Empire: World History - 65. When the Enslaved Took on Napoleon

Episode Date: July 13, 2023

Napoleon is emperor of France. Having consolidated his rule at home, he starts to look abroad and to the re-institution of slavery. His eyes set upon Haiti, where Toussaint L’Ouverture, the Black Spartacus, leads his army of freed slaves. How will this titanic clash play out? This episode is sponsored by BetterHelp. Give online therapy a try at betterhelp.com/empirepod. Twitter: @Empirepoduk Goalhangerpodcasts.com Producer: Callum Hill Exec Producer: Jack Davenport + Neil Fearn Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

If you want access to bonus episodes reading lists for every series of Empire, a chat community. Discounts for all the books mentioned in the week's podcast, add free listening and a weekly newsletter, sign up to Empire Club at www.mpowerpoduk.com. And welcome to Empire. I'm Anita Arnden. And I am William Drupul. Don't say anything. Just get on with it. Yeah, no, I will. I will. You're right, because it just encourages you. I can see you all setting up to say some fancy fancy.

Do you just say you just do you just pull? Anyway, welcome back. Welcome back. Having a presentational breakdown. It's been a long time coming. Tuesday. So we are talking about Toussaint-Levitture and he is the most successful man as far as slave uprisings are concerned. He arises from really inauspicious beginnings, and like so many of the people we cover in this series, they are set parameters by slavery, which they should, by all rights, never be able to break out of, but they do.

So Tucson Overture is a humble, sickly child who is on the island of Sandamank, which is now known as Haiti. and he rises up from being just a shepherd boy to being somebody who comes under the tutelage of we like to think Morgan Freeman, who sees some sort of as a wise old man of the hills, who sees something in him and teaches him his letters. He then becomes embroiled in the first and abortive slave uprising, which is a bloody, awful affair. And then with the second run at this, rises and rises through the ranks, and organizes a slave army, uniting different groups. And we talked about the different groups of their different interests, the mulattoes, the blacks.

And on the other side, you've got the small whites and the big whites is complicated. So if you need a little refresher, go back to that last one. But we left you where he is now General Lovettur. And he has an army at his disposal. But in the background, the politics of France are looming large, not over just Europe, but the whole world. world. Exactly. So while all this is going on in Haiti, massive changes are afoot in Europe. The revolution has happened. The Bastille has fallen. And in 1791, a new constitution is completed. And the monarchy is still in place, although an elected assembly now holds most of the power. And Louis XVIth makes a show

of supporting this constitution, but obviously inwardly is plotting against it and hoping that it's going to fail. And in June 1791, he tries to escape France, but he's caught, brought back. And in the aftermath of that, in November 1792, a secret cupboard is discovered in the Trollery Palace. And Louis' secret counter-revolutionary beliefs, all his correspondence, with other powers hoping to get rid of the revolution is revealed. And he is brought to trial for treason and executed in the guillotine on the 21st of January, 1793. Mary Antoinette follows him nine months later to the scaffold. So this changes everything. Immediately, Spain and Britain take the opportunity to declare war on revolutionary France. Now, in the island of Haiti,

this means that Louvator, who's slightly on the back foot against the French forces, has an ally in the Spanish. And very pragmatically, as is his way throughout his life, he allies briefly with the Spanish for one year. He joins the Spanish forces and gets their military help against the French. My enemy's enemy is my friend. But with this particular enemy, the Spaniards have a history of slavery too. So, I mean, how does he put aside those fears? So throughout his life, he's very pragmatic. sees this as a way of getting the military upper hand. But there's further complications because the

other force which has declared war on France now is Britain. And what that means in Caribbean terms is this is an excuse for the Royal Navy to start attacking all the French slave plantations and all the French islands. So Martinique and Guadeloupe both attacked by the Royal Navy and taken and the first British forces arrive on the shore of Haiti. So it's a complicated situation. And then in 1794, the news comes that the revolutionary government in France has abolished slavery. And this is the cue for Louvarture to sweep sides back to the French. And this is the moment now of his greatest glory.

He defeats both the Spanish and the British. He drives the British out of the island, and he now is the big man. He has taken over the island. So, William, he's driven out the British. He's driven out the Spanish. I mean, again, just the David and Goliath of this fight as well shouldn't be skimmed over. He is still one man leading. Okay, they're wearing smart uniforms, but they're not military men. These are slaves, who have only recently in the last few years been freed. But he manages to push out two of the most martial forces. in Europe. What about the French? Where are the French in all of this? In his affections, and his thoughts, and on his enemy lines. But the minute that the French in Paris declare the end of slavery, everything changes for Louvarture, because he thinks of himself as French. He's only joined the Spanish as a pragmatic move. And he joins the French pro-revolutionary forces. He says, I believe our only hope of this is in serving the French Republic. It is under

that flag that we are truly free and equal. So he now really believes this rhetoric of the revolution that the slaves are going to be free. And is, I mean, is he right in trusting it? Because, I mean, you know, liberty, fraternity, equality, that's fine for France and French people. But are they also thinking in terms of slaves as well? I mean, are they saying that we are abolitionists now? It's exactly the same debate that's going on at the same time in Britain. and you have in France a strong mercantile lobby who a lot of the people who are behind the revolution are middle class merchants

and they have a strong interest in slavery being maintained. So as in England, you've got different interests competing and trying to get a dominant position in power. And certainly in 1794, you have the Assembly choosing to abolish slavery. Now, this is not the end of the stories we'll see and this will change. and Napoleon plays a very dark part in this in bringing back slavery.

But that's for the future. For the time, yeah. Yeah, it's blowing an ending. That's not like you. Okay. But okay. So Levertoe now has control of Haiti. He's driven out those forces of the British and the Spanish.

He's now dealing with the French in the belief that actually under the French trickler, his people too, will be freed. Slavery is no more. But Lovetur. does something else, which will end up being a weakness, creating a weakness in his side. And that is, he realizes that, you know, they need money. They need money to survive. So instead of getting rid of the plantation system, he actually makes this really hugely controversial for the people who feel like, you know, life should change. Tomorrow is the day after the revolution. Tomorrow we will be

free men. Tomorrow our lives get better. But Lovitur keeps the plantations going. He calls the people who were yesterday slaves are now labourers. So they do get paid, but their conditions, their hours, their treatment, arguably, is no better than it was when they were slaves. They're free, they're getting a wage, but they're not enjoying their lives. It's harsh regulations. He sets out 5 a.m. in the morning until 5 in the evening, they have to work.

And remember, again, just as we said in the first episode, Haiti is the richest place in the new world at this point, extraordinary thought. It's producing hugely valuable amounts of cotton, tobacco, and most of all sugar. And it's a huge contributor to the French economy. Now, a lot of this has obviously been damaged by the uprising, by plantations being burned by the anarchy and the different wars that have gone on. But it still has the ability to turn itself around. And Louvichot's view is that he wants to be in charge of a rich, flourishing country and that people have got to work. So he's moved now from, in the sense, the easy thing of rebelling against the old regime to the much harder thing

of having to keep the whole thing together as a leader. I mean, it's a problem. A lot of other people are facing at the time in people like Washington who are, you know, they can prosecute a war. They're very good. But actually running sort of a cabinet of a bag of cats is very, very difficult. Politics is a different game. But Leverture centralises power. And he's sort of, you know, hungry to keep a hold of it in a way that Washington, you know, who wants to retire under his own tree and contemplate life after the revolution, does not. Lovichael wants to hang on. And it's really interested, C.L.R. James, who we mentioned in the first episode, he's written, you know, a marvelous book about Lovichu, says he made himself into a whole cabinet like a fascist dictator, except he

actually did the work, which I think is a really powerful line. So we see this whole new side of Louverture emerging now. He's no longer the general up in the mountains, organizing ambushes and riding from one place to another. He's sitting in a bureaucratic office, working five secretaries simultaneously, sending out letters in all directions. And he is a great writer-writers. And both CLR James and Sudhir Hussari Singh in their separate biographies have been able to mine these letters for his story. And there are crucial. resource. He's a meticulous correspondent. Important letters take several drafts. He scrutinizes every word that's conveyed. He also tells me his letter is not going to be delivered. So he often

sends follow-up letters. And it's from these letters at this point that we really get an impression of who he is, both in a political sense and at a personal sense. So politically, you see him championing causes of those in need. So, you know, a widow is looking to him to have her family property returned or a planter whose animals have been stolen goes to him and asks for some form of compensation. Even a gendarme who's been slapped by a captain quotes in breach of his human rights. But we also get glimpses of his private self and his life. He's very concerned for the education of his children, who he sends off education in France. He has his passion for horses and for roses. He loves his flowers. And he takes a huge. He takes a huge. He takes a

huge pride in his personal hygiene. While he's very Spartan in his eating habits, he's quite sort of foppish in his dressing. And he's constantly writing letters about dispatching fresh clothes and towels to him when he's on the move. Clothes, towels, perfume, pomade. That's who he is. Loaves of bread. He's very keen on a fresh baguette. I mean, to be honest, who isn't? The French do bread like no one else does bread. One last thing, music. He loves music. And one of his early letters shows him overseeing the formation of a little orchestra with a trumpeter and a clarinetist, which is a lovely detail. That is a lovely detail. But also it's sort of interesting to note. So he sends his children to France. And France is very happy to let him get on with it. Because for them, you know,

this otherwise the tap to their, you know, richest part of their empire will be turned off. At least if they have a man, a sympathetic man in charge, they kind of, you know, they don't mind. They let him get on with it. So he's in this really weird position where the people he has led, promised freedom to are starting to chafe because their life is no better. And the French, who he led an army against, you know, are saying, yeah, good on you, Liverature, carry on. But of course, what the French love is the fact that he's defeated the British. The British actually spent a fortune trying to defeat him and capture Haiti. They've apparently spent 2.6 million in 1796 alone, which is a colossal sum. And they've lost against his well-trained

ex-slave forces, 80,000 soldiers. So it's a major dent in British prestige, and Louverture can take the credit for this. And this gives him enormous credit in France. Although he's opposed France at one point, although he's risen up and he's been part of this uprising, the French is prepared to embrace anyone who defeats the English. Yeah, I mean, it's so interesting. He turns to, you know, almost overnight from villain and, you know, one of the most hated and feared and, you know, all of those voodoo mysticisms that surround him in the propaganda in France.

to being sort of a bit of a poster boy because he, you know, he kicked British, but the British, on the other hand, are demonising this man because he has humiliated them in many ways. There's a lovely quote by a man called Philippe Rume, who writes to his superiors in Paris, in a sense to explain to them what an important figure Toussaint is and why they need to embrace him. He writes, this is a rebel whose will commands the assessment. of nine-tenths of the population of Saint-Domain, a rebel whose courage, discipline, and strategic intelligence in the conduct of colonial war

have overcome the might and ruses of the British. A rebel who hardly ever sleeps and seems to multiply himself and be present in many different places at the same time. A rebel who knows the ideal locations for ambushes in every part of the territory, which is littered with mountains, rivers and passes. a rebel who commands. It's a wonderful quote.

But to have that kind of command, to have that kind of authority, he has to start making some really very difficult. And again, they don't please his own constituency decisions. So he wants to consolidate territory. Now he's looking at the mulatto territories. And he's saying, actually, I don't trust these people anymore. I don't trust them. We need to get rid of them. And he appoints a very important man who's going to be very important to the story of Haiti, Desaline. And he says, right, I need you to go and purge

the Malato territories. But Desaline, you know, just far overshoots the mandates. Goes wrong, it's completely overboard. Well, I mean, he shoots 300 prisoners and then he shoots another 50. And that is at that point, Two Some Levitin is absolutely horrified

because this is not what he wanted. He says, and these are his words, I said to prune the tree, not uprooted. It's a lovely thing that. I love that. So again, I mean, I'm just pointing out the weird, weirdness of political square dancing that goes on at this time. You know, the French are for him. They hated him 24 hours before. The French landowners, you know, the plantation owners, they are also bizarrely for him because he's somehow making the land still work because he's getting people to work.

And the people who work on the fields are starting to have their doubts about him because, hey, you know, in his name, there are mulattoes being executed. And also their lives are crap still. This is the fascinating thing about him is, you know, he's a realist, he's terribly pragmatic. And he genuinely wants this to be a flourishing colony. He now believes in the ideals of the revolution. He's been reading this literature which preceded the revolution and the ideas of freedom and equality are ones that he embraces. And now that the government in Paris has abolished slavery, he's doing all he can to turn Haiti into a model plantation system, whereby, and trying to find a way whereby he can keep the economy going, keep the plantations going, but ends slavery. And he's trying to satisfy all the different interest groups.

He realizes that without the plantations, he can't maintain this. You can't run a country on slogans. You can't. And this is a new country. The problem is, though, that's fine. That is pragmatic for a leader, but you've still got people who've had enough. So, you know, he does a deal with the plantation owners. A quarter of the crop share is going to go to the people who work the fields.

But that's, first of all, that's not much. Second of all, the take-up is so low that a lot of the labourers are saying, enough with this. Up with this, I will not put. And they're running away. from the plantation. So his discipline, it becomes even more draconian. And that doesn't win him any more friends. He's hemorrhaging friendship here among people who worshipped him. Even though it is different in respect of the fact they are offered a wage, which they never would have been when they were slaves, it's still not enough. And we said at the beginning how he is quite a austere figure

personally. He doesn't eat much. He's extremely disciplined. And he tries to promote this personal discipline onto his people. He makes speeches about personal industry, social morality, civic pride, free trade, public education, religious toleration. And all these people whose backs are broken say, shut up. You've been reading too many books. Yes. Shut up. My back hurts. My hands are sore. I want to go to sleep and I'd like to have more to eat. I mean, the words do not fill up a stomach. I mean, you know, this is, again, the prelude to the French revolution, you can say all the pretty words you want. You can make all the promises. But if people are hungry and fed up and tired, it's not going to cut any ice. But it works up to a point. He gets the agriculture and the profits

of the island up to about two-thirds of the level they were before the end of slavery. In other In other words, it's generating huge income. This is a very rich place again. Having been in anarchy for almost a decade, he's now got the economy up and running. The plantations are delivering sugar and tobacco and cotton. And he starts spending this money on schools. So he's a good leader. He's educating people. He understands all these things. He is. I mean, he's doing good. He's doing, I always think about literature is, you know, he He does his best, as he sees best, but it's not always the best thing he could have done. Well, it's not always popular.

I mean, he does that thing that, you know, the great leaders do of taking important and unpopular decisions. So he understands, it's important of having. And you can take unpopular decisions when you have sort of a, I suppose, you know, you've banked up enough credit. But again, these are people who are only recently freed. We'll come back to that because it might explain why Leverture so often is overlooked for Desaline in certain quarters in the Caribbean.

Desaline is the hero. We haven't spoken much about him, but we will come back to him. But Desaline, the man who executed 350 people without losing any sleep over it, will eventually eclipse Tissan in the pantheon of heroes for the Caribbean.

Tell me what the French are doing because it's Napoleon now who is sort of running the imperial side of things. So what is Napoleon doing because Napoleon now is the figurehead of the French, the muscularity of the French, what is he thinking or doing about all of this new power rising up, albeit quite fragile power rising up in the former colony? Well, if Napoleon is your hero, and of course, both today and and in the 19th century, he has many, many supporters, what he does to San Domingo, to Tucson and to the

whole world of this revolution is not a happy story. Napoleon supports not only the revival of slavery, but the reconquest of this island. Because under Toussaint, it has become now increasingly independent. He's making a lot of decisions himself. It's semi-detached from France. And Boudupon wants it back. And he is, he's listening now to the many interests in France that are saying, this is a vital part of our economy. You know, it's all very well talking about equality and liberty for whites, but the blacks need to be put in their place. We need to have them back on their plantations.

And if we're going to succeed in this revolution, we need to re-establish every. And I'm afraid to say that Napoleon supports them. In many ways, you know, this is a tale of two, not the cities, but two men who are starting two new countries at kind of a similar time. Because to all in terms and purposes, is Napoleon too is trying to, you know, forge a new republic. This is a new country with lots of enemies who hate them, you know.

And there are those who argue that Lovatur overplays his hand with Napoleonic France. Well, speak more about that. What does he do? Why do people say that? He just is undiplomatic. He establishes himself as the, he wants to be a lifetime governor. He's throwing his weight around and he's, you know, Napoleon is already used to everyone. coutowing to him in France. And from Napoleon's point of view, he's not going to have this ex-slave telling him where to get off. So Napoleon makes the decision to invade Haiti and to send an invasion force. And it doesn't just any old invasion force.

He sends a huge fleet under his own brother-in-law. Victor Emmanuel Leclerc, who's the husband of Napoleon's sister Pauline, even by the time of Napoleon's old age in exile in St. Helena. He has realized that this was a massive mistake sending this invasion fleet. And in his letters and interviews, because he's always receiving visitors and so on, in St. Helena, he blames everyone else for the decision to attack Santomar. He blames the Council of State. He blames Josephine and quote the shrieks of the colonial lobby for poisoning his relations with Tucson's regime. But this is, I think, a classic piece of a retrospective justification. In truth,

responsibility lies with him, and it's he that puts massive resources into this reconquest of the most profitable of all French colonies. Yeah, just before we go to the break, I mean, I don't, we sort of quibble quite a lot about pronunciation in the first episode of it. Who was brought

up to say St. Helina? Is it Helena? I've learned a thing. Is it Helena, St. Helena? Oh, anyway. We're outside of conference. I'm sure I'll tell us. Okay. I have many other mispronizations today.

I think you might be right. I'm looking at it again, say Helena, I think you might be right. Join us after the break. I don't say it often. Welcome back. If you're just joining us, before the break, William, the most important thing he said was I think you might be right. I can't remember saying that.

I'm going to play it back. It's now not just my ringtone, it's my doorbell. It's not just going to happen. Okay, so we've got Napoleon. And I think this is really interesting because there are voices trying to reassure Napoleon that Lovituo is a man worth doing business with. I mean, he sends out an emissary to go and sort of size up to Saint Lovicure, a man called Charles Vincent, who says, actually, you know what? Calm down. There's no man more attached to the ideal of French republicanism than this man.

But Napoleon, I mean, as you say, I don't know whether it's a racial thing or it's just a slaves, don't tell me what to do. I think it is partly racial thing. Napoleon does not like blacks. It's very clear. You know, in a sense, many, many of Napoleon supporters would love to make him different. He's, you know, he's slightly Churchillian in his attitudes here. Yeah. And, no, he's not a big man on racial equality at all, Napoleon.

And he hates Loveture for resisting him. Okay, and also, I mean, the hatred for Leverture is kind of growing. So you've got Napoleon. But I think let's just circle back just for one moment before we go on with what happens with the clash of the French. He's just busy losing friends. I mean, we talked about, you know, the people are running away from his plantations who just don't like, you know, the things that he feels have to be done to keep this new country alive. But you've also got Desaline now, the man who he censored for, you know, massacring 350 people, the mulattoes. Desaline is now getting really irritated with him too, because, unlike other slave rebellions in the past, Lovature does not want to purge the island of white people.

He believes very much of this should be, this is a new place. I often think about it as sort of like Mandela, you know, sort of coming out of Robin Island and people are expecting all sorts of retribution, but he doesn't do that. He says, you know what, we've got a new country, a new start. Can we get past this and build this together? Desaline doesn't like this. Desaline doesn't trust these people who, you know, with reason, who have been enslaving and torturing his people for such a long time.

So you've got him chafing. I'm just sort of thinking about all this bubbling discontent that Tucson Lovatou is sitting on top of while facing off against one of the greatest generals in the world at the time. I think you're absolutely right. And there's this moment when someone who's been a strong opponent of Lovatio comes to him for a job, a white former plantation owner. And previously he said he couldn't work under the blacks.

And then he goes to Leverture for a job. Louverture invites him in and says, of course, you know, he's big enough to forgive people. And he wants to give the whites a second chance. And he realizes a lot that they can bring to the island, that, you know, they understand the economy. They understand they're better educated than the blacks. And he thinks his new country needs them. But you're right. There's a whole lot of people that think this is an error, that the whites should be driven out.

And that he's got, he's too soft on the whites. And he's too fond of France. He said his children for education. They think he's sold out. I mean, he just sounds like such a sort of decent kind of man. I'm worried for him at this point. I am worried for him. Well, you've got every reason because the fleet which has left breast under Napoleon's brother-in-law is cited on the 29th of January 1802. The lead ships of the French fleet are cited on Cape Samana on the northeast corner of the island. And Tucson at this point is rather like sort of, you know, Churchill in 1944 or something.

He's visiting the coastal defences. He's having obstacles erected on beaches, building up forts. And he's inspecting his naval fences, preparing for some sort of small French reaction to this. What he sees to his horror is not some small French reaction, but an enormous battle fleet. at least 25 full-scale naval vessels, each large enough to carry a thousand men. Gosh. And as he gazes at the horizon, he can see the silhouettes of a dozen more warships heading for Sandemang. He has this awful sinking feeling that he's taken on far more than he can manage.

This is not a tactical show of force. This is a full-scale. He thinks war of extermination against him and his people. And he turns to his officers and declares, we must perish. all of France has come to Saint-Dermain. They've come to seek vengeance. So, I mean, this is just so dramatic. You know, a man has been fuelled by hope,

who's been driven by this higher cause, this vision, is suddenly seeing overwhelming odds coming towards it. I mean, again, it's sort of like Tolkien-esque, isn't it? It's just like thinking. You know, one of those... You know, so the hordes of Mordor coming towards you. And the mass of these ships appearing out of the haze of the horizon.

No, but, you know, where a lesser man would break at this point, and certainly, you know, from that amazing quote that you've just given us, most people would break. But he doesn't break, does he? What does he do instead? He decides to do, what did you call it, burnt earth, is it? Scorchth. Scorchth. He decides to destroy his own land and leave no quarter for the French on the plains. And he's going to retreat to the hills and go back to what he used to. He used to. to do, which is fighting organized colonial armies with guerrilla tactics. And he refuses to submit. He burns down the capital cap. And there is this battle at Crette-A-Piero, and the French do eventually take the fort that his men are manning, but they suffer colossal losses, plus there's yellow fever around. So the evading force begin to sicken in the climate.

And he's watching this. He's got spies everywhere. he knows exactly what's going on. I mean, against such extraordinary odds, the things that are in his favour are that he's smart. So he knows the terrain. He's also got hidden caches of weaponry up in those mountains that the French do not understand.

He also has a huge... I mean, although, you know, people are turning against him, he has a huge loyal network of messengers. So he knows, you know, where and when the French are going to strike, maybe sometimes even before they've even thunk it, he knows. And that sort of adds that mystical. power. You know, he's here, he's there, he's everywhere.

Lufichio, Lufitur, sorry, suddenly went into a football chant by accident. But you know what I mean? He's, he's there. Also, all his suppositions about what Napoleon is up to have proved right. News starts coming in that Bonaparte has restored slavery in Martinique, Tobago and St. Lucia, followed by Guadalupe and Ghana. So all these islands, which had seen the slaves freed, one by one, five. islands now have gone back to the old plantation slavery system. The whips are cracking,

the whites are back in charge, the chains are rattling. And he knows that this is the only option. It may be terrible odds. This may be Napoleon's finest troops under his own brother-in-law, but he has no option but go to the hills and begin to do what he does best, which is his guerrilla warfare. And according to his biographers, this spring campaign of 1802, when he takes on Napoleon's forces and it lasts 70 days, that this in a sense is his most brilliant military achievement. Can I just say, just an observation, you know, we often comment about how things are not taught. I have never heard of, you know, Napoleon and his slaving and his slaving attitude. I don't know that, exactly. And pushing free people back into slavery. You know, it is always all

about the British. It's always about his heroism, stroke stoicism or his evil, depending on which part of the world you live on. But it's all in relation to Britain and France. And there's whole side of him. I wonder if the French even talk about it. When I was researching for this podcast, I came across a fascinating New Yorker article published a couple of years ago at the same time that Sudhir Hazar Singh's amazing Black Spartacus was published in France. And exactly what you said was what this article was pointing out. Although he's not an unfamiliar figure in France and there has been a television series on the Black Spartacus, and he's better known than he is in Britain.

This whole side of Napoleon putting the free slaves back in chains is simply not part of the French curriculum. And the French, I think, are as ignorant about their empire and the dark side of it as we are in Britain. I mean, you know, no nation likes to think of itself in a negative light. And this is something that, you know, a lot of European countries, have to face up to. It's not just Britain. It's obviously Belgium, Italians. The Italians, you know, are not taught about the things that their empire did in Eritrea or Ethiopia and so on. And I think, you know,

the same sort of pattern that we're seeing here in Britain with this slow acknowledgement of the darker sides of empire is something that is happening in other countries too. And Louvretheor is a huge part of that in France. If you are living in France, I mean, we'd love to hear from you actually about how much you do know, how much you are taught, how much he is discussed. I mean, get in touch with this. What's our email? I always forget our email. What is it?

Empirpud UK at gmail.com. Thank you. So, okay, look, we've been in this kind of situation before, you know, where we have rebels who are rising up against an imperial power, who are fighting off enormous odds. And particularly when we covered Indian history, William, you know, sometimes, you know, these rebels and the rebel leaders are betrayed by those close to them because deals are done. But this does not happen here. This doesn't happen here. This is what's really unusual. So, you know, whereas in India, you have

sort of minor kings or minor Maharajas who are bought off or promised tracks of land if they turn or people from one part of the country who are promised great things. I'm sure those deals are trying to be made. But even though they've had their doubts about Lovichu, they do not. His men do not turn against him. This is something that impresses the French. Napoleon's brother-law Leclerc has a secretary who keeps a diary of this campaign. And you see this man's admiration for Louverture just grow with every day. I'll just read you something from his diary. He says, pressed against the rocks and hidden in trees at our arrival and departure, these men followed and proceeded our marches across the woods, where they could guide themselves

through tracks of which only they knew and were able to find in the darkest of nights by relying on natural starlight. Tussan would send his orders to his competence at the most unexpected moments through these men, they never betrayed his secrets. And his orders were scrupulously executed, no matter what they were, as if he were present. Is that great? That's his enemy writing that. Yes, again, I always think the words of the enemy are more powerful in a way than the words of your friends.

So, Toussaint is everywhere at this time. He's pushing himself and his men to their physical limits. He draws on all that he's learnt of guerrilla warfare and his military experience. he's constantly on the move apparently sleeping on a plank I love that detail for a few hours every night and he plays this game

he sends the French on long and exhausting marches to chase him across the mountains but always remains out of reach he leaves just enough space so that they can follow him and then he'll leave them up a mountain and down the other side and will always be one stage ahead

they'll find his fires of his camps but they never see him and he has his concealed caches of weapons that he's put there waiting for him. And he mercilessly harasses the French who are now beginning to suffer from disease. And one French commander writes that he was, and this is a quote, losing a lot of men to the rebels every day. They are dispersed in the woods and the mountains. They kill all our stragglers on the roads. They attack our columns and swiftly retreat, thanks to their perfect familiarity with the local areas. And Toussaint knows exactly,

where to have the ambushes, exactly where to spring. And so the French decide there's no way that they can obey Napoleon's orders and capture this man, because Napoleon has given orders not just that he wants this man defeated, he wants him brought back to him bound. Alive. Alive. And so Leclerc decides to try treachery. Now Leclerc, again, just in case, you know, there's so many names are flying out is Bonaparte's brother-in-law. He is, you know, he is the proxy of Bonaparte. So he has all power to do whatever he thinks is right. And in 1802, after this campaign has been going on a while,

Napoleon writes to him, reminding him of the secret instruction, specifically asking that Nouve-a-Tur and what he calls the principal brigands be deported to France as soon as the black citizens have been disarmed and slavery reintroduced. And the Claire realizes is that he can't possibly do, do it by any honorable means. And so he sets a trap. And this is a terrible moment. He invites Toussaint to meet him in the Georges Plantation with one of their local commanders. And this guy, Brune, who purports to his sincere friend, writes to Toussar, offers him protection. And in what is

his last letter as a freemant, Toussore, reaffirms his commitment to the public good, expresses his willingness to help, provides, he says that he is treated with honour. But honor is clearly the last thing on the mind of the French. Leclerc is all set to spring this track. And the great question people ask is how on earth did Tussar fall for this? According to the folklore of Haiti, Tussar had gone to a voodoo spiritualist to ask for a prediction of what's going to happen. And he's told he will be betrayed and captured. And yet still, he goes with just three men to meet the French. And previously they've had other parties,

and he's come with 300 men, you know, fully armed, all set to defend him. But at this occasion, maybe he's overconfident. It's unclear why on earth he did this. Too trusting. Maybe he really does believe this man is a good man, an honourable man, because he has a great honour code himself. He has an honour code himself, and he admires the French. This is the thing.

I mean, although in a sense now he's known for setting up the programme. by which the first free, you know, post-colonial state is set up, he, during his lifetime, is actually always willing to keep friends with France. If they give him honour, if they give him autonomy, he wants to be part of France. But that is not what's going to happen. So the trap is snaps shut around Liverture, predictably, if you only turn up with three men. And he is put in shackles. He's put on a ship.

The ship almost immediately set sail for breast. the time on his ship, the time on this crossing is hellish for him. He's confined in the cabin. We should say that his servant, his wife, his nieces and his son who are nearby are also seized. And even before the ship sets off, the French go to looting spree at Toussaint's own property at Ennery and steal his clothes, his furniture and his works of art because he's a great connoisseur. And they take this, they shove it on the ship. They keep him in a cabin separate from his wife. not allowed to see any member of his family. He's separate. He knows they're just, you know, a few feet away, but he can't see them. He can't hold them. He doesn't know how terrified

Suzanne, his wife is. And it's hell for him, because this is a country that chops people's heads off in public. And men and women have their heads chopped off in public. So he's fretting about his wife, probably more than himself. And on the 9th of July, they finally reach breast. and it's quite clear from the minute he's received that there's going to be no letting up of the pressure and the authorities do everything in their power to break him both physically and psychologically. He's not allowed, as we said, to talk to his family

and he's sent off deliberately, I think, to the coldest place in France, to the Jura Mountains, which is known for its cold weather and also its remoteness from the sea, because they still think he has such a reputation that this guy's going to do a, you know, Houdini and appears somewhere else.

Yeah, exactly. I mean, also he does write to Bonaparte directly, begging him to spare his wife. And this is the words that he used. These are the words that he uses. He writes of Suzanne, his wife. She is a mother who deserves the indulgence and goodwill of a generous and liberal nation.

You know, still falling back on that ideal he has of France that he truly brought into and begging them to spare an innocent woman. And Napoleon is just not interested. He sends several more letters from the juror from his high security prison where he's kept. Because Leclerc warns Napoleon that if he should escape and he says he definitely will try to. And if he were to return to Saint-Dermain, his mere presence would set the colony alight. He's put on the top floor of the prison, kept in a cell, no reading material or visitors.

And even his intake of sugar, which he mix into all his drinks, his own luxury is rationed, as is the wood to heat himself. Yeah. Again, the things that would break most people, but Tucsonavichita doesn't break. This is just a tirade of degrading treatment that he faces, but he faces it with dignity, and some may even say with defiance.

According to the later testimony of one of his guards, when he was stripped of his military outfit, he flings it at the officer who's told him to strip and says, take this to your master. It's a wonderful scene. Oh, tragic. So he's now falling apart. He can't take the cold. He's never been in a situation like this before. He's harassed by the prison authorities. There are night searches of his cell and he loses weight. He begins to suffer from a chronic cough in the cold. He isn't given enough wood. He isn't getting enough clothes. He complains of constant headaches and stomach pains. There's very little medical assistance. And on the same, he doesn't give enough wood. He doesn't get enough clothes. He complains of constant headaches and stomach pains. There's very little medical assistance. And on the same, 7th of April 1803, less than the year after he's docked at breast. The prison governor finds him dead in his cell slumped by the far side. Gosh, I mean, that's awful. That's awful, you know. His body's buried in the Fort Chapel, where it remains. Yeah. He's never, he's never,

taken back. He also, he dies a Catholic. That's interesting. I think, do the French try and say he sort of dies a heathen, but that's, that's not true? He's, he's. And also, he's, he's, I mean, there is, you know, some elements in the Caribbean, you know, very much imagine him as above all a figure of the voodoo. But his last letters talk in very Catholic terms about him being crowned with thorns. Well, we should talk about his legacy. It's such an ignominious end to a life. In June of that same year when he dies in that shivering, cold, lonely, dark place, two of his followers, one notably being Desilin, the man who was chafing under his decision to, you know, live and let live with all of the nationalities and colors and creeds on the island.

He unites with Petion and they rise up against French occupation. And this time, you know, they're not going to have this. They're not going to take Napoleon being in charge. What happens after they rise up and what makes him actually? Desaline is the man who becomes the history. hero of Haiti. Well, again, this is something, you know, which very few people will ever have heard of all studied in school. But there is an enormous French army of occupation now in Haiti. And in the wars of 1803, when these two lieutenants of Lovettur are taking on the French, in an extraordinary

campaign, the French lose more soldiers than they do 12 years later at Waterloo. That's amazing. Just say that again. So, I mean, just this is, this is still guerrilla warfare. This is still, you know, outnumbered, you know, ridiculous to one. Say that as figure again? The French lose more troops in the campaign against Desilina Pettion in 1803 than they do 12 years later at Waterloo against Duke of Wellington. Yeah, and it's a great victory. There is a final set-piece battle at Vertier.

and in December, the French, who have been wholeheartedly beaten in a formal set-piece battle, take the only option open to them, which is to evacuate Saint-Dermain. And the next year, the revolutionaries established a new, independent and free nation, Haiti, the world's first black republic. And I think the first post-colonial state. Am I right in that? I think that may be right. I can't think of anything else that would have happened.

The first time the European colonialism is rolled back. by the force of ours. Extraordinary moment. It is an extraordinary moment. And the legacy in the world is interesting. Because as I say, Leverteur is celebrated in the United States. He's a huge figure. He is a figure in Haiti, but often eclipsed by Desaline,

who is seen as a man who ultimately beat back foreign forces. There's an interesting thing going on in France. So France has, I think they've acknowledged that bad things happened under French occupation. But there are demands for reparations. which they are saying they will have nothing to do with. And there is not a formal apology, I think, that's ever happened from France either. No, well, it's interesting. Macron, of course, being a pragmatist, has had said different things at different times.

At one time, he did make a speech, which is something we haven't heard in this country ever made, which is a formal declaration of the atrocities of French colonialism. It's not sorry. It's not sorry, though, is it? But it's a declaration, okay. He's gone further than the British have gone. Okay, I was going to ask. He then in the more recent campaign, slightly backpedal,

when he was facing the challenge from the right, began speaking in very different terms. And there was a lot of sort of Islamophobia and so on. But you do think, even with that declaration, he went further than the British ever have? Yes, as I say, there's this very, very good study of this. And we've talked so much about the British Empire on this podcast. We've said very little about the French Empire.

But this New Yorker article, which I would recommend everyone on this subject goes into that whole story about the French failure to face up to the atrocities. And I think before we end this, we should say very firmly that these two wonderful books are books that we have to recommend to all our readers. CLR James, written in the 50s, absolute classic of post-colonial literature. But more recently, this wonderful biography of Toussaint-Lovatieu by Sudhir Hesir Singh, who's who speaks and teaches at Oxford. It's called Black Spartacus,

and it won the Wilson Prize for History in 2021. And it was completely new to me. I knew none of this before I opened it. It's also beautifully written. And all these lovely quotes that we produced about Tim, being like a tiger and everything. This is all from Sudhir Hazari Singh's wonderful work. So I would completely recommend this to anyone that wants to follow this up,

because I suspect this will be a story that very few of our listeners know, although it is, as you say, it is known in the States. It is known a little in France, and it is known to people that follow Wycliffe Jean and San Carlos Santana, who have respectively rapped and sung about it. Wycliffe Jean. Wycliff Jean. So we end as we began.

Thank you very, very much for listening. Apologise to everyone who's offended by our terrible pronunciation of everything. I'm sure we're going to get a whole post bag of letters. Let's be kind. Be kind. Exactly. Anyway, thank you very much for listening. That is all from me, Anita Arnann.

And me, William Duremberg.