Empty Netters Podcast - Did The Panarin Trade Save The Kings Season w/ Bayne Pettinger

Episode Date: February 5, 2026

Holy smokes we’ve got a blockbuster trade on our hands! The Kings rob the Rangers blind and add Panarin plus an extension! Connor McDavid has us ready to run through a brick wall, and now Sam Bennett has been added to the team so he can punch through one. Canada is going to be scary in Italy. Bayern Pettinger stops by from Toronto to chop it with the boys about his incredible journey through the hockey world and of course brag about his Olympic success. The Penguins are all the way back and seem like the real deal again. The Professors are also back to hook up before the break. And Dan nearly stumps Chris in Trivia Factorial.  Chapters (00:00) - Intro (02:00) - Panarin Trade Talk (15:53) - McDavid Players Tribune (26:19) - Sam Bennett Time (31:18) - Olympic Roster Reimagined (51:47) - Bayne Pettinger Interview (02:01:14) - Professors Puckline (02:12:32) - Trivia Factorial PRESENTED by BetMGM. Download the BETMGM app and use code “NETTERS” and enjoy up to $1500 in bonus bets if you lose your first wager! Thanks to our Sponsors! BetMGM: Use bonus code NETTERS when signing up to receive up to $1500 in bonus bets if your first bet loses. Gambling problem? Call 1-800-GAMBLER (Available in the US) 877-8-HOPENY or text HOPENY (467369) (NY) 1-800-327-5050 (MA), 1-800-NEXT-STEP (AZ), 1-800-BETS-OFF (IA), 1-800-981-0023 (PR) 21+ only. Please Gamble Responsibly. See⁠ BetMGM.com⁠ for Terms. First Bet Offer for new customers only. Subject to eligibility requirements. Bonus bets are non-withdrawable. In partnership with Kansas Crossing Casino and Hotel. This promotional offer is not available in New York, Nevada, Ontario, or Puerto Rico. Find LUCY near you at ⁠lucy.co/stores⁠, or save 20% on your first online order at lucy.co/NETTERS with promo code NETTERS. For more information on compliant messaging and to dive deeper into each product for your own education, please refer to LUCY’s in-depth guidelines ⁠HERE⁠. GOOD LUCK, HAVE FUN, DON'T DIE — In Theaters February 13, 2026 From Oscar-winning director Gore Verbinski (Pirates of the Caribbean, The Ring, Rango) comes a wild, one-of-a-kind action-comedy about a man claiming to be from the future (Sam Rockwell) who takes the patrons of an iconic Los Angeles diner hostage — recruiting a group of unlikely misfits to stop an impending AI apocalypse and save humanity from the perils of social media. Co-starring Haley Lu Richardson, Michael Peña, Zazie Beetz, and Juno Temple. Rated R. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Welcome to the Empty Netters podcast. Can you believe what this has become? There was a full 48 hours where I felt like I was like literally Superman. Jumbo loves playing Fortnite, so he gets on the sticks. Did TR show you the sauna cycle, or was that all year? No, I invented that. Almost a year now that I haven't taken a body check. That's kind of nice.

Finish tonight with some chicken fingers and a few guineasasas, ran into you guys. That's where this pod came to life. Ice is ready, and we are back with another episode of the empty netters podcast brought to you by bet m gm i'm your host dan powers over here on the sticks he's happy because the penguins are on a heater evan wakins hi way to wait a way to out me as a homer for the pen people need to know they need to know people need to know and over here to my left he's happy because his knees stopped making that weird clicking noise every time he gets out of bed did they

as always um i've actually I found a new morning routine. Okay. It's five minutes. Do it every morning. It's a lot of twisting, a lot of bending. And I don't know if it works. Is that actually true?

Are you actually doing that? No, I swear to God. Sandra thinks it's the dumbest thing she's ever seen in her life. So you're, like, you're actually waking up every morning and doing stretches. I've been doing, I wouldn't call them stretches. I'd call him jumping. You're jumping? Yep.

It's good for your lymph nodes. Yeah. Boom, boom, boom, boom. Yeah. Boom, boom, boom. You know about this? What? Like move them around.

To get up and jump. If you, or like, well, like, if you, like, go hard down on your heels, it, like, gives your lymph nodes a little drainage. Interesting. Yeah. I feel like I've been seen a lot of stuff about guashas recently with the lymph nodes. Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. The lymphatic fluid.

And people are like, don't buy a guasha. I use your fingers. They're natural guashas. And you just, like, do stuff like this. I'm like, drain it out. No, but guashas are better. And it looks... You changed.

So, listen. What the hell happened? I bet you're thinking, Chris looks different than the intro of the episode. What's going on? You'd be right. Do you look different, too? Oh, yeah, yeah, there we go.

I do now, bro. Yep. So we recorded, we reminded our business, we're making thumbnails, we're working our buns off. And then some breaking news. And then who tweeted it? Shefty.

Shefter. Holy Schefter. Like, what the fuck? Unbelievable. We got Schefter up in the biz now. This is crazy. So we literally, I literally ran from there to hear. I'm acquiring this information as we speak.

So we're doing, we're doing just a quick insert of breaking news because we couldn't have this episode come out without talking about the biggest news of Wednesday. Artemmy Panarin traded from the New York Rangers to the LA Kings. Here are the full details for you. Okay. And they're into the Kings, 50% retained. Yeah, we knew that, though. We said that in that episode. Had to happen. He signs a two-year extension, 11-mill AAV.

So, like, just kind of essentially just replaces the Copee. So I'd be like, it's way more than Copey. Yeah, right. But either way, the Rangers get prospect Liam Greentree, who is selected, I believe, 24th overall in the 2024 draft. A conditional 2026 third round pick, that becomes a second if L.A. wins one playoff series this year. and a conditional 2028 fourth round pick. Huge, huge trade and not the return Rangers fans expected. Well, there was the, who tweeted out those rumors, Elliot, about the sharks and the,

oh, I saw that on shout out hockey news. Or maybe it was Puck Empire? I don't know. But yeah, rumors were Rangers hit up the sharks and they were like, hey, you want Panarin? Give us Will Smith. And the sharks were like, lull, no. then they went to the caps and they were like, give us Ryan Leonard, and the caps were like, lull, no.

So when you see that as a Rangers fan and you think, even though you got hung up on, when you see the names you were asking for to see what you got now, I understand why you're rattled. I mean, we've been getting a ton of text. We got a text from Schwicki that was like, who are big Rangers fans being like, make this make sense to me, dude. How is this okay? I'm here to tell you, this was pretty much, this was worse than I thought, but closer to what I thought, then Rangers fans are thinking.

Like, we're here, right? I's expecting them to get this. Rangers fans are expecting them to get this. And I'm telling you, you were only ever going to get this. Yeah. So you came in a little under for sure. But you were not getting some fucking young megastar back for your, for a dude who was leaving for free, period, was leaving for free.

Yeah. So he, listen, it always sucks when this happens. You know what's ironic is this happened in favor of the Rangers. with Patrick Cain years ago. Yeah, yes, Dan. Caner was like, I am leaving. I am not signing here. I'm on the way out, and I only want to go to the Rangers.

So the Rangers fleeced the Hawks. Like it is what it is. Now this has kind of happened in return. Panarin has 57 points in 52 games, 19 goals. This is a good get for the Kings. Artemi Panarin is obviously a phenomenal, phenomenal, phenomenal player. He is also 34 years old. Not that old, but an old.

I mean, that's pretty old, dude. Yeah. Like, you have what? Four years left? Not everyone's Evachkin. Not everyone's Malkin. Not everyone's Krosby. But he's got the two year extension, those are two good years in my mind.

I would say, oh, wow, now he's dead. I'm like, you're going to get 80 points. I would say two good years, but I would say he's trending down. Sure. Like, he went 90, he had his, in 82 games, his 2023, all-star year, 92 points, 29 goals. then for the first time in his career the next year in 2023-24, 120 points in 82 games. Then last year, 89 in 80.

Now this year, 57 and 52. He's like, he's playing at like the 85-90 point pace. And I think he can give you two more 90s. Like, even with your trending down, I'm like, I think he gives you two more. So here's the question. Maybe not on the Kings. Can he do that in Jim Hiller system? Yeah.

So again, I like this trade for L.A. They just got better, a lot better. This is a right shot. Powerplay specialist, the 29th ranked powerplay in the NHL for the LA Kings, that is about to go up. Yeah. Like, this guy's immediately on your top line. He's immediately on your power play. He's probably playing with Kuzmenko.

Like, there's a world that Kuzmanko gets way better because of this. This guy's going to make other people better. He's an insane playmaker. He's a great, great player. However, I feel like a big gripe with Kings fans has been they just trade all of their prospects. And, like, Liam Green Tree is a good prospect. Like, let's get into that for a second. Please.

Liam Green Tree, two years ago, first round pick. Last season, lit the OHL on fire with the Windsor Spitfires. 49 goals, 70 assists, 119 points. He is a big body. He's like 6263, 200-pound winger. He's got no two front teeth. He's a fucking bruiser already with an NHL body already. He's got really, every report about him says he's got great high hockey IQ.

he sees the ice he's got great vision and this is that's Alex de Brinkett shit dude yes like you're scoring damn near 50 goals this year he's got 23 goals 22 assists 45 points and 34 games a little bit slower pace than last year but like he's a player he's a fucking player and I want to say too that even though Green Tree isn't this like top 10 prospect that everyone's juicing over he's the king's top ranked prospect like if you and and don't also forget Panarin was going to get to decide where I wanted to go and he could really limit the Rangers on. If he said behind closed doors, I will literally only go there, then you are screwed. And the best you can get is the best prospect they have. I'm not saying that's exactly what happened, but I'm saying if Panarin provided a limited amount of landing

spots, the best you can do is their best prospect, which Liam is in L.A. So that's, you know, you get what you get. So going, I want to say to the Rangers fans out there, number one, this is good. As in yourself. We knew we were always going to say, we knew we were always going to El Panarin. We came into this day. It was a sweepstakes day for Panarin because they were like, he's being moved before the roster freeze. So we always knew this was going to happen. Liam Green Tree is a great player. The idea of Liam Green Tree playing on the wing of Gay-Perrault in the future is should be very, very exciting to Rangers fans. I would get fired up about. A lot of people are going, I can't believe this return. This is a fleecing. How did they not get a first or at least a conditional first? I think this is what you talked about like that. I don't know that that was ever in the cards. Ever, Dan. At the end of the day, this is a 34-year-old player on an expiring contract. He's a great player, absolutely. But let's call it what it is. I am personally shocked that there was 50% salary retention and there was an extension.

I thought this was a like, maybe he'll extend at the end of the year. Because Panarin, Frank Sarajevoi said this was the only team that really Panarin's camp was talking about. Panarin likes big cities. Think about it. He was in Chicago, then obviously pit stop in Columbus, but then chooses the New York Rangers. Now he's choosing Los Angeles. It makes sense. Like he wants to be in a big city. But given that, and given that the extension was in place, I am a little bit like, yeah, yikes. How do we not get a little bit more? Yep. But if L.A. somehow wins a, it sounds so mean, if they win a first round series and you get a second round pick, you know, it's not going to be the best. second round pick. But if you get a second round pick and you get Liam Green Tree, at the end of the day, you're like, that's pretty good. Yeah, it's okay. Expiring player who had your nuts. That's it. He was like, he was like, I'm not resigning here and I'm only going to L.A. Right, exactly. That's what it sounds like. If he went, I'm going to one team, you are fucked. And, and, you know, you could say as a Rangers fan, like, come on, dude, we did right by you,

do us a solid and give us a five team list. So at least we can start a bidding war. If that didn't happened and sucks to suck, but this is the situation. And he, as you said, had your nuts. So he wants to play in LA. It's done. Frank's saying here, too, other teams were, they'd been preparing to offer neighborhood of four years, 11.75 mil. So like, this is, and here's the thing, man, a lot of shit talk on Ken Holland by a lot of people with so far what he's done or what he's not done with the Kings. This is a good trade. Yes. This is a win for the Kings. They just got better. Especially for this year. Like, come on. They just got. They just got. better. They didn't give up too much. Again, Liam is a great player, but like that conditional

third and a future, like, who gives a fuck? Who gives a fuck about those? Ultimately, Liam Green Tree was not making the Kings better this year. And the Kings are in win now mode. Like it's Cope's last year. You're trying to get back in, are they in a, they currently have a playoff spot? They're out. They're just out. They're just barely. Yeah. They're just barely out. Yeah. So yeah, yeah, out by one point and you've got a game in hand on Seattle. The Pacifics of fucking, you, You want to win tonight? Yeah. Yeah.

And people are going to make moves. Vegas, Vegas, Garry got Rasmus, like things are going to happen. Like, think about this. The Kings have played 54 games.

They have 60 points. So 55 points just ahead of them in the wildcard. Seattle with 61. So if you win your next game, you're in playoffs. If you win your next two games, you're ahead of Utah. Anaheim has 56 games.

So two more games. They only have 63 points. So you would be ahead of them. You'd be third. And here's the crazy one. Edmonton has 64 points and Vegas has 64 points. Edmonton has 57 games. So give the Kings three games if they win those.

They're at 66. They're ahead of Edmonton. Yep. So my two biggest final takeaways for this are one. The Kings have acquired Panarin, but also known of that none of their competitors acquired Panarin, if you know what I mean? Like he was such a hot commodity. he was obviously getting moved, not maybe getting moved, obviously getting moved.

So Panarin is going to go to some playoff team. Correct. It might as well be you. So this was a big move for two reasons, both bolstering yourself and hurting everyone else you're competing against. Yeah. Because, you know, it was Colorado, it was Dallas. Like there were places where you were like, Jesus Christ, they about to add bread man. So you do, that's awesome.

Second, and it's, you know, I'm sure other teams were calling them for this exact reason, too. This getting done pre-Olympic break is so awesome. awesome because you were going to come back. If it hadn't got done for any teams, you'd come back. It's such a mad scramble to the deadline. Everyone's trying to get back in the flow of it. Then you trade for him. He's got to come over, try to find a place to live, try to meet everybody, all this bullshit in

the, you know, in an absolute whirlwind. He is Russian. He is not going to the Olympics. Maybe he's got a little trip plan, but he can come here and chill for time. Go to in and out. Go try in and out, baby. Go do some out. Get settled.

I swear that's actually so important for this moment of time. Come here. We're good. up, find a place to live, everything's awesome, and then... You're essentially taking a vacation. Dude, you hit the ground running. Come to the South Bay, baby. I'm sure all the boys that aren't at Olympics will be hitting him up.

Anyone who's back in town will be like, dude, let's hang, let's have beers, whatever. That is, you never get this in the NHL. Like, you never get... Because even if you don't, if you trade before the deadline, the season's fucking going. So you're just, you're thrown in the mixer whenever it happens. This is free money, dude. That you just get to come hang out, meet the boys, meet the city, everything's good, and then you hit the ground running in March.

That's so true. Like, he can come here basically going from. the tundra of New York right now to Hermosa Beach. They'll probably start... Bring you some block. They'll probably start looking at houses right away.

Maybe he just takes Copey's house, dude. Copee's leaving. That would be sick. That would be the greatest transfer of all time. Yeah, that would be so sick. Fucking $30 million. Leave it furnished, yeah. I love this for Panarin.

You know, it'll be... And you know what? I know a lot of Kings fans are like, dude, we need young players. We need... But like I've said, you've got young players. Like, you've got talent. And frankly,

this is a pretty cool feeling. Like you've got Copey, this amazing two-way player, great, amazing playmaker who's leaving. And that was like a gutting, like, fuck, Jesus, we're losing our captain. But now you get this insane playmaker, leader, guy who has worn a letter.

So I think there's going to be an element too for this team. It's like, fuck yeah, we got him for two more years. That's pretty sick. So we'll see. I think the big question is, does he what does jim hiller do with this guy this is a this is if i'm our temi paneran and you look around the league at coaches who are great for your style of play i'm not looking at jim hiller yep so you wonder if jim hiller and

his defense first you know like really boring frankly style of play is going to look at an artami panarin and what he can do to the power play what he can do to just five v five hockey and if he goes great this is a piece we needed now we can adjust a little bit you would hope that you kind of have to because I think those, you probably had hard conversations with Holland going, dude, if I'm going to make a move like this, then you will act accordingly. Correct. Yeah. So, fucking A. Huge. Huge pickup.

Huge pickup. Now let's get back. Let's back to our regularly scheduled pod and we got a pretty sweet episode today too. Lots of nice fun hot ice to talk about the professors are back. We got Bain Pettinger on the pod to talk about his amazing story and also get hyped for Olympics. Unbelievable stuff. Let's jump right in. Hot Ice Topics.

I can't go another day on this pod without talking about Connor McDavid's Player Tribune article. That is correct. The Players Tribune is a great... Who started the Players Tribune? I don't know. Was it?

LeBron? Maybe. I hope not. It was, wasn't it? I don't know. I vaguely remember that. But then I was like... Oh, it is.

It's... It's... It was Jeter. Okay. That checks out. I swear it's so many. The Players Tribune would be something that LeBron would say he came up with with Jeter, but he let Jeter take it.

LeBron would be like this. Oh yeah, I remember when I remember when DJ was talking about that and we said it would be a great idea. And I wanted him to have it. I wanted him to be the first one to launch that. That's something LeBron would. Yeah. Anytime I see a player's Tribune article drop, I get fired up because it's always,

it's always awesome. It's always awesome. Every time, does not miss. The player's tribune is Christopher Nolan. Yep. The hit rate is 100%. So then I saw a McDavid one and I was like, whoa.

Yeah, I cannot wait to read that. Then I went to read it and I kind of assumed it was going to be how proud I am to be Canadian and how excited I am to go to the Olympics. A lot of stuff, which is in there. But it was so much cooler than that. I can't even wrap my brain around the emotions I'm feeling. I literally feel like I have just received my first boner.

And I'm going like, what is, what is this? Yeah. That's how I currently feel about Connor McDavid and the Edmonton Oilers right now. It was. And Canada. And Canada. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean, I, I've long said this.

I, when Connor McDavid came into the NHL, I bought his rookie year all-star t-shirt. Yeah. And I've loved him ever since. But I, you know, being enamored with Florida over the last couple of years and loving the stuff that we get to do with that team. There's definitely a part of me that was like, this is so fun. I love seeing the cats win,

Florida hockey, this, that, the other. But this fucking article was so brutal for me. Because A, it was, as someone who loves drama, we always talk about that on the show. We love drama. It is now clear that he will never leave Edmonton, ever in a million years and

I'm not saying that's a bad thing I'm saying that given that we like drama there no drama will come it also means that we are all rooting for them now yeah like there's no

we we've always said like yeah I want to see Connor and Leon and all those guys win a cup but now it's like I need I need it they have to This man cut his bachelor party short because he was so pissed. That is like, if that's not the most, you're the biggest fucking hockey guy I've ever seen in my life. I don't know what is.

So we're now all rooting for them. But then also, the way I read that and then was like, I am so fired up as a Canadian, as a Canadian national. that's how it made me feel reading what he said about like putting on the Canada jersey and wanting to win for Canada wanting to win for Edmonton I was like I am Canadian right now and I'm like fuck me like if I'm a member of Team USA and I read that player's tribune I'm like oh my fuck fuck um not I don't want to spoil the Bain interview because he talks about this yeah it is crazy to think that because these guys haven't been going to international tournaments

Connor McDavid hasn't won something in so long other than a billion individual trophies but it was a really cool insight where he's like I haven't won. I didn't think about that. Yeah, and I was like, oh, true. Truly, I didn't think about that. The best player and being like, I don't ever get to win. Like, oh, yeah, that sucks. Like, he was like, what

was it? Like, the last time he won was a world junior? Um, yeah, let's see. I'll find it. But yeah, he he was like, I have not won anything in forever. And so he was like pulling on that sweater and winning at four nations just made me be like, oh, fuck yeah. And how sick was it when he was like, he called out like Dewey? He's like, I look at across the room and just like Dewey and Marci are just chilling. Yeah, Sid just chilling.

And then also, I got to text him, shout out. What a fucking name drop Mac got in this where he's like, I'm thrilled to be here. Like the very end, dude. He's like pulling on that. sweater being in a room with the different generations of great players, Sid and Nate and Celebrini and all those guys. I was like, Matt. Well, fucking hell yeah, dude.

Matt's got fucking 80 points in the national. Holy shit, dude. That was fucking chills. Yeah. That was awesome. Yeah, everything you said about Canada agree. I was like, Jesus Christ. And dude, I, and I know you are too. Nothing will make me happy on Earth than Team USA winning gold against this Canadian team. But holy shit. And I never. been more scared in my life truly of this Canadian team like I don't know how you reading this art I don't know how you beat this team and this collection of human beings and and just dude if I were

on team Canada and I read that Players Tribune article I would be I would be so fucking rock hard I'd be walking around as if I accidentally OD'd on a bottle of Viagra and being like someone would go what's going on down there and I'd go like this I'm playing on a team with Connor McDavid in these Olympics. That's what's going. That's what's going. So, uh, I also want to say about the oiler stuff. I have two things, two more things that I want to talk about the. I'll start with the oiler stuff. Uh, I, you're right. I am now like, oh, okay, he is, he will die in Edmonton. He'll never leave. For good or for bad. And I'm actually kind of even confused about the deal he just signed, considering what I know now to be true about him. I'm like, dude, why

you just take an eight year burger and be like, whatever, I'm never, I'm never leaving. I, yeah, I don't know. I don't know either. I think it was just maybe to, to give another year of better cap situation. Yeah, yeah, flex. Maybe in two years, he signs for 9.7. But this, this guy, man, is, he also just stuffed everyone in a locker. Oh, my God. The, if that makes me a robot, then I'm a robot line. That was the next thing I'm talking about. Yeah. I, he, it's, it's felt like this dude has just been wanting to win a Stanley Cup for the last 10 years. And he's just been dealing with it, left, right and center with the media, with the questions, with this, that.

And he's just been seeing people go, oh, yeah, he doesn't like talking to us. This guy's a robot. He's, he's boring. He's got mental issues. And he must just be going home to his lovely wife and being like, What the fuck is wrong with everybody? I'm just trying to win here. I just love hockey.

And then he got the taste, dude. Someone gave him a nice little taste to that black tar heroin that is winning. Yeah. And he was like, oh, baby. They losing the cop, obviously, but that probably only made it better because he was like, yeah, I won. I got that taste again. But then I also got the sting of losing. And I'm like, I like the taste more.

So they're coming in. I mean, if I'm, I'm shitting my britches. if I'm Colorado, Dallas, Minnesota right now. If I'm Vegas right now. He had that one line where he goes, this room knows what it takes to elevate in playoffs. I'm like, the entire central is now dead. The entire central has now been put to rest.

Correct. Because the Pacific stinks and they are easily, easily making the Western Conference finals. And then I thought, oh man, it's going to be a tough series against the Aves or Dallas. What? They don't give a flying fuck about the Aves or Dallas or Mid-Intyre

And everyone keeps forgetting a little man named Zach Hyman is back. He's healthy again. 38 games, 36 points, 22 goals. Like that dude was not playing in that final. People forget that very conveniently. And Florida's not going to make playoffs. There's no Florida standing in your way. Dude, that is very possible now.

Like there, it is shaky knees time in Florida. So the, I just, it was actually funny because Connor goes, he kind of stuffed you in a locker being like, I hear all the fucking robot talk. fuck you but then he was also like this also i am a robot because i all i care about is winning hockey games and i was like you know what you're right we you we shouldn't call you a robot but actually we should because you are but there's nothing wrong with that put it robot inclusivity put it this way man i am like you are buy your ticket buy your ticket to edmonton right now because i'm i am telling you yeah whatever the future is whatever the future on the fucking

Oilers' Cup right now, hammer it. Go hammer that. I want to smash right now a parlay of Canada winning gold and the Edmonton Oilers winning Stanley Cup. Dude. Because that that Players Tribune article was essentially the sports

almanac from back to the future. That's what it was. McDavid McDavid Con Smyth, Oilers Cup, and Canada Gold. Let's go McDavid Hart. Canada Gold. McDavid Consmite.

Smyth, Oilers' Cup. Put that in your pipe and fucking smoke it, dude. Now we're all living on a beach. Smoke it and get higher. Then we all, then we all go to the Bahamas with Connor after that. Correct. Then we rest. Hey, this is your cup celebration and your bachelor's relationship. You can't bring a robot to the beach. He'll rust.

Yeah. That's why he had to leave. Yeah. Yeah, he's like tin man. Stop it, God. You're doing, what you're doing, you're making the mistake. No, no, this is what, Dan. This, he's finally being his true self here. Oh, it's the 2026, man. It's the year of Connor. I've never seen anything more clearly. And that article, if you're not, if you weren't

already a Connor McDavid fan, if you're not now, I mean, I don't care, I don't even, I don't care what you have to say. Because this is like, I'm just rooting hard. We're talking about him winning gold in Canada. Let's talk about Team Canada. Anthony Sorrelli is out. Banged up, not going to be playing. Immediately Sam Bennett goes in. Yep. we heard you'll hear from Bainer Cooper was like desperate to get Sam Bennett and that pumps me up because there were those awesome quotes

I know I mentioned this later but like those awesome quotes after Four Nations talking about Sam Bennett and Cooper was like when I called Sam Bennett and told him like he might not play that much Bennett was like I don't give a fuck I'll do whatever that's a guy you want in the foxhole for sure oh my God dude I think again we won't spoil this part of the Bain interview

because that was cool but I'm what I'm fascinated by the dude I would kill to have a doc release that's the decision the war room when they made the decisions for the Olympic rosters just because I'm like there's so much speculation of oh this of course the blues GM takes a blue you know and we're all just guessing but I'm like what happened what was the actual conversations and you know teaser but this was a really cool mini inside look at what goes on I can't believe cannot believe if John Cooper was pushing this hard for Bennett that he didn't make the team. It just goes to show how hard the roster is. I am thrilled that he's on the team. I'm devastated for Sirelli. It sucks.

All these injuries suck. Even the beginning of the year, we were saying the Barkoff shit, every time someone goes down, you're like, fuck, what about Olympics? This is damn near as close as it could have possibly happened, so it stings even worse. Because I'm sure Sorrelli's like,

everything's booked, his family's coming, and then you're like, actually, I'm not going. nightmare. So that sucks for him big time. Thrilled for Bennett, he's thrilled. He couldn't be happier to be there. For me, as if I needed anything else to be afraid of after that Players Tribune article, as an American hockey fan, I think this team makes the team scarier, personally. And that's not a knock on thoroughly at all. I'm just like Sam Bennett in these moments. I'm like, anytime you can get one of the most big game players in the league away from me in big moments, that's a win. And now here comes Sam Bennett.

who scored in the gold medal game at 4 nation. You know what my favorite thing about Sam Bennett is this season? We said right off. We were like Sam Bennett has to be on this team. And that's not. Oh, she said that, remember? Yeah. We were talking early.

He was like, no way to Sam Bennett not make this team. Yeah, it's not a knock on anyone. It's just a matter of like he's just got to be on his team. Sam Bennett, everyone talked, everyone was going nuts about his slow start. He's on pace for a career year. Yep. He has 42 points in 55 games, 19 goals, 23. Like he's just playing so well.

Yeah, maybe he'd been playing a shitload of hockey over three the last few years and just eased into the season. So it is like so fucking unfair. And USA would have this too, but it is so unfair that you lose a guy for Team Canada and go, oh, we'll take Sam Bennett. You're like, what? What are you fucking saying to me? He wasn't here yet?

Yeah, it's just crazy. Yep. It's, I got a text from a buddy that was like, Canada suffers a brutal injury and then its team gets better. Yeah. And again, that's kind of what I mean. I'm not,

I'm not saying that because I think Ant is amazing. I think it's the best like, oh, you just lost an incredibly perfect piece of this team. You put in an incredibly perfect piece of this team. And that's just, you're like, Jesus fucking Christ,

Canada. Get out of here. Yeah, that was, that is a embarrassment of riches. Yeah. Listen, I'll say this,

though, to your question before we move on. you ask, does USA feel more scared? I think there is an element of the I-A-H-F difference. Fair, fair. You know, I don't think Benny in the Olympics is going to be able to maybe be as much of a pest. He's not going to be donkey punching goalies or, you know, fighting anybody. But I think he can still just be a thorn in your side.

And this is what we always say. And this is why you got to put him on your team. we talked to him when he came on the pod this past summer. He might be one of the top five big game players in the NHL. That's what's about to say. It's like this guy just elevates every single playoffs, every single. That's why he wins Konsmite. So I think from that standpoint, not just USA, any team going up against them, you're like,

fuck, I hate that this dude's here because he just knows how to play in the big game. Dude, yeah, the narrative is like, oh, he's going to punch people. But I'm like, actually, what he's going to do is score in Four Nations gold medal game. He's going to score a billion goals in the final and win Conn Smyth. He's going to level somebody. Yeah. He's then going to pick up the puck, go down the ice, and dipsy-doodle dangle sesh goal. That's fucking insane.

That's what he's going to do. Yeah, that's epic. Yeah. So sorry, aunt, get well soon. Yep. Win yourself a cup. Yep. Be all right.

Bennett, let's go. See you in the lot. Yeah. I brought this up to you the other day and I just one, I just looked it up just because I was curious. Yeah, this was interesting. I was like, um, the, I was. I forget, where did I say that on one of the pods? I said it to Bainer.

Okay, yeah, but I was like, I wish, I almost wish the Olympic roster selection was based on points. Like literally, like the U.S. This is what I said. I was saying. The Ryder Cup in golf goes, six of the picks are just the top point scores in golf. Like, who's playing well this year? So even if you're a megastar, if you're having a bad year, you're like, you didn't make

the Ryder Cup team. Sorry. It's literally a point system. And I was like, it would be cool to see what the rosters would be like. Like if they were just taking – because five of the top 10 American scorers are not on the team. Right. I heard it was like that the roster building was more about like toughness maybe for the Americans. And everybody's kind of going like, why are we not going for skill and score, you know, scoring here?

It's with the discussion that we keep having is miracle, the miracle team poisoned USA hockey's brains permanently. And it's the reason it's the last. last time the U.S. won a gold in the Olympics and hockey and men's hockey. And it is because that was a time where the skill could not match up to other teams. They could not match up to the Soviets, could not match up to Canada. So it was, we got to beat them with toughness and with endurance and skating and this and that. But now the skill can match up. And yet we're still not building the roster. Yeah, you're prioritizing that underdog storyline. Yes. It's like we got to beat them with toughness. And I'm like, or check this out. They win gold every year with skill.

Yeah. We have skill now. What if we try to use that? It's very interesting that we still don't do it. Yeah. So I just, I didn't do D because it's kind of unfair to do like points for defensemen because I'm like some guys you are adding because you're like, you're a great defense. Yeah. But the 14 forwards. Also, you are prejudiced against D. You are a fucking. Fuck D. It's D erasure, man. So it's like, here we go again. No one talking about D.

Thanks a lot. I actually think we should have brought 22 forwards. I bet you do. And just play. Just fucking. No goalie. Yeah. You scumbad.

80 to 40 scores. This guy doesn't care about D at all. Top 14 scorer on, top 14 Canadian scores in the league as of yesterday. McDavid on the team. Nate on the team. Mack on the team. Shifley, not on the team.

Suzuki, on the team. Sid, on the team. Wyatt, not on the team. team. Marner, on the team. Stone, on the team. TK., not on the team. Reiner, on the team. Padard, not on the team. Hagle, on the team. O'Reilly, not on the team. And Geeky missed by one point. It's like, damn, that's crazy that geeky isn't. I mean, he's scoring so many goals. I know. He's on his fucking Austin Matthew shit. So that, looking at that team, Dan, you're not like, this is terrible. You know, like, I think you'd go, fuck, like, we're

missing Marshie. You know, Bennett ended up getting out of it, but you're missing Bennett. You're missing a Tom Wilson, you're missing a Bo Horvette, but I'm like, I'm not, I don't think anyone has any problem taking this team to Italy. And so, yeah, I mean, that team is fantastic. That's why we said they could, they could, they could ice two teams. I can't believe how impressed I am with Ryan O'Reilly. Same. Ryan O'Reilly is, I have to triple check that. Yeah, I was like, Ryan O'Reilly has 53 points in 55 games, I think, 20 goals. Literally. I mean, this is a guy who was in the lot. This is a guy who was in the locker room earlier this year being like, I suck, we suck, everything's falling apart. And he's just having a great fucking year. He might get

dealt at the deadline and get Nashville a fucking hefty piece back. That'd be really cool. You're telling me, based on points alone with how many forwards did we just do? Fourteen, the top 14 Canadian scores in the league he's in there? Yeah. I was like, cheat. So yeah, you're missing Bennett, Horvatt, Marcy, Tom Wilson. And Marcy's slow down. And you'll see this more on the American side, but injuries is a factor. Like, I almost would argue, um, if I were to actually push this to the, to the boards, it would be point per game. Point per game instead of, yeah, uh, because Marcia has 50 points and 45. Exactly. So I'm like, oh, you would have, you should be in there because you're over. Yeah. So like,

Brad Marchion, you fucking beauty. 25 goals, 25 assists. Amazing. Fifty five burgers, 55 fries, 55 shakes. Uh, uh, God, I love that show. Oh, wait, what do we need to make a reference to every episode again? Oh yeah. Oh, draft day. Draft day, yeah, yeah. Okay. Just get... I'm going to do split screens. Just keep... Brad. Guys just keep that under your hats? When it was when I wish John Cooper, I bet John Cooper had a slip of paper that said Sam Bennett no matter what. Cool. Does that count? We did it.

Yep. He ate it. Yeah, then he ate. He faded a little prayer. USA forwards. Jack Eichel. On the team. Robo. Off the team. Kyle Connor. On the team. Jake Gensel. On the team. Matt Boldie. On the team. Paige Thompson. On the team. Cole Coughfield. Off the team. De Brinket. Off the team. Schmaltzy. Off the team. Off the team. Larkin? On the team. On the team. Cutter. Off the team. Off the team. On the team. Off the team. Off the team. Off the team. Brock made it. Yeah. Sorry. Matt made it, made it. Missed. Yeah. Missing. Depending on which way you go on 14. Yeah. Yeah. Matthews. Matthew Kuch. Brady.

injury. Jack. He. injury and then J.T. Vinny. That's it. But you said J.T. Vinny Brock. Well, because I was like, it depends on who you put on. Like, if I say you made it, then Brock is missing. If I say Brock made it, Matthews is missing. Oh, got got you, got you. It depends on who get. That's 14 spot. But yeah, so this one would be a little crazier if they were like this. Matthew Kachuk, Brady Kachuk, Jack Hughes, and Austin Matthews aren't on the team. And I'd be like, well, I don't like this system anymore. Well, you need those grinders. You got to have, you Gotta have role players.

It is an interesting exercise to be like, why, this isn't a lifetime achievement award. This is like, who is firing right now? Right. Like, who are we bringing to Italy right now because they're playing great? And I'm like, there's a ton of guys on this list who I'm like, they're playing better than our megastars. And I'm like, can you elevate your game? Yes, probably. But I just think there's something too.

Like, oh, could we have not used Morgan Geeky's 40 fucking goals? I yeah it's probably the the US is just so confusing I know can I ask a question yeah do we have faith in Mike Sullivan here that's tough talk coming from you too so that is tough talk well I'm only saying that because the Rangers have not been great and I just don't know going into that if you're a player looking at what he's been doing and I'm not I've nothing against him and I think he's a great coach but like it is a streaky game not just for players but for coaches as well You know, and there's an aura around that.

I mean, we talk all the time about, yeah, it's funny that you're like, Mike Sullivan, you're, the Rangers are in dead last place. Let's get you behind the bench here. And then also, it's like, J.T. Miller has destroyed two franchises in 12 months. And they're like, put him on the team. And I'm like, okay. And I, you know, whatever. But that is, that's a tough look. Yeah.

So, yeah. It is funny that the Canucks are last in the West and the Rangers are last in the east. And JT. I'm not saying, I'm not saying, I'm just saying the facts. He was on both those two. Hey, they're saving it up for the Olympics. Don't worry. That's why they're not.

For sure. Yeah. I think we need to, U.S. hockey, listen. USA all the way. USA. But this will be interesting, Dan. If things in these games don't go well, I think maybe it's time to reassess what we do.

If this is a USA, Canada final and the USA loses a tight one, nothing will happen. But if the USA crashes, out in the quarterfinals here or something, I think there will be a hard look. I also think, what do you guys think about this? I think hockey, international hockey,

should be treated like soccer in that we have international breaks. Relax. In that we have international breaks where the international teams play, just like friendly matches. And they should have specific coaches. I bet there's probably not the financing for that. That's why they don't do it.

But I think it's dumb that, or not dumb, but I think it's interesting how like Mike Sullivan is the coach and John Cooper is the coach. And they're also the coach of NHL clubs. And I'm like, there should be a USA hockey coach. That'd be cool. That would be sick. And also with the amount of fucking dues I pay USA hockey to play beer league, there's certainly a budget. I'm paying your salary. Yeah, like Jesus Christ. So there's certainly. a budget, that would be sick. And Dan, it would just be so tough if like in soccer, there's like, we're doing an international break and then guys get hurt playing for their, that would be tough. But it's, it was crazy in the miracle doc to hear that they, those guys played 60 games.

That was, that was, have you watched, zero? I watched, I watched, I watched, I watched, I watched, most of them. I couldn't fucking believe that. It's great. Yeah. Yeah. Before the Olympics started, I'm like, played a full NHL season. This group of guys played in NHL season together. No wonder they won. They coalesced. Yeah. Christ, dude. These guys don't play together. No. Like, they show up and they go, go.

Play Latvia. Yeah, because it's not, chemistry, right? It's like, you've got to find that chemistry. So there's not a lot of time. It's unbelievable. Crazy. Especially when you're in Italy. Isn't the rink up there messed up?

It's tiny. It's small, right? They're supposed to be bigger, right? Yeah, four feet. So. I think I saw. What the hell? Maybe I, did I dream this?

Yes. No, I didn't. Yes. I didn't dream it. I saw a video of like a Zamboni going around the rink. It looks great. They got a jumbotron. He hit the wall.

He kept hitting the wall. No. It looked great. It looks great. I'm telling you guys, you got to be careful up there. Yeah. They built it really quick. No lean on railings.

Like I said, I'm going to nosebleeds too. Yeah, you're going to be up there. Bluth model home. Oh, shit. We're going to be up there. You stand up too fast to celebrate a goal. All of a sudden, you're going to feel everything's shaking. I need you wearing a harness like sting coming down from the rafters.

Yes. Yeah. Could you imagine if the ring collapsed that? I don't even want to say that. No. Let's not put that in the air. We're not going to say it. Okay.

Let's talk about the penguins before we move on. Yes. This team, especially with Ev here, deserves a quick highlight. Before we get into all Olympics all the time. Should I kind of put my Homer hat on? Put your Homer hat on the captain, that. That is a sick hat. Thank you.

Yeah, sometimes people see it at first. I'm like, where'd you serve? And I'm like, oh, wait, look at the top. You go like, it's the igloo. Yeah, yeah. Console Energy Center. Or now I guess it's PPG paint. That's fucking awesome.

Anyway. Okay. So the penguins, I don't have a clue what's happening. Because, dude, they cannot, could not in the past, keep the puck out of the net last years. That's been the real downfall. And plus 20 gold diff for their team, eighth in the league this year. Then that's a sturdy number. That's fantastic. They've got great splits. 13, 8 and 7 at home, 15, 7 and 5 on the road. And keep in mind, they are comfortably right now, in a, not comfortably, but they are, you know, in a playoff spot, in a locked playoff spot, while going one and seven in OT shootouts this year.

They're insane. They're horrible. The shootout. They have Crosby, Malkin, Lattang is when he's healthy, usually good at the shootout. And somehow they biff it. Every time. Always. So they started hot and we had a blast.

I was like, oh, wow. Because, dude, I don't need to say this again, but I was banging the drum of like Trade said, Trade Sid, trade Sid, this sucks. They started hot, and I went, oh, wow, I want him to stay if you're going to make playoffs and be fun. And then they dipped pretty bad. And then they dipped so bad that I was like, this is exactly everyone's worst fear. Oh, we just missed playoffs again, but we were too close to trade Sid and whatever. And I was like, God damn.

Yeah. God damn you, Pittsburgh. And now 11-2 and 2 in January. And they're nasty. And it's, you know what's crazy that's happening is like, they, let's let me pull up the penguins stats here because this team is they're doing things that I find very reminiscent of teams of the past but it's like Sid is leading with 59 points, Gino, 43 and 40. And like you've got Manta with 20 goals, Rust with 19. He's about to have 20.

And then there's guys like fucking Justin Brazzo. Yep. Few cooler stories in the league than Justin Brasso. He gets his first looks in Boston when he was like 25, 26. He's a stick on the golf course. Unbelievable. But now it's like here he is, dude. He's got 27 points in 41 games.

Like this is a guy. Wow, I've done that twice today. This is a guy who's going to have 20 goals in the NHL this season. That's fucking amazing. But that's what Sid does. And I'm not even saying they play together that much, but it's just being around him. It's the aura. All of a sudden, Brazzo is like, I'm a 20 goal guy in the NHL.

Yeah. That'll get you on a fucking roster. And he's young. So it's like he's just going to get better. But it's like this, I don't get it. This team. And I say I don't get it in a good way, a fun way. Cid's got 27 goals, Manta 20, Russ 19, Brazo 15, Gino 13, DeWar 13.

Like, they might have six 20 goals scores this year. And that's like that Boston team that won the cup, they had five or six 20 goals scores. Those things kind of matter in playoffs compared to maybe the Boston team in 2023 when it's like or maybe it was whatever one of these years recently where it's like David Posternack has 150 fucking points and he's your best player by a mile

and his scores every goal and then you get in playoffs and it's like hey shut him down a little bit and then the team really struggles. It's when you can spread that scoring around that it's awesome. I just hope that because Kyle Dubas has done a pretty good job of making some good

trades with fixing the goaltending and Chinikov coming in having that, you know, Russian thing going on with Malkin. Oh, yeah. They're conspire. And he's playing well with him. I know. I think Malkin for him, he's like a mad Max Ferry Road blood bag. It's like he's getting more energy from his Russian buddy, you know.

Hook him up. It's true. But I, but my fear is because it was like, what are we going to do? Are we going to build for the future? Correct. How do you do that? when Sid, Malk, and Latang all want to do the extended farewell tour, which is like how many seasons is that going to go? Because you really can't rebuild until they're out.

Yep, correct. But then they're looking at the season going, well, we're better than we thought we'd be. I just hope he doesn't try to do some big-ass trade at the deadline because it's like if it's not broke, don't fix it. To be a buyer, you mean? Like you don't want to bring in someone. I think if they want to do like one solid defenseman right-handed maybe because Latang gets injured a lot and he's out. And who knows, I mean, we have the Olympic break. but he might still be out.

Carlson's really streaky. He could be great or terrible. So, like, get one good solid right-handed defenseman. Don't go for something like, remember when... Well, those don't exist in the other. Well, it's true, yeah. Remember in 2013 when they went and got a ginnla, crank shaft? Yeah, right after Boston.

Morrow. And we got to the Eastern Conference Finals, and we scored two goals, got our asses handed to us in four games by the Bruins. And I was like, leading up to that, we looked really great. And then they fucked with the chemistry. to try and be like, we're going to win now.

And it's like, if you would just maybe let it play out. Yeah. Yeah. So, okay, interesting. So just you don't want a big move here. I think they're going to succeed or fail on their own merits that they've built. I think that they've got a big game tomorrow against the Sabres, which is going to be hard. We want that one.

The game last night against the Islanders, they like could have won. It was an O.T. Like, the Islanders are the bane of the Penguins existence. They're just in their heads. Yeah. But, like. I mean, you guys are just kind of sick. It's sick.

Well, we'll know. Skinner, man. Skinner won four straight to end January. He had a couple of monster performances in there, too. I think it was against Calgary at a 9-47 save percentage and against Van and a 3-2 win, a 9-38 save percentage with 32 or 30 saves on 32 shots. Like, fucking, we said it a million times. All Stu needed was a change of scenery.

And he just looks like he's happy in Pitt. Dude. And also, man, like they, right now, and I, obviously they've been hot, but the Islanders are a point back with having played two extra games. Oh, the Penguins are in playoffs. And then, yeah. But I don't want them to play the Islanders first round.

Yeah, that would, we will, I'd rather play Carolina. They're probably going to. I know. And that's, that's, I know, but you would take that, dude. Playoffs. Of course I take the playoffs. I'm just saying, like, Islanders in play. I know the Islanders have made playoffs.

Like there's a core of that team that is used to it, but I'm just telling you the, you are the Sydney Crosby penguin. Like in playoffs, you are more opposed. I just hope you've been burned so many times. The penguins are a lock for playoffs and that's unbelievable. Yes, they are. Well, no, the Metro is really bad. I am declaring it right now.

Like, the Penguins are a lock for playoffs. Don't fucking tease me, dude. No, they're a lock for playoffs. And I'll tell you why. They are in second in the Metro. And I mean, unless Washington figures out whatever the hell is going on with them, I don't even think there's anyone threatening them. The Rangers are dead.

The devils are dead. The Flyers are dead. Columbus has been surging, and that's fun. They've won six in a row. They're nine and one in the last 10 insane. But they're still five or so points back. My big thing with Pitt is they have a plus 20 goal diff. Yeah.

Like they are good. This Pittsburgh team is good. They're making playoffs. It's locked, book it, buy your tickets. Dude, actually, you might be right because it's just, I'm seeing it. Yeah. I'm seeing it now. Dude.

The penguin. Good luck, have fun, don't die. Came back from the future. You saw it. You saw it. The penguins are in place. The penguins are going to the cup. And Stu Skinner is going to beat McDavid.

No. I... We'll be lucky if we get past Tampa. Stu Skinner will cost McDavid three straight... Three straight... I think as a hockey fan, that would break me. Dude, if McDiv... I genuinely mean that.

If Stu Skinner pitches, Sto Skinner wins Con Smyth and pitches like three shutouts in a seven- Watching Conner lose again to Sid, his hero, and to Stu Skinner, his friend, that would break me.

I don't think I could handle that. Wow, dude. I just realized. Tragic. Yep, that would be tragic. Holy shit. All right, on that note, Pittsburgh is a wagon.

They're making playoffs. Congratulations. Let's take an ad break. And then let's hop into our awesome chat with Bain Pattinger. Folks, I know this is a hockey show, but today we're talking about football because the big game is right around the corner.

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unforgettable moments during the greatest game of all. And if you haven't joined BetMGM yet, you're going to use bonus code Netters, N-E-T-T-E-R-S, and you'll enjoy up to $1,500 of new player offers on your first wager. Bet MGM is where it's at. Make it legendary. Let's go. Coming to us live from Toronto right now, a Victoria, BC native. This guy has gold medals pouring out of his ears with World Juniors, World Championships, Olympics.

He's going to rub it in our face, this whole chat. I know it. He's now a certified NHL agent, a certified beauty. Bain Pettinger, thank you, so. much for coming on the empty netters podcast. Yeah, thank you for having me, a long time listener. So I'm really looking forward to this chat and a lot of topics to cover here. A lot of topics to cover. We're so pumped to have you. So we got to just jump right into it. We want to first dive into your hockey background because you've done so much in the game of

hockey that we're going to get into all these amazing things that you're working on right now. But tell the people, when did this all start for you? Were you playing at a young age? Were you coming from a hockey family? What really got you into it right off the jump? Yeah, I grew up in a hockey family on the west coast of Canada there in Victoria, BC. You know, and really hockey, my brother played in the NHL. He's in 1980-born. You know, he played 400-some-odd games with Washington, Tampa, and Vancouver.

I was the little brother always running around. You know, I played up to Junior B and then realized I'm better served off the ice with my skill set on the ice. So made the transition, played a bit for rugby Canada, actually, and then started working at 19 at hockey Canada as an internship in Calgary. I was going to school and luckily got one of their internships and ended up being 12 years at hockey Canada. I moved from a finance intern to manager of hockey operations when I left. So that's traveling the world with Team Canada.

So from, you know, world championships, world juniors, under 18s, World Cup of hockey in 2016 there, you know, got to work with all the now. national teams and some of the guys that come along with it. You know, the McDavid's, the Reinhards, the SIDS, those guys that really, you know, we went through kind of the program there together and some legendary stories from traveling the world with Team Canada. Oh, we can only imagine. I do first need to know, how did you swindle your way out of the finance department?

Because we both know that that is not where you wanted to be. No, I took any job to get my foot in the door. Like I feed all young people that reach out to me. It's about networking. You know, my dad says it best. hockey's a contact sport on and off the ice. I think it's important to have that roller decks and build that. So all of a sudden I'm playing Thursday hockey with Scott Sam and Bob Nicholson, Brad

Paskill, all these guys that are in the hockey ops department. And that leads to a stop by their office for a coffee. That leads to, hey, I saw an opening in national teams. And to go with the internal candidate over someone externally, you know, everyone's dream is to work at hockey Canada. And I had to grind it out for a bit there and move my way up the corporate ladder. But yeah, I definitely didn't have the finance. background, but it got me in the door.

Yeah. Dude, when you're not a numbers guy, it's hard to hide in the finance. You know what I mean? Like some other jobs, you can. It was the filing. Yeah. The alphabet where they started to audit me. And I said, okay, maybe I'm better served on the hockey side.

There you go. This is a win-win for both parties. Yeah. Yeah. But Boehner, I want to go back, though, for a second, because with all due respect to the Cougars and you run with those boys in Junior B, I want to hear a little bit about the rugby, dude, because that's sick. You were the real deal as a rugby guy.

What was that like? Yeah, so I, growing up in Victoria where it's kind of the rugby Canada headquarters, you know, there's no snow and if there is it lasts for a day. So you can play year around there. So when I showed up to high school at grade nine as my size of six foot four, I was kind of all untold that I was going to play rugby. You know, it wasn't really an option. I went to a powerhouse, Oak Bay High rugby school. And they saw the hockey, you know, they saw the rugby. And I ended up playing, you know, in Dubai, actually, for a world championship with that, which is like the equivalent of like a world juniors for hockey. Yeah, yeah. You know, lived in Wales for a bit. You know, played some provincial basketball too. So I'm a big believer even with my athletes today, like multi-sport, you know, play a hand-eye. You can work on that. You can work on fitness.

You can work on everything with playing and play as long as you can. You know, I think today we get these 12-year-olds that are only hockey players. Like, let's get them, let's play some golf. Let's play some lacrosse. Let's play as long as you can because, you know, I love rugby. And it's such a cool game. And I'm still a big fan of. Rugby Canada and how they're doing things. So it's super cool to be an alumni from there as well,

as well as hockey Canada. Yeah, I love it, man, because there's, and I'm so with you about the multi-sport thing, because it's everything, but hockey has become so specialized now that we have friends that have kids that are entering that, you know, 12-year-old age. And it's like, my God, if you're not being shipped off to the development program by then, you're a failure. And I'm like, it's crazy. The microscope, the microscope that they're under, you know, I advise my players, take, take a month or two off after the season, even AAA players. Like let the gear hurt when you get back on the ice. Have that build that drive back up so that because if you turn it into a 12 month sport or a year round sport, there's burnout.

And the pressures and the rankings and the trying to keep up with the Jones is because one guy's doing power skating three days a week. Everyone feels they have to do it. And it's it's a bit, you know, I think a problem in our game that, you know, we need to work on. And I think as advisors, we have a big role in that. Yeah, no doubt about it. What was it for you that it clicked in your head when you knew you wanted to. to stay in hockey because it's it's not always easy and i think you've actually spoken about this it's like a lot of guys who play forever and they think hockey is the only thing they can do they then have

that moment where they're not sure what type of area they could get into or even if they want to but for you it sounds like you always knew this is a world you knew you could serve really really well and you wanted to stay in it when was that moment for you uh i think in university you know i'm sitting there in finance courses and accounting and guys are talking about going off to internships at big banks and this and that. And I'm like, I don't want to do that. I don't want to hate my job. I want to love my job.

I want to, I want it to not feel like a job. Yeah. I want to go to the rink and have that camaraderie. And I obviously, I didn't have the skill on the ice, but I could still be around the trainers and the hot stoves and the buses and just that camaraderie of,

you know, being building with something and building and having that team mentality. I always grew up. I grew up with, you know, three siblings. So it was always that team mentality growing up. And I think that's what, you know, carried me into sport.

and luckily enough had a pretty good run at Hockey Canada over my 12 years there, you know, with some gold medals and some some memories. Oh my God. Yeah, go ahead. Well, I was going to say that's a perfect transition. As you get into hockey Canada, you're starting to work with the team. You're getting great relationships with all the guys. That's amazing.

And then just immediate success. What was, was the first tournament for you world championships or was it World Junior? It was under 18s because I started as a coordinator. Yeah. It was the test event. in Sochi Russia. So it was the year before. And so we go and unlike this Milan Olympics,

they had it all set in Russia. So they run the under 18, the spring one there. Yeah. So we had a double underage by the name of Connor McDavid come home. He was, you know, he showed up by always telling me,

he had his Justin Bieber haircut over the, over the forehead. You know, and he had played his year and eerie, but he was still kind of like, okay, you know, who is this kid? And I think he had three or four games with hat tricks over there.

He was on a line with Sam Reinhart. So these guys are 16. And you're already seeing the chemistry. Yeah. I think we rolled through that tournament, won a gold. And then obviously back the next year for the Olympics. But that was my first one, was the test event for the Olympics. And to see that venue then a year before.

And then afterwards at the actual Olympic show was pretty crazy to see how they, they pull it together. It was, all there was was a rink in the middle of a dirt field for under 18s. Like literally. Yeah. Like the security station was. you like drive through and me and Rhino always joked that they had these security dogs. We're like, those aren't even trained security dogs.

They're just this guy's pet, dude. Yeah. Yeah. Like we'd go up and pet them. We're like, there's no way to let. He's got a cat, dude. That's a cat. That's insane. Oh, Jesus.

They're not sniffing. They're looking for treats. Yeah. Yeah, that's what you got in. You got a couple snacks, couple of sco be snacks in your pocket. Yeah. You're used to, you're used to some Russian guards shaking you down for money. Now you got Russian dogs shaking you down for bones.

And it's like, what I'm back at that. And then you go back a year later and the whole village is built. and the security and the infrastructure and the Olympic Park. And you're like, whoa. You know, it's crazy how it goes. And Boehner, was that, had you traveled a lot in your life even? Like, was that nuts being like, holy shit, I'm going to Russia for U18, team can hockey Canada? Yeah, I did a backpack trip with my brother, my brother's two years older than me when we were like

18 and 20 one summer. We went and like did the classic like Prague beer halls and, you know, all of that, London, England, find the cheapest pub you can find and all that. but never at that level because hockey Canada, you know, they do such a good job of, of taking care of the players and their families, even at the under 18 level,

like the travel, the hotels, everything. But yeah, like there's, there was pinch me moments, whether it was going to Pyong Chang, Korea four times,

right? For that, yeah, yeah, like, you're downtown Seoul, Korea and you're like, how am I getting paid to be here with Team Canada?

Yeah, like, you can't draw that, like Europe's one thing because it's a hockey country, but it was really when you go to Asia where you're like, you know,

it's the whole time. time zone goes back and you know, you're not in, you know, traditional hockey rinks and, you know, you're out there, you know, the Zamboni barely works and you're like, what is, how are we, how is the national team here? But, you know, it's, it's cool. But at the same time, there's times definitely where, you know, you've been, I've been all over now to Russia to Finland, Sweden, Czech, you name it, pretty much all the, Denmark, all the hockey countries over there. And, and, but the pride that when you walk in with Team Canada, too, you know, it's like, we always, we always said, it's like, you know, and I'm not trying to,

you know, put it on here, because I know you boys are American, but it's like the New Zealand all blacks. Like when Team Canada walks in, when Team Canada walks into a rink in Denmark, whether you're a staff member like myself or Connor McDavid, people are like, they see the logo and they're like, whoa, yeah, right? It's like, it would be like us seeing the New Zealand all blacks. And we always said that with hockey Canada. Like, let's carry ourselves like that. Let's, let's have that because we have that reputation and pride. Yeah. No doubt about it. Banner. And, well, I was just going to say, Chris, it's actually funny, you know, we talk about all the. time at yes we're American but at four nations that first game especially with all the the

lunacy going on with trump and the 51st state comments and when that arena in montreal started singing collectively the canadian anthem we i was there in montreal i was saved so so were we and i was like i felt canadian in that moment i was like the the amount of just pure good-hearted pride in this country and in this game is so palpable right now it's unbelievable and you guys have been to probably as many games as I have, if not more. Like, I have never seen a rink packed an hour before. Oh my God. Warmups. Warmups were

to the gills. I was standing there and I was like, I've been to Olympic finals before and have never seen the Bell Center like that or a hockey rink like that. Yeah. I agree. And then obviously the three fights and you're like, okay, this is grabbing a beer. This is going to be a good case. Yeah, for real. And it's like, Chris, jump into what

you were about to say, but I do think that this Players Tribune article that McDavid just came with it's like I I've I've never been more scared uh this the you are so right the the the aura of hockey Canada is real and and you're you're feeling it where you know we're a week away here it's just coming alive with these guys it's it's exciting and like the gal's already being there yeah when he said oh his last win was in Moscow I was like I remember that one yeah yeah right like but that's crazy for a guy that

that he hasn't won in eight years. Like, and you, you don't think about it, but that's what drives, that's what drives those guys. Him and Sid and Nate is like, and that's the biggest thing that I took away from working with those athletes day and day out is like their preparation.

Yeah. Right. Like for us, we're like, oh, we're in Prague. We're having fun. They're like, no,

we have a chance to join, like Sid, join the triple goal club. We're going to win this thing. Yeah. For sure. Right. Like,

like, and like as soon as I think we added him late in 2015. We were in Prague. And we had a pretty good team already. and then as soon as Sid called, I think they got knocked out in the second round. And he called. He's like,

I want to come over. Usually we call guys. Yeah. He's like, I want to come over. I'm chasing the triple goal club. And then the boys like on the bus heard it. And it was like Bernsie and Muz and they're like,

Sid's coming over. Like, oh boy, we better tighten it up now. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Put the booze away. Put the booze. It's so real. You know,

he has that power of, and I could just see it. You know, even when Connor got asked about who should be the captain. He's like, oh, you think you've earned it. And Connor, like, laughs it off.

He's like, not a chance. Well, Sid is still on this planet that I will captain Canada if he is on the team. Yeah. Yeah. God, I love that. Well, Boehner, what I was about to ask was going into, when it becomes the Olympics in 2014, and you're going there, obviously, it's all crazy and huge and security and everything. But is there pressure? Because, yes, you are Team Canada and you're coming off the gold medal.

What was it like going into that Olympics as Team Canada being like, we have to win? We have to win gold. It's every tournament you go into. Look at the world juniors. It's, it's, and people say it gold or bust, the expectation within our media, this side of the border, our players, our program at hockey Canada is win or else from the outside world, everyone thinks it's catastrophic. You know, I look at this year, even after World Juniors, people ask like, is there a development program in Canada? I'm like, seven players were in the National Hockey League. Yeah.

Like, not loaned. That's a first unit power play. Yeah. Yeah. That, like, I don't think it's a development problem. I think it's a one-off minor hockey tournament that you have a bad goal or, You call that a best of seven series, World Juniors.

I think Canada wins all the time. You be too. Yep. Right. But a one off, a bad bounce, a miss call, a puck over glass,

and you don't get Sam Dickinson back or you don't get a player that makes a difference. Hey, the hockey world's catching up, right? But in Canada, it's very much win or bust. And I like that.

But that's every event they go to because we have set that expectation. And I think it's a good thing to have. We're not, we're not comfortable with, you know, oh, it's a bronze, good showing.

It's like, No, and I think that's the attitude for the Olympic team. That's the attitude for every, I think every time hockey Canada players and staff put on the jersey, that's the expectation. Yeah. Yeah, it is unfair that we don't give Canada the grace that people are catching up. And that's not a knock on Canada. It's credit to the rest of the world. You know, but Canada gets no slack on that.

It's like, you're still going to win. I'm like, everyone's pretty good now. And they're like, nope, you have to win. The Czechs play as hard as ever. The Swedes are skilled as ever. The Americans are top to bottom, all, you know, rock. stars like there is no easy Latvia is going to give you everything they got that's the thing everyone that plays team Canada is playing with health money yeah and it's the best punch if you win

like I remember when we were at World Cup of hockey I was with the team Canada so the older guys not North America and our guys did not want to play team North America because they had everything to lose they were the vets they were like these young bucks are coming and if we beat them oh well we should we've all you know 500 plus games in the league and veterans but if if we don't well what's the matter with Hawking Canada. The new waves coming. You know, and it's a lose-lose. They were like, well, you know, we can't, we can't do anything here. It's so real. We're actually just laughing this weekend. We were looking at the top six goalscores in the league right now. Three of them are American. None of those three are on

team America. You're like, what is going on here, US? I want to jump back to Olympics later because we have so much fun stuff to talk about. But, you know, continuing on your journey after hockey Canada, you get into the agenting world. And now it's like, what has it been? Seven years or so now? Seven years, yeah. Yeah. So you've been an NHLPA certified agent working with some of the top players in the league.

How fun has that experience been for you in that transition going away from hockey Canada and all of the allure that comes with it as we just talked about now getting into the more personal side working with players like this? Yeah. See, and I dealt with a lot of agents in my hockey Canada time, right? So I always had agents reaching out to me. I was running the team. So tickets, hotels, hey, can I get access to my player?

So I knew all the agents and kind of what they did. And, you know, everyone thinks it's the Jerry McGuire Red Wine dinners. It's a lot of sports psychology. Yeah. It's a lot of no, I don't know any player that calls their agent when things are going well. Yeah. Right. And that's true.

Yep. That's me included, right? You put out fires for a living. Right. Everyone, whether it's ice time, whether it's an injury, whether it's a trade, whether it's moving locations, free agency, contract, whatever, your phone. rings and for half a second, you go, oh, oh, what, what am I putting out here? Mm-hmm.

Right? And I love it, but, you know, so I went to, I originally got recruited by CAA, so Pat Brouson and J.P. Barry, worked with them for five years, um, both class acts, um, you know, nothing but the best. JP represented my brother Matt, so it was a natural fit. Nice. Yeah, it's perfect. Always the younger brother.

I remember my brother's wedding. JP, when are you hiring me? When are you hiring me? You know, and he just said, keep going with hockey Canada. Get your feet wet, network, you know, get, get, you know, another Olympic cycle or another World Juniors. So yeah, worked with them for five years

here in Toronto and then decided to open up my own shop. You know, I was in the right spot. I love my time at CAA. You know, I think there's pros and cons to big agencies. I think there's, you know,

pros and cons to smaller boutique agencies. Like I opened up with Apollo. You know, we're really focused on the client and having a small client list and only having a couple in a draft class. You know, but I also love working for myself.

I love being able to take on who we want. You know, work with them. see them grow. You know, we're almost in the fall, we'll be three years with Apollo. So our big draft will be next year in 27. You know, we could have three to four NHL first rounders. So I recruited when,

when we were, you know, three, four years ago. So to see that, to see that growth and have it where you control the brand, you control, you know, your marketing. I'm still doing it's entrepreneur life. I'm still running all the Instagram accounts looking for songs. You know, like it's very much a startup, but I love growing with the clients.

And I think it's awesome to be able to kind of, you know, our tagline is modern athlete management because, you know, I can, as in my age, I can relate to the parents, I can relate to the players, right? I can, you know, I have my, my GM contacts through hockey Canada, you know, my time at CAA can still lean on Pat and JP as, you know, with their stature in the game. But I think it's, I think it's the perfect blend of, of, you know, running my own shop, which is always a, you know, running, I think being your own boss is always everyone's dream. And, and, um, I love what I do. And, you know, like I said, it's, everyone thinks it's the glitzy, you know, red wine dinners and draft parties.

It's a lot of, you know, sports psych, frankly. I would say 60, 70% of my job is telling players never, never too high, never too low, right? You win a gold medal or you get healthy scratched as a 16 year old. It's all about long-term thinking, you know, staying in the moment, trusting the process. All the things you think are cliche, but these athletes have all this stuff coming at them now that, you know, I really think, you know, what I've gone through in my life, personally too, that I can relate to being in distress and being anxious about stuff and really having that remove yourself from the moment, give it 24 hours and let's think long picture and really helping our athletes like that by being available, not having too big of a

client list that you don't, you can't track your guys and your players and know exactly what's going on with them. Because I think that's important is actually know how they're playing. Are they minutes down? Are they not playing on the special teams? Are they struggling? Have they on 10 games without a point, right? Or are they on a heater? And, you know, they think that they're, they're all of a sudden a first round lock and you got to bring them back down to earth a bit. You know, and that's part of it is never too high, never too low, right?

And I know that sounds cliche, but I think it's important because through careers, as we know, every athlete's had a major injury. Every athlete's lost in a final. Every athlete has had setbacks, but also had success, you know, and I think you showed it in Connor's article there, right? Right? Like that, that players tribune, he's so hungry to win. He's been to the finals twice and lost and that must just

eat at him. And so, you know, his injury, you know, he had, like, I don't know if you guys watched that documentary, but when he didn't do the surgery and rehabbed his knee solo, like, you know, everyone, you know, Sid missed almost a year and a half with concussions. Like, people, people only remember the highlights. They don't remember the low lights that got them there.

And I think that's important to relate to today's athlete. Yeah. I think it's all, it's such a cool comment, as rewarding as I'm sure it is and going to be when it's like, oh, man, these guys that I recruited when we were tiny are now, we're going to have all these first round picks. Like, that's so awesome from the Jerry McGuire, POV. You're like, we did it. But I'm so with you, dude, that the massive perks now where you guys are at are being

so tuned in and clocked in to your clients. Because I think that goes such a long way for them, where it doesn't feel like, oh, I'm just a number here, right? It's like, hey, I'm aware of what's going on. I'm aware about you the person. Like I know who you are the person even more than the hockey player, right? And I manage each client differently. Some, you know, need a kick in the ass.

Some need a hug. And you only know that by knowing your clients through and through. You know, some parents are involved. Some never played the game, right? Each file is so different. It's not just stock. Here's player A in his draft year. It's, you know, what situation are they in?

What kind of team are they on? How is their, how is their hockey candidate experience? How is their, how are they tracking? What do they need to work on? One needs to work on foot speed in the summer. The other needs to gain upper body strength. So they're not just on the same programs, right? You have to you have to tweak them each individually and because they are individuals.

And they're not just a hockey player that says go do squats in the summer. No, we need to work on if someone needs track work or someone needs, you know, a goalie needs flexibility. Those are things that you have to kind of, I call almost an agent as like a, like a general contractor. You know, I'm not an expert in anything, but you need a power skater, you need a trainer in the summer. need a Bauer deal, you need a contract. I can kind of be that point of contact for everything so the players and parents can come to us and then we can find source it out. So they're not Googling power skating coaches in Vancouver. I have four that we've used. Right. And then

they interview them and and, and, hey, you pick who you want to go with. But I see it as almost like a general contractor role, if that makes sense. And instead of building houses, we're building hockey players. Definitely. And well, Bader, it's like, you know, everything you just said is so fascinating and interesting. And we talk all the time about how the agent athlete, agent talent relationship is one of the more fascinating things in the world because it's like you kind of both need each other. You're almost both courting each other at the beginning. And I'm curious for you and in starting Apollo and what you guys are doing, the more personal approach I think is so important in this space. What is it that you look for in some of these young athletes? You know,

if there's a young hockey player who's looking for representation and is attracted to you guys and what you're building and what you're doing, what are some of the things that you would want them to know, that that's a great thing for a young player to do that's going to make people want to work with them. I think, you know, and I've never seen a hockey school for it is hockey IQ, right, when we're scouting. Yep. You know, I've seen power skating. I've seen shooting coaches.

I've seen, you know, weight gym programs. I've never seen an IQ school. So it's one of those where, you know, we're recruiting. so young now in the agency world that you go to games and kids haven't even gone through puberty, but if they're out there and they see that backdoor pass or they're attempting to, you know, throw, they, you know, they're back checking, like compete, right? They're not just out there, you know, going all tilt in the, in the offensive zone and no, no care about back checking. You know, those are, those are things that we look for, you know, the amount of tips

that I get of you should see this 13 year old, he's got a mustache. I'm like, uh, I'm hoping for a good 25 year old to sign an initial contract, right? I'm, right? I'm, not, I'm not looking at, you know, the standings in the GTHL and saying, let's go get the top 10 kids because they're sick at 13. I want, I like to find that diamond in the rough, the kid that wasn't, you know, at the brick tournament per se, that that, that is a late bloomer that has the character that can think it, that the parents are on board for listening. Because that's a big thing too, you know, as much as they interview me with different

agencies, I interview them as well. Yeah. Because, you know, you don't want to go down a road where you're just barking up a tree and and they don't think that they need an agent, you know, and they don't think that my opinion matters. And not that it, not that I'm the be all end all. The end of the day, I'm an advisor. I'm not a decider. And I always say that, right? If we're in between schools, you know, whether it's a scholarship or a major junior route or whatever, I, you know, I provide my advice based on experience, but I'm not a family decider, right? I don't, I don't necessarily know

their financials, you know, can you go to an Ivy League? Because they don't give full rights. So, you know, it's going to cost you some, some dollars and, and U.S. dollars for Canadians, right? which isn't always easy. Or do you go with the full ride at Quinepiac? You know, so it's certain things that you try to provide all that you can based on your experience. But at the end of the day, the family is going to decide what they do. Yeah. So true.

Are you asked, you don't have to name any names, but if a guy calls and it's like, hey, I'm not, I want more ice time or whatever. The complaint is, do they expect you to know, okay, here are some teams I think you could get ice time at? Like, how much knowledge across the leagues do you, are you expected to know on for those questions? I think it's like not at the drop of a hat. I always say give me 24, 48 hours. Yeah, right. You know, like I can do some homework now within stat and stuff online. You can see, you know, if I'm looking at, say, a 16 year old in the OHL, I can look at what the other 16 year olds are playing, average ice time, you know, power play time, all of that.

So I know, based on facts, if I call a GM and, you know, need to bring it to them, then I do have the numbers to back it up. Yeah. You know, a lot of the time the player, you know, hasn't done things. the right way. And I mean that in that, hey, like, they're not being truthful in that maybe they didn't back check or maybe they weren't great here. You know, they, they never, it's like the gambler. They tell you what they won. They never tell you what they lost. Yeah, it's so true. You know, I'll go back and watch their games and say, hey, I didn't think you were great here. Or, you know, do you agree that, you know, hey, I got benched. Okay, well, I thought you missed two back checks there.

Like, you know, I can call the coach, but I think we got to save our bullets here, you know, because you don't want to be the, you don't want to be the boy that cried wolf all the time too, you know, and I, you know, there's a bit of, I think in our youth hockey, a bit of, you know, let's change it up. Let's just, let's quit and move on to the next thing. I'm a big thing of like, let's stick with a team and build and battle through adversity because what do you think is going to happen when you're a freshman in college? What do you think is going to happen when you're a rookie trying to make the national hockey

league? You're not going to be a top six forward right away. Yeah. You're just not. There's 750 jobs in the NHL and 650 them are on one way contracts. Yeah. So are you one of the top 100 out of the world, not in the NHL? because that's what it comes down to.

Yeah. That's fucking crazy to think about it. It's so true. Yeah. So amidst all of this amazing stuff like hockey Canada, like what you're doing with Apollo, another amazing part of your story was your coming out journey. And there was that incredible article in The Athletic with Pierre Lebrun that was so wonderful. But if you're comfortable, I'd love to hear you talk about you said that you had been out

to your family and some very close friends before you did your public statement with that great article. would you be able to tell us a little bit about when when you came out to them to your family and your close friends and what that moment was like and what urged you to find the strength to do that? Yeah, I kind of knew when I was younger, you know, I was a bit, you know, different, not different, but just not the norm, right? I'm always an outgoing personal guy. You know, I think we've hung out at All Star Games before and like, you know, I'm a bubbly personal guy. And I was just, I was so fearful to lose what I had built at Hockey Canada. that hockey was going to push me out, that, you know, everyone's fear before they come out is that the world's going to turn on you, that you're going to all of a sudden, you know, you're going to

tell a Connor McDavid and he's going to say, well, we're not friends, right? Like, you think the worst when you're about to come out. And it's just human nature, right? And I look back and I laugh now. Now that I've been out five years, like, I'm like, what was I thinking? Right. That was when I did it publicly. I was probably five years before that to my family, right?

but I was always tired of walking in a room wondering who knew, you know, oh, did my mom tell my aunt? And then you get the awkward question, oh, you see in anyone? And you're like, do they know that? Yeah, like, do they know that I'm out? Do they, you know, like, and what's that wink for? And like what, you know, like just awkwardness where you're like, you just live in this world of anxiety. And I just said finally, you know, I ran it by, you know, I think I mentioned in the article there. You know, Tyson is, you know, I was a big confidant when he was playing for the Leafs here.

You know, Morgan Riley, you know, obviously my family. Can you tell that Tice story? Yeah. It's great. With what? It's like you guys are just drinking wine, right? Like it's him and Emma, I think. Yeah.

I don't want to spell the story, but you just said you just blurted it out because you guys were talking about like sexuality. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Emma's sister's gay and she's out and we were just talking about hockey and some like, you know, having as we do with the berries, usually there's a couple bottles of red involved. Yeah. And, you know, he was just like, and I knew Tice kind of knew, right? And like he was still, he was dealing. with the whole Bab stuff and living in Toronto and first time traded.

And he was kind of, his world was kind of upside down too. And I just said, you know what? I'm getting. And he's like, what? And he's like, that's awesome. Yeah. And I was like, I said, well, any, we always joke about it.

I said, well, let's get another nice bottle of wine out. Yeah. Every time I see him now, we go to the cellar. And I'm like, well, I got, hey, Thais, I got something to tell you. You know? Yeah, right. Right. Yeah.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's like, that's your confession room. Like when you go down to the wine cellar, he's like, okay, what now? Every conversation you have like that, you know, like I remember telling Connor up at his cottage in Muscoca, every conversation, you're waiting for a reaction, right? And you think that it's going to be world ending. And then the more that you break down and you're like, oh, this isn't as bad as I thought. The big bad hockey world isn't that bad. Right? They're actually, they actually still think I'm a great guy. And you build up so much fear in your head and anxiety of, you know, over drinking and overthinking and, you know, and just. thinking that, you know, you have to be a certain way to fit into our game. And, and I think we've come a real long way from that, you know, but it's, it was definitely

a time in my life where I was like, scared as hell. For sure. That I, I, I, you know, I was like, I'm going to have to quit hockey. And I'm going to have to, I've built up this great resume and great friendships and, you know, all these gold medals and stuff. But I feel like I'm living a lie. And, and so finally, you know, sat down with Pierre, however, a couple more models of red and we did the article and it changed my life. You know, I broke out in,

I broke out in hives the night before. I called Pierre. I called Pierre at midnight and said, hey, you got to pull the article. I had, like a mental breakdown. And he said, Boehner, it's, it's done. It's sent in and it's going live in a couple hours. Like, I can't. I don't know if he could, but I thank Pierre. I thank Pierre for that. I had a full, like, broke out in hives and had a bit of a melter. And then I remember waking up at five, am and it was ting, ting, ting,

ting, it hit Twitter and the phone went nuts. And I was like, oh my God, there's a lot of people that care about you and care and are empathetic

and are like, you know, just genuine people I hadn't heard from in years, right? And not that I needed it, but it was when you, when you fear that your world's

going to flip upside down, it was such a, such a reassurance that I was doing the right thing. There wasn't, you know, there was a couple trolls online, but hey,

whatever, they're not in, they're not in my contact book. I don't need them. Yeah. You know, and I still get trolls for stuff that I speak out on on Pride jerseys and on Pride tape and certain things. And, but hey, I'm not going to let the haters because from that, we've, we've started

Alphabet Sports Collective from that, you know, I do a lot of advocacy work. Um, from that, I'm comfortable speaking on it, right? I would, I would freeze up before. If you ever asked me, um, if you were told me five years ago that I'd be on talking about me coming out of the closet, I would have thought you guys were fucking bad shit crazy. Yeah. Yeah. Right.

But I would have said, there's no, I said there's no way I'll do that. I'll have a secret boyfriend and I'll, I'll, no, I can't do that. I'll just deal with this my whole life. Yep. Yeah, it's, it's crippling. And now like to come out the other side and, and, you know, be an advocate and have that, that, you know, not mentorship, but now, now youth come to me, right? Now through our not for profit alphabet, like people come reach out to us and, hey, I'm going

through this. And you can reassure them that, you know, don't read the headlines that the NHL is big in bat. You know, read that Morgan Riley marches in the pride parade every year and he's a huge advocate and supporter. Right. And those don't often in our media get public, right? If you, if you were, if you were just a fan and you read the NHL headlines, you wouldn't know that it was only four players that decided to not wear a pride jersey and hundreds were for it. Right. It's, it's the, it's the negative. It's, it's let's not let the naysayers have that, right? Let's let's focus on the good that we're doing and the progress that we're making and not, oh my God, three,

three Russian players or whoever said, hey, I don't want, and all the power to them. But that's, that shouldn't be what the headline reads. Yeah. And, and, and, and I went on the Merrick show and a few and just said, hey, let's try to turn this upside down a bit of, of the narrative that hockey's a homophobic sport. Because I've heard from some of the best in the game that it's not. Yeah. I think that's so well said, Bader. And it's like, it's, you know, something you and I have talked a lot about over the last week

or so, it's like, I think what you're doing, and I want to get into Alphabet Sport Collective, because there's so much amazing stuff that you guys are doing, but it's like there is, you know, there's the negativity echo chamber and the way that people feed into it and they almost want to fuel the fire of any hate or negativity that exists. But there's so much great positivity and growth and kindness and love that's going on. And the movement to push all of that forward is just so important. And I think that that's what I am so impressed with with Alphabet Sports Collective because I think there are a lot of great ways that you're different than a lot of or other organizations like that where it's like the focusing on the good and uplifting and breathing life into the good as opposed to the negatives. It's just so, so empowering.

Yeah. And you know what? I started Alphabet. Well, we started Alphabet Sports Collective because I didn't know where to turn. Five years ago, I typed in gay hockey players online. we didn't have these shows. We didn't have heated rival or we didn't have, you know, what it is. It was still kind of taboo.

And I said, well, why isn't there, you know, there's people out there. Why isn't, why isn't there a common space for this? Why do I have to go to a pride night to feel like I belong, right? Why can't this just be my everyday life? Yep. Right. And, and I think, you know, I don't think it's coincidence that when I came out, you know, a month later, Luke Procop's agent who I know, Jared Johansson text me and said,

hey, Luke saw your story. Can you have a chat with him? right? He did an article with Pierre LeBron, came out the first NHL. Like, that's why representation and speaking your truth, I think matters. And I think, you know, if you're brave enough to do it, um, and get out there and be a face for it, I think that's huge. Yeah. Because, you know, I also, it's part of my story, but it's not my whole story, right? I want to be.

Damn right. Do I happen to have a male partner? Yeah. But like, that's not my defining role. That's not, that's not what I want to be known for. I want to be, but let's normalize that. Let's have those conversations so that we're not. not, oh, it's negative and it's taboo and the NHL and this and that.

Let's, let's have a space where, and with Alphabet, we really bring in the community. We're, we're not external and let's go, you know, do pride nights and all this. We're more get members of the queer community that don't think they belong in the game, involved in the game. Yes. You know, if you like hockey and you're queer, come join us. If, if you don't like hockey because it pushed you away because you're queer, come back. And if you've never heard of hockey and you're queer, come on in.

It's a space for you. Yeah, exactly. Right. It's a safe space where we host watch parties. We host membership. We have meetups. We have mobilization. You know, I'm trying to personally right now get on the hockey Canada board to have that representation, that queer voice. That, that, you know, so when we do make policies or we do make certain adjustments, we have that voice at the table. You know, and that goes for not just players. That's, that's media members. That's fans. That's, you know, you want to be a player. You want to be a referee. You know, our board is made up of such a diverse, at Alphabet, such diverse group. You know, we have trans referees. We have, you know, non-binary people. We have members of the community. We have straight members.

We have this voice that, you know, hey, come on in. It's a safe space. Join us. And we'll get you feeling good because there's no reason to hide that. And we're living proof of it that you can be, you know, successful and be gay in the game. And it's awesome. And why not spread that positivity and that, you know,

really because in the days where you're leading up to it, You're in such a dark spot to have people either that are about to come out and speak their truth or are already out. It's such a turning point for them. And to have that network, something that I never had, right? I never had an alphabet sports collective to go and say, I can talk to an NHL agent that has done this and had the biggest names in the hockey world support. That's one of the coolest parts I think, Boehner is, like you've spoken of Brendan Burke before and how he was somewhat of a pioneer for you. and I think passing that forward is the greatest thing that Alphabet does, right? It's exactly that where you go, this is your, you can see it.

I forget, you had an awesome quote that was like, sometimes if you just can't see yourself in a situation, it's impossible to dream. And what you've created is exactly that. Everyone in this community can see themselves in whatever role they want to have in hockey. And God, that must be so rewarding. And meet them where they're at, right? There's a lot of people that hate the game right now.

They think that it's, they're not welcome. and that, you know, the, you know, people ban Pride Nights and people do this and you read the headlines. I would think it's horrible too. But let's have a conversation because I think I've said it a couple times. The big bad hockey world isn't that big and bad when it comes to this stuff. You know, some of the greats in the game, although they may not be out there on Twitter, they are more than advocates, allies, whatever you want to call it. And, you know, with my network, you know, if they need some support, there's, they're a phone call or a text or something away for, you know, people that are, whether it's self-harming or feeling they don't belong.

really that's what it is, is bringing people together and, and make them feel good because that's that, the day I came out was the best day of my life. And I got to continue my career. I don't think it's a coincidence that after I came out, I started my own company and started my own non-for-profit to lift some weight off my back of worrying about myself and what people think of me, almost like,

fuck it, you like me or you don't. And I, I take that on in my agency role. I take that on an alphabet of, hey, if you've got an issue with it, that's on you.

That's not on me. I've done that for 33 years of my life. That's that that's a you problem, not a me. And I, I'm sure I've lost clients because of it. I'm sure I've not got recruits, but I wear my heart on my sleeve. You know, but I wear my heart on my sleeve for my clients and they know that. And that's why we keep the small client base. And I think it's important to be yourself, especially as an agent, because there's,

you're pulled in a million different directions. Yeah. No, it's so true. And listen, you mentioned it. It's, um, we're talking about the fun and the positivity and the welcoming vibe. Obviously, the past month, heated rivalry did that was such a fun thing. So I really want to know, and I want everyone to hear your take and your perspective on, you know, when this show was coming out, it's obviously connected to the hockey world, something that you're connected to as an out person

and former player and someone in the world. What were your expectations, your hesitations when you heard of this show? And then how did it impact you in relation to your lived experience? That must have been It's so crazy for you watching the show and being able to relate to so much. You know, you and I talked about the scenes when they're in Russia for the Olympics. You were like, I was fucking there. I was in Sochi. I was, you know, like that we were on a legal, illegal to be gay and you get arrested for it. Yeah.

I'm sitting there battling if I should come out or not. Yeah. Yeah. You know, I thought, you know, originally it was going to be a bit hokey per se. You know, I was like, oh, here we go, right? But the more I got into it, the more I had people. And I didn't, like, I wasn't stream. it the first night it came out. I was like, you know, but I had random people that I didn't even

knew, know what hockey was come up to me and be like, what do you think of this show? You know, what do you think of these storylines? And as they got going, right, I thought there were some unbelievable storylines of having to hide it. I've, I've done that. Yeah. Right. I've hidden relationships because the biggest fear is being out it, right? That someone uses your weaponizes your sexuality against you. That's your biggest fear, right? Um, when you're in the, um, when you're in the biggest fear. Um, when you're the closet. But yeah, as it went on, you know, the storylines, the writing, everything about it, you know, I thought was, and the way they did two separate stories, you know, with, with the two separate characters, like, you know, kudos to you guys for, for amplifying it, you know,

and not, you know, making a mockery of it. I think it's important that people see that those are real life examples, right? Those are things that you don't often see. Yeah, is it a fictional show 100%, right? Is it getting people talking 100%, right? People that, you know, you know, didn't love the game before that now we're coming into it. But, you know, those conversations like they had with, he had with his mom at the cabin. I've had that. Oh, man. Right.

Jesus. Like, it was at my heartstrings. I've had that. The biggest fear when his dad found him kissing on the deck there, like, that is someone's biggest fear. When he was having that melter, I was like, oh my God, I can't believe what he is going through. And, you know, like, the fact that it was, you know, Canadian, you know, partly funded.

I'm proud of that, like, on Crave. Like, I think it's, I think it's, I think it's, Awesome. Honestly, I think it's getting people talking about the game and inclusivity. And I think that's only good, right? I think that only breaks down barriers. I think that only humanizes things. You know, I have all my young clients. Oh, did you watch that new episode last night? Like, whenever would they be talking about a gay hockey show, right? But it's kind of normalizing it. And it's kind of like breaking down those barriers that, yes, these things actually happen. And I've lived those, right? Obviously, I'm not an Olympic athlete like that, but I've lived that hiding it. I've lived the, I've lived the, going around the corner so no one sees you, you know, um, you know, all those little things that really hit home from me, um, you know, it was personal and, and it's, and it's special.

And I think what it's doing for the game is awesome. Honestly, I think it's, I think anytime you can have inclusivity and, and Hollywood and all of this stuff involved, um, and in the right way, you know, it didn't feel cheesy. It didn't feel here's the, here's the token, you know, it was, it was, it was, it was, it was, it is the emotions behind it, the long summers away, the having to hide it. But then they brought some comedy, you know, when the dad's like, oh, from before the draft. Yeah. Yeah.

You know, like, please text, please text before you come back to the cottage. Yeah. Yeah. You see people let their guard down in humor and, you know, my dad's the same way now, you know, like with my partner. And like, like, like, I'll show up and he'll be like, hey, boys. Yeah. You never thought I'd say that, you know? Yeah.

Like just, you know, like normalizing it and having that perspective and just, again, like, like you see something out there that, you know, if I would have seen that when I was in the closet, I'd be like, oh, okay, people are cool with this. You know, everyone's, it's the hot buzz. Every time I go on Twitter now, it's about it. That was, that wasn't five years ago when I was about to come out. I was like, oh boy, you know, like now it's almost, you know, but I hope that we take that and do something with it, right?

I see the NHL doing, you know, pride nights or cottage nights. I hope that organizations like that take this and let's let's get Alphabet involved. Let's do something. Let's make actual change. Yeah. as opposed to, yeah, it's fun to say, hey, we're doing a cottage night when Boston and Montreal play each other. You know, I've seen those.

But how are we actually going to drive change and get rid of the homophobia in the game that does exist? You know, go read any online thing when a NHL team does a pride night. It's actually sickening. Yeah, right? And by no means, is it religious? By no means is it, but we're here and we exist and we're successful and we're going to keep being here. And by no means by our section. Are we going to turn away from the game that we love and and create a living in?

Yeah. No, you know, I loved what you just said about, you know, because there's, we had such a blast covering this show and what you just said about doing it in the right way. I think that is something that that deserves more attention. And it's, you know, a big thing that that we kind of did is like the, the authenticity of the story is so important because, you know, you know so many times in media there, there can be a story that's included in a show, in a movie, and it's not real. It's not authentic. It doesn't honor the character. And what I think oftentimes more harm than good is done with that. And we,

you know, we went into the show and we were like, yeah, let's fucking watch this show. But you do wonder, like you said, like, is it going to be hokey? Is it just going to be super sexy and provocative? and the way that those storylines just like the quality was just out of control as it went on and like they pulled us in and you're invested because it felt so real and authentic and that I think is why it stole so many hearts. I think that's why we one of the many reasons why we just loved it. And we keep saying it's like the love fest that it created and the way it got people like you mentioned, we got it too. Friends who were texting us as we were talking about the show and reviewing. it were like, what is this show? Should I watch it?

And we were just like, fuck yeah, absolutely. And it, I can't. Everywhere I go, people ask me about it. Yeah, same. I was like, just like, come on here. Like, settle down. Yeah, settled down. I wasn't the captain and best player of a team.

But no, it's like, you know, I can't tell you too how much it filled our hearts when we got buddies in the NHL who texted us. And they were like, hey, should I watch this show? And, you know, it was literally just like a curiosity of, is it a good show? And we were like, fuck yeah, watch it. And it's like texting with guys. You can tell they did their homework too, because like even this, the situation where his mom's talking about the sponsorship deals, right? Yeah.

And he's all dismissive. And I've been there. I've been like, you know, something happened the night before or you get a bad text or you get threatened to be outed, which I've, I've had happened when I was in the closet, right? Yeah. You go into this snappy. And I remember my mom saying, what's wrong? Right?

Like those are, you know, with, with Ilya being in Russia and it being illegal and him having kind of the fake girlfriend and saying, well, I could just marry. her. Those are thoughts that, you know, you can tell that they did their homework on it of what it's like to be a closeted athlete. And that's what I really appreciated about it was it wasn't just, hey, let's go like, you know, like I thought the hockey was good, but the storyline of the battles and the struggle of what it's like to be a closet athlete at a high level was, was I thought unbelievable. And, you know, yeah, something really cool was, um, that in the, if you take and I'm not, dismissing the KIP character, but I'm just saying the three NHL guys you're with, I thought it was

awesome that you didn't get, they all have to talk to their parents, right? Like you go, Shane has to do it with his parents. Ilya has the fake girlfriend and goes through a lot of it with that. Scott goes through a lot of it with his partner who he's like hiding, right? Like each, I thought it was so cool because Boehner, you go, oh, I had that conversation with my mom. That felt relatable to me. But I know that we have had people message us going, oh, I had the conversation with my fake girlfriend. And, you know, that part was really eligible to me. I thought it was so cool how they hit so many buckets of what that experience is and let people watching it who went through whatever various ones it was feel connected to in that way.

I thought that was genius. Well, yeah, because not every story is very bookend. You know, I'm very lucky in my story that my parents, my family, my friends were all accepting, embracing whatever you want to say. I've heard horror stories of kids coming out of the closet and getting kicked out of their house, right? A coach kicking them off a team, right? So that's, that's why the anxiety exists. You know, I think I'm one of the lucky ones with how my family and how, you know, my life has gone since. But I'm sure there's, there's out there. And I've heard stories of people that it's not as smooth, right? I think, you know, you guys are obviously in Cali. I grew up on the West Coast, pretty liberal, fun, you know, families that get it and accepting. There's, there's some people that aren't. And it's get out of the house. And I've heard those stories and it's sad. But that's why representation and having a safe space to go to like Alphabet or even tuning into the show and getting rid of, you know, the distractions in the world I think is is important.

Yeah. And so one thing I love to ask in this topic and I'm super curious of your perspective on it is, you know, we clearly have seen when something so great like this happens. and we see the growth and we feel the growth and the happiness and the joy in these moments, there are still people who try to tear it down and there's negativity that can leak in. So what are ways that, you know, we all as friends, as allies, like you said, whatever you want to call it, can just keep helping and ways to just keep raising awareness and keep making sure these things improve and gets to that place where it's like, yeah, this is a non-issue. This is a welcome space. The door is open for everyone.

Yeah, I think it's amplifying. using the platform that you have. You know, again, kudos to you guys for, for doing that and having, you know, the live stream shows and the reactions and everything. Like,

it's focusing on the positive. You know, I think in today's world, we can get so bogged down. Like I said with the pride jerseys, like four players said no, a 750. That's less than,

that's less than 0.1% is that that's not even near a minority. So, no, the NHL isn't that bad. You know, it's like, you know, there's players that love this show.

You know, they may, again, that are big supporters that not, you know, but they, they text me, hey, was that what it was like for you? So it's just keeping it positive and not, not the, the naysayers of, oh, well, this is just, you know, whatever. And this is, you know, it's just checking, you know, doing this.

And I think it's important that we keep that momentum going, that we normalize it, that it is people's live stories, whether it's myself or other people out there, you know, and it's not a woe as me. It's just that people are struggling. And I think to bring a light to it. And just because we work in sports doesn't make it any different. Right. I think it actually makes it harder. We live in a hypermasculine kind of, you know, suck it up. Don't, you know, your team first mentality. It's, it's tough to be an individual. And but we all battle something. We all, you know, have something that we don't like about ourselves. But I think I try to live it in my life too is like, focus on the positive. Focus on on what this show is brought. Focus on the stories of people coming out after seeing it. Focus on, you know, that stuff. the positivity, not the, not the, not the online trolls that don't even show their face. And I think it's just, we're giving that too much oxygen.

And I think, you know, I just think it's, it's, it's an awesome thing for the game to get people talking about it. And, and I really hope that the NHL and teams for that matter, take this and, and use it in a positive space. You've now brought in a whole new wave of, of fans. I think I saw something like there was a 400% uptake on Stubhub for a game for like a pride game. And I'm like, okay, let's now the business side of me as an agent says, let's, let's bring those people in and let's have them stay. Right. Let's have them be fans. And let's have them buy jerseys because that's, guess what?

That leads to expansion. That leaves to the cap going up. That leads to more money in the system, which leads to bigger paychecks for me. So let's go. Yep. Damn right. Damn right. Right.

I think more outdoor. Damn right. More fun. Yeah. God. Let's not limit it. Let's, let's keep this thing going in the momentum that it's created. And I think we'd be fooling.

foolish not to it for it to be a blimp on the radar. Completely agree, man. Because you've got this whole new fan base ready to come in and say, oh, maybe it's not as bad as we think. And let's let's capitalize, but let's use that momentum. And just keep this thing going. Agree. Agree.

So perfect transition again. You're a fucking legend at this. You should be a professional podcaster in terms of growing the game, keeping things humming. Got to talk about Olympics with you. As a guy who's been there, I don't need you to shove the Sochi ring in my face again, but I'm going to ask you to do it. There it is.

There we go. Let me get a good look at it too. It's unbelievable. Look at it. Damn, that is really cool. That's the hockey Canada logo on the side. I don't know if you guys know it. Yeah.

Yeah, I know it, Bainer, okay? So you've got so much experience here with hockey Canada, with Olympics, with gold medals. It's ridiculous. what what is this like for for the players for the fans for people attached like i i we're getting so hyped up for all of our new fans who have come in who you know existing fans so many have have not they can't remember the last time we really dove in and enjoyed olympics and hockey with best unbest nchel players we've got the pdub gals going in here they're already there like you know seeing see and erin ambrose there like getting ready for these games

I think they start on like Thursday here. Oh yeah. Oh yeah. They're like by the time this comes out like they're they're starting. So it's like the vibes are already humming. But as someone who's been there, what should people be looking forward to? And like what are you looking forward to? What's storylines?

What's firing you up about all this? See, it's funny. When you're in the Olympic bubble, you kind of you're so much more focused on team Canada itself. And in that, I mean the curlers, the figure figures. Sure, sure. Like I remember being in. in 2018 and, you know, Tessa Virtues across the meal hall there.

And she's competing for gold in a couple hours. And everyone's like, hey, good luck. You know, and then all the players are in the lounge and they know that the, like hockey's the very last event. Yeah. Like I remember in Sochi, we won. And the boys literally had to like go right to the closing ceremonies because it's the very last event.

But you've got snowboarders, curlers, uh, biathlon, all in the village. And they could be done in the first three days. And then they're just tearing it up in there. And you're getting ready for a gold medal game. Right. So, you know, a world championship is one thing, a world cup, you know, it's all hockey. But there you really feel the Olympic spirit, whether, whatever country you're with. You're like, oh, geez, there's that person. And, you know, they're walking through the meal hall with their gold medal.

And then you turn on the TV and they just had, you know, it was a snowboarder that just won is, you know, he's some 18 year old kid from Japan. And you're like, what is going on here? Right. So it's that. You're almost in a bubble, though. And Team Canada does a really good job of that of, of, you know, obviously players have their phone. and stuff, but they set it up so good with like player lounges and never as a player really sitting in his room, doom scrolling being like, oh, we got the US tomorrow. Like you're, you have to come together as such a quick team because one game, you know, I think they open against the checks, like one game and it, you, you could be a bad quarterfinal

matchup. Yeah, right. I think they have like three practices before they go, you know, like before they actually play, which may not even be in the main rink. So it is like hit the ground running. but really not protecting, but creating a bubble around the players, right? And I think they said the same at Four Nations. Like they try to just create this atmosphere because the noise around it. And obviously, you know, like you'll see the Olympics.

Like half of the, like they won't show it on the camera, but wherever the cameras are, half of the lower bowl is booked out for world media. Yeah. Like that's how hard, that's how hard tickets are to get. Like if you could ever get someone in there, if you look back at the cameras, the whole lower bowl is all,

desks and desks and people writing for like outlets that have the media rights and all of that. It's not it's not going to be that Boston four nations feel where it's fights. Obviously there's rules, but it's more, you know, you're going to see bad penalties. You're going to see times where, you know, like a world juniors where you see a bad call or you see, you know, a goal that should have gone in or a Bennington massive save and OT, you know, and like that split to second, it's not a best to seven. It's one game, best on best, but there's no chance that I'm betting against a motivated Connor, Sid, Nate. And nothing against, nothing against you American boys, but like, I know.

I've worked with some of those guys and like a pissed off motivated Connor is a dangerous thing. I told you, man, the Players Tribune article, I read it and I, A, I got so emotional on his behalf. The story about his bachelor party, like being bummed out on his bachelor party. I was like, fuck, man. I just want to give this guy a hug. But then I also finish it and I was like, fuck. Like they are winning so easily. It's ridiculous.

Well, and you know Coop's going to bring them together. Coop is one of the all-time, you know, best coaches. I think he's the longest tenured. But, you know, he was a lot to be the Olympic coach. You know, the way he brings guys together both on and off the ice is second to none, you know. And then you get talk. You get, you know, some of those coaches that are in there, Pete, Pete DeBore or, you know, Misha. You get these guys that I've worked with that you know.

you know, you know, Sid's going to have the boys dialed in, right? You know, he's, he's obviously a Hall of Famer all day long, but this, this puts them in the all time. So you can get this done. Right. And I think that motivation, the, the drive that they have, the, you know, and obviously I worked hockey Canada 12 years. I'm right or die hockey Canada. Yeah, yeah. I'll be ready to go.

And believe me, I've lost in shootouts to USA. They're a hell of a team. And not just saying that, the Swedes are stacked. Yep. The checks. Like, this isn't four nations. This is, you know, I hope one day Russia you can get back in there because I think they're very talented as well. Yeah.

Obviously, world politics is beyond, beyond us. But I think, you know, if they could ever get back in there, they've got, you know, look at their three starting goalies. Like, look at, look at USA's goalies. Insane. You're like, it's fucking crazy, man. Like it is like, it's wild. Yeah. The talent level.

For Four Nations, Bainer, because I was going to ask you this, too, that was such a cool moment for all of us, right? Because we hadn't seen Best on Best in so long. it had been in the years. And it felt like surely you had the same experience we did where I was getting texts from my, you know, basketball friends who are like, dude,

this is crazy. Like everyone was watching hockey for the first time in a long time. Do you anticipate that exact thing again? Or did we get spoiled to Four Nations? And now everyone's like, okay, I get this. I see what you guys are doing.

Or do you think it's going to be even bigger? The players will be very motivated because it is the Olympics and they've waited for it best on. Like nothing against Four Nations or World Cup of hockey, but those are NHL, NHL-NHL-P-A-run events. Yep. Right? This is the IOC.

This is an Olympic gold medal. This is, you know, you think of Athens. You think of like Salt Lake City. You think of, you know, Nagano when Gretz didn't shoot. Like, you know, I was on the World Cup team. And I couldn't like, you know, I couldn't replay every game. But I remember Salt Lake when Mario let it go through his legs to Paul Korea. Yeah.

I remember the golden goal in Vancouver where Sid Yelzigie, right? I can't remember. I can't remember stuff like that from Four Nations. But it's just, it's on another level to say, I think we were spoiled from a viewership standpoint. You know, you get those fights. You're in the Bell Center. You're in TV guarded.

It's prime time, 8 p.m. You know, I just look, like there's a game at 10 a.m. That team Canada is playing Eastern. So that's like 7.15 for you guys. I don't think you'll be screaming at your TV muck and pines. Yeah. Right. Boehner, you'd be surprised, pal.

I'm at King's Head Pub in Santa Monica at 6 a.m. watching Chelsea games drinking Guinness. So I don't know. I'm a Guinness guy too, but you know what I mean. Like, you know, I think the time zone, the rules, but the players will definitely be on a next level. I think, you know, anytime you throw an Olympic gold medal on the line. And I'm just so happy that it's back.

I've been to, obviously, Sochi in 2014 when it was best on best and nothing against non-NHL players, but it definitely didn't have the same feel in 2018. Yeah. Yeah. I don't think, I don't think there's anything wrong with, like, it is what it is. We had great players. We got a bronze. but it's nowhere near what a Connor McDavid and a Sidney Crosby on the same power play is.

And that's just, that's just straight up. That's just straight up facts. Remember that first. On the other side, you've got Kachuk Matthews and Quinn Hughes. You're like, oh, boy,

this is going to be, just stay out of the box. Yeah. Yeah, seriously. So true. I was about saying you met at Four Nations. Remember that first Canada suite and the first peeper that Canada got.

Oh, and he's just like, threw it kind of blind there. Just pass past, just pass, like, no look, backhand pass across the crease goal.

And everyone was like, Yikes. Connorset, Nate. I was like, are you shitting me? And then just, if you want, throw it to McCarer up top. Yeah. If you want, if you want. Just get them a give and go.

Give him a touch. Give him a Tyson Barry assist. Yeah. But, you know, aside from just all the excitement and everything we're all looking forward to, what do you think that the Olympics is going to do and can do for the game, both the men's and the women's game of just, like, new eyeballs. You know what I thought was interesting, Bainer is like, T.J.O., she's a really good friend. We've talked to him a lot, and he's obviously so vocal about how the Olympics made his career.

You know, it's like he wasn't a household name, and he then has the shootout moment, and then, you know, he gets a great deal with Washington when he gets dealt over there, and then he wins a Stanley Cup. I think we're beyond the point now where, especially with the U.S. and Canada, maybe, you're not seeing guys on this team that you're like, never heard of that guy. You know, it's like everyone's so good that you're like, not only do you know who's on the team, you're losing your mind about the guys who aren't selected on the team. So, you know, what do you see as what these games can do for our game as a whole? I think anytime you get the best players competing against each other, it's great.

I'm all for, you know, yeah, club teams, but there's 32 of them. Let's get it right. It's diluted, right? And I don't mean diluted. Every player belongs in the National Hockey League. But if you can stack up, you know, what team Canada has in their top six, you know, just to watch it, to see that speed. You know, I think John Cooper said it after his four nations. Like when he went after that final, he went back to the NHL and it felt like it was a lesser league.

Right? Just because of the speed that they play with and the the drive and the emotion and, you know, whether it's on the female side, they battle. They go head to head. You know, their club teams too now with the PWHL. Oh yeah. Their teammates one day and, you know, I'm sure Connor and Leon are flying over beside each other. But if Canada plays Germany, they're friends off. Yeah.

Same with Canada, USA. And that's what I think is the best about it, you know, is that. that anytime you can showcase the game's best. And I think the Olympics is shown in like something like 200 countries, like have media rights. Yeah. So whether it's France, whether it's whatever, they all know Canada, USA, Sweden, checks, you know, whichever it is.

But the more eyes you can get on the game, the more you can grow, right? The more exposure, the more revenue, the more showing that our game's awesome. And I think it's the hardest game in the world. Not only do you have to fly around full contact, but you have to do it on thin ice. blades. Yep. Right? The craziest thing I did.

Yeah. Basketball, football, baseball, you can just run. That's a pretty natural thing from the age up. The first thing you have to do in hockey is learn how to skate. Then you have to do it at high speed and then have running, someone running at you into a hard wall with a frozen puck. Yeah. When you actually break it down, like for non-hockey people, it's actually clinically insane what

these players do. No, it's, it's mental. I always say it's like when we talk about the athleticism needed in this sport, it's just unmatched. Like you're doing everything in any other sport on on skates with 50 pounds of equipment and a stick in your hand. It's fucking ridiculous. And full contact. Yeah, yeah. Let's not, let's not forget that part. Yeah. Well, listen, Bainer, I mean, I'm as fired up as I could possibly be for the Olympics now. So thank you very much for that. Can't wait to have my heart ripped out. But don't jinks it. We're going to, we'll get on after if there's a good battle or maybe before

the finals break in a lot of it. There you go. I love that. Um, you, I can't thank you enough for, for it for your time. This was such a great chat. I hope you know how much good you're doing for the world with every facet of what you're working on. So to come on here and share it with us means the world. Before we cut you loose, tell everyone where they can find Alphabet Sports Collective, where they can find Apollo, how they can get involved, how they can help, all of that stuff. Yeah, we're online, AlphabetSportscollective.com, you know, through my socials, Bain P, happy, even anyone that's struggling. You know, I'm, I'm a resource, you know, whether you're, you're listening and you say, hey, I don't want to, you know, I don't feel safe or whatever, or you just want to chat.

You know, I deal with people all day long, clients, non-clients, you know, so, you know, with Apollo, same thing. At Apollo athletes, we're building the base. And hopefully in the next couple of years, you're going to see some first rounders and, and some guys, some guys in the National League that I'm proud to have brought up and along. And same with Alphabet. We're going to continue to grow and, and bring people in and meet them where they're at and, you know, not, not push people away and get on online Twitter wars and all that. I think meet people where they're at and bring them in and educate and humanize and let's keep this thing going. Yes, sir. I absolutely love it. Well, thank you again, brother. We'll get you back on soon. Cheers, guys. Thanks so much. When it comes to nicotine,

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And they've let us take some sneak peeks, and it is so funny because literally it's like, dude, it's literally like Terminator, you know, but instead of like Jacked Arnold coming up, come with me if you want to live, the, it's Sam, it's Sam Rockwell in like a dude, a strainer helmet. He's absolutely out of his mind. The vibe is so good. It's going to be so funny, so action-packed.

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Professor, you are looking rather ragged today. Well, Daniel, I must admit, for a piece of content last night, I, I sprinkled powder, gold-bond powder into my hair. You did. And to appear older, as if I need any help in that category. And then I got, I forgot about that act and went to go to sleep last night. And I did think to myself there's a lot of powder in my hair. Now your pillowcase. Yes, yes.

And so then I give it to the old rinse. I did a rinse, but not, you know, a shower. It was more of a rinse. But then it was caked in there. In a way I had not anticipated. And I'm still recovering, to be honest with you. Still recovering. You have a PhD.

You're not a scientist. Correct. And listen, the content is king. And the video will sing. The video will sing. So it's worth it. It was worth every tangle. I anticipated that your ragged looks might come from the fact that our mega parlay last week was utterly terrible.

Well, I would say this. When we read the matchups, I read them in order of the puck drop. And so sometimes when I'm checking the scores in real time, the next on that Saturday, I'm going in chronological order and you can only win you can only get them all right if you get the first right so sometimes you lose immediately and I tuned in to the mega parley on Saturday

and it began as such gentlemen kings yes Avs yes pens yes on a row and I thought to myself we are living on a beach we might do it we might finally do it we quite literally will move to a beach but then cats no sharks no Canes, no, sabers no, devils no, aisles no. One of the worst runs in the history of the professor's set was absolutely shambolic, as they say.

Miraculously, miraculously, jackets, yes. Canucks, no, and Feeney will answer for his crimes someday. That, Professor Feeney will answer for Professor Feene. Mammoth, no, wild yes, knights, no, five and nine. The worst we've ever done. The worst we have ever done. But we could always do us. Always do even worse.

Watch me. Speaking of Watch Me, the life on the line, the worst we've ever done. Knights, no, sabers no, pens, yes, sharks no. I went oh and two, I apologize. As you should. Get your act together, sir. Both games were so close, it was not, it shouldn't have gone that way. I should never, I could not believe the sharks lost either.

It depends, the pens, the pens. You bet on the pens, oh, good happens. Everything else is a fucking disaster. However. The Friday Fade pulled us out of the trenches. Surely, as it always does. Yet again, the blue jackets with a Charlie Coil hat trick, Fade delivered.

We continue on the heater. Fade, it should be studied by other scientists. The Saturdays celly, we had Matlin Celebrini to score against the pathetic and woeful flames. We are pathetic and woeful. The shark's loose. Turns out we are pathetic. However, again, the Sunday. a hat-trick palais, we had the Keynes Money Line under six and a half and a Seth Jarvis point,

the Keynes won three-two in overtime, Keynes Money Line, the under, and Seth Jarvis with an assist on the O-T winner by Arho. What a moment. And that is a delicious bet for the people who are doubting me. With one single play, all three became real. It's incredible. And I will say, The Hattrick Parley is a lovely payout. It's a lovely payout. So I enjoy, enjoy the winnings. We are giving you brilliant, brilliant things. We did get greedy, slightly, and tried to entertain you even more on a Sunday with the stadium series.

Hatrick Parley bonus bet. Tampa Money Line, Coutcher off point under 6.5. Well, Tampa did win, and Cooch went off. four points, including an incredible 1T game tire. Brilliant. However, there were 10 goals

scored. So the under was obliterated. I did, however, in that game make a bet of Tampa Money Line and the over right before Puck drop.

Well, thank you for telling everyone, including me. I told the entire Noel Cain team. We were there. But... You were there. You were there.

You were there. So, listen, the fade hits the season. Selly misses, the Hattrick Parlay hits, the stadium series parley misses. You've come out on top. Absolutely. You've come out on top.

Yes, so here we are. We are, this is a Thursday that you're listening to this. And we have the Olympic break coming up. Thursday, the fifth is the last day of games. Which means there's no Friday fate. We don't have a fade. There's no Saturday, Selly. We don't have a Sunday Hattrick Parle.

Yes. So we are simply going to adjust. We will do life on the line. We will do Megapalay for the Thursday's slate. walk us through professor uh professor no no no

I thought we are going to go because of the similarities to uh a doctor Watson we'll be doing a doctor Watkins Dr Watkins

uh you will be participating in this you simply say who you think will shall win when I call on you do I have to have a British accent too No you do not But I would say

if you'd like to Yes We'd love it I'll rant I'll date Oh, yes, that's a pretty important I guess I'll date Daniel, Daniel

Jack the Ripper over there Daniel Would you like to begin? Oh yeah, we'll start with you, Daniel Daniel, pens at sabers I will take the pens Christopher, Isles at Devils I'll go aisles

Dr. Watson Cains at Rags I've got to go canes Yes, yes It's very smart Daniel sends at flyers This is brutal I'll take the

Flyers Finally a home team Daniel finally home team thank you Christopher Preds at caps Give me the caps Give me Logan He will be playing

Yes we don't know I suppose Give me the caps I would imagine Tuneup I'm not sure But I don't know That's the tricky part Dr Watson, cats at bolts

Oh, we got our bolts, don't we? Yes, yes, Watson, yes. And Daniel, kings at knights. I think I'm going to take the kings. Yes, the knights did burn you last week. They did. This is a good adjustment by you, Daniel. The Mega Parley, Live on a Beach.

Thursday edition. Pens, aisles, canes, flyers, caps, bolts, kings. Lovely, lovely work. I think the slate's very nice. I think it could do well for us. Lovely work. Now, the question becomes, if your life was on the line, and we have four games to pick, which four will we go with?

How would you like to do this? Because I did, I dropped the ball last time. We alternated and I went second last week. Is that right? I don't know. To be quite honest, I don't know. Well, I think whatever we did went horrible. We'd ride the warmer hand, not the hot hand, because you don't have that.

Alternates, why don't you go first and we'll see how we do. Alternate, leg one, leg one of the life on the line. Palais. In Nashville, they need to stay calm. But Ovi's in his office and he'll be shooting. It may be raining clap bombs, but at least they're not the ones from Putin. I know. Oh, fucking hell.

Well, Cab's money lie. Not his most ridiculous, which is good. All right, my first. Cooch scores two points a night. Kachuk still isn't quite right. The Battle of Florida may have officially swung. Cats are in a serious drought,

and time is starting to run out. The fat lady has maybe already sung. Tampa is so fucking back. Florida must get back on track, but Panthers fans are starting to fear. Cats may have nine lives, but hide your kids, hide your wives, because bolts are pounding everyone out here. Tampa, Moni, La. Excellent, excellent work, professor.

Excellent work. Excellent work. Right, right, oh, cheerio, cheerio. The next leg, the next leg. the islanders let Schaefer run free with no tether and he's put the league on notice while the Hughes brothers have played even worse together than the brothers on the white lotus

I don't know those two brothers had chemistry frankly they might have done bad for being honest they might have performed better. They at least got results. They could finish. They could finish. They could finish.

They might not remember it. All right. Our last leg of the life on the line parley. Two Cinderella's. It feels like Coachella, because both fan bases are rolling on Molly. Sabres and pens are both fun again. Buffalo folks are starting to feel jolly.

With players' minds on Milan, their focus may be gone. Taysian Rass have their minds on Milanese. But Sid is no child. His mind will be dialed. Sabers lose because they got lazy. Penn's Money Line. Excellent. Life on the line.

Caps, aisles, bolts, pens. Enjoy your winnings into the break. Treat yourself for something spectacular. because we will be in Italy and you deserve something nice too. Melanese. Yes, yes, yes. Okay, let's, no ad. We'll watch this.

We will disappear in three, two, one. Thank you so much to the professors for those delicious picks. Hopefully they did better than last week. That would be great. Make sure to get those in right now because it's Thursday. We've got the Olympic break coming up. We're going to close this episode out with a fun game. This one is called Trivia Factorial.

So I've got a player in mind. I've got questions for Chris. First one is worth 10 points. The next is 8, 6, 4, 2, and 1. If he guesses wrong, he's out. And I get zero. So he can go on down the line. Are you ready, sir?

Yes, I am. I suck at this game. It's my least confidence. You just have no courage. You have no courage to guess. But I also just don't know. Yeah, neither do I. Question number one, worth 10 points.

Despite having plans to join UMass Amherst, this American player decided to go to the OHL, where he spent three full seasons before jumping to the NHL. That's a great 10-pointer because I could have gotten that if I had happened to have known it. Yeah.

Almost went to UMass, did three OHL seasons and then went to the NHL. That's all you've said. Yep. Okay. And he's an American player. American player. H.L.

Frankly, I gave him a lot. Yeah, that's why I was a great 10-pointer. That's a great 10-pointer. I do not know. Move on. Okay. Question number two worth eight points. With the Erie Otters, he set a franchise record with over 50 goals and 100 points in his rookie season, winning CHL rookie of the year.

In his three seasons with Erie, he became the Otter's all-time goals and point score of any OHL player born in the U.S. He won CHL player of the year and is one of two players to score 50 goals and 100 points in all three years of their OHL career. Wow. Wow. Wow. All right. Really? Wow, he's really good. That is sick. Oh, yeah. That is a sickness.

Okay, so he, and you haven't given me any time period yet, so I don't know on age. But I have to believe this is, I have to believe this skill translated to the NHL. So I'm just thinking of like an all-time American scorer, someone who's pumping in goals, past or present. I'm going to give you a hint, okay? This guy is very current. Okay, so he's current guy. This isn't some like old school. It's an American guy who is scoring a ton of goals in the league probably.

Certainly he's doing all right. And he did it. He lit up the OHL. Lit it the fuck up. Yes. Damn, damn, damn, damn. We're going to move on. Yeah, go to six.

Go to six. I think you could get it on this one. Okay. Question number three worth six points. In his rookie year with the Chicago Blackhawks, He became the second youngest player in franchise history to score a hat-trick, four days younger than Jeremy Roanick. He then became the youngest Hawks rookie to score two hatricks, and then the first Hawks rookie ever to score three hatricks, and the first U.S.-born rookie to do so since Tony Granato in 1989. His 28 goals and 52 points earned him Blackhawks player of the year.

Okay. I'm going to guess. Whoa. But I don't know if this is right. But I just, if it's, I'll die on this. I'll happily die on this. Yeah, okay. Because I'm like, what?

Yeah. Okay. I'm hoping you went very topical to reward a great American. Is it Patrick Kane? No, it is not. Fuck. Damn. How is he not the best scoring Blackhawk ever?

In question number four for four points, despite great talent in the Blackhawks' teardown of 2022, they traded this player to the Senators for the seventh overall pick, 39th overall pick, and a 2024 third round pick. He played a full season with the Sends, but then refused to sign as an RFA. He was then dealt to Detroit for Dominic Kubalik, Donovan Sabrango, and a conditional 2024 first round, or a conditional 2024 first and a 2024 fourth. fourth. Cat? Yeah. Question number five, with two points, even though he's a top five in the NHL in goals, this exceptional U.S. talent was not selected for the 2026 Olympic roster, and for one,

a spin on his last name, this player's nickname is Cat. I actually was weirdly thinking, Kat, but I couldn't remember where he played. And then I was like, it must be, Kainer must have set all those records of like, he, I feel like he was pumping in goals. Yeah, maybe not hat tricks, though. Maybe not tricks. It was just tricks. Where did he he play? Who? Caner? Yeah.

Uh, la la la la la la la la la la I actually don't know. Because I couldn't remember that's why I was like I don't know. Or did he play just in high school? Bum, bum,

bum, bum, must be a dev program. But no, no, OHL London Knights leading them and scoring. Oh shit, he was in London. That's right. That's right.

So I'm like, fuck. He was in the OHL too. That was not being tricky. That was a goal score. I think that's the first zero ever, but I'm happy that I guess. Yeah. When you said top goals like this is also top.

We've been talking about cattle. Actually, if Kane hadn't just become the all-time leading American score, I think I might have been like, I was like, oh, he's definitely doing Kane. I know why he picked him. Fuck! Well, we got our first goose egg from CP. Comment's going to be so pissed. People knew cat early.

Huff stuff. All right, folks, that is it for us today at the MDNs episode podcast. Go on Spotify, Apple. Leave us some five-star reviews. Show us some love because we love you guys. We can't thank you enough for all of your support. always. Check us out on all of the things. We've got Olympic merch coming out. We've got a live show. Yes, sir. On Saturday, if you're in the L.A. area, come to the Westside Comedy Club.

We will be there doing a meet and greet before, having some drinks with you all. We're going to do a fun little episode. Rip it up. It's going to be blast. So, yes. Sean's, Sean will be there, too. Sean will be there. If we got any Sean fans, Sean is going to be there as part of the show. So if you're in the LA area, you need some fun plans on Saturday. Come to the show. We still got a few tickets left on sale. It's going to be a blast. Again, five-star reviews.

Subscribe on the YouTube. If you want to see more of us, we've got a ton of Olympic content coming up. Jack O'Callaghan, U.S. gold medal legend coming on the show. We'll be in Milan next week. A lot of fun stuff coming up. A lot of interviews, a lot of guests, a lot of great stuff. So we'll see you then. Can't wait to see you in Italy.

Can't wait to see you on. Saturday if you're coming to the show. And until all of that, skate hard.