Duncan Trussell Family Hour - 366: Conner Habib

Episode Date: December 29, 2019

Conner Habib, philosopher/porn star/podcasting mystic, joins the DTFH for a mega podcast! You can learn more about Conner here, and you can find & support his Patreon here. This episode is brought to you by: Feals - Visit feals.com/duncan and get 50% off your first order. Burrow - Visit burrow.com/duncan and use code DUNCAN at checkout to get $75 off and FREE 1 -week shipping.

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And you have tuned in to the Dugger Trussell Family Hour podcast. I'm going to start off with talking about something that a lot of people have been asking me about online. I'm sure most of you are aware of this by now, but one of my teachers, Ramdas, passed away a few days ago. And folks have been asking me to talk about him a little bit. One of my friends invited me to do his podcast

to do a tribute to him. And I thought about it, and I just don't think I'm really at a point with it where I could like, I don't even understand what it means that he has died. I mean, I know he's not here anymore. I know his physical body is being cremated. But I don't know yet how to feel about it. And I'm not going to rush some kind of epiphany related

to his passing. But I will talk about it eventually. You know what, but I will tell you this one little story. And I've got a lot of great stories about him, because I got lucky enough to go to these retreats and Maui and do interviews, not just with him, but with some of the teachers that would show up there. And I would get to be on stage with him and interview him.

And for me, this was just excruciating. I was so starstruck by him and so overwhelmed by him, because he meant so much to so many of us. I mean, he was everything that I could want in a spiritual, in a teacher. He was, on one level, this apostate professor who was getting blasted on LSD, took LSD to India, traveled through India, giving LSD to people,

meets this incredible being, Neem Karoli Baba, and awakens and becomes Ramdas, this teacher who truly radiated love. And you got around him, and you would get high as a kite, just from whatever the contact high was from being in his presence. You would feel so good. I was always overwhelmed by that. And it was the kind of thing where,

after you had been hanging out with him, there was still this vibratory sense of just love and just peace. And I am very sad that that has gone, and that that experience is not going to be accessible in the usual way anymore. And by usual, I mean being around a living person. But I was sitting on stage with him once,

and I would try to formulate these questions that would make me look cool up there, because I felt so scared. I was always just nervous. So I tried to come up with some brilliant question to ask the great teacher. And I'd been stewing over what to ask him. And we all knew at that time that he

was getting close to letting go of his body. And we were all feeling that. And so I'm sitting up there with him, and I said, what are we going to do when you die? And he scrunched up his face and mocked sadness and basically went, whee, whee, whee. I'm like, completely, just making fun of me in the way only a real teacher can.

Because it's like, yeah, my question was bullshit. It wasn't even based on me maybe even wondering that, as much as trying to come up with a cool thing to ask him. And maybe the way I'm describing it makes him seem callous, but it was so real and so beautiful. And also, within it, there was this merciful sweetness. This like, don't worry about that. That's not anything to worry about.

Because as he has said other times, where would I go? And so this is all in my head stuff and intellectual stuff. And the times I have gotten into my heart and really felt it, I just start crying. And that's where I'm at with it. So I'll talk about it more for sure. But right now, I'm just going to put a pin in that, so to speak. But I wanted to say something about it up front,

so I didn't sound absolutely crazy to those of you who know how much I love that man and how much he meant to me. And not just to me, but my god. So many people's lives were transformed because of his selfless commitment to helping people in whatever way he could. Not just in spiritual teachings, but just in any way at all. All right, that's my Ram Dass thing, whatever that is.

But boy, we got a great podcast for you today. Connor Habib is here with us. And this conversation is about two hours long. And my god, we covered everything. We covered everything from sunlight going into your ass to how to contact, to how to communicate with the dead. So this is a mega podcast. Strap in.

We're going to jump right into it. But first, this. A tremendous thank you to Fields for sponsoring this episode of the DTFH. My loves, do you have anxiety, chronic pain? Are you having trouble sleeping at least once a week? You're not alone. Many of us do.

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something this high grade. I couldn't recommend them more. Thank you, feels. I am going to be at the Denver Comedy Works coming right up. All the links for my upcoming shows are going to be at dougatressel.com. Hitting the bricks again. So you can find me.

I'm going to be at the Comedy Works January 23rd. I'm going to be at the Bell House February 6th. And right after that, I'm going to be at the Arlington Draft House. The Bell House is in Brooklyn. Friends, you can find all the data you need at dougatressel.com. Also, sign up for our Patreon. You'll get commercial free episodes of the DTFH.

You'll get extra hour long rants, rambles, occasional songs. And there's going to be more coming down the pipes. All you got to do is go to patreon.com forward slash DTFH. And for those of you who continue to use our Amazon link, God bless you for that, my sweet, sweet friends. Without further ado, we have got a glorious podcast for you with the wonderful Connor Habib. Some of you know him as an adult film star,

but probably most of you know him as a brilliant author and philosopher who has got a fantastic podcast called Against Everyone with Connor Habib. Also, he's got an amazing Patreon that you definitely should sign up for. If ever there was an artist out there that was worth supporting, besides me, it's Connor Habib. So all the links you need to find Connor

are going to be at dunkintrussell.com. All right, everybody, spread your chakras wide and let some of that sweet, affluvial, glory juice go spraying into the astral realm and rain on sweet Connor Habib's head. Welcome to the Dunkin' Trussell Family Hour Podcast, Connor Habib. ["Welcome to the Dunkin' Trussell Family Hour Podcast"]

["Welcome, welcome to the Dunkin' Trussell Family Hour Podcast"] It's the Dunkin' Trussell Family Hour Podcast. Connor, welcome back. Hi. It's great to see you, man. I know you, too, man. We were up in the kitchen talking and Connor, I hope this is OK that I say it on the podcast,

he lowered his voice and whispered conspiratorily, I don't think it's the end of the world. And I realized, like, wow, that go all my Patreon patrons. By the way, I don't want to out you as a non-apocalyptic person. So forgive me if you weren't ready to. An apocalypse denier? If you're an apocalypse.

An apocalypse denier, but I want to talk with you about that, because it was an epiphany to me when I realized, like, holy shit, we do live in a time where it's controversial to say that you don't think it's the end of the world. And I mean, if you look at the news and you look at the climate reports and you look at the potential for global destruction via nuclear weapons and the unknown shit

they're working on and the various top secret bunkers of the world, you could very easily think, there is no way this hyper-connected network of human beings could possibly pull this off much longer, especially with the fact that climate collapse is being predicted by every scientist, except for the quacks. But I agree with you. Good.

I don't think it's the end of the world, either. Well, goodbye to your Patreon patrons as well. What about? I think that the thing that turns people off is when you say, I don't think that. I don't think climate change is real. If you deny or reject scientific data. But yet, are we delusional?

Is this some kind of flaw in the human operating system that is incapable of groping global tragedy, global catastrophe? We look around, collect the data set of our surroundings. And from that, we extrapolate, ah, things are fine. When in fact, doom. Well, first of all, if that is true, it's still OK because it's really just us.

Most of so many people are saying it's the end times and everything. So it's OK if you have a few naysayers and you and I aren't in charge of public policy. So it's not a big deal. But no, I mean, look, I think that the big challenge of our moment is that we, so every era has had its apocalypse narrative. And when you say that, people are like, yes, but this time,

really, right? I think that there is something about our moment that makes it particularly, even more than old times, to see, particularly difficult to see how bad things aren't. So I think that there's actually an obstruction that is really causing us to be unable and unequipped to deal with seeing things clearly and sort of objectively and with a kind of open heart and a real kind of responsiveness

to it. So I think that's actually the difference. Like, I don't think that the difference is like that the world actually really is ending this time because we've always thought that. I think that there is a difference. And so I don't want to get into the sort of the boob where people are like, well, we've always

had end of the world narratives. I think there is actually a difference. But I think the difference is that there's a new kind of obstructive force in the way. Well, let's very quickly, just because it's fun and who doesn't love hearing about various end of the world stories, why don't we quickly just, I want to hear your favorite end of the world predictions

and eschatological mythologies. And I'll give you a few of mine because it's so fun to talk about the end of the world. But first, I'm going to turn off the noise machine. OK. Much thanks to Burrow for sponsoring this episode of the DTFH. Recently, I had some serious couch drama. My Chihuahua pissed on my couch right in front of my mother-in-law.

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and free one week shipping at burrow.com slash Duncan. That's B-U-R-R-O-W.com slash Duncan for $75 off a new burrow sofa. Thank you, burrow. I don't know if I haven't fit end of the world. I've just never even think of it. Okay, yes, I have something. Hey, let's hear one.

Okay, so this isn't an end of the world story, but I think that this is something that is really helpful to us now that includes the end of the world, which is that like, you know when you talk to people about death and you're like, okay, so you need to face the fact that you're gonna die, right, like that's this mature attitude.

But as soon as you say you need to face facts that this planet is going to die sooner or later, people have all kinds of really intense reactions to that. So my favorite end of the world story is my own, I guess, which is like, look, the planet is going to die and one of our jobs of being human is to be the caretakers of its death and to assist it kindly and compassionately

in its inevitable entropy. But what I don't mean is that might happen in 100 years. So just throw a party because the apocalypse this year, I don't even know if it's gonna happen in 7,000 years. I just think we need to carry around the end of the world in us the same way we carry around our deaths if we have a healthy relationship to it.

So it's not exactly answering your question, but I would say my favorite end of the world story is the one that we tell ourselves every day and try to overcome with a sense of like love and care. Yeah, right, that's the, that is the premise that, look, as above so below, this thing you're in right now, it's barely real from the view of cosmic time.

We are looking at, as they say, of a flicker of sentience and embodied sentience. So every single human being, this is what I love when you start looking at the various apocalyptic mythologies more as a psychological event in a person's life. And the crucifixion of Jesus, that's every single person right now.

And you know this, of course, you know what I'm getting at. And then the resurrection, I think you've taught me some of this. The resurrective potential in a person's life, that's the flower that Kali holds, that's the, while she's like standing in a landscape of devastation, this flower,

like look, it never ends, it always, that's that moment of grief when you get your first taste of the other side of it, that weird moment, the first day when you wake up and don't feel like a zombie. You know what I'm talking about? And so, yeah, man, it's like, I love this idea of being the hospice workers

of ourselves and the earth. And if you start with one, you're definitely gonna turn that way to the other, but then I also love the idea of simultaneously being a midwife, right? Because not only are you tending to your own personal subjective apocalypse, you're also letting it give birth

to that next version of you that's on the other side of fear of death. And similarly, I think one of the beautiful things, one of the, and this is a controversial thing to say, is that on the other side of this disaster, this, these tragedies that are surely coming as long as we're on a planet, there is always going to be something else.

There's always gonna be the potential for something even more beautiful. But you say that, and you sound like fucking Charles Manson. We gotta take him out, wipe him out in the thing. I'll tell you what, we are, we're the hospice workers. Right, right. We're the hospice workers. The caretakers of those snikes

and the boiling likes of fire. But it is, that's the problem is it's like, are we even to attempt to be, isn't it completely fucked up to attempt to be optimistic even in the face of such potential impending catastrophe? Is that just a spiritual bypass? And what we need is a full injection of horror

to drive us into the world, to stop the wreckage, the slow-motion avalanche. Tell me, Connor. Yeah, well, I mean, it's good to think about why we need the horror, right? I mean, I think, what is that giving to us? I don't necessarily have an answer because I don't really experience it, you know?

I mean, I certainly feel some grief, like when certain animal species go extinct or whatever, but the overarching narrative is really bizarre to me. Why do we need that horror? What are we externalizing? So like, let's take climate change. We can talk about it for a minute. Maybe it will piss everybody off, let's see.

But like, I never really think about climate change because I don't think it's a useful narrative. Like, I think all it does is it creates, it generates anxiety way more. So like, you know, we used to say like, we all need to raise awareness. Like, we definitely don't need to raise awareness anymore. It's like raised to the point

where it's like a fever bitch crazy, like something else needs to happen right now. But there are things that are environmental causes, which I think we can all get involved in that would directly affect climate change. You wouldn't even have to believe that it was real or not real. Deforestation, the overfishing,

you know, the raising pH content of the oceans, all that kind of stuff. These are things we can do something about. And there are material conditions and they can help, you know, enrich our spirit and enliven us and all that kind of stuff. And they would directly affect climate change anyway. So why are we, the interesting question to me

is to ask why do we keep like sort of feeding into and generating and raising this sort of fever of awareness around something that is actually quite beyond our ability to affect and funnels all our efforts into begging the state to help us? I mean, that's really like my question. And I think, and there's,

I think a sense of letting yourself off the hook, really. I mean, I really think that that's part of it. Right after Trump was elected in 2016, I went to see Rebecca Solnit. Do you know who that is? She's a, I don't think so. She's a writer, she's fine. I used to like her a lot more than I like her now,

but she went, she spoke at the LA Public Library and it was that night or it was like two days after the election or something. So of course, all the audience questions, even though she was there to talk about a book that was about maps, you know, like we're all about Trump and what we should do and all that kind of stuff.

And she was just like, if he doesn't sign these environmental courts, it's finished, we're all finished. Like she was panicking and I was like, what kind of like, this is the most immoral thing if you think everybody's gonna fucking die. Like you better be storming the White House right now. But you notice like how the urgency and intensity

with which these feelings are expressed or performed versus like what people are actually doing. So like if you really think it's the end of the world and it is, I mean, there's a real disconnect there. And I feel like that's because the climate change narrative is pulling people away from these very obvious material things that you can do that would necessarily affect that anyway.

And I do think it's like people have a need to be paralyzed by horror for better or for worse. And there are healthy ways to do it. You can watch that garbage man guy and Maholan drive come out from behind the dumpster and scare you like in a David Lynch movie or you can read a Patricia High Smith novel or you can do something like that

or you can actually be engaged in saying I wanna be paralyzed by the horror of this like narrative that I think is real. I think there are better ways to do it than that. Well, okay, great. I love that point. And I wanna dive into the better ways. And I think weirdly we can pull

from the wonderful conversation we had as we were making coffee upstairs about this phenomenon. About sun and the buttholes? Yeah. Oh, okay, great. Yeah, sun and the butthole, right? Which is, I mean, if there ever was a metaphor for so many things, it's like get some sun in your ass, man and you're gonna feel way better.

Now I don't know if it actually works physiologically but if you consider all like one of the things you said and I never really thought of this and it's weird because it is like people say all the time that's a place, stick it where the sun don't shine, right? Right? Yeah. But it's like, I never, you were like, you know, sun, that's like for your asshole to get sun in it.

Right. It's like the second coming of Christ or something. Totally. Right? That's a big deal for your asshole to suddenly get to have photons blasting into it. Probably not the, depending on how clean your asshole is. Or if you're Irish, the sunburn right away.

No, I'm thinking about the poor photons. They take like a million years to come out of the sun. They go blasting the earth. They're like, we're gonna land in someone's eyes. Yeah. And be color. Wait, that's- I'm gonna help someone read Gravity is Rainbow. But no.

It's actually- Let's do it! I have a peanut allergy! But, god damn it, fucking dad jokes. To me, the reality that we're all learning in the midst of this, the market pressures that are being created by the global panic happening in relation to the data coming from a scientist

studying what's happening in the ice caps and stuff, is that we're seeing huge leaps forward in solar technology. And eventually, we are gonna see the planet go from fossil fuels to solar. It's cheaper, it'll eventually be way cheaper. And so that is like one of the number one ways for us to, if we could do it, then carbon emissions

would be so reduced. I mean, and figure out a way to do it with airplanes. Just imagine if the whole planet is now doing what the plants have been doing forever, which is we're getting our fuel from the sun. So, as above so below, what I think of, when I see people who are really like angry and judgmental and all this is coming from terror

and all the terror is coming from a real love of the planet, I think, oh fuck, they're burning fossil fuels inside of themselves, right? We gotta go solar, not just with our cars, but with our hearts, so that we, so we have to get sun into the asshole of our hearts. Because if we can do that, then suddenly it becomes something that Jack Cornfield has said to me,

which is if you're gonna save the planet, save it because you love her. Save it out of love, not fear or hate or anger. Save it out of like real heartbreak, real, like not the angry heartbreak, the real heartbreak that you see in the faces of the enlightened people. You know what I mean? Where they're like, oh, this is, this is cat,

I'm feeling all of it, all the death, extinction, the pain, but it's not making me angry, it's just making me love everybody more. You know, and now you're dealing with real fucking power because that's, you're now converting the energy of truth into action instead of like distorted truth, which I think is fear. So we gotta, you know what I'm saying?

Like it's like, the task is like, shit, okay, if this is really happening, even before you go and storm the White House, just, you know what I mean? See what happens if suddenly you just feel fully the heartbreak of that reality and then act from that sweetness. Well, I mean, storming the White House is like,

I bring that up because people who have that kind of materialistic idea of how things are working, that would be the only solution within their sort of worldview. So by their own logic, it's like, this is your moral imperative, right? But what you're saying is more, correct, there are lots of things that need to happen within us.

So it's not just letting the sun into your asshole, it's like generating the sun out of your asshole, you know what I mean? Like seriously, like, let it be a light, you know? To shine among men. Exactly, exactly. But I mean, but I mean that, like, I mean, I'm making a joke, but the task that's up to us,

especially in this coming year, I think, is to be able to generate that light from ourselves and become beacons rather than await anything from the world outside of us to provide it with us, even the sun itself. Like the sun is like, yes, we can move to solar panels and all that. And I think that that would be a better version

of how to generate energy for whatever infrastructure stuff, right? But that's not gonna happen next year. I mean, I guess it could, but it's probably not gonna happen next year. But something that we can do right now as we're in our confusion is become these lights. And if it's like, I've been thinking about this a lot,

like if I'm in Ireland and I'm like this little light that's shining, hopefully flickering dim, whatever, but I'm this little light that's shining. And then there's someone in the north of Ireland and then there's someone in, you know, and then there's someone in the UK and then there's someone in Greenland or whatever. And you look at us a certain way, all kinds of shining,

then we become a constellation, right? And these constellations are, you have, you know, they're the heroes in mythology, you know, are the constellations of certain kinds of connections of beacons, right? And so we need to start doing that for each other, like instead of relying on anything, and this is our, I think it's such a huge problem right now,

is we're waiting for all the material conditions to change to be suitable to us and we're completely impotent. So I talked to this guy in my podcast, Franco Bifobarardi, who is this anarcho-communist theorist, but he's, gosh, he's amazing. And he was just saying, look, we all know what we're supposed to do information-wise,

but that's not the problem. Right now, we don't have the potency to carry it out. He calls it potency. The political will is completely dead. That's a different capacity. So like, that's part of what we have to generate for ourselves right now, is cultivate these capacities within ourselves

before we even, before we even act. And nobody's doing either. No one's acting, no one's cultivating the capacity. I'm not saying nobody, but lots of people aren't doing either of those things. How do you cultivate it? There's a lot of ways. There's poetry, there's magic,

there's meditation, there's ritual, there's therapy. There's lots of different ways to do it, sex. Different ways to generate rhythms within ourselves. How do you do it with sex? So I think with sex, one of the ways that you do it is you bring awareness to sex. This sounds so simple,

but I think people are really used to or seek sex as a kind of obliteration of the personality and obliteration of your individuality. And that's how we're taught sex is supposed to be good if you stumble into the hotel room, knocking over the nightstand lamps, falling to the ground with your partner, tearing at each other's clothes,

and there's just no you anymore. That's one type, but that's not mostly how sex happens. Mostly your thoughts are going through your head. And so what I think is it's good to pay attention to what's happening in the moment, in your thoughts, in your feelings, in your body, all that kind of stuff.

And sex is a great way to do that because it presents a challenge. It wants to sort of draw you down into this one sphere, you know, and people are listening. I'm manically thrusting toward my own cock and balls right now with my hand, but it wants to sort of pull you down into this one sphere. And when you're in that one sphere,

which is a great place to be and enjoy it, and I'm not giving you a moral prescription here, but it's hard to make the other levels of yourself transparent to yourself. And that's why it's such an unilluminated space. It's one of the reasons why people have such difficulty with sex in their lives because it's so hard to get out of that space

and be yourself in any other way. And people freak out about that all the time, like, oh, I'm just obsessed with watching porn and I'm obsessed with like, you know, having sex and thinking about people sexually and blah, blah, blah, they get, they're not, they moralize about it, but really the only problem that they're having, I think,

is that they're not trying to make any other aspect of their being present while they're having those feelings. They don't even know they can. Right, and it's so easy to do. You just, instead of... Wait, are you talking about the chakras? Well, I think that that's an interesting way to visualize it. I think that like, I don't want people to think

that they have to go through chakra theory and understand all of that to be able to do it. It's just sort of like, when you are having sex and you have a thought like, oh, I need to get these groceries tomorrow or whatever, or like, oh, I feel like this person thinks my, you know, my butt looks weird or whatever it is. Instead of trying to fight against those thoughts

or feeling bad about them afterwards, you just include that in the sexual experience and think about it, you know? And you're just like, okay, these are levels of my spirit while I'm doing it, you know? I always want to do like an essay called like the phenomenology of rimming where like someone was like eating my ass

and I was like, it's just easier to do when you're being rimmed than any other sexual act. And I'm just like writing down what I'm experiencing like as it's happening. I'm like, this is the feeling I'm having. This is what I see. This is what's in the room. This is what, you know, now...

If you do that, you gotta wear a lab coat. You do. It doesn't matter if it ends up on camera or not, but you've gotta dress like a scientist. You need to have some kind of... Dr. Giggles. You can borrow my modular synths. So it looks like you have a scientific panel behind you.

I will totally do that. Wait, walk me through. I mean, what's, I know like there were a few times I have had someone lick my asshole that, yeah, it's a lot. It's a lot. It's a lot to deal with. Like you are definitely dealing with so many fears

at that moment. Cause you're like, oh my God, oh my God. What, I haven't been sunning it lately. So it's depressed. It looks like one of those salamanders and one of those caves, you know, deep below the earth. You're thinking back to like, okay, when was, did I shower, I showered right before this, right?

Or when was the last time? And imagine for like a straight identified person, there's all the feelings of like, this is my asshole though, like that kind of stuff's happening to, or at least maybe the first time for you. I don't have, I don't have like that. I don't have that like things some dudes do

or it's like my assholes gay, I guess is what they think or something. I don't know what, you know, they be where it's like if someone touches, like if someone touches your asshole, then it will create in a lot of homophobic dudes, they're afraid it will create like a cascade of gay that rolls through their bodies, I think.

And then like, and then they feel ashamed of it forever. It's just like the gay Kundalini, like it's snaking its way up to your brain. Yeah. And so they don't even want to like, what the fuck, don't fucking touch me there. Don't release the snake. You know, there's a fucking snake down there.

And all it wants to do is sunbathe. The moment you tickle that dude, the golden snake of gay power snakes its way up my spine, gets into my brain and shoots gauges on it. Holy shit, man. That actually is weird. Watch out everybody. It's my favorite genre porn.

It's like gay snakes jerking off on straight dudes brains. It's like Chakra Enlightenment gay porn. That'd be fucking amazing. And I know our next project. No, clearly our next project is we have to raise funding for the phenomenon. Did you say phenomenon? Phenomenology of women, yeah.

But all that aside, I know I've never had a, that doesn't, I'm just more worried about hygiene. Like I'm just more worried about, like I want to be cleaned down there. If anybody's taking the very brave, daring, adventurous, fucking hardcore choice, that's like the dude who went into the Arctic. That's like Admiral Burr.

The lot city of Z. Yeah, yeah, I just want to like as much as can make it like as non-traumatic as possible. That's where my mind's going. But this energetic system that you're talking about, it seems to get amplified with sex. And I, or is what you're saying is that down there where I guess we're talking about first, second Chakra,

really, you know, I think about the Chakra sometime. I think they're a useful handle to like put on, like understanding where you're caught or where your energy is or maybe why you are obsessed with sex or why your numb and your chest, where, you know, why you don't feel that much or why blah, blah, blah. The first two Chakras, we've got survival, right?

That's number one. The second one is sex. The third one is power, right? Is that correct? Well, they're different systems. So you're just telling me the one you know. This is the University of Bro Science Chakra system taught to me by- And then the fourth is the creatine Chakra.

Yeah, so anyway, yeah, my fourth Chakra has love handles, unfortunately, I gotta get that thing to the gym. But no, so you get stuck in these various energy centers and when you're having sex, are you saying like that energy just goes all over? It goes into your head. It goes like you're just essentially like ping-ponging around energetically in your body when you're fucking.

Well, I think it's actually, it's more that like all your aspects of your being are working during sex, just like they are during all kinds of stuff that you do, you know, but sex and our culture has sort of curated sex to like do this, so it's made it more problematic. It gets all sort of like stuck in this one place. Like you only really, especially men I think,

really notice this one aspect of like their sexual experience. And it's all in the front, you know, and it's all just kind of like floating there and it's this intensity. So one of the things that like I say, you know, porn is really good for, like if we try to talk about sex and we talk about, you know, like, if you've ever seen like academics try to talk about sex,

it's like the most depressing thing. They're like, well, the like post-colonial like examination of the alternative of the blah, blah, blah, and it's like the least sexual thing you can think of. But like to actually talk about sex, like you have to experience down there, which is very hard because as soon as you start talking about things that arouse you,

it starts to sort of pull you down into that space. Like it's a portal, like you start talking about it and then it draws you into that area. It's a magnet. And then it starts to cut off like all the other stuff that's going on, right? So I think like to speak about sex, we have to speak in pornography.

So we're not used to that. I am because of all the porn I've done in my life, but most people are not used to doing that. Usually speaking in pornography shuts like 20 doors behind you as you're walking down a continuously narrowing hallway. So what do you mean by that? Well, it's like, like I just said,

it sort of draws you down into this one area. So it's like, I got you, I got you. So what I would like is like, try to leave the door open behind you as you go. And there are lots of ways to do that. And you asked this question in relation to developing a kind of potency, like how do we do that? Like there are aspects of yourself that are unillumined

and for most people, sex is one of those areas. And I, it's a very like dark, dark meaning unillumined, very dark path like to travel. And most people get really fucked up by traveling and walking on that path. I mean, it's hugely challenging for me. You mean the path of sex? Yes, the path of letting sex be your teacher

to become a beacon, you know? Yeah, what is that? Is it because addiction starts happening? Or you do, you know, when you meet like a authentic sex addict, they're so fevered by that addiction and so tormented by it. And some of them definitely start off with a real spiritual attitude about it,

have a healthy approach to it. What's the big deal? It's making someone else feel amazing. It's just a beautiful thing and then something happens. So you know what I mean? You can go nuts a little bit from, can you over fuck? Do you think you can over fuck? No, I mean, it's different for everybody.

I mean, first of all, I just want to, and it's not to like get on your case about it, but I just wouldn't use the word addiction. And the reason why when it comes to sex is that like the addiction processes that we have in place to help heal people, it just doesn't work for sex. People go to sex and love addiction stuff

and I think there's a lot of just bad science around that. But I think so much, it's like, in a world that tells you sex is bad in so many different kinds of ways, how would you even know where the bad aspect of it began and the do you know what I mean? It's not a substance, it's constitutive of our being. You came from sex.

So, I mean, okay, let me clarify. You know, addiction, the word is- Compulsion is a good word. Maybe it's like when I say freak, for example. I mean that not in the pejorative sense. I mean, that's a good term to me. I know some people like, I think of myself as being an outsider

with very freakish aspects of myself. And so I like, I don't mind, I love myself, I'm sorry to say, and I don't mind that term. So when I say addiction even, I don't even mean it. And like, I think it's a condition of being human with like such an incredible array of sensory apparatus to experience the data of this plane of existence. If you're not addicted to something,

you're probably doing something wrong. Like what's going on? You need a good experience with addiction in your life. I'm not recommending oxy or heroin or anything like that. Come on, if you're drinking coffee every day, you're fucking in there, baby. You're strapped into the coffee demon that in a lot of people are having anxiety attacks.

Once I was talking to a friend of mine, and she's like, oh, I'm not sleeping very well so I have to take sleeping pills. And I was like, do you drink coffee? And she's like, yeah, I'm addicted. So that's what I mean. I mean addiction is a normal thing. And when I say sex addiction, specifically,

what I bring comes to mind is once at the comedy store sitting on the steps in the back of the comedy store and some guy was in front of me. And he like looked like he's about to start crying. He's a big jockey dude. And he goes, he looks up at me. Like he's like really upset and he's like, I'm not gonna get any pussy tonight, man.

I just know it's not gonna happen. And that's what I mean. That, where you're like, what the fuck, man? Like you're so in need of fucking all the time that this one night where it doesn't happen, you're legitimately acting like someone who's begging for crack. That's what I mean.

And I don't know what you call that, I think is a term of convenience addiction works. Well, yeah, so I would just, yeah. The only reason why I push back at all is because there's this whole sex addiction sort of industry among therapists that I think is really unfounded. And there are really good people to check out

like Dr. David Lay and Nicole Prouse who have sort of debunked a lot of the science around that if you wanna go check it out. So you don't have to put a bitchy comment in the comments field when you listen to this. Think about how sex addiction is real. But I totally agree that in most everybody's life, there's something about the world

and aspect of the world that asks each individual, it's different for everybody, that asks to be contended with via excess. I want you to figure out your relationship to excess through me, right? And then for some people, it's sex, for some people, it's alcohol, for some people, it's phone. For most people, actually, I would say

the biggest one is probably work. It's like they think about their jobs when they leave, they're always answering their emails, they're always about, that's like the worst and probably the one that kills the most people too. But I think that that's what you're talking about is like these, if you imagine a spirit of excess that decides to sort of land on a different part

of the world and be like, here I am, this is how you're gonna deal with me, this is how you're gonna deal with me, it possesses and inhabits something that shows up in your life. Excess is an amazing thing and it's really something that I think you deal with by, I don't recommend this to everybody,

but I think one of the ways you can deal with it is going into it more like deeper and deeper and deeper. Adding wood to the fire. Yes, and then what happens if you survive that, which not everybody does, is you achieve an escape velocity. Like you've done it more than anybody else, I've had sex with thousands of people.

So now when I think about sex, I'm able to sort of stand on that bridge and watch the water flow underneath. And I can notice what's happening in me during sexual encounters, my sexual thoughts, my thoughts about sex and culture, all that kind of stuff, from a different vantage point that most people can.

You're like a sexual ninja. Yeah, exactly. You're like, it's, but it's, I mean, it's like, I feel like I can, my bridge that I stand on like that is like, I don't know, hearthstone, you know, like video games. I could tell you, that's funny. I've played so many fucking games of Mortal Kombat 11,

that I could tell you, and I could tell you all kinds of, and also there's a great deal of shame for me attached to that addiction, but with sex, here we have this thing that is so incredibly powerful and wonderful that everybody longs for it, generally. Yet, it's a thing that's been completely, completely prohibited.

Like it's been, as far as sex goes, it's been the dark ages for a long fucking time, historically. It's getting worse, I think. It's getting worse, yeah. So, which means that people have very little experience with it, like we just don't know all the, it's like an undiscovered country that is the terrain of sex workers,

that's the terrain of, I guess, scientists, but I agree with you, usually the scientists, their articulation of it is like an alien trying to describe like Oprah, you know? And most of them haven't had enough sex to be able to really talk about it in a worthwhile way, you know? Over the course of your career,

was there some point, like, you know, I'm trying to learn to play piano right now, and I'm in a period where I'm like, holy shit, I'm actually like, it's happening, like now my fingers are just playing music, when I'm, you know, I know how to do scales, I'm like, wow, was there a moment for you in the course of fucking where suddenly you were like,

wow, I'm learning things that most people just don't know. Well, yeah, so like, there was, while I was living in LA, there was, you know, a period where it was like, within two days, so I had sex with a guy, some anonymous, not anonymous, but someone I didn't know, and then the next day, sex with a different person, and both of them said to me, wow, what are you on, right?

And they didn't mean, like, cause you're chewing your own hand off or whatever, they were just like, I responded to both of them in the same way, I said, I just enjoy this. Like, they thought that to actually be in the experience, they had to do meth probably, you know, or some other substance, probably mostly meth and gay community, so to me, that was really distressing,

I was like, fuck, like this is what people are dealing with, but then also I just thought, well, that's good about me, it means that I am actually enjoying the experience in a way that, you know, people just want to see someone like that, they want to see someone that can deal with these difficult, dark, challenging places that excess of light's on and are doing okay, right?

That's why I get so much still, like I haven't been porn in like five years or something, but I still get tons of like mail, of email about like, thank you for doing this, thank you for doing this, thank you for doing this, that relates to sex, work, and porn, and it's like, they just want to see someone who's like navigated it and been fine,

now what they don't know is all the challenges and difficulties, like I've gone through my own life, going through those dark, what were some of those? Well, ego for sure was one of them, doing sex work really, really, really messes with your ego, and in a very specific way, you start sort of, you can start witnessing people as, what are they gonna bring to me sexually,

and if it's nothing, are they gonna pay me for this experience? Like, you start thinking of that. I had this one experience where I was like, I lived in San Francisco at the time, it was kind of at the height of my porn career, and I saw like a flyer on a telephone pole, and it was like, it was me, you know,

like party promoters would just like take porn images and put them on their flyers, you know, edited, so they can't see, you know, and it's like, pulse night at, you know, whatever, you know, hot go-go boys, $2 shots, whatever, you know. And so, I'm like, fuck these fucking assholes. Wait, hold on, what's a go-go boy? Oh, go-go boys, like a go-go dancer.

Oh, okay. Yeah, yeah. So I'm like, walking down the street, I see it from a distance, I'm like, you know, these fucking assholes, and I know the party, so I know who the promoter is, I'm like, do you not fucking ask me to use my image? That's my body, you motherfuckers. And I'm like getting more and more pissed off,

and I'm like, and the porn companies, they don't care, they're not gonna fucking defend my image and blah, blah, blah, and I get closer and closer, and then I'm in front of it, I'm like, oh, that's not me. Right? And then, and then that day, that very day, I got like super sick diarrhea for two weeks. And so it was like, God was like, oh,

like you think that everybody loves you because you're asshole, let's see what happens to it now, you motherfucker, you are moat. Yes, and like nothing knocks you out of your like ego around your body, and how desirable you are, and all that kind of stuff, than like having explosive diarrhea. You can't be sexy with explosive diarrhea.

No, I'm sure there are some people out there that would have been like, please bring it over, you know, but like, but you don't even wanna do it that, because you don't feel, you know. So I think like, there are ways, particular ways in which the way you relate to your body can become really challenging, if sex is your teacher, you know.

Are you talking like you just feel superior, you start feeling like puffed up? Yeah. Like you're basically like, you've turned into a sorcerer or something, like you're somebody who's learning. Totally. Okay, got it.

Yeah, I mean, think about like, I can say, see it sounds funny, but it's true. I can say, I'm an international sex symbol, and it's true. Yeah, right? If I just even put like, like I'm making, I'm laughing about it now, but if I even just put like the tiniest bit of like,

extra confidence, like you can hear how it would spill over immediately into this realm of like crazy fucking ego. Sure. Because sex is so powerful, because it's so unallumined, because it's so like unexamined for most people, that you can really hold sway over people, and you don't even have to like,

what's the fuck, I'm like 200 pounds now, I got a belly, all that kind of, it doesn't even have to do with the way you physically look anymore. That's like glamor. You can have the abs, you can have a certain kind of body, a certain kind of face,

but like once you get that kind of like vibe, like you're in it, and it's yours to deal with for the rest of your fucking life. So it's like, it's intense, you know? Because you can, yeah, you can like tractor beam people. You can, like people are gonna fall in love with you. You're gonna be the person that people

are like driving around thinking, holy shit, I just had sex with Connor, a people. Yeah, people do that all the time. Holy shit. And that, does that feel, but doesn't that, aside from the fact that on one level, ego's gonna get, yep. It's just, I can't even imagine.

If I was like, one thing when I'm driving around that I don't think, is I'm an international sex symbol. And if I did think it, I would be like, whoa, you gotta cut back on the weed, man, because I don't think that's necessarily. This is the part where in the Periscope video where the hearts start showing up and they're like, Duncan, we love you.

Hey, I'm not, let's just, let's, I'm not, I, it's fine. I think I know where my strengths and weaknesses lie. But on another level, I think at some point at some point I would feel when I was looking up with people that they were using me. Yeah, totally. And then that would be devastating. Like that would make me start feeling really angry and lonely.

That's its own, that's its own thing. You know, like I was in Dublin and where I live now and I went to like this, there were like four guys having sex and I like come over, you know, on an app. So I went over and like they all knew who I was, but they didn't tell me that I, they knew who I was. And then they started like getting their phones out and like to film me while I was there without asking me.

And I was like, what the fuck are you guys doing? And they're like, well, your face won't be enough. I'm like, you think I fucking care if my face is in it? Like that's not the issue. Like you guys are using this for your own fucking shit. And that's, that was really disturbing. So I had to go home and like walk myself through that and figure out, and it was fine afterward.

But it was like, you get into like situations like that where even after you've worked through a lot of stuff sexually that other people may not have, you're constantly encountering everybody else's shit, right? So like you're constantly encountering and you're like, fuck, like that's what that darkness is like. And that's what that does to people. And that's what it did to me.

It's just that I continued walking through it. And a lot of sex workers, that's what they end up doing is like, you know, the way I say is like sex workers bear the burden of a culture that refuses to work on its attitude to sex, right? So like sex workers have to, they see all of this and like they have to deal with in some sense with a kind of detachment.

I think the detachment can be very healthy. It can be a real amazing skill to have in your life. And it's why sex workers often become hospice care workers. They can touch bodies that they're, you know, not into or that are doing weird things or going through weird processes. But I think more than that, you just end up encountering the darkness around sex.

And I keep saying darkness, I don't mean evil. I mean, the light isn't there. And that's again, where this question started from. It's like, you know, to bring light. And there are lots of the other things I said, you know, magic, meditation, poetry, you know, music, all these kinds of things that can bring a kind of light to places that are unillumined and develop in you

because you have to go through all that darkness. You develop a capacity and developing that capacity brings a kind of potency which creates a radiation of light which allows people to form these kinds of constellations of beacons around the world. And I think that that's what 2020 needs to be about. That's beautiful. So if, so have sex with me, Duncan,

and then we'll see what happens. I can't, I'll talk to my wife, see what she says. No, I'm not going to talk to my wife. She'd be like, yeah, do it. You have to do it. Just do it. Okay, so, but the reason I bring up that I'm focusing on sex, aside from the fact that it's scintillating

and it titillates people and it's like off limits, it's also, if we're going to talk about the chain of existence or at least where our civilization grows from and which is, you know, the pixels of a civilization or people and the people come from fucking. But if the fucking is coming from darkness, then we're born into darkness. And we're born, for a lot of people,

like we're born into, if nothing else, a thing that you definitely shut your windows for, you know, like people close their windows for sex. When you're about to fuck, you close the windows and, you know, maybe not everybody does. Some people are like, leave it open, leave it open. But even that is like, leave it open. That's a totally weird thing too.

You know, so many other things I do with the windows open. You know, I don't even think about sex. There's all of a sudden you're aware of windows. And so this is the, I think, the reality of being a human is that you are born into darkness, sexual darkness. And what else, if that's what we're growing out of, then fuck. You know what I mean? Like of course there's all these threads of shame

and these strange, a sense of like, God, am I okay? Am I addicted to porn? Am I all right? Why do I do this? What is this? Even if it's a slight little, just a slight, you know, barely even move, if there was a, what do you call it, a Geiger counter for sexual shame,

even if it's just a little. Oh, you would focus on that until it looked like a giant fucking, like Trump signature, you know? Yeah. Shark fin. Yeah, yeah. Is it a shark fin? Have you ever seen a signature?

I've seen the signature, but I've never seen a shark fin in it. Oh, well, it's just these, like, it looks like jagged teeth, basically. Yeah, exactly. Yeah, so anyway, that's why, because it's like, you know, meditation, certainly. Poetry, any kind of artistic expression.

Also, weirdly, for me, you know, a lot of our art, like you'll talk to people about, well, why don't you try writing? Or, you know, for me, when I'm making music, I'll feel real shame for no reason at all about it. Like my connection with creativity is has this darkness in it too. You know, it's a, it's, I think many of us

just have a nice thread of darkness weaving around, not just the excess, but the stuff in between. Yeah, and so two things. One is to say that I love the point you're making about, like, we're born out of and through darkness. We're created through this sort of darkness of sex, right? I mean, that's really incredible to think of, right? Like, what hope do we have in some way

if that's what we're coming from? And you can apply that to lots of different areas of life, like one of the things I like to say is like, how the fuck are we gonna solve any problems in this world if when I ask you to think about a cat and I say, think about a cat for two minutes straight, you can't fucking do it. You're fucked, man.

Like you can't think about, you can't hold the thought of a cat for two minutes straight. Like your mind's gonna go in eight million different directions. So if you can't hold a single thought for two minutes, how can we solve any of these monumental problems before us, right? And there's a kind of darkness there.

It's like, when did my thoughts get fragmented? When did they go off in this direction? You don't know yourself. You don't know the process, the dynamic active process of your own thinking, right? But part of that comes from being born of this darkness that you're talking about. And unfortunately, spiritual teachers

are almost no help in this area at all. They all suck on it. The most brilliant minds of the world to say the stupidest things about sex. And the way I always say is like, if you go to a spiritual seminar or a conference or go to Esalen or whatever the fuck you go to and some spiritual teacher starts talking about sex,

raise your hand to be like, how many people have you had sex with? And if they hesitate, they're fucked. And if they say less than a thousand, then fuck it. Then Ram Dass is a man for you. Yes, exactly. Because you know, that's what he did publicly say. I've had sex with thousands of men.

Yes, it's amazing. Osho's pretty good on it. Like there are a few people that are pretty thoughtful about it. And it's not that you have to have sex with thousands of people that have a good opinion of it. I'm not saying that you have to do that. It's just that it tends to be that people talk about it

from a spiritual perspective all the time without having very much experience at all, right? And so you're getting a really, really, really distorted view of it. Or they have like, they're up there and if they mention sex, this is where you know something's fucked. If you're with a spiritual teacher and they mention sex,

but they do it and kind of like that. Oh yeah. Yeah, that weird giggle thing. Fuck. Totally. That's a weird thing. It's a pollutant, right? Let's cut to a commercial real quick.

The baby just woke up and then we'll come back. Okay. This is the problem. This is the problem I have being dear friends with people who come on the podcast as you forget to hit record and just keep doing the podcast. You're saying like the interesting, all kinds of interesting shit.

Only because like I just, and I know where we left off where this is gonna be a little bit of a shift from there, but not too far a shift. So Connor and I were just talking and he made the great point, which is like sex is not necessarily a cure-all. Becoming a sexual adept does not mean realization because.

Because Dr. Ruth was a sniper in the Israeli military. And she's awful. People idolize her and like everything about her is like terrible except this like one thing that she's kind of got right. I've never heard anyone talk shit about Dr. Ruth. I've been podcasting for so long and never once have I ever heard any,

I gotta hear this take. Oh, well she just like, she makes little comments about it. Like she's like, if you don't listen to me, don't forget. I know where to put that little red dot when I aim for you. Yeah, like she's, I mean. I've never heard her say that.

And all kinds of people that are in the Israeli military like refuse to apologize for their time and all that, even though plenty of people refuse service and you know, don't want to participate in the ethnic cleansing of Palestinians. But anyway, so yeah, it's just one of these things where. Can you imagine getting killed by Dr. Ruth? The worst, the worst.

It's like, it's cause it's like, well actually it's not the worst for you, you're, you're dead. It's the worst for your family who not only has to deal with the fact that you got sniped, but also has like, once they find out, yeah, it was the sex worker Dr. Ruth that killed your mother. Yeah, you can watch her. She's on Donnie Hue or whatever, right?

So, okay, so yeah, you're just saying that it's not, it's not like this practice is gonna make you enlightened or anything like that. No, it's one, it's one path that most people don't sort of go down for a way to re-engage with spirituality. I mean, we were talking about it like, you know, spiritual teachers, we were saying, like they very often just make a total fucking mess of it.

They're like a wreck when it comes to it. And for me, it's like, like you were talking about with the piano, like, or learning to, you know, play with the keyboard or whatever. It's like, there's darkness everywhere. And I think the recourse for people to be like, well, darkness and light are integrated.

It's the yin and yang and blah, blah, blah. It's like, that's all fine. But what I like to do is create new darkness. Like we're dealing with the fucking old same darkness again and again and again. Like I want us to create a new kind of danger and a new concept so we can deal with that kind of darkness. Because if it's true, the darkness and light are intertwined,

like us not resolving these old versions of it and these old shades of darkness is keeping us from like changing what kind of light is available to us as well, you know? So let's create something new now. You mean like a new boogeyman? Yeah, well, I should say that that, it will arise on its own, you know?

It's like, I think I've said this on the show before, but you know, this shaman from Burkina Faso said this to me, like about spiritual enlightenment, this guy, Maladoma Some, he was like, yeah, well, when you kind of, when you get in touch with the ancestors and you go through a spiritual process, it's like getting a driver's license,

you graduate into a new danger, you know? So you get to a certain point, but then there are these new things that were illegible to you before as dangers that show up. And then you have to contend with them, but you still, you know, and I don't know. I mean, maybe the, maybe darkness isn't infinitely, isn't infinitely a partner with us in everything we do.

Maybe we do escape it at a certain point. I don't know. I don't think it's like, I'm not able to say that. People say it was such certainty. Well, darkness is part of life. Well, how the fuck do you know? Like, just because it's part of yours? Like, maybe not, maybe not.

But in the meantime, since I can't access that, I'd like to say I'm bored of the old forms of darkness. Let's fucking move on. You want to revise darkness. You want to do an operating system upgrade on darkness itself. Exactly. What does that look like?

It's like suddenly we're terrified of like, what? Caterpillars or like people feel weird about colors. Here's an old version of it. Like, you know who David Graber is, right? Yeah, sure. So was he on the show or no? No, no, every, you know, I kind of embarrassed myself with him because, you know, he's an esteemed scholar

and my attempts to interview him collide, like he agreed, which is already like intense for me. But then my, my attempts to interview him collided with just, you know, my dad passed away when we had a Thanksgiving. Anyway, not yet. Yeah, got it. Well, so he has this book called Fragments

of an Anarchist Anthropology. And in it, it's a very small, it's a small short book. It's great. Just read it, especially because he has really big books. That's a really small short one. It's really powerful book where he's writing about certain indigenous cultures. And he's like, well, they are sort of egalitarian,

but like what you're not noticing and what you can't see. So they're more egalitarian than our societies as the constant war with spirits and sorcerers that's going on in an invisible plane. That's where the violence goes in a way, you know? And so that's, that's a version that pre, like for pre-existed, but it also exists now. So let's not just pretend that's all in the past,

exist now in certain indigenous cultures. But I would like to get to a version of that that's, that works via like this sort of Western path that a lot of us have been on. Like what would happen if we began to see the spiritual beings and forces that were behind the things, you know, like the obstructing kind of archon or whatever that's in the way of like seeing that this end of the world

is, you know, not that different from any of the other end of the worlds, but we have this new being that's fucking with us. What would the, the obstructing being, because think about the darkness in this way. It's like a being standing in front of the source of light. Like, so I want to see the outlines of those beings and be like, get the fuck out of here.

You know, now I can see that light. Oh, but when I turn this way, there's another being there. I want to encounter these other spiritual beings. So I can, in a sense, the old ones that were obstructing the light, I can give them what they need and be there for them and be loving to them. So they can also be redeemed

and do what they need to do in the world and in the cosmos, right? So it's not just about me. It's also about giving them what they need and helping them, you know? This, it sounds like what you're saying is we, we take, take like what are just considered, I don't know what you call them, tropes,

the societal problems that are in the zeitgeist right now. The mimetic spread of this new climate change eschatology. That sounds, I don't know, I hope I used all those words right because I'm not sure they're all right. So, but, and give them a personality. Give them a gestalt, a spirit, a being. So now the sum total of all the like fear

related to some impending climate-driven apocalypse, it becomes an archon. It becomes a living, breathing being that we could communicate with directly through some imaginative process. Is that what you mean? Yeah, well, I wouldn't say give it. I would say see, see it.

It's already there. It's already there. That thing in our experience in the West, it looks like the terror that we're all gonna be up to are necks and fucking Fukushima water. But on another level, its name is Gavra Das Noat. And it is the God of-

Exact terror. Yes. And then on another level, it's Shiva. And then on another level, it's God, right? And then, yeah, at exactly another level, it's God. And then on the ultimate level, it's you. Yeah, right. And so it's like choosing which of these

you wanna land at and how you wanna relate to it. Do you wanna relate to it as one of its messengers to go around and say, I am an emissary of God, I'm here to tell you that we are fucked and you better freak the fuck out because he demands our fear. And if you're not afraid, you're not listening. If you're not angry, you're not listening.

You must offer him your anger for it makes him strong. And there's a chance that if we can appease him, the world won't end. So it's just looking at it in these different ways. Or do you wanna be someone who's like, I'm not quite sure. That God on this Jamaz and Nalda is as powerful as he claims to be.

Bias Fibar, Bias Fibar, you know nothing. Take you have not looked into the tome of Nonaris or whatever, right? So on one level, it is quite like that though. And this is why I do love the supposition in Buddhism, the concept that all dharmas are empty, you know that. And on every single level of reality, from the level of God's down to us,

everything is impermanent, changing, and ultimately empty, including like Buddha and the dharma and all of it. Someone told me this story when that particular sutra, which I think is the heart sutra was first spoken, is a great story. Who knows if it's real or not, but the monks around the Buddha who heard it first just died.

It was so potent to deconstruct everything that it literally just killed, like people just slumped over. Now, who knows if that's fucking real or not, but I like this idea because it's first it's like, okay, if we identify the spirit behind the phenomena as a living sentient entity, it really produces new ways to interact with it.

Totally. So how, are you suggesting like some ritual to communicate with it or something? There's some of that. It would be different for each kind of being. I mean, just to add on to what you're saying real quickly, I would say that we notice that our old solutions don't work, right?

Like we notice that liberalism isn't working, socialism isn't working. We notice that the problems that we have that just environmentalism isn't working, like things that we thought might sort of help us along. We notice that they're ineffective. And part of that is that our refusal to engage with these things as beings allows them

to overwhelm all the old solutions that we have, right? So now if we begin to sort of identify what they are and there are ways to do that, and mostly they require a lot of inner work and sometimes inner work individually, but also with groups and also refinement of the personality, I can't stress that enough. I do not like people do magic and meditation

and all this kind of shit and they don't do anything to make themselves better people. So it's just complete waste of fucking time. But when you start to encounter them, they'll all have sort of different needs, right? Right. So like, I think the main one right now to deal with is this being called Ariman.

And I think I've brought him up on this show before I've certainly bring him up on my show sometimes. But I just, I just record an episode with someone who won a MacArthur Genius Award, right? And I'm trying to tell her about Ariman. And I just realized like when I was done, she's a writer, she's a brilliant person. But I was like, I was like,

this person thought I was in cloud fucking Cuckoo Land. I thought I was gonna say this guy's shit. Maybe not, like maybe actually she really, we are very friendly and I love her. But sometimes when I talk about these things, but this is the Duncan Tressel family. No shit. What you just described is almost every conversation.

Yeah. Right. So if you think of this being as like a total algorithm, right, like reductive, scientific response, love is all just chemicals in the brain. You know, like running on, like seeing the same fucking things all the time, going to movies that are spectacular,

but have no emotive like connection, all these kinds of things. Imagine those is like, like the milk will run sour and the lamb with three heads will be born. Like as Ariman draws closer and closer and closer to incarnating, these things start to happen because it's like they're growing and assembling his body.

Oh my God. It's like these are. His body's made of shitty movies? Yes. His body's made of algorithms, shitty movies, over deterministic science. Oil spills. Oil spills, yes.

And our wrote responses to things, right? So it's about denying our subjectivity and pulling it into an exactitude of language. So everybody's using the same words, the same expressions, the same like, you know, like just go on Twitter or whatever and see everybody saying the same fucking thing, right? Like you see them saying these words,

that's actually a moment where Ariman has entered into their speech pattern and emitted it, right? That's what happens. That is so creepy. It's creepy, right? Like mass spiritual possession manifesting is the repetition of phrases like, well, you know, at the end of the day.

Yes, totally. Or waiting for the asteroid to hit us, right? Like, so sometimes it can seize the content as well as the like expressive style. So wait, hold on. The modern world, I'm sorry, I just want to paint some pictures of what you just told me. So the modern world is like a temple

and within it, we can hear the reputation of certain mantras. Yes. And if you were, imagine, a thousand people in some technological temple all sitting there saying simultaneously, just waiting for the asteroid to hit us, just waiting for the asteroid to hit us,

just waiting for the asteroid to hit us, just waiting for the asteroid. And they're all possessed by some fungal, fucking sentient, horror thing. Wow, all right. Or like make it less obvious, you love to see it. You love to see it. You love to see it.

Like, you know that phrase that people use on Twitter like broke, woke, bespoke, broke, like these kinds of things. Like, and it's not that these phrases are bad, right? It's the unconsciously, it's the unconscious utterance of them, the way that we're sort of drawn in. And we're emphasizing the phrases, but it's all sorts of things.

It's the scientific worldview that reduces everything into chemicals, emotion, all that kind of stuff. With Arman, something you can do today, just today. And you don't want to do it too much because that will bring its own problems, but speak poetically. So in other words, like shake off the shackle of literalism and repetition when the word occurs to you, say it.

So like, and instead of ignoring it. So when you're like, when you go to a movie, this is such a weird example, but like, if you're like, oh, that movie, it just, you know, instead of saying like, oh, it was really cool. The characters were cool, the blah, blah, blah. Like instead of sinking into the exact language

that everybody uses, instead weight your speech towards your subjective experience. Like, oh, I just felt like I was kind of like swimming in this weird like thick water as I watched that movie. Say that. And you can't do it all the time. Cause if you do it all the time, then you fall into the problems of another being,

which is also problematic. We won't talk about him. Lucifer. But anyway, it's just to say like, do you little things in your day that reaffirm your subjectivity against the repetitive objectivity of this being that's sucking everything towards it, like iron filings,

you know, as it starts to sort of frame its shape. And you know the fucking followers of Aramon, because they're the ones when you come out of the movie theater and you're like, that movie kind of made me feel like I was one of like, I don't know, a million six salmon swimming up a polluted river into like a dog's asshole. They're gonna be like, what's wrong with you, man?

Totally. Boy, you're one, are you okay? Are you okay? That's one of the things, you know, to me, having like on Twitter by now, pretty much any horrific thing that could, many horrific slings and many, many terrible things have been said to me.

And most of the time, it's like, all right, you're just, we don't know each other and you've created something. God, I still can't, I find it so cloying when someone's like, are you okay, man? It's like that fucking concern trolling thing, just because the way you're expressing yourself doesn't fit in to what you're talking about.

The litany of Eremon, which is made up of just trite, basic, hyper-compressed, linguistic statements that everyone is muttering together as they numbly parade through their sad, fucking hypnotized lives. It just really, really drives me up the wall. You know what I mean? Are you okay?

In other words, you've asserted your subjectivity, so I'm going to pathologize that. Like expressing your individuality is pathologized. That's fucking, that's intense. It's a little thing you're saying and it might be a blip to other people, but you've seen it so many times because of the position you're in.

You can see that there's an urge, a cultural urge to pathologize you being yourself. That's what happens when you do too much DMT, folks. Yeah, that shit, yeah, that shit. It's like, and it is such a really dark invitation, people like that are presenting to you because really what they're saying is, fall in line, bitch.

Totally. Pipe down, fall in line, shut the fuck up. You're being too loud, prisoner 974419763. What are you saying? That doesn't make any sense. What you're saying is wrong because it's not what all of us are saying. You've got to buzz like the rest of the fucking hive.

So that's the other side of it is express your subjectivity in ways that you can and that feel correct to you and also have compassion for other people expressing their subjectivity. Take an interest in them. So if they say something to you that sounds crazy, like here's a really easy one,

like anti-vaxxer stuff, right? Where it's like, whatever you think about vaccines, I'm not gonna take a side on this or that. Of course, like to me, it's the most moot point because I'm homosexual, so you guys can do whatever and I've been vaccinated to do whatever the fuck you want with your crazy, measly bullshit.

But like, instead of being like, you fucking science ignoring idiot, blah, blah, blah. Instead, take a minute and say, what is the meaning? What's the value here for this person? And if you can understand them immediately, this person is one of their kid to die. Like they might be really,

they still might be endangering other people, they might be endangering their own kid, endangering themselves, blah, blah, blah. But that's fine, that's a separate issue and you can solve that in a different way if that's your belief system. But can there at least be this moment of taking an interest in other human beings?

So speaking poetically and taking an interest, those are two very simple things that you can do. They're also very difficult to initiate, but once you start doing them more and more, and I think it's something that drew me to you before I knew you. I heard, like your podcast, my favorite podcast before I was on it.

And so I was very thrilled to be asked, but shortly before I was on, I forget who you're talking to, but you were talking about being in a room full of comedians and you brought up God. And he was like as easy and sorry or something like that. He said, was like, oh, come on, man, like what the hell? You know, like, so you're in a circle of people.

I know you're talking about it. Do you know what I'm talking about? Yeah, okay. But I do know your time. But it was like a stop, stop right there, you know? And it's spiritual on me, oh yeah. Years ago, I, years ago, I heard you say that and I was like, this is like someone I really wanna talk to

because this kind of conversation precisely is the kind that is going to face the field of incessant buzzing, white noise that will drown out everything until all we speak in aesthetic. Whoa, that's a beautiful way to put it, man. And it's just like, we want censorship to be more obvious than it is right now.

Because at least, you know, then you have a thing to really repellige and spend, yeah, when you realize the censorship isn't, don't talk about, don't say that you don't like the United States of America. Don't say that you don't like the president. When it's like, actually the censorship is more along the lines of what,

you need to, in any given conversation, if you're talking about the world, try to express at least a little bit of fear about what's happening to the planet. Because otherwise, you're not fully like on the team that you need to be on. And it's oppressive and I wanna jump back by the way to...

Wait, can I just say one thing? I just wanna, I really think we need to flip that line that's like, if you're not outraged, you're not paying attention. And it needs to be now like, if you're outraged, you're not paying attention. You know, like, the outrage is the sign of non-attentiveness now, you know?

So let's start going there. Well, yeah, you're not paying attention enough to like, cause many people, if they're outraged, they haven't done even the slightest examination of what outrage is. Like, what does it feel like to be outraged? What are the components of your outrage? Just for a second,

pull in the limbs of the outraged turtle into the shell and like, look at the thing itself. And it's a very, it's pain. Being angry is very painful. So in the same way that you can find some compassion for vaccine conspiracy theorists or any version of anti-science people, but especially the vaccine thing,

when you go upstream from that, they love kids and they want kids to be okay. And similarly, if you look at the staunch vaccine people, identical, they want kids to be okay. And when you look at the people who are really freaked out about the world today, they want the world to be okay. And so, if you just go a little upstream from anybody's

particular fear dam, you will find love if you go far enough up. Totally. And that- That's a beautiful way to say it. It's like a river that's been obstructed by these structures that people build because they have this sense

that it's not gonna keep flowing, so let's protect what we've got, I guess. I don't think that's a very tortured analogy. Maybe it's more kind of like, if you go upstream, you get clean water, downstream, this gets progressively more polluted as it flows by the subjective cities people have built in the terrain of their consciousness,

they're composed of all the, what in Hinduism is called the samskaras, the layers of the symbol sets that have been adopted by them through the contagion of mass media. And then that, the love river starts getting polluted by fear. And then the next thing you know,

what do you get when you mix love and fear? Fucking anger. That's just how you make anger. You wanna make anger? Mix love and fear works every fucking time. Yeah, I love this. Just go a little bit upstream because I've been thinking about the flat earth people

lately and just like how dunked on and ridiculed they are. I don't believe that the earth is flat, but I do think that there's like, if you actually sort of take what, what's the meaning here for these people? Well, look, we live on a planet that appears to us to be flat and like the sun revolves around it, right? Like that's our experience.

And so then you have a scientific narrative that says, no, that's not it. This is what's happening. You are encountering people who are like, I want to be part of the way we define the world. I want my experience to matter, right? I want that to be included in our picture of what the earth is instead of vanishing it

in favor of a theory. Now, the problem is they're not loving themselves enough to see that that's what the actual impulse is too. Like you gotta turn it inward and be like, oh, that's me as well. And then, so I think you can do that with even the craziest things that we can consider. This is why I always say lately, as above so below,

it's like you can extrapolate from our own experience much bigger societal desires. I think the flat earthers are here at number one, let me just, not that you shouldn't be compassionate to all beings, but let me explain. Not all flat earthers, but I found out that flat earthers look down on hollow earthers. Oh.

You know what I mean? So when you realize there's actually a hierarchy, a weird like hierarchy of earth shapes and at the bottom is the fucking hollow earthers who get fucking completely railed against by the flat earthers at these weird conventions, then it's easy to, you're allowed to, you're allowed to benevolently mock flat earthers.

PS, DT here, my sweet friends, I am hollow earth adjacent. I have the dream of a gartha. I love reading about hollow earth stuff. The sun in the center of the earth, I'm not gonna go off on a hollow earth rant, but I love the general practice of when you come into contact

with any particularly stigmatized POV, no matter how virulent it may be, even motherfucking white supremacy, when you find a white supremacist and you swim upstream, you're gonna find like this, there's just love back there, even them. And now what are we to do? This is the problem with fucking having kids.

This is one of the things that like, it really messes you up in a very specific way, which is, and I remember years ago, there was a Tibetan monk who came to my college and gave a talk, and the premise of the talk was, if you understand your mother and the love your mother had for you, and then you understand that every single one of us

has been a mother to each other, because that's how long we've been incarnated, then from there, you can begin to really derive from compassion, but because I had, with my mother, a wonderful relationship, but a very turbulent one, I guess you could say, from time to time, when I heard that, it was really hard for me to connect with it.

But now when I see my wife with the baby, or the way I feel like the baby, and you realize every single person started off like that, with a mother who was looking at the baby, with the love that is in all the paintings, and the baby looking at the mother with that very same love, and you realize that's every Nazi,

that's every serial killer, that's maybe not everyone. I mean, some serial killers are thrown in a fucking barbecue grill or whatever, right out of the vagina, I guess, but in general, when you realize that that is the initial condition, and then you run into any of your most difficult friends or non-friends, and just have the fucking guts to drop down into your heart,

and think about their moms, you know? Think about you fucking their moms. I'm sorry, I had to do that for you. You have though, that's the reincarnation thing, is we probably have all fucked our moms in past, like our parents were our lovers, like this is like a really hard thing to think about, it's like, they were lovers too, we were in love, you know?

Oh yeah, yeah, everything. Totally. And you've killed them. And you've saved their lives, and you've been like leaves falling together out of a tree, and you've been like butterflies flying about, and you've been launching mortars at them, and you've been all of it, exactly,

but when you just, the moment you pull out, just to pull out, god damn it, man. I'm not even, it's now it's in you, it's in me now, the fucking dad jokes, I didn't even mean to do that one. When you look just a little deeper past the outrage, and you realize like you're angry because you want the world to be filled with love,

and to be working, and you're angry at people who want the same damn thing, but they think the way to achieve that is different than you. Oh my god, what are we gonna do? We're all running after the same thing. We all want the same thing, we all come from the same thing. Ha, fuck, it messes everything up

because the whole, I think, Aramon trip is one of like just, for the whole, for the structure of Aramon to stay cohesive for all these rotten parts from the shitty movies to the scientific materialism, to the torturing the grand quality of reality by shoving it into like essentially doing foot binding to reality itself.

When you realize that the thing is glued together by the sense that if someone doesn't think the way you do, there must be fucking nuts or crazy or wrong, then you simultaneously witness, oh shit, there's the chink in the fucking armor right there. The whole thing falls apart the moment we're able to look at each other and realize, oh, we're of love wearing a mask of error.

And Aramon is his own sort of love as well, right? And that's really, yeah, and waiting for us, waiting for us to be loving enough to it that I can discard these old responsibilities, which is to bring something to us through all these things as to bring a new kind of light to us because we have to overcome this form of darkness and become something new and deepen our capacity

and then encounter the next being, which is way worse, by the way. What? What the fucking crazy video game are we playing here, Connor? I know, yeah, it's Bowser, but it's intense. But I think that everything, love is, yes, love is the key to it, right? And maybe there's something beyond love

after this era of humanity goes on too, but right now, this really is the thing. And it's so hard for people to deal with that because they think what you're saying is like, well, just express some love and feel some love and give that gesture of love to the Nazi skinhead. And then everything will be fine. But of course, that's not for closing

on any of these other options that are available to us. If a bird gets in your house, you throw a towel over the bird and you take it outside, or if it's a bat, maybe kill it, I don't know. Put it in a cage. Yeah, you deal with the immediate, you deal with the, Yeah, put little sunglasses on it, take pictures.

Have it right up your hole and let it fly out into the sun as you sun your bee hole, your bird hole. But you have to take these immediate actions sometimes when there's a very frantic situation in front of you and sometimes that requires things that don't look like love. But make that the thing you lean back into. You're not losing anything to do that.

I don't get why people think that these two things are in conflict with each other when in fact, it's always, you'll take better actions if you do the thing that you're talking about. Okay, this makes me think of something that I think Rogan told me because he's into samurai. I haven't read it myself, so if I'm wrong about this, it's yet another thing I'm wrong about.

But I think it was Mio Matu Musashi who wrote the book of Fiverings. I think in there somewhere is this idea that if you're going to engage in a sword fight with someone to kill them, you're gonna win if you really love them. Oh, I love that. Yeah, it's like by addressing a virulent piece of shit, like some societal monster, it doesn't mean

that by looking upstream and finding the love, you're also condoning their fucking shitty POV or whatever the fuck they're doing based on that POV. But really what it's going to do is it's going to give you a more detailed psychological map of this particular thing you're up against. Because you'll notice a lot of these people that are presenting not love,

they're presenting generally a cold, expressionless face that is the thing you're looking up at while the fucking boots are stomping into your face. But when you realize it's behind there, oh my God, behind there is just like a fucking sad, broken-hearted, devastated, terrified thing. And behind that is just love. At least when you fucking finally managed

to surprise them in an alley and stab them. What do you finally get it? And you pull the mask off like Scooby-Doo at the end, but it's like a corpse. You're like, love was robbing the old mill and now it's bleeding on my shoes. Look, love was dressed as a Nazi. Love was like swoops.

Now it's a skeleton. Now it's just a skull. Creepiest serial killer on earth. I'm going to take your mask off skeleton. There's nothing there. Yeah, I mean, I think, I think, I think that there's, you know, it's very tricky because it is true and you can sense it

but as soon as you stop doing that, you become the thing that you hate, right? And yet sometimes you have to become the thing that you hate to overcome it. You have to go through. That's what our reincarnations are about. Like I have gotten information from two spiritual teachers recently

that I was a really, really, really bad person in a certain lifetime. And I'm still dealing with some of that stuff. But you have to go through that. You know, it's like you have to be, you have to go through the eye of evil to be able to understand it in your next lifetime. And it's like as many spiritual masters have said,

like to become sort of enlightened or to, I actually don't like the term enlightened, but to become a spiritual master or whatever, you had to have been a really, truly vile black magician in a certain lifetime, right? You have to because you got to get it. And if you're not, it's also not a choice. Then there's no intention behind it at all.

You're just sort of automatically promoted through this like stare, you know? And to that point, I wanna say, I do think that some people are truly evil people. I think that there is real evil that, and I think you and I have talked about this before, but it doesn't come from a wound. It comes from choosing very intentionally

to sort of align yourself with these beings that we're talking about in a counter sense to humanity and what everybody else is doing into compassion and speaking poetically and all these other things. And you decide to be this kind of black magician based on all that. And then you decide in the next life and then you decide in the next life.

It's not just one lifetime, but it's with such intensity that it carries into the next one and into the life between death and rebirth, it carries into that space as well. And you just keep doing it and you keep making these decisions and you retain a sort of memory of it. But that's so rare.

It's so rare that it's almost not even worth talking about because we're mostly dealing with the wounds. Now there are some people who I think are spiritually developed in a certain way that their task is to deal with those kinds of evil people and you have to do something different with them than you do with the people who are wanted. You have a different set of actions to take with them

and in some cases. You mean sorcerers. Yes. And in some cases their souls end up being consigned to oblivion and are actually obliterated. You think so? Yeah, yes. But not in a way that actually eliminates their spirit.

There's an eternality there that you can't take a piece of God and like, right, you can't. That's actually what they wanna do. That's actually what these black sorcerers wanna do is invert themselves, like to obliterate their own self. Because when you do that, you eliminate a part of God which means you destroy the entire universe. Holy shit.

So. Wait, you mean for them they look at it like those, they look at it like a amoeba. They're amoebas that have wrapped around a little fragment of the divine and they wanna fucking eliminate it completely somehow. Right. And that's possible.

By destroying their own souls. That's how they do it. If I keep doing black magic, I'm eliminating the chance for me to be. How do you define black magic? It's a real alignment with these other spiritual beings. You might start sort of unconsciously at first. Maybe just do something to hurt people.

There are black magicians who do stuff to get people in car accidents or hex other people or like whatever it might be. But then over time is awareness grows around that kind of stuff. So it's doing those things with a certain kind of intention. So it's doing those things, doing it with intention and then discovering these other spiritual beings

and deciding to work with them and developing the occult knowledge but deciding to never work on your personality. So you're moving more and more and more and more and more away from the part of yourself that is God and illuminating that. Nobody's succeeded so far in destroying their own spirit. But if it happens once, the entire universe is gone.

Oh my God. You mean that's like the splitting of the atom but on a metaphysical level. Exactly. It's like the opposite of the Christ. It's like the, it would be the emergence of some kind of like, well actually weirdly there is a phenomenon that I've heard about.

One of the worries in, what are the worries if we start fucking around with nanotech or with AI and nanotech is that it's called like the gray goo apocalypse, which is like sentient nanobots start reconstructing matter itself to try to perfect it. But in that perfection, their assessment as perfection is just to dissolve it down into some muck,

which is the planet just instantly turns into just goo basically because the nanobots are like, it's goo, that's how we finish goo, back to the goo. We're just like, you know, having your coffee and just suddenly you're just done, just splattered goo. Now, I kind of love that a little bit. Well, I mean, it's not the worst thing. But it's also, that's so materialistic.

It's like our being is not our physical body. So like, even if that happened, like we'd still have plenty. Turn the soul into goo, oh look, a soul, turn it into goo, the souls are goo, it's always been goo, it's always goo. This is one of my favorite theories, I've never heard of this.

I think I fucked up the description, I'll show it to you, it's out there, look up like it's, and I can't remember if it's gray goo or black goo, but it's goo. So, but a sorcerer is like, this is interesting and one of the main figures in Tibetan Buddhism, you know, he was a sorcerer, he used his black magic to kill his,

I think, family members. Yes, this is the person with the stones, like he had to move the, yeah, go ahead, tell the story there. Yeah, that's the story. Well, that's the idea, it's like he had to do these like crazy penances to burn off the karma from doing that stuff.

This is definitely, I think one of the tools I use when I find myself particularly frustrated in life is I bring to mind that, oh right, this incarnation is me moving these stones because no doubt in many past lives, I was, I definitely would have thrown fireballs at churches for sure. Jesus Christ in this life,

thank God I can't throw a fucking fireball, because if I could, I don't know, honestly, I don't know what I would have done. And when I was a kid, you know, who the fuck knows? And so, but I think sometimes when I do find myself in a bind, I think, oh, I'm gonna be patient with this, because who knows what I was doing? I might have been burning witches,

liquefying fucking cats, and grime, I don't know. But I know, and who gives a fuck? I know in this life what I've done, and there are many ways that I've been with people in ways that I'm not proud of, with my mom and my brother. You know, and I think that it's a useful thing to, and I think it's an honor to,

it gives you a nice sense of like, holy shit. Okay, I guess I must have been like Sauron or something based on what's happening to me right now. That's pretty cool, I must be powerful. And then think, I'm not gonna do that again. I'm not gonna do another whatever it may be. I'm gonna try not. You don't want that to happen to your kid,

which is your next life. Like, my next life is my child, you know? It's like, you have your child here, of course, but then there's your child that is you the next time around. You don't want that to fucking, you don't want to have to go through that. You wanna leave gifts for that being. Yeah, exactly.

In the form of whatever your thing is that you do, you're leaving a present for your next incarnation. Little breadcrumbs trails out. Did I say breadcum? You said, yeah, bedcum. Little bedcum trails. Just leave a trail of bedcum for your future self. Just, this is the synopsis of our conversation.

To me, Connor, I really value our friendship. And this conversation just really like, every time we talk, it gives me, I think about you so much, man. I think about your philosophy. I think a lot about like, you introduced me to Steiner and just the general beautiful way that you look at the world.

And it's like really, I think all the time about stuff that you've taught me regarding emotion and feelings and that the way you feel might be completely special, might be beyond language in the way we normally are able to describe things. And I think you really are in some way, I don't know if you, what would you call yourself?

An enemy of Eremon? Like a dragon slayer to some degree in the sense that the thing you put out into the world it would be an existential threat to any being that is wanting us to express ourselves in a boring, fucked up way. Well, I hope, first of all, thank you for saying all of that. And every time I talk with you,

it does feel like, I hope people who listen to these conversations feel this way. It's like there's this moment in the religious services I sometimes go to where the person up front turns to us and says, Christ in you. And it's this sort of cleansing moment. Like I feel like there's this sort of flash of cleansing gold light when I talk with you.

And so I leave and it's been reoriented in certain ways. And it's really helpful to me, but not just helpful, but it feels warm and loving. So thank you. And I want to just say that last part, what we can do is not just fight the enemy, that's important, but align ourselves with the spiritual beings that are doing that really high level work.

And one of them is the Archangel Maikael. And this coming year, probably when this episode comes out, this year is a Maikaelic year. We're being asked to really align ourselves with Maikael. And one of the ways you do that is by doing the difficult spiritual work on your own without expecting any of the spiritual world to come save you.

Interestingly, when you do that, you align yourself with the spiritual being and you strengthen his ability to do what he needs to do in this kind of communication, communicative battle with Araman. And so these things, people who are listening, speak poetically, be compassionate for other people, talk to the dead, this is very, very, very important. And I know your spiritual teacher just died Ram Dass.

Talk to the dead, it doesn't have to be Ram Dass. It can be somebody that you knew briefly that died, it could be whatever, but they're waiting. And what that does is it turns you into somebody who's deep in their capacity to engage in the spiritual world through acts of faith, devotion, care, hysterity, all these kinds of things. It brings so much to you.

And the dead are waiting for you to do that. And think about, how do you talk to the dead? It's, well, talking to the dead is easy, is you just talk to them, right? Like you just talk to them, you just start talking to them and listen. But when they speak to you, they speak in your own voice. And very often the things you say to them,

you're saying as them. So like the sound sort of weird. So as you speak, that's very often their words. But the best way to align yourself in the beginning, before you speak to them, think of something they said to you that was encouraging. Actually, do you wanna just do this real quickly to close out the episode?

Let's do it. Okay. Okay. So the first thing I wanna say about talking to the dead is when they die and after they die, try to reorient your thoughts. So it's not, I wish you were here, I wish you were here, I wish you were here.

And instead think, I'm grateful to you for what we have. I'm grateful. I'm so grateful to you for who you are and what we have. Okay. So that is, first of all, just sort of pulling you out of this one frequency and putting you in another. The other thing to do is think about them

saying an encouraging thing to you. Can you remember a time in your life when they said something encouraging, even if it was you look good today or something like that? Can you hear them say that? Yeah. Okay.

And hear them say that, feel that, okay? And then this is for when somebody dies recently. Now Ram Dass was pretty advanced sort of person. So he may not need this help. A lot of times dead people need help right after they die. It's difficult, it's a big transition. It's the loss of everything they know.

And so you can do this to sort of help them. But for Ram Dass, it may just be, I don't know. I don't know him, but it may just be a way to show him love in this time, okay? So Duncan, what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna read something to you. And I just want you to say it inwardly, like repeat after me, okay?

So I want you to imagine that, hear that encouraging thing in Ram Dass' voice, okay? Got it. And now I want you to speak the full name of the person to be addressed out loud. Richard Alpert, Ram Dass. Okay. And now I'm gonna read this,

but I want you to say it inwardly, okay? In the light of worldwide thoughts, now weaves the soul who was united with me on earth. May the warm life of my heart stream out to your soul. To warm your cold, to mitigate your heat. In spirit worlds, may my thoughts live within yours and your thoughts within mine. May my love be interwoven as my heart's offering

in the sheaths that now surround you. Cooling your heat, warming all your cold. Live, love upborn, light raid on upward. The love of my soul is reaching to you. My love's pure sensing is streaming to you. May they bear aloft and uphold you there in hopes wide heights, in loves clear spheres. Into spirit pastures, I will send the faithful love

which here we found, that we might be united soul with soul. So may you find my thinking ever-loving when from the spirit's light filled lands, you searching, turn your gaze of soul to see what here in me you seek. Now, I want you to hear Ram Dass's voice saying the following to you. And it is his spirit speaking to you through you. In radiant light, it is there I feel the power of life,

for death has awakened me from spirit sleep. Oh, I shall be and do from out me what radiant power within me shines. I was united with you, so remain united in me. Together, we shall speak the speech of eternal being. Together, we shall act where the results of our deeds are at work. Together, we shall weave in spirit

where human thought is woven in the word of eternal thought. Say amen now. That's beautiful. That's from Rudolf Steiner, but I used it when my friend, Lynn Margulies, died, and I felt no separation. We did it every day for a few days, and also I read to her from a text, you read it from a spiritual text,

but you read it inwardly as if you're sending it to them each night. Totally beautiful. Totally works, completely. Yes, until appear more and more to you as you do this. I'll send you that. I'll post it. I'll post it. Okay.

Wow, man. All right. Thank you. That was an unexpected emotional wrecking ball. It's time for us to do these things. Everybody who's listening is time to not just talk about how cool and weird psychedelic spiritual shit is and how funny. And I know a lot of you are not doing that.

I know a lot of you are doing real stuff as well, and that is the seed of real stuff too. And it's time to let go of fear of not believing or fear of being stupid. And just try if you have that fear. But take these words in, and especially if someone you know has just died, do this, do this.

And if someone you know died a while ago, talk to them. Tonight, after this is done, just stop and say, hear them saying something encouraging to you in their voice, and then say hello, and just say what you need to say. And do it often because this is what's being, this is what's missing. You wonder why our world is scary now, why we can't see hope,

why there's something in the way and a being standing in front of that light. And the fact of the matter is this is what's missing. Speaking to the dead, speaking from our own subjectivity, showing compassion, this is what's missing. So let's begin now. Conor Habib. The best.

Thank you so much. Where can people find you? I mean, in this room. Yeah, in your thoughts. Against everyone with Conor Habib, against everyone, not everybody or everything, against everyone with Conor Habib is my podcast. It comes out three times a month, four times a month,

and I have a Patreon, patreon.com forward slash Conor Habib, c-o-n-n-e-r-h-a-b-i-b, and that's the only way my show is funded. And I love doing the show, I think it's useful and helpful, and I would love for you to be a part of it, so please listen to it and be a part of it. All the links are going to be at duckatrestle.com.

Thank you Conor, I love you. Thank you Duck, and I love you too. Thanks for listening everybody. That was Conor Habib. Definitely sign up for his Patreon. You could tell from this conversation that he is a brilliant human, and he is putting out wonderful content

on his Patreon page, and it's a great way for you to have a direct interaction with him, and I'm so, I feel so lucky that he's my friend, and I could just call him up. Also, he's out there in Ireland, and I'm sure he could use as many subscribers as he could possibly get, so he could finally move into that castle

that Inya lives in with all those cats. Also, a big thank you to our sponsors. All the links you need to find the offer codes for any product you heard us talk about today are going to be at duckatrestle.com. If you like the podcast, won't you subscribe, and don't forget, I'm going to be at the Denver Comedy Works, the Arlington Draft House,

and a lot of other places on the East Coast coming up in January and February. You can find those dates at duckatrestle.com. I love y'all, and I'll see you real soon. Hare Krishna! A good time starts with a great wardrobe. Next stop, JCPenney. Family get-togethers to fancy occasions, wedding season two.

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