Drama Queens - Risky Business • EP 801

Episode Date: January 6, 2025

In the Season 8 premiere episode Joy comes clean about falling for the misdirect of this episode and Rob reminisces on filming a romantic scene in unpredictable conditions.  The Queens dissect the Alex, Mia, and Chase triangle and why Victoria would jeopardize her daughter's empire.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. It may look different, but native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

First of all, you don't know me. We're all about that high school, drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride and our comic girl, cheering for the right team. Drama queens, drama queens, smart girl, rough girl, fashion but you'll tough girl, you could sit with us, girl. Drama queen, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens. Hi, everyone. Hi, guys. We're back with a brand new season.

Hey, oh. Episode 8.01. Read it off, Joy. Okay, season eight, episode one, asleep at Heaven's Gate. Air date, September 14th, 2010. As the gang returns from Utah, Brooke and Julian are in an engaged bubble until the police knock on Brooke's door. And that is not sting. police show up at Brookstor.

Haley learns that she is pregnant. Nathan is preparing to leave for training camp, and Katie shoots her shot with Clay and Quinn. Ooh. Oh, boy, guys. Well, the theme song's back. The theme song is back. Also, it made me feel a lot of nostalgia to see the opening credits cutting from, you know,

the year one high school to now was very cute. That's cool. I like it. I have a question, and I wrote this in the thing, and I couldn't figure it out, because when the episode opens and you are doing the cool, like, collage letter with the pictures to Lucas, and your cute little hat and your hoops, I was like, oh, months have gone by. Her hair color is different. And then I was like, wait, but months can't have gone by because we're in.

a cliffhanger. And then I was like, but wait, because we do the flashback when Haley tells Nathan she's pregnant, but then the next day her hair is different. So my question is, was the plan like, I'm back, I'm out of my depression, I need a new do, and like maybe that morning, you know, she went and got her hair died and then like popped by the river cord on the way home was like feeling fancy fresh. Because it is the next day, right? It's not like, It has to be. It has to be the next day. Like two days couldn't have gone by.

You guys would be dead by that. How many days can Clay and Quinn realistically bleed out for? Yeah. How can they just lay there? Yeah, here's what I think it was. I think it was a lot more of joy needs to not be in a depression. Joy, like I had dyed my hair darker in the middle, you know, a few seasons prior because it was a preference of my partner at the time.

And stuck with that for a while and was kind of in the phase of coming out of my personal haze. And I really wanted to feel like myself again. And I was like, I look like my husband's mother. I'm not happy. And I don't, I want to feel like me. And so I started just making small changes, one of which included, hey, I really would like to just go back to my semi-natural hair color, which is always difficult getting that much red out.

But we did it. You did it. I think I just showed up on set and I was like, nope, I'm not changing it. This is what it is. And I don't know, eight seasons in there were like, whatever, Joy. Good for you. Truly, I know the River Court is the most beautiful shot and it's very iconic for our show. I sort of wish we had seen you writing the letter to Lucas, like under the, you know, the round hair dryer

at the salon to be like, oh, like, it would have actually been so cool to see the reveal of the new do the next day. Like, I'm back, baby. But I know our writers, well, our head writer was very spiteful and would never have given you that much grace. But I like it and I like it for you and I actually really like it for Haley too. So there. Thank you. Thank you very much. I did too. I was happy to see myself, a version of myself back. It felt good. Yeah. So sorry for all of you out there who were confused. This is a moment when personal life cross over into acting life and it's a TV show. Yeah. Deal with it. You mean almost like after eight years we were finally beginning to realize we could be our own people. Joy. Shock it. No. But you lightened your hair too.

It wasn't as dramatic as mine. But you also were lighter and fresher. Yeah, it was nice. Also, there really is something when you leave set in April and then you have to. you know, your summer hiatus, I don't know, you live a life for two and a half months. You do things. You change. Yeah. Yeah. And then yeah. I mean, similarly, I was like, hmm, this like, umbrae, whatever you call it that was very trendy at the time. I was like, this was very expensive. I'm not, I'm not like box dyeing it for you guys by. Yeah. Yeah. As a male outsider to your experience on the show, I do you feel like you're on a safari? No. I recall at the time truly was you all had so little recourse. Like there was,

your hands were so tied that I do remember hair color being like the one battleground that you all had. So I, I just remember it like it was a carousel of hair colors. Yeah. Changing because it was I kind of styles and cuts. It was like the one thing that you all could control and kind of force a hand on. And so it was like the one thing that you would exercise because you're like, well, you're shutting me down everywhere else. I'm going to mess with my hair. Yeah. You're absolutely right. I think we did a lot of that. You did a ton of it. Isn't that funny? I love it for us. Because when you think about it, not to get like too highbrow, but you know this is where my little like brain that read the article in like the American

medical journal kicks in. This is one of my favorite parts of your brain. Joy will text me sometimes. and be like, I know you have a fact on this. And I'm like, in fact, I do. Give me four minutes and I'll find it for you and I'll be right back. But like they talk a lot about how, you know, as they've studied certain things that really affect women, particularly eating disorders,

which we only really talk about with women, but also do affect young men. I want to be clear, us more so, that what they are is they are mechanisms of control. And for people who are incredibly regimented, by outside forces, be it authority, parents, you know, an abusive household, whatever. So many women, those experiences coupled with the way society pressures us to be good and look a certain way and, you know, be in servitude all the time or whatever.

It's why so many young women in particular develop eating disorders because it's the one thing in your life you can control. And I think it's actually really interesting to see how, in a way, hair became our rebellion because we also had a boss who in the midst of everything that was creepy about him would make as we've said a lot on this show a lot of comments about our weight and our bodies and I think for us it was sort of like we're not changing a goddamn thing about our bodies for you sir and I almost wonder if the way that what you know whether we were all kind of talking about who was going to go what color or you know you went like I did

after season two and went rogue and cut bangs and didn't get approval and then almost got fired over it. Like, I'm actually sort of so proud of us that we figured out some version of physical rebellion in this mechanism of control because I think if we hadn't, we would have probably been at risk for like more of that really sort of sad stuff that happens to so many of our peers. And I don't know. I remember sometimes like standing on set when the pizza would come and just holding my hands like this with a piece of pizza and looking at our boss and just slowly eating being like,

I dare you to say something to me about this. I don't know. We really, we rebelled. It is such an interesting psychological rabbit hole. I would like to spend more time going down at some point because I know in my life, and you guys may have felt this way too, but when you feel like you're out of control, like you have no ability to control the very basic fundamental things in your life. And whether that's it's because other people are controlling you or because you feel like you can't trust yourself to make decisions or whatever. And however, that manifests in people's lives, the feeling of trying to control then other people and trying to control your environment. And then I would find myself actually being really, really hard on other people, even just strangers

or customer service or whatever other, you know, I'd show up on set. And if an actor didn't know their lines I would just be so upset and it's not like it's like okay it's a thing it's annoying but things that were really easily dismissable or just let it roll off your back I would hold onto as this sense of injustice and like it's not okay and and I would be so hard on people because I was so hard on myself because I was allowing myself to be controlled and I didn't have this normal outlet of free will and control does that make sense yes wait and you actually just I just had a thought because I wonder if it's almost, I've had that in my own way. Like, when the environment is such a nightmare, any additional pressure feels like popping the balloon, you know?

Like, I went through a thing that you know a lot about, and it put me in a position where I couldn't stand to be touched by people I didn't know, which is a very hard psychological place. And for you, but you love being touched and snuggled. And like literally, if someone would grab my arm the way I would leap and freak out, like I felt like razor wire at the time. And now I look back and I go, God, that was so weird and so not myself. And I bring it up only because you're making me realize, I almost wonder if the mechanism of it is I am so taught. It's like you're being kind of, like the image I get is like, you know, break. Braveheart on the stretcher. Like, you're about to split. And so any additional pressure is so hard to handle. And I almost wonder if maybe the reason that those things at that time were so reactive

for you was because you were like, well, how dare you not follow the rules? Yeah. What do you mean you can't learn your lines? Like, this is the basic. We all have a lot of expectations put on us, but it's like you were probably triggered by expectations because that the amount of expectations on you were unsustainable. Yeah, that's exactly right. Wow. Two episodes in a row of therapy. Guys, I missed you.

Welcome back to the Drama Queen's Therapy Corner, sponsored by Better Help. Oh, my God, if they're a sponsor this week, we've truly nailed it. I do remember, okay, this will be the last thing I say about it because we're not. I haven't even looked at my notes yet for this episode. I haven't either. We don't stoop, but I will say, you know, in the world of the internet being assessable, like, now I'm starting to see people be like, if one more, if they talk about therapy one more time, and I'm like, if you have anybody in your life who's not talking about therapy regularly,

run. So anyway, be nice to people, people. Nice to people, people. I like that. Who's not nice to people is Katie. But it was just a dream, Sophia. It was just a dream. Oh, that's right.

It was just a dream. That's what I want to jump in on because. the relief I felt, even though I knew it was obviously a lie, like I knew it was a ruse in the writing. I did not.

You didn't? No. I forgot. The moment, the sort of moment where she comes out and is so present with you because it almost seems

as though Clay's been having a nightmare. You're so shaken up and Quinn is right there with you. And it felt so tender and almost maternal, and I don't mean that in a creepy way, you know, but like when a kid wakes up, their mom or dad is just so present. Yeah.

And it was this sweet, sweet moment, and I, and my thought, and I wrote this down, I said, oh, no, they're really going to take us through it, aren't they? Because I didn't remember that you were going to be in this sort of tandem coma world together for the whole episode. But that scene at night of her running back into the living room with you too really, It set me up to know I was going to get hurt by this episode. And I thought, wow, you guys did such a beautiful job making something that, obviously, as actors, you knew was a dream sequence, feels so real. And the more that you sell that first scene, the better it sets up the emotional sucker punch when you find out.

Because you're like, look at how great these two are together. Isn't this a beautiful, special thing? And then the end of episode is like, gotcha. It may not last. I thought all of that stuff played so well, all of the sort of coma dream sequence stuff. Yeah, I loved it. When we're walking on the beach and Clay has the moment of going, wait, there's no one else out here. Oh, is this where he starts to piece it together?

And then, nope. Nope. Not yet. Not yet. Although you sure looked real, like a real snack, Rob, in that cream-colored button-up shirt and those jeans just walking on the beach. beach. Hey. Hey.

That was fun. Thank you. No, but you did. But that was, I loved that moment of there's nobody else in the beach. Do you know what this means? And then we still get to keep playing. I completely forgot that this is part of the storyline.

I was reminded this was one of the things that my friend I was watching this show with was like, oh, but it's all a dream sequence. It's not real. I was like, oh, yeah, she said that really early on. So I was along for the ride. It's all right. I mean, I probably would have figured it out eventually. Was this Heather who did this? Danielle.

Daniel. Oh, in my book. Oh, yeah. Classic Danielle. Spoiler alert. But I'm glad. I'm glad because it was fun watching you to finally get all of your romantic moments before shit hits the fan. Yeah.

It's going to get real weird. In the turn where she spots the blood on her shirt. Oh, that was good. It was really good. Yeah. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional.

It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for a hundred of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornellis, who with Rutherford, Balls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream.

Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts was it cold it looked like a cold day on the beach well it was yes yes i mean listen there was never really like a good warm time in that water it was just sort of varying shades of cold and i do remember that being uh quite cold yeah yeah you guys you guys looked like troopers there was one point where it was supposed to be obviously you too in the ocean and it's so romantic and you're holding each other and you just get hit by such a big wave and I I watched you as

as the gentleman that you are like make sure to hold on to her because obviously she's topless and you're trying to protect her body from an entire camera crew and I just saw like she buries her face in your neck clearly because she's just gotten hit in the face by water and you guys are trying so hard to do the romance and I was like that's when you know you've got a great scene partner because you're like maybe we're going to drown but we're going to do it together and i've got you i won't let you go i won't let this you know terribly potentially violating thing happened to you we're going to be okay and i was like oh man history so great too the just the two of you on camera as quinn and clay the fact that your friendship was strong and you were really looking out for each other

and there was this sense of camaraderie behind the scenes you could really feel it in the scenes and it made clay and quinn even more endearing yeah yeah we were we were good teammates It's going through all that stuff, man. And I do remember, yeah, just being cold. And there are certain things that are like deceptively hard in acting. For example, playing dead. I think a non-actor would think that's got to be the easiest thing, right? It's not.

It's very hard because all of a sudden, as soon as you're supposed to be dead, you need to swallow. And your eye wants to twitch. And now how do I shallow? It's like all of these things, right? And another one that's very challenging is being romantic around crashing water, whether it's a waterfall. Or like Brulian having to kiss on the sand Why the water's kind of splashing you Because you're trying to like

Create this wonderfully picturesque beautiful moment But you're also trying to spit out the salt water from your mouth And your right eye got sand in it And it's just It's in your underwear Yeah man So I remember us just like doing our best And kind of being like did you get it?

Did you get it? Can we come in now? Are we done? Can we please be done? It's going to be done. Yeah, cut to stock footage of like a dolphin, just, you know, gleefully jumping out of the water and let's move to the next scene already. Exactly. You know what I liked about it is that in an interesting way, despite it being a dream sequence, it allows for this little love bubble that everyone's in to keep going. You know, Haley and Nathan talking about their pregnancy, this sweet chat the two of you have about how he wants a daughter just like you.

um you know brook and julian in this in this kind of reflection on the step they're about to take and talking about you know the cadence they've found and their intimacy and what what they're building and and even her reflecting on this Utah trip and saying you know watching jamie in his snow fort Peyton and i used to build those and it makes her think about how lucky they all are to be at this place in their life. The reflection everyone's getting to do is something that I really love for a kickoff episode because all of it feels so personal to each of the characters. And in a way, it takes the audience back too. And it reminds you of how far all these people have come. And then everyone's worlds obviously start to go a bit to shit. You guys have been shot. Brooke gets

arrested. It's like, oh, just kidding. You guys got nine minutes of exactly. And now we're back at it. I had zero recollection of this whole storyline for Brooke. So when the police came to the door, I kept me like, wait, is this a joke? Wait, she's actually getting booked. Wait, what is happening? That whole storyline came out of left field in a big way for me. Yeah, that was so confusing.

And you really don't see it coming off the grease lightning morning. Can I tell you that your makeup in that scene looked increasingly? Oh, yeah. Thanks, Bill. So good. So good. I liked that whole scene. I loved that sequence, but I, like, even the beginning when you guys were laying in bed, I was watching, I was watching. And then I was like, I don't, I'm embarrassed. Like, you, the intimacy, but like, you guys were so good, so convincing, so close. I kind of looked away. Like, I don't, this is my friend. I don't want to watch her. Like, I feel like a voyeur. This is, I'm so uncomfortable. By the way. Even I. Even I. I thought to myself watching it, I was like, oh, I'm finally starting to feel comfortable in myself as a woman, like at this time in my life, in a new way. Like, so much of it, especially because Brooke as a young woman was like this super over-sexualized character. Yeah. Everything was so performative for so long. and I was watching that scene

and I was like, oh, this is like this is more like a scene on an HBO show. It is. I know the intimacy of where even the hand on a hand on your leg. I mean, it wasn't like really racy. It was just intimate. It was like beautifully intimate. And I felt like I shouldn't be watching this.

This is a private moment. I kind of loved it. I was like, oh, this is nice. It's not so sticky like it used to be. And I think the writing was so simple and good that it enabled us to bring all this other energy into it. And I liked the intimacy that then led into this joke, you know, this sort of, okay, fine, he's got this fantasy, let's do this. And, you know, it's like the little bra and panties set and the pink lady jacket. So cute.

And you walking in in the middle of that, just like, and the only thing. I had to hide my body was the counter and then the bowl. A bowl of fruit. Dude, in the way that you scream, I'm pregnant, don't be mad as you run out the door over your shoulder was so funny. Yeah.

That scene was great, man. The moment of you realizing it though is perfect, Joy. You play that. It's so believable and funny. It's awesome. And especially on the heels of Nathan Cracking. the sex jokes about Quinn and Clay

and you're like, oh my God, no, no, no, no, no, no. And then you go to Brooke and Julian's and you're like, oh my God, no, no, no, no, no, no. It just keeps going for you. I'm just still having it in real life. It was just all just too much. It was too much. And the irony that the sort of couplet or I guess the triplet of it

is like Clay Quinn, Brooke Julian. And you're like, I'm actually the one that's pregnant. I'm leaving. Yes, it's so funny. So cute. And then this whole storyline of Jamie like meeting and explain to him what sex and basketballs and eggs. The uterus is the rim.

The rabbit. It's just so good. Funny rabbits. Yeah. That was terrific. Lady sex rabbit. Oh, yeah. The writers really, they hit a home run with that.

And then, oh, my mom has one of those. I mean, I just. Yeah. Oh, boy. So real. Nathan using Jamie as basically a piece of workout equipment was oh that's one of my first note it's so good yeah it's been fun watching him uh really sort of level up his dadding yeah and just to see him have such an interest in his kid and involving him

you know in so many things uh it's just it's really nice to see yeah but let's go back to brook because this shop this whole shop thing is it really turned me off oh god i forgot getting arrested and all the stuff with Victoria and all of the, I mean, I was really, really surprised. Same. Now, let me ask a question because, again, I'm coming at this having not seen seasons one through six. My reaction was this made no sense because it always seemed to me that Victoria was very on top of things. So I felt myself going, I'm confused at why she would let something so risky and a Regis go down.

But Alexander was like her kryptonite. Like she's, she wants to keep working with him. The whole thing was for the men's line. And if Alexander, if they didn't have the money for it, she wouldn't have been able to keep him around. So I'm guessing, I'm guessing that's where it's going. She risked her daughter's empire for the Thunder Down Under. It sounds like that's what happened.

Well, you know, the way I sort of see it too, especially, because so many people in, you know, versions of power positions that are artists go through either financial mismanagement or financial abuse, I think it happens more easily than you, than we all think. And what I appreciated about it and what we set up, you know, just for you in seasons five and six when we've skipped college, is that Brooke is the designer mogul. But Victoria is the CEO. She is the financial half of the company. And they have this whole thing where, you know, Victoria talks about how she's the one who spins the straw into gold. And eventually we get to the point where it's like, no, Brooks' ideas are the gold. And you're the one

who manages the business. And she apologizes, yada, yada. It's lovely. I can't remember what happened before and after season seven starting. So forgive me for what you already know there. But what I think is sort of genius about the way they did this with the Millie and Victoria and Brooke of it all is you realize how someone can be the creative, but they're not the executor. So they don't know about the ones and zeros of the business. And then you've got Millie who, you know, Victoria points out got promoted in a way maybe she shouldn't have, but who's also very good at her job. and as they're in this kind of hen fight like cats in a bag screaming at each other in the store

which I thought was great. Such a great scene. Such a great scene because everyone's just yelling at everyone else and Brooke wants to know what happened. You can kind of see the humanity in it and I do think it's like a little bit of an icarus story, right? You fly a little too close to the sun. The business has been so successful

and has always worked that Victoria thinks, well, we might not have it now, but the men's line will be huge. And we'll earn it so fast, no one will ever know. And there's a recession, and that's not what happened. And the numbers they fudged have been caught. And everything that you might do, if you get a little too high on your own supply, or a little too greedy, or maybe just a little too used to succeeding, and you get a little lazy, it can be.

all go up in smoke and I kind of love it and I agree with you joy wow I'm still talking sorry but there's a lot of thoughts I'm having no you're right I agree with you on the Alexander element but I also like that he's not central to the story because you do you do realize that this was just it was a bad business decision yeah it's like a small moment of elapsed of integrity that you know I think we all in different ways in our life, like, you know, it's like the white lie thing, like, oh, it's just a little thing. What difference does it make? It's fine. It's just a, I'm canceling a reservation, but they don't need to know that I'm not really sick, but they're going to charge me if I don't tell them I'm sick. You know, it's like these little things that go on through day to day life. And we can think nothing of it, but it's a lapse in integrity. And especially when it's done in an environment where someone is like Victoria, so you, to success, so used to things going really well. It's all working. It's like, I can fudge a number here and there. I can do a couple little things. It's fine. It's all going to work out. It's not going to be a big deal. Like, there's a personal vigilance that I think we're also susceptible

to if we don't stay on top of it. And this would happen to Victoria, I think. I think. I haven't seen what's happening next, but that's what it looks like. It's very good. I was, I think I was just confused because it went on for so long before we actually found out what happened. Yeah. Like it was odd that when they got to the store, Victoria wasn't like, here's the skinny. Here's what happened. You know, it was this thing where she wasn't quite saying anything and then Millie wasn't quite saying anything and Brooke is still standing there.

Brooke was like the voice of the audience going, what the hell is happening? Because it's like by this point, I've seen her get arrested and, you know, and then we've seen her drive home. like she's telling Julian she and they're just going okay fine but what happened like that I think that was where I there was so long where I was just left going huh that by the time we finally found out it was like why it doesn't matter but it was just it was a long time before we actually got to what happened where Victoria traditionally is someone who wastes no time getting to the the crux of the conversation yeah well I also think perhaps Victoria's not being

honest because she really is convinced we're flying the lawyer in and we're going to solve it. It's going to be fine. It's not that big of a deal. Yeah. Totally not that big of a deal. I can see in my head, Victoria, having a moment going, you know, when they're trying to raise money for the men's line going, well, it's only the climate of this economy. The fact that people won't give us what we're worth. Eight years ago, I could have raised this money in two days. Like she has all this sort of stuff built up under her. Yeah, that'll tell her it's going to continue to be this good. we're going to continue to succeed in this way. And I think the hard lesson when you've been successful is like, there's never a guarantee.

You really don't know. And what I sort of loved, actually, was that the face off took so long. And they started yelling about who's sleeping with who and who's unqualified for this and sizes and age. I mean, zero is a size, by the way. 50 is an age, by the way. Dead. Like, so funny. And so I liked that they were spinning out

so that Brooke couldn't get an answer because it made me feel more frustrated and more afraid and a little more desperate and I liked being brought there as a viewer, let alone as a person who was in the scene because there was so much of it that I didn't remember either. Do you know what's going to happen?

Do you remember what happens? I do not. Do you join? I do not, no. I remember a lot of it. I will say, because I don't want to be a spoiler, but... Don't be a Danielle.

Don't be a spoils part. I'm not going to be a spoiler. I'm just going to say, I think that Brooke telling Julian, you know, she's got some bucks squirreled away and he says, oh, you're the rich Brooke Davis when they're beginning

their wedding planning journey is unfortunately timed. One thing I do want to say that just feels important to acknowledge because sometimes I know our show makes people feel seen and sometimes I know our show makes people feel harmed. I understand the comedy the writers were going for in Brooke coming in

and explaining her experience in the jail. And I'm very much still saddened and was saddened in 2010 by the nature of the cheap shot of it. I think that our writers, for whatever reason, really thought that transphobia or being transphobic in adjacency was cool. This isn't the first time they've done it. Yeah. And I lost a battle on this. And for me,

it just brought back like a lot of memories about what it felt like to fight and then be told, you know, you're overreacting and this, that, and the other. And, you know, now I've got a friend literally arguing a case to defend people in front of the Supreme Court this week. so I don't know I just there isn't really like a way to make it better for anybody that I know that dialogue hurts yeah but I just want people to know that they're seen for me as an actor you know being sort of stuck in a space where it's like you're not a writer you're not a producer you don't get to change the dialogue what I really had to commit to in that was the physical violation of my character because they wouldn't let me change that

dialogue that was describing someone in that way. But it did, it was this weird thing, because I was like, I know this happens to people who go into these carceral environments and they are violated in ways that are really hard and awful. And then there's also this part of it that feels like a cheap shot. And so, I don't know. For me, I just had to say, like, what can I commit to here? What does feel true? And like, yeah, as a woman having to have a cavity search by a stranger, feels pretty horrific, no matter who that stranger is. And so, I don't know. I still hate it. And for anybody who watched the scene and hated it, I see you, I love you. And that's that. It's great. So that's all. I love that about you. I love your willingness to just dive into something

uncomfortable. And like, even if it's 15 years ago or however long, what year of 2010, yeah, 15 years ago. And still just acknowledge that and open it up. Thanks. You're right. It was such a cheap shot. There was totally unnecessary. There's so many things in our show that we talked. And necessary is the word. Unnecessary. There's so many other ways to write comedy. There's so many other funny things in life and the world in that scenario and that situation.

Like there's just so many other ways to do it. And it sucks that you were put in that position and had to lose that battle. And very cool of you to mention it now and try and make it better. It's awesome. Yeah. And look, I think we all had to do a lot of that. I mean, we talked about it even in the. the season seven finale, like what Chantel had to go through in her own physical body.

Like, for whatever reason with all the women, there was a lot of like cheap shot writing. Yeah. And yeah, we can't like change it, but I am very grateful that we get to acknowledge those things and be present and talk about it even now because it sticks with you in some way or another, you know? Well, and like Joy said, you know, there is something you can do and you just did it. you know, you acknowledged it, you brought it to light, you shared how you feel about it and why, you know, doesn't sit right with you. And I think that's, that is, that is what you can do. You just did it. Yeah. Yeah. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture.

It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly like, traditional it feels like Bob Dylan going electric that this is something we've been doing for the kinds of years you carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence that's sierra teller ornelis who with rutherford falls became the first native showrunner in television history on the podcast burn sage burn bridges we explore her story along with other native stories such as the creation of the first native comic-con or the importance of reservation basketball Every day, native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream.

Listen to Burn Sageburn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Let me ask a question. Did you, when Brooke and Julian were talking about the wedding and Julian confesses that he has been planning his dream wedding since he was nine years old. I had two immediate reactions. My first was, oh, that's funny. And then I immediately was like, oh, is this another attempt at like emasculating one of our leading men?

Yes. And of course it was, right? Yes. Yes. I thought it was, I thought he was joking at first because it just seemed so ridiculous. The masculation. Yeah, the flowers in the, you know, it wasn't even just like a. venue it was like this type of flower and a pineapple upside down cake or whatever it was what it's so

stupid it was odd yeah i don't know i will say austin you know is such a trooper such a good team player um and yeah he really leaned into it and for all of the reasons that had nothing to do with you know, good writing or good story content that the person in charge of our show didn't want like a bunch of really, he didn't want any more like young, hot, talented actors like Austin, Rob and James to like be on set, which is, you know, whatever it is. The way he had to essentially turn Julian into someone who was a bit of a joke and had no friends so that he could have a seven-year-old be his eventual best man is a choice, I guess. But I really admire that Austin leaned in and he was like, he was like, honestly, I loved Greece too. And I was like, same. It was literally my

favorite movie in middle school. What are you talking about? Me and my best friends, Betsy and Janice, used to like literally do the choreo in my living room at home, like after school. We loved it. And so we giggled and we were like, if this is what we're doing, let's do it and make it funny. And in an interesting way, what I got watching it from today was him committing so hard in that scene enabled me to really lean into, you know, the more masculine energy of the couple in bed. Like, he absorbed the feminine energy of the wedding in that scene. So I kind of got to be the dude that was like, okay, baby cakes. And like in my glasses with like my little notebook.

And the whole thing actually is really funny. And we have such a good chemistry together as, you know, friends and performers that even though it's a completely stupid storyline, I really enjoy watching it. I do too. Yeah. What I love about Austin is as an actor, he trusts himself so much and he treats like he understands his own presence. And he's not intimidated by writing or offended or offended or. worried or there were so many things that we would see come in and I would change lines all the time for various reasons. I was afraid it didn't fit with the character. I was a little worried

it might make me, Joy, personally, look kind of strange if I was saying this line or what, like, who knows, all these young things that we did when we were young. I really remember observing and learning from Austin the way that he would say, 99% of the time he would say exactly what was on the page. In terms of, I mean, I had, you worked with. them a lot more than I did. So maybe that's, was that your experience also? No, it's absolutely true. Yeah. I felt that a lot with him, that he would just take what was on the page and say exactly verbatim what those words were. And he always made it work. Yes. And I always thought I had to jump in and fix things control issues, right? But like I, to be able to watch an actor who is super, super capable,

he just trusted himself. And he was like, yeah, I'll just say the lines. It's fine. It'll work out. I really like that observation and particularly when you think about the kind of pedigree that Austin came from. I mean, his longest running prior series being John from Cincinnati on HBO written by David Milch, having worked on Deadwood. Like he came and treated our show, which I think we all, you know, carried a little bit of insecurity, maybe a little chip on our shoulder. We felt like we got made fun of a lot and we were mad about it. And Austin treated our teen soap opera the same way he treated like an award, you know, an award worthy show on HBO. And it was very inspiring to watch. And yeah, it's definitely a testament to him as an actor for sure.

I'm excited about the Brooke and Julian wedding. I am too. I am too. It's so cute. But that actually, you saying that in that way, Joy, makes me have a question for you, Rob, because you and, Chantelle in this whole sequence are you're in this dream space, right? Like, you know that you're having to do this very weird thing as an actor when you show up to set. And you know that it can't dawn on your characters until you, you say this, no one's on the beach, do you know what that

means? You give away something being wrong. She meets you there and then, you know, you have a gag about like party party how did how did you guys and particularly for you as as you know another man who really commits to what's on the page who's sitting with us today like how did you wrap your head around this episode for yourself how do you begin to put yourself in a space where you're like okay I'm in the world of a coma and I'm going to do X or did you have to kind of not think about that and just treat it like it was any other scene so you didn't like pressure yourself no it was super simple because Clay didn't know he was in a coma. So it wouldn't have been right for me to be playing any sort of inclination or playing it any different. Because to Clay, he's having a really

nice, lazy day on the beach with Quinn. Right. He's just having the best day. Yeah. So to me, it was just a relaxed, guard down, grounded, romantic, flirty, fun day. And because also, you know, there is that one misdirect moment about known being on the beach, which is fun for the audience. But that's obviously just clay being cheeky. Yeah. But then, because I think the more you lean into that sort of just like grounded, uh,

sincere nature of it, it helps the turn that much more. Yes. I like that. I really, really like that. I'm with you, Joy,

I find when I get material, like I, especially on, especially on like movies of the week and stuff, I will, I will, I go in and I like really kind of retool the dialogue. But one thing I have noticed about myself is I will oftentimes retool it

to the point of realizing that the original line is actually the one I should say. That does happen. That does happen. And I'll have a good laugh going like, okay, Mr. Writer, you got all the way back to the original text. There we go. But it's that control issue of like, I can make this better.

I can make it fit my mouth and my speech pattern. And at the end of the day, I'm like, no, maybe the writer, because there was a character I was playing on Chesapeake Shores. And they were writing him in a certain way where like, occasionally he kind of sounded like a robot. And so I was trying to finesse it occasionally until one episode where I went, I'm just going to say these words exactly how they're written. And when I did it, I realized it actually made the guy sound like he there was a little, like there was a little something going on.

Like he wasn't quite socially dialed in. And I realized, oh, they were actually intending for it. Like there was a line where he was just not reading the room at all and interrupting a conversation to focus on one person in my head. I'm like, who does this? What adult would do this? And it's like, oh, this character does it. Rob wouldn't. The character you're being paid to portray would.

So say the lines, dumb, dumb. I love that. Yep. I actually think that's a really cool exercise as an artist, too. Because in a way, what I sort of envision in that full circle, you know, back to the point of origin thing that you're describing is you're doing the work to actually. identify what of your own stuff you instinctually want to carry into this experience and then you process through your own bullshit and then you get back and you go none of that is actually for the

character and now I know who the character is you have to do that kind of work on yourself as an actor otherwise subconsciously you're just going to go ahead and bring in all your own stuff and your preconceived notions yeah and it's the same way that there'll be a scene and there'll be a line where you're like the character's supposed to say like I'm just so devastated and as the act you'll be like can you just trust my face to convey that I need to do the same thing for the writer like I need to trust that they know what they're doing and they wrote this as concisely and specifically and eloquently as possible there's a there's an element of like not feeling protected or maybe it's a control thing whatever we're getting to inside baseball let's talk about Alice Whitehead and her calling chase her boyfriend 12 hours after asking him to go out on their first date. Yeah. I have such a love-hate relationship with this character. Like, she really wins my heart so many times.

And then she does things that make me so mad at her, which is great. It's a credit to Jana. But good Lord. It's one thing to be possessive with Chase. And, hey, boyfriend, here's the part I didn't get. Because, like, that I can, listen, Alex is, she's a bit manic. Like, we've covered this, right? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

She's high highs and low, low. She's all over the place. She's a bit of a soup sandwich, some might say. But the part I didn't get was the hostility towards Mia. So strange. That's what I'm saying, the whole episode. It's like, okay, she's being flirty or whatever. But then all of a sudden, just to go out of her way to give Mia the what's the what for.

It's so dumb. Do you think, though, that that is because Chase is honest with her and says Mia texted me. and thinks, you know, there's something, whatever he says, I actually, of course, didn't write that part down, because my observation was, this is lazy writing and especially creepy since Brooke dated Chase in high school. And Brooke's high school line was, hi friend, hi boyfriend.

So why is Alex saying, hi, boyfriend? Like, wouldn't that creep you out if a girl you started dating in your 20s said exactly the thing that your high school sweetheart used to say to you? Like, I don't know. I would feel like I was, Maybe being stalked. So that was the thing I was a little hyper-focused on, and I realized I didn't take great notes for this scene.

But I wrote down, I said, Alex challenging me a overbearing question mark, also kind of awesome, because their energy in the scene is so good. I just was having fun watching my friends be great actors. But yeah, do you think it's because of the text message and she feels threatened? Do you think it's because Alex do pray is the,

kind of girl who always wants to win. What do we think, or do you think she's doing it because she might be under the impression that Mia only wants Chase back because she knows that Chase is now with Alex? I have obviously more questions than I realized I did. I don't think it's the latter because there is no Chase in Alex yet. They haven't even gone on the date. I know. But, you know, maybe she's under the impression that Mia heard some big to-do happened in Park City.

I don't know. This just seems like pot stirring, like unnecessary pot stirring. That's exactly. If we had seen like even just one date and they really had great chemistry, it would be different, right? But because absolutely nothing has happened, it just makes it seem like it's an ego thing for Alex. Because there's this weird moment, right? Yeah. When shout out to Stephen Coletti, who learned how to twirl glasses and mixers like a pro that was awesome.

When he's showing Alice White had these moves and she drops her cups, there's a moment where Mia's watching and then Mia turns to walk away. And as Alice picks up the shakers, she sees that Mia was watching. And there is a prolonged close-up on her face. And I was dying to know what the note was to her. Like I didn't know what she was playing. Like if she was happy Mia saw her, she was conflicted. But because the camera stayed there so long,

I couldn't figure out what message we were sending. Yeah, it was clearly they were trying to send a message. If you leave a camera on something that long, you're trying to say something like hammering at home. So what was the message? There's a part of me that it is happy that I'm getting a boy that somebody else wants. It just seems so hammy. It for sure was a note. Like somebody told Jana, here's what we need you.

There's the face that we need you to make for this shot. Because it didn't, for me, it didn't correlate with her character at that moment either. It's just so strange. Yeah, I got the impression, which maybe does track Rob to your point that this might be an ego thing for Alex. I got the impression that seeing that Mia was coming in and then chose to walk out, she watched it and then turned around and celebrated it. Like she had that little smile to herself and then went back to Chase. But again, it does feel, I feel like I wish they'd saved these bits for 802 and had had them go on a date in 801 that then would cause the tension. Because the tension works if it is motivated by something.

But it's been a day. Right. So now it just almost feels like it's too much competition too soon. Yeah. And if we're making it about Alex's ego, there's very little to root for. Yes. You know, whereas if she was actually going to bat for Chase and something, some promise, some potential, it would be different. But if it's just going to be a pissing match, it's hard to sort of rally behind that, you know?

I, so there's when Joy, when you are, when Haley's talking with Mia and the Red Bedroom Records thing, there's a really funny moment where I think she says something effective. Like, you're so smart or you can figure it all out or something. And you go, yeah, just don't. ask me to explain how babies are made and then with your hands you do to badoom you do a rim shot do you remember if that was scripted or if that was just you realizing your surroundings that was so funny and then as you exit the scene you have a savage line but it's a hilarious throwaway line where you're walking out as chase is walking in and you just casually say Alex is gross, pick Mia.

Uh-huh. Wait, I didn't even hear that. Yeah. Like a run-on word. They don't even, like, shoot your face. It's just you over your shoulder casually. They just stay on Chase the whole time, but it's hilarious. It's so funny.

It's so funny. That's great. I do like the Chase and Mia and Grubbs. I mean, did Mia and Grubbs ever get together? Is that what's coming up or they're just friends? So far, they're just friends. They were doing a mouth Miss Lauren thing, though, where it was like, is this about to be more? Yeah.

Was it fair of Mia to ask Chase if he had slept with, Alex? I don't think so. I don't think so. I mean, I guess you can ask anything. It doesn't have to be answered, but. That's true. I don't know. That feels rooted in ego to me, too.

You know, this idea that someone thinks that when your relationship ends, they have the right to know. anything about your romantic life is so strange. If she's trying to get over him, if it was like, just tell me that you guys slept together and then I can start really wrapping my brain around you being with another person. But, you know, but she's the one that broke up with him. Yeah, you broke up with him, babe. Come on.

Come on. Like, get over it. And I love that Chase. He actually put her in her place. And he was like, yeah, you broke up with me over text. You asked for me back over text. She asked me out in person. I love to.

Perfect. That's a perfect answer. Great. Yeah. Yeah. All right. We got a listener question here. Madison May asks.

There are some great cars in the show like Peyton's Comet or even Julian's truck in season eight. If you had to pick one of the character's cars to drive in her life, which one would you choose? I mean, that comet's great, but it's a boat that thing's going to be hard to park. What was Clay have a Porsche? What was the green car? Clay had that beautiful vintage Corvette. The old stingray that I was going to say that would be my pick.

And then I thought, yeah, but how often does that thing break down? Like Julian's truck might actually be the most practical vintage car we had on our show. I can't remember it, though. What color was it? What did it look like? Silver. Your car was that beautiful, like, gunmetal silver with the red interior. I know all the old cars.

How was it to drive, Rob? It was fast. It was great. I was going to say I would go Julian's truck because that car was tight. What color was the truck? Oh, the truck was black. Yeah. It was a black truck.

Big black pickup truck. Oh, yeah, that's a great car. Yeah, I think that would be my practical pick. Rob, you too? Yeah, yeah. The whatever stingray, is that what it was called? So, yeah, it was beautiful. But, I mean, like, it was small.

broke the glove box handles like it was you know what I mean it's more of an antique it's not like a car in my mind it's like a forest green in my mind no it was it was gun metal silver yeah yeah I believe you strange okay we got any honorable mentions honorable mentions let's see what some of my notes here I mean did grubbs sing in this or was it the last one that he sang in he did he wrote that last song for the album and then he put uh I loved the shot this might have actually be my honorable mention just as a technical the shot of him leaving the recording studio and you can see a blurry piece of paper in the foreground and then they rack and it's tour one london i was like oh that's that's very nice i liked i liked the decision i liked the way they did it it was it was a

beautiful little moment i would say my honorable mention is when nathan has the option to either give, it's Nathan and Haley sitting on the couch and Haley's like, you want to go give him the talk? And Nathan says, uh, or I could just play, I could give him the new Gears of War video game. I'm going to do that. Which I laugh because as a nerd gamer, I happen

to know that is one of the most violent games where it's like you're either shooting people or sawing that. I mean, they're like monsters. Like, yeah, like big guys, but like you're literally chainsawing bad guys in half and I just laughed going, I love that he avoided having

potentially uncomfortable conversation with his son and instead exposed him to massive violence after he's already looked at porn on the internet so we're just doing great as parents it's really excellent

dad of the year oh gosh well I guess my honorable mention will also be for Nathan and Haley but it's more about just where their relationship's at right now this is like top quality marriage material when you watch two partners

who are just showing up for each other and encouraging each other and holding on, holding space, the way Nathan, I mean, I guess if I had to give it to one, I would say to Nathan for the way he's been taking care of Haley and handling this whole situation. It was really, really excellent. So, yeah, I'm just, this is top form Nathan and Haley for me right now. Yeah, I absolutely agree. It's fun. It's really fun to watch you guys in this. And I like, I like seeing two parents who go, oh my God, we thought we'd be good at this. We have no idea what we're doing. How do we buy some time? Like, it's so real. Like, 25 years old. This is how old they're supposed to be.

25. I think James actually maybe was. But when you think about it now in our 40s, so we look back and we're like, what? What were we doing? I would not have had that maturity. I didn't. I didn't at 25.

Everybody nailed it, honestly. It may look different, but Native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for hundreds of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Teller Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first name. native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story,

along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. All right, we're spinning a wheel. We didn't even spin a wheel in the last episode, guys. We didn't.

We got so caught up. Okay, we have to make this one doubly good. Most likely to? Oh, this is unfair on our show. Oh, most likely to win a karaoke competition. I mean, half of our cast. Yeah.

There's a lot of musical talent. Come on. You, Grubbs, Kate, Tyler, Jana. Every musician that has come in on the show. I mean, how many bands that came in. Yeah, Jana. I mean, oh, good grief. Hillary's got a great singing voice, too.

I don't know. That's true. What are we going to do? We're going to have a battle of the One Tree Hill voices. I don't know, guys. And it depends on the song. You know, everybody's got a different genre. genre that they're good at.

I feel like I'm going to give my karaoke award to like Lee Norris because I just think we would all be taking it too seriously and trying to like really perform and he would just get up there and crush it and give. Actually, Rob, you probably would too. Yeah, agreed. I am tone deaf, but I pour my heart and soul into every performance. Okay, then you're getting my karaoke vote. I'm I'm co-signing with joy.

It's Rob. It's for it's in the spirit of the performance. Yes. That means the world to me, guys. Thank you. You're welcome. And thank you for listening, listeners. Thank you all so much.

We will see you next week for season eight, episode two. I can't see you. But I know you're there. Oh, boy. So scary. Maybe it's because we're all going to finally discover that Clay and Quinn have been shot. What? We really have left you guys hanging.

it makes me uncomfortable. So, so much. Also, the shot that they come back to of you on the floor after Nathan leaves your house, and it's you guys on the floor. And the blood on the door has not dried yet. And it's been a day, right? I mean, nighttime. So, I mean, listen, it should be dried.

It should be dried. It's fine. You know what? I don't need to say it. Why do I need to say it? It's fine. Everybody's doing a great job. Everyone's doing great.

Why do I need to point out the tiny little, this is where I need my friends. You guys have to jump in and be like, Joy, don't worry about it. It doesn't matter. Joy, you're doing it again, Joy. You're doing it again. Oh, sorry. Well, guys, that's sort of what our podcast is. Next week, we're going to do it again all over again.

Bye, everybody. Love you all. Hey, thanks for listening. Don't forget to leave us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram at Drama Queen's O-TH. Or email us at Dramaquins at iHeartRadio.com. See you next time. all about that high school drama girl drama girl all about them high school queens we'll take you

for a ride and our comic girl cheering for the right team drama queens drama queens smart girl rough girl fashion but you're tough girl you could sit with us girl drama queen drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens it may look different but native culture is alive my name is Nicole Garcia and on burn sage burn bridges we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

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