Duncan Trussell Family Hour - SHANE MAUSS in MAYBE

Episode Date: June 13, 2015

Duncan does a long winded inspirational rant which he feels severe reservations about uploading and is joined by Shane Mauss who schools him on neurology, science and DMT.

Ghost Towns, Dirty Angel, out now. You can get Dirty Angel anywhere you get your music. Ghost Towns, Dirty Angel, out now. New album and tour date coming this summer. Warning, warning, 24-minute spirituality rant approaching. If you want to jump past a hippy woo-woo stonery inspirational yap, go to right around the 24th minute. Thanks for listening everybody else.

I love you. This episode of the Duncan Trussell Family Hour podcast is brought to you by those sweet little digital lamb lords over at Squarespace.com. If you want to make a beautiful website, Squarespace is the place to do it. If you go to Squarespace.com and enter in offer code Duncan, you'll get 10% off at checkout. Welcome, welcome, welcome. Hello my sweet friends.

Hello my sweet little motes of nothingness parading around in bags of meat. It is I, Duncan Trussell, the skrillex of podcasting and you have tuned in to the Duncan Trussell Family Hour podcast. It happened. You are allowing the flocks of words flying out of the cave of my mouth to nest in your brain. You are allowing the flocks of words pouring out of my mouth. These flocks of words, the beating of their wings sounds like my raspy lesbian voice. You are letting these things nest in your brain. You are letting them fly into the caves on the side of your head that you call ears.

They fly in there and they nest. What an honor that you are allowing the word birds of my mind to fly into the cave holes on the side of your head. That really does amaze me and I am very grateful to you. I will do everything I can, everything in my power to only let the good birds fly out of my mouth during this podcast. Not the bad words. I don't mean bad words like shit or fuck or all of those which are obviously not bad words at all. They are both crucial as descriptions for essential aspects of human existence. I am talking about bad words.

I am talking about the dark raven words. I am talking about the demonic word birds that fly out of people's mouths and fly into the caves on the side of your head and infect your mind with a darkness that can cause you to behave in pretty terrible ways. In the old days, flocks of shit words that flew out of the cave of a person's mouth and into the ear cave of another person infecting their mind with dark thought patterns were called curses. That was the name for it. Cursing a person, cursing a person, you can definitely curse people and you may have been cursed. In fact, most unfortunately humans on this planet are operating under the spell of a series of very dark curses

that came from the words of doom flying out of the mouths of bad magicians, usually completely unconscious of their power, usually completely unaware of the great potency that they wield. Every time they open up the caves of their mouth and allow the dark language bats, the vampiric parasitic entities that flock together in the form of shit sentences to go pouring out into the universe and infect the inner sanctum of their fellow human beings' brains. But it happens all the time. The fucking TV is one of the number one purveyors of curses on this planet. That thing's a curse machine gun that you turn that thing on and you will get rocketed into your brain.

So many flocks of dark ideas and sentences that before you know it, you could be sitting in front of that fucking thing watching your fifth hour of forensic files and feeling that the dimension that you are currently existing in is a hell realm. Go out into the world and you see the world through the lens of forensic files all of a sudden. You don't see a beautiful, spacious, garden of Eden style planet with color and sound and light, which is amazing to be able to behold. You see a place where if there's a kid wandering by himself, that son of a bitch has probably got a four hour lifespan before some trench coat wearing hook handed

mustachioid demon comes driving by in an ice cream van, snatches that kid up and throws him in a wood chipper after fisting him for a few hours. That's a curse, man. That's a curse. You've been cursed. Now, sometimes maybe curses are fun for a lot of people. It's fun to walk through the world and look at it through the lens of danger, horror, awfulness. I think this is the number one reason people watch the news. We get a new curse every few months when it comes to news. There's always a new currently the way we're being cursed is ISIS.

A lot of people are stumbling through the world right now who have been cursed with ISIS fear, the fear curse of ISIS. There's a lot of people who wake up in the morning and worry about ISIS and they live in fucking Idaho. Think about that. There's a lot of people who every morning within six minutes of waking up, they start thinking about the dangers of ISIS. They start thinking about the potentiality of some future terrorist attack in some part of the United States due to ISIS.

When they wake up, they don't think, Holy shit, I'm a perfectly harmonized cloud of atoms capable of orgasm. They wake up and they think the Islamic Caliphate is at this very moment setting up bases all over Mexico and they're planning a massive terrorist attack against our sweet country. All thanks to that motherfucking B-rock Obama and his insane policies. Oh God, where's my respirator? I need a cigarette. They're cursed. These are victims of the dark sorcerers that run mainstream news. And most of us have been cursed.

It's kind of inevitable when you exist on that planet. I don't know if you guys are aware of the fact that there's a kind of fungus called cordyceps that will actually get into the brain of an ant and the ant will climb up on tree limbs and explode this fungus down on his fellow ants and they all become infected too. Well in the same way curses travel through generations via the words of parents to children and those fucking things can go on and on and on and on and they can get more and more and more and more powerful and people can just go crazy. Some parents just hang over their children just like those infected ants and they dust their minds with fear patterns that have existed for millennia

and you might be one of those people who have become possessed by negative thought patterns and that's called being cursed. What's the opposite of a curse? A blessing. How do you get rid of the weird shitty thought patterns? Well there's lots of ways. There's psychology. You can find a great therapist. You can start meditation. It's up to you. Really. You just have to decide you want to do it. You have to make the decision. It really is and I think Alex Gray and Allison Gray taught me this that you get to depict. You get to pick what window you want to look through. Do you want to look through the cursed lens? Do you want to look through the window that's covered

with all the negative sentences? Do you want to look through the lens that's filled with all the dark words that have been told to you by slumbering magicians who didn't realize that they were unleashing demons every time they opened their mouth and those demons have the tendency to fly into the ear holes of anyone who happens to be around and drag their lives into a dark mediocre state of limitation, guilt, and anxiety? They didn't know it's not their fault. There was no malice there. They were just infected by a linguistic fungus. You can choose to look through that window or you can do little thought experiments.

You can allow yourself just for fun. You don't have to believe it for the rest of your life, but just for fun. Just like an acting exercise or a little bit of make-believe. You can move your eyes from the window of doom into the window of paradise and just stay there for a second. Pretty quickly, a lot of sirens will start going off in your brain. All the various curses will start activating and one of the first things that might come into your consciousness is if I have hope, I'm going to be disappointed. Ooh, that's a powerful curse and it's gotten a lot of people. It's gotten a lot of people good. If I allow myself to believe this now, I'll be hurt in the future. It's some variation of that. That thing will start kicking in, but just for a second,

just for a second, as much as you're able with your will or however you transform your thought patterns, allow yourself to sit still and imagine that you are limitless, that you can do anything that you want, that you deserve love, and that you are a slumbering volcano of bliss. You know how like there's inact dormant volcanoes? Well, you're a dormant love volcano and you can at any second erupt and geyser pure unfiltered love into your community, into your family, in the form of selfless action. It can happen. I believe it can happen. Allow yourself the fantasy that it can happen just for a few minutes each day and then get back to your forensic files marathon, study the results, do these exercises

and then keep a little journal and write down any change that happens in your life. Write down anything that happens that's different from the usual stuff that goes on. If nothing changes, then you don't have to do the experiment anymore. But if you find that by allowing yourself a few minutes each day to indulge in the fantasy that you're a limitless being that deserves love and is composed of love, who has the potential to radically transform not just your own physical body and psyche, but the lives of the people closest to you and this creates some kind of change for the better in your life. Well, then congratulations. You've figured out a tool that you could use to improve your little flicker of existence

that you're currently enjoying in this dimension that we call Planet Earth. Hare Krishna! We've got a great guest for you today. We're going to dive right into that. But first, some quick biosnias. People, not a lot of people, but sometimes our parents have done that to us. Sometimes our friends will do that to us. They don't mean to do it. They're not malicious. They're not trying to hurt us. They've just been infected by a linguistic fungus that's been traveling through generations of human beings. And who knows where it started? The main thing is this. The takeaway is this, my friends. I invite you to do a magical analysis, a biological survey of the subjective life forms

that you call recurring thought patterns to figure out what beings that are currently existing in the ecosystem of your brain cave are moving you in the direction of heightened states of bliss and happiness and joy and connectivity and which of these beings are dragging you down into the tar pits of limitation, sadness, misery, depression, guilt, and pointlessness. Just analyze it and then, I don't know what you're supposed to do, but it's a real fun thought experiment to allow yourself the beautiful fantasy that every single limiting thought pattern that you currently have is not an accurate representation of who you are, but is in fact the echo of a curse that's been placed upon you

by some dark magician. I don't mean gargamel, but I'm saying a person who has fallen into the numb, ambient haze of modern life and is not paying attention to what they're saying to the people around them. And that could have been your mom, it could have been your dad, it could be your brother, it could be your boyfriend or girlfriend or husband and wife. They didn't mean to hurt you. They just became the accidental transmitter of a dark paradigm that has been afflicting humans since we were being dragged out of our huts by Vikings and decapitated and raped by Genghis Khan.

It's a dark time back there, man. We come from a pretty vicious world. We've had some dark periods here, so during those dark periods, people start saying shitty things to each other and that echo can go on and on and on and on. Quote my dear friend, Joe Rogan, the echo of savages. I love that phrase. Anyway, don't let yourself be cursed, guys, and for God's sakes, don't curse. Allow yourself, and you can go right back if you want to, into believing that you're a limited, awful, horrendous, angry, bloodthirsty, selfish piece of shit if that's where you want to live, if that's where you want to hang out,

if that's the universe you want to be in and that's the window you want to look through. I get it, man. I've looked through that window for a very long time and I understand why it could be fun. But just for fun, pull yourself away from that window and allow yourself to look through the insane window of the alchemist. Allow yourself to look through the window of the practicing magician, the yogi, or the bogey, or the saint, or the mystic. Just for a second, you don't have to keep looking out that window if you don't want to. You're welcome to go back and look through the window of doom whenever you want to. You can get right back to forensic files. You can get right back to watching Nancy Gray stammer about semen samples.

You can do it, but for one second, allow yourself to imagine that you are a limitless, super powerful, creative force that with focus and discipline can, starting right now, create a temporal wave of positivity that will not only roll through your physical form and manifest as health and getting into shape and having more energy and just feeling good, but will actually roll out of the cave of your mouth in the form of angelic words that spontaneously erupt at odd moments in the day. And those have been called prayer, where all of a sudden you find yourself just saying thank you to nothing in particular or to everything. Imagine, just for a second, that that's what you really are, that you can be a kind of fountain of bliss that goes erupting into this dimension, a volcano of joy that explodes into your particular community.

And it can happen in an unexpected way, just like out of the blue, volcanoes will suddenly explode. In the same way, out of the blue, you can start exploding love into your family and friends and work and business. And not in a bullshit way, not in the phony bullshit way where people explode love when really all they're trying to do is make you feel like a goddamn asshole because they're better than you, but in the actual way where suddenly you don't even know what you're saying, but you're saying just the right thing at just the right time to the person who needs to hear it and you don't even know why. And you don't even have to worry about why, but it can happen. These volcanoes have been exploding throughout history. They exploded in the form of Buddha and Jesus and Muhammad, Albert Einstein, Gandhi, Martin Luther King, Mother Teresa,

Amma, Neem Karoli, Baba Ramdas. And it can happen to you. You are the very crest of the wave of existence. As far as we know, you are the most advanced being living in the galaxy that you've incarnated into. And relative to the great universe that you're existing in, you are one, they're not a lot of humans. Sure, it seems like a lot because the planet ain't that big, but compared to the number of stars, compared to the number of galaxies, there's not a lot of us here. You're special. You're unique.

You have such incredible power. You're running the exact same bio-computer that gave birth to such things as the theory of relativity, electricity, quantum physics, all philosophical systems, yoga, and anything that any human ever did. You're running that exact same computer. That's you. That's you. That's the kind of power that you have. You can literally do anything. You can be the being that intuits or channels an entirely new system of thought

that can transform a huge part of the biomass that you're currently a member of. It happens all the time. Happened with Buddhism. It happened with Islam. It happened with Christianity. It could happen with you. I'm not saying you're Jesus. I'm not saying you're Muhammad.

God, who would want to be any of those things anyway? I mean, I guess if you really like people, I don't know. But you can actually... I see I'm doing the opposite of a curse on you right now. You can actually, at this very moment, this very moment, create the first movement. You know, like an avalanche can start with a pebble. Just a pebble moved out of place can hit another pebble, which hits another pebble and creates a chain reaction that creates an avalanche.

You can, at this very moment, if you wanted to, move that one little pebble, that one little piece of limitation, whatever it may be. You can just push it a little bit and you could create an avalanche of limitlessness in your life. Whatever that fucking means. You could do it. You could do it. You're a limitless being that deserves love and you exist in paradise. There, I said it.

You deserve love. You exist in paradise and you have the potential to do anything you want, regardless of what your current situation may seem. And I don't mean this in a kind of like televangelist bullshit way. I'm telling you, read Victor Frankel's Man's Search for Meaning. Study. You got to work hard. I'm not saying if you just lay back and suddenly decide that everything's perfect, everything's going to become perfect.

No! The blessing I'm placing on you is a blessing of action. And it's got to fucking start with the realization that you're limitless. It starts with joy. It can. It starts with allowing yourself to go crazy. You let yourself go crazy. That's the point. You let yourself become Don Quixote.

You let yourself believe that you're a hero, even if your current patterns of activity happen to be completely meaningless. You let yourself, you allow yourself the delusion that you are made of love. You allow yourself to pretend that and see what happens. Just see what happens. Like a scientist. Study it. What happens if you allow yourself to be hypnotized by this hippie spirituality rant

that I'm spewing into your ears right now, allow yourself to be temporarily lulled into a state of believing that you are incredibly powerful and that you matter and that you can do whatever you want and anything that you think is limiting you as an illusion, then pretty wild shit will start happening in your life. Try it. Just do the experiment. If it doesn't work, go back to forensic files.

If it doesn't work, find where it does work. Find your footing. Find your place where the thing works out. But just for a little while, go down into the subjective chasm of your consciousness and drive out all the bats that exist there as any limiting thought pattern that keeps repeating in your mind. See if you can do it. Replace them just temporarily and see what happens. It's pretty fucking cool.

It's pretty cool. It could possibly result in you changing the way you act. It could possibly result in you beginning to act in ways that amplify and accelerate your physical well-being, your health. It could get you to the gym. It could get you jogging. It could get you to take some class that you've been putting off taking. It could get you to read more. It could get you to start moving in the direction of amplifying your feelings of bliss.

And if you want to feel good, one of the best ways to do it is to start taking care of your body. There's lots of other ways, too. And not all of them involve plunging a needle in your fucking arm or pouring booze down your throat. Though those things will allow you a temporary state of bliss, it's true. They definitely have a high price. There's other ways, my friends, other ways. What did I just say? It's fun.

I love you. You deserve love. Fuck it, I said it. God damn it, I fucking said it. Beautiful world. It's a beautiful world. We have a beautiful guest today. We're going to dive right into this podcast.

But first, some quick business. This episode of the Duncan Trussell Family Hour podcast is brought to you by the electronic genies over at Squarespace.com. Squarespace. I'm going to admit something to you guys. I've said it before. I used to be a charlatan web designer. I tricked myself into believing that I knew how to build websites and I actually took money from a few people to build a subpar mediocre crap website, which I pretended was okay. That's the problem.

There's a lot of charlatan web designers out there. There's some really good web designers, but they're super expensive because they've spent years developing their craft. It's hard to find a great web designer. And if you're somebody who's wanting to start a business, you might not have a lot of money to get the business going, which is why Squarespace is awesome. If you go to squarespace.com right now and sign up and use offer code Duncan, you'll get 10% off at checkout. Here's the most incredible thing about what they're offering here is that you can start a trial with no credit card and you can start building your website today. So here's what that means. You've got a great idea for a prank website.

Maybe you want to convince your dad that we're being attacked by North Korea and you want to build a website that looks exactly like some mainstream media website. And you want to show that to your dad to freak him out. Some version of that. Maybe you want to make a website for Father's Day for your dad that seems to indicate that he's an online predator or something. There's so many great pranks you could do to your father using the internet and you could do it for free just by going to squarespace.com. You don't need a credit card, but if you want to actually sign up for a year, you will get a free domain name. And if you use my name, Duncan, you'll get 10% off your first purchase. Obviously, you don't just have to use Squarespace to get your dad's blood pressure through the roof.

You could also use it for an online business. Every single website comes with a free online store. It's simple, powerful. They've got beautiful designs, beautiful templates, and they've got 24-7 support via live chat and email. And I tested that out to make sure it was actually 24-7 support and it really is. They're also integrated with Google Apps. They've got a partnership with Getty Images and the whole thing is just an incredibly sublime service that lets you create websites without having to know how to code. Sure, you want to build your own website not using Squarespace?

Get an Adderall prescription. Grab a bunch of books on coding. Start snorting rails of Adderall. And by the end of the thing, you're going to look like a character from an HP Lovecraft novel. Your hair will turn white. Your eyes will be dilated. Your hands will be trembling because somewhere in the midst of learning to code while on Adderall, you witness the black leathery wings of an ancient species of immortal nefarious entities that want nothing more than to climb out of the darkness and drag all of humanity into hell.

So don't go there. There's no point. It'd be better for you to study the Necronomicon than to try to learn how to code. Go to Squarespace today. They support this podcast. I hope you'll support them. At least try out a trial membership to torture your dad. It could be lots of fun.

Give it a shot. Squarespace.com. Use offer code Duncan. And thanks, you guys, for supporting this podcast. We're also brought to you by Amazon.com. A great way for you to support this podcast that doesn't involve donating or buying one of our beautiful t-shirts is to go through our Amazon portal, which is located in the comments section of any of these episodes. Amazon's incredible. You don't have to go to a store to buy anything anymore.

They're amazing. And if you live in Los Angeles, they actually have a grocery delivery service. They will get stuff to your door the next day, sometimes the same day. It's shocking. I recently bought a Fitbit Flex, which I highly recommend. This is one of these body tracker devices. It's the high end of their body tracking pulse tracking devices. I've been wearing it and it's so addictive.

I don't know why, but there's something really empowering about knowing how many hours you've been sleeping and somehow this thing tracks it. It also has GPS in it tracks how far you're running. It's pretty cool. If you're thinking about getting in shape, something about gathering metrics about what you're doing really seems to help motivate you. You can get one of these things by going through our portal, located at DuncanTrustle.com. If you buy anything through them, they actually give us a small percentage of anything that you buy and it costs you nothing. And it's a fantastic way to support the show. And to those of you who have been doing that, God bless you.

Thank you. The Amazon portal is doing better than it has ever done before. And that's all because of you. And I hope others of you who are listening will consider going through that portal and bookmarking it. We also have a lot of great t-shirts located at DuncanTrustle.com. Some other cool stuff there. My favorite t-shirt right now is the one by Ron Regi. It has a Hamza on it and a lot of different symbols which are designed to create a metaphysical shield to ward off the evil eye.

Which is what happens when a player hater gazes at you because they can't stand the effulgence of the radiant beauty glowing out of your third eye. And I'll try to shoot you down by giving you an eye roll or a glare and these shirts are designed not only to protect you from the evil eye, but to draw potential lovers to you at music festivals. That's right. If you find yourself at a music festival and you're wearing one of these shirts, hopefully, theoretically, it will draw to you other listeners to the show. And it is my wish that the other listener that this shirt draws to you is someone who you will fall in love with, someone that you will make sweet love to in the dark of the night,

and someone who you will suckle upon and lick and touch and allow your mouth to descend upon their briny, luscious holes. Please get one of these shirts. You can go to DuncanTruzzle.com, click on the shop link. It's there. And finally, forgive me for this long intro. It was really fun to do. I've got some live shows coming up. Very exciting.

On July 21st, I'm going to be doing stand up at the Montreal Comedy Festival just for laughs. And I'm also going to be doing a live podcast out there. That's July 21st and 24th. If you go to DuncanTruzzle.com and click on the link, you can buy tickets there. Okay. I think that's about it, guys. Let's get on with this podcast. Today's guest is a comedian and DMT aficionado who has a wonderful podcast called Here We Are,

where he interviews science experts across the country. He also has a new comedy album coming out called My Big Break. It's actually out right now. You can get it on iTunes, Amazon and Spotify. Links will be at DuncanTruzzle.com. And you can check out his comedy special mating season, which is available on iTunes and Netflix. Everybody, please welcome to the DuncanTruzzle family hour podcast, Shane Mouse. It's the DuncanTruzzle family.

Shane, welcome to the DuncanTruzzle family hour podcast. Thank you for coming over. As often happens when you're doing a podcast, we started talking about neuroscience. And I asked you and you were saying, you know, some of it's hard to understand. Yeah. And I asked, really, I wasn't recording and I asked you, what's the most difficult thing? What are you having the most difficult thing understanding in neuroscience? Should we just start over?

Gotta leave that in there. Okay. All right. So I would say the, what I have the most trouble with, and it's, it's not that, I mean, I have to study a bunch of different fields for my podcast and everything anyway. So I'm not just concentrating on neuroscience, which is good. It's, it's bad to just stick with one area. But I think with neuroscience, the big thing is, is you have kind of how the brain works

on these big levels and then how it works on just the, the scale of like the neurotransmitter. And, and understanding those two things is not that difficult, but the stuff that's happening in between, I think is, is really, really, really, really difficult. But the stuff that's happening in between, I think is very difficult. So. But it's safe to say no one quite gets the way it's working just yet, right? Right. Especially like our non-conscious mind and stuff.

We get, we kind of have to look for evidence of things. So like a great example of it is, is a lot of neuroscience is almost like metaphors for what's happening. So I just had a guy on my podcast who wrote a book called The Rational Animal. It's a very good book, pretty straightforward. And the idea is, and you have to think about these as metaphors, not like some solid fact of exactly how the brain works. Right.

Is that, so, so, you know, it's, he's an evolutionary psychologist and, and the idea is, you know, we're trying to pass our genes on, where, where there's vehicles for our genes. And to do that, you're going to need a bunch of different strategies. So we all have to do these various roles in our lives to, to effectively pass our genes on. And so, so we have, we wear these many hats. So he separates it into seven sub selves, which is like a survival, you know, like the, he calls it the night watchman on the lookout for danger.

And then, and then there's a disease avoidance sub self. And then there's like a social sub self or hanging out with friends and, you know, getting along with coworkers and whatnot. And then there's a status sub self. Yes. Kind of aware of, okay, I need to work my way up whatever hierarchy is relevant in this particularly particular environment. And then there's a mate acquisition sub self and then a mate retention sub self.

Yes. And then a child rearing sub self. So those are like the seven sub selves. I, I'm way into meditation. I think there's like kind of an eighth one that's more of like an observer. I think that's kind of what you're acting as when you're meditating and you're seeing like ideas floating by. Yes.

I think a lot of those ideas are coming from kind of the seven sub selves. Again, this is more of a metaphor than anything. Right. But, but a good example of how these sub selves work is they can be primed in various ways. So like a really fascinating study is, is he took, he got two descriptions of restaurants and he got them just right so that your average person would pick one or the other just 50% of the time. So one restaurant is like, Hey, this is the main restaurant in this city.

Right in the top, you know, tourist area. Everyone that comes here goes here and, and blah, blah, blah. And then there's another restaurant that's like, Hey, this is a neat little gem tucked away. You know, if you're willing to go through the, you know, the back alley or whatever, you'll find this. So, so people will pick one of these with like 50% of the time, but then they prime people by showing them a movie.

So if they show those people a horror movie and prime that fear response, people will pick the popular restaurant that's like around a bunch of people and, you know, well lit and safe. But if you show someone a romantic comedy and prime that mate acquisition sub self, then people will go and pick that other restaurant to like, Oh, this would be a romantic place. Oh, that's so cool, man. I don't studies like that are so cool because you know that they just must come up again and again in the boardrooms of corporations as they, you know, because when, when I went

to school eons ago, we called that kind of, we called that black psychology corporate psychology, which is the, not that you're this guy necessarily studying that for the corporations, but a lot of neuroscientists have been hired to discover ways to manipulate the masses to sell products. Of course. And it's so interesting. It's like, it's like Target. Do you know Target's famous study of how they, how they figured out to tell when a woman's

pregnant? How? Um, so it was just this computer programmer who worked for Target and they were trying to figure out they're like, how would we know if a woman's pregnant? Because if you can get pregnant women to come into Target, pregnant women are too busy and they don't have any energy left. And so if you can get them there to get one thing, like say you send them a coupon for diapers, then they're going to get everything else in that one stop.

So, so that's a real boon. And then they're shopping there for life, you know, so, so this is a big money market. So they actually figured out through a series of algorithms that there was, there was like three or four simple things that intuitively don't make sense. But when added together, it's a good chance you're pregnant, which is like, it was like some multivitamin like zinc or something like that. I forget what it was and a larger purse. And then like some other bizarre thing like that.

Um, that, that was, or like jogging pants or something like that. It was, if you got these three things, chances are you're pregnant. It was so crazy cause they would send in the early stages of it, they would send coupons for diapers to, uh, like at one point, um, a girl's father called Target complaining. Like, why are you sending my, my daughter, these diaper coupons? She's not pregnant. And then he called back like a week or two later apologizing because she was pregnant. Target knew she was pregnant before the girl's father did.

And then the other thing is, is they, is it's kind of creepy. So Target finds out that you're pregnant and then all of a sudden you're getting these dark diaper coupons. And then that seems, you know, very shady and, and people don't necessarily like that. So what they do instead is they put that diaper coupon still on the front, but they surround it by like, here's a coupon for a lawn mower and like all this other stuff. Yeah. To hide it.

Pull up bar. Yeah. Yeah. People get really nervous when they hear about the very detailed research that's being done on them by people who want to make money from them. And it's a uncomfortable feeling to know that this research is generally being used to extract money from people. That's quite often what's funding the research is crowd manipulation.

And it gets even more sinister when you consider, okay, if Target has done this level of research and all they have to gain is simple money, right? How much more research is being done by the CIA? How much more research is being done by governments around the world who have world domination to gain from it? And how many of these studies are being made public? Right. Right.

Because when I think about the NSA and all the stuff that came out from this just treasure trove of data that they have extracted, I think, you know, I bet they're not just using that data to try to hunt down terrorists or monitor homeland terrorists or whatever nefarious reasons Alex Jones may have for it. But I bet they're actually using that data in ways that we don't even know yet. Right. They're trying to take the pulse of all of society to understand how deep the hypnosis is maybe, to understand when the next move is going to be, like how fertile the ground

is for the next war. It's the military industrial complex is behind a lot of it, I imagine. Oh, yeah. It's kind of it's insane. I've heard stories of scientists being brought together by the military and everything to kind of brainstorm locomotion and in like wild animals to figure out how to make a tank work better. Yeah.

Just like real, real strange. It is unfortunate because most of the scientists that I meet doing my podcast are, I mean, seemingly have pure intentions and are just interested in understanding human nature. It's just that they also have to get these studies funded and everything. Yeah. Someone has to fund them. And maybe if the general public was more interested in this, you know, there's like Gladwell or Skydan Ariely that are pretty popular writers about kind of like a lot of behavioral economics

stuff and that sort of thing or like the free economics stuff. And I think when the general public is interested, then there is a lot more research done on our behalf just kind of helping to understand ourselves. Sure. But otherwise it needs to be funded from somewhere. It's always like that. The story is the king gets, gathers together the great wizards or magicians of the kingdom and has them do whatever he wants them to do based on his desire for conquest.

It's an old story. It's like the oldest story ever. Right. And it's fun to think about. It's fun to imagine the cobbles of scientists who've been paid off by the military industrial complex. And it's fun to, because I like to think like, okay, if I've got infinite money and I suppose that the United States military has something like infinite money because we print money

and we've got, we print our own money. So they're like outside the game. So they've got infinite resources, right? So when I think about that, I had infinite resources and I had access to the world's top scientists. Not all of them. I'm sure there's some scientists who when they're contacted by one group or another, like I just don't want to do that kind of research.

I'm sorry. But I bet there's a hundred more for every one of them that's like, fuck. Yes. Give me that security clearance. Let me in. I will help you invent an invisibility cloak if I can. We'll work this shit out. You know when they're sitting around brainstorming, because they must brainstorm, right?

These think tanks of scientists and somebody from the military must sit down with them and say, listen guys, it's probably not possible, but we kind of want to control the weather. Yeah. They're like, well, we'll look into it. Don't know if we can or not, but we're definitely going to look into it to see if we can control the weather, because if we can control the weather, we have the ultimate weapon of war. We have the ultimate weapon.

If you can control the weather, you can conquer the planet. All you got to do is figure out a way to do it. Possible? Probably not, but guaranteed at this very moment. There's scientists working in some fucking government laboratory trying to figure out if they can control the weather, right? Wouldn't you say? Right, right.

But I mean, scientists also expose all sorts of insane stuff too. Like I had a guy on who's like a modern archeologist. So he does archeology of like modern stuff that happens. So he looks for, he goes down to the border of Mexico and there's this part in the border of Mexico where they just funnel immigrants through into the states. Basically, they use the desert as a deterrent. Wow. And so they actually have the fence up and then they stop the fence so that everyone will

go through this one part because it's like a five day hike through this desert. And a lot of times they see them on like day one and they're just like, well, we'll just let them go. We'll get them on day five when they're like starving and tired and to really teach them a lesson. And then people are dying and stuff too. So he's going and he's finding like people's like old shoes and water drugs and stuff like that, that they're leaving behind and exposing this kind of nefarious thing that our government

is doing. So and the other thing is, is that I don't think our government is, I wish our government was more intelligent. And actually, I think a lot of times our government doesn't give a shit about scientists. I'm not that worried about the mad scientist stuff because I don't think, yeah, when it comes to like invisibility cloaks and stuff like that, yeah, you can get some funding for that. But I wish they cared more about having scientists run some of these studies. Like I just got done talking with a guy who's like probably going to eradicate AIDS.

This dude is maybe going to eradicate AIDS. And he's doing it on like a shoestring budget because we're not, we're not putting money into stuff like that. Have you ever heard this great quote by Alistair Crowley? Mad, I'm going to butcher this here. Magic is what the vulgar call, magic is science for the vulgar. It's really cool. Like, you know, a lot of people when they hear about Crowley, they rightfully so.

A lot of the stuff is, who knows, complete fucking lunacy. But what they don't know about him is that he was really into science and really into the scientific method and really into studying the subjective universe through a stringent, strict lens to try to understand the internal state. And his idea was that this guy curing AIDS is doing magic. This is magic. And the fact that we know how it works doesn't therefore negate the fact that it's magic. But what this guy is doing is he's eradicating a demon.

There is a world dragon conquering the planet right now. There's a dragon running rampant through the world. It's called fucking AIDS. And this guy is coming up with a way to defeat that dragon or demon or monster, whatever you want to call it. And he's using some very guaranteed. He's using the most high tech tools accessible to him right now. And when it comes to science, those tools generally seem to involve the manipulation of reality

at the quantum or near quantum level, right? That's what they're doing. They're the genetic level. Very, very tiny, tiny manipulations of the universe that result in massive profound changes in the external universe that are no longer tiny. The splitting of the atom being a classic example of this. So what's so cool to me about science is it gets down deep, man. It gets into the deep, deep, tiniest recesses of the dimension that we're in.

And it creates insane chain reactions that result in massive shifts in our biomass. It's fucking magic as far as I'm concerned. I like to call it magic because if somebody, I think probably because when I was being taught science, it was by an asshole. So now the word sucks for me. Yeah. Yeah. I remember my chemistry class in high school.

My chemistry teacher gave us like an extra credit homework assignment on he has this idea that we're all we all came because we all came from Adam and Eve, which he actually believed. Yes. The literal interpretation that we all came from Adam and Eve. We're all because we're all a product of that incest. That's why we're getting dumber from generation to generation. Wow. This is what my chemistry teacher was teaching kids at a public school.

Yeah. Yeah. It's unbelievable. Unbelievable. Unbelievable. But yeah, and it is amazing the holes in science. So when you ask like what I have trouble with in neuroscience, it's so, so you take like kind of this bigger idea of these sub selves, which is more like toward the end of what's

happening in the process of the brain. But then if you go back to the beginning and what's happening just on this small difference of these neurotransmitter and these action potentials being blasted off by one neuron. Yeah. And then how that arises into this neural pattern and then how those build and construct ideas and how ideas come into being. Yeah. That's where everything kind of falls apart is trying to find that.

Like you mentioned physics, it's like trying to unify, you know, the theory of relativity with the quantum world. Yeah. Right. And that's the real challenge. The, that to me, one of my most profound LSD trips was sitting and listening to classical music and I'm listening to it and I'm tripping and it's such, it was very good LSD. This is years, probably the best LSD I ever took.

It was years and years ago, very clean, liquid, just wonderful stuff. Like you know, every once in a while, I don't know if you're, do you, have you ever taken acid? Yeah. Yeah. So I took acid like seven times and then had got in an accident on acid and then I stopped doing acid up, but I still do mushrooms and everything. With acid every once in a while, you will encounter a batch that feels like it was just

taken out of the oven, like fresh cookies or something where it's just like, it's somebody just whipped this stuff up and it's like, for whatever reason, it's amazing. And I don't know the science behind it and it's been unfortunately quite some time since I've taken LSD, but this stuff, man, I was so good and I was listening to classical music and then I was watching my thoughts. This is before I ever knew anything about mindfulness or Buddhism or anything, but I start watching my thoughts and then I start thinking, where are my thoughts coming from? Like where is this question here coming from?

What's producing the thoughts? What's the prelingual thing where it goes from a nothingness to a somethingness? And in that moment, I just went back all the way and got the, where the subject and the object merge that can happen on a psychedelic, where suddenly it was just like every your ego is just wiped out and for one quick second, everything, pure expansiveness, that sense of eradication of the self. And you're both watching it and a part of it at the same time? Yeah.

Well, you know, from time to time, and I think that this is, is a possibility. You can, I believe you can just blink out. Like you can go to pure observer mode where that, which is being, you just become the witness purely. So you're not witnessing the witness anymore. You're just that wide open, unobservable eye that's just it, whatever it happens to be, whether it's, you've managed to get to the very back of the neurological, you're in the back, backstage of the neurological theater, whether you've merged with some universal externalized consciousness, depending on what language you want to use for it.

You've zapped into that place, you know, where even your life or the every single thing that you are, or all the little pieces that make you what you are, it's just like a little moat of dust and this kind of vast, vast, vast thing that we all really are. What does science call that? Well, I mean, it's, it's very interesting. I, I, I try to challenge myself to think of science and neurological explanations for stuff like that. And, and it is a challenge.

I, I do think that, that there's, like, if you look at, like, why, so everyone's like, oh, what's the meaning of life? And people always think there's like a meaning of life, not like a bunch of meanings that are, that are dependent on context and are subjective. But, but people think there's like a meaning. And this is, and it's strange because like, how old were you when you'd say you started thinking like, what, what does all of this mean? Like, I think I started thinking that when I was like, maybe five, six years.

I, I started first having the, the little, little bits of questioning, like, wait, what is, what does all this mean? Right? I don't know if you remember how old you were. I, it's, it's like an ever present itchiness or something. Exactly. Exactly. So, so we can agree that like five year olds aren't saying a lot of profound

shit, right? Right. So clearly this is the same, this is seemingly an instinct. And why would there be an instinct? Well, think about, think about what our DNA does. Our, our same, basically the essentially, we all have essentially almost the exact same string of DNA and that string of DNA has made astronauts. Yeah.

Cowboys. Yeah. You know, Eskimos. Yep. It's, it's made, you know, we find ourselves in all these unpredictable environments. Humans are, have somehow been able to live in hot, cold, you know, whatever cities, rural areas and, and your genes don't really know what kind of environment you're going to be plopped into.

Right. And so that they kind of have to just equip you with this flexible set of tools and then, and then leave it open enough so that you can take in the information in the environment and then use those tools accordingly for the environment that you're in. Oh, you're on an island. Here's the tools for an Islander. Oh, you're in a landlocked desert area. Here's the tools for that person.

And you're saying that those traits come out based on the environment that you get shot out of a vagina into. Yeah. And then, and then this changes throughout your life history. So you hit puberty and now all of a sudden you go through all these biological changes. And now you have these new purposes. Now you want to get laid, right? Yeah.

Now you have these new roles and you become a father. You have this new role. Yes. And so this is always changing. So my thinking is that there has to be something in there just always poking at you, always prodding, just being like, what is the purpose of this? Always kind of, it's just kind of a goal oriented kind of searching for a goal. What are you doing here?

Yeah. Yeah. What's going on right now? Where should we, what do we do next? Yeah. And I think that that feeling of meaning of life is, I think it's, I think we have it the other way around. I think rather than our brains are trying to get us to a meaning in life, I think that

idea of thinking that there's a meaning is actually on the backside prodding us, pushing us in our barriers. And it's got an evolutionary function. It's just trying to get us to investigate our environment more and more and more, possibly to add more data to whatever that strand of DNA is. Yeah. Is it kind of ex, you know, I love, if you ever, I'm going to mispronounce his name. You ever read any, uh, Taylor, Taylor de Chardon?

You ever read any of his? No, I haven't. Oh, you will love him. He's great. This is a great book called The Phenomenon of Man that I've been reading and it is fucking awesome because he's a Jesuit priest, but he's really into evolution, like really into tracing. He, he, he talks a lot about the moment that geologic life or inorganic matter became

organic matter. Cause that did happen on this planet and it's a mystery as to why it happened. What could have been a meteor impact? We don't know. We don't know. Could have just been the swirling around of just the right stuff that ended up creating this like insane miracle. We don't know what it is.

It definitely happened inarguably, right? It had to have happened. The earth wasn't always flourishing with life at one point, but he talks a lot about how the earth in its pre-organic life state had all these potentials inside of it, right? Inside the earth was in the same way that inside of our DNA is the potential to make astronauts, Islanders, spaceships, time machines, microwaves. I don't know about time machines, but everything else. It's not outside of the laws of physics as far as we know.

Theoretically, it can happen. But in the same way the earth had inside of it a fucking moon. The earth had the moon in it at one point before whatever impact caused the moon to explode out of it. You know, it had all this potentiality inside of it. It had the potential for DNA. It was inside that whatever the fuck the earliest version of earth was. And then this thing happened, which we don't know.

And it's kind of infuriating because we might never fucking know. We have theories, amino acids or what do you call, you know, like we have theories and that's all we can ever have unless we do come up with a time machine and get to go back and witness that first fucking moment, that first moment. Oh, don't you love thinking about that first moment? The moment where the rock in the water became life. Right. Whoa, shit, that happened.

There's all these like it's very like kind of fractal ish kind of moment. You know, it's like trying to figure out the point of when when does water boil? OK, so you have you find this set temperature and they say, OK, now let's try to find it, get a little more accurate. OK, so it's X temperature point five. All right, let's get it. Let's add another decimal point in another decimal point. Let's get it more and more accurate.

And then you can actually never find out exactly the point that water boils. It's it's it's just it keeps on going infinitely. And there's that same sort of essence in that first little bit of life. Yeah, you could never figure it out. It's one of the great mysteries. And it we want to get back to what you're talking to originally when you go to the genesis of thought, you find yourself in a similar predicament, which is this planet, which managed to spit out super advanced monkey descendants,

continues its strange function of creating something out of nothing or the recalibration or the mixing of certain molecules to produce that which didn't exist before. We do that constantly all the time because our fucking brains are constantly bubbling with thoughts that come from as far as we can tell nowhere like where to come from, like the joke that you tell or the the the time you say just the right thing or just whatever you're about to say right now, you can't figure it out, man.

It's just like coming out of some general sense of momentum or something. It's just rising out of the nothing. Yeah, I mean, I guess I think about that a lot about about how how the genesis of ideas and where they go and every it's. But it seems like there are some kind of neural patterns in there. So, you know, you picture in your mind's eye, you can picture like a square or a rectangle or a circle, and this happens pretty quickly. Right. Yes. But but but then if you want to picture something like more complex,

like say a bathroom, yes, what would happen is as you would maybe picture like a bunch of different. There's a lot of like what is a perfect bathroom? You know, is it public or private? Or there's a million different. It starts constructing all of these pieces, like in your mind as you're doing it. And each of these little pieces is arising out of somewhere and then kind of being constructed in sort of your conscious awareness and like kind of this point in between consciousness and non-consciousness.

And you can form this idea in your head and then you can go and think about an orange or something like that. And the bathroom just goes away. Yeah, like doesn't exist in your consciousness anymore. And then you can bring that back and it's maybe back where it was. Yeah. Last where you assembled it. But like a better example of this is, is you have an idea for a joke. Say, you think of an idea for a joke and it's like, well, this is,

I don't know why I bothered to write this down. It's a shit idea. Yes. Whatever. The idea goes away. And then a month later, it just pops back into your head out of nowhere. Like the best joke you've ever written. Yeah, better. And it's so much better than it was. It went into your consciousness like this homeless,

drunken degenerate and, and then somehow popped out wearing this fancy suit with a top hat and all ready to go and ready to perform. And so what the fuck was that idea doing? Yeah. When it was down there. And I often think about as we were talking about DMT before recording is that I wonder, especially since doing DMT a bunch, it makes me think about this a lot is that so our environment, our conscious environment is getting information from outside of ourselves.

We're getting the light bouncing off of the walls and here is going into my eyes. And and that's forming my consciousness is environment. Yeah. But what is the environment like in the non-conscious conscious and say, and say we did have kind of these, these, you know, seven sub selves just as a metaphor. Yeah. Say you had kind of these things in there that like that take shape, like the shape of an idea, then how. Like a good example is.

Is if you want to, you know, if you want to remember something, they tell you like, say you want to make a grocery list. I got to go and get some stuff from the grocery store. So I need like some razor blades and and I need some Drano and some bottles of water. And then and you construct a story in like an outrageous story. In your head of of like you jump into a bunch of water and all of a sudden you're swimming through razor blades and yeah, and and you you need to get yourself

unstuck quick. So you need this liquid. And so if you construct this outrageous story, somehow your brain remembers it a lot, a lot better. And so I think I think like these ideas are kind of going down into this visual processing area and they're constructing these kind of neural patterns that I think take shape like down below and almost create their own worlds. Yeah. And so I think there are like these beings and things like that that are

actually just these various sub selves with different tasks within our mind. And it's just that that environment looks completely different and insane than the environment that we're used to. Right. You know, and it would be it would make sense to have it be like a very fractal ish world. I mean, that that's the best way to communicate a bunch of information would be a bunch of like holographic fractals would be a great source of because you can fit an infinite amount of information into a finite space with

a fractal. Well, it's, you know, what you're saying are mine. It's like if you know the God, I say that I talk about this too much private, you know, if you ever heard of you heard of the immoral tablet of Hermes Trimestigerius, do you know about this? So this is like consider this is like an alchemical scripture and it's very simple and I don't have the whole thing memorized, but I do have the first part. I remember the first part and the first part is as above so below. So it's the notion that the way things work in the small tends to be the way

things work in the big. Now, it seems like, you know, deep, weird quantum physics is showing that isn't necessarily the case, but it's mostly the case. So the idea is we've get, we know we're in a universe where big bangs happen because a big bang happened. We know that we know something happened 13.5 billion years ago that involved an incredible release of energy like a universe, our universe expanded and we're part of that expansion.

The expansion is continuing to happen, right? So we know that whatever this dimension that we are in, we know one of the qualities of the dimension is that it creates universes, safe to say, because we're in a universe, right? So you can pretty much inarguably say that place that we're at right now has a tendency where it creates universes. So that universal, that tendency to create universes, I think probably is continuing to happen inside of our psyche because we're composed of the same

material that the big bang is composed of. So probably the universal, the tendency for big bangs to happen or the inflation of dimensions or whatever you want to call where we're at, it's still happening inside of us. And it's probably, that's where you had, had down to when you take a nice suck on the DMT pipe. But, but, uh, uh, where it gets really curious is that the, um, you say, okay, these thoughts, they go down into the, as though they're a sub-seller,

sub-basement in ourself, right? That's the, you've constructed that, uh, as a way to kind of, as a thought experiment to work out what could be happening. This is all simply metaphors, simply metaphors, but if you go, like, it's really gets interesting when you start looking at the quantum functioning of the brain and you, and you realize that way, way down there, we're dealing with something that's so small that it's being affected by the vibratory state of everything around us, that there's just a connection of vibrations.

That's what's happening, right? It's like an undulating vibratory pattern that's manifested as our brain, right? That's what it is. I mean, I, for one, I just simply don't know enough about quantum physics. That never stopped me from fucking talking about it. And I'm not sure anyone does know how quantum physics is. Well, let's not call it, let's not call it, let's not call it quantum physics. But, well, I mean, the one thing that it does see, as far as, as far as we know,

your smallest neurotransmitter is orders and orders and orders of magnitude larger than the scale at which the quantum level works. But the neurotransmitter has got to be made of atoms and the atoms have got to be made of quarks and neutrinos. And so it's still, even the thing itself is composed of this, like these tiny, tiny little points of data, which are inexorably connected to all other points of data and which sort of, you know, like another way to put it is, we are, you know, what we're in right now is an atomic soup that happens to have

differentiated itself into the your form and my form and the room that we're in and all the aspects of everything. It's just a soup that has differentiated itself and its, its, its soupiness is always changing, but the stuff itself is eternal. You know, the stuff itself, energy cannot be created or destroyed. So the soup that, that's the, the deepest atomic elements of this stuff that we're in, it's never, it's not going anywhere, apparently, according to what is, which law of thermodynamics is energy cannot be created or destroyed?

What is that? Um, well, let's see, it's not the second. Who fucking cares? It's one of them, right? But that soupy shit. I need to brush up on my physics. God, me too. What, but we're in this soup, right?

We're in this soup, we're in the soupiness, the soupiness of matter that has differentiated itself into the form of thinking monkey descendants that have the tendency to create thoughts and they, we use these thoughts to manipulate the ex the soup even more. So that's what we, that's what we do. We are, are, we have these thought forms that emerge and then through those thought forms, some of us construct jokes or cars or spaceships or we basically use that to reassemble the soup to suit our desires or to suit

our desires usually. That's what we do. That's what we seem to be doing. The question, this is where it gets cool, man. The, if we don't know where our thoughts come from, in other words, we don't choose to have thoughts, the thoughts just come. We don't choose, we can open ourselves up to fields of study that might produce certain thoughts or I can sit here and think, okay, I want to

invent based on my complete lack of understanding of anything to do with quantum physics or science in general, I want to build a time machine. So what would I do to build a time machine? I can ask the question and I'll be met with a series of ridiculous thoughts based on whatever data I've accrued from watching like shit documentaries on Netflix and maybe from a few acid trips and maybe just from fantasy. And then my brain will produce all these varying possibilities that can lead me in the direction of inventing a time machine.

But where those thoughts came from is a mystery, right? It's a fucking mystery. Even where the question came from is a mystery. No, no one decides to ask the question. The question emerges. The question emerges into us. That needling thing that you're talking about, we didn't decide to come up with that inquisitive thing.

It's just in us, right? It's coming from something. Yeah. So what we're consciously aware of is kind of we're observing this like I already thought of these words before they were coming out of my mouth. And that was coming from a non-conscious. And then my consciousness is hopefully at best kind of steering things a little bit. You know, it's like the ships moving forward.

And maybe if I can get some accurate amount of feedback from observing my environment, I'm able to guide my non-conscious into selecting words and things to talk about that are appropriate for this context. That's what we like to believe. Because if we don't believe that when we suddenly become these fucking autonomous, these mechanistic things that have no free will and we need free will because we don't have free will and everything's meaningless. But to get back to Taylor Deschardin, his idea, which is really fucking cool,

is this soupy mass that we're part of right now that's differentiated in our separate bodies and all composite bits of phenomena or whatever. I'm sure there's a better way to say that. We're being drawn towards a thing that some future point that he calls the Omega point, there is a point that is actually sucking all of this soupy matter into it and the closer we get to it, the more we see an increased complexification and harmonization of the soup that we happen to be part of. And that's what we're witnessing in the birth of technology.

And that's what we're witnessing in all results that come from scientific innovation is actually the sort of manifestation of this Omega point that we're getting sucked into. It's what Kurzweil calls the singularity, Terrence McKenna calls the stranger tractor at the end of time and that that itchy like prodding thing is not so much for us to like figure out how to get better at living in whatever particular environment that we're in, but it's actually the same fucking thing that makes an embryo grow into a human being, only the embryo that we're a

part of is about to become some kind of, well, we don't know yet. Yeah. I mean, well, a few things, one, I mean, I don't necessarily subscribe to that way of thinking necessarily because I don't really believe that evolution has an direction other than in hindsight after the fact. Yeah, but it's very true that like that we have all of these things driving us that aren't necessarily in an individual organism's interest. Like our genes don't give a fuck about us, this vehicle that they want to be

passed on and and here we are like obsessed with sex and everything. And we don't even, a lot of times you don't even realize that like, oh, yeah, like babies happen that you know, you're just it just feels good to blow loads. Yes. And so and so. To quote Albert Einstein. You are, you are just very much an Antonimitan, just running around and

and you do all these, like a lot of people seem to think all of this intelligence and us sitting here philosophizing about whatever big idea is all just driven by this need to advertise fitness and to show off a good way to advertise fitness is to show off your intelligence and to do that. You have to do something costly, which is like, hey, I read a bunch of fucking bullshit books about this and memorized this and this. Yes. And now I tail feathers, tail feathers.

Yeah, yeah, right. It's no more than when you see the nature documentary and the little guy throws up his tail and like does a dance. Yeah, yeah, like that. That's what I mean. You only need like I think I think they've constructed there. There's like a thousand word vocabulary that you can give to the military to speak like, if you know these thousand words in any language, you can

communicate enough, but every word has all all these basically unnecessary words that we're using to advertise and everything. But but then back to saying, I mean, I don't necessarily like subscribe or like they agree with or especially in the past, I didn't agree with a lot of the things that you were saying. But I have like seen that stuff on DMT. Like I have seen like these this like kind of what you're saying. I it looked to me like a like a plane of existence.

Like everything is existing in this weird, smooth pattern. And then like us as an individual, it's almost like just kind of bubbling up a little bit and then floating back in literally what's happening. And and and I mean, I definitely I've seen that. I don't I don't trust my perception, but that's that's definitely happened. I mean, like you are bubbling out of the earth and you dissolve back into the earth. There's no way to argue with that. Definitely bubble out of the earth and you go back into the earth.

Right. You got to agree with that. That's for real. Yeah, there's no way around that. We bubble out of the earth and we melt back into the earth and the way we melt back into the earth is through either the bacteria eating us and we dissolve back into it or we get cremated and our and our bones and ashes get scattered. But we bubble out of the thing. We go back in and I love the genetic that that idea of like these genes, they don't give a fuck about you. They just need to travel on.

Now, that sounds so dire to a lot of people because they want to believe that they're an individual and they want to believe that they go on forever and they want to believe that they have some great importance in relation to the some total of all other organisms that existed on the planet. And the reason they want to believe that is because it's somehow terrifying to imagine that you're just a part of this beautiful, unfolding biological miracle that is exploding out of this planet. And where it gets really cool, man, is like if you imagine that all organic

life on the planet, if you were to like look at it from the fast, if you were to fast forward, if you could do the dream, which is to go back in time and then fast forward the whole fucking thing and watch it all happen. Dude, I've like seen that on on a really fucking hard mushroom trip. People, it's a dream. It's a fucking dream. But you look at the like, OK, you look at the Amoeba, right? And you see the Amoeba and the way the Amoeba will shoot all those. What are they called? Something pods that tendrils will come.

So in Amoeba, if you look at Amoeba, it'll shoot out these weird pods or these tendrils, these like these like they have a name for it. As slime molds do the same thing where it's these beautiful tendrils come climbing out of the fucking thing, exploring its environment, right? So the sum total of the biomass on planet Earth is doing that very same thing. And the tools that it's using are all forms of organic life. It's springing out of the earth. It's spreading its weird tendrils all over the planet, investigating

every fucking nook and cranny and a hole. Like when you see like cave fish deep in there, that's just a pseudopod. I think that's what they call it. That's a tendril of the biomass exploring the depths of some cave. And when you see human beings, that's just a very powerful tendril of the biomass that has expanded itself into the human form and is exploring its environment and from the exploration of the environment continues to fucking change.

The tool refines itself. And that's what evolution is. Now, why it does that? Who the fuck knows? Well, there's some interesting ideas about that, too. There's like, I mean, so so what's interesting is what you just described was was these organisms with these tools to explore this objective physical environment.

And now humans can explore this whole subjective world, this world of ideas. And how in the world did that did that rise? There's actually I saw an interesting idea one time. It was about how seventy five thousand years ago, there was this cognitive revolution and they don't know exactly what happened because there was the Neanderthals were around and they were they were bigger than us and seemingly smarter than us, seemingly had like better tools and everything else than humans were just kind of just getting by,

just barely. There's these little tribes of fifty and here and there. And there wasn't that many of them. And they think that what happened was at some point, somehow, the human brain was able to understand the idea of subjective reality. So so like a subjective reality is is it hides in places that it's hard to see. So like if you want to define is Walmart and that so objective reality is like, you know, a door or the law of physics or something like that. But if you want to define is Walmart or target, we were talking about target

earlier now, what is target is if you wanted to destroy target, say, how how would you do it? Would what if you bulldozed all of the target buildings? Would there still be a target? Yes, they could still build new buildings. But if you fired every target, the employees fire every employee. Now you could just hire there's targets still there. What about the CEO must be must be like the leaders of the company?

No, they switch all the time. You can get rid of him. So how would you get rid of a target? Well, somehow, if a judge, if a judge decides they're like a monopoly or something. So if a guy wearing like the silly dress hits like a piece of wood onto a desk a few times and then says these words that we we all just agreed upon mean something, but actually don't. Target would no longer be a thing.

That's right. It would be destroyed by an idea right then and there. You just describe magic and yet we but us being able to believe in these things makes our lives much easier. We're able to like, hey, let's go meet a target and you don't have to be like, but what the fuck is that? We grasp these subjective ideas really easily. And and they think maybe what happened 75,000 years ago, this cognitive revolution where maybe we are able to start

grasping these ideas was that now all of a sudden these tribes were able to bond over a bigger idea before it was just them fighting off each other and everyone's off on their own or whatever and you care about your tribe. But now you're able to form these alliances based on these ideas of like a higher power or or or or some moral ideal or whatever it might be. And perhaps that was why that evolved in second Big Bang.

That was the second. So there's like that was the subjective Big Bang, which is the the opening up of the internal universe that we are that contains all targets and all McDonald's and all thought and that's that is a really different. What's really cool about that universe is compared to the external universe. It's quite difficult to explore and because we don't have the tools yet to do it and I can't wait until we get them because that's going to be an awesome moment in science when they finally fucking figure out a way to.

DVR acid trip. That's going to be one of the great moments in human history because because we're all we're all kind of doomed to description right now, which I mean, we love to do it because we're comedians, but it's not a very accurate tool for nor is it trustworthy. Like I can tell I can talk about my DMT experiences all day long. And at the end of the day, I'd be like, now, don't believe a word that I just said because I don't.

Yeah, you know, I'm merely reporting with the best possible hope of grabbing on to like an essence of what I experienced. You can you can you know, the thing is you could always say like when I like so if I'm having a mushroom trip where I'm witnessing a legion of entities and seeing these kind of like woodland, wild spirit beings that seem reminiscent of like pan or like some kind of forest god. When I'm looking at that, there's a million things that I can tell myself that I'm seeing I can start at the furthest skeptical part that I can find, which is that this is

chemically like shoving my finger against a digital watch and it's creating a kind of wash of symbols that I'm then applying meaning to or I can go to the other side of the scale and say, I'm seeing elves right now. I'm seeing living entities, but you get to pick what definition you want to give for that right now. But what you can inarguably say when you're seeing those things, nobody can argue with this, I don't think anyone can argue with anything, but I think it's pretty safe to say the universe does this.

This is something the universe does. I'm witnessing a product of the universe. I'm witnessing something that actually happens. And what actually happens in the internal universe of our brain's subconscious, whatever you want to call it, is that there is a proliferation of disembodied beings, whatever you want to fucking call them, you can call them. And it really doesn't matter. There's something in there that's for sure.

Yes, it's teeming with life. It's teeming with life. I I tend to think and by the way, I if I like, I mean, I smoked DMT on a podcast before and you can listen to it. What podcast? Ryan Singer has me and paranormal you. I don't know if you know Ryan Singer, but I gave it to him for his first time. And then I smoked it.

But you can hear like before I smoke it, I'm talking to you like much like I a little bit skeptical about some of the stuff. And I spoke the shit and I explain what I'm seeing and I got out. I'm like, oh, yeah, this is all a lie. Right. Like there's not a doubt in my mind right now. Why is it a lie? This is all like a lie. Why a lie?

I mean, you witnessed it, didn't you? You saw what you were saying. No, no, no. I mean, I mean, after I'm a DMT. Oh, this place. Yeah, this this real exist real quote on existence that that we're in right now is a lie compared to that compared to that. What do you think this is a lie?

I mean, I I honestly just think it's all a lie. I don't I don't put any stuck in any perception when I think of the word lie. I think of intentionality behind it. Someone intentionally you sort of are personifying the thing into a trickster form when you say lie. So you're saying, I mean, I mean, first off, so so in that sense, it was like, oh, this is all like a simulation or something like that because because I just saw like the real deal and the real

deal. But but now me talking about how is this a lie? I would say, I mean, just sex is a very easy one to go back to. Where it's where it's you're attracted to, you know, a nice, a nice fertile woman. You have you have these standards of what you're looking for. And a lot of it's like face symmetry and stuff like that is is what's giving you this idea that this is a good looking thing that you're looking at. And it's all kind of bullshit.

Really, Maya, it's all it's like pure bullshit. You know the term Maya? No, I don't. So Maya is the term that in Hinduism, that's the word that they give for the universe. And that word translates into personified illusion is what they call it. Right. Another way they put it is this entire universe is like the reflection of trees on a lake.

So what we're in is a reflection of some more substantial truth state. But it's still happening. Like this is real. I don't see it as a lie. This is a real we're in something real, right? Yeah. And it's changing. Yeah. And this is what I think is different from when you talk about the non-conscious world, I think it actually is very, very much different than the universe.

I think the non-conscious is the realm of possibilities. I think is processing that. So so here's something I think about a lot. So take a moment in time. Like you had like you find out you have testicular cancer or something. Or like last year I break my feet, right? I jumped off this thing. I knew it was too high before I jumped.

I was out hiking, landed my feet broke. I heard them break. I'm like, oh, I'm fucked. But at that moment in time, in your mind's eye, in your non-conscious, you think of you think of several different things. One, you think of, OK, what do I do going forward? Like your mind's eye runs a simulation. What do I do here?

Do I call 911? Will that bring a helicopter here? Can I crawl down? So you're looking at all these various paths and then your mind's kind of running this simulation, OK, here's here's a number of options that you have right here. Let's follow this option to its logical conclusion. And then it's maybe and then that so I'm going to call 911. OK, let's run that simulation.

What's that look like? And then that will branch off here. What if I don't have insurance or what if my insurance doesn't cover that? And that branches off and that branches off. And pretty soon there's these branches of possibilities moving forward. But at that exact same moment, you also your brain also looks back. So so this is a big part of how how we train habits is through dopamine. So you give like a rat and a reward for a light comes on and it hits a lever

three times and it gets a reward. Yeah, trains you figure that out. And dopamine is the reward that it gets in the beginning. They they get the reward and then they get dopamine. But then after a while, dopamine is released right when the light comes. Yes, to motivate to get food or whatever. Because this is like, oh, there's something exciting. And dopamine is what what actually motivates you.

And so it's like a way of your brain going back in time to see like, oh, that worked last time. Let's do like you can teach pigeons superstition. It's really funny. You can have you can have pigeons that that seemingly you train them so that they do tasks and they get a reward. And this is how their life works. This is their environment.

And one day, just like when they're just hanging out in there, just throwing a reward randomly and then they'll just develop like a tick of like whatever they were doing. So they were like scratching their their right side at that time. So now they'll keep on like scratching that right side. Yeah, well, that yielded a result last time. You don't really even have to consciously think about it. Cargo cult, you know about cargo cults?

No, I think during World War two, they were dropping supplies on some up until that point, uncocked, contacted islands where there were people living there who apparently hadn't had contact with humans for a long time. And so all of a sudden, you know, they're living in like that wonderful, blissful state of pre-civilization where everything that happened yesterday is probably going to happen tomorrow. It's all kind of like just the same day without any, you know,

that's the way it is. And then all of a sudden out of the blue, a fucking goddamn box filled with crazy shit falls out of the sky. And so supposedly you look it up, man, maybe this has been debunked, but I'm pretty sure it's real. So they sounds familiar. They do what they were doing on that day in the hopes of summoning that thing back down.

So so now think of so, you know, I can't pretend to know what it's like to be diagnosed with cancer. So I'll stick with, you know, my feet. So I break my feet right. And then so not only are these there are these possibilities going forward, but now there's all these possibilities backwards. What what if I had just argued with my friend a little more? What if I climbed down a little more instead of jumping?

What if what if and you follow that backwards to a point where there is a decision and then you go, OK, what if I had done something else? And then that branches off into this possibility. So somehow in your brain, you have like this infinite amount of simulations of yourself all stemming from this one point in time going forward and backward. And and and so and that's doing that somehow and you'll see this when you dream.

You can see this in perfect clarity. Well, I think in our non-conscious world, it is just always in perfect clarity like that. And this kind of life flashing before your eyes or whatever, it's just kind of your mind's eyes dipping down like quickly. If you're going to die quick, your your mind, your whatever consciousness that dips into the non-conscious is looking like, hey, do we have anything for this?

Do we have any do we have any solutions to this problem? Just searching back through every moment in your life as fast as it could possibly. You know, you're falling out of the plane. It's so funny. Yeah, it's just like going through all the drawers in your house trying to find something you don't even know what you're looking for. You're just hoping to find something. Yeah, that's cool, man. Yeah.

So now take what we were talking about before with this. Where does this idea you have a shitty joke idea goes down, forgotten about, and then pops out this beautiful, well-working joke a month later. And you haven't given a second thought since that first initial incarnation of it, and where did it go? Well, maybe that idea went and it was run through all these various simulations. Maybe there is a universe down there that takes like ideas, takes shapes. It's like where the penguins go to fuck.

It's like, you know, like in there's like a place emperor penguins go to fuck. They like why they do it, who knows? But they go waddling so far into this blasted place to actually, I think it's not to fuck, it's to make babies, or maybe it is to fuck. They go there to fuck. They pair off, they make babies. Maybe that's our shitty ideas. They like migrate through this wilderness of our mind and there's

some beautiful place where ideas just make love with other ideas and then come back pregnant and just give birth to some better, more evolved version of the idea. I love that. That's a really cool notion. Yeah, I've just been trying to like I've been trying to see it and just with doing DMT and like having these ideas before I go in and then trying to observe which changes things, you know, when you have idea. Like if you have a sense of what's

happening in DMT world and then you go in, chances are it's going to give you whatever your inclination was, it's going to show you what you wanted to see, which is just more evidence that it probably is your non-conscious. Well, we've got to learn how to, I mean, like the trick is to, you know, this is why I love mindfulness practice and just learning to sort of watch, just watch the way it happens and not necessarily getting in there to try to make something happen. You ever go in a float tank?

I haven't yet. I've been meaning to so bad, man. Yeah, man, they're pretty incredible. And when you're in a float tank, you basically you're like kind of going into a dream state, but you're wide awake. So you're dreaming while you're what your eyes are open, but you're going in this dream state and it's a practice like you have to do it more than once. I just did this.

I went to, there's a great place in Austin called the Float Institute that I went to and did a two hour float. And then that was where, like, I don't, you don't know the amount of time, but towards the end of it, based in retrospect, because the light came on fairly soon after this, you know, something starts happening. Because I know my eyes are opening and I'm peering into this pitch black. And all of a sudden there's these like two just bright lights up there, two little bright lights.

And I'm thinking, man, I guess there's a crack in the top of the float tank or something that these lights have are coming through. And then I was, oh, oh, this is the thing they talk. This is my brain spitting out some kind of, and then it's gone. Because that part of your, that part that's exerted the realization is like taking you out of whatever that state is that you're in. So DMT, it must be the same way. It's like, how many times have you done DMT?

I've only done DMT about four times, I'd say. And never the, I've never gotten around the corner, never, never seen else, but have certainly had some incredibly beneficial, beautiful experiences from it. But, you know, I don't, I guess probably one difference between you and me is I have no problem. The symbol system I use to explain what's going on in there is not a neurological symbol system.

I just think you're, it's like allowing you to see into the, what's been called the astral plane or you're seeing what's been called the spirit world or you're seeing these. I mean, I've, I've certainly seen all sorts of shit like that. There's no denying it. I've seen all that stuff. I don't necessarily trust what I saw, but I definitely, I've seen it. I've talked with things in there.

Yeah, they do have a lot to say. And for me, it's just a matter of convenience because to me, it's like, I'm going to go for the juicy symbols or I'm going to go for the symbols that the symbols that I decide to use are going to be the ones that produce states of bliss or novelty or joy or more than anything are going to be help me be more effective in articulating my experience of the universe. And it was just fun, right? And for me, you know, I can think about what I saw on DMT and I could think,

well, I must be witnessing some kind of, you know, the subconch, the arc, the some compartment in my mind where all the archetypes are stored up and or I can be like, oh, you know, I could, you know, go to the Terence McKenna route where he just is like, it's some ridiculousness about how it changes the spin of your atoms and you're actually witnessing an alternate universe that surrounds you at all times. And for me, that works a fuckload better than to think, oh, this is just like some marsupial symbol pocket that's down in the deep

subbasement of my brain. And that's what I'm seeing. It's more like, fuck no, man. This is goddamn. This is the fucking death bardo. Like I'm witnessing the some completely alternate plane of existence that I seem to be existing on right now. It does.

It certainly gives that perception. Yeah. Absolutely. Absolutely. I so so there's there's several things that make me suspicious of that. Sometimes, which is like one thing that I noticed within myself is is I'll do DMT and especially in the beginning, it would be like as if I was opening and closing my eyes as fast as I possibly could.

And each time I opened my eyes, I was in a whole new world. Now I'm in a palace. Now I'm in a bathroom. Now I'm under the ocean. Now I'm in a volcano. And and there was hardly even any point at at like trying to capture any one of these scenes because it's like a blink of an eye and then you're on to the next amazing, except rather than a volcano or whatever, this is shit you've never seen

before and and like holograms and unimaginable indescribable things. But what's interesting is that it was always very because I was always very resistant and I'm just a very scientific minded person. I'm I err toward the side of skepticism. I like to think of myself as open minded, but I don't know how open minded I am. But anyway, after like after some time, I would start accepting a little more. And when I accepted, then these scenes would slow down a little bit and I would

gain more clarity and what I think might be happening, though, is is just simply the idea of accepting it. So so you just put all these drugs into your brain and now your eyes are closed or whatever and your brain's like coming up with ideas of like like, oh, what the fuck is happening right now? And then it's just like, what about this? Is this what's happening? Is this what's happening?

Is that just throwing a thousand of different like ideas, like narratives of things that could be happening and you're sitting there like, what the fuck is it? No, no, not possible, not possible, not possible. So it's like, well, how about this? How about this? And then eventually, after a while, you go, well, maybe. And then as soon as you go, maybe it's like, oh, OK, there you go. This is working.

OK, well, we'll play with this narrative for a little longer. And I wonder how much of our lives are like that, where where we're just believing in a perception enough where it's slowing down and we're buying into it more and more. Yeah. And you wonder how much of our lives is that one hundred fucking percent, man. And the beauty of being a human being is that we get to decide where to say maybe we get to decide where to say, possibly this, possibly this.

That's the very good point. That's the potency because there's so many of those frames flying in front of us. There's the frame of our inevitable debt. There's the frame of the idea that everybody around us is just, you know, genetically selfish genetic machines. There's the frame where every single person around us deserves love. There's the frame where we deserve love. There's the frame where we can do just about anything that we wanted to.

We can be healthy. We can get in shape. We can become better at whatever it is. There's all these other frames you get to pick. That's all. And I agree. And when you pick, maybe the best way to pick is to go, maybe, maybe this instead of being like, this is definitely it, because then you're probably a fool.

Yeah, just as give it a maybe because a lot of times most people that maybe that they're giving to they're giving this is definitely it. And that this is definitely that they're, they're applying to whatever frame there and is usually a shit frame. Yeah, because most people have come to associate truth and suffering. They think the truth must always, the truth hurts. The truth must always hurt. I don't think that's the case.

I think that you can pick and compose. You can build your own frame if you want. I mean, that's a very good point. I agree with you very much. I mean, when thinking of because there's only so far, you can chase the like existential rabbit hole down where you have to eventually decide like what you want to allow yourself to believe in. So it's like, OK, we're all we're all vehicles for our genes and these

automatons being pushed around by our instincts. And, and, and, you know, the only reason why we find this this lake or whatever aesthetically pleasing is because of the construction of it was ideal for our ancestors. There's a water source there and there's trees there that aren't too clumped together, but enough that can provide shade and it can provide cover. Sounds like a nice lake you're describing. Yeah, exactly.

But we're drawn to this sort of thing because this was this was a very useful environment to us. But so, so, you know, it's kind of a lie that that is beautiful. But what do you want to do? Do you want to flip a switch that makes you not like sunsets anymore? You know? That's a choice that you have to make. Yeah. And so you have to be like, no, I like the sunset lie.

Fuck yeah. Or because the other thing is the other thing might as well just be as much of a lie that the real truth of the matter is whatever the fuck it is that without lake or those trees or the sunset, all of it's going away, all of it's going away. All of it will be gone. I think that's beautiful. Yeah, me too. I like that you're just a rivulet of matter running in, you know, running through

time and that for a temporary moment, this rivulet is experiencing itself and that during that moment of experience, you can allow yourself to be kind to the people around you and to ease their suffering as best you can if you want to. And and that's fucking fun. And God damn it, if that's just a tail feather to get jizz blasting out of your cock, it's a better tail feather than a lot of the other ones. So pick that fucking tail feather.

You know, yeah, it's interesting. Science, this just helps confirm something that I've thought for science and magic are very similar. It's just that magic is a word that scientists don't like and science is a word that, well, assholes don't like, I guess, but not assholes. But you know what I mean? Right. Anyway, man, this is a been a wonderful conversation. Thank you so much.

I hope you'll come back on the show again soon. Really, really, really great. I'm going to put this one up right now. That was Shane Mouse. Big, you can go find out more about Shane by going to ShaneMouse.com. The link will be at at DuncanTrussell.com. Much thanks to Squarespace for sponsoring this episode. You can go to Squarespace.com and are in offer code Duncan and get 10% off at checkout.

Here's something that people have been requesting. It's the entirety of the new theme song created by the remarkable musician Essex. You can listen to more of his wonderful music by going to his website at ESSEKS.com. That's Essex.com. Thanks for listening, you guys. I'll see you next week with an interview with Tim Leary, son, Zack Leary and Gay Dillingham, who has created an incredible documentary about Tim Leary and Rom Doss called Dying to Know.

They're going to be screening that on July 10th in Northern California. And I'm going to put the podcast out next week. OK, that's it. I love you guys. Hare Krishna.