Drama Queens - Someday is Today

Episode Date: June 21, 2021

Hilarie Burton Morgan (Peyton), Bethany Joy Lenz (Haley), and Sophia Bush (Brooke) are the Drama Queens.  Together since 2003, their friendship has blossomed and strengthened over the decades. Now, for the very first time, they are watching every episode of One Tree Hill together. Starting with the pilot and running through all the seasons, these Queens are gonna share cherished memories that built their friendship, dish the dirt, and remind you why there’s only One Tree Hill, and it’s your home.  Always and Forever. Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. It may look different, but native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

First of all, you don't know me. We're all about that high school, drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride in our comic girl. Drama queen. Chearing for the right team. Drama queens, drama queen. You can be a smart girl, rough girl fashion, but you're tough girl. You can sit with us, girl.

Drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens. That feels good. I really love it. It's so fun, isn't it? We're back, baby. We did it. Oh, we survived all these years. We are reunited and it feels good.

It really does. You guys are more beautiful than you've ever been. And I'm so excited we're back in the same room together. This is amazing. It feels like a homecoming. It really, really does. Like, as long as we played high schoolers, we might as well have our own, like, letter jackets and high school reunion.

And we deserve them. God, we deserve pink lady jackets. Yes. But ours would be blue, right? And they say, go Ravens. I know. Go Ravens. How many times over the years have people come up to you too and said like, when is there

going to be a reunion? So much. So many. I've lost count, honestly. It's probably the number one question. And it's fans of the show. It's even like the sweetest reporters we've ever spoken to. People you wouldn't expect to be saying, please give us a reunion.

do that a lot. I really like it when like people who are from countries, we had no idea the show aired in come up. And they're like, we learned English watching your show. Yeah. I know. That's nuts. It's been a comfort food for so many people. And it's because of those fans, because of all you guys listening that we're even able to do this right now. We're so grateful and super super excited to be back together. It's true, though, you know, for us, and we've all talked about this in private, you know, there were years where when we finished the thing we did for a decade, we were like, no, we're done with that. And I think that the passion that the fans have carried out has actually allowed us to fall back in love with the show. You guys have given us nostalgia. You have enabled us to maintain our friendships. And honestly, our friendships are deeper and more ferocious and delicious than they've ever been.

Because like, we do get to travel to all these cool places together and meet, you know, the people who love our show. and you've reminded us that we love our show. And so now we're bringing you a new show. Did you guys ever imagine when we were like locked down in Wilmington, North Carolina in the early 2000s, that there would be a global fan base? Never. Never. I mean, you always hope that, but you never actually, I mean, you can't just sit around dreaming

that there's going to be some global, like, rush that we're going to become a major piece of pop culture. And then suddenly it happens. And I mean, but, you know, you're so. what was 2003 was it when we started? I didn't even know how the internet worked back then. No. Was there internet back then? I feel you were still dial up.

I mean, weren't we using like AIM? Yeah. What do you know is that? Home phones back then. I'm going to call Joy on her landline. That's right. Landlines when it was rude to call people on their cell phones

because you don't want to bother someone when they're out. I'll just call you when you're home. Now it's like the other way around. What do you guys remember the most about Wilmington? Like, let's talk about when we first... I mean, do you guys remember when you first showed up, like landed in that tiny little airport? Yes.

Well, and always a connecting flight because there's no direct flight into Wilmington, so you'd fly to Charlotte. And then you'd go get on the little plane. And I remember landing in Wilmington and getting off the plane. And I was like, oh, there are six gates in the airport. There's rocking chairs out front. I was like, can I sit in one of those?

I love it here. Had you guys ever been there before? No. No. See, I was like a Virginia kid. So we would vacation down there growing up. And there was a place. It was like Bubba's car lot, you know,

and it was all antique picture cars that had been used in movies that had shot there starting with like a fire starter, you know? Oh, yeah. So it had been a film town since the 80s. Because Frank Capra built screen gems there. Yeah. Like 70s or 80s, right?

Blue velvet shot there. So like David Lynch came in and did Super Bowl. creepy stuff. Empire Records shot there, which wasn't a David Lynch movie, but oh my God, it's Transmany. The best. I mean, there were so many cool things that had shot there before we got there. And so for me, it was like, oh, I get to go live in a vacation town where Bubba's car lot is, you know? Like, cool. And Dawson's had just like reigned Supreme in Wilmington. Were you I was allowed to watch Dawson's, because I wasn't. You weren't?

What? It was a bad kid show. I wasn't allowed to watch, like, Beverly Hills 902-1-0, but or Melrose Place, God forbid. I still, to this day, I'm like, what happened on that? I watched. I watched 902-1-0 to a point, and then there was an episode where Luke Perry and Jenny Garth had, like, an affair behind Shannon Doherty's back or something, and I didn't I didn't see commercials about that.

I didn't even see the episode. I was actually like a way at, this is so embarrassing. I was way at Space Camp and I'd Wild. It's fine. But my parents watched the episode and when I got home, they were like, we can't believe we've been letting you watch the show

with your babysitter. She's a bad influence. And I got a new babysitter. And I was banned from watching 902 and oh forever. So I think because that show was so bad is maybe why I was allowed to watch Dawson's. Because it was like small town kids, figuring it out. Yeah.

Dude, I remember having girlfriends over to watch, like the pilot of Dawson's and when Pacey had sex with the teacher my mother came in was like I forgot about that too. I forgot about that too. It was like the first storyline. I came in on Dawson's Late though. I didn't start watching until season like three or four

when they had sort of mellowed out. It wasn't so much of the trying to shock everybody because Kevin Williamson was definitely in a shock zone at that point when he started all that stuff. Maybe I must have done the same. I must have started watching it later. And then I remember being in college and ahead of a premiere, a season premiere,

going back and watching from the beginning with friends. And I think that might have been the first time I saw that. Yeah, it did. It let my world on fire. And all of a sudden, then everyone at school knew I wasn't allowed to watch it. They're like, she's a nerd. Yeah. But, you know, we were all actors at that point.

Joy, you started really young. How old were you when you started working? Oh, my gosh. Well, yeah. I mean, I started professionally when I was 12. so and but I was doing some kind of I was doing a lot of theater I mean we were all we were all drama queens in our own right of our high schools and schools you know we all did drama club and school plays and all that kind of stuff so that was and you for sure were Hillary I know you did a ton of musical theater I was initiated into the high school theater program when I was in third grade I was eight with a letter jacket because I played Gretel von Trapp I was just going to say, and then I followed up in fifth grade with Amarillis and the sound of music.

And so I thought I was so cool and adult because I was like, Who's Amarillis in the Sound of Music? She's like the little girl that plays the piano while Marion's singing, Goodnight My Someone, and she's like. Oh, the music man. What did I say? Sound of Music. Yes.

I was Gretel in Sound of Music, Amarillis and the Music Man. A lot of music happening in our eyes. I'm today years old always. I learned something about musicals from the two of you. Every time we're together, I'm like, I don't know. Nerd club. I love it. Well, I didn't start doing theater until I had an arts requirement in the eighth grade.

I tried to get out of it. And I tried to schedule my semester of theater for the same semester I was playing volleyball. And my school was like, you're an idiot. You can't do that. So I had to miss volleyball for the year, which in hindsight is a blessing because I never grew. So I'm not tall enough to be a volleyball player. I can see you be an aggressive volleyball player. You're competitive.

You're competitive. You're competitive for sure. But I'm like, I can get in there. I can help. but I um I can't help suddenly I was like yeah just the short kid being like give me the low ones um but suddenly I was like wait a minute I've been on this like med school track I thought you know like good immigrant daughter like you will be a doctor or a lawyer or a lawyer or a doctor and then I was like wait but plays or books come to life but I missed the whole musical theater

thing there's still time babe there's still time Our 100th episode will be a musical podcast. Oh my God, I can't wait. You will write us a musical and it will be fabulous. Oh, okay. You went from Creight on your head and you're going to be like, all right, I'm ready. I'll start now. What show was on the air when we were teenagers that you were like, oh, that's what I want to do?

Felicity. Yeah, Felicity. I got to be in a couple episodes of Felicity. You did? Yeah, I did. Rewind. Rewind. Yeah. I was, her teacher was like, seemed like he was hitting on her.

And it was, there was some episode where her teacher seemed like he was hitting on her. And then it turned out that he was actually, like, having an affair with me. What? And you were also a student? And I was also a student. But I also looked just like her. Like my hair was really big and curly. And so I think maybe there was a tie in there where it was like he was, it was super weird.

I don't know. But I can say everybody was really nice on that show. And Carrie, I've always admired her as an actress, too, but she was just so sweet and professional and, like, really warm. And, you know, I mean, people, and we know certainly being on a show where people came in and out all the time, it's really hard to keep track of all the guest stars and all the storylines and everything.

But Carrie was like, I always felt comfortable around her and she felt really warm and welcome. And come on in. And the hair makeup trailer, there was never like snobbiness or anything. So, you know, whatever. I had a great memory from being on that show. But what else was on the WB at the time? The WB was huge at the time.

Yeah, huge, huge. It owned our total age bracket. Yeah. Charmed Charmed, Felicity Dawson's. Buffy. Veronica Mars. We grew up on Buffy. Yeah.

Wasn't we Veronica Mars was UPN until it moved over? Until we merged. That happened in our merger. Yeah. Well, see, yep. That was. And that was. nuts because they were our competitor and we had this like rivalry don't you remember the end of

Veronica Mars in their credits they had like an icon of a tree burning and we took it so personally and then we all merged and we were on the same network and it was like oh hey guys it felt like west side story it was just like cool I guess we're friends now yeah the WB like I'd interviewed a bunch of people from other shows on the WB when I was working at MTV but But I was always on the other side of it. Like, I definitely wasn't the talent. I was just the interviewer. And so it was all the Smallville kids.

Oh, Smallville, too. Oh, my God. And then what was the one with Gregory Smith? Everwood. That was a big one. God, about that, too. Was Gilmore, Gildon. Gilmore girls.

Oh, my God. They just, they were printing hits. Yeah, they were. Oh, yeah. They were. And so if you were cast on a WV show, It was like, which is so funny that every year we always felt like we're on the bubble.

They may not pick you up. You know, we're not really sure if anybody's into it. I don't think people at home know that. So explain to them what the bubble is. Oh, yeah, yeah. Yeah. Okay. So the bubble is like you could burst at any moment.

You could be canceled at any moment. So better, you know, stay in line. Better make sure that we, you know, just keep our numbers up. Mind your piece and keys. Yeah, do whatever we have to do to sell, sell the show and make sure that we stay on the air. but it's ironic because clearly at that time wb wasn't picking up shows that were not going to be big hits let alone keeping them on the air for longer than longer than two seasons i think is a fair space of time to say like by then they they know and yet even into season five six seven eight

we might get we might get canceled every season i was there it was like you're lucky to have a job you know and isn't it funny that now as adults like all of us producing and directing we're like, oh, that's a scare tactic to keep your employees terrified so they never ask for anything. Got it. Thanks, guys. But as kids, we were like, oh, my God, we might lose our jobs. This might be the year.

We all find out we're failures. You know what has happened? We've reached that point in adulthood where we're like, fine, I lose my job. It's fine. You know, like the apathy has set in. But, you know, that was the biggest break ever. And trying to prove ourselves was funny. and also like a good way to have those connections that make lifelong friends it's like

oh remember when we all went through that together yeah it's like having matching tattoos on the inside yes oh i love that i almost got a tattoo at your wedding so i did too almost yeah the line was just really long i was like getting it later though i still got the bee yeah he just got it later i love it listen we had like 93 people get tattooed at my wedding We'll do that on a different episode of the show. We'll just like bring in Mike Lysina. Oh my God, yes. My tattoo us.

Why not? So what were you guys doing like right before you were cast on the show? What was like the six months leading up to finding out you were on the show? Well, I was, I had just moved from New York. I had been on a soap opera for a couple of years. And then I just lived in New York City doing nothing for one year. I spent all my money that I made on this. soap which you know what I was 19 or 20 and like making a stupid amount of money which is just so

unusual and I just it was kind of great to just blow all of it on like amazing restaurants and I saw a Broadway show every other night and I remember you're telling me you're like do you like champagne and I don't know you were like I'm good at champagne I mean I was like I moved out when I was 17 I had my own apartment you know and that's nuts you know yeah like I had I had been kind of living on my own taking care of myself for a long time. So when I got to L.A., I went to L.A. because I was in New York. I spent all my money. I went to the ATM one day and I had like $2,000 left. And, you know, I was like, oh, well, I guess I got to go to L.A. and try and get some guest spots. So I just packed up my bags. Did you know where to go? No, I mean, I had been in L.A.

so much because I had pilot season since I was 12, 14 years old, I was always flying out there for for testing and pilots and stuff. So anyway, once I got here, um, I was, um, you know, once I got here, um, um, it was it was stupidly charmed like it just kept working I just got here and I got on guest spots and on all these great different shows and started you know gun apartment and I got the the pilot for Ravens was sent to me and I flipped through it and I just was like I don't know I don't know if I wanted to do a teen drama and there were a lot of other auditions at the time so I just kind of passed by it and then six or seven months later my manager called me and she said watch this pilot. This is a show. The show I wanted you to audition for a few months ago, but anyway, they're recasting one of the parts. And if you like it, take a look.

So I took the pilot, the tape, the videotape. It was a chunky tape. I still have that chunky tape, man. I took it over to a friend's house and we sat down and watched it. And I loved the pilot. I mean, I really, really did. Yeah, I loved it. And I thought, man, I would love to be a part of the show.

I love the way they're weaving in music. and the tone of the characters feel so raw and connected. And like, this feels like something I could really sink my teeth into. So, yeah, I went in and did my audition. We should all talk about our audition experiences at some point, too. Oh, my gosh. So what were you doing before? Oh, man.

I mean, I was a junior in college. I had done this movie. I had auditioned for the female lead in Van Wilder opposite Ryan Reynolds. and they were like, you look 12. This isn't going to work. Oh, no, you did it. I thought you looked really pretty. Well, they kept bringing me back in,

and I eventually tested for the movie, and they were like, we just think you look too young to work opposite. Was that the Terriid part? Oh, man. Yeah. And they were like, but there's a part, there's one scene where there's this freshman in college girl, and we'd like to offer it to you. And I was like, wow, this is cool.

And I remember getting to work. And they were like, okay, so you're going to take that mark. And I was like, what is a mark? And Ryan Reynolds was the sweetest person. And he was like, come over here. And he gave me like a four minute lesson and was just like, this is a mark and what it means when they say toe up and look for this and make sure no one's ever in your light.

And I was like, okay. And then five minutes later they were like, so you're going to like, you know, we're going to smash cut to her walking in the room and you're in his lap and you guys are making out. And I was like, wow, this is tremendously awkward. Thank God he's such a nice person. And he's like remained the nicest human. But I did that.

And then I did this three-episode guest arc on NipTuck the first season. Oh, that's right. Yeah. Yeah, which was so fun and so, like, salacious and out of control. And then I was like, it was summer. And I was working my retail job. I was working at the Century City Mall. What shop?

I was working at Bloomingdale's. Girl! I did. And I... You were like Rachel Green. Literally. I, yes, I was following in Jennifer Anneson's television footsteps. And the anxiety that I had.

had every day because like all the other kids who worked there were bad and they would just take like extended smoke breaks. And I was having a panic attack every day because I was trying to re-color coordinate and arrange everything on the shelves by size and nobody else care. And I was like, I can't take it anymore. And then this came up and it and it was actually really interesting because similarly to you, I had read the Ravens script. And by the way, for anyone listening who doesn't know, Wintry Hill was originally titled Ravens, you know, the name of the basketball team. And I had read the script and I had wound up doing a different pilot for the same production company, Toland Robbins. Yeah. And it was very in the line of amazing WB shows, sort of like a

seventh heaven, like really warm family story. Oh, that's another one. Seven heaven. They printed hits, I tell you. But it was a pilot for ABC and ABC was like, we don't really need a family show. Like, this is cute, but we're not picking this up. And fun fact, Jeffrey Nordling from Big Little Lies played my dad. And my God, he's just been amazing forever. But our show didn't get picked up. And then they were recasting your part. They were recasting Haley.

And I got a call from one of the producers who was on my pilot and on Montreale, who was like, you know, we have these four lead characters. And all of them, when you meet them, are really struggling with something. And we need, messy, messy, sad, drama. And they were like, we need a character to be, like, ridiculous and sassy. We need, like, comic relief. Sassy's a good word. And I was like, broken, it was real sassy.

And I was like, that feels fun. And I remember going in and auditioning. And then I had, like, I think two more, a callback. And then there was the test where they were, remember we were there together. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. I remember. They were testing, they were doing the, well, her name wasn't even Brooke yet,

but they were doing the Brooke characters and the Haley's. And it was this weird room. I remember that because it was like a circle couch or something. It was some kind of like two half moon couches. I just remember walking in. You were on your headphones and I remember being, damn it, I hope I'm, that girl and I are not up for the same part. It's just so pretty.

Oh, my God. Were there other people there? Was it just you two? Because I was having a panic. I was like, I'm so nervous. I don't think I can talk to anyone because if I start talking to people, might throw up, and that'll definitely mean I don't get the job. What's fun.

Oh, God. It was so nerve-wracking. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for a hundred of years. you carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Teller Ornelis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history.

On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream listen to burn sage burn bridges on the iHeart radio app apple podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts no i'd been in

LA like six months before Ravens maybe even more than that and I'd had one boyfriend you know like I'd only had one boyfriend in my whole life and his friend was getting married out there so I piggybacked, like, a couple auditions onto this wedding trip. And he was so pissed about it because he had to drive me around. It was L.A. It was, like, before MapQuest, you know? Like, it was before Uber. You had to, like, read a map to get around.

The Tom is the guy. Oh, my God. I'll never get it. I got lost so many times reading that damn thing. And so I go to this audition for Mike Tolan, and he was directing radio with Cuba Gooding Jr. And I was auditioning for the part of, uh, Ed Harris's daughter. And I went in there and I did it and it was like kind of bitchy.

And he was like, here's what we need. We need you to be more vulnerable and like tell your dad that you need him. And I remember like the look on my face because your dad's a green beret, right? And I looked at him and I said, have you ever been a teenage girl before? Like there's no way. No way I would make him think that I needed him. And they were like, well, it's good to meet you. Like, someone else is going to get this part.

And so when I got cast, I barely auditioned for One True Hill. Because I think they used all the old footage from that audition. They're like, we need a bitch. Like, there's this Burton girl, and she's awful. And she's got so many opinions. And so I just, like, made a tape in New York with the casting director. And I ended up getting the job. But it was all very, like, I'd never met anyone.

anyone so when everyone was talking about tests and things like that i was like what is a test what are you guys talking about so when i showed up in wilmington everybody had already met each other because they'd all read with each other in auditions or tests chemistry reads and stuff yeah wow i just showed up and i met chad on dawson's creek i'd done one episode i'd done the hundredth episode of dawson's creek It was an episode where all those kids go to the MTV, spring break. I was like, wait, weren't you playing yourself? And I played myself. Oh, my God.

And it was, it should have been an omen because I remember, you know, my character's name is Hillary. They spelled it wrong. But Katie Holmes was telling me, like, oh, that Chad's character was one of the Hansen brothers. And my line was, thank God you told me I probably would have slept with him. And now when you're playing yourself, you're very sensitive. about that, especially when you're super young. And I was not a promiscuous woman. And you're like, I would never say that. And so I said that. I was like, guys, I got a problem with this line. And they're like, who is this little gas? Who's this mouthy thing? I was like, I'm not saying it. I was like, I'm not saying it. What kind of slutty stuff is this? Oh my God. And so it should have been an omen for like the continuation of my career down in Wilmington. Years of I am not saying this. I'm not doing it. What kind of slutty stuff is this? Oh my God. Yeah. But Chad got into the van our very first day. we were like going to the readthrough for the pilot

and introduced himself like we hadn't met and I remember being like this is war so all the like angsty bitchy stuff was legit like I was just being so I was a jerk kid I love it brought that energy in it was real real oh my God I love it what's crazy

to me is you telling that story makes me realize that the three of us had the exact same experience starting on our show we all showed up to spaces where everybody else knew everybody. Yeah. Because when we showed up, you then had done the pilot and you knew everybody, but you were

meeting everybody for all the Haley reshoots for the first time. That's right. And then when I showed up to start working, I had already been there for a bit. You had been there for a week because I wasn't in the pilot. I started in episode one, but they brought me out during the pilot reshoot scenes that you were doing. And so it's blowing my mind that the three of us women had the same repeat experience. That's weird.

That's crazy. And to learn that today is really weird. I apologize for bringing a chip on my shoulder. Who are these motherfars? Who is everybody? We'll show them. What I think was really fun is that we got to insert little tiny pieces of our real selves into our characters. Because I don't know that our bosses necessarily knew what they were doing a lot either.

It was new for a lot of them. And so we got to influence little little. bits and pieces of who our characters would become. I actually had been a cheerleader in high school. I was a very grumpy cheerleader in high school. I remember having like pictures of Charles Manson and quotes of his on my megaphone and like just to be just to be counter. Yeah, just to be a dick. And so when they created this character, I was like, whoa, that hits close to home. What were pieces of your characters that really stood out for you? guys either that were there already or that you inserted gosh i'm trying to think about this because

i have um well first of all i have the worst long-term memory ever you could make shit up no one would know joy um i mean i remember getting there and being i was kind of like i said already used to being dropped into new situations on my own and just having to sort of handle it and connect with people and make friends. So I'd been doing that for a while. So, and I'm such an introvert that I was also like, um, just wanted to spend time in my hotel room and walk around on my own and the riverview suites. Yeah, the river view suites and that, you know, I'd walk around just like being poetic and

writing poetry and back of napkins and things in my mind, writing songs and like, just so awkward and didn't know how to actually have a real like spending time getting to know somebody. So I think a lot of my experience was colored by that. But in terms of Haley and being on set, I mean, I remembered, what, I remember shooting the scene in the cafe with Karen and the chili and some thing about magazine pages being sticky. Ew, gross. I don't know.

So gross. We're going to have to, when we rewatch this pilot, we'll know what I'm talking about. But there was something about that. And I was like mouthing off to Lucas. And it felt very comfortable. Um, Moira and Chab were both really welcoming and really, um, encouraging. And, um, I felt like I had room to play. And, uh, and I think I, I resonated with the sense that Haley felt kind of introverted and awkward and didn't really know how to connect with people. Because even though I'm, I'm an extroverted introvert because of my business, I've learned how to, um, walk into a room and manage having a conversation connecting with lots of people and being charismatic. But inside, I'm, I'm, I'm an extrovert. I'm, I'm crawling into a hole and, like, can't wait to be alone. Yeah.

So I think there was a lot of that part of me that I recognized in Haley and, you know, connected with that. What about you? Oh, man. It was really interesting because there was a boldness to Brooke Davis. Well, actually, I need to rewind. Her name wasn't even Brooke Davis. Oh, yeah. It was terror.

Terra. Oh, my gosh. That's right. Like 1,000% no. Not that there's anything wrong with terrorists. Not that there's anything wrong, but like that was not her name. Yeah. You know?

Like it doesn't, it just doesn't feel right. Brooke is an expensive name. It is. And you know what's so funny is I remember when we were getting everything settled and one of our writers was like, well, what name do you like? And they suggested a couple. And my best friend from college is a girl named Brooke. No way.

And she is just like one of those people who is so chic. Like she can put on something that is actually like expensive and beautiful or she can put on a Zara t-shirt and it looks like it's a designer. Like somebody else we know. Oh, fancy pants over here. That's very sweet. I always am like, this is like a nice outfit. Why do I look like a teenage boy in this is how I feel every day?

Also like every single day I wear a pair of jeans and an oversized blazer. But this is not the point we're on. I do love a uniform. But I, and I just, there was something about like her. spirit, even in college, like I, similarly to you, I think I know how to, I know how to show up in a room. I know how to do my job. I'm really, really good at being bold for other people, but I've realized, as a grown up who has spent invested money in therapy, I'm actually, historically, I have not been good at being bold for myself. And my friend Brooke from college

was so unabashedly bold and was never ashamed of anything and never embarrassed by anything. and never worried she was offending anyone. She was so herself. And I knew that this character was supposed to be like that. And I think the interesting thing is that I learned a little more about how to do that for myself because I played Brooke Davis. And I brought like deeply self-conscious fear and self-searching to her. And I think I was able to humanize her because very similarly to you,

and I know we all experienced this on our show there were things that were written for me to do as this person that I just refused to do I said I'm not doing this Yeah we all had moments like that We all had that And I think there was something really beautiful that we got to be inspired by our characters

We got to inspire our characters And weirdly we stuck up for each other I'm like oh Brooke Davis and I stuck up for each other every day Oh that's a good way to think You know I feel that I feel like Peyton's story is a very different person than I am and I'm so defensive of her because she's like a broken winged bird you know and and there are other people in our industry who have done teen

dramas who try to distance themselves from it it's like guys it's a genre we make fun up you know what I mean and so for me always like owning her and defending her has been it's been a life's work but also like have we forgotten what is their show. Oh, uh, uh, come on.

Claire Daines and Jared Lettow's classic. Oh, my soul of life. Like, they're two of my favorite actors

who make the most incredible Academy Award nominated films we've ever seen. Like, I don't hate a teen drama. I love it. I think it makes you

great. People love them. Well, and you said something that I thought was so smart. Girl, all day. This is my, I know exactly what you're

going to say. You tell them because it's your mantra and I love it. Listen, all these folks out there winning awards with good scripts.

I'm not impressed because if you take a script and make it relatable and watchable and like make somebody cry you're a winner. I agree and I think about that so often and I'm like if we can make you

weep and have a deep talk with your family after an episode of our show on a very mediocre script 98% of the time. And a dog can eat a heart. Exactly. We can jump sharks and you still love us like come on. That takes some real metal if I may say so.

For all of us. Yeah. So in watching, in watching this, guys, I have, listen, I have not seen anything since I left. I haven't either. Like, no, not a thing. And I never saw the last three seasons because I was like off having babies and like, you know, just on a different planet. And so frankly, I'm nervous about rewatching because it's like, I know it's going to be painful to watch myself learn how to act on camera. Like, I wasn't in class.

I'd taken classes for years. I'd done theater forever, but TV acting is so, so, so different. I'm, I am, I am also nervous to rewatch because I, I know where my personal life was during those 10 years. Yep, sure do. And I, I know what I have. You're literally whole face just turned red. Yep. You're literally whole face.

still starting right. We got a lot in common, ladies. Yeah, but like I, when I think back on, there's so many parts of myself that I also have invested money in therapy. Yeah. And have, you know, done a lot of work as you do when life kicks your ass. And when I think about the sort of superiority complexes that I have back then like, how judgmental and like how, there was just.

so many things that I look back on my younger self and you I don't know if you guys do but I cringe at a lot of those moments. I mean, I'm still learning to forgive myself for just being human and growing and learning but I think back and I know I inserted so much of that into Haley and so when I watch her

when I have seen clips or things come on I always cringe because I'm just like oh God she's so like is that what I was like oh God I'm so sorry I feel insufferable I'm so scared

I'm in so strong. Oh, man. You know what's so interesting to me about it, though, is I also feel like, and we've had this experience, the three of us over the years. And, you know, we've talked about this with the fans. So many of you listening at home, probably no facets of these stories. But there was so much, not only of us as young adults who, by the way, knew nothing. We were learning in real time. It was the first time a lot of us were away from our parents, like ever.

Like, it was kind of like being pushed off a cliff and trying to get your, like, skydiving backpack on at the same time. It was really, it's a wonder none of us is dead. Yeah. So, congratulations. Of all the cast, like, we've thrived. We've really done all right. Everyone's a lot. You're like, we're doing great.

We're doing great. And you know, as you said last night at dinner, we all had dinner last night. And you said, you were talking about the benefit of being in Wilmington when we weren't being able to be snapped by paparazzi coming out of a restaurant. You know, like, that stuff messes with you when you're that young. And no wonder a lot of, a lot of, you know, kids without guidance and without their parents still there just kind of went off the rails, you know, that. And I don't know that we would have been any different if we hadn't been protected by our location in a lot of ways.

I mean, even the aspects of it that we did experience were really traumatizing for me. Yeah. Like I, it was so hard to handle this notion that everyone wants you to fail so they can make fun of you, but also you're meant to be perfect, but no one knows how to be perfect. let alone an adult because we were 20 years old and like I mean I you know children we were children the only thing that ever because I was always like drunk hungover like that's going to be the hard part of watching this for me is like that's a hangover you're the fire valley I was I was a brute um but the only paparazzi mess I ever ran into was at this hotel no way we are at the w hotel in

westwood yeah and I came out in like season five season six to start pitching TV shows that I'd created with my little brother, Billy. And so, Billy had worked on our show. Billy and I are staying here, maybe even in like one of these rooms, because I knew it had like two bedrooms here. And the next thing I know, like the magazines reporting Hillary Burton, seen laughing over dinner at the W Hotel with a mystery man. And I was like, it's my brother.

Ew, gross. But it was so late, you know, and I felt so vibrant. And that happened to me once, you know? And so I can't imagine, you're right. The kids that are just under the microscope all the time. But it's so interesting because when we think about it, there was that external attention. There was the very real world of what we were learning on set and being human beings, making mistakes and, you know, being hung over and figuring it out. And, and, you know.

I was never hung up. Never. It's part of my problem, by the way. We'll get you there. We're making up for it. Yeah, believe me, I've done since then. I think that there's something so interesting also about our ability now, the privilege, really, of getting a version of a do-over, of this female friendship that is so important to the three of us. Yeah.

That has been such a lifeline. We do have these tattoos on the inside that nobody else has. And we've been able to be like, oh, wow, weird to learn that there were some adults who didn't want us to be friends because they're. They thought we would negotiate together. So they, like, pitted us against each other at 20. That's dark. Like, and yet, no matter what anybody ever tried the ways they wanted to mess with us or the way the industry was trying to mess with kids in the early 2000s or anything, like,

the three of us came out like Jones of Arc, like just out of the fire. Like, what, you can't fuck with us? And I really, I love it. Yeah. I mean, all of us got involved in advocacy. Yeah. We're all a little surly. Who? Us? No, never.

No, I mean, I think rewatching it together as a group is going to be fun because I didn't know what you guys were going through on the show. And all we could do, especially that age is assume, like, that's one of the things that we don't, at that time, I guess, when we were being raised. This is a different generation. Like, we couldn't even texting. No. I had a Motorola razor and I thought I was so cool. That's like we'd flip our phones open and be like, wow.

That T-Mobile one that was like a typewriter. The sidekick. Oh my God. I still remember the sound of the sidekick opening the sh-sh-sh-sh-ch. And then the soft keys, the like, tach-tuk-d-d-da-dick. We weren't taught how to be like the value of being vulnerable with each other and so that it was okay to just be like, guys, I feel insecure when I'm around you and all you're doing is talking and bouncing off each other.

I don't know what to say and I can't keep up. And like, can you just like make space for me? Like, nobody would have taught me to say that when I was 20. It's just not, wasn't part of the generation we were raised in. But we can now. Yeah. And it feels so special. And I think about all the young women who reach out to all of us all the time, who are

watching the show now. Yeah. And who talk about how important our on-screen friendships are. And I'm like, man, we're getting the better version of any version of a friendship we had on screen or otherwise. We're getting it now in our adulthood in this new era, to your point, joy. Like women actually being taught to go to bat for each other instead of. And for themselves.

Yeah. Like, we're not each other's competition. We're each other's greatest champions. But back then, everyone around us wanted us to compete with each other. And I don't know. I think that all this stuff that's so scary to watch, I'm so relieved I get to watch with you guys. Joy's the talented one. Sophia's the gorgeous one and you're the angry one.

And I was like, what? Wow. What's said to you? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's not wrong. It's like, I was pretty angry. You're all so beautiful and talented.

I think we all do okay for ourselves. But in doing this, I think those titles are a fun thing to poke at. Yeah. Like we're going to have our friends on the show. Lee had his experiences. Antoine, James. All of our peers also had those experiences. So throughout the course of this whole series, like I'm excited to have them on because

they're going to have a totally different experience. Oh, they'll have experienced things. We never did for sure. This is what you were saying, Sophia, is I think one of the, it's the biggest reason why we wanted to do this podcast, because as fun as it is to reconnect, I love doing this with you girls. And, you know, yeah, this is this is such a cool revisit to a major pop culture moment. Yes. But the fact that now as as older women, you know, Hillary and I are moms raising young girls also just being able to offer to the younger generation a vision of what. a sisterhood can look like for women who grew up watching the show to be able to revisit that maybe with some of their girlfriends you know maybe you'll you out there listening will learn along with us some of the things that we are some of our takeaways some of the things that we're learning as we heal in some ways which i think this is going to be healing in a lot of ways watching as well

second season mullet i had i don't know if i'm ever going to go right oh my god yeah yeah yeah but anyway I just think, I think it's going to be great. And I think I'm really excited because I think that's going to be really helpful for a lot of, a lot of young women tuning in. Yeah. Yeah. I do too. All right. Let's get weird. Sorry, you can always count on me to be sincere.

You can always count on me to ruin it because I'm like, feelings are so hard. We love to lean in. And Hillary's like, I got a joke. I got a joke. I got a joke. I got a joke. Chris Chandler. Say something funny.

Feelings. Yeah. This is why I was always hung over. This is why we're a good unit. Yeah. it's it's we were cast really well and it's weird to think that there was a person out there who was responsible for choosing our friendships for us um and for me as a kid that was hard because I was like you can't tell me who to be friends with but like they did a really good job like we all

turned out great and the conventions we do are so fun yeah and so this is an extension of that yeah should be great um so yes we're you know we've got a whole How many seasons? Nine? We have 187 hours of television. What? We do. It's so many hours.

It's so many hours. Yeah. That's a lot. It's a lot. Like when we get those messages and someone's like, I'm rewatching it from the start for the fourth time. I'm like, thank you. And also, do you have homework? Or like a job?

Are you? Really? Us? Okay. Hang in. It's flattering. It's comforting. Yeah.

Who's going to be the person? you're most excited to have on and pick their brain. Paul's going to be a blast. Look, no lie. That's going to be fun. He's got a lot of energy. I also, I can't wait to hear Moira's perspective. Yes. Because like, she was our age when we started our show.

Yeah. And now I'm like, were we, I just want to look at her and be like, were we idiots? Oh, did you like us? She's going to have so much to say and Barbara too. Yeah, Barbara's so fun. Antoine for me is so fun because his perspective on all. Antoine had like kids who were teenagers when we were shooting the show.

And so he also was removed from it in a way where he could just watch us like spin our wheels and be messy and loved it. He loved it. Like when Anton called you and it's like, you need to go out tonight. We're going to sidebar. You know, like you knew. Yeah. All right. I'm going to get a lecture tonight. And he would just make sure that everything was cool. He was like a good negotiator. Yeah. Yeah. Antoine's the party. He really is. And for anyone listening, at home who might not know. Paul played Dan, Moira played Karen, Barbara played Deb, and Antoine played skills. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to

become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for a kind of two years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive, while navigating the modern world,

influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. When you think about the sort of epic feeling of, oh my God, I've been cast on a WB show. Do you guys remember? Because when I think about landing at, you know, our sweet little six-gate airport, which, by the way, when we've gone back for conventions, I'm like, oh, I just love it here. It still smells the same.

It's the smell. It's perfect. But I remember leaving the airport and I had to go straight to the studio for like a first meeting. And when I pulled into screen gems, the side of one of the stages had that huge Dawson's Creek mural on it. Yeah. And I just remember thinking, oh, my God, I'm here. Yeah. And it was so great.

Like at 20 years old, it was so crazy. That's what it felt. I was just kind of the days until our own big old heads got put up on the side. And they did. And they did. They put us in like the side of the cafeteria. Yeah. The entire sidewall.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. I was down with that. We all landed in different parts of town, too. Like when you first get, cast on a Warner Brothers show, you all stay at like the Riverview Suites in Wilmington, you know, which is the suites.

It was like an extended stay hotel. But then we all went off and picked our own places to live. And Joy, you were at the beach, right? Didn't you go to the beach season one? Oh my gosh. I think I did because that was the year we got those dogs. Remember Sophia? We got those dogs.

Oh, we went on a Saturday and got puppy. I know. Yeah. Well, I wasn't invited to Puppy Day. I was hung over. I might have been. I think we were scared to view. I was at the beach. It's so angry. That moved downtown second season. So yeah, I think where did you go? Well, I had the very first place I got because they put me up for the pilot. And then it was like, okay, child, here's a chunk of money. Go find a place to live. You know, and I'd never signed a lease on my own before. I didn't know how to do that. And so I found an apartment for like, $650 a month that was directly across the street from Karen's Cafe. I was living above firebelly. And it was the first time I'd ever lived alone.

And there was this dude next door to me who was so scary. His name was Glenn. If he's listening, I don't even care that you know you're scary because you're listening to this, which proves you're scary. So anyway, Glenn was so weird. And like, would lean out on his balcony to peek in. my balcony and then I found these holes in the wall and I was like you did not but I didn't know if it was just a shitty building or like Glenn was like Anthony Perkins psycho holes in the wall so I was so scary

so that is when I started inviting the crew to come over every time they wrapped at Karen's cafe just because I didn't want to be by myself and so I ended up having like ragers at this little $600 apartment and it was fun like it was a great time I was not far I was also off Front Street. The first apartment I found was, oh, you had a nice apartment. I loved that apartment. It was just in such a weird little building that I think there were only like four apartments. There was a weird staircase that went up the side of every level. And I think it was like two apartments per floor. It was basically the unused space that someone realized they could be making money on because it was the other side of the rooftop of the real cafe. Oh, my God.

Because I remember that brick wall. It was all that exposed brick. Because I think it had been outside and then they just made it inside and they put these four apartments in this like random space and it was so cool and it was so cool and I remember having to negotiate with the parking lot across the street because there was obviously like there was no parking there was nothing I negotiated with the parking lot that was across the street that was like a you know pay by day place and I like ran around until I found the owner like in a bar one day and I was like hey like I live across the street and is there any way I could just like pay you every month to park and I paid $95 a month to have a parking spot that's so much money oh which was so much

money to me at the time and now I think about like people complaining about how in New York they have to pay $1,200 a month for parking and I'm like yeah maybe I shouldn't have been complaining but we were just so broke and like you know it was all so weird I remember you know you get your like little they give you a couple thousand dollars and they're like buy your own plane ticket and and then move across the country with all your stuff. And you're like, okay. Like it's all so scary. But I loved that apartment.

I think I did you have a bunch of scrapbooking stuff? Yeah. I feel like I came over to pick you up and you're like, this is my scrapbooking room. I was so into it. I was so, my whole quote dining room table, whatever that was, was just covered in photo album shit. And I think I was into it for like a year and then was like, well, well, I just have a, I have a lot of. I have a, what's that called? Deco Pasch?

No, the, oh, cardstock. Cardstock. Yes, you look at all the scissors with like the weird edges. With the weird edges. I was like, I'm going to cardstock and I'm going to make borders and it's going to be beautiful. And then I was like, no, I'm not. No. I tried.

Listen, we've got a whole TV show. That's the scrapbook. But see, this is the thing. Even when it's not going to last, I'm really committed to the thing I decide I'm going to try to do. Even if it's just for a moment. There's been so many hobbies. that I've been like scrapbooking. I'm going to do that.

Yeah. I'm going to learn how to, I don't know, play the guitar. Never did that either. But I have one. Do you heard of being an artist, though, I think? You know, you explore all these different ideas. I did try to learn to knit. Damn it.

That's right. We all picked up weird hobbies to keep ourselves busy on set. Yeah. A lot of, you know, pre-social media. Now everybody just, like, scrolls through their phone. Yeah. No, we actually talk to each other and read books. and had knitting circles, kind of, not really.

We would interrogate the new kids. And we got dogs. Yeah, guys, I didn't get a dog. I did. Little Annie. She was such a good dog. Annie. And Carolina.

Carolina. Carolina. You remember that little golden? Yeah. Little golden. I was a shoe lab or retriever. I don't know what she was. They were so sweet.

They were cute little farm dogs. Yeah. She ended up on a farm. I just wasn't ready to take care of an animal that juncture in my life. But I am now. Listen, before we wrap up, I have kind of a little surprise for us. I like surprises.

Joy always has good surprises. Yeah. Oh, what? Okay, so this was given to me by one of our executive producers, Greg Prange, at the rap of the pilot. Congratulations. Of the, of the, it could have been the end of season one. It was a big gift, so maybe it was the end of season one. I'm not sure.

I just were having this moment. definitely like the first at the very beginning. I mean, that's amazing. This is a 1996 box of Don Perignon. And it's not a box, it's a bottle. I definitely didn't get one of these. Yeah, Joy, what did you do that we didn't do? Yeah, I thought everybody was like,

you truly like reached out the pilot and you got a present. I guess that was what it was at the end of the pilot. So anyway, I've been saving it for, you know, since 2001, I guess, right? Three. Don't make it work. 2000-ish 2003 but let's pop it open

and let's actually enjoy this bottle that I've been saving for exactly the right moment Is there anything more dramatic and fancy than a vintage doll? No girl I love fancy and by the way like it's so nice to be in a moment where you know it's special like when we were kids I don't know that we

recognized it all the time and so reuniting now feels good because we know it's special and Joy's going to But, oh, okay, here we go. Wow. That was very professionally done. Thank you. I drink a lot of champagne.

Yeah, apparently. Look at the color. That's what you said. This is like a nice amber color. You're welcome. This is so special. I have moved several times with this bottle, so there's a good chance. It's terrible.

Well, honestly, that would be kind of perfect. We're such good actors. You'll ever know. I love you guys. I love you guys. I love you. Here are you guys to drama queens. Yeah, that works.

That's nice. Oh, wow. Well, kids, we're going to have a great time now. Yes, we are. We'll see you next week. What are we doing next week? Next week, we are re-watching the pilot. So before you watch our show, I mean, if you want to participate, go watch the pilot.

And then come listen. We're going to have a nice chat about all the fun things we remember. And who else knows what else is. going to come up. A little bit of shit talk. Just a little. Just a little. We deserve it.

Champagne. Champagne. Okay, everybody. We deserve it. Bye. Hey, thanks for listening. Don't forget to leave us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram at Drama Queen's O-T-H.

Or email us at Drama Queens at iHeartRadio.com. See you next time. We're all about that high school drama. drama girl all about them high school queens and forever we'll take you for a ride and our comic girl cheering for the right team drama queens drama queen the smart girl rough girl fashion but you're tough girl you could sit with us girl drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens drama queens it may look different but native culture is alive my name is Nicole Garcia and on burn sage burn bridges we aim to explore that culture somewhere along the way it turned into

this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.