Effectively Wild: A FanGraphs Baseball Podcast - Effectively Wild Episode 1342: Take Me Out With the Crowdfunding

Episode Date: March 3, 2019

Ben Lindbergh and guest co-host Emily Waldon of The Athletic banter about how Emily got into covering the minor leagues, the perils and rewards of minor-league coverage, the progress of player development, the benefits of speaking Spanish, prospects of particular interest, the growing media interest in minor-league pay, and more, then (27:18) discuss the future […]

And there ain't nobody that can sing like me, ain't nobody that can sing like me. We will be under in the minor key, we will be under in the minor key. There ain't nobody that can sing like me. Hello and welcome to episode 1342 of Effectively Wild, a baseball podcast from Fangraphs presented by our Patreon supporters. I am Bellman Berg of The Ringer, and I am joined by today's guest co-host, Emily Walden of The Athletic, who covers the minor leagues, I guess the entire minor leagues in theory, but also specifically the Detroit Tigers minor league system. Hey, Emily. Hey, thanks so much for having me on. Very happy to have you.

So in a little bit, we will be joined by Jeremy Wolf, who is the executive director of an organization called More Than Baseball, which is dedicated to improving conditions for minor leaguers. This is something we've talked about in the past, but we have to keep talking about it because they're still not getting paid and don't seem to have any hope of getting paid in the foreseeable future. So Jeremy, who is a former minor leaguer himself, is trying to do something about that. And we will ask him about his group. We will also be joined at the same time by one of his partners in this endeavor, Simon Rosenblum-Larsen, who is a pitcher in the Tampa Bay Rays system.

And he's the director of player personnel for More Than Baseball. So Simon, who's a Harvard guy, is 22 and Jeremy is 25, but they are trying to change things. But I want to talk to you about your background and your coverage because being a minor leaguer is difficult, but covering the minor leagues seems pretty difficult too. I would not know from personal experience, but we haven't had a whole lot of people on the show, I think, who cover the minors just to tell stories about players, to profile what life in the minors is like, as opposed to just ranking and evaluating. So how did you get into this area of baseball coverage? Yeah, it was really kind of a funny thing because I always tell people I had no aspirations to do minor league coverage originally. originally. You kind of step into it and you want to be the one to interview Miguel Cabrera or, you know, Derek Jeter or, you know, the bigger names of the game. And it was really just a

matter of me sort of stepping into their world, so to speak, and starting to spend more time behind the scenes, not just, you know, a butt in the seats and sort of kind of getting to know what their days were like, you know, off the field, what goes sort of kind of getting to know what their days were like, you know, off the field, what goes on in the clubhouse, what goes on in the bus. And as you start to have more of those conversations, you start to get a better picture painted of what life is like for them. And obviously the pay scale comes up more often than not, especially now. And so you're able to have really candid, obviously off the record conversations with so many of the players, because it's such a touchy

subject that we have to respect their position and know that there's a very big risk involved if they go public with their opinions. Right, exactly. And have you noticed, even in the time that you've been covering the minors, I mean, it certainly seems from a national perspective, there's a lot more attention being paid to that. It's not new for minor leaguers. Obviously, they've been dealing with it this whole time. But in terms of media attention, that really seems to be ramping up. Yeah, I would say that it has, especially over the last couple of years. This is going to be my fifth season of doing work in the minor league circuit across the board. And I really didn't start

becoming aware of it until probably the last couple of years. I would say the last probably two or three years. And as more focus is being put on major league labor issues, and obviously the free agency topic of conversation, as we saw with Manny Machado and Bryce Harper, there's a lot of different pieces involved to it. And because of all of this stuff being stirred up at the major league level, it's starting to draw more attention to what's going on with the players down below. And when you start to hear about, you know, struggling to hit minimum wage or living at near poverty level pay scale, it really starts to fire people up because a lot of people view it as, hey, they made the choice to play this game. But in reality, they are employees. They have a boss.

They work for an organization. And then that sort of starts to draw in the debate of what should be required. What's the whole focus going to be like? So it's really become a very hot topic of conversation lately. Yeah. Well, what are some of the challenges of covering the minors just in general? I mean, I can imagine the travel for one thing, the lack of some of the information that you have on major league players that I take for granted when I'm writing about guys you don't have at your disposal when you're writing about minor league games. Yeah, it's really a lot of gumshoeing, if you will. Really, it's a very relational area. I know in the major league level, you do want to have relationships and you want to

build contacts. But at the minor league level, it's a lot of personal game attendance. So I can really get my own collection of notes put together, build relationship with scouts, build relationship with scouting directors, you know, player development staff, really to sort of get a well-rounded view of what's going on organization by organization, what areas vary from each other, you know, is nutrition more of a focal point at one club than another? Are there teams that are doing more to improve the living environments of the players? Do they offer housing?

Do they not offer housing? It varies so much across the board. But at the end of the day, there really has become more of a spotlight on the need for building a healthier environment for these farm systems. You know, if you're in a rebuild and you're trying to invest toward the future, I believe that's an absolute key for building a stronger organization. You want to show these guys you have their back, you're going to support them, you want to see them succeed, and you have to be able to build the environment to make that possible. Yeah, that's the other thing. There's just much more interest, I think,

in the minor leagues among fans of the major league team who in the past might not have known really what was going on in the minors until someone showed up on the major league roster because at this point i mean there is more information because of people like you who are providing it but also there are a lot of fans who are interested in young prospects for their fantasy teams for instance or as you say if they're currently in a down cycle at the major league level, then what else are you going to pay attention to except what's next and what's going to save you from this terrible team? That's probably something that Tigers fans can identify with right now. But you're right. I mean, that is in many cases the most entertaining thing to follow about a team if that team is not going to be winning right now.

Yeah, I would definitely agree with that. And the funny part of when I started my coverage with the Tiger system, when I started, Michael Fulmer was really the only full-blown prospect in the Tigers farm system. And he was there for maybe five minutes, and then they promoted him, and it brought it back to having no prospects all over again. So it was really kind of a good place in the aspect of seeing it at its worst, if you will. And then sort of seeing more of the pieces come into place, you know, a little bit more strategic drafting, a little bit more strategic trading, and seeing some of these really

quality guys come up. And, you know, outside of the Tigers, there's other teams that are in that same rebuild situation. And that forces the fan base to have to look at the lower levels and say, you know, dear God, please give us something to look forward to because we're starving for something to cheer about. Yeah, I guess you don't want to be covering the minor league system of a David Dombrowski team because he's generally just going to use the system to make the big league team better, which is good in a way. Maybe that is what it should be used for in many cases, but probably gives you a little less to work with. But yeah, how has that system since the Tigers

have embarked on their rebuild? I mean, they don't have a Padres or Rays type system at this point, but obviously it has grown a lot richer. It definitely has. And I want to say it was MLB Pipeline when they released their rankings. I want to say they had the Tigers in their top 10 for their farm system rankings, which if you followed the system at all, it's just light years ahead of where it used to be. And that's obviously, it's a sign of a good trend. I think the biggest challenge that they still face is a big lack of depth in multiple positions, specifically at first base, catching. And there really aren't many impact bats. And I actually spoke with Dave Littlefield, who is the vice president of player development

for Detroit, and he even acknowledged it as well. You know, he said, hey, we've got to put some more guys into place. We've got a few that are coming up, but they're still going to be probably a couple of years out. And you've got a guy like Kristen Stewart who made his debut last year. He'll likely be in the big league lineup. And so that's another bat that's not in the farm system. And that's, it's an area that they really need to focus on strengthening, sort of stabilizing multiple areas to add more depth and really just make that farm system more strong moving forward. And are you generally looking at your role as a writer and as a journalist as providing a sneak preview of what's to come?

Like, hey, hot tip, you should know this player because this player is going to be good someday. this player is going to be good someday? Or are you just kind of just trying to tell stories for players where they are right now and not necessarily only interested in guys who are one day going to be big, big league stars? Yeah, it's kind of a mix of both. Obviously, I do try and follow the bigger names. The fun part for me is I get to see them as soon as they sign. I get to see them start really from scratch and develop out of whether it was a high school field or a college field, or even some of these players who grew up playing, you know, in the Dominican or Venezuela, and really starting to see them kind of come into their own as a player. And that allows me to say, hey, guys, you know, so-and-so is a stud shortstop. He may be out, you know, still three, maybe even four years if he's a teenage player. He's got something.

And so it's nice to sort of, like you said, give that preview and say, you're going to have to be patient and trying to tell fans, as I'm sure you know, to be patient, easier said than done, especially in the Tigers farm system. So for me, I just sort of have to paint the picture and say, guys, I'm going to be realistic with you. Still going to be a couple of years, but here's what you have to look forward to. And that really is a lot of fun for me. Is the access at the minor league level an advantage? I mean, are players more willing to share their time with you? And are they maybe a little less coached in what they say? Or by the time they get into a minor league system you know they've been

in high school they've been in college maybe they've gotten some training from the team are they already talking like robots sometimes you know some of them do i found it to be the higher draft picks a lot of the the number one number two guys they've had that set down with the team they've gone through this is how you're going to talk to media. Or if you have guys who are former major leaguer sons, or Matt Manning, for example, his dad played in the NBA, he grew up around that media spotlight. And he got to see, this is how you work with media. This is how you, you know, present yourself. This is what you say, and obviously what you don't say. And so you kind of get a little bit more of that rehearsed,

if you will, verbiage when you're talking with some of those guys. But then the younger guys who are maybe, you know, bottom or like past the 10th round pick. So you're looking at 15th, 16th round guys. They're thrilled to talk to you. They will talk to you all day long. So having a little bit more attention because obviously they all know how hard it's going to be and how much work they're going to have to invest. And the teams are generally pretty good with access. They're a little bit more protective of their higher draft picks with good reason. You know, they've invested a good deal of money into these guys, and they want to make sure that they're able to sort of keep an eye on what's going on and what's being said. sort of keep an eye on what's going on and what's being said. So it's really a balancing act. You want to respect the organization. You don't want to, you know, poke and prod the player to the point where he doesn't want to see you again. And it's really just that balance of building relationships and say, hey, I'm here to tell people about the work you're doing and to hopefully shed a good light on you. So let's have a little trade off and help each other out. Yeah. And I remember

you had a thread on Twitter last summer at the end of the minor league season where you were So let's have a little trade off and help each other out. back from people about your coverage or whether you should be there. And you've kind of pushed past all of that and earned a place as a really respected voice on the minor leagues. So I don't know if you can explain some of that progression that you were talking about on Twitter at the time. Yeah, yeah, absolutely. It was, I credit the people who really kind of came alongside me and just told me to keep going. When I first came into the industry, and I'm sure people have seen this too, I'm very, very nice by nature. I'm not a confrontational or controversial person. I'm very much a relationship-driven person and somebody who likes to just be there to tell stories as I've been doing. And so having a thicker skin was

really something that I had to focus on. Just knowing Twitter, again, as you know, it can be a very, very brutal place. And just really kind of sort of knowing who I am, knowing my voice, I think was really the biggest thing I had to focus on and saying, what am I trying to bring to my following? What am I trying to present to my readers? What am I trying to present to my readers? What kind of content are they really starving for? And I think the fact that I stepped into that niche of, you know, that minor league coverage that at the time, you know, four years ago, nobody was really touching it. I mean, it was occasional pieces on, you know, a couple of double A guys,

maybe some triple A guys, and then it was major league coverage, I got to dig deeper. And I think that really sort of presented more of a unique perspective on the game and allowed me to paint a really cool picture for the fan base. And so once I was able to embrace that and really sort of, you know, tuned out the other people saying you should be this or be that, I figured out who I was and the content that I was able to bring. And that really built a lot more confidence for me. And it helped me really stop striving to try and be something I knew that I wasn't going to be.

And so that confidence really pushed me ahead. And it's really helped. And asking a lot of questions. I've really asked a lot of questions. And I've just been very, very blessed with the support staff I do and the mentors who have come alongside me and they've really helped get me where I am right now. technology is playing a greater role and how coaches have changed and their skill set and receptiveness to new ideas have changed. And so when players get to the majors, sometimes even when they get to pro ball at this point, they're already familiar with all of this technology and all of these techniques and they're enhancing themselves, or at least they're open to teams

making these tweaks with them. So I wonder how much of a glimpse you get of that process of these players who are very young in many cases, just going about things in a way that would have been completely unheard of, impossible five, 10 years ago because of the advent of all this new information. Yeah, it's funny. I was telling a good friend of mine the other day, we all try and grow with the game because the game is never going to stop changing. You know, it's so far from what it used to be, you know, 50 years ago. And even now, like you said, the technology has just, it's allowed teams to really sort of give their players a better look behind the scenes with the opposition and who they're

facing, what pitchers they're looking at, you know, being able to dissect their own performances. And I think that really has a lot of the players excited because they're being handed charts. They get to watch, you know, videos. Like teams have just a full video room set up at their complexes that these guys can sit down and study and watch film and, you know, really just put in the time to try and become better in that regard. And I think it has the players really excited. And I think teams, you know, have to stay open to those changes. There's always conversations about the clubs who are maybe a little bit old school still, and they're a little bit more, you know, pushing back against some of

the technological advancements. But I think as an organization, if you want to move ahead and you want to have success, you want to have a healthy farm system who's prepared, you really have to open your eyes to some of that and start to embrace it if you want to be successful. Yeah. Have you seen a great variety in the degree of adoption across organizations? I know the Tigers, they were known as one of the kind of old school late adopting teams, but they've gotten in on the act as well as everyone has really at this point. But do you still see some differences in just how pervasive that information is across organizations? Yeah, it really does depend team by team. Some teams are

more open with sharing information. Others are a bit, you know, a bit closed off, which I can understand. You want to be protective of the information that you have. But it's been encouraging to see the Tigers' progression in that way, too. I have seen really success with them in trying to embrace more of that and bring more gear into their complexes to sort of track things better and be paying more attention to the analytic side of things. And so they are a team that really has made progress. I think there's still some progress to be made there, but I think it's a move in the right direction. And I would agree with you that I think most teams, from what I can tell, have jumped on

board with it. I haven't seen in my travels, I really haven't seen a team push back against it fully to my knowledge. So I think most teams are going, you know, either get on board or you're going to be left behind and they're not really going to have a choice. Yeah. The other thing is that the minor league level teams can pretty much make players do whatever they want when it comes to gathering information, whether it's wearable sensors or even biofeedback data that you get when players are off the field, whereas at the major league level, a lot of that is regulated by the CBA and it's entirely optional or prohibited. So do you find that many minor leaguers have concerns about that or do they think this is going to help me in the long run? So sure, I'll try it. Yeah, I think the feedback that I've heard has been more positive than not.

I know with the Tiger system specifically, they've partnered with the University of Michigan scientific program. And that's kind of given them a way to not only track the progress of their players, but it's also giving the university an ability to sort of build their program on the sports science side of things. And so the players who I've spoken to, they're like, hey, gadgets, I'm on a computer, this is pretty sweet. So they're pretty in support of it from what I've heard. I haven't really heard too much concern from that end. And the other thing I wanted to ask you about is people ask, how can I get into this industry or what would be helpful? What skills should I study? And everyone says, learn

Spanish because then you'll be able to talk to more of the players. And we don't always do what we say. Sometimes we tell people they should learn Spanish and then don't do it ourselves. I know you have made at least some efforts in that area. Has that helped your coverage? Because I don't know, at the major league level, of course, you do have translators in every clubhouse. I don't know whether that's the case in the minors. I know you usually have Spanish-speaking coaches at the very least, but that must be difficult because obviously there are a lot of non-English-speaking or non-native English-speaking players in clubhouses that you're covering. And probably a lot of the time, those players have some of the most interesting stories to tell.

Absolutely. And the nice thing about social media is that even though I can't say that I'm fluent, I do know some Spanish, not really as fluent as I would like to be. But the nice thing about social media is there's different translation tools available to where you can at least have a pretty surface conversation and sort of, you know, get some information back and forth in that regard. And I totally agree with you. The stories of the Latin players who I've spoken with are fascinating. Just hearing kind of how they grew up. Some of them come from money, some of them come from nothing. And so to know that they made that transition here to a new country and getting to know a new culture and then also trying to succeed at the same time in this sport that they've been playing, I personally can't imagine it.

I mean, just picturing some of these guys who are 16 or 17 years old coming over to the States, that's just so foreign to me when I think back to when I was that age. And so what I've been able to do just with the teams that I have traveled to, they've all been very, very good with having somebody available. Specifically, I know with the Blue Jays and the understandable media exposure of Vladimir Guerrero Jr., they have one just to travel around with him. So he's almost got his own personal translator to have on hand because he's now doing so many media appearances and interviews. And with other guys, I know Luis Patino, who's a prospect in the Padre system. He told me he studied English for seven years before he came to the States.

So that was something where he really made that a focus and said, I want to be able to communicate on my own. I don't want to have to depend on other people to, you know, sort of carry that for me. So I think it just really depends on the background of the players. But the teams have done very good with either having a coach available to translate or an assigned translator for those types of interviews. Well, the Blue Jays would not need to figure out a translator if they would just promote Carrera to the majors and then there would be one there. Is that an issue that many minor leaguers care about or are upset about? Because obviously there are very few Guerreros and Chris Bryants and guys who get their service time manipulated in that very high profile way, but maybe there's some solidarity there for others? I think it's sort of just a thing that's understood. The players who I've spoken to, they'll just tell you, hey, it's the business. It's how the

business works. And I think that they're all aware of that. Would they like to see him get a chance? Yes, they all would. I know he's an extremely respected hitter in the Blue Jays system and across the league. So a lot of people are excited to see him get that chance, but I don't think there's too much of an uproar from the players just because they are aware of that business side of things. Yeah. And lastly, are there any players you've covered who you do want to kind of plug and tip people off to, whether it's a top prospect or maybe someone who's kind of under the radar

with the Tigers or not with the Tigers, even if it's just someone you really like covering because it's a fun person to talk to, regardless of whether he's a future superstar. Yeah, I would say, obviously, with my Tigers coverage, fans are going to get to see Casey Mize. He'll be able to play a full season this year after getting drafted last year. Very excited about him. All of the feeds that I've gotten from his spring so far have been velocity is great. Pitches are all solid. He's come as advertised. And so that's really a good sign for the Tigers farm system. And I've been able to do a lot with the Padres too.

A couple of guys, as I mentioned before, Luis Patino, who really sort of came into his own last year, he won't turn 20 until this fall. So you've got a 19-year-old who's hitting triple digits with his fastball. And this is somebody that the Padres discovered randomly in Colombia at a showcase that they weren't even supposed to see him. And he was an undersized, you know, 86 mile an hour fastball pitcher. And now he's put on about 60 pounds. He is throwing triple digits and the Padres are going, oh, okay, we'll take it. So he's another one. And then within the Padre system, again, more of the fascinating

international scouting aspects that I really appreciate is the Padres presence in Mexico, aspects that I really appreciate is the Padres' presence in Mexico, specifically with a kid that they picked up, Tirso Ornelas, who is still 18, I believe, and looks like Zeus, more or less. He's one of those, I think he's, gosh, how tall is he? I think he's about 6'4", and just ripped. He's just this solid, solid athletic kid, and he's still a baby in the grand scheme of things. And so the Padres are really starting to see some fruits of the work of Chris Kemp, who's their international scouting director, and really seeing that those gambles are paying off where they're kind of testing some of the lesser scouted regions around the world and really pulling off some interesting talent. So those are a few guys that are going to be really fun to watch this year.

Yeah. Have you covered anyone who's from just a very remote region baseball-wise, who's just kind of an outlier in that respect? Not off the top of my head. I know most of the Venezuelans tend to come from the same city or maybe like a city or two surrounding certain areas. Caracas is a big area where a lot of players have come from. A lot of the Dominican players come from the capital city or some of those outlying areas. And I think part of it is they're going to move towards where the showcases are held. So a lot of those international showcases, I think, draw a lot of those players who move a bit closer to be in that region.

And so none that I can think of really from odd places. I think the Mexican contingent has been really fascinating because I don't know the percentages off the top of my head, but I know that it's not as well represented as Venezuela or the Dominican or Puerto Rico or, you know, some of those other areas. So I think that side of it's been really intriguing. And the Padres have done a very good job, you know, figuring out what's available in that area. Yeah, it's always interesting to watch baseball expand to new markets, whether it's in Europe or Brazil or Taiwan. There are all sorts of places where baseball is gaining a foothold if it's not already a going concern.

So it's always interesting to see players come from those places and you wonder about the culture shock that they have to deal with as they deal with all the regular challenges of coming up through the system. So we are going to take a quick break and we will be right back with Jeremy Wolf and Simon Losen from Marsden to talk about more than baseball. A cruel matter of change When nothing's happened It's still the same We're not space age We won't be safe

We're just holding on again Waiting for the end Always hoping and praying All right, so we are back and we are joined now by Jeremy Wolfe and Simon Rosenblum-Larsen. Jeremy is the executive director of More Than Baseball and is a former Mets minor leaguer. Hey, Jeremy.

Hey, how you doing? Doing well. And Simon is a current Rays minor leaguer, and he's coming to us from spring training. Hey, Simon. Hey, how's it going? Going well. So, Jeremy, give us the origin story for More Than Baseball, and then, Simon, I will ask you about how you got involved.

It just started when I got drafted as a 31st rounder. And it was a dream come true. And I start all these conversations with it's absolutely a dream come true for all of these ballplayers to play professional baseball, to be a member of the Mets, a member of the Rays. That being said, there are some problems with the structure of it. There are some problems with what these players are receiving. There are some problems, obviously, with the salaries and the things that we've discussed over and over again, over years and years, comically in Bull Durham and other movies. But the whole thing started was when I got to my first, just basically my first week there, and I asked, you know, if I could have some bats and they're like, no, you get those yourself. And I, you know,

I was asking for cleats and nope, we get those ourselves. And so after games, there wasn't enough food for everybody. There were times where together we would, as teammates, we would try to help each other as best as we could. But I knew that there was something more that needed to happen to ensure that everybody had what they needed. So, you know, the whole idea of More Than Baseball really came from that need to create an outlet for guys to go and receive the equipment that they need, go and receive, you know, discounts on food. We'll try to help them with housing.

You know, minor leaguers in full season ball have to pay for their own housing for the most part. And, you know, I think that given how much they're making per game, let's let them focus on playing and not having to focus on the other part of it, the financial part of it. Let's try to ease the stress. So that's where the idea really came from. So, Simon, you're the director of player personnel for More Than Baseball, and it's fairly rare for minor leaguers to be publicly outspoken about these issues because, of course, they have a lot at stake in their own careers and they don't want to rub anyone in their own organizations the wrong way.

There's some risks there. And you just were drafted in the 19th round last year, and that was your first professional season. So what inspired you to get involved in such an active way? Yeah, I mean, I do want to say this organization is not, doesn't feel like a risk at all because, you know, I mean, these issues are out there, but as an organization, we are looking to partner with Major League Baseball. We're looking to partner with teams. We're looking to be an ally to teams and grow the game of baseball through fan engagement

and channeling some of that fan engagement to help minor leaguers out. So to me, it's, it's not, I'm not taking any stance that's against teams. I think, you know, the Rays honestly treat me incredibly well as a ball player, but I, you know, I'm aware of organizations that don't do that. And so for me, it's, it's not a risk at all. And I don't think, I think part of the reason more than baseball has a chance to really succeed is that we're, you know, there should be no risk involved with a player joining up with us. We want to grow the game of baseball as much as every major league organization and minor league organization wants to as well. So part of our goal is to just make the road a little smoother for minor leaguers, help utilize kind of the resources that we can channel to make the road just a little bit easier,

help guys develop to the best of their abilities and get the best chance to make the big leagues. And so for me, it was, you know, when I heard about the organization, I heard about what Jeremy's doing, and especially I heard about the approach that they're taking because, you know, there's people talk about unionization and things like that, and it just doesn't make any sense to me. It's something that players should feel like they can be totally open about being involved in an organization like this. And the route that we're taking should allow players to be totally comfortable saying, yeah, I'm part of the More Than Baseball family. Simon, I wanted to know, obviously you coming from the college environment,

how much of an understanding did you have of the minor league lifestyle before you signed up? And what was really the, oh my gosh, wake wake up call this is really how things are going to be while i'm a minor league player for me i you know you don't really know that much until you really do it obviously there's social media accounts like our friend eric sim he's done a lot of tweeting about it and minor league grinders and things like that and you see that stuff but you know it really the lifestyle is completely different than anything I've ever experienced. There's overnight bus rides and for, at least in the Rays organization, the food is never an issue, but it's, you know, sleeping on the floor of a bus on your way to Mahoning Valley, Ohio or something like that, that really, you know, that, that hits you. And it's kind of this

feeling of, you know, it's a romantic thing getting to play baseball every day, but it's also definitely a grind and definitely something that it pushes you to really make sure you love the game as much as you think you do. But, you know, again, like Jeremy said, I wouldn't, I wouldn't trade it for the world. I love the job I have. I love getting to wake up and do this every day. I just, you know, I think there's ways that we can leverage some fan support to make it a little easier on guys. So there wasn't really one specific moment, but I think just, you know, waking up every day, being at the ballpark, you know, eight, 10 hours a day and doing it for, I mean, I only did it for half a season. I did it from June until mid September. And I'm telling you like doing that every single day is,

it's a grind. It's really a grind. Well, Jeremy, I wanted to ask because there's no conflict between what you're doing and what teams are doing necessarily, as Simon was saying. But on the other hand, you were inspired to start this organization in part because of things like the Safe America's Pastime Act, which is Major League Baseball lobbying Congress successfully not to have to pay minor league players, essentially. So it's not necessarily individual teams that are making that decision, but it's the league acting on behalf of the teams. It's clearly with the team's or at least ownership's consent. that you see the sport trying to tamp down salaries and hold conditions at the point where you need to intervene to try to help improve the situation yourself?

Yeah, I thought it was interesting last year when that came out. And that was really the catalyst for us to keep pushing and keep trying to find a way, maybe a conduit to the change that can happen. I mean, when you're a player, you're not necessarily looking at the big picture of what a league or what a team or what a city or what. None of these players really care what the state of Arizona is doing and trying to exempt minor leaguers from eventually getting minimum wage laws in that state. There are things that you now see on the outside looking in and you say, well, for Major League Baseball to not pay minor leaguers, it is a business decision. They are federally exempt from doing so, and they're cutting costs and saving money because they don't have to. So when you look at it that way, we're not arguing for any sort of

wage improvement in our organization. Our job is more than baseball is to be able to provide the kids with what they're not being given to allow them to succeed in their job. And so we want, you know, when I was playing, I wish that I had the access to discounts on equipment and food and the housing. But, you know, I wish I was more prepared for when I was done playing. I wish I had a job lined up. I was 24, luckily, when I got injured and got released. If you're 27, 28, you're having nothing on your resume over the last three, four, five years. Minor league baseball is not going to give you that experience you need to succeed in business. And so when you look at all of those

aspects of playing and after careers, we're just trying to prepare this generation of minor leaguers to be successful for when they don't make it. It's a very slim chance that they make it to the major leagues. And we're trying to prepare them for when that happens. And we're trying to protect them while they're playing. And we want to be able to allow them to focus on playing. And then Jeremy, what in the conversations that have come up, especially over social media, there's been a lot of kickback from the fans towards the Players Association in regards to the minor league player situation. What is your hope that some of that could move in a positive direction once the new CBA is under discussion? Yeah, that's an interesting part of it because, you know, my argument on social media for the people who say, you know, shut up and

dribble, shut up and swing, your job is to play baseball. We get that. I don't want my buddies. I don't want my friends. I don't want other minor leaguers to have to sleep eight to an apartment on air mattresses anymore. And I know that some major leaguers might see that as a rite of passage and, and that's okay. Right. We've had to deal with people who have said that for years now about minor league baseball, you don't like it, play better. You know, all we're doing is is trying to mitigate the stresses that come with playing. And because it is so tough, because it's so demanding, because it's 142 games and 150 days, some of these players are playing extended spring training and not getting paid for that time. You know, when we tell those stories, people can you can't change a convinced mind, but people are going to start to understand that there is something that they can do individually. A fan can donate 10 bucks and that can feed a kid after a game before a game.

You know, a fan can give 50 bucks. A former player can donate to the to more than baseball and be able to pay our clubhouse dues. So there are so many opportunities that, you know, if the league doesn't want to work with us, that's OK. We can work with individual communities. We can work with former and current players. We can work with companies and fans to help build the game of baseball into a community that we know it can be. And we're just tired of seeing the rift between players and fans. And we just want to protect this next generation of minor leaders. And Simon, something that I hear people say sometimes when someone will cite a low salary, they'll say, sure, but they only do that half the year so they can go make money the other half of the year. Now, I don't know what you did this past offseason, but can you talk a little bit about the difficulty of doing that,

of finding seasonal work, and also just the demands that most fans don't know about, kind of the hours that go into being a minor league player, whether it's spring training, whether it's travel, whether it's training outside of games and away from the field that people don't really factor in necessarily when they're just thinking it's three hours a day. That's when you're at the ballpark. Yeah. So, I mean, the kind of modern take on baseball is there is no off season. I mean, there is no time where you're not doing anything to make

yourself a better player because if you take three months off, guys are going to pass you. I mean, it's a competitive game. And so personally, I mean, in my off season, I got, I got lucky. I found a job with a family friend, but you know, I was paying for my own apartment. I was paying for my own food. A lot of guys, I mean, most guys live at home. I wasn't in a situation where living at home was a possibility. And so for me, it was, you know, I found my own apartment. I got a job, I worked, and I trained for four hours a day, every day for the entire off season, basically. And so I don't know, I mean, I don't know what the kind of argument is, but I will say there is no off season. And on a day to day basis, you're at the ballpark for a lot more than three hours. So it is a full time job. I think over the

course of the year, if you count in training hours and things like that, we put in as many hours as any red-blooded American would put in a 40-hour-a-week job. We play seven days a week in spring training. We play seven days a week in the off-season we're training, seven days a week. So I think for the most part, it doesn't stop. Finding off offices and work is something that we're really trying to do with more than baseball or companies that we've partnered with. We've asked them to provide, you know, spots for players to come work or get some experience

at a company in the off season. I think that's really important. It's getting players a chance to earn money and get some skills that can be marketable once they, you know, if they're done playing sooner or later, whatever, those skills will come in handy at some point down the road. So our hope is that, you know, again, we can use our resources to give players a chance to make the offseason a little bit easier because it's hard for a lot of guys. Some guys will live at home. Some guys will work at a gas station. Some guys will move boxes. Some guys will do, you know, construction work. Almost everybody I talked to in spring training worked to some

degree in the off season, but usually they're temporary jobs. They might be jobs that are just for the holiday season in retail, something like that. So, you know, it is really hard to kind of figure out your off season, especially because they're off season camps. Organizations will have you down at points throughout the winter, and that might not work with your work schedule and you have to be there. And so I will say, you know, the offseason is something that we're focusing a lot on with More Than Baseball. We think we can be a kind of a conduit for players to just not have to worry about it. I think, you know, being able to have a consistent place to train, a consistent place to work, and a day-to-day routine that you can follow is really important

for getting better in the offseason, because if you don't get better, you're going to get passed. It's that kind of competitive business and we understand that and we just want to make it a little easier for ballplayers. And Simon, being one of the younger voices in the game right now, if you had an opportunity to sit down with a group of the major league owners and present your side of the experience, how would you present the benefits of what some of these positive changes could do for their organizations? And why would you kind of want to sell them to get on board as far as looking at the big picture for what they want to accomplish with their teams?

Yeah. I mean, I think one of the things that Morgan baseball has set out to accomplish is actually we can make, I think we can make player development better. I think particularly in regards to the offseason, but also during the season, if guys aren't well rested, if guys aren't well fed, if they're not eating nutritious food when they're not at the up in a front office, it would be basically, look, we can make your players better. We know that, I mean, everything matters. healthy food, by providing a good place to sleep, by allowing guys to kind of get into a routine and really train hard. I think that's the easiest selling point. We can do that. Organizations themselves can do that. So kind of either way works really well.

But we think we can, you know, at least step into the industry and be a positive force for player development. Yeah. And it seems like that should be an effective pitch for someone. I mean, put aside any ethical concerns and treating your players humanely, just look at it purely as a competitive advantage. It just seems silly not to make sure that your minor leaguers are well fed and well paid and can get the most out of their abilities. I will say that a lot of organizations are doing that. So I'm in the RAID system now and they do a very good job with, we are fed really well at the ballpark.

We have the resources to have high quality meals, the two meals a day they provide us. So there are organizations that are moving in that direction. And I will say, you know, huge credit to those organizations that are kind of taking the ball and running with it in that player development aspect of things. Yeah, there's definitely been progress. And it's a good thing that the, you know, peanut butter and jelly spread before and after the game is becoming a thing of the past, at least. But even, you know, given the amounts of money that we're talking about at the major league level, and given the potential savings because of how the CBA is currently structured and how much surplus value there is in a productive young player in his pre-arbitration years, I mean, you could pay your minor leaguers enough to ensure that they don't have to get that off-season job, that they can just train and, you know, focus on their fitness.

And you could do that and it might certainly wouldn't bankrupt any baseball team, but it might actually benefit you in the long run. And I wonder whether there will be some owner or ownership group that just says, yeah, you know what? We're going to be the first movers here. We're going to make this investment. And you figure there's probably some peer pressure against that because once someone does it, then everyone will have to do it just to keep up. And of course, most owners are probably happy with the situation as it currently stands. But Jeremy, do you think there will be someone who comes along and just says, I'm going to splurge here and I'm going to break

precedent? Yeah, I would hope so. I would hope that a group of major leaguers who are at that level can just get behind helping minor leaguers, helping minor leaguers' lives be better. If the minor leaguer is happy, if the minor leaguer is fed, if he's treated like a ballplayer should be, he's going to perform better. If he performs better, you're going to have a better product on the field. If you have a better product on the field, you're going to win more. And if you win more in the minor leagues, those teams are going to make more money because more fans are going to get to the ballpark. If that player understands how to win, if that ball player knows his potential and what it can be, then when he gets to the major leagues, he's going to be that much better. So I would say the hindrance comes from,

you know, their willingness to pull the trigger and pay them that certain amount of money, right? pull the trigger and pay them that certain amount of money, right? Or, you know, but we're not waiting for that to change. Our argument isn't pay them more. Argument is, you know, what can we do to help them today? And that's why, like Simon had mentioned about building a union. Well, okay, great. But that's going to take years. And given the influx of players every year because of the draft, the kids who are going to get released, we don't have time for that. Can I help Jimmy Lipper from Chattanooga get a case of bats today? Yes, I can. Can I help feed him?

Can I help get him a mattress? Can I help him in the offseason? Yes. And because of that, can we help him perform better and find out how good he actually can be and not have it be determined by his where he was drafted what his signing bonus was if he has an agent or not you know we want every ball player to have the ability to go out on the field and and perform and not have to worry about where his next meal is going

to come from or you know i don't want to get the inside pitch today because i got two bats left or don't slide because i'm going to rip my cleats and i don't have money to get another one you know what i mean so that's where we want see. We want to see major leaguers getting involved with something like this. We want to see the union. We built it so that the MLBPA can get behind it and that the MLB wants to get behind it. And then Jeremy, I'm curious to know your thoughts about obviously following up on Save America's Pastime Act last year, it was reported that there was the House bill being presented to fight against the minimum wage law in place in Arizona for spring training. What were your thoughts when you first caught wind of that? And what kind of a message do you think the owners are trying to send by fighting against that minimum wage law in Arizona?

I don't know. by fighting against that minimum wage law in Arizona? I don't know. Maybe part of it is they know that the tide is going to change soon, and they're trying to get ahead of what can happen to save the league money. You know, we haven't heard anything from the league, anything from anybody within the system that said that things are going to change for minor leaguers. You know, I will say when that stuff happens, because major league owners want to suppress the wages of the minor leaguers, it's just another thing we have to

get around. It's just another barrier that's set for minor leaguers. And it's another thing we have to work through as a community. And so if we can educate the baseball community as a whole and build the community around the stories that we find with minor leaguers, the value that they can bring to a town like Midland or even a big league town, in a way, I guess they have the Grizzlies, but a town like Memphis. Or I played in Kingsport, Tennessee, and there are small towns who live and die by the minor league team. And if we can bring the personality out of those teams, we're going to build a better community around the players. And so if major league baseball wants to, you know, go in and work legally to, to fight against minor leaguers, that's just another

thing that we have to work with. It's another thing that we can say, look what major league baseball is, is doing to mitigate the progress of minor leaguers. And so we want to be, we want to be a conduit to that change. And we want to change the narrative around that notion. And Simon, we've recently seen a lot of major league players become more outspoken about baseball's economic system and the CBA and free agency. Do you wish that there were more major leaguers being outspoken about this issue, about minor leaguers, even though minor leaguers are not in the union, it might still be helpful for more major leaguers to speak up. And as Jeremy was saying, it seems like a lot of them look at this as a rite of passage,

like, hey, I suffered through this, so they should have to too. Yeah, I mean, it would be great to have more big leaguers on board, obviously, that would never hurt anything. You know, I I think privately a lot of them probably think it a lot of them you know they went through it they were lucky enough to make it out and and kind of achieve everything that every minor leaguer is trying to achieve and so you know there's been certain players that have said stuff Adam Wainwright said something on Twitter a few weeks ago Sean Doolittle I think has been pretty outspoken about it so there are guys talking about it as an issue. I think, you know, nobody really wants to go against the PA

and things like that. And so there's lots of things holding players back from speaking out. But obviously, you know, from our end, I think we know, they know what goes on at the minor league levels. And so, yeah, if any of them, they can donate, they can speak out. There's a lot of ways in which they can kind of help change it. And then I wanted to ask you too, real quick, Simon, you've mentioned several times that the Rays have done a really, really good job with taking care of the organization,

looking out for you guys as players. What are some of maybe the creative ways that they have tried to make up for that lack of pay or, you know, the lack of maybe some other things? How are they being creative and sort of trying to balance that out for you guys to show that, you know, hey, maybe we're not doing this, but we do care about you. So this is another way that we're going to show that to you. The ways they're providing, they provide really high quality food. So on a daily basis, we get, you know, healthy grains. So we're

getting brown rice, we're getting healthy proteins, chicken, lean meat, things like that. They have tons of snacks available to us that we can take home with us. I mean, they really, they seem to know that nutrition is a huge deal. So we have two full-time nutritionists that are in the clubhouse every day talking to us, giving us advice. You know, I think they pull out all the stops in terms of food. I guess as an organization, I think the more food is a really, I mean, it's a really funny thing to think it's not, it doesn't seem like a huge deal, but really every little thing helps. And so the snacks that they provide, the extra, you know,

you can take a little bit of a meal home for your dinner or something like that. I think that's really, really important for helping ballplayers just build a healthy body and build something that can last a full season. Yeah. And Jeremy, you know, it seems like your organization is kind of making the best of a bad or suboptimal system here, because, I mean, in the abstract, it seems sort of backwards that you would have, say, fans kind of crowdfunding minor league pay and improving minor leaguers' conditions when you have these billion-dollar teams who are employing the minor leaguers. And in theory, they could just do that themselves. And so I worry, I guess, that maybe if you're successful, then it almost takes some pressure off of those teams to step up and take care of that themselves. But maybe the benefits outweigh any possible disadvantage there because you are actually helping people who need the help now.

Yeah, absolutely. If we're successful enough to provide every minor leaguer what they need to survive being a minor leaguer, we've done our job. And so if we can even mitigate the stress from the teams and not have them to pay it, well, if the minor league player is protected and if he has what he needs, then we've done our job. And right now they don't.

And we know that what we're doing can make a difference and it will make a difference. And to bring fans on board, all they want is access. I mean, all they want is to speak to the player. That player is in their community and we're superheroes to all of those kids. And if those kids in that family can help support a minor leaguer, help make his life better, that's going to build baseball in such a way that it isn't happening right now. And so,

you know, when I was playing in Kingsport, when I was even playing in Brooklyn, I was able to speak with kids who wore my number in school or when I was in Brooklyn were Jewish like me. And so that ability to connect with players is a really incredible experience for the players. And now it can be that sort of experience then, again, for the fans, because the fans can now directly influence the future of this player and help them or help this community or help this group of players or this team and allow them to perform at their best. So we want to bring everybody together, the teams, the organizations, the union, the fans, and these minor leaguers. And we know that if what we do can be successful, then we know that this formula can work. that we are trying to provide, we are more than happy to be totally out of business. I think, you know, if they, if they do the things, you know, if they do things the right way, if they, you know, provide the services that we're trying to provide, and then they provide that support system, we are, you know, we're incredibly, we'd be incredibly happy. So I think our goal in the

end is really just serve minor league players. I'm sure that they have an ally, they have something they can turn to if things get rough, if they need legal advice or financial advising or things like that. We want to be there for them in any respect we can be. And if they don't need us, then our job is done. Yeah. I was released about a month after I had back surgery. I got hurt on the field and I was released. I didn't have an agent and I could barely walk, I got hurt on the field and, and I was released. I didn't have an agent and I could barely walk when I got up to get the phone. And I had nobody to call when I even got injured. There was nobody to call. There was nobody to go to and make sure that I had what I needed. I, that I could take the next steps into whatever career I wanted to do.

And I'm lucky. I'm a, I'm a college graduate, but not a lot of minor leaguers are. They're either college juniors or high schoolers. And so I want the next steps to be provided for these players. I want them to know that they're not alone when their career is over. I had a buddy who just stopped playing because he got a really good job offer from Wells Fargo. And he goes, I can't pass it up. He goes,

I can't pass it up. I know I'm going to be in AAA next year. I've been hurt a few times, but I have to provide for my family. I have to go play well, you know, go work. And so this kid shows working over pursuing, you know,

his career even further. And, and for me, that's, that's our motivation to say, well, let's protect another player. Let's help another player so he doesn't have to make that choice. So he can still continue to play

baseball because he is good enough and he's gifted enough and he has the skills to do that and do it at that high of a level. He should be provided those opportunities to fulfill it and not have to be worried about, you know, what if I get a job offer and what if I have a better opportunity? Like baseball is the best opportunity possible. We want these kids to have what they need to get to that point and succeed at that point. And Jeremy, I'm curious too, I was looking over the team that you guys have put together for this organization. What was that process like going through and sort of, was it like a handpicking of people out of certain parts of businesses or how was that whole process of getting this team put together to get this

organization off the ground? Yeah, when we started this, I called one of my friends from high school. His dad was an agent in the NBA and he was an NBA executive and we got them on board. And then we got connected to Simon and Simon loved the idea. We got connected to board. And then we got connected to Simon. And Simon loved the idea. We got connected to Slade Heathcott, a former major leaguer who's helped us a lot. He's our director of business development. He's gotten us a majority of these companies to get on board. We've gotten Sharon Block, who's a professor at Harvard. She runs the labor and work life program there.

We got Mary Ullman Jaffet, who is an alumni of my college and runs San Antonio sports and does a really phenomenal job with the sports community in our city. And then you look at all of the rest of our advisors and our board is just people who love baseball and are doing what they can to help protect baseball from these issues. And so that's been the most fun for me is to get people from different walks of life on board, either sport management or sociology or anthropology or economics, and just talk to them

because everyone's background is different. We can get so much feedback, but they all come back to loving baseball. And that's what it comes down to. Can we protect this group of baseball players and protect the future of baseball and build it up in a local community or build it up nationally? And these people have helped us get to this point. And I couldn't thank them enough for that. Can you tell us how this actually works on a mechanical level when you say that you can donate and pay a minor leaguer tonight or something,

how do you decide how to distribute those funds or whatever resources you have? Do you try to prioritize certain players or teams? It seems like it would be complicated to decide how to direct those funds. Yeah. So for the most part, a fan can come to the website, morethanbaseball.org, and they can click on the give button and they can give in any increment that they want you know 15 25 100 even a thousand they can give monthly and and in our notes they can suggest where they would like it to go whether it's this will be for bats

and this will be for housing and this will be for food they can even sponsor a player and it can go directly to a player they can sponsor a clubhouse and help pay clubhouse dues. You know, the way we're going to split it up is just, we're going to find, you know, guys who need it, guys who need it first. And we're not going to give them straight money. That won't be our job. We want to give them, you know, that food. We want to be able to purchase them the food that they'll need. We want to be able to purchase them the mattresses. We want to be able to, you know,es. We want to be able to help offset costs. If they want to in the off season, they can come work a clinic and then we'll be able to pay them for their work. If we get 200 fans at a clinic in Dallas, we can then give them an hourly wage for the amount of donations we can get in, the amount that we

made and we can pay that player for that work upwards of $500, $600, which can be a really significant amount of money if you made $3,000 that season or $7,500 that season or $10,000 that season. So the money and everything we're going to do is transparent, fully transparent to the fans, and they're going to know exactly where every dollar goes. They can even sponsor a community, and if they want some of their money to go to building or renovating a field in Odessa, Texas, then that's something that we can do for them. Simon, what's the response from the player side about what they know about the organization? Have you had a chance to sort of go into detail with anyone either on your team or maybe players that you faced to sort of sell that vision to them as well? that you faced to sort of sell that vision to them as well? Yeah, I mean, I'm getting really,

every day I kind of, conversations come up. These are things that get talked about in the clubhouse. And I think, you know, the response for players has been really positive. They're excited that, you know, there's a group of people that are excited to help them. And so we've put together a sort of players committee. We have guys in a few different organizations that are going to be a part of the More Than Baseball team.

They're going to help direct outreach efforts. And every conversation that I've had with guys has been positive. Everybody's excited. Everybody feels like it's something that, you know, can help a lot of people out. I think guys have different views, especially, you know, if they were drafted pretty high and have a pretty good financial backing, or they have an agent that provides a lot of things for them. But I think most guys feel like, you know, it's really good to have folks kind of supporting players and excited to support players. That's the other thing. So it's been really, it's been a really easy sell

in the clubhouse to guys, especially, you know, obviously I've only been here for about a week because my league from training pitchers reported, we reported on the 26th, but every conversation I've had has been positive. And I'm excited to see, you know, if we can expand into clubhouses throughout minor league baseball. If I and I'm excited to see you know if we can expand into clubhouses throughout minor league baseball if I can add that briefly you know everyone's

going to stay anonymous and so that'll protect the player even if he's worried about retribution from the team for even getting becoming part of this you know though none of our media none of anything we say is ever going to be against you know we're non-combative we're non-adversarial and we want you know all 6,000 7,000 minor leaguers to join our side, but we want to make sure that the player knows that he will be protected and he will remain anonymous unless we can use him in a conversation like this. And I guess this could be for either of you guys, but, you know, neither of you was someone who got a gigantic bonus or was a very early round pick, who got a gigantic bonus or was a very early round pick, but you do have some of those guys in the minor leagues. Now, some people overvalue that and think that everyone got a big bonus when

really that's just a small minority of players who are getting any kind of bonus that's going to last them for years. But within minor league clubhouses, you do have the late round picks and the top picks and they're occupying the same space. And that must be sort of strange because you have guys with the fancy sports car in the parking lot and guys who were carpooling or biking to the park or something. Is that a weird sort of social dynamic? Yeah, I don't, it hasn't been weird for me personally. I guess we have different answers, but the dynamic is definitely there. I think it's something that you notice. Obviously, you walk into a parking lot at spring training and the range of cars is pretty incredible. or $1,200. I think we're all going through the same thing. You're playing the same amount of games. Your day-to-day schedule is pretty much the same, but one of you has basically an insurance

policy. The other one is kind of giving it everything that they have. And so I think it's a really interesting dynamic, at least in those club parties. Yeah, it was interesting. One of my roommates was a fifth or sixth rounder and got a large signing bonus, but he treated everybody with respect. I don't think I saw anybody treat anybody poorly because one was a first rounder or one was a 31st rounder. I think that respect is there. I think even culturally too, and we haven't really touched on the Dominicans or Venezuelans or even Puerto Ricans. But from what I saw when I was playing, that respect was there to a certain extent. We couldn't go ask our first round friend to help buy us equipment. And so I got to a point where I had to buy a worse quality than my teammate. And I had to

buy cheaper equipment than my teammate just because I couldn't afford it. And so I think that's the dichotomy between the high round and the low round. And I was a 31st rounder. I didn't have the luxury of that insurance policy. And so I had to trade with teammates. I had to trade batting gloves and things I could get for a bat, right? Or I had to do a favor or pay dinner just so I could get an extra piece of equipment? Or I had to do a favor or pay dinner just so I could get an extra piece of equipment. And I know guys can relate to that. Jeremy, what has the response been from agents in regards to the organization? Have you had much of a chance to speak with them? What's the reaction been to the vision that you guys have? So we've talked to two agents, two independent agents. They work,

you know, they're solo, they work on their own. One agent has about 20 guys, about three major leaguers. So they are getting paid. And we have one guy who's strictly minor league and he's on board because he wants access to more guys and that's more potential to get to the big leagues. What we're trying to do is obviously get discounts on equipment, offset costs, and that's going to help the agent because a lot of those things come out of the agent's pocket. And so if that agent can hop on board, start representing players, then we know that if a player is good enough and happens to get released because he's in the wrong situation, we know he's going to find another opportunity or an opportunity to make money in the offseason and play in Mexico or the Dominican summer leagues,

or I don't know if the Venezuelan summer league is still going, but that they're allowed to make money in the offseason. I think more players represented is a good thing. So agents have been incredibly supportive because this will offset costs for them and allow them to focus more on the player. I've had conversations with agents too in my world and they've all been really positive, even at bigger agencies. Obviously, if you're with a bigger agency, you don't need these services as much because we're actually providing similar services to some of these full service agencies, like off-season stuff and just kind of gear and things like that. But they've all been on board. I mean, they've been excited that there's energy

behind protecting minor leaguers. And I think agencies in general, you know, they pretty much share the same message. They they want what's best for their players as well. And so, you know, we're it's all about players and agencies. Agents are usually very pro player. Obviously, I think, you know, players are going to be very pro player and we hope we can be kind of a support system to bring those two groups together and just kind of bring people around, rally people around players throughout baseball. Let's jump five years into the future. What do you guys hope to see the organization doing in regards to, you know, housing arrangements or, you know, the equipment stuff we talked about? What's the long term goal that you guys are going to be able to step back and say, we did it, this is awesome, this is what we were shooting for? If wages are increased federally or if the teams decide to pay them

a livable wage for the amount that they're working, you know, 60, 70 hours a week, I would hope that some of this is pressure to do the right thing. I know in business, you don't necessarily want to focus on doing the right thing. I know in business, you don't necessarily want to focus on doing the right thing. You want to focus on cutting costs. In the short term, we obviously want to be able to provide this on a grander scale and not have to pick between one or two teams. We would hope that the MLBPA or even MLB or a group of major leaguers allows us to do this work and allows us financially to operate full time on this work. I would hope that in the next CBA, we could be absorbed by one of the organizations that will

allow us to do this work and allow us to focus solely on the daily grind and the daily struggle of being a minor league player. I would hope that we're showing that we can do good. We can do good speaking good. We're not going to scream from the rooftops in any sort of way. I don't think that our messaging is made for that. I think if we can show the value that this can bring, we can begin to help players in such an important way that it can be better in five years. And I would hope that in five years, it is better. And Simon, I'm sure that in five years, you'd like to be a big leaguer and be making plenty of money in addition to having minor leaguers make money. And I wanted to close just by asking you, you struck out 62 guys in 38 and two thirds innings last year in your rookie season. That's

pretty good. And you only walked nine, and one of those was intentional. Granted, I guess you're a college guy playing in short season ball, at least at the beginning there, and then you moved up to A ball. But what is your game? Give us your scouting report on yourself. I mean, my scouting report on myself is that I go out there, my goal is basically to just go out there and compete every day and push myself to be as good as I can possibly be. I think performance numbers, they come and go. Obviously, it's nice to have a good season. It's nice to walk away being happy about your statistics. But at the end of the day,

I mean, baseball is a game of consistency. And if you can get up every day and put in the same work every day and push yourself to be better every single day, the numbers will come as they come. So for me, it's a lot less about, you know, what kind of numbers can I put up? And it's more about, did I put in every possible thing I could have done to get better today? So I guess if you want a scouting report, I mean, I'm kind of a funky delivery reliever. I can get hitters out a lot of different ways, but I kind of throw from a low slot. And I

think that's been pretty deceptive so far. And, you know, hopefully I can build on that first season and really push myself against really high quality hitters and, you know, hopefully make this season better than the last. Thanks for not asking about my stats and thank you for not asking about my scouting report. I'll swing at every change. Don't worry about it. scouting report. I'll swing at every change. Don't worry about it. All right. Well, Jeremy, remind everyone one more time where they can find out more about More Than Baseball or get involved if they're interested. Yeah, they can go to morethanbaseball.org. They can follow us on Twitter and Instagram, mtb underscore org. All right. And Emily, thank you very much for joining me on this whole episode today. You can find her work at The Athletic and you can find her on Twitter at Emily C. Walton. It's been a pleasure.

Absolutely. Thanks for having me on. Thank you so much for having us. Yeah. Thank you, guys. Thanks to all of you made sure, as tweeted by Andy McCullough. Scott Boris on Philly's owner John Middleton, the maestro wanted to build the championship symphony. I want the harp. The Philly Philharpmonic Symphony was built. Boris also described Reese Hoskins as a great tuba player. I can't decide whether I'm sad that Jeff is no longer here to comment on Boris's comments, or whether it's just probably better for

Jeff's blood pressure not to have these things drawn to his attention and have to talk about them. I know you're all eager to hear who the new co-host is. We are making progress on that. We're getting very close. Sorry to keep you in suspense. There's just some behind-the-scenes stuff that had to be sorted before an announcement could be made. Again, I expect you all to be pleased. More on that soon, And in the meantime, you can support the podcast on Patreon by going to patreon.com slash effectivelywild. The following five listeners

have already pledged their support. WP Mulligan, David Cohen, Corey Serjak, Matt Piscitella, and Josh Aycock. Thanks to all of you. You can also rate and review and subscribe to Effectively Wild on iTunes and other podcast platforms.

Keep your questions and comments coming. We will eventually get to email shows again, so keep sending them to podcast at fangraphs.com or messaging us through Patreon if you're a supporter. Thanks to Dylan Higgins for his editing assistance. Please pre-order my book, The MVP Machine. If you are interested in the minor leagues and in player development, you will learn a lot from that book, as I learned a lot while I was working on it. I hope you have a wonderful rest of your weekend,

and we'll be back with another Team Preview podcast soon. More than that You know there's nothing More than that Tell me one thing More than this There's nothing