Episode 199 w/ Shawn Pen aka Little Shawn & Gabe The Jeweler
00:00 This is an iHeart Podcast. Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. Listen to Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Why is a soap opera western like Yellowstone so wildly successful? The American West with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater Podcast Network. So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th, where we'll delve into stories of the West and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today. Listen to the American West with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton English.
01:06 I'm Greg Lott. And this is Season 2 of the War on Drugs podcast. Yes, sir. Last year, a lot of the problems of the drug war. This year, a lot of the biggest names in music and sports. This kind of starts that a little bit, man. We met them at their homes. We met them at their recording studios. Stories matter, and it brings a face to them.
01:24 It makes it real. It really does. It makes it real. It really does. It makes it real. Listen to new episodes of the War on Drugs podcast season two on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures, and your guide on good company. The podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators,
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02:30 Make some noise! He's a legendary Queens rapper. Hey, hey, it's your boy N.O.R.E. He's a Miami hip-hop pioneer. What up, it's DJ EFN. Together, they drink it up with some of the biggest players. You know what I mean? In the most professional, unprofessional podcast
02:46 And your number one source for drunk facts It's Drink Champs motherfucking podcast Where every day is New Year's Eve It's time for Drink Champs Drink up motherfucking What it good be over this with us It's your boy N.O-R-E? What up? It's DJ EFN.
03:06 And this is Drink Chats motherfucking Yappy Owl. Make some noise! Now, I have two of the most infamous people I know together. Damn, he went straight to the infamous. We got allegedly... Allegedly in there too? Allegedly the guy who we heard used to take the juice. And then we got the guy who gives the juice.
03:36 Which one would that be? We don't know which one is which. I think I take him. We don't know which one is which, but let me just say something. I want to bring this brother up to the left of me, Big Sean. One of the, Little Sean. Put hickeys on your neck like Little Sean. And he was one of the most relentless dudes out there.
04:01 Brooklyn, phenomenal. Did not tell, not once. He could have told a lot. He did not tell, not once. He could have told a lot. He did not tell, not once. We have to respect that. Stood up. Has stories with Tupac. Has stories with Biggie.
04:20 And has stories all the fuck around. And now he's a positive brother. Like in my mind, he's my trainer. In my mind. I got the meal plan. I just haven't used it yet. I got the meal plan. And then I got the next brother that's standing to me.
04:37 Now he was a young brother from Queens, New York. In my mind, I don't know if you're not from Queens. Brooklyn. You're from Brooklyn. But in my mind, started out. And he went from the little guy on the block. Because you know they're all related. All the jewelry guy niggas, they're all related.
04:54 They're all like brothers, cousins, sisters, cousins. Real shit. He was the little guy. And I'm going to tell you, I seen him at Pharrell's concert in Philadelphia, and he looked at my old jury, and he said, I gotta make you right. And I did. So let's make some noise for Lil' Sean, move over to Rapper Young and the Band!
05:20 So I wanna start with both of you brothers, right? Cause we're both from New York City. And you have, like, I can't front. Your waves are spinning. Can you see him? No, I can see him, bro. Your waves is fucking me up right now. I'm going to be honest, my dude.
05:35 That's like some up north shit right there. I went too far? Yo, yo. Okay, but I got to. Let's just cut to the chase. Let's cut to the chase. Your name is Little Sean. In Brooklyn, you're the big homie.
05:51 When you heard of a guy named Big Sean, did you ever take it personal? Let's cut straight to the fucking point. Nah, because. I took it personal. Nah, you know what? Angie, Angie Martinez asked him on the air. About that specifically? If he ever heard of me.
06:10 And he was like, nah. She was like, oh, nah. See, that's why I would fuck with a nigga. Yeah, I said, you got to meet this guy. And you know, for me, right, when we came up in the game, I'm a little older than you, but we respected our elders and we did our homework. So we were following everybody that came before us.
06:29 Can I stop you for one second? The biggest part was you say we did our homework. Absolutely. So, you know, with social media and the Internet and these guys and I listen, I know all the words to the new shit. Right. More than my 14 year old. Wow. Right. I stay up. Because you're doing your homework. Yeah, but I like this shit I don't even understand like old dudes that don't like the young shit. All right, I'm on that gangster shit
06:53 So when I hear see me the Addie I'm hunting them down bow bow like that's my shit, you know say yeah, I want to hear that I'm in the pop smoke. Yes That's my neighborhood. They all from my hood They from East Flatbush All day I know them See I didn't even know that I just like them Because I like them
07:08 Yeah but That gangster shit See if you listen to it And it don't mean nothing to you After you hear certain words And they don't resonate You wasn't outside That wasn't
07:17 That's not for you So like for him I ain't gonna blow him up But for him You know he doing His drink jam shit But we connected Yes
07:24 On the phone. Yes. The buster. Yes, real shit. And then we were running the marathons online. And I won't lie to you. I needed health tips at the time. And I would call you and you would put me on.
07:40 But this is when you was in. No, no, he's still in. This nigga's not stopped. No, no, I'm talking about when he was locked up. No. No, he's home in. This nigga's not stopped. No, no, I'm talking about when he was locked up. No. No, he's old. He met when I came home. Yeah, he's old.
07:49 Yeah. So let's just, let's just, because for both of you brothers, let's take it from the beginning. Especially you, right? Where did you start? In Brooklyn. In Brooklyn? Flatbush, Canton Avenue. And you, from? In Brooklyn. In Brooklyn?
08:05 Flatbush, Canton Avenue. And you, so, what... My family started there. So you started, and you wanted to do jewelry? I didn't want to do this, no. Because Brooklyn was not the place to have jewelry on at that time. No. You're going to get robbed.
08:20 I'll be square more. It's not that I'll be square more than I didn't even think about now. So, what happened? Let's take it from there I would come to rock the ring is that hold on I'm not gonna lie your ring your ring just your ring just smack the shit out of me. Hold on. Let me see. Oh my god This is what your friend Orlando be trying to say Dude, the rubies that you be having is so fugazi This is how I ever This is how I ever I'm so sorry
08:58 And that's a Cohiba that he's smoking right there Oh yeah, no no no I got you So, how did you start, Gary? It was a family business. Started in Brooklyn. I don't know if you... Of course. I live down the block. I live down the block. There was a furniture store, but it was like a mall, but it was a furniture slash jewelry mall on Flatbush and Canton Avenue. Get the fuck out of there. Early 80s, late 80s, early 90s.
09:26 That's where my family started from. We had five stores in the mall. I was young. I was like 19. You had five stores in the mall. Yeah. We started, obviously, one, and then second, and second. They all wanted to see my older brother, Alex.
09:42 Only Alex. They wanted to see Alex. They don't give a fuck who it was. It was my dad, my uncles, my grandparents. They don't give a fuck. They didn't want to see Alex. There was one time Alex We'll get into it and I'll tell you. Okay. They don't get into all of that, but at that time it was my brother, Alex. That's it. They all know who, he understands who he was at that time. I didn't really want to do this, but it was just more like,
10:18 I was thrown into the fucking family business. Oh, you were too much, the family business. Yeah, the family business. I didn't want to become a lawyer. I didn't really want to, and I like arguing. a lawyer and I really want to get now like arguing Oh Yeah, I'm a divider I'm so now
10:33 Those Sean Coming from the rail Brooklyn. I cannot form the you're not from the gentrified Brooklyn If I'm the real Brooklyn East Flatbush and you're from the biggie. East Flatbush. And you're from the Biggie Smalls era. Before that. Now being from East Flatbush, how did you even connect with Biggie? Because Biggie's from Best Style, correct? Right.
10:53 Okay. So I'm from off of Church Avenue, right? Down the block from where he had, where people had their store. All West Indian. Anything West Indian related is from East Flatbush. So the Americans was in Bed-Stuy and East New York. So, uh... When I came into the industry, Puff just got hired.
11:19 So I'm from... At Uptown? Yes. I'm from Hitman Howie T. Hitman Howie T? Nah we're Hitman Howie T. Nah, man. He couldn't make it. So Full Force lived around the corner. Chubb Rock is Howie's first cousin. Special Ed was a baby down the block.
11:36 So this is all the hood, right? Oh my god. You see how he's saying this whole nonchalant? No, but that was the down. That's legendary shit. That's legendary shit. He just said it like, you know. I love that.
11:49 Can you go on? This is like late 80s, though. What year is this exactly? So people. Late 80s, mid to late 80s. Right. So then my whole surroundings, my entourage, was getting money. Right.
12:04 All right, so when I came out the house, I'm the only one that wanted to be in the music industry. Right? Right. So when I came out the house, my father was in the game. So I already had a couple dollars. So my first car, my man pulls up on me. He's like, yo, this is when he changed the legend. The first two- a legend a new shape
12:28 Okay, and I'm like, oh will you get that from coop? Yeah, he's like yo put some money in a shoebox Come with me downtown. So your first cause I act or legend. Yeah Let's make some noise to that So I drive to Claver between Fulton and Putnam. Pull up in the garage, pass the paper off.
12:55 They didn't have what I wanted. A week later, I went and picked it up. Un, from Undias. Undias, the small guy. Was working for the dude. For the car? Yeah. So he's the first person that gave me my car. They was doing the...
13:10 That's crazy. Yeah, so they was doing the switcheroos. Right, so that was my first joint. Years later, Puff got the job. Howie took me to meet Puff and Andre. And they hired me to write for Father MC. But we got to be clear, Puff got the job at Uptown.
13:29 Right. Because it almost sounds like you said Puff got the job at the car shop. No, no, no. I want to make sure that people understand what you're saying. Puff got the job at Uptown. So,
13:36 Father MC's his first signing. That was the first album he ain't on. That he ain't on. Wow. So I wrote half that album. Wow. Andre Harrell's running Uptown, right? Yes. on Wow So I wrote half that album Wow Andre Harrell's Running Uptown
13:46 Yes Right So now Isn't that open? From that They found Jodeci So I used to run with Puff Every day
13:54 Making sure Jodeci Was making music Making sure they ate Then they got married So Puff hooked me up With Mary Wait wait wait What's your connection again?
14:03 How do you get in this circle? You just like Skip Mads Tent Did he just say Nah I'm just saying That's how it happens No I'm talking about So Puff hooked me up with Meryl. Wait, wait, wait. What's your connection again? How do you get in this circle? You just like skip Mads' test. Did he just say he fed Jodeci? No, I'm talking about you. You just went from, I bought my cards and now I'm living with Meryl. Don't talk about that. This nigga just said, I fed Jodeci. You can't just say shit like that.
14:21 How do you get in the building with Puff and everybody? See, because back in the days, if you're doing an album, there's a list of producers that you got to fuck with. Right. Right. And Puff was calling all of them. Anybody. He's the A&R, so that's his job. So when I met Puff, I'm working with him every day in the studio. So now they got Jodeci.
14:44 Nobody knows their Jodeci yet. Oh, you had Jodeci before Jodeci. Right so I'm running with him House to house checking on this checking on that then he met Mary Then he hooked me up with Mary so I started messing with Mary and you were an artist It sounds like you yeah, you were an artist you touched down. Of course. Okay, so He's kinda out there a little bit already So okay so now You were an artist? You touched down. Of course. Okay. He's kind of out there a little bit already. So now, he gets his own thing. What?
15:14 Biggie was signed to Uptown first. So you didn't know Biggie through- Nah, he's a baby. I knew Un. Un was the hustler for the area with some other guys. Right, so every neighborhood, like Wise. Okay, okay. Every neighborhood got their area with some other guys. Right? So every neighborhood, like Wise. Okay. Okay.
15:29 Every neighborhood got their big homie getting money. Unn was that guy for Biggie's neighborhood. Oh. So when Biggie met Puff and Big got Unn, Unn was his right hand. And that's how they started Junior Mafia. Right, right. And Undiez and all of that. So when I met met On, I was like, you don't remember me? What?
15:49 He's like, nah. I said, Red Acura. He's like, oh shit. And I called some other names and he's like, that was you? I'm like, yeah. Because I always had one foot in and one foot out, which is how I ended up in the feds later. Wow. It caught up to me. Okay, so let's cut to the chase, right? A lot of people relate you to Tupac as well. And then a lot of people think this is... Hey, no, we don't listen. This is the first interview I've ever done in my life.
16:22 No problem. My God, man. I'm only here because... Listen, you you know I talk to you off the scenes. You know, you're my friend off the scenes. But I have to be straight. So a lot of people think when they see the Tupac robbery, that that was you. The robbery?
16:37 What robbery? The actual robbery of. In the studio? In the studio. No, no, no. That wasn't a robbery. Oh. Yeah, it was a robbery.
16:44 Yeah, whatever. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You say yeah? I mean, that's the least part that we all, that's the least part that we all focus on In the studio. No, no, no. That was a robbery. Oh. Yeah, it was a robbery. Yeah, yeah, yeah. You say that? I mean, that's the least part that we all focus on is a robbery. No, no, no, real. Because as a friend, you're my friend, but your name has been anonymous to this.
16:56 And then when I looked at the movie, they had Brooklyn niggas acting that role. So it made me immediately say, it really had to be Brooklyn niggas acting that role. So it made me immediately say, it really had to be Brooklyn niggas. You know Hays and Jack. You know all these dudes that Sonamis related to that incident. So I just want to ask you as a friend. Yeah, that was about to happen.
17:21 That was Tupac. That was Tupac. Tupac like, yo, yo, you sure you want to ask this? So for the sake of everything, was anything to do with you in Unique Studios? Or can you tell us the real story? Put it this way. Or what can you tell us, if anything? Put it this way, right?
17:41 All of these guys that was surrounding that incident, I grew up with all of them. They're all from East Flatbush. Right? So, you know, when that whole thing went down, he was coming to make a record with me. Pac? That's exactly the story I heard.
18:01 No, but I'm getting serious. You ain't, listen. Pac was coming to see you on the show, listen. This is the first time. Listen, this is the first time. It's officially said. I've ever done an interview, period. Right. So people.
18:12 I'm very honored. Thank you. People on my, come on. People on my Instagram page hit me up all the time for interviews, right? And my response is, not interested. Right? And they'll persist and keep going and going and then they'll take it upon themselves and do podcasts this kid did this shit two weeks ago and the followers
18:32 sent it to me in my dm and i posted it and i'm like i don't even know who this dude is he quoted me as saying something and i'm like bruh and then he popped up in the comments and i'm like yo i'm gonna give you some blood in your mouth And he's like I reached out to you so I go on my eat my email and I find some shit from like the top Of the year yeah, and I'm like I told you not interested right, but when I catch you Because I never did no gangster music right because of the shit I was doing off camera. But I apologize. But Pac was actually coming to see you at that studio.
19:11 So what happened... And you know what, man? I'm going to tell you. I don't really... I don't fuck with them dudes no more. Who's them dudes? I don't even call their name. Like, bro, I'm so tight.
19:23 See, I don't argue. And I don't go back and forth with people. Okay, if you say something disparaging about me I just want to get close enough to you to just grab So I don't I don't say nothing I don't give you no light So, you know People make their beds and when you make your bed at night, you got to line your bed. You got to line, absolutely. Right, so if you're trapped off, wherever you're at, that's on you.
19:51 But if you got a problem with me, when I catch you, I'm going to boogeyman you. And if you grew up with somebody, you know what they are and what they ain't. So Urban Legend has a certain select few of names from Brooklyn up here. Yes. I know the real
20:10 and I know who was really putting in that work and I know who wasn't. We know you know. So I didn't do no gangster music. I never said I'm a gangster at all.
20:20 The opposite. Yeah. So when that happened I never wanted to do a record with him. With Pac. Right. Okay.
20:29 So an ex-friend of mine always had celebrities hanging around. I thought this was a girl. This was a girl? No. Okay. So now, one day Tupac pops up. And I'm listening to the music. We draw narratives from the music that we hear people make.
20:48 So Pac wasn't known at this time when you met him? It's the early days of Pac. Well, yes, he was known, but he was doing... It was right after Digital Underground days? Yeah, it was after Digital Underground. He was in New York doing... And you know what I realized? After Juice. And you know what I realized? And you correct me if I'm wrong. He was in New York doing above the rim. After Juice.
21:06 And you know what I realized? And you correct me if I'm wrong. What I realized is after, you know, I really looked at Pac's career, right? And I looked at it. He had to be in New York for like his first 12 years of his career. So you're saying that is that the role you played? No. Right before he was doing
21:26 Above the Rim Right before the rape case Okay He pops up at one of our hangout spots So we used to hang in a certain place Every day And then on Tuesdays next door It was a comedy spot, it was in Queens
21:42 So we in the barber shop and Tupac pops up. And we're there and they're joking with him because he had like, and you can go on the internet and pull these pictures up and nobody ever notices that. So you just see somebody and you're like,
22:01 oh shit, he's, no. When he changed, he took off his herringbone, then he had a diamond cross. Then he had a diamond pinky ring. Then he had a gold presidential. Before that, he had a herringbone, he had baggy jeans. So there was a time he started dressing up. He had, like, motorcycle boots, a vest, like, good sweaters. That's all the dudes in my circle he came around and we watched him and they
22:30 clowned him and I said sat there and I didn't like it because that's what not who I thought he was we mean they clowned him for having been having the world like that you like that they were clowning him or you know like he took it I didn't like that he took it okay I didn't like that he took it. Okay. You know, because that's, you know they say, don't meet your heroes? Right. I've never stopped being a fan of rapping. Don't be discouraged. So when I came in the game, I was still a fan of rap music.
22:55 So now, you know how it is. You got a record out, and people know the record, and they know you, but you're seeing people that you just saw on TV or heard on the radio. Yes. I always walk up to dudes, damn, man, good to meet to meet you yeah and the greeting wasn't always good coming back right we'll get to that because i'll smash somebody today yeah so me and another friend of mine because it was a lot of us and everybody we all weren't getting money together so two people might have been in north carolina two people might have been in Deep Blue,
23:25 but we'll all get together. And we got up and went next door to Manhattan proper on 217th and Linden, and I was sitting there going, yo, I never imagined him to be the person that would sit through that. To my pop. Yeah. The next day,
23:42 new jewelry, new clothes, and I was like oh shit and he changed so if you go on the internet and you start pulling up those pictures you'll see the different him so another day I'm at the same
24:00 place the dude that owned the spot who was an ex friend of mine he's like yo come with me to the city to pick him up so we drive in there pick up pop me and this guy we argue like catching dogs right and he's you're the guy you're a pot okay okay and he's like oh park listen you don't listen i'm like i got more money than you why am right. And we pulled up to the park on Meridian. Park on Meridian, 57th Street. 56.
24:29 56, yeah. Well, I go to 57th side. I see, okay. I'm gonna blow myself up, I'm so sorry. Okay, okay, okay, let's go. And Pac came out, and he got in the car. This week got the rate paced as well, too, right? So we're in the 850, I'm in the backseat. Bro, there's no room in the 850 in the car. This is where he caught the rapace as well, too, right? So we're in a 850.
24:45 I'm in the backseat. Bro, there's no room in a 850 in the backseat. Pac gets in with a Ziploc bag of weed. This dude don't like weed or rap music. So I'm in the back going, I gotta get the fuck out this car. And I can't move, there's no door. Yeah, it's tight. He's armed.
25:06 Pac's armed. He puts in a Spice One tape. He don't like rap music. And I'm in the back going, I got to get the fuck out of this car. Right? We go back through the Midtown Tunnel. We get back to this shop. I get out the car.
25:22 My car is parked there. And he's like, yo, go get Scooter, and we're going to go meet up at such and such restaurant. We're hanging out tonight. I was like, all right, all right, yeah. I drove off. I'm like, yo, thank you, God, for getting me out the fuck this. So I go to Brooklyn to get my man Scooter.
25:40 I just visited him Monday in Otisville, right? Big up Scooter, yeah. So, yeah, Otisville. Otisville. Big up Scooter. So, Otisville. Otisville. That's the feds. It's just upstate. So that's my co-defendant. So we're getting ready to actually get him, get his case turned over. He's been
25:55 in 21 years and 5 months. That's hard. So I get there and he's dressed. Scooter. So he's dressed. And he's like, yo, we gonna meet Pac and them. I'm like, nah. We not he's dressed. And he's like, yo, we going to meet Pac and them. I'm like, nah. We not going to meet them. I'm like, yo, bro.
26:09 And I'm running it down, right? I'm in the backseat. And he's playing Spice One. He's smoking weed. But don't tell me this is the night to Pac and them. Listen. Listen. Because.
26:18 Yo, he wants to go meet up with them bad. He's not driving. I'm driving. And we sitting there. We just in the house drinking champagne, watching New York One. And we get the call. That's the night they caught the rape case at
26:31 Nell's. They was at Nell's and then it happened at the park of Meridian. And it happened at the park of Meridian. So I'm looking at him. I'm like, bro, I didn't know that was going to happen, but I knew it wasn't good
26:46 You do that night wasn't good like the vibe The vibe was all right. I just catch it on to what you said So you said that you could have actually been there the night pot caught the rape Oh my God! Oh my God! Oh my God! I don't know if that's a clap or an emotional hit. You know what? History. For good that you were there. That's reason to clap. That's reason to clap because that's real history.
27:14 You see, the thing is, for me, you know, no matter what's going on, right? You got guys that run the street and then they'll speak about the shit that they did to glorify it because they're trying to get attention All right, I'm not that guy, right? You know I'm saying so I really don't want nobody to know any intricacies
27:35 So a lot of people don't even know what I went to jail for all right because I never made gangster music So little Wayne prodigy all these guys going to jail for these guns. It's never been fired If you don't want to show I gotta be honest with you. Oh As much as you're trying to be humble Niggas in the street knew you was not the guy to play with they think see that see that's another thing Right, and I always tell my man. No, no, no, no, no, no, listen I won't let you do you got to think about it, right? You see, even you, right?
28:07 But niggas knew. Don't fuck with no show. But that's a thought. I don't know why. I don't either. But that's a thought. Not because nobody can tell you. It must have been Jigga or Biggie or somebody telling this niggas not to play with.
28:18 It was the people that I hung around. It was them. And I was able to hide under that cloud because they wanted to be famous for that shit Hmm, I made records I ghost wrote for a lot of people I came in the game writing for rappers Well sick, right? So when I saw all that when I actually got to meet all these gangster rappers and I saw that they were not gangsters I never wanted to do that You never what I never wanted to make no gangster records hmm because they
28:48 weren't because of them because of yeah because it turned you off even more than right that style of so that's real so now everybody had burped Adele as an accountant you go up there once a week and you get he had you on an allowance right to budget your money. So I pull up there, I don't want to park, I got my little man in the car. And I always had some jewelry on like I was hustling. Right, diamonds from the-
29:16 But let's describe Burt Vidal, because people don't even know that. This fucking guy. Who would have thought that was a store? No, that was that truck. You remember his office? Remember his office was crazy. He had all kinds of shit in his office.
29:28 He was a bat boy. So that's why he had all these million dollar baseball memorabilia in his office. Yeah, he had all the memorabilia, map pictures, he had like games and plays. When Joe DiMaggio, he was a bat boy for them days. Oh, that's why he had all that shit? Yeah, I get you. So when you go up there, you could see anybody from Robert De Niro to Sean Penn to Madonna, and then all the rappers.
29:51 So now I go up there once a week to pick up my allowance from the bookkeeper. You know how it go. And me and Bert was cool. And I get there and I see Eric B and Rakim. So I'm like, oh shit. For me, I don't... Hell yeah. and I get there and I see Eric B and Rakim. So I'm like, oh, shit, right? For me, I don't... Listen, when it comes to music and rap, LL was my favorite.
30:14 So going into the game and you actually seeing these people, I'm still fucked up, you know what I'm saying? Right? Yeah. So when I saw Eric B for the first time, I was like, yo, what's up, man? Oh, shit, Eric B. Goddamn. What up, my nigga?
30:29 Did he show you love or Eric B's a gangster? Nah, nah. So Eric looked at me like, you know, like, with the rhythm hit him a little, right? And I'm like... Yeah, yeah, Eric B's like that to this day. But... His strength...
30:44 So his strength, so his strength in the street was Supreme Magnetic and my man Rap. Let's be clear, let's be clear, hold on. Supreme Magnetic
30:52 from Fort Greene, Puerto Rican Supreme. So, because Pre from Queens, that's my brother, that's my brother, but I met
31:02 Puerto Rican Supreme from Fort Greene. My cousins used to live in Farragut so I would go to Fort Greene and I would see this little guy he's Puerto Rican Supreme so short and he had the fucking whole projects
31:19 like I will let you describe it so I knew them from Scooter Scooter. Scooter's like... Oh, you knew Prima number from Scooter? Of course. Okay. So, when I would see Eric, I already knew them, but fuck that.
31:33 I'm looking at the rap. You know what I'm saying? Like, this is fucking Eric B. Oh, shit. And I was so excited and happy to see this dude. And he shitted on me, and I ain't like that. You know what I'm saying? Like, fuck this dude.
31:44 He didn't shit on you. He's just there. Nah, he shitted on me and I ain't like that you know what I'm saying because listen it's the type of guy he is yeah because for me it wasn't about nothing tough it wasn't about street shit it was about I respect that so I was fucked up by that I ain't like that Yeah, you was a street nigga. Try that be street, right? I was fucked up by that. I ain't like that And I'm like damn I'm showing this dude some love and he's shitting on me like fuck this dude And I'm outspoken. I just don't this the first interview I've ever done I don't go to a piece of rock him was there to or not know where be so now I Get my money I leave I got my little man in So now, I get my money, I leave, and I got my little man in the car,
32:27 and I'm like, yo, man, this motherfucking dude Eric shit on me, man. Fuck this dude, right? Cool. Eric's like that to me to this day. Then the next time I seen him, he did the same thing. That's his personality.
32:40 And I'm like, yo, what the fuck is wrong with this dude? So now, I don't like him. Like, fuck all the rap. Fuck him being with Rakim. I don't fuck with this dude. Right? So, I go to Burt Bedell.
32:58 I go to pick up, I think I was grabbing like 18 grand this day to go shopping. Goddamn, let's make some noise for the boss. All right. having like 18 grand this day to go shopping. Goddamn, let's make some noise for the boss. The American West with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater Podcast Network, hosted by me, writer and historian Dan Flores, and brought to you by Velvet Buck. This podcast looks at a West available nowhere else. Each episode, I'll be diving into some of the lesser-known histories of the West.
33:28 I'll then be joined in conversation by guests such as Western historian Dr. Randall Williams and best-selling author and meat-eater founder Stephen Ranella. I'll correct my kids now and then where they'll say, when cave people were here. And I'll say, it seems like the Ice Age people that were here didn't have a real affinity for caves. So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th, where we'll delve into stories of the West and come to understand how it helps inform the ways
33:56 in which we experience the region today. Listen to The American West with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I know a lot of cops, and they get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. Across the country, cops called this taser
34:26 the revolution. But not everyone was convinced it was that simple. Cops believed everything that taser told them. From Lava for Good and the team that brought you Bone Valley comes a story about what happened when a multi-billion dollar company dedicated itself to one visionary mission. This is Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. It's really, really, really bad. Listen to new episodes of Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Binge episodes 1, 2, and 3 on May 21st and episodes 4, 5, and 6 on June 4th.
35:10 Ad-free at Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. I'm Clayton English. I'm Greg Lott. And this is season two of the War on Drugs podcast. Yes, sir. We are back. In a big way. In a very big way. Real people, real perspectives. This is kind of star-studugs podcast. Yes, sir. We are back. In a big way. In a very big way. Real people, real perspectives.
35:29 This is kind of star-studded a little bit, man. We got Ricky Williams, NFL player, Heisman Trophy winner. It's just a compassionate choice to allow players all reasonable means to care for themselves. Music stars Marcus King, John Osborne from Brothers Osborne. We have this misunderstanding of what this quote unquote drug thing is. Benny the Butcher. Brent Smith from Shinedown. We got B-Real from Cypress Hill. NHL enforcer Riley Cote.
35:54 Marine Corvette. MMA fighter Liz Karamush. What we're doing now isn't working and we need to change things. Stories matter and it brings a face to them. It makes it real. It really does. It makes it real. Listen to does. It makes it real. Listen to new episodes of the War on Drugs podcast season two
36:09 on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to hear episodes one week early and ad-free with exclusive content, subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. Sue, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming, how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. It's this idea that there are so many stories out there, and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen. Get a front row seat to where media, marketing, technology, entertainment and sports collide and hear how leaders like Anjali are carving out space and shaking things up a bit in the most crowded of markets. Listen to Good Company on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
37:39 So it was a Jamaican bookkeeper that Bert had me assigned to. Her name was Carol Kiddo. And when you go in the back, it's like just bookkeepers everywhere. And it's like aisles. So Eric B., Supreme, Bill Blass, God Rest the dead. All these guys, Coogee Rap, and they were like at the mouth of her, her aisle. So I walk in, and I look,
38:12 I see Eric. I'm already turned off. I speak to Prem. I'm like, what up, kid? And to me, I'm like, Puerto Rican Prem. So I'm like, damn, like wouldn't you know,
38:22 wouldn't you see that I know your man? Like wouldn't that, you know what I'm saying? Cool. So I go to get my money from her and I'm counting it out. And she's like, you know, Sean, be careful because that's a lot of money and you know. And I'm like, why?
38:38 She's like, you know those guys. And I'm like, Harold, I'm going to. She's like, okay. And she's talking about Eric Vee? Yeah. Eric Vee is a real big fan. And I'm like, because nobody knew me for that. And I always was dressed up like a Jamaican. And we wore silk shirts, hard bottoms.
38:57 So that's how I walked in the rap game. And my diamonds. And I'm leaving. And I spoke to everybody. And I'm leaving and I spoke to everybody and I just looked at Eric like, fuck that rap shit, right? Yo, I left there. I stopped to see Andre Uptown
39:14 and then I went to Aster and Broadway to buy some sneakers. I pulled up and parked. Got out the car. There's a red light there. I looked and Eric B had this ugly fucking white Pathfinder with kid in it out, and I looked and he's at the light, I'm like this motherfucker stalking me.
39:33 And he's at the light and he's looking like screw facing again, I'm like yo dude, I'm gonna kill you. Like that's it. I had enough. This sound like a sitcom, bro. This is like, right? This is some Curvy and dead enthusiasm. You see it in the face?
39:47 Yeah, but it's true. It's true. It's some curvy enthusiasm. Nobody's going to, listen, nobody's going to say this on camera or on the mic if it's not true. Because you could go back to the person. He's still alive. So in my mind, I hated him.
40:02 Like, fuck that there being rock him shit Yeah, because when you go Fuck you man, right? I understand we go so he's not the only one I cursed I hope you know saying because you're gonna show somebody some love and they should like dude I'm popping tops I'm really if you're looking at me and you're going, hickeys on your chest, Don Perignon, right?
40:28 Fuck this dude. Because you're listening to the lyrics. I'm going, okay. Right? I leave there. I go to this lady's house. She was 10 years older than me. I was fucking with her at the time.
40:40 She grew up with Russell. And I walk in. So you remember after Ricky got shot on Boys in the hood With in near longs crib, he was swinging at So I walked in I was mad Listening to me and she's not saying and. And she's like, who, Eric? I'm like, yeah, this motherfucker. Every time I see him, he's screw-facing me.
41:07 I'm going to kill him, right? He just broke up with her. Oh, my god. Oh, my god. The fuck? Give me my hand. Give me your hand. Give me your hand.
41:17 OK. OK. I was not ready. I was not ready for that one. So now, I know what it's about. Oh! I didn't even fit there, but oh no! Oh my God.
41:34 I didn't think of that until you said it. Even though you just said it, I didn't think of that, too. Yeah, no, no, I didn't get it until you said it like that. Yeah, you said it like that, I just got it. Okay, all right. So after that... I'm like it. Okay. So what happened? So after that, I'm like... This is a cup hanger, man.
41:47 I'm like, shit, don't even interview me, bro. I'm like, how would he know anything about me? Well she had a friend from Texas named Cat who was still cool with this dude. And she told him. So he just didn't like me. I'm like, all right, fuck it. You know, damn, if that's what it's about. I feel better because it ain't nothing serious to me.
42:19 But now, from now on, it's fuck you. So after that time, I just didn't fuck with him what you know and uh it was these guys from Queens that Special Ed
42:30 hooked up with Special Ed gotta come on the podcast come on yeah that's just I think he lives in the area too man we gotta get him through he might
42:37 yeah so I accidentally was Puerto Rican I don't lie that's the funniest shit I should have never accidentally
42:42 he actually was up front. Isn't he Trini? No, he's Jamaican. He's Jamaican. He's Jamaican. And I'm like, are you Puerto Rican? He's like, no, I'm not.
42:52 I said, oh, fuck. Whatever. So from that day on, I ain't fucked with the dude. Eric B. Right. So now, you know, he's hanging around and he sees that we have a lot of people in common. So Chris Lighty, God bless the dead.
43:13 That was one of my closest friends. A lot of people don't know because you know, we just weren't in front of the camera. But Chris, I call him now and Chris would do anything for me so he had a restaurant on Avenue a and like Houston Mecca remember that kind of one oh yeah let's get it so I'll take them take them logos off me and pop is cool
43:34 so take them logos on the funny dude I mean so he did the purpose by saying that so I get to the party and Chris is leaving in a hurry and I'm like you know I'm just kidding where you going he's leaving in a hurry. And I'm like, yo, I'm just kidding. Where you going? He's like, fuck it, dude. Eric B is back there. I'm like, okay. And he's like, nah, I'm leaving.
43:51 I said, nah, come back in. I've never heard this story, Big Sean. You wouldn't. So I drag him in. Little Sean. And I get to the back. In my mind. He's a big guy.
44:00 And Eric is with my niggas. He's with my niggas. Oh, wow. And I'm like, damn, this dude's like a stray animal. Like, how does he find these guys? I didn't even know they knew him. So when I get back there, he's with them. And he just stops what he's doing.
44:17 And he sees Chris. And he's just like. And I'm looking at Chris. They had a. I don't know what Eric's problem was with Chris. But now Chris is with me. And I don looking at Chris. I don't know what Eric's problem was with Chris, but now Chris is with me. And I don't like him. So I look at the dudes that he's with, who's my guys.
44:30 I'm like, yo, tell your man to stop looking at Chris like that. I'm on edge anyway. Right? I mean, to this day, like, we just, you know. So, years pass. I go to jail, I come home, Eric is around again. I'm like, what? Right?
44:52 And I'm like, this is a movie. I'm hoping the story ends well, man. So I'm like, how the fuck did this guy get in some shit? So, all of my niggas is Muslim. So I'm like, what is Eric doing here? Eric is Muslim now, he took his shirt. So I'm like, what is Eric doing? Eric is Muslim now. He took his shirt off. I'm like, really?
45:07 Cool. I don't fuck with the dude. I just not, I'm not going to forget that. Because he wasn't a nice guy. I'm a nice guy. Right? If you, I'm going to give you the same energy you give me. Right?
45:19 You speak to me nice, I'm going to speak to you nice. Cool. He wasn't a nice guy. So we're at a funeral Eric is dead yo it sounds funny but it's true okay so at the repass we're online we're getting the food and Eric looks at me he's like yo man tell me something how many people did you shoot back in the days and I'm like what? And he's like you probably forgot it so many I said bro listen that's not a question you ask people So now I know I don't know where this is going. No, I'm just telling you. So, pause.
46:05 You know, outside the funeral, them folks is there. The boys. I know that. Yeah. He don't know that. Right. You know? And I like it how it pause.
46:16 Right? So, I'm there. I park like five blocks away because I know what's going on. Right. You dig? So, Freddie Fox, who's a really good friend of mine. That's my nigga. He not talking to me now, but whatever.
46:34 I don't know why. Yeah, your bummy got broke. I don't know. That's my guy. But Eric is his man. That's his man. Right? So, the story goes, he would have been Rakim.
46:44 Yeah, he told you right here in the picture. Right? Listen, Eric is my, Bumpy is my man, but Eric is his guy. So anytime his name comes up, I make sure I say some shit he don't wanna hear. Fuck Eric, right? He don't like it.
46:59 And that's probably the reason why we not really speaking now, that he don't like to hear that shit. So Charlie Mack comes to town I thought I'd be Charlie Willie right right Paul so Charlie brings me to this MTV rap 30 anniversary shit at the bar but I don't go out so Charlie grabs me Supreme Magnetics brother rap he's on the back of the Payton Full album cover. He comes home after 27 years. They're coming up the block.
47:31 I'm waiting for Charlie to bring me down my band. I see him. I don't think he remembers me. I was a kid when he went to jail. Oh, Jamal, pre-married to your brother? Yeah. Go ahead. And he goes, yo, is that little Sean?
47:41 I'm like, oh, shit, Rap. Hey. I hug him. He's with Freddie, right? And I see Freddie. I'm like, oh, shit. Hey. I hug him. He's with Freddie. Right? And I see Freddie. I'm like, yo, what's up, man? Cool.
47:50 And we talk. We go in. And we're backstage. And Bumpy Knuckles looks at me. And he's like, Eric is mad at you. I'm like, why? He's like, some shit you said about him on your Instagram page. And I'm like, like well what did i say
48:06 i said well it was just where's he at so he's like oh he's in his dressing room i said i don't fucking show up but dude don't do that i said because he'll tell you he's mad at me but when we're alone he wants to know how many people i shot you know so, don't do that. You know what I'm saying? Like, see, at a point, you got to, if you're an actor and you're playing a role, like Al Pacino's not a gangster. Okay? I don't think Rob Swanson is a gangster, neither. Robert De Niro's not a gangster. When the camera's off, stop. Right.
48:37 Because you got some niggas out there that's not playing. Yeah. Right? So, while I never made those records, I'm not playing with you. Do you understand what I'm saying? So at a point, you got to have a cutoff line. It's an invisible line you're not supposed to cross. I respect that.
48:54 You dig what I'm saying? I respect that. So, you know, for me, I just like to stay in my cocoon. You know, I came up with Jay and then I knew big a day. I'm going to be honest. I'm not because I got I want to tell you how much respect that I saw Jay show you. You have that night at the show that we was all there but I'm going to see that relax. I got you.
49:19 Last I got some get to it later. This one is like the great Gazoo from the Flintstones. Are you thinking he's not paying attention? No, he's not. I got some get to it later. This one like the great kazoo from the fling stuff You know and I like to play the drunk bro, I like to play act like I'm drunk, but I remember everything you're You know what before you even see that So I Get to the place where you saw me, right? And there's only an elite few in this area. Yes.
49:54 If you made it to this area, you knew Jay fucked with you. Yeah. These dudes haven't seen me in 20 years. And they were doing double takes like oh shit hey Sean welcome back right spooky shit then I seen him and I said Nori what's good I said yo man you gotta do my my um my podcast he was like uh what kind of numbers you got and I'm like what he said he said you remember that he said he said uh he said, well, do mine first. Let's get your numbers up.
50:27 I do remember that. You gotta respect that. Good intentions. Yeah, good intentions. You gotta respect that. You know why? You're my friend. But you gotta respect that.
50:35 And you're my friend. I'm gonna be honest with you. You're one of the dudes that I look up to because I admire people like my brother Deuce Deuce, right? In all actuality, I've never seen Deuce Deuce do anything gangster. I just know he's a gangster.
50:57 Right. I actually never seen you do anything gangster. And you never will. But I know you're a gangster. I'm not, but yeah. I am not either. But I know you're a gangster. I'm not, but yeah. I am not neither. But I know. So let's go with you, Gabe. Let's go with you.
51:13 How you want to go from that to... No, because you know what? This is Drink Challenge. It's okay, but I'm going to be honest. Oh, man. I'm going to be honest. It's... Come on.
51:22 That was an amazing story, man. Come on. Come over here. Come over here. Get up. We can't hear you for a moment. I was amazing story, man To name some of the people that you know you made jewelry for the first person that put you on a map that you made jewelry for Angela Martinez Wow, I did not think you would say that Angie Angie and Peck house. don't want to show up. Show Pecos!
51:46 You got diamond paper clips on your shirt? Yeah. Oh no, he's super rich. He rich rich. I got to get your numbers. Gotcha. So the first person you ever made jewelry for was Angie? Yeah, I was 17, 18.
51:58 I was literally- And you wasn't working at a coliseum? No. Where was you working at? Flatbush? Diamond District first. Right away from from Flatbush we went straight to the diamond district because the diamond district let's just describe it for people that don't know people that don't know if you want to sell diamonds you have to be on 47th Street am I correct yeah 95% of the world's jewelry comes from that district, that one block.
52:26 You said 95%? Y'all get the first pick. We get the first pick. 90-95% comes from there. It's not the stores downstairs. But 95% of what again? Dye-made jewelry. No, but of what market?
52:41 Wholesale. Everywhere? Everywhere. Okay? 90%. You got Cali, maybe 5, 10, maybe 5, 7%. Right. And Hong Kong and everything else, no.
52:52 Wow. What did you think when you seen the guys, they robbed the guys? Those are my cousins, they robbed the guys. That was your cousins? Really? That was the stupidest robbery I've ever seen in my life. They got everybody, huh? You see, if that was back in his time. I would never happen
53:09 Yeah, cuz never gonna happen those guys are gonna run away. See you later You never see them for like a year. I was on the block. My first jeweler was Manny and Tito Well Manny and his father Tito man, where's Tito I'm gonna tell you something right now Tito before you say that in 96 97 that's how I came up 96 lady. So Tito disappeared. He did. Yeah because he ended up Picking a guy out of the lineup on my case. Does it sound like a good disappearance? Yeah, I'm sorry.
53:49 Yeah. I'm not sorry. Sorry, bro. That's why Teal's not here? Oh my God. So what happened was at that time, at that time Jacob was coming up. Jacob, he was on the corner.
54:02 He was on the corner. He was the little man. My family used to wholesale for him. Back in the day. Wholesale for Jacob. He's on the corner. He was on the corner. He was the little my family my family used to wholesale for him But you know the whole self a Jacob. Hell yeah, we got we got checks and all of that Still back in the 80s. Nice. We got the checks, but once he got struck a deal with Tito To bring him clientele who Jacob? Yeah True I'm with him Tito to Jacob He went to the fan made a deal to go over there.
54:25 Because it was over for him after he did what he, I knew that. Oh, I didn't know that. I was a little, my brother, my brother, my brother Alex. I didn't know that, yo. My brother Alex, who started in Flatbush. Yes, I knew this. Yeah, I didn't know that.
54:36 I didn't know that. You would never know. It's the first time I knew that Tito got in. You never gonna know because it's in that circle. He made my first choice. It's in that circle, in jewelry, in the family, in that world. So what happened?
54:44 He's in the world of the, Manny happened, Manny and the wife got a divorce. Yeah. And Tito sided with the mother. And then Manny disappeared off the block. He disappeared, yeah. So that was the first guy. Biz was one of the first people on the block. And it's all the same.
54:59 I'm saying something right now. Listen to me. No, I didn't. Listen to me. I'm just listening. At that time, when Big and himself, Jay even, I think before even Jay. Before. Before. No, Jay was the little man at the time.
55:14 My brother Alex was the one to go to in Brooklyn. In the mall, my brother, in our store. But it wasn't safe. It was not safe. It wasn't safe. We told him, I'll be square more. I'll be square more. It was not safe. I got my first gold front saying I'll be't safe. It was not safe. It wasn't safe. We told you, I was square mo. I was square mo. It was not safe.
55:25 I got my first gold front set. I was square mo. It was not safe. My brother was the one to go to that tip. You're very courageous to go down there. Yes. Yeah, I was a Queens nigga. My first front was from I was square mo.
55:34 Listen, that's how you know, bro. I told you about Cousins of Barragain, though. Yeah, but it doesn't matter. Yeah, it is. No, it doesn't matter. See, if they catch you, they'll say, sorry, we didn't know. Yeah, we didn't know. Sorry.
55:44 There you go. We got it. I said that earlier on hood therapy. Yeah, it is. No matter. See, if they catch you, they'll say, sorry, we didn't know. Yeah, we didn't know. Sorry. There you go. I said that earlier on hood therapy. Just in case y'all don't know, make sure you tune into hood therapy. So I, Jesus, Luis, I'm not going to lie. So you said Angie Martinez was the first person. And the piece that I made for her was the Animal House, her Animal House logo. But you also made jewelry for Jay-z. Oh, yeah, definitely we get into that a second Let's talk about it again tonight. Let's talk about that right now. Did Jay-z come to you what happened? No, it was
56:15 In which Jay-z was this? No, he still fucks with Jay-z. I'm saying how far back was it? They were fucking each other I wasn't it was you see I was trying to get to Jay for a long time. For a long time I was really getting, you know Peck, I was with Peck Cos, I was my brother. If anybody know me, it's Peck. It's Peck and he knows me like a motherfucker. There was an incident when Angie was doing a video with, uh, Sicario his name is? Sicario, I'm for Sicario.
56:45 I was in the trailer with J-Lo, her first husband, Chris. His name is. Did he just say he's in the trailer with J-Lo? Yeah, let's get, keep going. I was the refloss, I loved it. So I was a little fucking 18 square in the room, little kid, I got the pictures to prove, I'll show you. No problem, we believe you.
57:00 I had my, I had my, The yonder. The gangsta, the leather jacket, you know, with the three buttons. I had that jacket on, and whatever, the video shoot was, you know, my first video shoot, I didn't know what the fuck was going on. They said be there at 2.30. I was there at 2.15. This shit didn't start until like 7 o'clock at night. Sounds about right. Welcome to hip-hop. Welcome to hip-hop. That's hip-hop. She didn't start to like seven o'clock I didn't know what the fuck was going on. I'm like, yeah, I'm tired. I'm hungry and shit
57:39 Whatever we're doing the whole I forgot what restaurant it was somewhere in 23rd Street basement And she was you know, she she looked beautiful. They did her hand in the pink or whatever She had a pair of earrings Actually, I was out after the after the photo a video shoot. I go back in the trailer I'm you know, it's like two in the morning. I'm fucked up It's my law clock as you know, when they show that there's no That's 20 years old. It's a'm a long clock at 10.30, and I got a long clock at 4. Just to make sure I don't beat this nigga to sleep. So I leave, I get to the office the next day, and I'm like,
58:12 yo, I left a pair of fucking earrings. In the anti-Martinez era? No, I don't know, I forgot. You didn't know? I had no idea. That's when you got money. I had no insurance. No, no, listen, I had no insurance. Nothing, I just started.
58:25 What was the price tag on it, more or less? Like 100, 200 grand back then. It was fucking huge, bro. It was like five carats each on my odds. I just started. And you forgot who you left it with? No, I left it there in the trailer. I didn't look at it.
58:38 You're all damn like this. I'm fucked up. I don't know what's going on. I just literally started the business. And it's over. It finished. You're already in the hole. Already just literally started the business and it's over. It's finished. You're already in the hole. Already in the hole.
58:47 This, I look up, I don't know, like 3 o'clock in the afternoon. Fucking, fucking Pecos walks the fuck in there. You know, I didn't know him like that, man. I just knew him. I just met the guy a few months ago, you know. And he goes, I got you. He's like, yo, what happened? Why you look so upset, bro? I'm like, what do you mean, bro? I left some earrings in there. I didn't know how to call you guys.
59:11 I didn't know how to blame it on you guys to call somebody to go over there with my guys, you know, my brothers and my mother. I don't know. I was a young kid. He's like, what are you talking about, bro? He's like, you talking about these? Bang. Put some of them on the table.
59:23 I'm like, wow. Holy shit. And this is 99, 98? What? He just got his Def Jam thing. He was just going to Def Jam. He was fat. He wasn't look like you looking at you he was young his joulong club locker didn't look good yeah so I'm like so I'm like yo bro and then years later come around and we're somewhere I forgot where the hell we were and he's seeing the story who Gabi was there Gabi was there big up to Gabi Gabi lost a lot of weight yes Yes. Big up to Gabi. Yeah, he did. He fucking, he's literally telling you the story.
01:00:07 I don't know the back end of the story, what happened. This is fucking 15 years later. 20 years later, he's telling me what's going on. He fought literally with Gabi, all the guys. He fought with them. To get your earwax back. His ex-wife at that time put him on her ears like, nah, you ain't giving this back, bro. Fuck that.
01:00:25 Literally fought with everybody and bring that shit back to me. Goddamn. Let's go. And he didn't. Yo. Yo. I always told him, I was like, listen, I always believe you do good, you get good right back back.
01:00:39 Right. Whether it's today, tomorrow, it's going to come right back. Carlos, man. So you think Pop raped that bitch? Oh, no. I know he didn't. I know for a fact he didn't. I think he was just a famous guy.
01:00:53 That's why. See, the thing is this, right? In the whole place. If for that girl that that happened to her, whatever happened to her, right? She was promiscuous. I think something happened to her. Whatever happened to her. I think something happened to her. I'll say that. But you've seen the movie. Yeah, fuck the movie. The movie is a real suspicion. The movie made me mad. Let me tell you something. So they called me. Did they try to reach out to you on the move I'm not gonna lie listen to me
01:01:25 you know I'm in the media now you know you're my friend off the scenes right but I'm in the media now people actually send me screen by screen
01:01:33 that said that's little Sean right there and it was not just that scene it was the actual robbery of Tupac
01:01:42 now see and that's what offended me but now here's the thing, right? You see... Take it, sir. If you hear... Oh, I'm great. If you hear anything about you
01:01:54 that isn't true, and you feed into it, there's a piece of it that's true. You give life to that. Damn. So, for me, give life to that. Damn. So for me, I like to fight. Boxing, mixed martial arts,
01:02:10 like that's my, I mix it up. Right? With his face. Yeah. So when you hear shit, right, and I got on Instagram
01:02:19 just to promote a book that I wrote. Fiction. Right? What does fiction mean? That's fake or not true? I don't know. I feel like you're kind of saying fiction, but not fiction.
01:02:30 Hold on. Okay, okay. So people said, oh, shit. And I named it Behind the Smoke, not anything related to Sean. Yo, the followers, they're so fucking smart. They're like, yo, little Sean. I'm like oh shit, right?
01:02:47 That's where the Instagram name came from right book. No no no I just made it up. Okay, okay? Okay, right. It's a book, but you might want to promote what's the name of this miss up behind the smoke? Okay, so You know when people hit me up every day right and i never gave life to it tupac tupac tupac and i never i never responded and then all of a sudden one day it stopped and then you see people doing interviews i was there i did this i did that see that shit went over there and nobody ever heard me saying anything about it. So can I stop you right there? Of course you can.
01:03:26 You're the one piece that's missing. That never said a word. Ever. It's true. I'll be honest. I'll be honest. But. I'll be honest.
01:03:34 But. You are. But. Everything you're saying is 100% correct. But when you think about it, like matter of fact, the day we connected in Miami at the show, that's the first time me and Jay seen each other in 22 years. Okay, look, can I stop you for one second? I went to the dressing room, and I did not know I was going to the dressing room.
01:03:58 You came to the dressing room? And you know what Hov said? He was like, where's Lil Sean? And I said, oh, shit. And I gave Hov a five. And I went right back outside. And then I bumped him right into you. And I was like, and I looked at you.
01:04:14 And I was like, that nigga's looking for you. See, I don't like that. What? I didn't know that. And I knew he was going to say something here that I'm not going to know. It's the great kazoo from the flesh You think he's drunk he's not Listen, I'll seat you and I looked and I was like you belong here
01:04:35 Not you know this certain people that don't belong But when I'm in the certain places and the niggave has no idea that I know you at all I don't see I always tell people that right if you come see me I'll say we're the only ones that know we're here room unless you told somebody you were coming to see people only know what you tell them so when you see people talking this because they want to be known and they want to be seen I'm not that guy. I want to be a ghost So but not only that he was expecting you. Yes, he he looked for he looked at me Oh, let me tell you I'd look at me and business that where's little no, no, no, no, no, no, he didn't look at bigs
01:05:19 He looked at you. Okay, and I'm gonna tell you tell you why So now Beehive, Jay's first cousin, that's my best friend to this day. Wow. We're like this. A lot of people don't know because you'll never see us together. But I'll be at his house. He calls me one day and he's like, Jay called. And he asked about you.
01:05:41 No, I saw it. That's true story. I saw it. And I'm like, okay. And he's like, do you mind if I give him your number? I'm like, nah, that's my guy. You know, I don't, listen, if we don't see each other ever again, that's no strain on our relationship. Right.
01:05:57 You know what I'm saying? Like, we're always as cool as we was the last time I saw you. And it's cool. We grown men. No, but you must be getting money because a lot of people don't think like that. A lot of people will be like, yo, what?
01:06:11 The nigga ain't seeing me. He own me something. Yeah, but see, the thing is... That ain't just money, though. Well, nah, the thing is, listen, it depends on your character and who you are as an individual. I'm happy for anybody making it.
01:06:22 And I ain't got to know you. If I know you, I'm really happy that you're alive And you're well And you're prospering Right You know what I'm saying I'm not counting your pockets
01:06:31 So like with y'all The first episode I saw I said oh this is a hit Right I knew Thank you Right So
01:06:38 He calls From a blocked number And this is when you I I've seen you in Miami. Before I got there. Okay. And again, we're talking about Jay. And I'm thinking it's a jail call. Yeah.
01:06:51 He does call like a jail, like it's a fact. I'm thinking it's school, right? So I answer the phone and I don't hear the recording. And I hang up. He still calls me like a jail, nigga. And he calls again. Is that him right there? That's funny as shit.
01:07:03 Yo, yo, yo. So he calls calls again. Is that him right there? That's funny as shit. So he calls back again. I answer the phone and he starts speaking. And we just start laughing like we did the last time we saw each other, right? Follow a week, I'm in Miami. We get in the dressing room. And he looks and he goes, yo, I read everything on your page. I'm like like where do you find the time to read every said i read everything right on your instagram yeah so unless you go so he goes because you go in on your instagram yeah i don't care yeah you go
01:07:36 so he's like you're a fair man and i'm like what do you mean? And he's like, you're fair. So he's not going to give you everything. Right. And you got to figure it out. You know what he's thinking? I know how you write your Instagram. I feel like you, DeHaven, I'm so sorry. Don't put you on the same character.
01:07:58 You got to separate that. And I'm going to tell you why. Okay. I'm sitting there thinking about what he's talking about and I'm like bro one thing about me if me you ever had anything and I'm so old I might have forgot whatever it is you forgot right I said but I'm still the same person I'm not gonna wake up a sucker nigga right I don't do that so you don't know me as that guy. I'm not going to wake up that guy tomorrow.
01:08:27 Right. And do that. So anything I've ever written about him on my page has been complimentary and respectful as a grown man. You dig what I'm saying? Yeah. He deserves it. Yeah. And that's it.
01:08:41 So now Biggs Flies in To surprise Jay I'm there Right I'm there That's why Because you're Right so
01:08:51 I'm sitting here And the door to come in Is there Jay's sitting over here He can't see who's coming in So Biggs is not looking at me And he's like looking around the corner to sneak up on him.
01:09:07 And he sees me, goes, oh, shit, my brother's out, right? I see him after that. Right, you see him after that. So he sits down. When I came home, Dane grabbed me and gave me...
01:09:22 I don't know where he's going now. He gave me my fake job. No, good, all good. I love Dane're going now. He gave me my fake job. No, I'm good. All good. I love Dame. Great guy. He gave me my fake job for parole. So Dame got me, and it's Dame and Biggs.
01:09:35 The separation that just happened. I just came home and said, I don't even know what's going on. I know Dame through Clark. Clark introduced Dame andane and Jay Dane brought Jay to Biggs uptown and that's how they met okay and then that started so now Biggs is sitting. And he's acting like this is nothing. Like, he's just. No, but this is his life. I love the way you. I love the way you break. You break it in the illest shit.
01:10:09 Like, you know. Not sure. Not sure. Not sure. He just said his first name. Not saying. So now, Biggs is sitting to my right. Jay's on my left. And we're talking about some shit that happened.
01:10:24 Because there was a time I fell out with Dane, then Biggs stopped coming around, and then I started hanging out with Biggs every day. And Biggs was on that Washington Heights Latino shit. I'm with him every day. I'm having the most fun I ever had in my life. I don't even know how I got home every day. I'm having the most fun I ever had in my life, right? I don't even know how I got home every day, right? And
01:10:47 you look at Biggs and he's super quiet, but it's the best motherfucker you ever hung out with, right? I say that all the time. So, Biggs, we're talking about some shit that happened one night we hung out, and Biggs will pop up
01:11:04 at a spot. Everybody he's going to meet is already there all right people you've never seen before right crew of people and then there's this fucking big-ass motherfucker standing off in the corner so I'm thinking it's club security right I'm like I don't like club security right so I'm looking at this motherfucker like and somebody walked up to Biggs and started beefing. Biggs is quiet. So Biggs is not saying anything. He don't look scared, but he's just not responding.
01:11:35 So me, I'm on my just come home Biggs shit. So I'm standing off to the side like, yo, Biggs, what's up? What's up? And Biggs is looking at me going, I'm going, fuck that. What's up with this dude? What are we doing? Biggs looks at me, he goes, a million squash potatoes. I don't smoke weed.
01:11:55 I don't smoke weed, so I'm going, I'm not hot. I'm not even drunk. The fuck is he talking about? A million squash potatoes, right? And the dude is going crazy. And Biggs is just standing there looking at him. And I'm like, yo, Biggs,
01:12:11 what's up with this dude? I'm going to smash him. He's like, a million squash potatoes. I'm like, all right, you know what? I'm not even going to pay that shit no mind. At the end of the night, the dude disappeared. The big guy that was in the corner
01:12:27 all night long leaves. Biggs grabs me. We walk out the club. The big guy opens his fucking door and lets us in the SUV. And now I know he ain't club security.
01:12:49 He closed the door and we're in the car. We drive off. And I look at Biggs and Biggs goes, a million squash potatoes. That guy was his security. And nobody knew. He got there before Biggs. When Biggs pulled up, he opened his door and let him he got there before Biggs when Biggs pulled up he opened his door and he walked in Biggs had his own club security with him so Biggs wasn't worried he's like yo if this dude make a move he's finished the dude was
01:13:16 armed he was huge and I'm going and Biggs goes, a million squash potatoes. So now, so wait, don't clap. So don't clap. Don't clap. Don't clap. Don't clap, right? No million squash potatoes. Not yet.
01:13:34 So he's telling this story in Jay's dressing room. And we're dying. I'm crying. And Jay finishes the story. He said, I read that on your page. A million squash potatoes. I'm going, God damn. I wrote that five months ago.
01:13:43 No, no. That nigga watch his ass. the story said I read that on your page a million squash potatoes oh god damn I wrote that five months ago no no that nigga watches everything everything no no listen I thought I thought like I got you know I did business with this nigga something in like like he's not gonna pay attention to every day this nigga he hates me and be like that's not true playboy You know this is you said about me You know you wrote something I have an issue
01:14:24 He was the only guy who's the only client that I really like I'm not gonna lie you you made the big whole chain Yes, I did. I was and like he said I'm going back to what I really liked. I'm not going to lie, you made the big whole chain. Yes, I did. And like he said, I'm going back to what he's saying, I'm quiet. You see my Instagram, I put my jewelry in. How does this happen, though? Whole clothes? I'm quiet. So what happened was this chain was made.
01:14:35 My brother, God bless his soul, passed away a few years ago. He, our supplier, our factory in Turkey calls us. He's like, yo, we got this. Yeah, I'm sorry. Did you say your supplier in Turkey? Yeah, our factory. I mean our factory in Turkey calls us. He's like, yo, we got this. Yeah, I'm sorry. Did you say your supplier in Turkey? Yeah, our factory. I mean our factory.
01:14:48 No, no. You said your factory in Turkey? Yeah. Let's make some noise. Let's do it. Let's do it. Let's do it. Let's do it.
01:14:54 Let's do it. Let's do it. Let's do it. Let's do it. Let's do it. Let's do it. Let's do it. You guys are Turkish?
01:14:58 The family? Or no? Huh? You guys are Turkish? No, man. I don't know. Russian? Russian?
01:15:02 No, Russian. So, man. I don't know what relation they are. We go. They are man. I don't know what relation they are, but they are... He calls me, he's like, yo, this is fucking five kilo chicken. Everybody thinks it was ordered. It was not ordered. You made that shit?
01:15:13 Yeah. The big J, you didn't know that? Nah. It was not ordered. It was not J who called it, no. The fact he calls is, listen, your brother, the manager calls me like listen your brother ordered this thing you guys you guys are right over there
01:15:29 what are you fucking serious five kilo it's like 11 pounds like if you ordered it more dirty fuck you but I'm gonna go that's how we met I ordered it they call him what did it cost I can't say that I get that shit you tell me okay that's okay you're Sean I got I need to know so I so the thing comes in it comes in with Did it cost? I can't say that. You tell me off camera. I'll tell you off camera. You're a Sean. I got to tell you. I need to know. So the thing comes in. It comes in in a fucking towel.
01:15:50 You know the hotel towels? Wrapped up. It was fucked. Yo, bro. I put the shit on my neck. I was, you know, the veins right here. I couldn't breathe. Literally two seconds in, I could not breathe.
01:16:01 It's so fucking heavy. Bro, it was fucking insane. It was like two and a half inches wide like this. It was crazy. So really I was like, who the fuck am I selling this shit to? Like what the fuck is going on here? Oh, you all made it without a buyer? Yeah.
01:16:18 That's the jewelry game. You got to do it. You got to do it. You got to be different in the game. You got to do something crazy. Right. I call Peck house I'm a go pick. What are we doing with this? You got to help me like
01:16:36 Help me find somebody that I can you know, so this is not himself, but tell me who you think is gonna fit this thing He's a game think about it Did he see heaps in the piss in the hole? No, he said I'll think about it Let me see you know, I call you tell you yeah call him or you know, go, you know fight him Okay a Couple of weeks. I'm a couple days past, you know Saturdays with an open We're sort of in my grandmother. I mean we made a promise with an open on Saturdays. It's you know religious thing. You know, you Jewish I get a phone call This is February
01:17:10 Early March late February I got a phone call pet call me like five o'clock in the afternoon in the evening. He's like yo Where's the chain? All right. Well what happened? He's like it's in the store in the safe. He's like, open the store now. Jay want to see it. I said, I can't open the store. I got to open the store at 7.05. That's when the Sabbath breaks, and I can go see it.
01:17:35 If you're flatbush, you know the Jewish. Of course. Yeah, we're not doing, I know. I said, I don't care who it is. I'll see you there at 7.05 or 7.15. Nah, bro, he has a plane to catch. Yada, yada, blah, blah, blah. You broke the Sabbath for Jay?
01:17:46 No, hell no. I didn't break the Sabbath. I got there at 7.30. I got there at 7.30. I text him. I'm like, yo, I'm here. He pulls up. He's like, I'm like, what's going on?
01:17:57 I'm driving. He's calling me crazy. He's not telling you Jay coming? He's not telling me. Okay. He's like, yo, I'm like, what the fuck's going on here? What is the problem? He's like, yo, this guy has to be,
01:18:06 he didn't say who it was, he's like, this guy has to be in Atlanta at this time, the plane is waiting, stop fucking around. But he went to Big Chain? Yeah. Mm-mm. Oh, I'm bugging? I'm so sorry.
01:18:17 Never. I'm like, all right, cool. He pulls up to the store, like two trucks pull up, and at that point, I didn't meet Emory yet point I didn't meet emery yet I didn't cut him you never really know everybody he pulls the window down chase in the back I'm like looking in the car. Who the fuck is in the car break the shit out. Who is that in the car? He pokes out. It's like shut what I see that whole
01:18:42 And I'm walking with the fucking door and all you hear is cooked like that like you could you hear that like heavy shit and Marie's like what's up bro you got that and I hope was the door and I'm like hey let's make some noise picture of Jay on the private plane. With the yada. With the yada on his neck. Going. The yada.
01:19:11 Yada. What is it? It's the yada. It's the yada. Yeah. So he goes. That's the infamous picture. He's on a plane, a private plane with his Givenchy sweater.
01:19:21 We got to go to that picture. He's on there with a big-ass chain on. And I've come to find out he went to Jermaine Dupri's 20th anniversary of So So Death. So So Death. And that's where it came out
01:19:36 and everybody saw it. I got some great jail Emory stories. You know, me and Emory was locked up in the feds together. Let's take it from there. Okay, so. You and Emory were in jail in the feds. So when I went in, that was 98.
01:19:56 Nigga, that's the best year of my life. Was it? Yeah, the best year of my life was 1998. It was the worst year of my life. I'm so sorry. So. I want to let you know that I was living it for you. I appreciate that.
01:20:11 That's a good way to put it. I was, whatever happened to you, I was living it for you. My man. I apologize, I apologize. You need that one? What happened to you? I'm so sorry, continue. So now, the first phone call I made
01:20:24 when I got to the feds was to Clark. And that's how I found out Black just died. Okay, but I'm so sorry. That's my guy. For the sake of me being media, I have to ask. Why were you in the feds? I mean, you know, for all these rap records. All the lyrics.
01:20:41 But you also said you was positive in your rap records. No, I mean, you know. You you also said you was positive in your rap records. No. I mean, you know. You kind of said that earlier. You said you did. I padded myself after LL for women. That's hard. You understand what I'm saying?
01:20:55 Sex sells. Right. And that's just. You're not supposed to go to jail. Because LL never went to jail. No. But see, yeah. Well, LL didn't come up like I came up.
01:21:02 Right? So. That's funny, right? So, the first phone call I made was to Clark. And that's how I found out that Black Just got killed. Remember Black Just? That's my nigga. Okay.
01:21:21 So, when I heard that, I was like, wow. The next phone call I made was to Emery. He was home on house release. Okay. So when I heard that, I said, wow. The next phone call I made was to Emory. He was home on house release. Okay. About three years passed. So Emory was home on house release? House release. I didn't know he caught a case. Okay.
01:21:38 So three years later, I'm in the hole doing 188 days And I'm looking out the window They smoke up the window So you can't see You can't really make out Who you looking at And that's for the protection Because we'll fly kites Like such and such is here
01:21:56 Is he a good dude? Like you know You're in solitary Right So you'll check and see And I'm looking out a smoke glass And I look like at a guy That looks like Emery walking on the pound, but I can't be sure. Emery's not famous at this time.
01:22:11 No. So when I get out there, Emery's there. He just came in. So now, you know, it's me, him, and one other guy on the pound that knew Jay personally. Right? Emery's on the phone with him every day. I'm not, whatever. So when I left, Emory walked me out.
01:22:31 But there was a guy that grew up with Jay. And again, respect to the guy, Da Haven. I don't know him. I didn't grow up in Marcy. I met Jay through Jazzo. Jazzo was my guy. I met Jay through Jazzo Jazzo was my guy I met Jay through him And me and Jay clipped You know
01:22:51 And When you start the Instagram page You got these guys going I grew up with Jay These are the pictures And people are hitting me like Yo is this dude starting true I don't know
01:23:02 I didn't grow up with him So I can't really comment on that. Respect that. So the dude, DeHaven, jumps on my page, and he's in my DMs, and I'm like, bro, respectfully. I definitely was not ready for this. I don't know you.
01:23:16 I did not know. He hit you in your DM? Yeah, of course. Okay. We're in Brooklyn. I'm not rich, right? So of course you're going to see, right? And... They didn't know this. Yeah, so we're talking in DMs, and I'm not rich, right? So of course you're going to see, right? And. They didn't know this.
01:23:26 Yeah, so we're talking in DMs. I'm like, bro, I don't really respect your angle. But whatever you're doing, that's on you. I don't do that. You know what I'm saying? But I don't know you to come in and say what's true or what's not true. I don't get into that. You know?
01:23:45 So there was another guy in jail who came up with Jay, who did the same thing, kind of like what DeHaven did. So now me, him, and Emery, we're in the feds in Fort Dix. And Emery comes to my unit. And he's like, yo, I got to tell you something. I'm like, what's up? He's like, yo, this dude something I'm like what's up he's like yo this dude said some shit about you you know and I'm like do you know him from the street he like
01:24:13 nah I said did Jay know him he's like yeah and I'm like well what did he say and he said something about me and I'm like all right he said I know mean while you're all in the feds together yeah he's like you know i know you're going home i'm gonna fuck your time up dude in the feds that's all i did was fight so they didn't even have nothing else to take from me they took everything from me so they had to let me go so he's like i ain't gonna tell you but you know i stand by what i say so i went and checked the dude and i I'm like, yo. So I go see the dude and I'm like, yo, bro. I don't know you.
01:24:50 So I don't know what you're talking about. I don't even know why you would reference me. But I don't have it all upstairs. My elevator don't go to the penthouse. I'm telling you now. So all that shit you're doing, I'm going to stab you everywhere I catch so skin.
01:25:05 Right? You know, Clark's on your phone list. He's on mine. That's the only thing we have in common. I don't know you, bro, but the next time you call my, he's like, yo, who would say something about me?
01:25:18 I'm like, Emery Jones. He told me to tell you that he said it. I know you did it, but I'm not that guy. So if you want to go home go home, bro Yeah after that day Every time he went to the store he left something in my room He's going to the assistant so all this gangster shit niggas be talking see niggas want to talk
01:25:38 But niggas don't want to live that shit for real when they come up against something that's gonna touch you I'm gonna touch you. I'm going to touch you. And I'm not going to talk. It's mixed logic. OK? So now, so now, yeah, so now we all come home. This guy does a book, a DVD. He's doing the same shit.
01:26:04 Talking about Jay. I put Jay on. That's on you. Oh, you're. He's doing the same shit. Talking about Jay. I put Jay on. That's on you. Oh, you're talking about DeHaven. No, no, no. It's another guy. Another guy. I wouldn't even give him no light.
01:26:14 You know what I'm saying? Because you're not that guy for me. Because if you was that guy, you wouldn't be doing that. I'm going to be honest. That night that I saw you when I went I don't know what part I came to the joint but I love the thing was like whether y'all he was like we asked where you was yeah you know that's good motherfucker I'm gonna tell you. And I told him. And I was like, oh shit.
01:26:47 Oh shit. And I didn't know he was there. And I went back and I seen him. Yeah, so the thing is for me, you know, just because he's
01:26:54 this guy now and I've known him when he was, he doesn't owe me anything. You get yourself high. So just how you reinvented yourself. You could have stopped
01:27:03 when you stopped making music and that's it. You reinvent yourself, man. And you make yourself hot. You dig? And then whatever comes to you afterwards, that's it. The American West with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater Podcast Network, hosted by me, writer and historian Dan Flores, and brought to you by Velvet Buck. This podcast looks at a West available nowhere else.
01:27:33 Each episode, I'll be diving into some of the lesser-known histories of the West. I'll then be joined in conversation by guests such as Western historian Dr. Randall Williams and best-selling author and meat-eater founder Stephen Ranella. I'll correct my kids now and then where they'll say when cave people were here and I'll say it seems like the ice age people that were here didn't have a real affinity for caves. So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th where we'll delve into stories of the West and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today. Listen to The American West with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.
01:28:18 I know a lot of cops, and they get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. Across the country, cops called this taser the revolution. But not everyone was convinced it was that simple. Cops believed everything that taser told them. From Lava for Good and the team that brought you Bone Valley comes a story about what happened when a multibillion-dollar company dedicated itself to one visionary mission.
01:28:53 This is Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. It's really, really, really bad. Listen to new episodes of Absolute Season One, Taser Incorporated on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Binge episodes one, two, and three on May 21st and episodes four, five, and six on June 4th. Add free at Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. I'm Clayton English. I'm Greg Glod.
01:29:31 And this is season two of the War on Drugs podcast. Yes, sir. We are back. In a big way. In a very big way. Real people, real perspectives. This is kind of star-studded a little bit, man. We got Ricky Williams, NFL player, Heisman Trophy winner. It's just a compassionate choice to allow players all reasonable means to care for themselves. Music stars Marcus King, John Osborne from Brothers Osborne.
01:29:52 We have this misunderstanding of what this quote-unquote drug ban is. Benny the Butcher. Brent Smith from Shinedown. We got B-Real from Cypress Hill. NHL enforcer Riley Cote. Marine Cor vet. MMA fighter Liz Karamush. What we're doing now isn't working and we need to change things.
01:30:10 Stories matter and it brings a face to them. It makes it real. It really does. It makes it real. Listen to new episodes of the War on Drugs podcast season two on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to hear episodes one week early and ad-free with exclusive content, subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts.
01:30:38 I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on good company, the podcast where I sit down with the boldest innovators shaping what's next. In this episode, I'm joined by Anjali Sood, CEO of Tubi, for a conversation that's anything but ordinary. We dive into the competitive world of streaming, how she's turning so-called niche into mainstream gold, connecting audiences with stories that truly make them feel seen. What others dismiss as niche, we embrace as core. It's this idea that there are so many stories out there, and if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience is that they feel seen.
01:31:22 Get a front row seat to where media, marketing, technology, entertainment, and sports collide. And hear how leaders like Anjali are carving out space and shaking things up a bit in the most crowded of markets. Listen to Good Company on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Smoke jam. That's the after party. That's the smoke jam. Keep going, keep going.
01:32:07 So now, we all come home. And I see this dude. And now, he's YouTubed up. He wrote a book. And I'm in a party. You know, I went to go do something at this party. And I run into the guy. And he's like, yo, Sean, what's up, man?
01:32:27 Let's take a picture. I got a book. I'm like, I didn't take a picture with you in jail. I'm not going to take a picture with you in the street. But you good? He's like, yeah. And then he looks at the guy that I'm standing with. Street guy.
01:32:42 He did 11 years. This is the first time I ran into him. I don't know. They know each other. But this is the gangster, this to that, right? And he looks at the dude and the dude looks at him. He goes, yo, what's up, man? And the dude said, yo, get out of here before you get murdered. And the nigga put his head down and walked away. So you see, these are the people that's talking. And they're doing all this, I'm this, I'm that. That's bullshit.
01:33:16 So when you run up against a rich person, wise, we can call his name a million times. When you and I connected, we started talking. And our link was, our glue was, initially was Bustle. Okay. I love that guy. I didn't know you were as young as you are. You're 42. Okay.
01:33:30 So, we're talking and I'm telling you about everybody in your projects that I know and I'm like, every once in a while I go see Uncle Wise
01:33:39 on the ad in front of the barbershop. Right? And you're like, you know Wise? I'm like, yeah. Nobody will ever pull a picture up of Wyze on Instagram. You heard.
01:33:49 Right. And that's what it's about. If you are that guy, you're not worried about who knows, who thinks, who sees, because you're not trying to be fucking famous. Right. It's real shit. You understand what I'm saying? You getting that? I don't care. I just don't care.
01:34:08 I just don't care. So anytime I talk about crime on my page, I always write cryptically. Right. So I write books and scripts now. I write more than books. You definitely did not rob Tupac. Of course not. All right. We just got to throw that out there.
01:34:24 But I'll give you a funny story, okay, you know So you remember third base yes the white boy I love the niggas and he had a black DJ DJ Richie Richie See so The thing is was originally you know, he, so, the thing is, was it Richie Rich KMD? And you know, he did this shit the last time I was in Miami. He's like, oh, you don't smoke no more. He gonna try you, he gonna keep you.
01:34:53 I'm a foul brother. You're looking at your cup, it's empty. I'm your foul brother, come on, let's go. But Richie Rich is KMD also, right? The same group, KMD? No. Yeah, they had a group called KMD. Maybe I've got it, I don't know. Yeah, they had a group called KMD. Maybe a guy like me.
01:35:05 So, uh... One more word? Let's do it. Go ahead. This guy, Richie Rich, went to my high school, but he's younger than me. Right?
01:35:16 So, you know, one time I'm leaving, I'm going home, and he runs up to me. He's like, yo, man, I just got into the school, and, you know, I see you running with these guys, and, you know, just look out for me when you get a chance me. He's like, yo, man, I just got into the school. And, you know, I see you running with these guys.
01:35:26 And, you know, just look out for me when you get a chance. And I'm like, okay, I don't know who he is. Years later, we get in the industry. He's Richie Rich, third base. Whatever. So one night there was a party at Def Jam. Def Jam threw a party across the street from, remember when they were on Varick? Of course. Okay. 170 Varick. Right. street from, remember when they were on Varick? Of course.
01:35:45 Oh, 170 Varick. Right. 170 or 160 Varick. There was a club on 160. There was a club across the street
01:35:51 called Tilt. And I'm in there with some guys. Which is kind of like SLBs right now. Exactly. You know I'm on point. I'm a New York thing.
01:36:00 You probably see me in the back. I definitely see you. You probably see me in the back with the suitcase that was there. I know exactly who you are. It resonated later because I'm not smoking. So, keep going. That's how I started.
01:36:15 He knows I was there. He don't never talk. So we're in this party and I'm with the worst that Brooklyn has to offer. Okay? And I see Richie Rich and another guy that used to be with Third Base. I like these guys by knowing through Clark. Because this whole DJ thing. Clark is my guy, right?
01:36:38 So I'm always at his house. And I know everybody that's around him. So I see this dude and of course they're already drunk but i want to keep them away from these guys okay richie and them are drunk yup right and i see them and i'm pouring champagne and they hit my arm and they poured some champagne on my man Scooter. Bruh. And I look at him and he's like, yo, who is these dudes? And I look and I'm like, I got it.
01:37:15 Now, for the people that don't know, in the Tupac movie, Scooter is the guy that's nothing. Nothing. Nothing related. Nothing related. Nothing related. But in the Tupac nothing nothing nothing related nothing with it nothing related but in the two-part movie nothing related they tried to know the pick no no no no one's in school nope you see so I'm gonna tell you so I turn my back on these guys and I'm getting these guys away like yo what's up y'all
01:37:42 good all right go ahead and I turn around back to these guys away like, yo, what's up? Y'all good? All right, go ahead. And I turn around back to these guys. And they like, yo, you got a problem with these guys? What's up with them? And I turn around and one is holding the other back from like coming to fight. I don't know what happened, right? Right. And I'm looking. The third base dudes are holding themselves back?
01:38:02 Yeah. And I go in my pocket and I back my scalpel out and I start chasing them through the party like, you're fronting now. Like, stop, right? I get up. We leave the club. My car, I had a Lexus Coupe. I'm like me and Pepper from Salt and Pepper's, first people in New York with Lexus Coupes
01:38:24 when they first changed in the hill So I get outside and we walk into the cars and my shit is leaning I'm like, why is my shit leaning my shit is riddled with bullets You know, my shit is riddled with bullets. Yo, there shit is riddled with bullets. Yo, just a tear just dropped out my right eye. I'm like, yo, my fucking car. You shot your car? You shot my car. No way. Where at?
01:38:54 Where is this borough? By Tilt. No, you... 16th and 11th. In Manhattan? You shot your car, man. You shot my car, right? Yeah. Cool. Cool. I car, right? Yeah. Cool. I already knew who did it.
01:39:10 It definitely felt like some flatbush shit. Nope. Nope, it was not? Nope. All right, leave it alone. So now, put it in the shop, bought another car, I'm hooded up, and I'm looking for these motherfuckers. Because Richie Rich, that's not him. You get money, you could buy a gun, right?
01:39:29 And you shoot it. That don't make you tough. Right? You just got a gun. And I catch him and I put him in the hospital, right? My mother calls me a couple of days later. She's like, yo, why are the police looking for you? And at that time, I had cases out the wazoo, right?
01:39:51 And I'm like, I don't know. And then I figured it out. This kid went in the house, got his mother, called the ambulance, went to the hospital. She called the police. Yeah. And picked me out of a lineup. So now the day before, when I find out it's him, I call Clark. I'm like, yo, what's up with your man?
01:40:16 Call him on the three-way. Gets him on the phone. I'm like, yo, bro, I know y'all shot my car. I didn't say nothing. I'm turning myself in tomorrow with a lawyer. Don't go down there. Next day, I turn myself in. This motherfucker is behind.
01:40:35 Picks me out, right? Say nothing. I get out the same day. I call Clark again. Call your man. I'm like, yo, bro, auto protection can't help you. You're going to have to leave New York. I'm going to kill you.
01:40:47 Right. So, this guy is running around with a gun. He gets locked up. He's running around with a gun not to harm you. Scared.
01:41:00 Okay, scared, okay. He gets locked up with a gun charge. So, now he has a case. I'm not going to call her name because she'll be mad, but whoever promoted
01:41:16 the tunnel with Chris Light, don't call her name. Jessica? He said don't call her. Right? He said don't call her. I'm sorry. I didn't do it. Listen. She's the worst. Went down. No, I didn't.
01:41:29 No, this all happened. I was, oh my God, this is crazy. Went down to the DA's office and said that she saw them shoot my car. So they told him, said, listen, we're going to give him three months, and we're going to give you a one to three if you don't drop the charges. Wow. So the night that I caught him, right,
01:41:52 I took everything from him. Richie Rich. Not the Richie Rich now. DJ. Not the West Coast Richie Rich either. And I sold it to a guy that gave it to Tupac. I feel like you sold it to Raffia.
01:42:10 Wait, he said they gave it to Tupac. He gave it to Tupac. So if you look, there's a picture online with Tupac like this. And there's a bone bracelet with diamonds around it. Octagon. You remember that bracelet? Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. Tupac got that bracelet on. Wow. Thatagon, you remember that bracelet? Oh yeah, yeah, yeah. Tupac got that bracelet on.
01:42:27 Wow. That was Richard's bracelet. I need to understand what you're talking about right now. Are you telling me? Let me say it louder. Are you telling me you had the thing and then you, you the nigga, like, went and popped this in the bathroom like that?
01:42:43 Yeah. That's close to the y'all. You the nigga? All day. That's closer to y'all. So the thing is, right? I'll be gone. I'm going to take a pee-pee. Go ahead. So as far as robbing anybody, like that's so far beneath me. I respect that. As a person.
01:43:07 See, if I'm going to rob anybody at that time, when I was in the trenches. It's face to face. Give me yours. Bare face and you're going to know who did it. Yeah, you know. And it's not going to be for jewelry. It's going to be for something that,
01:43:20 it's called a no look back. See, when you grab a bag and it ain't worth you can't live off this bag don't do it because it's not enough for you to live comfortably don't do it so for the people that think about it I'm me honest because you're my friend and I know no we stopped setting up the clip man no no no no no no no no no listen listen listen all my guys is going did you get a list of you know he's gonna ask it just know when I watch the two-box box. It's a motherfucker funny. They said that this is the nigga.
01:44:07 I need you to say yes or no. Let me tell you something. Check this out. You definitely didn't say yes or no. Check this out. I would never. I would never. See, when that happened, it became such a phenomenon, especially
01:44:24 in Brooklyn. Yes. I had guys tell such a phenomenon, especially in Brooklyn. Yes. I had guys tell me, you know, I was there, and I did it. I'm like, really? You really? And you know they lying. I'm the only one that got questioned for the crime in Andre Harrell's office with Andre there. Midtown Law.
01:44:41 I wasn't ready for this part, but now I'm in. I'm telling you. Let's go. You know what I'm talking about. So you know what I'm talking about. You know what I'm talking about. Come on, get up.'m in. I'm telling you. Let's go. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I have a question. So you know Tuck? You know Tuck personally? Come on, get up, get up. Get up. OK.
01:44:48 You know Tuck? You know Tuck? Wait a minute. I don't know. I don't know Tuck. Which Tuck? King Tuck, man. You only know one, right?
01:44:55 I only know that one. I know him personally. Which one? East New York? King Tuck. OK. Wait, the right Tuck? The one that's actually charged for...
01:45:08 He hasn't been charged? No, he's in the feds. Hasn't been charged? He's in the feds. The one I'm talking about. He's in Otisville. I was just there Monday. He's in Otisville, yeah. Absolutely. Walter Johnson. Yes, absolutely.
01:45:24 He hasn't been charged with that Okay Listen that's a part of mine. that was a part of my circle. That's real. Scooter and Tut are in Otisville together. Okay? So, where you from originally? I'm from the Bronx.
01:45:55 Bronx. And how do you know him? You know of him or you know him? No, I know him personally. Inside, up north? Yeah. I was in Otisville. So, what year? I was in Oldsville. So, what year?
01:46:15 I was in Oldsville in 2007, 2008. You was there before Scooter got there. I was there before. So, you was there with Lou and Tudor. With who? Lou Hobbs. Lou Hobbs. Yeah, I was there with Lou Hobbs. Okay.
01:46:23 All right. Listen to me. Listen to me, right? Lou Hobbs. See? L.A, I was there with Lou Hobbs. Okay. All right. All right. Listen to me. Listen to me, right? Lou Hobbs. See, this is way beyond my street. You see, you would know these guys from in there. I know these guys from the sandbox.
01:46:47 Right? So you would hear things. And you can't really pinpoint facts as to what's true, what's not true. I know everything that is and everything that isn't. I know the real motherfuckers. And I know the guys that weren't as notorious as these guys. So now Scooter's there.
01:47:09 He's another one that you'll never ever hear talk and do interviews and stuff like that. But when he got to Otisville, he went there twice. The first time he was there for an hour. And the warden took him in the office and said you can't stay here and shipped him out back
01:47:26 to allenwood pen with prince and then from queens okay cool and then they brought him back so now the first visit i get cleared to go see him because i'm his co-defendant right so i go see him. Coming in, there's a family. And they call Tut's name. And I'm like, oh shit, it's Tut's family. Cool. They go in before me. I go in after. Tut comes out.
01:47:59 Out the back. Walks right by me. And over to his family. Scooter comes out. Sits next to me, and I'm like, yo, Tut just came out here. There's two people over there. He looks, he's like, pfft. So you don't know what goes on in jail, but you've been there,
01:48:16 so you know how it go, right? And Scooter has a problem with anybody doing any media shit. Because when you in the street, that's the last thing you want to do, right? You don't want to be on the mic. Sorry. You don't make music. It's real shit Right Three hours past they're going to take pictures now. You've been in the business room, right? So, you know how to go Pictures is over here. Y'all go back over there and this is the visiting room The CEO sit there. I've beenending machines is over there, right? There you go.
01:48:48 And Tut goes up to take a picture with his family. He stops over there and he sees me. He's like, yo, little, what's up? But he wouldn't come nowhere near me. Cool, Tut. Yeah? Okay. And I'm asking Scooter, what's going on? Like, he's like, I don't fuck with that dude. You see, so urban legend has
01:49:07 this that y'all all together but bruh in the circle it's like the shit that happened in your house we don't know right so nobody knows what happened in my house I know and I'm not gonna expose you but be cool but you definitely did not have anything no that's awesome like a brother nothing see nothing so I don't even know why people are doing interviews connecting themselves notice this they they've been pointing at because they didn't have nothing to do with that shit. That's real.
01:49:47 I was there. You were there. Bro, listen, my car was stuck in the parking lot. The niggas came to see you. Yeah, I had to go back the next day to get my car. Yo, when that one park out, I went up in the elevator. I was upstairs already. Big was there.
01:50:02 No one ever heard his song. You know what? No, because in Quad, the elevators are here. Big was there. No one never heard of his song. You know what? No. Because in Quad, the elevators are here. Number one. Why? I'm in. And when you get off the elevator, it's like a wall.
01:50:15 And I was over here by reception with Andre Harrell and Puff. Andre Harrell was there too? Of course. And Puff? Yeah, because here's the thing. This is how the whole shit came about. Andre was doing New. Of course. And Puff. Yeah, because here's the thing. This is how the whole shit came about. Andre was doing New York Undercover. You know that was his television show.
01:50:31 With the league executive producer? You didn't know that? I didn't know that. Okay, so. But what was his role in the show? He produced, executive produced? He was the producer. Okay.
01:50:38 That was his shit. That's nice. That's crazy. So, somebody had a bright idea and said, look we're gonna get pop to do a song with sean i had just signed to uptown at the time because at the time let me just describe this you're way hotter than biggie smalls biggie is not even he just started he just started you'd be the og he just you got he's on my other show is that is that record popping already after that after i He just started. He just started. You'd be the OG to him. He just started. You got it. He's on my other show.
01:51:06 Is that record popping already? After that. After that. I mean, think about it. He had songs released on Uptown. That was right before Big didn't have records on Uptown. So when I was on Uptown MCA, I released Don Perignon. And Big was in the video, right?
01:51:20 So when Dude got there and got off the elevator. I got to ask. When you say dude, you say Tupac? All right, cool. So even the account that he made, that's not what happened. What's the account that he made? He said everybody ran from him and that's not what happened. We ran from him. And they wasn't. That's not what happened. We ran towards him.
01:51:48 And we were trying to get him to sit down. Wow. And he went to sit down. And he popped back up. Which is what C says. C says that all the time. Yes, C says that all the time. But we didn't know.
01:51:59 Right? And he said, call my mother. And detectives got there. Ambulance got there, right? And they put him in the gurney and they stood him up and they brought him in the elevator to bring him down. So now everybody else that was still there, the police was like, we know that there's guns up here. We're going to search this floor. I heard that.
01:52:32 And there was one guy, short guy, that was with Tupac and them. He didn't leave when they left. And he was just on the wall stiff. And I walked up to him and I was like, yo, you good? He was like, yeah. And I said, come with me in the back. I brought him in what they call the live room where they have instruments, right? And I searched him.
01:53:00 He had a hammer on him. I took it off his waist. But you had to search him? Yeah. Took it off his waist. Put it in the piano. And I said, the cops are going to search this floor. So now, you know, let a couple days go by and you can come back and get your shit.
01:53:22 And he was like, thanks. I said, don't worry about it. Months later, me and Big, God bless the dead, we in Daddy's house. And we're talking about this. And Big is like, yo, I don't know why he would think that I had anything to do with that. Big, Tupac came to New York,
01:53:41 and I told him about hanging out with these guys. Tupac went and told these niggas that Big said that shit. So now they was on after Big. See, you don't hear that shit. You dig? No, I do hear it. You heard that shit. It's not, it's not pulverized.
01:54:00 It's not, you know. Right. But I did hear that. So Big was mad that pot put him on blast He said I can't believe that I'm the one that went and got his gun for him out the studio I Looked and I said you got it out the piano. He said how'd you know I said cuz I put it there All of that shit that happened afterwards was a ploy. And it was manufactured
01:54:29 by Suge Knight. When you say ploy, I don't know what a ploy means. It was a game plan. It was a game plan to get him to go over there. It was a strategy. It was a strategy.
01:54:39 So if you think about back then, Tupac got convicted of the rape. He went to jail. That sucker nigga Kevin Power did an interview for Vibe. The writer, the writer, Kevin Powell. The lesbian guy, I know him. And Tupac said, Thug Life is dead. He said, I might be killed after this interview, but I want my truth to be known.
01:55:05 Right? And he's doing the interview. Right? Suge Knight goes to get him out of jail. When Suge Knight got him out of jail, it's the first time you heard Biggie and Puff did it. That whole East Coast
01:55:22 West Coast shit was manufactured by Suge. Suge did that shit. But not the shooting. you're saying down. No, I'm talking about okay. Okay, just to be That was sure so not vibe not the media you say sure Tupac wasn't saying that Tupac was blaming street guys. After Suge came and got him out of jail. And that's the reason. I'm going to be honest. I'm going to be honest.
01:55:52 That's where I keep asking you. Because when Tupac was blaming the street guys, you was one of the number one names. Yeah, but I wasn't a street guy. He wasn't. He was writing songs. I was a rapper. He was Yeah, but I wasn't a street guy. He wasn't. He was writing songs. I was a rapper. He was a rapper.
01:56:08 I'm not going to lie. I can't really let you get away with that. But you have to because the thing is, you have to. You sound like a spy novel. Yeah, but you have to. You know why? Because you wouldn't know that if you didn't have a foot in the street. You ain't know a thing about me.
01:56:23 What'd you know? I'm not going to lie. You're very good. I'm just saying, what would you know? But foot in the street. You ain't know nothing about me. What'd you know? I'm not going to lie. You're very good. I'm just saying, what would you know? But it's the truth. What would you know? Right? So if I never spoke about this before, right?
01:56:33 And I'm telling you how this shit unraveled. If you see media, if it's on the newspaper tomorrow on the cover, y'all all going to talk. Trump gets impeached. Everybody in the room is going, Trump gets impeached, but he's not going to be he's not gonna be removed but he's impeached right you don't know what the fuck that means yeah they don't know the nuance he's still the president of the United States well your case is different Are you still going to ask him if he robbed? I had to be fair.
01:57:05 Ask him one more time. I had to be fair to my fans. Listen. Come on. You're a real nigga. But you only know that. And real niggas in the world like, yo, Sean. Robbed people?
01:57:19 No. They say, this is what they say. They say, no, Sean. Scooter. you name his name Don't assume David and what's the other nigga? What's the other they do Johnny said the y'all three niggas niggas that brought to put your button I'm telling you then y'all bring it to Gabriel.
01:57:46 Damn, you in there too? I'm using motherfucking ass. No, I'm joking. I'm joking. But here's the thing. Okay. It's been 20, 25 years. 25 years, yeah.
01:58:00 Is there a statute of limitations to that? Of course. But 20, I would, bro, 25 years, right? Yes. I was the only one questioned for the crime. Oh, you were actually questioned over it? I thought they questioned me, too. No, I was the only one questioned.
01:58:16 And I wouldn't. No. No. Nope. Nope. Nope. Nope. No.
01:58:23 I was the only one questioned for the crime. So you were a prime suspect at that moment? Yeah, because I had an open case in the same precinct. Right. At that time. And I said, I'll sit down with them. I don't care. But Andre has to be there. All right.
01:58:40 Yep. Yeah. So we're in Andre's office and they get there and they're like, yeah, we heard you were jealous of Tupac. And I'm like, really? And this is the feds or this is? No, no, state, state. State, okay.
01:58:53 Let's take it. NYPD. Yeah. And they said, we heard you were jealous of Tupac. I'm like, really? That's your angle? Alright. Peace.
01:59:01 And I got up and walked out. Great story, guys. Yeah, because... Oh, nah. You know that. Come on, champ. Come on, champ. So...
01:59:12 You dig? Wait a minute. But, bruh, listen to me. I'm listening to you. If I take something from you, it's going to ruin your life. If I take your chain and your watch, that ain't going to ruin your life. If I take your chain and your watch,
01:59:26 that ain't going to ruin your life. So, if I ever rob somebody, it won't be that. But you ever get offended by those stories? All the time. But not anymore.
01:59:41 After the past... Think about it. I'm in jail and that shit is coming to me. And people are saying, you're the leader of robbing Tupac. Right, but... How did that happen? Like, when you're in jail, niggas are like, you robbed Tupac. It's not just robbing, it's the... And you're in every jail, right?
02:00:00 I started in Virginia, I did the counties. Then I did Otisville. Then I went to Fort Dix. I came home from Fort Dix. I was on the east side. I was on the west side. Then I went to the camp. The camp wasn't built when I got there. Then I got kicked out of the camp.
02:00:20 I went to solitary for six months. Then I got back on the west side with Emory and them. And then I left from there. But, you know. What dicks is different than everybody having? Yalla. Yo, man, pull up a chair, man.
02:00:33 What the fuck is yalla? What is yalla? What is that? Everybody has that thing, bro. That's their thing. You got the yalla. Bro, they come into the store, yo, you see that yalla, what the fuck you talking about, bro?
02:00:44 Yeah, yeah. You get there, you get five kilos see that yalla. What the fuck are you talking about, bro? Yeah, yeah. So the thing is, right? Yes. For me, there was no internet when I went to jail. God bless you for saying that, I swear. I'm going after the old school. So when I came home in 98, no, not 98, 2003, September, I saw the internet. And I'm like, wow, this shit is nuts.
02:01:10 And then I saw cameras everywhere. I'm like, damn, you can't do nothing to nobody. Nothing. It's a different place. And depending on the type of person you are, it kind of makes you a better person because you have restraint. Yeah. Right? Great.
02:01:24 I got road rage. I like throwing shit out Right? Great. I got road rage. I like throwing shit out in my car. I like chasing people. You know, but you're on camera. Very true. So you see all these kids, like Tekashi69, all these guys. Let's talk about it. Open and shut case because you're on camera.
02:01:38 In front of camera, they do everything. And there's a time where we didn't have cameras. Hell yeah. Right? And if they solved the crime it was a rat Now they got the rat and the footage and the rats kind of like a cool You know what I'm gonna I'm gonna get us all about again This situation a couple of couple of weeks ago, talking about cameras. I came up with the same error.
02:02:09 No cameras, no fucking Instagram, no Myspace, no Insta, none of that shit. I was probably in the same clubs this guy was in. Okay. Envy, he even, now it's you, he. Look at you and nothing. I'm telling you, he looks very familiar. I'm not even gonna lie to you. Hey, bro. another time. So he's very familiar man
02:02:34 I was at that time. I was running around with my man boomer Brooklyn yeah boom heavy guy He was he was he was Yeah my bag he was back then we used to call him the wolves and all of this Those guys were not straight. I was pregnant not fucking around. I was in the club with a backpack with a bunch of Gold diamonds all bunch of shit in there. Oh I'm telling you you look familiar, bro. What did I do? What are you saying he rocks? Nah, I'm fucking around. It was a joke. It was a joke. I was an Envy at one point. I think Flex was DJing. I don't fucking remember. He was a club Envy and Flex was DJing.
02:03:32 Yeah, this was... What year? 2002? Not a lot. Your bracelet looks so crazy. Can you show the people your bracelet? Can you show the people? Look at this bracelet. What were you going to say? Oh, he was like look at his bracelet What were you gonna say? 2002 I was in jail. It wasn't it wasn't it wasn't saying wasn't you up to say you look familiar wasn't
02:03:57 I'm just saying I'm saying I was in there and I don't know it was They were afraid it was scared. I was in there because They were like yo, bro. You need to go upstairs to the DJ booth You remember I remember it was up top you weren't home Did it ever make you go to the DJ booth? No, they made me go up to the DJ booth. They were like yo stay right here don't fucking move What happened? This young kid I didn't understand what's going on. What happened?
02:04:24 Flex wanted some shit and I was there and whatever, you know, but still what he was saying about the whole Instagram and the whole flex and all of this. I'm not that guy either. If you see my Instagram, maybe I'll put the picture here or there myself, but I would never, ever say, yeah, I did this. Yeah. Yeah. I did that.
02:04:43 If you know, you know, you know, a lot of custom. Good. Yes, I understand that did that if you know, you know No, but you get a lot of custom good. Yes, I understand But you know, you know, you don't you should claim my shit now you say much Yeah, you see I did that no no because my sister I did that because you know Some people they just not gonna name names obviously, but some people they love to move around in funny ways. You gotta say names, man. Come on. You gotta say, bro, you gotta say names. You're here. Where am I?
02:05:09 Hell, if you're not doing that, I am not doing that. Wait, you shot him? Yeah. I robbed him. No, no, no. Listen, so. Listen, I'm not, listen, at the end of the day, when it's very, it's somehow, because right now,
02:05:24 you know, I'm looking at the error of the jewelry the whole thing Definitely not mad definitely not because you got a role at the times Can I actually cause a lot of people came from the Coliseum? Yes, they came from Queens Now to forty come on, I'm about to fucking please make sure my party you crash Then I came up with the Queens when I'm in a diamond district now Yes, that's what I want to be at the end of me Honestly, I want to get the fuck out of the fifth Avenue and go to your diamond district story. Oh, there we go now Yes, I'm getting ready to go in. This is 98
02:05:58 How about 19? I just signed a huge deal with Sylvia Rohn, right? Sylvia's good. I know Sylvia very well. And I can't go to Tito because he's not right. Right, because of that thing, right. So I go to my cousin, Don Poo. Because Tito is telling? Yeah, he's telling. So I go to my cousin, Don Poo, and I'm like, yo, I need you to take me to Jacob because I don't know him.
02:06:23 But if he knows you, right, he'll deal with me correct. Right. Because I heard that he wasn't all the way right. Did he say you're cutting his dog, Pooh? Yeah. Right? I love the way he just said that.
02:06:33 So he brings me there. I pick out some earrings. I give him $8,800. Right? I go to jail. A year later somebody came to visit me wearing them
02:06:47 and I'm looking I'm like damn where you got them stones from they're yellow and they're like these are yours I'm like those ain't mine and they're like
02:06:56 no these are your stones and I'm looking going those ain't mine they're yellow said they turned yellow one day right right he already don't say you already know right so now I got a lot of time left I want to get
02:07:14 out that day don't tell me you wait wait wait wait wait wait. So now, I come home. It's not even on my mind anymore five years later, right? I get with Dame. We're back and forth to Beverly Hills, right? Private jetting, right? We're in a party in Beverly Hills at this place called Teddy's, right? And... Jago walks in? No.
02:07:44 Quincy Jones is there. Dame is talking to Quincy. Sanaya Lathan, Quincy's daughters, right? And I'm just off to the side by myself. I go to the bathroom. I come out the bathroom. I stop at the bar to get me a drink. With who actually you're in?
02:08:03 I get me... I go to the bathroom and come on, get me a drink. I'm at the bar. Jacob and his wife walks up. Oh, man. Next to me. And I look, and I'm like, yo, what's up? And he's like, hey, how you doing?
02:08:15 Next to me. I said, you don't remember me? And he's like, nah. I said, yo, motherfucker, you sold me laser-treated stones. They were laser-treated. You know about that. Yes. After after a year they turn a color not after a year depends if you put if you put heat on them they turn a certain color I've never heard of this shit.
02:08:36 I don't get a lot of money. That means they're fake though? No, they're not fake. It doesn't mean they're fake. Listen to me. Let's say the original ones would cost, say, $25,000. Right. That's why he paid $8,800 at that time. You understand? Because you still consider diamonds.
02:08:59 They just come out of the earth the same way. We just laser them. I bought clear stones. I'm in jail. They turn yellow. I got a problem. I ain't buy. They turned yellow. I got a problem. I ain't buy yellow stones. Yeah. And he act like he didn't yellow.
02:09:09 But yellow is good. Yeah, but see. But you too buy. No, if you buy in white, you can return yellow. That's a problem. That's a problem. That's a fucking problem. Maybe it went up in price at that point.
02:09:17 So now. So Dame walks up. And he looks. And you know Dame, Dame. Dame, Dame. So I grab him. I'm like, yo, Dame. Dame got jokes. So I grab him. I'm like, yo, bro, I need my money when I get back. $8,800 ain't nothing to Dame at the time, right?
02:09:31 So he's like, yo, Sean, what happened? I said, listen, mind your business. I got him. Right? To Jacob. Yeah. And he looks at Dame. He's like, yo, I don't even know who this guy is.
02:09:40 Motherfucker, you know me, right? And I pull him close, and Dame separates us. I'm like, yo, when I get back to New York. I'm coming to your office Right after that he gets locked up with the BMF Listen to me I have a story about you. See, I don't care. No, I do care. Because you can't beat me. It doesn't even matter.
02:10:08 I'm going to tell you the truth. When you see me. I want one of them fake Richard Millers that he got. He got like Jacobs. Listen to me. Yeah. It looked like Richard Millers. Listen, I was in Atlanta at the time when BMF, these guys,
02:10:22 were throwing hundreds in the crowd. Literally. When they're throwing dollar bills, these guys are throwing hundreds in the crowd They do a couple hundred grand being very seriously talking hundreds of hundreds like literally In the place in the diversity, yeah in Atlanta in Atlanta fucking cars They never came to you. So this came there. I'm sorry It's a process You know, I know I'm standing my job and I'm like you who the fuck is that? Let me mind you At that time it was only Jacob had no competition for good. No, it was him to myself I come here on the day at 17 18 years old right across the street from him and we banging back and forth
02:11:06 We going nuts. My mom is in there making sure everything's trick is I'm traveling all over the place. I'm everywhere I don't know land don't hear it there. Let's talk about it. I Get to Atlanta and somebody was like, yo, you gotta go to a there's this fucking crew that's getting stupid money I was like fucking talking at that time Jeezy was just popped off with the whole, he had that song with Akon. Oh, he's a part of that. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So I'm like, all right, cool, whatever.
02:11:30 Let's go down there. I have to take my man, my man Boomer. I don't know if you probably heard of him or not. I know who he is. Okay, there you go. Okay. My man Boomer comes with me from Brooklyn. You know, he's a Brooklyn guy.
02:11:37 You know, everybody, these guys. I don't know. And they know the BMF. Yeah. So I grew up in Star City, by the way. I know. Okay, very good. I put it together. I'm sitting here. So I'm like, all right, let's go down in Star City by the way. I know okay
02:12:05 And we just go There's a lot of jeweler beef. They're just a bunch of pussies and we're going to get into that. He's right. We're going to get into that because, whatever. So I go in there, I feel like this guy because he's his guy in his world. I feel like I'm the guy in my world. I respect that. You know what I'm saying? And you're all the guy. And I'm not with all the instrument.
02:12:20 I'm going to come up and smack the shit out of your ass. Basically. So whatever, we down there, we down there, and I see these guys, they bring me up to their VIPs, yo, bro, bro, their fucking shit is insane. The BMF guys. BMF, yo. They're fucking throwing crazy money everywhere.
02:12:36 Literally crazy money everywhere. All the dudes that are trying to spend some money just embarrass themselves. Like, just go home, bro. Go home. That's real shit. Somebody just comes up, they're like, yo, You know trying to you know spend some money just embarrass themselves like just go home go home That's real shit. Somebody just comes up there like yo You know we my man boom was going around talking letting them know I'm here So somehow a day or two later word gets them and they each
02:13:01 Wanted some crazy shit some literally crazy shit He's like how much Five million All right, tell me some bread like stay a couple days You're lucky hey, bro. I'm going to go home. You're lucky. Hey, bro. Yeah, bro. Seriously, they came, I don't know, with fucking bags. Two of them.
02:13:35 Just the size of this table. A little smaller. I'm talking about right here. For the birds? You're lucky. I called him up. I was like, yo, I was 18, 19. I'm like, yo, what are we doing?
02:13:52 He's like, get the fuck out of there now. You're lucky. Get the fuck out of there now. I wouldn't have even said that on camera. You're lucky. What up? He's been 18 or 19 for a lot of these years, man. I know a lot. It happened in that time frame.
02:14:06 18, 19, 20, it was all in that two years. I had to ask him to go to the bathroom because I had to take a break. And Joe Crack, I love him to death. Yes. Joe Crack told me when we were at Jimmy's Uptown, you remember I'm 57? I love Jimmy's Uptown, yes. He told me, he's like, yo Gabe, if I'm with you or not, you you a motherfucker you gonna make it cuz you got it I see it in you and I was he was the I was the second only jewel he ever fuck with besides Jacob
02:14:32 Mm, he cut me that fucking one check. I mean like seven or eight TS pieces back in the days So Let's make some noise for that So segue I got a pistol Y'all niggas are very interesting. Let me just give you this right so I've been doing you know, I was personal training for 22 years, right? Getting people in shape right talk about it. And then I started designing meal plans for people to stop going to the gym. Oh, I didn't talk to you afterwards. Get off the medication, all that shit.
02:15:09 Fuck the gym. Fuck your trainer. Wait, the meal plan says fuck the gym? You didn't send me that instruction. You definitely didn't send me that. I sent him anything. You sent me the meal plan. You didn't say fuck the gym.
02:15:20 I'm calling, right? So my meal plan that I designed, you can sit home and watch TV and lose weight. Oh, man, I ain't going to talk to you. Right? And I've been selling it on Instagram, right? So, and I'm saying this because, right, a friend of yours told me to tell you what's up. He's down 20 pounds off the meal plan.
02:15:47 And I gave him the meal plan and he sends me these right So he said when you see Myself what's up? Mayor? Mayor sends me a video every morning and he says how many pounds that he he lost off the mail plan. He was great I'm gonna call him tomorrow. I'm like nigga. You're not sneaky at all This nigga listen this is probably the only guest we know that knew Biggie and Tupac. All right,
02:16:31 go take your piss. I got to take my piss. I got to. I'll be right back. This is what I want to know. Tell me heavy D stories. Heavy D? Yeah.
02:16:40 All right, so, I met Hev probably while hanging out at Uptown. Right. He's the first person that ever showed me love. Was he an executive at Uptown ever? Nope.
02:16:53 Because it seemed like he was bringing in all the artists. Nope. Hev was around from the beginning. Right. And he was the first person in Andre's ear. So Andre Harrell was the CEO of Uptown. And he always listened to Hef. Did Hef
02:17:10 help bring Big into the picture? No. I know Puff, but I'm saying Blue Funk was the first time I heard Big like serious. Hef told Andre, you need to hire this kid Puff Daddy. Oh, so he brought Puff into the building. He brought Puff there. Puff did everything else. So everything that came from Puff initially came so he brought Puff into the building He brought Puff there Puff did everything else
02:17:25 So everything that came from Puff Initially came from Hef Right So Whatever Puff had access to Was automatically Given to Hef
02:17:37 Because of who Hef was Right So Hef was like The matriarch Of Uptown MCA. Coolest motherfucker. Everybody loved him. Actors, old people, young people.
02:17:51 He just appealed to everybody. Right. You know, so in Mount Vernon, all of the gangsters, all of the thugs, the young guns, right? They all hung out at Hev's house. They ate food. We worked out, right? And all hung out at Hev's house. They ate food. We worked out, right? And Hev was a mama's boy. So Hev really never left his parents.
02:18:13 He was Jamaican as well. Dwight Myers. So mama's boy is not far from Caribbean. Everybody in Caribbean is a mama's boy. Hev is Jamaican. So Hev never left the nest. So he did over the whole house. And I'm saying that as a Cuban person we Caribbean in the basement was have shit So I used to get up every morning drive from Brooklyn all the way to Mount Vernon and work out with them in the basement
02:18:36 Right. So have had the remember the young guns Okay, so then not to be confused with it. Yeah. Not to be confused with Philly young guns. Yeah, because young Christians out here write everybody wrong. Yeah, no. Not young Christians. Way before that. But in my mind...
02:18:51 Right. I see young Christian Raleigh, I know that doesn't make sense. I don't know. So... I love it. I really do. I love it.
02:19:03 So, Hef was the person in Mount Vernon I love it. I really do. I love it. So, uh, Hev was the person in Mount Vernon that everybody went to for advice. Hev,
02:19:13 he did. Yep, and Hev would tell you what to do, what not to do. Hev put Puffy on. Nigga,
02:19:19 what barrels are you from? You were from every barrel. I went every barrel. If you're a real, if you're a real genius, you go area. No problem. If you're a real G, then you go there. There's no problem. So now, at the time, AZ the Rapper
02:19:31 is calling my house every day. Yo, he got everybody. He was a survivor. Everybody, bro. What you got? No, listen. And you did that on purpose right now. No, I'm not.
02:19:42 No, I'm not. No, listen. I mean, it was good. It was good. But you did it on purpose. You're doing an interview'm not. I'm just telling you. No, I'm not. I mean, it was good. It was good. It was good. But you did it on purpose. You're doing an interview, right? I'm not going to lie to you.
02:19:49 If you come from Brooklyn, you got to know who he is. So, look, right? So, AZ is calling my house every day. Rapping. On the phone. He's rapping to you on the phone. I think he's on the house. I'm on the phone.
02:20:03 Before long before. Before he's not on the phone. He's rapping to you on the phone. I think he's on Nas' album. Before long before. Before he's not on. Yeah, because one of his cousins was living in my neighborhood, so he used to always come and stay summers, right? And that's how I know him. So he's calling my phone every day rapping. I mean rapping to the point I put the phone down, I'm like, yo, I'm like, hello, hello. He's still rapping. And he's still going.
02:20:24 In my mind, he goes to say, bitch, I'm out of the business. I'm like, yo. I'm like, hello, hello. He's still rapping. He's still going. In my mind, he wants to say, I was in the business. You said something serious. He just got himself some lyrics. So, I'm like, listen. I'm in, but I'm not in. I could put you on, but I really can't put you on. But I have an idea.
02:20:53 I call Hev's best friend, Dio. You remember Dio? Yeah. I call Damien Blyden, Hev's right-hand man. You ever seen Hev? You always seen a tall dog skin bald guy with obviously Dawson he was the best okay I call I'm like I got a guy that you need to meet and I'm like he's really good I'm saucing it up right and you're talking about heavy D or who you talk Damien deal
02:21:27 And he's like I I sent him the number He calls AZ invites him to Mount Vernon Pete rock is really not heavy D's blood cousin what What? No. Come on, man. You're ruining us. I'm telling you the truth. Listen, you want to know the truth? I'm going to tell you the truth. I'm trying to tell you the truth.
02:21:51 Come on, man. We grew up on this. You're just fucking up our reality. Hev said that Pete Rock was his cousin because it would make a smooth transition. So if you like Hev, you're going to like his cousin. And he's doing fire beats, right? It's Pete Rock. It's my like him, you're going to like his cousin. And he's doing fire beats. It's Pete Rock. It's my cousin. There you go. So
02:22:09 Pete Rock is doing beats. Santa Claus next? No. So he hooks up with AZ, brings AZ to Pete Rock's basement. Pete Rock is doing tracks for Nas' first album, Illmatic.
02:22:33 So you're not going to tell me Pete Rock introduced Nas to AZ? Damien Dio introduced Pete Rock to AZ. Pete Rock is doing tracks for Nas's first album That's how Nas meets AZ So now now look You know about something that that's the way So now that's how AZ got on Nas's first album Now I see over East New York even Queens bread right wait AZ got on Nas' first album. Now...
02:23:05 Because he moved to East New York, he moved to Queensbridge. Right. So, wait, I'll let him do your story right now. Right, so it makes sense, right? It doesn't make sense. Okay, I'm from Brooklyn, right? Now it makes sense, yes. Cool. So now, I just did the introduction and I backed out of it, right? Today, when
02:23:23 you meet an artist and you're like, wow, I could make a bunch of money from let me sign them. That wasn't my thing. Cool. They meet and then history happens, right? A couple years ago, they do a documentary on AZ. So I said, let me watch it. Was this BT?
02:23:42 So I watched this shit. There's no mention of me. And I'm like, that's not how they met. So I go on social media and I'm like, yo, what kind of bullshit is this? That's not what happened. There wasn't no elaborate. I was a big hustler and he, that's bullshit. So I reach out, tag everybody.
02:24:02 I'm like, yo, what kind of sucky shit is this? Tag everybody. Yeah. And Dio goes, he's what kind of sucky shit is this? Tag everybody. Yeah. And D.O. goes, he's telling the truth. That's the AZ's man. Yeah. That's how we met. Right.
02:24:12 And that's how AZ got on Nas' album. You know? So keep it a hundred. You understand what I'm saying? I don't want no money, but God damn. Listen, I negotiated Busta Rhy rimes solo contract outside of course outside of leaders of the new school when he went solo how are you at buster right now great okay because you negotiated i was negotiating yeah because the thing is when you came into rap back in the days
02:24:42 right it was a lot of people you know a lot of people wasn't getting money you got a deal yeah right that didn't mean you made money and it's crazy my lawyer then is my lawyer now she just texted me right she said get the fuck out of there same lawyer. So Buster Rhymes cousin is on my case. Kid I grew up with. So that's how Buster ended up in Brooklyn. I don't know when you said Buster Rhymes cousin is on your case. I don't know if that means that his cousin. Well, just leave it at that. No, no, no, no, no, no. I'm going to explain. We grew up together. So Buster's parents got a divorce. One went to Long Island, one stayed in Brooklyn. So that's how he's from Long Island, and then his father stayed in Brooklyn.
02:25:33 Right. His father just passed. Got a rest of his soul, right? Yes. So I get a deal. The way my deal was structured, I got paid before the record was made. Baseball contract. I respect that.
02:25:49 Bam. So I drive up, I drive up on Troy and Church where we used to all hang out on the corner, right? In East Flatbush. I got Mary J. Blige with me. And Buster,
02:26:06 Buster, I'm not J. Blige with me. And Busta, Busta. I'm not fucking with this guy. This guy, come out. This guy been frozen the whole. No, no, I'm telling you the shit. Real shit. I know, I hear you, man. Real shit. Real shit.
02:26:18 Real shit. Real shit. Real shit. Real shit. So, I never smoked weed. All right. So, you know, I drive up on the block with Mary. All right.
02:26:36 And you got some guys that Busta grew up with that was hustling on the corner of Troy and Church. Flatbush. Yep. Flatbush. Yep. Respect. And he was a funny motherfucker. So, this is the first time they saw my car. I'm not going to lie.
02:26:48 I think Busta told me this story. I'm not even going to lie. So, Busta, Spliff, right? I grew up with Will. His name is Willie, right? And, yeah, Willie. So, these are, yeah, la, la, la. This is a funny motherfucker.
02:27:03 So, I drive up and it's the first time he's seen me with jury first time he's seen my car and then I got Mary with me so Busta is like stuck and Mary's already married first single which is the first single
02:27:20 at that time which is already popping it's popping. So she gets out the car and she's in the bus stop with them. She don't know what's going on. This is Flatbush. Yeah. She don't know what's going on.
02:27:35 And, you know, I get out the car and we're talking. Buster pulls me to the side. He's like, yo, how the fuck you got all of this? I got videos on TV. I have none of this. And I'm like, well, it depends fuck you got all of this? I got videos on TV. I have none of this. And I'm like, well, it depends on how your deal is structured. I said, I don't know what's going on with you, but I'll be back tomorrow. We'll sit down and just be transparent and tell me everything that's going on and I'll fix your shit.
02:28:01 Next day, I pull up. We sit in the car and I'm like, all right, cool. I'm going to link you with this attorney. I call her. She just texted me. I called Denise Brown. I'm like, listen, Buster Rounds, a childhood friend of mine, he's on Electra. I need you to fix his shit. And he's going solo. This is what he's going to do this in the school. Right, so he's beefing with Charlie Brown at the time.
02:28:28 Right. And they're having a lot of internal turmoil, right? Yep. But he's the guy, so this is why he was plucked for the Scenario remix and all these...
02:28:38 Was Leaders on Electro at the time? Yes. Yeah, yeah. So he was just going to go solo on Electro itself. So at the time yes, yeah, so he was just So at the time Fuck how many things we drop in this motherfucker? Yeah, so hooked up with Denise Brown
02:29:00 He was a friend of Sylvia wrong who spearheaded Electra. Hmm Negotiated his solo deal gave him a solo contract, gave him a bag. He bought his first car. And that's how he... I feel like it was a pathfinder. No, it was a forerunner. Same shit. Turned around, bust up?
02:29:15 Yep. And that's how he went solo and got on his way. About busting. Right, so... You got a story? Between him and AZ and stuff like that,
02:29:24 I've always been integral behind the scenes. If my man, and I know you said listen, let me tell you something This is a real nigga right here Must have he stepped up. I was trying to do something he stepped up. He just did it without any Equivocations he though he don't care that he's a good nigga. I want to... The nigga just stepped up and he just was there. And then told me, like, I'll be in the back, Lord. That's true about Boston. Here's the thing.
02:29:59 Wait, time out, time out, time out. Sorry, not to interject. Here's the thing, right? Yes, please. If you are going to give somebody something, and this is for everybody in the room, be a cheerful giver. Right. What if they take it from you? Listen.
02:30:13 That's not giving. If you're giving something, no one can take anything from you. You're not giving anything, but they come and take it. Listen. Act like they did something. Listen, hear what I'm saying. Hear what I'm saying. If you're a cheerful giver, you give from your heart. And you're not worried about what's coming back because there's no string on it. Right.
02:30:32 And if I give it to you, it's yours. Right. And whether or not you accept it, give it back, return the favor, that's on you. It's all for me. I gave you. And it came from a good place. And I'm good. And God will deal with you later whether you were right or wrong and that's just what it is
02:30:57 you could say many things many things have been, but up until this point, I've been blessed, I have no problems, I'm cool. I'll be 50 on Saturday. Yeah. Come on, come on. Looking like 35 years old, by the way. You know what I'm saying? So my thing is, we didn't grow up from the sandbox. We met on the fucking phone.
02:31:24 Yep. And we connected and we've been great ever since this because that's what it is but I'm gonna be honest I'm the honest I mean I just because I want to pick him up because I know he's like a humble guy but when I would went to the to the back to the scene Jay the same show I sent you at And I seen them. He's like you Look He look and I was the oh shit, I'm not a Brooklyn nigga make it the fuck I See but that's but see the thing y'all actually seen each other.
02:32:06 And then you seen each other- Right, right. And I didn't know you were there. I was there. So when you see me after, you know? Right, so when I got to the section, see you guys gotta understand, right, for me, Like Jay- I haven't been around in 22 years. Hold on, hold on, hold on, hold on, tell me more. I wanna describe this situation.
02:32:22 Like Jay-Z really wanted to see this Nick No, there's this serious. I'm out there and Jake we hit each other. I hit him all the time like I saw but He really wanted to go back to his Brooklyn roots and be with this Nick Like I kid you not kid you know, you know what I used to always say? And I'll tell you this, right? I used to always tell Jay, so you hear about 500 State Street. We used to be there every evening
02:32:51 before we'd go hang out. So when Clark introduced Dame to Jay, we would gather all the Brooklyn guys, and then we'd go to the city, and Dame have all his out-town guys, and we would meet in Midtown and party. And I used to always tell Jay Jay you are the best rapper that nobody has ever heard of as of yet so one day he calls me wakes me up out my sleep I'm like what up he's like I woke you and I'll call you back I said
02:33:20 nah I'm up what's up he said yo man do you have any uh connections with radio, I'm up. What's up? He said, yo, man, do you have any connections with radio? Because I'm waiting for Dame to get me a meeting and I haven't heard anything. It's been two weeks. I said, well, yeah, I'm on regular rotation with Don Perrion at the time of Hot 97. What you need? He said, yo, I would like a meeting. I said, all right, cool. But you have to drive. By the time you get to my house from Marcy, I'll be dressed. But you drive and I'll bring you up there. Him, B-Hot, and I want to say Bleak, drove that white GS to my house, picked me up. We went to Hot 97. We walked in. I never went there and asked anybody to play my record. Ever. I've never asked a DJ to do anything for me.
02:34:13 Never. I didn't care about that. I just wanted the money. Like, fuck all that other shit. Give me the check. So we get there. The program director was Tracy Clardy. Remember her?
02:34:24 Of course I do. White girl. Exactly. So you know where she's at director was Tracy Clardy. Remember her? Of course I do. White girl. Exactly. So you know where she's at now? I have no idea. She's running Viacom and BET. Fucking phenomenal. And all that cypher shit, that's her.
02:34:34 I love her. I love her. Cool. The cypher on BET Awards. And this white lady, chain-smoking lunatic, but cool as a motherfucker. If she stamp it, it's done. She created all that cypher shit for BET all their ward shows right I was like that walk in her office I'm like Tracy I've never been here I never I was messing with one of her friends at the time I said I never been here and asked you for
02:35:02 anything I said but this guy he's the one he took him off jay I said you gotta play his record and they got a bag for you take the bag the following two days later my birthday is funny he's saying he has a bag for the radio Tracy. If need be, let me say that, right? As a disclaimer. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Okay? So Tracy's sitting there, and she didn't say anything. She's like, damn, you've never even asked me for anything for you.
02:35:36 He must be somebody important. Two days later, it was my birthday, we was in the Palladium. I can't find the picture. Me, Biggs, Dane, Jay, and everybody they fucked with, and Tracy, right? So Jay is like, yo, what can I do for you? I'm like, nothing, get me a bottle of Cristal. I don't know, it was my birthday.
02:35:57 Going to a bottle of Cristal, where they at, getting drunk. Cool. Three days later, presidents that represent me, regular rotation. Wow. Prior to that, it was Battle of the Beats. Remember Battle of the Beats? Put Hickey's in my little song.
02:36:18 Right, so that's how Jay initially got on the radio. But let's be clear, because I so respect you telling us that Jay started. But let's be clear. The person that said your name first. Biggie. Biggie. Oh, let me tell you why. There was a reason.
02:36:37 Let's go. Let's go there. You're talking about Party and Bullshit. Party and Bullshit. And that was his first record. Yeah. Right? So there was a lady
02:36:47 that worked for Uptown MCA. She did styling. And she worked right next to Puff. Her name was Sybil Pinnock. She dressed everybody on Uptown MCA. Uptown MCA
02:36:59 was like an incubator. And everybody was probably from Harlem or the Bronx and then there was me and then the Lost Boys from Queens right so kind of rob everybody come on man you know the robbery nigga you've been robbing people the whole episode. In my mind. In my mind, I'm sorry. So now, one day, Sybil goes,
02:37:28 we're in the office hanging out. And this is what you did at Uptown MCA. You just hung out there every day, you listened to music, you picked beats, the studio was next door, and we, the budgets were open, and this is all we did. So, Sybil goes to me and Biggie, there's a movie I want you guys to read for. We're going to take a cab down to this casting thing, right? I never did that shit. Biggie was on
02:37:58 Uptown. So this is before Puff lost his deal there and did Arista and Bad Boy. There was no Bad Boy. Biggie was on Uptown, okay? This was before? Yes. You did the verse on Supercats joint? Well, no. Around the same time. Right, same time. Right.
02:38:13 So now, we all jump in a cab. Me, Biggie, and Sybil. We went to this office on Broadway between Houston and whatever. Bleecker. went in this place they gave us a script I don't know about read so I'm looking down reading this shit they said all right thank you then big went in did the same thing came out he I've never heard of hip hop before. No, no, no, no. He's enjoying this shit, right? So now, that night, I'm in the studio with Hev.
02:38:56 Hev is doing So For Real. I forgot. So For Real is this shit. So I'm telling Hev, yo, Sybil bought me the read for this movie. So Hev is like, word? All right. So what, you think you got the part? I'm like, nah, it was Sybil bought me the read for this movie. So Hev is like, word? All right. So Hev, you think you got the part? I'm like, nah, it was terrible.
02:39:08 Right? Who's the man? Nope. So I'm like, man, fuck that script, right? Months later, the movie comes out. Hev has the part that we read for. What is it? This was New Jersey Drive
02:39:38 So now yeah, I was terrible so the reason why big did Party and bullshit And mentioned me But he's in That little show Puffy bought him To the muse This is way before you I was in the muse You was in the muse I was in the muse The young bad motherfucker
02:39:52 Right He didn't even have A business doing outside Right He's outside Definitely in the muse Good So it's on Canal
02:39:59 In West Broadway Yeah And I got like 96 guys with me And we're in there And I'm getting ready to go on stage. You got like 96 guys with you? About 96.
02:40:08 Jesus Christ. Which means he has 117. That's crazy. So Puff comes to me. He's like, yo, I'm thinking about signing this guy. I want to see how he does. Talking about big. Yep.
02:40:20 I want to see how he does in front of a crowd. Do you mind? Stop. Stop. Please. Because what you're saying It's not for you to see like I wanted to stop you because what you just said was great Now sit continue. So now I'm actually on stage waiting for them to cue the dat.
02:40:45 The dat tape. And nobody knows what dat plays on. Yeah, we all know. Well, not everybody. The dat, right? The digital dat tape. And I'm like, Puff, anything for you. He introduces me to Big, who was Biggie Smalls at the time. Wait, isn't that your nigga from Brooklyn?
02:41:01 Yeah. It's your homie from Brooklyn. I don't know him yet. You don't know him? He got an orange champion sweatshirt on, some camouflage pants, right? Your nigga from Brooklyn? Yeah. It's the homie from Brooklyn. I don't know him yet. You don't know him? He got an orange champion sweatshirt on, some camouflage pants, right? Yeah.
02:41:11 And I meet him. Hug him. I'm like, so he's like, he's from Brooklyn. I'm like, oh, what? Even better. He gets on stage. He freestyles to Bismarck-y doo-doo rap instrumental. Kills it. Crazy.
02:41:22 Right? After that, he did Party and did party and and mentioned me in the record that was a thank you and we've been like this until he died what's one of the most craziest people that just walked into your fucking shit and just bought some jewelry Probably Boston Buster great guy though. He just walked in he's boy Jerry he was Yeah, just like that because I think I was doing stuff for Swizz,
02:42:05 and they were tight over there, so. That's a Dior shirt you got on? I ain't got a lot. You got months. Is this see-through? I don't know what your see-through shit is. You got your see-through shit on? Look, no, it's Jamaican shit.
02:42:16 It's Jamaican. What's up? What's up? What's up? Got some blood clots. Got some blood clots. Got some yacht shit on. We got some yacht shit on.
02:42:24 No, Busta was very, he's very, you all outside. My shit ready. By the way, let me bring up the Busta Rhymes. Busta's, I had issues also, and like you said, Busta's very, he does things on some, this is my bro. His own time. Yeah, no, no, no, there was, there was issues with, you know, certain people, a certain person, I'm sorry. And, you know, he found out and he comes to the office, he's like, what the fuck? I'm like, yeah, that's your man, bro.
02:42:54 He was like, right there. Thanks so much for that. What was the next call for? He calls, he calls the guy right there and say, yo, bro. He's like, yo, bro, what are you doing, bro? This is family, bro. What are you doing, bro? It's family, bro. What are you doing over here, bro? Where my man go?
02:43:07 He left. Dude that was sitting here, the new Chuck. He ain't even been on the flights. He been up since Tuesday. He ain't say goodbye. God damn. He balance. He ain't even here, bro.
02:43:17 He ain't even here. You talking about a driver? Yeah. Your driver? I got a fake driver. You got to make sure we out, young man. Keep this message out. Fake fake driver But the thing is And my point
02:43:28 Right There's a lot of people That have pulled strings And made things happen And you'll never hear from them Absolutely yeah Right so Like when you're talking about
02:43:39 Dame Dame At a point In my life Did a lot for me. I love the guy. He's probably the new Dame right now. I haven't been in touch with him in a long time. We fell out some years ago.
02:43:56 You should call him. But the thing is, Dame has some family members from the other side. And all you know is him because he's loud. But you know Darren Chandler, Darren's brother Bubby, Homicide from the Bronx. Like, Dame got some real family members. Can't forget about the Chief. Can't forget about the Chief.
02:44:19 How you know about the Chief? You from the Bronx. I don't know. Okay. Matter of fact, let me give you the Chief. Let me give you the Chief. that's funny you said that's crazy so now here's the chief the chief is Darren's father so in every family Darren Dash the cousin the cousin right The cousin. The cousin. Right. Okay. So Darren Chandler, he is probably the most important person behind Dane that you'll never know. And you will never see who he is. You won't speak.
02:44:54 He's in the cannabis business now, right? Making a bunch of bread. He knows who he is. Yeah, that's what I think. Right? This guy's father was that guy for the family right so when Dames mother passed the patriarch matriarch matriarch ages with his mother no no when he say Dave so when when Dames mother passed I don't know spot the chief took them in his home. When anybody else in the family had
02:45:33 kids that needed shelter, the chief took them in as Darren's father. Dane is Ivy League dame is ivy league educated dame reads a book a day dame grew up playing lacrosse dame is that guy he's not a street guy harlem is the only connection to the street he has ever had because of where he lived but out of that house came darian dash who went into technology. You remember Darien? My nigga. My nigga. Stacey Dash, who's Darien's brother, who went on to acting to Hollywood. Right?
02:46:14 Used to be my shorty. And then Dan. Used to be your shorty? Darien Dash is my guy. And then Dan. But all because of Darien's father. The chief. He's the one that took everybody out of that family that needed help. He helped everybody.
02:46:31 It's funny, he says the chief. That's crazy. Nobody's ever going to say that. I swear everything he said. Nobody in this room is going to say the chief. But that's what it is. So when you see Dame, like Dame is loud and he's obnoxious he's this he's that he's super smart he means well intelligent he'll give you the shirt off his back
02:46:53 but his delivery is fucked up it rubs people the wrong way great guy i can't take nothing from him great motherfucker you know what I mean? But his delivery rubs people the wrong way. But his family, bro. Even Dame. Dame is the one that took me to the boxing gym and said, yo, anybody around me has to know how to fight.
02:47:18 So everybody under Rockefeller's umbrella that ever boxed is because of Dame. Dame been boxed since he was seven. So you run up on Dame the wrong way. He's an anti-violent person. But you put your hands up, Dame going to knock you the fuck out. I'm just telling you, that's just what it is.
02:47:34 Right? We had an issue one time with Dame. At that time, Jacob was doing the Rockefeller pieces. Yeah. Who was doing the Rockefeller? Jacob at that time. Yeah. At that time, I think Cam just signed, I think to Rockefeller and they made us do it.
02:47:51 You know, they made my family. You started making the rock piece. I do what we do. It's on the internet. I think I got a piece and I never get a piece. He comes in there, he's fucking loud as he's like... Who? Dane. He comes in and he He's fucking loud as... He's like... Who?
02:48:06 Dane. He comes in and says, Yo, it's my cousin. I mean, yo. Tell me who the fuck made this. Tell me who told you to make this. He's just like pressing him. It's on YouTube.
02:48:15 You can see he's fucking... I'm sitting there scrolling a little cute. Like, oh. With my hat on. It was fucking... And he's... He's like that.
02:48:23 He's very... He's very smart. He's very he's very smart. He's very fucking smart. The thing is, I watch how everything unfolded and people have to move on and grow and you'll never know what their plight is.
02:48:37 Alright. I'm going to cut you off. I'm sorry. The whole thing about I'm sorry to cut you off. No problem. The whole thing about he's saying just now you've got to cut him off and move on and this and that. The whole situation with that other guy that you mentioned, to me, you know, I was very, very, I took it to the heart. You know, because my brother passed away. He called me. He said, yo, I'm here for you.
02:48:59 You understand? When somebody dies like that to you, and then you're supposed to be right there because you're always with us. We took you in, bring you everywhere, and introduce you to fucking as, you know, one of us. Because you wasn't one of us. We made you one of us. You understand? So it's... That shirt is a lot of money. That shirt, listen, that shirt costs a lot of money.
02:49:20 No, no. I mean, there's a check. I'm just saying. It's a few dollars. You know why? Because I was looking for an outfit to wear to see you, right? I'm going out.
02:49:28 I got to look right, right? And I went on the Dior site. I'm like, I'm not spending that much money for that shit. This motherfucker comes through with a see-through Jamaican Dior shirt, right? Let me tell you something. Yo, I know how hard that was, right? That's a Jamaican shirt.
02:49:40 That's a Jamaican shirt. I swear to God. That's a Jamaican shirt. I was 12. Listen, you have a Jamaican Dior shirt. I grew up in Brooklyn, bro. I grew up in Brooklyn, my God. It's a Jamaican Dior shirt.
02:49:52 How much is this Dior shirt? I don't know, like 800. No, that's not 800. I don't know, something like that. That is not an 800. Yeah, I got it this time. Listen, Tom, this is a fucking $3,000 shirt. No, it's not, bro.
02:50:02 Definitely not. Well, I feel like you're right. I'm going to turn my back on you. No, no, no. I feel like you're right. I feel like you're right. That's a $3,000. No, it's not, bro. Definitely not. Well, I feel like you're right. I'm going to turn my back on him. No, no, no. I feel like you're right. I feel like you're right. That's a $3,000 Dior shirt all day. No, stop. This whole Jamaican stuff, it happened.
02:50:11 I was 12 years old. A woman comes into the mall holding a baby, and she has the Jamaican, you know, those shirts? They're called Nick Ganzis. Nick Ganzis. She was wearing, she was holding the baby. Her nipples are sticking out like fucking bullets, and I'm like I'm 12 My dad comes out of nowhere. It's me the back of the head. What the fuck are you doing? I'm like, I'm just doing
02:50:34 They were wearing that shit just like that in the back. Yeah, but not to interject It's $3,000 no status a hundred. It's not $920 I promise I can go And then back to what I was saying. Okay. What he was saying is absolutely right, and I learned to, you know what, let it go. You did your, you understand, because you know what I mean? It was just funny how, you understand, guys just come into your life, and they just slither their way into, you know, where they are. And when they're on. Slither their way into who you are.
02:51:11 Into who people think they are. Into who they think they are. You understand what I'm saying? And literally on, you understand, some other shows and talking about people are asking them like, yo, how'd you get on? You know? You're talking about real estate. Yo, so I just want to say, sorry, Sean. I just want to say that you're right about that.
02:51:28 You put good out there, and God, you'll get it right back. Noreed runs five miles on the sand every morning. Do you know what running five miles is? Listen. Listen. Five miles is, listen, listen, five miles is, listen, this motherfucker runs five miles every day on the sand. When you have a boxer, you train the boxer, you bring him on the sand because it makes your feet heavy. So when you get in the ring, your feet are light from running on the sand.
02:52:01 Look, he's just going to agree with me, right? So we connected on the phone and I'm listening to him. I ran five miles once with Dane by accident. And I got on the phone with him and he's like, oh no, I run five miles every morning
02:52:24 on the sand. I live in Miami. I'm like When I was following a lot of people and I stopped following people you Started running and you're posting the shit on your stories and stuff. I swear I used to smoke cigarettes Because of your smoking cigarettes because of your whole thing over there you're running i stopped i swear i don't smoke cigarettes i swear i stopped that's not true listen i did not get the jewel from you but i had a blue point cigarette you ever see my i saw you I know you always master smoking you know what a cigarette going outside the store smoking like
02:53:08 crazy coming back in you know five minutes later I need to go smoke again you know the thing is crazy with you and I we connected on the phone are you my little like on that side right and so sorry you know in case niggas don't know no if you don't know you don't and they don't know. They see you, but they don't see me. Ever. So after this interview, I'm going back in my hole. Going back in my bunker.
02:53:34 Now please, say everything you need to say. You have to. Because, I'll be honest. I'll be honest. Twitter's my most negative conversation, right? So when I go to Instagram and I say, I got such and such, so when I say,
02:53:53 yo, I got Lil Sean here, right? I say, yo, I got Lil Sean tomorrow. Anybody say, it's that nigga that robbed Tupac. I can't with this fucking nigga. Yo. You know you my brother. I'm not trying to give you anything, but that's exactly what they said. He just made that record very clear.
02:54:20 I want you to tell these niggas, no. You know, look. For me, right? Yes. Even doing Behind the Smoke, right? And my guys know. That's your own shit. I've never done anything.
02:54:36 Yes. Nothing. I didn't come home. I didn't get back to music. I didn't find an artist. I didn't produce. I didn't write for nobody. I just was done with the music industry. I't go to puff parties I'm doing that shit
02:54:49 I go to puff parties sometimes nobody sees me well you can't nobody gives me shit I don't know there you go right well you on the phone they did invite me so for me I wasn't interested in none of those things. But definitely not. You already know. I don't know. What do you think? What do you think?
02:55:14 I don't think anything. But what do you think? Do you think I would stick up somebody for their jury? No, I don't think that. There you go. That's because I know you. But see, here's the thing. You're talking about people that you're corresponding with that don't know you.
02:55:31 They don't know me. But I'm not asking for me. No, no, listen. I'm asking for the people. But here's the thing. The audience. They're going by what they think. I don't care what a motherfucker think. If a motherfucker got a problem with me and he felt froggy he got late, but I'm a pop his top, but you definitely didn't rock you already know
02:55:52 But you know I know I know for me. I know I did it you told him no no I did it myself But what do you what do you? Do you think no I What do you what do you think I'm one man percent knowing you as a brother did you think? What do you think? No, I want me to say. What do you think? I want me to say, knowing you as a brother, I know that you hate me. So for me, you know, you hear, listen, you hear Nori constantly mentioning this, right?
02:56:20 I love who you are. Listen, imagine that. I didn't know who you were back then. Imagine that. Your waves are spinning now. You see this shit? I'm working. I don't know who you were back then.
02:56:33 I'm going to be honest. But imagine that happening in the federal system. See, when you in jail and that's coming at you. Right. See, a lot of guys go to jail and they become Muslim for protection. I'm a Christian. I feel like we should fix it up.
02:56:55 Right? So, if there's anyone that was in jail with me from 98 to 2003, they only going to tell you one of two things. And you can ask Emery. Bang. I came home on a Tuesday. I had a fight Saturday night.
02:57:16 I fought to the door. It's just who I am. We don't need to fight no more. No, but I'm just saying, hey, listen, I don't, but I will. It don't matter. But I'm just saying, hey, listen, I don't, but I will. Push comes to shove. It don't matter. But I'm just saying.
02:57:29 It is what it is. That thing has followed me and has plagued me forever, all day, forever. That's the reason why I wanted you to just clarify it. Listen, bro, let me tell you something, champ. You see me? Me? This is the first interview I've ever done in my life. He my friend of you did it for me Well, no, no, I can't say that. Okay. No hell no
02:57:56 him initially Whoa, come on. Give mederon. You know why? Because while I know you, we're not in touch. Me and him? Every other day. On Instagram. Once he told me he said, it's my neighbor.
02:58:22 See, the dynamic between you two, I don't know him. Never heard of him. I don't even know how you two got together. I don't want to know. Cool.
02:58:32 Who gives a fuck? But, Dream gives me a joke. It's like a joke. I see the show and I see him on camera and I'm like, okay,
02:58:41 who is this guy? And I look into his past and I'm like, okay, and I look into his past and I'm like good motherfucker and then we connect to DM I Know you we're good. I don't have to work on that right this and then I let him know It's my guy. Yeah, he already knew though. He knows you know, so this motherfucker is so important to this platform
02:59:17 Solid see we used to Industry see the industry is not about us anymore. It's about us now because of your Reinvention and when a motherfucker comes on this they don't even know Capone and Noriega They don't know about the snipes that was all my guy my life. Oh my god shit, right? Warning posters and all that kind of shit. They don't know that when they sit down with you. They just know drink champs Nori right. They don't know nori so when you ever hear any kind of street shit connected to nori you're like the same nori because i'm happy because he's happy yeah right but i must say there was a time when he did the moonwalk, you know what I'm talking about?
03:00:05 Yo, listen, I'm on the internet. I see everything. It's what I do every morning, right? So now I'm selling these meal plans. I can't even move out the house until I fulfill these orders. They're coming in. And I get on one day, and I see somebody pissed him off. And he did a video he said what what got me
03:00:30 fucked up pull up you got me all the way fucked up you're a chick I'm not fucking with you go get some niggas because this is who I really am and I said I said you know what I respect who he is now I love the reinvention. I love what he's doing. But I really embrace this. Because it still exists. I fell in love. Listen, I loved you more.
03:00:53 Thank you. When I saw. Thank you. Yeah, because that side came out. And I sat there and I watched that shit three times. And I said, this motherfucker fucks with this dude. Because this is what I'm doing. but don't get it fucked up. You got the mix you wasn't even born yet, right? This is why I am and I can revisit Yo, you came out of character.
03:01:26 You know that, right? I didn't want to. How many phone calls did you get? I got, you know what? I'm going to be honest. I got so many phone calls, but the one phone call that meant the world to me was my brother Deuce Deuce. And when Deuce called me and said, don't you ever sit by yourself. Because I was like.
03:01:43 He said, I'm by myself. I'm built up. Yeah, yeah. Don't worry about it. You got fucked I was like he said I'm by myself Yeah, don't worry about my father my brother James do said we never do that go for us Listen and be honest cuz cuz I was So you don't spaz. I was so stoked right you haven't been that person I never was that I wasn't that person but no no no You used to be that so he called me and he said he said I don't know who the fuck you think you are But if you think you by yourself you're not Bro, listen to me and God bless that moment
03:02:25 on God bless those I respect him who? who? the nigga out there smoking cigarettes listen you know and and it's okay it's you human It's okay. Yes. It's a human. It's okay. I know we know there No, but we know you didn't want to do that But at a point and you tried to deflect and you ignored and it wouldn't work and it got heavy And you're doing you're in the media space, right? So you gotta protect your brain, right?
03:03:00 He said what got me all the stuff we gonna stop this shit now and it stopped as soon as you did that There's a motherfucker say, you know what? I might not want that problem. I don't think they want this problem. I know they don't want this problem I'm Tony. You see Tony dress you see for me. It's Tony. This is my favorite graduate. Queens? No, Brooklyn. Tony Drexler. Where? What part? Crown Heights. Crown Heights, where?
03:03:29 Franklin, Los Angeles, San Diego, Calgary, and CrossFit. All right, stop. How old are you? Two years younger than me. We know each other and we don't know each other. Damn. But we know each other. And that's our brother.
03:03:37 We're brothers. We're brothers. We're brothers. We're brothers. We're brothers. We're brothers. We're brothers. We're brothers. We're brothers. We're brothers. We're don't know each other.
03:03:47 But we know each other. And that's how Brooklyn is. That's how Brooklyn is. I'll tell you a funny story, right? I'm at the Wells Fargo Arena in Philadelphia. And I'm with Charlie Mack. From Philadelphia. Yup. Charlie Mack is real special right here. Shout out to Charlie Mack. From Philadelphia. Yep.
03:04:07 Charlie Mack is real serious right here. Yeah, he was on Drink Chats. He was on Drink Chats. With Tony... Tony Ayo, MMO. Let's go. Somebody who has coffee. Tony Rock. Tony Rock.
03:04:17 So, Charlie Mack is on my right. The stage is right there. We're backstage. We can see who's performing. It was a Meek Mills concert. Meek Mills and Friends. A couple years ago, right? In Philadelphia. He's standing right here with his security. His brother, Paul Kane. I know his brother. He sees me. We speak, embrace, cool.
03:04:56 Charlie is sitting there waiting for me to speak to Fab. I don't know Fab. We never formally been introduced. Charlie from Philadelphia, he doesn't understand that. He's in Brooklyn. And we think everybody from Brooklyn knows each other. Not true. That's like kind of racist.
03:05:11 It is. It's geographical. Geographical racist? Same thing goes in jail. It's geographical, right? Good. And he's like, yo, you don't see Fab right there?
03:05:21 I'm like, yeah. I don't know him. He's like, how you don't know Fab? I'm like, he's younger than yeah, I don't know him. He's like, how you don't know Fab? I'm like, he's younger than me. I don't know him. I know who he is. I don't know him personally. So Charlie goes to Fab,
03:05:34 yo, you don't know little Sean? And super innocent. I would have stopped him had I seen him doing that. And he said, Fab said, of course I know who he is. We haven't been introduced. Right? That's the fear.
03:05:54 Charlie said, let a Philly guy introduce two Brooklyn guys. Introduce me and Fab. That's dope. And we met. And I had to explain to Charlie, Brooklyn is different. Leave Fab alone. No, Fab's dope. And we met. And I had to explain to Charlie, Brooklyn is different. Leave Fab alone. No, Fab's great. In my mind, Fab needs to raise a little up.
03:06:10 No, no, no, no, no, no, no, listen. I wanna know what happened this month. So, I had to tell Charlie, in Brooklyn, if there isn't a problem, there will never be a problem. That's hard. It's hard. It is. There will never be a problem. That's all In Brooklyn We want to knock off the next nigga
03:06:36 Queens Embraces their old jeans in Brooklyn. We don't We want to knock them down. Yeah. Y'all some fat ass motherfuckers. We don't respect where we came from in Brooklyn, culturally. Queens honors the person that came before them, which is why you still have respect for wise. Supreme from the Supreme Team, my guy. All of these old school guys.
03:07:03 Queens, they want to party and get money. Harlem parties and gets money. Queens, we tear people apart. Brooklyn, we tear people apart. Right, Brooklyn. Right? Look, in the Bronx, I had to tell them too.
03:07:16 In the Bronx, in my opinion, they do too. They do like, big people, in my opinion. Big people up or big them apart? No, big them up. Like, Big people love it. Break them apart. No, big them up. Like, like I'm being honest. But you have respect for your OGs in Queens and that's why he's sitting there.
03:07:31 And he's not even from Queens. No. He's from Brooklyn. Hold on. Queens, Brooklyn, Bronx, they all,
03:07:39 they all. But you from Queens. Yes. And I love you. So I know Ron, Archie, all these guys, all of Wise's babies. My, and I love you. So I know Ron, Archie, all these guys, all of Wise's babies.
03:07:48 My, my. I know all of them. And you. I'm their baby brother. Exactly. And you know what? I appreciate being their baby brother. How about that?
03:07:58 Come on. Like, there's so many people that, like, they'll be like, oh, sure, I don't know. I want to be your baby brother. Like, I appreciate that. You see, when you're finished with whatever it is you're doing, which is your journey in life,
03:08:15 all you people in this room, everybody here, right? You're only as good as your journey. Wow. And whether you help people or you pull people down, you're going to be a product of whatever you produced. And for me, if we were cool at one time and we're not now, I don't really have anything disparaging to say about you. No animosity?
03:08:44 No. But you're the only guy that I know that knows Tupac and Biggie. How did you meet Tupac? I met Tupac haphazardly. What? Haphazardly. Like it shouldn't have happened. Yeah.
03:09:03 By accident. All right, let's talk about that. I wasn't brought somewhere to be introduced to him. I was someplace he was already. He's already in Coyote. And we met. We met.
03:09:20 He was in Wynwood? It wasn't no elaborate. This is Lil Sean. Because in my mind, like you say, in my He was in Wynwood? At Art Pass? It wasn't no... It wasn't no elaborate... This is Lil Sean and you got... Because in my mind, like you say, in my mind... I was a gangster. Not in your mind, buddy. For the cameras, no.
03:09:37 It's true. For the cameras, I was a rapper. Right. But Pac had to realize that, though. No. He had no idea who I was The dude never knew who I was he didn't know you had a rapper or a street, dude. Nothing You told me didn't know who I was a brand new day
03:09:59 I see you you know who I was because I don't know what your local you was you're not from L.A., you don't know who Richie Rich is in Oakland. But Oakland knows who Richie Rich is. Richie Rich was that guy. He was the first T-40. I mean, I think it's different, man, because I'm in Miami. I know who Richie Rich was in Oakland. But you're from Miami. We from New York.
03:10:23 So you say you guys were just not wanting to know what the fuck everybody else Well, no, I'm saying what he said. Well pop Is I could see that I could see I could not get it, but I think pop was a student of the game I felt like he wouldn't know you listen, but I hadn't gone Yeah, I feel like he was no man listen there are people that didn't know to this day That Nori was with it was Capone and Noriega You know many people don't know that I respect that yo listen I'm here to argue the other day me and me and me and may have argued the other day
03:11:00 He's like people know I'm like no, you know And you just argue with what you know, it's true. It's not common knowledge He's like your father was known like nah. I got people Give you something better I forget what it was. But the last thing that it was there was like yo Nori's up there. But what they was saying was, Nori. Makes tacos.
03:11:34 I make tacos by myself. They said, yo. Even better. Even better for him. And I know this is a show I'm not trying to tell you. No, you run it. But he's doing drink champs, right? A lot of people are not on the internet.
03:11:52 So there are a select few of people that don't know what drink champs is. Absolutely. Okay, sir. But the people that know, know. And then when you tell somebody, you're like, oh shit. I put them on to drink champs. And once they're on, they start going to past episodes. Right, right. They binge watch it.
03:12:12 But now, he came in the game as Capone and Noriega. Right. Then he went solo. In a way. We blame him for reggaeton. And then your niggas lobbed me for that shit, man. Right? Now you're lobbing me.
03:12:30 I always liked it. But he don't like it. Reggaeton. Reggaeton. And I'm saying it. I pronounce it correctly. You did pronounce it pretty damn good. Because people think I'm Dominican.
03:12:41 I'm not. Reggaeton, right? But... After Reggaeton, right? But... After... Reggaeton... Yo, you are Cuban! He's a Cuban, right? And then he does... Drink Champs.
03:12:56 There are some people that only know Capone and Noriega. What, what, what? Nah, it's a fact. And then there are only people that know Daddy Yankee reggaeton No Drink chips right now you're dealing with three different people. He's right And when you can saw it you would go bullshit. I didn't know you were
03:13:20 I'm selling meal plans on Instagram I didn't know you were the one that did. And then they'll come back. After this, they'll know you're the one that robbed them. Oh, my God. Did she say you robbed DuBois? No, no, no, no. Why did they say that?
03:13:36 And then they'll come back. We never negotiated. Negotiated. Did you rob DuBois? We're three hours into this. He didn't do it, man. Sean, Sean, Sean. Sean, don't tell him to bring the stuff to me. We gotta take a picture and we gotta get out.
03:13:48 No, I'm gonna be honest. Listen, I'm gonna be honest. Listen. Because your name is synonymous. No, it's not. Oh, matter of fact, holy shit, it's Tupac's. I'll do one better. With the robbery of Tupac.
03:13:56 So I come home from jail, right? I get a phone call. And they're like, you know, I'm doing a Biggie movie. I'm like, what? I'm like, what? I'm like, what? I'm like, what? I'm like, what?
03:14:04 I'm like, what? I'm like, what? I'm like, what? I'm like, what? I from jail, right? I get a phone call. And they're like, you know, I'm doing a Biggie movie. Does the security guard call you? Nope. From Coyo? Nope. No, he said call you. See, you keep hearing Spanish.
03:14:19 From Coyo, right? No, it's Coyo. Good, good, good. So he's like, we're shooting on X, Y, Z, come meet us here tomorrow, I wanna show you some shit. So I go to the set, and he's like, out of respect, we wanna make sure you're okay with this. If you're not, it's out. This is the notorious movie.
03:14:41 And it's about you, this scene. It's your scene, where you this scene. Yes, see When you rock too much Jesus But I didn't say that I said that a lot moments you declare that before That's not me. No, you know what? Let's take a picture and look Definitely didn't rob to go Listen me robbing pockets like me robbing you know what I he didn't rob Tupac. Listen, me robbing pockets like me robbing you. No. Would I? He didn't rob Tupac, bro. You definitely didn't rob me. Would I?
03:15:10 You definitely didn't rob me. What would you think? Would you think I would rob you? I don't think you would rob me, but I'm gonna be honest. I'm not from Oakland. Doesn't matter. From Oakland? What do you think? I don't think you would rob me, but I think you would rob Tupac. I'm just throwing it out there. You think I would?
03:15:25 I think you would. You think so I think you would rob Tupac. I'm just throwing it at you. Because he's from Oakland? You think I would? I think you would. You think so? A little bit. A little bit. What would make you think that I would? Yo, man, we can't have psychiatric treatment right now, bro. What would make you think I would?
03:15:35 Your fade. Your fade. My fade? He's in the waves. Your fade makes people like, you're going to get this later. No? No? Never.
03:15:48 Never. Listen, guys. We're about to run out of digital time over here in real talk. I'm shocked. Listen. So they called me to the set. Right. And it's the dudes that's producing the film.
03:16:04 And they're like. Poetic Justice? No. No, not Poetic Justice. No, it was Boys in the Hood. How about that? Boys in the Hood. Let's go. So, I see this shit.
03:16:14 And whoever they have playing me has a speaking role. Right. And I read this shit and I'm like, nah. What the hell? Y'all not playing the y'all? I'm like, y'all gotta get that out. What the fuck is y'all? You don't like the way that they say?
03:16:27 I just don't like none of that shit. I don't have none of that shit connected to me, right? Like, take it all out. And they take it out. I'll expect that. So now, when you go back and look at the notorious movie, in the scene where the robbery happens, there's a light-skinned guy with freckles and a gray sweatshirt.
03:16:48 Is that you? That's supposed to be me. No speaking part. It was Mark Pitts. Oh, shit. Wait, wait, wait, wait. Wait, wait, wait, wait. Wait, wait, wait.
03:17:01 Oh, no, wait. This guy, you know what I mean? I'm going to take a piss. No, I'm just kidding. I'm going to take a piss, too. No, no. If we take a piss, we taking a picture, and we leaving. Before everybody takes a piss.
03:17:11 Please, tell these people. Guys, we got to leave because camera's about to die. But we need the ending of this. What are you saying? Mark Pits. Mark Pits is the one. Mark Pits and his cousin Wayne Barrow are the ones that spearheaded great waiters
03:17:31 The other ones that did the notorious film yes, we knew that and Miss Wallace has always been connected to them So they they've always been moving in Biggs best light in his absence, right? So she trusts them first. Right. Right? And they called me to the set. And they showed me what they were doing. I'm like, nah, that's not me.
03:17:57 And they took that shit out. So when you watch a notorious movie, there's a guy playing me. And you would never know that that's supposed to be me. Right. It's a kid, a licensed kid with a gray sweatshirt with a hoodie. A freckles on it and his face. But you canceled the lines. Early.
03:18:16 Right. So the persona but the lines are out. Gone. Right. And you just see this guy. And nobody knew. Go ahead. This is so hard. This is so you just see this guy. And nobody knew. Go ahead, come on. This is so hard. This is so beautiful. I love this.
03:18:29 Continue. No, no, no. We're gonna not continue. I'm gonna tell you what's gonna happen. We're gonna end this motherfucker. Because the camera's about to die. No. The digital's about to die. We- Everything's about to die right now.
03:18:41 No, I would like you to go. So we need- We need a final statement. Now we need a final statement. I'll keep going. Now we need a final statement. Now we need a final statement. You know what's crazy? I'll keep going. When it dies. You can keep going. It's going to die, bro.
03:18:51 I don't care. You see, now you have people that you want to show and they just blah, blah, blah. And I have not been reachable at all. No, you've never been reachable. Right? Cheers.
03:19:05 Thank you, sir. You can't find me. I can't find you. In my mind, you're my trainer. But if you go to him, I feel like I could find you. I feel like I could find you.
03:19:12 But him, he's on me whenever he wants, right? He's a great guy. Such a great guy. Love this guy. But now, I sit and I watch your show. Everybody you have on.
03:19:23 The best episodes that you've ever had have been Irv Gotti. I sit and I watch your show everybody you have on the best Episodes that you've ever had have been our guy Entertaining he's funny as shit No, it's been great man. He's been great Hilarious. Right? To us. Even more to us.
03:19:47 But now, I saw you interview Praz. Right. That's the same episode with Chuck. Chuck. Isn't it? No. I saw you interview Praz. Oh, no, no.
03:19:59 It's the same time frame. And I watched it in its entirety. Right? And he called my name. And I like I'm like why would you call my name what he said he said that he was with Tupac the night that he got robbed and shot and he said yeah I got it on my phone he said you know he said you remember little Sean? Listen, prize is a piece of shit On you That one left really quick
03:20:28 Right And the thing is The thing is for me For me If you call my name I'm like damn Pass me a hundred grand Why you been talking about me?
03:20:44 When was the last time you saw me? I never liked you. I never spoke to you. You don't have to know me. Why you on Drink Champs? A platform that gets this amount of views per episode. Why call my name? I'm not trying to be famous.
03:21:02 I'm not selling anything. Why me? Leave me out of your mouth You don't know me, champ Right? And when I catch you I might put blood in your mouth Right?
03:21:11 I'm not safe Leave me the fuck alone I'm watching the episode And I'm listening to this dude Call my name And then it's lies He did call your name 100%
03:21:20 Rewind It's lies connected to it Right? And I'm like First of all, what you're saying is incorrect. That's number one. It's a lie.
03:21:33 And you're doing that because the camera's on? Number two, bro, Tupac didn't leave you to come to the studio. He was at Ron G's house doing a mixtape, you fucking sucker. And when I catch you, I'm going to put blood in your mouth. Right? That's my thing.
03:21:53 And then you have a case looming over your head for embezzling money, you fucking sucker. You dig? Cool out. Be cool. Talk about you. Don't talk about me. You not that guy. Be cool. You was with the Fugees. Y'all sold the most records in hip-hop. Talk about that. I didn't sell no records. I got checks. I don't want that. I don't want that. I don't want you calling my name So if you're on a platform after selling 20 million records
03:22:32 It's something about you that ain't right and when I catch you But you get on this platform and you talk about how you were broke Because you didn't produce music like white left you didn't write music like Wyclef and you didn't write music like Lauren. And then when the group disbanded, you were stuck and left alone. And you didn't have no way to get any money. And you started embezzling bread. And you had to borrow money from street niggas. And niggas caught you and smacked your head off in a car for 75 grand.
03:23:03 Talk about that. Because you won't hear it from me, but when I catch you, put blood in your mouth. So when I watched the drink champs and I heard my name, I couldn't believe it. I'm like, damn, people still thinking about me? You know what it is. Yeah.
03:23:16 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah.
03:23:23 Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Take a picture. That's a great way. Take a picture? Okay. Take a picture. Thanks for joining us for another episode of Drink Champs, hosted by yours truly, DJ EFN and NORE. Please make sure to follow us on all our socials.
03:23:48 It's at Drink Champs across all platforms, at TheRealNoriega on IG, at Noriega on Twitter. Mine is at Who's Crazy on IG, at DJ EFN on Twitter. And most importantly, stay up to date with the latest releases, news, and merch by going to drinkchamps.com. Why is a soap opera Western like Yellowstone so wildly successful? The American West with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater Podcast Network.
03:24:23 So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th, where we'll delve into stories of the West and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today. Listen to The American West with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I know a lot of cops. They get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no.
03:24:55 This is Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. Listen to Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts or wherever you get your podcasts. I'm Clayton English. I'm Greg Glott.
03:25:14 And this is Season 2 of the War on Drugs podcast. Last year, a lot of the problems of the drug war. This year, a lot of the biggest names in music and sports. This kind of star-studded a little bit, man. We met them at their homes. We met them at their recording studios.
03:25:29 Stories matter and it brings a face to it. It makes it real. It really does. It makes it real. Listen to new episodes of the War on Drugs podcast season two on the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you get your podcast. I'm Michael Kassin, founder and CEO of 3C Ventures and your guide on good company. or wherever you get your podcasts. embrace as core. There are so many stories out there. And if you can find a way to curate and help the right person discover the right content, the term that we always hear from our audience
03:26:11 is that they feel seen. Listen to Good Company on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart Podcast.
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