Ear Biscuits with Rhett & Link - Ep. 11 Shay Carl Pt.2 - Ear Biscuits

Episode Date: December 6, 2013

After nearly 5 years of daily videos, is Shay Carl done with YouTube? In part 2 of our conversation, the Co-Founder of one of the leading multi-channel-network companies, Maker Studios, and father of the "first family of YouTube" shares how he got in to YouTube…and why he’s thinking of getting out. To learn more about listener data and our privacy practices visit: https://www.audacyinc.com/privacy-policy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit https://podcastchoices.com/adchoices

This is Mythical. All right, before we get started this week, we want to let you know that we have acquired a sponsor. What? This is very legitimizing. You know, even back in the days of playing t-ball, I remember looking out at the fences, because I was aiming for the fences, baby, and I would see billboards back there of local businesses. I was like, I have made it as a T-ball player because there are businesses who have placards in the back of, I don't think you can call it a stadium. Field. Field. It was a field with a fence.

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offer code R&L. Thanks to squarespace.com. Remember, it's offer code RANDL. It's like Randall if you didn't know how to spell it correctly. I've always spelled Randall that way, so I don't know what the problem is. I'm sorry, Randall's out there. Now it's time for an Ear Biscuit. Welcome to Ear Biscuits. I'm Link. And I'm Rhett. It's time to continue our conversation with Shea Carl, the premier family vlogger on the internet.

Last week we talked about what it was like growing up Mormon, and now we're moving on to what it's like to be a guy who puts his family out there for five years every single day on YouTube. Approaching five years. Yeah, we discussed the origin of his YouTube channels, the toll that five years of daily vlogs has taken on him. Is Shay burning out? Is he ready to quit? How does it impact his family? And also, what is it like to go from a guy who didn't even know what AIM Instant Messenger was to becoming the de facto spokesperson for Maker Studios whenever controversy hits? Yeah, we get into some good stuff.

I appreciate the candid nature of what he has to say about all of that. It's very fascinating. Like I said, that's why we have a part two. We didn't want to truncate any of that conversation, so we think you will enjoy it. There's an interesting dynamic in having your family on the internet at all. I think we can kind of give our perspective because, you know, we're family men, right?

We both have wives and kids. Why don't we start our own little Shaytar channels where we do that? You want to? You want to move into the same house? No. You know, we talked about doing that. You remember this. When we were moving out to-

Housing is expensive out here. Yeah, our mortgages, our rent out here was so much higher than our mortgages back in North Carolina that we were like, well, maybe we should just get a big house together. I mean, there was serious talk about this, but then we were like, you know what? We would kill each other. Yeah.

You know, our kids would probably kill each other. But if we were filming it, we could probably monetize it. Yeah. So now I'm rethinking it. I think the main factor, you know, if you've been a viewer of our videos for any length of time, once you find out that we have wives and we have kids, we see the question a lot. Whoa, what are the wives like? Why aren't you? We want to see your wives.

That's the question we get a lot, especially like on the Rentalink community, that type of thing. well um christy my wife and jesse red's wife i we have just not been as open to being on camera you know they haven't it was what you're saying i mean i said christy and jesse have not been open to being on camera and it's not the type of thing that we want to push is we're not vloggers in the first place so it's not like we share every moment of our life and then we're trying to cut around our wives who don't want to be on camera. That's just not who we are. We're not vloggers and our wives don't want to be vloggers. Well, and I think a really,

one of the most important aspects of why Shay is able to do it and do it so well is that, and he talks about this, is that he's able to kind of put himself in that mood that you need to be in in order to do a vlog. And not that we aren't necessarily, but a lot of people don't realize just like, when it comes down to just the business operations of running a production company that makes internet videos, we're pretty serious people.

And it's like, it isn't the kind of thing where you're going to like constantly want to see a camera on us, like sitting there, like thinking about that, even though he kind of talks about that it's not really that much footage in any given day. But I think a lot of times we're just like, this would be, you know, what you're going to see is you're going to see me yelling at my kids, telling them to like clean their Legos up. You know, not saying that he doesn't have all the same issues, but it just, it's never struck me as the kind of thing that would be, okay, yeah, this is going to be great content. But I do think that it's most, the main factor has been that, you know, our wives don't want to be on camera and

we respect that. And we know that the internet can be a cruel place in terms of commenting and things like that. And I'm not jumping at the chance to put my wife out there in front of the scrutiny of the internet if she doesn't want to be an entertainer. And we know just as one of the aspects of being a duo is constant comparison. So we know exactly what all of you think about Link compared

to me and me compared to Link. Physically, emotionally, we've heard every single comparison that could be made about us. And over seven or eight years of doing this full time, we've developed thick skins. I can take pretty much anything. But I don't want my wife

to be subjected to that because it isn't like Katie Lett is being compared to another wife every single But I don't want my wife to be subjected to that because it isn't like, you know, Katie Lett is being compared to another wife every single day in every single vlog. But that's what the internet would do if all of a sudden, if we put our wives out there. It just would not be a wise thing. Now, our kids, totally different situation.

You know, I think, but we have put our kids in things because, well, why? You know, they get views. Because they've had fun with it. I think from a young age, I mean, we don't put them in a lot of our videos, but just kind of to sneak them in here or there seemed to be something that we were comfortable doing.

I mean, Lando, by the time you get around to the fifth kid between our two families, you know, we are doing a vlog. Because we were actually doing daily vlogs at the time. We were trying that. I think it was daily. So we have a vlog of you coming in and visiting Lando when he was one day old type of thing. That's really an exception.

But around that same time, we did that. We used our kids as weights. A very much inspired by Shade Carl type of thing to do where we used our kids as weights. A very much inspired by Shade Carl type of thing to do, where we used our kids as weights. And they had a lot of fun with that. They like being a part of it. Make little cameos. When we did the Arby's commercial,

and Shepard got to be in it, Locke was disappointed that he didn't get to be in it. Right. And then we'll use Locke for something else, and Shepard will be upset that he doesn't. So, and your kid's the same deal. So they want to be a part of it, and they would probably be a part of it more if we let them have their way,

but we kind of try to keep tabs on it a little bit. And Lily made a cameo in the Get Off the Phone video. She did. And then Lincoln was, he said he wanted to be in it. Or he said, if I was in it, I would have done better than she did. He then Lincoln was, he said he wanted to be in it. Or he said, if I was in it, I would have done better than she did. He told me that. That is awesome.

At the dinner table. He's like vying for, it's like, well, you all can't be in everything. What did he say he would have done differently? Well, he didn't go that far. He didn't give any details. I didn't question him further. He didn't critique her performance.

Yeah, I mean, she was right there. But you know, the complete opposite of that mentality has been what Shea has done with his family. And, you know, we're not making any judgments about it. I think it's absolutely fascinating that he has made the decision, and we get into talking about this, and, like, how does he deal with his wife and how does he deal with the fact that what if his kids don't want to do this one day? Because he has made the decision to put his life and his wife and his kids out there. And he is the premier family vlogger. There's millions of people out there who have decided that they are going to tune in.

They are going to watch them live their lives. And that's what his life has become. Every single day for approaching five years. And it's fascinating. The conversation is fascinating. And let's get right into this biscuit. Now we want to talk about

I mean, you've got the whole transition story from not when you transition from a woman to a man, but... That's when I wasn't Mormon. The whole transition story from, not when you transition from a woman to a man. That's when I wasn't Mormon. Transitioning from being a DJ into YouTube. And I think people can hear you tell that story in a couple of different places. So we don't necessarily have to go into that. But we know that there was a number of jobs and then kind of getting into the YouTube thing.

And I think that one thing we like to talk about is the transition from being one of those early YouTube guys with a channel that was popular and then transitioning into sort of being the first family of YouTube. So let's get into that. first family of YouTube. So let's get into that. Yeah. I've heard us referred to as, and this isn't a term that I made up, but we've been referred to as the first family of YouTube, which I thought Naltz kind of was, you know, like you guys remember Naltz? Sure. Yeah. Like he had four kids and Naltz is still a really good friend of mine. But yeah, I mean, when I found YouTube, it was at a point in my life where, you know, we had just had our third kid and I was 27 years old and I just hated what I was doing for a living. Like I just, I always believed that I could love what I did, you know, like growing up, I was always, you know, I skied and I wanted to be a professional skier, you know, when I was growing up, cause I just wanted to do something that I

loved. Cause I figure, you know, 80% of your life is your job. and if you hate your job, then you hate your life. So I got a computer and got online and found Philip DeFranco. At first, I was – because back then, you didn't start a YouTube channel to make money. I think now people are like, oh, I want to start a YouTube channel so I can become rich and a famous YouTuber. As an occupation. Yeah, that's a job now. But back then then it was like oh i just i was addicted to the conversation in fact the probably the only video that i've ever deleted is my very first youtube video on my shea carl channel and so the very first thing i i got

on i was like there was this i think i looked up have you guys ever seen this video it's about uh this black preacher like pones these two Mormon missionaries. And I was like, oh. In what way? You mean? It was like a Bible bash situation. They were in a Denny's parking lot. And these two missionaries came up to talk to this guy.

And this guy, they had a camera rolling. He's like, oh, look at these two guys. Look at these two guys. And these two missionaries walk up. And you could tell they're just two greeny missionaries. They're like two 19-year-old kids that have no idea what they're doing or where they're at. And this guy is like this preacher from the south who knows the Bible really good. And he's just like, well, what about this?

What about this? And these two kids are like, uh, uh, uh. And I was just like rolling my eyes like, oh, no. And so there was this guy who uploaded that video called Utah Knight. He's like this ex-Morm Mormon who was like super anti Mormon. And so, uh, you know how religious debates happen on the internet.

So I started like, well, these, these poor kids, I didn't even know what hit him. And he's like, yeah, cause they're not,

they don't have the truth. And we started like kind of getting in this like comment battle back and forth. And I'm like, I'm like, let's meet, let's meet and talk about this. Cause I figured he lived in Utah. So I made a video cause it was funny at the time

because you got to know people just in the chat of the YouTube video. It was so small a time that there was like 10 people for like a week that were commenting back and forth on this video where it's like you got to know these people.

It was like a chat room. Exactly. In the YouTube comments. And it's like, I would come back to that video every day to see what the newest thing they said was. And then I would type something and then he would type something. It was like a week long conversation in the comment section of a YouTube video.

And you wanted to IRL it. Yeah. I was like, let's meet. Let's have a, cause it got to like, we're like teams. There's like, you know, sides of like, I agree with Shay and I agree with this other guy. And so it was like, I I was like it's like my first YouTube made up I made a video because everybody I knew my channel that's how I got like my first 15 or 20 subscribers is from this like big debate in the comment section of this video

and so I made a video and I'm like hey I'm like hey Utah and I we've been talking for the last week and have I'm like let's meet I'll meet you halfway I live in Idaho you live in Utah let's meet at the border and have lunch and talk about this. And then of course he's wouldn't agree to do it. He's like, no, I'm not going to meet with you and blah, blah, blah. And I uploaded that video. That was probably my very first YouTube video. And then I found out like there's all this other stuff on YouTube. I, you know, I started like searching around and then I'd uploaded it like a, my second next two videos or me and my brother singing with helium balloons and my mom's 50th birthday.

And then I uploaded a video of me doing backflip on skis, just like anything I had, I uploaded. And then I was like, I don't want to be known as the guy who's like fighting with this guy about religion. So I deleted that video. And I think, I'm pretty sure that's the only video I've ever deleted off of any of my channels is that very first video. So you were married with three kids at the time, and you were working day job with what? I just had started my own granite countertop business. I had done granite countertops for like three years, and I had just started my own business.

But YouTube was kind of your outlet. I mean, it seems everyone else who was doing that was younger, right? Yeah, so I was, other than Naltz and like Zipster, I was probably one of the older guys that was getting on right? Yeah, so I was, other than Naltz and like Zipster, I was probably one of the older guys that was getting on YouTube at the time. And it wasn't, I never, because like to be an entertainer,

like that was always my personality, but that was never like a viable career, like to be an actor or an entertainer. Like that was always like, oh, that's not realistic, you know? So I was good with people. I could talk to anybody. So in my mind,

I was always going to be a salesman. You know, all those tests they give you in school, like fill out this personality thing and it'll tell you what you're going to be when you grow up. So me, it was always like, I would be in marketing or sales because like it was good with people. I was creative.

And so that's what I was going to do. And I loved, you know, businesses. Yeah, well, that's the thing. That's why I started my own business because like, at least I want to work for myself. I always had an entrepreneur spirit. So I was like, at least I know I'm not going to do countertops forever, but at least I want to be doing it under my own terms.

But you were making videos in your spare time with three kids. I don't know how you had any, but whatever. But you were still engaging in all of this youtube right shenanigans when i you were creating videos of doing acrobatics and see because it was perfect timing because i was working at a granite shop right before i started my own granite business and i was working 50 60 hours a week so i never would have had time but i had just started my own business and so i could do one job a week and have a lot of extra spare time so i remember the the day where it's like, my wife came in and she's like, you need to go finish that job. But I'm like, I want to make a YouTube video. Like I was

more interested in making a YouTube video than going to finish this $10,000 granite job that I was contracted to do, uh, up on like the rich part of town, you know? So it was like, and what did she say to that? She's like, I don't care, honey, the bills, you know, that's what it was like and what did she say to that she's like I don't care honey the bills you know that's what it was it was like our mortgage is coming up and it was a scary proposition for her to own our own business because before then you know I had a steady job with a paycheck and she was nervous about like well how are we going to pay the bills if you know you're on YouTube and so then the second I found out I could get paid on YouTube was like I could be part of this community and a part of this discussion because that's what I was addicted to is just like, I was talking to people from all around the world,

you know? But you weren't, you were making, you weren't necessarily making vlogs. You were making, I was just making like rants, like just like whatever videos I could think of. And I had no idea you can make money. And it was just like, what funny idea could I make? And that's when I found Philip DeFranco. And I was like, this kid has like his own show. That's why I was so shocked. I was like, is this like, is there a network behind it? Cause he had this like little intro with some music and he had this little phone and he had this little, the Philip DeFranco show. And I was like, it seems like a TV show on the internet, but it seems like he's just doing it by himself. And there's, I think he had 60,000 subscribers at the time. And I was like, that's more people than live in my town. And there's, I think he had 60,000 subscribers at the time.

And I was like, that's more people than live in my town. And this, he seemed like a kid. I think he was like 20, 21 years old. That's a lot of countertops. That's a lot of countertops to be doing. And so I was like, I can talk like that. Like I watched his show and I'm like, I can do that. I can, you know, say funny things. And, you know, and so he had this, he uploaded this video, like I'd watched like two or three of his videos. And then like the things. He uploaded this video. I'd watched two or three of his videos. The next day, he uploaded this video titled, How to Get a Popular Online Show or Series. I was like, yeah, how?

That's what I want to do. I want to do that. He had a contest that said, submit a video as a video response, and I'm going to pick the top five that I like, and I'm going to promote you on my website. And I was like, oh, dude, this is great. So at the time, I was just getting into being a radio DJ, and the night DJ, he gave me this segment called The Rant of Shay, where I could call in and just rant about something.

So I came up with this rant about hand sanitizer that I called the He-Man germ. I was like, you know how hand sanitizer says it kills 99.99% of the germs? What about that 0.001%? That's the one germ I want dead because obviously he's the strongest germ. If I kill all the other germs and he's still left, he's the germ I want dead because he's the one that survived the germ apocalypse with the hand sanitizer. So I do this big rant about that and submit it to Phil's video and he liked it. And so he put us on his website.

There was five of us. And it was like there was a week for people to come watch those videos and vote on who they liked the best. Would we know any of the other five? At the time, no. I think they've all faded away. Losers.

Yeah. They weren't committed. So they voted. I think I got second or third and everybody voted on the website. I think, cause I think the guy who won had a thousand subscribers and I had zero, you know, it was like, I was just on the website. So I was kind of a nobody, but this other person had like a thousand subscribers. And so he won.

But I remember later, I don't know if this is true or not. I talked to Phil and Lindsay and they're like, we wanted you to win. We wanted you to win because it was like a poll where I would check every day. I'm like, Oh, I'm in second place. I'm in second place. And I, so I, I, I didn't win. But then, um, you know, later Phil's like, he's like, I'm going to promote you. So he, I think he sent me a message or something on YouTube. It said, Hey, get on aim so we can talk. And I'm like, what's aim? I got no idea. Cause I had just got this computer. I had, I had never taken a typing class, a computer class, or anything. So I remember Googling AIM.

I'm like, oh, it's like a chat thing. So we got on AIM, we started talking. He's like, hey, I'm going to give you a shout out. You should submit a partner application to the partner program. I was like, okay, okay. So then I remember the vlog, because I think it happened like two or three vlogs

after he told me it was going to, or his videos or his show. And every day he would upload a video. I'm like, oh, is this it? Is this it? And it was. And then finally he told me it was going to or his videos or his show and uh every day he would upload a video i'm like oh is this it is this it and it was and then finally he promoted me in one of his youtube videos because before that it was just on his website and then all of a sudden it was like i got 3 000 subscribers in a day and i was like i just spent all day refreshing youtube like refresh 20 more refresh five more and it was like this is amazing and then I remember getting my first check from google adsense for 300 bucks I was like that's I'm like honey look I just paid for groceries doing this

youtube thing so did you start doing rants because that's what worked or that's just I mean that's what I was kind of doing on that night show on the radio show because I was like well what am I gonna do like you know I didn't know what I to do. So I would just try to think of like funny scenarios. And, and then I did a thing where I was dancing to my wife's unitard and just whatever I could think of. I, one of my early videos is me trying to put a, this five gallon water jug on the water container blindfolded and it just like falls on the floor. And I, you know, I, I hammed it up. Like I fell down and there's just five gallons of water all over our kitchen floor, which I knew was going to happen because I thought, I'm not going to just try to beat my wife and get it perfectly

because I thought that's not entertaining. But if I drop this five gallons of water all over our kitchen, people are going to be like, holy crap. I remember all of these videos because we montaged them together for the music video we made for you when you won Supernote. Still one of my favorite songs. I love that song. But yeah, you had a lot of material that was montageable.

Oh, he's getting on his roof and he's jumping onto a trampoline in his backyard and he has children on it. Yep. Yep. Yep. That's perfect. And he's wearing a unitard. A unitard.

Yeah. This big fat guy from Idaho. And I think, I mean, that was the interesting thing is that a lot of people saw the mismatch of how big and fat and bearded I was and then how like cute and petite my wife was. And it was like, I had a lot of people. And you were very athletic. Yeah. And that's what was also weird. It's like this 300 pound dude is like jumping on his roof, like a ninja, you know, like how was he able to do that? Because I was always so athletic in school and stuff, but I had just gained all this weight. And I think people really thought that we were like a scripted show. We were the real life

king of queens. And so people thought it was fake. They thought, you guys, this is like Lonely Girl, kind of. Because that's right after Lonely Girl had come out that she was fake. So I think a lot of people thought that our family was fake. It was a script. Why would this girl ever marry this guy? And so I think a lot of people thought that our family was fake. Like it was a script. Like why would this girl ever marry this guy, you know?

And so I think that helped us actually at the first. Well, let me skip ahead and ask about that, and then we can go back. But, you know, when you decided to start losing weight, you created a Shayloss channel. This was many years later once you were, you know, very well established. Well, actually – I think it took a year. To lose weight.

You didn't start losing weight within that first year. No, I failed a bunch, yeah. But when you actually did start losing weight, was there a calculated decision or was there a moment of pause that this is gonna mess with my brand? You know, the thing that you were talking about, oh, you got this big guy who's funny with the big beard and the little wife. Well, you don't want the little guy

and the little wife, you know, kind of thing. So I learned that the hard way. I never thought about that. I never thought that, oh, I'm the big, fat, loud, obnoxious guy. I can't lose weight or I lose my branding. I never thought about that. I just thought I want to lose weight. I've been saying I'm going to lose weight for a long time. And I was finally doing it. And then I learned I lost a lot of my audience because of it. I used to sell, when I sold shirts, I would sell a majority two, three, and four X shirts. Like I would sell, if I put some shirts online, I would sell a XXX shirts, you know, 52X and like maybe no smalls, maybe a few. So a majority of my audience were bigger. And when I started losing weight.

How much weight did you lose? At one point I had lost like the highest, I mean, now I'm like 190 now. I've pecked on a few pounds of muscle. But I was 281 and I got down to 165 when I ran the Nashville Marathon. 115 pounds total. What did you see in terms of sales and what were the conclusions?

Views definitely went down. Instead of being the fat, funny guy, I was the skinny douchebag. I always would get that. You're so full of yourself now, Shay. It was really hard for me for a while. Cause it was like, what? Like, I just wanted to do this for my health. Like I wanted to be able to be there for my kids and be able to play with my kids. And now it's like, I'm looked on as like this

douchebag who just thinks he's so better than everybody else. Cause he lost weight. And I'm like, no, I just, I want to be healthy, you know? And I think what it was, and I've kind of, and I don't know if this is a hundred percent true, but I definitely think that for some people it is true, is that they saw this kind of big fat slob of a guy with this beautiful wife and beautiful children and kind of like what appeared to be this perfect life where it didn't seem like I had to try it all. I'm just a fun party animal, can do whatever he wants and still have this perfect life with a great wife and good children. But really, it takes a lot of work to have that.

It takes a lot of sacrifice and dedication. When people saw that, it wasn't as easy. It wasn't like this movie kind of script. It was like they saw the struggle and it was like I don't know why. I think people weren't rooting for me anymore or something. I don't know. But you know, I, I don't make any decisions based on what my audience thinks. You know, I just do things that, you know,

are, I think are best for me and my life and the health of me and my family. And, uh, you know, that's what the vlogs are like. We are who we are in the vlogs. I mean, anybody who knows me from YouTube and has hung out with me in real life, I don't know if you guys agree or disagree with this, but I am the same guy as I am on the YouTube videos. I'm just living my life and filming it every day, you know? So it's not like I'm making these calculated decisions that will help my career because I would love to just make – I mean, sometimes I have this fantasy of, like, logging off the internet and never getting on again. Like, seriously, like, it sounds so appealing to me to go to the mountains of Idaho, build a cabin, and just never get on the internet again. Like, to me, that's like – that would be awesome.

Yeah, well, let's talk about that because, you know, obviously there there was a time and maybe it was just very natural at first to be like I'm going to include my family in this because they're here and I want to be with them that's what it was it was just like this is great like my family can be my job because I get accused a lot of like you know exploiting yeah exploiting my children Like I'm not putting my kids in the video so that my views are better. I just want to be around my kids. And if I'm doing a video every day where I can make money hanging out with my kids, like that's a freaking dream come true. You know, like me and Colette, we'll be driving in the car and I'll be like, honey, like what if I told you five years ago that I'm going to have a job where we get paid more money than we've ever gotten paid ever.

And we get to be together as a family all the time. And all we have to do is film. We have to have a camera out for 20 minutes a day and then edit and upload it every day. Like that would be amazing. Like we think about telling ourselves that five years ago. And you'd be like, I wouldn't believe myself. No way. And that's the reality of our life.

And so it was a way to make money so that I could be with my family. And so it's like I say about this, you know, like for instance, Maker Studios. We moved out here four years ago and started Maker Studios. If Maker Studios sold for a bunch of money and I made a lot of cash off the shares that i have maker studios to me it's very tempting to just like disappear off the internet and just like because i'm not on the internet to get famous i'm on the internet to provide for my family while i'm with my family because that's the most important thing to me is just being with my family and if i sold makers if maker studios sold and i made a bunch of money i don't know I say that I would like to disappear and never get on the internet, but I think I would miss it, you know, but I definitely would scale back and I wouldn't share as much as we share. Okay. Well, let's, let's talk about that more, but to take one step back. I think that it seems to me that the whole daily vlog thing and that becoming your mainstay and source of income and what it is was kind of

an accident. It was a second channel. Totally, totally. I mean, how did that happen? Because Shay Carl, the first channel, was more sketch based. You would include your kids in that, but when was the decision to start doing daily vlogs? So when I turned 29 years old, daily vlogs? So when I turned 29 years old, I had been on YouTube for about a year. I had built up my Shay Carl audience. I think I had like 40,000 subscribers.

And it was always like coming up with skits and ideas. And I was like, oh man, I'm 29. This is the last year of my 20s. What am I going to do? I wanted to do something that was monumental. Something that's like, if I did this, that would be crazy. Something like a goal that I could set that would be like so hard to do. But if I just totally committed to it, I could do it. I thought, what if I made a video every single day for the last year of my twenties? Did I just say that out loud?

Yeah. Did I just say that out loud? Did I just say that where Charles Trippi could hear me and then say, you have to do it? Because I thought that's what happened. I thought you guys said, well, I'll do it if you do it. Oh, no, no. Like I started it and then like a month and a half later, he started it. Oh, so he copied you.

Well, I mean, I copied Anne Frank, you know. She wrote in her diary every day. I know you guys are great friends. Yeah, I mean, Charles, he's probably like my best friend from the internet. So yeah, like, I just actually sent a letter to the Guinness Book of World Records

telling them that I have missed days and that he is the longest consecutive vlogger. Even though I started a month and a half before Charles, I've missed days

in the last five years and he has not. He has not missed one day. In five years. In almost, I mean, coming up, this March

will be my five year mark and so I think he started in May. I think he started May 1st. So he started like a month and a half after me. So I had to write a letter to whom it may concern at the Guinness Book of World Record Company. Because they recognized you?

Yeah, they said, well, what about this? Everybody is claiming that Shay Carl has vlogged longer than you, but I haven't vlogged longer consecutively. I may have started before him, but I have missed days. How many days have you missed? Over the last, I don't vlogged longer consecutively. I may have started before him, but I have missed days. How many days have you missed? Over the last five years, maybe 10 or 12 days, maybe.

I don't like to admit that. As a daily vlogger, I don't like to admit that. And what has determined that? It's like where we had been traveling, and it's late, and I couldn't get the internet, and it was like the kids are cranky, and I'm like, honey, I've got to upload this video. And she's stressed, and I was like, I I couldn't get the internet and it was like, you know, the kids are cranky and I'm like, honey, I gotta upload this video. And she's like stressed. And I was like, I gotta find the internet

because there's this streak. And finally it's like, okay, screw it. Like my family is more important than getting this video up. You know, like my kids are miserable. My wife's hungry. Like I can't, you know, make them wait at the Starbucks in some random town

because I have to upload the vlog. Now when you miss that first day, though, is there this party that's like, you know what? This is it. I almost quit the vlogs a couple of times because it's like, man, I've missed. I think there was one day where I missed two days in a row. And I was like, you know what?

It's over. I'm done. I'm not going to upload videos. I'm not going to do daily videos anymore. But then I was like, no, I got to keep going. But I haven't missed a day. I haven't missed a day for the last year and a half. I've been very consistent over the last year and a half. I haven't missed a day I haven't missed a day for like the last year and a half like I've been very consistent over the last year

and a half I haven't missed any days and this is still something that you are doing yourself yeah I edit shoot everything yeah that's full time so on one hand I did have editors though there was about a year and a half where I had Brett the intern and Denise Vlogs edit

my videos for me and then you went back yeah it was like it didn't do as well when I had Brett the intern and Denise Vlogs edit my videos for me. And then you went back. Yeah, it was like it didn't do as well. When I had editors, it lost some of the personal feel, and I just missed doing it, and I missed adding in little things. Like they would edit and upload the video, and I'd go watch it. I'd be like, oh, why'd you cut this part out? And I remember having conversations with Denise one day. I was filming Suntard at school and they were doing a play

and she edited the video so that the play worked with the storyline. But there was a moment in the play where the kid like forgot his line and Gavin like whispered the line. Gavin Suntard. I don't care, you can leave that in. Gavin whispers the line to the kid

and then he's like, oh, so then he tells the line. So Denise edited it so it looked good in the play but I'm like no I want the part in where he whispers the line that's so cute and she's like oh I thought you'd want the play to flow I'm like no I don't care about the play I want to see

him whispering the line you know so there's little moments like that like it wasn't her fault or anything but just like little things yeah it's like ah I wish you would have put that in and so then I was like I'm just going to do it myself because there's more of a personal feel and so I just you know I like doing it better like, oh, I wish you would have put that in. So then I was like, I'm just going to do it myself because there's more of a personal feel. So I just like doing it better like that. And views have done better.

Since I took over, incrementally views have gone up. That intangible. Oh, yeah. Actually, it is intangible. I mean, yeah, I can look at Google Analytics. For the last 12 months, every single month, the last 12 months, Shaytard's views have increased. Where last month, we had 22 million monthly views,

and that's maybe the fourth highest viewed month in our entire history. Well, having another baby doesn't hurt. Yeah, that helps. That helps. So on one hand, you're saying, I wouldn't trade this occupation for the world. I get to be with my family and make this my living. On the other hand, you're saying, I'm really starting to think if I had the opportunity or I'm actually maybe even looking for the opportunity to stop cold turkey or to get out of it entirely. So I'm interested in that dynamic. I think here's what it is. I think I'm a little bit burned out, to be honest. Like, I think after five years, I need a break.

And I think if I had a month vacation where I could go just wherever away from the internet, because I have been on my phone, on the internet every single day for the last six years. If I had a month where I went, me and Colette talked about this the other day, that coming March will be my five-year anniversary, and then on spring break,

whenever that is for the kids getting out of school, we are going to go for a week vacation, a real vacation where it's not like a YouTube gathering or like a brand deal or something where I'm going for work, where we're going to go on a real vacation where I leave on purpose, my phone on my dresser at home. And then I get an airplane without my laptop and without my phone. Like

that freaks me out to think about that. But at the same time, it sounds like pure bliss, but it's like, I am just not going to be on the internet at all for a week. Well, that's talking one week. That's different. But yeah, I feel like if I had a month and it just kind of like got away from it, I feel like I would want to come back. Cause I do. I love it. I love making videos. I love seeing the interaction. I just at a point right now where it's been every day for five years, I'm like, I just need a break. And I, so I think when I say like, I would love to disappear into the wilderness of Idaho and never get on the internet again. I think that's just, I just need a break. So I think after I, after this five years, I'm definitely going to

stop the dailies after this five years. And I'm going to focus more on doing Shay Carl videos and we'll still vlog probably four days a week, but I'm, I'm going to, you know, not have that strict of a schedule where it's like, and on Sundays, that's after March 5th, after we hit that five years, I am not even, that's my goal is I'm not going to get on the internet at all on Sundays. Cause I still upload a one take video on Sundays where I just film a one clip and I don't edit it and I just upload it. But I'm still on Twitter and I'm still reading and I'm still in the comments because I can't upload a video without reading comments. Like I'm, I'm always reading comments. So that's going to be the new rule after the five year mark. After I get that, you know,

five years of daily vlogging under my belt Sundays, that's my new rule for life. I'm not getting on the internet at all. Are you fearful of that, of that moment? No, I'm excited about it. But then like my family questions me like, yeah, right. Shay, like you, you won't be able to do that. Like I tell my brother, like, I'm going to go on this month vacation, not getting on the internet. And he's like, he says, he doesn't believe me. Thinks he's like, you're not getting on Twitter. You're not going to Instagram anything. You're not going to read comments. I tell myself that I'm not, I don't know. I'm excited. He's like, you're not going to get on Twitter. You're not going to Instagram anything. You're not going to read comments. I tell myself that I'm not. I don't know. I'm excited. It's like

a new part of me that I haven't experienced in the last six years. Not doing a daily vlog. Yeah, talk about the toll, the challenges for you and your wife and your relationship and your family. What kind of toll does that take on you as an individual

and as a family? It's interesting because I mean the vlog is a huge priority in our family I said when I come home tonight from the podcast if this house is spotless then I'll take you guys all out to a movie and get a treat tomorrow so tomorrow I know what will happen

is it'll be like dad is it time to go to the movie? they'll come to me and they won't say dad is it time to go to the movie they'll come to me and they'll say, Dad, is the vlog up yet? Because it's like they know I can't do anything until the vlog's up. So it's not like, you know, also I feel like a big commitment to a lot of people. A lot of people who watch our videos,

they really rely on them. So I feel like this huge commitment to these people who've supported us for so long over the years, watched all of these videos, bought our merchandise, supported anything we've done. It's like, I have a huge commitment to them, you know? So it's like, first and foremost is my family, but then it's like the Shaytards are a family, you know? All these people who watch our videos, we're kind of like a proxy parent for a lot of these kids.

There's a pressure. Oh yeah. It's a huge pressure because like- But what kind of toll does that take on your relationship? I mean, I imagine you edit out the arguments. Well, this is a funny conversation we have with Charles and Allie where at the end of the night I'll go to import the footage from the day because I like to have it all imported in the timeline so that when I wake up I can start to edit.

And so I'll be importing the clips. I'll be like, honey, you only got one clip today? There'll be those fights. And she'll be like, I'm up, I can start to edit. And so I'll be importing the clips. I'll be like, honey, you only got one clip today? You know, like there'll be those fights. And she'll be like, I'm sorry, I was busy. And it's like those, I'm like, honey, this is our job. It's so easy. All you have to do is turn on the camera for six minutes, like four clips, four one-minute clips.

You know, like we've gotten into these pretty heated conversations. She's like, well, I couldn't because I had to do this. I'm like, babe, just turn on the camera. She's like, well, I didn't feel like vlogging. I'm like, honey, this is a dream. Like. Do you realize how many people wish they had this job? So we've gotten fights like that. And are you thinking at that moment, I should be filming this argument? Right. But people would love that. People would love to see that. But no, I don't want to turn on the camera when you're fighting. Charles and Allie actually tell me that when they're yelling, one of them will turn the camera on

just so they stop. So it's like, you know, you're not going to yell at the camera when the camera's on, you know. But it's... But there's that, you've drawn the line, because there is a principle of the same reason you didn't put the water cooler on the first time, but you made it dramatic. It's more appealing.

There is a more entertaining way to fight. And it's also what separates what you do from say, a reality show, because you're the producer and the editor. Forces the drama, yeah. So here's how I think about that, because I think people would love to see me and Mommy Tard fight just because people love drama.

I mean, our human species, that's why reality TV does so well. I just feel like there's so much of that already that they don't need it from us. Like, I feel like I want the Shaytards to be a place where they can come and always count on having uplifting positivity, optimism, happy, cheerful people to, you know, cause I feel like there's so many kids today that just have a cry. I mean, I read the comments and I just feel like crying. Like my dad just came home drunk again. I wish Shay and Colette were my parents.

And it's like they just live in these lives that their parents are fighting all the time. They go to school and they get bullied. They have all these horrible experiences and they can come home and get on the computer and have 15 minutes of just pure happiness, silly time where I'm wrestling the kids, throwing them around.

And I could leave those arguments in there, but I just feel like they've dealt with that all day long. I want to be a place where they can always count on coming to go away being like, oh, I feel better now. Well, it's interesting that your reason is for what it does for your audience, but there's also the reason I would imagine that you want some privacy.

Right. And when you're fighting, you'd rather just get it over with than exploit it for entertainment value. Exactly, like, hold on, honey. I'm gonna, yeah, let me turn on the camera. And you should have, you know, yeah, exactly, exactly. And at the same time, okay, so I have this like saying,

that's not my saying but I've kind of adopted it the happiness is a choice and that's a very literal thing that I learned because I had to turn the camera on and be that happy guy because there's days where you know I mean it's so ridiculous to even say but everybody wakes up in a pissy mood

everybody wakes up like I don't want to do it I don't want to vlog I don't want to turn the camera on and be like, hey, guys, okay, what are we doing? And I just like, I'm going to quit. I don't want to do this anymore. But it's like, okay. So I turn the camera on, and I smile, and I sit up straight, and I breathe deep. And it's like, hey, guys, and blah, blah, blah.

And I do the clip, and it's like a two-minute clip. And I turn the camera off, and I'm like, I actually feel better. Like I physiologically feel my body feels better. Just because I sat up, I took some deep breaths, I smiled, it changes how I feel. And I'm like,

that's like a choice. People are like, happiness isn't a choice, Shay. I'm like, it is. I felt like crap before I turned the camera on and after I did that vlog and tried to be funny

and tried to joke around with my kids, I really felt better. Okay, Shay, you're making it too happy. What I'm trying to get at here is what is the dark side? You just want the dirty stuff. So one time my girlfriend's dad ripped my shirt. You know, it's funny, but we've come so far. I think there's been fights in the past and stuff with me and my wife,

but we've come so far and experienced so much that there is no downside of it. I'm constantly— And not just conflict or fighting, but I mean the life. How does it affect my kids? I constantly take their temperature on that. I'm always like—I'll pull Gavin aside, or when we're kids? Yeah, like, I constantly take their temperature on that. I'm always like, you know, I'll pull Gavin aside or when we're driving, I'm like, what do you think about the vlogs?

Because the second that it's like, I feel like I'm forcing them to be funny on camera for YouTube, that's when all the fun stops. You know, it's like, I'm not gonna be like, get up here and be cute. You know what I mean? It's like, if they don't want to do it, I don't want to force them into it.

But it's totally the opposite. Like, I am reigning them back because they want to be in more I don't want to force them into it, but it's totally the opposite. Like I am reigning them back because they, they want to be in more videos. They want to start their own channel. And I'm just like, uh, it just, just,

I know the comments out there, you know? And it's like terms of service. I just keep saying, you guys can't tell you're 13. It's a rule. I always say this is a dream come true of a dream. I never knew I even had,

it'll be the most interesting part of this is to see what my kids will turn out to do in their lives. You know, if they'll all be entertainers or, but they all say they want to sing and be performers, but I'm just like, you can do whatever you want. You don't have to do this. And do you anticipate that whatever it is that they decide to do will be public knowledge

because it'll be on the internet? That's what I get worried about. Cause I, it's like, I, I just see, I foresee a day when one of my kids writes a book about this whole experience is like, you know, baby TARD is Emmy. I imagine Emmy writing a book saying my life is baby TARD. You know, it's almost like a character online. You know, they are the same person, but it's this like online persona that has been created by me for them. And I kind of joke sometimes I'm like, well, if you're raised on a farm, you got to go out and milk the cows. If you like to, or not, you're born in Shay Carl's household. You had to be cute on camera. You know, like I said, I would never force them into doing that, but, um, it'll just, I always say like,

you guys can do whatever you want, and I'll support you, and it'll just be interesting to see what they decide to do. And it seems like you've developed a little bit of a margin or freedom to be able to say, you know what, guys, we could stop this, and this isn't necessarily your livelihood at this point with the success that Maker Studios has seen, right? So how does that work? I mean, it's great to not have to worry about money anymore. And I'd hate to talk about money because it's just like, you know, people don't, I don't know. There's like some jealousy. Some people get it. It's like, they're, they're happy for our success, but some people, it drives them, you know, it's like the comments come in like, well, no, we're all not

lucky. Like you, Shay, to be able to, you know – it's like, well, I've worked my butt off for the last five years. And I believe in – I don't believe in a scarcity complex where it's like a lot of people feel like if somebody else succeeds, that means then there's less success in the universe for them. Like if you succeed, that means I can't succeed. It's like there's plenty for everybody. And it does feel good to not have to rely on the daily vlogs for money anymore. You know, we've got to the point where we're totally debt free. All five of our kids' college education is totally set. Like we have UTMAs, like we just fill out all the paperwork.

So like we're in a very comfortable position. And the reason we don't do the daily vlogs for money anymore it's just because one like I want to hit that five-year mark and like I said I have a lot of responsibility to that audience so those kids who have those crappy lives who I see those comments every day of like if it weren't for you guys I wouldn't have gotten through my senior year you know like just there's so many stories of kids that I just it's sad to find out how many bad parents there are out there of parents that just don't support their kids and just fight nonstop.

But from a livelihood standpoint, so you're doing it for them and for the five-year milestone, but from a livelihood standpoint, your position at Maker, what's your title? I mean, as a founder, writer. I'm a co-founder, but it's like, I don't run day-to-day at Maker. I go into Maker Studios once a month.

I actually try to stay away because every time I go in there, it's crazy. So I just make my content, and we have a sales team. They'll call me with brand deals. They're like, hey, here's a deal, so-and-so. We just did one with Urban Shredder Hot Wheels. But this is a deal for your channel, right? Yeah, for my channel. But then also as a founder, I mean, you're able to say, I'm doing it.

There's times where I have to go in and vote on the board. There's current things that are going on right now that I've had to go in to discuss changes in leadership at Maker Studios and stuff like that. I don't have any say or I don't want to have any say in day-to-day operations at Maker. I just want to focus on creating my content. They're a great resource. All my

merchandise is done through Rody Arcade. I have contact people for all the things I want to do. We have a cartoon. There's an animation department where I call them up. I'm like, Hey, let's do this cartoon. I want to be a Viking. And so then they have writers and animators and they put it all together and I show up and do the voiceover and then they create the videos and upload them. And then you say they, but I mean, it's the beauty of it is, is being a founder is that it's we, it's, you know, yeah, it's my company, you know, like like I'm like, I want to do this.

But if those things do well, then it's like, you know, like for instance, negotiating the contract for the split between my channels and Maker Studios is kind of this catch-22 because I'm negotiating for my channel, but Maker wants to get a bigger cut. But that's kind of like me because I'm an owner of Maker. Yeah, so it's like I get a cut of the but that's kind of like me because I'm a owner of Maker. Yeah. So it's like, I get a cut of the cut that Maker's taking. So there's weird things like that, but Maker's exploded. There's almost 400 employees there now. And those are 400 jobs that didn't exist four years ago. They weren't even in the marketplace four years ago. And so that's cool. My grandma was just in town because we had this new baby and my mom was in town and I took her on maker studios and she was just

like, wow. You know? And I'm even that way when I walked through there, I'm like, I don't know half of these people. And how did that happen? I mean, the start of it, it was kind of forged through friendship with you. Yeah. Danny and Lisa and Ben. It was out of necessity. Like, uh flew out to L.A. to help them with a brand deal. They had a brand deal with Fox, I think, to promote Crank 2, that movie with Jason Statham, where he had to keep his heartbeat above a certain rate. And Danny called me, and he said, hey, I got this brand deal. We need to get, like, five different YouTubers to make videos for this deal. We can pay you $2,000 and fly you out to LA and we'll shoot, help you shoot

and edit this video. And I was like, yeah, dude, that would be great coming from Idaho. So I flew out to LA. So are you saying if, if, if Rhett and I would have said yes to that brand deal with you, then we would be. Should have hindsight's 2020. You guys could be rich too. You are rich. That's how things happen, right? I mean, that is how it it happened you came into town and what you brought in a few people I came into town we made that video and I was like this is so awesome and you brought in a few people they were like hey we're going to start this company

and so Phil was like on a road trip I'm like dude you should move to LA because he was living in Georgia Atlanta at the time and he was on this big road trip he was doing like meet and greets all over the country he stopped in LA we had moved to LA already so we hung out i'm like dude we're starting this company you should join it they got shane dawson casam g you know all these people it's like let's join let's start this company we'll promote each other it was called the station yeah that was the name

of the the channel was the station but maker studios always existed as a company but the you know the the channel that we're all going to be part of was the station. And so, yeah, I remember when we started the station and started uploading those first videos, it exploded. We all gained 100,000 subscribers over a week's time, because it was like

everybody was pushing in, and then it pushed out. Everybody pushed their audience into the station, and then in reverse, all that it pushed out. So it's like everybody pushed their audience into the station. And then in reverse, all that audience pushed out and subscribed to all the members of the station. And that's kind of like a... But it was basically, Danny had the Fox deal. And he was like, let's form a business around that. Well, let's form a partnership where we can keep doing this together because we're

powerful because of, with our views brought together. So yeah, that was like the first, you know, I came down, we made that video and it was like, wow, all these YouTubers working together. Cause before that you, there was collabs on YouTube, but it was like, people would email clips to each other. Right. This is, as far as my knowledge, the first time where a bunch of YouTubers came together and we're like in each other's videos. Like Danny shot that video for me and then Lisa edited it. And I had no editing knowledge. Like I was on movie, I movie maker, you know, like windows movie maker. And I was horrible at editing and they had final cut pro and they had like a boom pole. And I was like, they're so Hollywood. They have this microphone on a stick, you know?

And I was like, holy crap, before that, like my wife is holding this digital camera and we had no idea what we're doing. So that upped the quality of my content because these were people that had been making videos for longer than me. And so as we're there making these videos for Fox, he's like, I'm thinking about a business

where we all make these videos together and we'll help each other. And like, we'll come up with ideas for each other and we'll act in each other's videos and we'll help each other edit and shoot. And it's just like this little community of YouTubers creating content and we'll just kind of help each other out. And I was like, that sounds great. That sounds like a lot. That's going to help me. And so that was the idea after this video that we shot.

And I went back to Idaho after being video that we shot and I moved home. I went back to Idaho after like being in LA for three days. And I told Colette, I'm like, let's move to Los Angeles. And she's like, no, you know, no way are we moving to LA? Because this, I had, we'd been doing the daily vlogs for two months and started to get the checks for the daily vlogs. And that was when it was like, this is my full-time job now. That like two months after doing the daily vlogs, my checks jumped like huge.

And it was like, all of a sudden, I was making more doing YouTube than I was doing my granite countertop business. And so it went from this YouTube thing is helping us pay our bills to this is the biggest, this is our, this is,

I'm making more money doing YouTube than granite. So I'm like, I'm done doing granite. And I just dove into YouTube with everything. It was like every, I ate, slept and breathed YouTube. You know,

any, any YouTube gathering that was happening, I'd go to, I read, I've read probably a hundred thousand comments, you know, just like Naltz wrote a book. Alan Distro wrote a book.

You remember Alan Lestufka? Oh, yeah. He's a YouTuber. You talked to him today. Did you? He did not. Yeah, he does our merch. Does he?

Oh, yeah. For DFTBA? Yeah. He wrote a book. I read that book from cover to cover. Like, you know, I've read like three YouTube books, you know, just because I wanted to know every in and out. You know, it was just, it was a dream come true of a dream I never knew I even had.

And the alliances from the beginning of the station, aka Maker as a company, who would have known that it would have turned into this? Oh, yeah. At the time. Never. In a million years, I'd never dreamed that we would have 400 people working at Maker Studios. But it goes from let's help each other get views and then let's work on brand deals and sell against that to, oh, we can sell against this entire audience for even more brand deals and the money just starts coming in. Yeah.

It's just the nature of the internet. The internet has exploded that much in the last four years that it was just great that of the internet. You know, the internet has exploded that much in the last four years that it was just great that we started an internet company, you know? But I'm interested in the dynamic of having to become a businessman. You say you're not involved in the day-to-day of Maker, yet you kind of have to come out of the woodwork

and be the spokesman when things hit the fan at times. I mean, Danny's not involved anymore. I mean, I don't follow the ins and outs of these things. But with the whole Ray William Johnson kind of thing, I was like, what is happening that you find yourself in a position where you are the face? Spokesperson for Maker Studios, right. Which is never a position that I like asked for but it I think it was just the nature of that I made videos of my life every day and a major part of those videos was this little family that lived in Idaho moving out to Los

Angeles California to start a business and so it was very very public. You know, it was like something I talked to the audience with. I'm like, Hey guys, you know, this is when we lived in Idaho. I'm like, we're going to move to California and start a business with some of our YouTube friends. So we were very transparent about that whole process. So it's like, Oh yeah, Shay Carl, he's going out. So anytime somebody wanted to check in on the station or check in on maker studios, I'm making a video every day of being a part of that process. So I think just by default, I somehow become the face of Maker Studios.

So the day that I hear that Ray William Johnson is tweeting all these things and leaving Maker Studios because of his contract, I was never even there when he signed his contract. I had no idea what his deal was or what the negotiations were. But the second that he comes out and starts tweeting

that he's leaving Maker Studios, all these tweets come pouring in. Shay, what's going on with Ray William Johnson? I'm like, I don't know. I have no idea. I've met the guy like twice in my whole life. And everybody's like thinking that I should like speak up and say something.

And I'm just like, I have no idea what his deal is, what the contract is or any of that. So it's like, you know, I'm getting all these tweets, and it's to the point where I'm like, well, I don't have to say anything about it. But then it's like so many tweets. It's like if I don't say something about it, then it seems like I'm hiding something. You know, because it's like, well, you're Shea Carl.

Like, you went and started this company. It's all in the video. So I'm like, I guess I got to make a video. You know, at that point, I just try to stand up for my friend and the company that I started. And, you know, I don't have any hard feelings for Ray. They had a disagreement.

Danny Diamond is not the easiest person to get along with. I think that's no secret, but that's one thing I love about Danny. Danny Diamond is one of those people that's like if you're his friend, he's like the best friend that you'll ever have. You want him on your side, but if he's not your friend, you hate him. You know, it's like, oh, Danny Diamond guy.

But if you're friends, it's like he's the strongest friend you'll ever have, you know, and he'll back you up any day of the week. But if you're not friends with him, then you hate him, you know? And Ray, I mean, you said you met Ray twice. I literally have met Ray William Johnson maybe. I met him once in New York at the 789 gathering where he just came up, and he knew a guy that I was friends with, and so we talked about that. We literally shook hands and met.

The only night that I've actually hung out and talked with Ray is one night me and Kasim and Ray went to the Viper Room and saw Wax perform, which is this guy that's a rapper. And then afterwards we went to Ray's hotel room and hung out for like an hour and just talked. But other than that, yeah, I've met Ray, like I said, three times. But I think Ray's smart, man. He's smart and he knows what he's doing.

I mean, my questions aren't really getting you to dish on anybody. Anyway, it's more of being interested in how— You want the dirt, don't you, Link? No, it's how you find yourself in a place where, like you said, you have to speak up about these things as— Well, it's like, I remember I was in junior high. I was friends with Chauncey Bronson and Jodie Eames. And Jodie hated Chauncey, and Chauncey hated Jodie. These are two—it sounds like girls' names, but these are

like real friends of mine. Both guys. Yeah, both dudes. So if I hung out with Jody, Chauncey was pissed. Like, why are you hanging out with him? I'm like, because we get along and we play sports. But Chauncey was like my skater friend who had long hair. And Jody hated Chauncey because he's such a punk.

He's got a punk hairstyle. But I liked skateboarding and skiing. So I liked hanging out with both of these guys but it was like I was always in the middle of like well if I hang out with Shanti I can't tell Jody and so a lot of times with like YouTube drama I feel like that's the position I'm in because I feel like I'm friends with everybody and I have no problems with people because a lot of you know this whole process a lot of people were young you know and they're like kind of figuring out who they were. I was a 27-year-old man with three kids, you know. It's like I already knew who I was. So when all this, like, quote-unquote drama happened, I was just like, ugh.

You know, it's like I'm just kind of stuck in the middle of it, you know. And it's like I have to kind of, like, play nice everybody. And, you know, then sometimes I just get sucked into it because, you know, just by association, you know. Were you – did you find yourself in the same position with when the whole danny thing went down oh that's a different i mean that's an ongoing thing right now so i don't know how much i want to talk about that but i mean yeah i mean i still hear so that means i'm putting you in the position yeah right now okay i i mean yeah i mean i probably shouldn't talk much about that.

I mean, we're still friends and friendly, but there's just, it's a tale as old as time, man. It's a big company, you know, it's like money and success and it splits people up. I'm still friends with all these people, but it's cost a couple friendships and relationships just because of the nature of pride and greed and all those things. And it's just like any fight ever. Nobody's right. My dad used to always say it takes two people to fight. There's always two sides of the story, and usually each side is a little bit right,

and people just disagree. My buddy Dave Ramsey says, and maybe you guys might not agree with this because you guys are a partnership, but he has a saying that says, the only ship that sinks

is a partnership. Do you guys ever find yourselves getting in a fight? Does Rhett and Link ever fight about business? We're kind of beyond partnership at this point.

Yeah, I tell you guys telling stories about third grade. Like you guys are... Or first grade if you want to go all the way back. All the way back then.

I was listening to, yeah, like somebody punched you in third grade. It want to go all the way back then i was listening to yeah like somebody punched you in third grade of marriage and you stuck up yeah yeah well it was vice versa if i have to split hairs he did he did stand up for me john carson right john carson we're coming after you yeah john carson yeah so maybe it's more of like you wouldn't take the partner business partnership but you and colette there's a partnership there that's a marriage partnership. For sure. We're not married, but it's somewhere in between the two. And here's the crazy thing about Danny and Maker Studios

is I would have ran the business a lot different than Danny did. I would have grown Maker Studios a lot slower. I would have tried to like lay out a good foundation. If it wasn't for Danny, Maker Studios wouldn't be where it is today. Maker Studios is huge in this market now because of the way that Danny built it. And it was just like, explode.

It's a gold rush. And he was right. In this industry at this time, it's happening so fast. I would have done it a lot slower, but he was just like, we need to get more people. We need to sign more channels. just like more advertising. He had all these big plans. I'm like, whoa, dude, let's just slow down and like, let's just work on some good YouTube videos. But he like, he had this mind, like we got to get marketing and we have to have this department.

And he would, we'd always tease him because he would just go off on these tangents, these rants, and he would be like pulling his hair. I was like a mad scientist of the internet, you know? He's like, we're gonna do this and this. And I'm like, whoa, what do you mean a sales team? We have like 10 sales people win. Like, why? And now we have that. So he was ambitious. He was a visionary. Yeah, he knew. He knew where it was going.

He saw where it was going and you know, you got to hand it to him. Like, Maker Studios is a huge player in our industry. So who's in charge today? Today, the CEO is Anand, who is a huge player in our industry. So who's in charge today? Today, the CEO is Anand, who is a former CEO of Endemol, which is a production company out of Europe. And he's running things now. And he's a great guy.

I really appreciate him. And he's done a lot of good things for Maker as well. It's like Danny is like the mad scientist know, the mad scientist who had the idea and got it all going. And then all of a sudden we have 300 employees and it's a major company and he's never been a CEO before. So it's like, he doesn't know how to like run these meetings and how to like get HR together. And like, we're learning all this stuff. Like there's insurance and 401ks and like all that kind of stuff. It's like, we're just kids who are making YouTube videos, you know? So it's like all this money, like Time Warner put all this money in and it's like, we don't know how to do all this. Like it's like

the thing that outgrew us, you know? So, you know, when Danny left, when he stepped down as CEO, that was actually a good night. I remember we had a big meeting, went over to his house and it was like, we did it. Like we got it to a point where this major, we're bringing in this major guy who's a CEO of this giant company who's now going to run this company that we just started off of a whim four years ago. And it was like, good job. We did it. And then, you know, other things have happened since then. But, um, yeah, it's, it's a, it's a success story if you ask me, like who are the other founders that are still in that we know? I know Lisa.

Lisa, Ben, Kasim, Ron. Hi, I'm Ron. And then Danny still owns shares. I might get in trouble for some of this stuff. I don't even know what I'm supposed to be saying. I'm going to be sued. Is your lawyer here? No.

This is not being recorded. Oh, we're just talking, right? We're just three dudes talking about our life, right? Yeah, right. Did I tell you about this time that I made out with my girlfriend and her mom? This is just for posterity. We've been talking for four hours now. Is this a deposition? We can wrap up.

We're all family, man. We all have women and children to get back home to. I mean, I will say, you know, to be staggering success in four years and watching it happen from the sidelines makes you bitter. No, it is amazing to see what has happened at Maker. And, you know, I think it's fabulous. It's cool.

I think it's, you know, a rising tide raises all ships. I think it's good for anybody in the business. You know, it's, you know, the more that we get, you know, as far as like, I hate saying, you know, people are always like, when people start taking YouTubers seriously or what's the word? Come on, you guys. Where's your vocabulary here? Legitimacy? Yeah, yes. Thank you. Oh, Link, I love you.

It's like when you need to sneeze. When you can't think of a word and it's like driving you crazy and you say that word that you're, I love you. It's like when you need to sneeze when you can't think of a word and it's driving you crazy and you say that word that you're trying to think of. It's like a good sneeze. Oh, legitimacy! Thank you.

Achoo. Yeah, I feel like the more stories of Time Warner investing $20 million into this industry, it legitimizes all of us and it shows mainstream Hollywood that this is the new form of entertainment. And you guys are great it legitimizes all of us and it shows, you know, mainstream Hollywood that, you know, this is the new form of entertainment and you guys are great at creating that. And you guys are,

you know, pioneers of that who have done TV. You guys have your own TV show or had your own TV show and are still making great content. This is the future. Cause that's, that's a question I always get asked is like, okay, now that you're, you know, you have this YouTube success, when are you going to get your own TV show? It's like, well, I don't want a TV show. I want to be a pioneer of this brand new, exciting thing that is converging on entertainment right now and be able to talk about this 10 years from now and the five-year mark, you said that you could, if I told you, you know what, Shay, I can see the future, and at that five-year mark, that's going to be it. You're going to turn off the vlog faucet. There's not going to be any more videos from you or your family. You could believe me. I would be okay with that scenario

I wouldn't be sad about it but I just don't see that realistically happening I feel like our family will be on the internet in some capacity for a long time I think if I'm realistic with myself I think I'll always be on YouTube as long as it's there and as long as the audience is there, I think I'll always want

to create things and just have that outlet. You know, I just, I need a little break. I think having coming at the tail end of five years of uploading a video every day, I think after I get like a month of just like fresh air and can like back away from it I think I'll come back refreshed and more excited about it than ever you know well all that being said thank you for spending two hours with us yeah

this has been good this is fun I'll listen I hope I don't listen to this later and be like oh why did I say that I don't think so you guys are just so disarming so handsome and I just want to talk to you guys are just so disarming. So handsome. I just want to talk to you guys. It's the two-on-one thing.

Yeah. That's the key. And why'd you guys make me sit on the floor? All right, grab that Sharpie. Why don't you sign the table? Oh, cool. The round table of dim lighting. Harley took up a giant part here.

Look at all these people. You got Tyler Oakley, Hannah Hart, Grace. Where's Phil's signature? Love Your Faces, wherever it is. Right there. Can I write thanks for the shout out? Yeah, do that. I'm going to complete the circle.

I'm going to put it here. And there it is, the conclusion of our epic conversation, two-parter with Shea Carl. Yeah, you know, I found it very interesting, more than interesting. Sure. That he was, that he's at this point where he could stop this. Like, you know, he actually, there's a part of him that wants to stop. There's an impulse to want to get out. I mean, he said if he could cash in

on his portion of Maker Studios, that if that could happen, that he might just walk away from the whole endeavor of being on the internet. But then, you know, he backtracks on that. He starts to think about the impact it would have on his audience and the impact that it would have on him as a creative person so i i mean he's he's certainly still processing that i don't think the headline will be shay is quitting but

it could be shay's shay thinks about it sometimes or a lot of times. Well, I would assume that those of you who have tuned in to this two-part series with Shay Carl right here on Ear Biscuits, who are Shay Tarts fans, you might be shaking in your boots a little bit if you think, oh, the five-year mark comes and these won't be daily or whatever. I'm sure you're going to want to let your voice be heard. You know, there's ways to do that. We're not encouraging you to go bombard the Shaytards with comments of saying, please don't quit, because I think this was Shay just being honest.

I appreciate his honesty about everything from his belief system to the decisions that he made to start the family vlog, why he continues it, his candidness about Maker Studios. I mean, this guy has lived quite a life, and there's a lot there, and he wasn't guarded about any of it. I really appreciate that. And I'm empathetic to the impulse to want to quit.

When you do something every day for five years, you know, I mean, give the guy a break. I mean, that's one of the reasons that we have seasons on Good Mythical Morning is because, you know, we like variety and we do a lot of different things on the show and we know people want it to come back, but we stop it because we want to like it because when we like it, you like it. When we're having a good time, you have a good time. If you do anything long enough, it gets old. I mean, I think about late night television hosts like Kimmel Fallon, all those guys, that daily grind of, I got to do this again, even though it's like a dream job, it's difficult. My grandma, Nanny Lucille.

Is a late night show host? Is a late night show host in Canada. No, she folded shirts at a shirt factory in Lillington, North Carolina for her entire working life. Wow. Just that job. And it's amazing. She can fold a mean shirt. What?

You ever have her come over and just fold shirts for you? No. Do you know how those dress shirts you get will have like pins everywhere and then there will be something that says inspected by number 279? She was a number. She was one of those numbers. And she would also put the pins in the shirt and things like that. The factory is since closed, but her and her younger sister, Aunt Vicki, who she lives with,

they both worked their entire working lives. And she was always so happy. Yeah, it's just this mentality of, well, this is my job. I'm a shirt folder. This is what I do. And I come home and I fry the chicken and I live my life.

I think it's generational. I mean, we live in a time where everybody thinks that they have to do something that they love. And you know what? And we encourage that. I mean, we get to do something that we love and we tell people to go do something you love. But I think the stark reality is that for most of the world,

you have to do something that you can do that will pay the bills. Yeah, and for- It's a privilege. To do anything that you can do that will pay the bills yeah and you know it's a privilege to do anything that you even enjoy even just a little bit is is a privilege you know it's not a right it's definitely not a right yeah so i i'll say i'm empathetic to you know to shay and him having him doing this and and being true to the. But I don't think what you're saying is that family vlogging and shirt folding are the same. Over time, it can feel the same, I think is what

I'm saying. And what I'm saying is that he still gets to do, as he acknowledged, he gets to do something that's absolutely incredible, that is a job. He isn't folding shirts, but he still might get tired of it. Even if you love it, you might get tired of it even if you love it you might get tired of it yeah and you know i mean that that brings me to say we're thankful to have the opportunity to be able to do this show to be able to reach your ears in this way um we counted a privilege to be able to have these conversations with shake carl and all of these other fascinated personalities from the internet to be able to understand what makes them Tick where they come from

That's what Ear Biscuits is And this is probably a good time to announce Our new project, an all new podcast That we're coming out with called Folding Shirts With Rhett and Link, just going to be a lot of shuffling Noises and some mild Conversation, and the occasional Oh I just pricked myself with a pen

And Nanny will be part of it. Yeah. She'll be here. We're going to bring Nanny. She recently recovered from a choking incident. Wait, you're going to bring that into this? She's okay now. And she's going to be folding some shirts with us.

It'll be awesome. Look for that. Look for that on the horizon. In the meantime, keep enjoying the Ear Biscuits. They're going to keep coming down the factory line. Every week.