Drama Queens - It Feels so Good • EP502

Episode Date: May 1, 2023

This was a very special episode for the Drama Queens and the rewatch brought back all the feels. Find out why the reunion on screen was genuine and what scripted parts of the episode have finally become clearer over the years.  Plus, this was the first episode Hilarie’s husband ever watched. Want to know how it went?! You’ll have to listen to find out!See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. It may look different, but native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

First of all, you don't know me. We're all about that high school drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride and our comic girl. Drama girl. Cheering for the right team. Drama queens, drama queens. Smart girl, rough girl, fashion but you'll tough girl. You could sit with us, girl.

Drama queen, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens. You guys, oh man, the mysteries are being, you know, figured out. Untangled is the right word. That's what I was like, I said, I fell asleep right after I watched the episode. It was so emotionally intense. I had to take a nap. And now I'm like up, ready to chat. I loved this episode, though.

Loved. I really loved it. We got so much. They packed a lot into this episode. And it was pretty seamless, I have to say. Yes. Right? It wasn't rushed.

Like sometimes when they give you one sentence and you go, all right, they just had to. It felt like everyone had time to do things and breathe and say things. And yet so much happened. Yeah. I'm going to actually do a rundown on the list of what happened. Here we go. Well, we have our synopsis. Let's see if the synopsis is accurate.

Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Okay. Skills signs Jamie up for the soapbox derby race. So fun. Haley has her first day as a teacher. It's harder than she thinks. thought. She also hires a nanny to get some much-needed help at home as Nathan's still struggling.

Brooke tries to convince Peyton to start her own record label while also deciding she wants to open a close over Bro's store in Tree Hill. And it was directed by Paul Johansson. This is sort of some of the stuff that happened. But I actually have a list of how much we packed into this episode. It's quick. I'm just going to read it. Lindsay, Quentin, Lucas and Skills are basketball coaches. Brooke and Jamie, mouth in the real world. Intro Nanny, Perry, Peyton and the label, Peyton and Lucas drama, Nathan Coping, Haley, Teaching, and then the three girls, the scene by the pool with all of us, like, reuniting for the first time. That's a lot of storyline, and all of those were actual storylines.

And I love that everyone's doing miserably. Like, no one is flourishing, but we all look good. Like, everyone looks really good, and we are just failing upwards. Fanfuckatastic. this was the first episode my husband has ever seen anything of by the way oh my gosh no normally you guys we watch the episodes together and because of scheduling we couldn't so we all watched it separately today and i'm sitting on my couch watching the episode and halfway through geoffrey comes through and just sees all of us and trick and is like i would like to know more about what's going on here and just sits down and

watches the last half of the episode and like was hooked it was like it was sweet to have someone who's never seen anything stand up at the end of the episode and be like, I get it. That makes sense. Right on. Oh, dad loves us. Dad loves us. And he acknowledged that we look like babies.

He's like, you guys, what were you? Like 12? Yeah. Really, really young. Okay, guys, well, Dad loves season five, episode two, Racing Like a Pro. Originally aired January 8th, 2008. And what an episode?

like Paul did such a good job directing this episode it all I I know we're going to talk about it for the next hour but it really did all feel so real so rooted and I love that with our time jump you said it Hillary everyone is having a hard time and it's being named when Lucas meets you at Trick he tells you everything that's going wrong for everyone else yeah he reminds you that you're not alone it reminds the audience that if you're having a hard time in these major times of transition, you're not alone. And Paul, as our director, managed to give such a packed episode that finally starts to give us answers on where everyone's been in these invisible four years. And with great performances, he is so good at drawing out good performances from everybody. And every single scene had room to breathe. You got to react to things. before it cut to the next thing. I just, I think he hits such a home run with this one.

Do you guys notice the lighting was different, too? Like, it's lit so much moodier. And, like, especially the intimate scenes between just two people. It had that Peter Kowalski. It was dark. It was a layer to it where there's a little bit of noir to it, where the shadows are as important as, like, what's lit up. And it just stood out because Peter originally was a

camera operator on our show. And as we moved through a different DP, he moved up and had to match what the other guy did. But I feel like this season, because we had a blank slate, Peter just got fancy. Yeah, he did. Oh, I miss Pete. I love that he brought it down. Pete's sort of signature thing, which was also so nice for us, was he would light a room, as you said, with a mood. and then he'd put these sort of glow balls, these beautiful, soft lantern lights around, and everything just felt a little sparkly. Yeah, a little magical, a little dreamy. Yeah, and these people coming home to each other is supposed to feel a little sparkly.

And the light communicates that in a really, really cool way. I remember the scene out by the pool when you guys came out, I think that was our first I don't I feel like I didn't even see you when we shot the first episode back No we don't see each other We didn't we weren't in scenes together

That was the first time I remember But I even even on set I feel like That was the first time I remember seeing you after we came back And I don't know if we shot these Kind of intertwined these two episodes or something But it's the first thing I remember filming anyway from season four is that moment And, Sophia, when you and I realized they were using the same red coloring in our hair.

Yeah. Well, they were trying to get mine out because I'd done a movie that summer and I'd been a redhead. I'd played this like, oh, that's why you're so red. So red. And they couldn't, we just couldn't color corrected enough. And yeah, the, oh, my God, it's not working. This is very Renee Russo's. Good, good look on you. I loved it. God, I love her. Good God, the Thomas Crown Affair will never get old to me. But what struck me in the scene, I do remember, to your point, like, getting in that day and being like, we're all back. Oh, my God. What struck me in the scene that I'd forgotten, because I, you know, I have that same sort of sense memory of when we all got to be together for the first time again. It's crazy. I physically remember that day as well. Like, it's like, it was yesterday.

Yes, it's so in there. And what I forgot that made me audibly gasped when I watched this was, oh my God, Brooke has not seen her godson since he was a baby. Yeah. And it was so like, wait, what? You know, he doesn't know her. Oh, my God. The little cues the writing gave us on how much we all had to catch up on that Brooke and Peyton have been apart for so long. see their phone calls and that and that brook doesn't know jamie outside of pictures yeah like oh my god

it's such a small moment but it it communicates so much that's paul too by the way because if you it's easy to in the script to just have shot like here comes jamie running around the corner everybody goes oh gosh jamie you pick him up give him a hug twirling around um but the fact that he had him kind of step out slowly and you took a second looking at him on the stairs then got to everyone's reaction. Those kinds of things create those moments. And I love that Brooke and Jamie really develops such a special relationship over the course of this season, in spite of the fact that she wasn't around for the beginning. I mean, that's her whole journey, right? It's like she built up this whole empire and then it's not enough. And she needs to get back to what is really

meaningful. I remember thinking that was crazy when we shot it. Like, what do you mean you've never seen this kid or you haven't seen this kid in years? And now that we're grownups with jobs and we're just like all over the place, you know, it's so normal just to be like, whoa, you have a mustache now, you know, kids grow up really, really fast, especially in those first years. And especially when you are at this sort of, you know, personal, relative empire of success. It's what we experienced doing our show. You move away. You're gone for 10 months. And then if you do a movie you're gone for the whole year. And you want to chase your dreams and you want to do things, but years go by. And I mean, I experienced it with family, like, literal years. And then I realized

I just knew a kid from photos. Yeah. While we did a show, we did this for nine, nine years, you know? Social media has made it worse. Because, you know, we think we're in touch. We think we're like all up to date. We feel like we know. Yeah. Yeah. Well, I love how this. episode opens because Brooke sneaking in Lucas's room is such an iconic thing from the high school years. And it feels nice to revisit an old habit that ends up being, you know, a little spicy, a little awkward. God, it's so hard to hate Michaela. But what I'm going to say is that watching the episode, like being Peyton Sawyer deep down inside, you guys, I still feel jealous that all my friends like her so much and that I like her so much. Like I felt Peyton's

feelings of like, God, she's so pretty and she's really cool and like she really seems to have it together and everybody likes her so much. She's so great. Because she is undeniable. Yeah. Yeah. She's a real deal for sure. But you guys were cute. It was so fun. I like that everyone is just kind of meeting her organically because that's what happens in a small town as much as Peyton wants to avoid it. Ah. Yeah. Well, and I remember that day with Michaela because that was the first I met her. And I remember sitting in the cash chairs in the living room of Karen's house and getting to chat and learning about what she was up to. And she had all these questions for me about, you know, Wilmington and the whole thing. And it was so much fun. And I remember thinking,

like, wow, it can be so nerve-wracking to get new people, you know, inserted into your work family. And you seem really fun. She's so solid. So well-spoken and intelligent and asks really good questions and insightful. Totally, totally born to be an artist. Actually, she is an incredible fine artist as well for anyone who doesn't know much about Michaela McManus. She'd go find out. She's really, really talented girl. Let's make sure we have her on in the next couple episodes. Yeah. Yeah, we should. And Michaela and I, we went to college together. Wait, what?

Did you know each other? No. Yes. We went to college together. Super in passing, like, because I was also working at MTV, so it was a little checked out of everything. But we're Fordham Lincoln Center girls. Oh, that's right.

It's like, it's weird when it feels like the whole world is a small town. You know, we do a TV show about a small town. But honestly, to come from New York and then be down in Wilmington. and have it be like, you remember this chick from the dorm? And it's like, uh-huh, she's really pretty. You can't miss her. She was great. Wow.

And she matches Lucas's kind of like serious energy in a way that Peyton never did. Peyton's goofy, man. She's like, awkward. Yeah, I felt that pain when I was, when I, when Peyton was watching Lucas and Lindsay at the race car thing when they arrived. And he was holding her hand and they were just walking through the crowd. I was like, oh, I've totally been in Peyton's shoes. You look at the couple and you're like, you're like, I don't want her to be right for him,

but I think she is. Yeah. This sucks. I love shooting that flashback stuff because I got to wear those dumb little bangs. I loved those. No, listen, I got a call from my mother when the episode aired, and she was like, don't you ever cut bangs? Don't you do it?

It looked terrible. And so I'm still traumatized by the Peyton book signing bangs, which is maybe why I've never had the confidence to go do it. I hope he saved them. At least you could clip him in now and then. Sophia, don't you have fake bangs? I was going to say as a person who made that mistake and cut real bangs not once but twice,

I then learned to not make the same mistake a third time. And it might have been Jojo was like, I'm just going to get you a clip in, say, please stop doing this. And I was like, okay. She was like, when you really want them, you just wear them for a night and she's not wrong yeah it's true you know what i will say to the contrast like something i love so much is that the episode opens that's sweetness and that being so enamored for lindsay with someone she knows but not personally and for brook with someone she doesn't know

at all but who seems great and they're sort of like wow wow you're fun no you're fun it's this fun energy and to go from this sort of excitement to the nerves, which are exciting, of Haley's first day of like, oh, what's it going to be like? And it almost feels like the fun stuff on the front end was a misdirect. Yes. And we expected the fun to keep going, especially for Haley James Scott. That's exactly what I wrote. I was just like, they teed us up for success. And then it like hurt really bad. Oh my God, it was such a betrayal. That was awful. I was upset. Yeah. How was that for you to watch? It was funny. I forgot. I really, I mean, that is like 101. You cannot let the class take over and bully you and get you pushed down to the point where you cry or you leave. I mean, I think just as a teacher, you know, you

You lose so much power in the classroom if you ever let that happen to you. So the fact that it happened on day one, oh, teenagers are so scary. They are, but I don't know that I would have acted very much different. I mean, I don't know what I would have done at 20, what was Haley, like 23, teaching a high school class? Come on. Maybe younger?

That's so weird. Yeah, I had a really young teacher who had to be really mean. like the first year and then lighten up as we, you know, got older just to like prove a point because, you know, they're our age, you know? And I was, I think we brought this up a few episodes ago. I was recently with my best friend and we were listening to my son and his friends talk about one teacher in particular. And my friend turned to me and he's like, kids bully adults just as much as they bully each other. And I can't imagine like going home at the end of the day after being a teacher and being like, those little sh**s really got to me.

Like, is my outfit lame? Is my hair lame? Is my reading voice lame? You know, like, whatever it is that the kids zero in on, they can make you feel just as awful as your peers. Yeah. Well, yeah. I liked that Haley had this dual, I had this dual approach that she went in on the first day trying to be very amiable. and giving them all the benefit of the doubt and like, I'm going to be really sweet and like the sort of jumping around the blackboard and like it was all. And I don't even know that this was intentionally a choice that I made so much as just, I guess, what was feeling in the moment. Like, oh, let's make this fun for everyone. Like almost the instinct would be like you'd behave that way with maybe an elementary school class. I felt that.

Yeah, it felt very, a bit condescending. But not intentionally. You have a little child. And so in your brain, you're like, I talk to children like children. Exactly, exactly. So then to get the rude awakening and I love the way she comes back later and just, okay, tough mom now. It's tough love time. Yeah.

I thought that was really fun. Are they setting you and Quentin up for something inappropriate? I can't remember. No, but, God, we had good chemistry. And we should have. It would have been so fun. Robbie is so great. Oof, he's great.

But I love that because we, again, it's just, it's tracking so well. We've seen Haley as a mom now to a four-year-old and you do the smile and you even enjoy. I mean, you use like your big, pretty cursive. Like you were having a whole moment. Yeah. And the shock of. like, oh, these feudal little fuckers are trying to create a hierarchy, I got to completely change my game.

Yeah. Like, as an audience member, we see you go from Jamie's mom to like the don't fuck with me teacher. And it's so fun. Well, those kids have no idea that you tamed Nathan Scott, who was the best of the bad. Like, Nathan Scott was awful stealing school buses, like, be a nightmare. and you tamed him at, you know, 16, 17. Yeah, she's done, especially after that deal with him in the kitchen.

It was like, she went back to school the next day, like, I'm done. I'm done trying to make everybody happy and trying to please everybody and try to hold everything together and pretend like everything's fine. I'm done. Here's what we're going to do. It's this way or you're out. I just don't have time. I don't have the energy.

Yeah. But everybody needs a turn like that in life. I've hit those moments. I know you guys have. And I hit them, you know, it's not just once. It happens in life as you. go on and on. So yeah, if that felt necessary and rewarding for her. Oh, yeah. And it feels nice when you do it and you go, oh, I'm different now. You're learning in this moment. You're picking up

what I'm putting down, but I've put it down already and I dare you. And everyone is like, uh-oh. They feel the dynamic shift. And that is, it's so fun. And I like that you do. You do. didn't have to make the connection that Quentin is a version of Nathan. I like that they that they placed the version of the man that Haley tamed. They place a new one in front of her. It causes a struggle and as she's figuring out how to deal with it in this way, in this version, it's actually Lucas and skills that are like, who does he remind you of? And they don't even have to say it. Yeah. And Lucas jumps in. Yeah, it's really good.

Well, there's, yeah, you'll do it once. You're not going to do it twice. Skills and Lucas as coaches stepping in for Whitey. Genius move and so fun. So fun to see. And they're good at it too. It may look different, but Native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia.

and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for a hundred of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornelis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history.

On the podcast, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other. native stories such as the creation of the first native comic con or the importance of reservation basketball every day native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream listen to burn sageburn bridges on the iHeart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts at Tree Hill High School, in the four years that we've been gone, that the kids have gone dark, they've gone feral. It's like we still have the same principle, you know, like nothing necessarily traumatic happened on a national scale, but now you've got a rebellious basketball team and you've got these nasty kids in the classroom causing trouble. What happened? It felt much more modern. It felt much less like the One Tree Hill fairy tale that we had created that were still connected to the late 90s, even though we've started. We've started. filming in the early odds, that this crowd felt much more forward moving in the progression

of like social society, I guess. And just the way that they were all interacting with each other and the banter. And it just was like, whoa, this is alive. This is so different than fairy tale land. It felt messier and more authentic. Do you guys feel like it was partially one of those things that like all the criticisms we got of everything being too fantastical, too fairy tale, too squeaky clean, blah, blah, blah, that they were like, all right, watch this. Like, now that we've had a time jump, we can kind of address the message boards and the articles, you know? Well, I think when we were the bad kids in the class, like, there was an episode where, like,

Nathan and Lucas got in a fight in the classroom, or, like, there was a time where Lucas got in trouble because he and Peyton were passing notes and kissing and stuff. Like, you were sleeping with a teacher, Brooke. I mean, we got in trouble. We got in trouble, but when you're the adult and the kids look at you, like, you loser. It just feels so different. Like, they're not doing anything that we didn't do. It's just different main character energy.

These kids are assuming the main character energy and treating us like we don't matter. But what's also so interesting about that and like you just dinged a light bulb in my head, this is human, right? when you know someone you can see the motivations for their actions you can forgive their transgressions you can say you have a really screwed up home life and that's why you look for validation and older men young lady you have a fill in the blank fill in the blank when you don't know anything about someone's life or background and they behave in a way that feels disrespectful or unruly you go who do these little shitheads think they are you don't forgive or humanize their messiness, you just think, wow, that was really bold and out of line.

And that is kind of fascinating. I can't wait to find out what Quentin's damage is because he is so handsome and so talented. And it makes it really easy to hate him because he's got so much going for him and he's still being like, you know, confrontational. But you're rooting for him because you know there's so much room to change. There's so much room for growth. And he's just posturing. He's just a high school kid who's posturing.

Oh, that laugh he does when he's leaving the gym? Yes. When he's like leaving your classroom and he's just laughing. It's just, it's like you can feel his hurt. Yeah. Like you can feel that he's a kid totally masking. That's one of the things too that I think I loved about the way this was put together and the way Paul directed my performance in that, that he was, it's not a power struggle.

You're not trying to dominate the room. You're just, you're fed up in every area of your life. And you're just coming in and being honest. And there's no sense in not just being honest. So just tell these kids exactly how you feel. And you don't have to be mean to be honest. You can just be honest. And so I remember doing that.

And it changed everything for me because instead of me trying to be tough and dominate, I just was able to, like, I felt a lot more compassion. And that, I think, made me connect more with Quentin. And hopefully, like, started to draw them together a little bit more Haley and Quentin because when you stop trying to dominate and you're just real, just totally authentic, like you said, Sophia, in the moment and there, it's so much easier to, I guess, read other people or have compassion or just see things from, from their perspective. When he has no idea what you're dealing with at home. And this is something that I really struggled with in the episode because when we shot this, like when we were kids, four months of Nathan being dark seemed like,

oh my God, it's crazy. And as a grown-up lady watching this, I'm like, he's only been down for four months. Like, why is Haley flipping the fuck out? Like, it made Haley seem crazy that she was so angry with him four months out. When, meanwhile, the audience is getting to see. him in private try to stand up and so it's just like oh god this is going so bad like just missing

each other yeah he they need a therapist so bad yeah but man four months can feel like a really long time when you're juggling everything doing everything and four months with a four year old that's what i mean yeah it's just so tough you know when you think about four months being 30 of a year. And this kid's probably had memory for two years. They remember everything. More than two years. But it's like it's a mate, it's three years, let's call it.

But it's amazing because you get everyone's perspective. Yeah. That's when it works is when everybody is understandable and everybody is frustrating. Yeah. And you just go, I just want better for these people because I love them. Nathan, I love that you just brought him up because he, this is a real mental health struggle for him.

And I love that they really did a deep dive on it in this episode and in this season. That's got to be so incredibly tough to have made a huge success out of your life that young and be, have so much ahead of you. and then get disabled in some way. Well, I guess it felt like character assassination to me, Joy. It felt like they were making you this shrill bitch because we've already seen Nathan try to kill himself multiple times. We know that he has a history of self-loathing and suicidal behavior and never had to deal with anything quite this traumatic.

You know, he crashed the car into the wall and was playing basketball like three weeks later. This, he's in a wheelchair and it's so, so serious. And so to have Haley, who has historically been really supportive and like, you know what, I'm going to take a different approach. I'm going to try something different to just have her throwing, you know, throwing the beer bottles and smashing plates and stuff. I was like, why are they making her so? Yeah, shrill is a good word.

Yeah. It just didn't feel aligned with the person that we've always known. I liked it. You did? I liked. Oh, I liked every bit of it. And here's what I'm going to say. I hear you on all of Nathan's mental health stuff.

And you're not wrong. We've spent four years worth of this TV show talking about it. And I do think there is a tendency to align your idea of someone with the way they're described. and Nathan Scott is our hero and our sweetheart. He is a bad boy done good because of this woman. He, like, we, he is such a champion. And yes, he's had these horrible things. And we, as adults, in the last year, have gone, oh, my God, this is a boy with, like, serious mental health issues.

Major problems. But they've never been willing to really address it on camera until this. Mm-hmm. And throughout all of it. Haley's been with him. Throughout all of it, she's reminded him. Yes, if this were the real world, he would have gone to therapy. And if this were the real world, four months into a catastrophic accident as adults, I think we would be different. But it's TV drama. And I love that from the way she behaves, you can see that whenever she's mad, she takes a deep breath

and keeps going. And whenever he fucks up with their son, she takes a deep breath and just says, sweetie daddy doesn't feel good i'm so sorry and we jump in all your friends are coming we're coming it's going to be amazing it's been a lot of jumping in to cover for him and i like that when no one is just telling the truth eventually everybody loses it yeah i like it for her because she's always been good and i like it because she's always cleaned up everybody's messes and when you yelled and then walked in the kitchen and the argument was over and then you threw all the bottles. I was like, God, I don't know waiting for this from her. I loved it. All I was thinking is I was like, I was like, who bought the beer? There was no Uber Eats back then. Who bought the goddamn beer?

Because someone's enabling this. Somebody's enabling it. Yes. I didn't even think about that part. Maybe even Haley was doing it. That, that beer bottle thing was totally improvised. Paul said, what do you, I was just was so uncomfortable. I was like, he said, what do you want to do? I was like, I mean, I want to throw these beer bottles across the room, but obviously I can't. He's like, why not? I was like, because they're props. He goes, well, we'll get it in one take, do it. And we didn't tell James.

So his reaction on the couch was real. He had no idea what was going on behind him. Amazing. But, you know, what you said just made me think, the one thing that flipped the switch, I think, Hillary, because I totally, I do hear what you're saying. Nathan historically has, even through all of his struggles, I correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think he's ever been someone who was a complainer

or felt really sorry for himself. He never really did the pity party thing. Am I wrong? I guess to me it was like four months. Haley was on tour for four months, you know? Right. A four-month period of time doesn't feel so fatalistic, I guess. But when you're living with somebody who just is refusing to, like, they just keep feeling sorry for themselves over and it for so long.

And there's like, you have a grace period where like, oh, my gosh, you've just been in a horrible accident. Of course anybody would feel sorry for themselves. Yes. Yes. And then it's like, okay, are we kind of coming out of that? And then the next phase is like, okay, but like life has to go on. I actually have to, do you care? Can you at least empathize?

Could you like be emotional and like talk with me about it? At least we can. So it feels like maybe they just sped that. progression up because that's the flip that got switched. I also think the four months, yeah, not the best writing we've ever had in an episode that is

filled with very good writing. But what I think is important to remember and I wish they would have repeated it with you, Joy, and not just with you and your scene as Peyton taking Nathan to the hospital hill. I wish they would have repeated the thing from episode

one, which is but your doctor is said you can walk. Remember that fight you guys have? Yeah. That's what we're missing. That's what we're missing. Because the whole reason she's so upset.

It's not, my husband's never going to walk again and I understand that maybe forever he'll be sad. It's they're telling you you can and you're refusing because you can't, you think you can't play basketball. Yeah. So because you can't play basketball, you don't want to play with our son. You don't want to crawl around on the floor with your kid. Yeah.

That gives it everything. And that's a miss. That's a miss in the episode because if we had been reminded that he was choosing this in some way. Y'all, I'm just thinking about postpartum depression. I'm like, four months is nothing. I was in a bad mood for eight. Yeah, that's true. No, they could have made it a year or two.

They could have made it like it had been in a while for sure. Yeah. I think you're right. Happy medium. I loved seeing him secretly try. Like, because a number of times he's like by himself trying to stand up. And then that last time where you think he's finally just going to commit suicide and he jumps up out of the water like free willy. Yes.

Jeff was like, what kind of show is this? It's the best baby. It reminded me of the season four shot when, you know, the episode where we all took our class pictures with the partners. yeah and i i did the not enough not enough not enough and and nathan was in front of the wings holding the basketballs it gave me that same like it mirrored that in some way totally and it's like nathan scott is back he's always going to be a hero that's who he is deep down he's got that in it's really cool um i'm going to jump in the car and go take maria to tennis but i'm going to try and jump back in to the zoom from my car so at least i can like pop in my every once in a while

but I'll be back in a minute. But like, I love that she's doing tennis. I have to say something, speaking to scenes by that pool, because we talked about this last week, or maybe it was the week before. But I went, oh, that you and I got assigned the Well Well. Right. As shared dialogue.

And then what was the next thing I said? Oh, Nathan, you look so heroin chic. He made me say it. Oh! There are only so many lines that our boss had in his repertoire. And, like, if he knew you were mad at him or didn't want to engage, he would make you say these things to kind of like remind you of him. And yeah, I felt his dirty little grubby, no fingernail hands all over this one.

It was always a this. It was always like, I'm going to put you in your place. I'm going to remind you if it's on the page, you have to say it. And it was like, and I just was like, right, right, right. Brooke and Peyton are having this beautiful moment where they've come home to each other. And now we're going to go out into our world and start seeing all of our friends again. Yeah. And you're going to make us do it with the creepiest things that you say to us.

Ew. Gross. Gross. Ew. Dude, where are Peyton and Brooke staying right now? I can't figure it out. I don't know either. I mean, I love that you spent the night at Mouth's house. That was my favorite because that's shit that we do in real life. I loved it. I went out with my girlfriends this past week and woke up and was like, who put me to bed? Oh, yeah.

That's the best. It's so fun as an adult to be like, I'm going to sleep here. And now the cool thing is, is at our age, everyone's like, hold on. And they open a drawer and there's just a bunch of new toothbrushes. And you're like, man, we're really doing it right. We're prepared for debauchery now. I loved that wake up so much. like, oh my God, I have to go and I've got to get Jamie and running around,

collecting the things, talking to him and then having this moment of, oh, you're here. It was such a fun scene. That's one. That's one that I remember, like, in my bones. You're so good with him. Like, it was, your babysitting skills were on full display here because, I mean, you just take to it so naturally and he's so drawn to you. And you guys were doing in real life what you're doing on the show, you know? Like, we didn't know this kid and you're making a relationship with him the same way Brooke is making a relationship with Jamie. Oh, yeah.

He became my little best friend. It was so fun. We had so much fun at work together. And I remember everything from, you know, his little suit and helping him zip it up and talking about how I would have made it for him. And he loved the story and, you know, swinging him in and out of his derby car. And, like, we, God, we just had so much fun. Such a sweet moment in time.

Jeff saw the Peyton Sawyer unemployed patch and he wants one so bad. He's like, where do they, where do they sell those? And I was like, I don't think they do. He's like, no, I want that. I need that. We should make one. It may look different, but native culture is very alive.

My name is Nicole Garcia. And on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for a hundred of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Teller Ornelis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other native stories. stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation

basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Here's what I remember from this episode. I didn't realize it happened this early in the season, but this derby car episode is the one where my childhood friend,

Scott Kirkpatrick, died in Iraq. And you can see it on my face when Peyton and Brooke have to walk from the river where you've thrown your phone, and I got to just hide in you. And we walk back up, we see Lucas and Lindsay, we have to walk past. them and you're having banter with Jamie from like the crowd and you can see like my face is all red like I'm clearly super upset but that was such a surreal day because everyone was there we were down by the river we had a ton of work to do that day and I'll just never ever forget it it was like I got the message in my trailer I went straight to Jojo's door in the hair

and makeup trailer and you were there and it was just like I don't know I got to hide in you and you didn't leave me alone on set like we hid out at our chairs Antoine's son was there during the whole box car race and it just felt really safe after we'd already dealt with all this chaos at work like I see it in the episode I see Peyton and Brooke but I see you and me behind it being like we're dealing with some really, really horrible dark shit and we're just going to team up and don't let anyone else get in the way. And it's weird to watch it all these years later because I can feel it. I remember what, I literally remember every single step of that day.

But yeah, to see it just like kind of mixed into an episode sprinkled in, thanks for taking care of me. We've told that story at conventions and stuff before, but I will never, I will never forget that. That was like my first really big grown-up loss and then to have to go film. It's like, cool story, kids, sorry your friend's dead. Anyway, we got a break for lunch in 30 minutes. We got to get this shot. Let's roll.

And I guess I don't know how other businesses are because we've only ever worked in this one. But it can feel really, you can feel really cut off from the real world. in your real life because you have to do this imaginary thing. Yeah. I also think there's a little bit of a disservice that happens because like all that's ever on TV are these perfectly edited episodes, right? And all that's ever on TV for our industry that's like, quote unquote, behind the scenes are award shows, which are insane and not real.

And so everything that people who don't work in our industry get to see is gorgeous, musical, lyrical, and glamorous. Curated. Yeah. And like, we work in the circus in the mud, man. It's so tricky and it's beautiful

and it's strange and it's profane and it's hard. It's really hard. And if you ever express honesty about why it's hard, people go, because, like, they've only ever seen the golden globe. Right. And, and I...

I don't know. I just want to, I really want to be a little clear and like really take pause to be honest about how hard it is to have your world blow up and have someone look at you and mean it when they say, I'm really sorry, but we don't have time for this. Right. Right. And then you are expected to split into and wait for your real life. So you can go do the on-camera life. And it's what we do and it's hard. It makes you a psycho. Like when you have to compartmentalize your life like that, it makes you a total nutcase because then you can't stop doing that.

Like everything becomes over here and then over there. well you become a professional at disassociating oh is that what i'm doing on my phone just like scrolling doom scrolling disassociating yeah and so when people say well for example from last week why didn't you talk about this sooner because i'm a fucking professional at putting my feelings in a box over there so i can come to work and not bother other people that's it i'll deal with it in 20 years Yeah. When the box explodes in my face, then I'll have to deal with it. But what I will say, morbid humor aside, is that was big. And I felt really lucky about the ways that you shared Scott with me and with us. And that you have continued to do that. and that you've helped make his memory advocacy that people get to participate in and that affected the trajectory of our show.

Like you've done a lot of really big things with how much you loved that friend. And I feel really lucky to have been close to it and to you for all of that. and I also want to remind you that just like six months before you did it for me because in season four when my grandpa died and we were filming you picked me up off the ground in the quad because somebody said to me I'm so sorry but we don't have time for this and there aren't many people who know how that feels and I feel really, maybe this is like a weird thing to say.

I feel really lucky that you did that for me once and I got to do it back. That's all. It feels so meta. Like it feels really met up. I know. It's really weird, isn't it? Because I, you know, you and I were separated a lot in the first few years. And then, you know, our characters are fighting.

And then as we are scripted together, we're having to deal with, like, grown-up stuff and really, like, confusing subject matter. And when we were coming home in this season, you and I were also starting to, like, go home in real life and have to answer for who we'd become. You know, having to answer to the people you know, having to go to Scott's funeral,

you having to go home and see your friends or see your family at your grandfather's service, you know, and answer. for what we had been living publicly, it isn't necessarily what my friends or family thought was appropriate for me. You know, I wasn't even allowed to watch teen dramas growing up. And here I am, neck deep in that shit.

That's so interesting, that idea of it being appropriate. What was hard for me was that people were like, isn't it fabulous? And I was like, it's really fucked up and hard. It's hard. And then I learned, oh, no. Nobody wants to hear a person who they look at as the on-screen success story say they're struggling. Oh, I better keep this to myself.

Well, what I'll say is that I'm really glad Paul was directing because to hear that message, Joy, Joy's back. We've got Joy back. She's in the car. Hi. I'm going to try not to talk too much. It's annoying through the car microphone, but I'm here. No, it's okay. There's a little bit of lag.

But you guys, we do have Joy back. Joy, we were talking about how. You got to be going back. Wait, what? Oh, wait, what? That's echo. That's a lag or an echo. Oh, I'm going to fix it.

I'm going to fix it. Can you hear me now? Yeah, we can hear you. But then we hear ourselves. Through your phone. I'm going to mute it. Go ahead and talk. That's okay.

We try sometimes with the car. The car always gets us. Joy, you just wave your hand when you want to talk. Okay. I'm here. I'm here. Okay. No, we were talking about, you know, my good friend Scott died in Iraq while we were filming this episode. And while it sucks that when you work and film, there's no going home for the day. It's just like, all right, suck it up. We still have eight hours.

You know, there's 500 people here to make this day happen. I was really glad that Paul was directing because I had to shoot that scene with Lucas in Trick. like the day after Scott died. And so Scott was the person that I did theater with growing up. He was absolutely my partner and all of that. And while he'd been in Iraq, we'd traded all of these messages about starting a production company when he got out because he was planning to get out.

And we were going to do an adaptation of Dostoevsky's The Idiot, which is the play we did together in high school, and updated and like so many big plans like Peyton and Brooke with this record label, you know, we're going to start a business. And I could not get through that scene where Peyton says, your art matters. It's what got me here because it was like I was talking to my friend. And it was killing me.

And I'm just like, and they're like, you're not supposed to cry in this scene, Hillary. And I'm like, right, right, right, right, right. But for all the times that you guys wanted me to cry and I was really having trouble, it's the opposite this time. And all I want to do is sob. and Paul was so good about being like, I want you to say these lines like it is the happiest thing

that you can say to Lucas and he really coached me to say it with a smile and I think you can still feel Peyton wanting to cry and putting on this brave face but I was absolutely talking to my friend in that scene and I don't know anyone

who could have gotten me through it other than Paul. He was so, he was such a shepherd in that moment. That was my favorite scene in the episode, actually. Because you were so dropped in to your body. Your voice sounded different. And I understand the context now. There was just something so, so grounded and real about that.

And I hate that, yeah, I hate that it's like those things, this weird thing. about our part where pain sometimes equal you don't want it but then also can make such a huge difference in the lives and the people who are experiencing that and it's just one of weird things that we do as artists live in whatever state we're in and then go to work just somehow try and put it all together and whatever happened that day really was magical and I I felt really moved by that, by that scene. Yeah, I mean, I guess I don't have a good conclusion,

but it was a beautiful performance. Thanks. It made me feel bad like Chad was the third wheel in the room. Like, hey, we're sorting through some real heavy stuff, Chad. I just need you to stand there and look handsome. If you could, that would be great. But he also was great because I think he knew that I was moving through some dark territory and knew just to just to stand there and be steady and like good and that was that was the right move

you know because I think then we had to do all the trick stuff that night too when we would go into trick we like lived in trick yeah it was fun to see all the girls out partying Haley not being a mom for the night I loved it I loved all of us being out and and weirdly that they wrote that bit about the girl who was wearing my clothes who wound up being the girl you'd been talking about at the label and we had this overlap we didn't know about and then we got to bring Haley into it and we all were like what it was it was such a like a genuine silly thing that happens with friends when you're like did you read about that you know and everybody's seen it because like for whatever reason it's the top of Twitter that day like it felt real and and light and

funny, gossipy, just like dishy, you know? Yeah. Who do we think that actress was? We need to figure out who the actress was. Probably somebody who didn't deserve it. I mean, that's it. That's it. We labeled all the poor girls in the early aughts is like,

she's a drunk because she like goes out at night. Yeah. It was probably someone perfectly lovely. Yeah, I'm sure. She was fine. She was fine. Top 10 hit on TRL. Did you guys get with Lori yet?

What? Oh, I'm sorry. Well, I was saying, you were saying she's so perfectly lovely, which also made me think of Tori Tobito, and I don't know if you guys have talked about Nanny Carey yet, but... No, we want you to talk about Nanny Carey. Wait, did you guys remember that she came in this early? No.

Oh, I couldn't believe it, episode two? It's like, I don't know where to look. We've got Hot Michaela and Hot Tori. I don't know where to look. just surrounding us with beauty. They were great. I love working with Tori. She was genuinely so sweet.

Like, who you see in Trick that night, that's Tori. And for any of you, if you haven't gone back and listened to our episode with Tori from the live shows that we did, you should go back and listen to those because she's so great and has some funny stories. But she was just lovely and couldn't have been more, again, we always say it, but it's hard to come into a show that's so well established and then try and make a mark, especially with a character that makes that. big of a stamp on the show and she was so lovely and sweet and kind and fun and just it was an

absolute dream scenario it couldn't have asked for anybody better she's such a non-competitive like open her person it's great she knows who she is um did you know she was going to end up being a bad guy like did you know where it was going i don't think so no not at all i don't think any of us did. I mean, when you hire a nanny that is that beautiful, you know it's going to go sideways, right? It's going to go bad. What I thought was interesting, though, is that again, they gave us a misdirect with it, where Haley doesn't have a problem with it. The girls are going hello, mouth, because he's being judged on his looks by this rude woman at his office, is like, don't do that. Also, I'd love to see that girl in a bathing suit. And we're like,

ew! So you're, they're playing with us. Will they or won't they? Will they or won't we? Innocent or bad. And because Tori is so lovely and her energy comes through her like it did in that scene at the bar, you think like, well, maybe it won't because that would be so stereotypical, right? Like the dad having the affair with the hot nanny, we've seen it a million times. So in a weird way, they make you debate what you already know so that you don't see crazy nanny Carrie coming. Yeah, it's so weird knowing what's going to happen and seeing how just sweet and gentle she comes in. She's so likable, man. It was really kind of hard to view Robbie Jones, who played Quentin as a high schooler because he wasn't. The same way we weren't.

you know he was our age and he's playing like in a lower bracket you know and we're like but he's not a kid he's our age and so that kind of stuff does get kind it's confusing because i'm like oh no he's a potential love interest the boys got macaela and tory to show up and had new friends to play with and we had someone playing a high schooler and we're like that's not there come on man it's a really small fishing hole here in wilmington and i just want to kiss somebody that's new No, I can't. It's like, you said it in season one, Hillary, like, it was either college students or retired golf guys. Like, we didn't have anybody to kiss but each other.

So, like, what do you want? What do you want from us? And it is weird when the optics, you know, when we're all 25 and we're now playing 25-year-olds. And then they bring in a 25-year-old to play a 17-year-old. You're like, what? I would have, I don't know, I would have loved to have seen if Nanny Carey didn't go crazy. I think, I think her in mouth could have been very sweet. Like this lovely woman and the newscaster, I don't know, but then like, obviously, I think that's really just because Millison's not in Tree Hill yet.

But I don't know, she could have had a, she could have had a lovely thing. Maybe she would have married a teacher. Maybe we don't know. been these lovely people her and skills could have been real spicy oh yeah oh like what if she fell for junk you know yes yeah yeah she could have been like i just i like how down to earth he is i like what a child at heart junk is playing with squirt guns it may look different but native culture is very alive my name is and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer

because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for a hundred of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornelis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with us,

other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. My favorite line of the episode was was little Jamie saying, I'm taking a stand to be echoed later by Brooke. Like that, as someone who felt like she was taking a stand and some stuff and, you know,

the six months that surrounded this episode, I loved seeing a child be like, not doing it. Ain't happening. Yeah, it was great. Well, Jeff was on a chair behind me. I was on the couch and he's like seated behind me. And when Matt, or when Skills says, yeah, my man's taking a stand. He like laughed out loud hard. And I was like, oh, oh, we're invested.

Okay, that's it for you. Fantastic. He loves skills. I love it. But that sense of not forcing your kid to do stuff they don't want to do, I'm that mom all day. I remember taking Gus to a rock wall. All the other kids were climbing the rocks and Gus got two of those little handholds up

and was like, we're good. And you have to explain to them like, hey, man, I'm so proud of you for not caving to peer pressure. do it in your own time you'll figure it out that is such a hard thing to do as a parent because you also know look my kid would never have learned to ride a bike if i didn't make her she sat there and was like kicking the bike she was so mad she was so i've never seen her throat fit in my life except over that bike and it was like i'm really not i really don't want to enter into a power struggle with her but her future will be sincerely less exciting if she doesn't know how to ride a bike.

She can't go on vacation with friends. She can't just run up the corner to see your friend. You don't want to, like, you've got to know how to ride a bike. I don't know. I got gravel at my house. You can't really ride a bike here. I don't know if my son knows how to ride a bike. I didn't learn to ride a bike until I was 18 years old.

Didn't you really? It's been so hard to learn back then. But anyway, I mean, I think there's things like that for everything. I mean, it could be like an, a same thing. safety issue or something that you actually have to or something that you're just like, no, this is important. Or getting right? Like if you fall off the horse,

the idea is you have to get back up. If you don't get back up, you will be paralyzed with fear for the rest of your life and you will never get back up on a horse. So as soon as you fall down, you have to get right back up on that horse. So I was watching that and thinking how great this is that Haley is giving Jamie that

autonomy to make that decision for himself. But it did also make me think of all the time. So it's like, when is it, it's hard to tell. When is the moment when you're like, I'm so sorry, but you actually do have to do this. Because I had Gus before any of my friends had kids, I was on an island. Like, I didn't know who to ask about stuff like that. And I remember making the decision that I wasn't going to potty train him. And I was like, no, all these women are like being super competitive about like their kid potty training or like learning how to do stuff super fast. I'm just going to let him figure it out. And sure enough, he just woke up one day and was like,

I'm potty trained now. And so that's totally been my method for everything. Like, they just wake up one day and they're like, it's time. Today's the day. Whether it's bike shit or, you know, go carts or whatever he wants to do. He's the personality like, Jamie, where it's like, I don't want to do it today. And then you wait. And a couple months later, they're like, right now, this is the time. And then they feel so empowered because they're like, I knew this was the right time. You didn't know, Mom, because you're a dumbass. But I knew. I knew.

Wow. George, she just refuses to do it. She's just like, no, you'll do it for me. You'll do it for me. You'll push the cart for me. But isn't that also interesting to realize that you got to know a little bit about where people live. Yeah. Because there's no kid who.

who's going to bike around, where's Gus going to go? It's not like you can bike anywhere, hundreds of acres of your farm. Like, it's going to take them an hour to bike to somebody's house and on gravel, who's biking? But Joy, we grew up in neighborhoods where you would literally bike two blocks away to see your friends. And yeah, if you couldn't, you wouldn't be able to have a social life. And it's funny to get outside your own arena of experience and go, Well, what, what is that for you? And somebody who I think tells the story so well, Glenn and Doyle, who I still can't believe I call a friend, what a weird thing.

She met one of my favorite authors, and we just happen to be friends. And I'll never get over it. And she's like, can you calm down about it? And I'm like, no, today's not the day. To use Hillary's point, not today, maybe tomorrow. But she wrote, there's a chapter in her book in Untamed about taking her daughters and maybe some of their friends. I don't really remember what the group was to get their ears pierced. And one of the girls was really game and one of them was like, nope.

And somebody said, just be brave. And she said, no, no, they're both being brave. Because one wants to do this and one does not. and they're both brave enough to listen to how they feel and know that they're making the right choices for themselves. And I was like, who, you should teach classes to everyone else because we could all use them. Like it was such an interesting way to put it in perspective

and to really bring my tangential story back. What a funny, wild, cool thing that a four-year-old saying, this is where my boundary is helped Brooke Davis, an adult who runs a huge global company say, you know what? I'm setting a boundary today. I loved it. I loved it. So good. The reveal of Brooke and Jamie pulling off the brown paper from the door and seeing that it's Karen's cafe, that was like goose bumpy. That was so sweet. Full sob for me. God, how could Karen just leave the cafe. It just makes me think, like, what happened?

Yeah. Yeah, where is she? We don't even know we haven't seen adults at all yet, have we? I think she's in Australia or something weird. Yeah, isn't she? They didn't want to pay anybody. Yeah, they got stingy. Yeah.

Our bosses wanted to buy very expensive sports cars, so actors were not getting paid. Which feels crazy when you have Moira Kelly, but here we are. We'll just talk about her until she. comes back. What else did we miss? There's so much stuff. I mean, I don't know. I love a love triangle,

so I'm super into the Lucas Peyton Lindsay thing. I'm really into what feels like it's going to be the Nathan Haley, Nanny Carey thing. Oh God,

I feel so dangerous. But I want to know who Brooke is going to kiss. Like it feels, Brooke Davis, you know, the Pied Piper of Boys, is not making eyes in anybody right now

and it feels very weird. She needs that. Brooke has been constantly all about the boys and this is so good for her and I love that she can also just set up a storyline

for us that isn't all about boy drama because everybody loves a little boy drama but we also need to see a woman just like figuring out how to start a company I mean or keep it

keep a quote and do new I mean I just love that I think it's so awesome. When she says on the phone yes there's a boy here and we know it's a little boy. It's my God, son. You're just not letting me finish.

Yeah, it's really nice. I'm sorry. Maria's here. She's getting in the car. I'm taking her to talk. Hi, honey. Hi. She's like, it was locked.

Okay. Mom, we have to go home. Mom, we have to go. Okay, guys. Okay. I'm sorry. I won't. All right.

I'm going to let you finish up. Okay. Bye. Okay, bye. See, that's what we do for the kids. That's what we do. I do love... that Brooke's world is expanding as she comes home,

that she knows what's important. It's sort of what we were talking about earlier when we were talking about loss, that a big work life that consumes all of your time without a life life is not enough. Yeah. And we were all really struggling with that at this point. Oh, my God.

Well, because at this age, two, like where I come from, everybody gets married at 21, 22. And I was catching a huge ration of shit from everyone. Like, you didn't come to my college graduation and you didn't come to my bachelor at party and you didn't come to this and you didn't come to this. Tell me about it. My time didn't belong to me. And it didn't belong to you. And so I felt awful and was just constantly apologizing for being a bad person because I didn't gotten this job. well yeah you're always on the receiving end of shit yeah and then someone will say well you know you went to that event and it's like well yeah because they scheduled around it because they want us

to do press that looks fancy from the outside but that's they look at that as strategic that's still that's a commercial that's a commercial that's advertising guys come on you know the um the the reality that you just you just don't get to go to things you just don't get to go to things. Yeah. You just don't. And yes, you love it, but it's hard and the struggle that it's both is something that I was really, I just felt so connected to in this moment. And I think I loved the storyline so much because Brooke got to change it. I didn't get to go home, she did. Yeah. She got to form a relationship with her godson and she got to be back with her best friend and you and I had those moments that were so beautiful together and I was like this is everything

I want yeah and I really really loved it it felt good it felt yeah really real um and I know that we're eventually going to end up like in Brooks apartment somewhere I all I can think is are they staying in a hotel in their own hometown right now because there is nothing that feels worse as someone that has to do that when I go home to Virginia like staying and in a hotel. Were they at the Riverview Suites? Maybe. Or Brooke and Peyton are at the Wilmontonian.

They're at the Wilmingtonian in the Maryland Monroe room. The themed room. Does Peyton go home? I don't remember. Do you still have the house, the Sawyer House? No. No. No, they haven't shown where we are.

Because I thought about that after last week's episode. I'm like, Peyton goes to pick Brooke up at the airport. But then where does she take her? Right. Where do we go? I'm very curious. I think this is probably why they make Brooke buy a house so fast. Right. Let's just settle down, girls. We're just going to. We're just going to buy a house. What did we miss? Because I love getting messages from people that are like, I can't believe they talked for an hour. They didn't bring up this. So I don't want to get yelled out anymore. I don't want to get y'all down either. I watch, I'm going to confess something. I watched this episode on my lunch break at play rehearsal in London. Yeah, you did.

made it 42 minutes or in or whatever I had I think hold on I've I've still got it pulled up I can tell you exactly where I had to stop oh you have to see the end the end is magic no I couldn't because I remember oh wait oh yeah I have I have seven minutes and 48 seconds left oh my god so I knew I knew once I realized what this episode was I knew what was coming I knew that I'm taking a stand was coming. I felt it in my bones. But guys, there's eight minutes. I have no idea. Hillary, tell me, what did I miss? Oh, my God. I mean, the reveal of Karen's Cafe is so good.

Like, that was a winner. Nathan rolls that wheelchair into the pool? Right. Oh, in the pool. That I remembered too. It was weird to be watching and go, oh, I remember how this. Oh, I remember how this. And then I thought, I know the cafe happens. I know Nathan in the pool happens. But then he gets out of the pool and he's perfectly dry.

and he goes to Jamie's room. No, he's not dry. Girl, he's dry. He takes Jamie out to the racetrack. And they race each other in the wheelchair and the little car. Oh, that's right. Oh, God. So they do their own soapbox rally.

Haley doesn't witness that, you know? And I guess I don't know. I just feel really sympathetic for Nathan because I've gone through dark patches that have certainly lasted longer than four months. And I'm like, see, he's connecting with. this kid they probably have these little like quiet moments that haley doesn't witness and he doesn't have to like be performative about it like hey buddy come come talk to me oh that's so they were very

cute sweet i forgot about that yeah it's interesting because i you know in all the in all the journeys we've done identify with his experience and deep sadness and rage and all of that and I know how long I waited to throw shit I wish I'd done it sooner so I also really want to cheer for lately

now we know the four months what is the appropriate amount of time we're going to figure out what that is it's like listen four months too soon six months now you're dead to me it also depends on it depends on what the issue is that's making you want to throw things I think

I mean Peyton leaving Nathan in the children's cancer ward of the hospital was so extreme and weird? That was unacceptable. Hi, I haven't seen you in four years. Just going to drop you off with all these immune compromised children real quick. What bothers me about those sorts of liberties is that it's just implausible. You would not be on the pediatric oncology floor taking someone to physical therapy. you know what I would have loved if you guys were having that conversation walking into the hospital getting on an elevator you turned him around and you and you smacked on college like you know pediatrics or whatever in the elevator and shoved him out and said look at look at how ungrateful you are I'm out and you left him there and he had to wheel back and go to physical therapy like do something more interesting than they're just happening to walk through here and there's not a single nurse saying you are not allowed to

on this floor, you could be bringing in a pathogen that could kill a kid. We didn't think things through. Come on. That hospital set was ours. We were going to use it however we wanted. Well, and it was only one floor. There was an elevator, but it went to nowhere. Hey, okay, other favorite scene of the show, though, is Yumi and Lucas on the River Court. Like, I love that we went back to that space together. It's like a magnet. and and that was part of the place where when we were talking about our lives and you said well you have this I wrote it down you said uh now I want to tell you what I wrote down and I can't see it there it is you said you have a very busy very great life and Brooke goes nope that's what it looks like nope this is what I care about and we get into this thing about your dreams and and investing in them and like work We're going to do it together. Yeah.

I just, I loved how honest, but like alive and joyous and messy it was. And then this boy shows up and it's like, hey, go talk to her about this. Oh, it just felt so fun. Brooke is such a good wing, man. Yeah. No, but that sense of like, I did the work thing, you and I do this in real life. You're doing it in Tulsa, you know, and you've done it in other small towns where you have kind of built. chapters of your life. I'm doing it here in Rhinebeck. It's like we go out and we work, work, work, work, work, work, work, work. I feel like the last

five years I've just been like working constantly. And then you hit this point where you're like, okay, I'm going to do a home chapter and I'm just going to be home for a while. And now I'm doing PTA and it takes precedent over literally everything else. Like I'm scheduling everything around PTA. PTA. It's the thing that restores us. us. Like we're cancers. We're homebodies. We're nesters. I like that Brooke is able to embody that and it doesn't look like failure. It looks like a different color success. Yeah, absolutely. Well, and everybody's always got opinions about what you're doing. A, not everybody knows what you're doing. And B, we all, we all need that. You know, I had all these people this year being like, well, what do you mean? You're not going to go to a pilot. What's your next show? And I was like, no. I need a minute. I need a minute. I want to be home for the holidays. I want to look around and just figure out what I want to do in this moment. And I was like, I want to go do a play. That's what I want to do. TV's there. I want to go do this other thing. And it feels excited.

and I think it can remind you of what you love and why when you give yourself a moment to breathe, reset, and then decide what excites you. And I love that these two friends are coming home to breathe and figuring out what excites them. It may look different, but Native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for a hundred of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornelis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history.

On the podcast, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we explore her. story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Okay, we have a question from Haley, not spelled like our Haley.

This is an L-E-I-G-H-H-Haley. If you had any scenes with Jamie, how would you go about rehearsing your lines with him? Would he have an acting coach on set to help him through every scene? Or did he rehearse ahead of time? I mean, you worked with them more than I did. Yeah, I mean, we worked together a lot. You know, time with kids is limited. But, yeah, he, I think his mom really, really worked with him a lot.

You know, his, his mom and siblings, uprooted, moved to Wilmington so that he could do this job. And his, his, I can't remember, I feel like he had two siblings. God, it's been. He had an older sister and a younger brother. Because I took the older sister with Mike Leone's daughter to go see Mama Mia. I had two nine-year-olds with me, jamming. Oh, my God. I was thinking for some reason that they were both.

older but that's probably why i'm thinking of i'm thinking there's like a baby running around set together yeah but you know his mom would really help him memorize things and because he was not working every day like we were he he he had less to remember and then we would work so we would rehearse and then we we would kind of gamify it you know i could be like well when you say this to me what do you think you're really saying? And he could, you know, he could ask me, what do you mean? And it's like, well, you know, somebody's having a really good day. And you say to them, how are you?

And they say, I'm good. Or if someone's having a bad day and you say to them, how are you? And they say, I'm good, yeah. You know the difference, right? Like, what's really underneath it? And so we would play these games together that were really, they were really fun and blocking with kids. you know, figuring out the action that happens through the scene, when you pick him up, when you high five, when you run around, that really, I think, can ground them too.

So he definitely had to do work at home. And then we would just work together. And then, I mean, Lasseter said it last week. Sometimes she'd be hiding next to the kitchen cabinets going, this is your line. We just made sure, we always made sure he had the support he needed because he was only four. Gus just got offered a movie And I'm like, no, I'm like, we haven't even read the script But I'm like also horrified because he wants to do it

And I'm like, oh my God, am I going to be a stage mom? Like, is that what's going to happen? I don't know. I can't like George is the age that Jackson was. And there's, she's so feral. There's no way she would stand on a mark. Like she won't let people brush her hair. She's like, ah, don't touch me.

You know, I can't imagine my baby, baby working, but Gus has got a mustache now. So he thinks he's a grown man and it's like, Mother, I must. Yeah, it's so stressful. Wow. I'm glad Jackson had you to mother hen him on set. Just take him under your wing. What's our most likely to? What are we got?

Let's spin a wheel. I'd be curious, too, to spin in, spin and spin. I'd be so curious to hear Joy and James answer that question as well, obviously, as the people who played his parents, like, how that was. Yeah, could he read at that point? Or did someone have to read the line to him? Ooh, who is most likely to become a detective? You. Dda, da, yeah, I mean, it's kind of what we do.

I mean, you literally do a documentary series about solving crimes, but also, if something's going on, on, you're always the person to go, guess what I found out? Guess what I dug up? Guess where blah, blah, blah went? Like, you always know, it's you. A thousand percent. Girl, I'm nosy. Oh, don't deflect.

You're good at it. No, I loved, like, on set, learning things from the crew and being able to, like, trickle information down and be like, where do you know? Do you know what I found out? Oh, my God. we're going through case files right now for the next season of our show and it's just fuckery everywhere and you know you want to

when you're dealing with morbid subject matter it messes with you but you want to show up and do a good job for these people because no one else is so I totally understand the private investigator mindset of like all right well no one else is doing the job I'll do it you know let's just roll up our sleeves

who on our show would be a PI It's always kind of... Like Fergie. He's always around, but just listen. But he's mysterious. Nobody knows what he does. Maybe he's in the CIA. Yeah, I'm into that.

Who else, like, doesn't have a job but is always around? I like those people where you just never really know. Yeah. What do you do? How do you afford your mortgage? How do you pay for gas? Yeah. How'd you buy that apartment?

Um, hmm. Like, is skills... Is his only job the basketball coach? Was he not have like another hustle? It seems that way. I just remember when we were kids, those like 1-800 commercials where you could do mail order degrees. And it was like, at home nursing, private investigator.

And I remember thinking like, why would I go to college? I could just stay home and be a private investigator. Yeah, I could stay home and play the Inspector Gadget theme song to myself all day. Dund-da-d-d-d-d-dard-d-d-d-d-darn it. Like, come on. I'm here for it. Sign me up. We got an honorable mention.

God, I feel like this whole episode is an honorable mention. Is that silly? I just love Nathan coming up out of the water. Because it was slow motion. It really was like free willy. Like it was like a different movie. And because there was so much heavy for me personally and also in the episode, I just loved that moment of like,

da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da-da. It was fun. I love feeling like our heroes are back. Yeah. And, you know, I know the journey's not over for him, but what he's saying is he's going to fight for it. Yeah. And that, like, that's, that's it. That's everything.

And that we got to see him make that decision by himself. Not with Haley, not with his son, not with anybody else. Like, to see him do it by himself. Now we get the added reward of him eventually revealing it to people. So I'm excited about our future episodes. What do we got next week, baby? next week season five episode three my way home is through you oh well that's sweet i love you we'll have so much fun in london love it thank you my angel um love you all see you next week see you

hey thanks for listening don't forget to leave us a review you can also follow us on instagram at drama queens o't hush or email us at drama queens at iHeartRadio dot com see you next time We're all about that high school, drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride and our comic girl, cheering for the right team. Drama queens, drama queens, smart girl, rough girl, fashion but you're tough girl, you could sit with us, girl. Drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens. It may look different, but native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges.

to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.