Dreamscapes Podcasts - Dreamscapes Episode 166: Guides & Guardians

Episode Date: June 21, 2024

Gao Motsemme ~ https://bit.ly/Orgasmicclarity

Greetings friends and welcome back to another episode of dreamscapes. Today, our guest, Dreamer is Rao, Rao Montsemi. I can't, suddenly my throat is so dry. I can't do the, do the, do the, do the G sound. Can you do it for me? You say your first name again. Did it well, how. How?

There we go. Chao Montsemi, originally from Botswana, now residing in Germany. She is a freedom illuminator, embodiment queen, human MRI. psychic surgeon. We got a lot to talk about. Um, you can find her at bit.L.Y slash orgasmic clarity. That link is going to be in the description below. For my part, would you kindly like, share, subscribe, tell your friends. If you have a dream to share, I want to talk to you. You don't have to be anybody special. Uh, just, just an internet friend. I'm happy, happy to, happy to hear from you and we can, we can make an episode. Um, I have, uh, if you'd like to

support my work, 17 currently available works of historical dream literature, the most recent, being The Fabric of Dreams by Catherine Taylor Craig. Of course, all this and more at Benjamin the DreamWizard.com, including downloadable MP3 versions, audio only of these very interviews. Also, if you'd head on over to Benjamin the Dreamwizard.com, trying to build a community there. It is attached to my Rumble account. It's free to join, and you can give me money or not.

But that's where I'd probably like to source most of the dreams going forward. It's like, hey, join and talk to me. Tell me what's going on. Let's make an episode. That is enough out of me. We're going to go back to our friend, Rao Montemé. Thank you for being here. I'm going to say your name like a bunch of times because it's just to try and get it in my head.

Thanks for having me. I'm so grateful to be here. And especially when you're talking about dreaming, when I enter your space, I love to start doing it by greeting as well. And I do that in my native languages. I greet your audience. So do me lang. Du Me Lang, Lokai. And in direct translation, it's agree.

Very nice. Okay is, where are you, locate yourself? And since we are here, talking about dreams in the dream escape, I just love this. How open are you to connect into this other side part of you? You know, and loki is just that. When you show up, what is your intention? and locate yourself, are you still out there, or you are bringing all of you, and most importantly, connecting to the body and allowing the body to share with you

what it wants to share with you. Because we might be talking about dreams here, and maybe my dreams, and then a dream pops up that maybe you have been pushing aside. So when you open up to allow your body to bring in what needs you to pay attention to, it might be the moment, especially when you're from the body, not the mind. Because the mind knows what it knows, the board it has all the major going you are present with it. So thanks for having me. Definitely. And we'll thank you also for hanging in through the technical difficulties.

Sometimes people, they already have a discord. They've already got it all dialed in. They jump in. Bam, we're good to go. Some folks have to download it and get used to it. I'm like, I'm sorry about that. It's so convenient for me. So I should be more convenient for my guest sometimes. But then when there's technical difficulties, it's like, wow, sometimes They're really, and they don't make any sense. You just push a bunch of buttons and suddenly everything's working. You're like, okay, I'm not going to touch it anymore. That's what we.

So I appreciate you also being very patient with that, with that whole process. Like, I wish it hadn't been a hassle. But I think sometimes it's these challenges that reveal the character of a person. Like I was saying, there was one person I talked to who was not very patient with the process and decided to pull the ripcord and get out. And I understand people are busy. Fair enough. But, you know, there's persistence. and patience and and patience and that kind of a positive spirit that goes with writing out

difficulty we're going to figure it out we're going to get it taken care of it's no big deal we just do it and so I really appreciate that about you too I think that says a lot about what people could expect when they speak with you because you have your own thing that you do and that's that's what I wanted to start with of like what is your you know your business or profession your calling and how did you get into that that's a great question and this is why I love being here he's I was led in my life by dreams and I knew from since I was a child through my dreams that there is something that is not spoken about in the society but there is something that I'm meant to do so I just started as a child having dreams that are not normal and

I will share these dreams especially with the amazing visitors the big snake that I don't even think there is any kind of snake that exists that's so huge. So I was having those visitors coming through. And I would share my dreams, you know, and I shared with my family. This is what is coming through. This is what is happening. And the first thing would be like, oh, my God, you're going to be a traditional doctor. You get to go to church.

Just go to church. Or eight times I'll go to somebody who's doing a reading, whether it's using a Bible or whatever. And they'll still hint that, that, oh, you are, you. You are meant to be a traditional doctor that is a calling that you're here to do. And I just went through life. Like when they say when your family is coming from a religious background, I followed through with the religious going to church. But on the other hand, it was not fully aligned.

When you connect with your truth, there is a path that we both called to. And for me, there were some things that I didn't even know why, but some things were just kind of like I had all knee-jerk reactions. Somethings were just pissing me off. Like, there's not truth here. and eventually I stopped going to church but despite all the path that I went through trying to run away from this drinking every weekend

you know I remember there was a moment where I would if I don't dream I know that I'm disconnected and I'll be like I have to stop drinking and reconnect because for me that was like a way that I was getting informed but still I was still not doing this work until everything that I had really collapsed. I lost my job. My younger brother had an accident.

My mom passed because that's when the message came through. So clearly you get to do what you are here to do. And what is that? These people are new will be. So that's how I got to do what I'm doing and help people where I'm helping them. Yeah. Very cool. You brought up a lot of interesting things.

I might work backwards. I might jump around. but there's a there's what am i trying to say there's some folks who are explicitly christian who are very opposed to or skeptical of but not just skeptical more like they considered evil witchcraft to interpret dreams even though there's biblical precedent for it being done and and it's a fair point to say you know how do i know i'm a profit level dream interpretation and actually listening to the voice of god's like well that's a good question And you should be skeptical.

There's a lot of fakes and scammers and people who just tell you what you want to hear and people who will manipulate you for their own good. I'd say you want to find someone who's got a good track record who's proven that they do the good work and that they're not scamming people. And it's a credibility issue. Yeah. So in my personal opinion, there's no contradiction or disconnection between I'm a Christian and I believe dream interpretation can be beneficial. but it uh speaking to which i mean then this bounces bounces back to the other one you said you know you have been guided by your dreams and i actually have a saying that i've got uh on my on my website benjamin the dream wizard dot com it's it that i stumbled to cry i didn't make this up

it is follow your dreams they know the way follow your dreams they know the way and that means a lot uh it's very meaningful to me of course and i think literally to you your dreams show you a path you could take. Absolutely. And it has a double meaning as well because sometimes dreams mean aspirations. It's like saying follow your bliss. Like what do you really want out of life?

Go that direction. That's the path you should take. That's one level of it. The other level of it, which I think is more relevant to what I do. And I love the double meaning. I think they're both true. But it's also pay attention to your dreams. They will allow you to have more insight about yourself and what your experience.

And that's on, so what I do is technically in the, it's more on the purely materialist scientific side psychology stuff. Now that's it. I am kind of a spiritually a mystic. I think there's forces be under control. I can't explain what I do. I open myself up. I hope to the literally the spirit of God to come into me and make me beneficial to someone

else. So that's, that's the focus. And that's another thing you mentioned there too is that when you were doing your introduction earlier, the first thing we have to do is be present and turn our attention in the right direction. If you're if you're not there and you're not paying attention or you're not focused in the right direction, you're not going to see what you need to see. You're not going to get anything out of that experience and you're not going to be able to provide anything of benefit to the other person. The other thing too is like as soon as you said you were talking about

your family and how your dreams said that they and people you consulted said, oh look, this means you're meant to be a doctor. So what does that mean, actually? If we look at what category of person, what archetype is the doctor? Well, it's a healer. So it's the doctor is a specific type of healer. So sometimes people get locked into only imagining one can be a healer in a specific way, doctor and not see the category is a lot broader.

And you, and honestly, you did end up in the same profession. Just not medical doctor in a hospital doing surgery. You know, you're, but you're still under that umbrella of He or the dreams did not lie to you about Absolutely. Yeah, yeah, about where you were going or what you wanted. Last thing is I talked a lot. And this is, I'm going to throw it back to you. You mentioned snakes, seeing snakes in your dream.

And I wanted to ask specifically, uh, and be, okay, broadly categories in them drill down to the specific. Um, every dream speak to you in the language of your understanding. Ooh, you're getting some. You okay there? It's fine. Okay, okay. Just check.

Just check and make it. Yeah. If you, if you ever need a break, let me know. Hey, I need five minutes. We'll pause and come back. It's fine. It's fine. It's good.

Fair enough. Last thing. So dreams speak to us in the language we understand, which includes our cultural references. So for you, I wanted to ask what, how do you or how does Botswanan culture represent snakes? What do they mean to you and how did that figure into your imagery? And I'm going to shut up for a minute. Yeah. there's actually a lot that should say even when you mention, I'm just going to start with that having that clarity, especially when you mentioned the religion and all that when it comes to dream. Because dreams is more like a, when you talk about it, whether it's in scientific, scientific terms or humanitarian terms, we just say it's more accessing our subconscious mind, right? And everyone has that, you know, but then the question is, I would say the challenge with my family was more what the dreams were telling me, not necessarily.

that dreaming is wrong, but with what was coming through, especially to your question about these big snakes. Because it was, like I said, it was this big, huge, I would say, like ocean snakes, because, like, at times I would find myself, even the oceans swimming with these sea creatures and all that. So it was just basically that. And when I look back in like the old African, ancient tradition basically the people who were really gifted in this craft they were

sometimes they will just disappear in the ocean or something like that not necessarily that they disappeared but it's kind of like they're going through that initiation or whatever that happens they're beyond the human eye or mind and then after some time when they thought the people have disappeared they show up and they continue with whatever that that meant to do so that was the relationship with what I was bringing through. Yeah. Yeah, that's amazing.

And so you've got that cultural reference that, like if there was a, what am I trying to say? So how do we view, say, snakes in the Western world or specifically in America the most? We've got a more cultural encyclopedia regarding snakes that are, that they're a hidden danger, a snake in the grass, the rattlesnake that you didn't see on the dusty trail through a lot of our cultural stories.

Um, so if a snake were, let's see, if I were to be guided on a path towards being a healer by dreams, it might not show my dreams might not show me the representation of a snake because it means something else to me specifically. But definitely in your, in your cultural framework, that was a sign and symbol that here's, here's the path that is open to you. here's a path that you maybe want to follow or a path that you have a natural talent for. And your mind says, you know, here's what you really want. Here's what you can do if you reach for it, if you pursue it. So that's fantastic.

And the idea of giant snakes, especially in the ocean, too, like, that's powerful imagery. I love that. Yeah. It's magical. And like you said, snake could also mean that hidden danger. But on the other hand, the thing is what kind of snake is showing up and how do you feel about it? Yes. You know, because just because of the conditioning about snakes being bad, obviously there's going to be that fear that we feel.

But when you connect with the presence of that, how does it feel? Does it feel like there is a threat here? Or it's just you being being protected? Because often that's how they show up. Like, they're just around. They're just watching. but they're not doing anything and I remember

I remember another in another dream as well not so maybe 10 years ago where I was actually was it a dream kind of like dream meditation you know a mixer of those and I just I was aware that I'm living my body

but then at the end I was still in this ocean and there was a point where I was like I was afraid but on the other hand I was just curious you know so I had my feet, it's kind of like they were really cleansing my feet

these huge snakes like they were licking my feet, cleansed my feet and all that and it was like as much as in my mind, because you can observe different aspects of myself in my mind, there's a part of me that is like, oh my God but then there's an inner knowing a part of

me that is accepting of the presence and allowing whatever that is being transmitted or whatever that is being healed at that moment to happen. So how we feel actually in dreams is very important like how we feel and even how we feel after and how it raised our life you know so there is a difference where the kind of snake is like a dangerous snake i know i've had some that came through and at first i was thinking like it's my kind of snake

but it wasn't you know but it's just a matter of observing the energy as well this is why i spoke about presence at the beginning and we can observe the the energy even when we are in dreams, right? You may be, just like we are awake when you're having a conversation and may feel like, yeah, but the energy didn't feel well. So in dreams still, there is a part of us that is aware, if at all you are able to be present. I believe it's kind of like, if you're able to be present in real life, you can also be present in dreams, especially if you are open to them. So it was such that feeling. Every time when they came, there was more, more, I want to know more, I want to play more. There was like a part of me that kind of like knew there is something here.

to bring through to know to play around with yeah definitely i think this is all a very good it's it's all very instructive of the idea uh that one symbol doesn't mean the same thing to all people and even among people that share a common understanding or or a range of references culturally or uh that that apply it still matters your specific interaction with that thing in your dream and in the context of the experience where does it happen what happens between you and this this this creature how did you feel about it and that's i'm trying to get better after now what's this episode 166 uh trying to get better at asking people how did you feel about that because i don't uh i've got a i got a touch of the tism as they say the diagnosed autistic so

emotions don't factor heavily in a lot of things i do i'm more about rational analytical um systematic type of stuff but uh which is really weird because i also follow my gut and just let let my brain explode with ideas and just wherever it takes me, I'll go with it. So these are all very good ways of, of, um, describing the importance of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, of, stuff. Um, I was going to ask you to, too, specific. So I call myself a wizard. And I've got to, an archetypal vision in my head of what of what that is. So I'll give it to you and then I'm going to throw it back to you. To me, it's like, we look at the, the archetype of a wizard.

It's a, he's probably old. He's got some gray, long gray hair working on it. And, you know, why is that part of the wizard archetype? Well, he's been around. Maybe he's seen some things. Maybe he's got some wisdom to share. And actually wizard and wisdom share the same root words. Yeah.

Wizard being one who shares wisdom or puts it into practice. practice. But also, you know, what are the, uh, and he walks with a with the staff because he's old and and, you know, sometimes your legs don't work so well. You're not working with your body. You're working with your mind. Um, yeah. To, uh, to, uh, to gaze in a crystal ball and see the futures. You can't understand cause and effect. I've been there, I've done that. Uh, let me tell you what'll happen if you follow this dangerous path. So it's and then speaking magic words is the idea of sharing beneficial information saying the right thing to the right person at the right time. Um, uh, uh, let me tell you. that causes them to have a better or there's evil wizard, sometimes a worse experience in life. You're going to choose whether to use your, use your powers for good or bad. So I wanted to, that's my conceptualization of why I use that title for myself

and what I'm trying to embody it in my practice. I wanted to throw back to you to say, you know, what is a freedom illuminator? What is, you know, an embodiment queen, human MRI.

How did you come to those titles to describe your practice? And it's, That's actually a good question. Freedom Illuminator is actually even part of my logo. And it's something that when I played around with a lot of names, and the one that I love the most is the quantum witch doctor. And I'm fully in a position where I don't care what you say. I was asked go with that one, quantum witch doctor.

You know, because at the core of it, that's who I am. But I realize that there are people who are. were just scared by the witch doctor part. You know, I've had people maybe want something and then they click on something that I share,

a link that I share with them and it's saying, quantum wish doctor. And when I get back like, oh, did you get that? It's kind of like, oh, Jesus is protecting me. I'm loved by Jesus.

She's scared by the word wish doctor and they're running for their lives and now it's kind of like, I don't have any problems. Jesus is taking care of me. So I just, decided to use the freedom

Illuminator actually came through while I was with this whole name but it was more for my logo because my logo is more it has a it has a horse and then Freedom Illuminator when I was asking about that this

was just came through just like that and then I received these horses but on the other hand a horse has a different meaning because when I was going through my divorce and the time when I was trying to fight the whole shift that is happening. I had a profound moment, a dream that is not a dream, and I bet you know what I'm talking about,

a dream that is small, real than anything. And I was just resting on this horse, touching it, feeling the heat of its neck, and it was just so amazing. And after that dream, I just, I just woke up from that with a renewed sense of freedom. and trust in the process so I believe

that was just the like for me it was kind of I felt like I was a horse in another lifetime that's how I felt after that connection because I felt that coming home coming to me the allowing of me to be and allowing the process to unfold

how it unfolds this is why the horse is a big part of my logo and the freedom illuminator came through the human MRI psychic surgeon it's just how I do the way because when I'm sitting with somebody I scan the body and see what needs attention, where are emotions stored, where there's blocks and all that. So as much as you can go to

do a scan at whatever medical practice and you get to see what is happening, I get to see that energetically just by being here. And then when I do my work, the psychic surgeon, I definitely do the surgery, but without opening you up. So I pull out whatever that you don't need or whatever that is interfering with your freedom and success. So that's the magic. That's, that. I do. So it's more like sometimes it's mental issues, sometimes emotional, sometimes it's physical. Sometimes it may be something that is physical that you're aware of, but the doctor has not really been able to tell what is going on or you are aware, even the doctors are aware of something. And I've had people who have worked with for something like four weeks and then

when they went back to do their schedule surgery, that was canceled because all that was there has cleared, like CSF cleared and all that. You know, because this is the thing. We're trusting of just the medical doctors, and yet our body is telling us the sign that something is not right, then we want to wait until there is, like, this is why at times people find out when things are in, like, extreme stages, right? But when you are open to the modern medical system,

but still open to the other way, you can try both and see what works and what meets you where you're at. So some people come through and like, though, the doctor didn't find anything, but I know there's a problem. And for me, like, that's the first thing that the moment they say hi, it's kind of like, what is happening with your number, arm and there is pain, your heart and all that is happening. It's kind of, oh, my God. You know, they just start lighting up. I have a problem. And I was wondering what's happening.

The doctor didn't see anything, but I knew something was happening. So I increased my insurance because I know I may die anytime. So it's one of those things. Yeah. Definitely. that's there's so many great great things wrapped up in that and a lot of our self concept is is expressed in titles in this way uh which which which is I think is fantastic it's like well what do I do and what does it really mean um so kind of kind of working backwards first just to comment on the idea of

dreams there's a long history of dreams being used for medical diagnosis that that sometimes our physical symptoms will show up in the dreams and and that that that that I mean, I mean, going back 2,000 years to, I think a guy, one of the most famous practitioners, Galen of Pergamon in the kind of Mediterranean, you know, Greek or Roman area. He would, he has a very famous dream that he diagnosed where, I think, I think it was that guy. Now, now I'm not sure. But anyway, the idea was the man dreamed of, you know, driving, you know, whipping, panting, sweating, horses uphill and the horses are struggling.

And it was interpreted to mean the man had, you know, a heart condition. And he did. So there's a tremendous possibility if we pay attention to our dreams in that way and other sources of information. We can get those kind of hints of a direction to look to fix a problem. And that's another thing I was going to say about the, I love the idea of psychic surgeon. And I, you know, there's one where there's the,

people do psychic surgery and like remove things through the skin or something. But that's one thing. But I think of psychology as being like a psychic surgeon, I'm like, that actually describes psychology very much. You're going into insubstantial psyche. I mean, there's nothing physical there to touch. There's an experience that's happening. And you're going to maybe pull out things that are cancerous or at least shed light.

And that's the idea of the freedom illuminators. Like sometimes we're stuck in a dark place. And that means, you know, we can't see our way out. But if you can illuminate a path to freedom, then the person can get out of the bad place that they're in. I love these, these images. And yeah, and a horse, I mean, there's, there's, it's, it's wonderfully iconic of something that is a self-contained natural phenomenon. I mean, horses are just born. They eat grass.

They run. And, and then eventually they make more horses. and that's very iconic of, I think, you know, both tremendous power and the physicality of the animal, but just the ease of natural being. A horse is just naturally free. So if you want to be free, you could do worse than to emulate a horse in a lot of ways to take on that spirit of the horse. And they're very intuitive too, right? Oh, yeah.

They get a sense. They can't speak. They can't rationalize in any way that they can't. can communicate, but they know if someone's not a good person and they stay away from them. They just know. Like, ah, and then we get that, uh, that I, uh, there's a Western phrase or at least in America. The idea of having horse sense like a horse knows. They know, they know the way home.

Yeah. They know where the grass is. They just got. And that's what, meaning someone who's actually just, uh, wise in a very simple way. Wise about the most simple, most basic, most obvious things is good horse sense. And it's, it's, it's quite interesting. Because when all these things were happening, and now when I look back in my childhood, because my parents were farmers, and we had cows. And actually, cows also can be a representation of ancestors when you have them in a dream.

You know, when you have, yeah. And we had horses. Like, everyone had some horse and all that. But everyone in my family's horses died. And I was the one who was, I would say I was rich with horses. Like, they just kind of like, I don't know. they just agreed with me. Like, there was just that connection.

And any horse that I was given, they would just multiply. I have a lot of them. And I had many of them. So it was quite interesting when I'm now in my old age and going through what I'm going through. And then this horse comes. And when I look at my childhood, it's kind of like, oh, so that explains it, you know. Yeah.

And it could also be a very personal icon for your unique experience of good fortune, abundance, that kind of a thing. So when you get into the idea of like, how am I going to express myself in the world? Well, what do I have? I have good fortune and abundance to share. And I want to have that increase in other people as well. So that, again, that icon comes to you and says, this is, this is the way. The dreams show you the way in that, in that regard.

Yeah. I love that. I think it's fascinating. There's too much we don't understand about the world. And people, I know people like to simplify it. Sometimes you don't have the mental bandwidth to consider all kinds of crazy ideas they've never heard of before or you're skeptical of or haven't been proven. but I think a lot of, I think we've lost too much connection with our gut and our intuition.

You know, our intuition isn't always right, but it's always pointing at something. There's always a reason for the feeling. And maybe that feeling is something you need to fix in yourself and maybe it's a warning about something outside. My conceptualization of intuition is it's like a lighthouse on the shore. It's like it, it's that kind of a beacon. It's that, well, it's definitely there. You can see it.

It's shining. And you know that in that direction, is the shoreline. You don't know exactly where every single rock is in the water. And you don't know where the best place is to put up on the shore. And maybe your goal isn't even to get to the shore. You're just moving around the lighthouse to keep going in a different direction. But it just tells you, it tells you something.

It gives you a point of reference. It gives you information. And then it alerts you to something that needs your attention. That's kind of how I conceive of dreams in general and that intuition. I love that. Because when you say that I'm not always right, I'm like, hmm, they're right. But like, when you explain it, I'm like, yeah, that's on point. It's not like 100% that's it.

But it's more like, I say them as breadcrumbs. You know, it's kind of like, follow the breadcrumbs. Just follow it. Just go along with it. And at times you can have something now and you want to hold into it. I want to know what this means and because I know something is coming. But it may reveal itself in two years. And it's like, oh.

Yeah. That's why, you know, but the question is, are you willing to go with it? And at times it can be one thing that I see also interfering with our intuition, it can also be our own wounds. What I say is that at times when we have not healed your wounded desires, you may overrule what is coming through because, or even interpreted how you want to interpret it. You know, I was married and the marriage was not working. And the message that came through the other time was just,

like I was given a vision but at the same time there was a message that came through basically the way it played out it was like being shown me and my husband who's now my ex-husband and I couldn't breathe I just couldn't breathe

in this dream I couldn't breathe but at the same time I was busy like angry criticizing and whatever we're talking about but I couldn't breathe and when I came out of it I was like oh then I just have to

accept him as he is and stop criticizing him, you know, not necessarily criticizing him, but there was certain things that I was not approving of, for instance, like alcohol and alcohol addiction and all that. And also with him also wanting me to be, like, he didn't want me to do this work. He felt like this is just an illusion. It's crazy fantasy, you know. So it was kind of like we're fighting about who I get to be and what I get to do. So from there, I was like, okay, I need to just accept her message is for this thing to work and just keep quiet and not do anything. But was that really the truth? No, it wasn't. I was shown that I can't breathe in this relationship. But there is a wounded part of me that wanted a relationship so badly that I just said,

okay, fine, I just have to stop talking and just accept him as he is, you know, and accepting someone as they are doesn't necessarily mean that I get to be with you. You can accept someone in that truth but still go separate ways. And like I said, one thing that I love, like I said, my dream has been my guide with this relationship, the time when we're kind of like separated but not officially separated, I got my divorce papers in a dream. Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

And that's the interesting thing too about dreams is that very often the only thing they show you is the truth. You get to decide how you feel about that. I mean, you very well could have decided. you know my my life is better off my my relationship is worth sacrificing for i'm going to give up this practice i'm going to stay in there i'm going i'm going to choose to change who i am and and because of i want what i want out of life and and that's not like um it's not a good thing or bad thing i i don't necessarily encourage people to sacrifice their own personality and sense of self

and goals just to make a relationship work but if that's your choice then that you're you are deciding who you want to be. So all the dream. And I love, I love visions. And this is where my, um, it's where my brain goes,

it just pops, uh, can't breathe. I mean, breathing is to, uh, inspire, to take into inspire.

And then death is expire. So breathing is life and, and the exhalation is or, or, or, or, or, or,

or, what you're, what you're seeing there is this. But also we, we think of inspire as, as to have, um, motivation put into us.

inspiration. I've been inspired to do this thing. And that's very much, you know, something has come into me of taking in something that, um, that gives me a vision, a purpose, uh, uh, like that. So yeah, all of these, all of these things show up in that dream where you're like, I can't breathe. So you could have decided, I'll just give up breathing. That's okay. I don't need it. I don't need it. I don't need to be inspired. I don't need to take things into me. I'm satisfied with something else. But you looked at and go, especially the framework we put in it when it's I can't catch my breath and this is uncomfortable, painful. It's showing you you're going through something you don't want to.

Something's got to give. You got to, it's got to be resolved one way or another. And this was the path that opened up before you. He said, you know, I've checked in with my gut. I've looked at what I want out of life and it's not worth this relationship with this person is not worth giving up these other things. Maybe he'll change. Maybe he'll accept me as I am.

But I'm just going to do what I do, the path that I've been shown that the goal that I want to reach for and he's going to have to make up his own decisions it looked like it just didn't work out which is always unfortunate but isn't isn't always the worst thing that can happen sometimes people got to split up and this is not working it's a mismatch it can't work we can just fight it forever and be miserable or we can just just move on and get it over with there's a lot that you say there that is like so flipping true in so many ways in the sense that it's kind of like because for me i feel like when you just connect to this part of us that you're like that you're knows higher intelligence, inner intelligence, higher self, whatever we call it, or

do you connect to that and actually even when you're talking about being in our power being in our power is not necessarily us holding into the human because the human has its own this is why at times we get caught up in the mind what you know but when you follow that and just be willing to trust that because at times we meet for a purpose whether it's our wounds that brought us together then we come together when that purpose is fulfilled, now the question is what's next? And when I'm looking at the soul, for instance, when I'm looking at the soul existence, the soul loves, it's here to evolve, you know, so the desire, it's to be more, it's challenged by, it's not like challenge in the sense

of us human, but it loves challenges because the question is, what is it going to be when it comes across a certain thing? What decision am I going to make? So it loves change, is more curious about every single experience, you know, because when I decided to give in to this, this is what I talk about healing generation of parents. My soul was dancing, but my human was afraid. And also there were many voices from the women who walked before me. What do you want? How somewhere angry as that comes to like men.

It has been like that for a long time where a young girl dreams of being married. from since the childhood, like, when I find my husband, you know, and at times we just let go and we live in that misery, like you said, hoping that someone will change, you know, and not listening to the discomfort, which is the discomfort or those emotions, sadness, anger, whatever that is piling up. You know, we don't listen to that and we get miserable, which as a human, you may be willing to sacrifice yourself to sustain a relationship,

but for the soul, it's like you say it, It's literally death because if it's the soul loves freedom and I believe the soul is freedom, you know, but then we're here in this body, but you can't express yourself. You can't give birth to your desires. You can't enjoy. You can't really allow yourself to have pleasure, which when I look at it, even when I ended up leaning into this and allowing, what came through was just basically that. Love is always present. The only reason why we feel when we're going through heart breaks and all that, why we feel the pain is because of the walls that we have created that are breaking.

But the love that you have for that person or even when you stay in a relationship and your reasoning is, I still love him or I still love him. You will never stop loving that person. Even when you think you have stopped loving that person or you've moved on, you may use somebody, especially that people who wait until they find someone and they move because I found someone. But it doesn't mean that they have gotten over the other person. They're just using the other person to jump ship, right? So love is always there, you know.

So that's just it. And when you look at it again, you are giving the other person a chance, especially the way you're always arguing and all that. Kind of like, what is possible if this person maybe meets somebody that he is willing to change himself, whether it's for him or for the other person? Because if at all you are arguing and wanting the other person to change, there are two things. accepting the other person as they are, you are loving an idea of who they could be if they

unleashed their highest potential or if they get to change. So you are not loving the person as they are. There's a part of you that deny, resist who that person is being. You have an idea. Even when you fall in love, I used to fall in love with potential a lot. This is why I went through toxic patterns in my relationship. I have potential. Oh my God, this person has got potential. does it mean that they're going to unleash it or you are the one who is projecting your own potential to these people? You know, because at times we talk about projection, but projection is not

only bad things. We can project our potential because we don't want to sit and unleash what is here, but then we're looking for somebody like, oh, this person is potential. You know, we will think that we can rescue them. We're not accepting them as they are. You know, so there's that resistance that is happening. And when you let go and maybe they're

find someone and when they meet this person, something happens. It's kind of like I'm willing to stop the alcohol addiction, drug addiction, whatever. I want to be best for myself and for you, you know. And it's also an opportunity for you to meet somebody else. So I just love, I just love that because we get to, we get to choose. We're going to be given what we need, which I always say, at times we pray. You know, you pray or you do chanting affirmations. You're saying that.

But the question is, when you are. given the information that you need, what are you going to do about it? Are you going to embrace it and make a decision based on what you truly desire? Or you want to be like, oh, the devil is a liar. Often we blame the devil. Oh, the devil is a liar. Somebody is trying to mess up my relationship, but I'm going to fight. You know, you are willing to fight for something, but not fighting for yourself. And I'm talking about that from experience, especially when we talk about dreams as well, because I had many dreams even in my relationship where I would see, even when someone is cheating, I would see that. And at times, I even want to ask a question, is this relationship really meant for me?

Some things would happen. Like, I asked that question on Monday. And on a Friday, I received a call from my ex-boyfriend by then. And I just, crazy, I just picked up the phone and I didn't say a word. And I was sleeping. So I just picked up a phone and put on my ear. and then he just started talking calling this girl's name, I love you, da-da-da, all the stories.

And at the end, I said hello. And that's when he don't know him. Oh, shit, I called her, you know. And I stayed in that relationship until it got miserable, but I was given what I wanted. That's true. Yeah, that's all there's so much good stuff in there. I mean, right at the very end there,

be careful what you wish for. You just might get it. And sometimes that's for the best. And a lot of it, has to do with what are you aiming for? Like if you're wishing for the right things, then it's good to get them. If you wish for the wrong things, that's going to go badly. Another thing you, you'd mention a little bit ago was this idea of, fall in love with the potential people. I resonate with that so much. I mean, I've got kind of a, and I think that's a pitfall

for the healer, but people drawn to being a healer is like, if you lived up to your potential, how glorious would it be? And then we look at that and approach approach the person like already from the beginning wanting to change them. And it's like, what you want to do is fall in love not only with their potential in a way. Because that isn't necessarily wrong. It can lead us down a wrong path. It can make us engage in wrong behaviors. But you also want to fall in love with the part of the part of them that is actively working towards achieving that potential.

Like without that motivation, you're just like, oh, well, this is, I just need to see this as a tragedy. That you could be so much more, but you don't want it. don't want it. I can't make you want it. That works with psychology as well. I mean, a broad leap under the, under the healer archetype. We see people who are damaged and we want them to overcome their struggles to put their past behind them in a way that, you know, makes sense of it. And as you were saying, puts them in their power. And that's, that's an amazing concept, too. That idea of being in your power. It's like, there's a lot of different kinds of power.

And some people think of power as force, dominance, control. But there's also the power in patience and long suffering and being the endurance of hanging in there while someone struggles and just being present for them. There was a Twitter thing. I said, don't follow me on Twitter. Say all kinds of crazy stuff.

But anyway, this is one of the good ones. The idea that when you're, say when you're counseling someone who has suicidal ideations, they're severely depressed and they're just, they're just really in a bad place. It's like they tell you life is hopeless. I want to die. And what we have to do, the healthiest approach is we can't validate that in the way of saying, you're right. Life is hopeless. You should die. Not the not the result we're looking for. We also can't say, no, your wrong life isn't hopeless because that's just, just negating. It's not, we actually want to, want to ride that line and say, that's a normal feeling. From where you're at, it's perfectly reasonable that you feel that way, that you believe it's hopeless and the pain is intolerable. So I just need to leave to escape the pain because it's never going to get better. And so the phrase that the way I express that concept is like what you're trying to say to someone is, It's okay if you don't have hope for the future.

I'm here to have that hope for you until you can have it for yourself. And that's kind of, that's a different kind of power too. I'm not, there's nothing I can do to force that person to feel differently. All I can do is be there for the process of change to get them back to a place where they've, they've been able to purge themselves of that feeling,

whether it's through purely talking or maybe talking in a mixture of, you know, antidepressants or something. Um, so yeah, just, just getting that, that idea. There's lots of different kinds of power. And sometimes just doing nothing and listening is a tremendous source of power. It's a power all on its own. Just being able to focus, really hear what someone's saying, take it in for the best understanding.

So I'll just stop there for a moment. All, all of those thoughts you had inspired those thoughts in me. So it's powerful what you said. And it's just that, you know, and it, and when you look at life, this is why there are books. This is why there is all this motivational speaking and all that. At times you can look at somebody's life and you just borrow that faith. You borrow that hope from that person to say if they made it, I can. So even when someone shares, you know, like you said, it's normal to feel that way because at some point we felt that.

Everybody. You know, when I went through the separation with my children, especially for the second time with my ex-husband, there was a part of me that wanted out. You know, it wanted out. But at the same time, there is this other aspect of myself that also knows that, hmm, life can be better. You know, so at that point it's more like, okay, I'm going to listen to both, but then I have to make a choice here. You know, and actually there is what you said even earlier when you're still talking about divorce. Who do I want to become?

You know, and is it really worth it to give up on this? Who other people went through this who made made it out of that? It doesn't matter whether it's financial crisis, heartache, you know, losing a lot of things. We all go through that and we feel differently about them, especially if we are so attached to them. Because even one of the main thing, when it came to me being who I'm being now and doing what I'm doing now, while I was going through the separation with my children the first time, the question that came through was, who are you? You know, who are you without?

But literally it was who are you without a religion, without your mother, your father, your house, your car, your job. All this things, your partner, your wife, your husband, all this things came through. And at the end it said, who are you without our children? That was like, whew. I was like, I just started crying. I don't know who I am. And it made me question even, it's kind of like a stupid question, actually. Who are you without a child?

I thought, what do you mean? You know, my children are a big part of my life, you know. And this is the thing. We don't have that freedom of individuality. And even when it comes to relationships, it's more like identifying attach to codependency and all that. It doesn't mean that we don't love our children and our partners. But the question is, who am I being?

And even in the choices that are making, who do I want to become? You know, which also still, even when it comes to the whole dreams that are coming through, they are giving us that choice to say, because for me when it comes to whether it's just like psychic, even if I may see some things that are going to happen in the future,

it's not like it's written on stone. It's one of the opportunities, possibilities that exist. So I always say even if you go to a psychic or something like that, it's not true true, which is also, I love the dream part because if you are good and playing with dreams, I have played with this when I was a child,

where I had a dream. And that was like before I knew that I even books about dreams, but it was just like me playing with life. I had this dream and I woke up before it was complete. And one of my questions was like, but God, why do you always show me things, especially bad things?

Because it was more like bad things that I dreamed of that became true. So why do you show me things? And that dream was not complete, but it was at the back of my mind. So when I went to sleep the following, I was like, okay, I want to continue where I left off and then

the dream continued. And then the third day again, I'm like, okay, I'm sleeping, but I want to continue again. And the dream continued. So for me, that was like, I don't care what you say, but there is more into this. And the fact

that I can also make that conscious decision choice and be willing to open this and continue where I left in a dream, and here I am. That was like, for me, it was like, I don't care what you say, you know. So it's all those options to say if you want to know more, if you want to go in and also change the outcome even in the dream, you are capable of doing that. You know, but the question, the most important thing even in life is anything that you're trying to do coming from fear.

Because I believe everything is magical when you're coming from love. Even when it comes to boundaries, we talk a lot about boundaries, boundaries and all that. And I believe boundaries is things that you cannot create from fear. Even when you're talking about connecting to other light beings or whatever, if I'm fearful, because I still remember, the first time I left my body, it was something like leaving my body while I was conscious. It's more like if it's in a dream state, but I was just kind of like lying down. And then I'm aware.

Actually, the voice just came through and it said, what about technology? So I was like, what about technology? So I'm waiting to hear what's going to happen. And then whoop, I'm out of my body. And I can look down and I saw my, my now ex-husband laying on the bed and I'm like, oh my God, oh my God. I'm like, take me back.

And I started praying. You know, so some of the things we can't experience beyond because there is fear. You know, so even when it comes to whether it's like dream, dream, dream. And I love what you said about dream as in goals, visions and all that, and even dreams on the other side. You know, if you come from love, the curiosity, the playfulness, and not being like this, that's when it becomes more fun, more playful. Yeah.

Definitely. And also being present. Yeah. No, for sure. We were talking about power. There's a unique element of power, which is also the willingness to see the truth when it isn't so pleasant. I mean, that's that's inner strength, you know, of that variety. And it's you've got to have that ability or develop it within yourself.

because otherwise you're living with nothing but denial, delusion, and you can't base real actions on false understandings. It's just it doesn't work. If you believe fire doesn't burn, you're still going to get burned. It's more likely because you're not being careful. You know, it's those analogies. Oh, so many great things you were saying. I wish I'd written down more of them.

Dreams, as you were saying, are very often warnings. And not always. So if we go back to Freud and Young and the early 19th or beginning of the 1900s, Freud's conception was dreams always contain a secret wish and that it's kind of disguised a little bit because maybe we're ashamed of it or we're not really sure how to understand it. So it's giving us these symbols that represent what. And that's true to a degree. And he considered a wish also to mean a fear.

You know, a wish can be a wish that a bad thing does. doesn't happen. So there's there's different ways of saying, you know, so if you fear something, it means that something you love is going to be absent. I, I'm afraid my mother will die because I love my mother and I don't want her to leave. You know, I'm afraid I'll be embarrassed in public because I love that other people see me as competent and, and, and appropriate to social standards and different things. So there's, every fear has its counterpart love way of understanding that, that type of thing. And I love the idea that, just, a final final thought on the concept dreams this was something i thought of earlier that i was going to

share with you is you and i have both and i think most people do have interpreted our own dreams um and i think most people can and i and i think most people should if they they should number one pay attention get something out of it even if it's very simple stuff don't don't imagine miracles happening on day one but the idea of starting to pay attention to those things you can go oh that's what I was thinking about. That's how I feel about that. I didn't realize that connection between these things that now gives me better insight, better understanding of,

well, now I have a choice. First, you have to become aware of a choice. And then you can make the choice. If you have no awareness, you're just on a path and we have no choice. You have to become aware of the choice first. And I guess we just take it for granted.

Having more choices is better to a certain degree. Certainly, if things aren't working so well, you're like, I need a way off this path. And then that's when dreams come. I'm afraid I'll be stuck on this path means I would love to be on a different path. That's what that's where my love is going.

I don't know. Oh, and then, but that doesn't mean that sometimes you're going to need help. You know, the idea that you can interpret your own dream. Sometimes you're a little too close to the problem. Sometimes you've got your own fears and anxieties. You don't want to see the truth as clearly as you probably should because that means accepting some pain along with it. And so it very much it can help to have someone to, who's,

a little more experienced in it like you like you or I to just kind of walk you through the steps and say well let's look at this together and there's a magic that happens between two people when they're sharing thoughts is I always look at it like there's only so many thoughts I can think and when you add another person they can think thoughts I can't think they're going to see something necessarily from a different perspective so if I just share ideas with them they're going to share their ideas with me inspired by my ideas that then inspire my ideas based on their ideas and there's like there's that's what I consider to be like a magic a form of magic Yeah.

You know, it's not, it's not literally, I can throw a fireball because I'm a wizard. It's not like that. It's more, it's this magic that happens in relationship. It's magic that happens when, when we experience the invention of a new idea. Nobody knows where that comes from. Someone, one day at a moment in time, there was not an idea and the next moment there's an idea. What just happened? Nobody knows.

That's magic. Psychology can't, science can't explain it. None of those things. Anyway, I'll stop. I'll stop there. You probably got some feedback. I actually love that. Like you said, awareness precedes choice and choice precedes change, you know, and that's just

it. You know, if you are not aware, then your choices are limited, you know? And I can still look back even like at the beginning of my career as an accountant. Many people that I came across, I knew as well, but a lot of people just, did you really make a correct career choice and accountant, is that really for you? You know, and I remember when I was in internship, one of my, one of my boss said, why don't you just go and be a model or something like that? And it's like, hmm, model is not really for me, you know.

But when it dawn on me, even about this whack, even motivational speaking, or speaking, being on stage. And by then I didn't feel so small, but there was a part of me that opened up. But it doesn't mean that there's no, there's no, like, bit of fear, you know, because it's not something that I always do. There is fear. And even when it comes to, actually what came to my mind as you were speaking, was before I fully accepted who I am,

whether it's a quantum wish doctor, human and I'm a psychics surgeon, before I embrace it fully, the dream that was always there was me being naked and people looking at me being uncomfortable. And I believe we all have this. when there is something that we are not willing to embrace to embody, then you'll find yourself somewhere where you are, there's some dreams that are repetitive,

because I'm speaking about this, another one can be just the toilet that is like full of shit. And another one is being naked in the dream and you're in front of people or people are watching you. So like those are kind ones, those are the ones that are like coming to mind because there is a part of us that we are, not we don't want to show people and I love this this I don't know where I

come across it but I love it just the word show the world who you are you know what part of us are we show into the world because often dreams also brings that part that is that we are hiding and being naked is kind of like what is possible when you just allowing yourself to be authentic and be seen in your beauty but because we have created so many things put on different masks you know we we don't even see the beauty that is within this, within who we are, you know, but we're afraid that if they get to know who I am, will they accept me, will they love me? And it doesn't mean at times even we are looking for the love, because when I look at my journey, sometimes we are looking for the love in the love

and acceptance in family, because that's how it has been since we're a child. You know, you want the family to accept you, to love you. But what if you are not here to be accepted by your family and everyone that you're looking for love from? But the most important thing is to accept yourself, you know, and when you do, you'll find your soul tried. The most important thing is to live your life fully, you know, because when I started doing, it's quite interesting because it's always different in the sense of whatever, I was called names, crazy one, you know, so I was different in so many ways. Sometimes when I was smoking, sometimes when I was drinking, but none of my family is smoking or anything, and especially as a woman is coming from a very traditional African

family, you know, so it was kind of like, there were those things, and I was, how I dressed, a lot of questions around just who I was being, you know, and there was this wound, the desire to be accepted. And even when I looked at the relationships that I was in, I was still a part of me that wanted to be accepted. I made a choice of, well, they accept me. And at times it's as stupid as, this is crazy. Like, another one was potential.

Another one was, like, the father of my two kids, one thing that I just appreciated was, like, in that family, they were smoking. So it's kind of like, well, okay, they have parents are smoking. working so I'm just cool. You know, it's just like, what are you doing? You know, it doesn't make any sense. But at times when you want to be accepted so badly, you make those, those choice. But at the end of the day, it's you who get to accept you. And then here I am, years later, I'm doing what I'm doing is not necessarily what is normal at home. At home, it's kind of like, we just go to church every Sunday and whatever that is being done, Easter's and all that. And here I am on a totally different

path. But for me, because like at the core of my being, I believe in love. I don't believe in all the separation. You know, for me it's kind of like we are all these human beings, amazing ones, and we get to love each other and animals and all the planet. For me, that's that's it. You know, my religion is love, you know, and the fact that I'm doing what I'm doing, helping people and all that, I'm expecting that if I share with my family where they get to know what I'm doing, they're just going to be happy for me, but they're still like, they don't get it. You know?

Yeah. So it's not about whether you, you know, as long as you are not doing anything immoral, if it's not as you're not hurting anyone, you get to accept yourself and live the life as you are meant to be. Because at times you look for love in the wrong place. Definitely. Yeah, though that's exactly what I was thinking too is, you know, we're not recommending anyone disassociate from their family, like,

as a default position, but there are families where there's very much dysfunctional. And seeking approval from a dysfunctional family means you have to be dysfunctional yourself in order to fit in. So sometimes you got to go. And then there's also families that are perfectly functional, but they don't see the world the same way you do. They don't, they don't understand. And I remember, you know, the idea of you have a parent who loves you and they say,

hey, if you live your life this way, you're going to have a hard road. and they don't want you to have a hard life. And then you, you know, part of you might say, well, don't control me. Don't tell me what to do. But then you also want to say, well, I recognize your, this is your love for me. You don't want to see me suffer. And then sometimes you got to say, I appreciate you don't want to see me suffer. It's coming from a good place.

You're not wrong. And I'm going to do it anyway because that's what I need to do. I need to go experience this more difficult way of being in the world. Even if you're right, I'm going to suffer more. That's just what I have to do. And sometimes that happens. It's very personal, very, very individual based on your circumstances, your family, your inner, inner guides that are telling you what to do and talking it over with someone is never,

never a bad idea. Hey, I got a big decision to make. What do I do? Let's get this out of my head and put it between us and we can both look at it and try and figure out what it is. Speaking of which, we've, we've already been talking for an hour. I think we could talk for another hour and it would just be equally fascinating. But I don't want to cheat you out of the dream interpretation experience.

So are you about ready to transition over to that? Yeah. Okay, wonderful. Let me make a little note of the time here. So this is that I actually wanted to just add into that before we jump into that. But now it's kind of like my mind is a little bit jumbled. But just like what you're just saying about following your path respectively and even learning something, I just believe like that's the whole truth.

And the truth of it is just that, that you'll never, there's no failure, there's nothing wrong with anything. You're just going to learn out of it, you know? So even when it comes to parenting, when you just know that at times, especially when you're talking about wisdom, you know, our wisdom comes from our experiences. And experience is something is the best teacher rather than reading or hearing from somebody else. So now we can transition. There's almost a way that sometimes you can't really understand something until you've experienced. experienced it. There's something to that. I mean, we can understand intellectually. We might even have a gut sense, but like there's different types of knowing about that kind of stuff. And one is to have been through it and go, wow, that not only was that nothing like I thought it would be, I didn't, I didn't really know what it was until I saw it, until I felt it happen. That's, that goes for a lot of things in life. I mean, I don't recommend anyone stick their hand in fire just to know that it burns, but, but you know it. You know it like you've never known it before once you've done it. Yeah, that's true.

That's true. Okay, so my process for the dream thing is I just shut up and listen. You tell me the story, the experience, and then we try and figure out what it means together. So I'm ready when you are. Benjamin the Dream Wizard wants to help you. Here's the veil of night and shine the light of understanding upon the mystery of dreams. Every episode of his Dreams program features real dreamers, gifted with rare insight into their nocturnal visions. New DreamScape's episodes appear every week on YouTube, Rumble, Odyssey, and other video hosting platforms, as well as free audiobooks exploring the psychological principles which inform our dream experience and much, much more.

To join The Wizard as a guest, reach out across more than a dozen social media platforms and through the contact page at Benjamin the Dream Wizard.com, where you will also find the wizard's growing catalog of historical dream literature. available on Amazon, documenting the wisdom and wonder of exploration into the world of dreams over the past 2,000 years. That's Benjamin the Dream Wizard on YouTube and at Benjamin the Dream Wizard.com. It's quite interesting because the dream that came, like an idea of a dream that came through, I'm not even sure if I'm going to be able to articulate it properly, but I have this connection with dogs, right? So I might jump here and there, but it's still about dogs, you know.

So I have a strong relationship with dogs, but it's kind of like different from the horses and the snakes and all that. But what I kind of see, what is coming through like right now is I'm speaking about it. I still remember another dream way I was like lying down. There was something I was lying down on it. And then it was very windy, very. very windy, you know where you don't even know what the hell is happening. So it was that windy but I was under a tree. And then these dogs came and they held all sides of whatever cloth that I was,

I was lying on and they took me to the room, you know. And it's kind of like there was some sort of like, I don't know, healing that was meant to happen in that room. So this is like one of the, one of the dreams that I have with these dogs. And then at times it's just like dogs coming through and just, licking me in the sense of just giving me love, but it's more like pleasurable the experience that I'm getting.

But another, another, like, it's more like a continuation because it's a repetition of this, especially the way at times I'm meant to be somewhere, I can see myself, I'm traveling, I'm getting to a place, and I'm curious, okay, why am I here? You know, and as I'm supposed to go through that place, whether I'm running away from something,

but I'm supposed to go through something, there are dogs, or even me just in my mind, before I'll be like, are there any dogs. I'm not afraid of dogs in my real life, but in those dreams I'll be like being cautious at their dogs in here. And at times

there will be, it's kind of like gatekeepers or something, I don't understand, but there is that continuation. The one that is coming through so vividly, it's somehow it's got something to do with my ancestors because I was at a place, I was at a place where I'm just there, I'm

familiar with it, but I don't remember it in this lifetime or in my memory. And then I opened the gate so I'm just curious who am I going to meet here but as I enter the mind is going to the dogs where are the dogs and then I see these dogs and instead of continuing through I go back so there is this something about dogs at times I may be traveling and I'm aware that I'm out of my body I'm traveling but then along the way there are dogs at times like it's a lot of them and they start biking and all that so it's kind of like I would say there is there's good experiences

but often when I look at my dreams, it's not like, it's more like a fear that is, that is playing around. And I had in my life, in my life, this lifetime, I had two, I had two dogs back when I was home. And like the memory, the dream that I had was when I was, I was like sleeping. But I woke up from this dream where I was asking my dog, like, Rex, what are you doing here? My dog was called Rex. So I was asking, what are you doing? And I was saying it so loud that my son came and asked me, Mommy, where is drugs?

I'm like, oh, I was just dreaming. So I just got out of the dream asking that question. So this is like, like this is the dream that came into my awareness as we're speaking to talk about. Yeah. Sure. So it sounds like we had maybe maybe a couple different dreams. You sound like you were describing maybe a series of recurring themes. We say recurring dreams, but the thing is dogs keep coming back to you.

Um, did you want to so, so, um, what I found for me that works best with trying to understand recurring dreams is to start with one and really kind of look at that. And then from that understanding, look at the other dreams and so care, are they common themes that seem to line up with that. So I think you might have told me a couple of different ones. The one that I started writing down was you're laying on something and it's windy and then the dogs take you somewhere else. Do you want to do that one?

or did you want to do a different one where you were at the place, you opened a gate and you were thinking about the dogs? Where do you want to go? Which dream would you rather talk about? Okay, let's talk about the ones where I am uncomfortable with that presence. Like the one where I was open the gate and I'm thinking about it and I see the dogs and instead of carrying on with my journey, I'm held back or a holdback or something. Yeah.

Okay, yeah. So if you want to tell me, tell me how that dream played out. I mean, the first thing you saw was you were standing in front of gates and then you opened them? Or where did that dream start? I would say it started with, you know, it's kind of like you are observing or you are hearing something. But more about my ancestors. I've got a feeling that it was more like my ancestors, especially on my partner side, on my father's side.

You know, that's how I've got that feeling around that. And then while I'm hearing or being observing this or this knowing that is coming through, then I kind of like saw myself traveling. And where I was traveling, I was traveling to this beautiful place. But it was fenced and there was this pitch house somehow. And I opened the gate to go inside with this curiosity as I'm like, what am I going to know more? Who am I going to meet here?

and then these dogs when like I question myself are there any dogs like you gotta be careful maybe there are dogs and as soon as I say that the dogs came

and it's kind of like I don't know I don't know what really happened there but I remember going back when I was going back because I didn't get through but I was with other three women you know and we were going back

with this women I don't remember much of the conversation that happened. But I just, one thing that I know without knowing where I know, it's just that it's got something to do with my paternalenish ancestors. But I don't know what is happening or even why the dogs kind of like stop me from coming inside that yard. Okay. That's pretty good.

So the beginning of this dream actually was not actually at a place yet, but the experience of traveling and the knowing that you were, I don't write this down, that you were in the observing or in the presence of or hearing or feeling your ancestors. Is that an accurate description of kind of the beginning of this dream sequence? Yeah, yeah. More like, you know, when there's kind of like an inquiry, but the inquiry is coming through as if like I'm going to be led to some, or be going to be shown something.

You know, that's like how it is. Even let me say we're just talking about something and like where, where does your father come from? What did you? What did they get over for them to be where you are and for you to even exist? You know, like kind of like going back to that. That was like kind of like the conversation. So and then from there I'm aware I'm living.

My soul is living the body. So I'm aware of the travel. that is about to happen. Yeah. So was there a physical location for the beginning of the dream? Like were you lying in bed, were you, or it was simply disembodied feeling? I'm trying to see it as clearly as I can. I was laying in bed.

And this was, okay, I just want to clarify the lying in bed means I, in my dream I was lying in bed or you were actually lying in bed. in bed and then you had more of an out of body experience physically, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, which, I would say I was lay in, okay, so this was, um, in, in, in some ways, what we might classify as more of kind of a waking dream in a sense, like a, like a vision experience. Fair enough. And these are, I'm more adept and comfortable with dreams that happen during sleep. Because I know exactly. how to characterize those. And maybe I don't have to handle this one any differently, but I'm not sure that it is or isn't different. That said, Carl Jung, but way back early 1900s,

when people didn't have a dream to share, he would have them make up a dream. In essence, go into a relaxed state and just daydream and talk about where their mind goes. So I'm not at all certain there's a tremendous difference. I think it's all thoughts. It's just depending on how well we're, depending on how properly passive we are in observing where our mind goes versus directing it.

Because we can make up a fantasy and we can imagine a scenario with a stated purpose and a goal that we invent the elements of intentionally. I think that's a different experience having you wake a constructed fantasy versus a more passive experience of letting our mind flow on its own. I think they are two different things. You hear me uncertain and fumbling my way through this because it is a phenomenon. I'm trying to wrap my head around. But I think we can treat it like a normal dream and just kind of go with that for now. I think we can still get something useful out of it. So the...

Oh, if you're okay, if you're okay, we can, there is more, a more recent one. I can use that one, but this one does not include dogs, even though there's a cat in it. Yeah. It doesn't include a dog. So, so we can, we can go with that one where I think, I think I'm willing to be challenged. I, what I'm doing is kind of reasoning through my own, like, can I competently handle this? I'm not sure, but I'm willing to try if you are. Also, I'm curious to see what happens.

But I also, I want to be like a full disclosure honest of like, this is, this is new. territory for me like and I'm not sure I'm going to handle it properly but I'm also very curious to see what happens like okay what happens if I try and apply my standard method to something that's possibly supernatural in a way like then again it isn't so there's a there's a purely materialist psychological way to understand this and it might be you were laying down and resting and you didn't and you just fell asleep and you had a little nap you had a little nap a little twilight experience of of, well, maybe I'm not fully asleep, but I'm relaxed enough that my mind can just wander and it felt like leaving your body. You didn't actually do that.

There's a lot of different ways to understand it. But I don't want to focus on that and say that's necessarily what I believe in your understanding of it is wrong. I just don't know. Like if you had an actual out of body experience and you went somewhere and saw something, I don't know what to do with that. I'm like, I believe you. I'm not sure I can interpret that kind of experience, you know. But I'm willing to do it. I'm willing to talk about it.

for me that is that is what it's common and like the thing is with that one I feel like since it's like it's like there's some puzzle of weight that I forgot and then this more recent one there's more like more clearer it has an element of getting out of body as well but it's more like a recent thing you know that that happened so I'm just going to share that one with you because it still has an element of being out of the body so here I am I'm lying in bed and as I'm lying in bed, I see myself kind of like I'm in a different space. So I'm still curious. It's more like still the awakened, it's more like, yeah, awakened dream.

You know, I'm aware of what is happening, you know. And as I'm watching around me, I can see a different setting. But I want to remember because there is this sofas that are more, like I remember the sofas, you know, like it's something that we had. and then one of them I compare to the sofas that I've got from my mom but the sitting is just

different so I'm just observing what is happening and as I'm observing the sofa is on my right side on my on my left side there is a window I'm aware there's a window in there

but as I look it's kind of like the curtain is a little bit open and there's light that is coming through but it's at the night like my awareness or my knowing is that it's at night you know so I'm just looking through this window

and as I'm looking through it a part of me is just being cautious like who opened the window the window is open you know like something is not right but as I'm looking through the window there's a cat that crosses

that crosses the cat is crossing but it's kind of like it's not going through the window but it's crossing going through whatever wall because it's not going through the window but I can see the cat crossing. But when the case is crossing, for me, it's kind of like

something is happening. I follow the cat. But as I'm following the cat, there is a child that is running ahead of me and she wants to know what is happening. And I'm concerned that, oh my God, this child may not make it back, you know?

And I'm not even sure if it's my daughter or what, but I know there's a little girl who follow this cat. So I find myself, as I follow the cat, I find myself in a I don't like outside my place, but more like a forest, but not a big forest. And here I am with my hands, I'm emitting this light, sort of like, I'm aware that there is darkness that is happening here, and I'm trying to shield or transmute whatever darkness that may be there.

And then at the end, I end up going. When I turned left again, there were like some people there. I'm trying to find this girl, but these people are busy doing what they're doing. someone is laying their art paintings on the floor and I'm crossing around like the recent one that I had where I was like wondering what is going on here or what should this even mean? That's a good one too. I think I might have missed a little bit for a moment while I was writing some things down. You said you found yourself in the forest light emitting from your hands kind of shining it around in the darkness and then I missed the transition to you found a person laying

more so you went so what happened between those those two things emitting light and then you found a person did i miss something in between i'm imiting light because there is this fear that there is darkness or something is happening but i can feel the energy that is pulsating through my my my hands and i'm just i trust my energy somehow to to blog this or whatever that is and i was just there but i got there because i'm following this little girl that somehow was following the cat, you know. So after I went through that, I turned left. But when I turned left, then it's kind of like, you know, when there is, I would say a marketplace, you know, there's just like a lot of people there. And what is standing out is I'm just going around, but at the end,

I come back again, but when I come back, this woman who has her art paintings and she's just like lying it on the floor, and I'm stepping on it, but at the same time I'm feeling uncomfortable with that, but it's kind of like, that's how just things are done, and I'm just passing through that. So at the back of my mind, there is, I'm concerned about this little girl, and I don't even know who this little girl is. Even in my waking life, I was like, is this my daughter, or is it my either child? You know, where did she even go? You know, so that's, that's how, that's like, kind of like what happened. For sure. No, that's, that's a very good one. And that's a little more, A little more my speed.

I'm already starting to have some good, you got to get off the paper, buddy. He's starting to have some good ideas, I hope, or inspirations for it. So just broadly speaking, there's an interesting thing going on here where you are following the girl

who's following the cat. There's something going on there. That's fantastic. And where it leads you. And the first thing I thought, and you know, you got to feel it for yourself, but just throwing out ideas is that there,

I think you're onto something with the inner child thing, or at least your concept of the child as a being, the childness or childhood or being a child. It's very natural that you know, you'd have a say a cat may be representative of some kind of natural phenomenon. You've got a child who's driven by curiosity

and cats are kind of, curiosity is synonymous with cats. And it's an impulsive curiosity that I do like, she's being drawn to the cowlick. She can't help it. It's out of your control. All you can decide is whether you're going to follow. follow her and you do you choose to to observe but part of it's out of fear is like it is she making a mistake is she going to get herself into trouble maybe I better keep an eye on this those are

all my initial thoughts and we haven't even gotten into like really really looking looking at how this thing is put together um so in the very beginning you start off inside inside a building and there is uh there's a window and the it's curtains and the curtains are drawn with a little bit a little bit of a crack and your your observation of this was um what was it who opened this uh so it wasn't you know it wasn't you and it's it's feeling uh where am i going with that it's um it's it's like a feeling of there's there's like a crack in the armor in a way that's not exactly what I'm saying, but it's like, you know, I didn't make this portal through which to look. Someone else did, but who did?

Like, this felt like your environment, your house. It didn't feel like you were in a stranger's house. Yeah, it felt like, like I said, like a home that I'm just out. Yeah. That I grew up, you know, that I'm aware of the setting. Like, this is familiar. Yeah. Yeah, for sure.

So there's, there's a kind of a broad, broad strokes thing where houses, houses specifically very often represent us. But specifically in this way, the idea of this is like you from the inside looking out of yourself, if that makes sense, like being in your room, in your house, in a familiar space with a portal to the outside,

a window, being the place you look out from inside yourself, to the outside world. And then to have, to have the window, curtain parted and to know that you didn't do it is like this was not my choice. I, uh, counterfactual. You didn't walk to the window and part the curtain yourself to look outside.

This is, uh, so it's kind of the idea of a, um, you're being shown something or you're becoming aware of something that is, that is external to yourself, definitely looking out the window, but, but even the, the process of having it come into your awareness, it wasn't by choice. You know, you didn't part the curtain yourself. I want to stop right there and you can give any feedback. a lever alone. And any thoughts so far on that?

The way I'm conceptualizing that, does something feel right or not right? Yeah. It's, it's, I mean, there's a lot of ideas that are just coming through. First thing with the, with the, like, like, when you mentioned first, like I said, there was light in this, in this window, like when you mentioned a portal, right? It was, in my awareness, it was dark, but there was, it was bright, whatever. it was bright, but it was whatever that was coming through.

But then in my awareness, like I would say there is fear that is coming through. From my observation, there was fear that was coming through, not like the curiosity of the who opened this is coming through with fear of, oh my God.

But on the other hand, there is a cat that is crossing over and then there is that knowing that this doesn't feel right. And what is coming through my awareness is kind of like the childhood. I would say programming or conditioning

about cares being dark, you know? You know, you know, yeah, so there was that. So about kids being dark. So it's kind of like there was that, that programming that kind of like came through. And I need even the following of it, this child who follows it, just because somehow,

there was a cat that crossed and this window was left open or somebody opened it but it was not me then there is something that is happening that is maybe dangerous this is why the next thing i find myself in this forest and what i'm doing is i'm using my gift to try and protect myself from this perceived danger or perceived darkness because if it's danger of a human i wouldn't use my energy but if it's that that's that's when i felt like there is something that is here. So when you're talking what came to my awareness or the questioning was are they two different aspects here as in like the conditioned one of what cares means and all that that is interpreting that from oh my God something is wrong and then there

is the inner child who is just like not coming from all the the condition is kind of like following that with the curiosity but I am following because I'm looking for her from the fear but not from the openness to perceive things differently or to see things differently like you said you know so that's what it's coming to my mind with with what you said so it's kind of like when I'm observing it I'm observing it like now from from two I would say conflicted aspects yeah yeah yeah and what you're saying there too so if we look at it from one perspective. It's the, the, the, the, uh, you know, the, you following the girl, following the cat. So there is a bit of that inner child thing. I think it's a good way to describe it. Like, we all have that natural curiosity. And what in this specific dream, but not just natural curiosity, but also a naivete where it's, she's going to be drawn to what fascinates her. A cat. I want to interact with the cat,

just pure desire to, to, to, to have an experience. but also not awareness or enough experience to pause and think, is that a good idea? That's you looking at this. This could be dangerous. Should I do that? Should I let her? Should I, in a way, should I follow my own inner curiosity to chase a cat, whatever the cat represents?

And in the sense, because it brought up the idea of fear, danger. you're you might be looking at if we conceptualize it this way there may be something going on in your life where you have a curiosity about something you're not sure it's good to look into that it might be dangerous to pursue a certain line of inquiry observation to to really have a look at something so there might be something in your life that you're worried is dangerous but your curiosity is saying i really want to know i do and so you're maybe showing yourself this this So we go back kind of the beginning of the dream. This is all before we get to the forest.

You are in yourself, in your home, in your safe space, your environment. You're in a contained room through which you can look out. But the window is parted by someone else and you're like, I didn't do this. And that's the first key that, you know, something's been, something's being shown to you or your attention has been captured by something that was that you didn't create. yourself. There's some external circumstance, something external to your own will, willpower that has forced itself into your awareness in terms of like, now you're aware of this thing. This is happening. The window is parted. You are looking out and there's light. So you're kind of drawn to that as well. What is this? What is this thing? There's that as well. And when you say the cat is crossing over,

does it move past the window or it's moving through the wall you said or something? Like the cat was inside the house with you and then went outside? Yeah. It's like. Yeah. It's like. Like, you know, you know, when, and then like I said, I was in a room. So I'm just looking and I'm seeing the familiar sofas and all that. And it's kind of like, this is like a whole, the home that I know, it's familiar. Oh, yeah, you mentioned that it was like sofas your mother had, but different? That's how, I mean, I can compare, even, even like in my weekend life, I feel like it's that. You know, like that's what it's kind of like that familiarity with, it was like the home that I grew up in or something like that, you know.

And then while I'm lined out. kind of like trying to make sense of what is happening. The window that I'm talking about is the window that is on the east. You know, and that's where I see the light, like, coming through and I'm away. Actually, at first it looked like it's just like the light, but then when I look through it, I realize it's not only like the curtain that is parted, the window is actually open, you know, where I'm like, who will open this? And then comes a cat, while I'm still trying to observe what happened,

comes a cat. I see the cat in the house, but it doesn't go through the window. It's kind of like it went through the wall, you know, because I didn't see it jumping on the window. It just went through the wall, you know, yeah. Okay. There's two things there that just popped up into my brain. There's something I think important or, or, well, it's all important, but, but something

interesting about the concept of saying being in my mother's house or a house that. feels like my mother's house. And if I do a brief tangent myself, so the idea to pop into my head was, you know, being in my father's house is like, well, it's his space.

He does things his way. And if I'm going to stay there, it's, you know, I'm going to follow his rules, you know. And there's something about leaving your parents' house, which is I'm going to strike out on my own.

I lose protection. It's dangerous. But I also gain freedom. I get the, I get to make the decisions. I get to pursue what I think is interesting. or the right thing to do. So there's something about this internal space is being like my mother's house,

which also brings to mind doing things my mother's way or seeing things from her perspective. But then it's almost like it's being forced into your awareness that there are things beyond that containment. There's other ways of being in the world or looking at the world. So sometimes we start ourselves off in a space saying, okay, what inspired this thought is thinking of how your mother lives, thinking of what her way of being in the world. And you become aware of, you know, quite involuntarily, someone left the curtain and not only the curtain open, but the window open. And so there's a windows, in this context, it's, it's an opportunity to see some, see the world differently, to see beyond your immediate environment or that. immediate to look beyond a contained concept all on its own. And you've got this cat, which in your mind is recalling childhood memories.

You were always told that cats have darkness in them. Maybe evil creatures or maybe tricksters that lead you astray, perhaps. Yeah. Tricks, which is whatever, you know, Yeah. When you're taking about time from a religious background, there is that, you know. For sure. Yeah.

Yeah. No. And then that's a perfect representation too of like, well, what are you going to find beyond the window? What are you going to find in by leaving this contained space of seeing and experiencing the world in a specific way? Speaking of cats, these guys. Yeah. It's quite interesting because it even went to the window. I think when I was watching it all I'm like flipping inside.

I mean, yeah. Yeah. And I think it's, oh, for sure. Yeah. Yeah. Wonderful synchronicity. But, but this, this cat is, it's also, it's, it's like a transcendent spirit. It pays no attention to the idea that there's a boundary at all.

It doesn't respond like a physical thing. It goes right through the wall, the window. It doesn't matter. And, and our brain can do that. Our brain can transcend concepts. So we can say, okay, I can look at the world that way. And then there is a boundary to that concept beyond which we are no longer in the concept. But our brain can just go right on through to another concept that's completely different.

We have that complete spirit-like freedom of movement between how we see things and how we conceptualize categories. So I think what we've got, yeah, is this kind of representation of seeing or being my mother's way. And then the awareness that there's, I can look beyond that. I can literally look out the open window to see. a different way of being in the world. And then you show yourself, now wait a minute, this little creature of darkness, it passes right through.

Is that, is it me? Am I going to, should I pass through? Should I go follow this thing? And there's probably that moment of hesitation. What your brain says is, well,

there's part of me that's already following it, that little girl. And then you're, now you're concerned for the little girl. You're like, maybe I should follow to make sure she's okay, to look after her. Is that kind of part of what was going on?

Like you were, drawn out of the house. Like you weren't going to follow the cat, but you're going to follow the girl because you need to protect her. Absolutely. Absolutely. That was my concern. Like someone has to take care of her or just make sure that she's okay. And what is coming through, as it's saying, you know, there's just a lot of things because they that's actually at my, at the home, like back home, back home, the home that I know that I was born and raised in in this lifetime. Which now when you're talking about this, I can see the. connection right there.

So it's kind of like there is aspects of myself that are still kind of like still holding into what I took from my mom or how my mom perceived life. You know, when you want to, this is like my understanding of life based on what I was taught, you know. And the fear of there is darkness here or especially the representation of a cat that there is darkness and then in my knowing or my perception there is a wall and there is this cat that goes through a wall. It's kind of like there's no wall here. It's just like in your mind, you are perceiving a wall here but still the window is open, there's light coming through. And here I am following this girl.

And for me, it's kind of like my understanding of this is at the same time, even if it's dangerous or there is darkness. Can I trust my gift that I can use it when it's necessary? sorry. That is me holding my hands out when I'm in the bush feeling like there is something happening here. But I'm using my hands knowing that if there is anything, I can transmute it. And the funny part is, like I said, where this girl went, where I ended up, I ended up in a marketplace where there was art, painting, lying on the floor. And I just felt uncomfortable, but it seems like people were just going on with that life. So when I look at that, even though I ended up coming back

but it's more like there is this other life where there is all this art is being laid on my on my feet or my legs as I'm passing through I don't know what that represents

but there was that as well you know as I was coming back so it's kind of like it's more like getting out of the shell that I perceive is and opening up to this whole other world and other creativity and all that.

And I feel like especially where I was afraid in using my gift and all that, I feel like it's more like even if indeed there is starkness, but can you trust your abilities, you know that you can use them when it's necessary instead of just staying stuck there. So it's mind-blowing, yeah. We'll see if you'll be a little shoulder cat.

No, I think that's fantastic. And that's, I was going to say, say um our childhood experiences i mean i keep talking about freudlady's i don't know for some reason it just is on my mind or or it seems most relevant to this so he was one of the first to say that our formative years our early childhood experiences dictate a lot of successes and failures that we will have later in life i think he was right about that that being said not everything is necessarily related to our childhood we don't always have to talk about your mother sometimes it comes up, but, but in this case, what it is is that our, our childhood experience does set the

baseline, the foundation for how we see the world itself. What our parents, by their behavior, by their explanations, they teach us what the world is and how it functions. So our very first world of view, our understanding of the world is our parents' frame of reference, because they don't know any different. They don't have our frame of reference. We haven't developed our own frame frame yet. So there's, I think there's something going on here where you're like, and there's nothing wrong with that.

I think the way my personally, the way my parents live, the way they view the world is 99% correct. I just have about 1% of my own opinions and differences in, in how I interpret things, what I prefer for my own lifestyle, that kind of thing.

I think that's that standard for a lot of people. There's very few people that completely reject everything their parents ever taught them. They taught you how to use a toilet and tie your shoes and brush your teeth and eat three meals a day. I mean, we all carry that stuff with us, even if our parents were maybe shitty people and, you know, not the years worth. Yeah, that's true.

Okay, what am I trying to say with this? I'm rambling. So I think you're considering the concept of, okay, if I look beyond this stable frame of reference that forms the foundation of my understanding of the world and my place in it, what am I going to find? Well, number one, it's going to be a scary experience. I can. I can pass through the wall just like the cat.

My inner child is hopelessly curious. She's going to, she wants to know. She wants to follow the cat. And you have a decision to make, do I go with her and look after her? Well, since you're the same person, you kind of have to, but it's your, it's your own, say, adult mind looking after your own sense of curiosity of like, okay, how do I satisfy my curiosity safely? And then the next thing you show you is, well, what does that look like? That looks like even in the deep dark forest, I have this ability to shine light out of my hands. And that light is very powerful.

That's like that's the idea of illumination. It's the idea of bringing light, bringing some idea to light, the revealing, pushing back the shadows to reveal the landscape to achieve understanding. I mean, there's very much, you know, light being representative with, um, uh, gaining knowledge, seeing clearly what is in front of you, observing things as they are. And something about that, that's wonderful from two angles. You didn't show yourself failing to properly use your light. You showed yourself confident in using your light. And it was a bright light and it shined.

And it came from both hands. And it did push back the darkness. So there's this good, you checked in with you. What's my inner sense of competence in your life? like, I can do this. Yeah, this, I have the skills. As you were saying, I have the skills necessary to engage in this task successfully. And what it revealed was the marketplace.

That's what the light revealed or you kind of transitioned into another section where suddenly you're in the marketplace. How did that happen? Yeah. I transitioned suddenly into that, into the marketplace. Mm-hmm. Yeah. And that's powerful too.

I would say, now I get the word powerful stuck in my head. I'm going to say it like 17 more times. I think it's important. It's like, so what you're considering then is, you know, okay, do I have the necessary competence to handle this discovery to handle chasing the cat with my inner curiosity safely? And you're like, yeah, I got light. And what does the light reveal?

It reveals a marketplace. And it's not that it revealed it like suddenly the force turned into it, but suddenly shining that light, the act of confirming with yourself, yes, I genuinely feel confident in my abilities. transition to the marketplace and marketplaces are very interesting. The idea of even calling it a marketplace, I mean, what you're going to,

there's lots of things you could acquire there. It's a, it's a feast for the senses in a way and a feast for the curiosity. Around the next corner could be what you're looking for. So you show yourself this place of, of, it's not just commerce. I don't think this is about business necessarily,

although it might be, uh, depending on, on, on, going on but could you tell me a little bit more about your path through the marketplace you said you made a path and then eventually ended up with the woman with the paintings yeah what is what is more standing out um i don't remember much about the marketplace but i know there was a lot going on

but i remember as if it's kind of like i'm now tracing tracing my steps back yeah but i see this woman who's standing with the with the with the paintings but he's put she's putting them on the floor you know and this is where I have to pass so I don't have any choice but to step on them but I just feel you know when you're like uncomfortable about something but it's kind of like there's nothing wrong like this is how we do things you know so this is how things work here and whether you're uncomfortable or whatever you just get to get used to it so I just passed through that and suddenly I was back in my in my in my bed like back yeah okay and on the other hand even like for instance when you mention about because for me like this is like my my childhood

where I get to basically fight for who I am you know like why don't you just be like my other children and this is like who I am so um and uh when even when you look at the cat like it's an adventurous animals it also likes its freedom you know so despite all the the other meaning to it, but when you look at it, it's kind of like that, you know, even when you're talking about the light and going through that and ending up in a marketplace, whatever that is or whatever that means, which is also, it's also more like an adventure in the marketplace, because like you said, you don't know what you're going to find, but you're going to be curious. Yeah.

For sure, definitely. And there's a, I think you capture it very well. There's something iconic about a cat as a free spirit. It just does what it does. And it's not held back. back by down even walls. It'll find its way through walls. And then I love this idea of the marketplace too, because there's a lot of different ways to represent that type of things. You could have found a library. Maybe that was your iconic representation of, hey, whatever I'm looking for, it's probably

in one of these books. Well, for you, it was more this, the marketplace type of thing, like, that what will be revealed by your competent ability to shed light upon a situation in that, in that sense, is you're going to have a marketplace of ideas. or possible solutions you could discover. And what you did discover, I mean, the place you showed yourself was a woman who makes paintings and she puts them on the ground and the only way forward is to walk over them, to step on them. And she knows that's what you do.

You just step on them. And it's okay. You're not disrespecting the paintings. They're almost there to be walked on. in a way. Yeah. Is that that felt right to phrase it that way? Yeah.

Yeah. So that's interesting too. And about this woman. So did you see her engaged in the act of painting at all or this is all the finished product and she's, what you see is her placing them on the ground knowing you're going to have to step on them? Yeah. It was a finished product and she's indeed placing them on the ground and knowing that I'm going to have to pass through them. I'm going to step on them.

So she's laying them on the floor and I get to pass. Yeah. Did you have a. sense of any specific images on the paintings? I don't remember the images as much, but I know that was kind of like, it's more like, I don't know, what is coming to my awareness, I know that was kind of like the oranges part in one of the paintings, but it was more like, for instance, I would say, a picture of a woman, that's one thing that is standing out, and that orangey's color is what

it's like coming through, but it was more painting of some sorts or that, whether it's some faces or whatever. That's, that's what is coming to my awareness. Yeah. Interesting. So I don't know how to drill down into what that means exactly this, but I think this is, because you've run yourself through a process. If I imagine getting out of my childhood, you know, my parents frame of reference from

childhood, following my curiosity, though it might, though I'm sometimes hesitant to do so, because if you just do, if you just do. if you just do what they did, you know that's successful because they succeeded to a certain degree. If you change anything, you're taking a risk. So am I going to follow this curiosity,

this transformation that my inner child wants to, my natural curiosity, am I going to be able to competently handle the discovery process of figuring out what is new and different? And you show yourself, yeah, I think I've got the light, the ability to shed light,

on these things, takes you to the marketplace. In the marketplace is the woman who creates paintings. She makes, the woman makes images, contained images, and you have to walk on them. There's a, there's something in that idea of her being a painter and it being a necessary process that you, that the path takes you across them, through them, past them. I don't know if anything's coming to mind with that one. my my thought was to ask when when about did you have this dream what might have been happening in your life now we've talked about it a little bit were you going through I mean how long ago was this would you say um it's not really that long ago probably a week or something like that like it's a new new dream yeah okay now that we've talked about a little bit can you think of anything you were going through or thinking about or planning ahead for that might have inspired this thought process I don't know a better way to ask the question.

I mean, which is kind of like crazy, because this is like a new dream, but here's the thing, which is going to bring a little bit of another dream between. Sure. Because I live in dreams. This is why I'm here. So, yeah, like the other day, I was supposed to have a podcast with another guy and, oh, maybe we had a bit of a podcast. whatever that was. And in this conversation,

we started to talk about generational errands and those inherited and all that. And in his words, exactly, he says, women are meant to be agreeable. And he doesn't think that men, and quite interesting, flipping crazy, because I never thought about this. Okay, it's kind of like the true I'm meeting.

And when you're asking me, this is what is coming through. So he says women are meant to be agreeable. And men, like they can't be two leaders, meaning that because I believe that if I'm embody my queen and my men is embodying his skin, we can't date together. This is not about power over. It's us doing it together and embodying our true self.

So I talk about the importance. Where we go when you need men who are embodied, who are connected to their emotions, especially even when you talk about the artistic expression or even connecting to our intuition, our emotions and nurturing. For me, that's an embodied, sacred masculine. So I talk about the importance of embodiment, the feminine, the masculine. So this guy is against what I'm saying. And I'm having your conversation.

I'm like, okay, I'm not careful of a debate, but I'm just going to share what I share in the end. He switched off, like basically shut me off. And I'm just left them like, oh shit. But this explains exactly what I'm talking about, about the whole control, leadership, toxic wounded, masculine, you know. So that's what happened in my real life where I'm like, wow. And guess what? That particular night, I'm just lying in bed again. And as I'm lying in bed, I'm aware. I actually, I just, I'm

turning like literally turning, I'm turning to the right side. And as I'm turning to the right side, I'm aware of myself that is a part of me that is coming through. And I'm aware of the shirt that this aspect is wearing is wearing a red shirt and I'm like that's me you know but there is this sexual desire I just feel holding for this aspect it comes through and I'm touching it you know and but there is resistance from this aspect it's resisting me but I want it like won it so badly like I want to make love with you right now so that's that's like what happened and after that I'm not sure here if it's like a continuation of the dream that particular night or it's something that followed the following day. The following day what came through was I'm still

lying on my bed but when I look on my right side again my daughter is lying there but I can feel like it's kind of like I can see his spirit or her soul is kind of like living the body but I'm kind of like a bit worried at the same time because I don't understand what is happening and when I look on the right side like on the wall I can I can see some, it's kind of like there's some pictures or paintings on the wall, you know, that are there. So that's like what happened. And then the third one was this part where I'm also observing this. And then I'm getting out of the window and following this.

So this is kind of like three dreams. I don't know, I don't know if it's like continuation in one night or like different nights. But that's what happened. But it was triggered by this conversation that happened in, in my physical life, you know. Absolutely. Yeah. Would you say your mother was more of a traditional, say, passive feminine woman, more

yielding, submissive, some people might say. Was that what your mother modeled in her home? Or how would you, go ahead. Okay, I would say submissive in this. I can't really say she was submissive because if she was submissive, have taken a lot of shit, but the reason why there was dysfunction is because she was willing to stand her ground, right? Sometimes women can end up like, yeah,

but because they're just willing to say, you're not going to run over me and shit on me, and I'm going to take that shit. So I wouldn't say she was submissive. I would say I see myself in her in so many ways, but it was more informed by the societal, cultural, experiences like this is how it has to be you know that's how it was because her concern even when it comes to my

dressing or who I was being was like how what would people say you know and I remember one of the conversation or the arguments or confrontations we had a few months before she passed I was in a moment where I was in my lowest and she was also sick but still there was that habit of the parent that was always there and at that moment I just turned around in my brokenness and I looked at her and I said, I know you hate me. And that was the first time that I saw the shock and the brokenness in her in the sense of, like, it was the first time it was occurring to her.

That's how I feel. And she said to me, I don't hate you. I never did. But I was just taught that you can't affirm a child, praise a child. because you're going to be big-headed. That's how I know about raising a child. So, yeah. Okay, definitely.

Well, that was one, I'm glad you answered, because it kind of, it kind of sort of through my mind in, in, okay, what am I trying to say? It would have made perfect sense if the conversation with this man who said, you should have a more passive, embody a more passive feminine role in that sense, of not being so fiercely independent perhaps might trigger a memory of your family where like you know my mother was kind of was not as fiercely independent as I am she had a different way you know I was willing to break out of so you're comparing say your choices in life your

approach to life what how you're living it to the way she lived it and you know neither one being good or bad but a good fit you know definitely for you so saying I'm going to live my life differently than my mother did is definitely leaving leaving my father's house in that sense to go and be someone different not under the same approach approach to life so but the fact that she it isn't so i had the wrong element of analysis perhaps it wasn't that you were being specifically triggered to think of of how passive you should be necessarily but uh But some other breaking away from a way of being that she embodied. And the answer you found is, and this came to me while you were talking, the idea of the images.

Like, what is what is what this painting? Well, a woman who's painting other women is generating images of what different women could be. It's like showing you a range of possibilities. Well, look at this woman and the way she does it. This woman, the way she does it. This woman, the way she does it. And what it is is it forms, literally forms the path you have to take to, to move forward. You have to step on these images.

You have to, you have to use the, the exploration of these images, this self-creation, this example of a self-creation type of thing in order to move forward. I'm going to stop there. And it's telling me what you think about that kind of way of looking at it. Yeah. And I'm just kind of like, for instance, when you, when you say like that conversation, what it triggered. For me, when I connect to this,

I'm just going to take you back, but I'm going to come back to you. When I connect to this aspect that I said, it came through that I really wanted. You know, for me, it was kind of like the masculine aspect of myself, which may also translate through the masculine man in my lineage

or in my father's lineage. You know, and I think there's something that I said about, oh, that I wanted to go there first, about the first dream. and my partner lineage, right? So it's quite interesting that when I'm saying this, I'm like, oh. So it was like, when I look at my own masculine energy, when I look at my father's, you know, the toxic,

I would say the wounded masculine basically, you know, because it becomes toxic not by choice, but it's just kind of like, my word is my word. I'm the man of the house. You're going to listen to me. As a woman, this is your role. You got to do that, you know. So I felt like this was.

aspect of myself that was like coming through that I wanted to make love to you know that I wanted which when I look at my inner child as much as I lost my father when he was 14 but he loved me like crazily but when I look at that love it was more the love of the physical presence but emotional unavailability which is also how we relate with our fathers most of the relationship it was more like being afraid of our father even though we love them or they love us but still emotional they were not emotional available. So I feel like this aspect was an aspect of myself. That was more what was projected by that guy, you know,

because immediately after in my shock of, oh, it's 2024 in this aspect or there is people who think like that. So I believe there's an aspect of myself that is, that lived that kind of life, disconnected from emotions. This is why the pleasurable me that is bringing that and that's like, let's make love. but this aspect is resisting that, you know. And now when you talk about, I just love what you said,

about different pictures, the self-creation, you know, it's not about, and even when I look, because I'm big on ancestors, when I look at ancestors, it's kind of like, even when I talk, and it's quite interesting because I've never articulated this the way I did when I said, my mother was like a no-borset kind of woman

in the sense of the decision. dysfunction was because she was still willing to hold her space to say, my voice matter, I matter, who I am matters. And because it was more like going through a strong toxic masculine, then it ended up being the dysfunction that was. And at times we don't even think of getting out of it. We're trying to fight it. But at times the best way is to leave like that window that was open, you know, which is kind of like this. There's also another way. So I love what you said about different portraits that were.

made that I get to step on them and it's not stepping on them out of disrespect. Yeah. It's just that there is a work that they did and out of that respect they built a part that is going to propel you forward. So at times we look at it and make it wrong, but at times it can be we've paved away and here it is. It might have been different aspects, different pictures, whatever that we did. We did the best that we could.

But now use that and go where you are meant to go. love that. Yeah. It seems like this one rather than giving you an answer is, or let's say, if we formulate the proper question, we can maybe get an answer out of it. The question was maybe something like what would it be like to or how do I conceptualize my process of my history into my destination, perhaps? So you having a feeling with that? Amen to that. That sounds kind of like rot it up. You've done enough digging and you've got your own understanding.

Now can you focus on destiny, you know, where you are meant to go. Checking in with your own ability to find a way forward. Is it worth my time to continue this investigation to leave what I know to explore possibilities? and to find a path. And I think by the time the dream wrapped up, it's like, you will, you can. You've got what it takes to do. You've got the natural curiosity.

You've got the power to illuminate. You've got the willingness to engage with, with the marketplace full of ideas and possibilities and to find the different representations of who you could be that form that path forward. Wow, this is good stuff. I love talking about dreams. Just the fact that we put all that together from all these images

I'm a little I'm a little blown away I'm like I'm like where the hell have you been Because you have a kind of person who will sit together in the morning and be like What do you dream about I'm telling you for me like that's a perfect world You know you can sit and talk about this because That dreams are just a puzzle that interesting and just like intuition the more you You like the curiosity you look at it you talk about it it's kind of like it's also that invite that I'm talking about like let's make love you know and the more

you you you bring it on the more it opens like it also start playing with you you know so I just love it because like in my dream in my dream because actually the one thing that I am I'm so grateful that I'm here because when I saw this I was like oh my god wow you know I just loved it and I didn't even know what it was going to be like but somehow I realized that I I have stopped being so curious about the dreams the way I used to be. You know, I don't know when that happened, but somehow it's also, again, different. Like you said, when you are having a conversation with someone and you can put the two and two together and allow it.

Because on the other hand, just like we started about connecting to our bodies and knowing when that is the truth, you know, like even when you wrapped it up at the end to say, this is more like now, follow your path and focus on your destiny instead of what happened like use that whatever that happened to propel you forward don't allow yourself to be consumed by what happened and all that like for me that is like amen you know that's it you know so it's just magical i love that there's very few dreams that i talk about with people that don't end up with some kind of positive message or a positive way of looking at the very least maybe that's my own buy I want to give someone inspiration to continue to be curious and to feel like everything's going to be okay.

But I, you know, honestly, I've never come across a dream where I'm like, oh, you're screwed. You just hate yourself and everything's going to be awful and terrible forever. I don't think our brain does that to us. It'll show us fears, you know, but mostly it's attempting to find a way forward. I think most our brains, even if you think it's just evolved over how many millions of years to be a puzzle solving machine. It wants to know things. It wants to give you useful information. And we just try to put that all together by talking about it.

I love that too, that the idea of the, you just reflecting on your own dream here and even me just hearing it maybe, the same as talking about it. Because then doors open up and you're like, I didn't even see that door. Now I'm through the door. And now, and then you throw that back to me. And I'm like, wait, we're in a whole new room. What do you see here? And then we figure that out.

I'm like, wow. That blows me. It still blows me away even though I know that's going to happen every time. I get people who are like, their whole dream is like five sentences. I was here. I did a thing. And we start talking about it. And an hour and a half later, we're still talking about it.

And there's new details. And there's, wait a minute. Now that you mention it, I did feel some kind of way. I did see something when I looked at that. Wow. I love that. I love it. Yeah.

It's so good. You know, like those small, those small things. That's where the magic is. This is why I love about dreams. And I'm just so grateful that you're doing this and you're so passionate about this. Because truly speaking, for me, if it wasn't because of dreams, I wouldn't be doing this work. Dreams have been my lighthouse throughout, throughout. And whenever I don't dream, I feel like something is not right.

I got to start paying attention and being intentional. Oh, yeah. You know, so, and even, like you say, that even if it can be something that it doesn't look good or it doesn't appear good, it's a warning. You know, the question is, are you going to take heed of the warning or you're going to ignore it? I had moments in my, when I was working in a corporate, when I was in a corporate world, I would dream about, like, there were people that I would be close to calling friends. And at times I would either see them in this dream, they're just laughing at me. And just like some weird things happening in this dream.

And especially the laughter, you know, the laughter way, and something was telling me that this is not right. But then the other time I woke up from this dream where there is this argument, someone says something about me. And I'm waking up from this dream And shortly after I get a call Oh you are wanted at the office Somebody said you say this And that is a person that I was warned about many times

And I still continued with the whole friendship thing Until it got to that point You know so it's never a bad thing As long as you are willing to listen But at times even if you end up going through it I think it's also a part of knowing Something about ourselves to say I knew about this

I was warned about this But I ignored it but here I am So next time you mean make a better choice. So it's a great thing. I wouldn't turn away from nightmares or fearful dreams either. I think they give you as much useful information, especially the more intense those are sometimes the more immediate the danger is like this is serious. This is really something that could be a problem. So you probably want to pay attention to it as much as the, you know, the dreams that scare us away from bad results and and draw us towards positive results. That's

definitely. Well, this has been, this has been. good. I've enjoyed talking to you. It's been amazing. I mean, I think you and I can, we can talk for even for years, right? Trust me. I know. I know. There was about an hour ago. I'm like, we should talk about the dream. And then there's still more to say. But when we do this, I'll wrap it up. I'll let you go. I know it's late getting late over in, over in Germany there. And I got, I got some other things to do today too. So we'll do the conclusion here. I will say to everyone listening, this has been our guest dreamer. I'm going to try it again. Rao Mozame,

originally from Botswana, but coming to us by way of Germany. She is a freedom illuminator, embodiment queen, human MRI, psychic surgeon, and quantum, which doctor. I love that one, the best. The counterpart to the wizard.

You can find her at Bitley slash orgasmic clarity. That's bit.ly slash orgasmic clarity. Link is in the description below. For my part, would you kindly like to share subscribe, tell your friends, always need more volunteer dreamers. I have 17 currently available works

of historical dream literature, the most recent The Fabric of Dreams by Catherine Taylor Craig. Of course, all this and more at Benjamin the Dreamwizard.com, including downloadable MP3 versions of this very podcast. If you would also head on over to Benjamin the Dreamwizard. Dot locals.com building a community there. It's attached to my Rumble account. Free to join. You can give me money or not. I'd just be happy to have you. And that's it. Once, once again, Rao Montsemi, thank you for being here. It's been real good talking to you. Thanks for having me.

I really enjoyed every second of it. Wonderful for me too. And everybody out there, thank you for listening.