Drama Queens - What's Next • EP 805

Episode Date: February 3, 2025

Wounds are... well, gross! Joy and Rob talk about Quinn's very realistic gunshot wound, and Joy shares a story about an injury that involved superglue. Rob is shocked by the darker side of Victoria this season, and Joy remembers feeling emotional while filming a particular scene with Sophia, as she felt disconnected from the cast. Plus, Rob and Joy reveal which OTH character they would bring back for another season.See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. It may look different, but native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first Native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

First of all, you don't know me. We're all about that high school, drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride and our comic girl, cheering for the right team. Drama queens, drama queens, smart girl, rough girl, fashion but you'll tough girl, you could sit with us, girl. Drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens. All right. What's up, Joy? All right, all right. That wasn't my best, McConaughey. How's yours? Probably worse, so let's stick with yours.

Okay. I would hate to turn people off of the episode six seconds in, so we'll just save it for a different time. Yeah, no problem. No problem. How you doing? Well, hey, everybody. Hey, I'm good. How are you? How's your day? We're doing this one a little later tonight, so you guys are catching us at the end of our days here. Yeah. a little exhausted, a little punchier, a little slap happy. We'll see.

How was everything with the kids today? Was it like a nice, easy, smooth, chill day? Or was it like a manic, wild, crazy day? I have a three-and-a-half-year-old. There is, it's just varying shades of anarchy. And today was, it was like, gong show. Oh, no. Yeah. Yeah. How was your day? My day was actually pretty chill. I just organized. from top to bottom. I decided to start spring cleaning a little early. I have always been a

bit of a messy, messy brain, messy person. And I look around and suddenly I see piles everywhere. And I'm like, oh, my God, I can't live like this. And I can't get anything done like this. So I just decided to take the week and I'm going from the back of my house to the front. And I'm every bobby pin, every sticker, every post-it note, every ticket from a that train in London from four years ago that's in the bottom of that purse and the back of the closet like everything is getting cleaned and then uh you know in the meantime i take some time to watch one tree hill oh yeah great segue welcome in everybody this week we have season eight episode five nobody taught us to quit air date october 12th 2010 synopsis reads

As Clay is discharged from the hospital, Nathan contemplates walking away from the NBA. Meanwhile, Brooke and Victoria disagree on how to handle the company's financial problems, and Chase discovers a secret about Alex, directed by the one and only James Lafferty, and it was written. And it was. It was written by a room of writers. That's right. Took a village. Well, what did you think? What do you think of this episode?

I really enjoyed it. Yeah, me too. I loved the start with, it was so perfect that Jamie wanted to see Quinn's gunshot wound. Also shout out to Rocky because that thing looked so real. So gross. And so real. It was really, really real. Yeah, that was fun and oozy.

Yeah, I love this. We just keep up with this narrative of the, well, the literal narration of the story happening, which is how One Tree Hill always started. So I love whenever they bring that in because nostalgia is big. And I like Haley writing her letters to Lucas, keeping him in the loop. I wonder, do you think they did that just to, like, maintain the nostalgia? Or do you think they were, like, trying to get Chad back and, like, trying to build it? Maybe they were, like, talking to him and trying to build up, like, audience love, and then it just didn't pan out?

I don't think so, because if you remember in season, towards the end of season seven, when Dan had his talk show, there was that really crappy line he had where he's like, we should bring Lucas on for a guest. God knows he's not doing anything. Oh, that's right. Yeah. No, they definitely were not trying to. No. I think it's a two birds one stone thing, right? where it's something for the audience because it's connective tissue to Lucas, someone

they're all missing. And then it is also a pretty clever way of just doing a little exposition. Yeah. Yeah, it is. Emotional exposition, as it were. Catching everybody up. Yeah, and what she was saying actually was really cool. I liked that what they had me talking about how hard it is to see how many people out there

are hurting, but how heartened she is by the fact that people keep reaching out for help as she's working at this crisis hotline. It is nice to, it was nice for me to think about that because I think a lot of us just kind of suffer in silence. I know I do. I'm like, it's not, I'm the last person to reach out when I'm feeling depressed or having a hard time. It is so painful to pick up the phone and call someone because I just don't want to be

a burden. And I always, which is so weird because I never, ever think that if a friend is having a hard time and calls me. I'm never like, oh, God. Yeah. You're flattered. I'm kind of busy right now. Yeah. No, I'm like, oh, thank you. Let's talk. I want to be here. I want to matter to you and help you and do something meaningful with my life. And if I can show up for you, that's amazing. And how can I help? Yeah, so I don't know why I have such a hard time reaching out. Are you, have you, like, evolved to this place, Rob, where you can just pick up the phone when you're having a hard time. Is it easier for you?

It's still the 1,000-pound phone, but I have my, the time between discomfort and reaching out is continually getting shorter and shorter. But I still, I still do the same thing, because it's old behavior, that whole, like, I don't want to be a bother. Yeah. When, just like you said, it's like, when a friend reaches out to me, it's, they're giving me an opportunity to show up for them and show them that I care about them. So I'm like, dude, I'm here, what's up?

You know what I mean? And so I'm getting better. But suffer and silence was sadly kind of my mantra during the show Because this was pre-therapy and stuff And I was just struggling in it But it was like, I don't want to be in imposition Yeah, yeah So yeah, I did the same as you

I'm glad things like this crisis hotline exist I didn't even really know it that it did Until we started filming this episode And I was like, crisis hotlines is a thing you can do I mean I knew there were numbers you could call If you were in serious mental health like self-destructive mode. But I didn't realize it was just some place you could call if you were feeling lonely and

needed somebody to talk to. And I love that even just the opening, just our show is introducing this to people as something that is a possibility if you aren't yet comfortable calling your friends or feel like you don't have anybody close enough that you could pick up a phone and call somebody like Haley James. Yeah. It's really sweet. It is a nice way to kind of spread awareness.

also normalize it. Yeah. You know? Because again, if you, you know, grew up like most of us, I think there was a, there was a stigma to asking for help, you know, it was considered weak, whatever that means, you know. So it was nice that our show was sort of putting it on the map. But going back to the gunshot wound, I love, you had some really funny moments this episode. And I love when the show gives you opportunities to be funny because you always just crush it. And I love that you come in the bathroom and Quinn's like, no, no, no, it's gross. And you're like, trick i'm a mom i've seen much much worse like please get over yourself and she pulls off the bandage and you see that pussy wound and you immediately are like nope i'm out hard pass and you just walk

out of the room and jamie's like so gross god so gross i cannot ugh i feel i mean are you okay with wounds and blood and stuff like can you manage to if you're you know if your kid falls down you just take a needle and stitch something or super glue or like are you all good with that uh i listen i like a needle like having to stitch my kid up no but that's just because i have no medical training i'm okay like around blood and and wounds and stuff i think if anything i'm a little more sheepish when they're my own. Oh. When it's one of my people, I can kind of be just, like, detached, like a mechanic.

Like, okay, yeah, that's a lot of blood. Like, cool, I'm going to help you. We're going to fake. You know what I mean? Yeah. Whereas if it's me, I can get a little squeamish like, ooh, that's, I'm seeing much farther into my tissue than I would care to right now. Is that bone?

I'm going to pass out, you know. How about you? It does depend. And I, with my daughter, I'm very calm under pressure, like anything I can handle. You know what's actually worse for me is if someone describes a wound. If someone is talking to me about an injury, my stomach immediately lurches into my, into my throat. Yeah, I mean, in an emergency situation, I think I can detach. I'm trying to think of any time when I've been, no, it doesn't gross me out.

And my own stuff I didn't. Oh my gosh. I had contractors working on my house and they were doing some floors and a floor vent got left open but it was like on the far side of the room and when I say open the floor vents are just a whole cut in the wood

but then it has the usually it has that metal thing over the top of it so they didn't have the metal thing on it but it was like far away on the other side of the room by a window and I didn't really go in that room very often so it really wasn't a big deal except that the i don't know if she was jumping on the trampoline in the next room but anyway the curtain rod fell down so i went to go fix it and so the curtain was covering the hole and i didn't see that it was open oh no is your stomach larching into your throat so i step into this hole but it's right

on the edge of the curtain so it's not like the curtain was going to protect my foot and and as i step into this hole the the freshly sliced wood freshly slices into my foot and I felt it and it was one of those super sharp cuts that you know it's going to hurt like a mother in about 30 seconds maybe 20 but you've got a very short window of time before all of the nerves start kicking in and they look down at this thing and it is down this this cut has got to be at least an inch and a half down into and you know your foot's kind of there's not a lot of meat there so it's um it's on the side of my foot and it's it's about an inch long and then probably an inch and a half deep into my foot so I looked at it

it was a perfectly clean slice and I could pull the sides of my foot apart and you could see right down into my muscle and like I'm not sure how I was like okay what am I going to do short window of time I hobbled very quickly into the kitchen where I have my medicine cabinet and I grabbed a little bit of super glue and I stuck that thing back together and I put a band-aid on it and I just left it alone wait I just pretended like it didn't happen you used house hold super glue on an open wound? Yeah, that's what you do. Seriously?

Yeah, I dated an Army Ranger once and he told me that that's just what they do. They just have super glue and they just like deal with their wounds with super glue. And I thought that was the craziest thing when I heard it. But in that moment, I was like, okay, I'm going to do it because it didn't look dirty. There was no sawdust. There was nothing in it that I thought I need to clean this out. I'm just going to close this thing up and I hope it goes away, which is probably very dumb. of me. But it, it turned out okay. I just didn't look at it. Didn't take the band-aid off for about

four days. And it, it healed. You just hoped and prayed for the best. What's so funny about this moment is I have to imagine that with the listeners, I'm curious what the ratio is of people who gasped because they thought like me that you can't put super glue in an open, uncleaned wound and also the people who already knew that. So, but it was a comment. let us know just where you were on that because you just kind of blew my mind that that's even an option it's a possibility so hey if you're in the wilderness i don't know if you're a big camping guy but uh keep some super glue on you i guess so man wow okay anyway wow we got off we got off the rails so it took you and i about 40 seconds of talking about the episode before we went on a 10

minute diatribe about injuries and wounds it's my fault every time i'm so sorry i I just feel like I can talk to you, Rob. That's it. I just feel like I can tell you anything. That's why I wasn't trying to wrap you up. I wanted to know where that story went. And you know, it got us to super glue. It sure did.

Well, no super glue for Quinn's wound. That thing is gnarly and it's going to take some time to recover. But I did really like seeing Quinn and Clay happy. I liked seeing them, like seeing him up and about getting, I mean, getting ready to get out of the hospital. You guys got all dressed up. which is so cute. Yeah. Did you find it funny that there was hospital staff mixed in with some of the friends outside the hospital?

Okay. I wasn't sure if you want to talk about the end. Yes. I did think that was really strange. Look, I loved the line. First of all, if we're going to talk about the hospital stuff, I loved the line that you said, they wheeled us into this place. We're walking out. They wheel us in.

We're walking out. So good. So strong. I feel like that's actually something I could use in life. But yes, I did think it was really funny that hospital staff was there clapping. Also, the handful of confetti that Jackson throws that turned into an unending overhead release that just kept going. Like we're at Madison Square Garden. As everyone hugs Clay, it was very, it was cute. But funny. Wait, so I didn't notice that did we not see anyone else with confetti in their hand? No. Oh, that's so. I mean, not that I noticed. Because it looked like a couple of confetti cannons went off.

It sure did. I remember shooting it. And I think you even see it in the shot where I'm like, my hand is up and I'm actually squinting because I'm genuinely like, this is far too much confetti. You just see the one thing, just Jackson, little Jackson with his hands and he just drops one big thing. And it just keeps going and going and going, like one of those birthday candles that you can't blow out. That's so funny. Well, yeah, the hospital staff out there, I thought to myself, it's, I wonder if they realized having four cast members, if they just thought it wasn't enough. But I just, I was laughing thinking, like, it would be so cool if we panned out.

And then you saw like a patient in distress in one of the windows and there was just no medical staff there because they were downstairs cheering for us. I love the way your brain works. It's great. I just told myself, like, it's Tree Hill. It's a small hospital. Maybe it's a slow day, and they're very excited for us. But I thought, in real life, I mean, I guess, dude, we don't need to go off on a tangent. Whatever.

It was sweet. It was sweet. But you did really get dressed up. This was beyond just looking nice. I mean, you were really Quinn in that dress and you in that suit. That was a big deal. my first thought was that's so much clothing to put on when you're that injured yes yes that's kind of what i was thinking too yeah to me that feels like it's your lulu lemon jumpsuit all day yeah it's a

track suit that's it you know it's sweats and it's a it's a sweatshirt so the fact it was done up i i appreciate maybe he was all hopped up on you know goofballs and pain meds but that's a lot of clothing to put on when you are just barely past death. I mean, I think it's just, this is mental fortitude, right? He's like, I'm going to prove, not only am I going to walk out of here, I'm going to walk out of here in a three-piece suit. I'm going to make sure that I'm sending the message that I'm ready to roll, but quite ambitious.

And then walking back into the house. So what I really wanted, I really desperate. really want a version of that scene where we go back in the house and we're just like, okay. And then we walk into the bedroom and there is still just smeared bloodstains all over the carpet and we're just like, Nathan tried his best. He should have got professionals. A little call back to the previous episode when he just gets down his hands and knees with one sponge in a bucket. We needed you directing this episode. Oh my gosh. Well, no, James did a great job, but we needed you directing a comedy version of this episode that they actually would have let you.

Yes, yes, the gag real version of it. The gag real version. Yeah. So it's... A for effort, Nate. Yeah, I mean, he really, clearly that carpet had been replaced. The fact that they go back into the same... I don't think I'd go back into the same bedroom.

I couldn't just go right back into my bedroom and go to sleep. I would have a really hard time with that. I don't know. I don't disagree with you. Does Quinn not have a home? Quinn came into Tree Hill and stayed with Nathan and Haley, and then she was like, I'm getting divorced. I'm going to move in with my boyfriend. She just doesn't have a house.

I think that's right. All right. I was going to say you guys could go to her place, but I don't think we've seen her place. It may look different, but Native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges. we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional.

It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for the kind of two years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Teller Ornales, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con

or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Going with the whole, like, they wheeled us in, we're walking out, it's, there is sort of a bravery and, like, I'm not going to be a victim mentality that that kind of tracks with, I'm going home. Get back up on the horse.

I'm choosing my life. Yep, I'm not going to be intimidated. I'm not going to change it. So, you know, all that I kind of get and don't bump on. The through line of what's next, I thought, was woven through this episode. episode so well. Oh yeah. I loved that. It was great, man. Such, such a good connective tissue for everyone's stories. I love that we're seeing more of, of Lee. It's been a very nice welcome change. Trying to find himself, trying to figure out for himself what's next. This was fun. Yes. And that first

scene with James, excuse me, with Nathan and Mouth at Rivercourt was great. Yeah. It was like sweet. friendship, and then they let Lee do comedy for basically the rest of the episode. And he's so dang funny. He's so, he always shows up. He's so good. Mouth's loneliness was so much fun to watch. I mean, when Julian comes over and, and I think Malthas Leni goes, hey, would you like a soda or a beer? And he goes, no, I'm good. And he goes, do you have any soda or beer? And then Julian goes, no, I just want to, you know, we can do a documentary. And he's insistent that they start it immediately. And then he's like, great, I just want to get your day-to-day stuff. And he comes out. Talk about a three-piece suit. With his hair slicked back, acting just like

such a Wall Street dude, bro tool. And, and, And all the while, like, it's so good and it's so cheesy. And then the end of it, he drops a pack of condoms and goes, oops, magnum condoms. That's embarrassing. It's like, what head trauma have you recently had? Like, what? He turns around and the tag still on the suit. Oh, God.

It's so good. It felt like a sitcom. It was so fun. And what's really great about it is the idea that Julian was that Mouth knew that his life was so boring that he was going to have to do something. So he goes all out for Julian. Julian's like, no, man, I promise. I just want your everyday life. And then when he gets it and Mouth is just sitting on the couch, picking up his toe lint and, you know, almost ordering something really stupid on QVC.

And Julian's like, actually, this is bad. This is really bad And then the next scene where Julian's He's packing up his equipment And mouth goes like Hey man I'm sure you can't stay any longer And it's Austin killed it He starts to speak

He goes The thing is And then there's a knock at the door And without skipping a beat He goes thank God And just rushes to the door He's so good man I just I love watching our friends do great work

You know Like I just want to cheer them on. I also, speaking of what you said at the beginning with Nathan and Mouth, there is a maturity that we're seeing happen with Nathan right now. And I love just him being intentional. Talk, I mean, talk about relying on your friends and reaching out to people. Nathan's showing up to sit down and talk with Mouth and just encourage him.

It feels like something that we don't see, again, we don't see modeled a lot for men. on television, especially at that time. And just to see two guys sitting there really genuinely encouraging each other without it being like, oh, we're being emotional. This is awkward. It was so cool. It's like, all right. Good on us.

Especially for a teenage show. Yeah. You know, it's one thing if they, there were probably some shows doing it with like 30, 40, 50 year old guys. But yeah, our show was young and cool. So, yeah, it wasn't very common. place but yeah Nathan's journey lately this whole season has been awesome yeah talk about a guy finding himself discovering himself and hitting his stride and it looks good on him it sure does

it's a good season I also we should talk about the opening credits on this one I'm not I'm not sure who the band was uh I really appreciate that they were trying to just do something different. You know, somebody hands you a song and they're like, do your own spin on it. You know, it's not going to work every time. You can't, you can't net the ball every single time. But what this highlighted for me, Rob's silently laughing by in the mic, what this highlighted for me is how good Gavin is, how good this song is, because the song does.

work in a lot of different contexts, and then it highlights how good his version of it is, too, and how exactly right it is for our show. And not just this particular band's version, but all of the versions that we're seeing this season, I appreciate different things about all of them. It's nice, but every single one of them just reminds me, yeah, we got Gavin deGra guys. Like, his version just really hammers at home. I was smiling and laughing because the way you started that was the drama queen's version of oh bless his heart you're like I appreciate that they took a different crack at it and I was like oh here we go joy talk some shit you have an opinion on this I do I'm sorry look I don't get it right every time either so yes you do and

who am I kidding yeah but so anyway just a just a just a reiteration of how much we love Gavin. We should bring Gavin on this podcast at the time. Do you think Gavin's watched the show? I don't, I actually don't know. I should ask him if he's watched the show. I haven't talked to him in ages. Yeah, he guest starred on it, but I don't know if he ever sat down to actually watch it. He doesn't seem to me like someone who enjoys sitting down and watching himself on television. I feel like Gavin keeps his head down, but I don't know. Maybe I'll reach out. I haven't, that would be fun to have him on.

Speaking of keeping your head down, should we discuss the prison of it all? Please, let's discuss the prison of it all. Okay, let's get ahead of ourselves because I have a specific hair question for you. Okay. At the end of the episode, when Victoria, they just do one shot. They cut to Victoria watching it in the big house. Yeah. And she has a different hairstyle.

Wow, where it's essentially like they took all of her hair and then just flipped it all back. Oh, yeah, the helmet. It's like a helmet. So is that a, was that a look? Is that supposed to be a prison thing? Because it was the only time we've ever seen it. And I immediately was like, what the hell is that? It might have been, or I don't know, Daphne is, she might have just run her hands through her hair before the take and been like, I just want it out of my face.

I just want it out of the way. As long as it's just out, it's fine. It is kind of like it's like a dynasty pompadour look. Yeah. I think it looked great on her, but it's definitely more of like a Robert Palmer girl 80s. So I don't know if they did that on purpose or if she just ran either way, whatever she did. She just manages to look fabulous all the time. But, okay, if we're going to talk about this and the prison stuff, before we get into like the character detail,

did you notice that Brooke So she comes to prison Talk to Victoria Then she leaves She talks to somebody else I can't remember who it was Who it was who says You really need to go say

All these things to Victoria So she goes And then it's like Immediately she's just there Sitting back down Same outfit I guess it's all in one day But it just felt really strange

It felt it felt like We just shot both scenes At the same time Which we did And I don't know I was a little confused I thought maybe like time had gone by

But it just seems like it's so hard to drive all the way to prison. Like the prison's not just like in Tree Hill, right? It's got to be kind of far out of town. It's like she's in a state penitentiary, isn't she? I didn't notice it. Okay. But it would have been funny if she was like, I want to put on my most pissed off outfit. She's just spite changing.

Yeah, it was like a leather jacket, like diamond earrings, hair slicked back. I said, okay, go, Brooke. I had this question as I watched that first scene where Victoria really just comes down super hard on her and takes some real, real, like, crummy shots at her. Like beyond disappointment, she says some things that are just straight up cruel. Yeah. For me, having come late to this party, I felt like it was way out of character. And I found myself going, so, like, has this whole thing been? an act or is this what everyone is this who she was seasons one through six well she wasn't in

the show until season wait when did she come on was it five i didn't realize she was on so long before you so yes okay victoria five okay so she's just before you so the whole arc when she first comes in is just what a nightmare she is how difficult her relationship is with Brooke because they, I mean, they have no relationship because she's always been on the road or dismissive of her. She's, Brooke was left to fend for herself. And Victoria is conniving and always doing some kind of underhanded thing and you can never trust her. And she's like the Dan Scott. So the fact that Victoria and Brooke have gotten to where they were when you joined the show and then progressed in that way, it's been this massive redemptive arc

to watch Brooke and her mom find a relationship and to watch a woman who was really hardened and manipulative to trust and soften and find the parts of herself that are vulnerable and want the best for her daughter and admit that she's, that she wants to be a mom and not resent Brooke for making her a mom. so it's yes to answer your question there have always been like she was talking about how i never wanted to get pregnant i you know i had to have you and like it was really horrible below the belt stuff and so yeah it's been a big redemptive arc but now to see victoria's all the claws all the insecurities just making the worst of her come out in this moment in prison it's so devastating because

you think, oh, she's come so far. Did she really come so far? And it's just old habits die hard and the insecurity reflexes are causing her to self-protect. Or was all of it still some form of manipulation or like building a false identity of like, well, okay, I can find my value as a quote-unquote good human. I can redeem myself if I'm a good mother. and by being a good mother, that means sacrificing myself for the company. But if Brooke foils that plan and takes the company away, then her sacrifices for nothing in her mind. So then that would affect her identity, I guess, is my armchair psychology version of it.

But it was sad. It was really sad to see all that come out. Yeah, I mean, okay, so if you haven't seen that part of Victoria at all, were you completely thrown for a loop? partially not entirely because I've obviously like gleaned enough from like comments made and just conversations that we've had around the show that she was a terrible mom it was it wasn't like I was having an issue because it didn't make sense to me it's like listen like you said her plan just got upended she's in prison it could be going terribly we have like there's a million reasons why she would be spread thin and just snap

It was more for me that I was sad because I have been loving watching her and Brooke like start over and form this beautiful thing. And it just made me go, oh shit, you're damaging that so bad right now. And it makes me question like if it's all been sincere. So long, so much effort put into building and repairing this relationship. and she just throws it all away the second that her, I mean, it's pretty high stakes. She's in prison and she thought she was making a sacrifice

that was going to pay off on the other end. And it didn't. She just has to suffer the consequences of her actions with no payoff. Oh, yeah. It's also, though, you're in prison. You have nothing to do except think. So you would assume that after she walked away and she had a chance to cool down that she would be like, shoot.

Yeah. Yeah, I got to walk some of those things way back. Yeah, well, she's clearly been not self-reflective during her time in prison. She's got her assistant Adele, and she's been making all of her plans for how to move the company forward. So now what is she going to do? Oh, Victoria. Oh, Victoria. She'll bounce back.

I loved the runner throughout the episode of Nathan avoiding talking about things. And it's so great that Jamie, such the wise owl. I love that the show constantly makes him sort of the wise owl, like from the mouth of babes. Because first of all, there's the bit where it's actually in the same conversation when Nathan hasn't told Clay. And Jamie essentially goes, of course you have. and like you avoid things and he's like what right no i don't that's the beginning of the runner but then there's this incredible line that jamie has where he says i wish you were a bobcat and i know you do too and i figure if you're not playing you must really think it's for the best and if i can

understand that clay will too so wise wisdom and perspective from him so it was a very sweet moment between the two, but then it's this awesome thing where Julian shows up at the house as Nathan's leaving. There's also the exchange about it's a bag, it's a man purse, it's a satchel or whatever, which I have to say though, even in that moment, I didn't even really mind even though it's like so obvious. They just tried to do everything they could to make Julian like not a sexy leading man and they failed. Didn't work. But I liked that they're being. The banter has gotten way less pointed and much more playful. Yes.

Because they were in the driveway, which reminded me of when they were in the driveway last season for the camping episode. And out of nowhere, Nathan is just a jerk. Why is he? He was so rude to him. I can't remember what we decided, but I remember us talking about this. Like, what the heck, dude? Why do you?

Why? Yeah. Whereas now in this one, I went, okay, these are. these are just two, these are two pals giving each other grief. Yeah. Like, this is great. But I love it because Nathan goes, do you see Claire? And he goes, yeah, yeah, I was just there.

And he goes, you didn't tell him about my decision, did you? And he says, no, Jamie told me that you avoid talking about things. And Nathan has a call back to his previous scene with Jamie where he goes, I'm totally going to take his PlayStation. Because he says something to Jamie like, if you do this, I'll take away your PlayStation or whatever. But like, it's this great thing. And then it's Nathan, again, being self-aware and actually caring. So he starts kind of crowdsourcing. He goes to Haley and he's like, hey, do I avoid things? Yeah. And at first, Haley's like, no, I don't think so. And he's like, yeah,

the clay thing. And you're like, oh, no, you're absolutely avoiding that. Yeah. but native culture is very alive. My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric,

that this is something we've been doing for a hundred of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. That's Sierra Taylor Ornelis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic-Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage, Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

side note the cross body bag um what people don't know is that our creator had a real issue with girls wearing purses across their bodies for some reason and we got like an official note like a ban on cross body purses for all the girls so you'll notice at some point we all stop wearing our purses over our shoulders i guess it wasn't sexy that is a weird thing to have a strong take on don't you think that too i agree yeah desperately clawing for control i remember once we were walking through the scene we all had our purses on and somebody probably scripty i don't know somebody came up and was like um so we've been asked for you to take your purses off your shoulder and put it on your other shoulder

or like switch sides is it bad for camera and they're like no like not across your body like is this a wardrobe issue is it why this is how everyone this is how we wear purses like every go look at every single girl on this college campus they're like no it's a it's coming from the top down like oh my god okay fine whatever yeah that's an odd one yeah that's one of those ones where you just shake your head and go okay shake your head so anyway julian's cross-body purse made me or a bag whatever made me uh what a double standard that the women on the show couldn't do it, but Julian, who they were trying to make into a woman, could. He only made it look better.

I know, man. He truly did. Oh, he so did. But yes, I love Nathan crowdsourcing the feedback. Again, more maturity for him. I thought that was great. And I also loved how he really comes through at the end and puts an interview on Mouth's website. knowing that Mouth is having a hard time

and he's just trying to figure out his way and Nathan's like, come on, man, let me help you out. That's one thing our show did really well is friends helping friends and talking each other through it and really showing how valuable it is to have a community around you

of people. And everybody serves a different role in different ways. You need a community. You need people around you who are going to lift you up. And we did that really well, I thought. Yeah.

I agree. I think we decided this conversation a couple episodes ago where I kind of said, oh, I've realized this is, this is just a show about friendship. Yeah. That's just the crux of the show. It's just friendship. And it's getting cooler because now that characters are maturing, you're getting to see

really meaningful, deep, you know, relationships and friendships between the characters. Speaking of which, when Nathan goes to the hospital and he breaks the news to Clay, this was also so relatable because how many times in your own life, have you been so nervous to have to say something to someone and you let it eat you up inside and you imagine every way it could go wrong and then you share whatever it is you have to share with them and you are met with the opposite and it's like love or warmth or understanding and it's like oh why did I wait so long to do that yes many many times and the maturity that clay has earned in this experience as well of perspective and maybe he would have responded

I mean you'll have to tell me maybe he would have responded that way no matter what but he didn't even take a second there wasn't one moment where clay was like thought of himself and and of what was going to go down now that Nathan's not I mean you the choice that you made to just have him immediately be empathetic with what Nathan must have been going through. It showed so much maturity for Clay of the perspective that happens when you go through something really difficult, you just, it puts everything into perspective. And I love seeing that. And the fact that you guys are now going to go into business together and that he wants to be an agent,

I was like, yay, standing up and cheering. Yes, go, Nathan. I want to see this next leg in his life. And the two of you guys together, finally, we're going to get you back the way that you were when you first showed up on the show. And everything was fast and moving and happy and good. And I'm craving that from the two of you.

I need more buddy comedy from you, too. Yeah, I'm so excited to see where that goes. And back to that moment, though, I love, yes, because I remember thinking that this was a great opportunity. to see how much Clay cared about Nathan, like the man, not the client. So, yeah, the choice to not take a beat. And the first words are Nate tells him, and Clay says, I'm sorry, Nate, that's got to be really hard for you.

Yeah. Which was just so kind, you know, that there was zero business involved. And then he goes on to say, your health comes first, your family comes. first. And it was like, oh, man, that's a good friend right there. That's a dude who cares about you. Yeah. Because the truth is, he just did lose a big chunk of money, a big chunk of money. Yeah. But he's so dropped in to his body, which I think is also something that happens when you go through a really intense traumatic experience and you come out on the other side of it, there's a weight to your understanding of what's valuable. What's the most valuable thing in life?

And it's just right at the, it's, it's on the tip of his tongue, he's ready with, with that guttural, weighted empathy. Clay's like, listen, buddy, I was just eating pudding with a ghost, okay? I don't care. I only want you to be healthy and happy. It's like, what, dude? Ghost pudding? Ghost pudding.

Wait, when you, okay, he walks in and you, you were doing something with your hand, Were you eating? Were you, oh, you were trying to feed yourself with your hand, right? Yeah. Are you right or left-handed? In real life, I'm right-handed. Oh, okay. I also, so obviously I think I played Clay right-handed, which is why it's such a struggle for him, because we go on to see him struggling, doing all this stuff.

But, yeah, I remember how, yeah, everything he does with his right is super impacted. Yeah. Random questions. Sorry, I just wondered when we were watching. Could you imagine if I was left? hand, but I just felt like clay should be right-handed. And I taught myself to write right-handed just for the role. So, uh, so, like, who does that kind of stuff? Like, Christian Bail, Joaquin Phoenix, like these guys who do super, super method stuff like that. I'm like, yeah, I'm the

Daniel Day Lewis of mediocre acting, so I trained my body to write right-handed. He's like, we never saw the character right-handed. Well, I wanted to be ready in case we did. I can drive ambidextrously, but I can't write ambidextrously. Joy, please tell the listeners what that means. Ambidextrous? Both hands. No, we all know the word ambidextrous. Tell us all, because I'm curious, what does it mean that you can drive ambidextrously? Well, I learned on a stick ship, so I'm okay.

I'm used to using both feet. I guess it's, you know, once you learn how to ride a bike, like it never goes away. so that's the way I learned how to drive. And then I obviously have an automatic now because I don't drive a car from 1985. But I don't know. I just drive with both feet sometimes. I put my foot, my left foot on the brake

and my right foot on the gas. This is exactly what happens when we recorded. No, it's just that you were the first person in history to rather than go, oh, I can drive manual or automatic to actually say, I can drive ambidextrously. I would love for you to go to the end of the DMV or next job you have where they ask if you can drive a stick. If you just went, yes, I am an ambidextrous driver.

Just watch them stand there quietly trying to decode what it is you're saying. Well, other good friendship stuff, Brooke and Haley under the bridge. I remember shooting this scene. I loved this. Both of my scenes with Sophia in this episode, I really love. I remember if I'm looking at my notes now it felt oh yeah it did feel a little rushed and expositional I remember that like I got there I sat down we said the things and then I leave and I did wish that we had had time to just dry it out a little bit more but I was so happy to see the two of them just spending a little time connecting Even though Haley was rushing around everywhere, like mothering everyone in this whole episode, as she tends to do. That felt really good.

And also when she goes over to close over bros and sees her sitting down on the ground. And I really remember that scene. I wish Sophia was here because I wonder what she remembers about that scene. I don't know why I remember it so well. I don't know if she and I were like in a fight and then we had to shoot that scene or if we were like just really disconnected. There was something going on and I remember sitting down and shooting that scene and like I remember having to go to a place of like, you know what?

I love her. I love her. And reach into that place and do the scene from there. And in that moment, feeling so much love for her and so connected to her and so like, this is what I want our friendship to be like. And there was so, I was in so much turmoil in my personal life. And I had such a disconnect with so many people and really complicated issues with friendship across the board with anybody that I, that wasn't in this weird group with me. So this scene, for some reason, every time I see it, when I think about Sof and I shooting episodes of Wentree Hill, this is one of the top, like, three that come up for me that I deeply remember sitting down and having this moment of like, oh, I want to be friends with her like this. So it made me kind of emotional watching that one.

It was beautiful. Was this the scene where she has a little speech about... All her success and hard work was just about getting her mom to love her and be proud of her. Yeah. Oh, that was so good, man. Yeah. So relatable. So vulnerable.

It's so relatable. It was great. And then is it, I think it's later in the episode, I believe it's later that you guys hang out again where you give her the advice where you say, like, don't focus on your work, focus on your life. Yeah. That's the scene I'm talking about, sitting in at Closer Over Bros. Okay. Yeah. Yeah. And it's, it's so nice. It's so great to see. Sophia does this so well, the emotional arc of her character.

You know, she can flat back and forth between comedy and very serious drama pretty quickly. And she wasn't doing a ton of comedy in this episode, but it felt like the smirks and all the little, like, realities of life are on the surface. But wait, she did have a great small piece of comedy. this is another one of those moments where you killed me and then she comes in shortly after and is an assassin with one look it's when the two of you yeah I think it's just the two of you go to trick and you walk up in Mia's there and she goes guys guys guys

be honest with me oh yeah look at them are they sleeping together talking about Alex and Chase who are in the background and the look on your face when she starts to, like, go back and watch this because before she, like, even really gets into it, it's, you have this look on your face that is so damn funny. And then you look, and they're obviously, like, sleeping together. And you're like, no, no, I don't think so. And while you're doing that, watch Sophia's face.

Oh, yeah, I was watching her face. I didn't see mine. I will go back. Look, it was great. She was an assassin. Absolutely. It was so good because she's like, I'm on board, I'm on board. And then she hears the horrible lie coming out of your mouth and has zero poker face about it.

He's just like, what? Do you have eyes? Oh, it was so good. Speaking of Chase and, oh my God, Alex, I was like, what is her name? Chase and Alex, this was kind of a big deal that he finds this script in the bar where she's like, did she take? take this job as a bartender and start dating him because she's doing research for her role. Ew. That was such a clever detail to add.

Yes. Because if it had just been any movie, all right. Yeah, she's an actress who's popular. Like it's inevitable, right? Yeah. But the fact she was playing a bartender who was having romance with. the bar manager, it did make you go, oh, this is way too similar to what you're doing right now. It's gross.

I wonder how he's going to handle this because that is, what I like about Chase is, I feel like he's actually, Chase feels reliable to me as somebody with a backbone that's not easy to manipulate. Like, he seems like a character that is so settled in himself that this girl, girl, I don't know, if he finds out that this actually is what she's doing and she tries to kind of weasel out of it, I don't think he's going to, I don't think he's going to stick around. I don't know. Well, I think what we see is when he, so fast forward to the end of the episode, he goes to her hotel and he's like, hey, what the hell is this? Yeah. She's like, ah, it's a script. And he basically just goes, how long have you known?

And she wasn't being forthright with him. And what's cool is that he does. He's just like, I'm out. No, thanks. I'm not going to wait around for you. This doesn't feel good. I'm gone. But then the next bit of her, the last piece we see of her, is her leaving her hotel room.

And it made me laugh because of two things. One, she's been in Tree Hill for months. And the only piece of luggage we see her leaving with is a carry-on-sized suitcase. Yeah. And all the times Millie's gone to her closet and just been like rifling through the hundreds of clothes. Yes. And that's, listen, that's super nitpicky because you could say Bell Hop already came and took every big bag. So that's, that's whatever. But it still is funny that like she's, now I'm leaving town with what I came with. And it's like, you've been here for half a year. But then the better part is as she's walking out, you see that she left the framed

photo or excuse me the framed movie poster of herself on the hotel wall what how do you notice these things it just so good don't i i got i got to go back you got to go because here's like it's the most hilarious thing because it actually says so much more about her character and it's so interesting that like what is the kind of person that hangs up framed things in a hotel room Mm-hmm, mm-hmm. Let alone, it's a giant, full-size movie poster of yourself. Yeah, no pictures of her family. There's no pictures of anybody meaningful to her.

And she doesn't even think, like, ah, I'm going to take it with me, or I'm going to at least pull the poster out. She's like, no, I'm going to leave the framed poster of myself on the hotel wall to just befuddle the housekeeping staff. No, it's a gift for the next guest. They're going to enjoy looking at her because she's who she is. Yeah, I could see that being her thinking. But yeah, that made me laugh.

I was like, oh, my, I had never really thought about it while she was still living there. But the fact that she was saying goodbye to the room and leaving it on the wall just killed me, man. 100%. That's so good. Wow. Well, there was so much about, so much in this episode that felt like it was about healing, you know, Nathan moving on to a new phase. and Quinn and Clay healing and moving on into the next, into the next thing. You know, what happens next? What's next?

Brooke and Victoria, Brooke, the company is disappearing, but she's healed in her heart in a way. It's like she's cleansed herself of all of the guilt and the concern and the things that went wrong. So that feels really good. mouth healing from his depression and just feeling like he's in a rut i love that too um yeah and go ahead what were you going to say i love that jamie is worried about his dad and he says to haley he says is his dad gonna be okay because last time he wasn't okay and haley has like that great line where she says he is because last time basketball left your dad and this time your dad is leaving basketball. And then there's like a couple little lines. And then you, you had a perfect button. You go,

I can't guarantee Chester won't start drinking. And then you guys laugh and the scene ends. And I was like, oh, perfect, perfect joke. Yeah. So cute. I loved it. So it's good. I was happy with this episode. Okay. One last question for you. Did you notice when, And it's towards the very, very end. There's a quick, quick scene of, it's not very much of a scene. It's just sort of like a vignette, part of a vignette, where Nathan and Jamie are outside playing catch, and it pans up to Haley in the window watching them.

Mm-hmm. Did you notice how pregnant you looked in that shot? Oh, I didn't. Maybe it was the angle, but it was odd because you looked super pregnant. I wonder if we shot that later. Like it could, like, we could have shot that, you know, as a pickup a couple weeks later or something. Because I was definitely growing. I think you're, yeah, maybe like a little belly rub on it, but it's like it's nothing you've done up to that point.

So anyways, I just thought it was odd because I was like, did we shoot this at a different time? Because Haley looks considerably more pregnant. We might have. It is kind of fun watching myself pregnant on TV. That's fun to see. Like little Maria growing. So exciting. It may look different, but native culture is very alive.

My name is Nicole Garcia, and on Burn Sage, Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. It was a huge honor to become a television writer because it does feel oddly, like, very traditional. It feels like Bob Dylan going electric, that this is something we've been doing for hundreds of years. You carry with you a sense of purpose and confidence. Sierra Teller Ornellis, who with Rutherford Falls became the first native showrunner in television history. On the podcast, Burn Sage Burn Bridges, we explore her story, along with other Native stories, such as the creation of the first Native Comic Con or the importance of reservation basketball. Every day, Native people are striving to keep traditions alive while navigating the modern world, influencing and bringing our culture into the mainstream. Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Honorable mention? Yeah. I guess mouth. Like Lee Norris just had so much fun with his material. I was really, I really enjoyed watching him play, you know? He's always fun. What about you? Lee was great.

I'll give mine, too. There's a really funny moment, unintentionally funny, when Brooke has realized she's like, you know, going to be losing a lot of her money in the business, and she's going through her dream wedding book, and she's removing pages.

Yeah. And it's so funny to me that her line is, so long pineapple cake and red velvet cupcakes. And I just found myself laughing going, Those have got to be the two cheapest components of your wedding. Yes, for sure. Why are those the two that are going? I just thought it was so, so funny that, like, that's what the writers picked as opposed to, like, so long vineyard destination.

Yes, flowers from Paris, shipped in from Paris. Yeah, oysters from New England, whatever it is. Instead, it was like, so long the two things I can make in my kitchen. I love that you notice stuff like this. That's great. So great. Okay, well, we have a listener question from Steph real quick. Steph wants to know if you could bring any one-trial character back for one season.

Who would it be and why? You know who I would bring back? Who? Q. Yes. Quentin. Because every time I see Robbie, it's an immediate love fest, which was funny because we never had anything together.

So the first time we crossed paths, like, we didn't know each other, but I had seen his work and I thought it was great. And I, so I came in hot like, dude, you're great. And he matched my energy. So now we only see each at conventions, but every single time, he's just so warm and kind and has such great energy that I would have loved to have gotten to actually play and work with him. Yeah.

I could actually see the two of you getting along really well. he's he is like you very dropped into his body very astute notices everything doesn't comment on everything but just you can tell he's noticing it all and he also doesn't one of my favorite things about robbie is that he doesn't let he in his conversation he calls people up to an elevated way of communicating so if somebody's throwing out an offhand comment that just sounds like rhetoric or if it sounds like they're exaggerating or whatever. He is so great at just mirroring it back. Like, really?

Oh, that. Oh, interesting. Like, why do you say that in particular? And it's not like a poking or a goading. It's really like a say what you mean. Like don't just go around talking. Like, mean what you say and say what you mean. I love it.

It's one of my favorite things about him. Aside from the fact that he's just jovial and one of those glass half full all the time kind of people, but can also really drop into a deep conversation. Anyway, it doesn't surprise me that you guys get along so well, and I miss him, and I would definitely bring Hugh back. And my second place for that would be Michaela McManus, because I just love having her around, too. She's so great. Another one. We had nothing together, and we did a convention in Wilmington last year, and it was one of the, Those, these moments are so funny, right?

Like, I get on the plane at LAX, and you know how you kind of have, like, actor radar? Like, anytime you're flying to Vancouver, you can just tell that one person with the baseball hat super low. You're like, all right, what show are they on? Yeah. Fly to, no, we fly from like, like, L.A. to wherever the connecting flight is. And I'm like, oh, I wonder if that's, that's someone. Like, I wonder who that is. And then on the puddle jumper into Wilmington, we're literally.

seated next to each other. And it's Michaela. And we've never, like, properly caught up, but we had, like, this one-and-a-half-hour flight. And she was so lovely and wonderful. She's cool. Exactly, like you said, I found myself going, like, damn it, I would love to be your friend and to have, like, gotten a chance to work with you. Yeah, I agree.

She's just so fantastic. Well, maybe in another life. Let's spin a wheel, folks. Most likely to get caught getting into a concert. Hillary, right? Yeah, probably Hillary. It just immediately felt like a Hillary story.

Yeah, that sounds about right. Would she just, would Hillary just be the sneaking in person or would she actually get caught? Oh, she would get caught, but then she would be Hillary and the security. you'd be like, you're awesome. Get in here. And now they have Thanksgivings together. It'd be like one of those things. That sounds about right.

That sounds about right. Okay, friends, next episode, season eight, episode six. Not Afraid. We'll see you next week. And we have stuff with us next week, too. We'll see you then. Bye. Woo-hoo.

Hey, thanks for listening. Don't forget to leave us a review. You can also follow us on Instagram at Drama Queen's O-TH.H. Or email us at Dramaquins at iHeartRadio.com. See you next time. We're all about that high school, drama girl, drama girl, all about them high school queens. We'll take you for a ride and our comic girl. Cheering for the right team.

Drama queens, drama queens, smart girl, rough girl, fashion but you'll tough girl. You could sit with us, girl. Drama queen, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens, drama queens. It may look different, but native culture is alive. My name is Nicole Garcia and I'm Burn Sage. Burn Bridges, we aim to explore that culture. Somewhere along the way, it turned into this full-fledged award-winning comic shop. That's Dr. Lee Francis IV, who opened the first native comic bookshop. Explore his story along with many other native stories on the show, Burn Sage Burn Bridges.

Listen to Burn Sage Burn Bridges on the IHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an IHeart podcast.