Drama Queens - Work in Progress: Jenny Cavnar

Episode Date: March 14, 2024

Jenny Cavnar is a trailblazer making history as the first female primary play-by-play announcer for an MLB team!  Jenny joins Sophia to talk about working in a male-dominated environment, breaking barriers, the women who paved the path for her and handling sexist trolls.  Jenny also discusses her path to her dream job, the importance of surrounding yourself with people who are rooting for you and pushing you outside your comfort zone, and how she juggles her career as a mom. See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an I-Heart podcast. Hi, everyone. It's Sophia. Welcome to Work in Progress. Hello, friends. Today, we are joined by a trailblazer. Jenny Kavanaar is an American sports broadcaster who is the television play-by-play announcer. of the Oakland Athletics of Major League Baseball. Guys, she's the first female primary play-by-play announcer in MLB history. She is an absolute legend.

She grew up in a baseball family, and she just is so incredibly inspiring. She is joining us today from her home in Colorado, where she is managing to juggle her MLB career, a family, young children, and a great big, beautiful life. Let's get to it. Jenny, I'm so excited that you're here today.

As you know, I think, you know, we're both such lovers of sport and seeing the way that women are really changing the game, not just in women's sports, but in the sports industry in general right now. is so inspiring. And so to have you as a literal trailblazer in the space, join us during Women's History Month, feels very cool. Thank you for taking the time. Oh, gosh. Thank you for having me.

It's like, I don't know, I'm so excited about women in sports right now and what is happening. And I think like two words sums it up for me and it's Caitlin Clark, right? If you're not on the Caitlin Clark train, like you just better jump on because she has just taken everything to a whole new level.

And it's so cool to see the history that she's made and what she's done. And then, you know, being part of this conversation of women and advancement in sports, it's like, pinch me because this is all happening. And it's so exciting. Yeah. Well, and your love of sport takes you all the way back to childhood, right? Yeah. Yeah.

From day one, I mean, I was definitely born into a family, the big sports family. my dad was a long time high school baseball coach. So my earliest memories of sports were really at the field when he was coaching and as a cheerleader and kind of realizing quickly that like, you know, a win or a loss can dictate a mood. And my dad was always so good about not really bringing that home. But, you know, you learn to ride that roller coaster of being a fan and the emotions that go along with sports. And then, you know, as I got older, clearly wanted to participate. I'm not much of a of a just sit and watch kind of gal.

So grabbed a glove was often out on the field, you know, whether it was his summer camps or even like, you know, working the table where the parents come in and taking money or going to the snack shack and working. Like just being involved. It was definitely

our family business was high school baseball. And we were all kind of all in. And then I think as soon as I picked up a glove and I picked up a basketball and all those things. I just remember that innate need to be competitive and the innate drive to like want to be on the court and want to be on a feel, want to be doing something sports related. So yeah, I think from the very beginning it's always been there. That's really cool. When you

were little, like if you think about, you know, little Jenny at eight or nine, were you really focused on sports at that time? Or was that something that evolved? you got older. Yeah, I think I was really focused on the sports. Like, I was just a really, I was late to the party and everything, like maturing, you know, growing into being a girly girl. Like I was definitely always the tomboy, hung out with the boys in the block. We had a lot of boys in our neighborhood, had an older brother. I had mostly boy cousins. I was around my dad's teams. Like, it was the theme of it didn't feel different to be the only girl, because that's just kind of how I grow up, right?

And so I do remember, you know, there were, I guess, other things that were exciting to me, but it always centered around sports, the memories, whether it was, again, just us being at the baseball field with my dad or going to my brother's games or, you know, going to my own games and thinking back to, I have no idea how my working mom did it and carded us to all these events now that I'm a mom and our kids are starting to get involved in. activities, but it's really cool to think that sports has just always kind of been around and evolved that way. And then I think, too, like, we live in such a different culture now where you can watch content all the time, right? Like kids are getting fed highlights anytime

they pick up their phone or, you know, you can see them just any hour of the day. And I think for us, it was more appointment television where like the big game was coming up and it was the build up and the excitement and you'd physically get a newspaper in the morning and you'd read about the game the night before, you'd read about the game coming up that day. And it was this slower process of the anticipation of the activity and the sport and what was to come with it. And so I do remember that a lot from being a kid. Again, now it's like we're just, we're watching highlights all the time, which is awesome, but it's just very different. Yeah, it is. It's really interesting that you can look up anything at any moment. You don't have to necessarily tune in

unless you're trying to avoid spoilers in real time. Right, right, which is so hard to do nowadays. My husband guys all the time and I'm like, you're on your phone all the time. How are you avoid the score of the game that's happened three hours ago? It's just talking out. When you were a kid, did you know that you wanted to work in sports because of the way that you grew up in your family or did that dawn on you later? Yeah, I mean, my earliest memory of picking a career was I wanted to be a marine biologist and work with dolphins. Like, that was like, and I also remember writing this paper where I wanted to be a gymnast in the Olympics and I was going to have three kids and be a gymnast in the Olympics. And, you know, in my eight-year-old mind, that sounded like a

reality back then. Those were my first two early career choices, but yes, shortly after that, once I realized that you could work in sports, I think that it always was like, that's what I'm going to do. And I think the beginning of those, again, goes back to just being at the field with my dad. We had a wonderful prep reporter in Colorado. Her name's Marcia Neville. And if Marcia was at your high school game you guys were the best in the state like she you know she presence meant that your team was amazing so um you know my dad was fortunate to have some good teams and she would be there and i she would run right on the field after the game to interview him and i was like she's getting out there faster than i am like i'm supposed to be out there

first um as the daughter of the coach so i was like that's a cool job and i think that kind of that seed was planted and then And then seeing Melissa Stark on TV on Monday night football in the late 90s was really when like the aha moment for me, that representation moment of there's someone that looks like me and is on TV and at the big event, like that would be a dream job. And just kind of using that as a springboard to eventually creating a career that luckily I think I was pretty naive in that moment, didn't know how competitive the industry was. and my dad didn't either and, you know, just spoke those words of truth into me and said, you can do this. And that's all it took for me to have a really big dream. That's so cool. And what a neat thing, too, that you can really see the way that that phrase, if you can see it, you can be it, really was so true for you. You saw these women in these

roles and saw yourself in them. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's what has become so special about where my career path took me is because it's allowed me to look back and realize like why I had such a focus and a narrow focus really at the time. If you ask any of my college friends, they will all tell you when asked what I want to do for a living. It was I want to be a football sideline reporter.

And it was just so specific to again, that representation of what I saw Melissa Stark. And I think Linda Cohn was on TV. doing Sports Center at the time, you know, anchoring at a desk. And there were a few women, but the majority, I think, of women that you saw in sport was on a sideline of a football field specifically. And then it just kind of grew. It grew into other sports. It grew into other aspects. It grew into hosting jobs. And then eventually we started hearing, you know, more female voices calling games or being the analyst of games. And that's really taken off in the last, you know, five to 10 years. And so just to be a part of that conversation and now to know that if you could

ask if I was in college now and you asked me what I wanted to do, I hope I would have a broader stroke than just this narrow focus because there are so many jobs that you can see women doing in sports. And it's not just on camera and it's not just on radio. There's writers. There's producers. there's directors like it is all around um and when i think about baseball specifically like we now have a female and uniform for the san francisco giants solicinacan akin is a coach there and that presentation is so powerful and she like braids her hair and it's just this cool like oh my gosh and going to a giant's game and being at oracle park i see little girls in the stands all the time either like also have a braid or have signs for Alyssa, like girls are getting incorporated into the game

where now MLB the show came out today and they have an entire like arena that you can play as a female in Major League Baseball. And it's just like, I think the idea of representation matters is no longer an idea. It's like we have to make this happen and work and the visual has to be there because you're right. Seeing is believing and Billie Jean. King did it so long ago for all of us and Title IX came out of that. And she's still on a platform of encouraging women to continue in their successes in sports. And it's really special. It really is. I feel so lucky. I sit on the advisory board of the first women's bank with Billy Jean and getting to work alongside one of my literal lifelong heroes in this equity space

in finance for women has been the coolest thing in my recent years. And we got to do some advocacy around the 50th anniversary of her foundation. And I'm just, I'm so in awe to your point of how all these things that I grew up caring about and wanting to work on, isn't it weird when we sit at these points like you and I are now as adults? And you go like, if 10-year-old me had any idea that this was my life, she wouldn't believe it. No. There's a couple way. It's so cool.

But I think, too, like, you just kind of brought it up. It's your passion and your purpose. Like, those things you can't remove from inside of you. And so I think having people around you that feed into them, like, allow it to grow and have allowed it to, like, become, you know, where we are today. And being able to sit at a table with Billie Jenkins. and know that you were impacted and influenced by what she did so long ago and now you get to work alongside of her to continue the conversation of equity is like it's it's really powerful

stuff it's so so cool do you ever you know now from this position that you're in you're also a mom do you talk to your dad about you know what it was like for him to watch you grow up and grow into the woman that you are? Like, is it, is it sort of a surreal thing to be able to look at your kids and also look at how you were raised and see all of these familial connections? Oh, gosh. It really, and then it's come full circle because I think for me, my parents have always preached, you can do whatever you want and, you know, we're going to support you. And that wasn't just to like a teenager to live out a dream and get into college or to go to a career. That was like a lifelong commitment that they made because they honestly are a huge part of caretaking

for our children now and without that like without that support of of my mom especially saying like I'm in retirement this is what I want to be doing for you and and for your family like we wouldn't be able to do these careers I wouldn't be able to take these opportunities because I'm from my kids sometimes in baseball and in the in the chaos of that world and you know my husband's a firefighter and his schedule is so different and unique and so my parents have been this extension of our family and my husband's parents you know my in-laws they don't live in Colorado where we reside but they have all made a priority to like put their lives on hold at moments where we just need them so that we can keep going in our careers and that to me is that

familial connection of like you know that like that like true. trust and belief in you to be whatever you want to be, but also be like, we're going to help you do that. It's cool. And so, yeah, we've, we've had those conversations and had those talks, but, like, I look back now more so on our growing up, and I don't know how it felt so seamless. Like, I don't know how my parents both held jobs and, you know, still, like, figured out and found the time to invest in our athletic endeavors and get us to all these games. And, you know, like the sacrifices that they make as parents, they're very special people for sure. And I'm so grateful for them. That's so cool. And now a word from our sponsors who make

this show possible. I also I also think it's so nice when you can talk about how it really works because there is this notion that, and I do believe it's true, we can have it all, but you can't really have it all at the same time. It requires juggling and planning and scheduling. And I think the way it works is when you're in community or in the community of your family. It does really take a village. And I think it's so important that we kind of let each other in on that reality so that people don't look around and go, why can't I do all of this by myself? Why can't I spend all of these plates? it's like you can't. You need a, you need a crew and how lucky you guys are that your family

can be that crew for you. Oh, gosh, you're so right. And I think it's, we've been sold this message for so long, especially as women, to your point of like, you can do it all. You can be a superwoman, super mom. Like, yeah, but it's exhausting. It's hard and it's hard work and it's not, it's not linear. Like, it's not like, okay, you have this career and here's that box. And like you have your family and here's that box for us in our world like those are constantly intersecting and um the scheduling part is honestly sometimes the most draining part of my day and my week because you know it's the responsibility of like does a small human have an adult with them at all times and who is who I'm asking for favors for and um you know we're hiring

help as well and um you know I want to make sure our kids grow up in activities and have you know friends and fun but now I'm asking these people that are taking care of them to not only take care of them but get them to and from places and make sure they're happy and healthy and um you know I think as a mom you're constantly like your heart is checking in on everyone and you want everyone to be in the best place but that means like you know are you in the best place and are you taking care of yourself and it's like yeah you're just constantly going through and thinking of things your brain like never shuts off our calendar is open all the time you know best best laid plans always need a backup plan and then there's poor dog who I'm like did

someone take the dog on a walk today and play with him right so it's um it's so wonderful and it's so beautiful and it it feeds so much in my soul that I can have this career and have this family but um it is constant work and it's hard work and um I think more than anything we all learned and I definitely point back to the pandemic of like this idea where when we had to stop and then we had to get back into things and we had to be away from people like human beings were made for community and it just like circled right back to your point of I'm so grateful that we get to raise our kids in a big community and that our families are involved and helpful and we've wonderful friends involved and our baseball communities involved. I mean they you know welcome our

our kids to doing things when we're at work and being around the game. And that's how I grew up. I grew up with baseball. And my husband grew up with baseball. And so it's a big part of our family. And I love that the intersection happens between career and family. Yeah, that's really special. And it's not lost on me that as you talk about the, you know, logistics for both you and your husband, your kids, your families, you're not only doing this as, you know, one half of a work. partnership of a, you know, marriage with two careers in it. But you're doing this in your individual career where you've moved up the ranks as a woman in sports in a world, particularly in baseball, that has really been primarily dominated by men. And so it's, you're not just

juggling a big life, but you're breaking these boundaries while you're doing it has, how has that felt? I imagine there have been times where it's been amazing and times where it's been hard. And, you know, it's, it's probably been every end of the spectrum. That's it. The roller coaster of emotion in doing it. I'm really grateful for the women in our industry. Specifically, I have a producer. I had a producer with the Rockies. That's a female and a very dear friend of mine. And she was breaking, you know, her own barriers on the production side and probably one of the only female producers of the big four sports, you know, really in television, that is a female. And she has three kids. And she was kind of the first representation

to me that like, oh, you can't have a family and figure this out. And she was very encouraging in that. And I watched how hard it was. And I watched how hard it was. And I watched how they made it work and I took you know notes and I was like okay if she can do it I can do it and she was really a huge factor for me because when I had kids I you know was trying to plan out when I was coming back and I remember her saying well maybe we shouldn't plan it maybe you're going to have a baby and four weeks later you're ready to come back to work and maybe you're going to have a baby and you're not going to be ready for 12 weeks and like we're going to be here and we're going to support you and we're going to figure that out.

But like, you don't want to put a limitation on yourself one way or the other. I don't think a man would have told me that. That was my boss. I think he would have looked at a schedule and I think he would have said by law, like your date coming back is this day and that's when the team is, you know, in Oakland or in San Diego and, you know, you're going to be there and then you're just going to move on. When I had my first baby, I remember asking our company about like breastfeeding. and if I can send, like, use that milk store company and send the milk back and, like, would they pay for that?

And like, oh, no, you won't pay for that. That's crazy. And I was like, oh, okay. Well, you know, this is like a pretty big company. We're owned by a pretty big parent company. And I'm sure they have some sort of policy for working moms that have to travel. Like, could you just look into it a little bit further? So, you know, of course, it takes forever for them to look into it. And I'll never forget. I had just called my first major league game in 2018. I was six months postpartum. I was panicking about like, what am I going to do? Because I'm on air for three plus hours. Like what happens if like I have to, you know, go pump and I can't because we're doing this game. You were trying to figure that out while I'm also doing something new with my job. And then I go on a road trip.

And I remember thinking I was like, I guess I'm just done. Like I guess I'm just going to have to like dry up and we'll move on. And it's okay. and I'm like mourning this whole situation. And I'm thinking all of these things when I'm in the shower and I get out and I have a voicemail for my boss. And he was like, hey, good news. I figured out how we can make things work for you. And I was just like, I'm kidding me.

This is not the time. It's six months too late to figure it out, right? So I guess like the idea of just being in this world as a woman, where you're not getting a lot of understanding, especially as you grow into a different role as a mom, and now I'm growing into different roles in my career. And everyone that's had this position in Major League Baseball as a primary play-by-play has been a man.

And a lot of those men, I would say probably 85% of them, have a wife at home that's taking care of all the home stuff and all the children's stuff, which is a full-time job. And I have so much respect for those women because I know the challenges of that partner is away for six months and they're very focused on their career. And oftentimes I find myself so divided because I have to be so focused on my career to make sure that I'm just as good if not trying to be better because I'm a woman in the seat. And I have all the home stuff to deal with and to do. And that's that's the path we've

chosen and it's a privilege. It really is. But it's chaos. and it's really hard sometimes. And I feel so supported. I'm saying all this. I feel so supported by my partner and by my husband, you know, doing his poll too and having to make a lot of sacrifices because of this career I've chosen.

But it's just different when you're the woman and when you're the mom and the way like you think and process things and want to plan for your family. Like that just doesn't go away because you're off doing other big career things. Yeah. but I think it's so important that we're up front about those things. Yes, yes. And that we can give each other advice and mentorship about it because it shouldn't have to be a binary for us.

Right. You know, that it's got to be one or the other, but it does require that other people, it requires that other people make allowances for us that we've been raised to make for them. Absolutely. Yes, that's such a powerful point. And I think, like, the more upfront we are about all of that, like, I will show you these bags under my eyes. It's there. Like, there's not a lot of sleep happening right now.

And that's okay. And I'm so comfortable in this idea that this is our season and this is where we're at. And I keep going back to that when I'm overwhelmed or anxious or letting the fear set in of how are we going to do all of this. Like, I just have to center back to the experience that we've had at this point. and the people that we have in our lives and like it's all going to be okay but it's so important that it's there's a visual for it because again we're inundated with content right and I find myself in the same pattern just like when we were growing up it was the magazines remember they talked about body image on magazines that you're seeing well now that again take away like that comes

out every week or every month like now it's every second like if you pull up instant You're just inundated with something that is not really realistic. Like, I'm seeing these women with these beautiful homes and their kids look like they're just all in order and their kids sleep at night. Like, my kids don't sleep at night. How's this happening? But we're inundated with this world of like perfection because content is in really short clips that's just packaged nicely for you.

And we need to have the bigger picture sometimes. we need to understand that it's not, it's that there's a lot going on with it, being a working mom, being, you know, someone who's thriving in their career. And it just, we need to help each other. We need to have that be up front, be forward. Yeah. Well, I think that's one of the things that the internet's so amazing, right, because it gives us these opportunities for community and connection. And I think it can be really toxic because we forget that we're looking at content, not at reality. Yes, right, right. You know, we, we forget that people have schedules and calendars of deliverables that might be planned a year in advance and that that might not be their

life even anymore, but it has to be for a job or a contract. And it's hard to remember. that what we're seeing is very often produced or just such a small fraction of someone's life. Yeah. And I think everyone I know is really kind of on the seesaw of how they feel about it. Like it's a real push-pull right now. And I think it's what makes the ability to do things like this exciting for me personally. It's why I think, you know, our listeners listen.

because they get to actually hear what you have to say, what I, you know, what my questions are for you and vice versa. Like, we can, we can be together in community. Right. Not just in like a 10 second clip. And then it seems like that's life. Exactly. Exactly. Just package up nicely and make it sound cute. Look good. Things. Yeah. It's nuts. And I think, you know, as I were raising kids and going back to that mom thing, I've watched a lot of my friends who have older kids, really struggle with how early do you let them look at social media? How do you let them into this world? Because back to your original point, like that provides community for them. And that's so important in growing up. But are there their minds even well equipped to like be able to

understand what's real and what's not real? Are our minds as 40 year olds even there? No. I mean, yeah, what about for us? We all struggle. Like, I think. I keep coming back to this word. And I was so lucky to go through this process on the Today Show and Hoda brought up like imposter syndrome, right? And I'm like, I can't believe you've been said that right now in this five minute interview we're having because it's a phrase I just keep coming back to like I feel like I'm having it in my career. And then I feel like in your day to day life, it's like there's just this constant battle of like what is real, what's not real, who's real? How do we act real? And, yeah, it's a strange world out there for sure.

Yeah. But a good one, to your point. And now a word from our sponsors. Now that people do look up so many things, as you were mentioning earlier. What a wild, incredible moment in history. You know, people can go. to look up the MLB and see you, our first ever female primary play-by-play announcer. Like, do you ever go, oh, my God, that's me?

Like, I'm the first one. I did it. It's crazy because I think, I just think there's been, like, women that have been doing it. It's just another step of, like, adding that primary word in, right? So you look back, like, Susan Waldman has been doing Yankees. games in the radio booth for decades. And the game is about the Yankees, like a very storied franchise. And she's been a huge part of that.

I've been a big voice of that team for so long. And after I called my first game in 2018, I remember Melanie Newman reaching out to me and she was calling games at the minor league level. And she eventually got a job with Apple TV and with the Baltimore Orioles calling games. And it's, you know, it's so great. great to see that women are doing it and being represented. And it's just one more door opening that out of the 30 teams, when you look at primary voices on television, it's going to be 29 men and one female. And that's a huge honor for sure. But I also like the best part about it is that the first

always comes with the idea that it's not going to be the last, right? History has told us that. And so I can't wait to like just see how it changes over the next decade because I feel really lucky to have been a part of a conversation of a lot of change in the game and in the sports TV game for the last, you know, six, seven years. And so I'm like, what is the next six, seven years going to bring with new reputation and new voices? And it's so exciting. It is. It's exciting. And I imagine it's also not always easy, you know, to. to be the first one in a room can sometimes be really hard. And I guess I'm curious with everything that's working

in the way that you and your family and your coworkers and your whole village is really figuring out how to make this happen, how have you also managed to persevere, how have you managed to figure out how to deal with what comes when the backlash comes? the sexism, the judgment, how do you navigate that? Yeah, I think, oh, it's, like, if this job would have come for me 10 years ago, 15 years ago, there's no way.

Like, I was not comfortable enough in my own skin to handle what other people were saying about me, especially I think I grew up like a people pleaser. And that will, that's, yeah, right, raise your hand. Same, same. Hi, hi. Oh, boy. So, you know, battling that, those comments can. You can say they don't matter, but as they add up, like, oh, no, do I need to change?

Am I doing something wrong? How do I fix this problem? The best piece of advice I've gotten in the last couple of months, I just admire her so much. Kate Scott is the voice of the Philadelphia 76ers. She's one of two female primary voices in the MBA, Lisa Byington and her became the first female voices last year. And I told her I was going to be getting this job before it became public because she's from the Bay Area and she knows a lot of the same people I'm going to be working with, knows the market. And then again, you know, she's just done the first thing. So I just need

you to like help me what's coming my way, set me up. She just said to me, listen, there was will be so many comments. There will be good ones. There will be bad ones and everything in between. And what you have to understand is the people writing those comments are dealing with their own insecurities. They're dealing with their own personal stuff. And you're the one in the way of that. And that's where this is coming from. And just to put a face to that and be like, yes you are so right about that like that is that's a hard concept i think to understand now but can you imagine like if we could get kids to understand that concept of like what they're reading on the internet and that it's not necessarily about you or at you but people are just dealing with

whatever it is biases their own junk in their life and like you're the one they heard and they didn't like and they're going to just let it loose on you you know so i i really have not read a lot of comments. I learned a long time ago to just not engage in that realm of social media. And I think, too, as you grow, no matter your career, you have to find people that you trust. And that doesn't just mean people that are going to blow smoke up your wazoo all the time and tell you how great you are. It's people that are going to tell you when you're not doing a good job, when you're not showing up, when you can be better, people that are going to push you to be better. And I would not be in this position or this place if I didn't have those people in

my career life and in my personal home life. My husband's a huge person like that for me. But the producer that I was mentioning, Alison Behill, she, she's one of those people that, like, in my career, she started this. She's the one that's like, why aren't you doing, we're going to have you do play by play. We're going to do this and we're going to be here and we're going to figure it out. And people that, like, I would have never been like, and that's the next career goal. That was scary to me. That was weird. That wasn't in my wheelhouse.

But other people seeing something in you, making you get out of your comfort zone, making you push, doing things that are uncomfortable. That's when we grow, right? And when you're in an entertainment industry, whether it's, you know, what I do in sports broadcasting, what you do as an actress, like getting out of your comfort zone is like, the number one thing that we have to do. And a lot of people don't have to do that in public and on this big stage. But that's just the job in the arena we've chosen. And so I think, again, I have to rely on my experiences. And I have to know when I start this season, game one for me is not going to be the same as game 162. There's growth that is going to happen. There's growth because I'm now doing play-by-play every day and not just backing up and filling in

every once in a while. So I have to give myself grace in that and know like my employers, the people who chose me for this job, they also are going to be doing that because they see the long term and not just today and what's going to happen out of the gate. And I also like, it is such a team thing for me. You talk about the loneliness maybe of being the first in a room, but I've never looked at it as like me being this female. I'm doing a job with an analyst and I'm doing a job with a producer, the whole team of people. Like to me, sports broadcasting is the ultimate team sport because

when you go on theater, you might be a voice of something, but there are countless amount of people that put in time to the day, to researching, to all the video elements, to putting graphics together, storylines. And then as the game is unfolding, like making sure that everyone is on the same page and getting it together and getting the message across. And so to me, the men in my life who've also supported me and the analysts that I worked with, like, that's the team. They're taking a huge risk in this too because they're stepping into that arena with me. And I remember looking back in 2018 when we called the game, not just the backlash that I got, but the backlash and the comments that my partner that my male analysts got, some of the phone calls from their friends

that they got, and then them telling me about them. And part of me was like, okay, you don't have to tell me everything. And part of me was like, this is interesting, opens up this conversation of, you know, it's new, it's changed. There's a different voice that is calling a game. There is a female voice and not a male voice. And it's a hard change for a lot of people who've grown up in sports growing up watching sports when you've only heard um you know one one tone and a male tone and now you're a female tone it can be jarring that's understandable but i think when we get over all of that and it becomes um more commonplace and we're seeing it in the NBA for sure right yeah i play game the other night and there was a female play by play and a female analyst calling an NBA game and it is like

nothing now to your ears i don't think it's jarring i don't think it's weird i think the NBA fan has had female voices in the game for the last seven years and they've adjusted and now they're starting to realize do you know this game or do you not know this game do you coming with like great entertainment value and stories and passion and get me excited about basketball or do you not that's the judgment and that's how it should be like I hate your voice and you're a woman and I don't like this or you know there is a man calling the game and that's better it should be like am I enjoying my experience of like learning something, understanding the game differently. If those are your takeaways and you can walk away saying like, oh, I learned something new or, oh, that was cool,

then that's way better than just judging something by a male or female perspective. Yeah, totally agree. And I think, look, at the end of the day, sports are for everyone. Everyone. Everyone. And the shifts that we're seeing. I mean, for me as, you know, such a lifelong sports fan and like now the part owner of a soccer team, like the work everyone in my life has been doing, you know, the last 10 years have been so major, the last five years have been transformational, seeing the national team players sue U.S. soccer and, you know, fight for pay equity, seeing, you know, the attention that women's sports have garnered just this year, the Caitlin and Clarks, the New York Liberty. Like, everybody's paying attention. And it's really exciting to see the metrics in terms of,

you know, the value ad in terms of the ticket sales. Like, seeing, you know, women's collegiate basketball tickets go for more than the Golden State Warriors tickets. I'm like, I don't hate it. Like, this is so cool. It's so cool. Yeah, it's just like it's about time that all of these incredible performance athletes are being recognized for their skill and really getting to show people who they are, who they've always been. It's so thrilling. It is. I mean, Jason Sadecas could wear anything he wants at any given time and how much have you seen him photographed in a WMBA sweatshirt. Yeah, totally. loves that's where he's at he's totally and you know I've seen it a lot I'm calling women's basketball the last several years

Cameron Brink who plays for Stanford her parents went to college with Steph Curry's parents and stuff three is often at Stanford women's basketball games and that's not lost like these crazy you know big time

pop stars rappers actors actors other male athletes walking in to an arena where women are playing sports. Like that image is powerful. Totally. When I was living in Chicago and, you know, going to Red Stars games and Sky Games all the time, like, you know, I went to a basketball game one night and 50 cent walked in.

And we were like, what are you doing here? Also, this is so cool. And, you know, that's, I don't know, 10 years ago. Yeah. And it's really, it is a very thrilling time to see the way, at least what it looks like, listen, I'm, I'm asthmatic, I'm a sports fan, I'm not a sports player. It's never really been my thing. But like, I, as a fan who has been paying attention for most of my life, it feels like people

are finally casting a wider net and making room for more of us. And that, that just feels. so exciting and I'm I guess I'm really bolstered because you're the actual expert on this in the room and it's nice to know that you feel the same that there's progress being made you know for women in traditionally male arenas of sport but also in female sports coverage yes yeah no I do I feel I feel the growth I see the growth of experience the growth right and you're doing it on a level of being an owner and so I will go there like that That is such an important space where the equality measures can continue to grow.

Because without women in positions of power to make some of these decisions, this doesn't grow, right? It just doesn't. I mean, I can point directly to the producer that was a female that started the conversation. And yes, males got on board and there were allies and they were like, yes, yes, let's go. But it was a woman that made that decision first and foremost. I was just hired at NBC Sports California by a woman who is a, you know, wonderful visionary. And the decision makers have to change the game. We can work and we can try and we can pursue.

But like up top, got to change the game there. I think the numbers show it. Like if you just want to go back to being fans, it doesn't matter if we're talking about, you know, the primary four sports, the big four in just men's sports, but adding women's sports onto that. When you look at the people sitting in the stands, the people spending money, which is always what it's going to come back to, because this is a business after all, there are 50 percent or close to 50 percent, if not more than 50 percent represented as female fans. And this has been in the NFL for so long. We have seen these numbers. They've been out there. And like there weren't really clothing companies even within the last 10 years before Aaron Andrews started something that we're even promoting clothing for these sports teams to be fans, even though the numbers suggested that that that marketplace was there.

And so if that marketplace is there and we're seeing them in the sand and we're seeing women talking online about sports and watching sports, then why isn't the representation of women on the other side? And so that, I think we've been just, as I mentioned, I think it's been flying off the shelves and growing at a great rate over the last 10 years. And I think there's always room for improvement and always more growth to the thumb. But it's just about continuing the conversation and continuing the visual and making that change. Yeah, it's so exciting. And it's so cool to know that we're going to get to continue the conversation. with you and that you're just going to continue like charging into these spaces and bringing

more of us along with you. I mean, across the whole landscape, it feels like such an inspiring and optimistic work in progress. Yeah, that's it, right? I think it's always a work in progress. I mean, all the back to how to begin with Billie Jean King, like when she set out for the battle of sexes, like what was her ultimate goal? Was there an end goal to it or was it a movement? And was it something that was going to be continuous and exactly that was it like she had she had a passion and a purpose for her life and that moment in time was just like a it was a marker it was a beginning it was a push a little bit and we're just let's it like we're just going to keep inching things open and you know soon it's it's going to be just the floodgates it's really

exciting what for you because it's i mean it's a big topic we're talking about it's industries, it's gender equity, it's it's big. But when you when you distill down that idea and think about it just for you as an individual, what what feels like your work and progress from this moment in your life and career? Gosh, that is, oh, I've thought about that a lot. That's really challenging, right? Like, I think it's always so good to look back because especially when you're in moments of like uncertainty and scary. And that's the moment I found myself in last year is our regional sports network that owned the Rockies was giving up the rights.

So we were all working last year not really knowing the future of our jobs, not really knowing or go, being in a space of like, am I doing what I'm supposed to be doing? What happens if the, you know, rug gets pulled out from under me in this job? And like, that's it. And there's no more opportunities. and it's dry and like what real world job am I going to get? How do you put like talks about sports on a resume? I know it's more than that.

But you're just your wheels are spinning. Like do I need to reinvent myself? So I went through this whole exercise like throughout the course of the season. But I think what's always pulled me is this. And I mentioned the word a couple of times, but it's passion, right? Like when you have such a passion to do something, it lights your fire. like you always get drawn back to it, no matter if you're taking lefts or rights, like somehow you have to circle back to like finding that direction and finding the light that's

guiding you. And so for me, having this be such a passion, I think I can look back on my experience and my growth of like day one when I started doing play by play and it was so foreign to me to learning different bits and pieces about how to prepare better, how to prepare more efficiently, how to put it together. And as they go into this season, I think that's my growth opportunity is like, I would lie to you if I sat here and was like, I am so ready for this. We're going to dominate it. Like, I am ready, but I also have room to grow. And I have to live in that. And I have to live in like, there's a voice of fear that lives in the back of your

mind. And I have to live with like, quieting that down with just confidence of experience. and knowing that like every day is going to be different. I'm going to learn something new every day. I'm going to grow from it every day. And I'm not going to be perfect. And that's okay. And that's okay. That's the space we need to live in.

And as long as we're growing and getting better and producing and connecting, like that goes back to why I love to do this and the passion of why I love to do this. And my friend Kate Scott that I was talking about earlier, She, like, left me with that little piece of advice. She's like, all you have to do in this job is do the work and be yourself. And whenever the noise comes, go back to that. Do the work, be yourself. And I've told myself that probably a hundred times a day.

The last, you know, four weeks and as we enter this new season. And really an athlete, like, if you think about it in any sport, that's probably their, you know, true center as well. like do the work work hard be yourself in the game and the second you stray away like that you mentally get just bogged down and you can't perform right you can't do your job as an athlete so i think that's like such a great lesson for us as humans too i love that do the work be yourself yeah it's a good one yeah do the work thank you thank you so much jenny you're so inspiring i really i'm so glad we got to today. I know. Me too. Right back after you. Thanks for me. It's great. Yeah. Thank you. And congratulations. And we'll we'll be rooting for you over here. Thank you so much.

Thank you.