Duncan Trussell Family Hour - 466: Raghu Markus

Episode Date: October 3, 2021

Raghu Markus, the person who literally introduced Duncan to Ram Dass, re-joins the DTFH! Check out the Love Serve Remember Foundation's 50th anniversary celebration of Ram Dass' seminal work, Be Here Now! Live on October 24th in Los Angeles, and streaming online! Click here for more info. Original music by Aaron Michael Goldberg. This episode is brought to you by: BetterHelp - Visit betterhealth.com/duncan to find a great counselor and get 10% off of your first month of counseling! Quip - Visit GetQuip.com/Duncan to SAVE $10 on a new electric toothbrush. Amazon Music - Visit Amazon.com/Trussell and get your first 3 months of Amazon Music FREE! BLUECHEW - Use offer code: DUNCAN at checkout and get your first shipment FREE with just $5 shipping.

Jessica. This is the happiest day of my life. Right up there with the day I bought my RV and insured it with Progressive. Man, I love that thing. There are a million fish in the sea, which I'm reminded of every time I bring my RV to the lake, but I vow to love and cherish you. Just as much as I cherish campsites with full electric and water hookups. I'm so sorry. Protect your beloved with an RV policy from Progressive. Take as little as four minutes to see what you could say that Progressive.com, Progressive Cancellty Insurance Company and Affiliates. Are you repeating the same relationship patterns? Find yourself with the same kind of person over and over? Are you feeling attacked by this ad? Is though I've been watching the horrific hell loop that you find yourself stuck in, therapy can help you figure out why. Visit betterhelp.com forward slash dunk it and break the cycle. This song goes out to you. I know who you are. I'm watching you.

I'm watching you. I'm watching you. I'm watching you. I'm watching you. I'm watching you. I'm watching you. They think it was trying to communicate through vibration, but ultimately the family of Mackenzie decided to just pull the plug and the asshole perished. And now a prayer from Mackenzie by Rev.

Oh great eternal spirit, please comfort us and bless our hearts. Allow us to see through the veils that we understand that that which is gone is but temporarily gone and that which is here shall not remain. Alighten us in a way that will give us the compassion and peace necessary to our poor neighbors and to forgive those who has harmed us. Most importantly may we not turn into quivering massive assholes on the floor of some Berlin apartment trembling and queefing away and eventually removed from life support. Let us understand that there is but one law of power and that is the law of love. It is the only law of power that offers us the hope of never mutating into a terrible, stinking, giant, quivering anus. Amen. For those who aren't familiar with Reverend Gertz, he lives on a 300 acre compound in Idaho and here's a note from Reverend Gertz to my listeners.

The Lord has commanded me to send this message out to the seven nations and all the churches of the land. I am seeking a new wife, a wife who is fertile, young and ready to endure the awful burden of sex that must be unleashed upon her so that we can create more humans. Wife applicants must be of legal age and comfortable with the burden of oral sex. Sincerely Reverend Gertz. Well there you go folks, looks like a pretty great pandemic opportunity. If you feel the call, go ahead and apply and maybe you could end up being impregnated by one of the great reverends of our nation. We've got an incredible podcast for you today. Raghu Marcus is here.

We're going to jump right into it, but first this. I want to thank Quip for sponsoring this episode of the DTFH Friends. We are truly nearing some Kurzweilian singularity because now we have the Quip toothbrush which doesn't just do a great job brushing your teeth with its sensitive sonic vibrations. Two minute timer with 30 second pulses for a guided clean. It's multi-use travel cover that doubles as a mirror. All that stuff's great, but it also sends you rewards for brushing your teeth. In the old days, the only reward you got was your teeth didn't rot out. Now, thanks to Quip, you can get free products, gift cards and discounts from Quip and their partners.

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That's $10 off smart electric toothbrush at GetQuip.com slash Duncan. It's G-E-T-Q-U-I-P dot com slash Duncan. Quip, the good habits company. Thank you, Quip. And we're back. Now, I'd love to invite you to join my Patreon, but I think you've already felt the call. Look, I don't need to remind you of what's going on out there. You know that some of the greatest musicians on our planet are being attacked by wild boars. And it's only a coincidence that if you sign up for the DTFH Patreon, then you could hang out with us for our weekly meditation group, which is called Journey into Boredom.

Not B-O-A-R, dumb, but boredom. Look, I have to read this. My attorney's telling me to read this whenever I do the Patreon plug, which is we are not responsible for any of the wild animal attacks that have been happening across this planet. There is no correlation between these animal attacks and not subscribing to the DTFH Patreon. We do not have a device that we uncovered in an ancient burial site in Iraq. We do not know how to pronounce Iraq. So that's what I got to read. We hope you will join your family at patreon.com forward slash DTFH. I don't think it's too late to join us.

We're actually working on an anthology of erotic cryptid stories right now and you could get in on that. Again, it's patreon.com forward slash DTFH. And now everybody, please welcome back to the DTFH, the person who literally brought me to Ram Dass. He drove me to Ram Dass' house where I got to hang out with him. He runs Ram Dass' foundation. The Love Serve Remember Foundation and they do incredible events, including the Ram Dass retreats in Maui that you always hear me yapping about. They've got one coming up. If you're lucky enough to be in LA, it's on Sunday, October 24th.

Starts at 10 a.m. at Wisdom. You can find all the info at Ram Dass.org. It's a huge event, basically a festival that ends with an amazing evening concert with Krishna Das, John Forte, East Forest, and Justin Beretta from the Glitch Mob. So it sounds super fun. If you're not going to be in LA, they're going to be streaming it. So you can go to Ram Dass.org and register and watch it from wherever you may be. Alright everybody, now welcome to the DTFH.

Raghu Marcus. Welcome! Raghu, welcome back. Duncan, thanks. I can't see you. Great to be here again. I smell because of COVID and I've been asking Aaron to like describe smells for me. What about taste?

I still somehow have maintained my taste, which is really weird. I wonder what's better. I think having your taste is better than... I mean, you've got to lose one taste. Oh, gosh. For sure. Taste is way... I mean, with smell, it's more embarrassing, but you're not the one...

You know what I mean? You can't smell yourself. So it's like just people are probably being polite around me. You know what I mean? Because I know sometimes I get... I come home from the studio and Aaron's like, you stink. And I'm like, oh, shit. And I can't tell.

But this... It's fun to get people to describe smells. I'm realizing. And one question... I've asked you a lot of questions about meme curly baba over the years, but one question I've never asked you. And as I can recall, I've never heard anyone talk about it at the Ram Dass retreats.

What did meme curly baba smell like? Out of all the questions that could be asked about such a thing. I mean, it is... I think very recently I did say to somebody, I don't know why it came up. Maybe same reason, COVID, losing your sense of smell. Yeah. And everybody that you would talk to,

that you know from the retreats or whatever Ram Dass is friends, they will tell you the exact same thing. So it's not me and my subjective thing. It's basically a baby blanket. Wow. So when you got close and you had your head in that, if you managed to get, you know, and just the blanket was everywhere.

So it was like not that hard to... Yeah. And yeah, it was amazing. Absolutely amazing that it had that, which you know so well with a baby and a small child. Luckily I could still, if I really shove my nose into Dune's hair and smell, I could smell that smell. And it is the, it has got to be the greatest,

the baby's smell is got to be the greatest smell there is. That is amazing that he smelled like that. You know, this is something before I, I didn't know what you would say honestly. I thought maybe you might say incense or something, but this is something... There was not too much incense around him. I've heard this like, I've heard this before,

that like certain beings that like, it's not just as though you like emanate something or it's not just like everything that comes out of your mouth is like authentically loving, but that your smell changes, that everything about them has shifted in some way. Now wait a minute. Okay.

Can I tell, you just said, you know, like a being that's no longer caught in us and them. There's no polarization. Okay. That level of a being, you know, people might use the word enlightenment or whatever, but so, and that nothing would come out of him except just words of love and wisdom all the time, right?

Yes. You just said that. Yeah. So, I mean, this is a weird kind of intersection with what you're talking about, but it so happens that I've been working on a film of one of our mentors. I think you know K.C. Tawari.

Krishna talks about him all the time. You know, somebody who was a regular guy, who was a school master and wore his tie and jacket every day and yet was a knocked out yogi with powers that nobody knew about. Right. It's extraordinary. It's worth it.

Hopefully, people enjoy it's worth a view. So, he, in this film, Tawari describes one day, it was a special day, one of the high holidays of Hinduism or whatever, maybe Durrapuja in the fall, which is coming up actually. And Tawari went, so they have a fire ceremony and in it you are offering up everything through different elements of yogurt and rice

and fruit and so on. It's a, you know, and it just goes on like 12 hours and this constant swaha, you've heard swaha? Yes. It's the, here it is, swaha, swaha. So, Tawari told him suddenly, he hears this voice yelling out from across the courtyard. Right.

And it's Nim Karoli Baba, it's Maharaj. And they had, I had to get this translated. I hope I can find the damn thing. Yeah, here it is. Would you like to hear what he says? You know, it's a little bit of, you know, putting it into idiosyncras terms. Yeah.

Shall we say? Okay, so that's the picture. You get the picture, Tawari's out there. And Tawari, part of this. I can't see the picture. No, I'm telling you the picture. There's no picture. Oh, okay.

In your mind's eye, you see this fire ceremony with people around it in this, in this small hut in the middle of the foothills of the Himalayas. Just imagine that. And then, so Tawari goes there, who I mentioned is really a knocked out yogi. In other words, whenever any kind of representation in any way of the divine presence comes around him,

he goes into a deep absorbed state where he is not, there's no pulse, you hear about it, you read about it in books about, you know, these kinds of states, they're called samadhi. Yes. And so he would do that all the time. So he's out there, and as soon as he sits down,

he's gone. And then, but he comes to, and he hears this voice screaming from across the courtyard of Nim Karoli Baba going, enough swaha, swaha. This jerk is dead, meaning he's in a trance. There's too much swaha. Swaha has been done too much.

God is dead from hunger. While you, you jerk keep doing swaha, swaha. That's the exact, you know, pretty exact translation that we got of the Hindi, because we did, I knew a little bit of what he was saying because I speak enough Hindi, but yeah. So that's the words of love and wisdom from Maharaj. Which basically it is true, because what he's saying is,

you can do these rituals from here to forever and repeat, you know, all these mantras. Unless it's coming from a place of real depth. This is me, by the way, talking. I'm interpreting this. This isn't him saying this, anything. But unless it's coming from a much deeper place, it's just like meditation or anything.

You're just doing it and fulfilling a function that you have created on a day to day basis. So the only good thing is that one day you will wake up. We do wake up. You know, it might take 20, 30 years. I don't know. Or lifetimes. Yeah, or lifetimes.

Well, certainly lifetime. But just to wake up enough to have awareness and any kind of spaciousness within the practice rather than I'm doing this is, so yeah. He was just hitting out it. You think you're doing, you're just doing these swahas, right? Great. Very good.

You know, I found, I listened to you on Instagram, Neem Karoli Baba talking. I'd never heard this before. I've heard him chanting Ram. But he was talking to a family and I read the translation. And the translation was exactly as Ram Das talked about how he would get frustrated sometimes because Neem Karoli Baba would ask him

what we would think of as mundane stuff. You know, I would want to talk about the news or I would want to talk about, you know, earth realm stuff. But you know, listening to his voice, it's just so powerful. And it helps not knowing what he's saying. A deep thank you to Amazon Music for sponsoring this episode.

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Thanks Amazon. Just hearing the rhythm and the sweetness in his words, and then when the translation was, he was just like help advising a family. He was saying to a mother, he was asking if she still yells at her child. She was saying to him, not anymore. You told me not to be angry with him anymore.

So I'm not anymore. And he's saying your son is a gentleman. And then, or whatever that translation is, and then asking her, do you eat at the table? Are you eating at the table? So it makes sense he smells like a child. It makes sense it's not incense. It makes sense that he just sounds like pure human

before all the bullshit, I guess. Well, what we heard people, before the temples were built, is that you or me? That's me. I think I live near like someone who's very sick because the fire trucks are always going there. That's great.

So he used to stay with families all the time. He did not... I mean, it's pretty terrific. He was just taking care. They told me, these people who he stayed with, he took care as if he was involved with everything, from the kid getting a cold and not being able to go to school. Actually, his own daughter,

we said, what was he like as a father to you? And she said, all I know is he did things like, he would walk me to school and he would hold an umbrella over my head to protect me from the severe sun where they were. And that's all I remember. I only remember kindness and like that. Nothing else.

It's all of it is very in opposition to each fact that you might find out like that. But it made sense to all... Who cares about any of this though, Duncan? Gee whiz, is this sounding like a... Well, it sounds like more of a conversation I might have privately with Christendass and we just talk about the old days.

I just wanted to talk about Niam Koli Baba with you. And I think, yes. And I think people... I mean, because I love the stories and having a family now especially, before I had a family, it didn't hit quite as hard. But now having a family and hearing the stories and having had moments of like,

wow, just taking care of Erin when she's sick, doing basic stuff around the house. How is this making me the same level of happy that before I would have to like go to Burning Man and be doing all kinds of drugs and like comping and like to not even... And it wouldn't even approximate that. And you know, this makes me think of Niam Koli Baba.

And that sim... And also of Chogyam Trumpa Rinpoche and his teaching on spiritual materialism, this idea of like, look, we can cut through all of this lofty bullshit and get to a really simple sort of place that isn't plagued by all the bells and whistles. So that's the...

Yes! Be here now. There we are. You should write a book. That's a good title for a book. You can't see what I just did because he doesn't put this shit up on YouTube. Well, I was thinking actually about... Of course, this being the 50th anniversary of Be Here Now, the book was published in 71.

Wow. And all the stories that are around that and how this has been such a, you know, definitive part of who Ram Dass is as a teacher, has been as a teacher till his death and as it goes on day to day. I used to laugh with him when you're not here. You know, nobody will know

because we just keep putting the same shit out all the time. So we do develop new things because we have a lot of good friends that are great teachers from Jack Cornfield and on. And Christian Dass, so... But the reality is that... I started thinking about this is just a... Like we got the trademark for that term just.

You know, who had it? An insurance company. Wait, you've trademarked the term Be Here Now? They trademarked Be Here Now. So they had control over its use. Oh, my God. So somebody found out, wait a minute, we can't let that happen. That's terrible.

And we actually managed after a couple of years. They weren't really that interested in the bottom line. So then just... So you're talking about this being that we were so fortunate to be around all those years ago and the way that it was just complete present all the time and presence. So I started thinking about Be Here Now

instead of just as an aphorism. But what are we really talking about in terms of the efficacy of it? And I started thinking of present, being in the present moment, the most obvious thing. We're not thinking about the future and not thinking about the past. And what happens when that stops, that back and forth

and then maybe there's enough of a slowing down so that you actually start to feel something. So the feeling something is the presence. So it's like present slash presence is really what Be Here Now is. And that's what Ram Dass experienced the first time. He went to India with this being named Karoli Baba. It's what we all experienced as well.

And it was invaluable to be around somebody who was no longer in time and space. In other words, no longer in polarity. No inner polarity. You know, this is actually in the UFO communities. One of the descriptors that is popping up now is extratemporal instead of extraterrestrial. Something outside of time coming into time

to hang out with all of us timelings. So is that how you would describe him, extratemporal? In those terms, yeah, absolutely. It was not somebody that you could recognize that way. That thing didn't talk to you the way we can talk to each other. There was no teaching going on. It was more being. And of course he would say things that became aphorisms for him.

Sub-ec, it's all one. There is only one thing going on. But he didn't say any of that. He'd point his finger and go, it's all one. So he was just driving out of this mind shit through those aphoristic, if that's a word, things that he said. But the level of it beyond the words and the simplicity of it is extraordinary.

And by the way, of course we all did very mischievous and stupid things. Never mind just the shit that was in our heads. So everybody out there, Duncan and I did something one time in a retreat and they had let me play the harmonium they had and our friends and so on. Anyway, it was fantastic harmonium. And more expensive than anything you could ever dream of in India. But Ed German reads, it was really good. And so I was appreciating it a lot.

So Duncan, through the goodness of his heart, actually gave it to me as a present later. It was based on a story of me with name Karoli Baba. One of us, one of the Westerners at one time had made a lot of stamps of pictures of him. Fun things and we all had them and he used to take them and then he'd give me those stamps and he'd give them out to people and everything. And of course he'd give all of them to the worst representative of the group or something, you know, some egomaniac guy you were judging, you know, whatever. And so one day I was across the courtyard and I did have some with me

but I had already used a bunch of them so I didn't have much. And he yelled out, anybody got any stamps? Through the translator of course. Maharaj, you want some stamps? Oh, okay. And I took this sheet of stamps out of my bag and this is no fancy mind reading, nothing like that bullshit. I ripped the stamps, the sheet in half, right in front of him. And I gave him half.

He looked at me like I had just done the worst thing that you could kill the guru or something. I mean, he looked like I really made a, I mean, are you serious? And then he threw them back at me. It's a good thing I didn't commit suicide right now. I was rather embarrassed and completely, you know, even as I repeat it, it's like horrible. Anyhow, I went back, I was back there with the same stamps a week later and anybody got any stamps? I gave them everything.

He looked at them and he looked at the translator and then he looked back at me and he did the thing, you can see him in pictures, which is point his finger up. You know, it's either, it's all one or watch out Schmuck. It's more like that was. So, and then so Duncan wrote, thanks for the, well, thanks for the stamps. Thanks for the stamps on my harmonium, which is still there. Well, because ever since then you have been giving us stamps in the form of these incredible retreats and bringing everybody together and all the insane work you do to keep the stamps flowing.

It's no simple thing to wrangle a bunch of boxy hippies. I'm sure and get somehow like get them to harmonize enough to do it. So yeah, a minute. Thanks for the stamps. I mean, I wouldn't be wondering how named Crowley Baba smelled if I didn't have you as a friend. That's a wonderful friendship qualification. It sure is. It is what it is though.

It's called satsang and we're a community, so we're really fortunate. You become so nice though after all these years. What happened to that other guy? We had so much fun. He ruined me. I did. Doug, you catch me on, catch me on like a low blood sugar day. I'll be a complete fucking asshole.

I just feel, I just feel happy today. Don't worry, Raku. I'll tell you what, I'll call you the next time I'm deeply angry and paranoid and yell at you. Now, but why the fuck are we so scared of this present moment thing? David Nickton was telling me it's called the fourth moment actually in the sense that really though by the time you're like, wow, I was just in the moment. You're not in the moment anymore, but there's this out of out of time and space place fourth moment, whatever you want to call it. But why the fuck are people seemingly so adverse to being in that place to the point that they had to travel to India to be around some being that allowed them to experience that or be in it or people have all kinds of quests they go on just for a taste of this thing that's theoretically in you is you all around you.

Why are we always trying to evade the place where theoretically all things are like new and reborn and pure and everything smells like a baby. Well, the fact that it's already right there, it's there. You just got to, you know, jive with it. It's the advice. You'd become an advice a little bit or that's an advice question. It's already here within us completely. There's nothing to look for nowhere to go and nothing to do but realize that fact. And if anybody can, that's not a path that I have any real connectivity with that young path, honestly.

Although I do believe that especially Tibetan Buddhists, you know, you and I have affection for Tibetan Buddhist philosophy and their version of reality jives best with whatever projections and beliefs that I've developed. Yeah. And so but the reason that all of us and we all do it where we turn away from the present and the presence is because it's and it's very analogous analogous to a psychedelic trip where at one point the letting go there is a letting go. There's a little trigger there. And the fear is that you won't be around to protect this eye. Me, me, me, me, me. Yes. You won't be around.

Yes. Who the hell is going to manage this thing? You know, and already got a tremendous amount of events systems built in to protect everything, you know. So that the idea of losing separation, which is our habitual pattern is very scary. Yeah. Very scary. Now, in a moment to moment, like there are people who might get with. I won't, I won't say Maharaj in this case because it too set apart as somebody that you can't even get to without some tremendous karmic predilection, whatever I should suppose.

I don't really know. But I'm talking just about like getting with somebody who like Ramdas. Yeah. And who's available, who was available and so on. And there's a way in with as soon as you get into that presence of somebody, he's just, he is just being here now. I mean, he then the being here now was completely tied to connecting in the love part of each of me, of you, from him. It was all one thing and it was all interconnected because he wasn't afraid to be there. And, you know, how he would just pull you in with his eyes and just stay there.

I mean, many people though would advert. So you would virtualize because it's just, I don't know if I can go, you know. Yes. I just don't know. I don't, I don't feel enough trust. And that's how. So that we get back to what you and I have talked a lot about, which is the importance of trust absolutely need to find that intuitive trust inside ourselves when and then meeting any situations. David Nick turn would talk about then meeting with any phenomena takes on a completely different hue and a different relationship, a different perspective from that place.

But okay, fear is real. And we all have tremendous ways in which we defend ourselves from all sorts of things related to our roles and identities and our relationships and all of that. So I think that what we all need to do is find that place where we can start to do as Trump or Rinpoche talks about a lot around meditation, create a gap. And if we can get that, that gap precludes chasing and believing these thoughts. So once that gap is there, we can create enough spaciousness so that we are way more open to the power of, in this case, using Ram Dass as an example, you would sit there and just, just become goo with him. And there wouldn't be any fear. Wow. I want to thank Blue Chew for sponsoring this episode of the DTFH.

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That's bluechew.com, promo code Duncan to receive your first month free. Visit bluechew.com for more details and important safety information. And we thank Blue Chew for sponsoring the podcast and also I thank them for continuing to send me their wonderful, chewable, magical, boner blasting tablets. And there wouldn't be any fear. Wow. Well, it's like, you know, it seems like we live in the age of not trusting. We live in an age of cynicism, bitterness, loneliness, and a kind of what you call deconstructive nihilism or something where it's like people are... just not trusting anything at all.

Is this some projection or something? Like, I mean, surely it makes sense to not trust people. There are certainly people who are most definitely counting on you trusting them so they could exploit you. Certainly you shouldn't trust that. Like, and I think maybe people have had so many disappointments from, you know, the world that all of a sudden what? So I trust this guy, you know, Ram Dass or I'm supposed to trust this teacher, that teacher or whatever. How? How to overcome, you know, all the lifetime of gradual growing paranoia.

At least, you know, having been like steeped in the global geopolitical climate that we've all been steeped in over the last probably our entire lifetimes. I'm going to say, well, how would you feel if you were locked in a room for a year and a half? Boy, it'd get paranoid and that's what's happened to a huge population, worldwide population. So looking at that is, it's good to have a way to look inside when you don't have nothing else going in after, you know, you can't watch that much TV. So it's good to have a way to look inside to see what is behind. Potentially, of course, you have to understand there is something that's behind our senses, thoughts, et cetera, et cetera. So unless that happens, unfortunately, that wheel will will continue and very difficult to get beyond that paranoia. And the polarization, well, we are living it.

I mean, what we've done to the environment, which is part and parcel with what this virus is and the way it's behaving. It's like it's got its own personality or something. Oh, yeah, now we're going to feel, I just read something. Today, we're going to figure out the virus goes. How do we get this aerosol thing going a little bit better? So it's smaller and it's going to be harder for it to be warded off and much easier to transmit. I read that today. What do you mean?

Someone's trying to do that? No, the virus is doing that. It is morphing so that it's the way in which the aerosols. Yeah, yeah. Any help? But wait, I want to, before I forget. And I, and in the, to go back to this concept, which is so incredibly simple yet, maybe because of its simplicity, incredibly confusing, the sub-ec idea, all one. Who is trusting here?

If we're, you know, trust, and it's, we're talking about, I guess, when, when, when they talk about ignorance, they say it's actively ignoring. This kind of trust sounds like a verb to me. It's like, is it a verb? Is it like, in other words, and I like the closest I can come to it. I mean, I've certainly felt that around Ram Dass, and I've certainly felt that around the entire spiritual community, my own paranoia and fear, my own grudge holding, my own, like, I'm not going to let them in. I can't, I can't. I'll be destroyed feeling. But what is that that's, that's pushing back?

What is the, what is the part that is not trusting? And what, if you had to describe the action of trusting, who is doing that action? If it's true trust, and it seems to me, there is, it's not a thought, it's a feeling. It's not a thought. Oh, I can trust him now. I mean, I go back to, I use Ram Dass as an example, because it's the most glaring example led me to India and all that, in terms of real trust. But it wasn't that. It was trusting.

There was a place where I absolutely was 100% certain that his being in this field through, through his, you know, we were just engaging through eyes and being in that, that field. So once that started, I'm just thinking back to, you know, what it was. And I had it other times with other, with him and other people, but a certain kind of timelessness. Now it's okay, we can just, I can just be here. This is cool. Yeah. And unconditionality. He's not thinking about me.

There's no judge. And there's nothing going on. He's just here. I don't, I don't know Ramda. I only met him that moment. So I had, there was no baggage in any way whatsoever. And I just, that was the moment. It was just that.

So later on, I can tell this story and say, so that created tremendous trust, which is more of the thought. And that's after the fact. It's after the fact. Because we're talking about this. It's like, you know, I love reading about neutron stars, crazy shit, crazy shit. These things are so dense. Once something gets pulled into it, you're just, you're part of the star now. Like there's no whatever, whatever chunk of meteor asteroid or whatever, you're just in the new, you're in it.

Maybe that's what truth is. Truth is a kind of neutron star that once you're in the truth, trust is an afterthought. Yeah. No, there's no thought. Yeah. That's just. You don't trust gravity. It's not like when I'm jumping up, I'm like, oh, are you going to let me come back down this time?

Yeah. Yeah. That's a perfect example, I think gravity and being up in one of the ships that these people are all going up as tourists. And, you know, the feeling of, I have to imagine a floating like that, the freedom and letting go isness. Letting go, it must be exhilarating beyond anything. And that's a perfect example of being in the moment. Being in the presence is that, but everybody's had that, I think, at one time.

It may get, you know, maybe when you were a kid and it got, then it got beaten out of yours. Yes. Or whatever, or you're crazy, whatever families do to each other. And, but I, and then eventually maybe, you know, you used psychedelic as a therapeutic thing. Yeah. And then that moment shows up. Once you, but once you get them, however you get them, for me, it was John Coltrane.

It's my famous John Coltrane story of hearing him and going out of my little. 17, 18 year old body, whatever. So it can happen anyway. And once it happens, then, I mean, for me, and I know you as well, I don't want to be miserable. And I was miserable. So now I, there is a something. So how do I get that something? Right.

And that's what led, you know, that's what that trust is in the moment, not the person or not the thing in the moment of where there isn't me and you. And there's just this gooey unconditionality. I would call it gooey unconditionality. Yeah. I probably, the heart Krishna founder used to really roast space programs in general. Really? He thought it was ridiculous that humans were so attached to their body that they were putting

themselves in cans, as he would put it, to go out of the planet's atmosphere for a little bit and then come back. I thought that was ridiculous because it was a complete misunderstanding of what humans can do spiritually. And Terrence McKenna used to make a joke about one of these massive telescopes trying to find alien life because underneath one of them, I can't remember which one, psilocybin mushrooms grew. And he would say how funny it is that like they've spent all this money on this equipment

to scan the skies for advanced life when just underneath these radio telescopes are something that if you eat them, you can talk to beings in the astral realm or whatever. I think there's something cool. I would never say no if someone invited me to go into space, but this state of consciousness or this ground of truth or fundamental goodness as it's described in Tibetan Buddhism. I think it would make the experience of being in an anti-gravity field pale in comparison to a simple reacquaintance with just where you're at right now. This is maybe one of the almost tragic qualities of humanity, right?

That the problem is everyone's off to the races imagining what's on the other side of whatever. Or it's in this person's pants, or it's in this bag of powder, or it's in this whatever the fuck, very expensive house somewhere. And it brings me back to this thing I've just been speculating about, which is why the fuck? Aren't people, and I don't mean it in a sanctimonious judgmental way because I'm one of these people who, if I haven't taken enough acid, God forbid, so I'm there on the precipice of being annihilated and clinging to the, clinging like a dog being taken into the vet.

You know what I mean? Like fuck this, I'm not going. Or even should I be at these retreats sometimes? And you know, during the kirtons, and even worse, I'm not on acid. But somehow there's that sudden like, what is this? I'm being vacuumed up into something, or I'm already part. If there's enough of me left, all it wants to do is go fuck this. So why argue?

It's just a perplexing condition, I guess. You know, it's like, why would it be that there is accessible theoretically at any moment to anyone who happens to be in a human body this place that we're already at paradoxically? Why aren't we hanging out there more? You just go, whoever thought of the whole thing, talk to them, okay? So I don't know. I think it's all crazy. Come in, come in, just go through this raft of incarnations to get back to the one.

And each one, you're running through all of the stuff that you hadn't quite run through in the previous incarnation. And you kind of realize it too. You know, realize Jesus, this didn't come from anywhere. Where the hell did this? I know this wasn't in my household, my parents. And boy, so you start to realize, you go, oh, for God's sake. And it's the ability to find the, this is Robert Thurman would talk like, find the bliss within the reality of being a human. And so the fact that we have, we reach, that's, and my favorite Raghas are the, are the reaching Raghas.

Wait, will you tell folks what a Raghas is? A Raghas, sorry. You know, in India, they have so many different melodic patterns that represent, you know, waking up in the morning and having evening, calming down, getting more rhythmic and so on. They just have something for each season, for each moment in the day. I mean, Indian, just they're incredible. And so they, each one of these things is called a Raghas. And it just has its own unique melodic pattern, note pattern, shall we say.

So there's one that's all about longing. And it's my favorite because, and then they use it in musicians like Jay Utah, he's been adept at you. In fact, I hear him still playing, just coming up with different things that have that particular pattern that does that particular thing, which is what we came here to do is longing to get back to that spacious, non-judgmental, loving, kind place. That's what it's all about. No escape. Now that's the brilliance of it, you know, is that once you, and I remember because, you know, Krishna Das just bombs me every once in a while. The most simple things out of the blue, right in my ear.

Then I'll walk off and I'll think about it for years. One of them being when he told me the longing is the grace. And I just will never forget that moment. And because, you know, I think a lot of us, we get confused and we think we're depraved, profane, or we must have fucked up because all we can do is long. That's all that's left, you know. And to hear folks like you, or even to know now there's like actual melodies. Yeah. That's representing.

Yeah. It's incredible because I don't know that people realize that is also a beautiful place to be. But would you say it's synonymous with being in the presence of Neem Koli Baba or sub below that experience? No, as he said, it's all one. You get to that place where you just aren't moving into reaction of all of your thoughts and emotions. You get to a place that's behind that, which does happen and this music will. What it does is it invokes this thing, deep thing in you that you remember. You remember the wholeness.

Yeah. And your whole full intention goes into expressing that. And when you express that, and the expression, by the way, can be just listening. It's not, you don't have to be doing, but you have to get so far into the moment of listening, which is just another meditation. The thoughts just stop the daggering of your mind so that you grab onto and believe them. That stops. And that's why music is such a powerful thing. That's why Krishna Das has got the kind of following he has because music is so powerful.

First, your thoughts stop and then there's this place that you're recognizing and you're just fully embracing and just allowing it to carry you on its rhythm, its notes and the power of the mantra. So that is a very, it is something that we brought back, you know, from India and is most represented by in our little tradition with Krishna Das and Jai Utah, I would say, in terms of the people that were in India. And that is exactly true. The longing and being in the moment where it's being expressed, either through listening or actually chanting or whatever you may do is the same moment that you can be with being like Ninkaroli Baba and Ramana Maharishi and all of the saints and siddhas of India. Yeah, it's the same, absolutely the same. And once we get that, then we can trust it and stop being so outrageously cynical and polarized. Because you can trust the longing. You might not be able to trust someone around you, a person or whatever because of your karma, but you sure as fuck know when you're longing for that specific thing.

You know, and because it is the most and it is beautiful and it is powerful. And, you know, I just think that there's a paradoxical delight when you start realizing that somehow there's a connection. The longing is a connection. It's not a disconnect. The feeling of being disconnected, at least for me, is like a numb, cynical, shitty, bitter feeling. Whereas the feeling of longing to, you know, for me. It is the landing. Yeah!

The land that, you know, the land that high board jump swimming thing. You're going to land it. Yeah. Or land, gymnastics, right? I know what you mean. Oh yeah, because they have to know. Right. I forgot the name for that.

When you lose your, there's a name for when you don't know where the ground is anymore. And it's like, if you don't know it, you're going to wipe out. That's the disconnect, you know? And yeah, right. I see what you're saying. Wow. Holy shit. That is so cool.

It's all in that. Yeah. It's just in that. It's not in what you think might happen once there is a landing in the way that you project. It's just not, it's so great to lose that whole attachment to thinking that we know anything. Yeah. Really good. It's a really good thing.

Yeah. Be here now. Be here now. And we're going to do this at the Wisdom, which you already mentioned. That's right. Yeah. Wisdom. Yeah.

October 24th. And it's going to be live stream. And we're going to have incredible immersive films and speakers like Jack. Jack's going to join us. Jack Cornfield. And I'll be there with Pete Holmes, our mutual friend Duncan and others, Trudy Goodman and Mirabai Starr. And then at night, there's going to be this incredible concert that will feature Christian

and us and John Forte, our newest member of the Love Surfer member family from the Fuji, who just is putting out an incredible record. And East Forest and Justin Beretta from Glitch Mob and Nina Routh. You'll be able to, I asked Duncan to come, but he wouldn't do it. I'm in family land right now. He's in family land. On the East Coast. The point here is just go there and register for free to get the stream.

Okay. Ragu, thank you so much. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. That was Ragu Marcus, everybody. Make sure you go to ramdas.org and register so you can watch the Wisdom event on Sunday,

October 24th. Thank you so much to our sponsors, Quip, Amazon Music, BetterHelp, and of course, my beloved Blue Chew. And thank you all for listening. I'll see you next week. Until then, Hare Krishna. Get fixed up with brands like Liz Claiborne, Worthington, Stafford, and Jay Farrar. Oh, and thereabouts for kids.

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