy guy it's sort of a consolation prize

here you go it's an adum here you go pal there's a kiss for you you know it was a it was like a sad thing and and I remember I do have that sense memory of being in the scene and what we really wanted to capture was the sadness of the timing being off, but the longing for them, you know, and it's interesting. You saying that has made me think even about what I was just saying

that in a way I see them as adults and also I see them kind of reliving their like childhood wounds together. That's what they say, right? is that, like, when you get into the right relationship, it's healthy in the present, but it can help you heal your past. And it's actually sort of special, and I hadn't thought about it until you said it,

that we're getting a window into Brooke and Julian, ultimately being right for each other and being able to, like, grow together and heal together. But in this moment, the timing is still a little off. So they're stuck. And the being kind of in limbo or stuck in tandem is, it's so sad. so sweet. Yeah, but you guys both played it great. But yeah, the opening of that scene of Julian

just sitting in the half-assembled car by himself cracked me up, man. That was so funny. And his ducky outfit was next level. When he and Jenna walked in, first of all, your hair was incredible. Like, you guys nailed your hair. But when Alex and Julian walked in, I mean, Everyone, though, Alexander was the same. Everyone who dressed up for this dance looked incredible. His hair kind of up like that. He looked so good. I loved it.

Everyone looked great. And I loved also, especially because of the way the writing was for Jana in the episode prior to this in 714. You know, they made a lot of this guy hitting on her and her being barely dressed and all this stuff. I love that she came into the dance looking like Skipper, like Barbie's kid sister. Like she looked beautiful. But she was in like Little Bermuda shorts. And like she wasn't in something like, whoa, sexy,

which obviously Jana can do. And I thought it was a very cool choice because her and Julian in a way came in looking more like siblings than like people on a date. And it was a really smart, choice from the wardrobe department to try to signal that they were really there as friends.

You know? Yeah, and again, it's like, so that's why I wish that she hadn't said, I'm still in love with him because it's like they're doing all of these things right to pave a really cool friendship. Exactly. By the way, speaking of her on set,

do you remember last episode, we didn't really talk about this, but with that director, the caricature of a terrible director, is like, let's see the scene. First of all, she has no scene partner. There is no other actor on set to run lines with. And she gets like four words in before he's like, it's terrible. It's whatever it is.

And by the way, she's tearing up. She's fully emotionally present. And he's like terrible acting. I'm like, wait, what's happening here? That was so confusing to me. Because like you said, first of all, I just felt like if the director's doing that for you, it's like usually to run words. Like, let's just hear the words.

If you're scene partners out there. she actually does the performance she gets emotional and he's like like he's not even paying attention he's like that's terrible you should have and i think that's the moment where he like grabs her wrists and he grabs her wrists it's so gross he makes some comment about her like needing to do better next time it was like he says can't you do anything right what awful gasp i did not okay man jan is a pro because she showed up beautifully. And yeah, I think you're right, especially because of the arc from 14 to 15 is so good for her. She's really, you know, mustering her strength and doing everything as right as she knows how to do.

That's why it feels like a little bit of a sabotage to have her say the thing to Alexander at the end, because you're like, no, she's doing better than this. Yeah. It's a sabotage and it's also just not. smart like why would you tell the right-hand man to the love interest of the just yes you know well it was pretty wonderful regardless um i know we mentioned it but i i did really love the sort of making up moment between Quinn and Kylie at the end. I remember that they had to be really careful. They basically put like a hair piece in Kylie, Sasha's hair, that they actually cut. So they basically put

like fake hair in the back and then put that in the locker. And I remember everyone being like, oh my God, oh my God, oh my God. Please don't cut any of her actual hair. And not feeling really stressful. I love how funny she was when Quinn's like, why do you have scissors in your person? She's like, I was going to slash your tires. When she pulled out a pair of scissors, it's funny because you see my notes. I'm like, why does she have a pair of scissors in her purse going to a school dance and then underneath it is just, never mind. They explained it right away. It's genius, actually. Yeah, it's so good. I also thought Grubbs was so sweet. It was nice to see him back, even though he barely did anything in the episode. To your point,

such a big ensemble. I wish, though, that they'd had someone. Like, why didn't Kylie ask for a drink and he know what she wanted? Like Grubbs being the psychic bartender is such a good bit that that was the one thing I was sad didn't happen here. But the rest of it, I just loved it. I loved Jackson having the whole home alone thing and then doing that sped up, like, kid, you know, on a sugar rush running around the house and falling over the furniture and all of it was just, it was really fun. I did make a note, and maybe you will remember this at the end, Nathan shows up in his amazing 80s hero moment, and she's like, whose car is that? And he says, it's yours. Happy birthday, baby. Do we ever see this Porsche that he bought again? I have no idea That's a great question

I wrote it down I was like wait I don't remember Do we ever see this car again Or is it literally just a joke Or a bit rather for this episode Because if we don't see it again It's going to be annoying

Yeah I have no idea if we do or not The Just an unrelated question Did Mouth move back in with Milly So he says he's going to stay a while and obviously that's where he's staying. But they haven't addressed it. But I was like, is he staying in Skills' old room?

Or are they just like sharing a bed, but they're broken up? I was curious about that as well. My honorable mention of this episode would be when Jamie hatches the plan to get himself home alone, when he calls Junk and Fergie, is it is called? No, I forget which one's which, but I think it's junk hangs up the phone. And he goes, oh, I guess they don't, they don't need us to babysit Jamie today. He goes, why? And he says, he said they're going in a different direction. In a different direction. That cracked me up. That's such a funny use, because that's something they say in acting, like if you audition for a role

and you don't get it, often a kind way of them saying is like, oh, they went in a different direction. So to hear that with babysitting, cracked me up. It was a sweet little nod to people who know the industry. And the fact that the episode is really bookended with Julian's movie. And he talks about how nervous he is for his first big speech. And you see him and Brooke doing this thing together anyway. And at the end, he makes the speech. And they have that sweet moment of eye contact.

And then Julian says, and action. And it cuts. I just loved it. I was like, it's so adorable, and it's a really cool way to end on a director. And then you cut to in memory of John Hughes. And I was like, that's some of those little moments. I'm like, that's really movie and TV magic at its best. Yeah, that was sweet.

There was a funny moment in that when Julian does that where he goes, and action. And for those who are just listening at home, I'm also showing he did like a hand gesture as if he was like a karate chop, yeah. And I laughed going like, I wonder if that was a choice on his part because he's a new director because no directors ever do a hand gesture while they yell action because no one's looking at them. But I thought that's great if he's just a little awkward and doesn't know.

So he's just like, and action, hand chop. Yeah, or was it because they were like, do something into camera because the last shot of the episode is him looking down the barrel of the lens. Like, who knows? Yeah, but that was great. It's so sweet. Well, I think overall, we actually really loved this episode. It made me very nostalgic.

This episode was great. Did it seem like we were tearing it apart too much? I feel like there was a couple little nitpicky things, but I think overall, this episode was awesome. Here's the thing. And, you know, we talk obviously a lot about therapy on our shows, so, like, no one is surprised that we are working through things. I mentioned to you that, like, we were beginning to joke about something last week. And then I was like, ah, I don't know. I don't know.

I never like to joke about people. I'm the person who gets very anxious joking about anything if I'm not the butt of the joke. Like I can't even finish a joke usually if it's about someone else. And people are like, yeah, but I'm in on the joke. But I get overly nervous. And I think because I threw myself into like a bundle of nerves, I just now I'm like, I don't know. I don't know. Maybe it's too much.

Is it too critical? I'm stuck in the loop of it, which is, you know, a fun. ADHD brain thing that happens to me. And wonderful. Some of your neurospiciness, do you have an honorable mention from this app? I, yeah, I mean, really the wardrobe for me is the honorable mention because it really built the world. I was also going to say, though, just because I'm looking at it, some of those little things like going in a different direction and action, there's little things we know that felt like inside jokes and when Julian asks Alex why there's no changes why do we have a golden rod script and she was like I wasn't going to let the final pages be salmon

yeah it's like it's such a funny thing that if you work on a set you know the the color order of the pages that you get and I always loved the golden rod pages the most and it it just made me laugh so I don't know maybe it's our little inside inside industry film jokes that also get my honorable mention. It's a tie. Yeah, because that joke is only for a very small audience. Yeah. Yeah, if you're not, if you're not hip with the industry, you would never get that. All right. Well, if you're going to give it to wardrobe, I'm going to give it to hair and makeup. Oh, great. Because between the two, I mean, seriously, the wardrobe and the hair and makeup in this episode made me so happy. And also the music department just killed it.

Unbelievable. This show always does a good job with music. But, I mean, I mean, I love the 80s. I'm a child of the 80s, so it has a very special place in my heart. So, yeah, this episode was right up my alley. Loved it. It may look different, but Native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional.

It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for a hundred of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep tradition.

alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. have pets, yes, nobody on the production side wanted to deal with animals. If you all had pets, what would your character have and why? I mean, is Clay like a golden retriever guy, or is he the guy that has a ferret? Let's be honest, Clay himself is a bit of a golden retriever. So, you know how they say the pet, like dog owners usually look like their dog. It would be pretty on brand if Clay had a golden retriever. But that being said, as soon as you said this question,

my first thought was, would Clay have a monkey? Like Ross used to on Friends. Yeah, exactly. I mean, people definitely look like their dogs. I have a big old square jaw, and I've always had like a big square-headed pit bull. Oh, you did. I haven't thought about that.

It was a gal with one eye, right? Yeah. Oh, she was so lovely. He was really the best. Oh, it was a boy. Yeah, Patch. I thought it was a girl. Yeah, Patch.

I remember patching the hair and makeup trailer. And Penny was the little girl, the little orange one. Yeah. Oh. So yummy. I love a sweet pit, man. Oh, they're so good. I could see, if I think about the ways we're similar, I think Brooke Davis would also love a rescue dog like that because she likes to take bets on people.

But if I'm not trying to relate us too close. I think in my fantasy world, because I'm really allergic to cats, so I can't have one, even though I think they're pretty amazing. I think Brooke would have one of those, like, gorgeous little bengal cats. You know, the ones that have, like, the leopard spots on them and the green eyes, but they're house cats? Whoa, no. They are so gorgeous.

They look like this. Oh, wow. Yeah, that is a good-looking cat. That also feels very Brooke Davis. Don't you think she'd have, like, a chic little kitty? Exactly. Look at their little eyes. Wow.

Like if I would not be constantly unable to see and sneezing, I would have one. Yeah, it's not worth the allergies, but it's a good-looking cat. Right? So, yeah, I think Brooke might be a cat lady. I love it. Are we spinning a wheel or are we just... We should. We didn't spin a wheel last week.

We didn't. We got so excited talking about things with Austin. We just bumped right out. What do we got? Most likely to get their pilot's license. I mean, it's Chase. He did. Agreed.

Yep. Has anybody actually done that on our show, though, like in real life? Tyler Hilton. Stop. I don't know if Tyler actually finished his certification, but he definitely started the process and has flown planes. Whoa. Okay.

Wow, I missed that. We got it. I was actually just talking. me about this. I was like, when do you come back on the show, dude? I'm dying to get you on. And he said, like, not till season nine? No. How is that possible? We should probably just have him join us for an episode and like watch and give us commentary. We should. Because he's, he's just so funny and such a great guy. We should, yeah, we should do that. And we can also ask me about this flying because, yeah, I'm pretty sure it's something he did. In fact, at the convention we were

talking and he made some reference. He's like, yeah, it's like, it's like they tell you when you're learning to fly. I was like, don't say that like that's relatable to me, guy. Yeah, you're Like, sorry, what? I've never flown a plane. Yeah, okay. All right. Well, maybe we need to get them on here. We'll get them on here.

Let's tell the folks we got next week, so what do we got? Okay, next episode, we will be back together for season seven, episode 16. My attendance is bad, but my intentions are good. That's a great title. It's a very good title. Thanks for joining, everybody. Keeping the high school theme going. Thanks, friends. We'll see you next week. Hey, thanks for listening. Don't forget to leave us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram at Drama Queen's O-T-H. Or email us at Drama Queen's at I-HeartRadio.com. See you next time.

We're all about that high school drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride and our comic girl. Dreamer for the right team Drama queens Smart girl rough girl Fashion but you're tough girl You could sit with us girl Drama queens drama queens

Drama queens drama queens drama queens Drama queens drama queens It may look different But native culture is alive My name is Nicole Garcia And on Burn Sage Burn Bridges We aim to explore that culture Somewhere along the way

It turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop That's Dr. Lee Francis the 4th who opened the first native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.