Drink Champs - Episode 404 w/ Erick Sermon

Episode Date: April 5, 2024

N.O.R.E. & DJ EFN are the Drink Champs in this episode the champs chop it up with the legend himself, Erick Sermon! Drink Champs alumni and hip-hop legend Erick Sermon joins us once again! Erick shares his journey in hip-hop, from his come up, changing the game with Parrish Smith and their group EPMD and much more! Erick talks about the importance of owning your publishing, and shares stories of Def Jam, Michael Jackson, Wu Tang Clan and much much more. Lots of great stories that you don’t want to miss! Make some noise for Erick Sermon!!! 💐💐💐🏆🏆🏆 🎉🎉🎉 Sign up for Underdog Fantasy HERE with promo code DRINK CHAMPS and get a $100 first deposit match: https://play.underdogfantasy.com/p-drink-champs *Subscribe to Patreon NOW for exclusive content, discount codes, M&G’s + more:  🏆* https://www.patreon.com/drinkchamps *Listen and subscribe at https://www.drinkchamps.com Follow Drink Champs: https://www.instagram.com/drinkchamps https://www.twitter.com/drinkchamps https://www.facebook.com/drinkchamps https://www.youtube.com/drinkchamps DJ EFN https://www.crazyhood.com https://www.instagram.com/whoscrazy https://www.twitter.com/djefn https://www.facebook.com/crazyhoodproductions N.O.R.E. https://www.instagram.com/therealnoreaga https://www.twitter.com/noreagaSee omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

This is an iHeart Podcast. Hear insightful, entertaining discussions on today's important health and wellness topics on the Health Discovered podcast from WebMD. Through in-depth conversations with experts, Health Discovered covers everything from tips for healthier living to the latest on therapy and mental health. My goal is to really de-stigmatize mental health treatment and looking at it from a whole health perspective. Physical health and mental health can be intertwined. Listen to WebMD Health Discovered on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts.

And it's Drink, Chess, Motherfucking Podcast. We'll be right back. biggest players in the most professional unprofessional podcast and your number one source for drunk facts where every day is new year's eve it's time for drink champs drink up what it could be hope these would assume me this is your boy n-o-r-e what up it's dj efn and this is drink Champ's Happy Hour. Make some noise! Now, when we talk about this brother right here, we talk about our icon. We talk about our legend.

This man has had three or four or five careers. Was part of one of the most legendary groups of all times. Classic album after classic album. Then he went on for his own career. Classic after classic after classic. Then he can turn off his producer hat and produce the shit out of you.

And had you sounding right on these streets, the people are still sampling him and his BMI checks are crazy. To this day. To this day. To this day. In case you don't know who we talk about. We talk about the one only.

Eric motherfuckers. We got to eat though. Spell my name right too. Spell your name right. We was on one of the most one of my favorite flights ever. That was legendary. Like, it was rock.

Excuse me. Big Daddy Kane to the left. Ja Rule in front of you. Me, you, Redman. Right. Y'all should have had a documentary. That was like a real version of Soul Plane, in my opinion. Leo called me like, Eric, how'd you like the plane?

The plane's a hotel. It was a slow plane, in my opinion. Leo called me like, Eric, how'd you like the plane? Right, right. The plane's a hotel. That's people was, they thought we was really like on something crazy. Like, what are y'all on? Everybody kept asking me. I'm like, it's a plane. But again, it was big, though. You know what I'm saying?

But Slickwick was in the back. Slickwick's house, let's be clear. Slickwick bullied us all. Yeah, yeah. Slickwick came in there. He cleaned his bed like a cell. Like, are you in jail? Like, you walk in jail. You're like, this is my position. Yeah, shit. So he's taking off that mask. So when you hear him, he's like, crumbs. He means it.

He means it. So the talking was minimum. It was worse when he was younger. Right, right. Like, no type of vision. Wow. Like, not looking, whatever.

Because, again, the coolest nigga you ever, you know, Vincent Slick Rick was one of my favorite albums. You know what I'm saying? When you listen to the records, they were like that.

But Rick's mentality was like that. He's way friendlier now But then Nah Really Packed a weapon The whole night

I used to hear stories About Slick Rick Running around With a gun everywhere And then you see him now He's like Cool calm I feel like he always

Has a cane in his hand For some reason Like a pimp cane He's just one of those But you're right He had the whole Back of the plane He had the whole

Back of the plane He didn't share with no one He didn't share with no one but um red man was on the camera right i'm sitting back and i'm looking at these pictures and i'm like these shits are really really dope you think from the experience of us being in front the camera it's easy for us to turn over and and flip like that yeah maybe i think that reggie listen when i first met him we call him red man wegie, listen, when I first met him. We call him Redman. We don't call him Reggie. When I first met him, he was always a person where, remember it would be an apartment with sunglasses

on. When I first, when Redman first came in here in a yellow suit. Yellow two-piece and shades. Okay. I'm like, yo, this is ill. Like a two, you know, the jacket with the pants, but yellow though.

Looked like a zoot suit. No, the illest shit though crazy but reggie was always always like a person that even now with technology whatever the the new shit came out whatever new technology game whatever he had it he bought he his mind whatever he was so whatever he put his mind to he can do it so i wasn't even shocked about him doing cameras and doing his own videos whatever like that he always had the vision to do whatever you know what I'm saying

so I wasn't shocked by it you know what I'm saying now he's skydiving and that's the part that's really ill though too the skydiving part the skydiving which we asked him

and he says like the freedom that he gets which is crazy because again to jump out the plane. Because he started with the people where they hold you. Now it's just him rocking. Yeah, he's certified.

But the freedom that he got to do that. Because Dougie Fresh asked him, like, is it a 50-50 chance? You know what I'm saying? Like, are you going to make it? You know what I'm saying? But he sees silence in that whole shit. The older Redman gets, the kind of whiter he's become. He's become a white guy.

You're crazy about that. But you know what? When you speak to him, his mind is just another thing that whatever he found, he found something else. You know what I'm saying? Like I said, I don't know what type of piece that he got, but he found it. Right. So, you know, people look for that. But let's talk about why we was all on that plane anyway.

Leo Cohn. Yes. Who has been a great. That was a great interview with Leo Cohn. Oh, that's my man. He's been a great guy to me. Right. But I want to address something.

You know, Dame Dash, I don't want to say he's picking on him, but Dame Dash has an issue with him, right? I chose not to bring up Dame Dash in a Lior interview because I wanted to keep it positive, right? But, you know, it's something you can't avoid. Like, I don't look at Lior as a coach of old. Not me personally. Yeah, me personally.

He's personally came to me and made me a better artist. He told me, somebody had a little bit more money, and he said, if you stick with me, I'm going to give you a career. So I stuck with Lior. And I got a career.

I had a career. But Dame famously calls him a coach of vultures. Do you think he's... Is that a such thing? Can you be that when you're off the culture? Right. One thing that I know about Leo Cohen is the fact that in the beginning,

don't forget he managed... He managed... Rush management. Yeah, but he managed to run DMC first. Wow. Before rush management happened. So when rush management, he's there from the beginning.

That's the part you kind of gets confusing when you hear it. See, Dame had a different experience with him. Right. Because Dame is powerful. Don't forget, Rockefeller didn't really need them except for distribution. Right. So when Def Siam started taking credit, that's when I think it got ugly. But I'm like, you know, to a little count, he helped me.

Yeah. You know, again, he was the person that showed me what it was. But again, you can't take the hip-hop from him. Right. I watched him. I watched him be like, that shit's whack. That's not fly. It's not dope.

Like, not you. How do you know this shit? You know? Right. So around Russell, that's why Russell was the man in the back. Leo was the up front. You can't be the up front if you don't know shit. But for him to be like, that shit is horrible.

I don't know what that shit is. Get that bullshit out of here. And that's how he was. No hesitation. You know what I'm saying? So we did Crossover. Before I had Crossover, I had the last, the fourth album done. Okay. Right?

Gold Digger had Did What It Did. It was number one the whole nine. So we had this song on the fourth album called Don't Play Me, Play The Next Man. Trying to do a Crossover part. I mean, a Gold Digger part two. Right. Him and Russell. If you drop that record, your career is over.

I never. So imagine this. So I'm like me and Paris is amped on the record. So when I was in L.A., when I got the Cypress Hills cassette tape, you hear B-Real tell the story. Because, again, when I got the tape, I bring the cassette. I said, Cube, I got some shit called Cypress Hills. I want you to listen to it.

So I bring it to Cube and it's going to be set. But another story though, but Roger Troutman had just came out. Woo. So I took his new album and I went through it.

Wow. And then I heard whatever you want. I heard it. So I went home and sampled it. Wow. it So I went home And sampled it So then I went back To

Them And they said That's the one And then The night After that We was in the studio All of us

And I played The Headbanger beat And that's when Reggie was like Nigga We started wilding out We started doing The Onyx shit

You know That wasn't really our style with the, you know, behind the shit. Right, like, you're shouting behind each other. That wasn't us. But again, it felt like the record. I made the record for Cube. I never got it to him.

Headbanging? Yes. You made a headbanger? What? Yep. That would have been after America's Most Wanted? Or after Death Certificate? Yes, after.

Before Death Certificate. Right, because what happened... No, you can, because what happened was... Was the hook on there, or no? No, I could hear him Death Certificate? Yes, after. Before Death Certificate. Right, because what happened... No, you can, because what happened was... Was the hook on there? Or no? No, I could hear him on it. No, no, no. Damn, now I can hear it on there.

No, no, no, no, no. The hook wasn't on there. Okay, okay. It's just the beat was loud. It sounded like some Lynch Mob shit to me. Exactly. Lynch Mob also, too, with Hank Shoffley and them. Yeah, yeah.

So it felt like something loud with the birds and the... I can hear that now. So it was loud. So I made that forame. I can hear that now. So it was loud. So I made that for him. I never got it to him. Wow. So the last two songs, Crossover and Headbang, was the last two songs that was made on that,

but it's never personal. That's crazy. I'm bouncing around a little bit. No, go ahead. Did you ever get caught up in the East Coast, West Coast? Because I remember listening to a record with you and Too Short. And I remember Too Short actually saying that. He says, um.

No, but that East Coast, West Coast stuff. Yeah, but I'm getting rid of that East Coast, West Coast stuff. Have you ever got caught in that? No, I tell you what. Yo, your Puerto Rican still came out of the quick sling. Oh, yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah. Sometimes you get, yo, nigga.

This nigga's Puerto Rican, too. Nigga be acting like, yo, what's up? Nigga be acting like, I'm putting down enough of, yeah, yeah. Sometimes you get, you know, yo, nigga, this nigga's Puerto Rican, too. Nigga be acting like, yo, what's up, nigga? I'm putting that enough for the nigga, nigga. Say, hold on, nigga. Hold on. Yo, listen. The Too Short, he pointed to me like, yo, E, you know why this is going on. Me and you's the only one that's doing this.

I didn't even peep that, why the world was going what they was doing. Me and Short was just friends because we were in Atlanta. So we wasn't tripping. You know what I'm saying? We in Georgia. You a New York guy in Georgia. A West Coast guy. We just out enjoying Georgia. Not realizing what's going on with that.

I mean we know but we ain't tripping on that because we in another whole place. I remember at one point Def Jam would not allow us to wear white shirts. Really? Because of cash money? No, no, no. Tell them. Because I think that was like trying to be neutral.

That's how in L.A. L.A. In L.A., you were known that they're like, yo, don't wear white shirts. That's what the East Coast and they was looking for. How do you know that? Oh, wow. I'm saying I'm a bad. I can't get good at that. The nigga's on the left side. Ay, this nigga, yo, yo, you gotta get,

you know what, when you talk about reggae tone and that type of beat, that's the only time you let niggas know he was, me out, don't got to talk, you know. Yo, Eric, you know who my first vibe was? Binnika, nigga. Listen, Binnika. My first rhyme to the industry was Jose Luis gotcha That was my very first rhyme LA LA if you ever heard it

I off top was repping Puerto Rican people Off top Because I get inducted into the Latin Heritage Month every day they mention me

you know what I mean but yeah no but that for real that people gotta look at that nobody did what you did

yeah I saw a reggaeton early early I was in Puerto Rico and I've seen you know Daddy Yankee no

I saw no I saw a female dancing to it and I thought it was Spanish reggae yeah I was like holy shit cuz I didn't really understand I was like and it came on after mommy mommy mommy it was emulating reggae it was emulating reggae and I came back home and I was like yo I was up to DJ enough DJ Camillo and I was like, yo, to DJ Enough, DJ Camilo. And I was like, yo, you playing a Spanish reggae? And they looked at me like, what the fuck is you talking about? And I was like, all right, cool. I was like, boom, boom.

And then it was Dago had the record. It was, I don't even know. It was do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do, do. Wassa Wassa. And I was like, oh, that shit sound like Spanish Biggie Smalls. And I was like, yo. Because Dago spits. Yeah, he spits.

He spits. And that's how DJs, the Smalls. And I was like, yo. Because Tego spits. Yeah, he spits. He spits. He's good. And that's how the DJs wouldn't fuck with it. Because God bless, at this time, they would say, we can only play that at hick parties. I don't know if y'all know what hick means. Of course. It's kind of like a derogatory. Puerto Rican.

Yeah. Like calling them Germans, too? Like when people say Germans. It's almost worse. No, calling them Germans is worse. Puerto Rican. Yeah. calling them Germans is worse. Puerto Ricans. Yeah, but so that's how, and you know, then linked with Tego, linked with Daddy Yankee,

and this shit is now. You want to get that out there in case people go back. In case people didn't know I was Latino. Yes, Latino para arriba. Yes. Let's go. So how did you get Marvin Gaye to clear that sample? Let's just stop, because you'd be at Prime

and all these foods. Listen, behind the closed doors, he'd be eating batillas and fucking, listen. Croquetas. You be eating croquetas and soft donuts. Hold on, hold on. You didn't tell me what you wanted to drink. You know that the papas, you be everything. Keep it real out of the house.

You know a lot of Spanish food. You know a lot of Spanish food. What do you want? Vodka or Japanese whiskey? I don't know about Japanese whiskey. I know about vodka, though. So you want me to go with vodka? Yeah, you can go with vodka.

Okay, can I get a vodka with lemon? We're going vodka with lemon. Okay, ask the question. Go ahead. How did you get Marvin Gaye to clear the sample? Because the rumor has it is if you get Marvin Gaye's estate to clear the sample, then you can't curse on the record. Hmm.

Yeah, see, I don't... You didn't... Again, I got to say Bernard, Bernard's name every time. I can't help it. He did it, though. You know what I'm saying?

Right. When Bernard stole the record, it was already too late. It was already to radio. Okay. And Clear Channel. Oh, okay, okay, yeah. So the record was already going.

Okay. So they wasn't going to stop it because it was a hit. I was number one in Miami. Wow. Yo, when that spring break, the May 28th, I couldn't get down whatever that main street was. Collins? Collins. Ocean, Ocean, bro.

Tyson Beffett came and got me. I was on the scooter, almost killed myself. The fucking, I couldn't get down there. Not knowing I was number one when I was whatever but when the record was already going

and it was number one in Florida it was too late it it heat up too fast so when we called

the state they was like okay they can stick you up right Just Play stuck me up too but um another story too

because niggas $60,000 for the react stuck me up too. But, another story too, because niggas, $60,000 for React stuck me up, like big time. Okay. Dame too, they got me. Marvin Gaye,

at State, I met the wife, Jan. Right. And, Eric B. had something to do with it. Wow.

Eric B. had Sean Long, the lawyer. Oh, shit. Marvin Gaye's lawyer. Yeah. Oh, wow. He made $50,000 off of that too. Oh, wow do with it. Wow. Eric B. had Sean Long, the lawyer. Oh, shit. Marvin Gaye's lawyer. Yeah. Oh, wow. He made $50,000 off of that, too.

Oh, wow. That's just crazy, isn't that right? I'm like, what did Eric B. got to do with this? That's a lawyer. But anyway, I gave him $150,000. I paid. Right. But I knew that that was going to get me that $4 million from Clive Davis.

So no matter what, I knew if I played played it and the thing about it was so crazy, it was already, already hot. It's already reacted. So, so, um, Jimmy Iovine had that movie.

Um, yeah, it was really good. That can happen. Um, that's what Danny DeVito and Martin Lawrence. So we had to wait 35, 30 days or 40 days for that to get,

for them to implement that, for the, whatever, for Clive to sign me. So we had to wait. But again, it was cool. But at the end of the day, we paid. You knew it was a sure investment on your end. You're like, I'm going to get it back.

Yes, because again, Bernard had told Ty and Matola that, yo, everyone's getting offered $2 million. Wow. So once we told that to Clive, Clive was like, okay, I get $4 million. And then Clive said, I'm going to give you 50-50. So not only $4 million, but we're going to go half and half. I'm the only one that he offered that partnership. Not Wyclef, not Busta, not none of them. Me.

That's on there, though. That doesn't happen at record labels. Not even Puppies, no. Okay. The me. Because again That's on there, though. That doesn't happen at record labels. Not any puppies, no. Okay. The me. Because again, he just, he, again, they find out, though. I don't know why, you know, in the days, you like me. Like, I don't know why you're doing that, though.

But, you know. Yo. I'ma keep working. Like, keep working. Yo. Yeah, we gotta go back to that clip that's going around. I'm saying, like, yo, because I'm, why are you, you know what I'm saying? I don't understand what's making me special.

Right. Well, you're the green-eyed badger. Fuck off, fuck off. Nigga's like, I ain't know until later on when you. Hold up, nigga. This is crazy. Yo, you crazy. Oh, man.

Wait, but that was a label deal, right deal Or an imprint deal Or just for you It wasn't My regular production deal It wasn't that It wasn't He gave me 50 That means

When he made 50 Making records Sold I made money But for you as an artist Yes Oh it wasn't even For you to do

When I got music My solo album Right right Okay That's crazy But now it still got me money For EPMD You as an artist? Yes. Oh, it wasn't even for you to do it? No, this was when I got music, my solo album. Right, right. Okay, okay. That's crazy. But now it still got me money for EPMD. And I knew I wasn't making an EPMD album. Oh, shit.

I just got a budget for that, too. This nigga was sick. I don't know. This nigga makes a noise. I don't know. He saw some games. I don't know why If you had a chance To pick one Whether it be

Being a solo artist In a group Or just being a producer Which one would you pick? A beat maker Your producer Really? Yep

The reason why is because If you know EPMD Like I did what We had to do in the beginning Cause again The first tour Was the Run's House tour

EPMD Public Enemy, JJ and Prince Prince and that was the four of us and then we left that tour, the next tour was LL Cool J

Slick Rick, Kane, EPMD after that was MC Hammer, MC Hammer EPMD, Vanilla Ice after that 92 came and then the EPMD Vanilla Ice after that 92 came and then the Hit Squad came so now we don't need nobody

cause Das is number one Reggie EPMD K-Solo so now we doing that so that came with the with the whole shit

you gotta tour but that wasn't my thing like I didn't the road wasn't really you know something I like to do that's why when you see me now my whole solo career I ain't or right like I didn't I made money off the production production and I'm saying so

even now EPMD we probably did like you know with 10 shows a year 11 shows a year I'm the only one in one of my and my colleagues who we don't do like you got came to do 90 dumb Dougie do 200 and something. God rest their dead, Bismarck Key was 180. And this money, they be made on there too. For sure.

But before I leave my sofa, I don't know my colleagues, I need $30,000. Right. So if you can do that, then I might even make a suggestion to go do it. You know,

if you want me to go do that. But other than that, though, I'm not coming off my sofa. Because, again, it's not beneficial to me because I'm already making this money. It's a lot of wear and tear on the body, too. After a while. You see what Method Man said when he was on here? When he said about overseas?

When he said about, you know, I'm tired, whatever like that? Yeah, that's how I felt, too. It's not easy. I can't say this artist's name, but I went to his show, and he killed the stage, right? But as soon as he walked off the stage, he put on this puss face. You said a puss face?

You know, one of them. Oh, like. And I can tell he had bills to pay. He didn't want to perform. It's not for everybody, man. That's the majority, though. Yeah, it's not for everybody. You think it's the majority? Yeah, it's the majority.

The majority. Wow. Not everybody's a showmanship. I can see Kane liking it. No, no, no. Listen. You know the big names. Right.

These niggas is living. You got to understand. Even at the minimum, Nori, if you make $10,000 a night and you do 100 shows, a million dollars, I don't know a doctor, a lawyer, no surgeon, nobody. So don't you ever look at one of us and be like, yo, numbers don't lie. Don't ever look at one of them and be like, I wonder what they're doing now. No, nigga. At the minimum, I'm only giving the minimum of what they're making.

Why? $10,000 a night. If they're doing 80 shows, 80 is $800,000. Yeah. So this is how you look at Kane, Rock Kim, Dougie, those people,

the ones that you know that you see all the time, everywhere, who's averaging 80 to 100 shows a year. The raw basses. I don't know about that. Yeah.

They got a tour right now. Raw bass. Rest in peace. Rest. I don't know. Yeah, they got a tour right now. Robb Bases, Tone Loke. Rest in peace, Easy Rock. Oh, now that 90s tour? Tone Loke, MC Breed,

Young MC, excuse me. That tour makes bread. I don't know what they make it, but that tour every year is pandemonium. Yep.

So don't look at when people be like, I wonder what they doing now and they get that judge or are you judging that and they look at certain people. like, I wonder what they're doing now and they get that judge, or are you judging that? And they look at certain people. Niggas better not even look over on this side. I

was a bar and selling over 70 million records. That means whatever albums that was out, I was on them. Right. And then my publishing, I own it. That's why I tell the story about, too, about young kids about having the publishing and how important it is to I own it That's why I tell the story About too About young kids

About having the publishing And how important it is To have it That's why all our argument With all those acts We got to name them That was in here fighting You know what I'm saying

Just for Metro booming And the weekend Sampling You a customer Right For I don't want to know Over again I get 4% of that record

Right I bring home $240,000 every four months. That's passive income for people that don't know. From one, not from the whole, only 4%. I'm talking about one record. Right. And there's no capping in this. This is how this shit works.

So when people look at certain things and see people out there, especially people with the publishing, that shit can feed you. You don't know when it's going to come. But every time I look around, Bernard Finn, Big Tank, he's the one that do all the 50-shit. Power, you know, BMF, the whole nine. Shit stay on there. You know, it just comes when you're able to have it. And that's fitted with Parrish.

Wow. Wow. Wow. That's fire. Because the EPMD stuff. Yeah, yeah. All right. Is there a reason why you decided

when he said producer, you said beat maker instead of going along with producer? No, I made a mistake. Oh, okay. That was good. I am not one of them. Okay, because you went

and took it to beat maker. That, that one's the one I don't know what happened. I didn't even drink that. Producer and the beat maker right a producer tells you that beat is dope but that beats not for you that paragraph is dope but it should go third that chorus is ill but it doesn't match those paragraphs right put that second verse first put

that one third i got to create the record a producer creates the record for the artist right so i never claimed to be the best beat maker i know how record for the artists right so I never claimed to be the best beat maker I know how to make a record right so did I'm not in that category of niggas saying yo the nigga be I never claimed to be that I'm not to make a song though right right Quincy Jones ain't gonna say he's a beat maker right I don't know where that came from I must some must have happened You did something? Now what happened with Just Blaze? You said Just Blaze?

Okay And this is for React That beat went around Okay Jermaine Dupri had the beat This is a rumor I was supposed to be on React Is that a rumor? Yes

No, that's not a rumor That's not a rumor Damn So Because It fit you Yeah What happened was I really couldn't find nobody to be able to understand where I was coming from.

Right. Red and Meth had to be. Wow. But since that lady was saying the sample, what do you say on top of that? Right. So, my shit was like, whatever she said, then I'm that. So, that's what made it able to be a record because I found the way to use it they all had to be but again Reggie I took an old old verse of Reggie's like I kind of like

you know like debodied and then I played it for the label and I said Reggie but they like it whatever so he did it over wow but but he wasn't there I just made the song up Did some mixtape shit Yeah, made the song up, yeah So did we ever find out what she was saying? Somebody was saying that she was talking about You know the rumors Like she was talking about suicide

And, you know, that's the rumors You know, people They was trying to kill me out there Holy shit Yeah So we never found out officially what she said? Somebody in the one of the Somebody said something that she said But said somebody one of the somebody said something

that she said but that was one of the main things she was talking about suicide because when you perform it do you let the crowd say that part of course did they do that too

they do the whatever it said they do again at the end of the day it was so crazy because me having Marvin Gaye right and then they then again you looking like

okay well damn this record is too big I can't come behind that but I was able to come right behind it with that. That's the part, too. I was like, God had his hands on me,

like, oh, shit. You give me another career? You know, so, at the end of the day, so, you know, again, I think Just Blaze, too, because they was hot.

Right. And I heard the rumors that they was mad that he gave me the beat. They was upset. Why? Because he's giving hit records away. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

It makes sense. The beat, they can all say that, but you don't know if it's going to be a hit because you had the record. Yeah. This happened as a hit, and now you're saying, okay, what? $60,000. All right. That was it. Just place it as the most money he ever got for a record in his life.

Wow. And did he stay there? No, he never got there no more. No, never again. Okay. Jeez Louise, Robert, jeez. Did you, going back to the beginning of EPMD,

did you ever see yourself as a solo artist from back then? Nah. This is, listen, man, Paris was the one that had experience because his brother was in the business and Paris was in a crew called the Rock Squad.

He just didn't rhyme. He was a DJ. But when he heard when I went to his neighborhood with my grandmother, I was already had two rhymes. I had the Bernard Getz story and I had Jane. So I used to spit those for his friends and him. So he was like, you know, one day we're going to go to the studio.

So I'm like, this can't be happening. You know what I'm saying? Like, you know, you don't care, you don't know. So he went to college because he played football.

So we skipped 85, 86, we kind of went in but we skipped that too. Then 87, we went in and made the first demo. And that's when November

of 87, It's My thing and your customer came out now you guys wasn't on Def Jam then no he's on Stephen back records independent sleeping back yeah first record so team bank records right man tronics what did that was the group that they had and they had Joyce Sims a lady that was you know that they had. And they had Joyce Sims, a lady that was, you know. Okay. You on my all. They had that too. Fresh had a lot. Fresh was kind of crazy.

Yeah. And then they signed Nice and Smooth. Wow. And then they had Craig Mack with the Zoom, Zoom, Zoom. So again, they was moving. Yeah. You know?

But I walked in the spot one day, I saw new computers, a new desk, new cars outside. And we broke. I'm thinking, I signed for $1,500. That means $750 for Paris, $750 for me. Wow. But I was a minor.

So when Russell went in for the audit, he was able to get it. Because they was in an illegal contract with you. That too. And they was just robbing. This wasn't right. So Russell came with like $1.6 million. And after that, we was on Def Jam. That's why that whole third album is I'm mad, manslaughter.

All type of angry titles when we signed on death jam because of what was going on with Sleeping Bag. And the rumor was, which I didn't really know until recently, the rumor was that you thought it was Parrish at first because he had the cars and he had the houses and you didn't. Oh, that's as far as the EPMD, how it got sour. Right. Yeah, that was everybody. I mean, we watched it, and everybody was saying, you know, the neighborhood talking.

Mm-hmm. Same with the EPMD rockin' beef. Right. It's the neighborhood that talks. Right. You know what I'm saying? Right. So at the end of the day, again, I wasn't on my business.

Right. You know, that's what it boils down to. I did think that... Burt Bedell was the accountant. Oh, wow. And Burt had all of us. Burt had everybody. But at the end of the day, Burt kind of helped me too.

Right. After a while, when I started seeing things, I started learning shit too. But again, at the end of the day, when you're young, all you're thinking is the negative part. Like, you know, somebody getting me. Right. You know what I'm saying? So. Why do you think

that's the mentality? Like, I got jerked my first contract too. I got, I think, five grand. I'm wearing an Ava Rex and a cowboy hat and some Gore-Tex boots. I thought I was rich.

I thought I was rich. I went to the tunnel. You couldn't tell me shit. Five grand. Imagine $750. $750. Word but but why do you think and and i'm gonna tell you something i knew my contract was shit right but i was i was under the impression i was like yo let me just get into this game opportunity and i'm gonna make it work yeah right when when do that generation stop and say, fuck that?

I'm going to get a good contract first, not get into this bad shit, because I listen to your story. And the American West with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater podcast network hosted by me, writer and historian Dan Flores, and brought to you by Velvet Buck. This podcast looks at a West available nowhere else. Each episode, I'll be diving into some of the lesser known histories of the West. I'll then be joined in conversation by guests such as Western historian Dr. Randall Williams and bestselling author and meat eater founder Stephen Ranella. I'll correct my kids now and then where they'll say when cave people were here. And I'll say it seems like the Ice Age people that were here didn't have a real affinity for caves. So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th, where we'll delve into stories of the West

and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today. Listen to The American West with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I know a lot of cops, and they get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. Across the country, cops called this taser the revolution.

But not everyone was convinced it was that simple. Cops believed everything that taser told them. From Lava for Good and the team that brought you Bone Valley comes a story about what happened when a multibillion dollar company dedicated itself to one visionary mission. This is Absolute Season One. Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. It's really, really, really bad. Listen to new episodes of Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Binge episodes 1, 2, and 3 on May 21st,

and episodes 4, 5, and 6 on June 4th. Ad-free at Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. And it's going to take us to heal us. It's Mental Health Awareness Month, and on a recent episode of Just Heal with Dr. J, the incomparable Taraji P. Henson stopped by to discuss how she's discovered peace on her journey. So what I'm hearing you saying is healing is a part of us also reconnecting to our childhood in some sort. You said I look how youthful I look because I never let that little girl inside of me die. I go outside and run outside with the dogs. I still play like a kid. I laugh.

You know, I love jokes. I love funny. I love laughing. I laugh at myself. I don't take myself too seriously. That's the stuff that keeps you young and stops you from being so hard to hear this and more things on the journey of healing you can listen to just heal with dr jay from the black effect podcast network on the iheart radio app apple podcast or wherever you get your podcast

at&t connecting changes everything I was researching, researching, researching And it was like You learned the business after that You kind of got And I'm like, damn That's fucking my story Like, I fucking had to learn publishing After I sold it

You know what I mean? I had to learn about points After I gave it away That's what everybody knows You know what I mean? So what I'm saying is like Your experience From your experience, from your experience,

I shouldn't have went through it. Right. From my experience, the next person shouldn't go through it. When do we stop this shit? When do we tell these artists that, what they worth?

This is what Kiss was just talking about the last interview. I just heard him saying, he's saying that again, is, he says, him signing a contract

these days is like for him robbing a bank. You know what I mean? It's just stupid to do. At the end of the day, you have to learn that all of us who went through it and saw what it was, why would you do that? Right. But the fame and that check they dingle in front of you for that 360 deal, it's hard for a kid to be like, what'd you say about points and all that type of stuff? Which is complicated.

All that stuff is complicated. Publishing, points. They should learn. They should teach a course before you get to them. And even merchandising. All of that. They control their merchandising. That's the whole thing, though, too, which is crazy.

The major artists that you know about, you haven't seen a t-shirt or nothing that they shows they don't own that part and that's also all that money from that 360 is gone so that's part was kind of crazy for you to be at your own show in your own concert and you got no merchandise even owning your likeness that's what it is right right and then and then the the language saying in perpetuity throughout the universe, like these things are crazy. You know what's the crazy shit? It's so fucked up right now that they can take your image

and put you in a video game that you don't even. Oh, that was AI shit. That's what it was. Yeah. Yeah, like at least when we did Def Jam, Fight for New York, we had to actually go in there. Oh, remember that? Yeah, yeah.

You had to go in there. That shit was kind of fly. That was fly. So right now, if you was to sign the 360 deal, your label can put you in Mortal Kombat 7 and just have you there. Hey, Mojo, you know what? You had a good move on that.

Oh, yeah. It was called the Dead Arm Nori. I still got that in real life, Eric. You know what I mean? I have witnessed him doing it. The move was nice. I don't know who he got, though. But the shit was crazy.

If there's anything probably positive of this generation of artists, they do have more power to dictate the type of deals because they're self-sufficient in what they're doing, at least on social media, creating their own revenue. If they're doing that. If they are. If they're self-sufficient in what they're doing at least on social media creating their own revenue. If they're doing that, if they're doing that, but the majority

of them too. See, all that money they're generating is from them shows. Right. That's why they're so rich. Either they got

the $2 million for the 360, but the shows, you see they're touring like crazy. They're out there in arenas early. All of them is in arenas.

All of them is out there. You know what I'm saying? I don't know how many. It's not a whole bunch, but they on them. But that money that you see they got is real. But I always tell them, I'm not hating on you. Nobody's coming to watch you in the future. And the scary part, they don't understand that when they hear it,

that means that you see how we can rock, or the people from the 70s and 60s, Mick Jagger's 136 years old. This nigga's still, you know what I'm saying? Mick Jagger, 140. He's not performing the casket. 142. $440 million when you step on that stage

for that year, that tour. Meaning that he made records that's going to always be able for people to show up. So when

this era has to go to work, how we can go to work, if you want to go to work, you can go get some money, whatever, they can't. Because when I, when that new,

when they get 40 and they're going to be talking about dick, fuck, suck, money, whatever, they can't. Because when they get 40 and they're going to be talking about dick, fuck, suck, pussy, whatever, it won't match. Right, right. It won't match. There's no longevity in that, right? It won't match. There's no longevity.

So I want to figure out how are you going to be able to earn money, nigga? If you didn't save or have some type of situation, you won't be able to do what we do past virality past going viral right this is this quote and this what i'm saying is so fucking lethal and i wish they can hear this like the fact that when that time comes right are you you're not going to be able to work. Right. It's real. You remember what I always say.

Like, that's why I love Europe. Because, like you just said, there's a time where you just can't book a show in America. Right. Europe don't get to see you like that. No. So Europe, that's kind of saved my life. You know what I'm saying? I always say Düsseldorf, Germany. He always laughs at at me but i was frequent in duzudorf germany i was like fuck that

they pay into my quote i'm going that's how i learned about miles and all that i started fucking with the plane tickets because you can't be paying that first class flight and then and you get all in all if it's all yes it's all in right's all in, right. So I would use my points to get that first class flight. Yeah, you put me on to that. But Europe, Europe, Europe, you know, Russia at times, Japan,

Asia, yeah. They held me down. They held me down where I didn't have to like take these little, because you know, that's how they start doing you. They'd be like,

here go $2,500. I'm getting $3,500. Then you want me at $2,500 but then you're just like, yo, I ain't doing shit. Let me go grab that. But Europe held us down. And it almost feels like They held us. They still hold us.

A lot of groups are still in Europe getting money. I just saw a fucking Los Angeles On the regular. I just saw a fucking Los Underground just now. Alcoholics. I seen them

right there out there. Do you think hip hop lives in Europe more than it lives in the United States? Well, now it does. Wow. Even though the new

stuff did infiltrate. I never thought it was going to infiltrate but again, kids come just now, you know, whatever, whatever.

Let me flash back to you because you flashed back a while ago because you got to make back outside. So I don't know what year you're talking about. You know what I'm saying?

Like, what year was that overseas? Because that's a long time. That was in the early 2000s. Early 2000s. This is, this is like, this is right before we do Drink Chance.

Right before we do Drink Chance. I was in what I call, let me tell you, I was what I call a hip-hop purgatory. All right. Like, I wasn't dead, but I was what I call A hip hop purgatory Alright Like I wasn't dead But I damn sure wasn't alive

Alright Like I was in that Tough tough space And you know Joe was there with me You know what I mean I had lunch with Joe yesterday right And he said something

Very interesting to me You know we always say When we in the studio studio, this is our best look, right? It's our best fight. Right. So, you know, we all think like that. I don't give a fuck what you say. Right. So Joe looks at me and goes, I think I'm making the best music of my life.

And I somewhat laugh because I'm like, nigga, you say that every year, right? And he says to me, it's because i don't have no pressure no more yeah and i was like and it's like so what he's saying is when there's no pressure right to to meet a record label stand right to me yep to meet they they they uh what is that shit uh schedule or whatever and you just make the music and I was like holy shit I had never looked at it like that and it goes against our argument of indie versus major too

oh cause the major puts that pressure too on you oh okay good lord you know we always argue indie versus major I said I'm a major guy

he's an indie guy but does that take it off of you when you're in the studio and you're making records and you're just like, yo, I'm doing it. I'm doing it. Because of course, it's going to be eventually lucrative. Right.

But right now, I'm just going to have some fun. Right. I'm just going to go on it. I'll tell you what. Mm-hmm. My thing was, and Nori was on my album too, when I made Vernia, that was what my feeling was. Mm-hmm. Because I didn't have

nobody telling me about no radio record or what to make. I'm doing it because I'm doing it for the culture. People that want to hear hip-hop. And when I did it that way, my colleagues showed up. Nas talked about, yo, I wish I

made that 300 record. Shack and them, everybody was just snooping them. It was just down the line saying, yo, did wish I made that 300 record. Shacking them. Everybody was just snooping them. It was just down the line saying, yo, did you get Eric Sermon's album? So usually I would hear what the company wants to say. That's how we do. Sometimes they write. Sometimes we fall into it. There's been a couple of times where I made songs.

No, I didn't want to make them records. But I tried to impress them to get it. But they can go out there and do the right thing. But again, when there's no pressure at this moment, so they can go out there and do the right thing. But again, when there's no pressure at this moment, that's why J.D. can talk about that.

Being independent and being in control, Joe doesn't care what happens because this is what he feels. And he ain't worried about, you know, what somebody else is saying.

If Kool and Dre say it's dope or Norris say it's dope and I think it's dope, I'm coming out with it. You know, so that's how I think that a lot of us feel who's independent. You know? Do you think a rapper ever really

retires? Maybe for not making records, but as far as him doing this and still, you know, writing rhymes and still, nah and still nah I think you're going to keep doing it but listen okay listen you keep that to yourself

because don't be busting niggas fuck all that because I don't feel that way nah fuck all that niggas that like hip hop and like Quincy Jones at his age still loves this you his age but still loves loves this you know people who still loves this I see Jermaine Dupri and see

Brian Michael Brian Michael and all them. I hate Jermaine Dupri's socks right now. Take them guys off. Them socks is crazy you see and Louis no I don't care them socks look like slave socks. Okay listen listen, but... I went too far? Yeah, but we still like doing it. The music is being made, and I think that the question you asked is real, because again, how many people have retired and came back? Yeah, like every now and then you see Hov do a concert, a pop-up or something. He's been retired for 20 years now.

Right. Joe said he's retired. He told me he's in the studio. Yeah, today again. Oh, for real? Yeah, yeah. The thing about Andre 2000, though, too, kills me, too, because, again, you're not doing no rhymes,

but you on Killer Mike's album. That's the part that bugs out. All of it, every other... Did you hear the flute album? So-and-so, he... I did. The flute album. No.

It's kind of hard. It's hard. I tried to hear you. I'm waiting for people to sample the fuck out of it. Yeah, but the fact that he still rhymes. And he's still rhyming top level. No. It's kind of hard. It's not. I tried to hate it. I'm waiting for people to sample the fuck out of it. But the fact that he still rhymes. And he's still rhyming top level. Yeah. But he comes and does it.

Right. So you can't say you're not rhyming. Right. You're not rapping. Right. Like you said. You know what I'm saying? So imagine if you got something to say on that, you got something to say.

I'm just doing being biased because I want him to come out. You know what I'm saying? He got something to say. I think he got something to say. I'm just doing being biased because I want him to come out. You know what I'm saying? He got something to say. I think he got something to say out there. I can't help it. This was a while ago. I'm in Carbone, and I'm just sitting there, and I just start writing. No one can read my handwriting.

No one. Not my wife, not even my mom. You're not handwriting, bro. I mean, I write graffiti, though. I still write graffiti. But you were typing. You just went like this. Yeah.

No one could read it. Like, how I put it together. You know, the only person who read my mind, I've read my rhyme word for word. Who's that? Kanye West. I knew it. Oh, you told me that, yeah. I grabbed my phone from him so fast, he was like, I looked, I said, holy shit.

He spit it how I wrote it. Like the cadence that you wrote it, that you learned to write it. It was creepy. I grabbed my phone looked I said holy shit he spit it how I wrote it like the cadence that you wrote it that you learned to write it it was creepy I grabbed my phone I said give my shit

where were y'all huh in Carbones okay so um you and Kanye what's y'all relationship yeah I mean

anything man that was a good segue good segue nah nah listen at the end of the day I never seen nobody That was a good segue? Good segue. No, no, listen. At the end of the day, I've never seen nobody excited about music like that. A few people that I've been in the lab with, you know, that feel the same way. When the beat come on and the momentum and the whole nine, same way. Because again, when I started with him, we was doing a lot of hip hop music.

And there's a room out there saying, Eric said that their album is coming. I never said nothing like that. I said I was working on the album. We was doing hip hop music. Pink Polo Kanye, right? Well, the fact that it was the beats and stuff. Because again, you come to get me, you know what I'm going to get ready to make.

You know what I'm saying? You come to get me. You know what I'm saying? And we had a vibe. The momentum was going crazy. And we had mad ideas the whole night, whatever, whatever. But as far as him and music,

he don't need nobody. I just heard Consequence say it too. He don't get people to write rhymes because he can't rhyme. The fact that maybe somebody else might have something that might be iller, or your mind might not go there. People think that because people are sitting there giving you ideas

the whole nine million that you need to do it. He don't. There was records that his man played me from 2013 that would shake this whole ground up wow you know did his his production whatever his rhyme all that shit is way up yeah you can't take that so so so i kind of was bugging out like what are we doing here but i understand now because this is what it is. It's the other idea that you might have. So I did the whole LA thing. They went to Japan. I didn't go. Then I went to Italy. And we was over there. And that vibe was dope too. When I walked in, I saw Ty Dolla $ign.

And him and Ty Dolla $ign had created something else that I wasn't doing when I was there. Okay. It wasn't matter. Sonically, you mean. Sonically, right, right. But still was, you know, you don't play with drums. Right.

So the whole time is like, yo, make sure the drums is crazy, whatever like that. Make sure it's like that. So I was trying to do what I could do at that moment but in the beginning we was making you know um he was part of vultures one there wasn't I don't know if that was the name okay you're just making no name this is the beginning okay this is you know we just trying to set the vibe up and see what we get ready to make right but we had something going you know what I'm saying? But again, I saw my couple of songs on the list.

When I was in Italy, I saw two of my songs on there. Right. When it came, my songs wasn't on there. Right, right. But how did you guys, how did that relationship

for you to come and work with him, how did that start? He called for me. He called, again, 88 Keys called Bernard again. And Bernard told me, yo, that, again, 88 Keys, called Bernard again. And Bernard told me, yo, that, oh, Kanye summons you. Is that how he said it? That's what I heard it like that.

Sounds like crumbs. Well, but again, it was the experience that I, you know, being around. Again, the antics, all that stuff that people, I always know that fact that when it came down to the music, this motherfucker is what you know of. Yeah. A pure genius. Or he needs no one. Right. But he just chooses to do that.

He likes to collaborate. Exactly. The ideas and see where your mind is at. Right. Same with Dre, though. Because, yeah, you did that, too. Because Dre really, when I first got to Dre's, I did, and one night he did three records of mine, just rhyme,

one after the other. I'm like, damn, this nigga Dre just did three songs back to back by 2.33 in the morning. I come back the next two days. We do another record, but he calls Snoop in. So Snoop is doing the jam. I'm like, damn, this is four songs now. Fully your production. Right.

The next couple days, he's doing a song. So I rhyme on that. Oh my god. Nobody's never going to hear this. You don't think it's a part of this joint Snoop Dre project they found

no not me and his no no and when I mean I can't even tell you the record this shit is oh man how many records is Dre

yeah word somebody gotta kidnap Dre I'm just throwing it out there somebody gotta kidnap him and let him hit his own shit be like yo man this song was exciting. This belongs to the world now, Dre.

It's not yours. The N.W.A. E.P.M.D. thing, the Eric Sermon Dre thing, it would have been something to talk about. Just like when the shit went viral without, I was there. But this record was fantastic. Wait, take us back to E.P.M.D. N.W.A.

thing. That's what people saw us as. It was always a comparison. Not rivals, though. Nah. Right, okay. Just a comparison of what we did and the music they made was almost the same. Because they wasn't, you was working with, y'all were doing funk before them, no?

No, same time. Same time? Yeah. It was, because when you go back to Eazy-E, he was already on Parliament. Okay. And I was doing the same, doing thatazy-E, he was already on Parliament. OK. And I was doing the same, doing that, too. Which would have been Dre doing it. Right.

Well, exactly. But again, not knowing, though. You know what I'm saying? But when you go back, you can hear the similarities. But it's very close. Yeah. Well, no, you're saying it's the same time. Yes.

Right. So I can't really say who had what. You know, I know that in 1987 It's My Thing and you were a customer came out. Me and Cube was tight. That's why you hear Cube when he's speaking about me too. I used to pick him up,

take him around. You know what I'm saying? It's crazy. Because again... He used to check in with you. He can't... Can't make this up. Cube came to, can't make this up. Cube came to my house one time, right?

Atlanta or New York? New York. Okay. I didn't have no AC in my new home. I just got it. He got the Jerry curl. Jerry curl.

Jerry curl. Continue. No AC, Jerry curl. Take it from there. He goes to the backyard, jumps in the pool, fully clothed. What?

Because he was hot. Because he was hot. What happens to the Jerry Curl? I'm just saying. I'm telling you what happens. Does it become finger waves now? I ain't look at all that. The fact that he jumped in the pool fully clothed.

Okay. What happens after that? No, I didn't. I mean, he went back. Because we was shooting the St. On's commercial in Wyandale. Oh, okay. So, he just, again, came over. But he must have been hot.

When you see a pool looking quenching and nice and blue it makes you breathe you know what I'm saying when you see it so that's he jumped in what kind of money was you getting back

then you had a pool yeah I'm counting your money that's all I need that's all I need you were getting some chicken back then

oh Jesus 1991 1992 yeah that's that long money that's that longevity you gotta understand though we didn't know we was producers

so don't forget we making the records we don't know that we producers so again we already a step ahead of the game so whatever royalties that you was getting or whatever advances you was getting it was still more than somebody who was just doing this but how did you not know you were producers already I thought that the records you heard Advances you was getting, it was still more than somebody who was just doing this. You know what I'm saying?

But how did you not know you were producers already? I thought that the records you heard, the people made them. That they were already making their own records? Everybody who I heard, I thought they made their records. So me and Paris went in and did what we thought everybody did. Not knowing that we were producers. Whoa. Well, thank God you didn't know.

And then Will Smith was like, stopped the show on stage one night and said, yo, EPMD's number one in Billboard. We don't know what Billboard was neither. Don't forget, we children. He's like, number one in Billboard? What is that? You know? Afterwards, Leo told me,

oh yeah, this is the Billboard charts. You're number one, you know? So Will been fucking up the stage for a long time. Who, Will? Yeah, you just said. Will was already... He was giving them props. Don't forget.

Fucking up the stage. Don't forget. Run DMC tour. But the most... The sellers, Fresh Prince, they's 2.5 million records old. But they still...

Parents just don't understand. That's it. Yeah. Will used to be backstage saying Yo I'm about to be famous I was like you already famous He was talking about being on TV way before it happened Wow

This nigga so strong You know me I'm about 50 pounds bigger now But I was still 200 That nigga picked me up And turned me upside down At 18 At 18 That nigga picked me up and turned me upside down. At 18. At 18?

All right. I've never been 18. And I'm like, first of all, I'm kind of confused. Why are you doing this? That's what we were doing right now. Why are you doing this? Because we're boys, you know? But for some reason, something must have happened, and they could just, you know, whatever.

Like, it was nothing. Snatched me. Whatever. 18. Have you ever been starstruck? Julius Irving. Julius Irving? Yeah.

Dr. J? I saw him at the Cleveland All-Star Awards back in 95 or whatever like that, and I shook his hand, but I couldn't speak. Nothing came out. Because my whole time, all I was thinking about when I was a kid was Irving. Actually, no. When I played basketball, when I shoot, I was like, Irving, all the time. My favorite number is number six.

My lucky number to me is number six. I'm going to be honest. When you just did like that, you look like you can't play ball at all. Okay, now that's the myth. The way you just did that, I ain't going to lie. I was embarrassed a little bit. Ask my boys in here,

they'll tell you. That was not true. Like, bro, have all of you like that. That's not true. Basketball might not be a sport. At any time, when you want to shoot

at this age. Yes, okay. We got some chance this weekend. We have a basketball game, and we have a handball. I'm nice in handball. That's awesome on Puerto Rican side. Awesome on Puerto Rican. Now you're selling the truth.

You was hiding shit. No, I wasn't. No, you started it. I'm trying to make handball a national sport in the Olympics. I seen your golf outfit, nigga, with the stripes, with the fucking. No, no. I seen yours. No, I ain't play golf. I don't play golf. You had the golf outfit, nigga, with the stripes, with the fucking... No, no. I seen... Nah, I ain't play golf. I don't play golf.

You had the golf outfit, nigga, with the... That's the handball outfit. Okay, well, make sure... Yeah, I'm trying to bring handball back, you know what I'm saying? I know I'm fucking with you. Is it time for a quick time slot? Oh, let's do it. Okay. You want to explain to him the game? You're not asking enough questions, because, again, we're going to edit this for two hours.

We ain't editing this shit. No, we don't edit it. We ain't editing shit. Okay No, we don't edit nothing. Oh, you don't? We ain't editing shit. Okay, so where's the stuff that, I mean, the drama that we can start? No drama. We don't need no drama.

That's a myth. No, but you're not asking the whole, did you ask everything? We are asking. No, we're not done. This is just the middle of the game.

This is the part. This is the part that everybody's talking about. Then we go off. By the way, I love this shit. But you got to pick a designated drinker for yourself. Yeah, pick a designated drinker. Nobody drinks.

Yeah. You can pick Sonny DBT right here. Okay, Sonny, you got it. All right. Oh, he got an EPMD shirt on? All right. Hey, Sonny, you know what time it is, right? So if you go out there drunk right now.

Oh, yeah. He's going to go out drunk. He's already drunk At 2pm Good one Who came with him who's driving Who's driving you Okay good

He got a horse and carriage It's 2pm Okay yeah It's 12 or 30 Oh he's, yeah. All right, so these are the rules. Well, no, no, it's 12 or 30. Oh, you're going to be fucked up. Yeah. All right, the rules is, this is the rules.

We're going to give you two, two different things to pick from. Yes. You say, you pick one, we good. If you say both or neither. Do you know that everybody in their mother watch this show?

No, we still got it. You saw, you saw, I got in an argument. Someone on Twitter was mad. They're like, why Nori got to keep saying the same stuff? I said, he's not talking to you. He's talking to the guest. Oh, no, in an argument. Someone on Twitter was mad. They're like, why Nori got to keep saying the same stuff? I said, he's not talking to you.

He's talking to the guest. He never heard that story. Okay, go ahead. I got you. I got you. All right. This is a good one. You want this one?

Yeah. I'll take this one. No, I'm going to do it. Okay, go ahead. Where your drink at, though? I'll get another one. Okay. I'm going to get my Mahuana.

And the shots, too. I want to make sure you just, you can't move in here. All right, ready? Tupac or DMX? I had to get another drink. DMX. Okay. And if you got any stories, you can.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Stop, and this is the part where we get into things. You got it? Oh, yeah. You know, DMX and Solo. Oh, that's right. K-Solo. His first record, yeah.

No, but as far as them. That beat. It was in jail together. It was in jail together. So I don't know who had Spellbound first. I know Solo was nice as fuck. Wow.

But DMX, for him to argue like that. For 20 years. To be like, yo, I did it. Like, you niggas ain't gonna argue like that the whole time.

He didn't let it go at all. But again, either way, we don't know. We don't know the proof, but DMX was... He was adamant. Adamant about his, though, too. But Solo was so dope at it, DMX didn't...

He didn't do it. He didn't need to, because DMX was so nice. He said, fuck it, I ain't got to do that shit. Right? Whatever. But anyway, Get Out Me Dog was being made. Right? And they called me and said, yo, we dissing your man.

You know? Def Jam. No. Irv Gotti and DMX. Like, you know, do you want me to take it out? I'm like, you got to do what you got to do. That's not what I got to do. You know what I'm saying?

It was whatever. I've never heard this story. So when it came out, they still bleeped it. Oh, that's the bleep? Yeah. But everyone knew that's what he said, though. I'm not going to lie. I didn't know that.

Yeah, I know that nigga K-Solo, whatever, they bleep it. Even though I said to them, do what you got to do. They still bleeped it. So that was the DMX-less story. Oh, wow. You ever met Tupac?

Yeah. I got pictures. Tupac used to be in my rim shot, man. Wow. In Atlanta. Oh, this is New York Tupac. No, Atlanta. He's in Atlanta. Oh, Atlanta. Okay got pictures. Tupac used to be in my rim shot, man. Wow. In Atlanta. Oh, that's the New York Tupac. No, Atlanta.

He stayed in Atlanta. Oh, Atlanta. Okay, okay. Because everybody was, they all was there, man. Right. You got to watch the Freaknik movies. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. They're about to date. That's on Hulu, right?

Yeah. Okay, yeah. I'm telling the story in there. Okay, okay, okay. That's right. I'm a star now, man. Yeah, yeah. Y'all niggas, y'all niggas. I ain't doing shit in there. You were too short. I can man. Yeah, yeah. Y'all niggas, I ain't doing shit.

You were too short. I can see you at Magic City. Y'all was tearing shit up. The original Magic City, too. Isn't that short? It's another nigga with some bread. I didn't even know that.

All right. Yeah, he holding. Okay, go ahead. Next one. Big pun or big L? Not or. Big pun, big L. See, that's,

oh, man, you wilding out with that one. Want to take a shot? You need to take a shot. Take's that since so by two different dynamics but both of them lyrically is there something nobody never seen but heard before see me for that you can't do that you gotta take a good job rest in peace to both of us and imagine if both of them would have been here today Same with Pac and X I always wanted

To see what Big Pun would be like With a Twitter account What made you say that? Or Eazy-E With an Instagram They would have been fucking up Because of an extension of personality. Yeah.

Like, I'm going to be honest. The first time I kind of like really, really knew that Fab was a real funny person was when he ranked on Ray J. When he did that, I was like, Fab is funny. Like, you get around Fab. Social media helped Fab, in my opinion. Like, it helped him because people started to say, holy shit, he's kind of funny. Because he didn't talk much.

He didn't talk much at first. It was an extension of his personality. His outfits would speak for him. It wouldn't be him. I got you. You know what I mean? But then he didn't have to do a dope interview or nothing. Fab would just be funny on the gram.

And then people started to gravitate towards him. Okay, so you want the next one? Yeah. L or Kane? Ooh. everybody and then people started to gravitate towards it yeah so okay so we want the next one yeah l or kane you got again you got the you got to look at man this is l o kujay yeah whatever the criteria for you literally this is you got to take a shot you got to take a shot. You got to take a shot. I thought you was going to. No, I was, but the dynamics is, you know.

I did have cuts in my eyebrows trying to be like Big Daddy Kane. Those are friends. And people are just mad sensitive now, too. When you just like, you know, damn, you didn't say my name, you know. Oh, yeah. Niggas be acting like that. They be like, you niggas, you mad at that? Primo or Pete Rock? Oh, what's wrong with you, man?

It's Dominican and the Colombian right there. Those two men don't split this up. Man, it's 1230, nigga. Him, all of us. Right. We drinking, too. You got to drink that. You got to 1230, nigga. Him? All of us? Right. We drinking too? You got to drink that. You got to drink that, man.

Okay. Sippy sip. Sippy sip. Who have you worked with more out of those two? Who? Primo or P-Rock? Pete. Okay.

Me and Pete got records from 1991 in Heavy D's basement. Wow. Wow. Rest in peace, Heavy D. Because his studio was in Heavy D's basement. Because Heavy D had the records. His stuff was down there at Heavy D's basement. Wow. Wow, rest in peace, Heavy D. Because his studio was in Heavy D's basement because Heavy D had the records, his stuff was down there

at Heavy D's crib. Wow. Rest in peace, Heavy D. That's another one we lost. Great. Slick Rick or Biggie Smalls? Yeah, what is... Yo.

You did it on purpose. Well, switch it up. Biggie Smalls or Slick Rick? It doesn't... Wait, what? Yo. What you saying? I just flipped it off. Biggie Smalls or Slick Rick? It doesn't... Wait, what? Yo. What'd you say? I just flipped it off.

These shit has never been this hard for nobody. You're lying. I'm lying. No, I watched this shit. This ain't... You put these shit together... But they making it personally for you. That's why.

They wanted it to be hard for you. Yeah, but you know the storyteller. Like, Biggie Smalls won too, but where'd it come from? This nigga. That's the point. Go ahead, nigga. You drunk, nigga. Go ahead, nigga. You drunk, nigga. Go ahead.

Okay. I feel sorry for you. You finished. They fucking you up. Any stories with Biggie? Yeah. Tell us. I'll tell you what.

I got to go for Bernard again. Okay. Bernard brought Biggie Smalls to a barbershop. Right? In Wyandotte? No, this is in Brooklyn. Uh-huh.

To meet me. But I don't remember that. You was getting your haircut in Brooklyn? Um, I'm not. Getting all that money? I'm a Pink Houses nigga, nigga.

Oh, really? East New York? Yeah. Okay. So, I didn't never, I never, I don't remember that story.

Okay. But, but he's adamant and people are confirming the story. Right. Anyway, the E.P. and D. breakup, I do Hidden Switches, my first single. It's directed by Puffy and Hype Williams. Wow. It's their first whatever. On the set is Notorious B.I.G. the whole entire time.

Right? So when I go do a set, Notorious B.I.G. the whole entire time. Right. So when I go do a set, I see him. You know, he was like, you know, just following. Now, I don't know why he in the video because Puffy had the whole Mount Vernon in my video. Wow. You know, at the time. Yeah. So Biggie Smalls tells Tracy Waples.

Tracy Waples. I need to be on Eric Sermon's album. Right. But meanwhile, I had my own crew right you know then I had met this Reggie talking about

this kid named Joe Sinister which JMSJ had and I heard him so that was the only special guest I had on the CD at the time but I never heard

Notorious B.I.G. you know I wanted I could shoot myself now at the end of the day but again that's my story of somebody who

was looking at me in a way like, yo, I fucks with this nigga. I need to be on this nigga's album CD. And he was bought to me. I don't remember. And that's before he had any records. No records. Party bullshit. Before he was on Heavy D's, Blue Funk.

Nowhere. He didn't do nothing yet. Wow. But he was signed to Puff. Puff, I don't know that. I don't know that. He was obviously around Puff. Yeah, he's with him.

Because Puff directed the video, you said. Yes. Okay. Buck Wilde or Diamond D? Okay. Buck Wilde or Diamond D? podcast looks at a West available nowhere else. Each episode, I'll be diving into some of the lesser known histories of the West. I'll then be joined in conversation by guests such as Western historian, Dr. Randall Williams, and bestselling author and meat eater founder, Stephen Rinella. I'll correct my kids now and then where they'll say when cave people were here,

and I'll say, it seems like the Ice Age people that were here didn't have a real affinity for caves. So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th, where we'll delve into stories of the West and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today. Listen to The American West with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts,

or wherever you get your podcasts. I know a lot of cops, and they get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. Across the country, cops call this taser the revolution. But not everyone was convinced it was that simple. Cops believed everything that taser told them.

From Lava for Good and the team that brought you Bone Valley comes a story about what happened when a multibillion-dollar company dedicated itself to one visionary mission. This is Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. It's really, really, really bad. Listen to new episodes of Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Binge episodes 1, 2, and 3 on May 21st and episodes 4, 5, and 6 on June 4th.

Add free at Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. And it's going to take us to heal us. It's Mental Health Awareness Month, and on a recent episode of just healed with dr j the incomparable taraji p henson stopped by to discuss how she's discovered peace on her journey so what i'm hearing you saying is healing is a part of us also reconnecting to our childhood in some sort you said i look how youthful i look because i never let that little girl inside of me die. I go outside and run outside with the dogs. I still play like a kid. I laugh. You know, I love jokes. I love funny. I love laughing. I laugh at myself. I don't take myself too seriously. That's the stuff that keeps you young and stops

you from being so hard. To hear this and more things on the journey of healing. You can listen to Just Heal with Dr. J from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. AT&T, connecting changes everything. I got to go with Diamond because, again, I played the first album in the tour bus. We played that every day. That was Dostoevsky's favorite album, though, too, but we heard that every day. So I got to say that first LP. That's the Stunt Blunts one? No, Sally's One Track Mind album.

That whole shit was crazy. Leo Combs or Russell Simmons? They're both the same people. So let's take a shot for that Do you have to Because they're both the same people You're saying they're one person You're saying both You're saying both

Oh yeah okay you're right Neither of both Maybe that smoke is getting me Because I'm not even doing anything This is crazy N.W.A. or Wu-Tang Clan? God damn Are you sure nigga you gonna be cool?

I know I'm gonna be cool Well start sipping Okay so you said same right? He said both Right both? Because you know Ah man cause N.W.A. man was just like you you

talk about cube ren dre and easy and then you're looking at the wu-tang clan and all nine of them came and shocked the planet you cannot they both those both of those crews shocked the planet don't forget the doc and doc that would have been if he didn't... Imagine what he would have been. We just had him on. We just had him on. Last week. Imagine.

This week. Was it this week? Yeah, yeah, yeah. It's coming out this week. Do people realize when you play and hear lyrically what he was?

I don't think he sold a million records, though. He didn't come out and do whatever. He lyrically... From Texas, lyrically, he was insane. It was similar to you guys.

You had DOS FX. You had EPMD. Yes. You had, I forget who else. Who am I forgetting? Was it Reggie? Yeah. Excuse me, Redman.

Redman. And they had NWA, Eazy-E, and DLC at the same time. Yeah, DLC. He was very dangerous. Very. Even though, don't forget, he wrote the chronic, though, too. Yeah, his pen game was crazy. He was damn near the Nas of the West Coast before.

Yeah, you're right. You got to give him that. People don't talk about him. And not even West Coast because he's from Texas, but he made his chops in L.A. People didn't give it to him because they don't know him and he only had the one situation. But again, if you go back and you play it or watch the video his his his delivery all of it like he knew his game was wild we're taking a shot right come on i look yeah and you know we ask him he was here yeah we shot him you know how how uh fuck it for you what is it it's uh what's the name of the the hit no no no

we're asking him, yo, where'd the patchwork come from? He said he just made it up. Like, we thought, you know, maybe he had some Caribbean background. He's like, nah, he just said he wanted to shock, he wanted to shock Drake

in the studio. Did you see his documentary? You got to see his documentary because when they talk about it, right, they all, everyone's like, and then Dr. Dre looks up and goes, I still to this day Don't know what the fuck

He said Oh for real Wow But it's wild He wasn't saying shit He said he just wanted to Bust out with that shit Right

No that's such an ill record And the whole album The album's crazy It is Okay Get the next one Biz Markie or ODB Biz Markie

Digital or analog analog all fucking day I'm analog all day too cube or Scarface this is a highly debatable one here you can go on that

you can say whatever I feel they're the same from different parts. They are the same, but you got one person that is radical, and one dude who tells stories that's insane. Radical would be a cube for you. Yes, whatever. But when you play America's Most Wanted, nigga, this is life-changing. And Death Certificate, too.

I think that's one of the biggest records. You playing and Jacket for Beats, the fucking EP. But I'm saying, back to back to back. That run. You got to include N.W.H. at the Compton.

Part of that run. And I don't want to do that because niggas is for real. Can you say my name? But Face is one of the- Nah, he's- Listen, man, but- Listen. You got to recognize me.

You Face and- Face is my friend. Don't forget, I produced this nigga. Right. So he's my boy. But when you go back to NWA and the writing, America's Most Wanted, that's a certificate. And the EP. Kill That Will is the EP, yep.

Just now, with all the success and such, you. That run is crazy. But you got to drink. That's what I said. That's what my argument was. That run is crazy. I know. Okay.

I had it built up. I was getting ready to say my. Give me up. I was getting ready to say my... Give me that. I was getting ready to go there. You guys are wild for this one. You got to say this one. I guess I got to say it. Puerto Rican food or Jamaican food? Spanish. I like how you said Spanish instead of Puerto Rican. All my baby mothers is Puerto Rican. All right. All right. That's right. Make some noise for your baby mother. I don't know why I thought rest in peace to Hurricane G, but I thought she was Cuban at one point for some reason. Because you was out of line.

See, that twang that Cardi B got, she had it first. Cardi B is Dominican. But the strong Puerto Rican sound. Oh yeah. The sassiness. Hurricane G was... Cardi B is Dominican though. Listen man. She might be madi B is Dominican, though.

Listen, man. You know what? It's a bug that you write about that because that's the whole shit because I'm Dominican. But listen. Wait, wait, what? No, listen. I'm not. She's like, dickhead. You know what?

Because I can't listen. Because the green eyes, right? I can pull it. I'm listening. You want to spin out. Listen. Hey pull it. I'm listening. You want us for that? Hey, wait, wait. Let me finish my story.

What's my story? I had a rap group named Team Hot up in Wash Heights, right? Yeah. They look just like us. Uh-huh. So, I'm like, damn, I look like y'all, you know? Maybe I can pass through. Right?

Because again, Dominicans go off that bus on 72nd Street. Fuck all that. I don't give a fuck what anybody say. I'm parked outside. He's going to come with the tostogas and be like, I'm here. She don't know no English,

but she bad as fuck. I'm just waiting to see if I can fix that. You know that bus that come up on Broadway? They bus that come up. You said you're going to teach her English? What? Before anybody go get her, I'm going to talk to her. And then my boy going to translate.

I got money for you. I'm going to give you an apartment, pay to stay in, some food and some clothes. And a visa. That's what they was doing. I mean, look,

you're not saying nothing that people really do out there. I didn't know about the culture. So whatever, I'm just here trying to see what's going on.

Wash Heights was new to me. Wow. And Dominica's was heavy. Now Wash Heights is to me. Wow. And Dominicans was heavy. Now Wash Heights is gentrified with restaurants and the whole not to. Starbucks and all that. But at that time, this is what they did. We parked outside 71st, 76th Street. Mira.

And listen. You missed the leaves to get your Starburst for you at the corner store. Don't laugh, man. Don't laugh. No, but the Grimmbacks were the Dominican with the Card, man. Don't laugh. No, but they're getting back to the Dominican with the Cardi B. You're right.

Dominicans and Puerto Ricans want you to know they're not that. Yeah, everybody's Cubans, Puerto Ricans. Like, we all Colombians. I don't understand the part. It's the same way

if I said you from Brooklyn and you were like, nah, I'm from Long Island. Because each has their own kind of their own culture. But that's the difference, though. Why are they saying that to knowing that they... It's stupid.

To me, it seems like they're close, but I don't know that. No, it's not. Right. It's not, but it is. The thing is, that's colonial bullshit in all of our minds. Great. You're correct. That's what it is.

But it is a difference, though. When I eat my fungo from a Puerto Rican... There's different slang. And I eat my fungo. But his was fucked up about that. You I eat mofongo from a Puerto Rican, and I eat mofongo, but here's what's fucked up about that. You can't even base it on the food. I went to my favorite Puerto Rican restaurant for damn near six months. I asked to meet the goddamn chefs,

and the chefs was Dominican. I was heated. I was like, this is not fair. But how different is mofongo from mangú? How different? It's the same shit, but it's not the same. And Cubans, we have the same shit, too. It's all plantain.

There's certain people who can taste Coca-Cola and Pepsi. And you know what? It all comes from Africa. All of that tradition comes from Africa. I'll take a check for that. It all comes from Africa. Our music, our food, it's all a mix. Huh?

Why not, Mr. Lee? Because one is Puerto Rican and one is Dominican. That's the only difference. You go like this when you eat it? What, what? That's the a mix. Huh? Why not? Why not, Mr. Lee? Because one is Puerto Rican and one is Dominican. That's the only difference. You go like this when you eat it? What, what? That's the only difference. No, it's not a plantain. Wait.

It's all based on plantain, bro. Relax, man. Hold up. This is the part, too. I love this argument, by the way. Because Alendule is, again, different with Puerto Ricans and Dominicans. Right. Some of them put olives in it, right?

Right. In what? In what? Yeah, the Alain Doulet, the rice and beans. Yeah, and some people put olives in the ground beef, too. And some people put olives in their pocket. I'm with that, too. Dominicans don't do it the same way that

Puerto Ricans do. Yeah, there's differences. That's why they... That's their beef. But it's the same name. No, it's not that. And then you gotta understand. The dish is called what?

Exactly. So that dish... Yeah, arroz y frijoles, arroz y congri. But then this is the thing too be hungry motherfuckers the differences to divide the caribbean and then the the south american and central american those start to change you know because then it's colonialism how long spain was there how long this was here like spain not a part of us spain is the reason why we talk Spanish, guys. Spain,

let me just tell you something. Come on, bro. Spain is the whitest. You're not a Taino. You are not a Taino. Spain is the whitest Latino country in the world. The color.

In the world. They are the reason why we are Latinos, unfortunately. I don't like them. It's colonialism, bro. I got to relax. And we all got to

take that shit and shut it. We all the same. Yeah, we're fucking up right now. You picked Puerto Rican food. You picked colonialism. You picked colonialism. Too short or E-40? Short.

Hammer or vanilla ice? Hammer. We got to talk. You was on that tour? Yeah. So how did you feel when everybody, like was it around

ever the time when third base was dissing Hammer, when people were dissing Hammer? Third base didn't come. They came in 91, but they wasn't out yet. They probably came when we got off the road. But how did you feel about people dissing Hammer and being that you was in fact?

Not because I had, don't forget, we had beef with Hammer, so it wasn't. So you guys started that then? What you mean? You had beef with Hammer, EPMD? Yeah, on the tour, yeah. Oh, remind us. Listen, me and Paris, on the tour, yeah. Oh, remind us. Listen, me and Paris, we gave it to everybody.

Like I said, I was, like I said, six, two and a half, heavy set, chocolate brown, hell of a jab, gift to get. It didn't matter. People thought they was like that, and we had to show them that you wasn't like that. So you open your mouth up, you're catching it. That's why Keith Murray was a problem, though, too. Everybody was trying to calm Keith Murray down, but you, they was sparking the fire on him. So he couldn't sit back and just say whatever.

He was going to cut you. So the same thing, too. When you're on this road and you're on this thing, always artists, you know, they want to get to a certain position. I want to go on before you or this and that or take your spot the whole nine. And anybody that was trying to get that, they had it coming. I never heard about the EPMD MC. I mean, I think I

vaguely remember. I said it on somebody else's thing, but you know, you want to hear what happened? Yes, I do. Okay, so we had a dancer called Fendi. Fendi was a good dancer. He's from Brooklyn? No, he's from... Brooklyn? No, he's from Far Rockaway.

Okay. Right? So he was all over the stage. Hammer comes out to speakers and rises, so you know you want to be like, stay off the speakers. You know what I'm saying? Hammer saying that?

Hammer's people told get out stay off epmd's dancers stay off the speaker right right so so okay so we on tour whatever like that's not that and this but when you in the when the mo in the crowd's hype you get amped so maybe in my dancer's mind he remembered but he probably didn't remember it. So, that one night, Vanilla Ice opens up. Matter of fact, Vanilla Ice wanted to go on tour and dance with Fendi, be on tour with EPMD. It's crazy.

But, he that night, got on the speaker. Dancing. So, we get off the stage. I think it was Hammer's brother, not Lou, but another one, came and was barking at Fendi.

So we don't know what this is going on. Do they have on hammer pants? I don't know. I didn't look at all that. I doubt everybody in his crew had them. Yeah, I'm picturing it. I'm just picturing a nigga screaming with hammer pants on. Maybe the staff, I mean, everybody that was on stage, but I don't think the brother did. But anyway, they was talking, right?

So we hear like yelling. We see the dancer going back and forth. So Paris comes over, hears it, and then boom, busts his nigga glasses, everything. The brother? Yes, all of it. Just all of it. And Paris was quick to throw a punch first quickly. So once he hit him, we see like a whole

fucking sea of people. Can you imagine? Hammer got 30 on stage anyway. Yeah, that's what he was known for. So the people start coming and there was police officers. No, I can't make this up. So after a while,

we ended up moving towards the wrong way. So now we in this corridor where you go backstage and change. And you're being cornered? And now it's me, Solo, Alvin, God of the Dead, and some other person against all these people. And we're like, oh shit. And one of the guys was like, yo, I want him, the chubby one. So I'm like, god damn it. I'm like, holy shit. So now I get into a karate stance.

I don't know. No kung fu. What kind of karate stance? Yo, you're storytelling this all right now. I get into a karate stance nothing whatever so Solo is a golden glove boxer so at least

I know maybe he can be able to see what he gotta do back it up take two or three one on one but I know Alvin he's dangerous but again

there's too many people right for some reason the police or the sheriffs it didn't get to that point but it almost got there so then the next day

we get a call from Leo and Russell because they had called them and said we want no parts for EPMD we want no parts of them and that's how it ended. The tour ended. Wow.

It's like, wow. Did you ever connect with Hammer after that? No, he didn't even show up to the next show. In his hometown, he didn't show up. Oakland.

Because of that? If he didn't come. To Oakland? No. That's crazy. Yeah. Mr. Fab, where y'all at? Too short, nobody?

Short came. Short came. Short was my, that's still my boy. Right. Like, short was like, really kind of like holding me down, kind of. Oh, really? Okay. You know?

Because they all cool now. Yeah. But they wasn't back then. I'm cool with Hammer now, too. I was cool with him then. Except for when people talk about Hammer, I'm like, man, you got to be crazy. Motherfucker sold 10 million records. You cannot take nothing from him.

And I was also an advocate, too. Like, where was he at for Hip Hop 50? You cannot do that. You cannot just leave that out. The big part of it, like, whatever. That's why he never came. You'd be like, yo, what happened to him? But again, the like, whatever. That's why he never came. You'd be like, yo, what happened to him? But, again, the time, whatever.

Everybody, listen, you're young, Nori, out there in the 90s. Ain't no, none of these phones, none of these other shit, this and that, whatever. Niggas got busy. You know how many shootouts we was in? Jesus. Like, as far as, like, you know, North Carolina, fucking Cali, fucking Rochester, upstate. I mean, these people didn't play you coming to their town. Right.

Because don't forget, you in their town, the girls is looking at you, the whole nine, whatever like that, and they doing the shit they have in the puffy at the club. Yo, I got money too, you know? That's the type of shit that was going on back then. Man, we in fucking Ohio, right? We in one of them shits, whatever, one of them arenas,

and I put, I have my, the EPMD jacket, put my jacket down. Somebody stole my jacket. So somebody said, yo, I got Eric Sermon's jacket, right? Making a whole big deal. I'm like, damn, man, this nigga's got my jacket. So I don't know who has it. But anyway, 12 Detroit niggas.

It's 8,000 people in there. They tearing this arena the fuck up. Right? Now, with me is Jalen Rose. Oh shit. Right? I'm the only one with a pistol. So now

it's like, okay, we gotta get because these niggas are now shooting. So I'm pistol. So now, it's like, okay, we got to get because these niggas are now shooting. So I'm telling you right now, kid, my mother died eight months ago. Jalen Rose is outside in a moving van. He had to jump in because

it was that hectic out in that part, but we got this basketball niggas. We got to make sure that he's safe. Wow. And this is when he's safe. Wow. And this is when he's in the NBA or when he was in the NBA? Yeah, it was in the NBA. Yeah. Okay.

Number five five. Maybe you might know, maybe, because this is 1990. Yeah, because isn't that the time? So that's five five. Isn't that the five five? It might be still five five. It might be still five five. Yeah, it might be, because don't forget, if you watch some

of his documentaries, you see on the sofa with Paris. Him and Paris, they got cool. But again, Fab Five had to be because it's 90.

So also had the moving band. I'm a white motherfucker. I'm a white motherfucker. Crazy. And I'm like, yeah, imagine that shit didn't go right. Right.

Thank God it did. Okay. Cypress Hills or Fugees? I got to go with Cypress because those are my boys, even though Fugees are my people, too, because I was mad cool with Lauren in the

beginning. People don't know that about Lauren. Lauren used to call the studio. We used to talk a lot. Like, talk a lot on the phone. You know what I mean? But again, Cypress Hills, they changed their whole Fugees chain. Let's skip, too, but like talk a lot on the phone you know what I mean but again but you know Cypress Hills they changed the whole

food chain let's skip to but for niggas like that hardcore shit that was popping with them I thought they was from New York that's the way

the perception the first video I was like holy shit but you gotta talk about you said you got the the tape the Cypress tape

we had the same Sony rep so when I when I got off the plane me and Paz was in the car with the Sony rep he had the Cypress tape. We had the same Sony rep. So when I got off the plane, me and Paz was in the car with the Sony rep. He had the Cypress Hills tape, whatever. I heard it. I'm like, this shit is crazy. I just happened to call Cube because I wanted Cube to hear it. I don't know why I called them.

But I said, yo, meet me at... He said, no, meet me at such and such. So I brought him the tape. When I came home, he in the video. Yeah. So he really liked the, you know, Cyber Steals when he heard them. And he's in the video in New York. That's what I'm saying.

In New York, that's the ill part. And Be Real says, when he looked up and saw him, like, holy shit, that's cute. That video has mad cameos. Yeah. That's a crazy video. A lot of New York cameos. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Yeah, he said that the label wanted them to shoot that to get to New York cameo. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Yeah, he said that the label wanted them to shoot that to get the New York, because again, not knowing that L.A. was going to play the record, but it's a New York sound and it's a jam,

so they're like, yo, let's shoot it there. It definitely got me. It was smart. It got me. You still going with that? Yeah, we've got another one. A death squad or hit squad?

The hit squad. Okay. Metro Boomin or hit squad? The hit squad. Okay. Metro Boomer or Murder Beats? Metro. Keith Murray or Redman? Why you doing that? Go ahead and drink, man. Cheers.

Salud. You got to sip. About to take a super pee-pee in a second. Just Blaze or Bink? They hate each other, by the way, FYI. Yeah, I know. See, if I say it's just because he did the record for me, though, too.

But Bink Dog's style is just insane. I think that people, I think he might be the father of it, of a couple of people's styles on the low. Wow. On the low. Because if you play the songs, don't forget,

he was there first. Right. So if you play the records and see some of the technique of it. When you say he was there first, you talking about Rockefeller or you talking about? No,

the style of the beat. Okay. When you hear people that came after him. Wow. You know, I'm just like, hey man,

hey, God damn it. That's big coming for you. I'm just giving the factual timing. The history of it. When you see the stuff that he was doing and you got to put Rockwell in there too because again some of the styles are similar

but he was first before the other one you know and but again we all take from shit you know what I mean but you know Just Blaze is incredible you gotta sit man

because both of them is ill at what they do I know. I'm sorry. Illegal or the youngsters? Illegal. Come on. Both those groups are dope, though.

Rakim or KRS-One? Rakim is my mentor. Chris is my man, though, too, but I got to go for my partner who's down the block from me. Long Island. Long Island. I'm going to have to take a pee-pee.

I got it. You got to take a dookie? Yeah. He picked Rakim. MJ or Prince? Obviously Michael. Yeah, you know Michael Jackson. Even though Prince is still a genius because he produced his own music and the whole nine.

I just watched some shit on Michael Jackson just before about what they said that Michael Jackson, when he did the O for Winfrey interview, right? It was 1 billion people that watched it. No, 500, 500 million.

Right. Then when he did, Oh no. Right? Then, when he did, oh no, when he passed away, it was one billion people that watched it. The funeral?

Yes. Wow. So when you talk about the people like, I'm the next Michael, none of y'all, no way in the world. His whole shit about him,

Prince don't have that neither. But you have to give it to Michael. He was something that we never, ever, ever, ever seen before. Right. Did you ever hear the stories of them beefing? No. Yeah. Like the more and more.

Yeah? We interview people, yeah. Yeah. I don't think they like each other at all. Yeah, but Mike said he showed up to one of these shows and shit. But he was there to shut him down. He wasn't there, like. Oh, okay.

Oh, oh. He wasn't there to, like. He, like, Mike would come up to some Prince shows and know that these people ain't going to tell him no. He's fucking Mike with Jackson. And he would go on and try to, like, perform before Prince on certain things. For real? Yeah, like this is, we have multiple stories

from different people. And Mike was, yeah, Mike was kind of, the more and more you kind of see it, and you like kind of see him like with gang members, you're like,

that didn't make sense. Like, I almost thought I saw him throw up a sign, but I didn't. I didn't, and I did. Wait, and beat it?

No, no, no. I'm talking about like in Thriller, all that. It was always like certain things. And then you hear like his affiliation. Like, it's different, man. So I always enjoy those stories. Those are my favorite stories, Michael Jackson and Prince stories. Have you ever met Mike?

Let me tell you a story with Mike. Yeah. Have you ever met Mike? Let me tell you a story with Mike. So I got a call to go do Blackstreet. Tell you Riley. So me and my cousin ride down to Virginia. Did they call Bernard Alexander again? Nah. All right, cool.

Yo, you mentioned his name one more time. I'm stopping the show. You know who I mentioned it. I know, but this is too much. Okay, go ahead. Let's go, let's go. MJ, MJ, let's take name one more time. I'm stopping the show. You know I mentioned it. I know, but this is too much. Okay, go ahead. Let's go. Let's go. MJ, let's take this to the store.

He's already in every interview. He's like, E, did you say my name again? What are we talking about? No, I'm kidding. So I go to Virginia, and I see... You're expecting to see Teddy Rowley? No, I go see him. He called me. Okay, Teddy.

So don't forget I did Booty Call The first single When they first album right That's right So after I Whatever I walk inside

For real So I walk inside there The first person I meet Is Pharrell Wow Right In Virginia Pharrell is a producer

There him Chad And a singer named Mike So He's like yo I rap Pharrell I a producer. Him, Chad, and a singer named Mike. So he's like, yo, I rap. Pharrell, Philly. Yes. Is his shirt tight? I feel like he has a tight shirt.

No, what's up with you people? I'm not looking at people like that. I do. I'll have to describe the situation. But go ahead, continue. So if you go on the internet, there's a song with me and Pharrell Called Bootnacalization That we made in 1993 Boot what?

Fuck out of here I know it's crazy 93 Yes Because I put him on two records So what you trying to say You discovered the Neptunes before me? No I just

Yo what you trying to do here man? Teddy had him Right that's very true Yeah he had him early He had Very true Before Rump Shaker In the studio That was the producers Yeah yeah What do you do here, man? Teddy had him. Right, that's very true. Yeah, he had him early. Early, yeah. Very true. Before Rump Shaker. In the studio,

that was the producers. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I let him rhyme on the records that I was doing. You let Pharrell rhyme before anybody else let him rhyme. Right. I always take those props.

Damn, fuck you, Eric. I always take those props. I didn't know that. You got to go on the YouTube and look at it. I didn't know that. I didn't know that. I didn't know that.

So anyway, I'm already amped up because I'm there with Teddy. You got to go on the YouTube and look at it. I didn't know that. I didn't know that. I didn't know that. So anyway, I'm already amped up because I'm there with Teddy. Right. Outside the tour bus, right? Michael Jackson on the tour bus. So, Mike goes to the bathroom.

I miss him, right? So I don't know that part. Teddy says, Eric, yo, you want to meet Michael? I'm like, not now. You said not now. I don't know that part. Teddy says, Eric, yo, you want to meet Michael? I'm like, not now. You said not now. I don't know.

What's wrong with you? Were you nervous or something? Did you tell him it was Michael J. Fox? I was there with Teddy. No, I was there with Teddy. He wasn't like, this is what I was here doing. For some reason, that wasn't more important than what I was doing. I know.

That's the illest shit. I told Teddy, not now. Crazy. I could have walked on that bus, shook hands, maybe could have been on a record, anything. Anything. My mind was someplace else. And let me guess, did Michael float out of there? No, he's ill, man.

He never sees him again. I never saw him. You out of there? No, he's ill, man. Look at this guy. He never sees him again. I never saw him. You never saw him? No. So your one chance to meet Mike, you blew it. Take a picture of the whole, I could have had all that shit. Yeah, man. You ain't even take a flick for the gram.

Tell you what, collaborate. Take a flick for yourself. Tell you what, collaborate the story, nigga. Like, yo, the bus is sitting out there. He said, you want to meet him? I said, not now. He must have thought, Teddy must have thought

he was wild. I don't know what he thought. What did Michael think if he was told Teddy? Oh yeah, if he was, how would he know?

Hey Teddy, tell Eric Sherman to come back here. Michael would have been like, he would have been like, crumbs. And then Teddy went back and said,

hey man, he'll be here in a little while. Yeah, but at the end of the day Michael Jackson Nobody was bigger than him Nobody Nobody

I'm not going to lie Chris Brown right now Very close What I told you nigga Very close though 500 million people Watching 1 billion people

Michael's an international phenomenon When he goes to the shows There's 100,000 people A shot No matter what Outside When he goes to the shows, there's 100,000 people a shot, no matter what, outside when he goes somewhere, they got to shut down the whole fucking

black neighborhood, everything. We never seen that from no individual, ever. That was it. Yeah. That's what I said, close.

Like damn near shaped political, everything internationally probably helped the Cold War. People that have stopped to see it when they show up somewhere what they got to do they have to shut down the neighborhood. This is just proof of the millions

and millions and millions of people. We never seen that for no individual. He's bigger than anything we've ever seen. Who? Come on Murray you just left field right now? That's two different things man. This That's why this question is crazy. I can come up with those two more. Oh, it is?

Okay. Oh, y'all go ahead. Ye or Pharrell? Kanye. We did that already? No. No, no, no. We just brought up Pharrell.

We just brought him up. You said, who'd you say? You said Kanye? Kanye. Even though Pharrell is ill, but Kanye, when he came, he kind of, whatever. I know when I was, like you said, when you sit there, you're kind of dormant. Right. But when I heard the shit when he came out, it kind of woke me up.

Kanye. As a producer, yeah. Okay. That's a compliment. Radio or podcast? Oh, it's podcast. Okay. Good. Good answer. Good answer. Good answer. Cam or Mace? Radio or podcast? Oh, it's podcast. Okay, good.

Good answer. Good answer. Good answer. Cam or Mace? You got to sip it. Oh, yeah. Big up to Cam and Mace, too, man. I'm very proud of you. And that's why.

I don't even know what they've done. That's why. Because, again, they both, to me, is almost kind of the same though, kind of though too. Because they both spit that dollar on the fire. They both spit it. It's dope what they're doing. Cheers.

Love what they're doing. Chris Rock or Dave Chappelle? Y'all got the biggest list ever. Yeah. That's a long, y'all niggas wild out with that. Yeah. So Chris Rock or, Dave, Chappelle. Yeah.

No, because I know Chris more than I know Dave. Tell us a story. No, I'm just saying that Chris Rocker is an EPMD fan. So, I'm saying I don't,'t you know and I watched everything he did and I watched everything Dave did too and they're both just hip hop heads

like heavy hip hop heads both of them yeah and both of them are legends and both of them yeah you got a drink? alright

one more sip no you too man I'm drinking we're drinking every time I know but you gotta cool out too like yeah you gotta cool out

this shit right here these are questions they fucked it up and got y'all drunk. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Nah, we good. Nah, yeah, we're not good. Raekwon or Method Man? Oh, man. Oh, man.

Raekwon is ill, but I'm going to give it to Method Man. Okay. Kicker Pree or DJ Red Alert yeah but they they do different things Kickapree is that's the point yeah

it's whatever it's whatever your category whatever you can say both yes both because they both impacted. Hugely impacted.

Usually. Because that mixtape game was something insane. Dr. Dre or Puff Daddy? Will you stop? Go ahead. Of course it's Dre. You said Dre? Yeah.

Molly Maul or Lars Professor? Molly Maul. Yeah. He invented sampling. You got to give it. There's nothing to say about that. Molly Marl or Lars Professor Molly Marl Yeah He invented sampling You got to give it There's nothing to say about that Right You still going?

Only a couple more A couple more Yo! MTV Raps or Video Music Box Ralph Medanus I like that Kiss or Fabulous Why does it say Fabian? Why does it say Fabian? Why does it say Fabian?

They wrote it in Spanish. I speak fluent. I speak fluent Mr. Lee. They knew that you was not representing. They put that in there. You put the Fabi-o. Have him say it because he going toalos! Have him say it, because he's going to say it. Have him say it. By the way, I didn't know this. Yeah, wow. West with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater Podcast Network, hosted by me,

writer and historian Dan Flores, and brought to you by Velvet Buck. This podcast looks at a West available nowhere else. Each episode, I'll be diving into some of the lesser known histories of the West. I'll then be joined in conversation by guests such as Western historian Dr. Randall Williams and best-selling author and meat-eater founder Stephen Rinella. I'll correct my kids now and then where they'll say when cave people were here and I'll say it seems like the ice age people that were here didn't have a real affinity for caves. So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th where we'll delve into stories of the West and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today. Listen to The American West with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app,

Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I know a lot of cops, and they get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. Across the country, cops called this taser the revolution. But not everyone was convinced it was that simple. Cops believed everything that taser told them.

From Lava for Good and the team that brought you Bone Valley comes a story about what happened when a multi-billion dollar company dedicated itself to one visionary mission. This is Absolute Season 1.

Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. It's really, really, really bad. Listen to new episodes of Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated, on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Binge episodes 1, 2, and 3 on May 21st and episodes 4, 5, and 6 on June 4th.

Add free at Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. And it's going to take us to heal us. It's Mental Health Awareness Month and on a recent episode of Just Heal with Dr. J, the incomparable Taraji P. Henson stopped by to discuss how she's discovered peace

on her journey. So what I'm hearing you saying is healing is a part of us also reconnecting to our childhood in some sort. You said I look how youthful I look because I never let that little girl inside of me die. I go outside and run outside with the dogs. I still play like a kid. I laugh. You know, I love jokes. I love funny. I love laughing. I laugh at myself. I don't take myself too seriously. That's the stuff that keeps you young and stops you from being so hard.

To hear this and more things on the journey of healing, you can listen to Just Heal with Dr. J from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. AT&T. Connecting changes everything. Fab turned out to be dangerous. He did. Yeah, man. Kiss was always dangerous. Always. Yeah, so, you know, you gotta

sip it. You know why? Because, again, because Fab turned out to be something dangerous. I mean, we don't have to sip it. You know why? Because again, because fads tend to be something dangerous. I mean, we don't have to sip it. I know. Yeah. You got it, Sonny? New Jack City or King of New York? If a nickel bag is sold in the park.

Frank White. But Nino Brown. Nino Brown brung Tharski niggas back to life. Yeah, yeah. No, what was homegirl? Rock and Ride Baby? That was the illest thing. New Jack City, yep.

But even though King of New York was fucking amazing. What's my man's name? And Chris Rock is- He was crazy. Wesley Snipes. Oh. Wesley Snipes did such a good job that when I met him in real life, I was still scared of him. Yeah?

And Ice-T, bro. Ice-T was a cop. But he did such a good job. That was the first time you saw him. I knew he wasn't a cop, though. He's the most illest gangster rapper, and this is the first time you see him as a cop. He did such a good job. That was the first time you saw him. I knew he wasn't a cop. He's the most illest gangster rapper, and this is the first time you see him as a cop. It was ill. Cool.

Ice-T. No, no, no. That's a fact. That's a fact. But what I'm saying is, my first time encountering Ice-T, because of that role, I wasn't scared of him. But when I met Westy- Oh, you were scared of him as-

Yeah, Westy. I saw- Nino. Nino. Yeah, Pookie. Look at your funky black ass. Yeah. And Pookie saw. Nino. Nino. Yeah, Pookie, look at your funky black ass. Yeah, and Pookie, yeah. Chris.

So you picked New Jack City? Yeah. Okay. And this is the last one, then we can get back to the interview. Loyalty or respect? I got to go on with, was it, holy shit, who'd you have up here? Snoop? No.

Sad Love? No. Yeah, Snoop said it though, too. But also, I think it was Bleak, Memphis. Everybody has a different take on it. I think they kind of, you need both of them. I think both is the most logical answer. I think this is the only question that we're supposed to drink on.

People come in with one, and they go in with this crazy diatribe of why one. So respect and loyalty, right? Yes. Me? Respect might be a little bit more bigger, though. Because the reason why is like, the loyalty is there, too, but I feel like if you don't got respect, you can't get that. So you don't want both?

You do, but respect is a big one, though. So you'd rather that than both? That's the thing. I'm going to respect, because that shit goes a long way. Because I can see what's happening. Loyalty, for me, is not how I'm still here. Respect not how I'm still here.

Respect is how I'm still here. Niggas respect me. So this is why I'm saying that to the loyalty I didn't really have to be loyal to nobody like that. You know,

that I know about. They'd be like, yo, damn, you're a loyal nigga. No, but respect? No, respect got me where I'm at. So you're going with respect?

Yes. But, let me just chime in. I'm explaining it the way niggas didn't explain it that way. Yeah, that's real. Respect, you can't buy it the way niggas didn't play it that way like respect you can't buy it you niggas can't get it if you if respect is earned it's always earned exactly it's always earned yeah but let me just chime in on you a little bit you not only have respect you have love that's the beautiful thing about you like you don't just have features

because people you know are looking to get a check or looking to know. People respect you, brother. That's what I'm saying. That's why I'm here. Yeah. The respect is you. But love is loyalty. That respect comes through love, though, right?

And to me, love is loyalty. And love is loyalty. You're putting three together, nigga. You got to choose love and loyalty. You said loyalty and respect. The love is something different. You can't just add another word. No, love is loyalty in my opinion.

You can't add another word. No? No, he said loyalty. I understand what you're saying. Love. Loyalty and respect. Love, he's adding another word. We can't do that.

I think love and loyalty is the same, no? You're not adding another word. Not really, not really. Not at all. Someone could love you and not be loyal to you. I'm going to take a shot for that anyway. I'm going to take a shot. For me getting it wrong, I'm going to take a shot.

You're trying to add something to the new contest. Because people that love you might not be loyal to you. I'm going to take a shot for that anyway. For me getting it wrong, I'm going to take a shot. You try to add something to the new contest. Because people that love you might do you dirty. Yeah. That's facts. Exactly. We don't want you to say shit. I want my shit. Stop just playing.

Go ahead. Let's go, man. You've been drinking from you. You deserve to say something. There ain't no camera on you or nothing. They ain't got no love for you. Oh, I'm going to be like that. I'm going to be like that.

Huh? Let's say what I want to say. Everyone's road is different. Your road might have, you know, on you or nothing. They ain't got no love for you. Oh, I'm a bad, I'm a bad. Huh? I just want to say what I want to say. Everyone's road is different. Your road might have, you know, This nigga drunk. Some people might go on a dirt road. Wait, wait, wait, wait.

Your longevity, you know, your road, it might have started off with loyalty and ended up, you're still here to respect vice versa. And that's why I'm saying that. Exactly. I didn't understand what he said. I did.

I just told you. No, you did not understand what he said. Respect comes first. He said like this. He said like this. He said vice versa. And then he flipped it like this. He said vice versa. And then he flicked it like this. He said vice versa.

The Lord came and come after him. Well, let me tell you something, Eric Sherman. Our show is about giving people their flowers when they can smell them, their thoughts when they can tell them, their dreams when they can drink them,

their thoughts when they can think them. And we need to give you your flowers. We need to give you your flowers. We need to give you your flowers. We wasn't doing this back then the first time you came on. The first time was... Hold on, let me say something. Let me say something for you. Mad bottles that was empty on the table.

Empty? What do you mean? We drank them because they was empty. Back in 2016, y'all was in a hotel with a bootleg chairs and all that type of shit. It was different times, man. Different times. Well, listen. He's pulling our car.

Y'all wasn't advanced. Y'all was trying to figure that shit out. We did. But we figured it out, right? Exactly. So this right here is dope. This is us figuring it out. Holy shit.

So let me just say something. Yo, I'm fucked with this, B. If it wasn't an EPMD, there wouldn't be a Capone or Noriega and there wouldn't be a Capone or Noriega and there wouldn't be

a drink. Absolutely. So... Did you watch the fucking shit with Mark Warbone talking in addition? Uh-oh.

No. Say it won't be a Backstreet Boys or NSYNC. You got the same. He might have seen that. You know that Now I know why you got that No it's the truth It's the truth

APMD It's the evolution man The two man groups The two man groups from Smith & Wesson To Mobb Deep To M.O.P To all of us We all owe it to y'all

I appreciate that That two man And I know I always say this word wrong Camarberry Right to M.O.P., to all of us, we all owe it to y'all. Right. I appreciate that. That two men, and I know I always say this word wrong, camaraderie. Right. That's the Spanish coming out of me. Yeah. Camaraderie. Camaraderie. You know that, man.

Yeah. The Commodores. You motherfuckers invented that? Well, we robbed Run DMC for it. But Run DMC was considered three people, though. Still. So why y'all say that? I understand that, though, but it's two. But Run DMC was considered three people, though. Still. So why y'all say that? I understand that, though, but it's two.

But it's still two rappers. Yeah, they had a DJ, too. Yeah, but. No, no, no. Jammin' Jay is the pinnacle. But the two rappers back and forth. Listen, when you look at the EPMD logo. Mm-hmm.

Oh, Lior did that. Russell said. Lior did this? Russell. I said, EPMD was E-P-E-E-M-D-E-E. It was long. Russell was like, do it this way. I said, Russell, you can't take your Run DMC logo.

The red? You can't take Run DMC's logo. Right. Because all it is is this chopped up line. Run DMC is one line. Damn, y'all had the same motherfucking logo. Now I don't look at it. What the fuck? And we told Russell, he said, don't take care, don't worry about that. I take care of that.

Chico. He said Chico. You fucking my childhood. I never know what to say to him just now. This ain't no fucking secret. You look right at it. It's not a secret. We're idiots. It's not a secret. But if you didn't know No, you're right. It's not a secret. We're idiots. It's not a secret. But if you didn't know, you didn't know.

I didn't know until today. I mean, I just thought the Def Jam. We had different colors, and then they had the nerve to put the red and the white like them on this one. Because these were the colors. Right. Right. And goddammit, it worked.

It worked. And y'all are lit. And because of that, if you want to give it to Run, Run DMC, to you guys, you guys. Well, the style changed. Rakim changed the style, then our new style came in. So that's when we started doing the gun talking. So that's where, again, the mob, these come in. Let me get a plug real quick. Because I called you, though, too.

You was busy. So don't say that. Yo, why I ain get a plug real quick because I called you, though, too. You was busy. So don't say that. Yo, why I ain't on the project because I called? Okay, the two-man group? Right. So when you bringing that up, though, too.

Yeah, you said it last time, too. Dynamic Duels, right? You did the whole album. Capone even called me for that. Dynamic Duels is something that I did because the way y'all did Drink Champs, like, okay, well,

I heard the story. I don't know if it's the way y'all did Drink Champs, like, okay, well, I heard the story. I don't know if it's true that y'all did this because to interview people like us? That's right. Yeah, our peers, yeah, from our generation. So when COVID was going on, even though I had the idea before, I was like, you know what? I got to do this for hip hop and for my colleagues who feel they can't make records no more. Who told you to stop making records?

Like, how you doing this? That's exactly the chance. I'm like, fuck all that. So I called the people. I mean, I DM'd them, I mean. I ain't really calling nobody, but I DM'd them. And I made records on them. So when I have run came to the studios.

Wow. But the Run DMC dynamic, of course, they wasn't making no shit. Both of them was just adamant it ain't happening. Right. So then I made, I called So and Pepper because I didn't have no girls. Wow. So that's why So and Pepper's on there now, though, too. Wow.

But on the album. Who you have? So and Pepper. So and Pepper. Mobb Deep. Mobb Deep. Prodigy was. Yes. You got Prodigy from Heaven? No, man. Jesus. So and Pepper. Mobb Deep. Mobb Deep. Prodigy? You got Prodigy from Heaven?

No, man. Jesus. I got vocals. I'm asking. I got vocals. You got vocals, okay. Helter Skelter. Helter Skelter.

I got vocals. Wow. Dog Pound. Okay. M.O.P. Okay. Red M.F. Not CNN.

E.P.M.D. E.P.M.D. 8 Ball M.J.G. Woo! Bumby. UGK. And UGK. But you can't say-Ball MJG. Woo! Bumby. UGK. And UGK. But you can't say UGK.

You got to say Bumby, Priesterman, Pimp C. Okay. You have to say it legally? You can't say UGK. Oh, wow. Some in the medical...

I'm saying, so that's some shit. Okay. Snoop Dogg and Nate Dogg. Okay. And Biggie Smalls and Biggie. All right. Biggie Smalls and Biggie?

Yes. And when you hear it. Wait, wait, what? Yeah, I know. It's going to stop you. What is Biggie Smalls and Biggie? Early Biggie Smalls and then Notorious. All of it is early.

But it's not something that was like vaguely familiar and the way that I did it it's fucked up because AI came out right so people

ain't gonna look at me and be like yo nah Eric but nah it's me this is how I made it if I if Biggie Smalls

and Tupac was together this is how I would hear them together rocking so I was doing my shit to make it seem like they was together how I said when me and Marvin was like I was doing my shit to make it seem like they was together. How I said with me and Marvin was like, I was answering back and forth with him.

Like he was with me. I made a song like that too to make it seem like those two were together. Which two? Biggie Smalls and Pac. Oh, and Pac. You didn't say that. Yeah, he said Biggie Smalls and Biggie. Oh, yeah, I did.

My bad. Yeah, and you know there was that guy that sued him. That's why he changed Biggie Smalls. I thought that's what you meant. And he ain't been drinking. No. Word. I got drunk off of him talking like that.

Yo, yo, yo, yo. I said Biggie Smalls and Biggie. Yeah. Were you looking at my confusion right now? Yeah, my bad. I said, God damn. Nah. I'm like, I don't always need to want to drink.

No, no, no. Tupac and Biggie Smalls, Tupac can be small. Tupac can be cold as hell. And you got clearance? Well, I guess Puffy cleared his quick. The Tupac stage is kind of, again, they're taking a long time, but nobody said no. So to me, it's a let go to me. I don't think anybody's going to tell you no.

Yeah, you're doing it out of love. I think you're one of those, let me give you your flowers. Please don't cut me off because you've been cutting me off. You've only guessed me. I don't think anybody's going to tell you no. Yeah, you're doing it out of love. I think that's, you're one of those, let me give you your flowers. Please don't cut me off because you've been cutting me off. You don't want to be guessed to cut me off. I like that. He deserves to cut you off. I didn't want to cut you off. Go ahead. No, no, no, it's cool. You are one of those people that no one can actually say no. But no, it says that all the time.

I'm just being honest. Your genuineness, your humbleness, and your realness. And his legacy. I'm not even... The legacy is like number seven. But the realness and how you are as a person. I don't think there's anybody on this earth. There's certain people who have that. Right.

You, I see it in Fat Joe. I can't tell Fat Joe no. And I can't tell DJ Khaled no, even though I be knowing it's wrong. But I be like, damn, Khaled can give me this, I don't know,

Khaled can ask me to do anything, I be like, what the fuck, all right, I'll do it. And I'm like, I don't know why,

like, but, but it's realness, it's the realness, hold on, it's the realness, it's the realness who you are, it's the humbleness, and like, you just all said, it's the realness. It's the realness. Hold on. You're right. My bad. My bad. It's the realness. Shit. It's the realness who you are. It's the humbleness.

And like you just all said. It's the legacy. You're a super, super legend. You're an icon. And I don't think there's anybody on this planet that if you call yourself is going to say no to you. Why do you say that? Because now he's going to look like he's a fucking genius. He is a fucking genius. He is a fucking genius.

He's a genius. I'm just being honest with you, man. But how do you know that that's not something that you wouldn't... I can see him saying, but you saying that too, I don't... Listen, man. I don't know no other way to be. You're never going to see that in yourself. That's the thing. You're right about that. And my mother used to be so upset.

Like, yo, what's wrong with you? Because I'd be like, man, guess who I saw with you because i'd be like my guess who i saw last night she was like so like you know again but this is just me i just i know that the humblest i'm humbled to a fault so that's why i'm in like i really can't say but the position that i'm in i never was able to even though i got the status I never was able to get to, you know, that part. But it's the long game and you are reaching that part. Yeah. Maybe the people that you at one point saw at that part, they're not here anymore.

And that's the part that I'm going to go on that. Apart from still being here after 36 years to be able to still be. Yeah. And then to be able to say, okay, you know what? A, I went to a party during the Grammys. I went to the Warner party because I'm on Warner, right? I walked in there. I was farming because it was all young people.

And I'm the old head in there, you know? But I'm like, I'm here with a project getting ready to come out in the system, like 300, with all that shit they got over there. And I'm over there getting ready to come out. So it kind of bugged me out a little bit that how the fuck I'm doing this this long and still be able to. And then, like, I got an announcement. I can't make it right now, though,, too But yeah about this but the shock the world right because because because my label is gonna be with somebody who did this before and

We are getting ready to make it another impact, you know far as this Somebody's missing the boat with talent. When we signed Nori, we knew he had 10 years. We're not signing that now. We're signing what's popular. So now you see why the music business is not doing so well. Seeing why you see the mirage of what you think is doing well. Nobody is signing no talent and

they're not saying that these everybody that's out is not talented but the talented people that don't have to worry about you was there no you hosted this Leo was like the algorithm the likes you come in front of me with this bullshit i'm smacking shit at you all this shit it don't matter all right and he told every major person in there sign some fucking talent all right he did so so this is where we at at this particular moment we need that leadership can you rap nigga save say some bars okay now rhyme regular but not behind that record right okay can you sing sing regular sing sing now live yeah rhyme regular but not behind that record. Can you sing? Sing regular. Sing now live. Yeah, no auto-tunes. Not behind the computer.

As far as talented people and that's what somebody just said that the major label killed the superstar. Damn. Used to be the radio killed the superstar. So we don't have that. So where is the 50? Where's D? Where's fucking all these people that you see that came out every five years that was humongous?

Where are they? Where's the M? Where's the Snoop? Where are they? We got the same people circling like this. And they're there, though. There's droves of talent, but nobody's doing anything. And that's what Leo was saying.

Right. He told the people, he said, sign some fucking talent. In front of all these labels, he said, look what hip-hop did. Made all y'all motherfucking millionaires. Leo was wild on that day. He said, look at all y'all sitting down there. Hip-hop did this for y'all. Very real.

So that's what I'm saying. I forgot that part. Damn. I forgot that part. Yeah, you was talking about that shit because the only way you don't call him, don't fuck with him. Dame had me scared. Dame with him. That's a name I be scared. No, that's a name. That's a name.

Oh, Jay. Do not fuck with me. I was like pranking the crowd and shit. Jay didn't want to be pranked. And I did not prank him either. But they told him to do it. I pranked everyone around him. But that table was crazy though. Swiss Beats, Jermaine Dupri, told them to do it. Yeah, they told you to go. I pranked everyone around them, but not him.

But that table was crazy, though. Swiss Beats, Jermaine Dupri, Jay, and Puffy. Yeah. It was wild. Are you following what's happening with Wendy Williams? Yeah, of course I watched it, you know? What the fuck? What are they, putting

cameras in her face? She did a series. No, no. That You know? What the fuck? What are they, putting cameras in her face? What is that? I just think that again. She did a series. She did a documentary. No, no. That shit was supposed to be her reintroduction, like she was saying, about coming back to TV. Okay. And then it went left.

Oh, that's what happened in that natural thing? Well, that's what she kept saying. Her health declined there. Right. Well, she wasn't supposed to shoot that. Right. So somebody signed off't supposed to shoot that. Right. So somebody signed off that shouldn't have. I think that, to me, that dude that was talking, I think that they got paid.

Wow. Because, again, she wasn't supposed to be seen. That wasn't supposed to be seen. Do you think that's karma coming back at her? Because she didn't know he wanted to be aggressive. I'm just asking. You think so? Because That question, you already answered that question. That's what everybody else

is saying. That too, too. But people do it, you know? But again, when you at that magnitude and that, all that, what are you doing? Oh, for you to take home. Yeah. He'll smoke all that shit here. He's chonging it for real.

And that shit has cocaine in it. Because I didn't think when these people would let that go down. Who's the peoples? I don't know. But I'm just, I mean. Those were them. That was. The people that.

No, not the family family. You're right. You're right. The family. Nobody was. I didn't think that. That's why you got be like Yo Who benefited Right

And I think it's like The manager And that guy that was You know To me They kept showing him Right You know

Yeah You said the karma Karma's a motherfucker though man I mean because I believe in karma She made a living Putting people In a vulnerable position

And now it's like She's going out At that same vulnerable position that she tried to put everyone else on. And I'm just curious because, I mean, she's the queen of black media to a certain extent. That's one that you can't take from her. After Oprah Winfrey, it was her. Yeah. I didn't know how big she was. All those years she was on. Yeah. I'm like, God damn, She was All those years She was on Yeah

Like I'm like God damn She was that She was big like that Like I remember At one point I wish she dissed me Like I swear to God

You will Yeah because it was like You like Got somewhere If she had beef with you Like Yo And if she didn't have

Beef with you What do you just say About somebody Not saying your name Recently Of Tupac I always wish Tupac Dissed me too

Yes I wanted to be on here He kind of did diss you But he just didn not saying your name recently of tupac i always wish tupac would just be too yes i wanted to know he kind of did this you but he just didn't say your name no he did when he did see it when he did uh mob deep and he said and those other I remember that. He was like, your mom even, one of you niggas got sick of selling other motherfuckers. He was talking about them. I was like, see your name, motherfucker. I never even peeped that when he said other motherfuckers.

I got to go back and check it out now. Because it never came out officially. It was those mixtapes that put out the record. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was hilarious.

No, he said, I wish he said my name. I would have been ill. I would have been on. What? Yeah, I mean, you know, Talib Khali said this in a funny way to us on our show.

And he said, even when Kanye West diss you, he big you up. Because if he diss you, it's like you have a new single out. Yeah. Everyone wants to talk to you. Oh, no. That nigga said something. I looked at Talib like, what? But then I thought about it. He was like, I got 15 interviews over the Dream Chats. Yes something? I looked at Charlie and I'm like, what? But then I thought about it.

He was like, I got 15 interviews over the drink challenge. Yes, that's true. And I was just like, what? That's true. You're right. In a certain way, it is.

Say it like that, Tupac, you're right about that because of your name, that means everybody heard it. Everybody, who's Nori? You're right. You remember Chino XL who was, I love Chino XL.

But I remember everyone inquiring about Chino XL because Tupac dissed him. And Tupac was like, yo, and Chino XL? Fuck you too. And I was like, who the fuck is Chino XL? And everybody went. And I don't know if Chino XL knows that. That's a big nigga though too. That nigga.

Nah, Chino XL is ill, bro. He's Puerto Rican. I love Chino XL. But I remember people who didn't know about hip hop was like, whatever Google was at that time, it wasn't Google back then. Whatever Google was at the time, it was like, let's find out about hip-hop. Yeah, but it doesn't always end that well. So we got to be honest about that part. It doesn't always.

Yes, it's true. Hey, sidebar, though. I got the runs. You know what? You got to take a shit. I was shitting from 6 o'clock this morning to like 8.30. No, seriously. This is crazy.

And I got the bubblegum snap. You take a drink chance to all the level right there. I got the BGs, and I don't know what part that I'm going to get up because you went up and whatever. I took a piss.

I know, but my other shit is coming in. So you was trying to put it on me. You was like, you got to take a shit. I know. It broke down. I was just letting y'all know that's avoided. God, you want to take a break?

We can take a break. No, we got a great bathroom back there. I know. I get it. I'm not scared to do that. I shit in public. I'm just saying the fact that I was shitting since 6.30. And I figured that, you know what, damn, I get to drink champs.

And then I shit champs. What happened was I ate some watermelon and whatever. Because if you eat something else, the BGs come. And you got to be careful. Yeah, you got to be careful with that. Before you go to the bathroom, can I ask you this one question? No, I'm not going to go right now. I'm going to take a piss in a second.

I got to take a piss in a second, too. It could be close. But hostile. On that record, hostile. There's always been that part. He's hostile right now. Where the guy goes, I got a right to be hostile. Right.

Who the fuck was that? That's from the Public Enemy album. Flavor Flav? No, it ain't Flavor. It's somebody from that, that song that I thought it was Martin Lawrence. No, that's from the Public Enemy album. When it comes on from from taking

and what's the Damn, it's not Red Without a Pause. It's one of them records before that I got it from there It's a P.E. album So it's not Marlon Lauren Not Flavor Flav You know Flavor's voice

Yeah, you would know it was Flavor It could have been It could have been Griff I wasn't far off Who was your biggest Influence hip-hop before you got on? Yeah, Run-D.M.C. Top? Number one?

Number one. And the niggas around the way. Who's around the way? Yeah, some dude named Berger Meister and some dude named Amazing A. These guys was the ones that was in the neighborhood. But this kid named Frankie, it was Darnell. I remember these people, man. When I'm coming back to my name, these guys was somebody special.

You know, Born C, my boy Patrick. Like, this is where I was able to get my shit from, from the neighborhood. First, before Rap is the Light came out Like hearing the music Right Rap is the Light came out And Turned my whole shit around

But before that It was these niggas You know Just around the way Just spit Right Did you ever think Hip hop would make it this far?

I know it's a cliche Yeah you sound like the record Listen All I want to do Is go on the radio thing in hip hop to make it this far? I know it's a cliche type of question. Yeah, you sound like the record. Listen, all I want to do is go on the radio. So nothing else really matters. Nobody don't think

about that part. That's crazy with a song called Crossover. No, this is before that. When you first start, you don't care about them. That's why 750 didn't matter.

I got 750 that went to Marshalls and went to King Cullen. I got groceries from my mom's and went to Marshalls and got me an Cullen. I got groceries for my moms and went to Marshalls. Marshalls, you can get your best gear at Marshalls. Marshalls is like for Alexander. Yeah.

Remember Alexander's? See, that's Queens. Yo, you know, niggas tried to get me in Left Brack Mall. Oh, Queens Center Mall? Yeah, what happened? Yo, niggas tried to get me. I went to go see this chick. They tried to rob you?

And she's like, yo, you got to leave the mall. I said, what? She said, niggas trying to get you. God damn it. That's why I'm fucking queens like that. Not like that. When I was doing my rounds, it was mostly Brooklyn, Manhattan, and the Bronx. OK, wow.

But since that shit happened to me, niggas tried to get me. I'm like, I ain't going back there. Jesus, man. Left rack. Left rack. You can try to get me my line going back there Left rack Because the crazy because when you get off right from the LA Whatever and the more like the girl said you gotta get out of here like what you mean Yeah, did they come to get you the mall is gentrified now, yeah. Huh? The mall is gentrified now. Yeah, in 88, it wasn't gentrified, it was niggas.

It was you in there. It was you in there. So what is your favorite part of the game? Is it making the record or performing the record? What you mean? Like, is it you putting the... In the studio

or where it comes out? I guess the same thing. Like, making the songs is better. Making the songs. Yeah, yeah. I mean, like, it's a four. I enjoy hearing what this record sounds like when i'm when i'm producing an artist so you know making those redman records is fun

making red and meth records was fun making keep my records is fun making epmd shit was fun though too but they don't forget that i you know i didn't did you know the jay-z's the fucking the scar faces the you know having four-3-2-1 and having these type of stuff, these records that's out there was fun. Doing R&B was fun. I did much R&B than I did hip-hop music.

People don't see me and be like, oh yeah, I did D'Angelo. I did Chico the Barge. I did these people. You look at all these groups That people It's like Whack to say Google me

But at the end of the day It's like you could say That you did this But like Like Nori was saying I can't say it But nigga you ain't me Right

That's right Like these niggas ain't me These niggas They ain't do what I did They ain't Not what I did God damn it But again

There's nobody I don't bark So there's no vocals. No vocals to be able to say, yo, whatever. So I'm like the underrated nigga. But not the underrated nigga. You know what I'm saying? But when it comes down to me doing rap music, but doing R&B too.

Right. Because they had the opportunities of groups that came to me. In front of me. I remember your era of producing R&B. I'm talking about the ones, the groups that came to me. In front of me. I remember your era of producing R&B. I'm talking about the ones, the groups that I would have had. That you could have

been behind 100%. Ray Korn, I could have had that. I could have had the Wu-Tang Clan. What? Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait. Wait, what? Go back.

I could have had Game. No, no, wait, wait. Stop, stop. You're going too fast. Way too fast. Go back to Ray Korn. Come on, Dick. What do you mean you could have had?

You could have had. He on the Wu-Tang, they show him on the Wu-Tang show. He's just, all this stuff is not, this is all documented. Don't forget, Bernard, again,

his father had a church. Bernard, you should be sitting here, bro. Go ahead. Bernard had a, his father had a church. He's drunk. Right. Without drinking, obviously.

He had a church in Staten Island. Uh-huh. Bernard took me to an apartment in Park Hill in the Wu-Tang Clan. Before they was Wu-Tang Clan, was out there. I got a picture that's going around

that we can't find me on my IROC with all them on the IROC and me before the Wu-Tang Clan. Now, I take a walk to Ray Kwan's steps of his apartment. His name was Shala at the time, whatever. He sit down there. He tells him the interview.

I almost signed with Eric. Oh, so before Wu-Tang launches. Yes. They ain't even nowhere near done. They ain't no Wu-Tang Clan yet. This is 89. So this is your same thing with Biggie. Biggie's around you.

You don't No None Ray None Ludacris The game All of them

50 Cent You saw You saw Corey When he tells that Niggas coming 50 Cent is like How to rob is out Whatever

Such and such And now he got to figure out What to do with him And he knock on my door Cause he live next door to me And he says yo Eric and Bernard You need to take care of this For me You you gotta take care of him that's why i did

you don't do it like we do you on the goddamn record god damn god this this sober drunk eric sermon is out of control yo so let me ask you you paranoid? Throw those niggas out like we do. Next thing you know, he gets shot. But does that make you paranoid that any artist you come across might be the next one, but you're not seeing it? I turned down Nas. I turned down the Fugees. I turned down fucking, these are all Banaz artists. Don't turn down.

Look, Sonny D's about to give you a demo. Do not turn him down. Look, he's got the jewels. I'm going to take a break. Oh, go. I got to finish next. This is a part to where like some parts of mistakes I've made in my life, the mistakes I wish I would have been able to know that,

to hear what Nas was saying. Because, again, that was the Illmatic album. I had no idea. Prior to him doing, so, okay, wait. What part of Nas do you meet him? Is it live at the barbecue? No, no, no. This is producing the Illmatic album coming.

For you to be a producer. Right. And you just didn't, I don't get it. I did, but I did C-list records. I wasn't paying attention to them like that. Oh, you didn't give them your all? No. Wow.

No. And after he left me, Bernard took them to P-Rock. At least Bernard did his job. Yo. I did records with him, like three songs, you know? So you were just being, what, arrogant at the time? It wasn't that. Don't forget, I had my own artists.

Right. So his squad's already happening at that time. Yes. So I can't hear what Queens, I'm from Long Island, so I don't know about Queens Bridge and the type of struggle and the whole that shit. My nigga's over here, so I'm about spellbound. And, you know,

then, um, and then Reggie's I got A's, bitch, and then Murray's over here, like, you know, so all this shit is too much. Now, we're all looking in retrospect, so it's easy to say that now, but I get it now.

In that landscape, you had the top tier artists already. It wasn't the fact that it was top tier. If I were to, like, if he had the same type of stuff that they were doing. You didn't hear this.

He turned down Illmatic. I heard that. He said he gave him his seedless beats. He said, hey, you can have this throwaway. He didn't believe me. I didn't give it to him. He just rhymed on what I gave him his seedless beats. He said, hey, you can have this throwaway. You didn't believe me? I didn't give it to him.

He just rhymed on what I gave him, but I knew it wasn't strong. He didn't give him his best. Yeah, because I didn't understand it. Long Island, niggas. I'm fucking with you. I'm fucking with you. That's crazy. But the coolest nigga in the planet.

Who? Nas. Oh, my God. Again, it was so long ago. I don't even know if he remember how the sessions went. But again, whatever. He just, he rocked on what I gave him. Right.

But you weren't a dick in the sessions, were you? What? You weren't being a dick in the sessions. No, hell no. You just didn't give him your best. I just wasn't paying attention. I didn't do the natural thing that you do in the studio when you're making records and you amp and stuff like that. It didn't happen like that.

It was Lars Pro? It was you? It was you? Was it Lars Pro? He said he took him to P-Rock after him. He took him to P-Rock. I love this story. Then again, Bernard brought me the Fugees and I was like

I can't well you're like Jersey I don't know about Jersey is that what you no this wasn't right because it was Haitians with Jamaican accents

no if it wasn't if it wasn't for I think Salaam Remy Salaam is ill bro that changed the game if I would have had but that changed the game for everybody, though.

Was that right again? That remixed? No, no, no. It was Boom Bap, was it? No. How many mics, right? How many mics? How many, many, many?

That one? Yeah. Whatever that remix was, it changed the game for DJs. How many mics? It changed everybody's perception. Because, again, the beginning of it wasn't... Wow. Oh, so you had salon do it wait what

oh yeah he did it just long story yeah yeah we got salam here he's he's right here in our backyard yeah yeah yeah he's down the street from me. That's true. Well, not down, well, he lives close to me. No, no, but my boy brought me game to the Fox Hills Mall in L.A. You shopping at Fox Hills Mall? That's the Hood Mall. Yeah, but, no, we New Yorkers.

Come on, now, stop it. Okay, all right. So. You got to chill. Yeah, you're right. That's your next artist Remember don't skip out You're going to regret that You're going to regret this guy

So he comes He comes in Right I talk to him I said yo Spit a 16 real quick He didn't know Where the 16 ball was

Game Right Okay So When he tells the story He says I was going to sign with Eric But he wasn't ready

So I signed with Fifth Wow So what happened? He spit the 16? No he didn't do it He didn't? No he spit Ryan But he didn't know

What the cutoff was Right You didn't see the talent? Or Oh yeah he was The game was sick The game was still hard Was the game changing for you That he didn't know the 16?

No. I just wasn't, like I said before. I just told you, man, I'm already doing me. You just was not into it. It wasn't that. I'm already out there. You're stretched thin. No.

Just the fact that my mind's not. I'm already, like you said before, not that niggas wasn't ill. I just wasn't I was doing some other shit My mind was someplace else It had to be It's the missus Keith Murray

The missus Keith Murray I'm ready for it I'll wait for you to come back When we come back Keith Murray'll wait for you to come back and when we come back Keith Murray at the end of the day at the end of the day

too and then when that nigga came it was really a problem because again it was like holy shit who are you

cause don't forget I heard one line on Keith Murray I heard one line on Redman put him on stage that night. Don't forget, if niggas don't know about Newark, New Jersey and Club Sensations. That's how you discover Redman. Yeah, I went to go do a show at Club Sensations, EPMD. That's in Newark?

Newark. Brick City. 89 or 90. Smells like a lot of crack. No, but it was wall to wall but they will rob you quickly. Yeah. But again,

the respect level part come in. So Reggie is brought in by Do It All from Loza Underground. Okay. He's not Loza Underground yet. Okay.

So Do It All rhymes and he says, yo, my man rap. And then Reggie was like, That's not the mayor now, right? Who? Do It All? Yeah, yeah.

He's the mayor now, right? Not the mayor. He's a councilman. I feel like that's the mayor now, right? Who? Do it all? Yeah, yeah. He's the mayor now, right? Not the mayor. He's a councilman. I feel like that's the mayor. No. So Reggie said a rhyme like, I float like a butterfly, sting like the rock group.

So he already had me because I thought he was going to say, I float like a butterfly, sting like a bee. He didn't say that metaphor. So I put him on stage that night. Didn't even know him. Just freshly, like,

whatever it was like. They're like, yo, what's the rest of you doing? What's the work you been doing on stage? How you up there? But I already knew from the door that I was going to fuck with him because of the rhyme. Why? Same thing with Keith Murray. I heard one line. He just says, let's squash the beef, cook it, and we all can get fat. So now, in my head, all I'm seeing is a hamburger inside of a frying pan, raising up to a hamburger. Let's squash the beef, cook it, we all can get fat. Now who the fuck is metaphoring like that? So again, right, it's too far fetched. So I knew what it was.

I knew from the door what it was. And I never... You ever get demos or you play somebody who somebody rhymed for you and you hear about a couple of bars and you know off the bat, like, yo, he's not ill? Right. You know that.

They ain't got to play you all, but they play you the whole record? Mm-hmm. Because you got to listen to it, play the whole record? Not with them. Not with Red and Keith. And DOS FX.

Mm. We didn't get into Dostoevsky too much. Let's talk about Dostoevsky. Dostoevsky too much. We met them at their school at a rap contest. Brooklyn? No, Virginia. Dostoevsky's not from Brooklyn?

No, they went to college. That's where they got together. They were from Brooklyn, though, right? One from Brooklyn, one from Jersey. But they met in college. But they met in college. And there was a rap contest, and we let these other guys win, because we knew that we was going to fuck with them.

Oh, shit. So we let them win? The other guys win, yeah. Okay. Because we knew that we was going to eventually fuck with these guys. Because the day was already too advanced. Who? Das FX?

Yes. Wow. The day was advanced. You see what happened. Yeah, out of control. You know what I'm saying? Like, you know, they was ready. You know, for some reason, they was just ready, you know?

And Sylvia Rome, Sylvia signed all those people that's different. You know, Busta Rhymes Missy Elliott, Doss FX K-Solo like everybody that was different Sylvia signed all those people who were just like different people would be like she did got me some noise for Sylvia Rome

yeah strong black woman strong black woman out there. Still getting it, too. We're still getting it. Still getting it. Hold on, let me get to my notes. So, did y'all discuss

Keith Murray already? No, man. What? What is it? No, no, I just want to No, I want to just talk about just how you just talked about Dawes FX.

The meeting Keith Murray because he was post Hit Squad. He wasn't in Hit Squad no he wasn't it's Death Squad right so what was that how did that begin

nah I mean of course it was like in the beginning nobody wanted to listen nobody wanted to sign DOS FX again Bernard went out there and got

why nobody wanted to sign them because nobody Def Jam didn't like him Def Jam didn't like Redman either that's crazy man he's like a Def Jam child and like him. Def Jam didn't like Redman either. That's crazy, man. He's like a Def Jam child. And then Leo Cohen didn't like Keith Murray.

So that's why Keith Murray wasn't on Def Jam. Jive. He was on Jive. Jive, yeah. But Russell was pissed because Russell didn't know that Leo had turned down Keith Murray. So they're not always right. Let's be honest. We've been saying that.

I'm just saying. You guys were saying how much how right they are. they're not always right. Let's be honest. We've been saying that. I'm just saying. You guys were saying how much, how right they are. They're not always right. But when Keith Murray was in prison and came home,

they gave him $2.8 million. Job or Def Jam? I was on that. Of course. I was on tour with Keith Murray. So don't forget

the, can you imagine, none of them got no deal like that. Nobody made no... Got no deal like Murray got. Coming home from prison. Three years from prison. $2.7 million.

At that time, right. That's crazy. And they gave jobs at $600,000 and Murray kept the rest. Wow. So they bought him off the contract. Get him off the contract. Don't forget.

So now you got Fatty Girl coming. Special delivery. Like, this is this nigga. You expect she's about to be, he's back to back like this. Leo's like, yo, give him that. So he ended up being that death jam later on, 2003. It was later, but it happened. But in the beginning, Leroy didn't tell

Russell that he turned down Murray right wow so let's address Keith Murray I got to

you say you wanted to use you want him to come I've been wanting to I love Keith Murray I want him to come on the show

yeah we do but I understand your point of view Keith see me at LL's on the show. Yeah, we do. But I understand your point of view. Keith see me at LL's Rock the Bells, right? I'm sitting outside. What, the one that just passed?

No, it was two years ago. This was two years ago. Okay. This is like post-pandemic. I see Keith. Keith sees me. Say what's up. But I'm waiting for my people to come in.

So I'm waiting for my people to come in. The security stopped me and they said, yo, see what you. Because I'm waiting for my people. So I'm like, no. Because my people is coming down. Keith must have took it like I was saying, no, he's not with me.

I kind of did say it like that that And I'm going to tell you why I was In Queens If I was anywhere else In the world Right And if Keith needed To get in

Right I'm obligated to get A fellow rapper And I'm obligated But I know he's from Long Island He's from right down the block. He's good.

LL's going to come get him eventually. Right, right. LL's going to come get him eventually. But I got these people that waited months to see me. I'm not mad at that. Waited months to see me. So I did kind of pick my people over seeing where Keith was. Right.

It was a misunderstanding, man. It was a misunderstanding, but I want to address it like a man. I want to address it like a man because how he took it, how he took it could have been that way. It could have been because it was just a spare moment. Like I dissed him.

And that's not me. That's what this whole show is about, is giving flowers. When I see a fellow legend, I want to salute a legend. Right. But at the same time, I don't do shows no more.

Eric, you said you don't leave the couch? I don't leave the motherfucking couch. You ain't got to leave the couch. I don't leave Carbones. I don't leave ZZ's. Your couch outside. I don't leave Contessa.

See? I don't leave these places. I earn my spot to be there. So when I'm there and I'm seeing a fellow person, and let's just be clear. Are these restaurants? I don't know. I don't even know. But let's just be clear. Are these restaurants? I don't know.

I don't even know. Well, let's just be clear. We all know. He's talking like, I know these motherfuckers. I'm not exactly aware. I only know Carbo. Okay, and we all know, we all know to a certain extent, Keef is a liability.

To a certain extent. Yeah, yeah. I did not want to be responsible for the person that let Keith in. Knowing that he has a relationship with LL, we're all here for LL, regardless if the check is involved or not, we're there for LL. I didn't want to be the guy that snicked

Keith Murray in. And he do some great, he fart on the mic. We seen him fart on the mic at Big Face Gary's show. We've seen him standing in front of the streets, stopping cars. We've seen him jump on top of a girl's back. It's all documented, guys.

This is all on the internet. So I felt at that time, I didn't want to be responsible. But did I dis-keep? Hell no, that's not what I meant. That was not my intention. That was not my intention. But my intention was to protect myself, though, as well. I got you. Yeah, you know what? Listen, I'm sad. So he went, so this is why I was mad. This is the reason why I was mad.

He told the story on Big Face Gary's show. I laughed at it. It was cool. I seen him with you after that. Do you know where we synced each other at? At the awards? At the awards! I synced him. You synced? BG Awards! I came right up to him and I said, O'Keefe. I know.

I said, O'Keefe, man, my brother, I didn't mean it like that. I said, yo, yo, are we good? Yeah, we said we good. And he said we good. He smiled at me. We actually have it on footage Right Of me confronting Not confronting him Right Because I didn't step to him It wasn't like I was like

Yo what's up nigga What you doing Nah nah nah I was just like Yo bro You misunderstood me I saw it It was good

You was with me It was you Me And Redman Right We shook hands We have it on tape And he goes

On Willie D's show And he goes I heard Nori got Five million dollars And he turned He's What I don't know What this fucking rumor Was about And he's like yeah and he goes, I heard Nori got $5 million and he turned. By the way,

I don't know what this fucking rumor was about. And he's like, yeah. So as soon as Nori, you know, got money, he started changing on me. And I'm like, I've never changed. There's one incident

that rocked the bells. You have records with LL. I feel like LL's obligated to get you in more than me. Right. More than me. I'm here for a job. Oite.

Now let me finish. All I know is the fact that it's this, man. Yeah. If you know Keith Murray's story, and he never told that story, you know, like, no parents, the way that his parents died, the way his sister and them died. God bless. The way that he had to help stuff down as a young 18-year-old kid on the block who funded everybody. Don't forget, he probably had Biggie Smalls in the hood.

That's fine. He probably had Nas in the hood. That's fine. Like, these people, they fucked with this nigga. That's the reason why we love him. I know. He's a legend, man. He's a legend.

We love him. So, like, anybody else who has, you know, something that's conflicted. Right. Again, just things, you know, things happen. And it was two things. Let me just tell you what else. So as we see each other, I get my people in who was waiting for 30 minutes. I get them in.

He was waiting for his time. But then we both go to the bathroom. We both come out of the bathroom. And we were like, he's on one side of the bathroom. I'm on the other side of the bathroom. And we both come out of the bathroom. I don't like giving, you know, fives after the bathroom. It's just a natural thing.

Right, I got you. I'm just like, ugh. I go to the stage. I go to the stage. I perform. And Keith says, and I have to address this part. He goes, he didn't stay there when Tragedy performed. Well, I just want to explain something to you.

Because I got to address him. Because he addressed me twice. He did it on Big Face Gary's show. And he did it on Willie D's show. What are you going to do with me, though? Exactly. Exactly. Set your ass up.

Yeah, so look. So no, no, no. I'm not So, look. So, no, no, no. I'm not negative at all. No, no, no. So, what happened was, he says, yo, Norby got on stage, and when Traj performed, he walked to the side.

That's called taking a break. It's called getting a water break. And it's called that this was my show. I was trying to let Traj shine. How could you take that in any other way? So... I don't watch nobody. Good.

Thank you. These are my class. When I'm done with my work, I'm fuck out of there. And niggas be like that too because I used to be like, damn, why niggas going home? Because I didn't understand

that when I was younger. Like, niggas ain't watching my show? I don't give a fuck who out there. So let me just finish. Let me just say this. I'm going the fuck home.

Keith, wherever you at, Keith. I respect that. The only reason why, and by the way, he said that he turned us down. I don't ever remember that. No, no, no. I don't ever remember that. But let me just tell you something, Keith. The only reason why we didn't take that interview at that time was because of us seeing that footage and us being concerned.

Yes. Do we have other people that's on here out of control? Right. We have. But we didn't know better. And now we do. Right. So the one thing that I don't want to do is help ruin some alleging.

Right. But one thing that you got to know, though, too, is the fact that so the BET Awards, right? Yep. Fantastic. Fantastic. The whole thing about though, too, is the fact that... So the BET Awards, right? Yep. Fantastic. Fantastic. The whole thing about it, too, is the fact that once you... But they say that he only act good when he around you and Red. But still, but still, you...

You're going to have to come. You have to... All this stuff that could put you in a situation. Yep. This is what you can't... The assistance... But then it takes away from the show. It's called Drink Chance.

You're right about that. I know that. It's called Drink Chance. You know that. It's called Drink Chance. I'm still me. I'm still fucking with you. It has no bearing on our conversation with you. Your conversation is still dope. He's a fake Puerto Rican. Listen.

And I'm still find a way. It don't matter without it. So again, the fact that I know the conversation would be, and that's why I wanted to say yes. We want him on. Exactly.

We love Keith Murray, man. At the end of the day, it's not like... The American West with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater Podcast Network hosted by me, writer and historian Dan Flores

and brought to you by Velvet Buck. This podcast looks at a West available nowhere else. Each episode, I'll be diving into some of the lesser known histories of the West. I'll then be joined in conversation by guests such as Western historian Dr. Randall Williams and bestselling author and meat eater founder, Stephen Ranella. I'll correct my kids now and then where they'll say when cave people were here. And I'll say it seems like the Ice Age people that were here didn't have a real affinity for caves. So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th, where we'll delve into stories of the West and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today.

Listen to The American West with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I know a lot of cops, and they get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. Across the country, cops called this taser the revolution. But not everyone was convinced it was that simple.

Cops believed everything that taser told them. From Lava for Good and the team that brought you Bone Valley comes a story about what happened when a multi-billion dollar company dedicated itself to one visionary mission. This is Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated. I get right back there and it's bad. It's really, really, really bad. Listen to new episodes of Absolute Season 1, Taser Incorporated on the iHeartRadio

app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. Binge episodes 1, 2, and 3 on May 21st, and episodes 4, 5, and 6 on June 4th. Ad-free at Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. And it's going to take us to heal us. It's Mental Health Awareness Month. And on a recent episode of Just Heal with Dr. J, the incomparable Taraji P. Henson stopped by to discuss how she's discovered peace on her journey. So what I'm hearing you saying is healing is a part of us also reconnecting to our childhood in some sort. You said I look how youthful I look because I never let that little girl inside of me die.

I go outside and run outside with the dogs. I still play like a kid. I laugh. You know, I love jokes. I love funny. I love laughing. I laugh at myself. I don't take myself too seriously.

That's the stuff that keeps you young and stops you from being so hard. To hear this and more things on the journey of healing, you can listen to Just Heal with Dr. J from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. AT&T, connecting changes everything. Every chance is the fact like when somebody's alone and shit ain't going down and then, you know, like... Because between me and you,

like Big Face Gary told me, I had a conversation with Big Face Gary. Big Face Gary, I was like, yo, did he drink? And he's like, yeah. And I'm like, wait a minute. So, I didn't want that. Because I'm like, alright, cool. Just like didn't want that. Because I'm like, all right, cool.

Just like how you not drinking, we can still do that. But the last thing I want to do is he drink and someone laugh and he take a joke the wrong way and try to get physical. Which has happened. Which has happened. All the time. So something that's like, we don't need that. What we need to do is give you your flowers. That's what we want.

We want to give you your flowers. But I think that the combo that he would give you would flowers right that's what we want but i think that the combo that he would give you would be fantastic yeah i believe that i think it's gonna happen i think it's gonna happen at the end of the day too which is like listen to me i was on drugs for 15 years right i was doing percocet for from 2008 to 2022 all right june 2nd would be my two years of me being sober, right? Wow, congrats. Congrats. Let's make some noise.

I understand about that substance abuse. This is what somebody has. It's serious. And to anybody that's, they taught me this in the rehab. I can tell FN to, he blew in the face, to go get help.

It ain't going to matter. You saw interventions before with people. You got to be ready. Right. You got to hit rock bottom sometimes. So everybody needs to stop with like, go and talk to each other. Who's talking to him?

It doesn't matter wow the individual itself has to be has to change i had to say to to myself i got to go inside even though i let all that time go by to where at the end i'm taking these 30s that are mixed with fentanyl so when i go in there and take my piss test, they say, oh, you do fentanyl too, don't you? I'm like,

I don't do fentanyl. So that means that the fentanyl and the press pills I was getting, because again, the street is providing me now. Now, the doctors,

I'm on the street getting pills. Of course, you know, people... The doctors cut you off? I never went back to them. You know, you can't go back

and they ain't going to be giving you pills. You got to go to the street. But again, the nigga who I was you off? I never went back to them. You know, you can't go back and they ain't going to be giving you pills. You got to go to the street. But again, the nigga who I was dealing with, I didn't know that he was dirty. But again, if I'm spending $8,000 a month,

of course he don't give a fucking... If the pills is fucked up. I ain't going to go with the value. Damn. $8,000 a month. Look at this fake drug dealer. He looking like... I wish I was your custody.

Foul niggas. So, of course, people who I thought that was my friends, damn, I could have died. But towards the end, I kept throwing up. So every time I would pop, I would throw up. You'd get rid of the toxin, right? Yeah, but it wasn't happening until that time. Wow. So whatever happened, that guard was like, hey, you know what? Hey, all right, I'm going to keep saving you, but the next time you might not make it.

So I went to rehab, went upstate, stayed there, met mad people, talked the whole nine. Because the most part is that I was worried about the whiffed jaw part. So the whiffed jaw part make years go by. Because Procosec is technically heroin, right? It's the synthetic heroin. The heroin is what you're addicted to. So at the end of the day, people that was in there, it was one dude named Smiley.

He had tracks all on this arm up. Doing needles. Tell him to put his shirt on because he, again, you could see everything. His whole arm was filled, right? People that was doing fentanyl too regularly. Crack was still heavy in there. You know what I'm saying? People was there because- Wait, what you mean? People was doing fentanyl too regularly. Crack was still heavy in there. You know what I mean? People was there because...

Wait, what you mean? People were doing fentanyl by themselves? No, I'm talking about as far as the... Yeah, when you heard that story. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

They were doing fentanyl by themselves. Yeah, yeah. What the fuck? Who are these people? What do you mean? Right, because the hospital uses it, so it's like...

Yeah, fentanyl is something that they mix with... Yeah, but it don't have to be the bad shit. The bad shit came in and killing people but they still use it in the hospital

the street shit's just bad oh wow so but again this stuff again you can go to heroin because once you can't afford the pill

you shoot it's an opioid don't forget you have to have money so it was never going to stop for me. That's a flex a little bit. We heard it. Fucking around.

So if you got the bread, you're going to always be doing it. But the sad part is the fact that imagine spending that money towards the end and you're not getting high. So for the last two years, I'm doing it so I won't get withdrawals. So that's the part that's fucked up. So when people see when your talent comes, now luckily, if I would have said, fuck it, I need to get that feeling.

And then I would have started shooting. That's the next step. That's what people go to. They go to the needle. Because the heroin part, whatever, ain't doing it for you no more. So that's what people go to they go to the needle you know because the heroin part whatever ain't doing it for you no more so that's what the whole part

was with me I'm like so like when you talk like when I did that Timberland left a big paragraph under my shit like Eric

he right these are niggas that was users him Meek fucking the Bow Wow the Waynes all these niggas

they call it lean But hydrocodone Is this liquid form of Yeah it's heroin Exactly It's an opioid So all this opioid That was

At that time You know me It came from the doctor I had back surgery He gave me 120 pills It stands this tall Inside of a In a thing of 120

So after a while you take the one you take the two and now your back pain is gone and then you like then that shit feel good the next you know the next time you look up at 22 days all that the whole bottle is gone now you're addicted it takes seven days for addiction wow you know what's the craziest? I really appreciate you sharing that story because most people never seen that version of you. Like, for outsiders looking in, you're very put together. You got to be nodding and leaning and you got to have no money.

See, the part you got to show, I'm still got to raise my son. So I'm still taking him to school, watching him, feeding him, the whole nine, cooking, whatever, taking him to practice, the whole shit. It's the functioning crackhead. Right.

Right. Which is real. The Wall Street, the whole nine, they're still doing them. Wow. The only time you don't do it is because you don't have any bread. And so now you're falling off. And then you've got to go to the street and act the stereotype of it. You're looking the part.

So you're doing it. But if you got the shit going, you're straight. Wow. Yeah. So I'm not going to give that off, and then, whatever, I can let you see me like that.

Wow. So the kids didn't even understand. They were shocked as to what I'm in rehab. They don't know that. You can't see your parents. Because you can't physically see that person.

Right. You know, unless they fucked up. That's what makes it very, very unique about you. I forget who I told today. I was like,

I'm mad excited to interview Eric Sherman. I'm mad excited. No, you told me. Randy Atkinson. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I was like, I'm mad excited, right? And... No, you told me. And, um... Brand new aftershocks. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I was like a mad,

I was just like, just hype, you know. Even though you're my friend, I consider you my friend. But I still, like, it doesn't take away from me being your fan. It can't, it can't.

And I'm mad excited and I never, that question would've never came up. Like, because I never, I always seen you put together. I've never seen you out of line. Now, people say that about DMX to me, right? They say that I never seen DMX high ever.

Because they say that when DMX got high. Oh, you never saw him high? They said that I never. They said me. Oh, yeah, right. Because when he actually got high, he stayed inside. So, you were seeing him on alcohol. me personally because when he actually got high he stayed inside so you were seeing him

on on alcohol you were seeing him on weed you weren't seeing him on I got you

the real substances that he was on so that was shocking to me but with you that's kind of like the total opposite because I've kind of

never seen you slipping like I've kind of always seen you put together for every time and that's one thing I said somebody asked me and I was like I was like you know I sincerely love Eric Sherman as a person not only his music and not only you know if it wasn't for EPMD it wouldn't be CNN but you've always been the same so you you done it excellent version of hiding that you ever did ecstasy a lot he's he he was my ecstasy dealer relax relax that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's

that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that's that Yes. Yes. Now that euphoria you get. I mean, I never got it.

He just sold it to me. That's all. Let me make you feel good. No, no, no. I just helped the guy get to you. Oh, I'll tell you my ecstasy story. We want to get into it. Let's go.

The Century Club in LA. Mm-hmm. Right? That sounds like a place for ecstasy. Yep. So now, I don't know nothing about this. It's me, Dre, exhibitzibit A few other people Getting ready to go out, right?

It's the girl who introduced you to you No, Dr. Dre did Dr. Dre is the first person who gave you ecstasy Let's make some noise for Dr. Dre I could have died So the chronic went to Let me share the raw film I don't even know

If he If he remembered this story But it's different I mean he about to remember it now But anyway This is what Sussan says Century Club we going to

He pops the trunk Go in the battalion Pass out pills to everybody Don't forget I got I got no instructions By the way I want to be at this party so bad Continue

Century Club I got no So now we in way, I want to be at this party so bad. Continue. Century Club. I got no instructions. So now we're in the Century Club, right? Like the record says, the Century Club. So now my homegirl, Alicia's there, Bobby Brown's wife, right? This is, wow, 90. Wow, let me see what I was doing.

Because I was doing an Exhibits album, so. I would say 96. The first Xzibit album. Oh, the first one? That's 94, 95? 95? Because I did the, Call it what you want to call it.

The first Xzibit, the one that had Paparazzi? The dad singer? No, no, no, the second album, man. Okay. Xziz is a 2000 girl. Check it out. So it had to be like 95, 96. No, Xziz didn't come out. No, nigga. Xziz was out in 95? No, in Miami Check it out. So it had to be like 95, 96. No, Ecstasy didn't come out.

Ecstasy was out in 95? No, in Miami for sure. Let me be quiet. I don't even know. I'm not making this up. It's like 96. You're talking about 96. I don't do no camping,

nigga, ever. I tell you it's 96. For no reason. Huh? 98 is the second album? So when was Pocorazzi? 95? 95.

So 98. 98. Okay. Second album. I do the Apple. Makes sense. I do the Apple. That makes sense. See, I do. Okay. Second album. I do the alcohol. Makes sense. See, I do. Right.

So I go to the club. Alicia, we lost our friend Tiffany. She just had died. So she starts crying. So now I'm in the club boo-hooing. Crying with her. You're rolling. You're in ecstasy.

No instructions. No instructions with ecstasy I'm crying with her I mean boohooing Right? After I'm done We can't laugh at that After I'm done No

After I'm done Someone pass, sorry After I'm done we go to the What's that hotel with the M? Maggion? Not the Maggion, the other one The Manchos No, not the Manchos neither After I'm done, we go to the, what's that hotel with the M? Magion? Not the Magion, the other one. The Montrose?

The Montrose. No, not the Montrose, neither. The Eco Hotel? No, the other one. No, not that one. It's a hotel. Let's go. That's irrelevant.

Hotel, right? The Marquis. Because Def Jam always do, either the W, the Montrose, Def Jam always find something to go whatever. So I go. La Matage. So I go. LaMontage. LaMontage. So the L was first with La, and then the M come after that, Dan.

So, so the LaMontage. This is the drunkest sober nigga I ever met. No, no. I feel drunker fucking than him. Sober champ's gone well. The Lama Taj. I ain't going to tell you who famous wife this is,

but somebody that's real famous, that's huge. I got his wife in the room. Who? Right? Yeah, I want to know. But she wasn't married then. Oh, even worse. I don't know if I was married with people like that.

Ever in my life. So now, I don't got no instructions. So now, I'm in there Bugging the fuck out I'm like yo Now my mouth is dry My shit Everything is dry And I'm sitting there tripping

She come in there With the robe on Nothing I'm like get out I'm like So now I'm sitting there They forgot to tell me To drink water

You know you gotta do I don't know So now She had to take the glow sticks And go like this. Nah, nah. You were buying glow sticks? After I kicked the girl out

I'm in the bed but time is moving slow. It's still maybe like two in the morning. I'm like, damn I ain't going to be able to get through this. But again,

if they would have told me about to have somebody with you Drink water the whole night I got no instructions Because I'm already boohooing He wants a handbook I'm already boohooing In the club crying

So you're saying Dr. Dre gave you the ecstasy And said go on Go on nigga You take on the emotions Of I took the emotions on that But got to the room And whatever like that

But again that's That's whatever The experience I never took that ever again Ever In that's whatever the experience i never took that ever again ever in my life ever and people rock with that the whole time yeah this guy sure is what i'm talking about ecstasy is because the same inferior use you get from that euphoria that's what percocet does um it's that's why the people in the record speak about it so much oh they shouldn't but nobody's going to speak about something that don't make them feel high.

Right. That ecstasy feel you get, Percocet give you that too. But doesn't Percocet make you sleepy? No, that's certain people. Every drug works for certain people. The thing is, it's the time before you fall asleep, there's that euphoria. That's the euphoria. That's the euphoria. But it can make you create and make

records and be as ill as you possibly can. How about niggas smoke weed? That's why niggas did heroin. That's why you got people who overdose. So you got the Kurt Coburns or the Marvin Gays or the Donny Hathaways. It's the creative juice. That shit that had you in there fucking beating that

fucking piano all night until five in the morning? You know what I'm saying? Are you okay? No. No, it will. I'm just giving you what it'll make you do.

You're recreating it way too real, bro. No, but you know, when you up there and you high, the creative part of it makes you feel good that you thought

you'd be in there, you know? You ever worked in Electric Lady? No. I wish I would've. You've never worked in Electric Lady? That's the one with the cat? That's the one with the cat. No, no, no. That's Jimi Hendrix. Yeah, with the cat. There was a cat there. In D'Angelo. Yeah. D'Angelo had something to do with it?

No, he ended up working there afterwards. The first album. Okay, okay. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, it's Jimi Hendrix's studio. And there used to be. Yeah, yeah. It's Jimmy Hendrix Studio. And there used to be a white cat there. And I'm allergic to cats. Like, anywhere. Like, if a cat is down the block, I will break out. That's the only cat in the world that I didn't break out for.

And I swore to God that it was Jimmy Hendrix. What, a real cat? Yeah. Oh. I thought you were talking about like a cat that was like furry. Not the homie cat. Yeah, that's why I thought you. I swore you would have worked at an electric lathe. I was like, you know what?

You get to this thing and you tell stories and you keep forgetting how sensitive people are, man. I just told people, don't call me, tell me, I'm just talking in my head about people. Nah, don't worry. Yeah, I know, but people. Don't worry, they blame us anyways. But I don't want to bring up the story, though, but again, this is what you do, right?

Yeah, bring up the story. We're documenting history. That's the problem, that hip-hop hasn't done a very good job of documenting itself properly. That's right. That's right. And your story gotta be told, goddammit. Yeah, I got some shit though, man, with some other niggas. So you had a story or no?

I got some shit. I mean, that's some... Y'all bugger the fuck out, man. You got to understand, this is what I tell people all the time. See how everybody is famous now? Imagine the 88. It's only like 12 of us. Right, it's a small group. With the whole world. It's crazy.

In the palm. You told my man, David, I told him about the other day. I'm in Philadelphia. I'm Michael Jackson. I got to jump over the gate. I got 10,000 kids chasing me. You was finger popping everything. I'm going to say it as far as how it was,

like the same type of effect you see, but you see how people, whatever, you see the fucking people talk, but they're all famous now, but back then it was only 12 of us, and I was one of them. Like EPMD, Rahim, Rakim, Dougie, Fred Hammer, Short, whatever.

It's the only name you can name 15 people. Can you imagine that with the whole world? I think, and this is the thing. No, I cannot. I think the culture takes for granted. Hold on, hold on, hold on. That's a good story. But I think the culture takes for granted that reality,

that it was a small thing that grew. I like to say when the iPod came to play and it made hip-hop a thing beyond hip-hop where you have a playlist where you can...

Yeah, but who did that? Oh, well, Apple and all these guys. Steve Jobs. But that's what expanded it. You know what's a bug that beyond the culture? Y'all remember,

Eminem had one commercial. Y'all remember that, right? Because don't forget, Steve went to Jimmy Iovine and said, yo, I got this shit called Apple. I got this shit called the iPod. I want you forget, Steve went to Jimmy Iovine and said, yo, I got this shit called Apple. I got this shit called the iPod. I want you to fuck with it.

Jimmy Iovine is making $100 million at Interscope. He gives a fuck about what Steve is talking about. But in the beginning, Eminem does one commercial for Apple. We never saw it again. Really? Eminem and YouTube. He did one commercial For Apple YouTube?

YouTube He didn't Nobody Jimmy Iovine Nobody believed in it They didn't believe that So they didn't let it happen? What Steve

Was playing with Like He changed That shit changed the game That fucking iPod That's what changed everything But it also changed And Apple

But that's what changed Hip hop in terms of it being Just culturally Yeah of course Cause I tell people all the time that fucking iPod. That's what changed everything. And Apple. But that's what changed hip-hop in terms of it being just culturally... Yeah, of course. Because I tell people all the time, like, from Miami hip-hop standpoint, I'm like, I remember going around and it was a few thousand hip-hop heads.

That's why you said that, because that's what happened. Steve went to him, whatever, and Jimmy is like, look at me, nigga. Endoscope, I'm fucking huge. You coming to me with this? He didn't believe it.

And it changed the game. It changed everything. It changed everything because it cross-genred everything. It made everybody be into everything. And then it just, good and bad. There's good and bad. I wish, though, oh, my God, to be able to, Tuesday comes and the CD's good and bad I wish though oh my god to be able to Tuesday comes

and the CD's coming out niggas on the line and Tower Records and be able to open up and read the back and the whole

that's that that was Sam Goody and the mixtape era like can you imagine if that still existed

like we waited for Tuesday and we waited for that and all of a sudden niggas dropping like yo can you and we waited for that and all of a sudden, niggas dropping like, yo, can you imagine we still had that type of shit?

Like, I understand about technology, though, but to be able to, you as a fan, to open up the package and to be able to read and see who the producer is, whatever.

Engineer. But where it was recorded. But then play the sequence. Right. But to care. The sequence was important. Not the shuffle. To care about it, guys. Right. But to care. The sequence was important. Not the shuffle. To care about it, guys.

There was no shuffle available. We're talking about to care about even wanting to read those credits. That's what I'm saying. When it changed, there's the positivity of the audience growing. Reggie was important because then when that interlude came, the interlude went, hey, it's a red dot on your head. It's a red dot on your head, It's a red dot on your head too. Oh shit,

and the record come on like, that was, it was dope. Nothing like that. Like, I know it's a dream though, but damn man, it's shit.

You was one of the first people that I heard speak about streaming. Yeah. Do you think, in retrospect, it's a good thing or a bad thing? Streaming, right now, it's a good thing or a bad thing? Streaming right now is quadrupling the contracts we got when we got contracts. Meaning when we signed our contracts, perpetuity, digital, and that was not involved.

Even with the less than one penny is better than the contracts we got. Wait, because of how much exponentially? The money that's being made is way, way more than the contract that we got. But the money being made for the label. Yeah, but if you have, if you're independent and you got a name and it goes to you, I'm just going as far as what's happening with me. Right. And when you talk to Baby, when Baby says, if you think there's no money in the music business, you ain't in the music business. Because people like him.

But the contract, listen to what I'm saying. The contract that we got that you signed from every artist doesn't compare to the one less than one thing that we get in the streaming now i don't know about what everybody else things is doing but i've seen it happen for people and what it's doing for other people who are benefiting off streaming right but the ill part the fact that it's supposed to be going up. Yeah, well, Congress is supposed to pass it to one penny. To a penny.

To a penny, which everybody's like, that's ridiculous, but... But you can imagine with a penny, oh my gosh, it's way big difference. But then when Snoop goes out and says, this needs to change, do you feel like the legacy artists should deserve... Snoop is the one that made that thing happen.

Yeah, I believe Snoop did, yeah. Oh, really? Because him vocalizing 1 billion streams and only made systems with it. Right, 80,000 or something like this. But see, I could get on him. It's different for the producer. Got you. The producer is not the artist or the writer.

It's always been different for the producer. But the producer get 50%? If we own the whole thing, we get the whole thing. There's different ways to skin the cat as a producer. Producer, I just showed you on publishing. Right, right. Are you saying if you're the artist and the producer? Right, but the artist, the producer, period,

is going to be ill because, again, you get all that publishing. You get royalty. You get all of that that come with it. The writer doesn't get it. The artist doesn't get it. That contract ain't made for him and her unless you're a big artist. You sell those millions of records, and then you look for your advance to come back big.

Right. Not the other mechanical stuff. You get it from the label side. Your next advance, the label side. Exactly. And then they'd be like, you know what? You owe me $500,000 because I paid for that. So you never... The label, you never recouped.

You're going to always owe them. Right. They're a bank. They're a bank. You're going to always owe them. Always. I remember seeing charges as a young youngin. They would tell me... We didn't have Instagram back then. We didn't have Twitter. um they would tell me you know we didn't have instagram back then we didn't have twitter and they would tell me oh you know we spent 150 000 in japan for you here and we spent such and such and and i didn't have access to japan back then so i would just take

their word do you think they was lying to us but you could always audit them though there's certain labels though too and I can say it now, that when Def Jam or whatever, they hope things to come under budget. So as long as I don't spend that money on you and I can pocket it, it's cool. Labels just did that, period. Some labels, they do what put money behind you. I'm not saying they didn't,

but they go off with you having a hit record and then that should explode it you know what i'm saying but the but but the thing is to come on the budget and for the pocket money right you know you recorded albums on the budget what do you mean nobody's saying that def jam has a hold the budget you know that was their goal to go under budget is it goal is to not spend money. That could be recording. That could be marketing, everything. So if I get money from-

What's it called? Reforecast? Recoup? No, recoup. Reforecast, yeah. I never did that. Recoup? Not reforcast.

I never took money. Oh, yeah, that's right. I never took extra money from them. Okay, wow. That's why I think that the respect, getting respecting, I get from Lior and from Bustamant because I was one of the only clients who never asked for extra money. I used what they gave me. What I did, my thing was I bought my own studio. When I bought my own studio. Good love. Early?

Yeah, and I named it something. It was on 32nd and Madison. And I named it something. You was in Manhattan too? Yes. Oh, you was wilding. Totally different. I named it something totally different.

And I... But it didn't seem like a Manhattan studio. No, it didn't. It was Hood. It was called the Hood Lab. But it was on 32nd and Madison. And I would charge

Def Jam, Tommy Boy, everybody who was doing business with me. but I would charge them on a different entity, and they never knew that I actually owned a studio. That's dope. That's dope. And then other clients started to catch on, like Menfbleag,

you know, other people was like, yo, wait a minute. So I was like, yo, what is Quads charging you? What is Sound on Sound charging you? What is Daddy's House charging you? They charge you this, I'll charge you this

and I'll give you back half. So I just, I had a whole. But that's the game. Yeah, I had a whole. Yeah, you had a kickback game.

Yeah, yeah. But that's what was going on in the labels at all. Do you know? Damn, did I just blow it up? I mean,

we got, it's all. Of what we did Hold on, hold on, hold on. I mean, we got answers. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all.

It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all.

It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all.

It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all.

It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all.

It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all.

It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all.

It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all. It's all.

It's all. It's all. It's all. It's what happened. Put a hole in Blast, but everybody did that. And they still do it now. Everybody that shit is doing this. And the radio game

was even crazier. Oh my God. It was disrespectful back then. I gave somebody $35,000. My shit came on at 3 a.m. in the morning. You got their money. I gave somebody $35,000. My shit came on at 3 a.m. in the morning. So I go, you got some spins. Where?

Nigga, nobody heard none of that. I wasn't ready. But that's the game. Let me ask you. There's going to be all these stories about hip-hop. Like, what is it? On Fox. Empire and all this.

170 Varick. 160 Varick? Yeah, Def Jam. Def Jam. That office. Was L. Single-handedly saved my life. Grand.

Grand, um... Green Studios? No, no, no. The car service, Grand. Oh, yeah, yeah, yes. And XYZ. How much money you spent on Grand? Two months. Two months, I know.

But let me just tell you something. I used to go there because the rush management was there, and that's how I got introduced to Chris Lighty. Right. Oh, yeah, you was on the... I was on Violet. the rush management was there and this hog got introduced to Chris Lighty. Right. Oh, yeah, you was on the— I was on Violet. Violet was on there.

But I wasn't on Def Jam at that time. I was on Penalty. But I used to go to that office. I could get a haircut there. I could roll dice there. And I could buy weed there. I stopped hanging in the hood. At Barrick?

Yes, at Barrick. I used to see Red weed there. I stopped hanging in the hood. At Varick? Yes, at Varick. I used to see Redman there. I used to see Rush Management there. To me, that is the quick, essential hip-hop story that should be told. What do you think? What about all the sex that was going on? Wait a minute, man. Out of control.

Hold on. What are you talking about? Because you're not mentioning that. Oh, yeah? You can't because you're a dearly beloved right now. You're a dearly beloved right now. But at the end of the day, you know Depp's there was insane. Wow.

It was bad. But again, the story could be told on that block. Yeah. But it could be told on Elizabeth Avenue. See, you was before. You wasn't here. I wasn't there. Yeah, you probably was like eight.

I started from Vavik. Yeah, Elizabeth is where Rush started at. Elizabeth Street. Okay. Any time you would go outside, you would see Run DMC, Rakim, EPM, you would see all of us outside. Like, just random. Broke chains everywhere.

Niggas just chilling. Right. But Varick was a whole dynamic of interns. Ooh. Why you act like you shocked, niggas? No, I didn't know. But Barak was a whole dynamic of interns. Why you act like you shocked, nigga? No, I didn't know. To me, this was like... He's saying... This was like...

You don't understand. Barak had the same run. When you got there, that was new. No, this was like Great Adventure to me. I was like, wait a minute. I could get my hair cut, roll dice, and buy weed at the same place. This is the hood. Fuck the hood. And it's safe. It's safe. I think that part, I buy weed at the same place. This is the hood. Fuck the hood.

And it's safe. I think that part, I think it's Rough Riders, there's Murder, Inc., and there's Rockefeller, and there's the Death Squad. And at that time, that shit was on fire. On fire.

When did you get signed there then? Remember, Chris Lighty Picked me up In 1998 Okay Or 97 97 Because

He He Got me into The N.O.R.E. album Which was my Biggest album 99 is Def Jam Hey

Let's go over there Real quick This is I gotta tell you this This is really You won't know this at all. Okay. Def Jam has me, the Def Squad, and Noriega, right?

Mm-hmm. Now, TRL was big, right? MTV. MTV. Right. And Peter Gunz and Lord Tariq got that shit out. Uptown Anthem. Right.

Yeah. So it's Uptown Anthem. Right. So it's Uptown Anthem. No, it's What What, Uptown Anthem, and Sugar, and Raps Delight. Right. Right. So we in the meeting. So Kugel and I don't really care about that, too. Yeah, so we got to make sure we have a little dilemma with the Death Squad and Noriega record, the What what record and and um and we got to see which one that we're going to um put to number one right

but i'm sitting there you know so they're talking they're not talking this in there too i'm like okay um so i'll tell you what we're going to make Nori be number one And then on the next couple of weeks When he comes Starts coming down We'll put y'all up there Whatever that We never got a chance It came down

So Nori stayed up there at number one And then when he came down at number two They put Peter Gunz and Lord Tariq on there So I never got a chance to get number one spot God damn I owe you lunch. Wait, this was TRL making those decisions? No, Def Jam. Yes.

But I tell you what, though. Randy knows. I end up having the number one album in the country, though. That's right. That's right. Randy knows. The album with number one. Yo, I'm not going to lie to you.

Let me just tell you something. I don't think you remember That day though No no no I was sitting outside To at that Whatever that Outside I think it was

One of the spring breaks Okay And we was all out there Like doing the show Why But I knew this In my head Like yo damn

Okay well In two weeks He's coming down Now I'm gonna get the spot It never happened God damn it Make some noise for me Once again yo, damn, okay, well, in two weeks he's coming down. Now I'm going to get the spot. It never happened. God damn it. Make some noise for me once again.

I'm going to be honest with you. Like, that run that we keep talking about, you, Dice Effects. Red Man. Red Man. Like, how did that feel? Because I believe cash money, no limit. Even Bad Boy, Rough Riders, Rockefeller, kind of based their... Murder, Inc. kind of based their thing off of that.

I think Hit Squad was a big example for a lot of crews. Yeah. And... Well, definitely for the Wu-Tang Clan because they show it in like in the series I don't know not just Wu-Tang everybody's like yeah like I was influenced by that yeah even more and I ask people this all the time while you was making history did you know you was making history um nah I just knew that the other question you asked did we know that it was ill like

when it was going on I'm like hell yeah we did we did look at this shit cause we all cause again to be on the billboard charts at the same time

you look at the billboard charts and you see all four of your groups did anybody else influence that type of structure I mean I know Ice-T Ice-T had Ryan Syndicate

that was the closest thing maybe yeah but what we did was not that's what I'm saying I mean, I know Ice-T had Rhyme Syndicate. That was the closest thing maybe. Yeah, but what we did was, yeah. That's what I'm saying. That's what I'm trying to say. Like anybody else. No, and then EPMD had three consecutive number one albums in a row. Why?

That's why I said before, my colleagues can talk about what they did, though, but consistency. Don't forget, we broke up. So imagine that five years break. Imagine from 1992 to 97 that we had them five years. Do you think the breakup fucked up a lot of business that the Hit Squad could have done? Nah, it made the crews come in. You got to understand, niggas can say that they was going to come and all type of shit,

but no, when his squad was there, you had to be very careful about what you was making and what you was going to be able to make to come in there because we was not going to stop. Wow.

And I don't know who I would have signed. Then my ear was, I don't know who I could have had because I was looking at, we was to keep building you know because it could have been a Raekwon it could have been it could have been somebody Murray would have been there but we don't know who could have been well I was trying to because at that time we was making I was making music every day so I so the production was going to be there. I had it.

So I don't know who I was going to be able to put down. And it was a highly respected crew. Highly respected. Again, like I told Nori, there was nobody. It's only a few of us. Nobody was around for any competition that I saw that was going to make me be. Because now I've done some past my clients. I mean, my colleagues right

because then we consistent and now we number one in this and then that crossover came out you know that was our biggest record you know then I was something we got some niggas over here the DOS effects kid and then Redman come he's like it was it was bad it was bad crazy in a good way yeah in a good way okay are we done now because we got to take um you got to take a we got to take more piss no i got one more piss i got another no no no you got some get your nose going um let's talk about stay real the record where are you going with that. I'm talking about the record Stay Real.

Okay. How did you make that record? He said he wanted to stay real. What's the motivation behind that? Stay real. It was a continuation of Crossover. That's what the lyrics are showing you. Everybody who wasn't keeping it real,

because, again, hip-hop was changing in my version. Because, again, you had the Vanilla Ice is coming, people was whatever, people started winning, Suze was getting sexy, the whole nine, whatever, this and that. So I just felt like I got to say something because it was like it was getting ready to change. But it really was a continuation of that right there, period. And I was in

georgia then so i told myself i was in georgia and i was um i tell you what this is the illest red man kind of kind of woke me up in georgia because i had got to a point where i got so comfortable i started getting real happy and I was playing them some happy shit. And I was going left. Because I was with left eye, so I was like, you know. You was dating left eye? I lived with her.

Don't forget, I'm broke. So I had to find some place to sleep. But y'all was dating? I slept. I stayed in her. She had a hotel. All right sleep But y'all was dating? I slept I stayed in her She had a hotel Hey, but y'all was dating Right

Right, okay She had When I moved to Georgia That's how I met Illegal Illegal was signed to her Right So now I'm Uncle Eric So I go to the place

she lives in like a hotel type of suite. Wait, didn't you pick the youngsters when we said illegal or the youngsters? No, how am I going to say the youngsters? I'm a producer. Okay, okay. My bad. Jamal was Death Squad. Okay.

So where am I at with that? No, but you just said you moved. So, I was getting soft. My whole shit was different. Because of that time? If you go back to my first album, I had a song called, Every now and then, I get a little crazy in the chorus.

I couldn't hear my accent. That sounds like her. That even sounds like TLC. It was a TLC line. But I was doing this not knowing. And then I had in one of my other rhymes

on the song, I was like, I got my hat to the back, my pants down below, whatever. I was, I didn't know I was doing this. I was just like,

getting soft. You put a condom like this? No. So Reggie was like, yo. She must have had that thing. So Reggie was like, He got to relax.

Yeah, niggas burning crib, Sam. Rest in peace, bro. So Reggie was like, Had you turning crow? Don't forget, nobody knew until a two-show went on Hot 97 said, oh yeah, that's the time when Eric Serm summer was left out like niggas already know the story because too

short to say it out loud already wear it up but at the end of the day i was not i didn't have hidden switches i didn't have stay real i didn't have none of that shit all my shit was Kind of pretty Reggie Real low Not wanting to be Assertive To me Like yo He's like Yo those are cool though man

But You know That type of shit You know It's cool but it ain't it I would never thought That he would say that to me You know

I'm producing you Nigga What are you talking about My shit you know That's dope, though. That's a good friend. And next thing you know, hitting switches. That's in my notes, by the way.

And then Stay Real, then Hostile. I was, I got back. Hitting switches is in my notes. I was just doing my interview for it. But if he didn't do that, I would have had a soft album on my debut. I wouldn't have had hitting switches. I wouldn't have had

hostile because my mind was someplace else. I was making... You was to the loving care? Maybe he was, man. You was to the loving care. You was TLC'd. Which is good. It looks good on you. It's kind of. You was good. You was TLC'd, which is good.

It looks good on you. Kind of. You was good. You was living. And left out. I don't think I've ever met left out. Lisa was mad cool. She seemed like she was mad cool.

Crazy, crazy cool. Right. All of them is cool. They all was mad cool. Like, don't forget, I'm new to the city. You know, like I said. I got a thousand dollars in American Express card. Trying to get through, see how I'm going to make it.

You know what I'm saying? Where were they in their career when you met them? It was humongous. Oh, they were already huge. Waterfalls and all that. Not waterfall. Waterfalls already? Humongous. Go chasing the waterfalls. This is 1993

Oh yeah it is Waterfalls They are humongous And again At the end of the day Everybody was going through What they was going through So I just happened to be

Again Illegal was hers Wow We talked about The L.O. Scarface record We talked about that already right Or did we not L.O. Scarface record. We talked about that already, right? Or did we not? L.O. Scarface record.

Yeah. Do Re Mi. Oh, Do Re Mi. Yeah, that was... What does that mean? That's L.O.'s chorus. That was old school. Do Re Mi Fa Sol Mi Do.

Yeah, that's what it was. That's opera shit. I don't know what the fuck that means. Do Re Mi Fa Sol Mi Do. Yeah, you know that in school? Come on, bro. Oh, he knows it in Spanish. No, you're right.

Yeah, that's what that was. That was L.A. was saying that. That was something that everybody know but you. Yeah, I didn't know. I didn't go to that school. I was in a special school. The yellow bus. I don't mind.

I don't mind. No, you were an artist. You never heard, do-re-mi-fa-so-la-ti. That's all he was doing. He was like, making dough. Get this bread.

It's the emperor. Hey! He was just doing it as a routine. Trying to make something up. You know, being slick with the wordplay. That's all that was. That's fire.

Street hot. Why would you bring that up? that was. That's fire. Street hop. Why would you bring that up? Because I love it. So, oh, I got a chance to go work with Nas again. So I go to LES studio. I bring street hop there to play it for him.

Is LES studio in Virginia? No, the one that was here in New York, in Long Island. Okay, okay. Whatever. I play that song for him because I wanted him to hear it. He didn't give a fuck

about what I was saying. He's like, can I get that record? L because I wanted him to hear it. He didn't give a fuck about what I was saying. He's like, can I get that record? LES or Nas? No, Nas. Okay. And I didn't give it to him. Again,

you've been frontin' on Nas your whole career. What's going on here? Yo, what's going on here? You just bring back memories of that because I played it for him. And you did?

And all I had to do was give it to him because I didn't really need it and my shit didn't go away anyway. All right. But he came back and did APMD. Came back and did APMD out. And you did and all I do is give it to because I ain't really need it and my shit ain't going away anyway Came back in the APMD out That's what I'm saying, but yeah, I just you know what that's right so I he came back and got me anyway I Feel like we should make some noise today alright but you've run it on Nas twice

damn I didn't really run it on him the fact that maybe he was serious maybe he wasn't but I played the record for him because I had to sample them and he's like what's up with that I was going to ask you

I think you already answered this but maybe there's one that we didn't speak about I remember I did Oy Mi Canto which is Boricua

Morena and Tata come up to me and Tata said I got this girl that wanted to do the West Indian version of it

and I was like alright cool whatever and it was there's going to say I got this girl that wanted to do the West Indian version of it. And I was like, all right, cool, whatever, whatever. And it was, there was going to say Barbados, you know, like Turks and Caicos, like shit like that. You know, Trinidad, Jamaica, right? It was Rihanna. What? She wasn't Rihanna at the time. I know that.

I know, I know, I know, I know. So I was like, yeah, no problem. And then Tonto was like, yeah, she just wants 15 grand. And I was just like, at the time I had a million dollars. Was she once? Yeah. Was she famous? She had the song, Ponder River.

Yeah, that song. A replay. I said Ponder River. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Ponder River? You knew what I meant. No, I said Ponder River. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Ponder River? You knew what I meant. No, I said Ponder River. Oh, okay, okay, okay. So, biggest mistake of my career.

So you got one of those. That's one of my biggest mistakes. You named some, but is there one that you didn't name tonight that you think? Nas is the biggest. Nas is the biggest, okay.

To this day, I still, again, can't believe that that EPMD record happened. Wow. But again, me not working and doing any produced records on him, that's one thing I wish I had inside my catalog is him. Nah, sir. I ain't the only one that said it, though. Mad people say about him. Meaning they presented him beats? No, just to work

with him. I work with him, but we just say I have a record that I made for him. Why? Well, let's speak it into existence. Hell yeah, on my album. I don't think Nye is going to be making records for a while. He done made all them albums he made.

Nah, he's still got so much music, I feel. I don't think he coming for a while, though. I mean, he did four or five back to back. I think he's going to go even further. Yeah, I think he is. I'm going to be honest. Are you sure? I think so. I think, yo, you know what? I think he's going to go even further. Yeah, I think he is. I'm going to be honest. I think so. I think, yo, you know what?

I think so. I think he's enjoying that independency. He's on a streak, too. Yeah, I think he's enjoying that independency, and he's enjoying what me and you spoke about earlier, what we spoke about earlier, excuse me, with Fat Joe. No, he said that. He said, I'm making records because I want to. He wants to, yes. Yeah, he don't need to

he don't need to he's giving Nas that freedom right now yeah but I don't think that he's doing anything because again Nas got so much dope shit

for you know the money that he making the adventures that he making I don't know he got a casino in Queens he about to build god damn it

that's crazy hit me when it's been ready baby that's such a great example for hip hop though Yeah But I'm going to be honest What Fat Joe said to me yesterday

Made sense To what Nas has been doing Yeah he's been doing it Doing something Because you want to do it Because you want to Because we got to remember A part of us

All of us Real artists Probably would have still rapped if we didn't make money yeah like we probably would have still like did it as a hobby maybe it wouldn't have been you know what i mean but my first like you just said you had signed for 750 i got signed for 5 000 but we basically was doing it for the love then right we didn't make money then But didn't we made it into a business? So, uh, I Love this

So ball I'm hot I really don't. Share me. I love it. So, Bob, I'm hot. No. I'm hot is this, again, having the Marvin Gaye. I try to, you know what's the bugged out? People said I try to strike lightning twice. I just happen to have the record on there, of course, the label. Let's go with that one.

What's what? I'm hot. Oh. I did the record on there, of course, the label. Let's go with that one. What's that? I'm hot. Oh. I did the Marvin Garvey, but since I fucked around and had another one. It worked. It didn't work work, but again. It did what it needed to do. It did what it needed to do, but that's.

I'm fucking around with the samples, making records. I just don't know that I'm going to actually use it. Right. And I just had the acapellas if it's fun to fuck with, just be chopping them. Right. That's a question for me. We talked about you getting your publishing, right?

But you also sample. A lot of times when you sample, people want 100% of that publisher. Did they take it? So how many times have you sampled and they asked for 100% of that publisher? Who asked for it? EPMD got real blessed back then

because we didn't clear Roger. We didn't clear Eric Clout. That was early and before sampling shit happened. Yeah, but they still came at us, but just like for $10,000. Right. The small shit. Yeah, wow. You know what I'm saying?

But the people that take the 100%, you have to really want it. The Reservoir Dogs, the Green Rock Wild, that was 100% by Isaac Hayes. But Jay liked it. He wanted it so bad, he said, go ahead and take it. Because sometimes people take that 100. It depends on how bad you want that record. But they'll take it.

But again, that's what I mean. We all fit the two-pocket state. Go ahead and take it. Because the hype But again Like Like that's what me You know That we offered The Tupac estate Go ahead and take it Cause Cause the hype Are It'll last longer for me

Right The importance of the record For you Yeah But you said You had Tupac and Biggie Is that fair The Biggie's estate

Yeah No Biggie's estate Cleared it Okay Same with The Mob Deeper's estate Cleared The Sean Price's estate

Cleared The Nate Dogg stayed clear. Like you said before, niggas stay clear and shit. But then sometimes you got that shit like- Rob Markman Because you motherfucker Eric Sherman. That's what you got. That's what you did. Eric Sherman.

I know you're humble, but I told you I'm being cocky for you. You know what I mean? Rob Markman But the Tupac, you heard stories about it taking long. Again, at the end of the day, I tell you, you can have it does, you heard stories about it taking long. But again, at the end of the day, I tell you, you can have it.

I just want the nostalgia of the record. Right. But I'll play it for y'all. Again, everybody who hears the record, they always,

their faces, I love to watch them because they be like, nah. I can't wait to hear it. There's no way. You can play it when we're done right here? There's no way. You can play when we're done right here?

There's no way. What? You can play today when we're done? Yeah. Yeah. Have you been to Bali to see Russell? To Bali. He offers.

Bali. He told you to? Yeah, he told me. Come down. I'm going to get your health right the whole night. You're going to love it. Yeah. Never went.

Yeah, of course. He offers you too. Yeah. He said he got a Snoop Dogg suite. He said he got a Snoop Dogg Yeah. Never went. Yeah, of course. He offered you too. Yes. He said he got a Snoop Dogg suite. He said he got a Snoop Dogg suite in the hotel. Right, in the hotel, yeah. It's probably a tax haven over there. Yeah.

He just, he went. Russell went and just did his thing. You know what I'm saying? Yeah. And so this is one time. No, this is your last one time. Let's go now. Let's go.

You got to tell. Take a picture. Tell us that next time. When we signed to Def Jam, right? We signed as Capone and Noriega, right? Yes. But then they was like, yo, we're not going to sign a Nori solo and a Capone solo. So you got to make a pick right now.

I felt like I already got my nut off. Capone was just coming home from jail. So I said, you know what? I let Capone do it. Yo, when? Before you? Huh? This is after?

This is when we signed the Def Jam. So they had a choice to sign Capone and Noriega and one solo out. So they signed Capone and Noriega and I said, you know what? Capone was just coming home from jail. I said, sign Capone's solo. They did. And then I remember me going in because Capone was working on his solo

before he worked on Capone and Noriega. And I remember me just going in and spending my own money. Def Jam would not pay for me to go in and record my solo while I'm waiting for Capone to finish his solo.

Right. And Kevin Lyles comes and sees me. And he says to me, man, I never told you this story. I should have told you this story years ago. And he goes, you're Eric Sherman right now. And I say to him, what do you mean? He said, that's crazy.

You feel like, can I tell you, can I tell you this, you know what you said earlier? No capping. He's like, yo, you feel like you, you holding the burden

of the group. You're holding it down and you feel like you're not being compensated the same way you will be it's gonna come or pause and i remember me saying i didn't know what he meant by that and years later i didn't know what he meant by that, was making a group album for me at that time was harder than making a solo album for me at that time. Because a group album, I had to collab.

I had to actually, but then after I made that solo album, it was just like, yo, this is so much easier way easier it's way easier and I remember him telling me that I remember me knowing you but remember me not like saying damn, what does he mean by that

and years later I got to know what he meant by that and sometimes you hold the burden of being that guy, not feeling like it, and then applying it. And to this day, I always say that my relationship with EFM is so much better because of my relationship with Capone. My relationship with Capone. The American West with Dan Flores is the latest show from the Meat Eater Podcast Network.

Hosted by me, writer and historian Dan Flores, and brought to you by Velvet Buck. This podcast looks at a West available nowhere else. Each episode, I'll be diving into some of the lesser-known histories of the West. I'll then be joined in conversation by guests such as Western historian Dr. Randall Williams and best-selling author and MeatEater founder Stephen Rinella. I'll correct my kids now and then where they'll say when cave people were here. And I'll say, it seems like the ice age people that were here didn't have a real affinity for caves. So join me starting Tuesday, May 6th, where we'll delve into stories of the West

and come to understand how it helps inform the ways in which we experience the region today. Listen to The American West with Dan Flores on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts. I know a lot of cops, and they get asked all the time, have you ever had to shoot your gun? Sometimes the answer is yes. But there's a company dedicated to a future where the answer will always be no. Across the country, cops called this taser the revolution. But not everyone was convinced it was that simple. Cops believed everything that taser told them. From Lava for

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and episodes 4, 5, and 6 on June 4th. Add free at Lava for Good Plus on Apple Podcasts. And it's going to take us to heal us it's mental health awareness month and on a recent episode of just healed with dr j the incomparable taraji p henson stopped by to discuss how she's discovered peace on her journey so what i'm hearing you saying is healing is a part of us also reconnecting to our childhood is some sort you said i look how youthful I look because I never let that little girl inside of me die. I go outside and run outside with the dogs. I still play like a kid.

I laugh. You know, I love jokes. I love funny. I love laughing. I laugh at myself. I don't take myself too seriously. That's the stuff that keeps you young and stops you from being so hard. To hear this and more things on the journey of healing, you can listen to Just Heal with Dr. J from the Black Effect Podcast Network on the iHeartRadio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you get your podcasts.

AT&T, Connecting changes everything. Makes me say I don't ever want to push EFN to anything that he doesn't want to do. Because I did that with Capone. Okay. And it pushed him away from it. Wow. Like, I wanted Capone to be on time. Right.

The motherfucker still ain't on time, bro. Yeah, yo, who do I mind you on Still ain't on time But when I pushed him to be Like me That was not the move You know what I mean That was not the move I should have let him be how he is

And that's the reason why I feel like me and EFM relationship works EFM doesn't judge me He doesn't give a fuck about. And we're both on time. We kind of try to beat each other. Right. See who's on time. But.

So I'm actually. This is the first time I'm saying this because nobody always. Nobody knew. Not because you're over. Nobody really knew the dynamics of what really happened between y'all two. Who, Capone and O.A.? Yeah. Capone's still my brother to this day.

No, I'm not saying that. I'm just saying the fact that even though you went solo, the album didn't come. See, it wasn't like my dynamic. My shit was different. Why did y'all stop making it? I always thought my dynamic was compared to yours. I never knew that they had to break up. See, he went to jail. So I would have... They had a more... They had a break up. See, he went to jail.

So I would have never been a solo artist if he didn't go to jail. I was forced. I met Nori doing the promo tour for CNN. That's how me and him met. He was the only... He was doing the run by himself. But in my mind,

we didn't have the internet back then, so we didn't know that you and Parrish, if that was the case, was... I thought I was basing my career off of you. Oh, okay. Like, you went solo, I went solo. Well, I based my shit off a cube. Damn. You know, because...

Leaving the UA? Yeah, because again, we're in major groups. Hold on, but that's a crazy comparison to what happened there No but still He still went solo Yeah but it was It was crazy

It doesn't matter You still leaving a major group But you felt the same Like energy that That you saw We all saw Q go through With no Vaseline No just the fact that

That's the part of Leaving a major group Okay Being in the major group. Okay. Being in the major group and then going your own separate ways. And then having to create your own identity

and create your own. Yes, all of that. And then seeing if it's going to, if people are going to accept it or not. Cuba tell you all the time too with so-and-so about not knowing.

Of course. You know, scared to death. You know, whatever. You know how people are. They tell you that, you know, you're better with the group. I know, scared to death, you know, whatever, you know how people are. We tell you that, you know, yo, yo, yo, you better with the group.

I mean, if you look at it, it was crazy for Cube to leave NW at its height. They, Straight Outta Compton was such a hit and that's when he left.

See, I was with the Breaker and people didn't, it still was, people still like, there's no way EPMD broke up. You know how big that,

that was huge for people, you know, but again, things happen, but you don't know it's going to work for you. Wow. But you were the primary producer in

EPMD? No, in the beginning, Paris did the first album. People don't know about that. Really? Because people, they always might think that it's me because he stopped working. But again, don't forget, he knew about this

stuff before I did. Is he older than you? Yeah, about a year or something. Okay. But at the end of the day, you know, I just learned how to do it. Right. By the second album.

You know. Oh, glad you did. You know, so when So What You're Saying came, you know, that was the beginning of where I was starting at, you know.

Shout out to both of y'all, man. So let me ask you, right? I love to ask artists this question. you know. Well, shout out to both of y'all, man. So, so let me ask you, right? Like, I'd love to ask the artist this question. What's on your rider? I don't get it. I don't do a rider. When you,

when you're at the show? No, I'm talking more like, if somebody does a book, you, to, to, to.

Yeah, sure. Oh, yeah, yeah. Um, damn, I,

I didn't even do all that. I wasn't even in it like that. Whatever food that came, you had chicken, salmon, rice, vegetables. But people had rolling paper, fucking alcohol, whatever. I don't care. I didn't care. I never cared. That's it. I never looked at no writer. I never't care. I never cared. That's it.

I never looked at no writer. I never did that. I know. You ain't asked for Mr. Chow's? I ain't asked for shit. Little Roy Rogers? Nothing. Eminem's?

Oh, yeah, the blue ones. The blue ones? Just the blue Eminem's? That's my R.R. Carrey one. I'm not making fun of people. Just take all the others. Just get the blue ones in there. I wonder if, my Rikari one though. I'm not making fun of people. Right. Like, just take all the others. Just get the blue ones in there. Right.

I wonder if that was ever real. Yeah, it's real. Yeah? People that's deepest, shit. Just to see if people would do it though? Yeah,

they would do it. But I'm saying, do you think they said it just to see if it would get done? No, that's what they want. Yeah. That's wild.

Who's Jenny? Jenny Penelope. Who's Jenny Penelope? Who's Jenny Penelope? Jenny Who's Jenny LeVolpes? Jenny LeVolpes, too, yeah. Same thing, Madonna. I want the water that's from Bali. Get it shipped over here.

How would she know it's from Bali, bro? I would have got her water, put Bali on that shit. Here you go. Nah, she knew because they got it in that dressing room. Have you ever met somebody that you were disappointed after meeting them and you was like, fuck, this guy was an asshole. Wow, who was that?

Mr. Lee. Not off the bat, but it happened, though. I can't remember. But yeah, it's somebody. Holy shit, I wish I could name a name right now. I wish you could name a name, too. Think about it.

Who is it? You got time. Prince. No. Tell me Denzel Washington. Somebody gave me the size. You know when you get the size like that? Yeah, one of those.

Who's that somebody? I don't remember. All right, we don't got to talk about that. Right. Well. We did it. We did it. Eric Sher.

So that's your phone? Where's my phone? Wait, this is my phone. No, the fucking questions, man. That's the phone. The phone is the shit you answered every shit? Yeah. You passed every question.

You missed some shit about the fucking Dore Me and the switches. You went off the whole script with some every shit? Yeah. You passed every question. You missed the shit about the fucking Dore Me and the Switches. You went off the whole script with some other shit. Yeah. Those are, I mean, I'm a special education student. I went to the resource room, in case you didn't know. Listen, man, you got notes, man. But it works out.

It works out. It works out. OK, is it me? Because you answered every one of my questions, all except for Bomb Diggie.gy yeah what's up with the records though what are you that's his thing man this is my shit i'm a fan so i go pick out my records the bomb diggy we never talk about yeah bomb diggy wasn't it wasn't it wasn't all the way done by me that's when i had ty pipe with me oh producer right so he's queens niggas so he Oh, the producer. Right. Queens. Queens, nigga. So he ain't fucking Queens, nigga, see?

Da boom, da boom, da boom. See, I didn't have that technique yet, but Ty Fife did. It sounded like me because the funk part of it. So I added some stuff in there, too, but that's mostly Ty Fife at the time. It was 95. Ty Fife, matter of fact, on that second album was doing like maybe three or four records on there because he was my new producer.

You know what I'm saying? He had a dope style, you know? So, but that's about that story on that record. But I think that, again, that was a record that too that LA took off with you know New York didn't really fuck with it

too tough people loved the second album but that single didn't go it didn't do nothing except for California didn't you mess with Derek Angeletti for a while wasn't he under your protege? D-Dot? No

you talking about D-Dot? No. No. No. You talking about D-Dot? Yeah. I just, no. Only ones in that camp was Fife and Rockwilder in that camp. Rockwilder. It was Rockwilder. We got to give Rockwilder.

Yeah, he's done. And D-Dot want to come through. Yes. Rockwilder's one person, though, too, that people, again, doesn't know. Like, again, you know already. I know. The big pun, the Jay-z the the christian that galera's the child the he's got an ill cat you know he got his own record called the

rock wall that rather than mephi people look at them jenny jackson this is one of those you know and people don't look at it and look at him at all you know as far as to really as one of those people you know right dangerous because i didn really as one of those people, you know. Right. Dangerous. Because I didn't know he did the Big Pump record. Right. Oh.

I had no idea he did that song. Which one? Um. The one that, uh, the ba-da-ba-da-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba-ba. That's Rock Wilder. Mr. Lee, you're not helping at all, bro. You're on that record. You came up.

What, what? You came up. Rockwell did that? Yes. You don't even know this? No. No. I was also high in those days.

Mr. Hesitant Sounds, can you Google that, please? You got it? Come on, man. This is my camp, nigga. Holy shit. This is crazy. Two records no reason to know nothing about. He waving this shit.

He's on both of them. I have a clue about none of them. I credit that to having a dope life. Nah, but, yo, Eric Sherman, I'm going to be honest with you, man. Last time I saw you, we were on the private jet. And then the next day, I went to Nice and I went to Paris. I'm seeing you today. And tomorrow, I'm going to Paris Paris stop lying. You're good luck

You travel a lot nigga She don't want me to know but the fact that she was like you really really be out there enjoying life for real Cuz tomorrow's not promised. I like that Every time I see you yeah, but you're doing it. Absolutely, yeah. Right? Yeah, man. So every time I see you, it's a great lot. Yeah, but all you're doing is showing niggas you got money in this shit. No, no. You see?

That's not the point. And the side posse you got, these niggas live out here at Dade County over there in Coral. Oh my god. You keep fucking around, these going to be able to go. Damn, the side posse? You brought them into this shit? Nori.

Yeah. Let me holla at you real quick. Hey, listen. No, no, you got to be careful. You got gotta be careful No I'm not Be careful I can't be here

To protect him like that Yo are you sure You didn't drink bro Hey yo but listen My first Wednesday Is not a coincidence Because again You know

This is my second day Living in Miami What you living in Miami now I just moved yesterday. And I can see the water and shit. I'm just jabbing because I'm flossing. Listen, but listen. And my G-wagon is being sent right now. Listen, but listen.

Let me tell you something. This place, I'm trying to find out if this is me or not. Because my man, once this nigga left California, I was like, this place I'm trying to find out if this is me or not right because because my man once this nigga left California I was like damn

so LA might not be the place LA's not the place right now will you stop it and so and New York was making me comfortable

like you know how you get the comfortability and when you get too comfortable you know you gotta be careful with that cause you can fall into a comfort zone

so I was doing that and um you know I've always been in Atlanta you know, you got to be careful with that because you can fall into a comfort zone. So I was doing that. And, you know, I've always been in Atlanta, you know what I'm saying? But I knew that that wasn't where I wanted to go now, too. Your freak nick is over. You got to go leave. So...

And he's rolling that movie, too. Yeah, I know. So my colleagues are here. Right. Nori, Fat Joe, Salaam, Kool and Dre. Scott Storch. The age group, Rick Ross, Scott Storch. All these people that I know.

Right. You know what I'm saying? Don't forget. DJ EFN. Young Bird, he was with me. That's right right yeah we got it

on release go ahead right so you got you got to understand we got a great Youngberg episode that we're never going to release

no we're going to release that motherfucker yo Rick Ross slept on my basement floor wow like this is this niggas ain't me B

right all I know the fact that this is what this niggas ain't me, B. Right. All I know, the fact that this is what I want to see for myself if this is where

I'm supposed to be at. Because again, the motivation is what people need to keep, you know, just to keep it fresh. Yeah, absolutely.

I can make music anywhere. But the motivation of people doing what I love to do makes you do what you love to do at a higher level. So when you're out here

dolo and you're over there by yourself and nobody's doing that now it's just you. You're still making it but it ain't the same type of motivation. That's what Atlanta had gave me. That's what LA had gave me. New York had gave me for a while Now Miami gonna give it to you

Yeah but don't I'm the fuck out of here It don't really matter Yeah get yourself a public sandwich A Publix Publix Not a public one But a Publix

Publix And then To the part The part of the Of the The weather part As far as this being like, you know, you wake up at 7. Summer every day. Well, right now it's supposed to be hurricanes.

This nigga right here jogging 5 or 10 miles. I don't know if you're lying that they're picking the camera up. Like, he's like, no, you're picking the camera up. You're like, okay. Yeah, and now I'm at 7. Nah, nigga, the camera. I watched the edit. I watched the edit. He out on different they can't. I watched the edit. I watched the edit.

He had on different sneakers. He said it's just AI. He had on some new bows, and they switched to Adidas. Not really quite sure. No. Only wear Nike, sir. Only wear Nike, sir. Good try.

Good try. Good try. Good try. Good try. You put in one run day A week's worth of running You can skip, man Skip two, be like

I'm on number 10 They're doing a movie today Okay, cut The movie's doing Oh, shit The ice melted Yeah Well

Well, listen, we This is your home now Now that we know you live here Yes Please come sober drunk every time. We love it, man. You are the soberest drunk person we ever had. We love it, man.

I feel like we've been you drinking everything we drinking. Word. I feel like every time we drink. This right here is the dopest shit, though. Nah. I see people get this, and this is dopest shit. But can I give you your props for two minutes, please? What happened?

You are a legend. You're an icon. In many ways, if you weren't here, I wouldn't be here. EFM would be, I don't know if you even noticed. EFM,

that's the original copies. He didn't go on eBay. No, no, no. I watched. That's the original. He has tennis balls from KRS-One. I do, I do.

He got your tapes on a tape. But the shirt, I don't know how many times you wore it for interviews with other people. I'm like, damn, that feels like that. I saw him before, but he never act like how I see you with the paraphernalia and the stuff that you do in the forest. Did you call it paraphernalia? I like that. He called it paraphernalia. That's that you do in the fall is like, damn, man, you represent. I like that. He called it paraphernalia.

That's illegal shit. Let's go. Yeah, because I didn't make that shit. None of that shit. He's like, I don't make money off this shit. I could get you off of that right now. He could get us for that, right? Like, oh, that's my likeness. Listen, so at the end of the day, but again, I realize it now, too.

At the end of the day, I'd be like, damn, these niggas be repping. And then for y'all to do that, like, y'all rep for real. I'm like, damn, these niggas rep for real. Like, for real, for real, EPMD repping. So that right there, I appreciate that, too. But again, at the end of the day, we was kids not knowing. I was just making what we thought was dope.

Period. And that's what we did. We made what we thought was dope. And you changed the world, man. And again, don't forget, we had the... I couldn't come whack. Can you imagine you at home and then Cram to Understand came on first.

MC Lyfe. Yes. That was Red Alert playing that, right? So the next... No, Craig Mack came to my house because Craig Mack used to come to my house all the time at my grandma's house. Also from Long Island. Me and Craig Mack used to listen to

the radio and see what's coming on next. So we heard Public Game No. 1 together. Wow. And we heard Nobody Beats the Biz. Oof. Also from Long Island. Right. And then the next week, I came in the door.

That was it for me. So now, don't forget, then you have, of course, you had KRS-One with the bridge and all that so we have I got all these people to watch don't forget

me and Paris is the last one out from the era from that era right don't forget you got Romney with Canes out

you know so I thought Leaders of the New School was the last one out no that's the next that's the next era that's the next era.

That's the next era. What I'm talking about as far as me and Paris listening. You hear what we heard? We heard Chaos One. We heard Light. We heard Biz. We heard Rakim. And we heard Public Enemy.

Wow. So imagine you sitting there. So how do we have to come when you hear that? And it's crazy because you guys sounded nothing like anybody you he was inspired by well rock him you felt like you sounded like rock him because that's what people said in the last interview and i never feel like you sound like paris said it into what you're saying they can say we signed the r that music was whack we dropped the album strictly business don't report i don't think you don't sound it but this is what they were saying okay right right back then don't forget though when that epm don't sound it, but this is what they were saying. Okay. Right, right. Back then. Don't forget, though.

When that EPMD shit was going on and Rakim from the next town, whatever that shit, I ain't no joke. Whatever. You can get a smack for this. Then EPMD came out like a diggum smack. You smack me and I smack you back. So niggas thought that that was the diss. Again, if you don't know that, the hood took that. So now Rakim is pissed.

I'm like, damn, no way. There's no way you want beef with him. We can't beat him. So then he said, I brought us to dig him. I never dug him. He couldn't find me. So I drug him. And the Danes is on the cover.

I'm like, oh, we in trouble. We in trouble. All of a sudden, we saw him at a place called The Building. And Parrish saw him, and place called The Building and Paris saw him and Paris squashed the beef. What did Paris do? What did he say to him? We saw him at the bar

and like, we talked to him and the shit was squashed. But again, the hood made that beef just because of what you thought you might have heard. So don't forget,

if your man gassed you up, you heard him say that, shit to smack me and smack you back. So it went crazy. So now you're going to forget. We're only two towns over. Brentwood,

then Wine Dance. We're right here. Wow. That's my mentor who I'm watching who I wouldn't even be going that far if I never heard him. My melody in fucking

Eric B. for President was the shit. That's what I based my shit off of. You don't know that, but I'm telling you. That's incredible. And he thinks you dissed him. Of course. You're bugging.

He don't think that. That's your icon. The hood did it. So he not the battery in the back. You ain't had no DM back then. We'd be like, yo, nigga. No, it was the bar when Paris saw him. It was too late for that.

It was too late. Because once that came, whatever, and then we said, it sounded like the R. We said, the virus said the R. Like, nigga, you can say this. It sounded like the R, and the music was what? Words. And he said, didn't that father leader came out?

What is the thing of my never ducking? You couldn't follow me. I'm like, oh, my God, we in trouble. and he switched it up yeah i was so young i didn't even actually all of that went over my head yo now i said it that's what all the you heard now i said but the rock him record came from me with the um uh autobiography that all that he said he said the same thing i told him he said said it in the rhyme. Wow. Jesus. That day when I went with the street

we talked about that story. Wow. And the next thing you know he wrote it in the rhyme. Yeah, that's how a motherfucking good artist is. You sit around, we talk and then we write about that shit that you just talked about.

All right, Drink Champs, we did it. Let's do it. Drink Champs is a Drink Champs LLC production, hosts and executive producers, N-O-R-E and DJ E-F-N. Listen to Drink Champs on Apple Podcasts, Amazon Music, Spotify,

or wherever you get your podcasts. Thanks for joining us for another episode of Drink Champs, hosted by yours truly, DJ EFN and NORE. Please make sure to follow us on all our socials. That's at Drink Champs across all platforms. At TheRealNoriega on IG. At Noriega on Twitter. Mine is at Who's Crazy on IG. At DJ EFga on Twitter. Mine is at Who's Crazy on IG, at DJEFN on Twitter.

And most importantly, stay up to date with the latest releases, news, and merch by going to drinkchamps.com. Hear insightful, entertaining discussions on today's important health and wellness topics on the Health Discovered podcast from WebMD. Through in-depth conversations with experts, Health Discovered covers everything from tips for healthier living to the latest on therapy and mental health. My goal is to really de-stigmatize mental health treatment and looking at it from a

whole health perspective. Physical health and mental health can be intertwined. Listen to WebMD Health Discovered on the iHeartRadio app or wherever you get your podcasts. This is an iHeart podcast.