Duncan Trussell Family Hour - 479: Alexandra Tweten

Episode Date: December 10, 2021

Alexandra Tweten, author and creator of @ByeFelipe, joins the DTFH! You can follow @ByeFelipe on Instagram, find the book on ByeFelipe.com, and learn more about Alexandra on AlexandraTweten.com! Original music by Aaron Michael Goldberg. This episode is brought to you by: Coinbase - Sign up at coinbase.com/duncan and receive $10 of Bitcoin for FREE! Bespoke Post - Use code DUNCAN at checkout for 20% off your first order! Unit - Visit UnitWorkers.com/Duncan to learn more about unions and start teaming up with your fellow workers today!

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Don't matter if you've been good or bad. Because you're going to get a new stepdad. A new stepdad for Christmas. Happy day. Happy day. Happy day, friends. It's me, Dee Trussell. I want to say, first of all, thank you for listening.

I'm so excited to be washing up on the shores of your ears and laying there like some beautiful, yet very bloated whale blasting out sweet music from its slime-covered fungal blowhole. Of course, that was Ruby Stylus' new stepdad for Christmas. It's a remake of the classic with the same name, New Stepdad for Christmas. Interestingly enough, the lyrics of that song

were written by Theodore Kaczynski when he was in high school. I'm so happy that you're here. We got a wonderful podcast for you today. Our guest, the wonderful Alexandra Tweetin, created a website years ago called by Felipe that took off. The website displays the generally terrifying responses some guys give to women when they've

been rejected on a dating app. Here's an example. I used UberDuck, which is an incredible website that turns famous people's voices into a deep fake to record one of these exchanges between somebody who's upset because the person they want to have sex with doesn't want to go out during the pandemic. You seriously not willing to meet over this virus?

I'm not putting people's lives at risk for my personal wishes. I'm deaf, bored, isolated feeling, but I like myself enough to spend some alone time and get the shitty American health care system a chance to handle the crisis. Get the fuck off this app and get the fuck out of this country. All I wanted to do was to come on your media looking face. We had a wonderful conversation, not just about by Felipe,

but dating in Los Angeles and the general weirdness out there right now when it comes to finding love. And if you're experiencing the pandemic dating blues, then this is the episode for you. We're going to jump right into it, but first this. This episode of the DTFH has been supported by Coinbase. I've been using Coinbase for a very long time. If you're interested in crypto, curious about crypto,

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that are coming up. I'm gonna be doing Stand Up in Austin. That is happening January, the weekend of January 8th at Vulcan Gas Company. All the links you need to find tickets will be at duckatrustle.com. Nashville, I'm gonna be there the weekend after Valentine's Day.

We only had two shows. They sold out, so we've added two more shows. That's at Zanies in Nashville. If you go to their website, you can find tickets. Again, the links will be at duckatrustle.com. Also, won't you subscribe to the DTF Patreon? It's at patreon.com, Ford slash DTFH. And now, everybody, here with us today

is the creator by Felipe and the author of the book by the same name by Felipe. This is Dick Picks and Other Delights of Modern Dating. She's got a wonderful podcast, V-Single. Now she's here with us today. Everybody, please welcome to the DTFH, Alexandra Tweedon. ["Welcome to the DTFH"] Welcome, welcome on you

That you are with us Shake hands, no need to be blue Welcome to you It's the duckatrustle. Alexandra, welcome to the DTFH. Thank you so much for being here. Thank you for having me. I'm so excited.

You know, it was so cool hanging out with you at EDC. It was. But then, I think I was yapping about by Felipe to you. And you were like, I made that. It was the craziest. I was so starstruck because it's one of the places I like to visit on the internet from time to time. Marvel at how fucked up it is out there in the dating universe.

But that was pretty weird synchronicity. Yeah, it was weird. Yeah, it was really fun hanging out with you and Erin. I was so excited to just... The day that we kind of took off, I was just like, yes, we get to hang out with Duncan and Erin. But it was so cool. I mean, honestly, hanging out with you all was like part of

what made us want to move back to LA. Just like, we just having like, you know, a chance to have... The conversations we're having were so fun. I know. At least the ones I can recall. We had a lot of fun. We did. First of all, could you just describe what,

for those folks out there who might not know what it is, could you just describe what it is? Yeah. So I started the Instagram account by Felipe in 2014. Seven years ago. But it was just like on a whim and like a stupid joke. And it calls out men who turn hostile when rejected or ignored. Because I was having a conversation with a bunch of friends

on the internet and we were like, why is it that anytime a guy hits on you, you just expect, like, if you're not interested or you say no, like you're just like waiting for that moment when they're like, well, fuck you anyway, or like you're fat or whatever. And it's something that women just internalize and like come to expect. And we were just having a conversation about that.

And I was like, yeah, why is that? And then people started sending me their like screenshots of like terrible things. They've gotten on dating sites. And then I just posted them on Instagram so that we could all make fun of them together. Is it this thing that like when guys, when you reject a guy and he immediately starts insulting you,

is there like a type of guy that does this or is it across the board? Like, is it just a sort of universal thing? Like symmetrical dudes or something? You know what I mean? You feel like a cut, like who are humping constantly or is it just across the board? You know, I thought that like maybe I could figure out when I

wrote my book, I was, I kept getting these questions like, who does this? Why? Why did they do this? And I thought like maybe I can like figure out some sort of true line of like, or, you know, something they all have in common. And I don't, I don't know.

It's just, I think it's guys who have are deeply hurt and like, there's something wrong there. But like, there's not really a way to, if I look at a guy or if I see, like some look like, oh, they definitely would do that. And others, I would never have guessed. And I don't really, I don't really know. When I was dating, my assumption is I'm not, you are not, we are not going to have sex.

That was it. So if I was getting rejected, there wasn't like, oh, you, boy, if you fucked your life up, it was just more like, yeah, yeah, I get it. I'm kind of weird looking and I know what I look like. But it's, to me, the thing that's like wild is like that some of these guys are like, seem to be so legitimately shocked that they're usually fairly gross flirtation is being knocked down.

Yeah. And you're like, you're like, in what situation did you expect that to work? Yeah. Yeah, right. Does it ever work for you? But it, but you like just, you think it must work. Does that, does it work?

Like it must work. Right. I mean, the reason that someone would be like that, wouldn't it be because at some point when they said to some person, I just wanted to come on your mediocre face, the person wrote back and was like, you know, all right, come on, let's go get a drink. Now that you put it that way. Yeah.

I am not sure. But I think, I mean, I think I've read on, on like, you know, the like pickup artist websites, you know, they think they call it like a numbers game. And like, if you just message a bunch of people, like maybe a cup one out of hundreds will respond in the way they want. Right. Yeah.

Yeah. Right. Like the, yeah, this is, well, I can remember when that book, the game came out. I read it. Did you read that book? Yeah. I actually have met Neil Strauss.

Wow. Cool. And yeah, I, the game is horrible, absolutely horrible. And, but you know, then he did write the truth and he did like a 180 and like went to sex rehab and was like, the game is like not, not good. Too late. Too late.

Too late. He's like the Oppenheimer of dating or something. You created this thing. Unless you can get all those things off the shelf. But you know, when you're, when reading that book and being like desperately horny, you read that book and you're like, but then you get to the part where it's like, give him a, go into bars with like bags of colorful rings.

I don't know if you remember that part. Like pathetic shit where you've got it. I think, I think I mostly just like skimmed it. But no, you go into one of the things, one of the tricks is you go into a bar, you've got a bag of rings, somehow using what's it called neuro linguistic programming. You tap someone on the shoulder while getting them to talk about some nice thing that happened in their life.

Then you tap their shoulder again later on so that they don't know why suddenly they're feeling good again. Then while they're like that, you've essentially, it's like tenderizing meat or something. And then when they're like that, you reach in and hand them one of your liars rings and say, listen, you know, this ring, I know you've got it on and you're like, this ring is good luck for me.

Look, I just think you could, you should have it because you deserve good luck or some bullshit like that. Now they're wearing your ring. Then they like a few days later, they see the ring and think of you and it's like triggering that. So you're like hacking a person basically so that you can hump. Yeah, that is such a like long, like convoluted way of just like the of where you could just be a decent person.

Yeah. But no, you have to like go through this whole journey. Yeah. I, in my, as I recall, I have never successfully gone home with anyone after at a bar. And I like, it just has never, I'm not even, not even like within, I'm just never happened maybe once. I mean, but I was years ago and I was much younger.

But, and I think that's probably the general experience, right? Or am I just a complete, am I just a failure at that sort of thing? Um, I don't know. I think I have, I think I've, I've got, no, I have, I've gone home with people from a bar. You have? Yeah. And, and it, that's, I mean, that, that's, that's an exciting

night though, right? That's, that's like a wonderful event. Yeah. Yeah. It's kind of like magical. But like, I only, I mean, I, I've only done it when I was like really into the person and. How do you know you're just talking to them at a, did they give

you a ring? How do you, what did, did you get the, did you ever look back after something like that and think to yourself, did I get like, pick up artists? Well, I, I definitely have experienced like guys that were attempting to do pick up artists things to me in bars and I am like, my radar goes off and I'm like, this feels weirdly fake.

Yeah. This feels weirdly contrived. Uh, and it's freaking me out. Um, so I don't, I don't think I have like taken someone home that used like pickup artists skills on me, but like, I don't know, maybe I have and I don't just don't realize it. Right. But like the last, I think the last time I went home with

someone from a bar, like was a few years ago, I think. Um, and I sort of like made the move because I was in this bar and, um, it was like country music night and I love country music and, um, I saw this guy and I was like, oh my God, that's a hottest guy I've ever seen in my life. Yeah. And I just, I was like staring at him and I didn't think I was. I thought I was like, uh, being not obvious.

Um, but he walked up to the bar and then I walked up next to him and I was just like, Hey, how's it going? Yeah. And then we ended up talking and like we went home. He ended up, he was visiting from Sweden for a month and we ended up seeing each other like every other day for the rest of the time that he was here. And, um, I ended up getting way too invested in that situation

and he was like, okay, I'm going back to Sweden. Bye. And I was like, but can't we like make this work? Oh, what a great month though. That was so romantic. A Swedish cowboy person. Yeah. Incredible.

It was like, I was like, this is my dream. This is my actual dream. It's happening. Yeah. It was magical the entire time he was there. It was absolutely magical. Wow. Do you still talk to him?

Um, no, he, we talked for a few months after he went back and then one day he was like, I was like, Hey, I was like, it seems like you're not really responding anymore. Like what's going on? He was like, I think we should just be friends. And then, um, like a month later, I saw that he had like a girlfriend in Sweden. So I was like, okay, well, that's not happening.

Did you say all I wanted to do was come on your mediocre face? I should have. Yeah, you would have won him back. Oh, he doesn't want to hear. Thank you. But spoke post for supporting this episode of the DTFH. Hey, you know what I'm tired of? I'm tired of all these boxes coming to the house and they're

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up and coming brand. Get 20% off your first monthly box when you sign up at boxofawesome.com enter the code Duncan at checkout. That's boxofawesome.com code Duncan for 20% off your first box. Thank you bespoke post. It seems like something about the volume of these messages really demonstrates more than anything that I've ever seen. Not like for me, it's like, well, I'm not dating anymore.

I'm married and sometimes we'll have a girlfriend or something, but that's a completely different form of flirtation. And it's like, it's definitely not what it was like out on the streets. But the something about the sheer volume of the thing shows this insane difference when it comes to the experience women are having versus the experience men are having. I know that's not the most. I know that's not a groundbreaking statement.

But, you know, but I do think something about by Felipe really drives that point home. Whereas like for me, I'm just going to get no, no response as I recall that happening a lot. Or if there is some response, it's just going to fade. It'll just fade away or something like that. But certainly if I never in the history of dating apps. When I, when I have been the one to not respond, have I been like, has

there been any kind of like violence towards me or a sense of like this person might, might like attack me for not wanting to go out on a date with him. Yeah. And that's, that's kind of like, that's a part of the reason when I started it, I was like, and I started getting a lot of followers. It was like, okay, what is this? And my goals and when I started it were like a give women a voice to like,

you know, talk about this stuff. And because we actually, when I start, I got messages that were hostile. I took it personally and I was like, oh my gosh, am I the only person that this happens to? And then when you start talking to other women, they're like, no, I get that too all the time. And then it's like, oh, okay, this is like a thing. And it feels better to know that you're not alone in this, but like the

secondary goals were like, letting other men know that this is what it's like for women online. And to just start a broader conversation about sexism and how women are treated online, because I would say the majority of guys probably didn't realize that that's what happened. And like, you know, people like you, like the guys, guys that would never do that, they don't realize how often it happens to women. And I don't know, I just always have been wanting to like start cultural

conversations about that stuff. And this was actually pre me too. Right. Right. And then it just, it was, it's kind of the roots part. One of the roots of that movement probably is based on your side or just this dawning. It's like part of the part of the, yeah, conversation.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. It's definitely part of the conversation. And it's a, it's a hard conversation for a lot of guys to, for even me, for me to have, it's a hard conversation. And also, I'm deaf. I mean, I'm far from perfect when it comes to dating.

I'm fucked up. I've got issues. I'm in therapy. I've got fucking, I'm like a mess. I'm a hot mess. Ask Aaron. I don't know how much you all talk, but Jesus, you might already know. But the point, but you know, it's like, but so it's a hard conversation because we,

anyone who's looking at that is reflecting like, oh my God, like where have I been guilty of this in some form in some way? Where have I done a low level? I mean, I've never told someone to leave the country or come on your mediocre face. But like where, where are we at fault here? And then, you know, obviously like how the fuck to, how do we fix it? How, how do you evolve out of it? Yeah.

I was watching some terrible Clint. Do you ever watch Clint Eastwood movies? Yeah. Oh my God. Oh my God. I'm watching this there. Like talk about like things that don't hold up to cultural standards. Fucking Clint Eastwood.

That's horrible. Horrible. But like I'm watching it and you know, just the general way, I don't know. There's a lady just stopped at a traffic light and some guys were like, hey, hey, what are you doing? You got blonde hair. Let me get in. I want to fuck you.

Hey, hey, like seven, like a gang of guys. And then she like says some like sassy thing to their like almost deliverance, like pre-sexual assault scene. If they got, she's like, ah, you go fly a kite and then drives off. But you see that and you see, okay, that was in the media. That was not, it was considered rude to talk to women like that. But it certainly wasn't considered off limits. Right.

It was weirdly and not encouraged. But it's kind of like, you know, that's what a guy does. Cat calling or whatever. You know, so that's our, that's our parents were steeped in that. Yeah. Is that what is happening online still? Like some echo of that? I think so.

Like people are always like, what you, you wouldn't, people wouldn't say this in real life, you know, and I'm like, well, actually, no, people have been saying stuff like that in real life, like this whole time is just that we didn't have this screenshot ability. We were recording ourselves walking down the street and experiencing it. But it does happen in real life. And yeah, I do think it's like, we're not that far removed from the Clint Eastwood movies. Like people think that we're completely evolved from it.

And I think it's still, it's still, I think it's slowly. Creeping out or slowly, you know, I think it is changing for the better, but it's, it's a slow process. Is it a Western? Is it like an, is it, do you think it's, has anyone done a study on cat calling or on like this kind of aggression in other countries? Is it like, so tell me about that. I mean, I can't off the top of my head, but I know that there has been, there have been studies about cat calling in other countries and compared to here and like where it comes

from, I think I, I think I referenced one actually in my book, but now that I've, it's been a while since I read it. But yeah, it's cultural also. It's just like, you know, you see your dad doing it and then you do it. And it's hard to break that cycle. Yeah. Oh my God. I mean, this, but this cycle that you're talking about, it's so, it's, we're talking about two

different types of anger. On one side, you have the kind of like crazy, raging, violent sexual anger that these guys are throwing out. And then at the other side, you have women who are like, this is shit that we've been putting up with since we can remember. And only recently has it been given the massive voice that it's been given, but it's too, it's like one of them seems to be a completely righteous, justified anger. The other seems to be a pathological poisonous anger.

And the two angers are like, you know, meeting right now. And it's, it's scary to watch. You know, and I've got two little, I've got two kids. I've got two boys, you know, and it's the kind of thing that I'm eagerly hoping to teach them not to be like that. Cause you know, when I was coming up, my dad, when I was very young, I think I babbled this to you in Vegas while I was on Academy. When I, when I was coming up, my dad was like really intent on me getting laid.

When I was 13 or 14, you got, have you gotten laid yet? I'm like, I didn't even know. I'm too young to even be like, dad, I'm fucking 14. What are you even talking about? You know, like getting laid. What do you mean? But you look at movies from the time, that time period, and that was like a huge theme for a teen to go fuck somebody.

Is that part of what has produced this thing that you are, that your site is displaying for everybody? Um, yeah, I definitely think it's like how we raise our kids and that absolutely is a huge part of it. But, um, I also think that people are capable of unlearning all the fucked up shit that they grew up with. Yeah. And, um, that's kind of like the, the second, the phase two that I'm sort of working on

is like, so I've been, you know, doing the bi-fleabay thing for so long. And I'm like, okay, but what, how do I evolve from this? Like how does this, what do we, where do we go from here? Because now we've, we're, people know about it. Yeah. And now I kind of want to sort of, I got a lot, a bunch of messages from guys being like, okay, I know what not to do, but now I don't know how to not be an ass or like, I don't know what to do and I don't know how to date and not be an asshole.

And, um, I'm like, I'm working on my next book. I'm like, look, I shouldn't have to write this book. Like it should be like pretty, you know, common knowledge, but people are, people are asking for it. Men are asking for it. So, uh, I'm, I really want to talk about just like, um, how men can be better. And like, even if you're not, you know, cat calling women and, you know, being shitty online, because I mean, probably the people that are going to read my book are not those

people, but, um, how can we talk to men and boys and, um, and get them to process their emotions and, um, let go of this version of masculinity that they've grown up with. That's like a very rigid cookie cutter of what men should be, like what real men are. And like, can we maybe like think outside the box and like be a little bit more creative and like what men should be. Can you describe, like if you had to describe the cookie cutter, what paradigm of what men should be, what versus what, what they could be, what would it, like if you had to write the description of this character for a Clint Eastwood movie and it was the most stereotypical

misogynistic, whatever, how would you describe it? But from now, a modern version of it, how would you describe it? Yeah. I mean, yeah, just look at like Clint Eastwood movies is like the definition of like real men, like they are, they're tough. They don't engage in girly, feminine feelings like, you know, sadness or, or not being tough. They, you know, you like look at women as objects and collect them and they only care about their own sexual needs and no one else's.

There's no, no empathy there. They just, you know, they keep everything bottled up inside. And yeah, the problem with that is that if you keep everything bottled up inside there, it's going to explode. And the only, the only ways that, that the stereotypical real men have of letting their emotions out are anger and, you know, violence. Right. Right.

You laugh about it, but it, but it's, it's sad. Yeah. It's, but yeah, it's a kind of laughter. I've seen other people have that kind of laughter too. It's like a laugh. It's like what, having experienced this reality for so long and then having to deal with people like me, we're aware of it. Like in the way that I know there's a Niagara Falls, I've never been there, but I know that

there's this like insane waterfall somewhere. I hear stories of people who've been there and you know what I mean? It's like, but I, I'm never going to know it like you do. I'm never going to know it with that, unless there's some virtual reality, neurological interface that I could plug into that could give me the experience, the experience of that level of fear when it comes to like, yeah, so it comes to dating. Like, I know rejection. I know like loneliness.

I know what it's like to like go through long periods where it's like, fuck, nobody, I don't think anybody really likes me. And that's not pleasant. But yeah, it's so that kind of laughter you have is it, it's not despair. Is it? It's not like the laughter of someone feeling despair. It's more of just like what it, how can you laugh in the face of it? Um, I, I don't know.

I grew up like my mom like always has just made fun of things that are like hard. Yeah. And that's kind of just how I deal with things is like, look at this. It's so stupid. It's so stupid. Like I have to laugh at it. Otherwise I would be crying. Right.

Yeah. And that's, that's kind of like the ethos of, of by Felipe too is like, this is so horrific that like there's no, I, I don't know how to, how else to deal with it except by laughing about it. Yeah. Right. Yeah. I mean, that, I think that's why people kind of like turn their backs on her or a coil

because they, to the point of becoming just there, the options are, okay, I engage with it. I engage with it. Come to terms with the fact that this is a reality for half of my species, uh, and, and deal with living in that kind of world or in, in that engage, I don't even know how to fucking engage with it. You know, you know, or I just pretend it's not real. Come on.

That's an anomalous thing, you know, it's not, it's like one out of a million dudes are like that. Everyone else is kind of cool. And then in that, you just don't believe these, the stories, which is, Yeah. Yeah. There's a lot of people that comment. Um, yeah.

Like a lot of men that comment, they're like, that's not real. This is made up. And it's like, even when they're looking at the evidence, like it's, it's evident. Like I did, I did not, you know, uh, Photoshop these, like that's what happened. Um, they still don't believe it. Um, and I don't know, that's just their own problem. But you know, I will say that I don't think it's a majority of men. I think it's like, um, a small percentage that just do it to every woman.

Like they're doing it to a lot of people per day. And, um, while, you know, the men who don't do it, like they don't experience it and they don't see it really, but like, if you talk to any woman, she has this experience, she has an experience like this. Yeah. Right. That's right. And the, the, that is just nuts when you, you know, Aaron has shared some, like some

of it with me and it's, and I remember my first reaction was to try to just think, come on, exaggerate, like, ho, you know, you want it to be an exaggeration. You don't want the world to be like that. You don't want people to be interacting with each other in that way. But the other side, you know, I went to one of these pickup artist conventions, not as an attendee. I was going on the road doing standup and in the same hotel, one of the people mentioned in that book, the game was there doing a seminar and they all came out of the seminar.

The, the menu had signed up for this thing and it was really like sad because, you know, it was like people, you know, who were severely disabled. It was people who were like, not, who are not just asymmetrical, but like, you know, like burned and literally burned and like people who have, you know, just want to be touched, you know, but, but are like, have reached such a place of, are you there still? Oh, you kind of skipped around. Okay. It's like, you're just seeing like a group of people who look like, you know, like sith

lords, horny sith lords. You know what I mean? Like they want to hum. They're so lonely. Underneath it all is just lonely. They want to be touched. I think, I think either Louis C. K. or Doug Stano has the most dark joke I've ever heard.

There are people living in the world right now who will never be touched by another person for the rest of their lives. And I am in no way saying that. Therefore act like a complete fucking asshole. But if you, when you see like a lot of that stuff, isn't it, isn't it pouring out of a subterranean, magmatic layer of just such deep despair and loneliness and sadness? Absolutely. And yeah, when I was researching the book and I was like, why?

Like trying to figure out answers. I there, I couldn't help but feel sorry for these guys. Cause like they must be so sad and so broken and so hurt. It's like kind of, it's a little, a little bit hard for me to like, you know, completely trash them. I mean, of course they, that doesn't excuse the behavior. But I do see how, because women, humans are wired for connection and like it's something I think, especially like during the pandemic that we've learned that like,

this is something that we all need is like physical touch and connection with other people and these guys want connections so badly, which that's valid. And, but I think the, the pickup artistry like kind of sells them this version that is, is not healthy, is not, it kind of, I feel like it, the pickup artists things they kind of like, and just like dating books in general, kind of just like show you how to pretend to be, like to have your shit together. Like you don't actually have to have your shit together. You're just like, Oh, well, if you act, if you do, if you press these A, B, A, B

start, like you can, you can press the buttons and like sex will come out. Yeah. And I don't know, maybe it works for some people, but I think like the better option would just be like, this is what I'm trying to, trying to say with my next book is like, actually just like going inward and actually transforming yourself and like learning how to express your emotions and be vulnerable and be yourself, people are attracted to that. Like I have seen, I mean, I've seen so many examples of really unattractive

guys who have such amazing confidence and they walk into a room and everyone is like, Oh my God, who is that? And like, you know, I'm, and so I've seen guys that like, you know, maybe they don't have looks going on, but like their personality and their confidence in themselves and like knowing themselves is very attractive. Right. And, um, I think, I think that's part of like the, the pickup artistry thing is like faking it, but I want to try to find a way like that guys or whoever women,

anyone can like actually embody that instead of just like faking it. Yeah, that's it. That, I mean, how do you, but how do you do that? Is it, are you in your book and sorry if like it's, if you're not, if you can't talk about it or if it's not quite there yet? I mean, I don't know. I'm, I'm working. I'm like literally finishing the proposal right now.

It froze up on me. Oh, I'm finishing the proposal right now. Uh, it hasn't been sold yet. Oh, your video is, uh, it'll come back. Okay. I can hear you. Okay. Cool.

Um, yeah, I'm, I'm working on the proposal right now. I'm almost done with it. Um, and then after that, you like send it out to publishers and then hopefully someone buys it. Um, but yeah, I've, I've, I've just been talking about it because I'm, I'm sort of like coming up with the concepts currently. So is it, you know, is it like that some people just need to go on a, like a personal, like evolutionary journey and then start dating or is it more that we

can date, but just be, be honest, like, stop bullshitting and see what happens. Yeah. Yeah. That's kind of, I mean, either way, there's, there's a million different, uh, journeys that you could take. I definitely think like slowing down, like during the pandemic, I stopped dating everyone. I learned transcendental meditation.

I like went inward. I was like, what do I really want? I, I kind of, I think that's another problem is like a lot of people just are like, I'm dating and they don't really think about what they actually want. And they're, they don't actually have like a goal in mind and a lot of guys and cause I've been on so many dates where I'm like, what are you looking for? And then they're just like, I don't know. And now, and whereas before in my twenties, I would be like, okay, well,

it's okay not to know. Now I'm like, no, that's a huge red flag. Like you should know what you're doing. Like, why are you here? Wow. Now let's talk about that. I've, I've blundered around. Like I sometimes I would feel superstitious about that or that by

speculating, again, you know, I put off getting therapy till the fucking pandemic. So it was like, and any healthy person I ever met was always like, you need to get therapy before you date, like work it out. You need to know like who you are and why you're even doing this and what's the impulse behind it and all of that. I think that is like huge. Like that is so much a big, huge key to it.

Like people are just bumbling around, not really have it. They're just like, you know, whatever. Um, and yeah, I think it's, it's really like either go on a journey, which I think a lot of people did during the pandemic. Um, I hope that, but there are a lot of people that just like didn't. Um, and, um, you know, figure out ways to, uh, regulate your own emotions. Like I, yeah, I started going to therapy also like a year before the pandemic. Um, and then like during the pandemic started meditating.

And that was just like a huge game changer for me in like any time I'm like anxious or whatever, like I can calm myself before texting the person or like freaking out, you know, um, and it's just been such an amazing difference. Um, but like I, I dated someone recently who didn't, he doesn't, he didn't meditate. He didn't exercise. Like he was kind, he's like kind of going to therapy, but like, and he, you know, just ended up like cutting things off really abruptly. And I was just like, I can see so clearly that he just needs to like build his

like emotional regulation skills and he hasn't quite figured that out yet. And so, um, yeah, that's like another thing that now, now, like that I added to my list of things that I'm looking for is like someone who has either meditation or something to like regulate their emotions. Like it's like dealing with your own shit before putting it on someone else. Right. Right. I want to thank unit for supporting this episode of the DTFH unit is an app

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and start teaming up with your coworkers today. It's totally free until you win the changes you want. And you can cancel anytime for 100% refund. Thank you so much. Unit. How, how, what's it like out there right now? If you had to describe what's your dating, how's it going for you out there in the dating world?

Um, well, yeah, dating in LA sucks. It's just, I mean, I don't know if it's LA, big cities. Like it's, it's hard. Um, and people just, you know, are bumbling around, just looking for sex. And to me, that's really boring at this point. Like I have done that. I've been single for like eight, nine years. Yeah.

Um, and on and off dating apps, um, that whole time, haven't, haven't, uh, I mean, I've dated people for like a few months here and there, but it's never worked out. And I'm just like, I had to get clear about like, okay, what am I doing? And now this last year, when I sort of like narrowed it down, it's been a lot easier for me, um, like weeding people out. And like, whereas like I would have gone on a date with this person, but I can tell that they're not like going the same direction that I'm going. And so like, let's not even go there.

So it's, it's just like, I've, I've just been like really like weeding out people. And it's, it's very rare for me to find someone that is, it's even a possibility. Um, but it's exhausting. I don't know. It's, it is, no, it is true. It's, it's so exhausting and so just bizarre. It's so weird, just the act of getting ready to go on a date. Then you meet someone and you're just, the whole ritual is just so strange.

And it can be really fun. But I think if I were trying to do it in a healthy way back then, I would, I wouldn't have gone on so many dates. I mean, my, my feeling was never so. I never got to the, the healthy part. Like I, you know, fell in love with Aaron and we got married and, you know, post all of that is when I'm like, this is worth enough for me that I'm have to like try to deal with all my bullshit.

Cause you know, but I feel like a lot of people now too are, are like being so perfectionistic and being like, if I'm not fully healed, if I'm not, if I don't have fully have my shit together, like I don't want to put that on someone else or I don't want to, I don't want to like get anyone involved. And, uh, I don't think you have to be like fully healed either. Like I don't think you have to be a perfect person in order to get into a relationship because like relationships are where you heal. Right.

And, um, yeah, but I'm seeing a lot of guys that are like, they got hurt once and then they just like, duh, their, their heart turns to stone and they're like, I'm never letting anyone in again. Oh my God. I was just watching red dawn. I don't know why I did a parade of like, I went from red dawn to a Clint Eastwood movie last night. I don't know why.

I guess cause we just got back from a family vacation. Aaron was tired. I'm like, I'm not watching Coco Mellon. It's going to be like dude war stuff. But red dawn, one of the lines is don't you ever cry again. Don't let a single tear fall from your eye. And I like, I think a lot of guys, like they just take that on. They don't even mean it when they say it.

Then I don't think I was really mean. Like I, my heart has become stone at the bullshit. You're feeling everything. Just stop. You're not like on, you're not in Afghanistan right now. Stop acting like you're some kind of mercenary. Who are you even fooling? You're scared and lonely.

And somebody put on this mask. It's a mask. It's like I'm putting on my tough guy mask. Nothing can affect me, but actually they're very sensitive. And, you know, I don't think there's anything wrong with that. And, you know, encouraging men to cry and let their feelings out. I mean, yes, we should be doing that. But, you know, I've also seen women police this too.

And like women uphold these, these terrible standards and, and, you know, make fun of men for crying. And so it's like, we're, we're also to blame. I'm sitting at dinner once with there was a friend of someone I was seeing at the time was there. I'm a testicular cancer survivor. I have one ball and I'm sitting there and she didn't know that. But out of the blue, she's talking about someone with one ball.

And she goes, and that means he's half a man. And I, I didn't say anything. I'm just like, oh my God, you, I was more like, wow, you really believe that? And then I'm trying to do the math in my head of like, you think like that's like the roots of masculinity or like having two, two balls. And if you lose one anyway, so, but yeah. So I know there's like the whole idea, the ideal that we're all going to be sensitive and guys can cry and stuff.

Sometimes women don't want that. They don't want you like weeping. It seems like it seems like it's legitimately can be off putting. If suddenly you start, I, you know, I was sitting, I hate crying because it's like now I'm crying. So, okay, do I start doing like performative crying? Do I make sure it? Look, I'm sensitive.

Do you see there's tears? Look, I'm not a heartless beast. Or do I like wipe the tears away? And now I'm the guy who's like afraid to cry. So I just get super neurotic if tears come. Cause I don't know what to do. I mean, I feel the same way if I'm crying in front of people. Like, and I cry, I cry a lot.

Yeah, I think so. Healthiest people I know cry all the time. The healthiest people I know, Ramdas, waterworks just would cry. Like wouldn't wipe the tears away, wouldn't make a big deal out of it. It was just part of what was happening, Dan. And I think that I, I a lot of the times try to like, try not to cry. And I try to keep it in. And like, I think a lot of the uncomfortableness of like trying to keep it in

and is like a most of the unpleasant part, you know, of any, of any emotion. It was like, if you're trying to stifle it, like a lot of people haven't just, just experienced that emotion by itself without the like trying not to let it out. You know, yeah. Yeah. It's, well, I mean, it's, I mean, it's, it's a form of metaphysical constipation. If someone isn't crying, I, I've heard that like from my new age friends,

that the tears, it's like there, there's all this real like energy that's being output from you when you're crying and that it's disastrous to hold it in. It's like, it toxifies your body and your body's trying to get it, get it out. And, but so it's, it's almost, it's dangerous to not cry. And when did that start? When, historically, when was it that like guys weren't supposed to cry? When did that happen? Is there, is anyone know?

I have no idea. I am, I, that's a good question. I should look that up. Um, all I know is that like, you know, it's, it's still, it's still not cool for men to cry in our society. But I mean, I think it's, it's slowly like some people are coming around to it. Yeah. Yeah.

I guess, I mean, there isn't another problem here that because we're dealing with a kind of primordial urge to have sex, to reproduce, to like make, to spread our DNA, and because we're dealing with this primordial urge, there's an evolutionary, I don't know if evolutionary is the right word. I use that word way too much. And my scientific friends are like, what are you talking about? That's not fucking evolution, but people mutate, people mutate to manipulate. People, you know, are so good at camouflaging that what, what I think is happening is

yes, there are people out there are legitimately exploring their emotions, legitimately like doing the work, legitimately trying to actualize themselves. And then there's people out there who are like, okay, they want us to cry. Okay. Yeah. And they're, they do the, the fuckboys evolve. Yes. Evolving fuckboys.

Yes. Evolving fuckboys. You could probably do like a Darwinian chart showing that the way that they wear the trends of the fuckboys. Oh yeah. Yeah. We talk about this on my podcast, like all the time, you know, it goes because like they, we, we, because we, when we date guys are like, okay, this seems like

they're like on, on our level, but then it comes out later that like actually no, they, they just said that to get laid, you know. Right. Now, but okay, but what if, what if like a fuckboy just says, I just want to have sex, does that make them an asshole? Can a fuckboy or someone just like, look, I want to have sex. I'm trying to work on myself. I'm, I'm, I'm, I don't really cry all that much.

Don't want to. If you want me to cry in front of you, I will, if that will make you want to have sex with me, is that still a fuckboy or is that what is that now? No, I think that's just, I think that's just being honest. And like, I wish more people would just be honest about like what they're actually looking for. But, uh, I think the reason that they put on this front of like, yeah, maybe I want a relationship is because a lot of women are, are, are not going to sleep

with them if they are like, I just won't sex. Um, so then they learn like, Oh, well, if I say that, I can't get laid. But like, if I pretend that I want a relationship, maybe I'll get farther. Yes. And yeah, I wish that people could just be honest about their intentions, about what they actually want. But, um, a lot of dating is like, fake is like putting up a front is like putting up a mask and like trying to manipulate other people and playing

games. And, but is that, do you think that's unethical or is that just some, some, um, just, I don't know, genetic way that thing, the animals engage in mating rituals. I love, I watch this bird show with forest and it's like, these birds in some island and they're so funny and they do these mating dances that are spectacular and, and, and how proud these birds are when they're like showing their feathers, you know, they're making themselves seem like different birds

than they actually are. Some of them, you know, extending weird probis guy and flapping in odd ways. It, do you think it's unethical, this sort of mating ritual where people put on a show in the hopes of impressing the, you know, someone, or is it just a natural part of the way we interact with each other when we're trying to reproduce? Um, I mean, putting on a show, you can do that. Uh, I, I just like, I respect it more when it's authentic, right?

When it's what, when it's real rather than like what you think I want to hear. And I think a lot of people are like, they assume that the other person can't handle it and they, so they don't talk about it or they don't say what they really want to say, but like, I don't know. Try it. Sometimes people will surprise you and be like, Oh, you just want to fuck like me too. Cool. And then you could just be on the same page.

Like, right. But also we're not so, you know, again, I'm having to think back to my dating days, but it wasn't like I knew that I wanted a relationship or didn't want a relationship. I think I did, but then also you would think about it. It just depends. Sometimes you'd be like, do I want a relationship? Clearly I must. I'm like, you know, like obsessing over this person or that person, but then it's

confusing and you know, I don't think a lot of people know, know what they want. I don't think so either. And, but I think they should try to figure it out. Right. You know, or, or like, okay, so we're on a date and I say to you, look. Sometimes I feel so happy. Sometimes I just feel like a crypt, like with some lich thing living far down in the subterranean tunnels.

And when I'm the lich thing, I just don't want to be around anybody. But when I'm feeling great, I like, I love life. If I like, I would never say that out of date. I would never do that. I would try to make jokes about names of oysters or something, you know, like never in a million years, what are we supposed to do here? Cause a lot of, you know, a lot of us are legitimately lonely, horny, scared, deeply confused and how are we supposed to relay that over the course of a date without

seeming like complete freaks? Exactly. It's an art, I think, uh, but like it would be so helpful if like we could do that. And I think, yeah, a lot of people are just so afraid of revealing their flaws or what they think of as flaws. But like if another person likes you enough, if you have like more of the things that they are looking for, like they're not going to care about it. Like, you know, I was dating someone who like snored really, really loud.

And, but like all of his other qualities, I was like, well, but he has all these other things and like in my mind, like that, like kind of makes up for it. Um, but like, you know, do you know, um, uh, Ellen Debaton, I actually don't really know how to pronounce his name, but he does like the school of life. Um, he did this. He wrote this article about, um, like why you will marry the wrong person. Um, but he has this, he has this quote. I'm going to get it wrong, but it's like, wouldn't it be amazing if we could

just, um, tell each other how, how we're mad on the first date? Cause it's like, how are you crazy? And, you know, and we could just exchange that because like, uh, if we know that, then we can, you know, understand where the other person's coming from, why they're doing what they're doing. And, um, we can decide if like their good qualities are worth putting up with the crazy and the truth is we're all crazy in some way. We all have our weird things where like we're hard to live with.

And, um, yeah, I just want people to be, to understand that and like, um, accept it and be able to talk about it. Like, I just think like it would be so amazing if people could just own their shit. Yeah. Yeah. It's, it's, isn't it wild? I mean, I think the game just was the quintessential, it was the quintessential doctrine of dishonesty that, and at least it just put it out there.

At least it was like, look, though, if you want love, you got to be a fucking con artist. This is like selling cars or some shit. You have to, you know, and, and, um, but at least it put it right out there on the table, which is like, this is where we're at now. And when it comes to finding love is we so don't believe in that we're good enough that we are willing to literally change our name to some douchey thing. I mean, I believe that was a recommendation in the book that you

change your name to like, my name's dice. Are you know what I mean? But, you know, whatever it is, you give yourself a pick up artist's name. But this is like the, this is, but it was like, so, by the way, it's, we chatted for about an hour. Do you have a little more time? Yeah. Yeah.

Okay. Great. Thank you. Uh, you, yeah. So, and I, I, I was, I definitely like in, in when I was much younger, I guess I did just assume like, yeah, no one would ever be interested in you. You know, so there does have to be some kind of showmanship or like, what's that movie that came out?

Obviously it's a comedy. Vince Vaughn, the wedding party or the wedding crashers, where these two sociopaths go to people's fucking weddings and like completely lie just to fuck, you know, but then obviously it's a comedy. We shouldn't take it seriously. But still that, that was the idea. So I love this. It's like, okay, we've got to get past this idea that we need to be somebody

else, but we kind of do. We do need to be someone else. Maybe that's the conversation. I think you have to help us here. I think we need, you need to figure out a new mode of dating. Some, some way when I'm sitting down for my first date with somebody that we can just get through, like maybe you could come up with a questionnaire. It's so awkward though.

It's so unnatural. I know. And then it's like, how do you get people to actually say the truth and not say like what they think the other person wants to say, wants to hear. Right. You know, fashionable confessions, you know, things that are still there. You're like, okay, but you're still cool. That's not your shadow being.

That's just some bullshit that you think is like a disclosure when it is. Yeah. Yeah. And I think the thing is, like you have to be self-actualized in order to participate in that. Like you have to know, like you have to, you know, not be afraid of, you have to be emotionally available. And I think so much of dating that I've experienced in LA is people being

emotionally unavailable. It's all like surface level, whatever conversation. And they're unwilling to actually talk about like their real issues or emotions or, um, you know, important topics, which I, you know, you have to get to know someone a little bit to, in order to trust them to go deep. But like, I just think it's all about, um, accepting it in yourself. And then once you can, which it's like, sounds easy or, you know, it's easier than it, it's harder than it sounds.

Yeah. Um, but yeah, I really think that a lot of people need to just slow down and really think about what they're putting out there and what they're putting into the world and, um, what they really want. And, um, yeah, that's going to be my next, my next book, how not to be a garbage person, like, um, yeah, because I think a lot of people just, they're just going through it and, and being pulled like by their emotions, which you need the emotions to like get you interested in things.

Yeah. But, um, then they wonder why it doesn't work out. And it's because they haven't like actually understood their, you know, their shadow and the things that make them tick. And I always say like dating and is just, um, uh, trying to resolve when you're dead, when you date someone, you're just trying to resolve the like worse, the, the thing that, um, the fucked up thing that like your worst parent did to you as a child.

So like, so like whatever your worst parent is, like when you date someone, the, usually the people that you're attracted to have this patterning of like some, something about your like worst parent. Um, and then you're, you date them because you're trying to, um, resolve whatever that problem is. Yeah. That's right. Oh yeah.

That it's the most, it's really the most, you know, you see a dog and the dog starts humping someone's leg and you see it and you feel so sorry for everyone involved, but especially the dog, because it's like, that doesn't even look like a dog. That's just a leg and it's, it's this surrogate thing that you're humping. You maybe don't even know why you're doing it, but it's a similar situation. It's just that where it's like you've, you're not humping a leg, you're humping your own trauma that you've projected onto another person and you're

looking for any indication from them, any, just a little flickering of whatever the behavior pattern was that traumatized you to like, you know, experience some kind of like pathetic, like, like psychological orgasm, some gross gratification where you can go back to the thing you probably forgot for a millisecond and feel the familiarity of whatever horror show you came out of in the hopes that it'll solve a puzzle. Yeah, that's tating in LA. There you go.

It's just people humping each other's trauma basically out there. Right? Yeah, exactly. So what do we, I mean, so maybe that's just the way it is. Well, I have found that like, since I like understood this concept, I was like, well, how am I doing that? And it's like, okay, well, I am like attracted. I've been attracted to these men who are emotionally unavailable and I'm so

into them and I'm like, I just want them to like me. And I'm like, why do I do that? Like if someone's emotionally unavailable, I shouldn't even be attracted to them because they're saying like, I'm not into it. Um, and since I've like sort of marinated in this concept, I've been like, well, I don't know, my dad was pretty emotionally unavailable growing up. And we never talked about like emotions or hard subjects or, you know, um, it was very like surface level.

Um, he was there physically, but like mentally somewhere else. And then I'm like, I was describing someone I was dating to my, to my friend and she was like, that sounds exactly like how you described your dad. And I was like, wow, um, you know, epiphany. And now, um, I can kind of see the signs of like, okay, well, now I can look out for if someone's emotionally unavailable, then I'm like, I have found this change in myself where like, I'm not even interested in that anymore. That's amazing.

These, I used to date like so many like musicians and writers and artists and whatever and LA. And then like, now I realize like how, how just, uh, closed off they are. And now I'm not even attracted to that anymore. I'm like, give me something real. Like I want connection, like actual connection. That is, that's, see, I do think that as a possibility is that you like the, whatever the old pattern is, it's not, it doesn't have to be you.

Yeah. And I think a lot of people think it's them. It's just something that you learned. It's not, it's not real. I think that's upsetting to people because they've invested so much energy in being whatever the, I'm the person who likes emotionally unavailable people or I'm the person who likes this or that, because to really follow it all the way down, it gets to the root of identity itself, doesn't it?

You realize like, Oh, all these components that you've put together into whatever the mandala of your identity are, these components aren't based on anything other than habit. And, and so there's really not a you. Exactly. And you can decide to change it. You can just be like, I don't want to do that anymore. And like, you know, you can't just change it like tomorrow, but like you can work on

changing these, it's like, you know, neuro neuroplasticity is like changing it slowly over time. Your, your brain actually changes the shape. Like if you think a thought a bunch of times, it's like, you know, wearing it, wearing it down like a river and like you can actually be like, no, I want to go the other way and have different thoughts. And like your brain physically changes when you think different thoughts. So it's like, it's not that I don't think people are, are destined to have to live

out the trauma that they experienced as children. Like I think that you can under, if you understand it and understand why you do things, you can consciously choose to do things in a better way or in a more healthy way for you. And I've been trying to do this, you know, and I want to, I want to help other people learn that they don't have to, they don't have to do the whole trying to resolve your, your parental trauma on with other people. It's a choice.

It's a choice. But what about consensually? Like, couldn't you say to someone, listen, I'm, I like it when people are, sometimes I get off on people being emotionally unavailable with me. Can we role play that from time to time where you become emotionally unavailable as a game, but you know, you have to throw away something that like you're like weirdly getting off on, right? I mean, there's just a way to maybe create a situation where you do that

consensually. Yeah, definitely. I think it requires a lot of communication and a lot of like open and honest communication, which people seem to have a problem with. Yeah. But, um, yeah, definitely. I think that could be a solution. It's such an awful feeling when you realize someone is like wanting is, is

non-consensually projecting their parent onto you. Oh my God, it's, and I have seen it. Like I have seen it in front of my friends. Like they'll tell me about their problems with their parents. Like, oh, my mom never gave me approval as a child. And that's like every, everything I do is because I want approval for my mom. And then I like see how they interact with me. And I'm like, this is so clearly to me, like a parallel.

Like you are trying, because if you, if you can somehow like resolve that in someone else, you feel like you accomplish something. You know, yeah. One of my friends was telling me, he literally says to himself, uh, when he's dating, he will say you in his mind, you are not my mom. You are not my mom. And I know it sounds ridiculous, but it is a very effective method. That's good.

Very effective method of like just, you know, because the moment you realize like, uh, this, this isn't, this isn't my mom. This is my dad. You know, or with my son, it's like when I realized like, this isn't me. When I was his age, dealing with like the chaos of my childhood. Yeah. And if I, and it's unnatural to, but if in my mind, I remind myself of that, it's like a veil gets lifted.

And now I can hang out in the moment with my wife or my kid instead of like turning them into screens. Yeah. Yeah. I think so much. A horror movie on. Yeah. So much is like, what are you projecting on the other person that is actually like

something someone else did you a long time ago and you think that this person is that person. And I've done it before and I realized it. Like I was like, oh, this guy's a piece of shit. He's like doing this on purpose. And like, oh, and then it turned out like he wasn't. And I was like, oh, I just projected like all of my past relationships onto this person. Yeah. Oh my God.

Yeah. It's, but is it all, here's a maybe impossible question to answer. Isn't it all just projection? Probably, honestly. That's so weird. That's so terrifying. Well, it's like, yeah. And anything that like any, how you perceive the world is like,

you know, it depends on your history and like what the things that you've experienced in life. So yeah, I guess. I mean, that's so sometimes I, you think, okay, I've gotten this far. Like I know that I know that my wife is not my mom. I know that my children are not me when I was their age. But then it's like, okay, what's the new projection I'm putting out onto the world? And then is it just projections on top of projections all the way down until, you know what I mean?

What does that leave us as some kind of like point? Well, I mean, I think that's the point of like mindfulness and like staying present. Like, right? Yeah. It's like, okay, the only real facts are like what's happening right now. And that's the like, you know, the only reality is like, yeah, this is what's what we're doing currently and we can both like agree of like what's going on. And yeah, I mean, I think it's a case of just like not assuming things about other people,

not assuming what they're thinking without asking them, not assuming that they have that they have what their intentions are, like just observing and being like, okay, these are the facts that I have. Right. And yeah, being present. The assumption that other people are telepathic is a great deal of suffering in the world. Yeah. Oh my gosh, I catch myself trying to read people's minds so often and that is like

something that I'm trying to change of like, oh, I know, I already know what they're thinking. They're blah, blah, blah. They think I'm a piece of shit or whatever, you know. And then it's like, wait a minute, brain, you don't actually know that they could be thinking about some other things that you don't even know. Right. Yeah. Exactly.

Yeah, that is the that that's the sad truth. I think maybe that's part of what some of like the reason some of these guys are so insane. Yeah, because they think they're like, oh, she thinks I'm a piece of shit. And like, you know, it's like, no, because that's only because you think that about yourself. Or even worse, it's a kind of like, it's a kind of like narcissistic telepathy where they, you know what I mean, where they're like, oh, no, no, no, she wants me. Like no matter what she says, no matter what she says, she wants me and because well, that that message has definitely been reinforced in traditional masculinity is like,

oh, she says, no, just keep persisting and like, you can change your mind. Yeah, sure. Yeah. And then kind of like ridiculous. God, I always do this. I'm going to say other people there was there have been times where I've caught myself legitimately thinking that someone else is attracted to me and making the assumption. Oh, yes.

But I know because of some vibe or something like that. And being like dead, like dead wrong, like completely dead wrong. I think a lot of people do that. Like, you don't even know you're doing it. You think that it's just like, okay, I'm picking up something here. Okay, I get what's going on. I understand the situation. No, they don't like you.

Yeah. No, you're actually 100% wrong. They don't like you at all. They're annoyed by you. They're thinking about somebody else. This is like, yeah, I think that's a dreadful mistake. And even sometimes, even if you do get the real answer, if your brain doesn't believe it, like if you're like, I don't understand why they broke up with me.

And then you ask them why and they tell you an answer. Your brain, if you don't think that way, your brain isn't going to believe it. You'll still be like, yeah, they're lying. Yeah. No, they don't know the real reason they broke up with me. The real reason they broke up with me is because of some thing I'm deciding. Yeah, exactly. So it's like your brain still will, that's why it's so important to be like,

actually, you're in control. Like you can choose what to think. Right. Yeah. I love that just bringing it down to like, okay, what's happening right now? Like abandon all of the whatever your particular complex game or agenda is. And then what's happening right now in this moment? Yeah, what facts do I have?

What do I absolutely know? And like being president and acting and choosing how you want to show up in the world. And being like, okay, well, what do I want to, what do I want to put out there? Have you spent any time thinking about how augmented reality is going to just completely transform dating? Have you thought about that? No. Oh, God, I hope you have you.

Yeah, I have, I have. I mean, it's one of the, I don't know anything about it. It's one of the winter is coming, you know, Game of Thrones winter is coming things that's on the horizon for humanity. And it's sort of, well, it's going to give people like the ability to do a lot of stuff that is questionable in the sense of just things like I like theoretically, I don't think we're close to this, but not probably probably five years away. I like, you know, like an AI scanning a person that you are interacting with and picking up

micro gestures, eye dilation, pulse, like weird movements. And then from that, giving you recommendations of things you could say to manipulate them or to like, you know, it's like, it's like pick up artistry 2.0. Exactly. Yeah. Pick up artistry meets transhumanism. It's manipulation. Yeah.

Technolot like, because it's like already, you know, the way that we are completely seduced by Instagram and all the, they already know how to run these algorithms just to keep us like glued to the fucking things. They're already using the tech is using pickup artist stuff, which has its roots in like BF Skinner anyway, to manipulate us. So the next step is, you know, AR goggle glasses or something that are that can signal to you when to like say certain things or how to act or can do scans on the person, you know, to pick up symptoms of, to pick up symptoms.

One of my friends works in tech and they were telling me that like, sometimes the algorithm knows someone's going to get sick before they know that they're sick. Yeah. Yeah. There's like the thing where like people, women were getting like pregnancy ads, like before they knew they were pregnant or something like a while ago. Yeah. Exactly that.

Wait. I feel like that was a few years ago that an article came out about that. Yeah. It's, it's really scary that it'll start suggesting things to you in advance of your disease or whatever it is. So yeah, like this is the, but, but also there's a positive side to it. I think maybe there's a way to use augmented reality on dates to just sort of display around

you all of your secrets, you know, like that they can just pluck out and open up and look like, look, this is who I really am. And from that save a lot of time. Yeah. I mean, I guess, I guess that could be useful is like, oh, if I could see all of the things like, oh, they're just out of a relationship or something. Like they're just rebounding. Like, yeah.

Then I can be like, no, thank you. Well, think of a bar with where you see that, but like full disclosure bar. Everyone's using augmented reality. People who are rebounding have like a special rebound star, a ball bouncing above their heads. People who are like, that would be amazing. That would be an incredible, incredible revolution when it came to dating. Yeah. It seems like it.

And I think that same sort of concept is like why people thought dating apps would be like amazing because they're like, it's going to save us so much time. It'll be so much more efficient to like find people if like you can take a quiz and then match it up with someone else's quiz and you find your perfect partner. But I think it's just like so much we've found that it's like so much more complicated than that. And for me, I think, I don't know. Online dating like increases the pool of people that you can meet. But I don't know if it's actually helped me like meet.

I definitely have met people that I wouldn't normally have met, but like, I don't know. There's just something about like meeting someone in real life and like understanding their vibe and like picking up on those cues and stuff that like cannot be replicated and cannot be but yeah, I would hope maybe if it makes things more efficient. But I don't know if it I can have a hard time trying to imagine that it would actually be helpful. Never worked for me. Never worked for me. It was always accidents and sequences.

There was never I've never had the algorithm never worked for me. Do you play around with the idea that you're soulmate or the person that you're going to be in a long term relationship with who who is like whoever they may be is currently existing on the planet right now. Do you ever like they must be right? Yeah, I know they are. And I mean, I don't believe in one soulmate. Like I think there's I think there's a ton of people that I could potentially connect with.

It's just there's a lot that's up to chance and it's like, am I going to meet them when they are in a place to be able to want the same things that I want? You know, it's like timing things and just like chance. But I have now that I like really sort of got my list of things that I really that I need and it's and it's not superficial things. Like I think everyone should should get more specific and about like what they are looking for. But mine are like, you know, makes makes me feel emotionally taken care of. They're nurturing, compassionate, like they have supportive.

They have like character traits that I'm looking for. And the other thing is that I feel really weird about is like a lot of women are like, stop, don't like make women feel bad if they don't want kids. And you know, like that's like all of my friends because like hardly any of my friends want kids. I think it's like an LA thing. But I'm like kind of the opposite. And I'm like, I do want a kid and it makes me feel weird when I'm hanging out with all of my friends. You're like, I don't know, I kind of want to get married and like have a family.

I think that's just like a weird LA thing, honestly. But I'm like so many men that I meet in LA are also like, I don't never want kids. And then like once I find that out, then I'm like, OK, well, that's that's a no. Right. Well, you know, look, here's the thing. Well, I'm a weirdo. So in retrospect, when I think about meeting Aaron and these beautiful children that we have now and I sometimes think, God, were the kids the ones that like brought us together? You know, it was like, because when you become a parent,

and the only reason to become a parent is you want to become a parent. Yes, absolutely. I think we talked about this in Vegas. I think we did. There's big gears at work in this universe that are so that just they're so massive that it makes like our little human attempts at meeting people seem like really sweet, but kind of tragic. It's like we want to control fate.

We want to control something that's so, so incredibly impossible to wrap our heads around. You know, and in that, that's where I've gone insane is in my attempts at that, because it's a legit. The thing you want is a beautiful thing, wanting a family and wanting to have kids. I can't like in the whole by the way, I used to be one of those guys. It's like, I don't want fucking kids. In fact, like two weeks before I met my wife who I had kids with, I was on the phone, my brother saying, I'll never reproduce.

And I was so proud of myself. I felt so edgy and so like, I don't know. Like, yeah, I'm a nihilist or so sad. I was kind of sad. And then I met Aaron and all that went right out the window and all that just flew away. And so all I'm saying is you just a lot of people don't know what they want. And exactly. I'm saying they should learn, get to know what they want.

But when you meet this person and they and you both are falling head over heels in love with each other, they might have started off thinking, I'm not a person who'll ever be a dad. And then a month or two in, they're like, we got to have kids. You know, that's the thing. So if you're, if in the beginning, I'm not, by the way, not suggesting you're, what you're wrong at all about your methodology here. But if in the beginning you create that as a prerequisite, you are leaving out the possibility that over the course of you two getting to know each other,

that possibility will, will change in their mind. Yeah. I mean, I definitely, I don't usually bring it up like on the first date or like right away because I do, I do understand that like connection, the connection sometimes can be a factor, like a more of a factor than like what they previously thought, especially with people who don't know what they want. And yeah, I definitely want to leave room open for people to like to discover it.

Like it's okay if you don't know exactly what you want. But in my experience, I've just met a lot of guys that are like, I don't really know. And then like still like a year later, it's like, okay, but how about now? They're like, I don't really know. Yeah. I really know what I'm doing. And it's like, how long do you like wait around for that?

But not a year. Yeah. Not a year. No. You don't wait a year. It like, all my friends, they were, who were married and kids are like, I knew when we met that we were going to have kids. And I thought that was the biggest pile of romantic bullshit I ever had in my life

until I met Aaron. And then it was like, Oh my God, this is like, this is the thing that we're talking about. How is this possible? So I don't know. I think you better watch out now that you've put it out into the universe at the level that you've put it up. I know.

It's like, now you're definitely going to get what you're looking for. Well, that's, that's, I kind of thought about this. I was like, you know, saying it out loud and saying that it's like, you know, it's manifesting it like now. Oh yeah. But I know what I want. And like, hopefully now it'll show up because I'm ready. Yeah.

Oh my God. It'll show. Yeah. Yeah. You're definitely, you'll get, you'll definitely have it for sure. You'll see. I mean, you know it already. You could probably feel it coming.

I mean, if you, that's part of like mindfulness, that's what's one of the weird things about mindfulness in a meditation practice. I remember being in this Ram Dass retreat and someone telling me, they know like days sometimes. They know like days, like days in advance that they are going to get in an argument with their partner, even when their partner and them are getting along, they can feel this, whatever the deepest of deepest things like beginning to emerge. Like, yes, it's so weird.

And like, I've had that experience mildly myself where you're like, wait, why? Everything's fine. And then all of a sudden Aaron and I are like in some weird stupid fight. And it's like, shit, I sensed this. Who knows what that is. But I think that's part of when you start getting into this stuff that you're getting into, you can really like feel it and then reach out across time and space and connect with whoever this person is or they are or whatever.

I'm like trying to like just telepathically put it out into the ether. This is like, find me. And yeah, I really want someone else who is authentic and just like wants the same things as me and is on the level of like having discovered meditation and emotional regulation. And like, I just want to like create something with someone and not have a relationship as like what the societal definition of a relationship is, but like co-create something like collaboratively with another person. And just have an open and honest, have open and honest conversations and like

have that communication. That is exciting to me because up until like, you know, my 20s, it was all just like casual dating and casual sex and whatever and partying and doing whatever. And that's like so not interesting and exciting to me anymore. Yeah. And I'm like, I think having an actual real connection with someone would be exciting for me at this point. Get ready.

Oh, get ready. Alexandra, thank you so much for this conversation with you. I'm looking forward to next week too. Thank you. Yeah. And I'm excited for you and Aaron to move back to LA and then we can all hang out. Yes. Oh, for sure.

Oh, yeah, it's this summer. We will be there. Oh my gosh. In the meantime, God bless you. Thank you so much for your awesome website and about your great book and all the time that you've given me today. Can you tell people where they can find you if they want to reach out or send you screenshots? Yeah.

Um, on Instagram by Felipe, B-Y-E-F-E-L-I-P-E, um, by Felipe.com that you can like, you know, my email and stuff is on there. You can buy the book anywhere books are sold. It's on like real book, e-book, audio book. You can listen to me read it for like eight hours. Cool. But yeah. And also my personal is just my name, Alexandra Tweeton.

Thank you, Alexandra. It's been a real joy. Thank you. Thank you. That was Alexandra Tweeton, everybody. All the links you need to find her will be at dunkintrustle.com. Thank you so much for our wonderful sponsors. Be spoke post unit and of course Coinbase.

And also thank you for listening. I'll see you soon with another episode. Until then, Hare Krishna. We're never short on options at JCP.com. All dressed up everywhere to go, JCPenney. With one of the best savings rates in America, banking with Capital One is the easiest decision in the history of decisions.

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