Duncan Trussell Family Hour - 362: Susan Marrufo

Episode Date: November 23, 2019

Susan Marrufo, co-founder of Samarasa Center, yoga teacher, and meditation teacher joins the DTFH! Duncan is coming to Denver! January 23-25. Click here to buy tickets. This episode is brought to you by: Squarespace - Use offer code: DUNCAN to save 10% on your first site. Burrow - Visit burrow.com/duncan and use code DUNCAN at checkout to get $75 off and FREE 1 -week shipping.

The NTT IndyCar Series. It's human versus machine, against all odds, every single lap. The ones who risk it all, battling not just each other, but the menaces hidden within the most challenging tracks and motor sports. Pushing 240 miles per hour and taking 5Gs to the neck just for fun. Fractions of a second, lost, are gained in every corner, adding up to defeat or victory. Experience the Children's of Alabama Indy Grand Prix this Sunday on NBC and Peacock at 3 o'clock Eastern. Okay, so yesterday Graham Hancock tweeted this awesome link to a story. I'll just read it to you. This is on phys.org. Photos show evidence of life on Mars, Ohio entomologist claims. Scientists scrambled to determine whether there is life on Mars. Ohio University professor

William Romaseh's research shows that we already have the evidence, courtesy of photographs from various Mars rovers. Dr. Romaseh, who specializes in arbo virology and general met slash medical entomology. What's medical entomology? That's weird. Are there like vets for insects? Like, can you bring a injured cricket to an entomologist and he'll put a cast on it? He spent several years studying photographs from the red planet that are available on the internet. He found numerous examples of insect-like forms structured similarly to bees, as well as reptile-like forms, both as fossils and living creatures. He presented his findings Tuesday at the National Meeting of the Entomological Society of America in St. Louis, Missouri.

There has been and still is life on Mars, Rosimer said, noting that the images appear to show both fossilized and living creatures. There is apparent diversity among the Martian insect-like fauna, which displays many features similar to Terran insects, wing flexion, agile gliding flight, wings. Anyway, you can look this up and look at these bugs and decide for yourself. The cynics out there, the skeptics, they're lighting this poor guy up. He's getting just beat down because all the images are blurry. But if you ask me, there are definitely insects on Mars. And I've known that for a long time actually because I have deep connections in the inner space community. Regardless, I got excited. I reached out to Professor Rosimer and he wrote back right away.

It was late at night. He told me to call him. I called him. He did that thing that scientists do where he said that I had the wrong number. He sounded pretty drunk. We talked for a while and he finally broke down and said, listen, you want, you want to hear something crazy? I'm like, you better believe I do. He's like, well, we not only have proof that there's bees on Mars, but these bees are musical bees and they've used some kind of satellite technology to pick up the sounds of these bees, which I'm going to play for you right now. Hope this doesn't get me ebstained. Sometimes it feels like you may never infect anybody. You're just another drum alone. Never gonna bond. Never gonna spawn. Never gonna lay eggs in the chest of someone's mama.

Don't you worry, one day you'll be our queen. So while you're incubating, don't be afraid to dream. You're gonna spawn one day. But for now it's time to incubate. Enjoy your rest inside the chest of the thing that you invest. But I believe in you. You are more than just love under me. You're gonna be a queen. All you gotta do is dream. So don't forget, even the most powerful queen. Start it off as just some eggs in someone's chest. And just remember, you will hear your host scream. All you gotta do is dream. You will bring glory to the hive. Wow, that is really inspirational. You know, it is easy to sometimes look at the temporary

conditions of your life and maybe look at the temporary conditions of your friend's life and get the feeling that you're never gonna get your big shot. But if you really think about it, then you'll realize that judging your insides by someone's outsides is a recipe for doom. And I think that's what this song teaches us, is that it's better to burst out of someone's insides into their outsides. And the motivation to do that is not gonna come from jealousy or anxiety or fear, but it's gonna come from knowing that if you believe in yourself and you have faith that the universe is holding you, embracing you in its beautiful chest, then you will begin to experience the kind of gratitude and joy just to be alive that I think will produce the ambition and inspiration

that any hatchling needs to have the courage to explode in glory out of the chest of their hosts. So I love that song and I love the Martian Bugs. What a beautiful podcast we have for you today. If you're interested in yoga, if you're interested in Tantra, then this is the episode for you. We're gonna jump into it, but first, this. Much thanks to Squarespace for sponsoring this episode of the DTFH. Let's face it, Thanksgiving is not what it used to be. In the old days, a simple statement at the dinner table like, I don't think war is that good, could lead to hours of fighting with your family, but now if you really want to cause sparks at the Thanksgiving table, you're gonna have to do

more than talk. You're gonna have to build a website. And if you want to build a website, there's no better place to go than to Squarespace. Squarespace has everything you need to create beautiful websites. They've got award-winning templates. They've got shopping cart functionality. They've got incredible analytics. You want to do email lists and email blasts and marketing campaigns. They've got that. They've got full integration with a variety of incredible services out there. They've got shopping cart functionality. They size to every phone. They've got incredible customer service. And if you want to build a website fast, you could do that too. Want to see a beautiful Squarespace website? Head over to duckatrussell.com and feast your eyes on that

glorious HTML, all created using Squarespace. But you don't just have to build a website for business. You could build a website for fun. And what better way to celebrate Thanksgiving than to head over to Squarespace and buy turkeysucks.com, which is somehow still available. I'm going to say it again, turkeysucks.com, turkeysucks.me. In fact, almost every single possible version of turkeysucks is right there on Squarespace for you to buy right now. Imagine the delight when your parents realize that their homepage is turkeysucks.me. Imagine their confusion when they see their very own Thanksgiving table. It's the main picture on that website. You're going to have a fun Thanksgiving. All you got to do is head over to squarespace.com

forward slash Duncan. And when you're ready to launch, use offer code Duncan, and you'll get 10% off your first order of a website or a domain. And if you do get any of the turkeysucks websites, could you do me a huge favor and tweet the website you make to at duckatrussell on Twitter? I'd like to see what you created for your Thanksgiving season. Again, that's squarespace.com forward slash Duncan and use offer code Duncan to get 10% off your first order of a website or a domain. One of my dogs pissed on my couch in front of my mother-in-law. He's mad at the baby and that's how it shows her. Had to drive the battle of the city with my wife to get a new couch.

I'd rather put a thousand black widows in my mouth. If I could do back time, I would have used furrow. Instead of waiting for a couple months to get a piss free couch. Why do that to yourself when the geniuses over at borough have figured out a painless way for you to get amazing furniture delivered to your house? You get to pick the fabric color. You get to pick the leg finish. You get to pick the arm rest style and length and you can add a chase lounge or an Ottoman or both. They've got durable fabric. It's naturally scratch and stain resistant built in USB charges and you can set it up yourself in minutes and add or remove seats

as needed. I tested this out. I have put together furniture from other places and it has taken me all day long. This just clips right together. It's so easy and they've got more than just sofas friends. They've got a sleep kit that transforms your comfy sofa into an even comfier bed. And now they've got rugs. They've got everything that you need to transform your living room, your bedroom or your house into a palace of comfort and joy and even better. They've got free one week shipping right now. You can get $75 off a new sofa and free one week shipping at burrow.com slash Duncan. That's B U R R O W dot com slash Duncan for $75 off a new burrow sofa. Beautiful children. By the time you hear this episode of the DTFH we will have all new merchandise

in the shop. Not just a few shirts here or there but an entire array of new garments for you to choose from just in time for the holidays. You want crow's milk related shirts. They're there. You want Christmas sweaters. They're there. You want audacious blasts of the face of yours truly with the beautiful Kim Jong-un. Yeah, they're there just as has been requested by so many of my listeners. We did it. I went to North Korea and did a photo shoot and it was actually pretty interesting. He wouldn't do the podcast with me. There's a language barrier there anyway, but it was a really fun trip. Check out the store at dunkitrustle.com. You'll see exactly what I'm talking about. Also, we have a Patreon. So go to patreon.com forward slash DTFH and subscribe.

You will get commercial free episodes of this podcast along with a lot of other stuff. We're about to relaunch. So if you sign up for certain tiers, you're going to get exclusive mugs and posters and stickers and also the ability to start watching some live feeds and stuff like that. Still working on the relaunch, but it's coming. Okay, let's get this show on the road. Now, without further ado, we present to you by We I Mean Me, a podcast that has everything a person might want in a podcast. You want to learn about a sex cult? Here you go. You want to question the fundamental nature of everything you know? Well, we've got that too. Today's guest is the co-founder of Samarasah Yoga Studio in Echo Park. She has done extensive training in yoga,

both her and her brother are mystical beings. So if you're in Echo Park, you definitely, definitely should at least check it out. Susan has an upcoming course at Samarasah called Yoga, Sex and Death, which is starting up mid-December. You can even go to a Q&A session, which is on December 15th at 10am. All right, let's do this. Everyone, please welcome to the Ducatressel family, our podcast, Susan Marufo. So here we are. Here we are at your yoga studio, Samarasah. Yes. And the first question I have for you is something that I think a lot of people wonder about when they come in here, which is, and I'll take a picture of this. What is the, what is the symbol there? What does that mean?

Okay, well, it's the all seeing eye, watching wherever you go. Okay, so when we started with the brand design, I had this idea, an image for a logo, which was, so there's a figure in the Hindu tradition called the Shiva. And Shiva, I don't have a statue of Shiva in here, but there is one in the front. Big one. Yeah. And he's got a symbol right here in his third eye, and it's called a tripundra. And I wanted, what does that mean tripundra? It's, it's just this, it's just the symbol that he's got right here. That's what they call it. And I wanted a variation of that symbol for Samarasah. Like I wanted a modern take on it. So our branding agency just played with it. And she came up with, our artistic director came up with this, the logo that you see, the eye.

When you walk in, you know, you see this eye. The all seeing eye, which is very, for a lot of people, that's like an evil symbol. They look at it as the, it's on the dollar bill. It represents, I don't know what, private jets. Well, this includes private jets and goes beyond private jets, because it's like, basically, it sees everything. It's like the Ajna chakra, which is the mental command center, the source of intuitive seeing. So everything that you could see with the eyes closed, maybe if, if you will. So your third eye. Yeah, third eye. It's your third eye. That's the third eye. And so we just took different variations of this third eye and put it into some cool looking images. I wanted to mix the eyes with triangles, because the triangles

symbolize an upward facing triangle is the symbol for the masculine masculine energies and a downward facing triangle is a symbol for feminine feminine energy. So this room has an upward facing triangle with the eye in the middle. This is like the masculine. And in that room, Sundari, it's downward facing triangle, the feminine. Wow. So this is the story behind all this. But when you were thinking about that, was that a branding agency decision, or were you using some kind of metaphysical sense of like, Oh, I need to balance masculine and feminine. Oh, right. Yeah, no, that was all from my practice, my philosophy, my, my yoga training. So I'm a, I'm a yoga teacher, and a meditation teacher. And I had been living in Tantric community for many,

many years. What was the name of that community? Okay, it's called a gamma. A gamma. Yes, A G A M A. So the reason I have this reaction is because it has been me too, like crazy. Where's the founder? It's located in Copangan in Thailand. Okay. An island in Thailand called Copangan in South Thailand. This is from Baba's? No, no, no, no, no, no connection. No, no connection. I mean, there's a connection in the way that our communities would sometimes they were like, a little bit incestuous. I hate to use that word. Sure. Given the conversation, but we, a lot of people that were to gamma left to gamma to go to Prem Baba because Prem Baba seemed like the pure community in Prem Baba was also Tantra. He is Tantra. But he doesn't brand

himself as a Tantra teacher. He doesn't call himself a Tantric teacher. He talks about Tantra in a different way than what most of the Western world looks at as Tantra. Can we, okay, very quickly, can we jump back to a gamma? Yes. And I want to talk about how you ended up on an island, a Thai island in a Tantra community. What were the steps? Well, how do you, how does that happen? That sounds crazy, in fact. I, so I was married and I was living a pretty normal Western life. I worked in advertising. I was a brand manager. I had a beautiful husband, all the things, you know, check, check, check, all the things I had. Where were you? I was in Dallas, Texas, which is like, in and of itself, that was rough. I just always felt like a fish out of water,

you know, like round peg square hole, like going to this advertising job. I didn't give a fuck. What advertising? It just seemed like on the outside, that's how things should look for me. You know, that's how my whole life was. It was like, I want to have this cool job. Advertising is cool. You work hard. You play hard. There's a lot of fucking boozy. I mean, we just, I parted really hard. I was basically killing myself for a good 15 years. I started early. Like booze. Yeah. Coke. Yeah. Just all the drugs. Yeah. Did you go to college for advertising? I got a bachelor's degree in communication and then I got a master's degree in communication. Wow. Yeah. Okay. Wow. This is nuts. So you're, you're like a hardcore advertising agent in Dallas,

parting hard. That's when you got married. Yeah. And how long were you married? Well, we were together for 11 years. We were married for eight, seven of them. Okay. Yeah. Okay. So please, I can't wait to hear the link. So then I was living this life that didn't feel totally authentic, but I couldn't really put my finger on what, why I was so unhappy. I just knew that shit's going in a direction that could get really sticky for me because I was, man, just running myself into the ground. Like I have this thing inside of me that is so hardcore, that's so, like just so strong. I did, like call it, call it passion, call it just a lot of shockty or energy. Yeah. And back then I just had no idea what to do with it. And I felt very

isolated and alone. I didn't feel connected. But I didn't know that was the thing. I didn't know that that's what was going on with me. So anyway, you didn't know, you wait, you didn't know you didn't feel connected. You just thought empty or something. Yeah. I wouldn't have put it that way. I wouldn't have said I don't feel connected because I had this husband that was like amazing and super sweet and I have a good family and I had all the things. So I felt like, well, I guess this is connection. You know, it's like, if you just do one thing all the time, you don't know, you don't experience that thing because you're not, you don't have perspective. You're not outside of it. Once you get outside of it, then it's like, oh, shit. Yeah. That is not connection. Okay. I know what

you're talking about. So like this sometime, like the, this is why I think like getting out of the country is so good. Yes. Because you get out of the country and suddenly you realize like, holy shit. Like I am, I, I'm even more insignificant than I imagined I was. This is the game people are, the game is being run in a slightly different way everywhere. And then you do see the wildness of the culture that you come from and the good things and the bad things. It definitely gives you perspective. So, but when you're in it, you can't, there's just no way to really get that bird's eye view of the, whatever the dance is that you're doing. Totally. I get you. Yeah. Okay. Travel. And you know what it's occurring to me right now as you're talking is not even

external travel, just external travel where you go to another place, but like this inner travel too, like doing inner work and getting pushing yourself a little bit emotionally or just exploring internally, like that kind of travel to get some perspective is also really valuable. But time travel, time travel, go into the future a few years and then look back and you'll always be like, what the fuck was I doing? Oh my God, I was wearing rave pants. I wore rave pants. I was wearing giant baggy rave. What the fuck are you getting that happen to me? It's crazy, but the time travel helps because you, you, you get out of it, you know, and you see, oh my God. Now, wow, how easy it is to get pulled into some kind of odd cycle and get really caught

up into thinking that this is all there is and all that matters and who I am. It's so easy. Totally. And I didn't know, um, when I, when I left, I had no reference for the way that I, for what, okay, let me see how I can say this. So an authentic life for me looked totally different than what it was in my twenties, but I had nobody modeling that life for me. Right. When I was in my twenties. Sure. So I didn't know what it could look like. I just knew that this shit wasn't working. Right. And I was like, I don't know. All I know is that this isn't working. I'm just going to throw myself out into the world and see, see if there's something else that feels better than this. Right. And so I just left. I just left the States. I left my marriage and I quit my job and

what? Yeah. And I went and I moved to Spain. What, like, what the, so how did that happen? You're just one day you're like, fuck this. I'm out. I mean, it was, it was not, it was like a slow decay. And I remember having a conversation with my husband at the time when I said to him, look, I know for sure if I stay, it's divorce because I've utilized every single tool I have at my capacity to stay in, in this. And I, I can't, I can't, but at least if I go, there's an unknown variable. And maybe that'll give me something to be able to make some peace with myself and in this marriage. And so that's a shot. We got a shot if I go. And he understood and he was like, okay, I get it. So then I left and I just went on this massive exploration and

I started getting really, I moved to Spain first and I started getting really deep into my own practice, yoga practice. And I was, were you doing yoga before you went to Spain? But it was like, for sure I was. And I had some amazing insights that occurred during that time. But I was also like, at the same time, just drinking myself into like a stupor. Yeah. Any chance I could get. So it kind of balanced out the effects of yoga. I wasn't able to like fly. Right. Because it was keeping me pretty neutral. I guess my practice, which was better than nothing, you know, in your practice at the time was just going to a yoga studio, right? Just the, you know, health yoga, right? But some spiritual stuff attached. Okay. So you go to Spain and then

did you rent an apartment in Spain? Wow. Yeah, I rented a pistol. I call it a little flat. I made some friends. I was teaching English. It was very low key. It wasn't stressful like advertising. I was teaching English to these little Spanish kids. And it was like the best year of my life. It's like the year of awakening. I was having all these experiences. What did your parents think? So my parents are very conservative. Right. They're from El Paso, Texas. And they were like, what the fuck are you doing? Okay. You're losing your mind. Everybody was like, Oh, everybody was so concerned about my marriage. You're gonna lose the perfect man. You're gonna lose the perfect guy. And it's like, does anybody see me? You know, like my soul is

like dying here. And everyone's concerned about you're going to lose a man. You know, it was really interesting. They probably thought you're having a nervous breakdown. Oh, they for sure did. But it's interesting to see how we have all grown because of this whole journey that I left and kind of went off on this deep dive internally. And the whole family went with me and they could have chosen to not but they have they've really met me and our relationships have just gotten much deeper and richer. I feel it's like now we just know each other. Whereas before I didn't know who I was, right? So I couldn't how could I show who I was to anybody else? Right. And so it would felt so inauthentic. And that's what I was running from is just myself being inauthentic

with everyone. It was just fucking gross, you know, feeling like my parents don't know me. My husband doesn't know me. And that just felt that's why I felt alone and isolated. Sure. Because I didn't know how to show myself to anybody because I didn't know who I was. And now it's just honest. Now it's much more honest. I think my parents are like, what are you doing with with your life? But they also see that I'm much happier. And they also see that I'm interested in them as people. And we're just closer. Here's a fun fact. Apparently flight attendants have higher any job, but they did a study of flight attendants have a higher rate of depression, because they have to act happy all the time. And they can't express themselves authentically. But any when they get stuck in

like day after day after any public service job that demands a happy attitude, causes this imposter syndrome at the most extreme level. And it really fucks with people's heads. So yeah, that's that's a real dark place to get into. What are you? Are you like a stepford wife? Are you some kind of automaton? Are you just what are you in there? So Spain, that's such a good way to put it imposter syndrome. Yeah, that's what that's what it felt like. It's called short term is the liar short. You're a fucking liar. Yeah, you're being paid to lie basically. Well, right. And you know, the thing when I look back, like you were talking about time travel, when I look back, it's like, it did feel like this isn't authentic, but it was the

best I could do. You know, so it was honest. It was honest at the time in that way, because it's all I knew to do. Sure. And now, after being on this path, like we were talking about like the shadow and just letting that's why I feel so strongly about just letting it be fucking okay. Whatever comes, it's the naturalness of energy moving through the collective energy moving through just this individual body. And like, how can I be with it? How can I experience it fully and just and let it let it go without needing to hold it down to constrict it to. Yeah. Yeah. So that's like the whole I think that's knowing that part of my background and my history might might be helpful when people hear what I'm teaching. Okay. So Spain, should we go back? Spain. So I'm in Spain,

and I'm like getting into my practice. But the crucial thing was that I was practicing by myself. I was doing my own like home practice. I was practicing like four hours a day. And it was like for the first time in my life, like, holy shit. I remember I would just cry. It was energy, just energy, moving. And water, tears would just come out of my face and so much emotion just would come every day because I had stopped drinking and stopped numbing. And it was all in there wanting to just come out and be felt and move through. And so even though like if somebody had seen me from the outside, crying, crying, it would have looked so intense and serious, but it was just so light. It was amazing. I was like experiencing things. That time was

like so powerful. I remember riding the bus to work every morning and looking out at the city of Sevilla. I was living in Sevilla and just feeling, I would look at a flower and just cry, cry, cry, because let me turn this. I just felt, that's funny, right? And I felt like when, like so clear inside, like there was just a total, there was only a physical body outline, there was nothing on the inside. Does that make sense? So like there was nothing internally to stick to anything externally. So nothing, everything that came just passed through me. It felt like it was just moving through me. There was no trigger. There was nothing to catch. You're a mirror. Yeah. Not even a mirror. It didn't even feel like a mirror, like I'm

reflecting anything back. It just felt like there's nothing there. There's nothing there. Like I feel like it felt like if somebody had come up to me and hurt me or said something to me, it would have been, it just would have been okay. Like it just, because there was nothing, no pain inside of me to catch their pain. Right. So it's like you pulled up all the fishing nets. There's that, like, you know, some people are just like a spider web of potential anger, like so many different things. It's like a dense web that almost any phenomena is going to trigger some form of, it's going to trigger a reaction. And the reaction is whatever the thing is that they do, some version of hissing or barking or screaming at the world. And then if that web

goes away, then it's, I know, I know, I think I understand what you're talking about. It's just there's not, there's nothing for anything to catch. And since you can't get caught, what are you anymore? You know, it underlines what you're saying is how people define themselves, not by their physical form, but by the shit that upsets them, they're defined by where they get caught, they're defined by their traps, internal snares, which is pretty depressing, if you think. So those went away from four hours of yoga a day. I mean, for me, that's just one, that's an aeration of yoga. But let me just, only because sometimes people that I get meet like you, they deaf, because they've practiced for so long, they do take it for granted almost that they were,

to you, that doesn't sound as, to me, that is the most hardcore thing. To get an apartment in Spain, leave my life behind, and then start sitting or doing, what were you doing like hatha yoga? Yeah, I was doing hatha yoga, I was doing meditation, and I was doing like mind mapping, where I would write thoughts down on paper and then make the connections. It's basically meditation on paper where I could see how the pattern of a thought, what does that look like? It just looks like I'm writing stream of consciousness, journaling, without censoring at all. And then going back to look at it, because it's thought on paper, so it's grounded. Ego is so fast, manas, mind just moves so quickly. But when you put it down on paper and really give yourself

the opportunity, which is a practice in and of itself, you like, I noticed how much I wanted to censor, and not really put it all down there. Yeah, what, that's it. You know, I have that all the time, where I'll be writing, and then I'll have a thing, oh God, you can't, you can't say that out loud. Right. And you look at that, I'm like, wait, who am I performing for right now? Like, there's no one here, but me, I'm writing into a thing that is certainly not sentient, at least I pray my journals, I have some, I pray my journals can't read, because they're going to be so fucking bored. But I got a boy here again. Oh my God, he's mind mapping. Oh, God, really? You're so funny. That's a funny thought. It's annoying. But yeah, so the censoring mechanism

that kicks in, that's kind of what it's teaching you, is that the idea, is it showing you where you self-censor? Yeah, well, that's the first, that's the first part. That's the first part of the journey. And then once you get past the censoring, which comes and goes, it's not like you're ever really past it, right? But you notice it, you keep going, you write, and then you start to see all the shit that comes out, or all the stuff that comes out, all the mind stuff that comes out, and you start to see connections of like, oh, so I see the inner workings of the mind and how this thought will inevitably lead to this thought. And then this thought, here comes the spiral downward from this thought, you just kind of go back and trace mind, which people can do

in meditation. You know, you can sit in meditation and do this, right? Sure. But it just helps me, for some reason, for me, writing things down is very beneficial, not necessarily for everyone, but for me, it's like a total path. That's amazing. So only because I get the sitting practice, of course, and I get the yoga, of course. But I never thought of journaling as a spiritual practice, but I could see how it is for sure. Oh my gosh, for sure. There's so many things. So, you know, let me just go back and speak to what you said, Duncan, about like, when you were talking about censoring, and you're like, who am I trying to perform for? It's this idea, it's the idea that we have of ourselves, this idealized image that we have of ourselves that we're trying to protect.

Right. You know, I don't want to see myself beyond like, I like thinking of myself as this kind of person who's kind and loving and right. And so I don't want to write on this whacked out shit down that I think about, actually, these thoughts that come. Yeah. That's why what you do is so interesting. And that's why I love your energy here, because I feel like you've tapped into that, like this, God, there's just space to say yes, whatever. Yeah. And that's where creativity comes. That's divine. Yeah, I know. Yes, I think so. And all is in it. Yes. It's certainly feels good to allow yourself to speak unspeakable things. If the motivation isn't harmed. Right. You know, that's, that's the motivation. The intent is, you don't want to say shit to

people that's just designed and upset them. But yeah, in the comedy world right now, intention is sort of getting ignored. And just the things people are saying or being like harshly judged. And people aren't looking like there's comedians who there's comedians who could say a completely non offensive joke. And it offends the shit out of people just because the comedian is like angry or, you know, really upset. And then there's comedians who could say the most offensive shit you ever in your life, but there's love behind it. And it just seems hilarious. In fact, the love seems to be the, as long as it's love that the offense is like, as long as behind the offense mask is love, oh my God, it's the best ever. But if you have offense and then behind it is

anger, it's really repugnant. It's like really repulsive to see that because you just like, why are you hitting me, man? I came here to see a comedy show not to get brutalized by your anger and your fun. But if it's love, and then it's, then it's whatever. It's usually pretty funny. I mean, it's like, you know, when people like put a video of their kid rapping or whatever and saying horrific things, but the kid just seems sweet, you know, like that there's a difference. Well, this conversation I'm very interested in. And I was talking to a guy who's involved in comedy. And so it's juicy that you're here and we're having this conversation because how it's, I think it gets tricky when we are interpreting somebody else's intention, right? How can you

know somebody else's intention? I mean, I think that you can know this doesn't feel good for me. Whatever that person on stage is doing, it doesn't feel good for me. But, but how do I know I just think it's a slippery slope when we, when like starting to say this person is angry and this person isn't, and they're saying the same thing, you know, they're using the same words. It's like, I know what you're saying. Who are we to say, right? A lot of the times though, what ends up happening is this, a lot of times I've noticed a comedian who is trying to be edgy out of some kind of branding or something like that, but doesn't really give a shit about what they're talking about. They've just gone through Twitter or whatever and found, here are the words

that are upsetting people right now. Here, I've, by the way, I've tried this shit before. You get so lazy with your writing that you just go for the most obvious, you know, thing because you want to seem like I'm like, Carl and man, or I'm like, right, I'm on the cutting edge. Right. And, but it's lazy because you are not the edge. You're at someone else's edge. That's not your fucking edge. Your edge is probably telling a story about some crazy thing that happened to you that you're afraid anyone could ever know. Right. That's edgy. Got it. You know, so, so, and usually you can identify that and the way you can identify it is people aren't laughing. It's not that funny. If just people just generally feel like, Oh boy, there we go again. Because, you know, the audience

just wants to laugh. And then, and then sometimes you'll see comedians say the most, this is how you really know that you're bombing your ass off. And I'm proud to say I've bombed a billion times, but this, I've never said this, which is, listen, I know you're trying not to laugh right now. It's like, no, no one in a comedy club is trying not to laugh. No one. No one's or they'll be like, you're looking around like, can I laugh at this? No, they're not. They're not looking around. They're looking at you and you're bombing. Your joke didn't work. You know what I mean? That's, that's the reality. And, and, you know, the thing is, like, I just think comedians need to be allowed to some degree to throw those shit Molotov cocktails into the

audience so they can fully grok why it doesn't work. Right. And if, and sometimes it's dismaying when you hear a comedian confusing their lack of skillful writing with some kind of, some kind of judgment from the PC crowd, which by the way, the PC crowd exists and it's, it's, it's really destructive, I think that's like, but as a comedian, I just, and the way I've been taught is always blame yourself. If you're bombing, blame yourself. It's almost always your fault. 90% of the time, 95% of the time you weren't able to ride that wave. And that's your fault. And that may or may not be true, but it certainly isn't powering. It's not going to, you might feel worse driving home. Anyway, I did not want to talk about comedy here. I'm just very, I'm very curious. I mean,

I'm asking you about it. Thank you for asking. And I appreciate you interviewing me. Listen, and I would love to talk about myself, but I do want to get back into the, and I understand why we took a natural jump into that, because we're talking about self censoring. We're talking about the, the authenticity. We're talking about the shadow and that completely meets where like comedy is right now, how to express the shadow, authentically. And, but, and I get, is that Tantra? Does Tantra have something to do with that? That's like an aspect of Tantra, because we didn't quite get to how you ended up in a Tantra community. We got to you crying in flowers on the bus. And that's where we diverted a little bit,

but I want to get into the, this community that you got into and how that happened. Okay, so after about a year of this time in Spain, I felt like I was still married, by the way, and we were trying to make it work. Just a big question mark. Can we do this? And my ex-husband actually was like, you should go get a teacher training certificate, like do a teacher training program. And so I started researching schools online. And I just found this school online. I was like, that's the one. I just felt it. I'm like this. It's like very gut stuff for me. So I went, and I had never, I didn't know anybody who had ever done a class at this school. I had, I just felt it. And I went and I just did a 500 hour teacher training program, which was three

months, a little over three months. And it was total immersion. I didn't know actually that it was, or if I had read it was Tantric, I don't even know that I knew what the fuck that meant. Right. You know, I was just like, whatever. I, the reason I went was because I knew they were studying a text that I wanted to study, which was the Bhagavad Gita. And I was like, this is the one I want to go to. So I went and I immersed myself. Now, I slowly started to realize things were going down at that school. And like what? Like the founder, Swami, was sleeping with women in my teacher training program. And what was your first hint that was happening? One of the girls in my teacher training program told me I'm sleeping

Okay. And did she say that in a like, in a sense of like, no big deal. I like it. Or did she, was she like complaining? I'm going to just, sorry, we're going to cut to a quick commercial. Now this, so where were you when she confided in you? Or was it a confidence at all? Well, at first it was, yeah, it wasn't confidence at first. She wouldn't say who her lover was, but she was like, Oh, I'm having problems with my lover and bubble. And eventually she just told me it's Swami. And I'm like, Oh, what's happening here? And then I started looking around. And I was like, eyes open to holy shit. Okay, I see, I see what's happening now. So yeah, he would have sex with a lot of the women. Did they all think of themselves as his girlfriend?

This one in particular that was in my training was telling him he needed to choose her and that she wanted to be the girlfriend. And yeah, there was a lot of drama. This is crazy to be thinking about this stuff right now. Is this place considered a cult? I mean, it depends on who you ask. I think it could have been taken on for sure. I mean, for sure, some people call it a cult. For me, I always felt like I was a little bit on the periphery. I knew enough. Listen, I'm not going to lie. This was like right up my alley. This is what I went to do. Okay. And right up your alley in the sense that it was so hardcore, you're like, Oh, shit, this is like jumping into another place. Like this isn't just some basic,

simple equinox yoga class. This this is like real like this is heavy duty, real crazy shit. This guru guy is having sex. And were other people having sex with each other? Was that a yeah, but that for me came later, like not even not just the sex. So the yoga was also wild for me. It was very esoteric. I mean, okay, it was like, Oh my God, this, this is what I was thirsty for. And these are my people like all of these, it was all it was. Do you mean like that? Like just help me understand. Because my my experience with yoga has been as basic as you can get. I go from time to time when my karma is good enough that I somehow get the ambition up to go and do basic yoga. I'll just do sun salutations, you know, downward dog, warrior's

pose, bricks all over. I'll have to use like all kinds of bricks and hate it because the teachers are always coming up to me and like, Listen, you're not bending, right? It's like, no, shit. I'm a fucking ball. I'm fucking straight. Don't you say my muscles have been tight for seven years? So this is my experience with yoga. So when you say esoteric yoga, what does that even look like? Well, it means that it wasn't this mainstream stuff that was based in philosophy. So what it looked like practically in the concrete world is like we were really working with energy. It wasn't so much about the physical body. It was a lot of mind stuff. We're moving energy with our minds. Okay. And we're working with chakras. Okay. And we're working with the etheric or energy body.

Gotcha. And so you put your body in a specific posture or shape. And then that particular posture resonates with a specific universal energy. And so you're focusing on the corresponding energy at the level of the microcosm, meaning the level of the physical body. So is this like the utterance of the specific mantras that go with the chakras and the visualization of the Sanskrit, the Sanskrit, um, you know, the, the bija mantras. Yes. Yeah. Is that what that? Is that how you do the resonance or whatever? How do you do that? You can. That's one way. There's so many different techniques. There's so much stuff out there, Duncan. It's like, what happens when you do it? Like let's take the heart chakra. How do you know that you

have tuned into that energy? You, you tune in and you do that, you tune in. So like, for example, there's a specific, we'll, we'll just take it, we'll take a concrete example of a posture, which is Bujangasana. We'll call it, um, cobra where you're laying on the, on the ground on your belly at first. And then you put your hands underneath your shoulders and you just lift the chest up like this. So this is a chest opener. You hear a lot of people in LA and these yoga classes talk about backbends and chest openers, right? Okay. So this kind of yoga isn't so concerned with like the physical posture and getting this crazy like whacked out thing going on physical level. It's just more about closing the eyes, focusing your attention

at the level of the heart and tuning in there. This is it. Concentrating, focusing the mind here. Eventually, the longer you can stay, you might, I don't want to project an experience onto anybody, right? But the idea is that you start to tune into the universal feeling of unconditional love. Like that's what you're doing. You're trying to get into resonance with by the law of correspondence. Yes. So by, so like you are the microcosm of the macrocosm, right? Yeah. The universe is here as within is without. Okay. So all of the universe is here. So in this particular practice, we're focusing on how to consciously work with the universe at this level of the microcosm to, to, um, call in any kind of universal energy we

want to experience. So, uh, you know, like dynamism, charisma, confidence, willpower, all that would be at the level of money Buddha chakra. And so if I put myself in specific postures that are resonating here and I'm focusing here, the naval center, this is like long enough. I mean, the idea there is that we hold postures for a long time. Like how long? Well, in the beginning, you start at like three minutes by the end of my training, 10 minutes, like in the, in my certification, we had to hold headstand for 10 minutes. You know, headstand is the crown Sahajwara chakra. So that's all about sublimation of energy, moving, moving energy from the lower chakras up to experience different levels of consciousness, to experience what it feels like

the qualities at the level of Anahata chakra. Like what does that, what does that feel like to, to be in that space, to be in that reality? What does it feel like at the level of money Buddha chakra, like inhabiting this like dynamism, charismatic kind of quality of energy? What does it feel like to put all of my energy here? And so the physical practice was one of the ways that we did that. But we also did it through love making, through practicing moving energy up, like the grosser, heavier energies at the level of that's called love making in this. Well, sex. Oh, you went sex. Yeah. Gotcha. I wasn't sure if you were doing like we called it love making. Right. So wait, so, right. Okay. So as part of this training, at some point, they're like, and also we're all

going to have sex. That's gonna happen. Well, it's more like you nobody. Yeah. I mean, you could get approached by somebody who's like, Hey, do you want to practice this together? Okay, I see. The pickup was like, Hey, let's do an Anahata meditation together. And it's like, got it. Wow. Yeah, that's crazy. That's wild. Yeah. But but in Tantra, I mean, this is the thing like, you always hear when people are talking about Tantra, they'll teachers will be like, it's not just about sex. But and it's always frustrating, because the teacher has to deal with like Western idiots, like, you guys were fucking and it's like, you see you have because in the West, we're all freaked out. And you have to like, yes, we are also tuning in with the universal vibration of compassion.

But okay, if you want to talk about that. But understandably so, because that's what like a lot of teachers now they sell their workshops with this word Tantra, right? Because yeah, people because they're going along with this idea, they're riding that wave. Yeah, of Tantra equals sexuality and it sells because sex sells. Yeah. So by saying Tantra, it's like saying, yeah, I mean, a lot of people in the West do think they equate Tantra with sexuality. I don't even use the word Tantra anymore. I don't say Tantra. I'm not. I just and also because I don't know what the fuck Tantra is, but it is on the website. It is in your bio. Yeah, Tantra. Yeah. Yeah. It's out there. I mean, I know what you're saying.

I get it. I think it's a very confusing word. And anytime any teacher I've listened to has gotten into it, there's a huge disclaimer attached to it, which is like that's just one little it's to me, isn't it more along the lines of like, it's everything, we're going to take the scope of it all being a human the whole circuit board or the whole control panel of identity, the entire thing can be utilized as a teaching, right? That's the idea. Yes. All of it. And so just meaning like, yeah, sex, but also eating, but also shitting, but also pissing, also running, also everything. It's all in there. Nothing is left out. It's totally inclusive. And it's shocking for people in the West because

the entire country was founded on principles that were related to the body being abhorrent and the world itself being kind of a mistake, not a mistake, but like this world is not much compared to heaven. Yes. It's an obstacle on the spiritual path, you know, like this world, this material world is an obstacle to reach God or to know God. It's like something that will tempt you, you know, and I've still got that in me. Yeah. I mean, I get it. I totally get it. You didn't have that in you when you realized that was going to be the scope of your study was going to include things that in the West, in Western culture, or sometimes considered blasphemous, especially when done under the auspices of some kind of religious training or some kind of like

spiritual training. I think it takes an extreme amount of discernment to go to a community like that and not get lost. I think discernment is the key. And I feel like I, by the grace of God, I feel like some discernment was there for me. And I knew I was there to practice confronting all of these ideas and beliefs about the world and about the things that should be denied and repressed. And at the same time, wanting to explore and go into all of it. And just to see how that felt for myself, just to experiment. So I went there to experiment, experiment, but I want to go back and say, I feel like the reason that I have a, I, it's not totally healed yet, this wound around Tantra, because when I got there to that school, there was a lot of classical Tantra that

we were learning. Like classical Tantra doesn't mention a lot about sex and sexuality in the, in the scriptures. It's just not there. And so it was, we were doing, we were studying classical Tantra, but also all this sexual stuff, which is called Neo Tantra, Neo Tantra. But we weren't really told that nobody was saying, this is Neo Tantra. And this is classical Tantra. It all just got lumped in together as like Tantra. So I thought all of it was just Tantra. And then I learned later, like, Oh, well, hold the fuck up. This actually isn't in the scriptures. It's not in the traditional texts. And here I was, and here I've been teaching this. And I feel hoodwinked a little bit, like a little manipulated. Yeah, I mean, I just felt like I want to know what I'm,

as best I can, what I'm trying, I'm transmitting to other people. And I felt like, God, I've been like saying something, I didn't know it was true. And yeah, hoodwinked is a good, it's a good word. Hoodwink, hoodwink, just this, you know, charismatic, manipulative teacher was trying to produce a, like, rationalization for what maybe was just like sex addiction or something. You see, I saw it. I mean, I looked around and was like, Okay, these people just want to call this spirituality. Everybody just wants to get fucked and be, you know, like, to fuck around and have sex. It's like, just call it what it is. Just let's, let's just say that we want to have sex and explore. And why do we need to make it about like some hide behind the spiritual front, a spiritual

mask, it didn't. Can I answer that? Yes. Why? Because it's fucking cool. It's like, you know, like, it makes me think of people who go looking for Sasquatch. They can't just go hiking. You know what I mean? Like, they've got to like, there has to be a medical agreement. Yeah. Yeah. It's not, it's some big deal. It's good. Makes, and I've gone squatching. And it is cool. Right. When you go and you think, Oh my God, there could be a big foot. And then they'll be like, look, a branch on the path. He left it for us. You're like, Holy shit, this is amazing. It's amazing. So I do get it. I do understand why, like, you know, adding some mystical quality to it. Yes, seductive. It's fun.

And there's healing in it. You know, Neotantra, all the things that I did, I explored a lot sexually. And there was a lot of healing in it for me. So I'm all for it. Did you tell your husband this was happening? Okay. So when I was still with him, I was not sexually exploring with other people because we were monogamous. And at this time, and it was like, not a, not a thing for me. I was like, pretty much closed down to any of that. And then we got, then we separated. And then it was like, okay, well, now it's time. Right. It's on. Right. And, and after that, I really started to experiment with different ways of relating. Sure. That we're very healing and that I'm all

for it. Like if it, if it feels good and it's working for you, do it. Yeah. Let's just call it Neotantra. Like just call it, call it that, you know, and it just feels more accurate. Right. That's all. So you're saying make a distinction between classical Tantra and this, this other version of it. And then it's fine. Just don't say it's the same thing. Yeah. And other, yeah, it's like, which it seems to be one of, um, you know, I'm listening to, like I mentioned earlier, this Ajahn Chah audio book and it's Theravadan Buddhism. It's very, I don't know if you'd call it conservative, but it's a very like, this is how it, the Buddha said to do it in these scriptures. This is how we do it. Don't add anything to it. Don't add a fucking thing. Stop. Before you even

get close to adding anything. Stop. You're not going to add anything to it, which I find that to be really frustrating because it's like, no, humans are creative. We get to evolve stuff. Right. But also I see how pragmatic that is. And it's an understanding of a form that emerges of the charismatic person who wants to add their font or whatever to the Dharma. And it's shit gets really wobbly. If that, you better really know this is what it is. Yes. And, or otherwise you can it's bad karma. Yes. Well, to me, that's very tantric because you better really know before you start playing in all of this fun stuff because that's why they call it like riding the tiger, because it's so easy to get lost. It's like the razor's edge. And I feel from my own personal

experience, there's a certain place to get to first if we're talking about like if we're speaking in these terms, like there's a certain place to get to first before you start practicing these things so that you can anchor in some experience of oneness or of truth, reality, capital R. And this Nick turn will say things like, you know, it's like, learn the scales, then do jazz, but don't just go, don't call like your lack of, he doesn't say this, I'm adding to it, but don't call your lack of musical understanding jazz. It's like the great jazz musicians, they were so familiar with the basics and respected the basics like deeply respected and studied them for a long time. And then their improvisations were commentary on the basics is

beautiful. But yeah, nobody wants to do that because it's like, fuck, your hands hurt, it's seemingly boring, even though it's not. And it takes a long time. You don't just get, there's a wonderful path, but it is a long path to get to that point, I would imagine. I mean, certainly it's that way. When I, when I first started stand up, I was trying to be some kind of, so embarrassing, like I was pretending to be some kind of outsider, a tour, some sort of like thing. And I remember getting off stage at the comedy store, and Eleanor is a comedian there, but at the time it was a waitress, I don't sure she'd started stand up then, but she'd been at the store for long enough to have seen the best, greatest comedians. And I get off stage,

and she looks at me and she goes, I don't know if that was, but it wasn't comedy. Eleanor, that's it. Now that's a true teacher, by the way, just just to put the sword in the thing. Yes, no big deal. I'm just going to tell you, I don't know what that was, but it wasn't comedy, and I'm going to walk away. I'm going to save you a couple of years here, maybe a couple of years of flailing by getting right to the point. And to me, it's like that, what we're talking about here, it reminds me of that, which is like, okay, neo-tantra, or is it even that? Or are you just, or is some of it it and some of it not, which is usually the case, right? Usually it's like, there are aspects of some real thing mixed in with the charismatic

teacher's confusion and attachment, and that's where everybody gets all messed up. I think the point is to ask the question of yourself, and be as honest as you can. What am I doing here? And what is this about? And what is this? Is it tantra? Is it neo-tantra? Why do I care? And I think tantra, as you were talking, it's like, what comes to me is the ripening. It's a natural path. It's the path of naturalness. There's a ripening that happens that can't be forced. It can't be ambitioned your way through, or you can't pretend your way through it. It's the natural unfolding. It's the ripening. That's what I feel like, like tantra is. How frustrating that is for people. For me. Right. I mean, I was just telling you.

It's so frustrating. We think like, okay, I want this thing. So what I'm going to do to get it is work double hard. And I'm going to run faster. I'm going to wake up earlier. I'm going to fucking, I'm just going to like, just think of all the words used to describe it. The grind. What do they say? Put your nose to the grindstone? Nose to the grindstone. Is that what they say? The grindstone. How awful would that be? Like, but you'd shred your nose. Or they say, what are all the words? All the words are like, in comedy, it's like, hit the bricks. But all the words involve violence, self-aggression. It's really, I think it definitely frustrates the identity to get to a thing where it's like, no,

it really doesn't matter. You're, whatever the thing, it's not about the way you think shit gets done. So how do you do it then? If it's the ripening, how do you facilitate that? If it isn't all this stuff we've been taught, if it isn't sweating bullets and like really going for it and eye the tiger in your way, running the stairs, doing the thing, what is it? I mean, it's a good question. I've been, I've been asking you the past two weeks, like how do you handle this? And I mean, I know, like I've experienced it in my own life, and I have theories and concepts that are not only mental, that have been integrated and embodied, but it's not, it hasn't stabilized to where it's just always like that. You know, like,

for me, I see it as there takes a certain amount of personal will to show up. Okay, sure. Show up. Yeah. And then let it go. And then let it go. So it's like using personal will for the benefit of all beings. Like you got to show up so that the universal will can move through and I will be done. Right. You know, so I feel like there's, there's like, I used to teach at this place called Kripalu on the east coast and they have this methodology that's like three steps of yoga. Step one is you do yoga. Like you, it's a willful thing.

Right. Stage two or step two is you do yoga and yoga does you. So it's the meeting of the two. You use personal will, but also there's the surrender, the like opening up, but you got to show up. Right. You got to get yourself there. You got to take yourself to the legend jump. Right. And that takes a fucking lot of will. Yes. And then you jump. Yeah.

And that's stage three, which is the free fall yoga does you. You're just being done. Wow. And I think that done by what? Done by what do you want to call it? I mean, I call it, I call it God. I, I've made peace with that word. It took me a while, but I've made peace with that word. And I feel like God is moving through this body and yeah, nothing there. Just that you're just some sort of mechanism, some sort of like aspect of a thing. You don't, there isn't much there. I've heard, you know, descriptions of like neem curly baba and people like that.

It's like, yeah, there's just nobody's there. Right. What's the, I can't remember his name, very famous saint. The description was he was a corpse that the universe spoke through. You get around it and it's off putting. Certainly it must be off putting to have that start happening. And, and, and I get the jump part because you, you would have to just at some point give up whatever the game was you were so engaged in, but isn't that just another game? Now I'm a mouthpiece for the universe. Like, isn't it, isn't that just also,

isn't it possible to get tricked into thinking that you're that when you're just not that either? Yeah. How do you know the difference? I mean, I don't know that you, I don't know about that, but I know that for me, the whole thing is just about asking the question. All right. That's the whole thing. And it's, it's actually a path of yoga called self inquiry or dhyana yoga, J N A N A.

And it's, it's just about asking, resting in the question. Don't know mind. Tripped out. It trips me out when I start, when I like really get into this whole vibe of like self inquiry, because it's really opening to the possibility. It's just questioning everything you think that nothing that you think is true. Yeah, that's pretty crazy. Isn't it? But yeah, right? Yes, I do.

Yes. But not, but not like just hearing my words and, and having somebody be like, Oh yeah, she's telling me nothing I think is true. And so I'm just not going to believe any of my thoughts. Like that's a mental, that's a very mental process. I'm talking about self inquiry, which is you got to go in and have that direct experience yourself. That's the realization. That's self realization. You sit in the question. Nobody can tell you anything if you try to get it from somebody else.

It's not the thing like you were saying. It's not an up here. It's an internal undoing of everything you've been taught, all these conditionings and concepts and everything you've been taught. So self inquiry is kind of like my where I rest now when, when teaching because it's like teaching. What does that even mean, right? But I, it's just about directing people back to the inside. It's not about giving them something more to like hold on to for their mind to salivate over and be like, Oh, another thing to put in my pocket and like, or beat myself up with. Yeah, I'm not doing right or whatever reinforce ego.

It's about just undoing undoing and going inside and sitting in the question and not get so into what is the answer. And I'm not saying it's an easy thing. Because I mean, I'm here in this real world situation trying to figure it out. I've heard Zen teachers talk about this as uncertainty that one of the, the human experience is uncertain. Just they can't be certain because of the nature of being in the bardo of becoming that we're in right now. How can anything be certain? There is no possibility of certainty. You just don't have that luxury and you trick yourself into thinking you do it. So is that, is that the question? Is that being in the question? Is that just allowing your death part? Yeah, that's the death part of there's nothing to hold on to

uncertainty. The groundless Tibetan Buddhism would call it the groundless. Like there's just nothing to fucking hold on to. And it feels like death because ego has nothing to hold. Yeah, except it's delusion. Except it's delusion. But then yeah, some I'm sorry to cut you off. Sometimes I think of it as you're falling out of an airplane. But then while you're falling out of an airplane, you're trying to have like a nice dinner with someone you have a table that's falling with you and plates and you're drinking wine. But you're trying to imagine that you're not plummeting through space into oblivion. So it's this very good. It's like the mind wants to imagine you're at a dinner party. The reality as well, you are at a dinner party, but the dinner dinner party

has got pushed out of a plane when you're born. And it's plummeting towards oblivion. So yes, this is a very uncertain, this is a very potentially terrifying situation if you really were to fully look at it as it is. Sorry. I would even have a different perspective on this. Should I go down this? Yes. Because you're sitting in a plane having dinner. And then the mind says, this plane is going down and I'm going to die and it's going to be awful and all that stuff. And I would say, is it true? How do you know? Because other than what you're thinking and believing, the reality is that you're sitting there having dinner.

Without the story of what's going to happen. Or this image of all this stuff that hasn't happened yet. Who knows? Who knows? Could be a simulator. I mean, exactly. Could be a dream. Exactly. Who knows? So I'm just asking the question. That's cool. Is it true? It's inquiry. I mean, and it just leaves you, it leaves you with nothing, but it leaves you. That's crazy. With nothing, but I guess reality. No story, no imagination. You're just there on the plane having dinner. Wow. Trip out. That is really intense. Yeah. Wow. Yeah. I love it. It brings you right back. And then, which is you're already here anyway, but it pulls you back in. That's cool. Yeah. See, because you're able to go there.

You felt that and you dropped into it. And that's not everyone can do that. I talk about this stuff to a lot of people on different groups and they come to workshops and I do the self-inquiry stuff. And it's very confronting for egos, you know? And I get it. I mean, I don't demonize ego. I'm all for it. And I'm like, yeah. Tontra, right? You can have an ego. It's just on play. I mean, ego is great if you're enjoying it. Yeah. Have fun. It's pleasurable. It's also pleasure. It's not this all bad. No. It's just like. Poor ego. All the things. Okay. Well, I don't know if I, we got off track a little bit. No, we got on track. I mean, there really isn't, this isn't, you know, no, we're completely on track because I think that we've hit this like beautiful place of

acknowledging the uncertainty. Is it uncertain? Question the uncertainty. And then somewhere in there, you start getting underneath all these layers of paint. And then somewhere in there, this, for me, it's always been like a new possibility emerges or a new renewal, a kind of, and this is why I do understand in Christianity what they call being born again, or that you must die to this world to come to know me, or all of those various ways and all the religions of saying, if you really want this, all you have to do is give up everything and you hear that no problem. Anytime I've heard that, I'm like, Oh, sure, I'll give up everything for realization. And then within moments, right? What the fuck am I talking about? Right? What am I going to give up

my, my, my car, my house, my job, my identity as a comic, my podcast, every, am I going to do that? Do I really want, no, you're not, of course not. Your beliefs, your beliefs, like your political beliefs, right? Like all the, even the spiritual beliefs. I mean, the whole game is you got to drop even the spiritual practice at some point, like a good teacher, a good practice means that at some point you won't need it anymore. That is, can you talk about that a little bit more? Because I don't think that gets said enough. And I'd love to hear your take on that. Yeah. I, because there's not a lot of money in that. Sorry. You know what I mean? Yeah, I know. You're like, what do you, what do you, you're running a yoga studio, you know, if the ideas you're going to

like get people where they're supposed to be in the like, okay, you're done. Right. Or even like me as a teacher before I opened a yoga center, it's like, my job isn't to be, I don't feel it doesn't feel authentic to me to be like, I know the way. And let me tell you the way, although that creeps in for sure. Sometimes I'm not going to lie. See, and I'm like, huh, that's there. But the idea is that I, it's like, you got to go inside. This isn't dependent upon me. I feel like a good teacher doesn't make a student using this language because it just feels easy. Um, like a student doesn't need me to give them an answer because I don't know. Like it's all about going inside and, and sitting in, in that sitting in the inquiry and sitting in

the realization place. Yeah. Well, most people do. I mean, it's uncomfortable. It is unbearable. I can't, my, my son is bringing me into that place all the time now. And it's a mother, not mother fuck to him, but like, I, I, I can't, you know, my wife, she's in her heart. I'm a mind person. I'm always up in my head. I've retreated into my head. I have a wonderful suite at the top of the skyscraper of meat. That is my identity. And it's a beautiful place. Lots of great books. Bhagavad Gita is there. All my favorite Ram Dass lectures are there. Plenty of graphs, maps, flow charts, lots of quantification mechanisms, but damned if there's a feeling that you get when you go down in your heart.

And Jesus God, that feeling is so beautiful and so powerful, but I don't like, what are you going to do? You're going to cry on the bus at flowers. You're going to like, you know, you can't, I don't want to. It's really terrifying to me to be there. And my child brings me there. I'm so grateful to even get a little taste of it, but I run, I run right back into my head up the three flights of stairs or how many flights of stairs are between my heart and my head. The elevator broke a few years ago. So at least we get in shape and we're running right over our heart. But the, the, the, you know what I mean? I, it's unbearable. So I get why people like, no, I don't think so, which I think would be another challenge is running a yoga studio is

if you want to give the real thing to people, the reaction they're going to have is, thank you. Goodbye. I'll see you. That's not a class for me. I don't want to feel my heart. So how do you do that? How do you deal with that? I feel like I have been in that practice of understanding. I feel like my guru. And I just mean the karma right now is about me learning how to do that. And because I got here to LA and just getting over myself, getting over my stories about what people can handle and can't handle and they're open or they're closed. I felt like everybody's closed here and these people don't know and I want to be, and really it's getting clean here and here. It's getting clear here and

here. Like who's being closed in the moment that I'm saying somebody else is being closed? Me. Oh shit. Right. It's just a projection of my mind. And, and when I sit and like do the work of inquiry, it's like, oh, I see it. I see it. And then I feel lighter and I feel clearer and I open up a little bit more. And there's nothing blocking me from that other person anymore. The story that was there isn't there anymore. But it's a constant thing for me. Like I do it and I feel clear and I feel open and there's nothing in between us. And like you were saying then the universe starts to meet because that's the yes. That's the yes. That's me making a decision to say yes is to do my work and get rid of these stories that are really blocking me from

clear seeing. Yeah. And then I, and then I can meet people really meet a person without my story about them. And then things start to expand. And then it contracts again. And then it's like rent. And then it's like you got to pay the, you know, pay the teachers and we got it with, and we're figure and it's like, what am I doing wrong? What am I doing wrong? That's the story in my mind that I work with. Like I'm doing something wrong as if I was responsible in the first place. Right. Come on. Yeah. But that's the, the, the stories of my ego. And so that's what I've been doing. That's my practice of just like, I'm questioning, I question, I do the work. I'm a Byron Katie. Have you heard of a woman named Byron Katie? Yeah. Okay. So she is a teacher

of mine. And I go to like, I, I, the work that she teaches, it's a system of self inquiry, and it has been so powerful for me. So when I say I'm doing the work of self inquiry these days, that's what it means. I'm doing Byron Katie, the work. My mom was in some, in something called Diamond Heart, which is a lot of self inquiry stuff and Diamond Heart, like from the Buddhist tradition. No, it's called, it was some kind of Sufi. I never, I, you know, when your mom's doing whatever they're doing right now. No. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like, I don't want to, I'm not gonna get it. Your mom could be hanging out with Jesus. Your mom could be hanging out with Vishnu. And you would be like, I don't think I'm gonna, I'm interested in that because you know,

you like it. So, but I do know that it was a system of, it reminds me, it actually reminds me of what you're talking about. It was a system of diving into the depth of your projection, conceptual framework and all that, and freeing yourself, liberating yourself to some degree from that weight of that project. Because it sucks. It sucks to be projected upon. Right. I know that. I know when I'm around someone and there's some expectation or they don't like you, or they're projecting on you a way you used to be. I mean, but even that, Duncan, it's like, how do you know? It's like, how do you know? I can feel it. Well, that's the mind. Oh, shit. Don't take that away from me. It's all I have left. I mean, it's just worth asking the

question because we think we know. And I mean, it's all about just being willing to, yoga for me is about detaching from your thoughts ultimately at the end of the day. It's like not attaching to what you're thinking and believing to experience what's underneath and all around. You know, earlier I said, were you in a cult? And then I, you know, but was that a cult? But then, and so what's funny about cult is they have this cult deprogramming thing where they come and get you, and then they deprogram you. They're like, no, the guy was not capable of turning into a rainbow. He was just drugging everybody and you were drugged for three months straight. Your parents aren't from the devil and they keep you until you finally snap back into the, you know,

reality tunnel of modern day life. But what's weird about certain cults is they're deprogramming you from the reality of modern day life, which is also a cult. And so, you know, so then you begin to realize like, oh, fuck, like what you're talking about is essentially blasphemy. You're talking about blaspheming main, what default reality in the sense of we're going to take everything you think about the way the world is and take it away from you. You don't get it anymore. Oh, okay. But then I would say what I, what I say is I'm not trying to take anything away from you. Like I'm not here to take your story away from you. I'm not. I'm not. Okay. Because that's yours to have. It's like for me, I had this ex boyfriend that was such a pain in the ass and I felt so

victimized by him and I was so hurt and wounded and it was very real for me. On some level, I knew this is a story I'm making up, right? But that wasn't what I was experiencing. It felt like I was a victim of this person. He is an asshole and I was a victim. And I felt it. So if somebody came along to me and was like, just drop that. And I had friends that were like, just drop it. And it felt so cruel because it's like, how about I drop you, motherfucker? Yeah, drop kick you. I mean, but it's like, if I could, I would. Right. If I could, I'm like, uh, so I'm, I'm aware that it's not a kind thing to just come in and tell someone, oh, just drop your story. Like I'm, I'm here to take your story away from you. I'm here to invite

an inquiry for you to undo the story from the inside out yourself. Like I, I don't feel like it's a kind thing to do to just be like, Hey, drop your story. Cause what's the reality of that? I mean, how many people, I mean, doesn't, at least for me, it didn't happen like that. Some stories I can work through quickly and some they just stay. So whatever. Well, I like what you're saying is, is exciting because I have started to become hyper aware of my, a few stories that I've got that in the past. I'm like, no, this is, this is it, man. You don't understand. One of them is alcoholic father with PTSD, all the addresses I've lived at. And like, I would tell people when I was really like wanting to make sure people understood how rough I'd,

I really like tell that story, like serious around the campfire, telling the ghost story that you're when you really want to freak people out. And I've been catching all of that, that react, the way I'm acting it out, the way I'm really like into it, the way it works as a great excuse for being a dick, the way it like all this, and it's fucking it up. So now I'm having more difficulty doing it or cancer survivors, another one, all of it, you know, all of it, you start realizing like, oh, I'm just so sick of it. It's like an old teddy bear or something. It's like an old stinky toy thing. I'm like, I'm, I don't want to do it anymore. I'm not saying it didn't happen to me. Right. It's just that extra, let me gather around and listen to my horror. I want to tell

you what I've seen. You know, I feel emotional like right now when you're talking, I'm just feeling, I'm getting emotional because I, I, I feel like also there's a kindness and a compassion to that it happened, that stuff, your story in like having some kindness and some compassion for yourself in, in needing that story. Oh yeah. You know, and like, because it's not done until it's done, not to pretend. And like, I think you're, you have good awareness that you see, you see that you're using the story and that you, you know, there's like a, like a sucking on the story a little bit and like, and, and like a big hug around that, you know, because it's very human. It's so human. Yeah. Yeah. I'm, yeah, I know. I mean, you know, I don't, I know it may seem

like I'm being self-effaced. I'm saying the story is heavy. Yeah. It's, it's like a bit, it's like a, it's like carrying around a backpack full of like Shreemukh Band of Atoms or something. I don't want anymore. I don't want to, it's like, oh, it's a heavy thing to carry. And it's like, at some point, if you really look deep, yeah, this is in the Bhagavad Gita. This is one of the verses that I like is it's talking about the soul. It cannot be cut, cannot be withered by the wind. It was never born. It will never die. All of that, you know, I love that. It can't really be touched in the way, you know, the soul is not traumatized. That is a, might be an offensive statement to some people. The soul sits beneath the trauma and it, and this is like really, really crazily edgy.

That's what the Bhagavad Gita is putting out there. It's like, well, this thing that you are truly, it's not really going to be touched by this world. And that's very frustrating. It's so radical, right? Like to say that is so radical and especially I feel like right now in these times. And so I, I feel like it was a gift that I had that last relationship where I felt so wounded and victimized because it's made me aware. I think if I didn't have it, I'd be like bypassing like a motherfucker. You know what I mean? Like with all the soul can't be touched. I'm not traumatized. Like you're not your trauma, you know, all of that, which happens. But it has helped me remember that as far as it feels real to me, the trauma, it's real. I mean, and so like,

I do want to put that bypassing thing, I want to say it because it's important to, to talk about it and not just say, I hope nobody hears that the soul rests underneath and it can't be touched and trauma just isn't a thing that exists at the soul level. And think that like, I'm sitting here saying, dismissing someone's years of being brutalized. Totally. It to me that yeah, I know it's not to negate you would be negating that thing, which is resting in the soul. And to be doing that is or is ridiculous and it's a delusion really. It's just you need like you need a mama to hold the baby. You know, the baby deserves to be held. This is a baby. The baby deserves to be loved. The baby deserves when

it's crying for someone to come and hold the baby and kiss the baby and love the baby. But it's like, if we become all baby and no soul, then we become motherless children. And this is a very, very difficult situation to be in. Who says that? Sometimes I feel like a motherless child. I can't remember some poet, I think, but like that's, that it, you know, that is real. That's the, when I'm all in that shit, I'm a motherless child. I have no one to help me. No one is there. Even people in my life, you can't, you don't know what this is. You couldn't help. And they couldn't help. They could try. Right. But wow, when you find that mother or whatever you want to call it, the soul, and you realize you are being held, you're being held

forever. Now you can fall asleep. I'm just crying. You know, you have such a good way. I got to tell you, can I just say this? I'm just going to say it. I didn't know. So I had been living in Asia for a really long time. Yeah. I was so out of like pop culture. I didn't know what the fuck's going on with entertainment industry really. And, and I came and we opened up this place and David came on board and it was amazing. And he's like, we got to get Duncan Tressel on in here. That's cool. And I was like, okay, I don't know. I don't know because I had been living under a rock, obviously. And I was like, I don't know. Like in Asia, you're not familiar with obscure

podcasters. The obscure podcaster mailing didn't make it out there. I mean, it's funny because people were like, you don't know Duncan Tressel. I'm like, I don't know anybody. I have not been living here. So anyway, so and, and then I was asking David, tell me about him. He's like, well, he's a comedian. He's, and I just thought, I don't, how does, if you put yourself in my place, I'm living in India, Asia, I'm living this whole other existence. I get to LA and I'm thinking, here it comes, the LA stuff of like, I'm going to have to sell out and not do all the things. And, and I was resistant. I was thinking, well, this isn't showbiz. Like this is mindfulness meditation. And David was like, just give it a, give it a chance. And I mean, I've told you this, but the

more and also I'm paying attention. I'm paying attention who crosses my path. And I'm also very curious. And so the more I got to know you, it's like, I, I was like, what the first time that you started talking with David about Buddhism and the path I was blown away, because the way that you speak about these things is like you have integrated these teachings. Like it's not like you're speaking from just a headspace. It's like you've lived it and you're embodying them. The, the way that you speak about it to somebody else is the measure of how much you've internalized it yourself. And you can, you can communicate it so well. And I thought, whoa, and deep things. I've seen some very, very miraculous parrots. You know, you're like, holy fuck it. Shit, that

parrot's a genius. Wow, that parrot, that parrot, that parrot is amazing. And I do, and again, this sounds self-effacing and I appreciate what you're saying. But I'm in the only reason I say it is because I have, I'm, I'm one of my, I have, I've been having this wonderful teacher on named Mitch Horowitz and he teaches Western esotericism. He's awesome. But he calls himself a seeker on the path. This is what I am for sure. Yeah. And, and, and, and meaning, in the other thing that popped into my head when you were saying that is, Oh boy, I'm glad you're friends with Aaron, because you just, just talked to her about how well I've integrated any of this shit. Because it's like, but I can talk about it. And I do, and part of me is aware of it and, and, and,

and I do live in it. But boy, I am so wobbly and so like up and down with it in the most extreme way that like, and when I hang out with someone who has a practice, it comes out more. When I'm around comedians, I'm funnier. Right. You know what I mean? So you pull something out, which is wonderful. And I like it where I'm like, wow, a motherless child. That's the soul is the mother. Hold it. Well, that's cool. Who the fuck said that? I'll have to remember that. Have you written any books? I want to read one. But you know what I mean? That that I find that to be more of a relate. That's why it's good to hang out with people like you and to have a community of spiritual seekers and why this in all the religions, this gets recommended over like, you know,

fall into good company. And that's all you need. And then something else comes into the room where you get to enjoy it. And you also don't get to own it. And that's, you know, well, that's it. You know, but that's what I mean about you. It's like, I don't feel like you're up here trying to say, I have the answer. You're a genuine seeker. And that is the place that you speak from. And that's what resonates with every, because I am too. I don't know who anybody that says they actually really know what the fuck is going on. That's a red flag. Watch out. They're going to try to have sex with you. Guaranteed. They are a matter of time. Not the meditation. There should be like a new tender for that. A tantric tender and not the meditation. I think it existed at

a gamma. I think we had something like that. I can't remember. What was it called? It was an actual look. Yeah, I mean, I don't want to say it out. Is a gamma still in existence? Oh my God, it was so controversial. And actually, I went, I went through this whole thing of like, Oh, I don't want to say a gamma. I don't want anyone to know I came from that school. It was a huge deal. It was a huge deal. They're still operating, but I don't think it's going to go. I mean, people are like writing rape culture, spray painting, somebody tried to burn down one of the halls. I mean, it's just like, wow. So it was it was bad, bad, bad, bad, like deep. It was a cult. It was a sex cult, classic Thailand sex cult, just a basic classic sex cult. And the problem with cults,

I think, and where it's really sad. And this is why I think the if you want to get some really fucked up karma, be a goddamn charlatan and start revising scripture that has been evolving for thousands of years to fit your selfish desires. And then and then because then what ends up happening is the reason your cult worked is because there was something real there. There was realness to it. There was I meet people all the time, raising a fundamentalist Christian family, brutalized by a fundamentalist Christianity, shamed by Jesus. Their version of Jesus was a shaming, monstrous entity that hated everything they wanted to do as a kid. And it's so sad because then they lose Jesus. They lose the possibility of the Christ consciousness,

the compassion. And it's so sad because they're so angry at the bullshit version of Jesus that got rammed in down their throat that they just they can't even and I get it. They can't look at a Bible without having an anxiety attack. Yeah, I get it. But it's sad because you lose the thing and all cults, Jim Jones, you name any fucking cult, no matter how fucked up it was, guaranteed if it was like powerful, there's a thread in there. There's something in there that's real that got distorted by the the whoever the cult leader was. And that's a that to me that is a sin. If there ever was a sin, it's doing that to be virtual crimes. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, but you said it yourself. This whole thing is a cult. I mean, are are the way that we live? I mean, the collective society,

the mind group, the mind think it's it's a cult. It's a cult. So to me, this word cult, when people say cult, I'm like, yeah, but culture, culture. I mean, our culture, I mean, yeah, we're told all these stories. We're just so immersed in it. It guides our lives. We don't stop to question. We all have buy in. And if we don't buy in like this, then what's wrong with you and you're fucked up? I mean, it's it's all, it's all to me, varying degrees of the same thing, which is just the buy in, you're just buying into it. So I don't yeah, I don't have such a thing. Like, yeah, it was a cult. It was just we chose to go there to transgress some things. And then in the this era, looking back now, like the after me to and man, that activated some wounds on personal trans personal level.

But looking back at these things now, it's like, how did that any of that fly? But at the time, it was a different story. At the time, it was like, let me get in here. I want to like push my boundaries. I want to, I want to explore. I want to transgress and close systems. All you need is a close system. Like, yeah, you know, the comedy store goes through phases. And there was a sadistic phase at the comedy store at one point where comedians were like doing the most horrific things to each other, like really bad. Really? Oh my god. Like what? Just psychological abuse, like really like dark shit, you know, pranks, but deep, deep, deep, hardcore pranks. And it was in a weird way. We did all understand that through this way that we are all fucking with

each other at that time, we were learning a lot about ourselves. Right. And but we're also going too far. And you were just seeing like just this, you know, it was it was crazy was the end of it was like the end of the era of Mitzi Shore and just anytime a kingdom is, you know, any, you know, when the, what is it? What's the Arthurian saying? It's like something like the land is the king, the land is the when the queen is sick, the land is sick. So it's like, but anyway, comedies are certainly a cult, by the way. But when you have closed systems, um, yeah, within these strange cultures appear, because there isn't the outside world to get in and be like, what the fuck are you doing? Right? So shit can go haywire fast. Okay, that's a closed

system. Yeah, closed system. When you're insulated from the, you know, when you're a bubble in a bubble, that yeah, that's why we look at these things. We like, how did it get to look at this, the prison experiment, you know, look at what happened there when people were given these different roles, how very quickly shit just went crazy or the, you know, just give, put 20 people in a room for six years and see what happens if they don't have any access to the outside world. No one to talk to, no one to tell them this is right or wrong. Just food that comes in through a door and then see at the end of the 20 years, they will have developed their own religion, probably their own spirituality. They'll be of some deaths. He'll be some weird leader. Maybe

they'll be communists. Who knows. But you know what I'm saying? Could be Lord of the Flies, could be, you know, paradise. But when you get that close off the Petrie dish, yeah. I mean, but that is, there's something about that that I'm very drawn to. Yeah. Right. Are you, I mean, I, I feel like most of society would be like, that's dangerous and it's a cult and stay away and it's not healthy, but there is, and I get it. I can get there. And also I'm going to be honest about, there's something so fascinating to me about that, right? Sure. That you can just close it up, close the circuit up. Yeah. Outside world's not getting involved. That's right. Let's fucking do this. Like let's go in and see what happens when we're disoriented. It's like getting

disoriented. That's right. And the assumption people have that this fucking world that they're in right now isn't tiny. You know what I mean? It's like, when you really look at your life, it's like, how, how far do you really travel outside your normal path? Are you sure there's a world out there? Are you positive you're not in a like small area, small radius? And that's the other thing I love is these things you're talking about. It's like, they're all these trapdoors in the reality tunnel of consensus reality, as it's called. And the trapdoors lead to these, I don't know, vacuums, the monasteries, the mystery schools. Who knows what the fuck? I know they're out there for sure. I know that as above so below. I know because I just know it.

I know that thing that you were in was a tiny, tiny, tiny, probably a fragment off of one of them. But like, there's big, big ones, big ones, and you don't get in. You just don't get in unless they want you in. And they won't let you go in because I imagine because they don't want to hurt you. You're not ready. You need to just, this is like the, you know, the thing you put the egg in to hatch it. What's that called? This is the, this is where eggs are hatched. There's other rooms of the, there's other parts of the hive. We just don't get to go into them. And the ones, like the one you're talking about when it, when the main hive hears about them like, what the fuck? Burn the chamber! That's not supposed to happen! Not understanding, oh no, these are everywhere, these chambers, and

they must exist. They must, this is why all these teachers, they vanish for years and years. Where do they go? Where did Jesus go? Where did the boy, they say the Buddha went into the forest. What happened really? All this, the, the Crowley talks about this, all the stories, what do they have in common? Someone vanishes. They go away. Where did they go? Where did they go? So then should they, would you say that they shouldn't, is it, does it take us back to the question of they should not be existing these things, these communities, right? I mean, try to stop them. It's such a tricky thing to talk about right now. I mean, when I think, because clearly this man was accused of rape, like,

oh yeah, you know, horrible, horrible, seemingly, probably, but I mean, but by, by this, what you're saying, it's like, this was meant to be, right? This, this is part of the, this is part of the lila. This is part of the play. Like this is a thing that's happening. And, and yeah, I know what you're saying. It's there until we got to come in and, and until just the natural unfolding says you can't be there anymore. I look at these, you know, I love these, sometimes a fish video will pop up. The fish are just swimming along and this thing jumps out of the sand. I don't know what they are. They're weird sand fish, horrible looking things. And they just eat the fish. The fish was just going, it was just, it was just swimming. And then suddenly it was like under

the sand getting eaten. Trapped or spiders, they exist too. Now for a trapped or spider, that awful fish, it's like, well, that's just what it is. But I mean, what I'm saying is they're traps. That sounds like a trap and it sucked. And I, you know, I, we have to figure out a way in the world to deal with evil, right? Like, how do we deal with evil in the world? And one trick that people use as well, it was part of my path. It taught me a lot. And that's great, as long as you're the one saying it. Right. And that's what you were telling me too. Right. If you're the one saying it's great, right, it was part of your path. Right. But sometimes like I've heard teachers, right, you're not one of them, but I have heard teachers do

this thing about like, we just have to accept that when you see a child, right, he's going through the most horrific thing a child could go through, right, some astral lobby, they signed up for make me not have skin for the only three months of my life. I fucking hate that. Yeah. Because I think it's, I just don't believe it works like that. And I think it's okay to be like, no, I like what you're saying. Don't know seems fucked up. I'm going to say fucked up. I'm going to say if someone's burning down halls of a Thai community center for yoga and spring rape culture on the wall, where there's that's bad. It was a bad place. I'm just going to say it. Fuck it. You're allowed to just fuck that place. Didn't do anybody any good. Just made bad reputation for

people who are in the other rabbit holes, maybe, or the other places that are actually trying to like utilize tantric teachings in a society where that shit is blasphemous to wake people up and they're doing it with an authentic heart. I don't know if they're out there. I'm assuming they are. And I would understand why they have to work in secrecy because they can't not be secret, because if they are not secret, then people who don't need to be there get in there. And then those people go crazy. And then they have to deal with it. I get the idea of like, oh, we stay in the background. That's not our jam to be out there. So I understand. I'm just assuming. I'm rambling on and on about something that maybe doesn't exist. I have no fucking clue. I'm pretty

sure it does. But when you hear about those little parts that fail, it's like, yeah, it was like somebody got to someone fucked up, man. But also, I know, as having been victimized in the past, it's easier for me to like try to repaint the story in a way that it wasn't quite as bad. Or it was like, you know what I mean, with parents, we do that, right? To think, yeah, maybe one of your parents was a fucking narcissist, right? You know what I mean? Maybe you were actually completely brutalized for your childhood by someone who couldn't get out of their head. You know, it's okay to, but that's the shit. I don't want to write my journal. We are, by the way, I'm going on and on. I feel like we got to this beautiful point that you made about 15 minutes ago. And then I

rambled. I'm sorry. I'm into it. The uncertainty. I love it so much. And having the guts to not know. Oh my God. Hot. Having the guts to not know. That's it, really. This is what you teach here? Is this part of your teaching? Yeah. I mean, yeah, for sure. I, you know, I get it. You are a teacher. Like you, you will say to me, you know, these things that are very nice, but you are the real, this is real, like what you're doing. It's very powerful. And it really does like cut right to the to me, like the

the heart of the matter, no pun intended, which is like, God damn it, I don't want to go down there. I don't want to do, I don't want to do that level of work. Sometimes I feel like what you, that's it. Just having the guts to not know and say, I don't know. And I'm, sometimes I don't have the guts to do that. And sometimes I do. And that's just it. It's just going on like that day by day. Sometimes I do. Sometimes I don't. And then we'll see what comes externally from all of that. People in your yoga classes cry, I bet you. That's a common thing, huh? That is so fun. It is a thing. And it's like, we used to joke that I had this resonance.

It's like, what did you do to that person in that class? Like, because they just would cry. But on, I like, I, this is, this isn't false humility. I even wonder if I should say it aloud or not. But I don't feel like it's me when I get up there to teach. It really feels like I'm just kind of tripping out on what shows up and I like it. It feels amazing for me. And I'm touched by it. I, right? Like, so, yeah, something amazing happens. But I do have to say it is this, a very big piece that I feel strongly about in teaching. And I ask all the teachers here to do it is a consecration before they teach, which is basically offering the fruits of the practice of the class up.

So that it's not about them and their personal will or what they want to get out of the class or them being a good teacher. It's just, you show up to let whatever needs to come through you, come through you. Yeah. And in this way, it's also like a karma thing. Like, if you're open, it'll burn clean. You know, it's not about like taking on karma from people and thinking you're responsible for what happens there. Like you are responsible. The teacher, Susan is responsible. It's like, it's not about me. And when there's a strong consecration, it ideally is just that it burns itself clean. And there's no one there to take anything. And I think that's where the crying might come from. I don't know. I did, you know, this whenever I get around certain teachers,

you just start crying. You really don't even know what you don't have to know. Right. Yeah. But it does like, and it'd be your mind wants to come up with like, Oh, that's why I was tearing up. Right. But it's like, no, I don't even know if that's what it was. It was just something about like, you know, it's I heard someone, maybe you could elaborate on this. We don't have a few more minutes. But someone was telling me like tears are like, don't hold back tears. Because it's a talk. It's literally toxicity. It's an energetic flow trying to come out of you. Is there some yogic? Well, I mean, I don't know about we could go in a few different directions there. But I mean, just energetically, it's it's just energy moving when there's when there's emotion.

You breathe some, some energy into spaces in the physical body, it's all really all related physical body, energy body, emotional body, mental body, spiritual body, yoga would say it's all connected. So if you are feeling something like the physical body can trigger something in the emotional body, then then then the energy body, because behind every emotion is an energy. Right. And with me here. Yes. So if energy starts moving, emotions start moving, like we're as before, there's some blocked energy here, then I start to breathe prana into that space, energy gets there, then emotions stuck emotion starts to move. And then it just is coming. It's just coming like this. It's like no story.

It's just sensation. It's just feeling its energy, let it come. And for some people, crying is crying is, is how energy moves. For me, I'm just tears, I'll just be taught like today. I mean, just tears will come, I'll be talking to somebody and I just noticed tears start falling down my face. It's just what I conceptualize it as now is energy. Like when I was in Spain and I was practicing four hours a day, I was crying and crying and crying. And I don't even think about it now. I don't even think, Oh my God, I'm crying, like all that stuff was gone in like the first year. I just, to me, it's just like energy is flowing. I make love, just tears, like crying, you know, crying and it might freak somebody out who's not used to all this, but it's like, to me,

it's just energy flowing. I sweat, right. I sweat tears. Wow, this is, this is such a wonderful conversation. Thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you for letting me do sits here. I love this place. The five year is so good. Echo Park is so lucky to have you. And can you just let people who maybe are in the LA area want to like come here? Can you tell them what the deal is? I know you've got some class coming up. Yeah. So I am teaching a six week long course called yoga, sex and death. And it's a, it's a pretty intense deep dive. We go, we go deep in the philosophy of yoga, but also into like psycho spiritual work. We, we get into the story psychologically, the whole narratives,

mother, father, sister, brother. And then we, we practice letting go in yoga, in how that relates to sexuality and also this uncertainty of death. And so when we get to the death part three, this part three part where we're actually looking at the, what happens according to the Tibetan Buddhist tradition, what happens when you die. So it, it can be confronting these things like sexuality and death can be confronting for people. So I just like to put it out there from the beginning. Like this is for sure, a course that will bring up some resistance sometimes. So just know that. And it's a course that can be confronting, but it's for those who, who really want, it's like the path of the warrior,

I call it. Dave, it's always like, why do you, you're not selling this to people when you talk about it like that was a sale. Okay. That's just like, holy shit. Any time you're like, yeah, this is why I love magic books. Cause they all start with like, don't read this or you're going to go nuts. Oh, like understand if you read this, your eyes will melt. Like, and you're like, holy shit, I'm buying this book. Well, that's what I say. I'm like, well, then my people will find this, like the people that really want it will be the people that are meant to be there. I feel like I just want to be, say it like it is from the beginning and the people that want it will find it. Yes. So I'm just going to keep doing that. Yeah. So yoga, sex and death starts

January 15th. And I mean, we have yoga on the daily schedule, Pilates on the daily schedule, mindfulness meditation on the daily schedule. We just want to create community, like a space for people to come. And I feel strongly about feeling safe so that they, they can go inside of themselves. Like this isn't a place where it's like, this is how you do it and dogma. And it's like, let's just work it out together. Let's be in community. Let's have these conversations. Let's just figure it like, let's just be together and be in this experiment to find what is in here, to find, to remember, you know, to remember what's inside. You heard it, friends. You see why I love this place. You're wonderful. Thank you so much for

giving me your time. Thank you. Come to Samarasah, friends. Susan, you're the best. You're the best. I appreciate you so much. Likewise. Hare Krishna. Thank you. That was Susan Marufo, everybody. If you're interested, check out Samarasacenter.com online or just go to Samarasah at Echo Park. I do, once a month, I do sitting meditation there. So if you want to come hang out with me doing nothing, I'm there once a month. It's all on the website. Thank you Burrow in Squarespace for sponsoring this episode of the DTFH. If you like us, won't you subscribe. I'll see you real soon, friends. We've got another podcast with Mitch Horowitz just around the corner. Until then, Hare Krishna.

Never ish. You can get everything you need delivered through Instacart right to your door in as fast as an hour. Skip the shop and savor more of your crazy, busy life with shop right in Instacart. Visit instacart.com to get free delivery on your first order. Offer valid for a limited time, minimum order, $10 additional terms apply. A good time starts with a great wardrobe. Next stop, JCPenney. Family get-togethers to fancy occasions, wedding season two. We do it all in style. Dresses, suiting and plenty of color to play with. Get fixed up with brands like Liz Claiborne, Worthington, Stafford and J4R. Oh, and thereabouts for kids. Super cute and extra affordable. Check out the latest in store and we're never short on options at

jcp.com. All dress stuff everywhere to go. JCPenney.