Dwarf Fortress Roundtable - Ep. 84: Memes and Stuff With Twisted Logic Gaming

Episode Date: April 3, 2023

We are joined this episode by Twisted Logic Gaming, and a good time was had by all!

Welcome to Dwarf Fortress Roundtable, the podcast for all things Dwarfee. Every couple weeks or so, your hosts gather to talk about our favorite game, Dwarf Fortress. So let's join your hosts, Roland. My PC, so maybe I have weird cameras in my room as well. Tony. There's totally a deer in the headlights there, because Roland said, thanks for watching. and I was like, wait a second. And Jonathan.

He hits the play button and he watches the little nib go across the street. As they present insightful, irreverent, and often incorrect analysis. Today we welcome Twisted Logic Gaming to the roundtable for discussion of memes. I had to upgrade my battery backup when I got a new video card. It was drawing too much power. It would set off the battery backup. And always remember, losing is fun. Well, first of all, I'd like to welcome in Twitter.

Twisted Logic Gaming to the podcast. Thank you very much. Twisted, welcome to Dwarfortures Roundtable. Welcome to the Dwarfortures Roundtable. Nice. Hello. Nice. I feel impressed and intimidated.

Oh, I love this game. With your permission, I might use that in our intro. Oh, absolutely. I don't use that. That would be great. Absolutely. Put a little reverb on it. Crazy.

The voice are the best. So I discovered your YouTube videos whenever version 50 of Dwar Fortress was released and you did a video regarding mine carts and how they had weren't working quite the way that they were before. I think that we were talking about the mine cart generator. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I was trying to build the shotguns and it was like the way that the track, the old track system versus the new track system, so the way that the new tracks work is it tries to predict how you want the tracks to go and it's like counterintuitive for building the shotguns

because you have to make these impulse ramps that and it doesn't it doesn't try to make those so you have to kind of work around it by digging a ramp and then maybe building a wall or door there so it turns properly and in the old way it was very it was very vexing when I first when I first turned it on. But in the old way, you would just go into the track menu and be like, okay, I need a north-south track ramp or north-east track ramp and then build it right there and then you'd done. I think it would be pretty cool if there was like an advanced mode switch for stairs

and tracks where you could do it the normal way, but then like how you can branch out with the priority mining. It would be cool if you can go into like advance mode for tracks and be like, okay, I want this very specific track right here. Same with stairs, too, because the, if you build an up stair, if you're just tunneling down, like, think about version 47, you're tunneling down to, like, the first cavern layer. As soon as you hit that cavern layer, it opens up a space and that's now a hole into your fortress. Right, right. If you switch that, if you switch that bottom stair to an up stair, just by building the upstairs there, that seals off the chamber and then you can just branch over and keep going.

In the new version, you kind of have to, like, finagle it a little bit, like, build a room, cut off the up downstairs with like a floor, and then build like an alternate connection to that stairwell, it just built. Like, it's not 100%, but I think it's still great with the new version. I still like the new version. I'm going to feel you in on a little pattern that we've seemed to be finding here. It seems that the more advanced the player is, the less that they like the new stairs. We had a, we had Tekin and Blind on here last month, and neither one of them liked the new stairs

at all but the three of us were like yeah this is great you don't have to do the up down thinking you're building a stair halfway and i think it's only situational for those those small situations where you where i would want that like that's why i'm thinking like their advance mode button but 90% of the time i like the new stairs because it's just like okay click here and go it's pretty easy it's nice yeah you're it's really interesting what you're saying about the popping into the caverns because i noticed that too because I was like, man, I thought, what? Why is everything getting in?

That's interesting. Yeah. Well, there's the answer to that. So as soon as that downstairs is created, there's a hole into the fortress where any flying creature can just fly up into your fortress. And they do. Yeah, and I've noticed if you build a floor over it, sometimes then that'll trap them because it'll destroy the stairway together.

And then I built a floor and then everyone's just stuck in that little room. And I was like, oh, okay, well, that sucks. Right. Great. Good luck, guys. And then in that video, it was just kind of like, I just like hit record and then booted up Door Fortress and like, all right, let's try to build a shotgun and see. And so I just kind of like unedited recording of it. And we ended up getting it.

The shotgun came out really nice. It works exactly the same. The physics are the same. It's just the new way to build the tracks, which is a little vexing. But it can be done. And I made a tutorial video on that on how to build the shotgun. Yeah. So I don't know how I discovered that video, but I did.

And I posted to our, to our Discord channel. And Cleaner Dev answer back said, yeah, you should, you should have him on because he's got lots of videos and he would be a great guest. And how have I not heard of this channel before? So I'm so glad that I did find it. And wow, you've got, looks like, like 50 something videos out right now. on just the Steam release version of Door Fortress. Yeah, absolutely, yeah. Looks like about half my videos are Dwar Fortress, like 186 of them.

And then a bunch of those are, like I did a Hermit Challenge in version 47. I did a let's play in version 47 basement graves of beers and then a bunch of like just standalones of building stuff. And then now the Steam version games. Well, how did you get started with Dwar Fortress? If you can remember. Yeah, I do. I kind of remember I was trying to build. this single player world in Minecraft

where it would be a server and you would join the server and it was hardcore server only so you'd join and try to survive right and if you die that's it and so I was I was building all these command block and traps all over the place and then like the game updated and I was and it like broke all my command blocks and I was like this is like a half years work gone because of this update then I was like you know what like let me look into like what game created Minecraft and then I and then over time I was like oh dwarf fortress okay and let me dig more into it and eventually I started playing it and it was either 2013 or 14

I started and it was pretty pretty sweet I had a very very slow learning process for the game like my first fort was destroyed by dingoes not dingo men just regular dingoes This comment is sponsored by Australia. I think I was trying to figure out the military in the first fortress and I sent the guys over to fight the dingoes and then they just became enraged and killed all the dwarves because we had no equipment assigned. I was like, missed that step.

Easy to do. Easy to do. Especially in version 47 where it's like a whole submenu of military and stuff. that's an awesome one that that one yeah and then each of the fortress is after that I'm trying to learn a new aspect of the game it was very it was very I think my second fortress I realized that oh okay there's a finite amount of metal

that I actually have here because I was just like make the jobs on repeat and then I'm like wait where did all the middle go and then I realized I had to dig more and process more ores and everything like that. But yeah, it was really my frustrations with Minecraft updating that got me to look into Dwar Fortress. And I view Minecraft as kind of like virtual Legos,

and Dwar Fortress is like Sandcastle at the beach, virtualized, you know? Right. That's a great way to put it. Eventually, the tide is going to come in and destroy your fortress, and then you just go ahead and make a new one the next day. Yeah, that's a good attitude to have. It's very uncomputer gamey for a lot of people, because I know a lot of people that'll play things like SimCity or, I guess,

City Skyline is what we play now. But, yeah, you know, people turn off disasters. Don't ruin precious. And, you know, half the fun is not knowing just what's going to happen. You can, you know, if you're good enough, you can usually control outcomes. But every once in a while, there's fun. Absolutely, yeah. You posted some artwork.

Was that Firefall your creation? No, that Firefall is. not my creation, but I have made a similar one. And then in version 50, now I'm trying to make a new one in the... Did you say Firefall? Am I hearing of Firefall? Okay. So do we want to explain that for the casual listeners?

Seems to be a magma pump sack. Yeah. And then right behind a Eurist face made out of metal. So you've made Iron Forge from World of Warcraft, basically. It's what it sounds like. Well, no, this particular picture. Did this come from the D.F. Wiki? That one is, it's a screenshot of a GIF, so it actually moves, but the Discord wasn't powerful enough to host the GIF.

Yeah. I forget where I found that one. I've been scouring the internet for Dwar Fortress Memes because I'm the moderator over at R-slash-Dwarfortress memes. Well, that gives us a good chance to go into that, too. I did not realize that there was a subreddit for Dwar Fortress 101, for Dwar Fortress Memes. For whatever reason, I was just focusing and have been focusing on the regular Dwarfortress subreddit. They're pretty low volume. I mean, not the memes one.

I didn't know about that one, but the 101 is pretty low traffic, like one post every couple, unless it's big. Well, I've noted that the 101 has. several posts that are by you twisted. So it looks like you were involved in that, in that subreddit whenever it was more active. And it sounds like that the powers that me are trying

to get it a little more active again, which is a good idea for new players. I believe that that was somebody, a different content creator that made that originally. I don't know if they're still making videos or not, but it seemed like when I found that one subreddit, because

I go into the main Dwar Fortress Reddit and I look on the side and they don't like memes here, which is understandable. So then I saw that there was another memes channel and then I was like started looking around for other channels because there's one like Dwar Fortress IRL where people put things that like just remind them a Dwar fortress in there. And then I found the 101 and it was kind of like a dead subreddit for a while and I think it like I posted a bunch of my new tutorials in there at the time, which was like two years ago.

And then eventually it became locked. And then I was thinking of myself, okay, I could try to take over one of these two subredits. Let me try the memes one. And then so I think the memes are better, I think. So then I believe I contacted Clino Debb and I was like, hey, you know, this is a locked subreddit over here, Door Fortress memes. Can we get that resurrected? Is there what's going on with it? And then I think he was, he just was like, yeah, you want to, you want to be the moderator over there?

And I was like, yeah, sure, absolutely. And so I posted a bunch. It was, I grew it from like maybe 200 people. I think it's at like 15,000 now or 500. Yeah, it's, it looks like 1,500, yeah. So it was a lot of, in the early days of that, it was a lot of just like finding old dwarf fortress memes and posting it on there just so that we're just at least some content that you can see, you know. and now that now we have new creators on making new memes one of my favorites was the one that talks about the difficulty of playing some games with playing dwarf fortress and it used as a metaphor a waiter serving food at a at a restaurant table oh yes yeah that's a good one here's your fun sir exactly Harken now, O kin of the Free Peoples, and lend thine ears to Burma Bradley's tale of the Dwarven Outpost Iroodem Nast, New Tower of Showing.

Long ago, in the year 105, on the 27th day of sandstone, a mighty fortress was erected in the land known as the passionate dune, nestled on the vast continent of the great land. This fortress was the hope and pride of the great civilization known as the wealthy rag, and it was named New Tower of Showing. The venerable leader of this fortress was the stout and wise Bim ink-dented, whose age had already seen 84 winters. Yet still he led his people with an iron will, and with a keen mind that was honed by the art of bookkeeping. Though Bim was known to say, I don't always do things in the most efficient way,

he was nevertheless a stalwart and tireless worker. And so it was, as he pulled his wagon towards a promising location, that one of the wheels of his conveyance came off, and Bim was undaunted, for he knew that the fate of his outpost and the glory of his people rested on his shoulders, and he would not falter. And so he pushed on, with the spirit of his forefathers in his heart, and the courage of his kin in his veins. So saith the Bard Burma Bradley. Let's take a look here at some of the questions that we've received over the last couple weeks from some of our listeners and get everybody's takes on them.

That sound okay to everybody? That sounds great. Absolutely. We received a email from a gentleman named Mario Carlone, or Carlani, Mario Corlone, and he brought up something that had been in my mind for the last couple weeks. I've been considering going back and playing 4705 to compare the experience of that with version 50, just to see which one I've. feel is, and this is big air quotes, better, because there are some things that I don't care for

about the new version that I think that 47 did much better. But there are also things about the new version that I think does much better than 47. So this gentleman actually ran into a bug on 4705 where farm plots display an air message that the ground's not farmable, but no matter how much he douses it with water, it appears to be muddy, but he still can't farm it. I don't don't have an answer for that question. Sorry there, Mario. But it does bring up the question. Have you guys gone back and played version 47 since 50 has come out? I haven't. I haven't had the desire to do it. I felt like I had plenty of time to spend with 47. And I felt like I got to know it pretty well and was very eager to see 50 in the

game. So I wasn't in any great hurry to go back and play the one that I was kind of like ready to be farewell to the inability to see what happened in my logs is really starting to bear on my on my gameplay yes i i do miss the act i do miss knowing when things happened like if a caravan comes or if there's a fight yeah i miss i miss the activity log like that's a bummer to have lost that or to have made it so difficult as to not exist that as a downer i get why he did it but Roll and Twisted, either of you fired up 47 since the new ones come out? I loaded up for measurements when I was making the Rodax Fortress, which I ended up flooding the whole map for. That's the one that's most of like the standalone videos are on.

So that fortress there, I loaded it up for measurements of like the distance between this stair and this stair and this stair and then like the room sizes. Just to be sure it was sort of about the same. and then I was looking at one of the machines I built as a reference. But I'm really enjoying the new version a lot better than 47. Like the announcements, I feel like that's going to be fixed. Yeah. I hope it's going to be fixed. The announcements and the reports.

And then you know what's another thing, which maybe not a lot of people have talked about, I play on a 4K display. And everything's like super tiny. Like, when I go to the world map, it's like, I can't zoom in on the world map like I could. In 47, you can pretty much zoom in and out as big as possible where you can have one tile taking up the whole screen. That's how close you can zoom. And this new version, you can't really, this finite amount. Go ahead.

Yeah, I agree with that on the 4K. It's not really very easy to play in 4K. True, true. Unless you have really good eyes or a magnifying glass. Okay, so, hang on. several things. I want to come back to the farm plot because I think I might have the solution because back in the day, if you build your things in a mountain biome, then most of the time the mountain biome would just tell you that you can farm here and not just tell you that

there are no seeds or appropriate plants. Because now if you do it, in the current version, it just shows you that you don't have any seeds for the plants that could be grown here, which are known, so it's like empty. Back in the day, it most often just showed you, yeah, you can't farm here. So that might be the solution, I think. I just came up with that. So it might not be fully correct, though. Sounds right.

It sounds right, right? Sure did. It could also be like a patch of boulder that's in the box that he's not seeing, but I think the mountain sounds more right. I'll tell you what, let me go ahead and read the direct quote from Mario's email then just because we may actually have an answer here. So the section that is pertinent here is, however, I have recently encountered a bug in version 4705 where farm plots display an error message that the ground is not farmable, despite dousing the ground with water and the ground tile appearing as muddy. I'd like to know if this bug has been fixed in any subsequent updates of the game.

So maybe Mario you should check to see if that farm plot is in a mountain biome. Yeah, that really sounds like it, because at once, you know, you always... find out about these things if you either go on the wiki or you experience it yourself. I went into a mounted biome and I could not farm like topsoil layer. I was like, what is it happening? So that could be that. Talking about the older version, 47 was a great love of mine. But just like every other relationship, at some point it breaks.

It goes away. and you know what, I have my great memories, but I will not return. Do you know something about my marriage that I don't? Oh, no. Did your wife listen to this podcast? Or should I say, did your ex-wife listen to this podcast now? I hope my marriage doesn't break. I hope that relationship lasts until one of us breaks.

But anyway, sorry. Yeah, so I have not booted up the game. even though I never truly finished the last fortress that I was playing. So in my head, it's still kind of running, if you know what I mean. Like an unfinished story. But I don't think I will be returning to it. I have literally a full world ahead of me, and I just have no time to spend on looking back.

All right. Well, I do plan on open. it up and trying it out sometime in the in the future just to see what uh you know which one i i like better not that it really matters because so so twisted i should fill you in here i have a reputation of not liking change oh yeah same you're gonna have to relearn all the buttons when you go back to version 47 yeah well yeah that's right yeah i just got I got used to the hot keys in 50. I don't know how to build nest boxes now without having to use the menus, so that's great.

Did you guys use the new D.F. Hackout? Yeah, I did. I think it just came out like this week, I think. Or maybe last week? I used the previous one, and then I carefully installed it and used it, and then I looked through it, and I was like, yeah, I don't really need to do any of this stuff. Huh. What are you guys using it for? So they re-added planning mode, which is pretty awesome.

And so you can, like, plan your furniture again if you did that in the past, if you used lazy newsback. Oh, yeah. Yeah, it's great. Yes, that's how I would make sure that all my bedrooms had nothing but masterworks in them. Yeah, that's excellent. That's cool. That's a great idea. And then you can also use the probe command to look at that tile for the farm question.

Good idea. I think it's just, I'm pretty sure it's just probe, and it'll tell you all tiles. information. Let me just pull up that. Does it include temperature? It should, yes. Oh, nice, nice. Because I'm kind of missing temperature information. So, yeah, it's temperature information. It's missing out of the new game. There's probe, which is properties of the tile.

And then there's B probe, which is building, and C probe, which is creature. Hmm. Okay. Well, that's worth it. The probe is going to tell you if it's above ground light tile or not as well. or if it's a subterranean dark for your farming, which is something they left out of version 50. And it used to hover over and it would be like above ground light in the bottom left-hand corner of version 47. I don't know if you guys know that.

It has to do with above-ground farming if you want to do non. Right, right. Yeah. Yeah, I was trying to picture exactly what it is that you're, I mean, I knew that you could, I think you could hover the mouse over it and it would tell you whether it was open above ground or below ground, right? Right.

That's right. The big reason I don't know is because I have. I haven't tried growing any above-ground crops in subterranean areas with a new version. I did in the previous version. I had strawberry farms that were underground. But my farming has not become quite so advanced as the previous one because it just seems that farming seems to be more efficient in the new version. So I don't have to go to as many lengths to grow the crops. They seem to do better on their own without a lot of finageling.

with a version 50 yeah i think you might be actually right about even though they supposedly did not change anything about that yeah i really feel like farming is just better because now i don't even grow plump helmets all year around i have it just in autumn or whatever one time a year i grow plump helmets and that's enough for my fortress part of the problem for me though is i don't know which change improved my farming because about the same time that version 50 came out, I was also changing to only having skilled farmers do the planting. And I was doing things more with managers. All of these things happened in my gameplay around the same time.

Yeah, too many things changed at once. Yeah, so I don't know what the actual cause of my improvements in farming was. it's probably just as likely that it was just because I'm managing things better. No, I'm with you. I think farming, I think farming got easier and more productive. And I think so. Yeah.

I think so. And I don't know. Do you guys do you guys do the fertilize thing? Do you do build the supply chain to make fertilizer for the plots? Because I did that and that seems to really light things up. I have not. Never have. Yeah.

Not since. Is that potash you throw on it? Yeah. I think that's what it is. I've never done that either. Yeah, I don't think you need to. It was just kind of one of those, and I was like, oh, I'm going to click fertilize. And it's like, I don't have this.

And I was like, oh, well, now you do. I don't know. It seems to increase the yield, but I don't know if it really matters. Yeah, I did that once. And I was like, wow, that is insane amounts of food. And then I never did it again because I constantly overproduced food anyway. So I'm like, okay, what would I need to fertilize? At a certain point in the fortress,

life, I just stop farming all together and just trade everything, all the food. Yeah. Yeah, that seems workable. Yeah, I could potentially totally do that as well. I have over 10,000 prepared meals again, and it's like, yo. Just enough, just enough to get you through that winter. And honestly, like a good third of all my production of plants is colors. So I can color my silk and my cloth.

and what not. And the other third is I'm making paper because I'm a book fortress. And like there's just one third that is focused on farming. And most of it currently is just outside farming where I grow a little bit of wheat. And I don't need anything else. Like once every 10 years I go out and collect a few things. Now I have even like citrus trees and whatnot. Too much food.

It's crazy. Can you dye cloth any color but blue with dimple cup dye? No. You need different plants and different dye to dye different colors. No, I guess I phrased that wrong. Do you have the possibility of creating dyes that are colors other than blue? Yes, yes, yes. You have something that is called.

red root I always assumed it would be red but it looks more brownish and then there's dimple dye and there's one other

you know brown's just the poor man's red anyway can I put that on a shirt there's a blade weed which was emerald right yeah what's that twisted

there's a blade weed which is emerald dye aha I like emerald green looks like a silver barb which is a black dye or no it's a silver dye. It's a color black, though. So, yeah, there are quite a few colors that you can

close your dwarves in. Currently, everything in my fortress is blue or brownish red. Yeah, man, I have so many leather bags simply for that purpose. It's absolutely crazy. I normally trade for the dyes from the humans. They usually only have the emerald. They probably make it. Damn, I don't think they'd like me. Well, all right. Well, thanks, Mario. for that question that sent us on several threads. Really nice questions. Oh, Mario's also a research software engineer at an oceanographic research institute. So, yeah, cool.

That seems pretty neat. I'd like to see some good sea steading ports from him then. Next question up is probably a simpler one. It's from Libdomini is the listener. and Libdomini asks, how do you keep dwarfs from bringing cheese to their room and letting it rot and sleeping in their own miasma? I don't know why cheese rots in general.

Like, I think in the real world, the gnarlier it is, the better it is. I mean, I do you know what? I agree. Do we need to turn some cheese? Like, are we talking, you know, like craft slices here? Are we talking like brie? Because a breeze, fine. You know, shove it under your bed for a couple weeks and you get to go.

No, no, I want blue mold in my cheese. Unironically speaking, I love blue mold cheese. Anybody out there, you want to bring me flowers? I don't want flowers. I want a blue mold cheese. Thank you very much. Unironically. I would love that.

A lot of blue mold cheese? A key of blue mold cheese. And, I mean, okay, the first question. question back, do you have tables and or chairs in the rooms that your dwarves live in? Because if you do, then they try to eat there instead. You can, however, without removing the cool furniture from their rooms, you can just forbid them, and they will no longer actually sit on the chair while there's technically still a chair in their room. So you could do that. If they don't, then it might have to do with military things, but I'm uncertain about that. I think they changed it because I have not seen that behavior for a long time. It would be the backpacks if it wasn't the case with the chairs, tables, rooms. So they'll carry food normally by default.

In version 47, if you load it up and go to the military screen, there's a sub-menu for carrying food and drink, and that was overlooked in this version. I believe they're going to add it in a later patch. But right now, the ammunition and the food and drink carrying, they're both default values that they were set in version 47, which is carry one food. So if they have a backpack on, I normally won't, I won't make any backpacks or if I get any, I'll forbid them or throw them in magma or something just because of this. Yeah, I don't know if there's any way that you can tell dwarves not to bring food to the room directly. You have to do it sneakily, I would think.

Am I right? Just lock the door. Just, well, you can't lock them out of the bedroom, though. No, I don't mean outside. What? Just lock them inside. You know, they can't bring cheese into their bedroom if they're locked inside. Oh, gotcha.

Easy enough. I have a feeling it has something to do with, like, dining room and seating and lack of appropriate other place to eat it. That's my guess. I bet you could solve it with that. Well, thank you, Libdomini, for your question. Okay. Harken now, O kin of the Free Peoples, and listen closely to Christopher Harris's tale of the ill-famed traitor of Newtower, February renown iron, a dwarf of 56 years, who is known to be greedy, ungrateful, clumsy and anxious, and who holds no love for her kin or family. Don't bother trying to play on my emotions, she says, with a tone as cold as the mountain peaks. Despite her unpleasant demeanor, February has formed a bond of friendship with Rockist-Oder-Fensed, a planter of 73 years, whose first love is agriculture.

Rockest is a skilled diagnostician, and sometimes he wonders whether it would be better to retire and spend his days in idleness, enjoying the fruits of his labor. Rockist's closest friend is risen oily hammer, an anger-prone brewer who believes that hard work is the true sign of character. Together, these three unlikely companions will strive to make Newtower of showing a shining jewel in the amulet of their great civilization. So saith the bard Christopher Harris. So this is from Teked, a username Techid.

So if you could pick two bugs or shortcomings of Dwar Fortress to fix today in exchange for no other fixes ever, what would they be? Oh, wow. What? No, thanks. Pass. If you guys could pick two bugs or shortcomings of Dwar Fortress to fix today in exchange for no other fixes ever, what would they be? That's harsh. He goes on to add that at least one of his would be clothing claims, uh, hand down, hands down.

down. I mean, you're asking for your save games to be broken forever. Let's back this off. Like, what kind of like I'm going to say? It's a hypothetical. I don't know. I mean... Okay, you know what? I actually have an opinion about that. And that is, if I could

touch the border of any window and resize it the way I wanted to be resized, including the text box inside that window, then I would be delighted because if I currently click on an item and I try to read its description, I get a maybe three by four centimeter box and I can read what, five sentences and then have to scroll down. And that is painful because I currently have a statue that is encrusted with literally everything I have in my fortress,

The text is so long, it would probably fill my screen in a full text mode. I can't read it, and I'm very sad about it. Of course, this brings nightmares back to me of old Windows multiple document interface applications. So I can now see Windows 3.1 or Windows 95 controls on a dual fortress screen. Because back in the day, they thought that it was cool to have, including games, for some reason. They would have games that actually looked like Windows and weren't able to full screen. And they all had every little window in the game would have a separate window control on it.

You can resize everything, but it was really ugly and it was very clunky. Does anybody besides me remember that era? Yeah. It was always a DOS box. No, this was with Windows, I think that it was introduced with Windows 3.1. There was the difference between single document interface and multiple document interface, and multiple document interface was what we're used to. Yeah, it was really annoying.

Excel suffered from that for years, years and years and years. Word did too, yeah. All the Microsoft properties, because they were pushing it, right? It was a terrible dark time of pestilence and famine and not being able to have multiple windows for an app. It was terrible. Yeah, exactly. And whoever Microsoft, I'm talking to you, whoever,

never did that, you should feel bad about yourself because it was terrible. And it was gone by the time Windows 2000 rolled around. I think those Excel things, and Excel and Word, that went on for ages. Anyway, this is pretty... This is not the office podcast.

Pretty esoteric diversion here. I strike my comment from the record. You don't need to. It's annoying. You're right. But nobody under the age of like 40 is going to get that. So, Let's move on.

Let's see. So my first one that I chose that I would fix would be the reporting and logging system. That is the big one. But there's a new bug now. That's fixed. But now there's a new bug, which means no events are logged at all. So congratulations. We're not fixing it.

Again, it's all hypothetical, man. You're taking it too little. I have to. My second point of emphasis would be to be able to access at least some Legends mode information from inside Fortress mode so that you don't have to export a save in order to read information about this dwarf that just came in, you know, Legends mode information from this dwarf that just migrated in. That would be nice. There is now kind of a way around it, I think. For Legends mode? Yeah, yeah.

Do tell more. I have not checked it out, but I think. it works what you do is you say save without quitting the game and then it asks you for a save state name and then you should fill it in and then you have two different saves in two different things for example i um save like my hand saved a world and then abandoned that fortress and when i clicked on continue playing i wanted to make a new fortress but the old save was still there so right now i currently still have a save from the old fortress and a save from the new fortress. Obviously there's now, I don't know, 80 years between, but I could technically make a new save, call it like save two,

go into that, abandon the fortress there, and I don't have to, you know, actually abandon my fortress. I can just go back to the automatic save and then play my fortress normally while also using Legends mode on the manual save that I did. You know what I mean? Yeah. I do. I do. You're still jumping through some hoops.

What I would like to see is like in your library have like an oracle. You know, you could assign a position in your library that would be an Oracle. And it's like a life feed. Yeah. That would be great. Yeah, it's where you could go to them and basically I have information about these dwarves in your fortress and be, you know, something like that. But something that is in universe, end game that you could take a look at. And much like what was done with a simpler effect, whenever Meph had his,

it wasn't bookkeeper. Librarian? The librarian. The librarian, yeah. Yeah, it was the workshop that, yeah, it came with lots of warnings. Yeah, and it crashed, but the idea, that's, I like that idea. Yeah, I liked it too. True.

I used that a lot. It felt really fun having one, too. like having a library felt fun. Now that I've put you on the spot, twisted, can you think of anything? Oh, absolutely. I really like the announcement's idea, but just to say some different things, the mind carts, when they're filled with liquid, they become invisible. And then sometimes when you build tracks and have a room dug out underneath the track, you can kind of see through it into the lower level. and so there's some like these translucent effects that aren't really supposed to be there with the mind carts

as well as yeah so so that was actually in the video that you guys first discovered I was just like looking for more bugs at that point and then I'm thinking that also the military screens that are missing for ammunition and carrying food and drink because only the default Archer is working right now with Ranged and that's just really, really vexing. So if that was the only two bugs I could fix,

probably those two, but it's a toss-up between mine carts and the announcement system. But now that we have more programmers aboard, and I think that we're going to get a lot of fun stuff, I think that a lot of the bugs are going to get fixed. it looks like FPS death is coming to an end, the death of SPSPS death.

That would be pretty cool. Yeah, that would be really neat. Then you only have yourself to blame. Right. Which would be, hey, oh, well, yeah, I was going to fix that problem. But, oh, FPS deaths. I would have beat that siege, of course, but my computer died. I don't believe in FPS.

You can get pretty far into it now. Like, I've had forts with more than 350 dwarfs with this, with this particular release and I don't think I could ever push 200 in the last version. So things have gotten leaner on the on the code side, I think, too. To be fair, though, your PC is not just a smart fridge. So I would say you have a Ryzen 9 also. I mean, I have the small baby Ryzen 9 though. Is there a small baby?

I believe there's still a big difference between the baby raisin and the big Ryzen 9. and you now have a, what, a threat ripper? So you can't really say that, oh yeah, the game has got so much easier on my PC if you're playing on the best hardware out there currently. Well, I mean, to be fair, like I did have, I had an I-9 before and now I've got a Verizon 9, 79-50, and I mean, it doesn't really matter because it's a single-core game, so any of, I think any of They're still faster.

Well, it's just single core. That's how I benchmark my CPUs now as I'm like, I don't care about all these threads. Give me single core. Typical Dwar Fortress player. Give me the fastest CPU you have. I started doing that a few years ago, too. What's the fastest single core? What's that twisted?

I started doing that a few years ago, too, just like single core performance only. Yeah. Versus price, you know. It's terrible because that is actually what got me this CPU, because I was looking at how much speed I can get for this amount of money, and I was actually considering getting the big seven, but then the small nine is slightly faster at single core speeds. So, yeah, I went for that.

Yep. You got it. I'd like to see Dwell Fortress run on some of these supercomputers that have, you know, Zeta Flops that run Linux. I'd like to see if someone can install it. Well, we've got to get a Linux release out. We have to check if somebody at Nassau Place, Dwar Fortress. Yeah.

I mean, they do. Here at Lawrence Livermore Labs, we are running Dwar Fortress simulations on this. I want to see it running on the MacCardware. Yeah, that's right. Yeah, oh, yeah, because it's top secret. That's right. Tarns turn secretly an agent for the intelligence community. This is just a benchmarking tool.

I was going to say Potnam's actually a covert operative. They're all spies. So thank you, Tekin, for your question. I hope that we have answered it to your satisfaction. Gather now, O kin of the Free Peoples, and listen closely to Byron's tale of Eurist Quake Prestige, the militia commander of Newtower. Though he is, but an adequate maist wharf,

He believes that one can always rely on family when all else fails. Eurist is known to lack self-control, and his frail frame makes him quick to despair. Despite his shortcomings, Eurist has formed a close friendship with the chief medical dwarf, Medzeth Budsaber, who is known to be a hateful quarreler, valuing power above all else. Medzith is a competent diagnostician and a skilled surgeon, bone doctor, and suturer, and she declares herself to be well. Minket-fenced fountain, a patient and resilient dwarf with a sharp focus, is a close friend of Mebseth. Her skills make her the ideal fortress manager, and she is also the most competent cook in the fortress.

An artisan, their materials, and the tools to shape them, she exclaims proudly, for she is 70 years old, and her talents have been honed by many years of hard work. These seven dwarves, renowned as the elders of New Tower of Showing, are deserving of the highest praise. May their names be remembered for all time, and may their deeds be sung by the bards of future generations. So saith the bard Byron. So Twisted, you've been doing YouTube videos as your main thing. Or maybe your only thing, but that's how I know about your existence. Oh, yeah, it's kind of a side project.

I got a real job, too. So whenever I get some time, I play some video games and record it. But mostly it's YouTube. Yeah, absolutely. How long does that go? How long have you been doing this content creation thing? I think it's three years now in coming up in June. What's your favorite thing to stream?

Other than Dwar Fortress. Other than Dwar Fortress? Kenchi. You guys ever play Kenchi? Yeah, I did it. That's a fun game. Okay. I'm actually the, I hold the world record for a Kenchi speed run of,

yeah, Bugmaster. Hardcore mode. Holy crap, oh. Dang. So you start off in the game, and if your game crashes or if you reload the game, hardcore run is over, so you can't even do that. And I beat it in like an hour, I think it's an hour and a half is the current world record. You see here, it was one hour and 30 minutes.

I was like asking Door Fortress players what other games they play, because I feel like you're kind of a special self-selecting person to have found Door Fortress and gotten into it in the first place. So I'm always just like, okay, what? So his similarity is that Kenchi is also a single developer. Holy God. So Kenchi is also a single developer, but they hired an art department or maybe one other guy to do an artist, like an artist. But that's also a single developer game.

And I was playing some Stardu Valley with my wife for a little bit. That's a single developer game. and Minecraft. Those are the games that are currently in my rotation. Now, I've heard of Kinshi, but what does this Minecraft thing you speak of? It's an infinaminer. Infini minor. It's an infinaminer clone.

It's owned by this up, you know, this up-and-coming software publisher in the Seattle area, I think. Definitely watch that company that they're going to be up to school stuff. I'll have to check out this kenshi. I've never, I've never come across it before. That looks pretty cool. Oh, yeah. It's one of those games where you fall into a deep dark hole if you play it for too long, and then you're like, oh, no.

I can't afford another one of those. Oh, you can. You can't afford another one. It's on sale right now, I think. Yeah. No, no, I'm not talking about, I'm not talking about money. You're talking about time. Me neither.

I'm not talking about time. That's right. And we're just trying, we're enablers here. this is not a place you go for oh no help me curb my addiction sorry man this is all enablers it's bad enough whenever i sit down after work to play dwarf fortress for a few minutes and next thing i know it's dawn yeah yeah yeah there you go it is on sale right now there you go and it says similar to games you've played rimworld and door fortress so there you go yeah it is something and you can also do a lot of

wacky stuff that you can experience, for example, in the adventure mode in War Fortress as well. It's very wacky. Pretty cool. Is it a FPS? Not frames per second. First person shooter.

It's a sword punk style squad-based RPG. So most of your units are going to be katana or Naganata, maybe heavy weapons, heavy swords, and then there's very few crossbow characters and that's it.

Martial arts, maybe. Yeah, it's not an FPS. You don't need reaction time, really. But it's also limb-based combat. So, like, your arm can get chopped off. You can get your leg taken off. It's great. It's really fun, yeah.

That seems to be the thing, because I was looking at this other game, what was that on Steam? It was also a limb-based combat, but it's, like, almost unknown. It was like a third limb-based combat that I found recently. Okay. Lim-based combat, as in you take your right arm and do something with that, as in actual limbs of the body? Right.

The knights that said knee. Who said knee? Yeah. That was the example of limb-based combat in my mind. Well, actually, Tony, I think that you're referring to the Black Knight scene. I am referring to the beginning. Thank you for that You know what

I'm doing I couldn't remember where it was in the film so that's why I said emphatically incorrectly so that I would be corrected

as opposed to saying I can't remember which part of the film was that in and everyone's like I don't know I needed to know it starts at four minutes

and 33 seconds into the film it's just no sir you are incorrect is it five minutes and 22 So the other one is called Examina.

And I'm sort of looking into that. It seems really fun, but it's a pretty high learning curve as well because it's a real time and you have to use the mouse for combat. And it seems like physics based as well. So limb-based combat is where the game takes into account all the body parts. Is that true? Right. So if your arm gets scratched, it's not as efficient. Right. You can lose a leg, maybe.

Like if you get struck and it pinches your right thigh and it bruises it and the bone is bruised and the brain is bruised. It bruises the fat. That's one of my favorite ones. You have a brain in your thigh? Yeah, no brain in the thigh. It depends on what kind of forgotten beast we're talking about. here. It's true. We're talking about the thigh-brained forgotten beasts. There's some weird stuff with injuries that I've noticed in this release, though, where I had a fort with a whole bunch of injured people, and then I would inevitably keep assigning them to squads, not realizing

they were injured and in bed, so I started labeling them all injured, so I would stop doing that. And then I had some problems with that fort, and so I've started a new one, and I've noticed a lot of my dwarves have come over and it says lost the ability to stand they don't have crutches but they're happily moving about the new fort. Labeled is injured having lost the ability to stand doesn't seem to be slowing

them down so good for them. That's weird. I mean I get the dwarfs get scratched and stuff. My dwarfs are very scarred for example but I don't have a lot of people that need crutches. In this one's really weird

I look at her health and it says she has lost the ability to stand and it seems to not really be slowing her down and she doesn't have crutches. So she's great for her. You know, I look up here and I see that we've been recording on this stream, not counting the one that screwed up and we had to restart.

We've been recording for over an hour here. And I haven't even breached a subject that me and Twisted talked about discussing to start with, which is we're going to talk about megaprojects. Oh. But what it looks like in order to discuss that properly, we will have to have twisted

logic gaming back on here. I think I might have called you twisted gaming logic, which is earlier. I apologize for that. I was describing to a fortress. That's part of the, part of the name comes from just my brain over, overclock. And then I'm just spitting out words and they get all. jambled into one. Your own GPT3, it sounds like.

Well, Twisted, if you're willing, we'll have you back on here to talk about Megaproject. Absolutely. Yeah. So thank you so much for joining us today. It has been a total blast, a very, more stream of consciousness than we typically have with guests, which I like that. Thank you very much.

I appreciate it. Do we have anything else that we want to put out there today? So you did say that there was a new release of DF hack. I need to put that in the show notes and check that out. So certainly talk about that on our next episode, I think. Can I make some blatant self-advertisement? Absolutely. Okay.

Plug something. And feel free, twisted as well. You can plug whatever you want here after a role and gets done being narcissistic. Excellent. You know what I have this podcast for, right? Exactly. So I will actually be playing a new bloodline with Taked. And we have a new special guest on as well.

She has just recently taken up Door Fortress, so she is very new in the game, and we have already spoken about her starting the fortress, and we, after her, take over and so on. And it's going to be everybody gets a year, everybody gets a few weeks. It will be starting around April, I think it was, but we're not fully fixed on that yet.

But you can all appreciate a new kind of continuous series that I will be putting out from then on. That's great. I wish that I could dedicate and be better at bloodlining, but we've tried it a couple times, and I've just failed miserably every time we do it. I mean, not failing in the fortress, but I fail to get things done in a timely manner. Oh, yeah, no, I feel that. you know I am I'm cursed so I have this same problem but ultimately we did it totally relaxed I told him like hey I need another week blah blah blah and then it was to just like finish it

when you're done and give it over and that work good enough so let's let's see if we can make it work or not so it's you and techett and this mystery other a mystery mother person. I'm not sure if I can say their name right yet because we have to figure things out more. It's a mystery third person and she just has taken

it up. If they kill the fort you're going to boot him off. No, no, no, no. I'm not that terrible. We're going to take it slow. So when you guys say the bold line forts, is that kind of like a succession where Roland you would play?

for a year and then Tekkid would play the next year, the mystery guest third year or however you order it? Yeah, exactly. We consider doing mayors like switching out mayors, but that takes a long time so everybody gets a mayor

or everybody switches when the mayor gets elected. But ultimately, just playing a year is a way more stable time frame. That's what I found with my new series that I'm starting, I think I started it last week when I was talking to you guys while I was editing

the episode. I'm playing with the Dwar Fortress World Map, so it looks like Earth. Yeah, I saw that. That's very nice. Yeah, and so we're going to dig the Panama Canal. And that's the whole, that's the new fortress right now. I'm trying to do it in less than 10 years. We're digging Panama Canal.

Terrific. Where did you get that map? So I found it on, where did we find that? That's on the old forum, the Bay 12 forums. I made a video on how to get it into this version, which is public right now, which is just basically going to my Google Drive and downloading the WorldGen text and adding it to yours. But that was made with a program called Perfect World. And with Perfect World, you can add in a map, like a height map.

Like if you want to do a hype map of Germany, you can add in that and then bring that into the world of Dwar Fortress where you can play. So somebody did the, that was U-Tunnels that made it, I believe, was his name. It was the author of the World Map. And then there was another old player that made England and Ireland. And now I'm learning how to do it now as well. And I plan to make a few, but, you know, I got to learn it before I tell you what I'm going to make. Well, that's awesome. That's awesome.

Yeah, we, now that we've brought it up, I think that we could probably talk about another hour on the ecosystem of plugins. and what we would like to see to be applied to the New World Fortress. However, we are out of time for today. So head over to twistedlogic.com. I was going to say, Twisted, tell us where our listeners can find you on the internet and plug whatever it is that you want to plug here. So I think that you should go to YouTube.com slash twisted logic gaming, and that'll bring you to my main YouTube page.

That's where the majority of my content is. as well as R-slash Dwar Fortress Memes. Good stuff, by the way. I like it. Perfect. All right, so everyone out there, thanks for tuning in to Dwar Fortress Roundtable, and we will see everybody next time.

Good luck and dig deep. Thank you very much. Awesome. Thanks for watching. See you later. This has been the Dwarfortress Roundtable podcast. You can find all our past episodes at DF Roundtable.com. Stop by and leave a message.

message or suggestion in the comments section for this episode. While you're there, you can subscribe to Dwarfortress Roundtable or find us in the podcast service of your choice. You can find video content on our YouTube channel, and you can send us an email at Eurist at DFRoundable.com. That's UR-I-ST at D-F Roundtable.com. Please consider donating to the creators of Dwarfortress at Bay12 Games.com. If you'd like to help support this podcast, you can find us at page Patreon.com slash D.F. Roundtable. This is a conversational podcast. Allcrafts horseship is of the highest quality. Thanks, Delphonzo.