Endgame with Gita Wirjawan - Rachmat Kaimuddin: A New Chapter of an All-Commerce Unicorn

Episode Date: August 4, 2021

Rachmat Kaimuddin, the only non-founding CEO of an Indonesian unicorn, shares his contrarian views on the online marketplace business and how Bukalapak's unique narrative—robust but adaptive, empowering as opposed to disruptive—has a special place in the country's internet economy landscape. In collaboration with Bukalapak.

Sometimes, sometimes if you know-caternobarctic, that's like that's synonyming. Yeah. Yeah, there's been many things that we can work on. And, for example, which was not to make make sure, but how much the way to give tool to the barrens, so that they can be modern retailer. And without need, this, you know, what, yeah, what, investation, and sogainment.

So, yeah, that, you know, that's mindset we're. we always try to remind ourselves, yeah. If we can, it's making something to make something more than, or rather, as a ecosystem, it's more than just, that's what we think of. This is end game. Hello, my.

Hello, my friend. Hiymed Kymuddin, Bimpinan or CEO of Bukalapap.com. Today, wewantara our format is a bit better, making it's about there is protocol of the health of the new. Rahmat, what about? Good, Patita, how about?

Okay, okay, I'm going to talk with you. Maybe we're just like that we're going to talk about when you're the last little, you know, tell you'd, there's, there's life in there, there's been a new, or what's been very important, or that's very important, that's very important, and to the next. So, thank you.

So, my, this, this, this, this, in Makasar. So, in Kota Makasar, in 2009. If I was from from from from from from from Maccasar, there's a lot of time one thing, that's not that I've never

I've never, I'm from there, I'm from, I'm from the mobile. Okay, that's by design or by default? Unfortunately, not not by design, So that's right of my husband's in the boughamongubah, so he's back in the family, he wasa, come in a brojol. Oh, Lama, okay.

And when I was like, I said, I had to have used to push casmas, to help, for help, it's been iru, it's called. So, that's it named Rhammed, because it's been saved, Oh, very interesting. It's very, very.

I'm from Bulubah, yeah, is very legendary, with many things, including to make up to construction capo-cafal finisi. That's out. If, my assal of the... Mya'a'a'a from the city Wajob.

But, I've got to work at when that was PNS in the Department of Pertanian, in Makasar. Okay, okay. So how is the way of the school? Yeah, so when I was in the last I'm from a lot of the SMACA, to Mughan and Monsarra. From there, three years in Magelang,

that's the first we're, like, it's like, school in java. And after that, then after that, then after that, from Magelang, got rejuice to MIT, so to America, that's kind of, that's about? Warrison. For example, to Magelang, is it

a decision, or more than the other? That's my, Pagelang, is, but, but... Okay, okay. ...enaric. Maybe, So, so that's when I was at one of the same time I'm at one SMP. So, when I was a little, all of usia-school.

Then, my brother-in-law, the first, got BASISSyswa to Bandung, at the S-M-A-Band-Um at the HM-Ti-A-Band-U. And then, past S-MP, I also think, how can I, so I can help people-tua, not-n-n-insah-haw-in. then. And then class class 3, from the class 3rdrauma, this ishma,

ashrama, it was one of the best schools in Indonesia. Yeah, that's school. And the most interesting for me, is, is, gratis. So, when we're thinking, wow, this, do you may, if, if, if, if, can't even if you can't bring up,

it's just to make up. I can't even if I can't even if I can't even if I'm going to be able to get it. Tell you, what's the time in the Ussentara is what is that you are you very passionate, more to empirical science, or to social science, or to athletic, or to, or music, or a or something? Yeah. So, so,

we're always, you know, we're looking at a lot of kind of, yeah, yeah, a lot of people who are in the time order, right? PATH, we think that, if we'll look to look,

career that's safe, you know, but I'd need to be a tentara. So I also one of the time of the time, want to be a lot of, can't, inso, P.N., and, you're all kinds,

in there's it's quite, it's quite for the world of the first. There's a lot of people, there's been decontrination that's really, yeah, the intuiness, we're always be given,

that, look, you, that, privilege, in here, d'a, this is, this is, this,

this, so, so, So, so you always the good, and you always you owe it to the country, at some point you have to be leader of this country, that's always very, in the gaddle.

You are a leader, now. But, as well, from the academician, maybe, from the academician, what, what, what, what is being magnet? Yeah. So that's interesting, it's the thing's three aspects. So the aspect of the badian,

aspect thesmapton just money, which is physical, and academic. Now, I'm not sure, I'm not sure that I'm excel, that it was in-a-cadmiral-class and so many-naut-needed. If you're just mediocre, like, just. I just like I'm just like it. It's not just like it. Okay.

So, I was in a case of a couple of course I've got to come up competition and competition of national, and the last, the time it was also, to give mewakili Jawa-Tenah, Lomba, Cerdas, Cermat, Bhas,

Cermat, Bhasa, Then we had won't, after that I'm going to be selected. Wow, that. Outerbriousa. So I think, oh, I think that's, I think, oh, like, yeah? Wohempsiata in Canada, yeah?

Yeah, ma'am. Yeah, ma'am. Wow, bison. And then, ma'am? No, sir. That's the first time of the other than Indonesia, I'm getting from the continentia.

Okay. So, the Olympiadia, can, there's matematic, physical, they're more mature. So, that we were about trial batch. Training's just two mingu, when we're coming up like, okay, oh, this is it.

But yeah, good experience, like, for us, for us. Yeah, yeah. Yep, we're getting medalling, Indonesia. Good, very, like. Although it's not, but you can't get in MIT? Yeah, yeah. Al-Hardulah, sir.

Yeah. Now, then, how about, to, why to MIT? Not to ITB, or to ITS, or to UGM, or to U.S. Or to U.S. How about? Yeah, that's the story, is also, it's not, yeah?

So, I'm not up-pickering. or not up to be able to doorking, like MIT and so many. Nimpie just, not borkanee, sir. No, no idea, yeah, the idea. So, I'd be able to dole my son, he's in ITB. So, somehow, this I'm going to be a lot of, so on the, just back from Olympiada, one day, So the day-p-p-p-tranet-n,

I'm-lilus, I'm-lux-n-p-t-n. And after I'm not-lilus, I've got, there over, from the friend of my other-tua-sai.

Yeah, to beck, so, he said, he said, he said, when I'm going to be able, he said, he said, yeah,

if, if, If there's papa, don't worry about your child's education, if we can't support. If we're supposed. Outer-bishop. So, he said, wow, she Rahmatt, me, tinter, too, kind, too. Try just, he's daftar school in US. If, if we can go to the top schools,

we'll try support. Now, I'm after. And, I'm rejiki, I getterima, take my, Tita, Tata. So, yeah. It's not very much, baroqueh, baroqueh. Not easy-you-like, that's for me. Rejewy-btsy-bucked-bucked-you-to-do, then you?

Yes, right? So, ma'et, I've got to try, I've got to have, I've got... Eclatic passion I've tried, I've got toftar technique chemia, But I'm still in electro, and I'm going to be like I'm going to be able to learn. Were you a good student, or excellent, or okay, okay, a lot?

At MIT, I'm just-bias-bias-a-bysed, ma. Many goal at the time, it was quite simple. How much the way to be able to lose, quick, quick. So after first year, after that got got a lot of good. And then I thought, I think, yeah, I'd have, I'm going to finish three years. I'll finish education weekly.

Good, good. Then, after lus, how? Kirta-turb-d-at-law or long-mung-mill S-2? S-2-2-9-9-1-6-6-6-a-old-old-old-old-old-old-old-old-old. I was I was a F1, I'm at the F1 Visa OPT, yeah, optional for the training. So I worked in Boston, as a hardware design engineer in one of one of the

tester equipment in there. Now, it's interesting, if not that's right, right, if that's not that, that's a lot of MIT, too, that's right? And then, at the OPPI,T, I was all right? Actually, when I was the day I work was, this,

there was 9-11 in America. Ampun, yeah, yeah. So, what, America is, so, it's a place that's very It's interesting for gendal. If we want to come up jubat just at Cambridge, when it was at the police line, so we're...

But it's not-pap-a-papes, actually, not even when it's not, that's the people who, who can't, maybe, maybe, have had been a ethnicity, that's that,

right, I'm not. like Latino, like Latino or Vietnamese. Or not as I'm not as if, who, who, I'm like, who, I'm not know, who's, I'm not sure, that's not quite, but after that, I'm thinking, too, when I was thinking, when I was back to H-1B visa, process it took a while, because omelight security clearance is more long, and my name is very conducive, my name is Muhammad Rahmat Kaimudin.

So, yeah, usually when I'm going to be able to ride a person like random check, you know, man. No, no way. And I'm not even, and name's my name only, I used to get random check, if to go to. But, yeah, a lot of the name. But they'd look at passport, right?

That, that, that, before. So, I think, yeah, and, I'm going to go where can back to Indonesia. So, when I'm going to take visa, visa's long, visa's long, I've gotter BCG also, and, al-Dolns, so I'm going to get it, so I'm going to get a lot, so after, finally, got a chance to get a chance, too, for AMBELAS II, sir, sir.

So, yeah. Now, that's what, to Stanford? not to the other, because Silicon Valley or there's a factor line? First, because we're trying to try to look ranking just, like that. As far as top schools. BCG is also very picky, for which he wants to sponsorin, and then.

I, I guess, I'm, to be able to dovetar to, this. just what other, like, some of the other than what I've got to docketer, I'm having from almost everyone, to call my amateur my own, not, not cast interview. From the other than the other than maters'amater of Pagita gave interview, Stanford, cast interview, but I'm not looos, but I'm errone in our life. I was not lulles, first time.

But what I felt is, I fall in love with the process. So, that's funny. So they're discuss. It's funny about. If you're like, sometimes, the process is like, hey, we are very competitive school, are you good enough,

to move? If Stanford is, oh, come here, come here, and then, after that, it's just. But I'm just like, this is funny. It's just like that. That's been given illusy

kirkmatan, before reject. Yeah. So, I applied, when that, I applied Stanford again. And second time around, I was that I'd be termed. And I'm, there was thinking, too, because this is in the island valley. I've ever seen in the East Coast.

Yeah. What's, of, uh, what, I'm not quite, Stanford is also very good, very good university, so I think, that, yeah, I think to,

yeah, I'm going to be able to, this, this, since lulus S-1, had to consulting, Lus S2,

Pudal Languana, yeah, can, to private equity, to real sector, then, much, like, before we've got to be about, but, but,

in your, whether you, is, is very good or okay, okay, okay,

for you can't put up to what, what, what, so, what, so, so, so, so, so I'm going to be able to C.G., and, after that, to, MBA, I was that, I'm really, I have, what, yeah, mindset, generalist, sir, so.

So, so, maybe, we'll see it, we see a big picture, big picture thinking. And, t'n'tenotally, we've been able to beaure many studies and started making, like, yeah, from business management, from leadership, from investations, from, like, HR, and all kinds. So, so, so, back, first, I'm, first, I'm, actually, I'm just as investas.

So when I'm back, like the Stanford, I'm going to meet like Warren Buffett, like Jim Coulter, Tom Stiers from Farallon, like, in this, how do you create value by allocating capital?

At that, it, it's interesting for I think a decision, like we can't benefit, that's if we're right or wrong, that's for me. But after that, in QFAT, we have philosophy also very much, so. So, the person that said, if Tom and the people, it said, if you're going to deal, you have to prove that you can run it, and you have to monitor it, until can't exit. So if we've been build, if we're to be parachute, so the CFO, that's the company. And that

made me make me make sure, I'm going to learn many, where, maybe, I was learning a lot of people who, people who are people who are very high-educated. And if we're in real sector, basically, we're getting, yeah, all of, yeah, like, like, more heterogeneous, like. If we're consulting, in investment banking, private equity, can, we can't be able to be like what I'm talking about.

You know what I'm talking about. For the sector, we can't work from the baratiness, like physical, and that's a partegis, that's for me, for example of life. Yeah. Empircali for whatever all that I'm taking. Multi-mary, yeah. From the blue-color-bancel-buckolour-bucked to white-collar,

spectrums, that, luas. Now, then, if I'm not, if I'm not that, variations you, you're very very positive. We're trying to talk about Bucalapak.

When you're going to make up to make upuadai Bucalapak, can be said, how, the procession, from the sysi external and from the

internal of you, and from the first time I was the approach and the founders, sirhounders, pasting the first, but it's very uncommon, really, really, like, is, not there's Mazzaki, there, but he said,

but he said, no, I think, we're looking, that we're trying to professional, and, like, Mr. Rahmatt, that's profile is to beauch. For me, for me, there's about that I'm thinking of my opinion because I always think I'm not going to take care for something I don't have any kind of care of enough to be able to be doing good.

The other, but the first, I'm feeling honored. And then, the second, this is, this is, this is, This is like, like, this is the way of it, like, it's a lot of life, like, jodoole of my life, because, like, in the time, sometimes, there are things that can't doork us to get something, like, not-loss on the time, it's going to be like MIT.

And, I've got, I have, I have, my own, my own, my own, I, which I've told me in essay, I, at the site of the application MBA. The point, what is your career expedition in the future? And I published at some point, I'd be a leader in a certain point, that's a big impact to the society.

Of course, there's a type of my name for my own, or the government, or government. When that, when Bukalapak offer came about, I think that, I think, my way to fulfill the promise. Because Bukalapak and it's from the first of the

social impact is as one of the pillar that's the... At the time, I think, okay, I check again, I'm going to comeana, the a way way, what is the expectation, and sogainer.

And I think, okay, bismillah, we'll take this offer. If I may ask, there is one or two factors that make you ragged? Or make you make you say no? Or everything else was okay? So it's actually, it's like this, publicly available information

so when I joined Rukalapak in 2019, the discussion is at the end in the last year. Situationing that, we're just, we're just, we're just, we're doing, just, shift. And that's one of the

there's the data, like, like, reputation, until there's who's who's going to lose like Bukalapak, go bankrupt, and so many so much. So it's not ideal, to run. So this, maybe not my own personal thing, because I've talked to people, yeah, I've done to do diligence to people who can make decisions, that gives me information, but from the people,

the people are the same. They're talking about. I'm going to. And then... Yes. Yes, so. Bisikin, right? Yeah, can?

...saptain, there are people whogey-pugalii-saiaean in the time that long, he's in the nuneukey, please, don't, don't, don't, this, this, on, here, this, at you know, because of them, because of the same way. But I'm like that. But I'm like a national asset. This is a national asset. And this is rare opportunity. And, this is what, yeah, something that's maybe I can add a lot of value. But if I'm like in the time in the time in the time I'm sure,

I'm sure, bankers, bankers, senior, that's more jagued than I, that's, that, and this, maybe, what, yeah, optimisation resource only, I think. I'm, because,

if she, if, he, in Maccaser, he's to be in service, If you're like Bukhalapak, it's what? So he's not going to hear about. So he's not. He's asked, but I've got to tell me, but I finally gave you guys, and if my wife,

he always percée with the conclusion my own, just, yeah, the people, people, that's always question. But from that, beyond that, not, sir, because I think, I'm being this opportunity to work for a lot of course of course. Yeah, yeah.

You stood out, you stand out, I think you've done well. What I'm curious, that was December 2019, then two, three months after it, to COVID. I'm going to get a bit about how much more before before before you're going to be, was there a sense of hopelessness or more hopefulness that, or make you know, and make you've got to make you've got? And, in the way of the Hlembagaan,

also there repurposing, like in Bukalapak. That's, I want to try, gali, de, more than. What transpired in several months, that's from, you know, one, you've been past, you know, after that, after that, how, that, perjalan, what, what, what, what, what? Anything exciting that we should know about?

A lot, ma. So, of course, of course, I was just trying to put my legs under the desk, yeah, the main founder, which is an icon in the industry. I'm from industry that's apart. Relatingly, not many people who know me, that's not a public figure, which I actually prefer to the way, so many. Maybe there's what is this guy? So, so, so, so the first of the time, trying to try to get my heads around, the business, the stakeholders, and sogain

now, but, but if it happened, yeah, maybe this, this is still happening today, without what, of course, it's very scary, ma'am. It's very scary for everyone. We don't know what, what? But, but I'm maybe there a little bit of a bit of a bit,

that's a lot, if there some conditions that crisis, I get focused really quickly, and, and there, maybe, because it's been, how much more than I'm not even though,

I'm about Soudirman Mbara, in the same, 2008. I'm not used to be a class. I'm a lot more than I'm millionaires. Tibert, we're out, many people who offer for recently, because dot-com bubble burst. When I was going to school,

the MBA, the MBS crisis, this is unfolding before our eyes, out there's out there's being wrong, so, so, this, I'm thinking, like, this is, I'm going to be able, because they're all that, what, yeah, share, you know, this is, how about worries and so many things. For me, for me, I have to step up. I am the leader, and how much we can focus on how we can focus on what is the most important, what is the most important?

And what is we're going, what is important, this is two. The first, ma'am our first, sir, ma'amouran our cariwal our cariwal our cariwalrya can't work as far as a man. They have physical safety and psychological safety. Oh, yeah, important, too. Because, yeah, this can be a paincate, yeah, can't where-mah-mah-mah, so we think, okay,

we need, okay, we have to work from home, for a while. we've got after a while, people who are over the other than pay cut, and so many of them there's quite, right, resist, right? This is also what we'll try to cut a lot of costs, but

we'll try as much as possible so that rejury our reggae us, so that we're not to be able to becured down, so far as usual. We'll be able to check along, and the second is, of course, we're not only operation. We don't have luxury to stop,

because we know in e-commerce this is a pillar of economian that's been time if we don't have that luxury we don't have that's going to be, okay, we stop, stop, do, take, don't know, and then, then, then, and then, we can't keep operational, because people will be need, that. But how much the way that, balancing personal safety

And then we can't be able to be work work. And the second we also, we're still need to funding. We also can't know when can come again. So we have to be efficient. We have to look at which

which is which which is unah, which can, which we can postpone and we're stretch everything. So, the cutusans of the point of the point of the end up, we have to get up, and maybe relatively ruthless, like, we're doing that.

And so far, yeah, that's what we're trying, as quickly as we can. The time is an essence, we're not to know to the front like how. Right, right. That's what's about what on what's about what's about comangue of the pentingingan,

in holistic, including, mitra, micro- UMKM, what, what that, and what's all, if I'm in order to crucial,

yeah, for the of the existence of this platform this. if you know, if gojang-geng, if it's not be not to clothe with good, it's able to be able to put in the retinananed, if it's not, it's not, too.

Betoedal, sir. So, the stakeholder that we manage, is internal employees, though, sir, we'll get to the of our work we can't unfortunate, so I can't go to January, awal, up in December to do you, because we were, we were taking place where,

in 17-tit, then we just got to end up so we're making, last, month, Mado, the senenang-en-en-en-nev-o, ma'am. Oh, so? So, we're just going to We get to meet our colleagues, we got to meet our colleagues, we can't work from the room,

skeleton crew's where we have to get up, practically we have to kick everyone out of the office, and then we can make a system so that people can still be working. So, if we're it's about platform we can do that can't and the two different. The first,

the people are the people of the last, this is, they're relatively actually, can't be able to be from the platform terjaga, because they're selling it online. But issue is that is, there's

shift for the things that are what's what's that's what's that's what's that's something that's like to buy people online like electronics, durable goods, or what other than branded small things, it's kind of, because people are the focus for the things that are which, including, maybe, and maskers, and sogain.

So, this, we have to communicate as a great as much because if they're, if they're they're selling the salesmen, that's going to turn with drastic, you know, because people, I don't need to have been, I need to use the same, so we're always trying to communicate again.

But my time and people can shifting. And what's interesting, it's in Mitra Bukalapak. This, this, is the warring of Bukalapak we, that we digitized. we also, when they're at a lot of physical transactions. So this is also to educate,

so for education overall, in platform we, we're talking about information information about COVID, in terms of the data, including education from doctors, and so many and sogain. We're going to be with telemedicine or health tech, we have partner,

We can't get there, there's some of the first, there's there's a lot, there's a lot, for the time. Then, for the other than we're going to, we're going to shifting education. So, we can, like, video, how handle cash, so, you can be able to be safe. And then we give translate the language, basas-bhasa local, because if, if all areas-in-haw-bass-Indo-Indo.

We can't even beas-Indo. We've got to make sense, Basa, Basa, Basa, in Medan, we're saying, we're saying, oh, like, like, oh, like, like, like, like, like, like this. And this is very interesting. We're also, another stakeholder

that's very critical, is the government, we know. So, the government, ibaratness, we're going to to get digitalization UMKM. On digitization of UMKM, he's gaiung besamut. So, this is the first time that all the big tech companies.

We're who are like being in front, but we can't move to one meja. This we're going to like how, how we're going to be it, how digitalization? Not peduli again, what kind of what? What's important? We can do we can do this, we can be able to digitalization.

That's what the program of the Baja borgiawata in Indonesia. Wow. Unsure of the same-as-forwards. Okay, we fast forward a little. If we look, three years, the three years, Kegarer's Bukalap is at 1, 100%. Then, to top, processing value

value of the year's $85 trillion, right? Rupia. And then, top line is up on $1 trillion. This, if I'm in myruth, I'm not very-biasa. And I'm seeing, you can just be able to be able to just as guinea pick.

What's important is just through platforms digital lines, who want to want to be in the Bursa. Now, that, if I look, this, this is a penicaping to get-seed-as-as-cally, you.

Yeah, right? But, it's paying off. Try, tell you, in, in, of the of the of the market of the market-lapak to come to the bursa, and the kirkalculation is how much, if it's because, because Bukalapak, it's a better, with platform or marketplace line, or, maybe, the ucuran is different, or how much, but if I look at it, this, this, the result of dynamismanion is, it's, very positive. up to today, and this is

not only that's only that will be able to bursa, but if I'm in terms of the second tier, third tier, and fourth tier, digital platforms, will be very inspirations. Cobra, let's tell you. So, if you're in Bucca Lapa, so, actually, sir, mansept our mindset our,

is how, how, how much of how much more than how much more than how much more than how much more than people, like, but we're also very realistic with, with condition of our own. So if, if you look at Bukkah Lapa, it's, better than e-commerce or company technology line, maybe, maybe equity that's up in the that's quite in the way.

Yeah, if the IPO this is a lot of man, I'm in, I'm in, this is the first time, yeah, we raised with a number that, maybe, people, we've done that

three, four years ago, actually, yeah. But, but, we're being And we can, we can't we can't even with private Trump, but with public grounds, by the idea,

with IPO. Why we've got to be sure that with a one business that's very big, that's, in fact, we're going to be more than, more than, with stakeholders that many, it can't be able to, is very good if we're doing fundraising

that's also that's with that can bring up for us, for us also also as a class as a company, as a organization. Memas, well, since, This is Bukalapak, if you've been looking atop,

you're relatively unique, we have an tech, which is a person TBCA, we have sovereign wealth fund, GIC, we have N Financial, which is very strategic tech. So, this is relatively shareholder is long-term strategic, yeah, at a lot of it. And, obviously, they also have also have the expectations for the government and

if we're public. Now, if we're going to public, as a person who'suania 11 years, as a person that's transaction like this, by the way to be able to be more, yeah, it's about the process pendewasana. How everyone will be able to be able to beguessing us, and the process fundraisinginging is very transparent. So we're just to know,

we're really, is it, is it, is this, are we doing the right thing? And validations will we get from public. That's one of one factor. The other than the other than we've been a lot of innovation. We've got to be a lot of the Bukalapak this, we're going to be from online marketplace. But the moment we look at online marketplace this

has started, like, not malady segment that we're not going to beaerous we're going to beacques, Bucalapak, lay in the whole lot of the whole thing in this in the way in the way the way to be it in this, we can, we're about branch out, and spend a lot of energy in there. And that also makes up against resource also, because maybe the data that we could use for marketing, we have allocations to make resources,

making networking. And maybe, the way are you doing that? So, why are you doing that? So for us, for the public this is one of the next step to make up the Bukalapak this is a business that's more sustainable and also, of course, mainly in Indonesia. So, because if it's how, if it's a company,

the first thing is easiest for us in the US, for the past, by the pastimea, many people, I'm about what, I'm just about sometimes, when in Indonesia

Capital Market, it's, so far, can't even like this like if if it's a market,

yeah, so we're making a lot, okay, the amount, but it's like Butakapak, like Bucca Lumpac, like the... But if you're in the world,

maybe, the joling the dollar, it's a bit more... But this is the first time, that we're doing... So, we're notucas, if this, this part of this part of this... this is ayaemone, like, where, and, like, this... I mean, it's... That is... It's... it, um, um, it's... ...mugas, yeah, yeah, maybe... in a way, wasn't... It's like, but this is a process that for us to be able to be able to be as well.

And this is okay, this is okay, this is it can be able to be it as a process crystallization of the way, but if I see it justro, this is it can be it as a process not only for Bukalapak, but if I'm in my course for the world of course, because, of course, investor retail, this is more participation, and menungganging narration you,

yeah, right, that's allammy is great, and narrations that's going to be more great. But this also can give you inspiration to people of the people of the people inundasia who want to do something. And, and, and, and, and, a lot of people micro-U.M.K.M., if we can, it's, it, can,

the permerdaian micro-U-MKM, from the number of the energy, it can be $125,000. That, how, that, dynamism this can be manfacquat-can, for their more dynamic as to the more than and don't look, and again, again, that's happened that's been, what, what,

what, yeah, clumpuant, or clumpuant in some of micro-UMKM, because they can't do not be able to do adaptations. But, if I'm in myraise you, it's really can't getis-bawahi, that, adaptation, to digitalization, it's very much to do you

not know, or is that the sub-pandang that can be able okay? Right, sir, so, it's, the narrations in Bukalapak

is, how to be able toeroying umkam through technology. So, we don't be a story that I'm,

This is a platform commerce with the most, this, sales or transactions. We thinker is, hey, this is under-serve market, but big, which is UMKM, this is under-serve market, which is, people in out of five-cota-bessar, we want to try to try to help them help them. So we have technology yeah, we have online marketplace,

we have digitalization Warung, which is Mitra Bukalapak, and this we can connectsikin. And this is a solution that's for Indonesia, you know, right? Now, this if, if, if we're just we're giving rejukey and and the

and investor, too, and IPO this success, in our opinion, this is more than to the percension on the potential Indonesia, atas potency UNKM Indonesia.

Rami, maybe, only only the conduit that's been because what we're we're giving, this, we'll use to extend the service

to make UMKMKMKHR can be better back. And, And maybe what's in the garis-bawaiting is, this is something disruptive. This is something that's very-existency of re-existency of whereousa-usanaan,

that's, if I don't know, people can't look at it from the other than. It's one thing in Bukalapag, we're sometimes, sometimes, if we're talking, and disruptsing, it's like synonyming. In our, maybe, because functioned that we also many professionals who have appreciation to have

non-tech industries, that this is creating values, So actually, actually, we can't work with, if we can't work together. So we tie up with, like, financial service in Bukalapak

that, we're not making it, but we're making them can launchur can launchur can serve as the platform we're, and can be

by customers, customer our, and, and, and, the other, the mitra Bukalapak is,

not, but, to have them matting war room. But how much more than how much better than they can be modern retailer without without, you know,

investasies and so many. So, yeah, that's mindset we always try to remind ourselves, yeah, if we're making, this, make something to be better betteral, or rather, as a

ecosystem, mal be that's not being that's being taken. If I think I'm just as a certainan-it-like, it's very much more than inspiration for, of the unicorn and decakorn to make a crystallization of the way. But I just see this is all from super cycle to the time, five to 10 years to the time,

to be a lot of the sector that's still still disrupts, same-asconcally. The other, examples of real estate, and cesehatan, pertanian, peternanagan, even pari-wisata, and peddica.

And this, if, in myrude, I mean, sector-septuartes of each, with peculiarities each, it's very much, it's very can't be very much positive, the process crystallization, the milan that is being

this, this is the I'm going to talk about about the time and and I always I've tariff, not to

six, but I'm taking to the two, two, in 2014, you, you've been Now, that's how, that?

In'roth you? Bucalap, ke, or digitalization, or, even could be cupas, in context, the sectors that, I think, still still still disrupts,

how much, how much, that's, very, I'm not, I'm not, because I'm like,

I'm going to talk with to okay, if you're more better than more than just a chariote, but how we can makechequise about the issue on inclusion of the economy that you've been very much, how we can makechaqqa

problem in acclaim. Two things are things that I think that's a sort of long-pangangang, and this stakeholders' not I'm not saying or you're just, but if I'm a generation of enduous, not millennial or zillennial. Now that, I want to try to book us in context like that.

Yeah, back. If you're going to come up. If you're from, maybe, something in the Lensa, M.K.M., maybe wish, we're, harapan we're going to, in 2004-5, UMKM is, that's under under underduring with corporations. Tenduantuant,

so much other than things like financial inclusion, can't be able to get model or not, and sogainment, now, not peruble again, has to be corporation, with a compucoing that's all over. Everyone can get access to capital. Also, maybe the other two,

the opportunities, like how to access bigger market, is also by WMKM. There's not even batas, like, oh, has to be a cabang, in where, where can get. Misalya, like, business process, which, maybe,

has installed a very expensive ERP, and, sogainer to get the data, and soagery can be accessed with the UMKM, with the skill that's quite relatively standard. This is also like supply chain, business process, this will be many investments in where, that will make some of these logistical issues also become efficient.

So, people, imbaratness, UMKM is more much more to be able to be able to in the future. And they can't even scale, but if there's enough there's internet, they can make a living. I think what we are going to work on, there's a lot of people are going to work on that

also, and the hope that's probably, in 2045, probably. But this, if we know, if we're going to, if we're going to, you know, Inclusion is an inclusion, which is obvious. But what's a certain is how we can't make sure kind of equalization of opportunities. And it's termed in various in ratios

ratio-rashio-racea-coefficient, which is the sunjangu is more, more than more than I'm I'm saying that's inclusion of the Ulland it's making access to the model, but we also have to make sure that it's been a part for the importance redistribuscy, secremen to the better,

and stability macro and, it's not only to be able, even, it's, and I'm not just, lookalapak is very good and can be able to be able to propang inclusion of the money, and you can't acture just, metric or field-filthertentu, so you redistribusies of chastrivation and the security of stability

of the energy that's related to the environment of KM that, still be able to keep in the number. Panaghanan how about about that about that's like that. Yeah, we're just the idea, yeah, so, intoniness, if at the, in our case,

including, people think, banking service, so, or, which is, but, actually,

the, the, also, for the for the , that maybe, the information,

that was that we're that we can put-uped, supply, if you know, to be a lot of where, get back from where, if you know,

if you're going to export, import, that'd been long process just can't access to a certain. This is the hope we can't access. In 2004-5, maybe, that's been done to be done. Within an app,

you can start, you can choose, I want to be retailer, I'm going to be, So what, so, so everyone, and everyone, uh, even within within there, uh,

well, we're still, this is, but, but... But we start seeing, but... We've got, we've got... We've got, uh, bributty-buktina, yeah, bibbit-n't-neau-d-d-d-it-nia, bribut-n't-a-old-old-old-old. Oh, yeah.

I, I, I'm very positive, look to the 24 years to the people in the people who are people who are people people who are people who are in Indonesia, who'd never have been to be a think of it, to be a person who's going to be a person. But now, eh, it's juster juster just just, now,

almost, as far as a lot of people, that's not like when we were, young. Right, right established, right well-established, very well-established, very scale,

and multinational. But if you're not young young, they're going to lullusan or out of the they're going to make up, ah, no, I want to try on this,

the careranin'in' only three. That's a peruban paradigm that, if I think I'm not positive. Because, yeah, want, not to comejuven for the country, that we have more than the more than able to be able risko that's true, and, and, at the end of the same way,

just stability, that, can't be able to topang with the power. And, if not want, to, mow-mellation-as-o-widener-as-a-o-o-an-entrepreneurial. And I'm looking, okay, like, we're going to rapid fire a little, In 2004, you've got to look at how unicorns in Indonesia?

Banyx. Banyar, we've got got similar, US, 10-year-lorn-laloo, maybe, it should. Yeah. And, okay, in Marketplace,

you'll see consolidation will be in time in a time-de-de-at, or more, long long. Maybe there's, I don't know this consolidates or not, but specialization, like. So, we'll, we'll try,

each market that will start, like, yeah, this, the brantam here, not just too long, later, will be there. Like, in America, too, can be like that. A lot of e-commerce

that survive, thrive, but they've got uniqueness So I'm going to push a bit, but as fast what you, it's up to bea-lapak, it's, to be tempted to do vertical vertical I'm like that's about it. So, we think,

we're going to to make up to make an expansion. So by definition, marketplace, if in physical, it's same just like super app. Yeah.

In the platform, in, Whatever whatever other than product and layanan, we can't, as well as customer. So, yeah, if you're in Bukalapak, first we're dagam, yeah, commerce. If you're up commerce, what is the adjacent?

The adjacent is financial services. Because in per-daggagan, there's money that's going to be and if there are money that's going to be, there's more than there's money more. So if there's money we're talking about capital, capital.

If there's more, we're talking investment. Now, today, through the first time, temptation is from the beginning. But what we are trying to do today is, that's collaboration with very established institutions. So for provide loan service,

banking service, we're working with banks. that's already that's the other than our some of our shareholders 100 plus years old bank locally and global or one of the largest bank regional in this

so we've got to know we can't make more more than they're from their people if we're making we're investing we also think okay this there are big fund managers that will do much better

even though, while I've been WM-M-I, and people have been W-M-I, but they're working their own, but how can we deliver we can be delivered, we can give this, to, and that's enough. That is enough.

As long as long as it can be there's just, we're focused on. There are things that, maybe, at the time we can make a vertical new that's what we can't make it better than others. But if we can't make it better than we're going to be, better than we're doing better than we're doing. That's what we're doing that.

That's what we're making our, thinking we're like Bukalapak slightly, what, because we're not always making news. Because we always want to work. Right, that makes sense, makes sense. But what, if I'm in terms of it, is very in a lot of mentalism.

Dibanding, if in America, that's just being in the marketplace, tibatibaba, to make spaceship, to planet Mars, that's kind of vertical, who's more that's a bit gilat, but, but, but I'm good. And I, I'm sure, and,

of course, predecessor, your predecessor, including Zaki and my mind, it's really inspired. Mooda-Mudda-Mudahan, in 24-to-de-depan we can see of rhammat that new that can galley and merawatt narrations of narrations

to the next to the time. Thank you, ma'amatt. But, Rahmat, now, even now, many that's the same thing, the ender, you know, underponder here. There, there are there.

There, there. for the people as what, as well as in the other academic, in the world of the business, in the world public enterprise, or in the world, even, social enterprise. What do you think, that they can't from you as a manipin Bukalapak

who has made sure has narration that's great and the other than the narrative the next to you know, maybe, if I'm going to be, so, what we're doing, in the past, yeah, 18 months' last year. I mean, it's from here, from this, from the first, from the first, yeah, from it. It's focus to have the problem, that, and mission. So we think we'll make up umkMKM, through technology.

And that's the wayjavement tahners can't be better, upa, so at the same we're making online marketplace, then industry's a little bit we're having flexibility to shifting and to look to solve this problem, what's what, that's what,

Sometimes, there's temptation or goda-godan for the stintoshedical and so much. Sementara, we're not know, this, nassifes, nilies, nilies, which is very dark, so. Staying the course, it's important. But you're trying to highlight shifting, If I think that's shifting, it's important

because it's important a lot of people. I'm looking many people in dimensions whatever, in public enterprise, social enterprise, or private enterprise, the more than they're not in frontosven, it's more difficult they're making repurposing,

apalagy with dynamics that often often be able That's right. That's right So, that's not from the quality, but from adaptability Right, right.

And that, we think, this is the same thing in the world in the world but, but it's not on.

Yeah, sir, sir. Rahmat, out-biasa, this, What's important, thank you. Thank you, ma'amah, same as much, everyone, everyone, everyone,

Amen. Amen, amen. Well, that's Rahmat Kaimudin, the Bimpinan from Bukalapak.com. Thank you.