Drink Champs - Episode 216 "Quarantine Champs Ep.7" w/ Marc Lamont Hill, Mysonne, Bun B & Talib Kweli (Part 1)

Episode Date: June 19, 2020

N.O.R.E. & DJ EFN are the Drink Champs. In this episode the #QuarantineChamps chop it up with Marc Lamont Hill, Mysonne, Bun B & Talib Kweli.Host of BET News & Black Coffee & Temple University Professor Marc Lamont Hill joins us along with Activist & MC, The N.Y. General Mysonne! In our most political episode to date Marc Lamont Hill and Mysonne discuss Black Lives Matters and social injustice.The Champs discuss topics such as "Copaganda", the importance of protesting for your rights, Karenism / Amy Cooper Law and using your platform to spread awareness.Bun B and Talib Kweli join the conversation; as we discuss the issues surrounding policing, the benefits of defunding the police and using that money for other needs, 3rd party activation of police body cameras and much more!Follow:Drink Champshttp://www.drinkchamps.comhttp://www.instagram.com/drinkchampshttp://www.twitter.com/drinkchampshttp://www.facebook.com/drinkchampsDJ EFNhttp://www.crazyhood.comhttp://www.instagram.com/whoscrazyhttp://www.twitter.com/djefnhttp://www.facebook.com/crazyhoodproductionsN.O.R.E.http://www.instagram.com/therealnoreagahttp://www.twitter.com/noreaga--- Support this podcast: https://anchor.fm/drinkchamps/support Learn more about your ad-choices at https://www.iheartpodcastnetwork.comSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

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This week on Dope Labs, Titi and I dive into the world of probiotics, the hype, the science, and what your gut bacteria are really doing behind the scenes. From drinks and gummies to probiotic pillows. Yes, really, probiotic pillows. We're breaking down what's legit and what's just brilliant marketing. With expert insight from gastroenterologist Dr. Roshi Raj. Listen to Dope Labs on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And it's going to take us to heal us. It's Mental Health Awareness Month, and on a recent episode of Just Heal with Dr. J,

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or wherever you get your podcasts. AT&T, connecting changes everything. We still, we still, we still, we still, we still, we still. Thank you. me hip-hop pioneer what up it's dj efn together they drink it up with some of the biggest players in the most professional unprofessional podcast and your number one source for drunk facts where every day is new year's eve it's time for drink champs drink up what's going on drink Drink Champs fans? This is a special edition. This is a whole different edition.

I wanted to do something totally different. You know, I know people who've watched the show, who've, you know, followed the show, you realize that I'm, quote, unquote, I'm not a political guy. I'm not, you know, our thing is, like, we kind of, like, avoid religion and politics not a political guy. I'm not, you know, our thing is we kind of like avoid religion and politics to a certain

degree because we want people to come and have fun. And I know I'm not like, you know, a role model, but at the same time I'm not blind. I am not blind. You know what I'm saying? I live in the same there's two Americas and I live, unfortunately, I live

on one that that is being crushed right now you know what i mean and i'm a part of it so i have to say something i have to you know and in so many times i said this to you off the air so many times celebrities you know when they come to this to to to you know we all you even see in michael jordan and tiger wood speaking out like it's like you know what But you could tell they go through certain publicists and things like that. I didn't want to do that. I wanted to say somebody that I respect, a person I consider an activist, and wanted to

get my brother right here on here, not only as a guest, but to actually co-host. And, you know, I got a couple of other brothers coming in. So I usually give an introduction and, you know, I want you to tell the people exactly who you are. What's up, good brother? This is Mark Lamont Hill. I am an activist. I'm a professor at Temple University.

I've been an organizer and an activist since I was 15. I'm 42. And I'm a journalist. I'm host of BET News. And I'm a commentator. And, you know, basically, I just try to tell the truth in public every chance I get. Yes, yes, yes. One of the things I want to get into real quick. I got a question for you. It's drink champs. I've been trying to get on drink champs.

We still drinking, right? Yo, yo, yo, listen. I'm not going to lie. For this episode, I'm not sure about the drinking because I want to be on point. I'm going to smoke a little bit. I'm sorry. Open your mind.

But you can drink if you would like. If you would drink, it's fine. I brought my... I brought Black G a little bit. I'm sorry. Open your mind. You can drink if you would like. I brought black on. Surprise. That's what we're here for. Listen, one of the questions I like to ask was you was very clear on during the protest of how we're

moving forward and how I'm going that the police picture taking isn't doing as good as we think it is. Right. We got to stop that shit, man. moving forward and how I'm going, that the police picture-taking isn't doing as good as we think it is. Right. We got to stop that shit, man. Okay. Here's the thing.

It depends on what your goal is. If your goal... People on the street right now talking about defunding police, abolishing police, trying to reshape the world. And the problem is some people want to reform the police, some people want to findhape the world. And the problem is some people want to reform the police.

Some people want to find a new way. If you're trying to reform the police, then yeah, that might work. But our goal is to say, wait a minute, what we're doing right now as a society isn't working. The way we lock people up

to solve our problems isn't working. The way we arrest our way out of everything isn't working. And when you go out there and you're protesting the police, you're protesting police brutality, and then you let the cop take a knee with you, you let the cop shoot jades with you, you let the

cop do the cha-cha slide with you that night, you know what I mean? Those type of images make it seem as if the problem isn't the police or policing, but that the problem is one individual officer or one bad apple in a bunch. And we got to get out of the bad apple model. We got to stop saying this is bad apples. It's not bad apples.

It's the system. And we got to get rid of the system. So what We got to stop saying this is bad apples. It's not bad apples. It's the system. And we got to get rid of the system. So what do the people say to people who have family members and they know that their own brother ain't racist. They know their own brother is not a bad cop. What do you say to them?

And they're taking the pictures. That's what I say. People get real funny about the police. Let's use school as an example real quick. There's not a black person in America that wouldn't say public schools are fucked up, right? Right. So the schools are all fucked up. It doesn't mean your auntie that's a teacher is a bad teacher.

It just means the school is fucked up. And so pointing out all the good teachers and all the people that work hard and do their best to teach doesn't change the fact that school is fucked up. So similarly, I know a lot of people who are good people. I got homies that work for the police force. You know what I mean? I got, I got friends who work for the police for family rather than work for the police force. It's not that I don't know people who do their best every night against the odds, but the system, just like the schools,

just like other things is broken. And when you take the picture, it makes it seem again, it's what we call copaganda. It makes people think that the cops are not the problem, that the policing system isn't the problem. And when you take the individual picture, we can't tell the difference. That one cop might save you. That one cop might do his job. That's what he's supposed to do. But the system

is broken, and we can't keep showing these individual special cops and make them seem like they have the norm because they're not. And it's not an attack on cops. It's a critique of the system. Right. And even when you get to see, like, when you get to see, like, the riots

and you see that there's people, like, the police is stabbing the cars. The police is acting more like thugs than the rioters. Like, I'm sitting back and I'm like, what's going on here? And then the crazy thing is the people not focusing on that.

I just don't, I just, we have never been in these times. But what do you think about that? When we actually get in the seat, the police being thugs, and then people denying it. People were like, well, you shouldn't have did a crime. Like, what do you mean? Like, he shouldn't have had his knee on. Right, right.

First of all, anybody who grew up in the hood knows what you see with the police right now Is no different Than what we've seen our whole lives Right I'm 42 I'm 42 too by the way Right

We didn't have camera phones growing up Right We didn't have cameras Right You don't walk around the hood with a camera Right So every time the police did shit We didn't have evidence to prove it

And the problem in America Is black people's witness doesn't count. Black people saying it happened doesn't mean that it happened. Rodney King, we watched Rodney King get beat. It didn't matter. We watched it and it still didn't matter. The police were like, yeah, but if we hadn't beat him, he would have got up and fucked us up. So we had to do it.

In America, the jury believed it. So our witness just doesn't count. So what does that mean? That means that the cameras and the evidence is a small slice of a fight to get america to see what we see and so now america's watching the police beat people in new york city that didn't do nothing chasing people down the street knocking them off their bike we've been saying that for years right police don't go in

the corner and get you off the corner asking you nicely they don't write a strongly worded letter they're like get the fuck off the corner and if you don't corner asking you nicely, they don't write a strongly worded letter. They're like, get the fuck off the corner. And if you don't get off, they start swinging, and it doesn't matter whether it's legal or not. And you're right. People will make excuses for police. They'll say, well, you know, if you weren't doing a crime, you know, it doesn't matter.

Everybody does crimes, right? We have a system designed to punish you for those crimes. If I give a counterfeit 20 to somebody, that's not a capital offense. That's I don't shouldn't get the death penalty for that. Right. And what Officer Chauvin did was he gave George Floyd the death penalty for for for a counterfeit bill. And that's what can never happen. That's the actual problem. And now that America got to see it, they're like, oh, my God, we can't believe this is happening.

But again, they make it sound like this is an exceptional case and this is outside the norm. It's not outside the norm. This is not that the police did something exceptional. It's that every day police use police brutality. And every once in a while, their brutality goes even farther. You know, and somebody dies. But the brutality every day is the problem. They put their foot on somebody's neck right now. Right. They just might not die. Right. And do you think the system,

like, why has there never been, I've seen something Farrakhan said, right? And Farrakhan said the crazy thing. He said, black people, we have never had a history of hurting white people, right? Yeah. Like, would the system change, like Like had it been Black officers

With the same amount of deaths Had it been black officers Doing this to white children Or you know what I mean Jewish children for instance If America Alright When there's a school shooting

Think about the school shooting What's the first thing they say on the news Oh my god this shouldn't happen here. That shit shouldn't happen nowhere. But when it comes to white people, they say this shouldn't happen here. Right. White kids die when a white woman goes missing on TV. The first thing they say is we got to find her. Right. She's missing. Black women, when they go, they're not missing. They're just gone. Right. We just say, look, Natasha's gone gone we don't know what happened to her whereas the news will run for two three

four five ten we still talk about john benet ramsey from from 96 you know what i'm saying because because a white woman missing is intolerable right john i'll give you one quick historical note john f kennedy walks through harlem in 1960 holding up a black baby and they said oh that's a campaign stunt right he's just trying to make Adam Clayton Powell happy. He's just trying to get cheap votes from liberals. His brother Bobby walks through West Virginia, through Appalachia a few years later holding a white baby, and he's hungry.

His belly's bloated. Snots coming out of his nose. He's crying. We start our war on poverty. We don't have a threshold for white misery. And they try to make it sound like it's a good thing. Oh, black people, they so resilient. Y'all so tough. I shouldn't have to be resilient.

I shouldn't have to be tough. I shouldn't have to play through pain. But that's what they make us do. America doesn't want to see white people suffer. They are willing to see black people suffer all day. Now, my song, first off, welcome to the chat, man. Welcome to- What's up, good brother?

What's up, brother? This ain't drink champs, it's protest champs because you know what a lot of us you know my son i'm speaking for myself a lot of us you know we want to do more um we don't necessarily know how to do more you understand i'm saying that's why brothers like you on the front line has to be always respected always have to be saluted i've seen you on live with with snoop dogg i seem to uh i believe he made a donation towards it. I think we want to do the same thing. But, you know, I just wanted to talk to you on the front

line because it was funny the other day. I think I seen you in the Bronx protest, correct? And it was crazy because people like Fat Joe, you think he's supposed to be so successful and things like that. He called me for 20 minutes. He was like, man, I wish I was there. How can we have something in the Bronx

and I'm not be there? And I was just like, I was so happy like that people, like we care, like we care. One thing I wanted to say is, like I said earlier, we integrated. A lot of us, we come from the same territories. We come from the same places. But a lot of us don't know. You know what I'm saying? So that's why a person

like you on the front line is, I started when I was talking to the bro, I was saying like, you know, a lot of us celebrities, you know, sometimes we make a bad decision because we want to speak on Black Lives Matter. We want to do that. But, you know, some of us are out of the loop. Let's just be clear.

Some of us is out of the loop. So in order for us to maintain, I wanted to speak to a brother like you. You know what I mean? Well, you know, first of all, I want to say thank you for always uplifting the work I do, uplifting everything I do, being gentle. You know what I'm saying? For that.

And second of all, it's so much. Like, it's so much that we can be doing different. The thing about this movement is that it's so many different intersections. There's so many different ways that you can get involved. Like, you know, you using your platform, you don't have to be at the march. You know what I'm saying? The fact that you give people like me and Mark Lamar Hill, who has been one of the leading people about civil rights, you know, forever, a platform to talk about these things, to educate people, let them know what's going on. That's a role that you play. You know, as like fat joe like i wish i would have had your

numbers i dm'd it to him but unfortunately i didn't have his phone number to call him be like i need you out here but you know everybody has a role and and you know as far as being on the front line it just helps me it just helps me when brothers like yourself, when the radio stations, you know, and all of these big platforms utilize their platforms to amplify what we're saying. We actually have an action that I'm going to tell you brothers about later that I need y'all to, you know,

because what we were saying is we was on a call with a lot of artists because everybody is right now, I think this moment has shifted the paradigm. It's no longer blindfolded like he was saying. They said, oh, this shouldn't happen here. I think this situation, I don't know

if it was the exact situation. I don't know if it was timing. I don't know if it was COVID-19. You'd be in your house. You'd be dealing with trauma, stress. I don't know what it was. It was the culmination of everything. But I know this situation shifted everybody's mindset. The people who were telling me all lives

matter yesterday was like, well, I really understand it now. They was calling on my phone crying. There was so much going on. So it shifted the mindset of everybody. So in this moment right now, we see that the world understands that

Black Lives Matter. They have a block that they painted Black Lives Don't Matter. My neighbors that used to support Trump and things like that, I see them now and they're like, we got to get him out of here. I'm like, what? That's what I'm talking about.

You know what I mean? I would avoid trying to speak politics with them because I've seen them with their hat. I've seen them sneaking around with their hat. You know what I mean? But then now they see me and they're stopping us. They're like, oh, man, we got to get him out of here. Like he's even pissed in the mall. You must live in a good ass neighborhood, too. You got Trump supporters next door. They're around. They're around. You steal the blacks on the wall. You live somewhere. So let me ask you both of you brothers something.

One thing that struck me was the fact that, you know, Jay-Z being the successful that he is, him taking the time out, calling the governor, and the governor actually expressing the point that saying he felt like Jay-Z treated him like a man. And then he called, then that's when, correct me if I'm wrong, is that when the district attorney became that black guy or the black guy was already on there?

It was a it was a lot of pressure. So Jay-Z definitely played a role in that. The state attorney general, Keith Ellison, is now overseeing that case. It was but it wasn't just Jay-Z. Shout out to Ho for doing that. But it's also we don't want to ever lose sight of the activists on the ground that made this happen, too, because they knew we were watching. And that's the thing. Just like with Ahmaud Arbery, they knew we were watching. They saw the tape. They ain't give a

fuck about the tape. Then they saw, we saw the tape and our reaction, they said, oh, we got to do something. Same thing here. Now they're like, oh, wait a minute. They saw George Floyd. They in the streets. We got to change the prosecutor. And they shouldn't take that, but that's what it took. But having influential people like Jay-Z doing it as well. Like my son said, like using the platform, using their platform and their reach to do something is key. Because now, you know, you got money behind it. You got celebrity behind it, which means the reach is wider.

If a whole ton of somebody do something, people do it. And then you've got the pressure of people on the streets that are willing to tear shit down if they got to. They had no choice. It seemed like after that, the charges went up. I could be wrong in how I'm saying it, you know what I mean? But it seems like then the other three was actually picked up too. Now, again, I'm not

saying it was all Jay-Z neither, but I'm glad when it's like, you know, because hip-hop is also a race to me too. You know what I'm saying? Like, rappers, we are our own little fraternity. So I have to big up, you know, my song fraternity. So I have to big up my song with his part. I have to big up Bum B and Talib Kweli, everybody. And I just wanted to big that up, too.

No, he deserve it. He deserve it. Especially after all that heat he caught from the NFL shit. It's important to say, look, when he's doing something that I agree with, because I didn't agree with the NFL shit all the way, but with this, he's 100% on point. And when I was in Ferguson six years ago people was getting bailed out people was getting support people was getting flown here and that shit came from J&B a lot of that and they didn't sell it they didn't promote it they didn't put a newspaper they just quietly

did the support and did with celebrities like you said earlier need to do which is sometimes move out the way and say look I don't need to be the face of this I don't need to be the voice of this I just need to support you in any way you need to be supported. That's what it was for me. And for me, that happens with Jay a lot. You know, so, you know, I know a lot of people didn't agree with the NFL. I had I had mixed understanding. I was like, let me see what happens. Let's just see where it goes. But I know firsthand a lot of stuff that Jay does like and he doesn't say anything like I know that until freedom a lot of things that we've done that they've been right supported us financially

you know gave us platforms to do a lot of things from the beginning you know what I'm saying so and he never says anything about it I know before the governor's situation you know making sure that the lawyers get there paying for certain lawyers, doing a lot of the activists that was on the ground in Minnesota that he was responsible for getting. So there's a lot of stuff that people don't know and he doesn't even say nothing about it. You'll hear him, because I know he talks

to people I know and they'll be like, you know, I did all that. No, I don't say nothing. And they cursing him out. You'll hear people like, yo, Jay needs to be doing more. Jay ain't doing this. And it's like, Jay don't got to go up there and scream, yo, what's going on? Sometimes the unseen hand is the best hand to have, you know what I'm saying?

I'm glad that everybody's playing their part, man. I think at this moment we are making shifts. They just changed laws in Minnesota. They just repealed... Chokehold, right? They changed the chokehold law, right? Yeah, they repealed the 58 law in New York City, you know, where now they're going to have the officers' information to the public. You can actually go see.

They can't just look you up, man. You can look them up when they arrest you, you know what I'm saying? So it's so much different things. and they're about to budget cut, take about a billion dollars from the New York City Police Department to put into different things inside of the schools and community. And, you know, they took out some of you. They done took some of you from New York. So, you know, that's not really good.

Right. You know what I'm saying? And some of you, you know, if you ain't got nothing to do on the townhouse side. Yeah. You know what I'm saying? So these are things

that we really need to focus on, man. I'm glad that the world is waking up, and I'm glad that for 14 straight days, they've been protesting. 14 straight days. I'm going to bounce around a little bit. Now, let's talk about Karenism, right? Let's talk about this

because I heard the law is changing. It's going to be called Amy Cooper. Is that this woman's name that called with the dog? Isn't that like weaponizing her? Isn't that like, you know, naming that law like in her community and people who think like her, isn't that like going down like a legend?

Yeah, look, she earned it. Like, look, you know how many laws are made for shit for white people when they're the victims of shit? The Brady Bill. Megan's Law. Right. Oh, shit, I didn't mean that.

So she got to hold that L. He's not a victim. That's what I'm saying. So now we got all these sympathetic laws to white people. Now she got to hold this L. Look, you called the police on a brother for no reason. And we saw the whole thing. It was like a Scorsese movie.

She was like, look, I'm not tying up this dog. And if you don't get away from me and stop filming me, I'm going to call the police. I'm going to tell them you black. And basically she was like, you know what they're going to do

because you a nigga and I'm white. And he was like, do what you like. She did the shit. And then she went in a full Meryl Streep mood. She started screaming by the end. Like you would have thought a nigga was like a jerk. He's my dog! Right. have thought a nigga was like, he's trying to take my dog!

Right. Dog quacks! I'm like, if I couldn't see the shit with my own eyes, I would have thought she was getting attacked. The brother was standing still. So I'm not for criminalizing everything and locking everybody up, but I will say that white people got to learn

that they can't weaponize their whiteness against black people, and that's what's happening when this shit go. You know what one thing was so scary about that video? It was like he had experience with that. This wasn't his first time doing it. He was like, he just pulled out his phone real fast. He knew

exactly what to do, and he's been profiled like this before in that same bar. And what fucked me up about it is he's a Harvard graduate, and the nigga is in Central Park on Memorial Day birdwatching. There's no safer Negro in America

than the nigga birdwatching on Central Park. I was birding. I don't know. I was just birding. If you're doing that and you're still scared, that tell you how fucked up America is.

And the fact that he knows to pull out the camera? Word. That tell you everything. What would happen if he was smoking an L in the park? Yeah, he wasn't from the Huns. You know what I'm saying? He was a nigga

that was doing a Harvard graduate birdie. I never heard of birdie. I didn't know that shit was a word. Listen, I heard of birdie and I watched a movie called The Good Year or The Big Year or something like that with Jack Black. So I heard of birdie. I had no idea it was anywhere

near New York City. I didn't know there's Red Robins and Woody Woodpackers in New York or Central Park. I had no idea. That ain't for us. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's crazy, man. So are you in New York right now, Mark? No, I got

a spot in Brooklyn. Okay. And as soon as that COVID hit in March, I went back to Philly. I'm in my crib in Philly, man. I wasn't trying to get that shit. New York too tight. I'm in Philly. I got space.

How about you, my son? Where you at? I'm actually just grabbed back to New York, folks. I got back on Saturday because we had a big march Saturday in the city. And Sunday, we did the Bronx march.

Yesterday, I just kind of relaxed. So today I'm homeschooling with my kids. Oh, that's what's up. The reason why I ask is because I'm not so familiar with what's going on with the James Dolan story. I know that he publicly, I think he made a statement

saying that he wasn't going to make a statement. Which is, oh, he told his not made a statement, he told his staff that he wasn't going to make a statement. Not made a statement. He told his staff that he wasn't going to make a statement. And I think it pissed off a lot. Are you guys, you know, James Dillon, the Knicks owner. Are you guys... What was this?

Yeah. You not familiar, Mark? I know, yeah. First of all, as a Philadelphian, right. Fuck all New York sports. I just got to say that. I got to put that out there. I didn't know you was going there.

And so, James, I hate the Knicks for all kinds of reasons. I used to respect the Knicks. What James Dolan has done on every level is tear apart the team, tear apart the culture. And the NBA has a culture right now of resistance. People are speaking out. I'm talking to coaches hitting me up offline, players hitting me up offline like,

yo, how can I support? How can I do this? James Dolan is from carrying Charles Oakley out of Madison Square Garden, getting him arrested, all of that shit. No respect. And this is just another example. You could just say I support Black Lives. Saying Black Lives Matter shouldn't be controversial

that's all you gotta say black lives matter i support the resistance i support the movement i want justice you can say some basic shit like i support justice the fact that he won't it's not about his personal opinion it's a signal to certain kinds of other people right when you say i'm not gonna make a statement you're signaling to those white people with them red hats on right that you still got their back, or you at least still respect their perspective. And that's the problem. And he's so worried about them that he's going to alienate the players.

And sports, shut aside for a minute, that's just not how you build community. That's not how you manage a team. But even from an NBA level, another reason why people don't want to go to the Knicks is because of the ownership. Because you got a league that's all black, and some owners that won't stand up. And the NFL is 10 times worse ownership. Because you got a league that's all black and some owners that won't stand up.

And the NFL is 10 times worse than that. You got a league that's 70-80% black and the owners won't stand with them. That's the problem. Right. Did you see the football like mixtape thing that the football players did? And then all of a sudden after that, Roger

Goodell actually said, it was almost like he was trying to admit that he was wrong. But I thought Roger Goodell was a bit sincere. How did you guys feel when you seen Roger Goodell? I think for me, you know, it's just like the whole thing with Jordan. People were like, oh, Jordan never said nothing for years. And now he's saying something. You know, he's just jumping in.

It's like, what do we want? Is our goal to bring people around? Are we trying to get the people that don't get it to get it to say, okay, I made a mistake. I've done this right. What is our goal? For me, Roger Goodell, maybe I say it's too little, too late, but we are at a

moment that's shifting the paradigm. Like I said yesterday, three people that I know that were saying all lives matter called me crying talking about, man, I get it now. Black lives matter. My wife's sister's husband, who's a white guy, and he's a good friend of mine. He's never been vocal about any of these things. He's been on the phone crying.

He's calling her crying like, yo, we got to do more about this. What do we have to do? How can I use my privilege? I'm having conversations with people. They're unfollowing their friends on Instagram. They're saying negative stuff. There's a shift. So for me, Roger Goodell, he's starting to come around, I think.

And that's why I didn't want to rush to the situation with Jay. I have enough respect for Jay that he's not going to constantly deal and sit in the face with somebody that he's not building with, that he don't see some level of something that, all right, this man can be pushed here to where he's going to get some level of respect.

I didn't think he was just going to completely compromise his legacy to sit at the table with a nigga that wasn't going to come around at all. So I believe that these are conversations he's probably been having with him. Like, yo, you got to understand what's going on. And it starts to work. You know, just like Meek. Meek being around

Robert Kraft and all these dudes and their minds they just starting to change. They didn't understand certain things. So we don't know where his heart is. That's for him to tell.

But I'm just saying it's a step in the right direction. Because when he makes that statement he creates the culture to change

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I feel that, and I'll take that with Jay because I think Jay has good intention and Jay has shown at least that he's willing to put his money where his mouth is and fight for us so I would give Jay the benefit of the doubt more than I would Roger Goodell I think Jay understands though, I think you're right Jay understands his power

in that room, but like he said I show you how to move in a room full of vultures. They still vultures. And their intention is never to do anything but make money. And I looked at the Goodell statement. I looked at it like 10 times. And it's like some mind trick they do on you, right? Because the statement was good for business because the league is known as being racist. So they had to say something. So it's good for business, but he didn't actually say anything. I'm going to read you just a little part of this shit, right?

He said, wait, do I got the joint in front of me? Uh, I don't, but he's, I pulled up the wrong joint. But basically if you, if you, if you look at the, if you look at the statement, he didn't actually say anything about, he didn't use the word violence. He didn't use the word race. He said, you know, I'm sorry for the unfortunate deaths of Ahmaud Arbery. He didn't say they got killed. He didn't say the word police. He didn't

say the word race. He didn't say the word racism. He didn't say the word white supremacy. So, if you read this statement, you could have thought Ahmaud Arbery and George Floyd slipped on a banana peel or got hit by a truck. He didn't say murder. I didn't peep that. He didn't say murder. He didn't say kill. He didn't even say how they died.

He made the statement, which I agree with my son, that's a hell of a piece of progress. Ten years ago, they wouldn't have said shit. That pressure helps, so we've got to keep the pressure on them. It's such a low bar now. They just acknowledged it. They basically said,

something happened. It was bad. We're sorry. We'll do more. They didn't say what, who, what, yo, they just acknowledge it. They basically said something happened. It was bad. We're sorry. We'll do more. Right? They didn't say what, who, what, where, why. They didn't say how they're going to make it better. And they damn sure ain't trying to rehire Colin Kaepernick. So for me, until the NFL does more, it seems to me like an empty gesture. Right. I think I

get you. Because it's people like Popovich who are very you get it. Like, he gets it. Yes. He calls it out. He don't play no games. It's real simple for him. You know what I'm saying?

It's just, for me, I understand that people move at a different pace, man. It's just like being in the streets, right? And being in the hood, right? So when I go through and I deal with certain kids and people be tearing them up and all that, I understand the process it's going to take for them to get to a certain place. You know what I'm saying? Like, these people,

like, you know, most of these, especially these billionaires, they are etched in racism so much that they can't even identify with it. So when you actually, when they actually say something like this, you realize that you clicked something. So now, okay, I got you.

Now I can just keep feeding you a little more. And that's a process. This man, his whole legacy and empire and everything was built on white supremacy. They so far, they got influenza. They kill people and they plead influenza.

They don't quit. They thought nothing was going to happen to them. This is the mindset most of them have. So when they start coming around a little bit, I take it with a grain of salt, but I understand the progress and I understand the moment that we're in. Because you know what? I liked it

with the NBA when we found out about Donald Sterling. You know what I'm saying? When it was like, I think that was like the first mark where we was like wow people are starting to listen people are starting to get it that you know we although I don't look at them

as they work for them even though they do kind of work for them I hate when they call the guy the owner but I mean it's obviously this is what it is but when they acted and they acted I think it's named Adam I forgot what's his name? Adam, I forgot. Adam Silver. I think he did an excellent job by seeing how uncomfortable not just the players was, but the fans and everybody.

And then I think it was almost also who he talked about. Like, I didn't know anybody had beef with Magic Johnson. Like, you know what I'm saying? Like, I was like, for real? Magic? I knew Magic enemies that was like, word?'re like him like you know i mean so like what did you think about that you think that that hand that was handled that that's how you do it it's again it's like the system doesn't work and you have to leverage your power to make it work or to or to break it down the nba players said look we had enough donald sterling was doing that shit for years. He used to take women and his friends

into the NBA locker room, into the shower, and show him the players. They was animals at the zoo. I saw the blackboard documentary. Right. That's some wild ass shit. You know what I'm saying? Like, so it was years of that.

He was racist in his private life in terms of real estate and housing, just like Donald Trump was. So there's a whole legacy of him being racist. It took decades for them to say enough. But where the players had the power was they could walk off the court. They could say, none of this works without us.

You just got to not be scared of losing a check. You got to be not scared of fighting. If you do that, you can win. They got him the fuck up out of here. And they did it quick. What happens if the NBA, you know, they're trying to reconvene the season,

and they want to go to Orlando or Disney World. What happens if all the NBA players, that's because everyone's not going, right? You know, the Knicks is not even thought of, right? You know what I'm saying? So everyone's not going, right? But what happens if these athletes really got together and said, you know what?

Until we get rid of this racist rhetoric, until we get, you know, our people to stand with us, we're not playing. What would happen to the system? It would shut down. This is what I'm trying to say. If we understood our power. LeBron, Chris Paul, all of them got together and said, all the black players unite. And it's going to make the white brothers unite anyway, because they're the minority there.

What would happen? I'm sorry to cut you off there. You know, the NBA would be finished. Or they would have to completely reconstruct to fit whatever their needs are. It's just like we were saying, people were saying about the HBCUs. Like, if the black players start saying, yo, go to the HBCUs, we would completely shift

the whole economic system. You understand? But we don't utilize our power because we've been taught we don't have it. That's the fastest way not to utilize your power is to think you don't have it. And that's what's happened with us. Like, we don't sit there and realize, I have conversations with people all the time, you know, about, yo,

you got power. They go, yo, I can't. They said, who's they? Like, you have to, you understand the power you are., yo, I can't. They said, who's they? You understand the power you are? I say this all the time. And we had LeBron and we had Oprah and we had probably 10 of the most powerful black people in the world that sat at one table

and decided, yo, we gonna make this. This is how it's going. Because we dictate culture, period. We dictate everything culturally. So they control the media but we control the culture. And once you control the culture, you can take the media. we dictate culture period like we dictate everything culturally we did so they they control the media but we control the culture and once you control the culture you can take the media because the media the culture the media is built on the culture so once you say yo this is where we going and we all left instagram top of them say yo we're going all of us is going over

here and you own that it's gonna shift we just don't understand that and we've never utilized that power. We've never done that. If they decided, they could run the NBA. Literally run the NBA. The owners don't have nothing. I think LeBron is that smart to do it. I think other athletes

in the past was that smart as well, but I think LeBron is that smart, that rich, and that he's that articulate. Like, with him and Chris Paul, there's certain people who understand what's going on. There's certain people who understand. You know what I mean? Like, as opposed to, like, you know,

they can do it articulate. It can be an NBA takeover without it being, like, a takeover where it's hostile. I think they would really come and make change and get people that is, you know, even accused of being racist the fuck out of there so everyone can play the game. You know what I mean? Because just even that word owner always

bothered me. Right. And that's why the NBA moved to a new word, right? Because they were like, we not, they use, I think it's governors now, they don't let, yeah. Because they was like, this ownership ain't working. The NFL's still with it, but the NBA said no. But the problem in the past has been,

there's always been courageous voices that stood up and said, this shit is wrong. But you got to be in a position of power. That's why LeBron is so important, because LeBron is the best player in the world. He's the most influential player in the world. He's the richest dude in the league. He could walk away tomorrow and never need another dollar,

and he's still standing up. Craig Hodges did the same shit in 94 The problem is Craig Hodges was on the bulls And Craig went up to Michael Jordan and Magic Johnson Before the NBA finals and said Look We need more Owners, black owners, we need more black

Players who are in control Of their destiny We need to create our own shit And what happened was Michael Jordan magic was like, nah, we're not ready for that yet. Craig Hodges went to the White House after they won the NBA championship, gave George Bush a letter

saying, here's what's wrong with Black America. Here's what you need to do to fix it. He went up there with a dashiki on best shooter in the NBA. The reigning three-point champion. They got him out of there. He ain't playing another game in the NBA again. If Michael Jordan does that, they can't get rid of Michael Jordan, but they can get rid of Craig Hodges.

They can get rid of Mahmoud Abdul-Raouf. So the key is for the best players in the league to stand strong and stand tall, and then the other players will come with them. Whatever LeBron do, the rest of them do. And that's why I respect LeBron for standing up so much. Welcome, Bambi. Welcome, Bambi. What's going on?

What's up, man? What's up, man? What up, my son? How you doing, King? I'm good, man. I'm just now, you know, I left the service about an hour ago. My granddaughter broke her tube, so we had to go and get her and take her to the dentist. But, man, like, we should all go home the way they sent that boy home today,

for real. They just took the casket out of the hearse and put it in the horse-drawn carriage, and they're taking him horse-drawn carriage to his final resting place. That's right, because the brother was from

Houston, correct? Yes, sir. That's right. That's right. Wow. What kind of correct yes sir that's right that's right wow what kind of stuff was they saying to the service oh man like unity you know what I'm saying justice um you know just really here's the thing right we spent over the last two weeks talking about George Floyd's death right today they Today, they talked about his life. That was a beautiful thing. You know, they had his friends, they had his family, they had

people from his hood, from Third Ward, the CUNY homes, and they were just lifting him up, man. You know what I'm saying? Giving him his proper respects, remembering him in a real way as a human being, not like a video clip on TV, you know? But definitely people asking for justice, you know, asking for police reform.

The mayor announced that he was signing an executive order to outlaw the chokehold in the city of Houston to give fair warning before discharging a firearm. Just the whole way that officers are allowed to engage in the city of Houston. A couple of different things. You know, the Congressional Black Caucus attended, led by Congresswoman Bass, Sheila Jackson Lee, state rep, Congressman Al Green, another state rep. Joe Biden gave a very, very heartfelt message via video. He was actually in town and met with the family yesterday, but he didn't want to attend the funeral to draw too much attention away from what was going on. But one of the best speakers today, I have to say,

there was a white pastor there from South Main Baptist. Yeah, it was a pastor of South Main Baptist Church in Houston, basically saying that, you know, white churches that profess to be houses of God, you know, and claim to love all God's children got to do a better job when it comes to their relations with black people and helping black people stand for their causes. You know what I'm saying? Like, I was very, very happy to hear that, you know, and he was like, you know, he wanted

to be, he said on the stage, he's like, I wonder if I'm supposed to say something and just shut up and listen. And I'm glad y'all let a white man speak today. But he was very, you know, he was very, very real about, you know, white privilege and white accountability right now and standing with everybody, especially if you're a white person that claims to be a Christian and, you know, all Christians are children of God and you claim to love all of God's children, then why aren't you

doing the right thing and standing with black people right now, you know? All right. That's what we need white people to do right there. I agree. Yeah, sorry about that. I apologize. All good. So, Bun, I just seen footage of, I believe it's another police killing out in Houston this time.

And they were saying the same exact thing. You know, I can't breathe. I can't breathe. Yeah, new footage of an arrest that the footage was just released. And it's insane, man. Like, you know, we're not supposed to keep hearing this. The same thing. Right. It's these levels of engagement, the levels of escalation that police officers have been able to have with people of color in this country with impunity. You know, my thing is, you know, when we do this police reform, when we ask for these bills, I would ask for stiffer penalties for police that commit crimes while in duty

and in uniform. You know, police are allowed a certain level of authority, right? They're allowed to patrol your streets with authority. They're allowed to carry a handgun in the streets of America. And because of that, we should hold them even more accountable. Like, we regular citizens, we don't get the level of authority that police get. So when we commit an assault,

right, we get X amount of time. My son, I know you feel me on this. That's my whole point. That's been my whole point. You know what I'm saying? Like, we should, we're not supposed to get the same, we don't have the same level of authority that police have. We're not held to the same standards in our't have the same level of authority that police have. We're not held to the same standards

in our communities as police are. So when they violate our trust and break the law while wearing the uniform, they should be held to stiffer penalties. And I think that if, you know, if they knew the kind of time they was looking at, they'd probably think twice about some of the shit that they're doing.

You know? I also see certain cities in America have third-party activation of the body cam. I think every police department in America should have third-party activation. I think as soon as dispatch puts out a call and offers a response to that call, that officer's camera should immediately be turned on.

The minute he tells dispatch he's going out on that call, he shouldn't have the say as to whether or not, or if all, that his camera is on. That shit should be automatic. Take it out of the police's hand. You know what I'm saying? How about in Arizona? In Arizona, you don't get to turn off the camera.

Yeah, we don't get to turn off security cameras when we're doing nothing nowhere. Nah. They need to be under the same scrutiny, if not more scrutiny, in America. You know what I'm saying? There just needs to be a totally different level of accountability, period. I think we can't get over that.

And what you guys think about Arizona, were they making it illegal, or they're actually charging people for like, you know, if you film the police. Isn't that like, that's like, that's like, it's damn near saying you can hang somebody, right? That's the problem, right? The police are

resisting accountability at all times. That's why a lot of people didn't like the body cameras. They wanted the police to be seen, but they were worried that one, that would just dump more money into police departments when we're trying to defund them and that the police would just turn the cameras off strategically when they wanted to. But if you're going to have the camera, it got to be on at all times. And people should be able to film the police.

We have cop watch programs in New York. We have cop watch programs in Philly designed to make sure that the police get surveilled just as much as they surveil us. And the fact that they're making it illegal tells you that the police are scared right now. The police are running scared because they don't want to be accountable. When we started marching in 2064, one of the things we talked about was civilian review boards. The police should not be policing themselves. We talked about cameras. The police should be should be filmed at all times through body cameras and through outside entities. And the police have resisted that. They'll give up three officers

and get them charged like they did in Minnesota. They'll give up an officer every once in a while, but what they'll never give up is their ability to be autonomous, their ability to govern themselves, and their ability to watch and judge themselves. I mean, think about how crazy it is for the police to be

able to do their own internal investigations of police brutality. That's like if your girl accused you of cheating and you say, no, no, no, I can prove I didn't, just ask my homie, right? It's like, of course, what are you going to say, right? It's the same thing. The police investigate themselves. When you file a complaint in Philadelphia, for example, against the police, the first thing the police do is they take your story, Then they show your story to the officer. They let the officer read your story. And then after the officer reads your story, the officer can then respond to what you said. So he can just read what you said and write something against you, which is what happened to me in Philly when I filed a complaint 10 years ago.

So it's the same thing. So we need to get rid of laws that make it illegal to film cops. We need to get rid of laws that allow the police not to keep the surveillance cameras on at all times. And we need to build civilian oversight of police in every single city around America. There should be no city where an outside board of citizens doesn't get to judge police when they go outside the lines.

But Mark, we got to give those independent community review boards subpoena power. Yes. That's the key thing about that, right? They need to be able to have subpoena power so that they can request videos, they can request texts, emails, and everything that goes with the case so that they can say, okay, like think of the Russia poll, right? Like when Adam Schiff and everybody went in and they reviewed the evidence,

they were like, look, I just left out of this meeting. I saw the text. I saw the emails. I listened to phone calls. It was some fuck shit going on. Excuse me, Taylor. I'm sorry. It was it was a mess going on. I got my grandbaby in the car. You know what I'm saying? But like something wrong happened and we need to investigate this. We need to bring charges and we need people to be held accountable. You know what I'm saying? What's going on in Tucson right now is simply a reflection of the people that

they elected to go in because that was a city council vote that made that outlawed belief. What does that say to black people? What does that say to black people? That says don't go to Tucson. That's a big word. Don't go to Tucson. That's what it tells me. Don't go to Tucson. That's a big word. Don't go to Tucson. That's what it tells me. Don't go to Tucson.

Because if the cops doing something to me, ain't going to be no proof. And look, I'm in Houston, right? So, like with these Karens that call in and say black people. Didn't you have an encounter with Karen? You had an encounter with Karen, right? You had an encounter with Karen. Yeah, yeah. At Waterbury, we had a problem with a Karen.

You know what I'm saying? And so, here's what I'm finding out, right? From lawyers that accountant with a Karen. Yeah, yeah. At Waterbury, we had a problem with a Karen. You know what I'm saying? And so here's what I'm finding out, right, from lawyers that I've talked to. Hold on. Sorry about that. From attorneys that I've talked to. In a court of law, those phone calls are admissible. Right? So it's called

hysterical something. I can't... The name is missing. I'm missing a name right now. But literally, a person makes a phone call, 911, right? Hysterical and frantic. Oh my God, this black man is doing something to me. This black man is attacking me, he's threatening me. The police come, they arrest you, they give you a case, you go to court, that phone call is admissible. And that becomes the only record of any evidence that gets put into your case. So just imagine how many

of these Karens have already locked up people in America. This is our phone call. Like Emmett Till died from a Karen. Let's not remember. Word. Word. You know what I'm saying? Who on her deathbed recanted everything. But Emmett been dead. You got to live a

full life. Right. So what do we do? And then when you look, I watched it. Did you see what happened in Buffalo when he pushed the old man to the ground? Yes, yes, yes. And Trump's tweet? Trump's tweet is another thing. But just to see that the

officers that came out, the 200 officers that came out for this, they were clapping for them. This shows you the mind state. How did you look and watch them throw? It happened in Philly too. It happened in Philly too. The guy got charged and they clapped for him. You can understand the mind state.

These people are comfortable. I was so hurt watching that old man hit the ground and watching blood leaking out his head and they just let that man stay there. That was so... They have a level of inhumanity within the police system and structure

that I can't even identify with. I can't even identify with that level of inhumanity that they have right now because they really think that that shit is okay. And that's why we need to abolish the police. That's why I'm past reforming the police. We need to get rid of the police. I've been a prison

abolitionist, a police abolitionist for a long time and there was a moment when I would say that and people would look at me like I was crazy. Now I think people realize that policing is the problem. Our long-term vision has to be to live in communities without police. And people say, what would that look like? It looks like the suburbs. Our long-term vision has to be to live in communities without police. And people say, what would that look like? It looks like the suburbs.

It looks like every neighborhood outside of the hood. It's possible to have a world without police. What that means is we need to take the money that we put in police forces and invest in the hood. Exactly. Because half the shit police come out for, we don't need them for. Right?

When your people get a drug overdose, you don't need the police there. Right?'t need them for. Right? When your people get a drug overdose, you don't need the police there. Right? You need a doctor. Right? When there's somebody having an argument on the street that's not physical, you need conflict resolution. You don't need the police. When somebody is drunk and passed out at night, you don't need the police. When a kid, you know, there's so many things. When a kid

cuts school, you don't need the police. When somebody gets in a fight in school, you don't need the police. There's all these things that we use the police for that we don't need so let's take that money out of the police and put it to people who actually have skills like psychology i mean specific skills like psychologists doctors social workers um if you if we do that then we won't have so many instances half the time black people don't call the police is not because we don't need help it's because we know that whatever the police are going to do when they get there is worse than the thing we dealing with in that moment so you you're like, fuck it. I just,

I just deal with it myself. So Mark, let me just play devil's advocate right now. There's no level of police reform that you would be comfortable with right now. I'm comfortable with reform as long as it doesn't operate against the idea that policing is the problem. So, for example, I'm okay with a body—I'm not against a body camera per se. I just don't like the fact that the money that goes into body cameras isn't really being used for body cameras. It's being used to support the police more broadly. But yes, I'm for all kinds—like, a civilian review board is a reform, but it's a reform that still continues to frame police as the problem. I'm OK with what I'm not OK with is given programs with like police and community to make us think that if the police just knew us better,

they were just nicer, that that would solve the problem. So I think the prison reform, I'm not against prison reforms. Like, for example, giving people condoms in prison is something that makes prisons safer. Giving people getting rid of cash bail makes prisons make makes makes life better for folks because they not as we decarcerate. But I don't want any kind of reform that makes us think that the current system is savable. That's all I'm saying. I'm with reform, just not reform to make us think the system as it is can sustain itself all right now here's a big problem that i have right now like as i get deeper into under these understanding these kind of interactions and the lack of uh punishment or lack of accountability for everything the the and my son could probably speak to this more and more and more i hear about the power of police union

right that's the thing that I want to reform, right? And I don't know if, you know, I understand that... Police unity or police union? Police union, okay. Yeah, police union, right? And I understand the more that I talk about this, you know, I keep hearing about how strong the police union lobby is

and how much political power that they hold. I have a friend here in Houston. He's a state senator. He tried to put a bill on the floor in 2011 that addressed everything that we're trying to have addressed now. And it didn't even make it out of committee. Right. Like it was something that didn't even make it didn't even make it to the floor of the

state Senate. Right. And at the state capitol, it never even became something that went to a vote. And so, like, I'm trying to figure out, like, how do we offset the power of the police union? Like, should we have a lobbying group that throws money around politically to combat the power that the police union has

with elected officials as well? Or do we ask for regulation of police unions in America? You know? The Medal of Honor is the highest military decoration in the United States. Recipients have done the improbable, showing immense bravery and sacrifice in the name of something much bigger than themselves. This medal is for the men who went down that day. It's for the families of those who didn't make it. I'm J.R. Martinez. I'm a U.S. Army veteran myself, and I'm honored to tell

you the stories of these heroes on the new season of Medal of Honor, Stories of Courage from Pushkin Industries and iHeart Podcast. From Robert Blake, the first black sailor to be awarded the medal, to Daniel Daly, one of only 19 people to have received the Medal of Honor twice. These are stories about people who have distinguished themselves by acts of valor, going above and beyond the call of duty. You'll hear about what they did, what it meant, and what their stories tell us about the nature of courage and sacrifice. Listen to Medal of Honor on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. The American West with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater Podcast Network, hosted by me, writer and historian Dan Flores, and brought to you by Velvet Buck.

This podcast looks at a West available nowhere else. Each episode, I'll be diving into some of the lesser-known histories of the West. I'll then be joined in conversation by guests such as Western historian Dr. Randall Williams and best-selling author and meat-eater founder Stephen Ranella. I'll correct my kids now and then. They'll say, and best-selling author and meat-eater founder Stephen Ranella. I'll correct my kids now and then where they'll say when cave people were here. And I'll say it seems like the Ice Age people that were here didn't have a real affinity for caves. So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th, where we'll delve into stories of the West and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today.

Listen to The American West with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I know a lot of cops, and they get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. Across the country, cops called this taser the revolution. But not everyone was convinced it was that simple. Cops believed everything that taser told them.

From Lava for Good and the team that brought you Bone Valley comes a story about what happened when a multi-billion dollar company dedicated itself to one visionary mission. This is Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. It's really, really, really bad. Listen to new episodes of Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Binge episodes 1, 2, and 3 on May 21st, and episodes 4, 5, and 6 on June 4th. Ad-free at Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. I'm Clayton English. I'm Greg Lott. And this is Season 2 of the War on Drugs podcast. podcasts. It's just a compassionate choice to allow players all reasonable means to care for themselves.

Music stars Marcus King, John Osborne from Brothers Osborne. We have this misunderstanding of what this quote-unquote drug ban is. Benny the Butcher. Brent Smith from Shinedown. We got B-Real from Cypress Hill. NHL enforcer Riley Cote. Marine Corvette. MMA fighter Liz Karamush.

What we're doing now isn't working and we need to change things. Stories matter and it brings a face to them. It makes it real. It really does. It makes it real. Listen to new episodes of the War on Drugs podcast season two on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And to hear episodes one week early and ad-free with exclusive content,

subscribe to Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. We need something different. Bottom line, to me, is that they've created a structure that is pretty much untouchable. They made laws that pretty much they govern themselves. You can't hold them accountable, and they're not going to hold themselves accountable. You know, we've created something.

We have something inside New York, and it's in a lot of different states. I don't know if y'all have it out there in Houston, but we have something called a crisis management system in which a lot of people from our community, we got ex-gang people, we got people who came home from prison, we got people who will respect the credible messages within the community who conflict resolute.

They're actually the ones stopping the violence inside. The New York Police Department is not stopping any violence. They're actually creating more violence than they're stopping. Like, you know, we have three different organizations that I work with firsthand. We have GMAX, we have Man Up, and we have Life Camp. Erica Ford, Chandu McFadden, and A.T. Mitchell. A.T. Mitchell and Erica Ford were pretty much like the architects

of the crisis management inside New York State. And what they did was brothers who were formerly incarcerated that were in gangs, they came home, and they became the people that had more credible messaging and who had more respect in the communities than any police officer had. So they knew the temperature of the community, who was going on, they knew who was beating them

before it started. They had respect for the dudes, had respect for them. So they walking in the hood, finding out, yo, such and such, and I'm about to have beef. So they stopping the beef before it happened. They not just coming, arresting, and throwing people in prison. So that, for me, is a way better structure than the police. Because the police are coming to them to get the information.

The police are trying to figure out how they doing it. They got in one place in Brownsville that I know was one of the highest murder capitals, they haven't had a killing in about, I think they had about two, three years in this cash manhunt. You know what I'm saying? So these are things that I know are possible.

So that's why I don't believe the police. We don't really need the police. There should be some structure that when it gets to a certain point where it's past what we can do within the hood, then they come. But just like he said, just coming to the hood because somebody had a fight or because the dog

is in the tree or just patrolling our neighborhoods, we don't need that. Exactly. Why don't nobody ever say fuck the fire department or fuck the ambulance? Because they only come when there's a fire. And they put that on fire. And they do one job.

Exactly. They're not hyping and creating more drama inside the community. Imagine if the fire department came and just started setting other shit on fire. They put your house fire out and just set your car on fire or punch your brother in the face.

You'd be like, fuck the fire department too. But Bun made an important point about the police union, and I think you're right. I mean, there's the question of getting the political muscle to get rid of police unions, and there's the question of do we regulate it? But the problem is regulating the police union is challenging for the same reason that the first thing is challenging, because

to create laws that regulate the police union, you've got to fight against the police union lobbies in the city. So ultimately, to me, the thing we need to do is expand our voting base. Right. Black people vote. But we need to we need to be very articulate about what we're voting for. We need to expand the number of people that vote and we need to be able to overpower the police union vote. Because right now there's a lot of mayors, including the mayor of Minneapolis, that said, look, I'm not going to I can't say that I want to defund police. Because even though he what does that mean exactly when they say defund the police?

They mean take the money that's going currently into the police and put it in other areas. Because a lot of people feel like that means that we just going to fire all the police. And suddenly, you know, your grandmama get knocked in the head and ain't nobody to call. Right. That's not it. The idea is that we take the funds that are going out of the police, into the police, and put them into other areas where they could be used. Because right now, even the police themselves are being stretched really thin in terms

of what they're asked to do. They got to get the cat out the tree. They got to resolve a fight. They did that in Camden, New Jersey. They defunded the police. Yes. And I live in Philly, so I'm 10 minutes from Camden, New Jersey. Yes. They defunded the police. Yes. Right. And I live in Philly, so I'm 10 minutes from Camden.

What was the result of that? Murders went down. Robberies went down. Arrests went down. The one thing that did go up, though, and this is interesting, and I talk about this in my book. I have a book called Nobody, which looks at this in Ferguson, is the number of tickets for dumb shit went up. So the number of tickets for people not wearing bicycle helmets went up by four. You know why? Because the police ain't got shit else to do.

So part of what we got to do is not turn the police into tax collectors for the city. But that's why you defund, and that's why you can reduce the police force slowly, because you don't need them as much. That's the point. We got to imagine a world where we don't need police anymore. And that's why Bunn's point is important about, you know, are reforms acceptable? Yes, they are. As long as they continue to keep at the end,

as our goal, a world where police are not necessary and where we understand that right now policing is the problem. It's not a solution to our problem. It is the problem. Necessary because poverty is violent. So if you eliminate poverty, if you eliminate conditions inside the communities, like he said, the suburbs, there's nobody in the suburbs because there's no reason for crime to be committed.

You know what I'm saying? Exactly. So if you eliminate the reason for crime to be committed and you put these monies into the communities, you make sure people have jobs, you don't cut some of you and then say, you know, oh, we need to police. Of course you give them nothing else.

This is how they survive. Some of you, you buy those sneakers for the summer, they're hanging out. You take out all the programs. There's no sports this summer. So what do you think is going to happen in these communities? You know, so it doesn't make sense. So we got to create a system.

We got to create a structure that eliminates the reason for the police, and then we don't need the police. Exactly. And we got to inform people about what these budgets are for, right? Like when we talk about defunding the police, I'll give you a perfect example. You watch TV. You see the police throw tear gas, you see the police throw pepper spray, you see the police shoot rubber bullets, right?

Like, we pay for that. That comes out of the city budget. Now, there's no other use for tear gas, pepper spray, rubber bullets, riot gear, shields. There's no other use for that except against the citizens. There's no other scenario. Like, if somebody robbed a bank, they ain't throwing tear gas at them. They're not shooting rubber bullets. That's for engagement with the citizens

of the city. Why would citizens pay for the police to throw that shit and use that shit against them? Most people don't really understand that. Our vote, there's a billion dollar budget for the police on the table in Houston, right? Our vote comes up tomorrow. And so we've been trying to inform people about it to contact their congresspeople and at least say, look, let's put the vote off right now.

Like, we got a lot of other things going on. going to use this moment where we're out worried about George Floyd and police brutality to basically give the police another billion dollars while we're looking to the left. They're going to break bread with them on the right. And so they're trying to have a moratorium on this budget spending until the public can be more aware of what they're spending the money on. You know what I'm saying? And so that's the thing. When Mark talks about voting and broadening the scope of the vote, and that comes with information and education. And so everybody I talk to when they're like, man, voting don't mean nothing. Voting ain't going to change shit. I say, look, you got a partner. Let's say your homeboy catch a case. My son, I know you know what I'm talking about. Your homeboy catch a case, right? You be like damn that's fucked up. Um, what court you in like what what court you got to go to?

They tell you the court. Oh, you got judge so and so nigga you finna ride like like he finna lay the hammer on you Yeah, I got you know that there are judge who if judges in America that are infamous for Excessive sentencing when it comes to people of color. A judge is an appointed position in cities. Specific judges in certain districts, that's a voter's thing. So if you want to change the way you and your homies are

getting prosecuted, because obviously you're done as soon as you walk in the courtroom with them dreads and some tattoos, it's over for you. You're going to throw the whole library at you. You're going to throw the whole book. You're going to throw the library at you. Not just the book. You're going to throw the whole library at you. So that's why you got to vote. You got to vote them kind of dudes

out of office. Hey, hey, Mr. Kweli. What up? What's up, OG? What's up? What's up? Mark, my song, Nori, was good. Yes, yes, yes. So, look, look, I was waiting for this question for Kweli, right? I was good. Yes, yes, yes. So, look, look. I was waiting for this question for Kweli, right?

I was waiting for this. I promise, I promise. I want to ask all y'all all together, right? All of us, we're all involved with this. We're all black. And we all, you know, they say black people, we forgive people too much, right? But me, on this situation, I'm ready to invite the brother back to the barbecue and even make him a plate

of potato salad. I'm talking about Kanye West. He touched me when I seen him protest with the... Not the money part. The money part is whatever, right? That's great. I respect that. I love that too.

But it feels like he's trying to come back. I. I love that, too. But it feels like he's trying to come back. I'm looking from the outside in, but it feels like he's trying to come back. I'll start with you, Kweli, but you dig. I mean, well, shout out to 88 Keys. I had a meeting

with Kanye. I hung out with Kanye all day a few months ago, a couple months ago. I think maybe January or February. 88 Keys and me and Kanye went out to dinner. I mean, went out to breakfast. We talked a bunch. And he said talking points. He talked about how he understood that aligning himself with Candace Owens was a mistake. He didn't go as far in that conversation to say he wasn't down with Trump no more. But the things that he said led me to believe that maybe he was on that path. And I've already spoken out publicly, privately. I've used a firm hand. I've used to try to get to fly with molasses. I've done everything I could. I've already said what I can to Kanye about Trump. So he's a grown man. I don't feel like it's my place to tell him

not to like Trump more than I've already done it. But I was hopeful. And then a couple months after he said those things to me, he went back in the press and was bigging Trump up again. So I was like, okay, maybe he's still confused. But I will say as far as his recent things, people come to me and say, why doesn't Kanye speak out? And the problem is, and Mark, you know this very well,

there's a lot of artists and celebrities that speak out and don't know what the fuck they talking about. You know, so... I started this conversation off with that speech. I said, listen, I, like, you know, I know I don't live what the fuck they talking about. You know, so... I started this conversation off with that speech. I said, listen. Yeah. I, like, you know, I know I live in a... I don't live in a bubble bubble,

but I live in a certain bubble, so I must think some of the smartest brothers I know, that's why I hit all you motherfuckers in here on me. Go ahead, go ahead. No, but that's what it is. I mean, why would I want to hear Kanye's opinion on what's going on? Like, even if...

The only thing I want to hear Kanye talk about is Yeezys and samples at this point. You know what I'm saying? They said the reporter said, let's speak with Ja Rule. Yeah, yeah, with Ja Rule. I don't want to hear what Ja Rule has to say. I don't want to hear what Kanye got to say about any of this. But what I will say is, if he had come out and dissed Trump, people would call him a hypocrite. If he had come out and supported the families and dissed Trump, people will call him a hypocrite. If he had come out and supported

the families and diss Trump, people will call him a hypocrite. So I do believe that the brother's smart enough to know that the best thing he could have did was to send that young man, send George Floyd's daughter to school, give money, protest with the people. All those things I applaud, I think is admirable, and I think that was the right thing for him to do. I still think it's our job as his peers to call him out for his hypocrisy and his love for Trump, but I applaud what he did. I think, for me,

I think Kanye is so confused, right? He doesn't have a position. That's a very dangerous person for me. You know what I'm saying? When you flip-flop, you say this, you say that, you go here, you go here. Like, his integrity is

in question with me. So I don't know who you're going to be. It's like somebody stabbing you in the back and then they say sorry. Kanye has done so much damage to our culture. The shit he did wasn't just, oh, you like Trump. He damaged the culture. You know what I'm saying? He led people astray. He put

people... He was giving GOP token points that were lies. He was giving validity to somebody that he didn't even realize was damaging us. Or he realized, or he didn't, or he did it for whatever his political gain, his financial gain, whatever it was.

It was so dangerous to me that at one point I said Kanye West was the most dangerous black person in America at one time. Yeah, and just to add on to what you're saying, I just add to your point, I want you to finish. But you're absolutely right because me, people know I'm online a lot, I'll be tweeting a lot and I see the direct influences. I see not just one or two individuals, I see whole groups of black people.

And granted, there's a lot of white boys in digital black face, and there's a lot of bots and all that. But that's not what I'm talking about in this conversation. I'm talking about I see a lot of black people form groups around the idea that we can now like MAGA. We can now like Trump. And I feel like Kanye is directly responsible for that. And then when he was at HBTU, sitting there with Trump's talking points. Like, people was going to him saying music. He's like, yoU sitting there with Trump's talking points. Like, people was going to him, saying music. He's like, yo, I'm with Trump.

I love Trump. The Republican Party was the one that freed the blacks. You don't know that. And he's saying this, but he's not giving them proper education. He's giving some talking points that somebody gave you. He's not saying that not this Republican Party. The Democratic Party used to be the Republican Party. Then they switched positions.

But he's just saying the words. And people are like, word. And they're just hearing things. He don't know what he's talking about. He's just using talking points. And he's trying to get, you know, then one minute you're with the church. Then one minute, you know, you're a sick fuck. You want to, like, you're just too confusing for me.

So I can't allow you in my house. Because I don't know what you're going to fuck, you want your life. And you're just too confusing for me. So I can't allow you in my house. You can't go to my picnic, because I don't know what you're going to do. Not in my picnic. All right, Mark. Can he go to the picnic? I can tell you where he goes. He can come to the picnic. Oh, he heard Bun talking. Okay, Bun talking? Yeah, Bun. Where'd he go?

Hold on, Bun. You're breaking up. Hold on. Barbecue. He's going to bring that with raisins in it. That's what he's going to do for your bottle. Yeah, I'm going to go. Can y'all hear me now? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, that's why you can't bring Kanye to the barbecue

because he's going to bring potato salad, but it's going to be potato salad with raisins in it. You hungry? I mean, when Kanye said that shit about the Republican Party freed the slaves, I texted the nigga. I was like, yo, that's that's that you spread incorrect information directly. And what he did was he said to send him the links. I sent him the links to all the information like you missed this, this, that. He said, put this in a put this in a screenshot so I could post it out so so people could see both sides argument.

So I put it in a screenshot. He said, no, that's too much information. I was like, brother, if you don't want the information, then you need to stop speaking. I condensed it, right? I condensed the information and he tweeted it out. He tweeted it out, but I think it was Steve Stout who gave him those talking points

because then he was like, he tweeted out something that Steve Stout had told him after that. So I'm like, okay, you talking to people who may be good people but they don't know shit about politics. Some people want to have an insightful conversation and grow and some people don't. I remember, it's probably been six, seven

years now, I talked to Kanye and he was saying some wild shit. He was in Chicago and I made my counter argument. I hear what you're saying. You got all these facts, but I ain't fucking with your facts because they go against what I already think. If somebody says some shit like that,

that means that they're not trying to grow. They're not trying to learn. I don't dispose of people. You couldn't have said that. No, he definitely said that shit. No, he said that shit. I ain't fucking with your facts. That's what I already think.

And he's crazy because there's conscious people in his circle, right? Like, GLC is in his circle. He's super conscious. The brother Malik is in his circle. They're super conscious. I know for a fact that they tried to sit down with him before the Trump meeting and go over, like, a list of things. Like, this is what you need to be asking for.

Like, these are the things that you need to be talking about. You know what I'm saying? You need to be talking about, you know, helping the children in the cities of Chicago. You need to be talking about police reform. You need to be talking about prison reform. They gave him all of that shit. But that's, this is a problem that we have with the police, right? Not to get off of Kanye because I don't have a problem staying on his case for a minute. But that we have with the police, right? Not to get off of Kanye,

because I don't have a problem staying on his case for a minute, but that's the problem with police. Police get training. They get sensitivity training. They get taught rules of engagement, what's legal and what's not legal, and interactions and during escalation.

But none of that means nothing if they don't want to implement that shit. So you can teach police the right way to engage with a community, but if they don't want to implement that shit so you can teach the right way to engage with a community but if they don't receive it and they don't implement it it's redundant and that's the problem with kanye you can give him all the conscious facts and information that you want to give him but to be honest the brother wants to believe that he knows what's best for everybody and i I don't know if that's a, if that's a by-product of his mental illness. I don't know if he's bipolar.

Like, I don't know what exactly his mental illness situation is. Right. But, and not to like deafen the voice of people with mental health, but even they need to be aware of like, I just don't think the nigga taking his medicine sometimes. You know what I'm saying?

Like we dealt with that with Pimp. You know, Pimp had mental health, and Pimp didn't like taking his medicine sometimes because it would leave him somewhat numb, right? Like, not able to really deal with his emotions and be in touch with his emotions, so he wouldn't want to take his medicine. But then now you purely acting off of emotion,

and that's not going to work either. Like, you have to have some sense of reason. I just saw that John Legend said that he ain't really been dealing with Kanye that much. And John Legend is woken up. Like John gets it. Right. You know, he's in the space. He's active.

He puts his money where his mouth is. You know what I'm saying? And so when there's only so much that people can try to talk to somebody and when until they realize that this dude is not trying to hit it like he said i'm not fucking with your facts right now you know and that's why he told that's why he told sway you don't have all the answers because he believes he has all the answers right and you don't you can make good music but that don't mean nothing when it comes to society's, you know, systemic racism and our social standards and everything else that we deal with. And Kweli is right, man. Everybody don't need to be talking.

Motherfuckers need to really sit the fuck down and shut the fuck up when it comes to speaking about this shit. Just because you got a platform like you have to be really understanding of the weight and the power of your platform. Right? And so, there are a lot of kids who hear Kanye talk about God and talk about all this type of shit and think Kanye's got it. Why else would he be as famous and as

popular as he is if he didn't know what he was talking about? That ain't got shit to do with nothing. You ain't gotta know what you're talking about to make a good record. That's two totally different things. It's so dangerous. And like my son says, that level of power and influence is dangerous because of how

detrimental it can be. You know what I'm saying? Send and make messages not only sends people in the wrong direction, sometimes it just makes people indifferent. It puts people in a position where I don't know who the fuck led the two, so fuck it, I'm dead. I'm out of it.

Yeah, exactly. You don't think that was like his version of saying, yo, I'm trying to make a step towards the right direction because he went to actual Chicago, walked with the people. I think that's his version of doing it. I don't think everyone... That doesn't mean he has good Maybe. That's his thing.

That doesn't mean he has good intentions. That makes for good optics. That shit makes for good optics. I don't believe it. I see people were faking their black... They had a model who showed up to the march, held up a sign, took a picture, and left.

Just standing on a corner that she knew the march was going to walk past. As soon as the march, held up a sign, took a picture, and left. Right. You know, like, just, like, standing on a corner that she knew the march was going to walk past. As soon as the marchers came, she stood there, held up a sign, and left, posted it on social media, and now she's trying to give the appearance that she's woke. This shit is about optics. The other thing is...

I don't believe that shit. I don't believe that, because there's a million... Look how many people got killed in Chicago this weekend. Like, 84 people shot, 18 people died in Chicago. 24 hours. That was in 24 hours. That's insane.

And the thing is, it's another piece of this. I mean, the cynical read is, and I think it's fair to beat some of the cynical Kanye, skeptical at least, is giving $2 million when you're declared a billionaire by Forbes is not an extraordinary act. I mean, you almost have to give $2 million donations for tax purposes, right?

So he could have given it to a lot of places. Especially when your homies is giving $50. Right, right. Exactly. But the other piece of this is, it's not that Kanye doesn't love black people. I never thought Kanye didn't love black people. And even a white racist can see that George Floyd shouldn't have died that way. Even if they don't give a fuck, they can still know that he shouldn't have died that way.

So to me, showing that you are upset about George Floyd is a sign of any kind of conversion. The issue with Kanye is not that he doesn't see black poverty and black death and black pain. The question is, how does he make sense of it? How does he process it? If you think that black death is your own choice, if you think slavery is a choice. Kanye thinks slavery is fucked up. He just thinks when he says it's a choice, it's his analysis of how we ended up there. That's the problem. Similarly, if you have a bootstraps narrative that says the black people are poor and black people are dying and it's because they don't unify, they don't organize, they don't do what they need to do, instead of blaming the structures and the institutions that made him a billionaire and that make us

on the wrong side of so much vulnerability, then that's the issue with Kanye. So Kanye marching with people against somebody getting killed in broad daylight, that doesn't mean shit to me. I need to see Kanye say the problem is the fact that black people are vulnerable in the first place. The problem is that black people are jobless.

The fact is that black people in the middle of COVID-19, which should be a universal illness, black people are the ones dying from it at a disproportionate rate. And so that kind of analysis is what I need from Kanye. But let me say that differently. I don't need it from Kanye. I just need it from Kanye if he's going to talk. I'm okay if Kanye

don't talk. I don't make beats. I don't rap. I'm not good at it. And if I went out there and rapped, I would rap as well as Kanye does social analysis. I don't do it. You know what I'm saying? And that's exactly the problem. So it's not just about Kanye.

It's about getting artists and intellectuals and activists who have an analysis who have something to offer. So when Quad does it, when my son does it, when Bun does it, it's different because y'all are informed by these issues. I ain't got the only platform

for this shit. I want y'all to talk as much as I want to talk. But if you don't have the analysis, then don't do it. And it's not just artists. There's intellectuals

or people with PhDs that don't have the right analysis. There's people with PhDs that are saying the same dumb shit that I'm mad at Kanye for. So I don't want to hear a Boyce Watkins analysis any more than I want to hear a Kanye analysis.

Because it's the same problem. It's the same problem. That's the issue for me, man. I think it's amazing that Kim is the one that has a level of awareness. Right. It's really true. It's really true. It's really true. Kim is the one that has

the compassion. I feel like Kim's got the compassion. Hold on. The OG in the bad zone. Yeah. In the bad zone, he driving. But yeah, like he said, man, Kim has, she has more compassion. She seems to just think about things before she talks.

Kanye has a God complex and that's what the issue is. Yeah. And it's really what it is. He believes that he knows more than everybody on every subject. He could just find out about it yesterday. She has the empathy. She has the awareness of, I mean, I don't know if her dad was a party or not,

but she's Armenian. Damn, those sound like some good points. He was my dad. And he lost him. We lost him, man. But like you say, yeah, she got the talking points. And she's doing the work that's the other thing what good is it to have analysis if you don't do shit

and that's the other problem, it's people who got plenty of analysis and don't do shit it's not that I don't have criticisms of anybody who's doing reform work, I'm a radical but at least there are people who are home right now who wouldn't be home if not for Kim Kardashian's work, it's people who are free that wouldn't be free, And that shit gotta count for

something. That's all I'm saying. It does. That's right. I think that Kim's family, the thing that they're best at is optics and is publicity and is media. And so I think more

than anything, the cynical argument would be Kim understands and her family understand the optics better than Kanye. But I also think I'm an optimist, you know, and I'm also I'm also I'm pro-black, but I believe in the human spirit. You know, and I would like to think that when I see I don't even know the names. I don't even know that I don't follow any of the gossipy stuff. But I saw like the sisters was arguing there was a clip that went on and went viral one of them was upset because she's like i'm so famous and they're starting to critique the fame machine that has made them famous and i think when you grow older you have children and kim kardashian got black children you know what i'm saying so it's like when you grow older

and you see the world and you have a chance to move out of that fame machine and you're able to be like, wow, okay, this affects my black children as well. And when she talks about getting a law degree, when she talks about what am I going to just be famous for being Kim Kardashian? I think we see the growth in her and we want to see

the growth in Kanye that we're not seeing. I think when we see, it's not even growth, we've seen decline in Kanye. College dropout, we thought he seeing. I think, it's not even growth, we've seen decline in college. College dropped by a week. We thought he knew. We thought he was 100% clear. To your point, when you said Kim is doing the work, she's actually getting people

out of prison. Kanye is doing the reverse. He's getting people killed because he's validating to white people why these black people don't deserve anything because they made the choice to be there. You know what I'm saying? They need to do these things. If they do something better, it can change.

So white people take that and say, look, even Kanye knows. You know what I'm saying? So they actually are on two different ends of the spectrum when you talk about this situation. And I want to tell you something. We're doing something, right? And I don't want to forget it. Breonna Taylor, the sister who was killed in Kentucky,

was shot by the police eight times. They shot over 40 rounds into her home. No knock warrant. Kicked in the door. The boyfriend mid-order night, he hears somebody kick the door. They don't say to the police, they don't say nothing. He fires one warning shot.

They shoot through the house. They never even walk through the door. Over 30 plus shots. Eight of them went into her. The other ones shot into a bedroom where her little sister and her daughter was at. But they weren't there. They would usually be there. It would have been three women had been dead if they had

been home. They charged him with attempted murder because he shot one warning shot after they kicked him and didn't say nothing. The man they was looking for never lived in that house. But he also had already been in custody nine hours before they even did. They even

came with the warmth. So everything is fucked up. So we need these officers that they haven't been fired. Some of them, you know, they're on death's duty. Nothing has happened to them, right? They're still working. They're still working, everything. Nothing has happened.

He just got out of prison. Her boyfriend, for the 10 money they did, just dropped the charges because he had a lawyer, a black lawyer, who said, I don't even get why you're in here. So she let him go. But we're still fighting to get something to happen for her. And it's

unfortunate. You know, I work with a lot of women and they point out every day. I was on a conversation with Janelle Monet and Marsha Ambrose and a couple other of us. We had a conversation and they said, why is it that nobody cares about Black

women? Like, why aren't our brothers as vocal about Black women dying as we are about them? That's right. And it touched me. It really touched me. You know? So what we're doing, they're putting out, the sisters are putting out this whole I think it's Alicia Keys,

it's Cardi B, so many sisters. They're putting out PSA. And I've been, you know, Until Freedom, my organization, Tamika put it together. And I've been tasked to get as many of my brothers of influence to repost it. When you see it go out from these sisters,

for us to repost it, stand in solidarity. I ask y'all, I ask all the brothers of influence to have platforms to do the same thing. I want to just add on. Thank you for saying that, my son. I think it's very important. Me, personally, I've been paying attention. Your journey as an artist and as an activist is very important to me. It's very, very inspirational to me. And I want to appreciate you

for what you're doing. I think the work that Until Freedom does and Tamika and everybody down with that organization has been powerful. Like I got people in my family in New York who are not political who text me and be like, yo, you think I should support Until Freedom? And I'm like, yes, yes. And that shows me that y'all doing the work because y'all reaching the people who don't even really pay attention all the time, you know? So, and I will say, I'm glad you made that point because we have, we have a number of brothers on this call. In our movement, there's a huge, huge strain to patriarchy. Like, like I'm a black man.

I'm a straight black man. I have fallen into the same traps of misogyny and homophobia and all these things that straight black men generally fall into. I'm guilty of all of it. I've tried to grow as a human being. But when I went when I first went to meet the Dream Defenders in Florida, when I first went to Ferguson over to my ground thing, I saw black women on the front lines of the struggle more than anybody. And that's not scientific. That's my anecdote. My personal viewpoint is like, and I gotta say,

I saw black women, straight black women and gay black women on the front lines murdering a lot of people. And a lot of these straight brothers would be like the Black Lives Matter of the Day and these women don't care about the black men. They're the ones I didn't see. The people who talk the most shit online,

they're the ones I don't see in the front lines. So when you see her name, when you see people talk about Breonna Taylor and you see people talk about Sandra Bland, we have to do as men, what we ask white people to do for black people. We have to not just say that we stand with women. We have to actively be anti-sexist.

We have to actively be anti-misogynist to make sure that we are active in the way that we are uplifting these women. And that means we got to ride for them. Because I agree, like when Mike Brown died in 2014, Sandra Bland was the name we should have been saying. Renisha McBride was the name

we should have been saying. All of our bigide was a name we should have been saying. All of our big campaigns, whether it's Rodney King, Trayvon, George Floyd, it's always a black man. And we have to be able to have a nationwide outrage over Breonna Taylor the same way we do over George Floyd. And black trans women die at a higher rate than anybody else. I mean, I think the national life expectancy of black trans women is 35. If we say Black Lives Matter, that means every single national life expectancy of black trans women is 35. We say Black Lives Matter. That means every single black life, all black lives matter. And that means that we got

to have these campaigns for them, too. We're in Minnesota protesting for justice for all black people. And a trans woman, Iyana Dior, was beaten senselessly by 30 people in Minnesota at the same time. Like, that shit can't happen. All black lives gotta matter, and we gotta be willing to march and campaign and tear down shit and fight for laws that affect them as well. Everybody. And if we don't do that, then we won't get anywhere.

Black women have historically been on the front lines. Through every civil rights movement that we've ever had in this country, black women have always been on the front line because black women know what happens to black men in society. And that's why, if you look at women in general, women in our country always compromise for their men, right?

Women, you know, black women, you know, didn't join the feminism movement until later because they stood with black men for civil rights. So they were behind the ball on that. Black women know how important it is to have a black man in the house with the children, which is why they stand up so strong for black men. They know what what police do to black men. They know what police do to black men, right? They know what racist, what the Klan has historically done to black men, right? As far as demasculating and cutting off with penises and all these different things, right? And so as bad as it is for them, they still put their own personal needs to decide to stand in for black men. We need to look at

every black woman as we look at our mother in that same way. That's the reality. We look at black women and we understand that they're mothers, but we don't hold them and we quit. I'm out. I'm done.

And so we're going to be quick, right? Every black woman is potentially somebody's mother, somebody's sister. We have to I went to, there was a... You might sound like a Star Wars fan. Yeah, I was going to say, I was going to say, I wasn't that way. ...Oriana's birthday, right? They need to speak for all the black sisters. I'm sorry, I apologize for that. But yeah, and so when we went there, me and Trey the Troop went to this rally,

and they were like, well, we weren't going to let any black men speak. But if y'all want to say something, no, we're not here to talk. We're here to support y'all. We're here to back y'all up. We're here in solidarity in the same way that y'all show up to everything that we do. Right. And silently but proudly march with us and stand in front of us. You know what I'm saying? It's our turn now. Today is your day to speak and it's our turn to sit in the back silently holding y'all down. And we just got to learn to do that on a daily basis.

That's it. I learned how to do that. I learned how to do that and do it with black men. You know, I watched my sister Tamika go into a space that was uncomfortable because she knew it was benefiting for us. And she intentionally went in there

knowing that white women and other people were going to attack her. And I stood in that space around with women, and I took lead. I let them take the lead, and I followed, and I helped, and I filled in gaps. And she took a lot.

You don't even understand the shit that she took behind closed doors in those rooms where white women were trying to tell her about, you know, what is black issues have to do with women's issues? What does black have to do with women's issues? You know, those are all the things they have. I don't understand. What is being black? We're talking about women. Why are you talking about being black? She had to firmly stand there and make sure that black women were centered and everything. That's what made

her a target. Her not being willing to denounce Minister Farrakhan. Her not standing firm in that and taking all this pressure. I understand the plight of the black. Let's make some noise for that. the Caracons, you know, standing firm in that and taking all this pressure, man, you know. So, I understand the plight of the Black woman. Let's make some noise for that.

Everybody, everybody. All Black women, big up to me as well. Very proud of them. Very proud of them. So, yeah. Let's not forget with Tracy Morgan. Let's not forget Let's not forget with Tracy Morgan Let's not forget Tina Fey

When Tina Fey tried to say that It's breaking up again Right You're talking about that bitch is the new black America but the white or the white woman Bitch is the new black. The plight of the white woman is no bitches are new black. Yeah. She said bitches are new black. I didn't even hear that one.

When Hillary Clinton was leading in the polls and remember Tina Fey was doing the Sarah Palin on SNL. She did a skit where she said just remember bitches are new black and then Tracy came next week, and what did he say? He said Black is the New... He said

something funny to respond to her, but you know, but the community, the Black community, I don't think... I'm a fan of Tina Fey, but that was very tone-deaf. It was very tone-deaf, and the timing was wrong, and it just wasn't something dope to say at all. And Tracy had to come.

He was still a cast member on SNL at that time. And it was something. I imagine that conversation happened like after the show. Like, yo, that ain't going to work. You know what I mean? Right. Like, fuck is you doing? Right.

Like, fuck out of here. And I'm sure black people had to educate her. And then her being a very open-minded person was like, you know what, let's talk about it. Let's, you know, let me give you, cause keep in mind, she's the show, she was the head writer, right? She was one of the main producers for the show and she didn't debate his issue or whatever. She was open up, open-minded enough to let him come on and be like, you know what, well, tell me that on camera. Let's have this conversation in real time. Right. I wanted to add to the conversation real quick.

I've been taking notes about, because, you know, when my son brought up Breonna Taylor, the uprising, you know, and if you do movement work, you learn to call what they call riots, you learn to call them uprisings. You know, The uprising sort of helped to reopen the case for Breonna Taylor.

And so people, Martin Luther King was famous for saying that a riot is the language of the unheard. But too often, we don't actually see the actual, that sounds romantic, it sounds good, but we don't actually quantify the tangents in that. And when King was murdered in 1968, Mark, you correct me because you know more about history than I do probably, but the Civil Rights Act was passed shortly after the King riots, right? Yeah, another Civil Rights Act. Yep, yep, that's exactly right. I want to list the things just for this conversation that I've noticed that I've seen a change in sensitive uprisings in Minneapolis over George Floyd. And starting with SNL, you know, a friend of mine, Jimmy Fallon, who was silent about doing blackface. He apologized for blackface on TV and then brought Jane Elliott on his program on Tonight Show. And for me to see Jane Elliott on Tonight Show and to see Jimmy Fallon apologize for blackface, that was a good thing. The NFL apologizing for not taking the players' protests seriously came out of

these uprisings. The Confederate flag removal from the Marines and the Army, we don't fuck with the Confederate flag no more, that came out of these uprisings. Bob Johnson, a conservative billionaire, is now pro-reparations publicly that came out of these uprisings the officers who

got arrested defund the police mark you said you were radical right so defund the police as a concept which is different than abolish the police but defund the police move from the fringe to the to the more moderate and more mainstream now you got liberals and people who are going to vote democrat and people who don't consider themselves radicals saying we should defund the police. I've seen videos of gang solidarity. I've seen the Latin Kings linking up with the Bloods. I've seen, you know, we've seen that before, but I've seen it come as a result of this tragedy with George Floyd and the uprising. The last thing I noticed, and the thing that made me most excited, when I seen the chief of Chicago police

saying after a week of uprising, the police are just exhausted. So if we can just, if we can all band together and only in a week exhaust the Chicago Police Department, imagine what we could do in a year of sustained movement like this. Thanks for joining us for another episode of Drink Champs, hosted by yours truly, DJ EFN and NORE. Please make sure to follow us on all our socials.

It's at Drink Champs across all platforms, at TheRealNoriega on IG, at Noriega on Twitter. Mine is at Who's Crazy on IG, at DJ EFN on Twitter. And most importantly, stay up to date with the latest releases, news and merch by going to drink champs.com. The medal of honor is the highest military decoration in the United States. Recipients have done the improbable, the unexpected showing immense bravery and sacrifice in the United States. Recipients have done the improbable, the unexpected, showing immense bravery and sacrifice in the name of something much bigger than themselves.

This medal is for the men who went down that day. On Medal of Honor, Stories of Courage, you'll hear about these heroes and what their stories tell us about the nature of bravery. Listen to Medal of Honor on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Why is a soap opera Western like Yellowstone so wildly successful? The American West with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater Podcast Network. So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th, where we'll delve into stories of the West and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today. Listen to the American West with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

Your gut microbiome and those healthy bacteria can actually have positive effects. Your mental health, your immunity, your risk of cancer, almost any disease under the sun. This week on Dope Labs, Titi and I dive into the world of probiotics, the hype, the science, and what your gut bacteria are really doing behind the scenes. From drinks and gummies to probiotic pillows. Yes, really, probiotic pillows. We're breaking down what's legit and what's just brilliant marketing.

With expert insight from gastroenterologist Dr. Roshi Raj. Listen to Dope Labs on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. And it's going to take us to heal us. It's Mental Health Awareness Month, and on a recent episode of Just Heal with Dr. J, the incomparable Taraji P. Henson stopped by to discuss how she's discovered peace on her journey.

I never let that little girl inside of me die. To hear this and more things on the journey of healing, you can listen to Just Heal with Dr. J from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. AT&T, connecting changes everything. This is an iHeart Podcast.