Drama Queens - The Class of 2007 • EP420

Episode Date: April 10, 2023

It’s graduation day in Tree Hill and Joy, Hilarie and Sophia are looking back and reflecting on what they’re still learning.   Find out who rises as a surprising model mentor, whose humbling ended up being super hot and what moment brought everyone to tears.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. It may look different, but native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

First of all, you don't know me. We're all about that high school drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride in our comic girl. Drama girl. Cheering for the right team. Drama queens, drama queens. Smart girl, rough girl, fashion but you'll tough girl. You could sit with us, girl.

Drama queen, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens. Oh, you guys. Okay, how many of us are feeling big feelings right now? So many big feelings. This one was a sneak attack, it felt like. It made me weepy at multiple points, but God, at the end there, I just started to solve. I was like, oh, no, it's all coming out. Yeah, when Whitbury was talking to Nathan at the cemetery, is that what got you?

Oh, my God, we'll get there. Yeah. Just thinking about it. Killer. What a killer. killer. Oh, so beautiful. All right, kids, we're back with episode 420. Season 4, episode 20, the birth and death of day. It originally aired June 6th, 2007. As graduation day dawns in Tree Hill, some dreams begin as others end. Haley prepares for her graduation speech and her role

as a young mother, while Nathan prepares for life without basketball. Brooke makes a heartfelt confession that puts her future in jeopardy. Lucas confronts Dan as Karen's life is threatened. Peyton is awesome. Deb is awesome. None of this is in the synopsis, but it feels important. Mouth is awesome. Antoine is awesome. And so is Bevan. And let's go. Everyone is awesome. The Wall of Honor. Do you guys like that the only people on the Wall of Honor were our friends? Like no other kid accomplished anything in Tree Hill High School. I love that you noticed that. I love that it was purple, again, always purple. And it was made out of those little cardboard letters that preschool teachers

use on their walls. Yeah. That's cute. Arts and crafts. It is so weird, though, you're right, that there wasn't like somebody who excelled at Spanish, who we didn't know, but just another member of the senior class. Yeah, where are the science fair kids, man? Exactly. Someone did some incredible engineering project.

Neh. Just the main characters of the TV show. They were so rushed. It's the end of the season. The art department's like, I am not going to come up with six. extra personalities to honor on this wall. Not happening. Did you guys have like walls of honor in your high school? Sidebar, but remember we used to shoot at Laney all the time and they had that whole case.

It was all Michael Jordan. Oh, yeah. Everything. Here's what pissed me off. We had the like the trophy case and the wall of honor at my high school and it was only sports. And then I would go over to our rival high school where Pat and Oswald went. And he had a whole like. fucking shrine for theater.

And I was like, why don't we have a theater shrine at our school? And so he and I are rivals. And I just feel like he got a little bit more respect at Broad Run. Then I got a Park View. Yeah, I mean, going to an all-girls school, we had everything. Like, people's art projects would get featured on certain ends of the hallway. They'd do exhibitions of, like, the photography class, and there'd be photos from theater stuff. And sure, things from, like, I don't know, girls volleyball and whatever.

But we had boards all down. the hallways so there wasn't just like one zone there wasn't one construction paperboard there wasn't one sad little wall with four little photos i can't remember that makes me want to go back to my high school and walk around and i know the art room had a big we we had art in the basement and that there was always cool stuff on display there because there was just so much space but i don't know there definitely was a sports a heavy sports bent at my school too so i don't really remember anything else. Graduation ceremony is a big deal. I mean, the lead up to that is there's a lot going on in this episode. It's like you have all this trauma happening, but then this very

normal American right of passage also happening. And so the extreme versus the mundane is definitely on display here. I really liked actually, to your point, how they highlighted that in that montage series they did of everybody getting ready. And you see Brooke and Chase just playing, trying on their graduation gowns and caps. And it's so sweet and childish. And it's juxtaposed with Peyton and Lucas in the hospital and Nathan's at the factory. And you realize that there's just all this sort of disparate experience happening. I thought that was really a good choice. I think that's kind of what high school feels like. You know, everybody at school is its own little community and that when we're all experiencing the drama between each other,

but then everybody goes home and they have their whole home life and all the stuff that so many people in class don't know about. So it felt still very connected to real life high school in that way, too, that experience of all the drama that is behind the scenes that nobody knows about. Yeah. Well, it starts off with the bat shit stuff. I mean, we had forgotten Lucas shot at Dan. Yeah.

How do we miss that? Also, I just love when a high school kid is like a sharpshooter. He's like a shot right next to your face. Next time I won't miss. I was just like, this is so funny. It was a warning shot. Yeah, it was kind of hilarious. I was really intense.

I didn't expect Karen to be in a coma the whole episode. That surprised me. Me either. But I did really like seeing Lucas and Deb together because I don't actually know if they've ever had a scene together, have they? Remember he caught her with the pills in the kitchen and she was really threatening with him back then? So I love the arc of their relationship.

I love that she's mothering him in place of his mother. Yeah, that's good. And I like that she's ferocious about it. The way that Barbara can infuse something serious with really great comedy and ride the line of both things, I think is so cool. And when she walks into the room and is super sweet with the two of you, Hillary, and sent you away. And then she just slaps the shit out of it. She hit him, man. Wow.

That was brutal. but it was so, it felt so real and like she couldn't contain the emotion and she was so upset and it shocked me and it made me laugh and it was just like a perfectly played moment of intensity and I really liked that dynamic between them

I like that she calls him out and that he admits it to her and then confides in her and she's the first person to believe him that was special. I like that she cops to her crazy you know and principal Turner also hits this point when he and Brooke are together. And he says, I know I must seem ancient to you.

I loved that. It was so true. I'm sure Deb is feeling the same thing. Like, you must think I'm an idiot. You must think I'm so old that I don't know what you're thinking. And, you know, when we were the kids on the show, I say that in quotes, we did look at the people who are older than us as kind of separate in a way. And now that we're their age, it's like, no, I'm hip to what. all you little dumb-dums are doing? Yeah. Well, the funny thing is, is when you're young, you look at the generation above you and you think, man, they're old and they're probably missing it. And then you get into the generation above the young people and you're like, I know everything you're doing and everything you're going to do for the next 20 years, you ding-dong. I'm so much smarter than you.

I'm so much smart. Come on. Like, let me mentor you. Let me help you. And I like that in her way, Deb goes from being a parent who's afraid and angry to being a mentor, to being the person he can confide in and the person who gives him advice and the person who offers to protect him in that moment. It was a really cool arc for her in this episode alone. It's so true. It wasn't until my late 30s that I really started realizing

exactly what you were just saying, Sophia, that the older generation isn't out of it. They just are so far advanced and that you still feel like you're young. No matter how old you get, you still, there are still days when you feel like, I still feel like I'm 18, like I'm 20. And I remember my parents used to say that when they were in their 30s and 40s. And I was like, oh, whatever, I don't get it. But in high school, I definitely felt like us against them. I love that he said that. And it really resonated.

It just reminded me how I'm looking at my daughter now and Hill, I'm sure you look at your kids and remember the way that you looked at people your age when you were young. Right? didn't, I thought 30 was so old, but so not. My best friend Nick came to visit and he was just hanging out with Gus and like being around some of Gus's friends and just hearing some stories about school. And we were talking about how some of the other kids at school treat the teachers. And this sense of like kids being or adults being bullied by children or adults being put in their place by children, he was like, God, I just never even thought about it.

I always thought teachers were so secure and solid or just adults in general, we're so secure and solid. But we really are on the same emotional wavelength as like a teenager. There's an equality there that's so depressing once you realize that secret. You're like, oh, no, I'm never going to advance. I'm always going to feel this way. Well, it's like when you realize that being bullied always stings. Do you want, sorry, guys, the, oh, it's because I took his toy.

The puppy. I took the puppies toy way. Okay, you can have it back. Pay attention. Why is he pawing at my feet? It is really weird. You know, I can't believe he just said that because it reminds me. I was talking to a friend of mine about this on Sunday night,

and we were talking about how weird the Internet is because you think everyone's having the same conversation, and then you realize people really aren't. And I remember years ago, there was like a group of kids that were clearly fans of our show. who, like my Twitter just kept blowing up. They were doing what looked like a, it was like they were having a whole conversation with each other, but it was all in dialogue from our show. Oh, stressful. And I just thought it was so funny. And it just so happened that I was like sitting in the makeup

chair at work. And my Twitter just kept, like every 10 seconds, I had like 56 notifications. And so I started to read it and I was laughing. And I was like, they keep tagging me in all these things. Like, they're tagging a bunch of us. They want us to participate. I just happened to have my phone in my hand. So I responded with something and everybody laughed and it was funny. And then somebody said, I was like, one of your lines, Hillary from like when we were fighting on the show. Something mean. It was just something like sassy, you know. And so I hit back with the the like season seven Brooke, Julie, and Alex of it all. And I was like, oh, does Brooke Davis have to slap a bitch? Like thinking this is so funny. Because it was, you know, something about

hitting. And these kids went ballistic. And we're like, oh my God, I can't believe you would say that to me. You're an adult. How fucking embarrassing. And then it turned into, like, you evil hag. And I was like, oh, I guess you guys haven't actually seen the whole show. I thought we were playing a game. I thought this was charades. I was like, I'm so.

And I literally was like, so you're not on season seven yet? And then it turned into this, like, whole, it was so weird. And I was like, I think I need to leave the internet. Like, how do I get out of this? Nothing is what you think it is anywhere. And I'm a grown-up, and I'm very uncomfortable. and I think these kids are 15 and I'm just going to exit stage left. You wanted all the attention.

This has gotten weird. We can't tangle with teenagers, man. You can't do it. I was like, I'm twice your age and I'm uncomfortable. I don't know what's going on here, but I'm going. Have a good time. Here's some money for snacks, kids. Yeah.

I was like, enjoy. Let me know when you get a couple seasons advanced. No, I mean, look, there's a generational divide in this episode for sure. And it's weird for us to watch it at this phase in our life because now we're on the other side of it. I, oh, man, I feel like Whitey's the only true adult. Do you know what I mean? Yeah, for sure.

But maybe he's also not. I thought Karen was too. But then we saw this side of her that was of the vulnerability of needing, like the way she was getting sucked back into things with Dan. It's like that part of her, hadn't still healed from high school. It was like it was an open wound. Yeah. But yeah, Whitey seems to be the one who's always got everything under control. I wonder if Whitey's just so far past so much of his life experience, so far past his trauma, his wounds, that they don't affect

him in the same way. Because it is wild, right, at our age, which Karen is in the show. When something hits you and you go, oh, that happened to me 20 years ago, and it still hurt. when somebody pushes a finger in that bruise. Wow. Like, it can be shocking as an adult to realize you carry trauma around with you from the past. And I just, like, do you think when you get to be our parents age? You know, like, my parents are in their 70s. Do you think when you get to be that old, you're just like, ah, fuck it, and I did it all.

I'm good. I'm done. No. It's healed. Give me a cocktail. No? Maybe it's just whitey then. You get worse.

Yeah, because it's harder to change. The older you get, the harder you get, the hard. it is to change. You got no time. Well, old people who don't deal with their trauma, like old people who don't go to therapy are mean. Yeah. Get off my line. They're mean. It's true. QR. Better Help Add, go. Right. It may look different, but Native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly like very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric that this is something we've been doing for a hundreds of years. You carry with you

a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sageburn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. You know who else is an adult, though, in this episode?

Is Skills his dad? Yay! Love him. I loved him. I don't know who this actor is, but he was so. great. Why wasn't he on the show more? He was so natural. I wish we'd gotten more of him. I know. And he was just so in control and sensible and like the kind of guy you, he was another whitey type where you would just want to go sit down and have a chat with him and feel like

he would be embracing and give you wisdom. Oh, I needed more of skills as dad. But I loved seeing skills in Bevin in this episode because we needed the levity. So that was really fun. We needed the levity and what was nice because our show was so often so milk toast and was really afraid to talk about actual dynamics in a place like North Carolina I appreciated that

even though we gave it a very leave it to beaver ending, we acknowledge the fact that Antoine that skills had a different experience. We acknowledge the fact that it can be volatile, you know, in a small town in the south when like a white

cheerleader starts dating a black athlete like it was important to to not keep ignoring it. Yeah. It would have been nice if they had if they had gone into it a little bit more though. That would have been cool. It would have been a cool like season arc actually. It would have been a cool arc rather than a we know we haven't done this and it's pretty weird that we haven't.

So we're going to bop it in this episode and wrap it up by the end. You know, that's something that's so typical and unfortunate about I think big network shows as they try to like slide things in in small doses. But I was glad to see it. And to your point, it was. it was really fun knowing Antoine and Bevin as well as we do to watch them play a dynamic together and figure out how to put both heart and humor into it. Like, I liked watching them play those scenes because they did things with them that you know weren't on the page.

Even the fact that when Bevin even brought it up, or the skills bring it up, on the basketball court, the very first time it was introduced in the episode, and Bevin, the way it was written, I was just listening to the words going, this could have been really milked. It could have been like a meaningful, deep conversation that was like kind of scary. And I love that Bevin just, she just buzzed right through it. It was like all up here on this high level of like, yeah, well, all right, it's going to be fine. And if not, then they're not the parents I raised them to be.

That was my favorite line. It was great. Me too. That if not, then they're not the parents I raised them to be. I was like, that is golden. Golden. in. And by the way, from this vantage point, doesn't that hit differently? Because you go, yep, yep, when you go through life with your parents, you kind of have to be their parents too. Yep.

Yeah. I mean, even they're just textbooks were so different when they were in high school than they were when we were in high school and even more so now. You know, like, there is a re-education process. And so as a parent, I always want to know more from my kid, you know? Like, what are you hearing that I heard differently in the 90s, 8 billion years ago, you know? That's one of my favorite things about being a parent. Yeah, it's just learning. Learning things through their eyes and through as we discover new information and as everything changes, just being able to watch the world through her eyes. And not be threatened by it. Right. It's so educational. I love it. Yeah, I do love that skills family made an appearance. I wish they would

have made an appearance sooner. And I wish that they had been friends with Karen. Like if these little boys grew up together, I'm friends with all of Gus's friends' parents, you know? Yeah. That's a no-brainer. That's like she should have been sitting in Karen's living rooms from episode two and like a regular face that we saw all the time. Yes. Can you imagine what Antoine's mom's commentary on like the Deb and Dan of it all would have been? Magic. Magic. Yeah. Where was she when Karen started dating Dan. Like we needed it. Skills' mom's voice. Especially because Skills's mom could have been like, you're going to go on a date with that man who and fill in the blank of some high school experience, some terrible thing Dan did. Like she could have given us all the

backstory of them. And then we would have, to your point, had these experiences. I would have loved to have seen family dinners at Karen's with Lucas and Skills and Skills as parents. And like some of the other boys from the team, that would have been so special. Having, like, just sat through rec league basketball, which I don't want to brag, but Gus Morgan's team totally won the championship last week, you guys. And just so you know, it felt just like a Ravens basketball game. I was so back in it. Just like, oh, where's the confetti? But you sit there with the other parents and whether that's the only time you see them or you talk to each other all the time, like there's a bond there, unless you're the most anti-social awful person on the planet.

Karen's not that person so no she would have definitely been friends with all these other sports parents yeah yeah it's it's a shame I will it's I'm just going to rewrite it in my mind so that's how I watch the show from now on when I think back yeah I love that um well okay let's talk about Nathan because what's interesting is this role reversal of Nathan now working in a factory I mean I don't know the Lucas ever worked in a factory but a blue collar job and um I loved seeing a young man who is dealing with difficult circumstances make tough choices for his family and from a hopeful place he wasn't being a victim he wasn't like suffering through it it was i'm just i'm gonna do the right thing and things are going to work out and i'll figure it out and he had such a good

attitude about it and it really went along with haley's speech about the world doesn't owe you anything. I loved that because it's, I think it, I personally think that's so true. And I, I think we really got to see the mirror of that with what, how Nathan was approaching, walking into this new job. Well, for Nathan, I wonder how much of it is he grew up with the money. He grew up with the big house. He grew up with the camps and the privilege and all of that. And so the loss of that doesn't mean anything because it didn't it didn't solve the problems you know and so being with haley and having a strong family unit solves the problems that's the that's the thing to guard that's good yeah and i think it's really interesting too what what's sort of arresting about it when you when you watch

that scene between nathan and skills on the river court and skills of course assumes nathan's talking about did you get me a spot on your team? And then Nathan reveals, no, I'm asking if I can take the job and the shock because skills is as the story goes, you work hard, you move forward, maybe you get a scholarship, you know, you succeed upward. And the question being asked is, is Nathan now beginning to fall? This boy has fallen off his pedestal. He's not going to the best basketball school in the world on a free ride scholarship anymore.

And it's it's something I found really refreshing about seeing these kids talk about how hard it is to afford college, how hard it is to figure out your finances. You know, Nathan saying to Haley, we can't afford to both go to college, so I'll get a job. That's most people's reality. You know, they say that the average person in America is a $400 emergency away from bankruptcy. So how do you figure out those student loans? do you figure out that that future for yourself? And I thought it was really refreshing for the first time that I can remember anyway on TV. Seeing a kid who, to your point, had it all, all the money, all the camps, all the, everything was always covered for him. Every opportunity.

Yeah. And now he doesn't have anything. And he's got to figure it out. And the thing he prioritizes is his family. It really begs the question, which ties back to what you just said, Hillary. What is success? What does success really mean? Because everybody has this idea in high school of what they're supposed to become and how it's supposed to all. And we saw that when Haley was practicing her speech and turned around and saw Nathan covered in Greece and sweat. And, you know, it's like, oh, maybe it's not all about like my dreams and being everything I want to be. Like, what does success actually look like? I love trade school, man. I have so many kids that come and ask me about like college and what do I do if I want to do this. And, If I want to be in film, what's the trajectory? I love trade school. We need electricians in film. We need plumbers.

We need carpenters. We need all of these specialized skills. To me, they're every bit as important as surgeons, you know? And our country doesn't necessarily treat four-year or six-year graduates the same way they treat trades people. but I have pushed back against this any opportunity I get because I love a trade school. We have a program, I mean, we had a program in high school when I was growing up that was called Votech, vocational technology. And here we've got BOSIs in New York, man, get out there and learn a skill and like, work a job that facilitates a life that you love.

Yes. There's a big Votech near where my husband grew up in Oklahoma, and it's an incredible school. And like now even the the sort of electrical trajectory, like the track, if you want to go become an electrician, at that school is running all the way up to being able to build wind turbines for clean energy. That's awesome. It's incredible. And let me tell you something, when I'm at home trying not to electrocute myself, watching YouTube videos to learn how to install a dimmer, because like I just want the lights to not be so bright at night. I'm thinking, I really wish I'd taken some more practical shit in college because I don't know how to do anything and I'm learning it all from

the internet. Yes, because if you think about how much money now as as grownups and homeowners we spend on having people come over, you probably save your weight and tuition. If you just went to school after, you know, once you get out and you go have a life, you save all that money because you know how to do it yourself. It's incredible. And by the way, you know, to your point, Joy, you've ever done any work on your home or you've lived in your home when your parents have done work on your home. I'm like, man, it would be so cool to make a great salary as like a contractor or a builder. And, you know, you get to kind of set your own projects and choose your own stuff. I'm like, what's that kind of empowerment look like? We've got to sit around

and, you know, make tapes and wait for people to give us jobs. And I'm like, oh, I just want to learn how to tile my own bathroom. That is all I want to do. It's awesome that there are careers where you're not just sitting in an office. Yeah. I frankly, I'm just going to say it. I'm pissed that Nathan doesn't stay in the factory because when he came home all covered in grease and sinewy and mussely and ducky and dirty. Damn, wasn't that sexy? Y'all, I wouldn't have minded a couple seasons of Nathan just being mussely and lifting up heavy shit.

By the way, I love that the writers were like, isn't this sad? And the three of us were like, no, that's hot. So hot. It was adult, too. You know, there's, like, I like that Nathan has this dream of playing basketball, but it does have a Peter Pan quality to it of not quite wanting to grow up. And, you know, that is part of graduation. There are kids that go right into grown-up stuff if they're not already doing it.

And then there are the kids who have the privilege of continuing to be teenagers for another two, four, six years. I don't know. I'm a dropout. I got what I needed out of my first two years of school. I had a good paying job. I was producing TV. Cool. And so when my kid, I mean, my son is already stressing out about college. And I'm just like, I think I'm doing the reverse psychology thing where I'm like, are you sure you want to go that route? Are you sure you don't want to just start PAing when you're 18? Work your way up that way. Because I think so much pressure is put on these kids. Like you have to. You have to go. Yeah. Well, and so much pressure is put on kids now. to be good at everything. They're supposed to have like a sport, a musician, something, you know, like a musical instrument and an extracurricular and a debate team. And a charity thing, yeah. Yeah, like one thing. You're supposed to try out all the things and figure out what you like and then go do that thing.

You know, I thought I was going to be a heart surgeon. I had an arts requirement. I did a play. But you sort of were. I sort of was eventually. I played one on TV. But like, you know, I had an arts. requirement for a semester. I thought I'll go do this one play and it'll be fun. And it changed the

course of my life. I figured out what I liked better. I love to tell stories. I love to to be in community and it shifted for me. You're a different kind of heart doctor now. That's okay. Aw. Aw. We're empathy surgeons. Oh. All right. Hey, you said it. All right, Dr. Davis. You said it in the episode, you were like, why is every pregnancy on this show, like, so threatening? Why is every woman almost dying when she has a baby on our show? It's really weird. It's like an easy target for vulnerability, maybe? Yes.

It is a really delicate time, and it is, it can be very scary, you know? Anything can go wrong, but I don't know. It feels like every chick who gets pregnant has to be in peril so that a boy can come in and save her. How many pregnancies have we had on the show, though? Well, we know that we've got Karen. We know we have, Peyton is going to almost die.

Yeah. Brooke, do you almost die? Yeah. Okay. Oh, so every time, yeah, so in the trajectory of the future, this is what happens. And you got hit by a car while you were pregnant.

Yeah, right. Yeah, we forgot about that one. it's really weird I don't know guys I feel like we can do better it may look different but native culture is very alive my name is Nicole Garcia

and on Burn Sage Burn Bridges we aim to explore that culture it was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly like very traditional it feels like Bob Dylan going electric that this is something we've been doing for a kind of years, you carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence.

That's Sierra Taylor Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sageburn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I wish we'd known ahead of watching the episode today that Moira was going to be in a coma as Karen

the whole time, because I would have love to just grab her for five minutes and be like, is that fun for you or boring? Did you get to actually nap or was it annoying to have to come in and get into makeup to just get in a bed with your eyes closed? I have questions. It's fun. It's fun to come in and get. I had to be in a coma. You just could get your makeup on and lay down. It seems like Karen's in a coma for like a while, right? Oh, is she? Is she? I mean, he brings her in. Oh, in the episode. Yeah. Oh, days. Yes. Yeah, yeah. Because of graduation. And there was a track. We even tracked something all of us at the beginning of the episode. Lucas, Peyton, and. Deb are all in their clothes from the day that Karen was brought in.

Well, no, I changed my shirt. Oh, you changed, sorry. That's what it was. It was a weird clothing jump. Yeah, it's Lucas and Deb who are still in their clothes from the day before, the day Karen comes to the hospital.

But you guys have changed, Joy, you and James have changed. You're now in that, like, red and white tank top moment. So they're trying to show that it's overnights from the very beginning of the episode, from early scenes.

Yeah. Oh, and I, I got a tan overnight, too. Girl, it worked. Where'd you go for the weekend, Joy? Guys, was this the time? Do you remember, was it Rachel Kick, who set up the spray tan shower in the trailer?

Yes. And she had, like, did she do our airbrushing or hired somebody? But I think that was my first, like, airbrushed tan that I had gotten in the, yeah. So you don't remember this, Sophia? Rachel Kick was so fun. Tell everybody who Rachel Kick was. She was our makeup artist. She was great.

I did love Rachel. She was our makeup artist for a long time, but she came in, she came in and set up this, like, shower. I think it was also a year maybe we got a bigger hair makeup trailer, but she set up all of these curtains, the plastic curtains all over the walls on the floor. And then she just, we would go in there in our, you know, pasties in a underwear and they would just spray tan us. You don't, just, Sophia, you don't remember this? Not really. I didn't spray tan. I don't know if I did either.

I'm pretty pale. I don't like being in my underwear in front of anyone ever. I'm such a prude. Maybe it was just me and Bevin. I don't know. You guys were tan and glowing and all beautiful and stuff. Because I remember season four, there was a person who shall remain nameless, a producer who'd come out from L.A., who in a way that made me feel so uncomfortable, was like, look at your skin, it's like milk. And I went, thank you.

thank you ew so I remember that I was so that I was so pale in season four that people were telling me I looked like a dairy product I don't think I was getting a spray tan

look at you're like goat cheese yeah wow you're like a little cam and bear there almond milk that's so gross it's so creepy no Rachel Kick was fun she was so cool

yeah she was spicy man no I love the tan Tanning spray was fun. Yeah, you had a lot going on that was really good. You had like a really good Pam Anderson messy bun in this episode. Yeah, I love that messy bun. And the graduation hair, the big curls, I love so much. Did you have input in this graduation speech?

I think I did, actually. I remember, as I was watching it back, it felt like something I had tweaked. I don't remember specifically. but I do, it did feel, like, I really liked it a lot. Probably because I put my spin on it. It's better now. It was so great, guys. I rewrote it.

You know what? Fast forward to whatever season Brooke gets married in. I've said it publicly before. It's the same shit about her wedding vows. I'm like, you want to know why they were so good? I wrote them. There's a point. Like, by now in season four, we know our characters so well.

And the points you're making, like, really think about it. They even did the flashback in this episode to that scene with you and Lucas and Karen in season one with Julius Caesar. Yeah, that's right. All of this has been Haley's journey. Who knows that better than you? Yeah. Well, I mean, I think all the Julius Caesar stuff was for sure from the writer's room. I didn't, like, completely rewrite the speech.

But I did feel, at least toward the end of it that I had kind of, like, maybe the world doesn't owe us anything. I wonder if I put that in her. Maybe it was already written. and I really don't know. Sorry, I can't remember. I know they did the arc of the Caesar stuff, but I just mean for you, this journey and the points you're making,

like, it's your four-year arc is wrapped up in that speech. So I don't know, maybe it's just knowing what's gone into it. I can see it when you're giving it from that stage. It's really special. That was fun.

I remember that episode. It was weird. to be a graduation gown and cap again? We didn't have a capping gown at my high school. What? You didn't? No, we graduated in dresses, like in... Gowns?

Like full dresses, it was tradition. Please tell me it was like a ball gown. Everyone wears a white dress. Oh, yeah. Because the formal uniform at my high school is a white uniform, like a Sue Mills uniform with a green W on the pocket. And so the thing was like on every really formal day at school, everyone wears their white uniform since like, I don't know, 1910 or something. And so you would graduate in a white dress. And I mean, I guess you could wear a gown if you wanted to.

But some people were like cocktail dresses. Like this cool girl that I knew who was a year younger than me, Winnie, always wore a suit and she wore a white suit. Like it was always a vibe. Nice. And now I was actually, it's so silly, but I was on a Zoom with my, with the head of my school last week. Well, that's not silly. That's cool. They're so cutie. And she was like, well, we've transitioned to cap and gowns. And I was like, I only ever got one on TV. So it's so funny. So that's today.

Joy, what do you remember from your graduation? I had just gotten a tattoo. And I had to cover it and my foot was wrapped in saran wrap to keep the tattoo clean or whatever. And I remember I remember my parents had just gotten divorced like two years prior and both of them maybe had just gotten remarried like six months before my graduation

or something like that. So I remember there being some weird, a little weird tension. But mostly I remember standing up there and I was always still focused on this boy that I loved And, you know, is he going to sign my yearbook? And then, like, so there was a boy that I loved, and there were a couple others that I just had crushes on, like, in case the backup plan didn't work, you know? And I just remember all the yearbook signing and running around.

And I think there was a sense of emptiness, but also excitement. It was, you know, it was sad. And, like, I was happy to be leaving, but also it felt a little unfulfilling. I kind of in the same way that, like, a wedding or prom does, where, like, you know, it was sad. It's such a big buildup, and then it happens, and you're like, oh, okay. I don't know. What about you guys? Do you have specific memories?

Well, our graduation was covered by the local cable access network. Remember, like, Channel 3 was always, like, the local cable access channel. And they had a camera set up at the end of the aisle where you process in and then you process out. So you processed in, passing the camera. You went and you sat in the little folding chairs. you did graduation and then you process out and I this is a dumb thing to say but I had been a homecoming queen and the boy who was homecoming king also had the last name with a B was Matt Brownlee and we didn't necessarily like each other we weren't pals and as we're

processing out you know I'm like feeling kind of emotional and he processes out from the boy's side and I process out from the girl's side and we happen to meet up and he's like I'm going to stop you and I'm going to kiss you right in front of that camera and I was like you know what? Okay. And so on cable access

he like dips me and kisses me and stops the procession and you just hear all the parents up in the stands. She's like, what are they doing? Did all the kids hip and holler? Oh yeah. Everyone was like,

makeup, you know, it was like a big deal. It was funny. It was funny. It was so fun. It was funny. And it was like, it's nice. to be in a moment and know it's a moment and be like,

this is going to be something I laugh at later. But yeah, Matt Brownlee and I totally made out on cable access. It was, that's so fun. Yeah, I've never spoken to him again. I'm glad Brooke got to graduate. I thought that was really cool. I was wondering how they were going to handle that because I really, I mean, I knew you did.

I felt like I remembered that you did graduate, but I wasn't sure how they were going to handle it. And I liked it. I was happy that, you know, you went and made a case for yourself and he was like, all right, you're not going to be a bridge builder, right? Go. Go graduate. You're not going to study engineering. No, I loved that. And I loved that it was really for her to make it right, for her to be able to respect herself and to be willing to take the consequences, but still to say, I've done all this really good stuff and I think I've

grown a lot. And, you know, please don't, please don't ruin my life. But if you have to, it was funny because Please don't ruin my life Just please don't ruin my life I remembered that whole scene with Principal Turner and how it felt and what it felt like

to figure out how to play all of those lines because on paper they're a little ridiculous and we had this very sort of human experience as people

to our earlier point sort of seeing across the divide at each other I fully forgot Coletti ran into that scene I was so surprised when we ran up in the hall. We were all surprised. It was so cute.

Yeah, it was so sweet. I will say I was really relieved because, you know, you never know what you remember and what you don't. When we walked out, I was like, why isn't Brooke asking if Rachel can graduate? Why isn't she doing that? I was really bothered all episode trying to figure out, is she going to call her? Are they going to get her to come back? Like, how does it happen? Because she's at the party.

And then to realize that Turner did it. I was like, oh, that's a nice moment. that they gave to him to allow him to offer that kindness was, I thought, very sweet. A last hurrah for Principal Turner, who I don't know if we ever see again. Oh, he's so good, though. You know, like, my two favorite scenes in this episode are the scene with Brooke and Principal Turner and Nathan and Whitey. And I think that's because I have a really soft spot for teachers.

They have stepped into my life when I needed guidance outside of my home. And even as an adult, there's still my parental figures, you know. My teachers come and visit me and stay in my house. And I love that they can be something other than just, you know, who they are in the history classroom or the science classroom. Principal Turner's looking at the trajectory of Brooke Davis's life and making the decision, I'm not going to traumatize this kid. He probably knows that your parents aren't around. Like, teachers know everything. Yeah.

He knows what your variables are. And I love that he made a decision that would lift you up instead of taking you down a notch. And that's what good teachers do. They read the circumstances. I love that. Well, well said. So true. Well, the whitey, Nathan's scene.

Y'all want to talk about some blubbery women. Blubbering. For sure. Sobbing. And he gives Haley credit for it. He gives you credit for it. Oh, no. I thought he was going to retire.

I thought he was done. Just the way he comes through. And did he do it just for Nathan? Yeah. Nathan just looked his father in the eye and said, you will never know my son. Nathan just cut off the limb that is his parent, which is the hardest thing for a kid to do.

And Whitey, a short time later, steps right into the role. He is the father that Nathan needed. Yes, because Nathan's about to be a father. He needs someone to show him how to do it. He didn't have Uncle Keith to show him the way Lucas did. So now Nathan's got no father figure, nobody to walk him through how to handle a baby or a toddler or raise a young man. And yes, Whitey's stepping right into that role, that is community at its finest. And Nathan has twice the wound. Because think about it, he emancipated himself to get away from his toxic father. And then as he saw his father changing and becoming a kinder man and showing up for people and being more gentle and essentially, unbeknownst to Nathan, softening in the wake of the worst thing that Dan has ever done. Yeah. He welcomed his dad back in.

He said, I love you. I'm on your side. I know you couldn't have done this. Oh, yeah. I'll fight for you. Just tell me you didn't do this. And Dan can't do it. And so Nathan, it's not even.

just that he walks away from his dad, he's walked away and then been willing to let him back in. And that's sort of like, God, that double injury. And what I realized watching Whitey say, it's not a great school and they haven't won anything and there's this position. Whitey is showing up for Nathan in his moment of emergency in the way Dan did not, which led Nathan to take that money. Oh, God! Like Whitey's going backwards and healing past trauma for Nathan. Wow. And it's really beautiful.

I think that's why we all wept. Because for years now, we've wanted this boy to have a father who puts him first. And his father figure coach is the one that does it. And it's really beautiful. The conversation that Nathan has with Dan was kind of jarring for me to watch because I just spent the whole weekend doing some work on it couldn't happen here

the true crime show that I work on and what we run into in that scenario is a lot of people who refuse to believe the facts and they say things like no that person could never do that that person is not corrupt

but we have all the evidence that they are and that duality where anybody can be a good guy or a bad guy in your life and even if they're a bad guy in your life chances are they're also a really good guy in someone else's life

you know Dan has been recently a good guy in Nathan's life but a really really bad guy in other people's lives and it's so heartbreaking when you have to confront someone with that I think James did

such a good job because there's so much hope in his voice he's just yelled at his mother in the hospital and that was shot so cool because you hear the baby crying out the babies are crying out saying like fix me fix me give me what I need give me what I need and no one's giving them what they need as Nathan is visually tearing apart from his mother and he goes to his dad and he's crying out like just give me the reassurance I need damn thank you. god damn doesn't lie right like at least dan's not doubling down yeah yeah finally and paul did all of this stuff in this episode so beautifully when you watch paul play vulnerability in his physically intimidating stature his big tall body and we know how scary dan can be he has really

frightened any viewer of this show multiple times in the first scene with lucas where he's begging him to say he's wrong and and paul breaks eye contact with chat they're staring at each other and i realized when i when it happened i thought to myself i don't think i've ever seen dan scott break eye contact with anyone and he can't hold lucas's gaze and he looks down just just below his eyes and i went and then you get to this later scene with nathan and he can't even look at him and it's they're just really powerful choices by an actor you know he's always so specific about the choices that he makes there's always a reason behind it and i love that i love the i just love simple choices sometimes i've that happens to me a lot like i'll get on sets

and i'll start we'll start working on something and sometimes you just have to get the bad ideas out first and so you know it's like the big over the top stuff comes out and you're like trying to feel it in your body and where do you feel it and i remember doing that a lot in episodes with paul and he's so great as a director too because he'll let you he'll let you get it out and then he'll come up and say okay so now stop acting and just all that stuff you just did it's already in your body now so just say the line um and it works it usually works um yeah i love a simple choice. Well, we see Lucas having all this like grown-up conversation with Dan where he's being very firm. He's like, you will not be in my mother's life. This child will have me as an adult man in their

life the same way Keith raised me. You are unnecessary here. I mean, that is an adult conversation. But then I loved the scene between Lucas and Haley where you give him the gift that his mom has had for him, the bound copy of his book, and he says, I just want her to be my mom again. And that sense, that's what graduation is. It's like this, this cusp of adulthood. And I just want to be the kid. I want to be reassured. I want to be cuddled. I still feel all of those feelings. Like, do you ever just have a day where you're like, I really need to be babyed today? Yes. Lucas needed to be babied in that moment. I think that's what it is. I do that to my husband sometimes. I'll walk up to him in the middle of the day and go, will you just hold me just for a minute? Like we're both working and we have stuff to do, but can we just take a break? And will you just hold me for a minute. So good. I love Maria will do that to me sometimes. She'll see me in their house and be like, Mommy, do you need a hug. I do. I need a hug. I was on 11 and Gus was just like, hey, hey.

Come here. Come here, me. And you're like, no, you're not supposed to parent me. I'm the parent. I know. I always feel guilty. I know. It's like, yes, but please don't let this. You want, please. No. I think that's such guys, as a friend who watches you both parent, I think that that's such a beautiful sign that you're doing such a good job. You're raising emotionally intelligent kids who want to relate, who don't infantilize themselves around you. They trust you as they. their moms. But they also want to love and support you in the way you love and support them. Girl, when they're in therapy in like 20. I'm gold starring the both of you through the Zoom screen. I had to take care of my mother. Okay, we have a listener question. All right, let's do it. It's from Sam. Sam says, you all started your acting careers when you were pretty young. Was there any high school or college event or experience that you regret missing.

Oh, that's a good question. Yeah, I mean, I started doing professional stuff in like sixth grade. I was doing professional theater and had an agent in seventh grade. And it came down to a pep rally. When I was a freshman or sophomore, I got bumped up to varsity. And I also had this huge audition in New York City. And they're like, if you go to that audition, you are destroying the pep rally. for all these varsity girls.

And it might be their last pep rally. And don't you dare, Hillary Burton. Don't you dare do that. And I had to make this decision to like either jump into one pool or the other pool, but you can't have your feet in both. And it was weird.

I made it with such clarity. I was like, well, they're hiring old people to do high school shows anyway. I'm going to go to high school. And then when I do a high school show, I'll have lived it. And I'll have all this shit to draw from. And sure enough.

like one tree hill came around and I was like oh my god I manifested this no I like high schooled so hard because I knew that I'd had to give up something for it and maybe that's why I was just like clubs clubs clubs I wish I had done that's so cool I never did a sport and that's what I'm like I really especially as an only child it would have been good for me I really wish I had I had played a sport and I wanted to play soccer or even basketball um just something And I could never commit to a team because there were always plays happening in auditions and I just never knew when something was going to come up. And yeah, I mean, my parents gave me the option. But I kept choosing theater.

And I kind of wish that they had said this year, you're taking a year off. Just take a year off, play sports, learn how to, you know, be on a team. Yeah. Joy, you should join like an adult kickball league or something. Like there's adult leagues where you could go and play. That's fun. Yeah, that would be a good idea. Thanks.

I'll look into that, actually. See what's going on around here. All the dads in my community play volleyball. It's kind of weird, but also like... I love it. Yeah. I've got friends in soccer leagues. It's really fun.

Yeah. It's interesting because my school was so... But all girls' school is so specific. And we had, you know, theater was my thing there. And, yeah, there were sports and there was great art. There was so much to do there. But by nature, it was very... insular and very academic. And I loved that. But I remember thinking, you know, watching all the

things we watched growing up that I didn't know what any of that was like. So I had thought I wanted to go to, you know, like a small arts college. And then I thought, well, that's just more the same. I got to go have, I got to go do the movie thing, the thing I see on screen. So I picked the biggest school with the biggest football team and the biggest Greek system. And it was kind of like just trying on a different uniform. I had done one thing and I wanted to try on another thing. And I think for a long time, that's sort of what it felt like to me was, well, I'll, I'll try this on. I'll see what this feels like. You know, we went to do our show. And it was like, what's it like to be a, you know, young kid on TV. And it took me a while to figure out what I wanted

versus what I wanted to just try, to try on, you know. What was the idea? high school experience that you saw on TV? It just was like, I didn't know what it was like to go to a big sporting match. I didn't know what it was like to have boys in my class. Joy and I are like, man, you missed out. You know, there was no big, like, homecoming weekend. We didn't have that. And I wanted to know what that was like.

And so I went and tried it out. But, you know, our job as actors is to adapt the environments we're in. I've always been real good at doing whatever's going. on around me. But it took me a while to figure out what I loved to do and what I wanted to do rather than what was just good to support the group. And now the funny thing is, there's not an experience. I'm not like, man, I wish I could go to one more, you know, USC football game or one more whatever. I'm like, oh, I just wish I could go back and do one more year of communications with Professor Smith. I'm like, like, it's the classes I want. It's not the, it's not the stuff or the

clubs or the any of it it's it's truly just the school it's not the parties dude i went to all of them of course you said it's the classes it is like guys how many parties have we gone to and how much do the three of us bitch before we have to go to a party about what we're going to wear and how we're going to it's so stressful yeah we know when i think about adult life and how much we have to do and how many responsibilities we have what i wouldn't give for the luxury of nothing to do but Mr. A. Paul's history class? Oh, Mr. A. Paul. Nothing to do but get smarter. He looked like Indiana Jones. He wore the hat. Oh, he talked about, you know what I mean? Like, it was a fun class. And I was just, that would be nice. It would be nice. I would love to just go take notes as my

job. Look at this. I do it all day anyway. If that was it, oh, I would love it. You know what I miss? I miss the smell of burning dust from the overhead projector. Remember the overhead? And like you could smell it crackle. Yeah. The first time they turned it on like week two of class and you're like, there it is.

There it is. I love an overhead projector. God, that's what I want for Christmas. I want an old decommissioned high school overhead projector. Let's get on Etsy, guys. Let's go. It may look different, but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture.

It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for hundreds of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con

or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Do we have an honorable mention as the question? I don't know, the silicone babies.

Are those the honorable honorable mention? Tell them about the silicone babies. This is kind of a new thing. Like, it wasn't in the first few seasons. I just remember at some point they brought this. It's a baby made out of silicone so that it moves and kind of jiggles. Yeah, like when you're holding it, it kind of bounces instead of being a hard doll. Exactly. Yeah. But they were so creepy. And that they was like $10,000. Yes, they were so expensive. And they weighed like 12 pounds. So it was creepy because it looked really real. And if you touched it, like its little skin would smush and it had real eyelashes and like rosy cheeks. But it was so heavy that it just kind of felt like you were carrying a dead thing. It had rosy cheeks if they decorated it. Otherwise it was just ashen.

And it was this creepy, ashen-looking, weighted baby. With, like, fuzz on its head. Yeah. And sometimes they would smother it in jam to make it look like, you know. A newborn. And the texture of it. The texture of it couldn't be, like, matte or shiny. And so it had, like, this gummy quality to it.

Yes. Everything would stick to it, lint and everything. Yeah, the more you used it, the more it got covered in just, like, fuzz from your clothes or from the blankets. Gross. Gross. So gross. And that's why all I could think of when you, Hillary, you took the baby and sit down and Lucas goes outside and you're just like looking lovingly at this baby's face and like wonder and amazement. And all I can think of was the nasty little buzz covered, lint covered silicone face. And the dead giveaway that it's the doll and not the baby, because you can only

have the baby on camera for like 20 whole minutes in a day, is that you take it in that way where the whole time you turn it, you never turn its face toward the camera. And you're like, that's a doll. That's how you know it's a doll. Oh, my God, it's so gross. There's a lot of acting going on around here. That feels like a dishonorable mention because it made us all so upset. I want to know what,

we got to have a happy one, you guys. What's an honorable mention in this episode? I don't know. Is it Skills Dad or Principal Turner or... You know what it is? It's the trifecta of Step-in Dads. It's Whitey. A.

Principal Turner and Skills Dad, Chuck Taylor. That's it. Step-in Dads. Step-in Dads. Oh, I love it. love this instead of step dads step in dads i feel like there's a whole organization about to happen with that that's so cool remember that thing a couple years ago that there was um there was a school was it was it in southern california i can't remember the story went viral about how they were doing

a day at the school with dads breakfast with dads yeah and so many kids either you know grew up in single parent households or had dads who worked crazy hours and couldn't come and all these dads and the community came to school in their shirts and ties and sat in. That makes me sob. Oh, my gosh. There's a guy on Instagram who does this. I got to find his tab. Have you seen it?

This guy who, it's like breakfast with dad and he gives you advice while he eats? Yes. Oh, I love him. That's so sweet. I'm going to find that tag. Step in dads for the wind. Step in dads. Good job.

Yeah, let's spin a wheel before we prepare for the end of high school. I can't believe it, guys. We've done all of high school. We did it. It's intense. Really intense. Ooh. All right.

Our most likely two is... Most likely to get a speeding ticket. Me. Yes. The girl who wasn't allowed to have a car on the show is absolutely like the speedy. Mm-hmm. Uh-huh. Yeah.

I definitely have had my fair share of speeding tickets, unfortunately. Do you really? Yeah. I always get tickets. for dumb shit. Well, I'm an excellent driver. And so I feel, if I do say so myself, you're like, I grew up in New Jersey. I handle the tri-state area. I am. I'm like, I feel like I'm connected to the car. I could be like a race car driver. I feel really good. So when I'm behind a wheel, I don't hesitate. I'm not a, I drive with both feet sometimes. I know how to stop and go. I know

how to, you know, like come up fast on something, slow down, move out of the way, and navigate the whole thing. So sometimes if I got to get somewhere, I get a little too cocky, and, yeah, I've been pulled over a couple times. I mean, it's one way to meet people. I think maybe it's because I've done a lot of that training, like done some track stuff and some, you know, stunt training and cars and, like, high-speed chase stuff. Fun. That now I'm like, oh, I know how complicated that is. And now I'm the woman in my neighborhood who screams at people to slow down.

I'm like, where are you going? What's so important? What's so important you have to run over the neighbor's cat? Oh, my God, I have become that person who's just like, I don't have anywhere to go that's that important. And I never thought that I would be that person. Because, like, my favorite thing to do is be like, no, I can do it. I can do all the stunts for this high-speed chase. Watch, let's go.

Get the crane car out. Let's do it. That's right. And I don't know, man. I don't know if I burned it out. But I have become a very chill, very mellow driver. You cannot go speedy through a neighborhood. That's just a basic role.

You're not supposed to do it. People used to go so fast in my neighborhood in California. And I had fantasies about sitting out on my patio and just sitting there with a big bucket of eggs and wait, just waiting for cars to start speeding through and just nail them. I never did it. There's time. I don't know. Who on the show is meant what character? Yeah, which character do we think is a speed demon?

Who's got some aggression? Deb Probably Deb Yeah Yeah Yeah because I'm trying to think If anyone else

Like Nathan's not anymore Maybe season one He would What if Bevin I feel like it's got to be a girl It's just got to be someone That's like It's convertible season

Let's roll I know Bevan's a good one Yeah Yeah All right well Not us Don't speed kids

You've got plenty of time But we're out of time What do we got next? It's the all-night graduation party. It is. Episode 21, all of a sudden, I miss everyone. This is going to be, is this the Spice Girls' Dance episode that's coming up? We all, like, after graduation, I have the baby and we all go to the cabin.

Is that it? Wait, I have a baby. I can't go to a cabin and dance after I have a baby. No, we've been to the cabin. It's that, like, abandoned house. Oh, yeah, abandoned house. But do I do that after having a baby? Maybe it's...

Oh, yeah, girl. You sure do. Wow. That's going to be interesting to watch. Right. Well, good luck, everybody. Yeah, we'll see you next time. Hey, thanks for listening.

Don't forget to leave us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram at Drama Queen's O-TH. Or email us at Dramaqueans at iHeartRadio.com. See you next time. We're all about that high school. Drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school. Queens. We'll take you for a ride and our comic girl. Drama, girl. Cheering for the right team.

Drama queens, drama queens. Smart girl, rough girl, fashion, but you're tough girl. You could sit with us, girl. Drama queens, drama queens, drama queens. Drama queens. It may look different, but native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis the 4th, who opened the first native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

This is an IHeart podcast.