Ear Biscuits with Rhett & Link - 244: Are We Having A Mid-Life Crisis? | Ear Biscuits Ep.244

Episode Date: June 8, 2020

Or should we call it a mid-life assessment? Listen to R&L discuss their views and experiences on growing older in this episode of Ear Biscuits! To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Let's go seize the night. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Visit amex.ca slash yamex. Benefits vary by card, other conditions apply. Welcome to Ear Biscuits. I'm Link. And I'm Rhett. This week, we're still at our individual tables of adequate, I don't know if I've got adequate lighting this week. We didn't even think we were gonna be here. Hey, we're both wearing gray T-shirts. Is that better than being in the same dimly lit round table?

That's our comfort zone? Well, the funny thing is, is we're actually now in contact with one another. You know, we shot GMM together. So we're no longer social distancing from each other because we basically have formed a pod between our families and now with Stevie. But here's the thing,

we thought that we were gonna be recording this in the studio this week, and we are gonna be shooting some GMM in the studio this week, but there's a bunch of construction going on and people in and out of the studio. So in order to minimize risk, we're in here again. So we lied, we're sorry.

Or no, we were mistaken. We were just wrong. We were mistaken, we were wrong. But you know what? We're gonna make the best of it. One more episode like this. Yeah, hopefully just this one. But.

Is my birthday as we're recording this, as with everything else, nothing counts. I mean, you tweeted, I appreciate you acknowledging my birthday on Twitter. I will acknowledge that you acknowledge my birthday right now. It was a mild acknowledgement given the state of the world. I know, you know, it's like,

we've been through so many milestones here at my home, like multiple birthdays, multiple Mother's Day anniversaries, you know, all types of stuff. And it's just so, it's so hard to work up the gumption to like try to make it special because it's like, you just feel like I'm just gonna wait. It'll be special again later, you know? And so, I don't know, man.

And then you compound, you know, we're not just living in a world that's a pandemic. We're in crisis here in America, you know? Yeah, well, so we'll talk about that a little bit because what we're gonna talk about when we get into the main part of the episode is we're gonna be talking about getting older and not just as two middle-aged men

who are literally older now, but just the process of growing up and we're gonna touch on some different stages in life and we're using your questions to explore that. Looking forward to that, but- Yeah, so whether you're in your teens, your 20s, 30s, 40s, wherever you are, we've been through a lot of it and we anticipate even more. So we'll be touching on all

that stuff, hopefully. But before we get into that, yes, we do want to acknowledge what's going on in the world. I mean, last week on Air Biscuits, we were talking about that I wanted to, because of just for my own personal health, to take a news break. Now, wisely, you pointed out at the time that that was really a decision that was rooted in my own privilege of being able to just check out. And since then, and we also, we talked about the murder of George Floyd briefly and how that, we had just learned about that when we recorded the night before. And I had a lot of anger about that. And just over the course of the few days after that, of course, protests broke out throughout the nation. They're continuing to go on right now.

We've got curfews in place in Los Angeles and things have really gotten volatile out there. And, you know, so we're not gonna do, I think the thing that a lot of times white folks like to do which is to be like, hey, let's get together with other white folks and talk about race. I think that would be, in one sense, that could be a little tone deaf.

And I think that we be, in one sense, that could be a little tone deaf. And I think that we have made an effort to, you know, as a company, but also as individuals to say some things during this time. recently to be conscious about is just the idea of not just doing the typical thing where you kind of come in and say your piece as if what you have to say is super important. I mean, I had a lot of things on my mind and on my heart about what was happening. And it hit me that the most strategic thing that I could do is just talk about a little bit about what I've been learning, learning, especially from black voices who actually understand the history of what's going on in our country and understand why what's happening right now is happening. Mm-hmm.

And so instead of trying to speak my mind necessarily, what I did is I wrote a letter to my former self and tried to embody the way that I used to think about these issues, you know, which I was very sure was a just and right and logical way of thinking about them. And I've since come to the realization that a lot of those thoughts were based in my privilege and my whiteness, which is contrary to what a lot of people on the internet will say is not a myth. Yeah. And I'll just jump in and say, if you haven't read the Medium article that Rhett wrote,

I'm super proud of the fact that he put that down on paper, or you can watch him read it, or listen to him read it on his Instagram page. So here I am finally promoting your Instagram. Well, and also my Twitter, so you can shout me out on Twitter and Instagram. Or Twitter. I decided to read it because, you know,

we talked about this last week as well. I mean, every once in a while, something gets me and I'd like, I have to say something and I'll write a medium piece. But, you know, it kind of just hit me. A lot of people don't read, period. And a lot of people don't read, take the time to just read an article. And a lot of people don't read period. And a lot of people don't read,

media articles. Take the time to just read an article and a lot of people don't wanna read something from a guy who's famous on YouTube, which I get that neither do I. But I thought that by taking the time to read it, I could maybe communicate how personal it was and also get it out there. Because again, it's like, I'm not trying to speak into the culture at large and I'm not trying to be a voice that is telling black

people how they should be acting and reacting to what's going on. Like that's what a lot of white people that I know like to do. But what I wanted to do is, as I said, the only thing that I'm an authority on in this situation is the way that I used to think about this, because I was there, it was me.

And so I just wanna talk about that. And so I'm not gonna rehash it here, but like Link said, I mean, that's what I have to say about the situation. Of course, as a company, we're doing what we can to support the movement to fight racial inequality and injustice, both by speaking into it, but also in giving.

But I think, and instead of waiting until the end of the episode to give a rec, I wanna give my rec up front, because I think that rather than listen to us talk about it, I'd like you to listen to a very, very compelling black voice on these issues. And one of the books that was the most eye-opening for me was Stamped from the Beginning by Ibram X. Kendi. So this is a, and first of all, thankfully he has two versions of this book, because if you just read Stamped from the Beginning,

it's a long, comprehensive book. It's a history book that covers the history of racism against black people, starting even before America, but then the majority of the book talks about just the history of racism in America. Now, if you're like us, if you're our age, if you're from where we're from, I think we grew up kind of just thinking that, yeah, of course there was racism against black people. I mean, back in the day, I mean, of course, I mean, there was slavery and then there was stuff before the civil rights movement. But I mean, now it's kind of like, I mean, of course, I mean, there was slavery and then there was stuff before the civil rights movement.

But I mean, now it's kind of like, I mean, hey, we had a black president. I mean, everything's cool now, right? And I think that that's not really understanding the depth of racism in America and what that means and what that has meant for black people historically and what that means for black people now. So I heavily, highly, as enthusiastically as possible recommend reading or listening to

Stamped from the Beginning. And if that 19 and a half hour audible book is a little bit too much for you to bite off, he actually collaborated with, I think Jason Reynolds is his name, and did, I think it's just called Stamped. And it's basically the teenage version of the content that's in Stamped from the beginning. It kind of changes the voice and speaks a little bit in a less academic and more like to speak into this generation. And it's a shorter read,

but it's essentially the same content. So stamped by Ibram X. Kendi. Okay, I can get into that. Yeah, and I would just say, again, the tendency, and this has been my tendency for my whole life, my tendency is just as events unfold in the world is to begin forming opinions about those events my tendency is just as events unfold in the world

is to begin forming opinions about those events and then beginning to spout those opinions off and talk to other people about those opinions before listening and before understanding the context. And if you say things like white privilege is a myth, if you say that there is no racist oppression in America today, A, you're flat wrong. And the only way to learn that you're wrong

is to actually learn about the history of racism in America. And you've got to educate yourself. And that doesn't mean the US history class that you took in high school did it. Because I took that same US history class and they didn't talk about this stuff. They didn't talk about this stuff to the degree

and with the accuracy and the stepping out of the traditional colonialist white perspective in the way that Ibram is able to do. So Stanford in the beginning. And also I recommended four other books that are kind of come at things from a different angle, but are all great in the medium article that you can recommend all those.

And the rest of them are shorter if you wanna try one of those. I've really had to come to grips with the fact that being on the sidelines of this issue is perpetuating the problem. You know, there are a lot of quotes floating around that say it much more eloquently than that. But for me, you know,

I haven't denied these problems and I haven't sought to actively undermine it by any means. But I feel like I've been paralyzed because with a combination of just not being educated enough and not, and just being, and having fear about deciding to say or do things because, you know, we're in this environment where if you, if you decide to say something, you know, my instinct is not to take as little amount of time as possible to like understand something just so I can then turn around and say where I stand on it, you know?

I'm very hesitant to take stands on things because I just don't have a lot of confidence when it comes to that type of thing. So instead, I just don't have a lot of confidence when it comes to that type of thing. So instead, I just get intimidated and just kind of move on to the next thing. And I'm troubled by it, but I'm kind of frozen on the sidelines. And I've really come to grips with like,

that's, I don't want to stay there, you know? But it's just acknowledging the excuses in order to work through them to say, hey, sometimes if you say something and you say the wrong thing, even if you're trying to help, then you make people upset that you're trying to help, you know, or if you put anything on the internet that shares something and that implies that you're taking action or that you believe other people should also take action, it just puts a target.

You know, no matter what is being said on the internet, if you look underneath it, most there someone is very much opposed to it. You know? Yeah. And so I wig out trying to anticipate what that is. Well I find it really interesting that- It's paralyzing. I find it really interesting that one of the accusations, one of the accusations that we've received,

this year we've become more vocal, right? Obviously we've become more vocal for a number of reasons. We became more vocal once we kind of broke the story of our deconversion, deconstruction, and people have perceived that we're, you know, being more political or talking about issues. I think that those things just happen to coincide in one sense, but it also coincided with 2020,

which is a year in which you're not getting political, you're kind of missing the point. You're not participating if you're not getting political. But I'll say that one of the accusations that we received sort of multiple times is, you guys are doing this to please your audience. Let me tell you everybody, we've done nothing but lose audience.

We've done nothing but lose audience. Every time I tweet something that is a little bit controversial, I lose followers. So we're not doing this to gain audience. I want as many people to stick around as possible, but that's not where we're doing it. But to speak to what you're talking about with this hesitation to say something

because you feel like you're gonna say something wrong. First of all, you are going to say something wrong, right? When you speak into these things, you are going to get it wrong. And you don't mean me personally, you're not singling me out, I don't think. No, anyone who makes a decision to try to be a part of it is gonna get it wrong and it's just part of the process.

But it's also the way that we learn how to do it. And I think you'll be surprised that if you just take a humble posture and you take a posture that is like, I'm here to learn, I'm here to listen. If I said that in the wrong way, or if I had an idea that was actually based in some cloak racism that I didn't even know if I had,

point that out to me, because I want to grow. And I think another aspect of that is, the more that I listen, the more that I learn, the better way to engage, right? And this is a really recent thing for us. I mean, you know, I think the way that I have thought and felt about these issues of racial injustice in America has been around for quite some time,

but the way that I'm actually interacting and engaging and sort of understanding the depth of the problem, the persistence of the problem, that's something that's only come, that's not gonna come by just having a conversation with you. You know what I'm saying? Me and you can get together and talk and pontificate and philosophize about everything into the Cal's Con Home

and we're never gonna understand the situation that's happening in black America, right? The only way you're gonna understand that is you have to read, listen to black voices. And so if you're speaking into this, but you haven't read a book like Stamped from the Beginning, you haven't listened to a talk or a video, you're not following anybody on Twitter

who's speaking from that perspective. You don't have the facts. You can't, you know, you're coming into this with blinders on. And it took me a long time to, and that's not just the case with this issue, that's the case with every issue, right? It drives me, the thing that drives me crazy

is when I, if you find yourself in the wrong place, you know, on Twitter, or scrolling through the comments, you get barraged, you get pummeled by people who there is, I can discern no love or empathy in their point of view. It's one thing to disagree or to make a counterpoint or to come from a different place. that's the one thing I do feel like I can discern, you know, is kind of sniff out like, is there any love, any component of love in what you're saying? And I mean, that's why it's deeply disturbing to me. If, you know, if, if I go to the president's Twitter timeline. You know, I just, you know, it deeply disturbs me that I cannot pick up just a grain of empathy in what he says.

And I mean, you know, I know we don't want, you know, it's like, well, here I am getting into, you know. That's, but hold on, but here's the thing. That's not political. That's just human intuition. I'm being into, you know. But hold on, but here's the thing. That's not political. That's just human intuition. I'm being honest with you. Like seeing the fact that our country is going through what it's going through right now,

and we have a president who we don't even want him to speak about it because him speaking about it makes it worse. Like that's unprecedented that we have a president who we do not actually want to say anything because he will only inflame, he will only divide. That's not a political observation. That's just a logical observation about human behavior.

I don't care what side of the spectrum you're on, you cannot deny that fact. He is not a leader, he is a divider. He's making it worse. It's the absolute last thing that we need right now. Hopefully it won't last much longer. So let's shift to a brighter topic of getting older. Shop Best Buy's get into these questions.

We'll start with Meredith Gordon. Isabeanfuzz on Twitter, do you believe in the existence of a quarter life crisis? I'm 37, so obviously closer to having a midlife crisis, but since in quarantine, I've been thinking it might be possible to take the quarantine quarter life crisis intensive and get it done before 40. Yeah, if you're 37 and you're having a quarter life crisis,

that means that you expect to be 148 years old, if I'm doing the math right. Well, but she's saying I'm closer to having a midlife crisis. Quarter life crisis, I guess, would be like in your mid 20s. But I do know- I don't know about that. I can relate to the fact that like, I mean, being in quarantine,

it's time for a lot of reflection. And so I've definitely found myself asking, what is my life? What am I doing? I mean, I wouldn't call it a crisis. So deemphasizing the word crisis, I do think I've had like a midlife assessment period. And there's a lot of question marks associated with that, but it's, you know, turning 42 and having time to think about it more,

I just feel like what's the rest of my life gonna look like? Like, I'm looking back at everything we've done. And by the way, we've, and if you listen through a bunch of these episodes, we've lived a bunch of life, man. I'm super grateful. Like, we've lived a bunch of life, man. I'm super grateful. Like we've had great lives, multiple.

We've had multiple careers. I feel like we've lived multiple lives. We've had like different careers and even in this current career, there's been like multiple iterations to it. And this year, even before the pandemic, it was kind of a transition year for us professionally, because we had come off of touring,

we'd been ambitious about a number of things, and then it was kind of like a regrouping phase in order to then figure out where we were going next and the things we were gonna create next in addition to this show and Good Mythical Morning in terms of building the company and on a lot of fronts, you know? So it's, I felt like I'm in this midlife mindset

even before the quarantine. And I'm, I don't know, I mean, can you relate to that? Do you feel like you're having a midlife crisis? I think that the components of a midlife crisis, and that's why you're probably feeling it, and I'm feeling it too, you've been working towards something and it doesn't have to necessarily be your career,

it could just be like, you're just trying to get, you're trying to do life. And there's a certain part of your life where you're really trying hard to do life and to focus and to move things to the next level. And then you start crossing over into this place where you sort of realize that, oh, what I was trying to accomplish

kind of set up in my life, it's kind of happened. I have a house, I have a car, I have kids, I have a relatively stable job. And then you start looking over the horizon and you're like, oh, so it's just this. It's just this and it's just more of this and then one day I die. And I think that that transitional period,

like there's a point in your life where when you're in college or whatever, all you're thinking about is what's ahead of you. I gotta figure this out. I gotta make the right decision about what I'm gonna do. And then you may, like for us, we went through the different transitions to get to the point where we're working together

doing this stuff and then constantly trying to just grind and figure it out and build this business. Yeah, there was so much scrambling. And yeah, for us, I'm so grateful that we're at a place where we're enjoying stability, even in the face of what's going on economically, relative stability for us. Right, so I think- Not total stability, and I'm still wigging out a lot, but-

But the ability to have a midlife crisis is a privilege, right? Yeah. It means that you've gotten to a point where you're actually able to stop, step outside of your circumstances and be like, Is this all there is? Is this it?

Yeah. You know, I talked about this book a long time ago, you forced the recommendation out of me, the second mountain. Right. Where it talks about, you know, you work really hard to get at the first mountain and if you either fall off the first mountain

or you get to the top of it, and at that point you realize this can't be my mountain. And I think that one of the things that's coinciding with our midlife crisis, if that's the, I will use that word, you can use assessment, I'll say crisis, is I think there's no mystery in why this is the year that we decided to tell our full story about the lost years.

There's no mystery why I'm willing to say the things that I say on Twitter. And it's because I think that this life has got to be bigger than me just trying to be a successful person and make it on YouTube or whatever it is that we call what we're trying to do, right? Just like, oh no, actually, I kind of need to think about the mark that I'm leaving a little bit.

Legacy. Yeah, and it's, I think that you just naturally become, so it's all about, everyone's gonna have a crisis. The question is just, well, what is your response to it? Are you gonna buy a Ferrari? Well, I'm not going to. Or are you just gonna become. You know what my Ferrari is gonna be?

Cause I've been talking to you about this. I've started looking at hashtag van life. I don't know what planted the seed in my mind, but I'm like, people are modifying these vans, like these sprinter vans. And like, once you click on one of those on Instagram, Instagram knows you wanna look at the inside of people's vans.

So I'm like, man, these people are like traveling around from state to state, sleeping and living in a van. They're parking their van next to a mountain lake, opening the back doors of the van, and taking a picture from their bed to a lake. I saw this one clip. I appreciate this. Somebody had a, they had like a GoPro stuck to their forehead

and they got out of their bed in their van. They scooped up a coffee mug, poured coffee into it, opened the door to the van, and it was a beautiful mountain lake. And then they walk out onto this little stone pathway. And then they just, with their coffee, walk on the pathway and just jump into the lake. And I was like, that's going to be the rest of my life. I'm going to get one of these vans. And I'm talking to you about it. I'm talking to my kids about it. Lando's into it.

Christie's like, where's the shower in this thing? I'm like, I think you have to shower outside. Unless you- Well, that's the thing. I don't wanna be, well, first of all, I was talking to, I told you about this. I was talking to my friend's brother who had a van that they were redoing and he was creating a system that recycled

three gallons of water so you could take a shower inside the van. He was like trying to- Yeah, yeah, yeah, that's right. But he's just a dude and it's him and his wife. I think you planted the seed when you told me that. Well, but I really, I believe in this, but I have one hang up for me personally

and one hang up for you personally that I don't think knows the showstopper necessarily. You know me, I'm just a big man and hashtag van life probably doesn't have a lot of six foot seven aficionados. As long as your knees bend, you'll be all right. But the second thing is, is that you have, it's a family of five.

So is this a, when your kids are gone? I'm thinking about like making a cut to the team. You know, to make this van life thing happen. It's like, well, are you in or not? Cause everyone's not gonna make it. The idea of doing van life with my family is not something that I'm into. I mean, I'll do a vacation with them.

I'll stay in a hotel. I'm not talking about living in a van. I'm talking about having the ultra luxury of just being able to get into the van every other month and go on like an excursion. But you want me to go with you? Sometimes. Yeah, but isn't it just one bed?

I'm not sharing a bed with you. I'll put another- You're the worst person in the world to share a bed with. I haven't shared a bed with you since. No, I'm putting another bed on top. You can sleep up there in the pop-up tent. Just for the sake of the fan fiction people, I do need to finish that sentence though. We used to go to conferences when we were in college

and after college where like forced college students would stay in one hotel room. And me and you would share like a queen size bed in a hotel and you are not a good bed partner because you move a whole lot. I've said it before, I'll say it again. I sleep with reckless abandon. You wake up and your face is right next to my face.

So I definitely do not want to be a part of that if that's part of hashtag van life. You wait until you see this van. What was the last thing that filled you with wonder that took you away from your desk or your car in traffic? Well, for us, and I'm going to guess for some of you, that thing is... Animate!

Hi, I'm Nick Friedman. I'm Lee Alec Murray. And I'm going to guess for some of you, that thing is... Anime! Hi, I'm Nick Friedman. I'm Lee Alec Murray. And I'm Leah President. And welcome to Crunchyroll Presents The Anime Effect. It's a weekly news show. With the best celebrity guests. And hot takes galore. So join us every Friday wherever you get your podcasts

and watch full video episodes on Crunchyroll or on the Crunchyroll YouTube channel. Next question, Ruth asks, no, that's Ruth Doll 11. Why does time seem to move exponentially faster each year? So like when you're a kid, everything goes so slowly. When you're a teenager, when you're like, the more you want time to progress, the less it does.

And then the more you want it to slow down, the more it speeds up. I guess that rings true for me. Definitely rings true for me. I think it rings true for a lot of people. And so I looked up, is there any science behind this? This is what an article in Scientific American said. "'Our brain encodes new experiences,

"'but not familiar ones into memory. And our retrospective judgment of time is based on how many new memories we create over a certain period. In other words, the more new memories we build on a weekend getaway, the longer that trip will seem in hindsight. In your vein.

This phenomenon, which Hammond, Hammond is, I guess, the doctor that they're quoting, has dubbed the holiday paradox, seems to present one of the best clues as to why, in retrospect, time seems to pass more quickly the older we get. From childhood to early adulthood, we have many fresh experiences and learn countless new skills. As adults, though, our lives become more routine and we experience fewer unfamiliar events. Just like I said, you're like, is this all there is? As a result, our early years

tend to be relatively overrepresented in our autobiographical memory and on reflection seem to have lasted longer. So it's not that in the moment, like if you sit an old person down and a young person down for an hour, it's actually probably the younger person who's gonna feel like that hour is taking longer.

Oh, actually that's consistent with it. But it's not about that. It's really just the fact that you don't have any points of reference. You gotta have points of reference. New experiences. To create memories. To me, that's the thing. And I think I'm onto this van life thing

because I'm so cooped up and I wanna go to parks now. I wanna get out of the house again and I want to experience adventure. And I mean, maybe it's overblown because I'm so cooped up and it'll dissipate over the rest of the year as things continue to loosen up, but fingers crossed. I don't know, I'm not really making predictions here. But I do like the idea of,

and we've talked about this in the past, like creating experiences, new experiences that enrich your life. And you know, I'm a creature of habit. I like to do, I like getting things honed and perfected and then replicate it. But it's not the, that's not, that doesn't make for the best life necessarily.

And actually, I mean, and according to this, the more routine, the faster your life is gonna go. The faster you're gonna piss it away. Mm. And not- You don't break up the routine. Not even remember any of it. Well, it's funny because you know, I'm not a routine guy and I'm actually noticing,

like one of the things I've done consistently because we haven't had to go into the office every day and so we're not getting, I'm getting up early but I'm not having to get on the road at the same time every day. Yeah. Is that I'm meditating and I'm working out. And then I'm actually able to walk,

probably like with Jesse at the end of the day. But it's getting tougher for me because it feels like I go and I like get up, stretch, meditate, workout. Yeah, it's the same old thing. Do my smoothie. And then I'm just like, I got to eat something different. Like it takes me about three weeks and I'm like, I've had this smoothie for three weeks.

And it's like, I started getting stir crazy. I'm like, I got to have an oatmeal. I got to do something else to mix it up. But the thing you're talking about, this cooped up thing. So I think, I don't know if I made this a wreck. I should have made it a wreck, but did I talk about the book, Underland? Did I talk about that? Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Did I make that a wreck? So when I, and I was, at the beginning of quarantine, I was doing this exercise where I was sort of figuring out what my values are. And I don't mean that in like a family values kind of way. I was just like, what do I want my life to be kind of represented by and what I want to be present in my life?

And adventure was one of the things that I wanted to be present in my life, right? I have a sense of adventure, you do too. But when you get super busy, the opportunity or the sort of scheduling adventures can sometimes go by the wayside. And what I found is that I'm just waiting

for an opportunity for a vacation, not anymore, but before quarantine, it was like, oh, Jesse, let's go spend a weekend in a hotel and what we'll do is on Saturday, we'll just lay by the pool. And I kind of discovered this like five or six years ago. And I was like, this laying next to a pool and reading on vacation, that's where it's at, right?

But I started realizing that we were doing things like going to Cabo for a weekend and laying next to the pool. And of course it's like beautiful. And I love the company and great food, great drink, whatever. Starts to blur together. You're also like, hold on,

but like right outside the grounds of this hotel, there's probably like a cave that I could go into. You know what I'm saying? Like, and the thing I told Jessie is I was like, when we travel from now on, I really wanna make sure that we've got a balance of adventure and relaxation because you don't wanna just go and just run yourself ragged on a vacation,

but to really think about the opportunities for adventure that present themselves in any given location. Or you know what, adventure in your own backyard. You know? Yeah, you don't, adventure in your own backyard. Yeah, you don't have to travel to do it. But I'm just saying that I haven't even seen travel as primarily about adventure. Like, we went to France a few years ago for that film festival and had it,

we actually did, what's the one thing you remember about that trip? What's the one thing you tell people about that trip? The scooter. Almost dying on a scooter, right. Yeah, yeah. And it's like, cause we made a choice for adventure. That was the right choice, man.

That'll make your life short or long. I can't, I didn't understand your science. Next question. You might die, but it'll make your life longer. Grace Anna tweeted, "'I turned 17 in just a few weeks "'and I couldn't be more ready for my birthday "'and being one year closer to adulthood.

"'But I feel like being so eager for adulthood "'is almost wrong. "'Everyone I talk to about this says adulthood is awful. "'How should I feel about my impending adulthood?'' Adulthood is awful. I mean, I understand- 17? Lily 17, it is awful. I mean, I understand- 17. Lily 17.

It's like, I mean, I understand, you talk about being cooped up. There's like a certain freedom of like wanting to get on with your own life. You know, it's, as a parent, her question makes me just think about how I look at my family. I'm starting to think as Lily's 17, Lincoln's 15, Locke is 16.

You start to think about them just months down the road of leaving the house. They're going to be on their own. It's definitely another part of aging for me. I'm kind of co-opping her question for me as a parent, but I start to think about things like, when my kids get out of the house, what are they gonna come back to? A van, apparently.

They're gonna come back and there's gonna be a foundation and a van on it. Am I building a lifestyle for me and Christy that is not dependent on kids and it doesn't revolve around our kids, but also build a future and start to have dreams that my kids can enter back into, but it's not all about them.

You know, that's the next phase for us, right? And I mean, Well, the best way to keep it not about them, the best way to keep it not about them is as soon as they leave to go to college, you turn their room into something else. It doesn't even matter what it is. It could be a gym.

It could just be just where all the socks that you can't match are. You know what I'm saying? Oh, wow. Just take their bed, their desk, their posters, get rid of it all, because you want to be very clear about you will not live here after you graduate college. So don't get any ideas unless you wanna sleep on a bunch of mismatched socks.

That's my plan. But I start to think about like, am I gonna live in this house? Is this the house that Lincoln is gonna come back to with his, you know, is this the house that they bring their partners back to? You're the significant others. Hey, mom and dad, you gotta meet Derek.

I don't know. I'm predicting there's gonna be a Derek involved. Jesse and I have, we've kind of made this decision that no, that our current house will not be that house. We are also like, we like change and I mean, I'm surprised we haven't moved already. But I think that at this point, we're like, we're committed to staying in this location until Shepard,

that which is like, he's 11. So seven more years until he goes to college. So maybe while they're in college, we'd be like, hey, let's try something else. And I don't know, I haven't thought about my, the child psychology, because I know kids like to come back to something familiar. So I don't know, I haven't thought about that aspect of it.

Even seven more years in this house, and I do start to think about that too. It's like, I know that there'll be a lot more memories in this house, but there's not a lot of room for someone, for additional people to come back to. But I do start to think about that. But to directly answer Grace Anna's question very quickly, for someone for additional people to come back to, you know? Yeah. But I do start to think about that. But to directly answer Grace Anna's question very quickly,

you should feel incredible about your, it's age 17, good, listen, the peak of your life is right over the horizon. I mean, listen, you've got right now at age 17, there's a bunch of things that are about to coincide. Your level of passion for things and your level of freedom are about to combine in a beautiful synergistic explosion, okay? And you need to realize that. Don't Okay? And you need to realize that. Don't wish it away.

You have this incredible opportunity to just not have a whole lot of responsibilities. Get a van. Yes. Get a van. Are we talking about a gap year here? Is that what you're talking about? No, no. Well, first of all, gap years are becoming very common because of the coronavirus. The whole world is in a gap year. Right, but no, a gap year, yes, but I'm just talking about the fact that you're gonna feel like college is a lot,

but just let me tell you, it's not. It's like, don't, I mean, I'm not saying don't study, I'm just saying that don't fall for the lie that it's a lot. It's freedom. And not everybody goes to college, but what I'm saying is, before that, you got this gap

between being under your parents' roof and then being, having a roof with other people under it. There's this window. That's the window of opportunity. You know what I'm saying? Just see it for what it is. Just see it for what it is. Enjoy it.

Newest X Suite. There's no name associated with this, but that's the handle. It looks like Lewis, but with an N. What do you think is the turning point for becoming an adult? I'm currently 18, but my life hasn't changed that much these past years, and I can't see myself as an adult. Is it getting a job, a degree,

or is it just a matter of age? Kennedy, at Kennedy Giro, kinda adds to this question. At what point in your life did you feel like you actually had a good handle on things? I just graduated college and I will start my first big girl job soon and I'm very overwhelmed.

It's like trying to figure out when are you an adult and when do you feel like you have a handle on things? I mean, I've said before that, yeah, Christie's back there, she's mouthing never. Yeah, that's exactly right. I mean, I think said before that, yeah, Christie's back there. She's mouthing never. I think, yeah, that's exactly right. I mean, I think I've thought before, I felt like I've said before that I feel like I'm an adult when I had responsibility.

Definitely having kids made me feel like, oh, well, I'm not the kid because now I have one. That must make me the adult. But it was something that I kind of had to stop and derive. Well, yes. To me, I think the moment that you become an adult is when you have the realization that no one has a handle on things.

Ever. Like, it's the moment in which you, which is like all of a sudden, you look around and you're like, oh, they also don't know what the hell they're doing. This is great. They're all faking it. They're all faking that they've got it figured out. That's the moment you become an adult.

Because when you're a child, you look up, usually because you're short, and you see these adults, and they just seem like, I mean, they're moving in a very purposeful direction. Their shirts are tucked in, their britches. Yes, they're like cranking up cars and like jogging and bringing in food. They're doing lots of things that seem purposeful, that make you feel stable,

but then when you become that person, and you're like, I'm kind of just doing what they did, but hold on, I don't really know what I'm doing. I feel overwhelmed. I don't have a handle on things. That's the realization. That's when you become an adult. Well, Lisa at bleedbluebergen tweeted,

one of these usernames are crazy. Lisa said, I think this quote would be a cool topic point on getting older. This is from Alden Nowland. Nowland, never heard of this guy, have you? No. The day the child realizes that all adults are imperfect, he becomes an adolescent.

The day he forgives them, he becomes an adult. That's an eloquent way of saying the same thing we were saying. That there's a level of maturity associated with realizing that no one is, everyone's imperfect, nobody's got everything figured out, no one makes the right decision, everybody's in need of forgiveness.

And if you can give that, I think that's a good measuring stick for adulthood, for maturity. If you can forgive people and probably forgive yourself too, and give yourself and to say, hey, we're all just, we're all just, we're all stumbling forward in time towards our own demise.

But we might as well live it up in the meantime. Cause another aspect of it, I don't remember exactly the moment that this hit me, but there was a moment in which I found myself living through a personal moment in my life that coincided with the first memory of my parents. Does that make sense? So when I started realizing,

I remember seeing my parents be parents. There's a moment that I can remember my parents doing parental things. And then there's a moment in which you see yourself doing the same thing, and that's when you can begin to get to that point of forgiveness. You're like, damn, it's hard to be a parent. You have sympathy for your own parents.

And even though it doesn't help, I tell my 16 year old this all the time, it's like, I can't wait till you have your own kids. I mean, that's a pointless thing to say and I shouldn't say it, I say it in frustration, but it's also true because there will come a time, I'm hoping, that there will be a phone call or an email or at least a text that's just like,

"'Okay, Dad, I get it." You know what I'm saying? Just to, and I think that's the moment, that's another way to kind of gauge adulthood. You don't have to be a parent. It could be any stage of life where you can relate to another generation. Did you ever have that moment with your parents

where you were like, you know what, I get it. It's funny today, I talked to my mom, she wished me a happy birthday and she was like, well, I wanna know, do you feel old as dirt? And I was like, I laughed. And she was like, well, I wanna know, do you feel old as dirt? And I was like, I laughed and she was like, when I turned 42, I remember that you told me, man, mom, you're old as dirt. So now that you're 42, do you feel old as dirt?

And she said she remembered it. She's been waiting all these years. She's been waiting all these years. I don't remember saying that to her. I'm sure it was a joke. She basically said it was a joke. But do you, I mean, there is an aspect of aging that is you talk to your parents differently. I mean, was there a point where you've,

just the way that you were, you're waiting for Locke to text you and say, you know what, I get it. Do you recall giving that to your parents? The way that that comes out for me is, I mean, I don't do this all the time, but I'm not necessarily great at saying it. I'm pretty good at writing it.

And so in a number of cards over the years, whether it's Father's Day, Mother's Day, birthday or whatever, and again, I'm not super consistent in this, but I've definitely have specific memories of sitting down and being like, I'm going to write how much I appreciate how my mom mothered me, how my father fathered me, because I get it. Understanding how meaningful it

was to have my dad present for all my sporting events and stuff like that. And growing up and realizing, damn, that's really hard to do. Like that took intention and sacrifice. So acknowledging that in cards is what you've done. Yeah, I mean, I'm not saying we haven't talked about it, but I'm saying that I, in some fashion, even though I'm not the best communicator, I have communicated that to them as I've gotten older. I remember one time when I was in college,

my dad had a camper and he took it to Jordan Lake and me and my dad, this was like the first time ever that me and my dad like did a camping trip, like sleepover thing where it was just the two of us. We were sitting out there at Jordan Lake and we cracked open a beer, we like shared a beer. Well, we each had our own beer. And I just remember that being a milestone moment.

I remember being nervous going, I was like, I'm driving out here, meeting my dad, you know, I never live with my dad except in like visitation situations, but it was really cool because like, all of a sudden we were just, we were two guys doing things that we would both do with our friends, but we were doing it with each other. And we were having a conversation that we would each have with a friend.

And I mean, that was a long time coming for me and my dad, you know, because we never lived together. There are elements of that with all of my kids, you know, like I try to speak to them, I talk to them about things and I talk to them in ways that I would talk to you sometimes, depending on the subject matter, right? There are these parents who,

they never stop baby talking their kids, even when they're adults. Like I know of people, I'm not close to people, but I've observed people who would still talk kind of like baby talk to their, you know, their daughter or son that's in their 20s. What? Yeah. I'm thinking of one person in particular

that you, but you don't know them. Well, we need to talk about this after because I don't know who you're- There's parents who never change how they talk to their children. And that's just not good, it seems like. I never baby talked either of my kids. I just baby talked the dog.

I figured that she can take it for her entire life. But I look forward to having an adult to adult relationship with my kids. That's why I like to picture them once they leave coming back and whether it's here or somewhere else, like I wanna create an environment where they wanna be a part of me and Christy's lives. Well, you know the way to do that.

The way to do that is... Probably a beach house. Yes, you either get a beach house if we're so blessed to be able to afford one or you rent a beach house and taking your adult children on vacation, that's how you keep them around because they are not gonna be able to afford their own vacation. Taking your adult children on vacation, that's how you keep them around

because they are not gonna be able to afford their own vacation. They're all going into this world that's gonna be, all the robots are gonna have the jobs. I mean, they're gonna wanna go on vacation with you forever. Yeah, they're gonna wanna like take the hibernation pill and then only wake up for hibernation to go. For vacation.

With me and then just hibernate again. And I think that what we're gonna do and we'll still be making content on some level, maybe we'll still be making this podcast. I think that we need to commit right now that we're going to be the parents that they want to go on vacation with. You know what I'm saying?

Like you gotta think about it. You gotta, there needs to be a survey or something. I mean, we gotta do like a kids focus group to be like, what makes going on vacation with people miserable and make sure that we're not the ones contributing to that? Yeah. Whatever that is, let's commit to that. Because just because somebody's got the ability

to pay for your vacation doesn't make the vacation fun. No. Okay, those are two completely different things. All right, Erica with a K. Erica, very active, mythical beast. She's got a, I mean, her question was so intense and so long that it took two tweets. Looking back at myself in my 20s and even early 30s

and realizing that many of my opinions and viewpoints were still being formed by my parent, I feel like I didn't start forming independent thoughts until later in life. When do you think you start truly having opinions and views that wouldn't necessarily be approved by your parents? Do you think the need for approval from such major influences, parents,

slows down progressive changes in societal issues? Whoa, this is a big one to get into right here at the end. Well, let's just say yes. She asked me, yeah, that's my answer, yes. Hashtag your biscuits, let us know what you think. No, we're gonna answer it, okay. Because I've already done my rec, we don't have to do that. This question, this is a great question because just the other day, Jesse and I were having a conversation about, so, you know, when we talked about the lost years,

we kind of told our life story and that we were raised in a very particular sort of way of thinking and we don't think that way exactly anymore. And first of all, that's a super common thing, not just today, but that's been a super common thing throughout the history of the world, especially post-industrial revolution. There's lots of societal generational changes that take place pretty quickly.

And the older generations is like, back in my day, we didn't think like this. And also most child psychologists suggest that a child sees a structure and most kids need to sort of rebel through that structure, even if they kind of come back to it, right? And Jesse and I were talking about our personalities. And we are both rule followers, right? I'm a three on the Enneagram. I'm a performer. But one of the great ways to kind of exercise your threeness is to recognize how to succeed within

a framework and then be like, oh, I can do that. That's why I did well in school, I did well in sports, and I was a good kid that made my parents proud, right? I was really good at that. Jessie's a two on the Enneagram, which is not about achieving, but it's more about helping people do things and basically being there for people. But in the same way that she's a rule follower.

So we got well into adulthood, into our 30s, still holding very tightly to basically the things that we had been taught and our parents had taught us. But we were also then talking about a guy that we went to high school with, I'm not gonna name his name, that was a friend of ours, who also like went to church with us. But then all of a sudden, you remember this,

prom one year, junior year, senior year, he showed up- In a dress. Dressed, but not just dressed as a woman, like he had on makeup and he had done his hair and it almost was like so well done that the first thing I thought was who's the new girl? Right, I remember thinking that. And then the second thing I thought was,

that's so and so, so and so. And at the time I was like, oh, that's a funny joke. Like I wasn't like, oh, I can't believe he did that. I remember just thinking that like, that was really bold and like very funny. Like that's, like he really pulled that off. But I didn't stop and think, why did he do that, right? Now, as we grew up a little bit, I realized that, oh.

He was making a statement. He checked out. He rebelled against the system that he saw in place at the time. He just did it in high school. And then he went off to college and became an adult who was somebody that didn't hold to the same worldview as his parents.

But it took me to get to in my 30s before I began to investigate the worldview, right? And I'm not saying that this isn't really a truth, non-truth, whether it's true or not. That's not what I'm, we talked about that a lot in the last years. This is more about like the way that you think and the way that you see the world,

have you ever made it personal, right? Cause you may just, you may transfer the same exact worldview that was handed to you by your parents and make it personal and actually passionately interact with it. But usually the process of actually wanting to kind of take control and make it your own, one of two things happen.

You grab hold of it and it slips out of your hand and you realize that's not for me, or you grab hold of it and you realize that it fits your hands perfectly and you adopt it. But different personalities make that decision at different times. I kind of got all the way through my 20s still in a very performance oriented mindset

where it was about making my parents proud. And that's not every, I think Erica is saying that she's the same kind of person. My wife's the same kind of person, but a lot of people, including the guy we're talking about who went to high school with, it happened earlier for him.

Yeah, I think for me too, it was, I just, I wanna, if you tell me the right way to do it and enough people agree, then it's just, this is just, this is the safe, secure path. And I'm gonna, I can feel okay, I can feel confident. And it's, I didn't have this sense of needing to discover myself or express myself in a way that was counter to anything that the plans that I was adopting.

I just wanna feel okay. I just want to feel safe. I don't want to feel like I'm out here on a limb trying to figure this out. And I just didn't have that drive. I had another drive. I had a drive for security. And so, yeah, it did take a long time for me to start to figure out who I was for me and not for anybody else, you know? And then, you know, we got married so young that you transfer from this is the family that I grew up in, this is the system that works there, to now this is the family that I've formed

and I gotta meet Chrissy's expectations, she's gotta meet my expectations. It's like you go from one to another, at least we did. Yeah, and the second part of the question about, do you think this slows down progressive changes in societal issues? I mean, definitely it does, but, and I'm not, listen, I didn't study this. This is total Rhett pulling it out of his ass, which is a good bit of what I say. But my theory on this, the way that I think about like societal progression, right? Because I do. I mean, I think one of the big changes in worldview that happened,

like when I was an evangelical Christian, I saw the world as getting progressively worse, right? Because that's consistent with eschatology, you know, the idea that things are gonna slowly get progressively worse and then Jesus is gonna come back, right? Now that I'm more, I don't believe that anymore and I'm more progressive in my mindset, I actually think that the world is getting better and I actually think, if you read Steven Pinker's latest book, I think the facts are on the side of it actually,

even though it seems more chaotic and you're getting a lot more information that makes it seem, even right now, with riots happening throughout the nation, you may be, oh, everything's going crazy. Well, in reality, basically every marker that you can measure, society is getting better over time, right?

So I think the facts are on the side of things are progressing. What I've always said is that stretching progression, like social progressive stuff is like stretching the fabric of society, right? And it eventually fills in and you stretch it. And I think that people only have so much capacity for change.

It's like you pull it too hard and sometimes it rips and then you gotta stitch it and you gotta keep pulling. I believe that you keep pushing things in the right direction. And to me, it's just a good segue to zoom out and say, yeah, I feel like what's going on right now, we're at such a pivotal moment in history and it's such an important moment in time

that we can choose to be on the sidelines, be part of the problem, be a part of the solutions, be a part of the evolution, be a part of the evolution, the positive evolution of society. And I do have hope that as to bring it full circle, as we listen, and as we have open minds and open hearts, that it's a privilege to have the opportunity to be a part of what's happening now. And it's scary and there's no clear path forward

on a number of fronts. You know, when you think about racial injustice, when you think about the environment, when you think about this pandemic, you can add things to the list but we're we're we're a part of it you know and we can we can impact it and we can we can do that stretching and i you know i'm i'm choosing to to to find hope in that and to find a way to be a part of it and to move forward and not just try to escape

or ignore or just get old. Yeah, well, and I think that you were talking about earlier the aspect of feeling like you're standing on the sidelines sometimes. And I think everybody you were talking about earlier, the aspect of feeling like you're standing on the sidelines sometimes. And I think everybody probably has a tendency to feel that way. The way that I've kind of seen my role in this stretching of societal fabric

over the course of my life is that first of all, you know, my personality is one who is naturally gonna grab onto the blanket. I naturally gonna grab onto the blanket. I'm gonna grab onto the fabric. That's just the kind of way I live my life, right? And I spent a good portion of my life pulling on one side of that fabric, trying to keep it in place.

And I feel like one of the things that I'm doing in the second half of my life is saying, you know what? I actually feel like I was wrong and I'm moving to the other side of the blanket and I'm pulling on it. And that's kind of the way that I see the two halves of my life and the way I've kind of contributed to what Erica's kind of talking about, these bigger societal issues. And so in some ways I kind of feel like I'm making up for things. That's just, I don't know if that's right or wrong,

but that's how I interact with it. And I don't think, and I do think that there was sort of this middle period where it was kind of like, all right, I'm gonna let go of the blanket. I'm letting go of the fabric everybody's pulling on. I'm gonna just watch for a little bit. And then once I was like, okay, I think I know which direction I wanna pull.

I've just been pulling it harder. Yeah, I mean, in the context of aging, we've talked about like being engaged. I mean, you can let life pass you by, as they say, you can let life happen to you, or you can happen to life. You know, I think that's the thing that I want to, I want to be engaged, I want to be happening to life, not life just happening to me.

Life throws a lot at us, to life and not life just happening to me. Life throws a lot at us. And there's things, but when you respond, we do have the ability to engage. And I think that that's, again, that's exciting. That's a place where there's hope in that. Yeah, well, and the last thing I'll say is I think that the biggest difference with the way that I engage about these things, just, you know, and specifically like the issue

of racial injustice, right? I think that I spent a good portion of my life thinking about what I had to protect personally, right? Like what were my rights and my interests and how do I hold tightly to those and how do I protect those? And I think that one of the biggest changes that has taken place over the past decade

is trying to think a little bit less about what I have and what my rights are and think about people who have been marginalized, people who have been denied rights, people who have been denied opportunity, people who don't have the same opportunity that I have and think, oh, okay, I kind of want to realign my actions the way I give, the way I spend my time and the things I say and who I vote for to take those people into account rather than just think about what I have and what's mine and what I can protect.

And that may be an oversimplification, but it's been helpful for me to see it that way. And I think it's a good sort of North Star. Are you thinking about yourself or are you thinking about others? Yeah, because you only got one life to live unless we have more that I don't know about. You won't know and if you do,

you probably won't remember it. Unless you adhere to a particular faith system that recognizes that and then you like do some sort of exploration of your past lives. But who's to say that you'll be able to do that? You might find yourself in a worldview that denies that and you'll miss out all the opportunities of living your subsequent lives.

Hashtag gear biscuits. If anything we've said, except for the very last part, even that, I don't care, has given you something that you wanna weigh in on, please do that. Let's keep the conversation going. And I look forward to maybe not being in separate places for the next Ear Biscuit next week, but we will speak at you next week.

Fingers crossed. And thanks for your questions. As always, you're contributing to the conversation. Let's carry the conversation on on the internet.