Drama Queens - "Sexy Chicken Soup For The Soul" with Shantel VanSanten and Lindsey McKeon • EP 718

Episode Date: November 18, 2024

 The James sisters are reunited and it feels SO good! Joy welcomes her on screen sisters Shantel VanSanten & Lindsey McKeon to discuss how differently they each grieved their TV mom’s passing. Shantel shares how her real life had an emotional parallel to this episode. Rob has a hot take on Clay's new stalker.  And if you ever had a question about who was the favorite James sister, the Queens give you their vote! See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. It may look different, but native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

First of all, you don't know me. We're all about that high school, drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride and our comic girl, cheering for the right team. Drama queens, drama queens, smart girl, rough girl, fashion but you'll tough girl, you could sit with us, girl. Drama queen, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens. All right, everybody. I'm just going to jump in and steal this intro because I am particularly excited about today's episode. We have, dare I say, a Drama Queen's exclusive.

Never been done. Might never be done again. So if you're listening, well done. You're here for a great one. Because today we have not one, not two, but three of the James sisters. That's right. We have Taylor, aka Lindsay McKeon. We have Quinn, aka Chantal.

Van Santon, aka Van Scranton, and we have Haley, aka Bethany Joy Lens. And of course, you have myself, Hillary, Burton, Morgan. Ladies, welcome to the show. Thanks. Thanks for coming, you guys. So happy to see you. So good to be here with all of us. We made it happen. It's only been like two or three years, right? Not so much the same. Having you all at the same,

It's like the Olympics. We get it once every four years. We're excited it's here and it's gone too soon. I'm so glad you're finally here, Chantal, in particular, because we've had Lindsay, but we've talked with, I've had conversations with so many people who are like, oh, even Austin was saying, like, gosh, the drama queen's been going on for so long,

and they haven't invited me on the show. I wonder what's going on. I hope they're not mad at me. And then we're like, oh, no, wait, you literally just, your character's not on the show yet. So it hasn't happened. I'm so glad we finally reached. the Chantel season where you're here.

Yay. I love it. It's so funny because I'll sit back. I'm like, I wonder what's going to be like the introduction? Is it going to be like Clay and Quinn's first kiss? Is it like, which was Sophia directed. You know what I mean? I'm like, and then it was like, can you come because your mom's dying and you're like,

oh, gut punch. At least it wasn't the divorce that happened like, you know, 17, 16 episodes ago within one season. Yeah. Well, I thought this was great because all three of us really got, I mean, aside from the episode where we were fighting in the pool, which was, you know, there was a lot to say about that episode. We had a lot of work to do. And it was certainly fun to play with you guys. But this felt really poignant and meaningful. And I certainly hear more comments than anything about this episode from fans. And I don't know about you guys, but when people come up to me, I get a lot of Nathan and Haley, but the one consistent thing that I hear is when you guys did the storyline where your mom died, I was going through A, B, and C in my life, and it made a huge impact on me and thank you. And so this felt like the right time to have us all together. I love hearing that. That's like probably the favorite thing about being an actor. There's not too many anymore. But that is one of the best things to hear.

jump into it. Joy, do you want to give the rundown of the episode? I would love to do, thank you. Yes, so this is Season 7, Episode 18. The last day of our acquaintance air date February 22nd, 2010. As Brooke angrily deals

with Alex's trist with Julian, Lydia's condition worsens, prompting Quinn and Haley to try and reconnect with Taylor. Clay is forced to deal with Katie's unsettling advances and were they unsettling? And Nathan helps Jamie come to terms with Lydia's impending death.

This was written by our dear friend Mike Daniels. Mike D. Oh, I love Mike. And he did such a great job writing this episode and combining the sort of tenderness with also the necessary comedy and the other storylines. I mean, that's a hard blend to do. But you can always rely on Mike. When we got done, I watched it last night. I'm in Texas with, I actually watched it with my.

mom. And it was the first episode I've ever watched with my family, my mom, and I got to watch it together. But when we got done, she said, oh, there was a lot of sexy time as well mixed in with grief. I said, so we'll call it sexy chicken soup for the soul. I was like, we're going to rename the episode. That's cute. I love that. Oh, I love that you watched it with your mom. That's really sweet. It just happened to be this way and I thought it was very, yeah, like, poignant and perfect to watch it with Mother. Yeah. For both of you, Lindsay, have you watched the show at all since we wrapped? No. I mean, honestly, I've never watched it fully. Um, anyways, but this, I didn't remember so much of this. I remember the emotions of being in the scene. I watched it

with my husband last night and he's like, are you getting emotional? I'm like, yeah, because it's, I was emotional in the scene. It's bringing up that same feeling. Yeah. But yeah, it's surprising watching it. Like, Tim, it's such a different era one. And, you know, where we all were in our lives at that time is probably like a very different space to go back to and have memories of that.

Yeah. So, yeah, all of that is kind of wild. And then to see it and be like, oh wow like there's a lot of crazy this is like crazy female storylines there's a lot of exposure as your mother said um and like how many times did taylor come into a scene with her boobs out and a robe on and i was it's just it's wild to see it's just wild to see and and be 42 now and have such a different perspective on life and bodies and all of the things yeah yeah i like that um i i

realized in this episode Alexander really just was brought in to serve as this boy toy character just to serve as this he's like a facilitator

for women's it was like a catiness or something I couldn't quite figure out what the point was it just felt like

he's here to make to give Alex and Victoria and Brooke a reason to be catty it was just

So strange. He didn't have any other real function so far. Maybe it gets better. But I mean, I liked him at the end with Daphne. That was fun. Yeah. It was funny to see her just like full makeout in the middle of the street. Also, like a slap by an icon just hits different. And that scene I love because when she slapped, it was just better. You know? There was just there. And so the slap and the kiss Oh yeah It's so it's so dynasty It's so old movie It's so good Am I in an episode of Melrose Place What's happening?

That's what it felt like I mean before we dive too deep into our stuff Which it gets so, you know It can get so heavy And there's so many things to talk about Behind the scenes of how this episode went But can we talk about Brooke and Daphne On the floor

Talking that those shots were great It was really fun to see them doing something other than anything in our episode where it's not talking heads people just standing there talking to each other I love but this was this is good this is a long time coming the final revelation of brook's love for julian and and they're coming back together and the punch with Alex and all of it I thought it was fun the slap the punch that it was so good also that it was this interesting thing happening where as you all were losing your mom, we were watching Brooke get her mom back. So that's that scene. I didn't notice it until the close over bro's scene

where she sits down with her. And she's like, obviously Victoria has always kind of just been like Victoria who's just all about herself and she's cutting this season we've seen her start to soften. But that moment in particular I thought like, oh, how interesting. It's like they're losing the mom that they've always had and Brooke is finally getting back the mom that she never had. Yeah. That's a good take on it. Mike Daniels, man. Yeah, you can always count on Mike.

Also, Janet has that great line after Cilf's punched her and Brooke goes to Alex's hotel room and Alex opens the door and Brooke goes, oh my God, because she sees the black eye and she goes, yeah, I didn't know your own strength, did you bam, bam? That was cute. That was good.

I think it's funny how you guys never I don't know if you crossed paths for a long time the Quinn and Taylor and Brooke characters were always on in Clay too

other than Quinn and Clay but like you guys were no I mean Clay was there for you were there for the whole Taylor reveal with Quinn's husband right were you in that episode

Oh the awkward dinner table makeout scene for sure yeah that's right super fun I think I missed that episode so I don't I didn't remember They made you guys look like sociopaths for a couple of episodes there. That was crazy.

It got way weird, man. So weird. No, I mean, we really were only, like Quinn was really only intertwined in the story with family and then Clay, you know. Yeah, it took a while before everybody really started integrating. But I think that's good. I guess that's part of when you're renewing a show and you've got a new cast and you're doing new storylines and new things.

it's better to draw things out a little bit. This is my first time. I remember having the one-on-one scene with you, Chantel, too. And really enjoying that because that was the first time we got to actually work together, you know? Yeah, where I so remember doing that scene as well and being like, gosh, this is so bizarre. Like we have, we're sisters, we're supposed to have this history.

And you're like, hi, nice to meet you. I'm your sister. Okay, okay, let's do this scene that's like, charged with all this history and stuff and you know that's where your traumatic family toolbox comes in and helps out but um but it's always like that you know you're like it's you'll do a movie and like the first day they're like okay sex scene is up first day you guys go you know how it is but it was so beautiful the just the dynamic you know Lindsay that you brought um because they had shown, you know, Haley and Quinn and, like, the bond that they had. And then, you know,

you always have to have the, the sibling that, like, throws a rift. But I felt, but it wasn't just you coming in and being, you know, a selfish or whatever we say. It really, like, you can see your pain. You can see where it comes from. And that, you know, the beautiful scene you had with our mom where you were like in her hospital room alone and all of the things that were underneath the surface that came out in that scene where you just feel like you don't belong and you know you're not the good child and all of these things that you were so wrong about that you held on to that story and you start to empathize I mean you know you're not some evil villain who just sleeps with our men you know you're somebody who's in pain and and a real

you know, complex human. And you just did such a beautiful job of, of all of it that, you know, I felt her. And I was like, oh, she's my favorite siblings. Oh, hey. I love the, like doing this show and doing supernatural where these shows go on for years and there's like an arc of my character. And each time I come back, I'm in different stages of my life. And I feel like the ending of these shows is, Like, this was Taylor's redemption. Like, this was me getting to come back. And you get to see the Taylor's actually a human, you know? She's not just an evil, horrible.

And how great that you had that moment with Lydia, where it's just the two of you. And Lydia says to Taylor, she's like, you are the most like me. Yeah. I was a whole different person before I was Lydia the mom. And I thought that was, it was just so smart and so lovely. Why'd you hide that from us, mom? Why'd you wait so long and tell her? Played the good girl all these years.

Because Taylor never went home. She was never around long enough for mom to tell her. That's why. Zane, got I get me. But yeah, Lindsay, your stuff was so great and to finally see you soften. Because, yeah, I mean, like, your whole thing this far has been like, her uniform is booty shorts. Her one speed is bitchy.

You know, and so it was so nice to get to see, like, a talented actor go more and do, you know, do deeper, do softer. And it was just such, I think, a great, you know, reveal for the audience to see, like, oh, there you are. Like, that's the person who's in pain. And Chantelle, we were talking about this last week. You do such a great job of being on the verge of emotion, which is such a tricky thing to do. But where it's like, it's such a powerful tool, though, because I think it really pulls the, audience in, you know, because it's like, oh, it's like there's some, there's more power to someone fighting back their tears than there is to someone pushing them. And we were having

this conversation last week about how you do that so well. But yeah, like your stuff was fantastic. Joy, your stuff was great. And what I liked about it was all three of you were kind of different levels of grieving. Like you each had your own flavor and all of it was relatable. Yeah. So it's like, I think for anyone watching, they can find themselves in one of the three of you at any given point. I think that's probably why this is the storyline that gets the most feedback on my end anyway because no matter what part of the grief journey you're in and whether you're losing a parent or a sibling or just going through a time when you're even even the loss of a relationship can you know is a death in many ways and I think people

just connected with that and the different the different ways that you process grief and try and find your way through. I totally agree, Chantelle. Yeah, neither of you guys were here when we, you don't hear what we say about you behind your back and all the lovely things that we say about you. But it's true, yeah, Chantel, the sense of holding everything in and the way that you,

there's a fragility to you that has a strength, like a spine of strength, the way that you are able to stand, experience what you're experiencing. You're so solid, but it's like I want to reach out and give you a hug because it seems like you might collapse at any moment. And yet, I have no doubt that Quinn is 100% going to be okay, whether somebody's there to catch her or not. And it's a really interesting dynamic to see. Lindsay, we were saying a couple weeks ago, especially with that episode where

the one was it the one before this Rob where Lydia tells us that she's got cancer or was it two before

this? One before this I think right? This is a very quick storyline. Like we're going

through the photos in the living room right? Yeah. Oh but it's at the end of that episode. Is this where

we're packing like we're in the room and I'm packing? I remember doing the scene with you. I do too. I don't remember if that's the one

I directed or if it was before that but um you are a firework it's like i never you never know when lindsay's going to go off on camera and it's so exciting like i never know what to expect from you and it always made it so fun to work with you too because it's the unpredictability was so exciting as an actor um and as an audience member now to be so removed from it and watch you on camera and be like what what what is she going to do next. I have no idea if you're going to laugh, if you're going to cry, if you're going to hit somebody, if you're going to hit yourself. I don't know if you're going to run out of the scene.

I don't know if you're just like stop everything and calm down. Like I have no idea what to expect at any given moment. It makes it so fun to watch you. Yeah. Yeah, it's true. And I felt that way in the scene between you guys and when you walked in the room with Bess and her hospital bed and I mean, Bess Armstrong, like what an actress. Oh, yeah. I cried a lot. watching this back guys this is a rough one she's she's a she's a force but everything she says just like cuts it's so clear when she speaks you know there's no fluff there's no um she doesn't put a whole lot and i don't know how to explain it's like she doesn't put a whole lot of her emotion through it she's just like this is what i need to say i need you to get it you know and yeah like we were so lucky to to have

her and I remember looking at her and she eerily looks very similar to my mother. And I had this time my mom last night sitting there. I was like, mom, you guys look. My mom has like short blonde hair, like similar. She does. So crazy how similar they look. Chantelle, I never noticed that. You're absolutely right. It was really, I remember at the time being like, wow, this is really freaky. Like, did they look at picture? Do they? And you know, you were like, no, these were our parents. all along and I'm like it's so crazy um you know I want to I want to share a small interesting anecdote you know you you talk about like kind of holding that that thread of like fragility but um I found out the scene where Bess and I are in again I don't know remember if it was

one or two episodes back but we're in the space that she rents for Quinn to have a gallery I took a phone call from my mother that night and while we were shooting it and found out that my grandmother had breast cancer. So while we were going through, and my grandmother was such a warrior and fought it and survived. But it was such a bizarre timing of things, of course,

which I find throughout my career, things like that happen where, you know, you're like, this just could not be happening at a worse time, but then that's kind of the through line of what I'm watching, for me, this 23-year-old version of myself going through and grappling with as we're doing an episode where our mother's dying. And I'm wondering if my grandmother, who is like my second mother, you know, is going to die. And what is this going to be like and what our goodbyes like and um you know what is the big C word like and um it's just it's it's really crazy the way that sometimes life parallels what our characters are going through

and nobody knew about it it may look different but native culture is very alive my name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aimed to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for hundreds of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Teller Ornelis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner

in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we explore her story. along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Did shooting this episode help you process grief or did it feel false and strange? Like I'm crying about something that's not real, but there is something that is real going on. But how do I, like you're having to muster emotions maybe when you're not wanting to or you're feeling okay and you, like, how does you manage that? I just remember, I had never had a significant death. Like a mother, my grandmother, you know, passed 10 years ago now, but from lung cancer. But at the time, it was like the biggest shock. And I think I felt a bit like a zombie doing this episode and a bit like out of my own body and not understanding and not really being able to process and grieve what it would even be like.

and I think about the other parallel of when my grandmother did die and my last conversation I got to have with her and it's nothing like you know what this episode is but you know I had to just go with it but it felt a little bit more out of body and not actually real and this isn't what would happen and a bit like I just wanted to be removed and more have the scenes with my sisters because that felt like an anchor for me rather than the reality of what was actually happening, you know.

Such a strange thing about our job, like no matter what's going on in your personal life, death, divorce, childbirth, physical sickness, you got the flu. Yeah, like, no matter what, you got to show up at work. hit your mark on your call time. Yeah. And if you're on a show like ours, there's a lot of emotional vampirism. So there's there's coincidence like you're talking about. And then there's stuff that's literally just being mined from your life to put into the show.

Yeah. Joy and Lindsay, had you guys ever had like a significant death before we did this scene? No. No. I don't think before we did it. So my question back to you guys is what Joy said. Like how did it feel for you? did it feel false?

Did it feel like you were processing different grief? I mean, obviously, like, the scenes with you and mom and all of the things, it's, there was so much to pull on, you know, in regular life for that. But the scene where she actually died, like, I remember working with my coach at the time. And like the way she was explaining death to me and how people process it, it's, you know, it's so weird when you're actually in. like the death scene and it's not necessarily how you think it would be like a lot of people aren't like oh somebody's dying you're you're not like kicking and screaming and crying usually it's like

there's something else that washes over you that's this surreal present like almost detached like experience of like i haven't really processed this before how do you process what's actually happening you know it's a reality that everybody must face but it's a reality that everybody must face but it's It's not something usually we're dealing with every day and it's something so shocking, especially in our culture, like the American culture doesn't really know how to deal with grief and death in like a beautiful integrated way in our culture. So it's something that's always a little bit like surreal and we're afraid of and we don't fully understand, you know. That's so beautifully said. I thought there was a really good moment of that with Haley and Lydia when it was just the two of you in the. the hospital room and you have this moment where you realize oh and you say you're talking about

her soup and you say i don't even have the recipe and that was such an interesting glimpse because obviously like it's just you realizing like the impermanence of everything about how it's all about to be gone and then the next little snippet where she's writing it down and all you're doing is just watching her like you could see the shift that was one of those moments where you were like oh oh god this is what this is what this means and then when you give it back to your son like at the end when you're like oh this is up to me now i carry this torch forward like those were very real moments of like what happens when you realize somebody's going to be gone and how do you move forward and what do you bring of them with you you know but yeah and i and i think you're right

that there's if you don't have personal experience processing personal experience processing a certain type of emotion it's one of the interesting maybe blessings of our job but to get to show up and have the opportunity to learn how to process that i mean i think that's that can be so freeing if you alleviate yourself from the pressure of i have to perform this scene i have to convey this thing that I don't know how to convey and instead lean into that. I don't know how to convey this. I haven't experienced this before. I wonder what's going to happen. And then they say action and you're like, what's going to happen? But I'm here for it. I'm here to believe the moment I'm looking at best thinking, this is my mom and she's dying. How do I feel? And you just you just

fall into it. Yeah. It's really interesting. Interesting. And Bess, to kind of going back to what Chantel said, I think Bess is, like, have you ever watched a really good athlete? And you go, this sport doesn't look so hard. That's kind of like Bess as an actor. She's so good that it looks like what she's doing is little to nothing. Yes. But that's only because she's that good.

Yeah. But I think if you were just watching this, I think a lot of people could go, I could do that role. You're not doing much. It's like, it's because she's really good. Yeah, she knows how to not do much because very often in life, there's a lot going on under the surface and not too much coming out on your face. You're not making faces. You're experiencing something.

And there's an intimacy that only someone who's up close can see what's going on behind the veil. And that's what the camera provides for us. Is that up close experience? You know, there's a quote I always loved. I didn't discover it. until, you know, not when I was 23 doing this show by a playwright Mamet. And he says, in life, there's no emotional preparation for lost, surprise, betrayal, or discovery.

And neither is there on stage. So forget the funny voices, pick up your cue, and speak out even though frightened. And I often come back to it still. Because I think, I don't have to know how to do this. I can be, you know, I can't have an. idea of how I'm going to do it because we're not prepared when we're betrayed, frightened, we have lost, we, you know, and, and it's just, you're just present and honest and truthful. And I know when my, when my grandmother actually passed shortly before, I was, I was living in a,

in the hospice with her and I had to leave to go do a job. And she was like, you have to go. This is what you're calling me. This is, you know, and gave me her grace to go. I remember sitting on the floor next to her chair, and I knew it was going to be my last conversation face-to-face. And let me tell you, I did not sleep the night before. I was like, okay, I got to ask her questions. I got to find out, you know, something about her and grandpa. I got to, you know, I was just so anxious of like, how do I tell her everything I need

to say, like, do I write? Do I? And that moment came and, man, do I remember it so clear. really, and we looked at each other and we're sobbing, of course. And all that came out of our mouth was, I love you. I was like, I just, I love you. And it's all encompassing. And we both knew. We knew the life and the bond and the memories and everything that I was, you know, going to carry forward. And it was, that was, those were the only words. We're just repeating, I love you. I love you and crying into each other's arms and I gave her a kiss and I left and I just thought, how perfect.

I could never have prepared for that. When I watched this episode back, I give myself, you know, I was saying this to Rob earlier, I give myself some grace because, you know, that 23-year-old girl was going through so much and really didn't have any idea what loss was. but me is 39 now I know I'm me and loss are best friends and nothing could prepare me for the way I think I'm going to be strong or the way I think I'm going to say things when I'm going through and the expectation I have for the moments or for myself and it's so interesting that I come back to that mammoth quote even in my own life just to be like I don't have to know

how to do this. I just have to be present and honest and in like in my heart. And that's it. That's all I can do. I wish I had, I wish we had both had this quote when we were doing the show because I like you found myself in situations where I was way in it. Like this show all of a sudden, like we signed on and they're like, great, your wife's super dead. You're going through a divorce and you're 23. I'm like, listen, I've now been through a divorce. Oh, you want to know, I had no idea what a divorce would be like, oh, thank God I didn't know because this would have, these episodes would have been real different. But how much, it would have been so freeing to know that though, right? Because back then I thought like, I would, I imposed all of this imaginary pressure on myself.

This is what grief has to look like. Tears equal sadness. You know, and that's just like the opposite way to approach being just in the moment and present. And like you said, it's like I have to remind myself just in day to day life of like, I have to. to give myself permission to be a human being. Yeah. Which means it's going to be constantly imperfect and it's going to be messy, you know, but it's like, am I trending in the right direction? Am I trending towards growth?

Great. Yeah. And all the hiccups are okay, you know? But like when I catch myself being hard on myself, it's like, hey, bud, you get to be a human being today. This is part for the course. Okay, okay. Yes. Still figuring it out.

At any age, you're still figuring it out, you know? Yeah. no more than you did yesterday, hopefully, but like none of us, I think, really kind of are going to leave this earth, like, totally exalted being like, I got that in the bag, you know, do it all over. I'd be so good at this. Those people probably haven't gone to therapy. Like, haven't looked inward if they're like, I crushed it, 10 to 10. Right. But did you? Did you ask around?

Speaking of work in progress, there was a hilarious moment. There was two very funny, unintentional moments in this episode for me, which I greatly appreciated. And speaking of just being a human and trying to learn, there was a beautiful moment when Haley's making the chicken dumpling soup back at home. It's at the top of the scene, Joy. I don't know if you caught this. You go to take a little sip of it and you're using a ladle that has a hole in it. So all of the water pours out through the hole and you just kind of like, At the edge of it.

I totally caught it. I laughed so hard going like, I know set deck had a ladle or a spoon on set. Why did we give her the one thing not designed to hold liquid? No, this was notoriously one of my constant thorn in my sides was not having a working set. There was all kinds of facade, but I would open cupboards and there would be nothing there. And it was so frustrating because I would go in for rehearsal and I might have opened the cupboard I might not have. But in the scene, I'm like, actually, if I'm over here, I'm going to make myself a mug of tea or whatever and open it up. And it was just a completely empty cupboard.

So I actually am not convinced that there was any kind of spoon on set. I think perhaps I asked for one at the last moment and that's what was available. I said, great, let's go. They were like, could you just use your hand and you're like, no. it's boiling liquid getting a spoon and this was like this is all we got it may look different but native culture is very alive my name is Nicole Garcia and on burn sage burn bridges we aim to explore that culture it was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly like very traditional it feels like Bob Dylan going electric that this is something we've been doing

for hundreds of years, you carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Teller Ornales, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The other really funny moment actually happened in the kitchen. It's when you are prior to, I think your mom passing, Yes, you are in the kitchen chopping vegetables and you're having a very hard moment. And Nathan walks in. He's like, are you okay? And you chop your thumb or your finger. And you're like, ow.

And he's like, is it bad? And you're like, yeah, it's bad. And you have like a rag over it. And then you proceed to put your hands on your face, to talk with your hands, to put your hands on your face again. And I just left going. And onions. I was chopping onions. Yes.

I just wish we could play the reality. it where there is just blood on your face. There's blood on him because you're gesticulating wildly. That killed me. I was like, all right. Yeah. And onions in my eyes. Like I put my hands immediately up to my eyes.

Like, hello. You should look like Carrie at the end of the movie. Not just gorgeous, perfectly lit, perfect hair. I know. Yeah. Fail. I watched you doing the chopping too and you were chopping like so fervently that I was like, she's going to chop her finger thinking it was.

I didn't know that that was the scene that was. about to play out, but I was like, she's actually going to drop her pink or be careful. Oh, God. Yeah, that was fun. I remember reading the episode and thinking, is this just going to be like three whaling sisters? You know what I mean? Like, that was my idea of, well, if our mom's dying, how are we even going to speak through these scenes?

Like, how are you going to mean? And, you know, it just, I find myself so. when I was watching it so like taken back instantly to those versions of us and the conversations on the side of set and all of the stories behind the scenes, you know, that play in like a separate movie the whole time I'm watching. At the very end when we were, this is so not funny, but I had to share it with my mom when we were, you were dumping Joy of the ashes and the wind was blow it. Oh my God, the ashes, guys. Mom's ashes were all over our black coats and we, and then they're like, you're crying, you're sad. And we are just like, guys, we can't, our mom is all over us.

Guys, do you also remember how full that urn was? I don't know, mom was heavy. Like, I don't mean to be crass, but like it was so, like, we kept, I remember when they said action, it was like, we're finally going to pour it. And we start report and then it's like there's more and there's more it went on and on and on to the point where I was like I either have to laugh or cry right now this is so absurd but the camera's still rolling so I'm just going to keep dumping and just become overwhelmed with the fact that this is so much more than I expected and I allowed it to make me you know cry more but objectively I wanted to laugh because it was so absurd yeah apparently she was cremated with all of her earthly

possessions. It's everything. How very Egyptian of her. When we when we talk about not being able to be prepared like that moment I was the same I was like oh gosh I've never you know what is this going to be like and it was between the wind and the amount of ashes and the fact you were still dumping like two three minutes in and it was all over us I was the same I was just like is this is this common like is this okay honked right now? It was one of those that when I watched it, I had to share the anecdote with my mom last night. And I was just like, yeah. I wonder if that's, because remember, we didn't rehearse it because we wanted to be surprised.

We wanted to, like, experience emotions. So we didn't dump any ashes on purpose. So there were rehearsal ashes in there. That's it. That's what we should have done. Some rehearsal ashes. I don't know, but that was rough. And it was, it was all over us.

And then we're like, do we cut? Do we react to the fact that? we like rush it off? Do we brush it off? Like, what do we do? Just cry on each other for more, I guess. Also, who were all those people and where were the rest of our siblings? Do you remember?

Like, they were like, okay, so like these three people are going to stand behind you, like, we'll assume these are kind of like your brothers. Yeah, that's right. I never understood, you know, the order of when we were born, how many siblings we had, parents were. Yeah. I would have been a senior when you were in high school, so then people will bring it up to me. Like, well, why didn't they show you? I was like, because I wasn't on the show that. But, you know, there's all of that. They were like, so we'll cluster some people behind you. Just choosing some of our background extras is like, and what? These people are, oh, hi, sibling,

you know, but we're not going to interact with them. We'll only interact with each other. All last minute. Whatever we paid for landslide. was worth it oh my goodness i gotta say that's one thing this show consistently knocks out of the park is the score it's just it's so good and then i think there's a shenaya twain son that played after that that was Cheryl crow Cheryl crow thank you now oh yeah i think i actually recorded that i might be mixing up memories but i i know i recorded it i think they asked me to record that song for this episode in case they couldn't afford the Cheryl Crow version. I feel like I vaguely remember that story.

And then they did end up getting Cheryl's version of it, which is great. But I was also kind of like, oh, God, I want to do my version of it. Yeah. How lucky they are that they just had you on the bench that they could go, yeah. You were someone's plan B, like, how fortunate for the producers that they had you in the back pocket to be like, yeah, you can cover us. Rob, why didn't they ask you? It's this weird thing.

I wondered the same thing, and then I remembered I am absolutely tone deaf. So it's either that or my availability was just not great back then. Yeah. There was another song, too. There was a song, is it open your eyes? I forget, is it, maybe it's Trent Dabbs. I forget who sings it. But I remember at the time discovering that song and hearing that it was going to be in the

episode and listening to it before we shot the scene where our mother actually, actually like passes. Oh, and that was like just a stab in the stomach to like hear over and over open your eyes because she was. Yeah. Do that and just like the thoughts. How beautiful this thing that Mike wrote in of Jamie bringing in his solar system stars. Oh, that just broke my heart. It was so beautiful. Well, about the make a wish. You know, he's like, I have grandma to thank for that because she told me to make a wish. Now when he brought that in full circle, it was so nice. Yep. So great. Just like the honest kid moment of, you know, him being able to like tell that she's sick and she's going to die and just there isn't like, you know, this breakdown of like an adult understanding of, you know, how it's going to change his life. But just that scene where he's like, she's going to die, you know, and there's like this gravity to it that a kid brings that is so honest and raw. And. you know, then there's still this beautiful, hope-filled moment where he brings it in.

It's like, make the wish, Grandma, like being able to give her what she gave him. You know, that was so, it was so special. Our show was good at that, bringing things around full circle, remembering things from a long time ago. I mean, even what you were saying earlier about the Taylor storyline, like, Lindsay, when you came in in the beginning, I mean, was it season two that you first came in? I want to say it was two. I think so. I feel like it was. Yeah, because I had just gotten married. Right? Yeah, I think so. But to see that arc all the way through and to watch this redemption arc, it's just so interesting. It's so interesting the choices you made and that they really allowed you to run with that too. I feel like I love that. I feel like they just gave you space. Like here's your lines. Just we trust you. Just go. Yeah. I was so, yeah. I mean, that's such a beautiful thing that they didn't like, you know, with this arc, didn't just pigeonhole Taylor and actually just wanted to see her experience

and emotion and human side. It was so interesting to me the roles that each of us played and the way that you got to just back off and say, I don't want to deal with this. No, I can't believe you're first. I can't believe you're giving up and I'm not going to engage with this. I'm not going to enable you in this giving up of life, I refuse, um, and how that actually turned out to be just an indicator of your own pain. Um, I wanted to see a whole movie of it. Like, it was, it's such an interesting character arc. Um, was that fun for you to be able to come in and every single time, I feel like there was something new because you were always so good at creating layers underneath what was on top. Like, you,

Yeah, Taylor's speed is bitchy, but there was so many layers, there were so many layers of pain underneath it. Like, how did you manage that all the time? How did you manage for us to still love you and want you back and still, like, be interested in this girl and all of her issues and relate to Taylor and yet also be on the surface just crazy and bitchy? That is very sweet of you to say all of that. I think there's just, you know, I always, no matter where I was, and I always, no matter where I was,

life or my career, I just always tried to be as like true as possible and bring all of the layers of me as much as I could access anyway at that time and space. But I think joy, honestly, it's just like the levels and layers of pain in my own life experience and, you know, wanting to get to feel that and excavate that as an actress too was one of the reasons I I liked being an actress. It's like if I have a hard time experiencing this in my life or this is under the surface but it's not healed and I get to play a character that also brings that out. It's a it's a cathartic experience. That's such a gift though because it's not always the case.

I think there's a lot of actors that put on a mask and they go play a character because they're trying to actually escape from whatever their current pain is or the thing that they're trying to process through. So it's a real gift that you have and that you give to the audience to be able to allow people to see in. It's almost permission to process their own pain too. Like you're doing, wherever you are in life, don't shove it down in order to perform and put something else on. Just use it. Like, let's keep working through it. Yeah. I mean, I think that's what we're taught so much in life in our culture is to just shove it down.

you know like you don't really have that emotion like get to work like just live your life um but on a healing journey and if you're a spiritual person which i am it's like what is life actually for what's the deeper meaning who am i as i'm here what am i learning how am i growing um and as much as everything in us wants to escape and run away and hide like one that doesn't help you always have to deal with your shit either now or at a later date so like why don't you man woman up and do it um but also it's just like what you know what is my own legacy for me as I'm here you know and to me as I've gone through everything in life it's not just like making money being an actor doing this doing that it's like it's what is my essence

what what do I get to take with me what do these molecules get to take with me when I transition out of my body, you know, and I used acting to do that. I use my life to do that in relationship. It makes it very difficult sometimes for the people around me. Unfortunately, it's not an easy journey and it's not one that everybody wants to take on, but this is my, you know, life mission as I'm here. So thank you for seeing and acknowledge. And also, messy is fun to watch. People who have it all together are boring. Yes. It's so. the shelf life of someone who has all of their ducks in a row is very short whereas i think as a viewer we are drawn to messiness i think because we relate to it we see ourselves in it and it's also

just more interesting so that was i thought very appealing the way that sort of your trajectory was over this last bit and also and this is just a testament sort of how you you played taylor there is there was always sort of it was kind of touched upon i think joy called you a firework there was always an unpredictability. And the only other character on the show who has a similar kind of vibe is Dan Scott. And that when Dan Scott comes on a scene, I'm like, oh, shit, what's about to happen? And it was the same thing. Like, you'd come on the screen. I'd be like, oh, shh, Hurricane Taylor, what are we about to get into? And then you're like, French and Quinn's X at the dinner table. I'm like, damn, I did not see that come. You know what I mean? It was great just because the character

was already written so big that I think you just, you wisely went like, well, that I'm not. I'm going to take big swings and I'm just going to let them pull me back. And it made for this really fun experience of watching her as being like, I'm going to lean in because I want to know what she's going to do next. Well, it was so fun for me because, you know, so often you don't get to play in all of that and like do all of these quote unquote wrong, bad, extreme things. And like Taylor lived in that space. And so for me to get to go in and play like the different levels of that,

How fun. I mean, that's the very beginning. I'm like, she's my favorite sister because you ground her emotions in something that me as my, you know, 39-year-old self. I understand. I see the pain. I see, you know, where things are coming from. But your reactions to it, you know, while they may be big and firework, you ground it so

beautifully. It's so funny because I, at the time when we were shooting, was like, oh, I'm just supposed to hate her. And like, she's bitchy. And so we're bitchy. And you know what I mean? Like that was the dynamic of me not, I don't have me and my sister are best friends. So, you know, I didn't have that experience or understanding of that with a sister.

And so I just kind of leaned in on like, well, whatever, you know, Quinn thinks, like she's not going to try to understand her. But it was such a different experience watching it, you know, and seeing you and being like, wow, this is stellar. Like, this is so cool that I know and I can see everything under the surface, even if your reactions are this. You know, it's like, I know what, I know what this really is about. So it was, it was really beautiful. And I think that that kind of speaks to where we were at in life versus like where we are now. And I think it is a much younger, I would say less experienced, perhaps immature approach just to be able to label someone with one word. That person's a bitch.

Yeah. And then you get older and you have some life experience and you're like, there's a lot more to that story. Oh, yeah. Yeah. That is symptomatic of a whole different thing going on, you know. So it's kind of funny that like back then when we were playing it, it was like, oh, yeah, that's just who she is. And now as adults, we're like, no, it's not. No, it's not. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia. And on burn. Sage, Burned Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for hundreds of years.

You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Teller Ornelis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world,

influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Chantelle, do you remember what happens for Quinn after this, like in the next few episodes, how the grief kind of like, I mean, is she immediately just take, oh, Rob's laughing. Is this because the whole Katie thing? Yes, 100% that's why I'm laughing, yeah. We don't get to grieve. We just go down a rabbit hole of cats.

Either way, how have we not talked about the fact that in between all of this, Clay is off and this is, I didn't realize this was the birth. of the Katie story. Oh, yeah. I was like, I was kind of shocked a little bit about it. It was like, oh my gosh. Like, this is where it started. And then so like we, that was a totally different tangent. I don't even, I don't even remember having an episode, not that I would remember all

of it, where Quinn is still breathing, you know, I feel like we're just dumped into the next tumble dryer of drama. I know for sure you don't grieve in 719 because it's your gallery opening. So the entire focus is the gallery opening. That's the next episode? That's the next one, yeah. Oh my gosh. So I don't, I mean, I think maybe at one point it's like, we think we may be offhandedly say like,

your mom would have loved this or something. We must be, yes, of course. It's in honor of her. Everything else just kind of moves, moves forward. Yeah, this Katie stuff happened so much fast. The fact that she was in the second scene of the episode was really, with this random roommate who we never see again, it was very strange. I don't know. I don't like this storyline that's coming.

I don't like it. No, it's, I will also tell you I don't like it either. I remember when they said, you're going to have a stalker. And I was like, cool. Yeah. That's a fun reversal. the guy's going to get stopped for a change let's do it you know who are you getting and they're like great news we we got her back Amanda shul's coming back and like wait what like but don't worry

we're going to put her in a wig for an episode for an episode then she'll dye her hair I mean it was like okay guys it's it's just odd to me again it's that she like she's being scouted by agents which means she is clearly playing at a pretty high level and she's She meets this guy and somehow goes straight up cuckoo for cocoa puffs and just decides like, this is my new everything. I agree with you, Joy, the roommate was weird. I think it would have been more effective if she was just talking to herself. It would have explained this craziness. Exactly.

Exactly. Because do we ever see this girl again? Well, she, in 719, here's the funny thing. In 719, she talks to her in the room again, but we don't even see her. Oh, so much. I mean, I'd rather her at least just be crazy right off. the bat because otherwise now she's got this person in her life who's enabling her crazy and then we never addressed that which is strange and then like the roommates should have been

like eating paint chips so you'd go like they're both clearly crazy right oh my lord you know but um and the the funniest thing was that at the end of the episode after she has researched clay and apparently even though there was zero people at sarah's funeral there is a facebook page about her memorial where people are like miss you girl rip queen you know and she's found that she's dyed her hair and then like it's not already so obvious we just brought the same actress back she turns to the roommate who and she goes like plus i have a feeling and she takes off the towel reveals amanda shul's hair i'm his type and then she kind of is in the exact same pose and does the same smile that's on the computer and then the camera as if it's not wildly clear to

everyone in the audience, the camera pans to the computer like, see, don't they look alike? Yes. It's like hat on a hat. What are we doing, guys? By the way, she's looking at a picture of herself as her, you know what I mean? She's like, we're just the same. Like, really? Also, she had no moment of going, holy cow, I look exactly like his, like she didn't balk at the fact that she might actually have an identical twin in the world.

This was so badly done. I'm sorry. The fact that they could have, like, if they're going to do this for real, first of all, why not draw it out? Why not have her seem like a normal, a normal girl? Maybe actually die Amanda's hair brown. Like, is it that hard? Can you not do like a rinse?

Anyway, if they had to have Amanda back, could she not have had an accent or like a completely different personality, maybe, some kind of something that they could have let her explore a different side of her acting abilities, that she's clearly so. You know, she's so talented. And then, why couldn't it have been a real slow burn? Like, when you meet somebody who's a little off their rocker, you don't always notice it right away. You kind of think, like, this person's fun, or they're a little wild.

You just get, like, little clues here and there. And then eventually, maybe, like, six episodes in, she dyes her hair. And like, oh, my God, that's right. Oh, I'm so sorry. I didn't mean to, this is freaking you out. I can dye my hair back. I really didn't mean to freak you out. Oh, my God, I'm so embarrassed.

This is terrible. Like, slow, make it creepy. Where's the Hitchcock of it all? Where's the vertigo? Well, that would require self-awareness, which clearly she has absolutely none. She traded that in for more cuckoo. And there's a scene when we first reveal her and she turns around the tennis court. There's the shot when we cut back to Clay of him reacting.

And I remember just, that was just Rob reacting to what was happening on the show. Like, holy shit, we're actually doing this right now. Here we go. Okay. And then the fact that like, you know what would have made more sense is that Clay is just so caught off guard that he allows some sort of a romantic brief moment to happen. Like if there was anything that justified giving her a crumb. Yeah. Because the thing that's weird is Clay is nothing but professional.

He calls her, he meets her in public to have a meeting. He quickly, whether he was really interested or not, doesn't matter. he quickly just goes, hey, I'm not your guy. Sorry. She offers him a number. He goes, first of all, he should have to say, I have a girlfriend. Shame on you, Clay, but whatever. But then she offers the number.

And he's like, ain't going to happen, sister. I'm good. So it's odd. Like, how do you just taking the number? Maybe had you just taken the number and been like, uh, yeah, okay, I'll deal with this later. You know what I mean? Yeah. And all she knows is like Clay's cute and he drives a nice car and she's like, that's enough for me to

throw my whole life away. I'm in. We're getting married. And it's not how women are? I mean, on this show occasionally, and also the fact that, because this is one of those ones where it's like the movie Home Alone, like if you've seen the people redo it where like it's home alone, but Kevin just picks up the phone and like calls the hotel and calls his mom and it's like the movie's over in 35 seconds, you know, this is one where it's like, I don't understand why Clay didn't go back to Quinn and absolutely download. Like, holy shit, babe, you're never going to believe this. Can I show you a picture? Like, the fact, the part that I bump on and it gets much worse in 719 is that Clay treats it as if something inappropriate or untoward has happened. And to the point where she shows up at the gallery and buys a picture of Clay and Quinn goes, hey, Clay, I want to introduce you to the girl.

I'm going to have to share you with. And Clay walks up and pretends like he hasn't met her. I need to watch 719. I don't remember she came to the gallery. And Quinn doesn't recognize her. Like Quinn hasn't poured over photos of Clay's dead ex-wife. Yeah. No one has a moment of going, like Quinn should have 100% gone like, what the hell?

Who is that? And then like Clay grabs you by the arm and he's like, what are you doing here? I told you. Like the way you would talk to a mistress. So it's like buddy. It's so bad, guys. It's so bad. So, Joe, you asked if I was grieving.

Obviously, I'm in such deep grief about my mother. I don't recognize this woman looks like his dad. Am I just, I can't, I can't. I think we need to come up with the drinking game for the next, for this whole storyline. There has to be something for this Katie storyline that we can all take shots every time it happens. We're going to figure it out. This goes into like next season, doesn't it? I just remember walking on set that day.

You guys were in some kind of hurricane and the houses, but you were like trying to escape her in the house and the rain. But we were shooting on set. So it was like inside the studio. And I watched it for probably. a half an hour and was like this shit is so crazy I got to go what's going on. She like locks me in the house and hunts me down. It's like a whole thing

she tries to kill me. We shot outside. We shot at the pool and the stage. But I feel like I don't know. I have to look. I wouldn't really not know. But I feel like this goes into something happens like my revenge happens like in season eight. Jeez.

That's that long? Well I know that yeah, I think I remember how the season ends for Clay and twin. Well, yeah, I remember how it ends too. But then there's like, I come back and like avenge us in eight with her. Nice. I don't remember that at all. Chantelle, did you and Amanda have fun? Yeah, we did. I mean, of course, you know, like we had, um, I mean, Amanda's just great. You know, we've seen her like in subsequent years and stuff. And it really was, I mean, it's difficult, I think, to play any villain. And she's actually just such a little.

lovely human being that in the hell we're going to do this one but a lot of the stuff was so intense with her and i like you know once we like actually realize what she's doing um and she's she's great you know i felt um lucky to like get to do such intense stuff with somebody that we had fun with that's good yeah katie's one of those roles you have to go all in on and you can't you can't hedge or worry about the way you look, you know, you just have to go go full psycho, you know, which is very, it's a far cry from who Amanda Shul is, but she, to her credit, man, she, she went in. She gave them what they wrote.

It's just breathing that this is like in the midst of this episode, there is, I guess, you know, sometimes I feel like we were always in our own storyline or whatever was happening and we wouldn't be shooting on the same days. So when I watch, I'm like, oh, my. gosh there's so much happening in everybody's life that they had to wasn't like they had a dedicated episode of every scene was our you know our mother passing um so it's just so crazy to look back and be like oh cool while mom was dying you know clays out meeting the stalker that you know we're going to jump into that storyline oh that's right yeah it's so creepy how about mouth and miss

Lauren, because I have big feelings around this. So what you don't know is at the end of 717, it ended. So they've been doing this very weird dance now. Skills left for L.A. earlier this season. So he and Miss Lauren

just sort of broke up. Like, it was this weird thing. And then we find out that they're like not even talking. It's odd. And then like she just starts coming. And of course Millie had her terrible after school special drug story. So they broke. up and mouth and miss lauren just kind of start hanging out and it was one of those ones where

every time i watched a scene i kept thinking oh are they about to kiss because like i don't remember you know what the vibe is very like what's happening in this room right now so the way episode seven 17 ended was with mouth saying to someone because there was a bunch there was a whole through line of like seize the day go for go after what you want and so there was this misdirective mouth going like i want i want to date you i want to take you out on it date. The reveal was he wasn't saying that to Millie. He was saying that to Miss Lauren. So at the top of this episode, I was bummed that it opened with him being like, oh, yeah, sorry, I was drunk. And she's like, I was, for a brief period, I was disappointed because it's like, we've been planting these seeds for like half a season. What are we doing with these two?

And she's like, I'd rather be your wingman than your rebound. I'm like, all right, I respect that. I get that. But also they're out. Like, they're already out. Didn't the, when did this conversation? Like, this kind of stuff always drives me crazy in a show when you're like, okay, but how did you get from point A to point B without having this conversation first? Clearly, they drove separate cars, Joy. Clear.

So he asked her to go out with him. She just stood there staring at him at the door. And then what happened between that moment and now they're suddenly walking through Mayfair, like the shopping center in Wilmington, they've got, they've picked up food. so something happened they're hanging out you're totally right i didn't even think about the night when it happened yeah anyway oh wow that's weird well we do get a bit of a payoff though because later in the episode miss lauren shows up at the apartment and she kisses mouth and i'm like let's go this is exciting and then skills walks in the room i'm like okay um how did you

Did he even have suitcases? I feel like he was had with like a Coke. I feel like he just had a styrofoam cup and like something in his hand. That's so funny. Also the fact that they were, their entrances were spaced out by about 12 seconds. So I just love the fact that like they didn't see each other. Opposite stairwells. He stopped to send a text message.

But it was fun writing that I found myself going, yeah. all right, let's explore this. And then immediately it was like, and here's the crimp in that plan. Yeah. I don't know. I don't know what's going to happen. I think the whole thing feels a little decopaged together.

And I wish. Does that mean piece together, like randomly? Yeah, you know, it's like messy glue. Sorry, a guy here. I have no idea your French fashion words. No, it's glue. It's glue and like little pieces of paper that are cut up.

Okay, thank you. We did it in like fourth grade, no? He didn't decopage things. I went to public school, Lindsay. I don't think we used any French words, okay? Deco page. Okay, poster, plaster. I don't know, postage.

Thank you. Yeah. Dumb it down for the guys on the podcast, would you? But I liked that they had skills walk in. I think that it'll be interesting to see what happens. I just wish I believed it more. I wish I was more invested. That's all.

I love that Rob is invested, though. I mean, he was, like, waiting for this kiss to happen. Yeah, and I will tell you, Joy, having watched the, I've watched 19. And so I have, we're going to have a much larger discussion about it because more stuff goes down. And I have a hot take. So there's your teaser for next episode, listener. Tune in to hear me get on a soapbox about Miss Lauren and Mouth. I can't wait.

Well, okay, we have a couple things before we wrap up the episode. We've got a listener question. This is from Tina. and she wants to know if you had to pick a reality show to be on, what show would you choose? The Great British Baking Show, even though I can't bake, I would want to be on that show. I also might go on Love is Blind

because I think that's hilarious. I would want to host F. Boy Island. It's so good. I mean, listen, I can't host it because I think that Nikki, who hosted, is amazing and she's wonderful. But, like, I just, I fell in love with watching F. Boy Island because it's this character study of, like, the new generation that I'm no longer a part of because I'm not going to. I'm like, thank God

I don't have to date nowadays. This is like when you're in your 20s, this is terrible. So I just want to like go host, you know, I wouldn't want to be on it. Lindsay, the question if you didn't hear it was. Reality show question. No, just say no. I would just say no. So many of them are so filled with drama. I would just like my nervous system would just shut down. But I think now that I've done a lot of, like, construction and home decorating and stuff, I was like, man, I should have just been filming all of this and sent it out and done that kind of reality show. That would be kind of cool. You could. And you should.

Do it. Robert. I think, listen, if summer's approaching, it's obviously going to be Survivor because there's no better way to get that hot summer bod than three weeks of starvation. I love Survivor, by the way. We're just watching it last night. Yeah, it's our show here. So every week, I mean, listen, it's, that show is wildly difficult. What season are they on?

I don't know. We're watching 46 right now, but there's at least four we haven't seen. So they've, they've done. Jeff Probes is like 80 years old by now. Still looks great. And still look amazing. But I think I just, I watch the show. And I know everyone, you hear contestants say it.

They're like, it's so much easier to watch the show. Like, because I was thinking about, Like, could you imagine not, there's a tribe right now is like historically bad. They haven't had fire for 10 days. They've been only eating coconuts for 10 days and they're not sleeping. Can you imagine what version of yourself you would be after no sleep and no food for 10 days and you're losing every challenge? I would be the worst talking head because I would either just be crying hysterically or I would be pure vitrily. It would be terrible.

Have you guys ever watched the one I'm obsessed with is alone in its own? Yeah. And I'm upset. Like they film themselves and there are times they like make puppets like just like Wilson. Yes, just like Wilson. But they make puppets or they've painted their faces or and I'm like because they're alone.

And at the beginning I was like, oh my gosh, I would love this. Like I'm such a hermit crab who like that's being alone. I would totally wouldn't survive. But I would love to do this. And then, you know, you get into like a few episodes and you're like, I don't think people were ever meant to be alone, like actually really, truly sequestered because almost all of them go a little cuckoo. Yeah, it's a little crazy. I'm going to change my answer, though. History's mysteries.

You guys are inspiring me. The more that I think I would want to go do some kind of history's mystery show where I get to go, like, explore places that have to do with historical archaeological sites and find out things about history that. We never knew. I think that would be really fun and exciting. Can we choose that over being on Love is Blind, Joy? Oh, that's a tough one. Yes, absolutely. Yes, sign me up to travel.

I would, you know, if we're going to change the answer, I would say my, if I was hosting a show, anything food related. Like, put me on Great British Bake Off, Iron Chef. I mean, I'll even do Beat Bobby Flay. I'll do the Great British gluten-free bakeoff. I'll do, I'll do, I'll be here. I mean, where I can have all the gluten-free treats that people try to make. I'm down. It may look different, but Native culture is very alive.

My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going election. that this is something we've been doing for hundreds of years, you carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep

traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sageburn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Okay, do we want to spin a wheel? Let's spin a wheel. What is spinning a wheel? You're about to find out, Lindsay McCann. You know, in high school, when they have the most likely twos at the end of it,

of the year book. All right. So this is our most likely to. So you choose who in real life of our cast and then who of the characters in the cast are most likely to host their own talk show. That's really funny. Hilarious. Well, listen, I mean, Dan Scott's the layup answer for characters, right? Yes, for sure. I think Mouth could come in a hot second place. I could see Mouth hosting his own talk show. Yes? Yeah. I don't know. In real life.

I mean, in real life, it's Rob. Come on. Clearly. Clearly. Obviously. Joy, would you want to? No. No.

I just did Kelly Clarkson, and I haven't done anything that's that fast-paced before. Like, I'm more of a drop-in conversation. And I realized leaving that, it was the first show I'd ever done that was that, like, you have to just get your thing out in sound. bites. It's got to, you have five minutes to say everything that you need to say and it is a skill that I don't have. And to have multiple people come in throughout an entire day and you're shooting for, you do two episodes a day is what she does, I think. And you get like three to five minutes with each person. That just sounds miserable to me. It's like all small talk all day long. I couldn't do it. But Rob does such a good job of, I always found this from like day one of meeting you.

Like, the references that you can pull from years and years, even before you were born, and then you, like, definitely make jokes and soundbites. I'm like, it is a skill that I don't have either. I'm like a long-winded take you on a journey. Yeah, me too. You'll end up at the answer somewhere. But, like, Rob is so good. You're so good at, like, the comedy, but then having the heart and, you know, the soundbite moments

and, you know, looping in historical things about. about boys to men, even though, you know, whatever that it is. Historical moments of boys. The fact that you just combined those two things in a sentence is my favorite. History from the 90s. Well, thank you for saying that. I give all the credit to high functioning anxiety. There you go.

There you go. Yeah. Childhood trauma and high functioning anxiety. Oh, yeah. So we also do an honorable mention, which is just sort of like your shout out of the one thing. really liked the episode. Maybe, yeah, your favorite, your favorite takeaway. Maybe it's something we haven't discussed as much. Hmm. I mean, honorable mention for me is to mom. Like she was, she was, like you said, she was the glue. She was the glue of it all that, and I could see us all

looking like sisters, and that was our mom, and she was our glue. So that's my honorable mention. I love that. Well, I mean, I've, I've complimented both of you enough to say that you, you both did an exceptional job in this episode through all the grief and everything that we had to process through. So I'll give my honorable mention then to... Yourself. To Jana Kramer. Can you imagine?

To myself. To Jana. She always surprises me. She's another one of those actors where you never quite know what to expect. It's a different type of unpredictability because of the... the nature of the character but um she was much more grounded in this episode uh this character was so much more like she just keeps dropping into better and better versions of herself and i think jan has been really masterful at that arc going from someone who started out almost as wild and

crazy as our friend katie to going you know much more mellowing out going through her own dramatic grief, trauma journey and finding herself into a place of like some semblance of peace. And I'm really enjoying watching her. Every time she's on screen, it's like getting better and better. Yeah, she's great. It's been nice to see her get to have levels, you know, because initially it was just the only two speeds were high, high, and low, low. You know, it was very manic with her. And that's so tough to play.

And now that she gets to do some smaller stuff, you know, you see that she's very, very good. she brings it my honorable mention um i know we've talked about at length but it would be the quartet of the the james women i'd say the three of you and best i mean you guys are this whole episode and everyone brought it it was all so good it was also just so grounded none of it felt like it was a push or a poll it all felt like like the you know the audience got to come to you and it was believable and like i said i think there's it there's so many entry points for people to relate their own experiences of grief and loss between the three of you and then just the way best played it. So yeah, man, hats off to the four of you.

You all crushed it. Thanks, Rob. I also love working with you girls, too. Like, I always felt good about our scenes and what was being brought to the scenes and the openness and the willingness to play and feel and all of that. You know, sometimes with actors or scenes, you can feel blockages or they have all their own stuff going on. But I feel both of you always showed up present and to play and to like get your hands dirty. And that makes life so much easier, you know, especially with these kinds of scenes. Thanks. Yeah, I feel that way about you too. You too, Chantal. All right. So we'll see you all in another four years. Is that what we can say? I'm so glad we got the three of us together, the four of us, Rob. I'm so glad that you helped

to facilitate all this too and just to like have the three james sisters together felt really amazing um thanks for letting me crash your sleepover guys thanks for making fun you learned about you learned about new um arts and crafts that you're now going to have to go decopage i can't wait to talk about decopage to all of my dude bro friends and have them go what and i'm gonna go you don't know what it is ugh google it bro right next episode season seven episode 19 every picture tells a different story. Come back. Robert has quite an opinion for you guys on this next

episode. Love you both. Thank you so much for joining us. Yeah. Thank you too. Thanks for having us. Love you guys. Bye. Hey, thanks for listening. Don't forget to leave us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram at Drama Queen's O-T-H.

Or email us at Dramaquins at iHeartRadio.com. See you next time. We all about that high school drama girl drama girl all about them high school queens we'll take you for a ride and our comic girl drama girl cheering for the right team drama queens drama queens smart girl rough girl fashion but you're tough girl you could sit with us girl drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens It may look different, but Native Culture is Alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture.

Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other Native stories on the show, Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.